Federal Coalition discussion

[Knobby22]

This is an excellent article.
You can see how the some of the strange political decisions got made (or didn't get made) that got them kicked out e.g. alienating Chinese voters, West Australia, women, treating Sydney's West like its USA red Republican territory etc.

A Liberal Party guided by right-wing commentators is in serious trouble

Hardline Coalition MPs and columnists are pushing a narrative that goes like this: the Morrison government positioned itself as “Labor-lite” and lost as a result.

www.theage.com.au

 

[rederob]

This is an excellent article.
You can see how the some of the strange political decisions got made (or didn't get made) that got them kicked out e.g. alienating Chinese voters, West Australia, women, treating Sydney's West like its USA red Republican territory etc.

A Liberal Party guided by right-wing commentators is in serious trouble

Hardline Coalition MPs and columnists are pushing a narrative that goes like this: the Morrison government positioned itself as “Labor-lite” and lost as a result.

www.theage.com.au

A more interesting feature of this election is that LNP preferences to Labor ahead of the Greens is likely to get Labor the 76 seats they need to have a majority in the House.

It raises the question of whether or not the NLP should in future preference Teal so that a potentially hung Parliament at least has non-LNP members who share some policies and might even deal them "Supply" ahead of Labor under such a scenario.

 

[Craton]

What does COA stand for?

COAlition

 

[wayneL]

This is an excellent article.
You can see how the some of the strange political decisions got made (or didn't get made) that got them kicked out e.g. alienating Chinese voters, West Australia, women, treating Sydney's West like its USA red Republican territory etc.

A Liberal Party guided by right-wing commentators is in serious trouble

Hardline Coalition MPs and columnists are pushing a narrative that goes like this: the Morrison government positioned itself as “Labor-lite” and lost as a result.

www.theage.com.au

Julie Szego is a leftist and married to an ex Labor Party member of Parliament. As such, this view is not surprising and is completely wide of the mark as far as real-world Liberal voters are concerned.

 

[Knobby22]

Dave Sharma makes some good points, I have edited the letter to make it a lot shorter:

To lose one Liberal heartland seat could be attributed to misfortune. To lose several, and across multiple states, is a disaster.

Affluent, well-educated and progressive, they have been strongholds of the Liberal Party for decades. They have produced its senior leadership, underwritten its fundraising and provided much of its membership.

It’s a bloodbath of sizeable proportion. And if we ever wish to return to the government benches, it is incumbent upon us to learn the lessons of this defeat.

The Liberals must recreate the ‘‘broad church’’ envisaged by Menzies.

The British Conservatives after Tony Blair won in a landslide in 1997 shifted to the right, with policies centred around law and order, immigration and ‘‘tough on crime’’ rhetoric. They lost successive elections to Blair. It was only when David Cameron became leader and consciously went about shedding the Conservatives’ ‘‘nasty’’ image that they became once more electable.

We did not lose any seats to our right. We lost them entirely to our left. And if we are to regain government, we will need to regain the political centre. This does not require an abandonment of our ideological core. Small government, less regulation, support for business and free enterprise, a commitment to individual rights and freedoms, and robust defence and national security remain our most valuable offerings.

I support the two-party system, but it appears the electorate will not stomach the rigidities and compromises that come with it. Our future may well be German-style ‘‘traffic light’’ coalitions of parties to form government. If that is the way the winds are blowing, we should position ourselves for it.

 

[wayneL]

Dave Sharma makes some good points, I have edited the letter to make it a lot shorter:

To lose one Liberal heartland seat could be attributed to misfortune. To lose several, and across multiple states, is a disaster.

Affluent, well-educated and progressive, they have been strongholds of the Liberal Party for decades. They have produced its senior leadership, underwritten its fundraising and provided much of its membership.

It’s a bloodbath of sizeable proportion. And if we ever wish to return to the government benches, it is incumbent upon us to learn the lessons of this defeat.

The Liberals must recreate the ‘‘broad church’’ envisaged by Menzies.

The British Conservatives after Tony Blair won in a landslide in 1997 shifted to the right, with policies centred around law and order, immigration and ‘‘tough on crime’’ rhetoric. They lost successive elections to Blair. It was only when David Cameron became leader and consciously went about shedding the Conservatives’ ‘‘nasty’’ image that they became once more electable.

We did not lose any seats to our right. We lost them entirely to our left. And if we are to regain government, we will need to regain the political centre. This does not require an abandonment of our ideological core. Small government, less regulation, support for business and free enterprise, a commitment to individual rights and freedoms, and robust defence and national security remain our most valuable offerings.

I support the two-party system, but it appears the electorate will not stomach the rigidities and compromises that come with it. Our future may well be German-style ‘‘traffic light’’ coalitions of parties to form government. If that is the way the winds are blowing, we should position ourselves for it.

But see a lot of voters were lost because the government went too far to the left.

Headlines seats lost were because the inner-city trendies have all moved to the left, because they have been sold on climate change and na monumental hypocrisy, want to virtue signal to their rich mates in their Toorak mansions.

I mean just look at the bloke at the wef bragging about apps that will track people's carbon footprint... The owner of a truly massive yacht. Fucken disgusting. Carbon austerity is only for the plebeians and not for the so-called elite.

This is reflected across the anglosphere.

Chasing those voters will ensure the hemorrhaging of their base... They will certainly never get me back nor ex liberal voters that I associate with... nor the egregious virtue signalling hypocrites.

 

[greggles]

But see a lot of voters were lost because the government went too far to the left.

Headlines seats lost were because the inner-city trendies have all moved to the left, because they have been sold on climate change and na monumental hypocrisy, want to virtue signal to their rich mates in their Toorak mansions.

I mean just look at the bloke at the wef bragging about apps that will track people's carbon footprint... The owner of a truly massive yacht. Fucken disgusting. Carbon austerity is only for the plebeians and not for the so-called elite.

This is reflected across the anglosphere.

Chasing those voters will ensure the hemorrhaging of their base... They will certainly never get me back nor ex liberal voters that I associate with... nor the egregious virtue signalling hypocrites.

The votes that were lost from the Liberals went to the ALP, the Greens or left leaning independents. If votes were lost because the government went too far to the left we would see an increase in votes for parties and independents to the right of the Liberals in those seats that were lost. This did not happen.

Social conservatism in any form is on the nose. Woke is in, moral fuddy duddies are out. The Liberals may have lost some of their "base" but they lost more moderates to the left. There is little difference between the ALP and the Liberals on the economy any more, so people are voting on issues of conscience and personalities.

This election was decided by women and those under 30.

 

[basilio]

But see a lot of voters were lost because the government went too far to the left.

Headlines seats lost were because the inner-city trendies have all moved to the left, because they have been sold on climate change and na monumental hypocrisy, want to virtue signal to their rich mates in their Toorak mansions.

I mean just look at the bloke at the wef bragging about apps that will track people's carbon footprint... The owner of a truly massive yacht. Fucken disgusting. Carbon austerity is only for the plebeians and not for the so-called elite.

This is reflected across the anglosphere.

Chasing those voters will ensure the hemorrhaging of their base... They will certainly never get me back nor ex liberal voters that I associate with... nor the egregious virtue signalling hypocrites.

Not recognising that human caused CC is real and must be addressed at many levels just makes politicians look like ideological basket cases. I appreciate that Wayne has his own particular interpretation of this fact but the facts on the ground now demand action not dismissal and unrelated ad hominem attacks

What sort of action ? Immense but political parties can't take serious steps without an agreement on the reality of the situation. This was the core of the TEAL success. The candidates all had CC and a real response as the head of their policy. They were challenging a Government that was hamstrung by its own members on the issue. It had to change or go.

 

[greggles]

The idea of the Greens taking a seat away from the LNP would have been the stuff of science fiction prior to this election, but it's going to happen in the seat of Brisbane. Out of the 9.5% the LNP lost, 7.6% of it went to the ALP and the Greens.

 

[Knobby22]

But see a lot of voters were lost because the government went too far to the left.

That is rubbish. Where did they go left? Greggles called it above.

As Sharma implied, the Libs don't need to go left or right to win the next election. Just don't piss off your natural supporters.

Don't do dog whistling -picking on minorities, gays cross-genders, religion, the Chinese ship on WA. Sure it works in the USA but it doesn't work here. We are all over it and wise to it. The only people it works on are already voting for Palmer and Hanson.

Make policies that mean something e.g. their climate policy (wink wink everyone it means nothing); Why couldn't they come up with a plan?? It doesn't have to match Labor. just a basic plan. Laziness.

If you are going to go nuts on China with megaphone diplomacy, don't expect exporters who now can't sell wine and lobster to support you. Also don't be surprised if your Chinese born supporters (who are mostly small business owners) change sides. Ever heard of diplomacy?

Don't be dodgy. The ICAC stuff up was completely self inflicted. Right wing Liberals voting teal because they wanted action on the internal corruption within the Libs.

Don't follow right wing woke agendas leave that stuff for the fringe parties.e.g. WA freedom crap.

Select decent candidates. e.g. The independent that beat Kristina Keneally was selected to be in the Liberal Senate but they backstabbed her at the last minute and gave it to a white bloke whom no one had ever heard of and she quit the Libs in disgust. Now she is back as an independent and can get revenge- crazy!

.

 

[greggles]

Just one final comment on this. Morrison is probably the worst PM in generations. He didn't deserve to win, neither did the LNP in general. It was time for a change.

What sealed it for me was Morrison blowing $90 billion on non-existent submarines and then refusing to back a $1 an hour pay rise for Australia's lowest paid workers (the ones that kept this country moving during COVID) amid rampant inflation. That made him look like an epic, out-of-touch cnut. I could not support such a person politically knowing that it would just be another three years of more of the same.

 

[moXJO]

That is rubbish. Where did they go left? Greggles called it above.

As Sharma implied, the Libs don't need to go left or right to win the next election. Just don't piss off your natural supporters.

Don't do dog whistling -picking on minorities, gays cross-genders, religion, the Chinese ship on WA. Sure it works in the USA but it doesn't work here. We are all over it and wise to it. The only people it works on are already voting for Palmer and Hanson.

Make policies that mean something e.g. their climate policy (wink wink everyone it means nothing); Why couldn't they come up with a plan?? It doesn't have to match Labor. just a basic plan. Laziness.

If you are going to go nuts on China with megaphone diplomacy, don't expect exporters who now can't sell wine and lobster to support you. Also don't be surprised if your Chinese born supporters (who are mostly small business owners) change sides. Ever heard of diplomacy?

Don't be dodgy. The ICAC stuff up was completely self inflicted. Right wing Liberals voting teal because they wanted action on the internal corruption within the Libs.

Don't follow right wing woke agendas leave that stuff for the fringe parties.e.g. WA freedom crap.

Select decent candidates. e.g. The independent that beat Kristina Keneally was selected to be in the Liberal Senate but they backstabbed her at the last minute and gave it to a white bloke whom no one had ever heard of and she quit the Libs in disgust. Now she is back as an independent and can get revenge- crazy!

.

It honestly makes you wonder how sheltered the majority of these dckheads in politics are.

Flying in party members to "safe" multicultural seats is over. Why parties think sticking a whitey in a multicultural seat. When you have a member right there that ticks all the boxes. Well it stinks a bit of paybacks and corrupt process.

 

[wayneL]

That is rubbish. Where did they go left? Greggles called it above.

As Sharma implied, the Libs don't need to go left or right to win the next election. Just don't piss off your natural supporters.

Don't do dog whistling -picking on minorities, gays cross-genders, religion, the Chinese ship on WA. Sure it works in the USA but it doesn't work here. We are all over it and wise to it. The only people it works on are already voting for Palmer and Hanson.

Make policies that mean something e.g. their climate policy (wink wink everyone it means nothing); Why couldn't they come up with a plan?? It doesn't have to match Labor. just a basic plan. Laziness.

If you are going to go nuts on China with megaphone diplomacy, don't expect exporters who now can't sell wine and lobster to support you. Also don't be surprised if your Chinese born supporters (who are mostly small business owners) change sides. Ever heard of diplomacy?

Don't be dodgy. The ICAC stuff up was completely self inflicted. Right wing Liberals voting teal because they wanted action on the internal corruption within the Libs.

Don't follow right wing woke agendas leave that stuff for the fringe parties.e.g. WA freedom crap.

Select decent candidates. e.g. The independent that beat Kristina Keneally was selected to be in the Liberal Senate but they backstabbed her at the last minute and gave it to a white bloke whom no one had ever heard of and she quit the Libs in disgust. Now she is back as an independent and can get revenge- crazy!

.

I can agree with a number of your points, Knobby, But that in no way means that they have shifted to the right and it is interesting that since you have posted this the only 2 likes you received are from our resident extreme leftists.

However it is a fact at Liberal Party instituted ipso facto mmt and vastly expanded the welfare state. So and it to the identitarians in society, pandering to people who would never vote for them.

Worst of all, they have embraced the wef agenda.

None of this is moving to the right, and the reason that they have alienated their base is because of these moves to the left.

This is all in addition to the dumb shyte that you and others have highlighted above.

 

[wayneL]

It honestly makes you wonder how sheltered the majority of these dckheads in politics are.

Flying in party members to "safe" multicultural seats is over. Why parties think sticking a whitey in a multicultural seat. When you have a member right there that ticks all the boxes. Well it stinks a bit of paybacks and corrupt process.

I was just listening to Carmen Lawrence on 6PR and she made some excellent points along the same lines. In particular how the teal candidates were selected on a community basis (notwithstanding Simon HoC's involvement), rather than the top-down/captains pick style of candidate selection of the major parties.

 

[SirRumpole]

None of this is moving to the right, and the reason that they have alienated their base is because of these moves to the left.

I can't really detect any move to the 'Left' from the Libs, unless you are talking about paying Jobkeeper during the pandemic.

In fact, criticising Andrews and McGowan for their pandemic lockdowns cost them dearly in Vic and WA.

And not supporting a rise in the minimum wage at a time of rising costs is pretty blatant Thatcherism.

So where is the move to the Left by the LNP ?

 

[sptrawler]

Personally I think everyone is reading way too much into it, Morrison didn't win the 2019 election Shorten lost it, if Labor had presented a reasonable platform they would have been in office laready.
The coalition was well past its use by date, but still polled more primary votes than Labor, having said that both primary votes are at all time lows.
People voted for a change because it was time for a change, the biggest shock was how many didn't vote for either major party IMO.
So really Albo has to give a good account of himself this term in office, or it could turn really ugly next election, especially if the Labor/ Coalition support continues to erode.
The Cities voted the Government in and they may be the first to feel any financial pain, as they are the ones who are hocked up to the eyeballs.
It should make for a very interesting times, when the ones who can afford inflation, only live kilometers away from those who can't.

 

[wayneL]

I can't really detect any move to the 'Left' from the Libs, unless you are talking about paying Jobkeeper during the pandemic.

In fact, criticising Andrews and McGowan for their pandemic lockdowns cost them dearly in Vic and WA.

And not supporting a rise in the minimum wage at a time of rising costs is pretty blatant Thatcherism.

So where is the move to the Left by the LNP ?

Well, it's curious.

All those on the right think the liberal party moved to the left and all those on the left think the liberal party moved to the right.

I know that I consider myself centre/centre right and in no way did the current Liberal Party represent me.

 

[sptrawler]

Well, it's curious.

All those on the right think the liberal party moved to the left and all those on the left think the liberal party moved to the right.

I know that I consider myself centre/centre right and in no way did the current Liberal Party represent me.

I think everyone is confused, because there as so many mixed messages, McGowan is Labor and really popular and he is a clone of Barnett.
A huge amount of money has been thrown out the window Federally, as social welfare and everyone is complaining, mainly due to the lack of warm feel good stuff like reducing fossil fuel usage and exports faster.
So is welfare the pressing issue, or climate action, obviously by the result and the rhetoric climate action is what is most important.

So now we have the elites ringing in change, which basically is demanding a reduction in fossil fuel usage and exports, so no doubt that will be given priority.
I for one am looking forward to the acceleration, of both the reduction in fossil fuel usage and the banning of it being exported.

It was interesting that Penny Wong gave Australia a spray for not doing more to reduce global warming, when it threatens our Pacific partners and hopes they will forgive us and we promise to do more.
Yet at the same time they are embracing China, who are committed to building 100 new coal fired stations, maybe she needs to speak to her audience.
I don't think for one minute, that the poor Pacific nations are going to put climate change ahead of their poverty, like we have IMO.

I think it is great to try and ingratiate ourselves, but we do need to use enticements that they are interested in IMO.

Time will tell, but IMO Australia has finally become affluent enough, to put environmental issues ahead of social and welfare which is a good sign IMO.
Interesting times ahead.

 

[Smurf1976]

The Cities voted the Government in and they may be the first to feel any financial pain, as they are the ones who are hocked up to the eyeballs.

The trouble with cities is that they're a stark representation of society living side by side.

Those who live with at least some grasp of reality versus those in a bubble.

Those who actually do care about what happens to others versus those who don't.

And so on.

The harsh reality of inflation driven by scarcity isn't that it leads to some going without. No, it's that it requires some to go without in order to bring consumption down to match supply. That goes for anything from food to fuel.

There's an awful lot of pain coming for the lower half sadly and nothing will avoid it now.

 

[sptrawler]

The harsh reality of inflation driven by scarcity isn't that it leads to some going without. No, it's that it requires some to go without in order to bring consumption down to match supply. That goes for anything from food to fuel.

There's an awful lot of pain coming for the lower half sadly and nothing will avoid it now.

Absolutely, I think everyone should get ready for some shocking realities, hopefully it isn't as bad as we think it will be.
It will be better when we come out the other side of this change, the question is, how painful will the journey be?

Greens have mandate to stop new oil and gas projects: Bandt tells Labor

A significant number of voters backed the Greens or independents who called for stronger action on climate change – and Adam Bandt says Labor needs to recognise it.

www.smh.com.au