Electric cars?

[sptrawler]

As I said before, let the government show the way instead of dictating to the plebs.

The Government should first have a robust feasible plan, both economically and technically, before making a statement of fact.
Because IMO the statement of fact becomes everyones reality, when it may not be achievable, but it may in fact cause chaos and social upheaval.
IMO the Governments would be much better served, funding the rolling out of a comprehensive EV charging network, then when it is complete introducing tax benefits and penalties to encourage the uptake.
If the uptake isn't quick enough, then put in place a date that ICE cars will be banned, at least the infrastructure is in place to support the ban.
Just making a date in the future, is a load of BS, that helps no one.
Just my thoughts.

 

[qldfrog]

Chinese micro EV car
A nice city car
https://www.autocarindia.com/news/auto-expo-2020-great-wall-r1-ev-showcased-416014
Around 15k aud in China

 

[sptrawler]

News on the electric car front, very interesting and fairly comprehensive article.
https://www.drive.com.au/news/why-e...t-taxpayer-dollars-123213.html?trackLink=SMH0
From the article:
The Australian automotive industry is divided over whether taxpayer dollars should be used to boost electric vehicle sales or help pay for a national charging network.
Car companies have also warned against a ban on petrol and diesel cars because, they say, the profits from these mass market models are crucial to funding advancements in battery technology.

The Federal Government is preparing to rollout an electric car plan that would bring Australia into line with other countries such as Norway and the UK, which wants to ban petrol and diesel engines by 2035.


During a meeting in Sydney between the Electric Vehicle Council of Australia and the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries this week, an industry insider warned the electric-car lobby group that it “could become a cart with no horse without car manufacturers selling a range of products, including petrol and diesel engines, which continue to pay the way for the industry”.

 

[sptrawler]

News on the autonomous driverless cars.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/nuro-...car-for-road-tests-123215.html?trackLink=SMH3:
From the article:
Thanks to a temporary exemption from some of the country's low-speed vehicle requires, the company can deploy up to 5000 R2 delivery vans during the test period.

NHTSA says it "will closely monitor Nuro’s operations during and after that time" with Nuro required to submit mandatory reports about the R2 and its autonomous driving functions. It is also required to engage with communities where it will test the vehicle.

"Since this is a low-speed self-driving delivery vehicle, certain features that the Department traditionally required – such as mirrors and a windshield for vehicles carrying drivers – no longer make sense,” said Elaine Chao, the US secretary of transportation, said in a prepared statement.

 

[sptrawler]

Not exactly an electric car, but another toy along the same lines.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02...llion-on-hydrogen-powered-superyacht/11949380

 

[sptrawler]

Not exactly an electric car, but another toy along the same lines.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02...llion-on-hydrogen-powered-superyacht/11949380

The ABC has now retracted the statement that Bill Gates bought the superyacht.
I wonder why they printed it without checking it, maybe ABC Fact Check can do a self check, as they are so critical of everyone else making false statements?

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02...t-been-sold-to-bill-gates-sinot-says/11949380
Another example of glass houses and brick throwing IMO.

 

[qldfrog]

https://robbreport.com/motors/cars/new-nikola-electric-pickup-badger-details-2898314/
Nice
Electric hydrogen ute and powerhouse

 

[sptrawler]

BMW to plug in hybrid, very soon.

https://www.couriermail.com.au/moto...n/news-story/0da96ff2afb735cb56b7c32cedab9647

 

[Smurf1976]

IMO that is exactly what the Federal Government should be getting involved in, something that requires standard roll out across Australia.

FWIW they're acting because there's a few electricity companies who are going to do it for them if they don't.

 

[sptrawler]

FWIW they're acting because there's a few electricity companies who are going to do it for them if they don't.

As long as it brings about a standard roll out, that is the main thing. IMO

 

[orr]

One of those life changing opportunities right in front of all of us right now.
I know a few people who own enough Tesla Shares to change their life.

one bought under $100 and another at Just under $200.

me I don’t have any but am excited and happy for friends and family who do.

some valuations go as high as over $10000

which I’d see as fanciful until I see Berkshire Hathaways stock price.

if Space X is floated I’ll be on it in a flash!

Tech; You don't have to go through the whole durge(that's an unfair critique these two guy's work) ... but from about the 23min mark comes the tickler to an IPO for Teslas StarLink, from the CEO. And the Australias communications Authority's ok to Starlinks implementation.

 

[SirRumpole]

During a meeting in Sydney between the Electric Vehicle Council of Australia and the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries this week, an industry insider warned the electric-car lobby group that it “could become a cart with no horse without car manufacturers selling a range of products, including petrol and diesel engines, which continue to pay the way for the industry”.

Yep, that petrol excise revenue loss is going to worry a lot of people.

The EV manufacturers basically want a free ride on the back of the ICE vehicles.

 

[Smurf1976]

Yep, that petrol excise revenue loss is going to worry a lot of people.

The EV manufacturers basically want a free ride on the back of the ICE vehicles.

Agreed although I'll add that the common thinking that fuel excise is a road user charge is only indirectly true. It does raise revenue, and governments do fund roads, but it's an indirect one in so far as an EV pays no such tax whilst my lawnmower sure isn't being driven down a public street despite using petrol.

It is thus not essential that fuel excise is replaced by another tax on vehicle use. It could instead be replaced by higher income tax, reforming the GST or indeed any other tax. The one thing I'll say with certainty though is that taxing electricity is, politically, outright impossible so forget that one. Closest it might go is a tax on commercially operated fast chargers but you won't be paying a special tax on electricity used for charging at home, that's political suicide.

 

[sptrawler]

Yep, that petrol excise revenue loss is going to worry a lot of people.

The EV manufacturers basically want a free ride on the back of the ICE vehicles.

From a manufacturers point of view, they will be easier to build, a lot less parts, a lot less labour and a lot less warranty work.
But they will want to make a lot more profit, not sell the car a lot cheaper.

 

[Value Collector]

The EV manufacturers basically want a free ride on the back of the ICE vehicles.

I see it as a non issue, the average family car only generates a few hundred dollars in revenue each year.

Simply keep the fuel tax as it is and just slowly raise the rego across all vehicles if the petrol revenue decreases over time, that way petrol cars continue to pay extra and electric cars while electric cars slowly help pick up some slack over time too, that way electric will always be a bit cheaper, call the difference a pollution tax or air quality tax.

 

[sptrawler]

I see it as a non issue, the average family car only generates a few hundred dollars in revenue each year.
.

I think one of the main loss of revenue will be from losses in ICE vehicle maintenance and repairs.
The ICE vehicle has a lot of wearing parts and service issues eg coolant system, engine service, gearbox service, drive train service, engine management diagnostics and repairs.
These systems and the routine service, repair of the systems employs a lot of people and entails replacing components on a regular basis.
The loss of income tax on wages for service personnel and GST on the service components wont be insignificant. IMO

 

[Value Collector]

I think one of the main loss of revenue will be from losses in ICE vehicle maintenance and repairs.
The ICE vehicle has a lot of wearing parts and service issues eg coolant system, engine service, gearbox service, drive train service, engine management diagnostics and repairs.
These systems and the routine service, repair of the systems employs a lot of people and entails replacing components on a regular basis.
The loss of income tax on wages for service personnel and GST on the service components wont be insignificant. IMO

Thats a net plus to the economy though.

if people aren’t spending money repairing cars, they can spend it elsewhere.

who knows, if you aren’t spending $350 every 6 months on servicing, you might instead spend it on car washing or even restaurants, yoga lessons or a million other things.

 

[sptrawler]

Thats a net plus to the economy though.

if people aren’t spending money repairing cars, they can spend it elsewhere.

who knows, if you aren’t spending $350 every 6 months on servicing, you might instead spend it on car washing or even restaurants, yoga lessons or a million other things.

What about the people who no longer have a job servicing/repairing a car, or selling the parts required, or those that make the parts required air cleaners, oil filters etc?
It's nice to think every job that doesn't need paying for frees up money, but it also adds to the welfare side of the ledger.

 

[Humid]

I see it as a non issue, the average family car only generates a few hundred dollars in revenue each year.

Simply keep the fuel tax as it is and just slowly raise the rego across all vehicles if the petrol revenue decreases over time, that way petrol cars continue to pay extra and electric cars while electric cars slowly help pick up some slack over time too, that way electric will always be a bit cheaper, call the difference a pollution tax or air quality tax.

A few hundred dollars really?
What is the average family car?

 

[Smurf1976]

Simply keep the fuel tax as it is and just slowly raise the rego across all vehicles if the petrol revenue decreases over time, that way petrol cars continue to pay extra and electric cars while electric cars slowly help pick up some slack over time too, that way electric will always be a bit cheaper, call the difference a pollution tax or air quality tax.

If I was wanting to be elected then I'd be very certain to tie the increased rego to phasing out of fuel tax so that an average motorist paid not a cent more. I'd also make sure this was done before any significant number of people owned an EV since for EV owners there's no sweetener in the deal.

A higher rego tax, whilst retaining fuel excise, would not unreasonably be represented as a "tax on the poor" since it would indeed be the owners of older cars, who are typically lower income, who'd face the tax hike assuming it's done at a time when most new vehicle sales are electric or hydrogen.

Any such move would also need agreement of the states since rego is a state charge whilst fuel excise is federal.