Electric cars?

[SirRumpole]

Entire new industries spring up, and others are wiped out, with this sort of change.

And let's not forget that if electric cars take over, governments will be losing billions in fuel excise revenue which they will have to make up elsewhere.

Any guesses for how they will do that ?

 

[Smurf1976]

Any guesses for how they will do that ?

Taxing electricity would be politically difficult given its many other uses and that voters are already unhappy with prices.

So my guess is road user charging on ALL highways or other roads maintained by state / federal governments.

So everything apart from local roads, which are maintained by councils, becomes a toll road.

At that point we’ll quite likely see fuel excise abolished as a form of politically popular compensation to the mostly lower income people plus those living in the middle of nowhere who will still be using petrol / diesel. A revenue neutral move which also avoids allegations of double taxation.

We’re a long way from that point though and I doubt we’ll see any serious move for quite a few years yet.

 

[Value Collector]

Nothing's wrong with paying people to use their services and labour. Just that there's a difference between what's fair and what's entrepreneurial.

Not all efficiency would be passed onto the consumer. We all know that.

AGL might offer that $1 a day now, they'll get it back a few times over whenever they find it's appropriate for their shareholders. Kinda like initially buying power from domestic solar panels at some 20cents... they know buy the same power for 7cents or so, sell the same power to the same set of consumers for 21cents.

Saw on YouTube that Tesla in the US is starting to charge its SuperCharger user $0.45 per minute they left their charged car at the station.

So the moment your car is charged, you have 5 minutes to get out or be slug the fee.

The lady was a bit worried whether she overparked or not, and how much extra she's going to have to pay at her next Tesla checkup.

I'm guessing Tesla haven't had time to build an app to notify the car's owner their car has been charged. So owners will either have to stay in the car while it's being charged, or run back and forth, or just pay up.

All for the good of fellow customers so they won't wait for inconsiderate owners who parked their car their all day, of course.

Getting a 3-phase power line to your garrage won't be cheap either. Might need a separate meter, a seperate account, a whole bunch of paper work then a suitably qualified electrician who charges $500 for just cutting a cable from a pole.

So yea, Tesla and EVs are nice. Just for the average people who have to think about food, bills, taxes... it's going to be a while before the adoption rate make it economical. Until then, the first adopters will have to not think about the costs, just the pleasure of owning one.

Tesla started charging the penalty because they want you to move your car as soon as it’s charged, and not leave it parked there all day.

But Tesla supercharger network is not for profit, all revenue is going to be used to expand and maintain the network

 

[Value Collector]

And the rest of us will be using them as guinea pigs to see what the problems are.

I wonder if Tesla co is using their own product as company cars ?

The model 3’s roll out is

1, company employees
2, customers in local area of factory
3, rest of California
4, spread west across America
5, left hand drive countries
6, right hand drive countries

Hence why I won’t get mine till early 2019.

If you place your order today, there will be about 450,000 people that get their cars before you, so you are hardly a first adopter,

 

[Value Collector]

I wonder if they stringently test them. Like shake the car for hours, operate the electronics thousands of times and run the motor continuously until failure. With a rush to beat everyone to market obviously not.

The model 3 spent 18 months in design and testing before it started production, they are hardly rushing.

The car that was announced on Friday won’t be in production till 2020, and the truck enters production in 2 years.

It’s like you guys just make up stories in your head.

 

[Value Collector]

And let's not forget that if electric cars take over, governments will be losing billions in fuel excise revenue which they will have to make up elsewhere.

Any guesses for how they will do that ?

Maybe some sort of added per kilometre charge to registration.

So the people using the roads more pay more, that’s why the tax was on fuel in the first place.

 

[Gringotts Bank]

related

http://www.driverless-future.com/?page_id=384

 

[luutzu]

Tesla started charging the penalty because they want you to move your car as soon as it’s charged, and not leave it parked there all day.

But Tesla supercharger network is not for profit, all revenue is going to be used to expand and maintain the network

For sure it's for the good of fellow travellers

Even Sydney Airport now offer 15 minutes free pick up. Tesla, being more efficient, is offering 5 mins before they charge some $30 per hour, counting by the minute - to be fair.

I'm betting that their systems currently do not ping or send a text to the owner warning them to be more considerate.

Everything about Tesla is not for profit
BUt profit will come, with a vengeance.

 

[Wysiwyg]

It’s like you guys just make up stories in your head.

Did you watch that video till the end and listen to what he said? 11 months ironing out issues with the service agents on his new Tesla car. It's like not made up.

 

[Value Collector]

For sure it's for the good of fellow travellers

Even Sydney Airport now offer 15 minutes free pick up. Tesla, being more efficient, is offering 5 mins before they charge some $30 per hour, counting by the minute - to be fair.

I'm betting that their systems currently do not ping or send a text to the owner warning them to be more considerate.

Everything about Tesla is not for profit
BUt profit will come, with a vengeance.

They only brought in the penalty because people leaving their cars in the charging bay for hours was becoming a problem.

You can monitor the charge on your phone app, and it notifies you when you reach what ever charge you set it for.

No, tesla definitely wants to make a profit selling cars and trucks, just not from charging.

 

[Value Collector]

Did you watch that video till the end and listen to what he said? 11 months ironing out issues with the service agents on his new Tesla car. It's like not made up.

Name any car you want and you will find some one complaining that they have had trouble with it.

I was saying you made about a story by saying they rushed to market without testing their products.

I watch heaps of tesla reviews and clogs etc, plenty of happy customers, there was a few teething problems, but you expect that.

 

[Value Collector]

For sure it's for the good of fellow travellers

Even Sydney Airport now offer 15 minutes free pick up. Tesla, being more efficient, is offering 5 mins before they charge some $30 per hour, counting by the minute - to be fair.

I'm betting that their systems currently do not ping or send a text to the owner warning them to be more considerate.

Everything about Tesla is not for profit
BUt profit will come, with a vengeance.

Also one other thing, you don't get charged an idle fee if the charging station is less than 50% full, so if there are 8 charging bays, and only 3 are taken, you are ok leaving your car a bit longer, but if the charging station is busy, you get notified that you have 5 mins to move your car.

It makes sense, you would park your car at a petrol bowser when the service station is busy.

Also this is only for super chargers, that are designed for travellers wanting to quickly charge and get back on the road, the slower destination charges at work places, hotels, shopping centres etc etc aren't charged the fee, they are designed to charge your car slowly as you park there over night or for a work day.

 

[luutzu]

Also one other thing, you don't get charged an idle fee if the charging station is less than 50% full, so if there are 8 charging bays, and only 3 are taken, you are ok leaving your car a bit longer, but if the charging station is busy, you get notified that you have 5 mins to move your car.

It makes sense, you would park your car at a petrol bowser when the service station is busy.

Also this is only for super chargers, that are designed for travellers wanting to quickly charge and get back on the road, the slower destination charges at work places, hotels, shopping centres etc etc aren't charged the fee, they are designed to charge your car slowly as you park there over night or for a work day.

It's the half empty rule that gets your money.

See, if they were to charge you after 5min no matter what, then chances are Teslians will keep a close eye out on the charging status. But allow the half-empty and it's alright rule, people will more likely to "risk it". They'd roll the dice and the house always win.

Say I pulled up to charge and I'm the only one at the bay. I'd figured that the chances of other rich and awesome Tesla owner filling up more than half the bay are very low. So I'd browse the aisles at Woolies, check out a few useless shops... come back and pow! Elon Musk sent a few Tesla dealers to charge at the other bays and I'd be paying for it

 

[Macquack]

Did you watch that video till the end and listen to what he said? 11 months ironing out issues with the service agents on his new Tesla car. It's like not made up.

That guy is just an old woman. Not one issue of any real substance in his complaints. If all new car owners were as painstakingly difficult as that guy, all car manufacturers would go broke.

 

[Value Collector]

It's the half empty rule that gets your money.

See, if they were to charge you after 5min no matter what, then chances are Teslians will keep a close eye out on the charging status. But allow the half-empty and it's alright rule, people will more likely to "risk it". They'd roll the dice and the house always win.

Say I pulled up to charge and I'm the only one at the bay. I'd figured that the chances of other rich and awesome Tesla owner filling up more than half the bay are very low. So I'd browse the aisles at Woolies, check out a few useless shops... come back and pow! Elon Musk sent a few Tesla dealers to charge at the other bays and I'd be paying for it

As I said you get notified by you app, if charges will apply and when your car reaches enough car to get to your destination,

For example, if you only need 24% charge to make it the last 80kms home, your app will notify that you now have enough charge, you would have to leave it charging another 30mins after you had enough charge, then you get a warning etc

Basically it's just trying to say "don't be a d##k and park you car at the petrol bowser"

To be honest I wish they had that rule at the petrol station to prevent people doing a light grocery shop at Bp while their car is blocking the bowser.

 

[Value Collector]

Did you watch that video till the end and listen to what he said? 11 months ironing out issues with the service agents on his new Tesla car. It's like not made up.

Check out this guy.

150,000 miles (240,000kms) and the only maintenance has been 4 sets of tyres.

He smashes his car driving shuttle runs between Las Vegas and La daily (the tesla taxi), charging multiple full cycle fast charges per day (which is not the ideal way to charge)

But even with all those charge cycles, at super charge rates he has only lost 6% of battery life.

His business is based around providing low cost transport long distances because his car came with free super charging for life.

 

[luutzu]

As I said you get notified by you app, if charges will apply and when your car reaches enough car to get to your destination,

For example, if you only need 24% charge to make it the last 80kms home, your app will notify that you now have enough charge, you would have to leave it charging another 30mins after you had enough charge, then you get a warning etc

Basically it's just trying to say "don't be a d##k and park you car at the petrol bowser"

To be honest I wish they had that rule at the petrol station to prevent people doing a light grocery shop at Bp while their car is blocking the bowser.

Teslsa is saying "don't be a D##k" but its design is saying "please be a d##k so we charge your car and recharge our revenue stream at the same time"

If I need to do shopping at a pump station, I would drive my car to its parking space. When the line's long I'd even do that when I don't need to do any shopping. See, no need to charge people to make them considerate.

Speaking of grocery shopping... there's a gas station nearby my place where the enterprising operator also sells fruits and vege in the open, right next to the pumps. That's gotta be breaking some health code.

 

[Value Collector]

Teslsa is saying "don't be a D##k" but its design is saying "please be a d##k so we charge your car and recharge our revenue stream at the same time"

If I need to do shopping at a pump station, I would drive my car to its parking space. When the line's long I'd even do that when I don't need to do any shopping. See, no need to charge people to make them considerate.

Speaking of grocery shopping... there's a gas station nearby my place where the enterprising operator also sells fruits and vege in the open, right next to the pumps. That's gotta be breaking some health code.

So you have nothing to worry about then, it's only inconsiderate people that need worry.

Basically it's not a parking place, the fees need to Be steep, to make an impact, if they charged $5 an hour, people would treat it like parking.

 

[luutzu]

So you have nothing to worry about then, it's only inconsiderate people that need worry.

Basically it's not a parking place, the fees need to Be steep, to make an impact, if they charged $5 an hour, people would treat it like parking.

$5 an hour is pretty steep you know

But yea, I prefer my cars mostly analogue. A real man's push buttons, with ticking dials, real metal gear knobs that burns the gears config into your palm after an hour in the Aussie sun. Though I'd buy one for the mrs and me brothers if ever i win the jackpot. Everyone need their iPhones.

Speaking of which, how has these Tesla handle the extreme weather? I mean, leaving your phone in the sun pretty much fries it. Leaving an all-electronic car with super computers, sensors, cameras... and glass rooftops on most models. Can't be good after a few years.

 

[Value Collector]

$5 an hour is pretty steep you know

My local Westfields charges $20 for an hour if you stay passed the allotted free parking time. I think Tesla just wants it to be in everyones mind that staying after your car has done charging is not an option.

Speaking of which, how has these Tesla handle the extreme weather? I mean, leaving your phone in the sun pretty much fries it. Leaving an all-electronic car with super computers, sensors, cameras... and glass rooftops on most models. Can't be good after a few years.

I can't see it being much different to any newer model car.