Electric cars?

[JohnDe]

Electricity sales are subject to GST, even your home electricity has GST on it, so when you are charging at home (unless from 100% solar in that moment) you will be paying GST.

I am not sure about charge point, but I can’t see why they would be exempt from charging gst.

Even if a person uses solar to charge, the solar installation itself is subject to GST, so there is still tax revenue being generated when people install solar to try and cover some of their charging costs.

GST is charged

 

[farmerge]

I agree, they should definitely state it on their invoices, but Mick was saying he didn’t think they charged GST, but I think they do and just might not state it on receipts.

Maybe there is a loop hole that once you have signed up to a service and become a member the rules are slightly different.

Going by the post with the "terms" and the bit circled GST, is definitely included. Just seems wrong to me. When all the dealings that I have with various outfits the GST is very clearly stated as an item in it's own right.

 

[farmerge]

GST is charged

View attachment 153226

John De and thsi is how all Tax Invoices that I receive look also. The layout format may be a little different, but GST is clearly shown Shouldn't be a different rule for some.

 

[qldfrog]

John De and thsi is how all Tax Invoices that I receive look also. The layout format may be a little different, but GST is clearly shown Shouldn't be a different rule for some.

Any gst registered business mush display gst in the invoice.
That's mandatory.
They are just in breach and this is very amateurish..unless they have a special exemption?

 

[mullokintyre]

Just in case someone may have thought I was being a bit creative with the truth, here is a copy of one of the invoices, clearly marked as a TAX invoice, but no mention of GST.
If you were running a business, how could you legally get a claim back against the GST paid?
Mick

Fast Cities Australia Pty. Ltd dba. Evie Networks ABN: 58 613 484 754 Tax Invoice Your charging session receipt 13 February 2023 at 3:00:52 pm AEDT Sutton Forest West - HS002 13125 Hume Hwy Sutton Forest, NSW 2577
Sale Amount	29.52 AUD
Total Cost	29.52 AUD
Session Details
Station ID	HS002B
Location	Sutton Forest West - HS002 13125 Hume Hwy Sutton Forest, NSW 2577
Connector	2
Power	350.0000 kW Max DC Power
Start Time	13 Feb 2023, 2:11:54 pm
End Time	13 Feb 2023, 3:00:52 pm
End Reason	EV Disconnected
Total Energy	49.1940 kWh
Transaction Details
Transaction ID	XXXXXXX
Payment Method	Credit Card
Currency	AUD
Activation Type	MOBILE
Pricing and Fees
0.60/kWh
Costs
2:11 pm - 3:00 pm
Charging Time	48m
Energy Fee	0.60 AUD /kWh
Energy Distributed	49.1940 kWh
Energy Cost	29.52 AUD
Total Sales Amount	29.52 AUD
Questions about bills? Contact us with the following information: Transaction ID: XXXXXXX - Station ID: HS002B
Contact Us

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​

Thank you for choosing Evie.
​

 

[JohnDe]

Any gst registered business mush display gst in the invoice.
That's mandatory.
They are just in breach and this is very amateurish..unless they have a special exemption?

I think this covers why the EVIE invoice is not as informative (on the Tax side) as the Tesla invoice, which includes the GST but is not required to -

"If a customer asks for a tax invoice, you must provide one within 28 days, unless it is for a sale of $82.50 (including GST) or less."

When to provide a tax invoice​

If a customer asks for a tax invoice, you must provide one within 28 days, unless it is for a sale of $82.50 (including GST) or less.

The information a tax invoice must include depends on:

• the sale amount
• the sale type (for example, a sale that includes both taxable and non-taxable items)
• who issues the tax invoice.

Sales under $1,000​

Tax invoices for taxable sales of less than $1,000 must include enough information to clearly determine the following 7 details:

1. document is intended to be a tax invoice
2. seller's identity
3. seller's Australian business number (ABN)
4. date the invoice was issued
5. brief description of the items sold, including the quantity (if applicable) and the price
6. GST amount (if any) payable – this can be shown separately or, if the GST amount is exactly one-eleventh of the total price, as a statement which says 'Total price includes GST'
7. extent to which each sale on the invoice is a taxable sale

Example 1: Tax invoice for a sale under $1,000

End of example

Sales of $1,000 or more​

Tax invoices for sales of $1,000 or more also need to show the buyer's identity or ABN.

If your tax invoices meet the requirements for sales of $1,000 or more, you can also use them for sales of lesser amounts.

Example 2 shows:

• GST included in each line item
• the sale is clearly identified as being fully taxable by the words 'Total price includes GST'
• the buyer's identity for sales of $1,000 or more.

Example 2: Tax invoice for a sale of $1,000 or more

Tax invoices | Australian Taxation Office

Explains when to provide a tax invoice, what it must include and dealing with non-taxable sales and rounding.

www.ato.gov.au

 

[mullokintyre]

Amazon has unleashed its Robo taxis in California. Could this be the way of the future?

Amazon has signalled its intention to offer autonomous transport by deploying a fleet of all-electric, self-driving robotaxis on public roads in California.
The online retail giant, which bought self-driving start-up company Zoox for $1.9 billion in 2020, has begun trialling the driverless vehicles by offering a free robotaxi shuttle service for its employees.

A robotaxi successfully completed its first journey on February 11, a short 1.6km trip between two Zoox office buildings in Foster, California, a feat it claims marks the first time in history a purpose-built robotaxi without any manual controls has driven autonomously with passengers.

Rather than retrofitting existing vehicles, the Zoox robotaxi EVs have been expressly manufactured to serve as self-driving transport, with the toaster-shaped modules featuring no steering wheel or pedals.
Zoox’s robotaxis are capable of speeds of 56km/h, with enough space for four inside, with the two rows of two seats facing each other to facilitate conversations between passengers (or possibly because they might be too scared to look out the windscreen).

The driverless vehicles have been through rigorous testing on private Californian roads, and are capable of negotiating traffic lights, pedestrians, vehicles and other potential obstacles while in transit.

Zoox CEO Aicha Evans avoided naming a date for the commercial launch of the robotaxis, which require further government approval, but did suggest the shuttle service launch is a sign of things to come.

“Becoming the first company to operate a purpose-built robotaxi with passengers on open public roads in California is a significant milestone in not only Zoox’s journey, but for the autonomous-vehicle industry at large,” Ms Evans said.
Amazon is not the only big company pursuing self-driving tech, with General Motors and Google both spending billions on driverless car research and development.

It hasn’t been all smooth-sailing for autonomous vehicles, however, with Ford and Volkswagen recently closing down development of the much-hyped Argo AI self-driving unit, instead choosing to focus resources on driver-assistance technology instead.

At the risk of being cancelled, I would only say that we need to see how this scales up to meaningful numbers of Autonomous vehicles before getting too excited.
Mick

 

[sptrawler]

Amazon has unleashed its Robo taxis in California. Could this be the way of the future?


At the risk of being cancelled, I would only say that we need to see how this scales up to meaningful numbers of Autonomous vehicles before getting too excited.
Mick

It wont happen overnight, but for city dwellers I think that will be the future.

This will be so no one can steal them, or drunks commandeer them : ?
Rather than retrofitting existing vehicles, the Zoox robotaxi EVs have been expressly manufactured to serve as self-driving transport, with the toaster-shaped modules featuring no steering wheel or pedals.

 

[mullokintyre]

It wont happen overnight, but for city dwellers I think that will be the future.

This will be so no one can steal them, or drunks commandeer them : ?
Rather than retrofitting existing vehicles, the Zoox robotaxi EVs have been expressly manufactured to serve as self-driving transport, with the toaster-shaped modules featuring no steering wheel or pedals.

You are so old school, @sptrawler , these days thieves don't need steering wheels or pedals, they hack into the software and cause mayhem.
Mick

 

[Value Collector]

Just in case someone may have thought I was being a bit creative with the truth, here is a copy of one of the invoices, clearly marked as a TAX invoice, but no mention of GST.
If you were running a business, how could you legally get a claim back against the GST paid?
Mick
View attachment 153248

Fast Cities Australia Pty. Ltd dba. Evie Networks ABN: 58 613 484 754 Tax Invoice Your charging session receipt 13 February 2023 at 3:00:52 pm AEDT Sutton Forest West - HS002 13125 Hume Hwy Sutton Forest, NSW 2577
Sale Amount	29.52 AUD
Total Cost	29.52 AUD
Session Details
Station ID	HS002B
Location	Sutton Forest West - HS002 13125 Hume Hwy Sutton Forest, NSW 2577
Connector	2
Power	350.0000 kW Max DC Power
Start Time	13 Feb 2023, 2:11:54 pm
End Time	13 Feb 2023, 3:00:52 pm
End Reason	EV Disconnected
Total Energy	49.1940 kWh
Transaction Details
Transaction ID	XXXXXXX
Payment Method	Credit Card
Currency	AUD
Activation Type	MOBILE
Pricing and Fees
0.60/kWh
Costs
2:11 pm - 3:00 pm
Charging Time	48m
Energy Fee	0.60 AUD /kWh
Energy Distributed	49.1940 kWh
Energy Cost	29.52 AUD
Total Sales Amount	29.52 AUD
Questions about bills? Contact us with the following information: Transaction ID: XXXXXXX - Station ID: HS002B
Contact Us

Privacy Policy
Terms of Service

View attachment 153249


Thank you for choosing Evie.
​

I didn't think you were lying, I just think for some reason they aren't showing the GST they are charging you.

I just checked a couple of subscription services I am subscribed to, and noticed neither Charge Fox, Apple, Disney plus or Netflix show GST, I wonder if once you are subscribed and clicked on the "agree" button to the terms and conditions then the emails showing the receipts don't need to show GST breakdown.


Businesses generally don't look receipt by receipt to work out GST, the BAS form just asks you to write the total of all your receipts and then divide it by 11 so it shows you the 10% GST component.

 

[mullokintyre]

I didn't think you were lying, I just think for some reason they aren't showing the GST they are charging you.


Businesses generally don't look receipt by receipt to work out GST, they BAS form just asks you to write the total of all your receipts and then divide it by 11 so it shows you the 10% GST.

Perhaps some businesses are more sloppy than others.
When we had the Pharmacy, I used to check pretty much every invoice that came in, because most drugs, and some services were GST exempt.
If an invoice came in with a mix of GST exmpt health stuff and non exempt, it was a pain the proverbial.
Some small business don't reach the Threshold , whatever that is these days.
We got audited three times by the ATO over GST , cos the dorks could not understand how anyone could get a GST refund.
Mick

 

[JohnDe]

Perhaps some businesses are more sloppy than others.
When we had the Pharmacy, I used to check pretty much every invoice that came in, because most drugs, and some services were GST exempt.
If an invoice came in with a mix of GST exmpt health stuff and non exempt, it was a pain the proverbial.
Some small business don't reach the Threshold , whatever that is these days.
We got audited three times by the ATO over GST , cos the dorks could not understand how anyone could get a GST refund.
Mick

When GST first came in the rule was that no tax invoice was required for anything under $50. It must have changed at some point because it is now $82.5 and under. Anything above $82.50 must have the GST shown.

Tax invoices | Australian Taxation Office

Explains when to provide a tax invoice, what it must include and dealing with non-taxable sales and rounding.

www.ato.gov.au

 

[mullokintyre]

When GST first came in the rule was that no tax invoice was required for anything under $50. It must have changed at some point because it is now $82.5 and under. Anything above $82.50 must have the GST shown.

Tax invoices | Australian Taxation Office

Explains when to provide a tax invoice, what it must include and dealing with non-taxable sales and rounding.

www.ato.gov.au

No, I was referring to a different threshold for registering for GST.
There was/is a threshold at which you don't have to deal in GST

You must register for GST:

• when your business or enterprise has a GST turnover (gross income from all businesses minus GST) of $75,000 or more (the GST threshold) – see Working out your GST turnover

Geez, that registration threshold has not changed since the introduction of GST.
One of our cleaners was under the 75,000 threshold as it was a second job for her.
I doubt if there would be too many these days who could slip under 75k!
Mick
Edit - damn, we got off topic AGAIN. No more GST talk in Electric cars for me.

 

[Value Collector]

Perhaps some businesses are more sloppy than others.
When we had the Pharmacy, I used to check pretty much every invoice that came in, because most drugs, and some services were GST exempt.
If an invoice came in with a mix of GST exmpt health stuff and non exempt, it was a pain the proverbial.
Some small business don't reach the Threshold , whatever that is these days.
We got audited three times by the ATO over GST , cos the dorks could not understand how anyone could get a GST refund.
Mick

I guess if you are dealing in GST exempt things, you might look at more invoices, but you would develop an instinct into which products definitely include GST for example your electricity.

My Business had zero exempt things, so all purchases went in one column and sales in another, divide both by 11 and minus A from B and you write the check for the difference. It used to take like 10 mins

 

[JohnDe]

A one off, or a trending issue with Chinese vehicles -

 

[farmerge]

I guess if you are dealing in GST exempt things, you might look at more invoices, but you would develop an instinct into which products definitely include GST for example your electricity.

My Business had zero exempt things, so all purchases went in one column and sales in another, divide both by 11 and minus A from B and you write the check for the difference. It used to take like 10 mins

I don't know about 10 minutes but we have the same sort of system, then it goes to the bean counters for a fee ofcourse

 

[sptrawler]

A one off, or a trending issue with Chinese vehicles -

How old is that post from the bearded bloke?

 

[JohnDe]

How old is that post from the bearded bloke?

Yesterday, 26/02/2023

 

[sptrawler]

Yesterday, 26/02/2023

Well if it's accurate and I'm not saying it is, it is a bit like the 1970's -80's assembly methods, where they put them together then spray them.
Not good, that sort of rust doesn't happen these days in modern auto assembly methods, pre treating and pre assembly painting that doesn't happen.
Now they just wear out.
Didn't that guy buy an Atto 3?

 

[mullokintyre]

Well if it's accurate and I'm not saying it is, it is a bit like the 1970's -80's assembly methods, where they put them together then spray them.
Not good, that sort of rust doesn't happen these days in modern auto assembly methods, pre treating and pre assembly painting that doesn't happen.
Now they just wear out.
Didn't that guy buy an Atto 3?

The car in question was a statutory writeoff oafter an accident, so was damaged, parts previously not exposed to moisture, suddenly are.
As someone who has pulled a fair share of old cars apart, bolted or welded parts that are bare metal and not treated or painted, but have seam sealer applied will last for 50 years without rust.
You pull them apart and expose them to air, and they will be rusty within a week.
Cars made from aluminium or other alloys would not have the same problem.
BYD is cheap to make coz they are made with cheaper thin wall steel rather than more expensive aluminium and other alloys.
Mick