Electric cars?

[rederob]

The "government" reason were not why car manufacturers were not sending evs. I quoted an article pages back on the actual reasons and that wasn't it.

Really?
Here's what one of the largest automakers in the world said:

"Here there is no CO2 target, latent hostility to EVs [and] Victoria has taxed a new technology that is barely here ... [it has] not [been] thought through ... We don’t ask for incentives. [Nor do] we don’t ask for disincentives."​

​

Then there's this from @mullokintyre:

"Could it possible be because they have to convert to RHD, or have to ship by boat when shipping costs are thru the roof assuming you can get a ship to move them, or pass the crash test dummy legislation, plus its a very small market."​

Not a single point was on the money. I previously mapped the many nations with RHD, so that's not a problem, nor are shipping costs as Europe is a long way from China! Crash test costs are negligible as they use cars that fail QA, and/or have production runs that amortise these costs.

NEV automakers do not see Australia as a single market because NEV policies are a bugger's muddle across State/Territories. And as we have no overarching national policies that support NEVs it's just so much easier to supply to European nations rather than try to concoct selling arrangements here that are consistent across our nation .

 

[moXJO]

Really?
Here's what one of the largest automakers in the world said:

"Here there is no CO2 target, latent hostility to EVs [and] Victoria has taxed a new technology that is barely here ... [it has] not [been] thought through ... We don’t ask for incentives. [Nor do] we don’t ask for disincentives."​

​

Then there's this from @mullokintyre:

"Could it possible be because they have to convert to RHD, or have to ship by boat when shipping costs are thru the roof assuming you can get a ship to move them, or pass the crash test dummy legislation, plus its a very small market."​

Not a single point was on the money. I previously mapped the many nations with RHD, so that's not a problem, nor are shipping costs as Europe is a long way from China! Crash test costs are negligible as they use cars that fail QA, and/or have production runs that amortise these costs.

NEV automakers do not see Australia as a single market because NEV policies are a bugger's muddle across State/Territories. And as we have no overarching national policies that support NEVs it's just so much easier to supply to European nations rather than try to concoct selling arrangements here that are consistent across our nation .

I think tractors were outselling evs in Australia last year, or the last.
Our government is sht, no getting around that. I suppose the lack of spruiking by government is partly to blame. Realistically they should be able to sell off their own merit imo. I think ev demand has tripled this year without incentives. So demand will build.

Problem is manufacturers can't cover orders. Throw in blown up trade supply lines and they ain't churning out evs in enough quantities. Even if you do want one range of options is still limited. And then there's the wait. Not to mention lack of knowledge from dealerships.

 

[rederob]

Realistically they should be able to sell off their own merit imo. I think ev demand has tripled this year without incentives. So demand will build
Problem is manufacturers can't cover orders. Throw in blown up trade supply lines and they ain't churning out evs in enough quantities. Even if you do want one range of options is still limited. And then there's the wait. Not to mention lack of knowledge from dealerships.

All the above is true.
The only point I rabbit on about is that because we have done nothing at the national level to foster a local EV market, manufacturers have prioritised other markets ahead of ours. The result is a double whammy effect, multiplied many times.

 

[sptrawler]

All the above is true.
The only point I rabbit on about is that because we have done nothing at the national level to foster a local EV market, manufacturers have prioritised other markets ahead of ours. The result is a double whammy effect, multiplied many times.

You have been rabbiting on about the Federal Government on every issue, so why should this one miss out. ?

Morrison could be feeding the 5,000 a meal of fish at the sea of Galilee and you would be running round like a chook with its head chopped off, telling people not to eat because it is probably out of date. ?

 

[moXJO]

All the above is true.
The only point I rabbit on about is that because we have done nothing at the national level to foster a local EV market, manufacturers have prioritised other markets ahead of ours. The result is a double whammy effect, multiplied many times.

I agree.
We seem to be stuck in time with any sort of future proofing imo.

 

[mullokintyre]

Chinese manufacturer, BYD, has announced that it will produce an Electric Ute.
from Chasing cars

The Australian distributor of Chinese car manufacturer BYD has confirmed an all-electric ute will be unveiled in 2023 before it heads to our shores.

Luke Todd, chief executive officer of BYD distributor EV Direct, told Chasing Cars he had already seen the unnamed commercial vehicle in person during the durability testing phase of the 2023 BYD ute.

Mr Todd said he is aiming to bring the fully-electric ute to Australia as part of an onslaught of eight vehicles EV Direct will launch locally by 2024.
“It’s unconfirmed whether it will be on sale yet in 2023, but we’re pushing (to bring it to Australia) as hard as we can,” he said.

With this in mind, the BYD ute will likely make it to Australia in late 2023 or in early 2024.

What do we know about the new BYD ute?​

Few details have been confirmed so far but Australians can expect a driving range of at least 450km in normal driving conditions.

It’s not clear whether this figure takes a load into account – but it’s likely that a heavy payload or towing a trailer would result in reduced range. That said, the maximum range of leaders in this growing segment – include the Ford F-150 Lightning, which claims 483km when testing according to at-times lenient EPA testing standard.

BYD’s use of its new modular ‘Blade’ battery and e-platform 3.0 has allowed engineers to scale battery packs up or down depending on the vehicle size and needs.

I wonder if these utes from BYD will be sold through the AP eagers franchises as well?
Hope so, as I have shares in APE.
Mick

 

[sptrawler]

I agree.
We seem to be stuck in time with any sort of future proofing imo.

The right hand drive market is small on the World stage, where most highly populated first world countries are left hand drive e.g U.S.A, China and the EU, add to that the fact our market is infinitesimal in regard RHD demand due to the small population and range anxiety compared to e.g U.K, Japan and the remainder are mainly ex British colonies.

Given that the manufacturing of E.V's is limited, they will obviously be building production facilities to supply the major LHD markets, no matter what Australia does, until production capacity increases to meet demand we will be an afterthought.

People need to get a grip, why do we think Australia is so Important? 78 million cars were made in 2020, 17million are sold in the U.S, 21million in China, EU 10million, that is just 3 LHD countries with plenty of wealthy people to buy expensive E.V's.

Australia where 1million cars are sold, telling the manufacturers hey over here we will give an incentive, is really going to get their attention. ?

We have really lost the plot, it's the media again giving us Australian plebs the idea we are important on the World stage, rather than in our rather small closed minds IMO

But it would be nice, if the taxpayer would give me a bit of money off my car, it is dearer than Rob's. ?

 

[Macquack]

Chinese manufacturer, BYD, has announced that it will produce an Electric Ute.
from Chasing cars

I wonder if these utes from BYD will be sold through the AP eagers franchises as well?
Hope so, as I have shares in APE.
Mick

Michaelia won't be happy.



When that bimbo Cash retires from politics, she is a shoe in to play a character in "Kath & Kim". No acting experience necessary, she can just play herself.

 

[Humid]

Michaelia won't be happy.



When that bimbo Cash retires from politics, she is a shoe in to play a character in "Kath & Kim". No acting experience necessary, she can just play herself.

 

[rederob]

You have been rabbiting on about the Federal Government on every issue, so why should this one miss out. ?

Given I am mostly quoting what industry says about Scomo's mob and their lack of supportive policies, it's just a matter of being honest about the problem.
Here's a few recent thoughts from the car industry, including:

• "Behyad Jafari, CEO of the Electric Vehicle Council, said the Government’s plan wasn’t fit for the 21st century and will mean Australians continue to miss out on the best technology on offer."

And here are more, including:

• “We need to acknowledge the OECD has gone down a particular policy road and as a small global player, we’re affected by that,” says Michael Bradley, managing director of the Australian Automobile Association.
  
  “We can’t insulate ourselves from what’s going on in the rest of the world, no matter how hard we try.”
  
  The solution, according to Bradley and Tony Weber, head of the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries, is for Australia to develop its own CO2 emissions regime.

The right hand drive market is small on the World stage, where most highly populated first world countries are left hand drive e.g U.S.A, China and the EU, add to that the fact our market is infinitesimal in regard RHD demand due to the small population and range anxiety compared to e.g U.K, Japan and the remainder are mainly ex British colonies.

The idea that RHDs is an issue is not supported by the fact that about a third of the world's population has this driver configuration Setting up dedicated RHD production lines in a plant is no big deal given the global market will need to accommodate over 300 million drivers.

 

[sptrawler]

Given I am mostly quoting what industry says about Scomo's mob and their lack of supportive policies, it's just a matter of being honest about the problem.
Here's a few recent thoughts from the car industry, including:

• "Behyad Jafari, CEO of the Electric Vehicle Council, said the Government’s plan wasn’t fit for the 21st century and will mean Australians continue to miss out on the best technology on offer."

And here are more, including:

• “We need to acknowledge the OECD has gone down a particular policy road and as a small global player, we’re affected by that,” says Michael Bradley, managing director of the Australian Automobile Association.
  
  “We can’t insulate ourselves from what’s going on in the rest of the world, no matter how hard we try.”
  
  The solution, according to Bradley and Tony Weber, head of the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries, is for Australia to develop its own CO2 emissions regime.

Of course the car industry is asking for more assistance, if I was a vehicle manufacturer I would be looking for money to help with the transition of my business and look for anyone I could blame for the fact I can't make enough cars to meet demand.
That is logical, not political.

The idea that RHDs is an issue is not supported by the fact that about a third of the world's population has this driver configuration Setting up dedicated RHD production lines in a plant is no big deal given the global market will need to accommodate over 300 million drivers.

The third of the World that drives on the right hand side. is mainly made up of third world impoverished people i.e India, South Africa, which I actually alluded to in my post regarding the propensity of LHD vehicles are made for large first world wealthy consumers.
So really my case still stands the majority of manufacturing being built will be for Chinese, U.S and the EU LHD markets, despite disagreement.

 

[Macquack]

The third of the World that drives on the right hand side. is mainly made up of third world impoverished people i.e India, South Africa, which I actually alluded to in my post regarding the propensity of LHD vehicles are made for large first world wealthy consumers.

The third of the world steer the car "on the right hand side" (RHD), but "drive on the left hand side" of the road.

What side of the road do Western Australians drive on?

 

[sptrawler]

The third of the world steer the car "on the right hand side" (RHD), but "drive on the left hand side" of the road.

What side of the road do Western Australians drive on?

My appologies for your confusion.

 

[Macquack]

My appologies for your confusion.

Its you confusion that I am worried about, as I don't want to have any accidents when I go there on holidays.

 

[Smurf1976]

I hope i provide entertainment

The comment wasn't referring to this forum or anyone on it.

Some of what gets posted in the comments section on the mainstream media websites is truly bizarre though even when taken from a technology, environmental, corporate and politically neutral perspective.

My view is that politics and the media have seriously failed to give the general public accurate information about all thus, thus fuelling tribalism.

 

[Smurf1976]

I did regret not renting a Tesla in the UK though, because that was more of a road trip holiday for us, and we saw heaps of places we could have charged along the way.

Same here - driving an ICE around much of the UK I spotted EV chargers on quite a few occasions, indeed more on that trip than I've come across in total in Australia thus far.

Also remember seeing EV's parked on the street in Paris left on charge overnight. This was in 2017.



I don't know the street name, it was in the inner part of the city though, and there were a dozen or so of them on charge like this.

 

[sptrawler]

Its you confusion that I am worried about, as I don't want to have any accidents when I go there on holidays.

I would have thought that as the discussion was about the manufacturing of RHD vehicles and LHD vehicles, the typo would have been obvious, therefore again my appologies, it is easy to make those type of errors on a small mobile phone screen I find, especially when I am hurrying.
Again I hope you can accept my appologies.

 

[moXJO]

The right hand drive market is small on the World stage, where most highly populated first world countries are left hand drive e.g U.S.A, China and the EU, add to that the fact our market is infinitesimal in regard RHD demand due to the small population and range anxiety compared to e.g U.K, Japan and the remainder are mainly ex British colonies.

Given that the manufacturing of E.V's is limited, they will obviously be building production facilities to supply the major LHD markets, no matter what Australia does, until production capacity increases to meet demand we will be an afterthought.

People need to get a grip, why do we think Australia is so Important? 78 million cars were made in 2020, 17million are sold in the U.S, 21million in China, EU 10million, that is just 3 LHD countries with plenty of wealthy people to buy expensive E.V's.

Australia where 1million cars are sold, telling the manufacturers hey over here we will give an incentive, is really going to get their attention. ?

We have really lost the plot, it's the media again giving us Australian plebs the idea we are important on the World stage, rather than in our rather small closed minds IMO

But it would be nice, if the taxpayer would give me a bit of money off my car, it is dearer than Rob's. ?

I'm sure there was a reason for it. Parts to get rid of, or dumping ice vehicle stock on us. I can't remember what it was now.

 

[Smurf1976]

I suppose the lack of spruiking by government is partly to blame.

I see both sides of this one.

Consumers will buy what they want to buy. It's their money and their decision so long as it's legal.

But then rather a lot of vehicles are bought by fleets and I'm told that at least one company ditched it's EV fleet plans simply because they didn't want to risk getting themselves on the wrong side of the federal government with whom they have unavoidable dealings. If the feds say EV's are out and (for random example) don't drink coffee well then rest assured, ICE cars and tea it is. From a business perspective that's rational but, since cars are turned over in the fleet fairly frequently, it means what's sold second hand to the public who'll get another decade or more use out of them is diesel not electric.

Governments have a role to lead by example in any situation.

 

[moXJO]

I see both sides of this one.

Consumers will buy what they want to buy. It's their money and their decision so long as it's legal.

But then rather a lot of vehicles are bought by fleets and I'm told that at least one company ditched it's EV fleet plans simply because they didn't want to risk getting themselves on the wrong side of the federal government with whom they have unavoidable dealings. If the feds say EV's are out and (for random example) don't drink coffee well then rest assured, ICE cars and tea it is. From a business perspective that's rational but, since cars are turned over in the fleet fairly frequently, it means what's sold second hand to the public who'll get another decade or more use out of them is diesel not electric.

Governments have a role to lead by example in any situation.

Plus side of being slow buggers: we get to watch other countries iron out the kinks of the transition. Servicing, training, after market parts, problems, locating charge points, not a lot of point being out in front. We can get a comprehensive look at the different strategies occurring and pick and choose.