Dump it Here

Ann · 12 January 2019

tech/a said:
All good.

Discretionary

6/10 at 3R wins
4/10 at .7R losses

Pretty tough I know!

Systematic

4/10 at 5.6 R wins and
6/10 a5 1 R losses

Tough again but long and short trading I’m happy.

Others may do better.

I’ve not seen any of your trades Ann so can’t comment on your trading ability.
You seem to have a good handle on vanilla T/A

Happiness is what it is all about Tech/a and it sounds like you have more than enough money to play with.

I tend not to chart or mention what I trade, I have a privacy issue as I use my real first name, If I mentioned two or three stocks I owned, it would be pretty easy to trace exactly who I am and where I live as I hold my stocks until they close me out or get bought out. One never knows these days with stalkers and what-knot. Just being prudent.

These days I get a profit from nearly 100% of my stock choices, provided I use just my 'vanilla' style. Where I risk a fail is if I want to veer from that path. I like to test stuff and I do that with my normal trading $10,000 a trade. For instance on one occassion I decided to trade on the MACD signal alone with STO....fail, lost 10% + brokerage. I then decided to do the same thing but working with as much FA as I could understand with MRM.....fail lost about 15% +brokerage. The only bad 'vanilla' pick was AMP, I saw a flag on a flagpole, thinking it would overcome a long term overhead falling resistance line and a double top....did not! SMASH! FAIL! About 10% plus brokerage.
Never ever will I trade into a long term overhead ever, ever again, lesson learned. But I knew that already and did it anyway, deserved the kicking. I think I was bleating about it here on the AMP thread. Blaming others for my own mistake of course!

Smurf1976 · 12 January 2019

Ann said:
I have a privacy issue as I use my real first name

Well you've beaten me.

I promise that I'm not really blue and white and wasn't marketing petrol ~40 years ago.

tech/a · 12 January 2019

Yeh I know what you mean
Try being a Duck!

Near 100% wins from the stocks you pick.
You seriously have the holy grail keep it very
Very close - that I’m sure is a certainty.

I bow to the best results a trader has ever mentioned.
Using vanilla T/A at that.

To be honest from your postings I’d have never picked it!

Ann · 12 January 2019

ducati916 said:
While Skate, I'm sure is quite capable of defending himself if he so chose, I will do so as in my short time of reading his posts I have found him to be exceptionally polite and patient.

Also there are some rather obvious lessons to be learned.

So:

"I was not expecting a diatribe from you just a simple response. "

I suggest you look up the meaning of the underlined word.

duc I now what diatribe means, it has several meanings and Skate is sufficiently eloquent to know them as well....amongst others, criticism, stricture, reproof, reproval, reprimand, rebuke, admonishment, admonition. This is how it sounded to me. A subjective interpretation based on the abnormal over-use of my name and not once answering a simple question of a few words with an equal simple response of a few words but basically saying I had no idea what I was talking about when none of the subjects where mentioned in my original simple question.

ducati916 said:
"Addressing me by name once is sufficient, twice is permissible any more than that sounds condescending. Avoid over using someone's name, it is rude and sounds manipulative."

I would disagree.

Your prerogative.

ducati916 said:
As a 'trader' you are self-employed. You are a 'business', unless you are employed to trade for someone [bank/hedge fund/etc].

On a bigger picture basis: without those who engage in business, we are back to hunting/gathering. Only through specialisation/diversification of production can we continue to consume: which by definition means someone has to create and run businesses. If you are an 'employee' you are employed by a business owner.

I buy stocks as an over all part of my investment portfolio. I do not regard it as a business as I don't employ anyone, I don't pay anyone a dividend and I don't draw a personal income from the investments. I roll the whole thing into more investments.
I have no problem if someone wishes to run a business for themselves. I have always loved being an employee, it is awesome.

ducati916 said:
"I learnt from my father running your own business was totally rdiculous and not worth the effort."

Such a generalisation is both ill-informed and disrespectful to those that do.

I believe I have a right to express how I feel about running a business from the experiences I went through living with my father, watching him swindle decent people out of their money and then turning his back on their pleadings. I am speaking about myself and my own experiences, where is that ill-informed or disrespectful?

ducati916 said:
"Loans are poison, you dance to another man and the economies tune.
When the relationship breaks down, often your family have no where else to go and no means to leave because all your assets are 'in the business'."

A 'loan' is a tool like any other. It can be prudent, it can be dangerous. Again, simply a generalisation without merit.

I lived with debt and its consequences all my childhood and came away with an abhorrence of debt in any form. Again I feel you are being unjust when I am explaining something to someone about my feelings and experiences to accuse me of 'a generalisation without merit'.

ducati916 said:
"Bingo, that is my #1 FA indicator for a strong business. See FA isn't so hard if you think about it Skate!"

As has been demonstrated on another thread, recognising legitimate cash-flow from simply cash-flow, is not as straightforward as one might imagine.

That was simply a little follow on between Skate and myself from a previous conversation and he would have fully understood its reference, aparently unlike yourself who is reading something out of context.

ducati916 said:
"There are some emotions I can't feel. Fear is one of them, it just converts to the feeling of power. I quite welcome failure, it is a great teacher."

Possibly you are unique in the human race.

No not at all. I would be one of those blokes who leaps over the wall into enemy fire to save a mate. There are ship loads of us.

ducati916 said:
"If you have fear, you clearly don't have confidence you know what you are doing. If you don't know what you are doing, don't trade."

Skate is referring to a 'business', not to trading. Even if it were 'trading' as a business, if you have quit your job, have taken your savings/loan/whatever and undertaken the business of trading, if your trade expectancy is below that initially contemplated and the rent/mortgage/bills/etc are due [as they always are], I would argue it is only natural to feel stress/fear.

If a person is not 100% confident trading and finds it fearful and stressful, I would strongly recommend they get another source of income, preferably working for someone else.

ducati916 said:
I would seriously consider tendering an apology to Skate.

Go right ahead duc!

Ann · 12 January 2019

tech/a said:
Yeh I know what you mean
Try being a Duck!

Near 100% wins from the stocks you pick.
You seriously have the holy grail keep it very
Very close - that I’m sure is a certainty.

I bow to the best results a trader has ever mentioned.
Using vanilla T/A at that.

To be honest from your postings I’d have never picked it!

It is not a holy grail tech/a it is just years and years of practice drawing support and resistance lines and deciding when an entry level is a good one, getting to know the 'feeling' of a chart. Once a support line is tested I like that as an entry point. If I try to trade on 'shapes' (AMP) I have tended not to do so well. I also look at the overall situation of the markets, I look at the sector of that particular stock I watch gold and oil as these are quite a driver for the markets, I watch the US bond price, the CRB index and a number of other things. All things are connected.

I don't want to make people think I am some sort of guru, I have seen the sort of damage gurus have done on other sites. I would rather be seen as a bit of a fool than drag anyone into this game with false hopes, it isn't easy and I don't want to make it look too easy. That is one of the reasons I tend to hang out charting in the Commodities, no one pays much attention to those. I never like to advise people on stock choices as I may be wrong for their style of trading or just wrong in general.

I will give you a for-instance with my current market investment thoughts. I was working on something most of today, the CRB Index. I feel it is about to fall, I have been watching it for many years. I went to the site to inspect who the actual stock constituents are for the CRB Index, amongst other things. There are a number of Australian stocks which will be very negatively impacted if the CRB falls. Two stocks I had just started to watch for my own portfolio were FMG and BSL. They are included in the CRB index. Having now seen that, I am going to step back a little, I never rush at my trades, no need. There is a high risk of a rapid downside for these two if the CRB fails, if it doesn't, fine. Like trams, there is always another perfectly good one coming along shortly. I only ever buy into the markets if I am in the right mental frame of mind and in reasonable health.

tech/a · 12 January 2019

And this returns you an almost 100% hit rate
Coupled with vanilla T/A

Impressive I doubt anyone else could do that!

ducati916 · 13 January 2019

Ann said:
1. duc I now what diatribe means, it has several meanings and Skate is sufficiently eloquent to know them as well....amongst others, criticism, stricture, reproof, reproval, reprimand, rebuke, admonishment, admonition. This is how it sounded to me. A subjective interpretation based on the abnormal over-use of my name and not once answering a simple question of a few words with an equal simple response of a few words but basically saying I had no idea what I was talking about when none of the subjects where mentioned in my original simple question.

2. I have no problem if someone wishes to run a business for themselves. I have always loved being an employee, it is awesome.

3. I believe I have a right to express how I feel about running a business from the experiences I went through living with my father, watching him swindle decent people out of their money and then turning his back on their pleadings. I am speaking about myself and my own experiences, where is that ill-informed or disrespectful?

4. I lived with debt and its consequences all my childhood and came away with an abhorrence of debt in any form. Again I feel you are being unjust when I am explaining something to someone about my feelings and experiences to accuse me of 'a generalisation without merit'.

5. No not at all. I would be one of those blokes who leaps over the wall into enemy fire to save a mate. There are ship loads of us.

6. If a person is not 100% confident trading and finds it fearful and stressful, I would strongly recommend they get another source of income, preferably working for someone else.

7. Go right ahead duc!

1. I have read [some] of Skate's posts. Invariably they are polite and well meaning. Any error of interpretation lies with the reader.

2. Unfortunately, that is not what was expressed.

3. Yes you have a right to express anything personal to yourself. No argument. That is however not what you did: you took your personal position and extrapolated it onto everyone else. That is disrespectful to those that are self-employed and run legitimate businesses.

4. Same argument as above.

5. And if you spoke to those people [most, if not all] would state that they were afraid while doing so. Bravery is overcoming the fear, not an absence of fear.

6. Which totally misses the point re. starting a business.

7. I will, apologies Skate for diluting your thread with off-topic issues.

jog on
duc

Skate · 13 January 2019

ducati916 said:
1. I have read [some] of Skate's posts. Invariably they are polite and well meaning. Any error of interpretation lies with the reader.

2. Unfortunately, that is not what was expressed.

3. Yes you have a right to express anything personal to yourself. No argument. That is however not what you did: you took your personal position and extrapolated it onto everyone else. That is disrespectful to those that are self-employed and run legitimate businesses.

4. Same argument as above.

5. And if you spoke to those people [most, if not all] would state that they were afraid while doing so. Bravery is overcoming the fear, not an absence of fear.

6. Which totally misses the point re. starting a business.

7. I will, apologies Skate for diluting your thread with off-topic issues.

jog on
duc

ducati916, you have nothing to apologise for, on the contrary your posts adds immense value to this thread. By taking a stance it shows your mettle to carry on & continue to express what you think, also it now allows me to express my views in a generic way for others to better understand.

First - my definition of mettle
Mettle is all about courage. If someone wants to "test your mettle," they want to see if you have the heart to follow through when the going gets tough & Duc, you have that in spades.

We all have beliefs & we are constantly expressing our beliefs both verbally and through our actions as perfectly illustrated by the preceding posts.

Furthermore, we are constantly interacting with other people’s beliefs as they express them.

What exactly does a belief do?
Our beliefs are an intricate part of our identity, the fact is none of us was born with any of our beliefs. They were all acquired in a combination of ways & sometimes by the way of a father figure.

Instilled by others
Many of the beliefs that have the most profound impact on our lives were not even acquired by us as an act of free will but instilled by other people & sometimes by force.

Negative implications
And it probably won't come as a surprise to anyone that usually the beliefs that cause us the most difficulty are those that were acquired from others without our conscious consent. By that I mean beliefs that we acquired when we were too young and uninformed to realise the negative implications of what we were being taught.

Our beliefs shape our lives
In the broadest sense, our beliefs shape the way we experience our lives.

Beliefs are acquired
As I have already said, we're not born with any of our beliefs. They're acquired, and as they accumulate, we live our lives in a way that reflects what we have learned to believe.

Perception
They manage our perception and interpretation of environmental information in a way that is consistent with what we believe. There isn't much about the way we function that beliefs don't play a major role in.

Reinforcement
Having negative beliefs reinforced when we are young will have major implications in our adult lives, our mental well-being that will profoundly impact our lives.

Skate.

Skate · 13 January 2019

Self-control
Self-control makes everyone more productive. However, we should repress our feelings of anxiety, fear, anger or sadness when making comments.

Biological impulses
We must acknowledge and understand our emotions for what they are. Like animals, biological impulses drive our emotions. There is no way to escape them, but we can learn to self-regulate our feelings and, in so doing, manage them.

Measured comments
Self-regulation is the ongoing inner conversation that emotionally intelligent engage in to be free from being prisoners of their feelings. If we are able to engage in such a conversation, we still feel bad moods and emotional impulses just as everyone else does, but we can learn to control them and even to channel them in useful ways.

Skate.

Skate · 13 January 2019

We come up with stories
When our ideas or beliefs are challenged we tend to be defensive & start to make up stories confirming why you are right & everyone else is wrong. We tell ourselves the same story over & over till we tend to believe our own bull$hit.

Mental struggles
Most of our stories relate to mental struggles, the mental gymnastics we all experience at some stage & the struggles normally relate to personal issues, like "we’re not where we want to be" and "I should be doing better than this" and it always relate to something outside our control, or our lack of some natural talent or ability. But talent and skill are two key elements to success attainable by anyone who is truly committed.

Nothing changes if nothing changes
You can get the skill if you can get beyond the mental limits of how hard, difficult, or “impossible” it may be to master something.

Self doubt
What matters is that you quell the uncertainty and doubt that pollutes your mind/decisions by planning ahead for all possibilities. We all need to simplify our lives in this increasingly noisy & cranky world. But even more critical, we need to remind ourselves to do nothing sometimes and just think about now.

Skate.

Ann · 13 January 2019

tech/a said:
And this returns you an almost 100% hit rate
Coupled with vanilla T/A

Impressive I doubt anyone else could do that!

They certainly could Tech/a, anyone. I have put up how I enter a stock on FMG. https://www.aussiestockforums.com/posts/1009612/
It is pretty much always the same way, not necessarily right at the bottom of a stock, it can be anywhere along the left side of the chart, same principles apply. It is basic, simple charting sticking to the KISS principle. For short sales, go to the right and read it in reverse.

Skate · 13 January 2019

Ann said:
They certainly could Tech/a, anyone. I have put up how I enter a stock on FMG. https://www.aussiestockforums.com/posts/1009612/
It is pretty much always the same way, not necessarily right at the bottom of a stock, it can be anywhere along the left side of the chart, same principles apply. It is basic, simple charting sticking to the KISS principle. For short sales, go to the right and read it in reverse.

Ann, would you please be kind enough to re-post your hyperlinked post in its entirety here in the 'Dump it here' thread please - others reading this thread would find your post very interesting, I'm sure of that. (this is what the 'Dump it here' thread is all about - educational material for beginners)

Skate.

Ann · 13 January 2019

Skate said:
Ann, would you please be kind enough to re-post your hyperlinked post in its entirety here in the 'Dump it here' thread please - others reading this thread would find your post very interesting, I'm sure of that. (this is what the 'Dump it here' thread is all about - educational material for beginners)

Skate.

That link is its entirety Skate, it links to my post from both my post here and your post where you just quoted my post. But this whole thing appears to be turning into a pissing contest and that is something I have avoided for the last 13 odd years I have been here. There should only ever be one guru per stockmarket forum otherwise it just confuses the punters who to follow! It sure the hell isn't going to be me.

Skate · 13 January 2019

Ann said:
That link is its entirety Skate, it links to my post from both my post here and your post where you just quoted my post. But this whole thing appears to be turning into a pissing contest and that is something I have avoided for the last 13 odd years I have been here. There should only ever be one guru per stockmarket forum otherwise it just confuses the punters who to follow! It sure the hell isn't going to be me.

Sorry Ann, your post is very valuable for the 'Dump it here' thread as its gives an insight how others trade - there is no right or wrong method when it comes to trading, what works for you might not work for others, it's for the reader to decide.

Instead or contesting your method of trading it would be better for others to explain an alternative, or their methodology when it comes to their trading style - as peter2 has done in his thread.

Skate.

Ann · 13 January 2019

Skate said:
Sorry Ann, your post is very valuable for the 'Dump it here' thread as its gives an insight how others trade - there is no right or wrong method when it comes to trading, what works for you might not work for others, it's for the reader to decide.

Instead or contesting your method of trading it would be better for others to explain an alternative, or their methodology when it comes to their trading style - as peter2 has done in his thread.

Skate.

.....Love Peter2 and another great poster who was wonderfully patient trying to teach me the Elliot Wave....Porper. These guys are great! Always stop to read them if they pop up.

tech/a · 13 January 2019

Ann
If you make a claim expect to be
Taken up on it.

No pissing contest.

I’m just looking for evidence that vanilla T/A can return near to 100%
Winning trades.
In 25 years countless hrs with Quants a fair circle of professional traders
Directly and in directly —- your claim is at 180 degrees to everyone in the field of trading.

Your claim —— if you can’t back it up why make it in the first place?
Why make statements like you wouldn’t trade with % wins like I report or indeed 50%.

Those types of statements warrant further investigation and a trader with such an amazing result is to be revered if they can demonstrate it.

We will all learn
So please go ahead!

Ann · 13 January 2019

tech/a said:
Ann
If you make a claim expect to be
Taken up on it.

No pissing contest.

I’m just looking for evidence that vanilla T/A can return near to 100%
Winning trades.
In 25 years countless hrs with Quants a fair circle of professional traders
Directly and in directly —- your claim is at 180 degrees to everyone in the field of trading.

Your claim —— if you can’t back it up why make it in the first place?
Why make statements like you wouldn’t trade with % wins like I report or indeed 50%.

Those types of statements warrant further investigation and a trader with such an amazing result is to be revered if they can demonstrate it.

We will all learn
So please go ahead!

The thing is Tech/a, I don't want to be revered. I leave that for others with a greater need than myself.

tech/a · 13 January 2019

Very disappointing.
I really thought there was another T/A
On this forum who had something of value to contribute.

Unfortunately claims like yours give T/A a bad name.
Particularly when claims/methods cannot be substantiated.

It just makes it look like bullshite.

Ann · 13 January 2019

tech/a said:
Very disappointing.
I really thought there was another T/A
On this forum who had something of value to contribute.

Unfortunately claims like yours give T/A a bad name.
Particularly when claims/methods cannot be substantiated.

It just makes it look like bullshite.

Well life is just full of little disappointments and bullsh!t Tech/a. It is up to all of us to gain from others where we may.

peter2 · 13 January 2019

@Ann Thank you for your compliment.

Let me return the compliment by saying that I enjoy seeing your charts with longer term lines. I rarely look at yearly trend lines as I'm focused on the smaller time frames.

My "dump" for skate is to never overlook the bigger picture even if we're only trading short time frames.

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