Australia’s $911,000,000,000 Debt

[Value Collector]

Back 20 years ago gender delineation was rare.

It's always been there, it's just people used to have to hide their true self. Now they can be more open. I think it will make for a happy society, in the past LGBTQ people communities suffered very high rates of suicide, hopefully being able to express that side of them selves if good for their mental heath.

 

[farmerge]

More prevalent now.

Back 20 years ago gender delineation was rare.
I remember an Excavator operator --- Kevin--Wanted
to be called Natalie---dressed like Natalie and Looked
like Kevin Tatts and all. Copped a lot but never changed.

I'm surprised at how many guys wear Makeup. Particularly
Mascara!

I certainly must move around in a different circle. Where I work and those that I deal with are either definitely blokes or sheilas.

 

[farmerge]

It's always been there, it's just people used to have to hide their true self. Now they can be more open. I think it will make for a happy society, in the past LGBTQ people communities suffered very high rates of suicide, hopefully being able to express that side of them selves if good for their mental heath.

I have no issue with what people want or prefer.
What I don't like is having it shoved under my nose and having you must accept this.
My son has just sent another of the companys e-mails to me about this.
A department dedicated to "pride"
They don't contribute to the bottom line only to their hip pocket, or where ever they keep their wallets.

 

[wayneL]

It's not that hard to grasp, its just basically referring to your colleagues in a way they want to be referred to. Its not that different from forms that ask your "Name", but also have a section to write your "Preferred name".

I used to work with a guy who's name was Ruban, he hated it, he wanted us to call him Jim, so we called him Jim regardless of what it said on his birth certificate, its not that hard to be Kind.

It's no different with gender, if someone wants you to refer to them as a she or he or they just do it, regardless of what the birth certificate suggests, it's just polite and kind.

I have no problem with preferred names and will even humour he/she under sufferance, in order to be kind.

I will never ever, under any circumstance is however prostitute my language and good grammar with they/them (unless referring to people in plural). Even less so made up BS pronouns like Zhe/Zher.

It's not kind, it's @#$&ing stupid.

 

[tech/a]

I certainly must move around in a different circle. Where I work and those that I deal with are either definitely blokes or sheilas.

I'm in the Civil industry.
Men are men and even the men who are not
wanting the be identified as men
you wouldn't mess with.

My experience is that girls in this industry are girls
and all men of whatever leaning look after the girls.
Men are men even when they do not want to be identified
as men when it comes to all women! Well, that's my observation.

 

[Value Collector]

I will never ever, under any circumstance is however prostitute my language and good grammar with they/them (unless referring to people in plural). Even less so made up BS pronouns like Zhe/Zher.

It's not kind, it's @#$&ing stupid.

But we always use "They" and "Them" to refer to single people when we don't want to use their gender.

For example, its perfectly normal to say something like.

"The author of that post made a mistake when they wrote your instead of you're"
"does your boss want me to get them a coffee? how do they have it"

Because we aren't referring or don't know to the authors or bosses gender, we don't have to say He or She, so we say they or them. I don't know why thats an issue, or why some people decide thats the hill they want to die on.

 

[Value Collector]

I certainly must move around in a different circle. Where I work and those that I deal with are either definitely blokes or sheilas.

the odds are if you have met more than 50 people, you have met an LGBTQ person, whether they are public about it is another story, most you wouldn't even know, because they hide their true self.

 

[wayneL]

But we always use "They" and "Them" to refer to single people when we don't want to use their gender.

For example, its perfectly normal to say something like.
"The author of that post made a mistake when they wrote your instead of you're"

Because we don't know the authors gender, we can't say He or She, so we say they. I don't know why thats an issue, or why some people decide thats the hill they want to die on.

In that specific instance is correct grammar.

I will never use they/them inappropriately.

And believe me I ain't dying on any hill, just refusing to participate in nonsense.

 

[Value Collector]

.

I will never use they/them inappropriately.

I don't think any one is asking you too.

As you can see we always refer to single people using they or them, when we don't refer to gender its not strange, all some people are taking is not to be referred to as a he or she, and prefer you to use they or them as in the example above.

eg. "does your boss want me to get them a coffee? how do they have it"

just imagine for a second that you don't know a persons gender, the correct sentence should come to your mind.

 

[wayneL]

I don't think any one is asking you too.

As you can see we always refer to single people using they or them, when we don't refer to gender its not strange, all some people are taking is not to be referred to as a he or she, and prefer you to use they or them as in the example above.

eg. "does your boss want me to get them a coffee? how do they have it

You are not using relevant examples.

However, I am prepared to use it/that

 

[frugal.rock]

Who ya crappin' on off topic with Wayne? ?
Rhetorical question, no answer required.

 

[Value Collector]

You are not using relevant examples.

However, I am prepared to use it/that

They aren’t irrelevant examples, I think they are exact examples of how people that don’t want to identify as a gender would prefer to be referred to.

Can you supply me with an example of regular speech you are talking about where “he” or “she”can not be replaced with “they”

But, you said you would never refer to singular people as they or them, I am just pointing out that you probably already do.

I think you might have listened to to many angry talking heads that are upset about gender issues, and who wrongly assume that they and them isn’t a natural way to talk, like piers Morgan who basically said exactly what you said, and then later went on and used those terms anyway because that’s how we all talk.

 

[wayneL]

They aren’t irrelevant examples, I think they are exact examples of how people that don’t want to identify as a gender would prefer to be referred to.

Can you supply me with an example of regular speech you are talking about where “he” or “she”can not be replaced with “they”

But, you said you would never refer to singular people as they or them, I am just pointing out that you probably already do.

I think you might have listened to to many angry talking heads that are upset about gender issues, and who wrongly assume that they and them isn’t a natural way to talk, like piers Morgan who basically said exactly what you said, and then later went on and used those terms anyway because that’s how we all talk.

Ferchrissake. LoL

Akshually, analysing my and mrs' s speech patterns with wood almost never use they in those circumstances.

In any case that is only reserved for someone unknown and unseen, if ever used that way.

"'They' is going to the shop" is both poor/incorrect grammar and ridiculous in the extreme and an assault on the language.

 

[Value Collector]

Ferchrissake. LoL

Akshually, analysing my and mrs' s speech patterns with wood almost never use they in those circumstances.

In any case that is only reserved for someone unknown and unseen, if ever used that way.

"'They' is going to the shop" is both poor/incorrect grammar and ridiculous in the extreme and an assault on the language.

You would simply say “They are going to the ship”, see it’s easy as pie.

I bet you and your mrs use it all the time.

Imagine one night you wife said in an alarmed voice “He there is a person in the back yard”

I bet you might reply some like “what are they doing? Get the rifle I am going to shoot Them”

My wife and we’re at the shopping centre car park today and she saw some one throw rubbish out their car.

She quite naturally said “why would They do that”

 

[wayneL]

You would simply say “They are going to the ship”, see it’s easy as pie.

I bet you and your mrs use it all the time.

Imagine one night you wife said in an alarmed voice “He there is a person in the back yard”

I bet you might reply some like “what are they doing? Get the rifle I am going to shoot Them”

My wife and we’re at the shopping centre car park today and she saw some one throw rubbish out their car.

She quite naturally said “why would They do that”

Sorry, that's profoundly stupid and I ain't doing it.

 

[farmerge]

the odds are if you have met more than 50 people, you have met an LGBTQ person, whether they are public about it is another story, most you wouldn't even know, because they hide their true self.

I have worked for quite a few LGBTQ's over the years.
Anything but shy about themselves.
Genuinely very nice and pleasant people to deal with, and have never with me anyway pushed their barrow.

 

[wayneL]

I have worked for quite a few LGBTQ's over the years.
Anything but shy about themselves.
Genuinely very nice and pleasant people to deal with, and have never with me anyway pushed their barrow.

Profound, and totally my experience too. There's HEAPS of *LGB* folks in the horsey world. (Plus a lot of stuff that would make even Jilly Cooper blush). Including many clients and many of whom I would consider friends.

None profess any personal pronouns other than what their biological sex is. Apart from one gay guy who was interchangeably refered to as either he or she, but it was no big deal. (Partner of my best friend's brother, unfortunately passed away quite young).

It's actually quite entertaining, the juxtaposition between gays and straights and the resulting good humoured banter.

IME these people aren't so keen on the politics of rest of the alphabet soup and really quite embarrassed by the pride month excesses.

It really is a non issue, the least interesting thing about people in our sport and nobody gives a crap.

FWIW

 

[Value Collector]

Sorry, that's profoundly stupid and I ain't doing it.

What is stupid about it, You already do it, when ever you don’t know some one’s gender, you already naturally say they and them. It’s so normal you don’t even realise you are doing it.

You can refer to some one as “it” if you like, but they will and every one else will know you are intentionally trying to be rude, because as I showed it’s just not normal Australian speech to refer to a person as it, but it is quite normal to refer to people as they.

 

[Value Collector]

I have worked for quite a few LGBTQ's over the years.
Anything but shy about themselves.
Genuinely very nice and pleasant people to deal with, and have never with me anyway pushed their barrow.

So what’s the issue, if one of them that you worked with regularly said “hey Farmerge, would you mind if in the future you referred to me as she/her rather than he/him” would that really be such a big deal?

And if a company knew that they had people amongst their work force that felt that way is it really a big issue to try make a record of that so they can respect that persons wishes on company communications?

The people that are against it are really making mountains out of mole hills really.

 

[wayneL]

What is stupid about it, You already do it, when ever you don’t know some one’s gender, you already naturally say they and them. It’s so normal you don’t even realise you are doing it.

You can refer to some one as “it” if you like, but they will and every one else will know you are intentionally trying to be rude, because as I showed it’s just not normal Australian speech to refer to a person as it, but it is quite normal to refer to people as they.

You are being disingenuous and unintelligent. My example was clear enough.

It's stupid at best and intentional division at worst.