Australia Day

[sptrawler]

Current date just doesn't represent Australia that's before you get to Aboriginals being against it as I said before if people want to celebrate the start of the British penal colony no big deal that's great but it doesn't represent today's modern Australia, just change the date to celebrate the day end of problem.

You pose a really good question, which of our public holidays do represent today's Australia?

Christmas and Easter, I have heard you lambast Christians, as have I, so is that also a relic of a bygone era, that is no longer reflective of modern Australia?

Let's be honest the Muslims, Hindu's and Sihks are much more respectful of their religion, so maybe their holy days are more appropriate when they make up a large number of the population.

The Kings birthday, well as you say :
Its along the same lines as Charles is our head of state FFS maybe one day we will grow up.

So are they actually a left over from a bygone era and in the name of honesty, self respect and common decency aren't we being hypocritical acknowledging them and taking a paid day off work to honor them? Aren't we just taking the pizz and the money because we are entitled?

HMMM maybe the public holidays do represent today's modern Australian's, more than we realise.

 

[Knobby22]

Current date just doesn't represent Australia that's before you get to Aboriginals being against it as I said before if people want to celebrate the start of the British penal colony no big deal that's great but it doesn't represent today's modern Australia, just change the date to celebrate the day end of problem.

It celebrates the first offshore detention centre, a proud tradition that we still continue today

 

[IFocus]

It celebrates the first offshore detention centre, a proud tradition that we still continue today

That's very good knobby

 

[IFocus]

I don't disagree with that, but what if another group disagree with the next date, then as Christians become a minority why wouldn't we change Christmas, or indeed Easter ?

At the end of the day where do you delineate which groups are more deserving, changing dates IMO is problematic and to a degree pandering to minority pressure.

They do have issue, so incorporate it with another holiday that is recognised as being representative of Australian spirit, like ANZAC day maybe.
To change it to a day that represents nothing, doesn't instill patriotism it tips our hat to tokenism and shallowness.

If it was Anzac day, it actually represents something all Australians should be proud of loyalty, respect, bravery and mateship and give a time to reflect on what it means to call yourself Australian rather than just a member of the lucky country.

What group in Australia does the 26th represent and how?

 

[wayneL]

What group in Australia does the 26th represent and how?

Everyone

 

[sptrawler]

What group in Australia does the 26th represent and how?

Boxing Day, celebrated on December 26th, is a public holiday in Australia, following the Christmas celebrations for Western Christians. This day has its roots in British history, where it was traditionally a day to give 'Christmas boxes' to service workers.


Just the poms looking after people as usual.

Same as the long service leave, that Australians get.

And the welfare system that means they dont have to sell bintang tee shirts on the beach to buy food as some other invaders made them do.

 

[Knobby22]

That's very good knobby

Yea Aussie humour, dry and deprecating. Yanks and poms don't really get it.

Went to an Australian day celebration in the country town of Gisborne today as they had moved it from the 26th. Full of locals and kids, a lot of elderly people. Typical elites. There I go again with the humour.

You have top Australians such as Captain Cummins say we should pick a less divisive day. Not that hard.

My bet it will be the Libs that move the date when they next get in. Labor have nothing to gain by changing it. So we will have at least another 7 years of foreign media bitching.

 

[farmerge]

How would you feel if someone cut down your front doors? After all, it’s not your land that you have decided to put your possessions on. Right?

@JohnDe Well, that is the 1st people's belief. which I don't agree with.

 

[sptrawler]

As I've said all along, it is time to actually ask the indigenous what they want in the way of compensation.

All this poncing on is nonsense, all Governments talk about is we will do this, we will do that.

As I keep saying, the indigenous feel they had their land stolen, they want compensation for loss.

Ask them exactly what they feel they are owed and come to an agreement, done, over, move on.

It goes onto the national debt bill, taxes are raised and it is put into the historical journals.

Once done, always will be, it is just like an NBN, or an NDIS, or a better schools, do it move on.

It isn't as though the compensation will be sent to a Swiss bank account, or through some offshore tax haven.

Well no doubt some will, but the majority will be spent in Australia and some of it will help the remote aboriginals, probably not much, but some.
it just needs to be done IMO, as I said in the beginning of the voice thread, the issue will not go away with anything other than compensation, like it or not.
Hawke promised it, Rudd waffled about it as Rudd does, Albo tried to sell a bunny and no one bought it.

Just get on with it, get a line in the sand on what the indigenous think is fair and reasonable and work from there, get it out in the open and transparent.
I'm sure everyone is over it and everyone needs to know what the bottom line is to bury the issue and allow indigenous to be treated the same as the rest of the population.
Rather than being an unfunded bottomless pit, with very little to show for it.

The Australian public deserve that, rather than the constant stress and angst perpetrated by political and media shaming.
Be honest and up front, and explain what the indigenous feel is fair compensation, above and beyond what they already receive.

At the end of the day, we can afford to pay $300billion for subs, just in case, so sorting out an clear and present issue shouldn't be an issue, just move the tax scales back up.

 

[wayneL]

As I've said all along, it is time to actually ask the indigenous what they want in the way of compensation.

All this poncing on is nonsense, all Governments talk about is we will do this, we will do that.

As I keep saying, the indigenous feel they had their land stolen, they want compensation for loss.

Ask them exactly what they feel they are owed and come to an agreement, done, over, move on.

It goes onto the national debt bill, taxes are raised and it is put into the historical journals.

Once done, always will be, it is just like an NBN, or an NDIS, or a better schools, do it move on.

It isn't as though the compensation will be sent to a Swiss bank account, or through some offshore tax haven.

Well no doubt some will, but the majority will be spent in Australia and some of it will help the remote aboriginals, probably not much, but some.
it just needs to be done IMO, as I said in the beginning of the voice thread, the issue will not go away with anything other than compensation, like it or not.
Hawke promised it, Rudd waffled about it as Rudd does, Albo tried to sell a bunny and no one bought it.

Just get on with it, get a line in the sand on what the indigenous think is fair and reasonable and work from there, get it out in the open and transparent.
I'm sure everyone is over it and everyone needs to know what the bottom line is to bury the issue and allow indigenous to be treated the same as the rest of the population.
Rather than being an unfunded bottomless pit, with very little to show for it.

The Australian public deserve that, rather than the constant stress and angst perpetrated by political and media shaming.
Be honest and up front, and explain what the indigenous feel is fair compensation, above and beyond what they already receive.

At the end of the day, we can afford to pay $300billion for subs, just in case, so sorting out an clear and present issue shouldn't be an issue, just move the tax scales back up.

I profoundly and vehemently disagree on about 10,000 levels. That will be the end of this already FUBAR country.

AFUERA

 

[farmerge]

As I've said all along, it is time to actually ask the indigenous what they want in the way of compensation.

All this poncing on is nonsense, all Governments talk about is we will do this, we will do that.

As I keep saying, the indigenous feel they had their land stolen, they want compensation for loss.

Ask them exactly what they feel they are owed and come to an agreement, done, over, move on.

It goes onto the national debt bill, taxes are raised and it is put into the historical journals.

Once done, always will be, it is just like an NBN, or an NDIS, or a better schools, do it move on.

It isn't as though the compensation will be sent to a Swiss bank account, or through some offshore tax haven.

Well no doubt some will, but the majority will be spent in Australia and some of it will help the remote aboriginals, probably not much, but some.
it just needs to be done IMO, as I said in the beginning of the voice thread, the issue will not go away with anything other than compensation, like it or not.
Hawke promised it, Rudd waffled about it as Rudd does, Albo tried to sell a bunny and no one bought it.

Just get on with it, get a line in the sand on what the indigenous think is fair and reasonable and work from there, get it out in the open and transparent.
I'm sure everyone is over it and everyone needs to know what the bottom line is to bury the issue and allow indigenous to be treated the same as the rest of the population.
Rather than being an unfunded bottomless pit, with very little to show for it.

The Australian public deserve that, rather than the constant stress and angst perpetrated by political and media shaming.
Be honest and up front, and explain what the indigenous feel is fair compensation, above and beyond what they already receive.

At the end of the day, we can afford to pay $300billion for subs, just in case, so sorting out an clear and present issue shouldn't be an issue, just move the tax scales back up.

Hmmm not too sure about all of this.
How about finding out what and where the mountain of dollars already goes and where it is spent, before handing over even more.

 

[Knobby22]

New Zealand has Waitangi Day as their National holiday.
USA has Independence Day.
France has Bastille day.
Switzerland's National Day goes back to 1291 when they signed the Federation!
The UK get by without a National Day which to me is actually pretty cool. Such self confidence!

I know we haven't got any big event day we can fall back on that marks us as becoming a nation (except 1 Jan but no one wants to lose a holiday) but surely we can pick something that everyone can be happy with. Maybe 1st September, Wattle Day?

February would be the ideal month and I looked up events in this month and there was nothing! One of the biggest was when the UK recognised degrees from our Universities! Says it all really.

 

[orr]

How would you feel if someone cut down your front doors? After all, it’s not your land that you have decided to put your possessions on. Right?

Oblivious to the irony of his post;
The 'doors' were cut down on a home occupied for tens of thousands of years and a uniformed oppreative of a european crime family gabbered in a unitelagble language 'it's ours now ' ..... Two hundred years later that Legal fiction was annulled, The Damage Done. A semblance of title was returned.
Title .... just like I have over my frount doors. Legal Title.
And so the bloke who best symbolises that theft under the lie of 'terra-nullius', lionized by those thin skinned and ignorant of anything more than a cursory knowledge their own countries history, gets a little bit of rough treatment in an attempt shake awake people living in a self centred mystical fantasy.

And Trawler to #58; that's a ham, cheese and pineapple sandwich (think pizza)... I can add some more hints if you're still having trouble.
what about? .... 'book him Danno, murder one'
more pertinant... 'this day will live in infamy'
There's more than one place you can cut down a Cook.

 

[orr]

Current date just doesn't represent Australia that's before you get to Aboriginals being against it as I said before if people want to celebrate the start of the British penal colony no big deal that's great but it doesn't represent today's modern Australia, just change the date to celebrate the day end of problem.

Hand me a magic wand Focus... I'd make it two days, if Xmas can have two and Easter.
If we take the 26th Jan, it is a point of delineation, there was no going back.
So if we take 25-26 Jan, The 25 to know what was: 26 aspiration for what can be.

 

[JohnDe]

Oblivious to the irony of his post;
The 'doors' were cut down on a home occupied for tens of thousands of years

And that is how civilisation evolved. From the first human that decided to walk out of the protection of the cave and cross the river to explore the other side. The first humans to paddle across the ocean to find a new island.

The irony you describe is a drop in the ocean compared to the age of civilisation. It is obvious that you enjoy the life you have in this great country, given to you by thousands of generations exploring the world and developing our knowledge.

List of ancient civilizations

This is an alphabetically ordered list of ancient civilizations. It includes types of cultures, traditions, and industries as well as more traditionally defined

www.britannica.com

 

[qldfrog]

As I've said all along, it is time to actually ask the indigenous what they want in the way of compensation.

All this poncing on is nonsense, all Governments talk about is we will do this, we will do that.

As I keep saying, the indigenous feel they had their land stolen, they want compensation for loss.

Ask them exactly what they feel they are owed and come to an agreement, done, over, move on.

It goes onto the national debt bill, taxes are raised and it is put into the historical journals.

Once done, always will be, it is just like an NBN, or an NDIS, or a better schools, do it move on.

It isn't as though the compensation will be sent to a Swiss bank account, or through some offshore tax haven.

Well no doubt some will, but the majority will be spent in Australia and some of it will help the remote aboriginals, probably not much, but some.
it just needs to be done IMO, as I said in the beginning of the voice thread, the issue will not go away with anything other than compensation, like it or not.
Hawke promised it, Rudd waffled about it as Rudd does, Albo tried to sell a bunny and no one bought it.

Just get on with it, get a line in the sand on what the indigenous think is fair and reasonable and work from there, get it out in the open and transparent.
I'm sure everyone is over it and everyone needs to know what the bottom line is to bury the issue and allow indigenous to be treated the same as the rest of the population.
Rather than being an unfunded bottomless pit, with very little to show for it.

The Australian public deserve that, rather than the constant stress and angst perpetrated by political and media shaming.
Be honest and up front, and explain what the indigenous feel is fair compensation, above and beyond what they already receive.

At the end of the day, we can afford to pay $300billion for subs, just in case, so sorting out an clear and present issue shouldn't be an issue, just move the tax scales back up.

Just a note..we can not afford the subs..even less breaking that country further apart..but I genuinely it is already done since a certain referendum .
us vs them

 

[sptrawler]

And Trawler to #58; that's a ham, cheese and pineapple sandwich (think pizza)... I can add some more hints if you're still having trouble.
what about? .... 'book him Danno, murder one'
more pertinant... 'this day will live in infamy'
There's more than one place you can cut down a Cook.

The other positive is you can say anything you like and no one will say anything anyway, that's the plus of you guys owning the stage.

Alan Joyce played that stage like a fiddle, but in the long run it didn't gain him any friends, allies or support, as was shown when the cheer went up at his leaving.
Enjoy the moment, I think in the end the indigenous will get a payout and I also think they will lose more than they will gain.
Time will tell.

 

[sptrawler]

Hand me a magic wand Focus... I'd make it two days, if Xmas can have two and Easter.
If we take the 26th Jan, it is a point of delineation, there was no going back.
So if we take 25-26 Jan, The 25 to know what was: 26 aspiration for what can be.

What you actually work.

 

[JohnDe]

Hand me a magic wand Focus... I'd make it two days, if Xmas can have two and Easter.
If we take the 26th Jan, it is a point of delineation, there was no going back.
So if we take 25-26 Jan, The 25 to know what was: 26 aspiration for what can be.

Contemporary Australians, and particularly the young, tend to view the early settlement solely through the prism of colonisation and dispossession. Many others have absorbed the gulag myth propagated by Hughes, who wilfully confused the harshness of the places of secondary punishment – such as Port Arthur, Norfolk Island and Moreton Bay – with conditions and practices in the main settlements.

The untold story of the Australian revolution carries its freight – moral, political, philosophical – into our century. It suggests that individuals, and entire societies, can be improved by improving their conditions; that work and purpose are, in fact, morally uplifting.

It illuminates some of the causes of social misery, as well as some of the cures. It’s an optimistic, and a badly needed, tale.

This cheering vision of what has often been seen as an infernal colony, shouldn’t skew towards utopianism. In its broad outlines the convict experience was, as Darwin put it, about remaking, conversion and elevation. But it was, nevertheless, at heart, a form of extreme punishment for mostly petty offences. For many coveys the pursuit of freedom, despite the considerable risks, was preferable to the rigidities of indentured servitude. They escaped – even from the strictly supervised chain gangs – into the bush. Many perished there.

The reason, I think, that French observers were keen to stress the philosophical implications of the Australian revolution – the wonderfully named Hyacinthe de Bougainville also makes this point during his visit of 1825 – is that the French Revolution had been so heavily freighted with unrealised, or betrayed idealism. They were attuned to the sentiments of equality and fraternity. But they had lived through bloodshed, repression and, at the end of it all, the heady swell of Bonapartism and the restoration of a repressive monarchy. What they observed at Sydney Cove was the realisation of humane social ideas without any espousal of those ideals: a revolution without a Robespierre; a revolution without a guillotine.

It was not, of course, a revolution without bloodshed. Or violence, in the form of dispossession. Or murder, on both sides. But it would be facile to reduce the one story – the celebratory story with a powerful contemporary resonance – to the other. To reduce everything to black and white. Sophisticated cultures deal with complex origin stories of many strands.

Luke Slattery is the author of four works of non-fiction and one of fiction.

 

[Smurf1976]

Current date just doesn't represent Australia that's before you get to Aboriginals being against it as I said before if people want to celebrate the start of the British penal colony no big deal that's great but it doesn't represent today's modern Australia, just change the date to celebrate the day end of problem.

I doubt many have any real attachment to 26 January as the date. So long as they get a public holiday, preferably a long weekend, and it's at a time of year when the weather's good then they'll be happy.

Trouble is we're in an environment where rational debate, on any subject, has become all but impossible and where both sides seek to grab all they can get. That leads directly to a situation where change is likely to be opposed no matter what it is simply due to "thin end of the wedge" type fears.

That isn't unique to this issue, it applies to practically everything and has effectively killed old style "progressive" politics completely since it relied upon the ability to challenge conventional wisdom, it relied on people being willing to listen to ideas they strongly disagreed with, it relied upon the media being willing to run stories despite their journalists and editors strongly disagreeing with the message, and so on. All that's now gone because "you offended me and you can't do that" which has outright killed debate.

As a friend who's long been involved in the conservation movement said to me a while ago, if today's situation had prevailed decades ago then every last creek would've been dammed, every forest would've been cleared and so on simply because rational debate and challenging conventional wisdom is all but impossible today. Indeed that itself cuts close to the bone - in today's context the idea that two individuals with opposing views on various matters could in practice be friends is anathema to many. We just avoid certain subjects and all's well in that sense.