American Politics

[basilio]

Interesting twist on the FTX - Sam Bankman- Fried story.
One of the BIG screams a couple of weeks ago was from Republicans who declared he was just a Democrat stooge and that the Dems should give up the millions of allegedly stolen funds.

You know where this going don't ya ? Yep Sammy boy flicked the same amount of money to the Republicans. He just did it anonymously because he didn't want the blow back from the "liberal" press.

FTX billionaire Sam Bankman-Fried funneled dark money to Republicans​

The crypto entrepreneur was thought to be a big donor to Democrats but now acknowledges he gave equally to GOP

Sam Bankman-Fried said most of his donations to Republicans were not publicly disclosed. Photograph: Saul Loeb/AFP/Getty Images

Dominic Rushe

@dominicru
Thu 1 Dec 2022 04.20 AEDTLast modified on Fri 2 Dec 2022 03.09 AEDT

The fall of crypto billionaire Sam Bankman-Fried has been painted as a big blow to the Democratic party, whose candidates were major beneficiaries of his largesse. But in a new interview, Bankman-Fried has claimed he gave equally large amounts of money to Republicans.
“I donated to both parties. I donated about the same amount to both parties,” Bankman-Fried told the crypto commentator and citizen journalist Tiffany Fong.

“All my Republican donations were dark,” he said, referring to political donations that are not publicly disclosed. “The reason was not for regulatory reasons, it’s because reporters freak the xuck out if you donate to Republicans. They’re all super liberal, and I didn’t want to have that fight.”
Bankman-Fried’s undisclosed donations were made possible by the supreme court’s 2010 decision in the Citizens United case, which allowed donors to give anonymously and has led to more than $1bn being poured into federal elections since 2010.

FTX billionaire Sam Bankman-Fried funneled dark money to Republicans

The crypto entrepreneur was thought to be a big donor to Democrats but now acknowledges he gave equally to GOP

www.theguardian.com

 

[basilio]

It's called democracy.

He can present his views and if enough people vote for him and his people then he can do what he likes.

Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Really ? You actually believe that or are you just deep sea fishing ?
Does the words Constitution or Laws mean much if anything to you ?

Maybe countries have such details just to ensure that lying megalomaniacs like Trump don't get into power.

 

[The Triangle]

Really ? You actually believe that or are you just deep sea fishing ?
Does the words Constitution or Laws mean much if anything to you ?

Maybe countries have such details just to ensure that lying megalomaniacs like Trump don't get into power.

I see trump has expanded the real-estate in your head to include a new 36-hole golf course. Looks great.

Just because you hate Trump doesn't mean you can silence him or throw him in jail without charges or conviction. Pretending to act shocked at anything Trump says or does at this stage..... c'mon.

Trump can say whatever he wants as long as it's not defamation or some other crime. And if what he says is a crime then he will be charged. And if Trump wants to run for office, then he can run for office under whatever opinions and views he wants to have, and people are free to vote for or against him. You know full well that's how the system works.

If Trump wants to run on a scrap the constitution platform, then you should be happy for him because he'll have no hope of getting elected again.

 

[basilio]

I see trump has expanded the real-estate in your head to include a new 36-hole golf course. Looks great.

Just because you hate Trump doesn't mean you can silence him or throw him in jail without charges or conviction. Pretending to act shocked at anything Trump says or does at this stage..... c'mon.

Trump can say whatever he wants as long as it's not defamation or some other crime. And if what he says is a crime then he will be charged. And if Trump wants to run for office, then he can run for office under whatever opinions and views he wants to have, and people are free to vote for or against him. You know full well that's how the system works.

If Trump wants to run on a scrap the constitution platform, then you should be happy for him because he'll have no hope of getting elected again.

Ok so perhaps you genuinely don't understand (or care about) what a Parliamentary democracy means and the various elements that underpin it.
A critical element is an agreed process for the transfer of political power on the basis of free and fair elections. Without that acceptance by the political parties the system is open to exactly what Trump has been doing since he won the 2016 election :

1) Denigrating the electoral system before the election as corrupt if he didn't get elected.
2) Refusing to accept the results of the election and declaring he had won. There are legal processes to investigate any claims of fraud in elections. Trump made 60 court applications questioning the results. Every one was found unsubstantiated. Nonetheless he still maintains that white is black.
3) Attempting to stop the transfer of political power to the newly elected Government. He used his position to call his supporters to Congress on January 6th 2021 and, as the incumbent President, allowed the mob to charge through Congress with threats to kill the Vice President and stop the swearing in of the new Government. This action is called sedition - trying to overthrow the government. To date a number of the leaders of the Jan 6th mob have been found guilty of this crime. More are facing trial. Donald Trump also faces this possibility.

The system of parliamentary democracy needs the participants to play by the rules and conventions that underpin this type of government. Destroying these conventions undermines the whole democratic system.

Some background on Principles of Democracy.

7. Control over the abuse of power​

Democracy can only survive if everyone buys in – the citizens through their support on voting day and all other times of year, and politicians by playing by the rules and working to improve the lives of everyone. Abuse of power occurs when a government decides it is above the law, when politicians believe a different set of rules apply to them, when the levers of the state are moved to favor only a certain segment of society at the expense of others, or when public money is funneled into accounts of corrupt leaders and their friends. We see this often in the world’s “democracies” and increasingly so in Europe too.

There are ways to insulate democracy from such abuse, but there is no way to protect it completely. Diffusing powers across different branches of government helps to hold them all to account, for example. Protecting free and fair elections are also important. This includes protecting independent media so citizens can get good information in the lead up to voting, and means protecting election laws to make sure the process is fair.

11. Free and fair elections​

Change should be considered a natural and healthy feature of democracy. As the government exists to serve the people, and public opinion shifts all the time on all sorts of issues, it is only natural that elections will produce different results at different times. So it is essential that these elections occur freely and fairly. This means that people are given good and accurate information before voting, and that they are free to discuss and debate it. It also means that on election day, people have equal access to the polls, that everyone’s vote has the same value, and that all votes are counted. Moreover, elections shouldn’t come irregularly or be called whenever it suits the government.

12. Free courts​

Even in a perfectly functioning democracy, disputes will arise. In these situations, it’s important that both sides have equal access to an independent body that can resolve the dispute. In democracies, this is the judicial system. Judges are a bit like referees – they’re an independent body that is supposed to apply the rules the same to all. A football match would be a sham if the ref was picked by one of the teams, and democracy is similarly shambolic when the government packs the courts with its friends or disregards judicial decisions.

13. Accepting election results​

When elections don’t go the way of those in power, they must accept them and step down. The peaceful transfer of power defines the democratic process. Losers of elections must accept defeat, and though they can and should continue to openly share their ideas and participate in public debate, they must accept that their positions do not at present have majority support.

14. Rule of law​

Democratic societies operate under the rule of law. This essentially means that a nation’s laws apply equally to all people, and everyone, especially the government, must play by the rules. It means that the rights and freedoms and democratic processes described above are respected and nurtured. And it means that the laws are also enforced in a fair and consistent way, and there’s an independent body, like the courts, to settle disputes that do arise. Liberties recently published its shadow report to the EU on the current rule of law situation across the bloc, finding a number of concerning trends across many member states.

14 Principles of Democracy

What makes a democracy a democracy? What are the basic principles of a democracy? What should you know about these? Why are they important?

www.liberties.eu

 

[basilio]

Comments about Trumps latest lines on suspending the Constitution.



1 hour ago

"I solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic;"

Many Republican politicians seem to have forgotten the US Military Oath but there must be some that still honor it. If so then where are they and why can I not hear them loudly and proudly defending it?

5 hours ago

Hi, my name is Donald Trump. I cannot seem to win an election if I follow the rules that have been in place for close to 250 years. Can we get rid of the rules so I can have a chance?

I have some ideas, very big ideas, very big. And the grandest plans, plans that are bigger than God.


1 hour ago

Seeing as how virtually every oath of office contains the phrase to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, both foreign and domestic, this should disqualify him from ever holding any kind of office ever again.

31 minutes ago

trumpy's medical records were just released.
According to the brain scan, the left side of his brain has nothing right, while the right side has nothing left.

Republicans respond to Trump’s call to suspend Constitution

On Dec. 4, several Republicans responded to former president Donald Trump calling to suspend the Constitution in another attempt to discredit the 2020 election.

news.yahoo.com

 

[The Triangle]

Ok so perhaps you genuinely don't understand (or care about) what a Parliamentary democracy means and the various elements that underpin it.
A critical element is an agreed process for the transfer of political power on the basis of free and fair elections. Without that acceptance by the political parties the system is open to exactly what Trump has been doing since he won the 2016 election :

1) Denigrating the electoral system before the election as corrupt if he didn't get elected.
2) Refusing to accept the results of the election and declaring he had won. There are legal processes to investigate any claims of fraud in elections. Trump made 60 court applications questioning the results. Every one was found unsubstantiated. Nonetheless he still maintains that white is black.
3) Attempting to stop the transfer of political power to the newly elected Government. He used his position to call his supporters to Congress on January 6th 2021 and, as the incumbent President, allowed the mob to charge through Congress with threats to kill the Vice President and stop the swearing in of the new Government. This action is called sedition - trying to overthrow the government. To date a number of the leaders of the Jan 6th mob have been found guilty of this crime. More are facing trial. Donald Trump also faces this possibility.

The system of parliamentary democracy needs the participants to play by the rules and conventions that underpin this type of government. Destroying these conventions undermines the whole democratic system.

Some background on Principles of Democracy.

7. Control over the abuse of power​

Democracy can only survive if everyone buys in – the citizens through their support on voting day and all other times of year, and politicians by playing by the rules and working to improve the lives of everyone. Abuse of power occurs when a government decides it is above the law, when politicians believe a different set of rules apply to them, when the levers of the state are moved to favor only a certain segment of society at the expense of others, or when public money is funneled into accounts of corrupt leaders and their friends. We see this often in the world’s “democracies” and increasingly so in Europe too.

There are ways to insulate democracy from such abuse, but there is no way to protect it completely. Diffusing powers across different branches of government helps to hold them all to account, for example. Protecting free and fair elections are also important. This includes protecting independent media so citizens can get good information in the lead up to voting, and means protecting election laws to make sure the process is fair.

11. Free and fair elections​

Change should be considered a natural and healthy feature of democracy. As the government exists to serve the people, and public opinion shifts all the time on all sorts of issues, it is only natural that elections will produce different results at different times. So it is essential that these elections occur freely and fairly. This means that people are given good and accurate information before voting, and that they are free to discuss and debate it. It also means that on election day, people have equal access to the polls, that everyone’s vote has the same value, and that all votes are counted. Moreover, elections shouldn’t come irregularly or be called whenever it suits the government.

12. Free courts​

Even in a perfectly functioning democracy, disputes will arise. In these situations, it’s important that both sides have equal access to an independent body that can resolve the dispute. In democracies, this is the judicial system. Judges are a bit like referees – they’re an independent body that is supposed to apply the rules the same to all. A football match would be a sham if the ref was picked by one of the teams, and democracy is similarly shambolic when the government packs the courts with its friends or disregards judicial decisions.

13. Accepting election results​

When elections don’t go the way of those in power, they must accept them and step down. The peaceful transfer of power defines the democratic process. Losers of elections must accept defeat, and though they can and should continue to openly share their ideas and participate in public debate, they must accept that their positions do not at present have majority support.

14. Rule of law​

Democratic societies operate under the rule of law. This essentially means that a nation’s laws apply equally to all people, and everyone, especially the government, must play by the rules. It means that the rights and freedoms and democratic processes described above are respected and nurtured. And it means that the laws are also enforced in a fair and consistent way, and there’s an independent body, like the courts, to settle disputes that do arise. Liberties recently published its shadow report to the EU on the current rule of law situation across the bloc, finding a number of concerning trends across many member states.

14 Principles of Democracy

What makes a democracy a democracy? What are the basic principles of a democracy? What should you know about these? Why are they important?

www.liberties.eu

Bravo you found one of a trillion pages on the internet to quote! Do you have a point to make? An opinion? What is your issue here? We can do this all day. But I consulted doctors and as I'm worried about your mental health I don't want your TDS to flare up again (and I've got mangos to prep and dehydrate). Yes. You hate Donald Trump. We all know it as you post the same thing every day.

Anyways, I'll make it easy for you with some specific questions: Do you have an opinion on why Donald Trump is not currently in prison? or on bail pending trial? Has the US 'parliamentary democracy' as you call it failed? If it has failed who is currently running the government? Do you think Donald Trump should not be allowed to run for president? If so, what law allows for this? Or should the laws be changed and how should they be changed to not allow him to run?

 

[basilio]

Keep trolling T. Or perhaps go and and prep some mangoes. Probably far more constructive than anything you have to say on this topic.

If you aren't aware of the state of play regarding regarding Donald Trumps role in inciting the Jan 6th mob to prevent the transfer of power than nothing I say will inform you. Likewise if you havn't noticed the progress of judicial investigations into Donald Trump over a number of election related matters - just inform yourself. And likewise you can easily find the laws that would prevent Trump from running for President again.

No I don't particularly "hate " Donald Trump per se. I would have the same concern about any lying, criminal figure who was trying to destroy the US system of democracy and had clear form of his capacity to do so. It's what the person does that makes him culpable not his/her name.

 

[IFocus]

Not that I agree with your comment and at Bas expense but that sledge below made me laugh

I see trump has expanded the real-estate in your head to include a new 36-hole golf course. Looks great.

 

[wayneL]

I guess the God Emperor is being up front about it, instead of just ignoring the constitution with impunity, like others have (and no, not just Democrats).

 

[moXJO]

I have no idea what Trump is up to till I get a update from those suffering TDS.
I don't think most of the right leaning on here care till we notice he's a troll point.

For Gods sake let him die in irrelevance.
His shot was the 2020 election and the dems managed to steal that. He isn't getting another shot.

 

[wayneL]

Then there's the Twitter files. Real collusion.

Crickets from the Democrat media.

 

[moXJO]

Then there's the Twitter files. Real collusion.

Crickets from the Democrat media.

At this point it's just "disconnect". The right knew all along and don't care anymore. The left just say "Elons a nazi" and really don't care. It's honestly pointless at this stage.

 

[basilio]

I can totally agree that Donald Trump is too extreme to win an election in 2024.

But who is talking about wining an election? When you have a base of 50 million people who believe everything you say just because you say it it isn't that hard to make a country unmanageable. In fact a far smaller number of determined people will overcome the silent majority.

 

[moXJO]

I can totally agree that Donald Trump is too extreme to win an election in 2024.

But who is talking about wining an election? When you have a base of 50 million people who believe everything you say just because you say it it isn't that hard to make a country unmanageable. In fact a far smaller number of determined people will overcome the silent majority.

He has a base, but he has turned off many Republican voters. His age is an issue.
His divisiveness is an issue.

Just because he got a lot of votes doesn't mean it's because they are cultists. The just won't vote democratic. It will be dependent on who they put up against Trump for the presidential nominations imo.

 

[mullokintyre]

Ok so perhaps you genuinely don't understand (or care about) what a Parliamentary democracy means and the various elements that underpin it.

1.Ah, the usual you don't understand or care argument.
Imediately puts you at the intellectual top of the argument.
well, the US does not have a parliament.
The US is at best a loose collection of state governments into a Federation.
The English parliament from which our own parliamentary system is drawn, has an upper house full of unelected Lords.
At least Congressional members are answerable to the American people.
As to Democracy, the yanks, for all their many faults, have numerous debates on Democracy. The fact that they can, is one of the greatest symbols of democracy. They actually have a bill of rights, which is more than OZ does.
Presidential elections have nothing to do with parliamentary Democracy, unless you think its possible to have a parliament of one person.

A critical element is an agreed process for the transfer of political power on the basis of free and fair elections. Without that acceptance by the political parties the system is open to exactly what Trump has been doing since he won the 2016 election :

1) Denigrating the electoral system before the election as corrupt if he didn't get elected.

So you reckon that farcical system they have where they elect collegiate members to vote on their behalf does not deserve denigrating?
Or maybe the fact that the elections whether local federal or presidential are run by each state, each with with different rules for counting, voting and registrations causes major problems such that a state like Florida with 25 million people gets its voting and counting done on the same day, where other states such as Arizona are still going weeks afterwards?
So much of the US system of elections should be denigrated.

2. What you or I or anyone else who is nor entitled to vote in US elections says about it is totally irrelevant. We don't get to vote. Period.
If there are enough people who want someone like Trump then that is their choice.
But at leat we know that if he did win, he will only get a single term. No Xi for life for him.

Mick

 

[SirRumpole]

So much of the US system of elections should be denigrated.

Certainly the things you pointed out are a problem for the US, but they have allowed the inequalities in their system to perpetuate over hundreds of years.

On their own heads be it.

 

[moXJO]

Certainly the things you pointed out are a problem for the US, but they have allowed the inequalities in their system to perpetuate over hundreds of years.

On their own heads be it.

Have you seen our system?

 

[SirRumpole]

Have you seen our system?

Of course I have, I live here.

It could be improved but I would say it's one of the best in the world.

 

[wayneL]

Of course I have, I live here.

It could be improved but I would say it's one of the best in the world.

This is the one that hands an absolute majority to a party with only 36% of the vote? (Yes I know it's more nuanced than that, but still)

 

[mullokintyre]

This is the one that hands an absolute majority to a party with only 36% of the vote? (Yes I know it's more nuanced than that, but still)

And it is also the one that allows Tasmania to elect a senator with 51,000 votes, but a senator from NSW requires 685,00 odd.
SA gets its 6 senators with a quota of 161,00 and WA with 218,000. If you happen to vote in NT, you only need 35,000.
All votes are equal, its just that some votes are more equal than others.
Mick