Ukraine War

[Sean K]

Go to prison .... OR die

View attachment 147075

When was the last time a major power ‘mobilized’ for war? I’m not sure if Korea or Vietnam were mobilizations? Might be WW2…

 

[Dona Ferentes]

When was the last time a major power ‘mobilized’ for war? I’m not sure if Korea or Vietnam were mobilizations? Might be WW2…

Interesting he's not playing the 'long game' .... maybe Europe will get through winter? Maybe he's underestimated the blowback. (genocidalists usually do)

 

[moXJO]

When was the last time a major power ‘mobilized’ for war? I’m not sure if Korea or Vietnam were mobilizations? Might be WW2…

This is a big call by Putin. Huge ramifications.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

• We are not at war with Ukraine, but with the collective West - Russian Defense Minister #Shoigu.
• 70 military and more than 200 civilian satellites, entire NATO bloc, working in the interests of #Ukraine - Shoigu.

.... you know what; he's right, especially about the second tweet. What did you expect, dumbass?

 

[Value Collector]

When was the last time a major power ‘mobilized’ for war? I’m not sure if Korea or Vietnam were mobilizations? Might be WW2…

Vietnam involved conscription, at that point I would call in mobilisation.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

When was the last time a major power ‘mobilized’ for war? I’m not sure if Korea or Vietnam were mobilizations? Might be WW2…

Vietnam involved conscription, at that point I would call in mobilisation.

It is always difficult with Russia.

Their definitions can be quite different from ours, and opaque to a non-Russian ear.

It would be interesting to be a fly on the wall at the Five Eyes pow wow tonight.

gg

 

[Sean K]

Vietnam involved conscription, at that point I would call in mobilisation.

Yeah, we did as well. National Service. A pile of countries have compulsory service after high school too. Not sure if the connotation is the same and what other laws are brought in for the war effort. Mobilization to me means some other extraordinary powers of State. Like diverting normal civilian industry to the war effort. Not sure if Russia has done that yet.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

I really don't care what Russia does, to be honest.

It is more Beijing's reaction and involvement, if any, that is the main danger.

This move by Putin was not unexpected and probably flagged to the West days ago from friendly cousins within the Kremlin nomenklatura.

It was actually discussed on R1 their version of " Your ABC " ( Politics for loyal babushkas ) about 3 hours before the announcement by Uncle Vova.

China is a bigger worry. The kerfuffle with Ukraine and NATO has reduced Russia to a mid range power atm.

gg

 

[JohnDe]

For Ukraine, cheers

 

[Dona Ferentes]

The kerfuffle with Ukraine and NATO has reduced Russia to a mid range power atm.

gg

And some wags say Russia has gone from being the second most powerful military country in the world to being the second most powerful military country in Ukraine. !!

But that ignores the sheer depth of their collective military-industrial complex

 

[Sean K]

I really don't care what Russia does, to be honest.

It is more Beijing's reaction and involvement, if any, that is the main danger.

This move by Putin was not unexpected and probably flagged to the West days ago from friendly cousins within the Kremlin nomenklatura.

It was actually discussed on R1 their version of " Your ABC " ( Politics for loyal babushkas ) about 3 hours before the announcement by Uncle Vova.

China is a bigger worry. The kerfuffle with Ukraine and NATO has reduced Russia to a mid range power atm.

gg

This has occurred only a couple of days after the Putin/Xi meeting. Must have got permission and some sort of tacit backing. Yes, that’s more troubling if China sign on.

 

[Dona Ferentes]

This has occurred only a couple of days after the Putin/Xi meeting. Must have got permission and some sort of tacit backing. Yes, that’s more troubling if China sign on.

good point

 

[moXJO]

Hopefully the months of grind has taken its toll on the Russian military. If they are resorting to nuke threats they may just be spent on the ground.

All it will do is reinforce Europe's military machine and unite the west. China, Russia and Iran are in an anti-west bloc. Crumbling Russia would be a big strategic bonus.

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Hot off the Press.

It would appear that China is not going to back Russia in a warry manner atm.

gg

 

[Value Collector]

Yeah, we did as well. National Service. A pile of countries have compulsory service after high school too. Not sure if the connotation is the same and what other laws are brought in for the war effort. Mobilization to me means some other extraordinary powers of State. Like diverting normal civilian industry to the war effort. Not sure if Russia has done that yet.

Yeah, but the draft in the USA was a lot different than the normal National service, they drafted 2.2 Million people during the Vietnam war, and anybody of service age could be drafted, not just people leaving high school.

The Vietnam war Era was also the high point of the modern military industrial complexes, I would say during Vietnam and the Cold War in general the USA was mobilised, but it depends on the definition I guess.

 

[Value Collector]

Hopefully the months of grind has taken its toll on the Russian military. If they are resorting to nuke threats they may just be spent on the ground.

All it will do is reinforce Europe's military machine and unite the west. China, Russia and Iran are in an anti-west bloc. Crumbling Russia would be a big strategic bonus.

One thing that I have been thinking about for the past few weeks, is that for the last 30 years people have been saying that soldiers on the ground are almost obsolete, because the Air Force would quickly decimate ground forces in a real war.

But, this fight in Ukraine has shown that it really is all about ground forces still, and that it only takes ground forces to be armed with some modern portable surface to Air missiles and the opposing Air Force backs right off. Russian pilots are terrified of the western anti air weapons, they aren't willing to risk close engagements after they have received a bloody nose in the early months.

 

[Value Collector]

Hot off the Press.

It would appear that China is not going to back Russia in a warry manner atm.



gg

do you have a link, I can't find the article

 

[Sean K]

One thing that I have been thinking about for the past few weeks, is that for the last 30 years people have been saying that soldiers on the ground are almost obsolete, because the Air Force would quickly decimate ground forces in a real war.

But, this fight in Ukraine has shown that it really is all about ground forces still, and that it only takes ground forces to be armed with some modern portable surface to Air missiles and the opposing Air Force backs right off. Russian pilots are terrified of the western anti air weapons, they aren't willing to risk close engagements after they have received a bloody nose in the early months.

Yep. Russia has hardly used its air force or navy for some reason. Initially it was for surprise, (and because hardly anyone was told they were going to war) but then I think it was preservation of major pieces of equipment and to not cause too much collateral damage. Plus, don’t discount more significant air defence systems provided to Ukraine that haven’t been advertised. Likewise anti-ship missiles. Were they really launched from Ukraine? Hmmm

 

[InsvestoBoy]

One thing that I have been thinking about for the past few weeks, is that for the last 30 years people have been saying that soldiers on the ground are almost obsolete, because the Air Force would quickly decimate ground forces in a real war.

But, this fight in Ukraine has shown that it really is all about ground forces still, and that it only takes ground forces to be armed with some modern portable surface to Air missiles and the opposing Air Force backs right off. Russian pilots are terrified of the western anti air weapons, they aren't willing to risk close engagements after they have received a bloody nose in the early months.

Did we really need to wait for Ukraine to show this after multiple armies of goat farmers with AK-47s held off the almighty (especially relative to Russia) USAF in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, etc not to mention the Houthis in Yemen who have been incessantly crushing the US backed Saudi "air force"?

 

[moXJO]

One thing that I have been thinking about for the past few weeks, is that for the last 30 years people have been saying that soldiers on the ground are almost obsolete, because the Air Force would quickly decimate ground forces in a real war.

But, this fight in Ukraine has shown that it really is all about ground forces still, and that it only takes ground forces to be armed with some modern portable surface to Air missiles and the opposing Air Force backs right off. Russian pilots are terrified of the western anti air weapons, they aren't willing to risk close engagements after they have received a bloody nose in the early months.

Big takeaway is that you can never have enough high tech missiles. Also that cheap drones with 60mm mortars are a massive demoralising tool.

Some huge lessons for Australia given our troops numbers.