Ukraine War

[divs4ever]

WE'RE IN BIG TROUBLE... (AND IT'S ABOUT TO ESCALATE)



a bit of a push wearing the camo jacket in mid ( UK ) summer , but yes we have been in trouble for a while

 

[3 hound]

WE'RE IN BIG TROUBLE... (AND IT'S ABOUT TO ESCALATE)



a bit of a push wearing the camo jacket in mid ( UK ) summer , but yes we have been in trouble for a while

Klaus Schuab gets a mention, why is that not surprising.

 

[divs4ever]

well the war would be a timely distraction from crashing economies , food and energy shortages etc etc etc

( and a GREAT reason to delay servicing debt loads )

 

[3 hound]

well the war would be a timely distraction from crashing economies , food and energy shortages etc etc etc

( and a GREAT reason to delay servicing debt loads )

This is why the most ardent leftists are turning against Biden. No money for social programs promised in the election no plan to reduce inflation - big money and resources channelled into a war with Russia.

The "racists Republicans" in contrast just made history in a 85% Latino area with the election of the first female born in Mexico that overturned a democratic stronghold. She ran on Trump's key agenda items; border security, belief in God, traditional family values, pro life.....

 

[divs4ever]

i bet those ardent Leftists regret not rigging the election for Bernie ( Sanders ) now

am not saying he would have been the solution , but certainly a better option in the USA 2022

 

[3 hound]

i bet those ardent Leftists regret not rigging the election for Bernie ( Sanders ) now

am not saying he would have been the solution , but certainly a better option in the USA 2022

Well they have lost their chance forever, Bernie has stated he won't be running in 2024.


Looks like those student loans will have to be paid afterall.

 

[JohnDe]

For those throwing blame at Western governments, read your history first. Russia is no angel, it is a paranoid failed state with a mad man in dictatorial control.

Today's Russia, once more the strongest nation in Europe and yet weaker than its collective enemies, calls to mind the turn-of-the-century German Empire, which Henry Kissinger described as "too big for Europe, but too small for the world." Now, as then, a rising power, propelled by nationalism, is seeking to revise the European order. Now, as then, it believes that through superior cunning, and perhaps even by proving its might, it can force a larger role for itself. Now, as then, the drift toward war is gradual and easy to miss — which is exactly what makes it so dangerous.

June 29, 2015

Putin's Russia is weak. It can no longer stand toe to toe with the US. It no longer has Europe divided in a stalemate; rather, it sees the continent as dominated by an ever-encroaching anti-Russian alliance. In the Russian view, the country's weakness leaves it at imminent risk, vulnerable to a hostile West bent on subjugating or outright destroying Russia as it did to Iraq and Libya.

This is made more urgent for Putin by his political problems at home.

Putin's answer has been to assert Russian power beyond its actual strength — and, in the process, to recast himself as a national hero guarding against foreign enemies. Without a world-power-class military or economy at his disposal, he is instead wielding confusion and uncertainty — which Soviet leaders rightly avoided as existential dangers — as weapons against the West.

Unable to overtly control Eastern Europe, he has fomented risks and crises there, sponsoring separatists in Ukraine and conducting dangerous military activity along NATO airspace and coastal borders, giving Russia more leverage there. Reasserting a Russian sphere of influence over Eastern Europe, he apparently believes, will finally give Russia security from the hostile West — and make Russia a great power once more.

Knowing his military is outmatched against the Americans, he is blurring the distinction between war and peace, deploying tactics that exist in, and thus widen, the gray between: militia violence, propaganda, cyberattacks, under a new rubric the Russian military sometimes calls "hybrid war."

Unable to cross America's red lines, Putin is doing his best to muddy them — and, to deter the Americans, muddying his own. Turning otherwise routine diplomatic and military incidents into games of high-stakes chicken favors Russia, he believes, as the West will ultimately yield to his superior will.

To solve the problem of Russia's conventional military weakness, he has dramatically lowered the threshold for when he would use nuclear weapons, hoping to terrify the West such that it will bend to avoid conflict. In public speeches, over and over, he references those weapons and his willingness to use them. He has enshrined, in Russia's official nuclear doctrine, a dangerous idea no Soviet leader ever adopted: that a nuclear war could be winnable.

In early April, for example, a Russian fighter jet crossed into the Baltic Sea and "buzzed" a US military plane, missing it by only 20 feet. It was one of several recent near-misses that, according to a think tank called the European Leadership Institute, have had a "high probability of causing casualties or a direct military confrontation between Russia and Western states."

Meanwhile, Russia has been flying its nuclear-capable strategic bombers along NATO airspace, often with the planes' transponders switched off, making an accident or misperception more likely. As if that weren't dangerous enough, the bombers — hulking, decades-old Tupolev Tu-95 models — have become prone to accidents such as engine fires. What if a Tu-95 went down unexpectedly, say, off the coast of Norway? What if it was carrying nuclear warheads, or it went down during a moment of high tension? Such incidents can lead to misunderstandings, and such misunderstandings can lead to war.

How World War III became possible

A nuclear conflict with Russia is likelier than you think.

www.vox.com

 

[3 hound]

For those throwing blame at Western governments

Blame for what incident are you referring to???

 

[JohnDe]

Blame for what incident are you referring to???

Incident? Where did you get that from? I'm sorry if my post has confused you, I know that reading is an art form these days, but homework is always good before commenting

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

For those throwing blame at Western governments, read your history first. Russia is no angel, it is a paranoid failed state with a mad man in dictatorial control.



June 29, 2015

How World War III became possible

A nuclear conflict with Russia is likelier than you think.

www.vox.com

Thanks @JohnDe for the enclosed vox.com article and your commentary. It is a prescient read, hard to believe it is from 7 years ago during Obama's time.

It really brings together the current mindset in both Russia and NATO.

And Putin is nuts, a KGB thug, a bully, through and through.

Luckily the West seems to be marching to a different united drum now and may be able to face him down. Otherwise it will be deja vu, as they say, all over again, sometime down the track.

gg

 

[3 hound]

NATO announces China as a security threat to the West.

 

[3 hound]

Incident? Where did you get that from? I'm sorry if my post has confused you, I know that reading is an art form these days, but homework is always good before commenting

For those throwing blame at Western governments

The quote above is worse than misinformation it's non-information. What incident are you referring that "those" are blaming which (or all) Western governments of.


A coherent response is not possible because your accusation could apply to literally an infinite number variables and possibilities.

Slow down for a second think about what you are trying to say, write it down and perhaps ask someone else if it makes any sense before you post.

 

[Belli]

And Putin is nuts, a KGB thug, a bully, through and through.

Well, Patriarch Kirill of the Russian Orthodox Church likes him so that's good isn't it?

 

[JohnDe]

Thanks @JohnDe for the enclosed vox.com article and your commentary. It is a prescient read, hard to believe it is from 7 years ago during Obama's time.

It really brings together the current mindset in both Russia and NATO.

And Putin is nuts, a KGB thug, a bully, through and through.

Luckily the West seems to be marching to a different united drum now and may be able to face him down. Otherwise it will be deja vu, as they say, all over again, sometime down the track.

gg

"Luckily the West seems to be marching to a different united drum now" Agreed.

The worrying part of all this is that western governments are forced to back off due to increasing voter (incorrect) sentiment, giving Putin exactly what he wants - weak, do nothing governments that give him full reign to do whatever he likes. If people knew their history, they'd see the similarities to Hitler's aggression in the early 1930's.

If all stay strong and united, Russia will back down with or without Putin.

 

[qldfrog]

The new BRICS alliance is a mortal threat to the West

This week it was announced that Iran and Argentina had applied to join the BRICS. The BRICS — which until recently has been made up of Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa — is a forum that allows countries outside of Western developed economies to forge alliances on economic issues...

unherd.com

This is where the trouble is..and note Brazil and Argentina...
If we had more IQ in gov..we aka Oz should be there..well or at the very least not against/opposed...
Even i find it a stretch to go to bed with iran..but if Venezuela is ok for biden now so why not Iran ..or North Korea ?

 

[Telamelo]

"Luckily the West seems to be marching to a different united drum now" Agreed.

The worrying part of all this is that western governments are forced to back off due to increasing voter (incorrect) sentiment, giving Putin exactly what he wants - weak, do nothing governments that give him full reign to do whatever he likes. If people knew their history, they'd see the similarities to Hitler's aggression in the early 1930's.

If all stay strong and united, Russia will back down with or without Putin.

RE: "If all stay strong and united, Russia will back down with or without Putin"



Seriously @JohnDe you really think so !? Then you don't understand/are ignorant of Russia's people/culture & Putin's intellect/mindset/mentality.

I don't condone Putin's actions whatsoever as war is pure evil but neither do I condone EU/NATO's response/actions in escalating situation.

Clearly neither side wants peace as both keen on pursuing an escalation of war to the point of a heightened nuclear threat.

I hate/detest war simple as that but unfortunately seems like mankind/humanity hasn't learnt anything from previous world war's/conflicts & history itself.

 

[JohnDe]

RE: "If all stay strong and united, Russia will back down with or without Putin"



Seriously @JohnDe you really think so !? Then you don't understand/are ignorant of Russia's people/culture & Putin's intellect/mindset/mentality.

I don't condone Putin's actions whatsoever as war is pure evil but neither do I condone EU/NATO's response/actions in escalating situation.

Clearly neither side wants peace as both keen on pursuing an escalation of war to the point of a heightened nuclear threat.

I hate/detest war simple as that but unfortunately seems like mankind/humanity hasn't learnt anything from previous world war's/conflicts & history itself.

Possibly, or maybe you’re ignorant to what is happening inside Russia, the full control of traditional and social media by the state, and the paranoia.

Did you read the article I posted, which discusses the facts.

Imagine if the world governments stood up to Hitler’s Nazi regime in 1935.

I suggest you read the article written by people with a lot more knowledge and resources than you have.

How World War III became possible

A nuclear conflict with Russia is likelier than you think.

www.vox.com

 

[eskys]

Well, Patriarch Kirill of the Russian Orthodox Church likes him so that's good isn't it?

Belli forgot about number 45

 

[againsthegrain]

There are estimates that communism killed anywhere between 8 to 20 million Russians under the soviet rule.

This is basically what you need to understand about the culture and population. Russian east orthodox Church and culture which is a offshoot of the Greek Orthodox deviated a different way over the centuries.

Greek and Roman culture on which Europe is based is mainly aimed towards fairness and rights of the citizen (this is theory, we are human so its never perfect)

The Russian east slavic version of the orthodox church and culture is more focused on the rights of the ruling class over the rights and fairness or the citizen.

Ivan the great, Peter the great, the Bolsheviks all of them wiped out any intellectuals or middle class that opposed their rule. Leaving behind the peasants that would obey and anybody else that submitted.

It is not that majority of Russians are so supportive of the war, they support it or off to the gulags my friend.

There is plenty of intelligent and smart Russians that ran and never looked back, Kasparov is one example a chess grandmaster who under no pressure from anywhere says it like he sees it. Of course he doesn't have to worry about kgb knocking on his door at 2am

 

[Smurf1976]

For those throwing blame at Western governments, read your history first. Russia is no angel, it is a paranoid failed state with a mad man in dictatorial control.

I'll simply observe that I personally know quite a few who've had major concerns about this for 25+ years now.

Concerns that becoming highly dependent on Russia and others, whilst handing them an outright fortune financially, would end very badly.

I'm no military strategist and nor is anyone I know but the basic scenario has always seemed extremely obvious. Handing lots of money to someone you've a bad history with, and becoming critically dependent on them. What could possibly go wrong.....

My conclusion being that either Western governments are run by people who don't think strategically or they've done it intentionally.

To an economic focus I note that the war already seems to have become the standard excuse for just about everything, including things that have either little to do with it or which have long been a powder keg just looking for a spark to set it off.