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Not a short throwaway line. But IMV worth thinking about. Much to learn from Annabel Crabbs analysis.​

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The attacks on Marcia Langton are not part of a theoretical debate. We know that racism exists​

www.abc.net.au

There's a foul, rising tide of racism in the Voice debate ahead of the referendum

Bunburying is the art of concocting a noble-sounding alibi to provide cover for an undisclosed and less-noble objective. Why is this relevant today? Because senior First Nations academic Marcia Langton has been at the centre of a comprehensive Bunburying. Here's what transpired, writes Annabel...
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au
 
mullokintyre said:
I would agree with that except I don't think it applies purely to Aboriginal people.
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Totally agree it's not unique to Aboriginal people and applies to many.

From a personal perspective well I don't know anyone, not one person, who hasn't had some trauma, setback or other life drama at some point. Not a single one. In some way everyone cops it somehow, and most by the age of 40 experience some sort of drama.

The key is to accept what can't be changed and focus on moving forward.

Or should I claim compensation from Germany for WW2? Or perhaps from the Australian Government for the 1991 recession? Or from China for the pandemic? Or do I get up, dust myself off and carry on? :2twocents
 
wayneL said:
Oh this was saaaweeeeeeet!

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I think that actually says it all but not in the way you were intending.

"More than 5,000 people dead and 10,000 feared missing in Libya floods" - now there's a real, actual problem affecting many albeit in another country.

In the year 2258 will there be people in Libya demanding compensation for the floods that swept away their ancestors' house a few generations prior?

Or will they have long since gotten on with it by then? :2twocents
 
Smurf1976 said:
I think that actually says it all but not in the way you were intending.

"More than 5,000 people dead and 10,000 feared missing in Libya floods" - now there's a real, actual problem affecting many albeit in another country.

In the year 2258 will there be people in Libya demanding compensation for the floods that swept away their ancestors' house a few generations prior?

Or will they have long since gotten on with it by then? :2twocents
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That's exactly her point, dripping with sarcasm of course. That has always been her point, ever since I first heard her speak.
 
Leaving aside the emotion and inevitable charges of racism, a reasonable person could see that the whole idea is unworkable in practise.

There are about 250 tribes or mobs in the indigenous population all with their own interests and wants. Are there going to be 250 places on the Voice to represent them ?

And what chance of agreement would there be with such a diverse input ? And if you leave some mobs out then there will be the inevitable complaints of non consultation.

And if they do try to consult with them all it would make an almost dysfunctional Parliament even more so while waiting for the Voice's deliberations.

Far from being an adjunct to the Parliamentary, process, it will be a blockage, and one we can't afford in a rapidly changing world.
 
SirRumpole said:
Leaving aside the emotion and inevitable charges of racism, a reasonable person could see that the whole idea is unworkable in practise.

There are about 250 tribes or mobs in the indigenous population all with their own interests and wants. Are there going to be 250 places on the Voice to represent them ?

And what chance of agreement would there be with such a diverse input ? And if you leave some mobs out then there will be the inevitable complaints of non consultation.

And if they do try to consult with them all it would make an almost dysfunctional Parliament even more so while waiting for the Voice's deliberations.

Far from being an adjunct to the Parliamentary, process, it will be a blockage, and one we can't afford in a rapidly changing world.
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They already have over 120 land councils alone and the representatives are democratically chosen. Then they have specific departments in Canberra with a large number of employees just dealing with native title claims both indigenous and not, about 50/50 I've been told. No matter what the govt does or gives them it will never be enough. Most states in Australia have an indigenous bill to a treaty already passed I might also add.

One of the biggest issues they face is inter-tribal disagreements. Take a place like Frase Island for example, it was inhabited by 3 distinctive tribes. Then they had seasonal fishing on the island when other tribes from the mainland would build bark canoes and float across and the other tribes on the island would allow them to use the land to access the fishing. The tribal land barriers between the separate tribes changed all the time and there was no real way to confirm who owned what. So who are they going to pay out or give the land to?

On another front, the things over there now are so ridiculous that if an 80 year old turtle washes up on the beach to die, the rangers have to get consent from the elders to euthanase it, they usually say no, so the dingoes just rip it apart while it's still alive in front of young kids and tourists.

The US is light years away with all of this with their indigenous, they've got treaties, they've given them land, they've given repatriations, and they still have a higher rate of young age mortality, unemployment issues, drug and alcohol issues, high youth suicides, intergenerational trauma, nepotism and corruption with funding in the reserves, gender discrimination.
The latest is the drug cartels move into these native Indian reserves because state law enforcement can't enter them without permission or can't enforce state law in the reserves, the housing is ruined by the meth labs so it gets boarded up and they lose housing. Some of the land either gets sold to pastoralists or investors or the government has to buy it back otherwise non indigenous move in and cause problems because they refuse to follow native tribal laws.
 
wayneL said:
👍
I first heard her speak on Aboriginal radio in Qld circa 2012. I've been a fan ever since.
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I would be very surprised if she doesn't become the first Australian female P.M of aboriginal descent, she carries herself very well, thinks quickly on her feet and isn't drawn into the media narrative.
She has a huge amount of charisma and is a role model for aspirational indigenous people, it will be interesting to watch her rise in the political spectrum IMO, the voice certainly has showcased a shining light for aboriginals in Jacinta Price's case. :2twocents
 
I reckon I should switch my vote :)

A guy who was all set to vote Yes in the upcoming Voice referendum has changed his mind after Jacinta Price pointed out that colonisation means Indigenous Australians now have taps.

“I was focusing on the fact that Indigenous Australians have lower life expectancies, higher unemployment and poorer living conditions. But turns out they have access to water and food so I’m not sure what all the fuss was about. Looks like everything’s tip top,” the Victorian man said.

He said he now conceded that Indigenous people were better off due to colonisation. “That was over 200 years ago. I mean, sure, some people alive today were forcibly removed from their families when they were kids. But on the plus side, they have access to a system of pipes underground that supplies water. Swings and roundabouts”.
 
basilio said:
I reckon I should switch my vote :)

A guy who was all set to vote Yes in the upcoming Voice referendum has changed his mind after Jacinta Price pointed out that colonisation means Indigenous Australians now have taps.

“I was focusing on the fact that Indigenous Australians have lower life expectancies, higher unemployment and poorer living conditions. But turns out they have access to water and food so I’m not sure what all the fuss was about. Looks like everything’s tip top,” the Victorian man said.

He said he now conceded that Indigenous people were better off due to colonisation. “That was over 200 years ago. I mean, sure, some people alive today were forcibly removed from their families when they were kids. But on the plus side, they have access to a system of pipes underground that supplies water. Swings and roundabouts”.
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They also have colour tv and refrigerators. Lucky.

Seriously though would any of them want to be wandering around naked in the hot sun when they can have air con and cold beer ?
 
SirRumpole said:
They also have colour tv and refrigerators. Lucky.

Seriously though would any of them want to be wandering around naked in the hot sun when they can have air con and cold beer ?
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JohnDe said:
At 30 June 2022, the Aboriginals Benefit Account held $1.394 billion in term deposits with Australian banks.


At 30 June 2022, there were 3,521 Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander corporations registered under the CATSI Act, including 243 registered native title bodies corporate.


Infrastructure and housing: While housing is primarily a state and territory responsibility, the NIAA’s role is to manage targeted Commonwealth co-funding, to support jurisdictions in greatest need of more housing for First Nations peoples
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I want to know why the ABA has close to $1.5B sitting in bank accounts, when there are Aboriginal communities living in 3rd world conditions. I bet Jacinta is asking the same question.

 
SirRumpole said:
They also have colour tv and refrigerators. Lucky.

Seriously though would any of them want to be wandering around naked in the hot sun when they can have air con and cold beer ?
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Yeah... and so what ? I thought we were discussing The Voice referendum. One question two simple parts.
Not a hundred "what ifs? What about ? WTF !! " and all the other diversions being thrown up.

A proposal that was originally offered and supported by the previous Liberal Government. That still has support from a number of those Party members.
 
basilio said:
Yeah... and so what ? I thought we were discussing The Voice referendum. One question two simple parts.
Not a hundred "what ifs? What about ? WTF !! " and all the other diversions being thrown up.

A proposal that was originally offered and supported by the previous Liberal Government. That still has support from a number of those Party members.
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Well, you brought up the bit about pipes, which has nothing to do with the referendum!

I think the libs originally supported recognition, the Voice came later.
 
SirRumpole said:
Well, you brought up the but about pipes, which has nothing to do with the referendum!
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THAT WAS A JOKE... Really. Truly.

It was a sick sad joke when Jacinta Price tried to say having running water and food made up for colonization.

The joke was turned back by pointing out what a dumb, fetid monstrosity the statement was when looking at what has happened.
 
basilio said:
Yeah... and so what ? I thought we were discussing The Voice referendum. One question two simple parts.
Not a hundred "what ifs? What about ? WTF !! " and all the other diversions being thrown up.

A proposal that was originally offered and supported by the previous Liberal Government. That still has support from a number of those Party members.
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Yeah, because the voice was advertised to everyone in Australia as an advisory body (ONLY) with literally no detail at all bar a few possibilities of guestimation. How many years of deliberation did it take to make the Uluru statement again, and they can't supply much detail around the most important part? No one can even tell how much it will cost to run?

That sounds good to me where can I sign up and anyone who asks questions is a baseline racist, OOOOH!
 
TimeISmoney said:
Yeah, because the voice was advertised to everyone in Australia as an advisory body (ONLY) with literally no detail at all bar a few possibilities of guestimation. How many years of deliberation did it take to make the Uluru statement again, and they can't supply much detail around the most important part? No one can even tell how much it will cost to run?

That sounds good to me where can I sign up and anyone who asks questions is a base racist, OOOOH!
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Yes The Voice will be a purely advisory body. And it will be developed through Parliament. Parliament will oversee its budget and decide on details. Almost certainly it won't work perfectly the first time. Parliament always reserves the right and need to review operations and where necessary tweak systems.

Voting YES for the Voice gives indigenous communities a constitutional right to make representations to government about issues that affect their community. Governments can take or leave or amend any representations - as they do all the time.

www.theguardian.com

The yes pamphlet: campaign’s voice to parliament referendum essay – annotated and factchecked

Pamphlets written by politicians and published by the AEC have put the official case for a yes and no vote. They were not independently factchecked before publication, so Guardian Australia has added notes to the full essays to help you make better sense of them
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
basilio said:
It was a sick sad joke when Jacinta Price tried to say having running water and food made up for colonization.
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Dead set bas. Would you prefer to be wandering around in the desert eating grubs, or having a nice meal at your favourite restaurant ?

A better life is theirs if they choose to take advantage of it as a lot have.
 

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