The symbol of the Halal Certification Authority Australia

[sptrawler]

It kind of makes sense a bit, pigs can catch a lot of the same diseases as humans, and in places where sanitation is poor, and pigs muck about in human waste, it poses health risks, and would be unclean.

That makes sense, however, if the pigs are kept in a place where human waste isn't present, why can't they be eaten.
Generally pigs are fairly clean animals, compared to most.
They tend to toilet in a certain area, seperate to where they eat and sleep.

Maybe due to their dna being similar to humans, a long time ago, it was realised that desease could be passed from pigs to humans.

Therefore because most were illiterate back then, the religious head honcho's started the mass acceptance that you can't eat pork.
Which would make sense, as most desease or poison identification and cures were passed down through the medicine man, witch doctor, religous leaders.

Maybe it shows an amazing degree of awareness, even now the authorities are scared to death of cross species infection i.e bird flu.
With both the Muslims and Jews not eating pork, maybe in early history, something nasty happened in the middle east, that they realised came from consuming pork.

Probably drifting off thread.

 

[Bintang]

The manager of Fleurieau explained his position very clearly. His conclusion was that the small amount of money brought in by the contract with Etihad (or some ME airline) did not warrant the grief he was receiving via social media accusing him of supporting Muslim terrorism. So he dropped the Halal certification.

http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2014/s4133082.htm

I find it interesting that there is a website http://www.halalsquare.com.au/groceries/ for halal certified products in Australia which itself does NOT require that all the products on its list have to actually be certified by a certification company. From the website:

"We are currently working with supermarkets and food manufacturers to help build this database and Insyah Allah it will be of benefit to the Muslim community.

For a product to appear on this list, it needs to either be:

- Halal certified by a certification company
- Considered Halal 'safe' based on ingredients. For example, yoghurts with halal gelatine. This is usually confirmed by the manufacturer."


So based on the above the Fleurieau company should not have to pay for a certificate to have their yoghurt products accepted as halal.

I also find Leigh Sale's definition of 'halal' as rather narrow. She said, "A halal product is one that doesn't contain any traces of pork, blood or alcohol, meaning it's ok for muslims to eat".

However, she conveniently neglected to mention the requirements of halal meat, probably because they are too shocking to mention on an ABC broadcast. The animals are treated a bit viciously to say the least. Mentioning it might detract from the 'viciousness' label which Leigh Sales pinned on the anti-halal campaigners in her opening statement.

 

[Wysiwyg]

See my kind of Aussie. My kind of people actually - informed, honest, open, swear like a sailor... awesome.

Ha that was good stuff. As the champ says in words we all feel but don't say, "come here [Australia] but don't be a $#@% head".

 

[Value Collector]

The animals are treated a bit viciously to say the least.

What are you talking about?

In Australia Halal slaughter is pretty much the same as normal.

The animal is stunned and rendered unconscious, it then has its throat cut.

That's no different to normal slaughter, it's actually australian law that cattle have their throat cut, after being stunned.

Halal laws actually state their is to be no undue stress or suffering on the animal.

 

[SirRumpole]

What are you talking about?

In Australia Halal slaughter is pretty much the same as normal.

The animal is stunned and rendered unconscious, it then has its throat cut.

That's no different to normal slaughter, it's actually australian law that cattle have their throat cut, after being stunned.

Halal laws actually state their is to be no undue stress or suffering on the animal.

So what you appear to be saying is that there is really no need for Halal certification because we slaughter animals in a way that is acceptable to Muslims anyway ?

 

[Value Collector]

So what you appear to be saying is that there is really no need for Halal certification because we slaughter animals in a way that is acceptable to Muslims anyway ?

If that's all halal was then yes, but the rules for animal slaughter are only part of the Halal rules, you still have the avoidance of certain animal products in ingredients etc, zero alcohol used in prep etc

Also they are rare, but there are a few slaughter houses that kill with electrocution, this wouldn't be considered halal, if the electrocution is designed to kill rather than stun, it's not allowed. But I would have to check, I think I remember killing by electrocution is being phased out in Australia.

 

[luutzu]

Ha that was good stuff. As the champ says in words we all feel but don't say, "come here [Australia] but don't be a $#@% head".

hehe... I also agree with that.

Australia is a great country, seriously. I couldn't imagine a better place to live or raise a family.

Most migrants would agree with that and most will assimilate. But assimilation doesn't mean getting rid of all their religious and cultural beliefs and go "White" and "Christian". Who knows, maybe other cultural practices could also benefit Australian society... say the Confucian teachings of filial piety - being good to your parents and family, looking after them in their old age (not saying that Westerners don't, just Asians in general take it more literally and keep the folks at home (to look after the grandkids, haha)). I heard that in the Koran, it said that after God is your parents.

It can be a bit much to worship everything your parents say and decide, from personal experiences assimilation mean getting to the middle somewhere - treating your elders with great respect but also have an independent mind.

 

[DB008]

So what you appear to be saying is that there is really no need for Halal certification because we slaughter animals in a way that is acceptable to Muslims anyway ?

Hmm....

Danish halal and kosher ban leaves religious groups with nowhere to turn

A ban on halal and kosher slaughter without prior stunning of animals has come into effect in Denmark. A similar ban is already in force in Sweden and Norway, as well as other European nations. This decision follows previous debates in Denmark about halal slaughter and the marking of halal slaughtered meat, and has stirred deep controversy among Muslim and Jewish groups both within the country and beyond.

The ban was called anti-Semitic by Israel’s deputy minister of religious services; similarly, the Danish non-profit group Danish Halal decried the ban as a clear infringement of religious freedom. The issue is also expected to put severe strain on bilateral trade with countries such as Saudi Arabia.

In announcing the ban, the recently appointed Danish minister for food, agriculture and fisheries, Dan Jørgensen, referred to a Danish animal protection law that allows the minister to make the decision like this without first taking it to the Danish national parliament. Jørgensen once served as president of the Animal Welfare Intergroup, which advocates animal welfare and conservation issues, and he has been widely cited as arguing that that the imperative to legally protect animal welfare trumps religious liberty.

But the ban raises a number of issues beyond this one, which has dominated the coverage. First, food consumption is an important way of expressing of religious identity and rights at the personal and organisational level. Muslim and Jewish groups' carefulness about everyday halal/kosher consumption has led to rigorously enforced regulations on global production and trade. Banning religious slaughter directly undermines the whole international structure of third-party certification of halal and kosher products, which was built to ensure that producers live up to requirements such as slaughter without stunning.

The ban also flies in the face of various well-funded transnational attempts to bridge the gap between animal rights advocates and religious interest groups. For example, an EU-supported project, DIALREL, aims to improve public knowledge on religious slaughter through dialogue on issues of welfare, legislation and socioeconomic concerns. That project explicitly focuses on religious slaughter as a controversial and emotive subject, caught between animal welfare considerations and cultural/human rights issues. The Danish ban seems to consider the conversation closed.

http://theconversation.com/danish-halal-and-kosher-ban-leaves-religious-groups-with-nowhere-to-turn-23392

 

[DB008]

QSociety has done one too...

Kirralie Smith at the 1st Intl Symposium on Liberty and Islam in Australia

 

[SirRumpole]

They've got our cats, next they'll go after our beer !!@

Halal certified cat food. That sounds right, after all all those Muslims have Whiskas don't they ?

 

[Bintang]

They've got our cats, next they'll go after our beer !!@

Halal certified cat food. That sounds right, after all all those Muslims have Whiskas don't they ?

Actually, they might go after our wine first!

 

[DB008]

Why halal certification is in turmoil

Kirralie Smith is a permaculture farmer from northern New South Wales and a mother of three. She is also the public face of the virulent campaign to boycott halal food and products.

Halal means permissible for Muslims to eat or use, and the Facebook page "'Boycott Halal in Australia" has 41,000 supporters.

Smith speaks at events organised by "Islam-critical" groups such as the Q Society, which has also been involved in local campaigns to stop mosques being built. Her "Halal Choices" website, she says, gets 80,000 visitors a month.


Smith and her supporters claim halal certification is a scam by Muslim interests to raise money for mosques and therefore for "jihad." They base this assertion on media reports in France, Canada and the United States claiming certification funds had been paid to organisations linked to Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood.

Yet neither Smith nor her unofficial patron, the Q Society, could elaborate on the Australian situation. "To the best of our knowledge no one has yet undertaken similar research," says Q Society's national president Debbie Robinson.

http://www.smh.com.au/national/why-halal-certification-is-in-turmoil-20141227-12cmd3.html

 

[SirRumpole]

"The Truth about Halal"

Tonight on Four Corners ABC 8:30 pm