The Gillard Government

[MrBurns]

How was Leigh Sales with Kevin Rudd tonight ?

Was she a teddybear ?

She wasnt too bad but Rudd is a useless waste of space, it really stands out now.

 

[Julia]

How was Leigh Sales with Kevin Rudd tonight ?

Was she a teddybear ?

I don't think so. She correctly drew attention to the very obvious fact that he is consciously 'putting himself out there' at every opportunity, and did this quite forcefully, without quite being rude.
Seeing him again, with his pompous manner, was a ghastly reminder of just how much of a disaster he was.

 

[drsmith]

I've now seen iit.

It took a few attempts, but Leigh did get him to mention the G-word.

 

[sptrawler]

So now what? Mr Swan, Worlds Greatest Treasurer
Six months ago you want to tax the crap out of Fortesque Metals, because they are supposedly making a killing.
Now six months further on they are struggling to stay afloat because of their debt repayments and falling prices.
They are apparently $8billion in debt, from putting in infrastructure, the funding of the debt was based on a stable return.
Now what? a tax break so they don't go under, or just let the Chinese buy them out at fire sale price?
Mate your a genius, I can see why Ifocus and So_Cynical are so enamoured with you.LOL,LOL,LOL
Don't just kill the golden goose, pluck it and stuff it and give it to the fox.
What happens now when Aussie mining companies try to get finance?
This is the problem with a very short sighted tax grab, the repercussions may be far reaching.

http://www.theage.com.au/business/m...fears-drag-fortescue-down-20120913-25uf9.html

 

[Ves]

To be fair, I think FMG would have been in this trouble with or without the MRRT. I think they've been poorly managed, using Wayne Swan or the labour government as an excuse (or even a little reason for this!) is stretching it IMO. Massive amounts of debt as producer with low margins. Not the government's fault, I'm afraid!

 

[sptrawler]

That leads to the next problem, when China ownes all the mines and is the customer.
How do you tax them on profits, if they keep the price they pay for their commodity down? Maybe that is where royalties on tonnage was smarter.
No, nothing could be smarter than than the current government.LOL Bring on the election.

 

[sptrawler]

To be fair, I think FMG would have been in this trouble with or without the MRRT. I think they've been poorly managed, using Wayne Swan or the labour government as an excuse (or even a little reason for this!) is stretching it IMO. Massive amounts of debt as producer with low margins. Not the government's fault, I'm afraid!

Well that is debatable, they were underwritten on the understanding pre MRRT, with the knowledge material prices fluctuate.
Post MRRT, any excessive rise in material prices, doesn't translate into debt servicing.

Also to be fair Labor and Swan in particular, held up Fortesque and Forrest to public ridicule on the premise they sit back and cream everyone. I don't think the people being layed off or the backers will agree with you.

 

[Ves]

Well that is debatable, they were underwritten on the understanding pre MRRT, with the knowledge material prices fluctuate.
Post MRRT, any excessive rise in material prices, doesn't translate into debt servicing.

Can you tell me what their margins would be at $90 per tonne:

a) with the MRRT
b) without it

???

They borrowed $1.6 billion in October 2011. Are you saying they forgot about the MRRT and borrowed any way?

Another $1.5 billion in December 2010 and $2.7 billion in October 2010. I could keep going if you like. I am sure the MRRT was known then too. Perhaps not in its final form as such, but why go borrow if you think it is going to eat into your margins so much?

Are you sure FMG wasn't just greedy? Borrowing massive amounts of money with no contingency plan, because you know the party in China will still be going years from now?

Do they even pay the MRRT on any of their expansion projects? I was sure that they were quoted to have said that the tax was ridiculous because a lot of their projects would be exempt in the first few years.

 

[sptrawler]

Can you tell me what their margins would be at $90 per tonne:

a) with the MRRT
b) without it

???

They borrowed $1.6 billion in October 2011. Are you saying they forgot about the MRRT and borrowed any way?

Another $1.5 billion in December 2010 and $2.7 billion in October 2010. I could keep going if you like. I am sure the MRRT was known then too. Perhaps not in its final form as such, but why go borrow if you think it is going to eat into your margins so much?

Are you sure FMG wasn't just greedy? Borrowing massive amounts of money with no contingency plan, because you know the party in China will still be going years from now?

Do they even pay the MRRT on any of their expansion projects? I was sure that they were quoted to have said that the tax was ridiculous because a lot of their projects would be exempt in the first few years.

No I don't think they are greedy infrastructure cost huge money, their rail lne is reportedly valued at $2.5b.
To get funding for mine development and supporting infrastructure takes certainty of return, when a government starts moving the the goal posts it causes financiers to balk.
Whether ther pay the MRRT tax or not is irrelevant, no one is going to put up more funding on the uncertainty

 

[drsmith]

I haven't looked into FMG specifically, but trouble over debt covenants is usually of a company's own making.

 

[sptrawler]

I haven't looked into FMG specifically, but trouble over debt covenants is usually of a company's own making.

Agreed, however if for example the government ups the company tax rate from 30% to 35% would that cause an issue.
How about the government removes negative gearing and only allows investors to offset loses against capital gains.
Would they not, in most cases, cause trouble over debt covenants. Also would they be of a borrowers own making.
Or should the government have said contracts signed from this point on have these new tax rulings imposed.

 

[sptrawler]

That leads to the next problem, when China ownes all the mines and is the customer.
How do you tax them on profits, if they keep the price they pay for their commodity down? Maybe that is where royalties on tonnage was smarter.
No, nothing could be smarter than than the current government.LOL Bring on the election.

Well it sounds as though the predators are circling. It will be interesting to see how much MRRT tax the government get if Boasteel end up taking control of Fortesque.LOL

http://www.smh.com.au/business/mini...rest-in-talks-with-stokes-20120914-25wso.html

 

[drsmith]

Agreed, however if for example the government ups the company tax rate from 30% to 35% would that cause an issue.

How about the government removes negative gearing and only allows investors to offset loses against capital gains.

Won't happen, but negative gearing against unrelated passive income should be removed as part of broader tax reform.

With business, the government is more likely to go after deductions and concessions than a direct hit on the headline corporate tax rate.

 

[IFocus]

Won't happen, but negative gearing against unrelated passive income should be removed as part of broader tax reform.

With business, the government is more likely to go after deductions and concessions than a direct hit on the headline corporate tax rate.

Abbott is going to be caught out with a lack of revenue so other than superannuation where will the money come from?

 

[sails]

Abbott is going to be caught out with a lack of revenue so other than superannuation where will the money come from?

Does Gillard have a sick plan to leave the credit card maxed out with massive interest payments and so many committed expenses so there is nothing left when she's booted out?

Surely that would be wrong? Didn't Gillard promise to serve the Australian people? By hurting Abbott, she is also hurting the majority of Aussie voters.

Howard handed over a surplus and then Gillard deliberately puts Australia into severe financial difficulties just because she doesn't like Abbott? If so, I would call that irresponsible, undemocratic and she is not fit to be PM.

 

[drsmith]

Abbott is going to be caught out with a lack of revenue so other than superannuation where will the money come from?

Do you consider that our economic circumstanses are such that there will be no choice in relation to increasing the corporate tax rate ?

If that's the case, it speaks volumes about where you truely stand on the current government's economic management.

 

[dutchie]

If so, I would call that irresponsible, undemocratic and she is not fit to be PM.

So whats new??

Its not Abbott Abbott Abbott but for Julia its

Julia Julia Julia Julia Julia (or me me me me me)

 

[sptrawler]

Abbott is going to be caught out with a lack of revenue so other than superannuation where will the money come from?

I have to agree with you IFocus, sad isn't it. 2007 - 2013 massive mining boom and what do we have to show for it?
Half baked N.B.N, $hit loads of detainees, huge increase in government debt and of course huge payrises for our politicians.LOL
Yep I think everyone wants to go home from the party and deal with the hangover.
It's fun going out with the loonies, but eventualy you have to go home and face the music.

 

[DB008]

Big boost for Gillard in latest Newspoll

Julia Gillard is leading Tony Abbott as preferred prime minister by the biggest margin in more than a year, according to a Newspoll released today.

The poll, published in The Australian newspaper today, shows Ms Gillard is 14 points ahead of Mr Abbott as preferred PM.

In the last fortnight her support rose from 39 per cent to 46 per cent, while Mr Abbott's fell from 38 per cent to 32 per cent.

Labor's primary vote rose three points to 36 per cent while the Coalition shed five points to 41 per cent.

But the parties are neck and neck on 50 per cent each in the two-party preferred standings.

The Greens have also recovered from a bad result earlier this month, with their primary vote increasing from a three-and-a-half year low of 8 per cent to 12 per cent.

The poll has a margin of error of 3 per cent.

The poll's release comes one day after Ms Gillard used the ALP's Queensland conference to mark her re-entry into the political fray following the death of her father.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-09-17/big-boost-for-gillard-in-latest-newspoll/4264478

 

[MrBurns]

This just confirms BS will win and as Gillard is a master at this it only encourages more undeliverable promises and lies