The future of Australian property prices

[sptrawler]

These not get stats in the way :
Well, the median gross household income was $1616 a week for 2015-2016, the most recent figures available from the Australian Bureau of Statistics. That equates to $84,032 a year.
So your so called battlers are hardly average on $150K.

Lets keep it simple, as you stated it is not rocket science.
.

Now I see where you are coming from, my idea of average worker, is a person who has some form of technical training or skill set e.g rigger, tradie, nurse,garbo etc. who can expect to earn approx $80-110k per annum. A close mate of mine is a council worker on verge collection, he earns approx$90k.
These days both partners need to work, to have any chance of paying of your PR and investing and with both working $150k is achievable.

Your idea of average household, would appear to include those, whose main source of income is probably welfare.
Well I can't argue, they will probably never be able to afford, an investment property.
I also never said someone on $150k was a battler, a battler wouldn't be buying an investment property, so don't make up $hit.

 

[SirRumpole]

Your idea of average household, would appear to include those, whose main source of income is probably welfare.

You think people can get $80k pa on welfare ?

 

[luutzu]

You think people can get $80k pa on welfare ?

An average worker wouldn't be getting $80k either.

These average and median wage statistics are a bit funny. It's a bit like GDP per capita where... if you, me and Bill Gates assets were summed up and divvy, on paper, into 3... we're all billionaires. Except only one of us is.

 

[SirRumpole]

An average worker wouldn't be getting $80k either.

These average and median wage statistics are a bit funny. It's a bit like GDP per capita where... if you, me and Bill Gates assets were summed up and divvy, on paper, into 3... we're all billionaires. Except only one of us is.

The median wage is what 50% of income earners are getting which gives a better indication of the income distribution.

The average or mean is distorted upwards by a small number of very high income earners so it doesn't represent the real distribution but it's the one government politicians like to quote so they can pretend they have raised wages.

 

[sptrawler]

You think people can get $80k pa on welfare ?

If you read his post, it is the mean average household income, so that would include households on a lot less and a lot more than $80k.
On $80k I would not expect their main income to be welfare, but a household on $26k, I would expect to receive a fair bit of welfare.

 

[sptrawler]

An average worker wouldn't be getting $80k either.
.

The quoted $80k is household income, it includes those with two income families.

But here is a paste of average wages in Australia.

https://www.livingin-australia.com/salaries-australia/

My daughter in law, started work about 8 months ago, for a road maintenance company not a big company. More pot hole repairs, culverts etc.
She obtained her H/R license, traffic control tickets etc, she is on $90k+

 

[Darc Knight]

Homer, were you always a "right wing screw over the slack arse workers" type even before you retired?
I ask this as I once knew a construction worker who was a staunch BLF and every Union flag waver. He then moved into Management started buying investment properties and turned real right wing - ratting on the working class to advance his position further.

(His Life actually fell to pieces - lost all his money, marriage and kids, now he's back to being an ordinary "pleb")

 

[Sdajii]

An average worker wouldn't be getting $80k either.

These average and median wage statistics are a bit funny. It's a bit like GDP per capita where... if you, me and Bill Gates assets were summed up and divvy, on paper, into 3... we're all billionaires. Except only one of us is.

That would be the case if they used mean. It's the whole reason they use median instead. The median of you, me and Bill Gates is the wealthier of you and myself (unless you're wealthier than Bill Gates, in which case it's him). Median wage is a good representation of the typical but not 'average' person.

 

[luutzu]

That would be the case if they used mean. It's the whole reason they use median instead. The median of you, me and Bill Gates is the wealthier of you and myself (unless you're wealthier than Bill Gates, in which case it's him). Median wage is a good representation of the typical but not 'average' person.

Yea, true. Though wouldn't the Mode be more representative? It's been a while since my stats years.

I was referring to "per capita"... that's an average still popularly used to show how rich we're all getting each time the Gates and Murdoch of the world gain a few hundred million dollars.

btw, did you know that the top 10% of the US own some 87% of all the listed stocks? The top 1% own some 40%?

Wouldn't it be cool if that's changed?

 

[luutzu]

The quoted $80k is household income, it includes those with two income families.

But here is a paste of average wages in Australia.

https://www.livingin-australia.com/salaries-australia/

My daughter in law, started work about 8 months ago, for a road maintenance company not a big company. More pot hole repairs, culverts etc.
She obtained her H/R license, traffic control tickets etc, she is on $90k+

You the numbers aren't right when NT earns more than NSW.



Wait... WA earns more too? I thought you guys have a property crash over there.

 

[sptrawler]

Homer, were you always a "right wing screw over the slack arse workers" type even before you retired?
I ask this as I once knew a construction worker who was a staunch BLF and every Union flag waver. He then moved into Management started buying investment properties and turned real right wing - ratting on the working class to advance his position further.

(His Life actually fell to pieces - lost all his money, marriage and kids, now he's back to being an ordinary "pleb")

I don't see myself a right wing screw, always worked for wages, was a supervisor from about 32 to 35 years old, but went back to being a pleb.

I guess it all is about perceptions, some people think tax incentives to encourage people to invest, take risk and save are bad.
Others think people spending everything they earn, to obtain someone else's tax is bad.

I wouldn't call anybody on here left or right, I would say most on here are fairly balanced, but again that is only my opinion.
I've seen a lot of so called 'christians', do very 'unchristian' things, yet they will swear black and blue they're christian.
Same goes for this left and right crap.
I've seen many 'greenies', driving $hit boxes blowing oil smoke everywhere, with stickers on the back saying save the whales and shut down coal.
So you saying I'm right leaning, is worth what it cost.

 

[Smurf1976]

Once you start looking at wage / salary rates, you start to become aware of just how divided our society has become.

Wages are both a symptom and a cause of that as are housing prices.

Which brings another point to mind as I typed that last sentence.

When the issue first started getting out of hand it was invariably referred to as "house" prices. It's been going so long now that this is no longer appropriate, since the idea of living in an apartment, itself renamed from the previous term of "flat", has become far more common.

An orderly, gradual winding back of the bubble is what we need. Slow and steady over an extended period not an almighty crash that takes down however many businesses, jobs and the stock market with it.

As for wages, well an issue there is that other than internally within large organizations there's no one wage rate for any given occupation and it's not always the best and brightest who get paid the most, in some cases it's the worst who are in that situation (squeaky wheel syndrome). That in itself is another huge problem.

 

[sptrawler]

You the numbers aren't right when NT earns more than NSW.

View attachment 91230

Wait... WA earns more too? I thought you guys have a property crash over there.

NT and W.A have a lot of mine related work, it does pay well, this tends to force up wages in the other areas to hold workers.
Like I said my mate is a council garbo and reckons he will crack $100k this year.

 

[luutzu]

NT and W.A have a lot of mine related work, it does pay well, this tends to force up wages in the other areas to hold workers.
Like I said my mate is a council garbo and reckons he will crack $100k this year.

I'm heading to Perth. Half a million property that's liveable in, $90k average wage... what's going on?

 

[satanoperca]

Now I see where you are coming from, my idea of average worker, is a person who has some form of technical training or skill set e.g rigger, tradie, nurse,garbo etc. who can expect to earn approx $80-110k per annum. A close mate of mine is a council worker on verge collection, he earns approx$90k.
These days both partners need to work, to have any chance of paying of your PR and investing and with both working $150k is achievable.

Your idea of average household, would appear to include those, whose main source of income is probably welfare.
Well I can't argue, they will probably never be able to afford, an investment property.
I also never said someone on $150k was a battler, a battler wouldn't be buying an investment property, so don't make up $hit.

You are off your trollie. If you think that, I know many a person with a least one degree, who doesn't earn above $85K.

A rigger, a gabbo are hardly skilled in my profession, crap an electrician only connects up wires, not rocket science and a rocket scientist would not earn what you think you do.

Yes I am being abusive/rude or whatever you want to say, but you live in a fantasy land that doesn't exist anymore.

 

[sptrawler]

You are off your trollie. If you think that, I know many a person with a least one degree, who doesn't earn above $85K.

A rigger, a gabbo are hardly skilled in my profession, crap an electrician only connects up wires, not rocket science and a rocket scientist would not earn what you think you do.

Yes I am being abusive/rude or whatever you want to say, but you live in a fantasy land that doesn't exist anymore.

Well you had better sit down and have a chill pill, you must be on pretty crappy wages, by the sound of it. That explains everything.
I just looked on Seek for what jobs were around Perth, not all show hourly rate, but here you go.
https://www.seek.com.au/job/3805486...6fc-42bb-4af7-8c2d-2ed608eea80c&type=standout

$50.49/hr 10-12 hours/ day.

$50.49 x 10x 5 days x 48 weeks= $121,176

Obviously investing is outside your pay grade, but that is normal for an industrial sparky in W.A. If you want to go FIFO you can add about 20 - 30k to that.

There is only one of us who is off his trolley, and it isn't me.
You be as rude as you like, if I had your attitude, i would probably be angry also.

 

[sptrawler]

I'm heading to Perth. Half a million property that's liveable in, $90k average wage... what's going on?

Everyone wants to live in Sydney and Melbourne, that's what is going on, simple supply and demand.

Plenty of people = low wages, due to competition + high house prices, due to competition.

Add to that, all the immigrants want to settle there.

 

[luutzu]

Everyone wants to live in Sydney and Melbourne, that's what is going on, simple supply and demand.

Plenty of people = low wages, due to competition + high house prices, due to competition.

Add to that, all the immigrants want to settle there.

That's a good point.

Though they might choose the cities 'cause White country people makes them nervous. Why I don't know

Spoke to a couple tradies before and a sparky said when he was younger he and his wife stayed in the country for a while. It apparently goes pitch dark after the sunset?

 

[Smurf1976]

I generally keep out of these "personal" debates as a matter of principle but I'll make an exception and simply say this.

Wage rates in a market economy are a function of supply and demand. Simple as that. They are not an accurate reflection of anyone's intelligence or contribution to society.

 

[Ann]

Spoke to a couple tradies before and a sparky said when he was younger he and his wife stayed in the country for a while. It apparently goes pitch dark after the sunset?

Sure does Luu, there are no city lights to reflect off the clouds. That is why you can see a sky full of stars up the bush, it is magic!