The Abbott Government

SirRumpole · 29 August 2015

noco said:
How do you claim it to be a political exercise?....What has politics got to do with it?...Wasn't the Victorian Labor government also involved?

I was a bungled effort by the Border Protection Force (Federal Minister Peter Dutton) to try and look tough by issuing such statements as

Officers will be positioned at various locations around the city and will speak "with any individual we cross paths with", ABF regional commander for Victoria and Tasmania Don Smith said in a statement.

my bolds
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-...eck-visas-on-the-streets-of-melbourne/6732086

So, you may have been wandering down Collins Street and if you looked a bit foreign may be asked for a visa and if you couldn't produce it, what then ?

As you yourself said, there are better ways of doing this sort of thing, so why did they pick that one, and then have to backflip when people complained ?

sydboy007 · 29 August 2015

noco said:
So Rumpy, you and Sydboy condone illegal immigrants roaming the streets at will and breaking the law with overstayed visas.....How many could be terrorists?......you would not know and probably do not care.......If you lived in a communist state I doubt you would get away with it.

Look, it is not that agree with the way the Victorian Government and the AFP went about their task as I am sure there are better ways of doing it.

From what I understand is when an overseas visitor enters the country on a study or work visa, they are normally nominated by a sponsor, so I do not see any reason why the authorities cannot go to their sponsor and seek their whereabouts....If the sponsor states they do not know, then they should be held accountable.....

If in the case of a holiday visa, sooner or later those who have broken the law will have to seek employment to live and this where employers could play a role.

Where there is a will there is a a way.

So you attack us as being easy for immigrants overstaying their visas, yet I've repeatedly said I'd like to see a large cut in immigration until we have an open and honest debate on how we fund the infrastructure required to house a new Perth worth of population every 3 to 4 years.

You then go on to say you don't actually support what the Govt had proposed, nor did you understand that it wasn't the AFP working with Victorian Police but a new quasi police force formed from the combination of Customs and Border staff. So you accept the basis of my argument but still want to criticise.

You then go on to propose some more reasonable ideas, but remember that companies bringing in workers under 457 Visas have a very poor history of compliance, so possibly it would be good to start "small" by enforcing the rules with 457 visa workers and ensuring a very high rate of compliance, then using the lessons learned for other areas. That way when the CHaFTA is signed we might have a chance of ensuring the Chinese companies don't import cheap labor by the A380 load.

The majority of Visa overstays have historically been from the UK and USA.

noco · 29 August 2015

SirRumpole said:
I was a bungled effort by the Border Protection Force (Federal Minister Peter Dutton) to try and look tough by issuing such statements as

my bolds
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-...eck-visas-on-the-streets-of-melbourne/6732086

So, you may have been wandering down Collins Street and if you looked a bit foreign may be asked for a visa and if you couldn't produce it, what then ?

As you yourself said, there are better ways of doing this sort of thing, so why did they pick that one, and then have to backflip when people complained ?

Rumpy, I do not know what you are carrying on about, I have already told you I disagree about the way they went about it....END OF STORY.....

awg · 29 August 2015

noco said:
How do you claim it to be a political exercise?....What has politics got to do with it?...Wasn't the Victorian Labor government also involved?

These guys even wear black shirts dont they? What a strangely worded announcement..who could have possibly conceived such a half-baked implementation.

Apparently Dutton has to authorise such an operation, with Abbot away, seems like communications might have gone awry on this one ?

Expect ABC Insiders will be all over it Sunday

IFocus · 29 August 2015

noco said:
So Rumpy, you and Sydboy condone illegal immigrants roaming the streets at will and breaking the law with overstayed visas.....How many could be terrorists?......you would not know and probably do not care.......If you lived in a communist state I doubt you would get away with it.

The implications of the Border Force Nazi uniformed stooges marching down Australian cities main streets demanding ID and proof of Australian citizenship is at best chilling.

I believe they indeed have the legal right to do this.

The fact it was stopped due to protest is absolutely terrifying because if it was necessary then they would have proceeded regardless.

They haven't proceeded so we can safely assume it was a complete political stunt (as was the formation) gone wrong with people waking up to the seriousness of a police authoritarian state run by a complete loser (Dutton)

How many flags will Abbott stand in front of to grandly announce what a great job Border Force is doing.

noco · 29 August 2015

IFocus said:
The implications of the Border Force Nazi uniformed stooges marching down Australian cities main streets demanding ID and proof of Australian citizenship is at best chilling.

I believe they indeed have the legal right to do this.

The fact it was stopped due to protest is absolutely terrifying because if it was necessary then they would have proceeded regardless.

They haven't proceeded so we can safely assume it was a complete political stunt (as was the formation) gone wrong with people waking up to the seriousness of a police authoritarian state run by a complete loser (Dutton)

How many flags will Abbott stand in front of to grandly announce what a great job Border Force is doing.

Mate, you are as bad as Rumpy wanted to make a big deal with me over this incident.

Didn't you read my post where I stated I did not agree as to the way they went about it.

For Christ sake get over it,...You have got it wrong again.

My post # 7378 ...my bolds.

Look, it is not that agree with the way the Victorian Government and the AFP went about their task as I am sure there are better ways of doing it.

SirRumpole · 29 August 2015

noco said:
Mate, you are as bad as Rumpy wanted to make a big deal with me over this incident.

Didn't you read my post where I stated I did not agree as to the way they went about it.

For Christ sake get over it,...You have got it wrong again.

My post # 7378 ...my bolds.

Look, it is not that agree with the way the Victorian Government and the AFP went about their task as I am sure there are better ways of doing it.

Then you asked why I thought it was a political exercise and I told you, after which you went off the deep end.

drsmith · 29 August 2015

awg said:
Apparently Dutton has to authorise such an operation, with Abbot away, seems like communications might have gone awry on this one ?

That's where I'd lay the blame if there was government involvement.

He was shifted out of health and into what is now largely a caretaker portfolio for a reason.

noco · 29 August 2015

SirRumpole said:
Then you asked why I thought it was a political exercise and I told you, after which you went off the deep end.

How was it political?....Was it an attempt to embarrass the LUG party.....The only thing I can see what you are driving out is a brick wall.

Get over it.....I am, and I will not carry on with any more such stupidity with you.

McLovin · 29 August 2015

If some noddy in a blackshirt approaches me on the street asking to see my papers I will tell him in no uncertain terms to get f*cked.

What is the Australian Border Force anyway and why are they wearing those ridiculous Stasiesque uniforms?

It's a ridiculous marketing exercise by the government. Give 'em new uniforms and a strong sounding name.

overhang · 29 August 2015

noco said:
How was it political?....Was it an attempt to embarrass the LUG party.....The only thing I can see what you are driving out is a brick wall.

Get over it.....I am, and I will not carry on with any more such stupidity with you.

Because the government has asked for weekly security PR that they can announce up until the election and what a way to do it, I know I'll feel a lot safer with that backpacker overstaying their working holiday now out of the country, thank you Mr Abbott.

A meeting of the National Security Committee of the cabinet has, however, recently asked for a list of national-security-related things that could be announced weekly between now and the election.

http://www.afr.com/opinion/columnis...hitlam-government-of-our-time-20150813-giy574

The Abbott government is trying to win the next election on a fear mongering national security campaign, he has contacted the US and begged them to make a formal request to Australia to join the bombing in Syria even though every military expert has said that Australia is not needed but yet Abbott is happy to put our tax pay dollars bombing a country so that he can win votes by claiming he is defeating the "death cult" when even the yanks have said they don't know how to fight IS.

SirRumpole · 29 August 2015

I wouldn't put it past this lot to plant a phony bomb somewhere then make a big noise about finding it and what a great job they are doing to protect our National Security.

McLovin · 29 August 2015

This is the slippery slope that started with the meta data collection. I remember on here a few posters said they didn't care because if you weren't doing anything wrong blah blah blah. Well now we have a government that has tested the water with having spot visa checks on the street to see what the reaction would be. Slippery slope. Give them an inch they're taking a mile.

sydboy007 · 29 August 2015

McLovin said:
This is the slippery slope that started with the meta data collection. I remember on here a few posters said they didn't care because if you weren't doing anything wrong blah blah blah. Well now we have a government that has tested the water with having spot visa checks on the street to see what the reaction would be. Slippery slope. Give them an inch they're taking a mile.

That was my feeling too. A toe in the water to see what the public reaction would be. If no stink they'd quickly roll it out all over the country and then we'd start to see real mission creep.

It's sad they think we need to be made into the very countries they say they are protecting us from.

sptrawler · 29 August 2015

IFocus said:
The implications of the Border Force Nazi uniformed stooges marching down Australian cities main streets demanding ID and proof of Australian citizenship is at best chilling.

I believe they indeed have the legal right to do this.

Yes it is just like the CFMEU, BLF or the MUA heavies, on a picket line.

Demanding proof of union membership.lol

We are a society of double standards. Our hypocrisy is beyond belief.

Not that I agree with the behaviour of either party, just showing that we already accept that sort of behaviour.lol

We just find it more repulsive, when it isn't focused on our own.

SirRumpole · 29 August 2015

sptrawler said:
Yes it is just like the CFMEU, BLF or the MUA heavies, on a picket line.

Demanding proof of union membership.lol

We are a society of double standards. Our hypocrisy is beyond belief.

So one excuses the other does it ?

The majority vote for dills like Dutton and we have every right to express our opinions on the actions of government.

And what makes you think people who criticise operation "Fortitude" don't have a similar opinion of union pickets ?

sptrawler · 29 August 2015

SirRumpole said:
So one excuses the other does it ?

The majority vote for dills like Dutton and we have every right to express our opinions on the actions of government.

And what makes you think people who criticise operation "Fortitude" don't have a similar opinion of union pickets ?

Here you go again putting words in my mouth.

Did I say one excuses the other?

Did I say I agreed with one or the other?

Well Bill Shorten, doesn't have the same opinion.

IFocus · 29 August 2015

sptrawler said:
Yes it is just like the CFMEU, BLF or the MUA heavies, on a picket line.

.

Unions are a collective force for workers and their rights and improvements to condition pay etc.

Border Force is a paramilitary force that can lawfully kick your door in and arrest you for J walking or not having ID.

tell me again what the likeness is?

BTW McLovin's point about telling them where to go would result in quite a serious offense.

luutzu · 29 August 2015

Since "border force" officers are being unleashed on us far away from the borders, does it mean the Abbott gov't has fail its sovereign border controls and are now chasing for illegals all over the country?

sptrawler · 29 August 2015

IFocus said:
Unions are a collective force for workers and their rights and improvements to condition pay etc.

That's what they used to be, that's what they should be, then maybe they wouldn't have a problem with workers becoming disenfranchised with them.
Which has resulted in an ever decreasing membership.

IFocus said:
Border Force is a paramilitary force that can lawfully kick your door in and arrest you for J walking or not having ID.
tell me again what the likeness is?

That is a really emotional nonsensical statement, the fisheries department can do that already.

What your really saying is who gives a rats if people are overstaying their visas, taking our jobs, as long as they aren't catching maron out of season.

Your logic cracks me up/

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awg

IFocus

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sydboy007

sptrawler

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IFocus

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