The Abbott Government

[Julia]

So you believe there is not a single recommending in the Henry tax review that could have been used in the budget?

http://taxreview.treasury.gov.au/con...chapter_12.htm

138 recommendations and the Govt, like Labor, has chosen to ignore them. How is that rational when we're told there's a budget crisis? It's only rational when political ideology trumps good policy.

Didn't the Henry tax review come out while Labor was in government? Were you raging about nothing being done about it then?

NZ has a much better Super system. It's universal and is simply added to the claimant's taxable income. There is no tax free threshold as applies here, so everyone pays tax at some level. Simple, and afaik, extremely workable. There are certainly not the constant squabbles about it as occur here.

 

[sptrawler]

Noco as Syd has said on many occassions, the tax threshold reductions were unsustainable, I sugest they return to the levels, pre Howard reducing them, which was in 2000.

Which was $14,102 + 47 cents for every dollar over $50,000.

Well that wasn't too long ago, but apparently that shouldn't have been raised.

We certainly wouldn't have a deficit, if they hadn't increased the thresholds, but the Labor hacks would be screaming about tax thresholds.

They really are a bunch of lost souls.
They don't want to be in opposition, yet when they get in power they overspend on poorly thought out policy.

Then when they are in opposition, they don't want to help pay for the debt they have caused. Childish behaviour.IMO

I wonder how much money people would be earning, if as Syd sugests we go to pre Howard threshold increases.
That would sort out all our tax/welfare problems. Wind the tax scales back to 2000 levels, that's only 7 years before Labor got in.
Apparently that caused all the problems, well I can see it will fix them.lol

 

[SirRumpole]

As Syd and I said, pensioners would get more money if it was linked to cpi, not wages. As the RBA has said on numerous occassions they expect average wages to fall and cpi to be at the upper levels of their range.
But as is usual, the plebs listen to the white sound from the hollow vessels. Priceless
Haven't you read wages are falling, cpi is rising, the dollar is falling which will result in a rise in cpi.

I really do get a laugh out of your posts.lol

It depends how long that cycle lasts as to whether pensioners will be better off or not in the long term. Obviously the pensioner advocates have done their sums and have determined that they will be worse off in the long run.

I suggest you take it up with them.

Also, if what you say is true , then Hockey is pretty stupid isn't he ? Trying to make savings but instead giving the pensioners more. What a dill.

 

[banco]

I was going to have a shot at the obvious contradiction regarding pollies smoking cigars/ pollies arriving in private jets.

But I really find it a bit of a shock, that someone I thought was open minded, can't see the sense in the idea.
Two points.
1. As far as I know those with an ongoing condition are exempt. I know this because my Mum freaked, I said calm down and find out the facts. She asked her doctor and he told her because she had an ongoing condition it wouldn't affect her.

Your mum is going to be in for quite a shock then if the budget gets through. Those with ongoing conditions are not exempt.

 

[sptrawler]

Didn't the Henry tax review come out while Labor was in government? Were you raging about nothing being done about it then?

NZ has a much better Super system. It's universal and is simply added to the claimant's taxable income. There is no tax free threshold as applies here, so everyone pays tax at some level. Simple, and afaik, extremely workable. There are certainly not the constant squabbles about it as occur here.

The last thing Syd wants is sensible discussion, he ignores that and regurgitates endless pro Labor waffle or offal, he isn't interested in giving any leeway to the Government or their mandate to implement policy.

Sounds like someone who sits in some office overnight, being paid to reply to forums, or someone who has a job that really should be offshored.

My guess is, it will be.

 

[sptrawler]

Your mum is going to be in for quite a shock then if the budget gets through. Those with ongoing conditions are not exempt.

Have you checked up on that? I am so over it. FFS


If I find you are wrong Banco, I will be all over you forever, I am so pi$$ed of with this budget missinformation. I don't forget and i don't forgive, also I expect to be treated the same way.

So We will check out that statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Well two minutes later first google entry.


Those who have special health needs, such as those with Health Assessments or those on Chronic Disease Management programs, will be exempt from the patient contribution.

Well before this times out, it looks like me and you are going to have issues.lol
Sounds like another brain fart from labor as GG would say.
I hate bad language but you really make me angry, the problem with ill founded scare tactics, it sends us all down the chute.
Also diminishes your credibility.

 

[sptrawler]

It depends how long that cycle lasts as to whether pensioners will be better off or not in the long term. Obviously the pensioner advocates have done their sums and have determined that they will be worse off in the long run.

I suggest you take it up with them.

Also, if what you say is true , then Hockey is pretty stupid isn't he ? Trying to make savings but instead giving the pensioners more. What a dill.

No, actually it just showed how little thought you gave to your comment. So really you're the dill.

Hockey made his call pre the wage and cpi results, you made your statement purely on a party based blurb.
That makes you the goon.

Shorten says blah , blah , blah, Sir Rumpole say blah, blah, blah.
You and Banco should maybe get together.lol

 

[banco]

Have you checked up on that? I am so over it. FFS


If I find you are wrong Banco, I will be all over you forever, I am so pi$$ed of with this budget missinformation. I don't forget and i don't forgive, also I expect to be treated the same way.

So We will check out that statement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Well two minutes later first google entry.


Those who have special health needs, such as those with Health Assessments or those on Chronic Disease Management programs, will be exempt from the patient contribution.

Well before this times out, it looks like me and you are going to have issues.lol
Sounds like another brain fart from labor as GG would say.
I hate bad language but you really make me angry, the problem with ill founded scare tactics, it sends us all down the chute.
Also diminishes your credibility.

While it is true that Medicare’s chronic disease management item will be exempt from the $7 GP fee, this is only for one doctors visit a year where the GP plans the patients care for their chronic illnesses.

Australian Medical Association GP spokesman Dr Brian Morton says every other visit the patient with a chronic illness makes to the GP or medical test that is ordered would be hit by a $7 GP fee.

http://www.news.com.au/national/who...their-own-policy/story-fncynjr2-1226926025926

Anyway remember we are in a budget emergency and your mum shouldn't expect to be able to bludge off the taxpayer.

 

[SirRumpole]

Hockey made his call pre the wage and cpi results, you made your statement purely on a party based blurb.
That makes you the goon.

So Hockey makes long term decisions based on short term results that he hasn't got yet ?

I return to my original point. He is a dill, and so are people who believe him.

I can avoid Hockey easily enough, but could you let us know when and where you are going on your caravanning holiday ?

There are some people I like to avoid on the roads if I possibly can.

 

[sptrawler]

While it is true that Medicare’s chronic disease management item will be exempt from the $7 GP fee, this is only for one doctors visit a year where the GP plans the patients care for their chronic illnesses.

Australian Medical Association GP spokesman Dr Brian Morton says every other visit the patient with a chronic illness makes to the GP or medical test that is ordered would be hit by a $7 GP fee.

http://www.news.com.au/national/who...their-own-policy/story-fncynjr2-1226926025926

Anyway remember we are in a budget emergency and your mum shouldn't expect to be able to bludge off the taxpayer.

Well as I said, my mother was worried, she lives in Collie a country town in W.A.
I told her to go and ask the doctor how it will affect her, she is 82 has type2 diabetes and heart tablets.
When she asked the doctor how it would affect her, he said you have an ongoing problem that requires constant monitoring and care, you will not be charged the $7 payment.

Now you can talk it up as much as you want, but untill that is proven wrong, I will take that as being more correct, than someone who has a vested interest in spreading miss information.

My mother and father paid taxes in Australia all their lives, same as I have, so I don't see any welfare they recieve as a bludge. Actually dad died at 70 years old so he more than paid for himself.

They also lived and worked in remote mining towns of W.A in the 1960's, they have more than paid their way.

It's a shame personal greed has overtaken personal ambition IMO. Now it's not so much about how much I can improve myself, it's more about how much can I get for minimal effort. IMO

So getting back to your statement, is my mum in for a shock? Or were you just on the Labor shock and awe hyperbowl crap, a bit like Sir Rumpole.

 

[banco]

Well as I said, my mother was worried, she lives in Collie a country town in W.A.
I told her to go and ask the doctor how it will affect her, she is 82 has type2 diabetes and heart tablets.
When she asked the doctor how it would affect her, he said you have an ongoing problem that requires constant monitoring and care, you will not be charged the $7 payment.

Now you can talk it up as much as you want, but untill that is proven wrong, I will take that as being more correct, than someone who has a vested interest in spreading miss information.

.

Sounds like you and the good doctor are the ones giving your mum misinformation (assuming she didn't misunderstand him in the first place). Can you point to this mythical policy that will exempt people with ongoing problems? Of course not because it doesn't exist.

Funny how you are all for fiscal restraint and "tough budgets" then when the cuts impact you or yours it's "I pay taxes".

 

[sydboy007]

Didn't the Henry tax review come out while Labor was in government? Were you raging about nothing being done about it then?

NZ has a much better Super system. It's universal and is simply added to the claimant's taxable income. There is no tax free threshold as applies here, so everyone pays tax at some level. Simple, and afaik, extremely workable. There are certainly not the constant squabbles about it as occur here.

Go through my comments from when Labor was on the treasury benches and you will find I was complaining about them not using the Henry Tax review.

 

[Logique]

...With regards the pension if someone 55 gives up their job, travels the world, buys porsches and blow all their money, qualify for a taxpayer funded income of $32,000 per year indexed to the average wage. Sounds good to me...

sp, a bit of a digression, but..55? You mean 65 right?

 

[sydboy007]

Noco as Syd has said on many occassions, the tax threshold reductions were unsustainable, I sugest they return to the levels, pre Howard reducing them, which was in 2000.

Which was $14,102 + 47 cents for every dollar over $50,000.

Well that wasn't too long ago, but apparently that shouldn't have been raised.

We certainly wouldn't have a deficit, if they hadn't increased the thresholds, but the Labor hacks would be screaming about tax thresholds.

They really are a bunch of lost souls.
They don't want to be in opposition, yet when they get in power they overspend on poorly thought out policy.

Then when they are in opposition, they don't want to help pay for the debt they have caused. Childish behaviour.IMO

I wonder how much money people would be earning, if as Syd sugests we go to pre Howard threshold increases.
That would sort out all our tax/welfare problems. Wind the tax scales back to 2000 levels, that's only 7 years before Labor got in.
Apparently that caused all the problems, well I can see it will fix them.lol

When did I ever say taxes should go back to their per 2000 levels.

What I have said is that in total all the Howard and the post 2007 Rudd tax cuts were unsustainable.

The majority of those cuts were funded not by tax reform but by the mining boom. Now that revenue is back to a level as a % of GDP roughly in line with the pre boom level the budget is in deficit. So we have a roughly 3% drop in federal taxation revenue. Pretty much that transitory income jump was spent on tax cuts and increased welfare. From my way of looking at it, when someone knows they've got a temporary wage increase but sets up new spending that is reliant on at least maintaining that new level of income, they're not particularly good economic managers.

You seem to like ignoring the fact that it was the Howard Govt that gave us the massive increases in wasteful middle class welfare. Howard was the one to send the budget into structural deficit, and Rudd was a fool in copying the remaining tax cuts after 2007. Sensible economic managers do not hear the RBA saying inflation is getting out of control and decide to provide billions more in tax cuts and other spending increases, forcing mortgage rates to hit over 9%.

 

[sydboy007]

While it is true that Medicare’s chronic disease management item will be exempt from the $7 GP fee, this is only for one doctors visit a year where the GP plans the patients care for their chronic illnesses.

Australian Medical Association GP spokesman Dr Brian Morton says every other visit the patient with a chronic illness makes to the GP or medical test that is ordered would be hit by a $7 GP fee.

http://www.news.com.au/national/who...their-own-policy/story-fncynjr2-1226926025926

Anyway remember we are in a budget emergency and your mum shouldn't expect to be able to bludge off the taxpayer.

The $7 co-payment also kicks in for vaccinations. The health minister has already come out and said he doesn't believe this will cause a drop in vaccination rates.

The new system is also designed to penalise doctors who try to bulk bill without charging the co payment by seeing their income drop to just $31.30 for a level B consultation. No co-payment no low gap incentive payment from the Govt. The health minister does talk about a $2 per patient "windfall" for GPs when they charge the $7 co-payment.

 

[sptrawler]

sp, a bit of a digression, but..55? You mean 65 right?

No I meant 55, that gives the person 10 or so years to blow their money, before becoming eligible for the pension. No point in waiting till 65, enjoy it while still relitively young.

 

[sptrawler]

When did I ever say taxes should go back to their per 2000 levels.

What I have said is that in total all the Howard and the post 2007 Rudd tax cuts were unsustainable.

The majority of those cuts were funded not by tax reform but by the mining boom. Now that revenue is back to a level as a % of GDP roughly in line with the pre boom level the budget is in deficit. So we have a roughly 3% drop in federal taxation revenue. Pretty much that transitory income jump was spent on tax cuts and increased welfare. From my way of looking at it, when someone knows they've got a temporary wage increase but sets up new spending that is reliant on at least maintaining that new level of income, they're not particularly good economic managers.

You seem to like ignoring the fact that it was the Howard Govt that gave us the massive increases in wasteful middle class welfare. Howard was the one to send the budget into structural deficit, and Rudd was a fool in copying the remaining tax cuts after 2007. Sensible economic managers do not hear the RBA saying inflation is getting out of control and decide to provide billions more in tax cuts and other spending increases, forcing mortgage rates to hit over 9%.

Well as I said ,reset the tax levels back to sustainable levels, as they were pre mining boom. Everyone has had fun, now back to reality as per the normal grind years. Obviously the thresholds would have to be higher to reflect higher average wages, but as you say maybe the tax rates shouldn't have been dropped.

Also welfare payments increased at unsustainable rates, over recent years, that needs to be brought back into line also.

We can't change history, but it doesn't mean we can't learn and change the future.

 

[noco]

Having read all the waffle from the main contenders in this discussion, I am more than satisfied you will never keep every one happy all the time, half the time or none of the time at all.

Most people are a greedy jealous bunch......why should he get more than me?......why should I work past 65 and not get the aged pension when I have worked hard and paid taxes all my life......Why should I work at all when I can get the dole or a disability pension ( in many cases not entitled to it)?........Why shouldn't I go to the pub every night and pi$$ my money against the wall......smoke my head off and become a burden to the tax payer because I have a liver problem or lung cancer?......Who said I can't go to a casino or pub and send my savings down the slot of a poker machine and when it is all gone apply for social security and a cheap housing commission unit......Yeah...don't worry about where the money comes from or who has to pay for it......She'll be right mate as we so often hear.

Who said I can't work until I was 76 years of age before applying for a part aged pension......Who said I can't enjoy life with my savings and travel to various parts of the world to see how other people live in other parts of the Western world and third world countries......see how other people around the world live......see how in many parts of the world how many people have to work 55 hours per week on low wages and then have to live on smell of an oily rag.......see in many of those countries where there is no social security, no aged pension, no health care.....in many of those countries if you you go to a doctor or a hospital it is money up front or you don't get the treatment.....The young ones take care of their elders.

So for Christ sake stop complaining about what you think you should have or what you have not got in comparison to the other person who has been a lot wiser in the way he or she has lived their past life......Many of us have a brain and use it well.......some of us have only half a brain and sort struggle to get by and some have no brain at all but happy to sponge off other people.....you don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer.

I have good idea and it will probably ruffle a few feathers.

I would like to see a new party called the Fabian Party.
Rumpy as the President.
Syd as treasurer.
Ifocus as finance minister.
MacQuack as foreign minister.
Jacquie Lambie as defense minister.
Clive Palmer as minister for mining and infrastructure.

Ah yes....one has to have a laugh at the funny side of present day politics run at times by a bunch of lunatics.
Ya just gotta lov'em.

 

[SirRumpole]

Ah yes....one has to have a laugh at the funny side of present day politics run at times by a bunch of lunatics.
Ya just gotta lov'em.

Thanks for that important and meaningful contribution to the debate.

All you have said is "shut up if you don't agree with me".

May I suggest you do the same ?

.you don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer.

That certainly can be done. Having more people with cash to spend is better for the economy at large than having a few people with lots of loot that they spend most of the day counting or spending on unproductive assets like big houses, boats and aircraft.

Big companies are useless without lots of customers with the money to buy their products.

The trouble with you noco, is that like your leader you are addicted to the one line slogans without giving much thought to what goes on in the real economy.

 

[noco]

Thanks for that important and meaningful contribution to the debate.

All you have said is "shut up if you don't agree with me".

May I suggest you do the same ?

I haven't said a word old mate.....what have I said that that you don't agree with?......just listening or reading what one says to the other about the way the country should be run is really amusing.....We live in a democracy of free speech...if you don't like the way a government is running the country express your opinion at the ballot box....that is what happened to the last incompetent lot......they messed up big time and got tossed out.....who ever you vote for, you have to accept what the majority want until the next round.....if it burns a hole in your pocket, so be it.....we all have to learn to agree to disagree.

ROFL...