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The Abbott Government

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noco said:
Can you name one amongst the Green/Labor coalition who could match him....there is not too much talent left in the Labor Party.
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Haven't you heard? AQUIS has declared a quarantine for the Liberal front bench due to a massive outbreak of foot in mouth.

Joe seems to be foaming at the mouth the last couple of days, Brandis is near terminal from it last week, while Abetz seemed to have been drinking from an old 1950s cup. Even your super man Tony had it during a couple of interviews last week with his memorable "It is not what you're doing on the internet, it's the sites you're visiting" line.

Hopefully a cup of tea and a bex with an afternoon siesta will help in their recovery.
 
banco said:
dreyfus, bowen and wong for a start
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As I recall, these three were ministers in the Gillard Rudd debacle and supported/participated in forming their policies.

Furthering thus policy would be be disastrous.

Are you suggesting these three would radically depart from that ideology?
 
wayneL said:
As I recall, these three were ministers in the Gillard Rudd debacle and supported/participated in forming their policies.

Furthering thus policy would be be disastrous.

Are you suggesting these three would radically depart from that ideology?
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I'm suggesting they are more competent politicians than Hockey.
 
orr said:
I'm leaving foot prints to where I've been, But this quote by John Stuart Mill echo's down the ages,

"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives."

Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/john_stuart_mill.html#p7oXWtFvataBlPpd.99

in your own time noco, or any others, give us your take on the great Mr Stuart Mill.
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On the other hand, the Great Winston Churchill said:

“If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.”

NB liberal in the UK context.

As far as the Mill quote, probably spot on in the context of the time. I think he be horrified by todays social democrats.
 
wayneL said:
As I recall, these three were ministers in the Gillard Rudd debacle and supported/participated in forming their policies.

Furthering thus policy would be be disastrous.

Are you suggesting these three would radically depart from that ideology?
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I think a better measure for this current lot is against Howards front bench which did have some very talented and competent ministers.

The Abbott front bench and cabinet in general are not highly regarded by anyone. There are some very capable people on the backbench but generally from the wrong factions or not far enough to the right.

Abbott is still beholden to the right of the party many being laggards from Howards lower order like the speaker Bronwyn Bishop and Kevin Andrews etc.
 
banco said:
Fewer unforced errors.
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Well I don't grade a politicians capabilities by the number (ie fewest) of gaffs, rather, by policies, both economic and social.

While this lot has been disappointing to say the least, I do not fear for our country under their stewardship.

I am absolutely petrified for Australia if and when Short'un and Komrades - including and particularly Wong, Bowen and Dreyfus... and you can chuck in Plibersek(sp) in that cabal of economic and social vandals - get into power.

I am seriously considering putting my hand up for alien abduction if this comes to pass.
 
IFocus said:
I think a better measure for this current lot is against Howards front bench which did have some very talented and competent ministers.

The Abbott front bench and cabinet in general are not highly regarded by anyone. There are some very capable people on the backbench but generally from the wrong factions or not far enough to the right.

Abbott is still beholden to the right of the party many being laggards from Howards lower order like the speaker Bronwyn Bishop and Kevin Andrews etc.
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As Syd (I think) said, we seriously need a third force in politics. But not from the lunatic fringes like One Nation or The Greens, or one based on a larger than life personality with no agenda apart from... well whatever it is... like the PUPpies; something sensible from the center - like the Oz Democarrots before they metamorphosed into the Greens without the greenwash.

Something along the lines of the Orange Bookers. (Syd will appreciate their stance on land tax)
 
Biggest mistake this government did, was say things can't keep going on the same way, we can't spend more than we earn.

That has caused everyone that does, to scream "WHY".:D

The Fairfax media has fed into the hysteria, because they need to increase circulation to keep their jobs.:xyxthumbs

It really doesn't matter what showbag Bill says, they were going backwards at 300km/hr.

Someone will have to put the brakes on.:2twocents
 
wayneL said:
Well I don't grade a politicians capabilities by the number (ie fewest) of gaffs, rather, by policies, both economic and social.

While this lot has been disappointing to say the least, I do not fear for our country under their stewardship.

I am absolutely petrified for Australia if and when Short'un and Komrades - including and particularly Wong, Bowen and Dreyfus... and you can chuck in Plibersek(sp) in that cabal of economic and social vandals - get into power.

I am seriously considering putting my hand up for alien abduction if this comes to pass.
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If you are crap at the politics you can forget the policy as it won't get through (as Hockey is finding out). You think John Howard would have been dumb enough in a million years to make the comments about poor people and driving?
 
banco said:
If you are crap at the politics you can forget the policy as it won't get through (as Hockey is finding out). You think John Howard would have been dumb enough in a million years to make the comments about poor people and driving?
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Ήταν ένα καταπληκτικό ηλίθιο πράγμα που λέει και πιστεύω αρκετά ανακριβή. Ακριβώς δεν σκέφτομαι ότι δικαιολογεί την παράδοση της Αυστραλίας πίσω στα χέρια των προαναφερθε'ντων ξοδεύοντας βανδάλων πλεονάσματος.

Μικρότερος δύο κακών.

It was a sensationally stupid thing to say and I believe quite incorrect. I just don't think it justifies delivering Australia back into the hands of the aforementioned spendthrifts and profligates.

Lesser of two evils.
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We have two dysfunctional major parties, this government deserves to be a one term government at this rate and Labor are in no position to govern for quite some time as the wounds are still fresh from their last endeavor. I agree with the few others here that we require a third force in politics closer to center. We are all worse off under this political landscape.
 
banco said:
Let's face it unless he's fielding softball questions from Kochie Joe Hockey just isn't that good at being a politician. I used to think he was good at the politics but not so good at policy. It looks like he's not good at either.
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Very perceptive comment banco.

Today's Age headline is:
"Libs attack Hockey" mentioning 2 Queensland backbenchers and NSW based senator who have attacked him.
The article also mentions that his 2nd and 3rd most senior advisors have quit since the budget was released - a difference of opinion?

From the Age:
Mr Hockey's gaffe has capped a difficult three months in which the Treasurer has been under fire for puffing a cigar and days later, dancing with his son on budget night before delivering a wide ranging budget cuts, taking a holiday in Fiji during a key parliamentary sitting, complaining that everyone in the media was against him and co-operating with a biography that revealed he wanted an even tougher budget.

I believe he won't be given the chance to muck up a second budget.
Noco, please tell me when that rag, the Courier Mail attacks him, (or even reports the attacks of the Queensland backbenchers) as this will mean he has lost the backing of Rupert and he will resign soon after. I look forward to reading his autobiography at that point.
 
sptrawler said:
Biggest mistake this government did, was say things can't keep going on the same way, we can't spend more than we earn.
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But they haven't done this. Yes we've been told the age of entitlement is over, yet PPL is still a policy priority.

Yes the age of entitlement is over, but what structural balances have been proposed by Abbott and Joe?

You can't ignore the politics of policy. They have. You can't try to force through what is patently a grossly unfair budget then wonder why there's such blow back from the public which gives the opposition and non aligned senators the backbone to block the most unfair measures.

Pretty much everyone knows we need to cut back on spending and get the budget balanced in the next few years. So rather than relying on bracket creep the Government should be broadening the tax base. Our tax base is increasingly being hollowed out and far too reliant on personal and corporate taxes. Those taxes have a very high marginal excess burden - estimated to be 24-40% in the Henry review.

In the last 3 months there's been practically a policy vacuum from the Govt. It is no longer a policy to not be Labor.

We have 363 tax expenditures. Why not pick 10 to remove. Probably not a lot of revenue is you pick the ones providing the least tax leakage, but symbolism works. Quarantine NG to new builds only while grandfathering the current system. Bring the states in and work out a deal to replace stamp duty with a broadly based land tax. Share the political pain and show you have true leadership. Sell it with the question of "Why should only the roughly 5% of households purchasing a property each year provide the largest share of state funding behind GST"? Frame it as a housing affordability measure by showing a land tax would reduce the need for upfront developer levies so FHBs can see $40-50K reduction in prices. Frame it as providing the states with the ability to fund their own programs so there is a clear division of responsibility. Then show how income and corporate taxes will come down as the policy is introduced.

This Government doesn't have a sales problem with the budget. They have an ideology problem that is blinding them to the fact they're producing very poor policy, the public knows it's unfair and bad policy, and the media is feeding off that. They've committed funding to a road tunnel in Melbourne estimated to cost $1M per meter, that will produce 80c of economic return for every $ invested. That is not good policy no matter how much lipstick is put on the pig.

I also find it strange how the media has only become an issue since September 2013. Why wasn't it a problem before then?

I'd argue the good policy side is the easy part, once you take the ideologically based blinders off. The hard part is packaging the proposed changes so it's easy to show they are fair. Once the public can see that, they'll still not like you for taking away some of their lollies, but they'll respect you for having the courage to do it.
 
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