Street Violence and Alcohol

[jersey10]

gunna tell you a maybe true story now . all identities and situations have been made up to protect the innocent

once upon a time in a WA city there was a crowd of 100 or more locals that used to come to the nightclub precint every week JUST to start blues , roll ppl and generally make a nuisance

the local police , nightclub owners done everything they could VIA the laws to stop it .ie bannings , lockouts , lockups , offender lists etc

the trouble still continued just not in the clubs carparks but in the streets as ppl waited for cabs / walked home

one day another bunch of peesed of locals hired a pantech truck , filled it with 40 of the biggest , ugliest bat weilding vigalantes they could find , whose name cannot be mentioned as currently they are frowned upon in the media

thos bunch of ruffians drove up and fdown the nighclub area and bashed all known trouble makers ,and made a speedy getaway

they did this every weekend for 3 weeks

was no more trouble except the odd individual numnut playing up for over 6 months in said precinct

this strategy may be frowned upon but boy did it work a treat

oh thats if it really happened and not just the ramblings of some drunken hairy nun

this proves that the trouble can be stopped so long as the perpetrators fear the consequence enough.

 

[overhang]

I honestly would like to see some sort of licensing/barcode type system introduced, every licensed venue required to have a card reader upon entry, every patron required to have a drinking license. It would be sort of a demerit point type system that would lead to a state wide ban from all licensed venues. Something like that anyway, its to easy to be kicked out for an altercation only to walk a block down the road and fight someone in the next pub.
To accidentally bump into someone and apologize only to be told if you do it again you'll be knocked out is the sort of aggressive sentiment that large number of drunks seem to have.

 

[MrBurns]

The current attitude toward the police is another part of the problem, they've been castrated by the law and need to be able to act more aggressively, which also means get the girls out of there and leave it to the men and tough men at that.

 

[nunthewiser]

this proves that the trouble can be stopped so long as the perpetrators fear the consequence enough.

yep and im all for sending in the riot squads / TRG to go in with boots and all , but they tried that in northbridge ,perth , only to have the bleeding hearts whinging about how bad and heavy handed the cops are

screaming police brutality in one voice and screaming please stop the violence around the nightclubs in the other .........

 

[MrBurns]

I have at times seriously wished I was part of the mafia so I could dipense justice the way it should be.

 

[jersey10]

yep and im all for sending in the riot squads / TRG to go in with boots and all , but they tried that in northbridge ,perth , only to have the bleeding hearts whinging about how bad and heavy handed the cops are

screaming police brutality in one voice and screaming please stop the violence around the nightclubs in the other .........

I agree with you. However, i'm not implying that the only consequence these scumbags will be fearful of has to be violence or a display of physical force.

 

[nunthewiser]

I agree with you. However, i'm not implying that the only consequence these scumbags will be fearful of has to be violence or a display of physical force.

locking up , bannings , restrictions on entering licensed premises all sound great but they dont actually work .not up here anyways

been tried , is a very grey area where there is alcohol and drugs involved

violent people do however understand violence

sad but true

 

[nunthewiser]

I have at times seriously wished I was part of the mafia so I could dipense justice the way it should be.

LOL im sure there is an application form available on the net somewhere

but ya gotta remember tho

live by the sword , die by the sword

 

[waza1960]

Simple solution= More police +Zero Tolerance unlikely though with most labour state Govnmts close to bankrupt

 

[Ageo]

I have at times seriously wished I was part of the mafia so I could dipense justice the way it should be.

True but then you will need to look over your shoulders for other things.

But i agree, A few yrs back in Griffith there was always trouble at the local pubs etc.. but at my cousins nightclub the trouble was always controlled, who knows why but perhaps its just the way the public viewed the place. Very safe environment to go out indeed.

 

[nunthewiser]

True but then you will need to look over your shoulders for other things.

But i agree, A few yrs back in Griffith there was always trouble at the local pubs etc.. but at my cousins nightclub the trouble was always controlled, who knows why but perhaps its just the way the public viewed the place. Very safe environment to go out indeed.

knows a few pubs , clubs in perth and adelaide of similar structure ....... safest night out anyone can have and enjoyable BUT woe to those that decide to play up in these places

the focus in these places are as a place where one can go out , spend there cash and party in an enviroment where you not gunna get kinghit by some nob that thinks knocking out some drunk punter is there idea of a good time

funny how the powers that be seem to want to close these places down tho ..

 

[nunthewiser]

Been involved with this issue quite a lot on Hobart (where it's worse than you might expect).

yes the "ISOBAR " sure can be a dodgy little place at times .same as the "SOHO"



good nightlife in hobart , generally friendly punters but same as everywhere , the minority stuff it for the rest.

 

[nunthewiser]

i think i will stop posting here now before anyone starts thinking im a drunken corrupted nun that hangs out in seedy places as a hobby

 

[Timmy]

i think i will stop posting here now before anyone starts thinking im a drunken corrupted nun that hangs out in seedy places as a hobby

C'mon nun - how shallow do you think we all are? I am sure no-one here has just started to think that.

 

[Sugar Dunkaton]

I think someone mentioned earlier that they have been out and got on the sauce but not once been in a scuffle.

This is the same as me, I have been out for years and years, I have drunk myself stupid a number of times regrettably, but I pay the price for that the next day. Not once have i been in a scuffle of any kind. It is not worth the risk. There is glass, there is concrete, there is benches with sharp edges. There is a lot that can go wrong-and winding up dead, blind or without the use of one or more limbs is not worth the ego boost of trying to give someone a black eye.

It is claimed so many times that when someone has died in a scuffle that it was an accident, but it is not. These fights breakout to maliciously inflict harm-so if you are a willing contestant, If your oppoisition dies or some other permanent injury due to hitting his head on the concrete or something similiar, Murder or attempted murder is a fair charge.

And I think Groups of people that hunt down isolated individuals should be jailed. It is weak.

I have witnessed one of the most sickening public bashings by a group of "heros", on one poor hapless individual. And when he was bashed to beyond consciouness and recognition. One idiot had to come in and king hit him again to further mess up his jaw.

I think that the people are the major problem here, not the alcohol-alcohol works as a catalyst though. But the people who I know that have been in fights before on the sauce, their personalities are such that they would defend their ego on the gas or not. These people will never back down given any circumstances.

My conclusion is that it is the egos and arrogance of many people that cause this violence.

My solution would be something of a three strikes policy with incremental penalties, increasing steeply. And the penalty for the first strike would be serious enough. I would be going after anyone who is in a public scuffle.

It jsut makes me sick that people can break a glass over someones head or knock them out on a gutter or the like.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Why not a new perspective?



Bring it BACK to reality, you would be surprised how many soft **** would be gangsters are really out there!

 

[Smurf1976]

yes the "ISOBAR " sure can be a dodgy little place at times .same as the "SOHO"



good nightlife in hobart , generally friendly punters but same as everywhere , the minority stuff it for the rest.

Exactly. Dumbest thing ever done with this issue in Hobart was shutting down Surreal in my opinion. Iso would have gone broke anyway (and was clearly headed that way) if not for that factor. Putting virtually everyone in a single area with a dodge club, lots of dark spots (hard to police) etc wasn't what I'd call a smart move.

Even the oldies probably remember the constant Surreal Vs Isobar advertising war on TV, print and especially radio. Combined, they would have been a significant share of total radio advertising at one point. Too much capacity, not enough people so it was easy to avoid whichever was the worse club at the time, hence enforcing at least a minimum standard. Likewise the less mainstream venues also had to compete for business since if it wasn't good enough, there was always space in one of the mainstream alternatives.

Big problem is there's no incentive to run a decent venue. No point spending $ millions settting up, trying to keep the bad people out etc when that cuts profits and means you need to remain in business for years to make it worthwhile financially.

The incentive now is build it cheap (in the unlikely event you can actually get approval to build it in the first place...), sell as much booze as possible and maximise profits before it's shut down. That's certainly the message that's been sent over the past few years - you probably won't be allowed to remain in business anyway so you might as well grab what you can while you can get it. Not a recipe for responsible operation.

All that said, the underlying problem is the culture that getting smashed is the only reason to go out in the first place. To be fair to the operators, that's the market they're operating in so it's either serve the drunks or they'll sit in a park somewhre instead. Australian culture doesn't really allow anyone to actually implement responsible service of alcohol without putting themselves out of business. Even in a small country town, they still have to compete with the bottle shop and someone's backyard or the local park.

We need a fundamental change in Australian cultural attitudes toward alcohol if this is ever going to change. Given that even the nerds seem to have joined the "get smashed every weekend" brigade over the past 5 - 10 years, I don't see much chance of that happening. In Australia, anyone who doesn't participate in this is viewed as at best a bit wierd and that's the problem. Smashed is "normal" now.

 

[Trevor_S]

In Australia, anyone who doesn't participate in this is viewed as at best a bit wierd and that's the problem. Smashed is "normal" now.

While that's true to a point, I have never been smashed or drunk and I associate with people of a like mind. I never went out to clubs when I was younger as the stench of ciggy smoke made it unbearable. Some friends have the occasional drink but I can't remember the last time a friend of mine was drunk. I would rather get up at 5-5:30am and go hiking or mountain bike riding for example.

I personally think alcohol is the next tobacco and will eventually be banned from advertising by the "I know what's best for you brigade" and those partaking will be just as ostrasized as smokers are now, 20 - 30 years hence...


I don't see the attraction, the frugal side of my nature also wants to forgo it purely from a cost point of view, so I don't participate.

 

[Tink]

I agree with you Trevor

I think alcohol will go down the same line as tobacco did, with all the warnings, no more ads etc...

 

[Junior]

I have been going out drinking in Melbourne's CBD for the past 7 years or so...prob about once a fortnight on average. I've never been in a fight or felt scared, I've probably had blokes try to start a fight with me maybe 3-4 times and that wasn't in the CBD. I remember one time in Brighton and once on Toorak Rd out the front of Silvers nightclub.

I've seen plenty of fights and violence but managed to stay out of it even after a hundred frothys. So from my perspective I think all the media hype is making too much of a big deal over a problem that exists in most big cities. Melbourne is a city of well over 3 million people now, the CBD is packed with late night drinking venues. There's obviously going to be some violence.

If you think Melbourne has a problem check out Cavill avenue on a Saturday night, it's an absolute mess.