Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

Storm Financial Group

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Solly said:
"Storm Financial's Emmanuel and Julie Cassimatis to sell"

"THE co-founders of collapsed investment firm Storm Financial, Emmanuel and Julie Cassimatis, owe $16 million and face personal bankruptcy.

Mr Cassimatis said yesterday all their assets were for sale or to be listed – Townsville and Brisbane mansions, private jet, cars and boats.

The once high-flying entrepreneur and his wife had a fortune last year estimated at $450 million on The Sunday Mail Top 100 Rich List.

But yesterday he said: "I don't even know whether we're going to survive financially."

The bad news continues for them, with some clients lining up to sue them personally."


Full Story by Mitch Gaynor here;

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,24989406-5007190,00.html
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I reckon most clients wiped out by the Storm would be fervently hoping the Cassamati's DON'T survive financially. Just having the gall to publicly postulate the possibility that they MIGHT survive financially again shows how insensitive those creeps really are.

Let 'em rot, I say.

aj
(fortunately not a client)
 
The gall of EC......
In the article linked above

"We always took dividends in December," he said.

"How was I supposed to know I better not take a dividend because it's not going to look good because we're screwed?"

When we had our video link up with him on 28th November and he told us our entire portfolio had been sold out with a debt still owing to Colonial of $195,000 and we reminded him of our 2.3 million dollar debt to ANZ(Secured by property we now have to sell to pay ANZ).That was what he said our position was. "Well then your screwed!".....now he knows how we felt in November before he took his 2mill.
Screw you!!!!!:mad::(
 
Mash said:
The gall of EC......
In the article linked above

"We always took dividends in December," he said.

"How was I supposed to know I better not take a dividend because it's not going to look good because we're screwed?"

When we had our video link up with him on 28th November and he told us our entire portfolio had been sold out with a debt still owing to Colonial of $195,000 and we reminded him of our 2.3 million dollar debt to ANZ(Secured by property we now have to sell to pay ANZ).That was what he said our position was. "Well then your screwed!".....now he knows how we felt in November before he took his 2mill.
Screw you!!!!!:mad::(
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Yep I noted that comment as well - I was in two minds on whether this guy genuinely believed his own BS or was just a BS artist - that line seems to show he is the latter.

And to take an 800k investment from someone in December is just shocking as well (almost half of the dividend he took). Its just out and out theft - anyone that runs a business has a responsibility to have a good underestanding of its viability.

That short article has certainly cemented my view of character of the man.
 
There's a two page article in today's Sunday Mail, Agenda section, also by Mitch Gaynor.

In the article , EC says he is supressing 'immense anger' as he tries to help clients. His anger is directed at the Comm Bank and is infuriated by its actions. The article also refers to EC's involvement with MLC, previous interest free loans to clients during the dot com bust, current outstanding loans to 40 Storm clients. The article also states that Storms income went from $77Mil in 2007-8 to $200,000 in January.

If you can source a copy of the article, I believe it's quite a good read.
 
Mash said:
When we had our video link up with him on 28th November and he told us our entire portfolio had been sold out with a debt still owing to Colonial of $195,000 and we reminded him of our 2.3 million dollar debt to ANZ(Secured by property we now have to sell to pay ANZ).That was what he said our position was. "Well then your screwed!".....[(
Click to expand...


That's just an appalling thing to say, and demonstrates that his 'concern' for his clients is all a facade.

But my goodness, you were dealing in big figures!
 
Yes big figures which now result in big losses.... have been called greedy.... and nothing you all call us is any worse than the names we have called ourselves.... I hate what we have done.... that is believing a snakeoil conman...... when we joined storm..... we were obviously marked as a cashcow....newly retired with cash sum in hand. and property to morgage...we thought we had done our homework....seen other planners.... gone through the figures....I think the problem was our LVR started conservative....50% max.....but as each "step" (Storm speak for sinking more dough) the Statement of Additional Advice only saw the LVR rise 3-4%....BUT step after step quickly had it up to 78%..... then through "capitalizing" the interest to the loan ( now in hindsight realise wasn't in original advice they just slipped it in once we had stopped asking so many questions)...the LVR grew steeply as the market fell.. We were always correcting information in the "Statements of Advice" and asked why our loan against the properties was not included in the LVR (only the margin loan was)...we kept our own spreadsheet and when the market was at 4200 we wanted out, saw the advisor and as previously mentioned in this thread by others were stalled told they had strategies in place and in hindsight obviously they were trying to keep their cashflow up.... yes we should have jumped up and down more...should have yelled not just asked.... we will forever regret not demanding to be heard.... but like I said .... we have beaten ourselves up (Since November 28) .... only those other storm clients know the tactics and that's why we are banding together.... more for emotional support as much as anything...don't expect to get money back...just some mental and emotional stability.Sorrry went on a bit of a rant.... that's what it's like these days..... "trust us"....those words make me sick to the stomach:banghead::banghead::horse:
 
tonzo said:
As a former Storm client i dont remember actually providing any evidence of my wages or extra income. We provided a bank statement to prove we had an iniatial investment amount (proceeds of a house sale) and gave verbals of wages. After the initial paperwork any additional steps (storm speak for extra investment via margin loans) were in the form of several one page forms for us to sign plus a bigger statement to initial that outlined the process. However after having recently borrowed money for both house and car loans the paperwork we received to borrow margin loans required only one signature whereas the home and car required multiple. It does seem very possible to me that the loan documents might be fishy and if thats the case both storm and the banks have to be held responsible for potentially shoddy loan approvals. However i still maintain that individual investors are responsible for there own losses. People who are scratching their heads wondering how they ended up with so much negative equity need to take responsibility for their own finances. I would check the value of our storm badged challenger investments several times a week against the value of our margin loans. Once the difference between the two got close to the level where we would start to have less left over than our initial investment amount we decided to get out. I should also mention that a year peviously we wished to cash out once we had more than doubled our initial investmant amount but were very firmly discouraged not to. You would go into your meeting with a stratrgy in mind and they would talk you out of it. If people paid attention to their investments which you are an idiot if you dont do even if only in a casual fashion then there is lees chance they would be in this predicament We set our selves a limit of what we were prepared to lose and that was out initial investment amount it turns out we ended up with about 10% more in the end. It is a tragedy for everone involved but it seems to from reading the papers and the internet that very few people involved be it clients, FA's, banks ot the Cassimatis's are willing to take responsibility. I freely admit that i loved the tax perks involved in having big tax deuctions for my investment loans and so would every other storm client. Life is not easy and no-one gives you anything for free but ultimately the buck stops with us for our individual choices
Click to expand...

An excellent post. It's good to see a former Storm client put forward a balanced view, including an acknowledgement of the fact that Storm clients had a responsibility to keep themselves up to date with their investments and to take defensive action when appropriate, even if it meant stepping in and taking control from the 'investment professionals' they put in charge.
 
tonzo said:
As a former Storm client i dont remember actually providing any evidence of my wages or extra income. We provided a bank statement to prove we had an iniatial investment amount (proceeds of a house sale) and gave verbals of wages. After the initial paperwork any additional steps (storm speak for extra investment via margin loans) were in the form of several one page forms for us to sign plus a bigger statement to initial that outlined the process. However after having recently borrowed money for both house and car loans the paperwork we received to borrow margin loans required only one signature whereas the home and car required multiple. It does seem very possible to me that the loan documents might be fishy and if thats the case both storm and the banks have to be held responsible for potentially shoddy loan approvals. However i still maintain that individual investors are responsible for there own losses. People who are scratching their heads wondering how they ended up with so much negative equity need to take responsibility for their own finances. I would check the value of our storm badged challenger investments several times a week against the value of our margin loans. Once the difference between the two got close to the level where we would start to have less left over than our initial investment amount we decided to get out. I should also mention that a year peviously we wished to cash out once we had more than doubled our initial investmant amount but were very firmly discouraged not to. You would go into your meeting with a stratrgy in mind and they would talk you out of it. If people paid attention to their investments which you are an idiot if you dont do even if only in a casual fashion then there is lees chance they would be in this predicament We set our selves a limit of what we were prepared to lose and that was out initial investment amount it turns out we ended up with about 10% more in the end. It is a tragedy for everone involved but it seems to from reading the papers and the internet that very few people involved be it clients, FA's, banks ot the Cassimatis's are willing to take responsibility. I freely admit that i loved the tax perks involved in having big tax deuctions for my investment loans and so would every other storm client. Life is not easy and no-one gives you anything for free but ultimately the buck stops with us for our individual choices
Click to expand...

Just a quick question tonzo, who was your advisor with storm?
 
Is there anyone who can give an example (with all the numbers) of a typical storm investor's situation.

e.g. Property valuation, mortgage amount, margin loan amount, shareholdings , margin call proceeds etc, and current financial position.

Sorry, if this offends anybody.
 
Monario said:
Perhaps we are overdue for some restructuring of the legislation that companies, failed companies, and ceo's etc. hide behind when the things go wrong...

I, and I believe many others feel it is time that the laws that let these things happen, are updated...
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Fair enough. So what are you going to do about it? Just talk, or take some real action?
My guess is that you'll do what most of us will do - we'll have a whinge every so often but we won't take any concrete action to try and change things.
What we'll do instead is what you tried to do when you invested through Storm.....we'll try to utilise the opportunities that the system gives us.
Because that's the strength of our system....opportunities, and lots of them - opportunities we can profit from if we know the rules.
And one of the rules is risk management. That means keeping a close watch on your investments, even if you've appointed a professional to manage them. And keeping watch on your manager to make sure he's doing things the way you want them done. It means taking defensive action when appropriate.
You can't afford to go to sleep at the wheel when you've got investment money on the line. Particularly when it's geared investment money.
 
Mash said:
a snakeoil conman........ we will forever regret not demanding to be heard.... but like I said .... we have beaten ourselves up (Since November 28) .... only those other storm clients know the tactics and that's why we are banding together.... more for emotional support as much as anything...don't expect to get money back...just some mental and emotional stability.Sorrry went on a bit of a rant.... that's what it's like these days..... "trust us"....those words make me sick to the stomach:banghead::banghead::horse:
Click to expand...

I know how you feel. I just wish I had not listened to the same crap that I now know every client heard. To think back on the conversations we had makes me ill. If I could get my hands on the throat of my advisor there is no telling what I would do.

When EC (otherwise known in our household as slime ball extraordinaire) came to Brisbane and gave a talk he told the audience that he couldn't understand why everyone was asking him "will I lose my house?" He said "why does everyone want to know that and not ask the question "will I lose my portfolio?".
Well we, like many, have lost both you lame brain idiot.

I cannot stand the sight of him, he makes my skin crawl. Someone in a previous post made mention of the term sociopath and I would have to agree. Someone like him feels zero compassion and empathy.


Anyway most of my posts have been emotive and have had very little purpose but to vent my annoyance. Given that I better make this my last.
So long and may some joy return to the lives of those who have been burned by Storm bloody Financial.
 
Stung, I know how you feel - there should be a prosecution against the advisers and of course EC. Those not in Storm have no idea how many lies were told, how people were blocked from getting out (I checked my portfolio every week last year and did ask the adviser and Challenger how to get out), how I was told there was not 1 chance in 100 that I would be left owing on the house, how the investment was low risk, etc. I take responsibility for signing up and trusting the adviser and not trying harder to get out. I should have done a sit in . . . I totally understand your fury and rage but am moving on - using savings to pay down as much of the mortgage as I can, selling out of Macquarie, talking to various lawyers, checking in with the advocacy group (sicag). I have appreciated your posts . . . thanks.
:(
 
stung said:
I know how you feel. I just wish I had not listened to the same crap that I now know every client heard. To think back on the conversations we had makes me ill. If I could get my hands on the throat of my advisor there is no telling what I would do.

When EC (otherwise known in our household as slime ball extraordinaire) came to Brisbane and gave a talk he told the audience that he couldn't understand why everyone was asking him "will I lose my house?" He said "why does everyone want to know that and not ask the question "will I lose my portfolio?".
Well we, like many, have lost both you lame brain idiot.

I cannot stand the sight of him, he makes my skin crawl. Someone in a previous post made mention of the term sociopath and I would have to agree. Someone like him feels zero compassion and empathy.


Anyway most of my posts have been emotive and have had very little purpose but to vent my annoyance. Given that I better make this my last.
So long and may some joy return to the lives of those who have been burned by Storm bloody Financial.
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing your story with us all. I initially couldn't understand how people could get involved with this mob but after meeting and talking with ex clients I can understand how people were seduced by what they saw and were told. I have always held a hard line towards those who invested, and am sure this has been interperted as being uncaring. But you need to be very hard and discplined to extradite yourself out of this event. Keep the momentum up never doubt yourself in anyway that you will find a remedy, life will go on, it will be different but it doesn't mean that your future won't be full and complete. Do let EC be a negative factor in your life, no amount of anger, name calling etc changes anything. Don't be distracted by anything that impedes your wellbeing or way forward......EVER.
 
bunyip said:
Fair enough. So what are you going to do about it? Just talk, or take some real action?
My guess is that you'll do what most of us will do - we'll have a whinge every so often but we won't take any concrete action to try and change things.
What we'll do instead is what you tried to do when you invested through Storm.....we'll try to utilise the opportunities that the system gives us.
Because that's the strength of our system....opportunities, and lots of them - opportunities we can profit from if we know the rules.
And one of the rules is risk management. That means keeping a close watch on your investments, even if you've appointed a professional to manage them. And keeping watch on your manager to make sure he's doing things the way you want them done. It means taking defensive action when appropriate.
You can't afford to go to sleep at the wheel when you've got investment money on the line. Particularly when it's geared investment money.
Click to expand...



Bunyip, I suggest you go back through this thread and read all my posts, once you have, then let me know if you still feel as though I fell asleep at the wheel!!

As for action on the items you think I am doing nothing towrads..

1) contacted senators and local members via email and post
2) had meeting with senator
3) spoke with media
4) got the word out to as many people as possible, this forum happens to be one avenue of doing that
5) spoken to lawyers in regards to litigation
6) joined with SICAG
7) Spoke with all relevant parties.

If you can suggest other means let me know....
 
I read this thread with amazement and also appreciate those who shared the situation that you were in. I may not be with storm but I've studied books about the stock market crash in 1907 & 1927 a few years back and wondered if there was ever going to be another cash, would it become as bad as that era.

Now I'm reading first hand whats happening to people in my life time!

Thanks for sharing with me this lesson.

Paul
 
Monario said:
Bunyip, I suggest you go back through this thread and read all my posts, once you have, then let me know if you still feel as though I fell asleep at the wheel!!

As for action on the items you think I am doing nothing towrads..

1) contacted senators and local members via email and post
2) had meeting with senator
3) spoke with media
4) got the word out to as many people as possible, this forum happens to be one avenue of doing that
5) spoken to lawyers in regards to litigation
6) joined with SICAG
7) Spoke with all relevant parties.

If you can suggest other means let me know....
Click to expand...

I commend your effort in trying to make some changes.
I was once very much that way inclined myself.
As a member of the Young Nationals and also of various agricultural organisations, I was actively involved in formulating policies and submitting them to state council, from where some of them were adopted as official policy of our orgnaisation. They were then submitted to government in the hope of convincing them to make changes.
To the best of my knowledge, none of our submissions were ever adopted as government policy.

These days I'm happy to admit I just go along with the system even though it contains many things I disagree with.
I try to avoid wasting my mental energy in ranting and fuming about them - I find it more productive to put that energy into exploiting the money-making opportunities the system offers me.

I'll decline your suggestion to go back through all your posts to see if you fell asleep at the wheel, since my comments in that regard were not directed at you specifically. They were used in reference to the situation where the alarm bells were ringing loud and clear, giving plenty of time for Storm clients and other stock market investors to convert to cash, or at least drastically reduce their exposure. If they heard or read the warning signals but still didn't take defensive action, or if they were unaware of the warning signals, then I see that as a clear case of falling asleep at the wheel.
 

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