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Religion, Science, Scepticism, Philosophy and things metaphysical

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qldfrog said:
Kind of spoiling a bit the notion of heaven, so no...?
Better enjoy here while we can
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You may be surprised to know that Augustine and Jerome – 2 big writers in Christendom - strongly felt that Adam and Eve were virgins in Paradise.

In his Confessions, Augustine describes experiencing, from time to time, a heavenly happiness or ecstasy , unlike anything in the world.

Pleasures excite people, but they also make a soul weak, causing it to have problems. Such is the human condition in this life.
 
grah33 said:
You may be surprised to know that Augustine and Jerome – 2 big writers in Christendom - strongly felt that Adam and Eve were virgins in Paradise.

In his Confessions, Augustine describes experiencing, from time to time, a heavenly happiness or ecstasy , unlike anything in the world.

Pleasures excite people, but they also make a soul weak, causing it to have problems. Such is the human condition in this life.
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But I thought the Catholic Church new accepts Adam and Eve are just mythical. At least Cardinal Pell said that when debating Richard Dawkins on Q&A. It was just impossible for the Catholic Church to reconcile Adam and Eve with what is known about evolution.

On top of that, how could they be virgins if they had children, Cain and Abel? And what the heck is so special about being virgins? Clearly those 2 big writers in Christendom are very delusional.
 
bellenuit said:
But I thought the Catholic Church new accepts Adam and Eve are just mythical. At least Cardinal Pell said that when debating Richard Dawkins on Q&A. It was just impossible for the Catholic Church to reconcile Adam and Eve with what is known about evolution.

On top of that, how could they be virgins if they had children, Cain and Abel? And what the heck is so special about being virgins? Clearly those 2 big writers in Christendom are very delusional.
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Adam, Eve, and Evolution
https://www.catholic.com/tract/adam-eve-and-evolution
 
bellenuit said:
But I thought the Catholic Church new accepts Adam and Eve are just mythical. At least Cardinal Pell said that when debating Richard Dawkins on Q&A. It was just impossible for the Catholic Church to reconcile Adam and Eve with what is known about evolution.
On top of that, how could they be virgins if they had children, Cain and Abel? And what the heck is so special about being virgins? Clearly those 2 big writers in Christendom are very delusional.
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Each cardinal is different and the Church leaves everybody to have their own view; whether God used evolution or not to create the human race. Although Christ and Paul ( apostle) spoke of Adam as a real human being, and the OT does track all human descendants form Adam and Eve.

From past browsing my take on their view : The first child came later after the fall, as did marriage (they thought it also defunct). At first there was no child, yet they were naked, so passion must have come later after the fall ( along with death). Augustine regarded passion to be something against reason; u should have a child because you want to create one, not from sexual desire. And the private parts worked so. They didn't want to create a child, so didn't make one. None of this is cannon though, just their interesting and respected views. TBH though I could be incorrect in some of these details (haven't got time).

Along with Paul they also thought that the marriage act, though lawful, was detrimental . I'm not clear on it, but I do know that the flesh is brought into subjection easily enough when some kind of abstinence is practiced. To be able to control yourself, and be habitually carefree is a good thing. Or, as another poster alluded, to be master over everything
 
bellenuit said:
A Visual Map of the World’s Major Religions (and Non-Religions)
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Bellenuit, we seem to forget the $ religion, or more exactly Yuan among 1.5 billion chineses both in China and OC (overseas chinese all over the world and definitively in Asia):
In the new year, who cares about health and happiness : Luck (in games and gambling) and wealth, fake banknotes, real money gifts for wedding or all important stage of life
it is incredible to someone like me. and in my opinion is really like a religion with gurus, evening courses, shows, mass hysteria, fanatism
I do like Chinese people..well some of them but it is a side of today's china which is very sad
Let's call this moneytism with probably just below 2 billions followers:(
 
We really need to see what can be done at early childhood then education to resolve this. Intermingling of cultures a big one too. Are such mountains too high ?



The Dutch Atheist
Nonprofit Organization
 
explod said:
We really need to see what can be done at early childhood then education to resolve this. Intermingling of cultures a big one too. Are such mountains too high ?



The Dutch Atheist
Nonprofit Organization
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Every wondered why the Islamic world, once leaders in science, now aren't?

Ever wondered why the Christain world ran past them at a million miles an hour ans became the most liberal and technologically advanced ever?

Think about that Plod. Put the Greens toxic narrative in check and think about it.
 
wayneL said:
Every wondered why the Islamic world, once leaders in science, now aren't?

Ever wondered why the Christain world ran past them at a million miles an hour ans became the most liberal and technologically advanced ever?

Think about that Plod. Put the Greens toxic narrative in check and think about it.
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Religion advancing anything useful and productive my eye wayne. Just one (and can insight many more) huge event to ponder:-

"The French Revolution was a watershed event in world history that lasted from 1789 to 1799. Among other things, it saw the French abolishing feudalism; beheading their monarch; changing their form of government from a monarchy to a republic; forming a constitution based on the principle of equality and freedom; and becoming the first state to grant universal male suffrage. The French Revolution had a great and far-reaching impact that probably transformed the world more than any other revolution. Its repercussions includelessening the importance of religion; rise of Modern Nationalism; spread of Liberalism and igniting the Age of Revolutions. Most importantly the Revolution altered the course of modern history, triggering the global decline of absolute monarchies and replacing them with republics and liberal democracies. Know more about the impact of the French Revolution through its 10 major effects."

https://learnodo-newtonic.com/french-revolution-effects
 
Nice segue.
You might want to try answering my question though.
 
wayneL said:
Ever wondered why the Christain world ran past them at a million miles an hour ans became the most liberal and technologically advanced ever?

.
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Simple, he Christian countries slowly took Christianity less seriously.

The boom is economics and sciences came because society became less religious, not more religious.
 
Value Collector said:
Simple, he Christian countries slowly took Christianity less seriously.

The boom is economics and sciences came because society became less religious, not more religious.
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Only partly, yes that is a valid point, but only about 25% of the answer.
 
wayneL said:
Only partly, yes that is a valid point, but only about 25% of the answer.
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Well I think we would all agree that if the Muslim countries reduced their level of religiosity, and started spending more time in universities instead of mosques, their society would improve.

And it would be silly to say that their religion caused the improvement, when the improvement only happened as Islam was put to the back of their mind more and more.

But that is the arguement you have made, you are claiming the religion helped us leave the dark ages, when it actually caused the dark ages.
 
Value Collector said:
Well I think we would all agree that if the Muslim countries reduced their level of religiosity, and started spending more time in universities instead of mosques, their society would improve.

And it would be silly to say that their religion caused the improvement, when the improvement only happened as Islam was put to the back of their mind more and more.

But that is the arguement you have made, you are claiming the religion helped us leave the dark ages, when it actually caused the dark ages.
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Que?

When did I say that?
 
Christianity did nothing until the enlightenment and people started being nice to each other pretty much what you are against now ;)
 
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