chops_a_must
Printing My Own Money
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- 1 November 2006
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If an agnostic rejects the idea of God, they are an atheist full stop. I am 99% sure in myself there is no god, certainly not in the western form anyway. Therefore I am agnostic, because no presented format for god has any merit, apart from 2 ideas, which aren't congruent with western religion - but it is possible.Well, technically, an atheist believes there isn't a GOD... (i.e a definite position), means it might as well be a religion.
not sure about agnostic... in its purest form, NO, it can't be a religion, as an agnostic suspends judgement or is indifferent to the presence or lack there of, of God. But when an agnostic simply rejects the probability of God full stop, then for all intents and purposes... that is the same as an athiest.
Interesting topic.
I am not a practising Christian but I did volunteer work as a counsellor, for a year or so, for a Catholic-based drop-in centre for the homeless and people with a myriad of issues.
At times this was a dangerous environment. For me this was only occasional. for regular staff it was continous. I remember, on one occasion, "calming" a huge guy in a drug-induced state for over an hour, knowing he had needles and knives on him, while waiting for the police to arrive.
The paid staff worked for pretty much the minimum wage. I never once heard religion raised as an offer or as an issue. They had no monetary ambitions other than keeping food on the family table. Their entire focus was on the difficult task of how best to help others. Entirely selfless and based on the welfare of others.
There are good people everywhere.
I agree, that's all great, but is it religion being good, or just people being good?Very true. Those of us who are critical of religion, myself included, need to acknowledge that there's a good side to religion as well. Nowhere is that good side more evident than in religions doing volunteer work for needy people such as druggies, the homeless, victims of natural disasters, or whatever.
I agree, that's all great, but is it religion being good, or just people being good?
I agree, that's all great, but is it religion being good, or just people being good?
It is people being good but they are that way through, and because of, their religious upbringing or beliefs.
Many years ago my grandmother told me that the best way to get into an argument and lose friends was to talk religion or politics and if they were combined it was dynamite. I'm afraid I never learnt to back off from either. However it never hurts to find out what the other person thinks and to listen to their points of view.I think we'll talk this one around in circles till the cows come home.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nioka
It is people being good but they are that way through, and because of, their religious upbringing or beliefs.
I think we'll talk this one around in circles till the cows come home.
Ah yes, the door knockers....Jehovah's Witnesses mostly - the same religion who will let their loved ones die, rather than allow them to have a life-saving blood transfusion.I completely disagree that religion is a prerequisite for having a decent moral compass.
One saying, which I think comes from the Bible, though, is "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
Pretty much covers most things really.
I don't care if people want to go to a church, sing songs, pray, chant, etc, (even taking communion which seems pretty silly to me). But I do object when those people tell me I am missing out, living an immoral existence, or otherwise failing to appreciate the reality of life, if I don't want to do the same.
And to those ghastly people who so persistently come knocking at the door, especially when they trail little kids with them, I'd suggest they spend their time more constructively. Might just 'accidentally' let the dog out next time I see them coming.
Well, my position is that culture made religious laws, not the other way around. So, it's people who are good first.Many years ago my grandmother told me that the best way to get into an argument and lose friends was to talk religion or politics and if they were combined it was dynamite. I'm afraid I never learnt to back off from either. However it never hurts to find out what the other person thinks and to listen to their points of view.
It is people being good but they are that way through, and because of, their religious upbringing or beliefs.
Yep, another supporting point to this is that if it wasn't the case, why do we have different religions?agree with the culture determining religion thing though
Just personality? Circumstance is a very strong inhibitor to behavior.Nope. You are either born good or born bad. Religion has nothing to do with it. Upbringing and religious beliefs may moderate or inhibit poor behavior but they are not the cause of underlying behavior - personality is.
Nope. You are either born good or born bad. Religion has nothing to do with it. Upbringing and religious beliefs may moderate or inhibit poor behavior but they are not the cause of underlying behavior - personality is.
Cheers
I agree, that's all great, but is it religion being good, or just people being good?
Apparently, the concept of original sin as applied to varying degrees in christian belief has us all born evil Judd with a life of prayer and good deed hopefully enough to rectify our evil ways and allow our soul passage into heaven.
Surly
Now you are quoting me out of context. I'm not suggesting that you have to be religious to be a good person. The discussion at that time was about religious organisations and their voluntary work. Good people will be good with or without religion but it is a religious upbringing that will encourage there to be more good people and help those that may be "bad" to become better people.I think you're right kennas, but I have to say that I totally disagree with nioka's statement above, good people will be good with or without religion.
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