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Religion IS crazy!

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cynic said:
What aspect/s of my discourse on this matter was/were so unclear that it/they require revisitation?
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I think we would like you to post the exact bible verse, and then explain why you think they are talking about chromosomes.
 
Value Collector said:
I think we would like you to post the exact bible verse, and then explain why you think they are talking about chromosomes.
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That's been done on this thread already! Should you find yourself genuinely interested in receiving answers to your questions, please let me know. Until then stop wasting my time!
 
Eg. We all agree that religion has some very bad side effects, but can anyone think of any good things it does that can't be done in other ways? If not, then just like a pill that has bad side effects, you should avoid it in favor of other things
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Do any atheists here send their children to religious private schools ?

Why ?

Are there any atheist private schools ? ie any that proudly advertise their atheism ?
 
cynic said:
That's been done on this thread already! Should you find yourself genuinely interested in receiving answers to your questions, please let me know. Until then stop wasting my time!
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Did you post the exact wording of the verse? If so can you let me know which verse it was
 
SirRumpole said:
Are there any atheist private schools ? ie any that proudly advertise their atheism ?
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That would be a bit weird, it doesn't really make sense to have an "atheist" school, because as I said atheism is a default position, it has no doctrines to teach, I guess you could call any school that doesn't promote religion atheist.

The point of schooling as far as I see it is the educate people, some schools want to include religion so I guess they label them selves as catholic or Islamic etc. but if a school just avoids religion, there is no need to label them as an atheist school, they are just the default position of a normal school, you can't teach lessons on atheism, there is nothing to teach, after a 2 minutes description of it, the lesson would be over,
 
cynic said:
If memory serves me correctly, Bellenuit was kind enough to supply the relevant verse during our earlier discourse on this matter.
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Your playing the old, "I have the evidence, but your not getting it" game again.

I have actually googled it, and from what I have found its all bogus, I am just wondering if you have something I have missed, so I would like the verse your referring to.

Or haven't you actually read it?
 
Value Collector said:
And yes rumpole, all those religions you mentioned have nasty side effects, you should research the bad bits rather than just assume they are all Rosie,

Yes there are violent Buddhists, and Hindus that burn people alive. And Jesus said that no laws in the Old Testament will change so you can still follow Jesus and fall back onto those nasty rules, and yes jesus supported slavery
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How many Christians today do you think support slavery ?

There are obviously a lot of religious fanatics out there not taking the word of their saviour seriously on slavery. Just proof that religions have to change with the times. And of course if Jesus did support slavery, he also said "do unto others as you would have others do unto you". I wouldn't want to be a slave , would you ?

VC ,you are a decent person, please don't cherry pick only those things from religion that support your bigotry that religion is the cause of all evils in the world.

More wars have been fought over political differences, competition for resources and megalomania than have been fought in the name of religion.
 
SirRumpole said:
Old Testament - some violent stuff in there too, but it's usually God that takes revenge, he doesn't instruct his followers to do his dirty work.
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I am surprised you would say that because the OT is full of passages where God instructs his followers to do his dirty work. This was discussed thoroughly back around posts #1965 to #1967.

Here is a repeat of some of what was posted then (emphasis mine).

1 Samuel 15 - New International Version

15 Samuel said to Saul, “I am the one the Lord sent to anoint you king over his people Israel; so listen now to the message from the Lord. 2 This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. 3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

4 So Saul summoned the men and mustered them at Telaim—two hundred thousand foot soldiers and ten thousand from Judah. 5 Saul went to the city of Amalek and set an ambush in the ravine. 6 Then he said to the Kenites, “Go away, leave the Amalekites so that I do not destroy you along with them; for you showed kindness to all the Israelites when they came up out of Egypt.” So the Kenites moved away from the Amalekites.

7 Then Saul attacked the Amalekites all the way from Havilah to Shur, near the eastern border of Egypt. 8 He took Agag king of the Amalekites alive, and all his people he totally destroyed with the sword. 9 But Saul and the army spared Agag and the best of the sheep and cattle, the fat calves and lambs—everything that was good. These they were unwilling to destroy completely, but everything that was despised and weak they totally destroyed.

10 Then the word of the Lord came to Samuel: 11 “I regret that I have made Saul king, because he has turned away from me and has not carried out my instructions.” Samuel was angry, and he cried out to the Lord all that night.

etc.....
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In that particular quote, the Lord is angry with Saul because he had the audacity to spare everything that was good..

Here is some more:

Exodus 21:20-21 King James Version (KJV)

20 And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.

21 Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money.


Exodus 32:27 King James Version (KJV)

27 And he said unto them, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.

Numbers 31:17-18 King James Version (KJV)

17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
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Notice among these the acceptance of slavery, but in particular the last quote where he urges that his followers rape young virgin girls.

Just do some Googling and you will find lots of passages where God urges his followers to do abhorrent things.
 
bellenuit said:
I am surprised you would say that because the OT is full of passages where God instructs his followers to do his dirty work. This was discussed thoroughly back around posts #1965 to #1967.

Here is a repeat of some of what was posted then (emphasis mine).



In that particular quote, the Lord is angry with Saul because he had the audacity to spare everything that was good..

Here is some more:



Notice among these the acceptance of slavery, but in particular the last quote where he urges that his followers rape young virgin girls.

Just do some Googling and you will find lots of passages where God urges his followers to do abhorrent things.
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OK, but as I said Christians don't go around saying those sort of things today, they related to past events. Times have changed. And the OT is basically the Jewish Bible and even they don't think it's ok to rape young virgin girls.
 
SirRumpole said:
How many Christians today do you think support slavery ?

There are obviously a lot of religious fanatics out there not taking the word of their saviour seriously on slavery. Just proof that religions have to change with the times. And of course if Jesus did support slavery, he also said "do unto others as you would have others do unto you". I wouldn't want to be a slave , would you ?

VC ,you are a decent person, please don't cherry pick only those things from religion that support your bigotry that religion is the cause of all evils in the world.

More wars have been fought over political differences, competition for resources and megalomania than have been fought in the name of religion.
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Have I ever said religion is the cause of all evils? I think you will find that my opinion is as I said that it has a lot of bad side effects, which are not worth it because the good effects people are after don't actually need religion to be achieved.

I am not cherry picking, I am just asking you to research whether these religions do have bad side effects before you say that they are all good, yes Jesus said some good things, but he also said some bad things, it's the bad things that cause trouble, and yes the bible was used to fight against the outlawing of slavery, and the bible is used to continue the discrimination against gays.

Anyone that says the bible has good verses has to cherry pick through the bad to find them.
 
Value Collector said:
Your playing the old, "I have the evidence, but your not getting it" game again.

I have actually googled it, and from what I have found its all bogus, I am just wondering if you have something I have missed, so I would like the verse your referring to.

Or haven't you actually read it?
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DB008 said:
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My discourse commenced on this thread 27 December 2013, when I responded to DB008's post with the following:
cynic said:
DB,

Thankyou for sharing yet another fine example of a pseudo scientist making bold declarations of ignorance.

If a person could demonstrate that there is at least one biblical passage that demonstrated the existence of scientific knowledge, millenia ahead of its rediscovery by the modern western scientist, would you be willing to entertain the possibility that there might be a lot more to religion than certain (not all) atheists would have you believe?


Would anyone here care to know of the error to which I allude? (An elementary understanding of biological and chemical concepts, coupled with analytical skills and an approach to enquiry that is devoid of cognitive bias, should suffice for this error's discernment.)
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Said discourse then continued over subsequent pages and included participation and comments by a number of posters.



P.S. Rather than attempting to google the whole of cyberspace, there is an advanced search feature on ASF that was effective in locating these earlier posts.
 
SirRumpole said:
OK, but as I said Christians don't go around saying those sort of things today, they related to past events. Times have changed. And the OT is basically the Jewish Bible and even they don't think it's ok to rape young virgin girls.
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There are christians that still believe in witches etc, and torture and burn people who they think are witches including children.

I admit the bad side effects of most Christians are not as crazy these days, but they are there. And the craziness of the Christian faith has only been toned down in the last few centuries because in general society has gotten progressively secular, never forget how they acted when they actually had all the power.
 
cynic said:
My discourse commenced on this thread 27 December 2013, when I responded to DB008's post with the following:


Said discourse then continued over subsequent pages and included participation and comments by a number of posters.



P.S. Rather than attempting to google the whole of cyberspace, there is an advanced search feature on ASF that was effective in locating these earlier posts.
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Can you just give me the verse? What are you afraid of?
 
I am not cherry picking, I am just asking you to research whether these religions do have bad side effects before you say that they are all good,
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Did I ever say they are all good ? I've made a point of saying they have done some bad things, but picking out a few loonies who may believe in witches is irrelevant and silly considering the 99.999% of Christians who don't.
 
SirRumpole said:
OK, but as I said Christians don't go around saying those sort of things today, they related to past events. Times have changed. And the OT is basically the Jewish Bible and even they don't think it's ok to rape young virgin girls.
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Yes, I agree with that, but the reason from memory that those quotes were first posted by me was in response to claims made at the time by Pav (I think) that humanist morality was subjective and therefore faulty, and that only the God of the Bible provided the absolute objective morality that we should (and he claims to) live by. If that is the case, times changing should not in anyway effect what we regard as moral.
 
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