Religion IS crazy!

[bunyip]

Yes,excellent; this should be required watching for the politically correct Islami apologists. The peaceful majority of Muslims is irrevelant and we are living in a fool's world if we think that this majority would ever stand up to the jihadists, or even co-operate wth law enforcement to expose their illegal activities.

And I believe we’re living in a fool’s world if we think the average Muslim would be willing to fight for our country if there was an outbreak of war. Many thousands of Australian men and women volunteers signed up in the last two major wars that Australia fought in.
But I very much doubt that the Islamists we have in our country now would be willing to put their lives on the line for Australia – in that situation they’d be about as useful as boobs on a blowfly.

 

[Value Collector]

And I believe we’re living in a fool’s world if we think the average Muslim would be willing to fight for our country if there was an outbreak of war. Many thousands of Australian men and women volunteers signed up in the last two major wars that Australia fought in.
But I very much doubt that the Islamists we have in our country now would be willing to put their lives on the line for Australia – in that situation they’d be about as useful as boobs on a blowfly.

In the Interests of fairness, I have served in both the Regular and Reserve Army, and I have met people of Muslim backgrounds in both.

also, hundreds of thousands of Muslims fought in world war 1 and world war 2 on our side.

to put it in perspective, Australia sent 324,000 soldiers overseas in WW1, India sent 1.5Million, over 400,000 Indian soldiers were muslim.

a large portion of Indian soldiers were Muslim.

 

[Calliope]

You did infer that centre link allowed married men to also claim benefits for defectors partners, and the way i read Sydboy's comment was that he was asking you to provide information on centre links terms and conditions that allow this.

And I told him to do his own research. As you appear to have a common interest with sydboy I suggest you assist him in his research. I don't know what you interest is, but the main point of my comment was that influential married Muslims can circumvent the paedophelia laws by marrying young girls.The Centrelink aspect is secondary.

As an apologist for Muslim culture consider this;

For years, child marriage in this country has been hidden under layers of culture and tradition in tight-knit communities — a fringe issue that’s been difficult to gauge and hard to investigate. Then came news of a 12-year-old girl who was “married” in January to a 26-year-old Lebanese university student in an Islamic *ceremony at the girl’s home in NSW’s Hunter *Valley, and the layers of secrecy began to peel away. On best estimates, the number of girls in Australia being forced into marriage here or overseas is in the hundreds every year. Girls as young as 12 or 13 are disappearing from schoolyards, packed off to the countries of their parents’ birth to wed men they have never met, while others are taken from their homes in southern Asia and the Middle East and brought into Australia to marry.

The National Children’s and Youth Law Centre has identified 250 cases of under-age marriage over the past 24 months, while *Sharobeem, who was herself married to a cousin at the age of 14, says there are at least 60 child wives living in south-western Sydney alone. In Melbourne, Melba Marginson, executive director of the Victorian Immigrant and Refugee Women’s Coalition (VIRWC), says her women’s friendship network sees 150 women a week, most of whom come from communities where arranged marriages are practiced. “But what we are seeing is only the tip of the iceberg,” she says.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...-flesh-they-want/story-e6frg8h6-1226949239039

hundreds of thousands of Muslims fought in world war 1 and world war 2 on our side

Yas...Against Christians, in Europe.

 

[bunyip]

In the Interests of fairness, I have served in both the Regular and Reserve Army, and I have met people of Muslim backgrounds in both.

also, hundreds of thousands of Muslims fought in world war 1 and world war 2 on our side.

to put it in perspective, Australia sent 324,000 soldiers overseas in WW1, India sent 1.5Million, over 400,000 Indian soldiers were muslim.

a large portion of Indian soldiers were Muslim.

Thanks VC, those are fair comments.
One of the benefits of public forums I guess is that we can increase our knowledge based on the experience and knowledge of others.
I do have to wonder though if they'd be willing to fight for Australia in the event that we go to war with an Islamic country.

My comments are based on my observation that Muslims seem to keep pretty much to themselves and appear reluctant to join in with whatever is going on in their communities. Also that there have been some nasty incidents in the US military forces where one of their Muslim soldiers has suddenly turned on his mates and attacked them, with fatal results.

Tell me – how did the Muslims you served with get on in relation to army meals and routine? I can't imagine that demanding Halal food, and wanting to pray several times a day, would get a nod of approval from the army.

 

[Value Collector]

Tell me – how did the Muslims you served with get on in relation to army meals and routine? I can't imagine that demanding Halal food, and wanting to pray several times a day, would get a nod of approval from the army.

Muslims are a lot like Jews, in that there are many cultural Muslims, that even though they are pretty much atheist, they still carry on with a lot of cultural activites, eg avoiding pork etc.

The Muslims I met varied, Some Identified as Muslim and wouldn't drink alcohol or eat pork, But were not strict about halal beef etc, any food was ok except alcohol and pork, and I never saw them pray or act religiously.

Others took food more seriously and were pretty much vegetarian when eating at the mess, When I was posted to east timor there was a halal mess on my barracks, because we shared it with pakastani and Bangladeshi troops,

I never got into any deep theological conversations,

But in my experience, it seems a lot of the younger generation of Muslims are not deeply religious, but the cultural aspects linger as they do with Jews, eg, an atheist mate of mine still calls himself a jew even though we is not at all religious, it's pretty much like a second generation Aussie still holding onto some cultural Scottish heritage.

 

[Value Collector]

As an apologist for Muslim culture consider this;

I am not a Muslim apologist.

I am against any forced arranged marriage, when it be Muslim, Hindu, Buddist or Jewish. ( but if the participates are legal age and consenting I have no problem with it)

I am also against any adults having sexual relations with minors, whether that be a catholic preist, a muslim, a morman or an atheist.

As I said earlier, I have no interest is totalling up which members of which religion behave worse, I am happy to say that All religions I have encountered have doctrines which are immoral, None have met their burden of proof, and none should get any special treatment.

 

[Value Collector]

And I told him to do his own research.

The burden of proof is on the one making the claim.

 

[Value Collector]

Yas...Against Christians, in Europe.

Against Fascists, For Christians.

They travelled half way around the world and fought and died fighting against fascism, while some European countries remained neutral.

 

[Calliope]

I am not a Muslim apologist.

Pull the other leg.

" If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it's a duck"

 

[Value Collector]

Pull the other leg.

" If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it's a duck"

Pointing out facts doesn't make me an apologist.

I am an atheist, and have been described as a militant atheist, I think those that know me would laugh if they heard someone say I was a Muslim apologist.

My whole position here is that religions are Bad and should not be given any special treatment, You have argued that Christianity does deserve a special treatment because it is not as bad as Islam. All I have done is point out that the examples you have given of bad Islamic practices often are mirrored in Christianity and the bible, hence neither deserves a special treatment.

 

[sydboy007]

No you didn't. Your words were " Can you please refer me to information on centrelink".

I an not your flunkey. Do your own research if you wish to disprove what I said.

Curious. How does one find information on a policy that doesn't exist. You made a claim, now seem unwilling to actually prove it. Why make the claim in the first place if it was false or you're too lazy to back it up?

There's enough angst within the community without people like yourself making outrageous claims that are not true. How about sticking to the facts?

 

[sydboy007]

Yes,excellent; this should be required watching for the politically correct Islami apologists. The peaceful majority of Muslims is irrevelant and we are living in a fool's world if we think that this majority would ever stand up to the jihadists, or even co-operate wth law enforcement to expose their illegal activities.

Yes, excellent http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/case-studies ; this should be required reading for the politically correct Christian apologists.

The Christian majority against paedophilia is irrelevant and we are living in a fools world if we think this majority would ever stand up to paedophile priests and church hierarchy, or to even co-operate with law enforcement to expose their illegal activities.

---------------

some perspective. Those who COULD have done something about the abuse of children within various churches did not face the fear of death for themselves or their families if they had gone to the police or went public in some way and tried to stop it. A multitude of decades and the abuse was still ongoing.

The silent majority in most muslim countries do face death of themselves and family for standing up to the extremists, yet some do put themselves in harms way to stand up for their beliefs.

How many of us can honestly answer that we would risk our lives, and the lives of our children and other family members, to stand up against murder suicides and other atrocities? I think it's only possible to answer this honestly when faced with the real choice. It's easy to condemn those facing the real danger from thousands of kilometres away in the safety of Australia.

 

[Calliope]

My whole position here is that religions are Bad and should not be given any special treatment, You have argued that Christianity does deserve a special treatment because it is not as bad as Islam.

That is a lie. What i said was "I am an atheist but I have tried to avoid taking cheap shots at the Christian religion which has served this country well."

That was a personal opinion only. I neither made nor implied nor advocated special treatment for anyone. You, and others, picked on this statement in order to ignore that my post was about Muslim treatment of their women. This is a part of the Islamist religion which you and your cronies look at through rose-coloured glasses.

You on the other hand have lavished praises on Muslims because they served us well in two world wars. You can forget about WWI. More Muslims fought on the German side (Turks) than with the Allies. In WW2 it was mainly in defence against against the Japanese.

Also,

The Germans after the huge losses before Moscow (December 1941) found themsleves needing to look for additional manpower. One of the places they looked was amomg Muslims. Here they found willing recruits both in the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia, Both the Wehrmacht and SS formed military units with Muslim recruits

.

 

[Tink]

VC, a militant atheist, we would never have guessed .
A religion in itself.

Thanks Calliope for understanding what I was saying in my last post.
"I am an atheist but I have tried to avoid taking cheap shots at the Christian religion which has served this country well

 

[Calliope]

Yes, excellent http://www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/public-hearings/case-studies ; this should be required reading for the politically correct Christian apologists.

I am surprised that you are a Muslim apologist. Consider this;

The following are excerpts on homosexuality, taken from the Saudi Ministry of Education Textbooks for Islamic Studies:
"Homosexuality is one of the most disgusting sins and greatest crimes.... It is a vile perversion that goes against sound nature, and is one of the most corrupting and hideous sins.... The punishment for homosexuality is death. Both the active and passive participants are to be killed whether or not they have previously had sexual intercourse in the context of a legal marriage.... Some of the companions of the Prophet stated that [the perpetrator] is to be burned with fire. It has also been said that he should be stoned, or thrown from a high place."

Wikipedia

 

[Value Collector]

What i said was "I am an atheist but I have tried to avoid taking cheap shots at the Christian religion which has served this country well."

So you don't think avoiding talking cheap shots at one group, while openly taking cheap shots at another is special treatment.

This is a part of the Islamist religion which you and your cronies look at through rose-coloured glasses.

It's also part of Christianity, Have you read the bible?

You on the other hand have lavished praises on Muslims because they served us well in two world wars.

I wouldn't say I lavished praise, I simply pointed out the truth, Some one else made a comment that they didn't think muslims would fight like Australians have, I simply pointed out that they had fought in those wars he mentioned. Nothing I said could be considered praise.

You can forget about WWI. More Muslims fought on the German side

I would say more Christians fought on the German side than did Muslims. The Truth of the matter is that both sides were made up by Christians, Muslims and other religions.

You can't take away one groups efforts just because some of the enemy had the same religion, other wise you may as well say that any Australian Christians war effort didn't count, because the Germans and Italians were Chrisitan.

In WW2 it was mainly in defence against against the Japanese.

Yes, which directly helped Australia's defence, If the Japanese didn't have to commit to fighting 700,000 Indian troops in Burma, I would say the battle on the Kakoda tract would have went differently.

 

[Value Collector]

VC, a militant atheist, we would never have guessed .
A religion in itself.

Do you consider "OFF" a TV channel? or bald a hair colour?

 

[Tink]

Do you consider "OFF" a TV channel? or bald a hair colour?

Keep preaching, that is what you are doing.

 

[Value Collector]

Keep preaching, that is what you are doing.

Can you please quote some specific doctrine or tenants that I have preached?

This might help you understand atheism tink.

 

[Calliope]

Keep preaching, that is what you are doing.

Tink, do you mind if I give you a little belated advice;

Don't argue with a fool...especially one with an obsession, such as a militant atheist. You are right about him preaching. Hatred of religion is his religion.