Labor's carbon tax lie

[sptrawler]

Your real people in the real world appear to be doing it tough, however this is the penalty which has to be paid for the privelege of living in a beautiful state with real seasons.

My situation;
Single, living alone.
All electric
Electric hot water system
No artificial heating or cooling
1.5 Kw solar system
Credits on power bills after 6 months with the panels on the roof...$230.

Prior to that my power bills averaged below 100 bucks per quarter.

I don't live in Queensland, maybe you could enlighten me as to how much the public are subsidising your solar feed in tarrif?

 

[Calliope]

I don't live in Queensland, maybe you could enlighten me as to how much the public are subsidising your solar feed in tarrif?

AGL credits me with 52c for each net kWh I feed back into the grid.

 

[Calliope]

Problem is that there's no way the industry is viable if everyone gets a bill that low. Simply keeping you connected costs at least that much, assuming zero actual consumption. So it works for one household to do it, but it falls in a heap rather spectacularly if everyone does it.

Yes I agree...having a low carbon footprint is actually anti-social. However I blame all the Qld sunshine on my roof. Perhaps I should install reverse cycle air conditioning and plasma TV to help run up my bill. To add to my dilemma I get a State Govt rebate on my bill on account of being a Senior Citizen.

It's A Good Life If You Don't Weaken.

 

[Smurf1976]

I have nothing against any individual getting whatever they can from solar, rebates, subsidies and so on. Just as long as they realise that it doesn't work financially if more than a minority of households drop consumption to very low levels and/or install solar PV.

The solution, of course, is to charge separately for network services and energy. Trouble is, there's only one place in Australia (Tas) and few in the world that have tried it, and it was an outright disaster politically so I doubt that we''ll see anyone keen to try it in Qld or anywhere else anytime soon. All those shack owners and others who are massively subsidised turned out to be quite a force politically - and that was 15 years ago when solar wasn't an issue.

 

[noco]

If the news on this link has credence, this darned much talked about carbon (dioxide) may never get off the ground.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ed-on-carbon-tax/story-e6freonf-1226131327476

 

[sails]

Bad news - and something else we weren't told about...

If true, this is simply shocking that a government who came in with a mandate for no carbon tax now proceeds with the help of minority MPs + minority greens in the senate and looks like they will be doing irrepairable damage to this country. This is undemocratic, imo.

It makes any black holes thrown at the coalition look like pocket money. Is it a criminal offence to deliberately destroy one's country?:

From Henry Ergas at the Australian explains:

Once the carbon change legislation is in place, he said, repeal would amount to an acquisition of property by the commonwealth, as holders of emissions permits would be deprived of a valuable asset. As a result, the commonwealth would be liable, under s.51(xxxi) of the Australian Constitution, to pay compensation, potentially in the billions of dollars. A future government would therefore find repeal prohibitively costly.

That consequence is anything but unintended. The clean energy legislation, released this week, specifically provides that "a carbon unit (its generic term for a right to emit) is personal property".​

Full article: Labor plants poison pills in carbon tax

Are those in favour of carbon tax poised to benefit financially if it proceeds? Is this why some, such as Turnbull, so keen for it to go ahead? Is this what it is really about and nothing to do with the environment?

 

[-Bevo-]

Bad news - and something else we weren't told about...

If true, this is simply shocking that a government who came in with a mandate for no carbon tax now proceeds with the help of minority MPs + minority greens in the senate and looks like they will be doing irrepairable damage to this country. This is undemocratic, imo.

It makes any black holes thrown at the coalition look like pocket money. Is it a criminal offence to deliberately destroy one's country?:

QUOTE]

I read that and nothing suprises me anymore with this government they did a similar thing with NBN so it would be very costly to stop, but that was compo to telstra if they get stuffed around which would only be fair, never have I hated a government sooooo much I hated Rudd but Gillard is much worse or atleast this minority government is someone please save us from them.

 

[MACCA350]

Was watching some senate committee hearings regarding the carbon dioxide tax. Being interviewed was a major Victorian electricity wholesale supplier. They were asked how much they expect the carbon tax to increase their wholesale costs. Their response was a 30% increase in their wholesale rate

So much for the theory that this tax will have little impact

Cheers

 

[joea]

If the news on this link has credence, this darned much talked about carbon (dioxide) may never get off the ground.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ed-on-carbon-tax/story-e6freonf-1226131327476

Your point is that it should not get off the ground in the format that Labor has compiled.
The facts are, because the 500 companies have a licence to pollute, it should be a simple process to put the screws on those 500 companies.
Now we will never get a list of these 500 companies, because you can bet Gillard has some companies on that list that "p**s" her off, and not necessarily for pollution reasons at all.

Well she did not take the high courts decision very well did she. So she is now going to change thae act, and legislation so she can "spit" in the eye of the high court and put their decision where it belongs and that's in the waste paper basket.

So where do the voters stand? Well we stand to "cop it" until she is removed.
How to remove her? Well (love him or hate him), Abbott is one of the chances we have.

I think in the next few weeks, federal politics may get interesting.

Lastly the "journo's" comment that the current politic's is not very nice.
Well it's it's a bit hard when you are dealing with a "gutter rat".
joea

 

[joea]

Your real people in the real world appear to be doing it tough, however this is the penalty which has to be paid for the privelege of living in a beautiful state with real seasons.

My situation;
Single, living alone.
All electric
Electric hot water system
No artificial heating or cooling
1.5 Kw solar system
Credits on power bills after 6 months with the panels on the roof...$230.

Prior to that my power bills averaged below 100 bucks per quarter.

I believe this statement to be correct.
I have seen a statement from a woman living near me and she is half this. She lives alone.
My retired neighbours have a solar hot water, and 5 solar panels grid conect. Although their bill is slightly higher than stated above, they have bore water and attempt to reduce the ground water level, by about 5 metres each week watering their plants and native trees.
My neighbour on the other side pays $1100 a quarter. They have a bore pump a pressure pump, a swimming pool pump, a enviro septic system pump, 3 kids. 3 tv's. 2deep freezes(fisherman) and two fridges. When Christmas comes and all the lights go on
in the yard, they peak to $1500 a quarter. And you can see the house site from outer space.
So the range of bills I have seen are from $120 - $1500.

joea

 

[noco]

After listening to Greg Combet on Four Corners, the lies that he and Gillard have told about this carbon tax which will do nothing for climate change has been proven by information readily available from the Power House Museum. See attached photos.

Why isn't Combet and Gillard taking any notice of this information???

 

[drsmith]

After listening to Greg Combet on Four Corners, the lies that he and Gillard have told about this carbon tax which will do nothing for climate change has been proven by information readily available from the Power House Museum. See attached photos.

Why isn't Combet and Gillard taking any notice of this information???

Halfway through, I've lost count of how many times the term skeptic was used.

EDIT: Later, the biggie was rolled out,

Dangerous climate change

It's essentially a carbon tax propaganda piece.

It won't save them.

 

[Calliope]

Peter Switzer says Gillard must change her mind.

Regular readers will know I am not opposed to governments, businesses and consumers reducing their carbon footprint, but the timing for a carbon tax is economically wrong.

The world is preoccupied with overcoming the stress of the GFC and another looming recession, and will not be addressing planetary problems seriously for at least five years.

That means we are putting Australian industry at a terrible competitive disadvantage primarily for philosophical and moral reasons.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...ituation-changes/story-e6frg9if-1226144924713

 

[tech/a]

Carbon tax if it is ever applied wont be going anywhere.
It will be the biggest cash cow for governments ever seen.
Does nothing to solve nothing.

We the dumb public have been sold the biggest of lies.

 

[sails]

Carbon tax if it is ever applied wont be going anywhere.
It will be the biggest cash cow for governments ever seen.
Does nothing to solve nothing.

We the dumb public have been sold the biggest of lies.

Problem is that some voters were conned into voting for labor on the understanding carbon tax wasn't going to happen in this term at least.

If Gillard had told the truth before the last election, there is a good chance there would not have been a hung parliament. It seems the lie was needed for votes.

I am amazed that, in a so called democracy, we have a minority government (which means they didn't win) with a PM whose MP's first allegiance is to the party before their constituents, independents who are not representing the majority of their electorates and yet they all gang up together to enforce a tax that has around a 70% disapproval rating (as per opinion polls) and has potential for massive damage to our economy.

And yet the 70% seem helpless to do anything about it. I doubt this is the real intent of democracy which usually means "government by the people".

 

[Logique]

Carbon tax if it is ever applied wont be going anywhere.
It will be the biggest cash cow for governments ever seen. Does nothing to solve nothing. We the dumb public have been sold the biggest of lies.

Go tech/a!

Mainly posting in relief that someone finally called Four Corners/ABC on their practice of running what I call 'Jaws' doom music behind the people subtlely disapproved of, eg climate sceptics, but happy 'Wiggles' music behind those who meet the ABC lofty, latte set standards.

Coal mining, queue the doom music. Not reporting said bolta, but propaganda, and he is right.

Been doing it all day ump. National broadcaster - in which nation? Of course Sen Bob Brown will be straight onto this, demanding an enquiry into the ABC.

 

[Julia]

Carbon tax if it is ever applied wont be going anywhere.
It will be the biggest cash cow for governments ever seen.
Does nothing to solve nothing.

We the dumb public have been sold the biggest of lies.

I don't think the public are dumb at all, and neither have we been "sold" on the carbon tax. On the contrary.
Had the public been given the opportunity to vote on it, Labor would never have had to consider roping in the support of the Independents and The Greens, so minimal would have been their vote. The Coalition would have won clearly.

 

[sptrawler]

Well we have solved the carbon tax/ coal burning problem in W.A.
Both of the thermal coal producers have now been sold to overseas companies.
I just hope the overseas companies will sell us some of their coal or our electricity will get really expensive.
On the other hand, maybe we get be the first to embrace the new renewables, and close our coal fired stations.
I am just so pleased I put the solar panels on the roof.

 

[Smurf1976]

Well we have solved the carbon tax/ coal burning problem in W.A.
Both of the thermal coal producers have now been sold to overseas companies.
I just hope the overseas companies will sell us some of their coal or our electricity will get really expensive.
On the other hand, maybe we get be the first to embrace the new renewables, and close our coal fired stations.
I am just so pleased I put the solar panels on the roof.

In all seriousness and not wanting to start a state versus state war, I think that WA is being profoundly dumb when it comes to energy.

What's going to happen a not long from now when ALL the coal and gas has been locked up under export contracts and there's literally none available for local use? Then 30 years later when the whole lot is physically gone and production ceases?

What is the long term plan for WA? With the fuel being shipped offshore at an ever increasing rate, plus increasing reliance on desal for water supply, they'd better hope that solar, wind etc is a goer otherwise they're completely stuffed.

WA residents ought to be asking the state's leaders some damn hard questions about the long term future in my opinion.

 

[sails]

Interesting article by Henry Ergas where he explains more about this tax and Garnaut's assertions in the Australia. The article is a well worth reading - here is a snippet on treasury modelling:

As best one can tell, that assertion relies on Treasury's modelling. Yet no scientist would accept that modelling. Not because it is necessarily wrong but because the models and data on which it relies is secret, and hence incapable of being tested.

Full article: Mr Garnaut, climate policy should be questioned


And here is a link to more Ergas articles on carbon tax:

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/columnists/henry-ergas