Is Global Warming becoming unstoppable?

[Calliope]

Good post Orr

:screwy:

 

[noco]

I don't know how old some of you fellows are but from what I gather on some of your posts, not very old at all.

I have been through 8 decades of climate change and there is nothing new today that did not happen in my younger days in Brisbane.

Electrical storms that brought strong gusts of wind that ripped off corrugated iron roofs like a can opener and hail stones as big as cricket balls. Hail still 6 inches deep in the yard the next morning. Tiled roofs shattered from hail.

Heat waves in the high 30's for several days until the storms cooled it down.

Erosion on Palm beach from adverse weather leaving sand cliffs 8 and 9 feet high along the sand dunes and 6 months later the sand dunes had recovered with dry sand blown up the beach which was 100 yards wide. Look at it today when houses were built on those sand dunes, rock walls had to be built to stop the houses falling into the sea resulting in the loss of a great beach.

My late mother tells me of the horrific cyclone she went through in Port Dougals in 1911, She, her mother and three sisters all shelterd under the heavy kitchen table while the whole house collapsed on top of them. The table saved them. There were no catagories of strength to compare in those days but what she explained to me it could have been in the 4 or even 5 range.

As a plumber working on sheep stations in the early 50's and having been marooned on one station by flood waters for two weeks. No helicopters to drop food supplies as the owners had been through all before and always stocked up before such events took place. No sealed flood proof roads in those days. Drought so bad the dams dried up and even some of the bore drains dried up. In those days the average sheep cocky grew 400 or 500 acres of silage, buried it with 2 feet of earth cover and was good fodder for a decade after to feed the sheep until the rains came.

All the coastal towns north of Brisbane suffered at one time or another with severe floods no different to what they do today.

There were always bush fires no matter where you lived. Acres and acres of scorched farm lands and soon after green shoots appeared and even without rain. Bush fires burn more fossil fuel in one week than all the power stations in one year and what about the gases erupting from volcanos. These anomalies are never mentioned; only the man made crap that ALARMISTS keep harping on about and if they persist with their propaganda long enough the naive believe it

So please don't bore me with this global warming crap, sorry it is now climate change as there has been no increase in the average tempeature for 16 years, as being something new.

It is the biggest con job that has ever taken place in the last 100 years.

 

[So_Cynical]

A super storm (cat 5) has just gone through the southern Philippines so far south as to be a 1 in 20 year event, a super storm went through NY state 2 months ago another 1 in 20 year event, as was Katrina a 1 in 50 year event and the Brisbane storm of 2 years ago a 1 in 50 year event.

All super storms of unusually large size (more than 200 kms across) all supposedly rare events, all in different parts of the world with 2 storm at the extremes of latitude....as predicted by the Global warming models.

 

[Knobby22]

Pretending? That's a new one. How about answering the basic questions many have posted only to see non-responses from the AGW lap dogs here?

Start with answering this - Where is observed evidence that shows man's 3% of CO2 is driving "calamity" supported by ALL climate scientists? Or is that stretching your propaganda beliefs a little too far?

You've seen the graphs, you've seen the Arctic and Antarctic melting. You've read about the permafrost melting.
You've seen all the major scientific societies are in agreement. You've seen evidence that the very few scientists in disagreement and they aren't climate scientists. You've seen there is an organisation that specialises in propaganda to stop action on this issue. You've seen that a certain right wing society is putting money into stopping climate change even as they espouse it doesn't exist. Sure, there is that retired guy they trot out and that English "Lord", both extremely credible (not). I can't see how I can further influence your 'reality" by repeating it all again.

The earth is warming. Long way to go yet, its just started and it will take 100 years to take full effect.
Heard of the 3 wise monkeys?

 

[Calliope]

Sorry, basilio and Knobby - your propaganda is not working.

Young Australians more concerned about the economy than climate

FORGET the environment, it's the economy, stupid. Young Australians have dumped the environment from the top of their concerns and replaced it with the economy.

Mission Australia's national Youth Survey found concern about the environment _ considered to be the leading issue for the previous two years (37 per cent last year and 38 per cent in 2010) _ fell to 17.5 per cent.

The country's biggest annual poll of young people and their concerns found the economy and finances was ranked in the top three issues by 31 per cent of respondents, followed by population at 28 per cent and alcohol and drugs (22 per cent).

The economy did not even rank in the top three the previous year with only 21 per cent of respondents ranking it as a concern.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...omy-than-climate/story-e6frg926-1226530049092

 

[OzWaveGuy]

A super storm (cat 5) has just gone through the southern Philippines so far south as to be a 1 in 20 year event, a super storm went through NY state 2 months ago another 1 in 20 year event, as was Katrina a 1 in 50 year event and the Brisbane storm of 2 years ago a 1 in 50 year event.

All super storms of unusually large size (more than 200 kms across) all supposedly rare events, all in different parts of the world with 2 storm at the extremes of latitude....as predicted by the Global warming models.

1 in 20 year event, 1 in 50 year event? - are you saying the models predicted that we would see storms that occur every 20 or 50 years? I guess if such storms have happened in the past, then they'll probably happen again - thanks but no need for models or armchair analysis by hysterics.

Perhaps some real analysis is called for - can you put up a chart that shows the storm frequency over the last 100yrs or so, the quotes (and dates) that the models precisely predicted such storms and the hard evidence that man's 3% of total CO2 emissions are fully to blame.

 

[Aussiejeff]

Snowing in the VIC alps in December again.

Wilsons' Prom weather gauge recorded freezing cold winds gusting up to 159kph and chill factor down to -13 or so from 4am this morning.

Must be that global warming causing it, I suppose...

 

[noco]

You've seen the graphs, you've seen the Arctic and Antarctic melting. You've read about the permafrost melting.
You've seen all the major scientific societies are in agreement. You've seen evidence that the very few scientists in disagreement and they aren't climate scientists. You've seen there is an organisation that specialises in propaganda to stop action on this issue. You've seen that a certain right wing society is putting money into stopping climate change even as they espouse it doesn't exist. Sure, there is that retired guy they trot out and that English "Lord", both extremely credible (not). I can't see how I can further influence your 'reality" by repeating it all again.

The earth is warming. Long way to go yet, its just started and it will take 100 years to take full effect.
Heard of the 3 wise monkeys?

Ha Knobby, I have just come back from a cruise up the Alaskan coast and went into Glacier Bay.

The glaciers are moving all the time and are some a 2 mile deep. I saw big chunks of ice as big as a bus fall into the sea and this is where the Alarmist take their photos. Ah, they will say look at how the galciers are melting. What a load of crap you believe.

The tour guide says it has been happening for centuries.

It is a big con job. Go up to Alaska and check it out for yourself next year, you might learn something.

 

[Knobby22]

Read this noco and tell me its a con job.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/11/29/pol-ice-sheets-melting-greenland.html

 

[Knobby22]

Sorry, basilio and Knobby - your propaganda is not working.

Young Australians more concerned about the economy than climate



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...omy-than-climate/story-e6frg926-1226530049092

I agree, I am too. It's human nature - long term threat vs short term threat.
The truth is the environmental movement has failed miserably.

"If the civil rights movement had been as unsuccessful, Rosa park's Grand-daughter would still be in the back of the bus." Nick Feik The Age

We are going to see the world temperature rise at least 3 degrees before I die and I am resigned to it. I am even investing in gas projects because nothing will change. I think the youth have given up also. The powerful people control the world and try to control thinking. As long as you can fool some of the people all the time they are assured that their finances aren't hurt.

I'm not going to suffer. I will probably be dead by 2050 as I will be in my mid '80s by then. the world will be in a horrible dystopia getting continually worse due to climate change and pollution and overpopulation unless humanity can somehow achieve major cultural change. History says we won't and so the world will not be a very nice place by then for humanity. As for tigers and other wildlife, this will be an extinction event like no other. Humanity hasn't evolved enough.

It didn't help that the environmental movement has been co-opted by the socialists. You could see Bob Brown secretly fighting them in his own party. Socialism is a failed concept that is unattractive to many people and having them aligned with the environmentalists does no favours.

I am continually amazed that many people can't see what is happening. If you want to be a successful investor you need to catch long term trends. As I said, humanity isn't sufficiently evolved. I would love to be frozen and wake up in 200 years and see what happened.

 

[white_goodman]

I will probably be dead by 2050 as I will be in my mid '80s by then. the world will be in a horrible dystopia getting continually worse due to climate change and pollution and overpopulation unless humanity can somehow achieve major cultural change.

I thought all the Malthusians had died, how quaint..

id only be worrying about overpopulation if I lived in India or Nigeria, apart from that dont fret

 

[noco]

Read this noco and tell me its a con job.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/11/29/pol-ice-sheets-melting-greenland.html

Knobby, this happened a thousand yeras ago when Greenland lost all of it's ice coverage. The Vikings went to Greenland because it was GREEN and they grew crops and grazed sheep and cattle and then 500 yeras later the ice came back and there was no more grazing or growing crops.

Go to google and search it out. It is still a con job and these so called scientist are well paid to spread their propaganda to the naive.

What is happeneing in Greenland now may allow farmers to go back and grow crops and graze like they did 1000yeras ago.

Those photos on the U-Tube were typical of what I observed in Glacier Bay Alaska.

 

[bellenuit]

Sea levels on the rise in Perth

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/15550905/sea-levels-on-the-rise-in-perth/

Can anyone explain why sea levels in Perth would rise higher than the global average? I can only assume that the sun's gravitational pull makes sea levels rise more the closer you are to the equator. Or perhaps the earth's spin causes the earth's surface water to bulge upwards the closer you are to the equator (because it is spinning faster the closer to the equator you are), drawing water from the polar regions? It's disappointing the article didn't offer an explanation.

 

[noco]

Sea levels on the rise in Perth

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/15550905/sea-levels-on-the-rise-in-perth/

Can anyone explain why sea levels in Perth would rise higher than the global average? I can only assume that the sun's gravitational pull makes sea levels rise more the closer you are to the equator. Or perhaps the earth's spin causes the earth's surface water to bulge upwards the closer you are to the equator (because it is spinning faster the closer to the equator you are), drawing water from the polar regions? It's disappointing the article didn't offer an explanation.

From what I learnt at school 75 years ago, the moon has the influence on the tides and the consequential hieght and not the sun.

 

[So_Cynical]

1 in 20 year event, 1 in 50 year event?

You are not familiar with the term 1 in 50 year weather event... don't know what it means?

Seriously

 

[Julia]

You are not familiar with the term 1 in 50 year weather event... don't know what it means?

Seriously

Seriously, I've heard many different interpretations of this expression, including on the ABC's Science Report where they seem unable to agree.

So I look forward to your enlightening all of us as to the exact meaning.

 

[So_Cynical]

Perhaps some real analysis is called for - can you put up a chart that shows the storm frequency over the last 100yrs or so, the quotes (and dates)

I banged up a quick 20 year chart for you...notice the trend?

http://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/hurrarchive.asp?MR=1
~

 

[So_Cynical]

Seriously, I've heard many different interpretations of this expression, including on the ABC's Science Report where they seem unable to agree.

So I look forward to your enlightening all of us as to the exact meaning.

Of the top of my head...i always believed it meant that a 1 in 50 year event was meant to happen on average about once in 50 years..cant see any other way to see it.

Now averages being what they are when it comes to weather...it means that its not that uncommon to get a 1 in 50 year event 20 years apart or at the other extreme not uncommon to have those events 80 years apart.

However its not common at all to get multiple 1 in 50 year events at smaller and smaller intervals...the Hurricane in the Philippines of a few days ago was a rare event because of the Latitude of origin and travel...it started at 4 ° North and travelled pretty much due west for a week.

That's unheard of and a 1 in 50 or 100 year event...Hurricanes do not develop at latitudes under 5 ° North or South but this one did...as an Aussie reference point Darwin sits at 12.4 ° S and Darwin doesn't get many Cyclones because its considered to far north.

http://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/wp201226.asp
~

 

[Julia]

Of the top of my head...i always believed it meant that a 1 in 50 year event was meant to happen on average about once in 50 years..cant see any other way to see it.

That's how most people imagine it.
But this is what I have heard strongly contested in science programs.
So perhaps don't be so supercilious to other posters when you're not sure yourself.

 

[chiff]

Greenland...why is it named thus.
My information is because it was ancient land scam.Erik the Red after being banned from Iceland took some followers to a new land that he named Greenland.He did this in order to entice new settlers there,not because it was a verdant paradise.
The same would apply if real estate people were trying to entice people to the Simpson desert by naming it Simpson Waters.