Global Warming - How Valid and Serious?

[Wysiwyg]

Sorry, but `fixing` the effect and not the cause is what we humans do worse.Exponential growth.I suppose we can always start docking the boys at birth

 

[2020hindsight]

Smurf, advice please
there are a couple of articles on Emissions Trading Schemes etc in the latest Engineers Aust Magazine. - maybe you've seen them.

and requirements for reporting emissions by mid 2008 etc (for some companies at least). NGER National Greenhouse and Energy Register etc.

I reckon it deserves a new thread
Just can't think what to call it. ?

Maybe managers "at the coal face" - oops, make that "at the alternative energy face" could post their experiences on how the system is affecting them .

Then again - no reason it couldn't be here I guess.

 

[2020hindsight]

In answer to the ridiculous claim that CO2 is not a pollutant, i.e. it is "plant food" ...

....... I make the equally ridiculous point ( fighting fire with fire here) that CO2 is seen as a suitable "emergency on-farm euthanasia of swine"
http://www.aasv.org/shap/issues/v13n4/v13n4p210.html

Summary
In the event of a foreign animal disease outbreak in the United States, a rapid and humane method of on-farm swine euthanasia will be required. Given the extraordinary number of animals involved and the design of currently used swine confinement buildings, methods relying on the handling and restraint of individual animals will likely prove much too slow to stem the spread of disease. Humanely depopulating commercial swine production facilities may be accomplished by using enclosed dump bed trucks or trailers as on-farm carbon dioxide euthanasia chambers.

We review the principles governing the use of carbon dioxide in enclosed spaces and show that adherence to the 2000 Report of the American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) Panel on Euthanasia recommendation for carbon dioxide flow rate is appropriate for humane euthanasia within any enclosed volume or space. In addition, we demonstrate the feasibility of applying the AVMA guidelines for on-farm carbon dioxide euthanasia to groups of adult pigs.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Density_of_air

The density of air, ρ (Greek: rho) (air density), is the mass per unit volume of Earth's atmosphere, .... As does air pressure, air density decreases with increasing altitude and temperature. At sea level and at 20 °C, dry air has a density of approximately 1.2 kg/m3 (call this an SG of 0.0012)

Hence 1GL = 10^9 L = 10^6 m^3 = 1,200,000 kg = 1200T.

Hence the volume under the Sydney Harbour Bridge deck (=1GL) is 1200T of CO2
unless I'm mistaken ( seems a lot ?)

and 1T of CO2 is the volume of 833 m^2 = 2.5m x 18.25m x 18.25m (= 8.2ft x 60 ft x 60 ft)
= very roughly 1T of CO2 is the volume of a "typical" (large?) house (say 36 squares plan area), ceiling height 2.5m

E& OE

"the initial scheme for the stationary energy sector would set the unit of measure at 1T CO2-e , and one permit would be required for each tonne emitted"

 

[2020hindsight]

Animal rights activists, Terri Irwin, Jane Goodall, Pink.

http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1396
1. Terri Irwin... "we started filming (almost) by accident" - "we don't suit up to tell people about wildlife - we LIVE it! - we all need to part ofit or we're gonna lose planet Earth!"

Animals had always been a family affair for Steve Irwin. His parents were wildlife experts who built a zoo and later passed it on to him. Steve, who became a huge animal conservation advocate, said he'd like to eventually pass the torch on to his children. That's what's been happening since his death last September. And not with just promoting animal conservation, but also promoting Australia as a travel destination. What is daughter Bindi (and wife Terri) doing to continue his work?

http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1673
2. Jane Goodall .. "I can remember you when yuo were just one day old - now you're a fallen king - the wounds are better but your mind is worried"

Dr. Jane Goodall. She's spent forty-seven years living with, studying, writing about and advocating for chimpanzees.

But don't call her just an animal-rights activist. Her institute campaigns for wildlife research, education, conservation, and works to empower women and communities in the Kigoma region of Africa. Dr. Jane Goodall is celebrating the thirtieth anniversary of "The Jane Goodall Institute" this year by lecturing around the world on the challenges and success of conservation projects and improving the lives of the people who live around them.

http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1352
3. Pink ..
hey wayne ... she's on Gore's team (Pink)

as long as you keep Aussie "sheep farming" out of this - I notice she ain't popular with the Aussie sheep industry. (the second of 2 videos)

slow start but at the 4m 27s mark:-
Pink: "Of course I'm obsessed with 'An Inconvenient Truth' - I have a hybrid -which everybody should ... so much to learn - I love learning about it - the fact that I can turn off a light switch and I'm doing something good"

However, Pink is not merely focused on the entertainment industry. She is a strong animal rights activist and is turning her attention to the growing issue of the environment. Find out how Pink is changing the world for the better.

PS At last, a blond US singer who doesn't rely on her pelvic thrusts to sell records...

 

[Smurf1976]

Animal rights activists, Terri Irwin, Jane Goodall, Pink.

http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1396
1. Terri Irwin... "we started filming (almost) by accident" - "we don't suit up to tell people about wildlife - we LIVE it! - we all need to part ofit or we're gonna lose planet Earth!"


http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1673
2. Jane Goodall .. "I can remember you when yuo were just one day old - now you're a fallen king - the wounds are better but your mind is worried"


http://www.cbc.ca/thehour/video.php?id=1352
3. Pink ..
hey wayne ... she's on Gore's team (Pink)

as long as you keep Aussie "sheep farming" out of this - I notice she ain't popular with the Aussie sheep industry. (the second of 2 videos)

slow start but at the 4m 27s mark:-
Pink: "Of course I'm obsessed with 'An Inconvenient Truth' - I have a hybrid -which everybody should ... so much to learn - I love learning about it - the fact that I can turn off a light switch and I'm doing something good"



PS At last, a blond US singer who doesn't rely on her pelvic thrusts to sell records...

But Smurf doesn't fail to notice the irony of it all.

If I go to the CD player and put in a Pink CD then crank up the volume then, in short, I'm burning fossil fuels to do it. And don't even mention how much fuel a major concert burns - it's not trivial.

Basically nothing we do is completely free of fossil fuels. Save a bit on heating the house and spend the money on something else - all you're doing is changing the means of CO2 production.

If you paid for it, it pollutes. All of it.

 

[2020hindsight]

But Smurf doesn't fail to notice the irony of it all.

If I go to the CD player and put in a Pink CD then crank up the volume then, in short, I'm burning fossil fuels to do it. And don't even mention how much fuel a major concert burns - it's not trivial.

some of her songs are quite quiet mate

Lee Kernaghan uses heaps more "watts" - "what's that?" - "I SAID WATTS"

ps I hear you.
THAT"s it - from hence forth, Big Day Out is cancelled !

Pink - Dear Mr President Live In Wembley - I'm Not Dead Tour

 

[Smurf1976]

some of her songs are quite quiet mate

Yeah I know. I normally skip those songs and do my bit to keep the house nice and warm by cranking up my 1000W amp...

Off that topic though, I must give full credit to whoever scheduled the ads during the Simpsons tonight. Homer plugs in the electric Santa during a heatwave and plunges Springfield into darkness.

A minute or two later it's not one but literally every second advertisement telling me to shut the curtains and have a cold bath (well, give the clothes a cold wash) in order to "save energy, save money".

Yep, nice scheduling that and it's all about saving the environment, right? Absolutely nothing to do with zero inflows, 23.3% storage, gas-fired generation only half working... No, it's about the environment and saving the householder a bit of money (at least they'll think so until those inflated bills start arriving). : :

 

[2020hindsight]

Speakin of inflated bills- did I tell you about my brother in law - he complained about his electricity bills a few years back - they were astronomical.

Power company said - pay up, or we shut you down!
he paid - but next month same problem .
again "pay up, or we shut you down!"
he said "damn it - I can't afford to keep this up".
So they turned off his power, and all the street lamps went out
(believe it or nuts lol)

 

[Smurf1976]

Speakin of inflated bills- did I tell you about my brother in law - he complained about his electricity bills a few years back - they were astronomical.

Power company said - pay up, or we shut you down!
he paid - but next month same problem .
again "pay up, or we shut you down!"
he said "damn it - I can't afford to keep this up".
So they turned off his power, and all the street lamps went out
(believe it or nuts lol)

It's even funnier when the power company realises after literally 30 years that the swimming pool (at a swimming centre) isn't connected to the meter. Only the office and lights but not the pool itself.

Needless to say they had some pretty low bills and a nice warm pool. And no surprises for guessing that the owners didn't see a problem with the arrangement.

 

[willial]

The main problem is global swarming and unless we control the population we cannot control resource use and pollution . it is politically difficult to say to people 2 or less children and extras you will be taxed for. The days of large welfare payments encouraging the non producing to breed should be past. By extreme measures we may cut our greenhouse gas emissions by 10% in world terms making .05% difference .Mainly political hot air as the parties lobby to who is greener. Watch rudd backslide from meaningful targets. Technology is the answer with improved absorption and conversion fo solar rays .

 

[Wysiwyg]

The main problem is global swarming and unless we control the population we cannot control resource use and pollution . it is politically difficult to say to people 2 or less children and extras you will be taxed for. The days of large welfare payments encouraging the non producing to breed should be past. By extreme measures we may cut our greenhouse gas emissions by 10% in world terms making .05% difference .Mainly political hot air as the parties lobby to who is greener. Watch rudd backslide from meaningful targets. Technology is the answer with improved absorption and conversion fo solar rays .

Too right, encourage people to take responsibility for their lives and to pay their way through life.Planning for children through being financially able to support them and mentally stable to care for them are good building blocks.

I`m all for supporting the genuine weaker ones but i reckon there is a good 25% that are too damn lazy to look after themselves and prefer to feed off the people that do pay their way.

 

[wayneL]

FYI

Central China is having the coldest and snowiest winter in decades.

...and we had a few snowflakes in Cheltenham today... proper snow forecast for tommorrow.

I'm firing up the Hummer to see if I can warm things up a bit.

 

[--B--]

but wayne the AGW hypists will have you believe that cold weather is also a sign of catastrophic climate change.

any weather event these days is attributed to human caused climate change it seems and while the basis of the argument revolves around co2 trapping heat and therefore 'warming' the planet, this doesnt seem to matter if the weather doesnt play along...

 

[Julia]

but wayne the AGW hypists will have you believe that cold weather is also a sign of catastrophic climate change.

any weather event these days is attributed to human caused climate change it seems and while the basis of the argument revolves around co2 trapping heat and therefore 'warming' the planet, this doesnt seem to matter if the weather doesnt play along...

Yep, we've had the coolest spring and summer in the 14 years that I've lived in this part of Qld, hardly a day over 30 degrees.

 

[Happy]

One of arguments that this is global warming too, is that melting ice takes about 80 kcal per gram of ice to melt, once majority of ice cap is gone, temperatures will jump up higher faster.

Probably there is counterargument, which says that this is not correct, so until we fry or freeze we will be able to keep this debate alive.

 

[long$$]

It has seemed a cool summer but.....

SMH Today

AUSTRALIA had its hottest January on record, in line with a pattern that has seen the country's average temperature rise over the past five decades under the impact of global warming.

"Nearly the whole country has been hotter than average for daytime and night-time temperatures in January," David Jones, the head of climate analysis at the Bureau of Meteorology, said yesterday. "It's not so much a few places breaking records by large margins. It's nearly the whole country being one to two degrees warmer than average".

The average temperature across the country rose 1.3 degrees last month, but large areas, especially in the Pilbara in Western Australia and in Central Australia, recorded temperatures three to four degrees above average.

"We just continue to get a stream of these records being broken," said Dr Jones, who has analysed Australia's rising temperature going back almost 60 years.

"The general pattern is one of warming. We have now warmed up by a degree since 1950. The effects of global warming have been felt across Australia as a whole. And the pattern of warming across Australia is very consistent with the pattern we've seen across the globe."

Sydney's daytime January temperature was right on average at 25.9 degrees thanks to easterly summer winds, but night-time temperatures were almost two degrees up at 20.3 degrees.

The rest of the state was not so fortunate. Temperatures in the south and west climbed two degrees higher than average.

Pooncarie, a town west of Griffith, recorded the state's highest temperature, 44.5 degrees. The licensee of Pooncarie's Telegraph Hotel, Sharon Neyland, did not need to be told the news.

"It would not surprise me at all," she said yesterday. "It's been terrible. I don't know whether it's because I am getting old but it's been very, very hot."

The only exception to the record temperatures was in eastern Queensland and north-eastern NSW, where wet weather brought the figures one or two degrees below the average.

 

[Smurf1976]

Record drought in Tas.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/02/01/2152424.htm

 

[Smurf1976]

Yep, we've had the coolest spring and summer in the 14 years that I've lived in this part of Qld, hardly a day over 30 degrees.

Any chance of sending some of that down here?

Recently Hobart's daily maximum has been averaging higher than Sydney, Melbourne and Adelaide and about equal with Brisbane. It's cooled down in the past few days though.

The water you can see flowing into Great Lake in the previous post isn't a river or creek. It's just water being transferred from another storage that is itself virtually empty. Actual proper inflows are, well, they just aren't happening at all now.

 

[2020hindsight]

Smurf , better borrow Wayne's hummer and do a rain dance