Giving 16 and 17 year olds the vote?

derty · 27 July 2009

Just saw this article in The Australian:
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25839595-601,00.html

SIXTEEN and 17-year-olds could be given a voluntary right to vote in federal elections, under changes to be canvassed by the Rudd government later this year.

While the Liberal Party's newest recruit, Francesca Perrottet, 16, said the shift could inspire young people to get involved in politics and widen the pool of leadership talent, senior Liberals shunned the idea.

Special Minister of State Joe Ludwig said the government would raise the issue in its second electoral green paper later this year.

The move, which comes more than 35 years after the voting age was lowered from 21 to 18, will spark strong views from all sides of politics.

It follows fierce and ongoing debate over reforms to political donations and funding, which is part of the first stage of the government's electoral reform agenda.

"The Rudd government is committed to reforming and modernising Australia's electoral system," Senator Ludwig said....

I cannot say that I think this is a good idea - I imagine the Labor research has identified that they have more support in the younger generations.

When I was 18 (about 20 years ago) my understanding and regard for politics was minimal at best, I just didn't give two rats. From my dealings with young people from 16 to early 20's at work, family and with friends children they have even less of an inclination to give a hoot about politics. Politics just isn't high on the priority list of today's texting mad youths living in a 10 second bubble of wants and needs.

Kez180 · 27 July 2009

Giving them the responsibility of electing leaders might snap them out of the me, me, me, mentality...

Mr J · 27 July 2009

Derty, I doubt kids think any more or less about politics than they have in previous decades. Some couldn't care less, some are activists, and most are in-between. This isn't really something that can judged by age, as some kids are far more informed about politics than many adults, and of course some kids really should not be allowed to vote. I like the idea of it being voluntary, as those who care will vote, and those that don't care won't vote. I wish voting was currently voluntary.

waz · 27 July 2009

They would most likely vote for which ever political party reduces the alcohol drinking and smoking age from 18 to 16.

They don't care about taxes/health care/ etc.

Teenagers (Red bull generation) already have to much power, are lazy and ungrateful for what they have.

Im only 28 and I want the governemnt to introduce compulsory national service.
Thats does not mean force them into military service. In most countries they work in schools and hospitals.

Mr J · 27 July 2009

waz said:
Teenagers (Red bull generation) already have to much power, are lazy and ungrateful for what they have.

Says every older generation since the dawn of time. It's interesting to see that society is cramping down on every form of discrimination possible and to ridiculous extents, but age has never been discussed. I've never seen a more ignorant and arrogant attitude than what the older generations have towards younger generations.

You're a bundle of joy, waz.

waz · 27 July 2009

Exactly my point Mr J. There was a time when I was once a teenager.
And i wish I knew then what I know now.

In a few years time the current young generation will be replaced by another generation. Then they will complain about kids just 5 years younger than them.

So do you imply that i just a few years from now the current 16 - 18 years olds will also 'cramp down on every form of discrimination possible and to ridiculous extents, and age will never been discussed'.

If not, what will change in the next 10 years that has never occured in the history of mankind?

Mr J · 27 July 2009

So do you imply that i just a few years from now the current 16 - 18 years olds will also 'cramp down on every form of discrimination possible and to ridiculous extents, and age will never been discussed'.

I think you misunderstood. I was just making an observation that society has become so anti-discriminatory yet is completely discriminatory when it comes to age.

trainspotter · 27 July 2009

THE poster boy for teenage stupidity is refusing to come home and face the music. Corey Delaney is staying with friends and enjoying the limelight after his 16th b/party turned into a 500-person free-for-all at the weekend. He will not go home and face his furious parents. Yep ... let's give them the vote shall we??

Old Mate · 27 July 2009

I myself am 19, I'd appreciate it if you didn't put me in the same group as those fools. Thank you.

Oh and no, don't let them vote. Like Derty said, Labor seems to have more support in the younger generations which is probably why they're advocating this.

trainspotter · 27 July 2009

16 and 17 year olds should NOT vote because their cerebral cortex has not developed enough to understand WHAT they are voting for let alone whether thay are Liberal or Labor or (insert party denomination here). Most of the time a "kid" has a political opinion because someone else has driven their idealogy into them ie Mummy & Daddy or that really cute maths teacher in year 10.

I have yet to meet a 16/17 year old who can rationalise politically and still maintain a balanced conversation. Their I.Q. levels have not developed in their VAST experience they have had on this planet. Some of them are still wetting the bed and living at home.

IQ - a number used to express the apparent relative intelligence of a person that is the ratio multiplied by 100 of the mental age as reported on a standardized test to the chronological age. IQ is the measure of cognitive abilities, such as the ability to learn or understand or to deal with new situations; the skilled use of reason; the ability to apply knowledge to manipulate one's environment or to think abstractly as measured by objective criteria (as tests); mental acuteness; logic and analytical skills.

waz · 27 July 2009

Hehe, yup I did misunderstand your post.

My point was, just like I wanted more power when I was young, now that Im older, (only by a few years), I wish I didn't have so much power.

Likewise, people today who want power, will also most likely to feel the same way in a few years time.

And the same will happen with the next generation into perpetuity.

Have you got any examples of age discrimination???

oh, old mate, your right, we are generalising here. Its like starting a thread about 'americans being arrogant'. Now where have I seen that before???
Forums are filled with generlisations. Don't take it personally.

There is another generlisation that all Australians like vegemite. Im sure most of us don't appreciate that, however we lean to live with it.

Buckeroo · 27 July 2009

This is a bit more dangerous than people realize. Kids this age are easily lead, it can be consider the dangerous years for parents to loose control.

So, it wouldn't be hard for an individual to woo these young people for their own ends - a good example was the Hitler youth in Germany.

Food for thought? - I really sometimes wonder what KRudd is really up to?

Cheers

Mr J · 27 July 2009

trainspotter said:
THE poster boy for teenage stupidity is refusing to come home and face the music. Corey Delaney is staying with friends and enjoying the limelight after his 16th b/party turned into a 500-person free-for-all at the weekend. He will not go home and face his furious parents. Yep ... let's give them the vote shall we??

No, let's wait a year or so until he's 18, I'm sure he will have completely changed by then.

I have yet to meet a 16/17 year old who can rationalise politically and still maintain a balanced conversation. Their I.Q. levels have not developed in their VAST experience they have had on this planet. Some of them are still wetting the bed and living at home.

They must be some pretty stupid teenagers. Over a limited sample, I could also conclude that adults are quite stupid and shouldn't be voting.

Forums are filled with generlisations. Don't take it personally.

I don't think I take anything personally. I just don't like generalistions, especially when they're dismissive. If I was to make comments similar to the ones trainspotter has just made, but about race, I'd be banned from most forums, reamed in the media, fired from most positions etc. Yet to make a similar statement about age would not be that controversial, and possibly even acceptable.

beerwm · 27 July 2009

A person's vote should be weighted accordingly;

-dollars taxed - contribute more to society, have a larger say in its use.

-intelligence - greater understanding of politics/economics/society - greater ability to influence it.

-fixed proportion - a token realisation that you are affected by society's choices so you deserve a partial say in its decisions.

find a formula-

calculate one's voting power from 1-100 or 50-100, or whichever.

Buckeroo · 27 July 2009

beerwm said:
A person's vote should be weighted accordingly;

-dollars taxed - contribute more to society, have a larger say in its use.

-intelligence - greater understanding of politics/economics/society - greater ability to influence it.

-fixed proportion - a token realisation that you are affected by society's choices so you deserve a partial say in its decisions.

find a formula-

calculate one's voting power from 1-100 or 50-100, or whichever.

I dare you to calculate the proportion of a woman's vote - who would be sillier enough to take this on!!!

Mr J · 27 July 2009

How do we judge intelligence? Why intelligence at all, rather than political awareness?

Calliope · 27 July 2009

That old ex-commie, Philip Adams advocates the vote for 16 year olds so there is obviously an ulterior motive. Children at state schools are indoctrinated in left wing ideology including climate change.

The idea is to get them early before the indoctrination wears off, and they start thinking for themselves.

waz · 27 July 2009

The other option is to leave things the way they are.

There are more important issues for our politicians to discuss right now.
This is just some sidetrack to take our mind of other things.

They way you judge intelligence is to 'generalise' and assume that anyone over the age of 18 is competent to make a well informed decision.

It's One vote per citizen, we all have equal rights to the Commonwealth of Australia regardless of sex, money, tax, ethnic background, where you happen to be in the world on voting day and AGE.

I still dont see how we are discriminating against age here.

beerwm · 27 July 2009

Buckeroo said:
I dare you to calculate the proportion of a woman's vote - who would be sillier enough to take this on!!!

haha, good point

waz · 27 July 2009

Another generlisation is that everyone on this forum is a man and that we all have a sense of humor.

hehehe

Giving 16 and 17 year olds the vote?

derty

Kez180

Mr J

waz

Mr J

waz

Mr J

trainspotter

Attachments

Old Mate

trainspotter

waz

Buckeroo

Mr J

beerwm

Buckeroo

Mr J

Calliope

waz

beerwm

waz

Similar threads

Giving 16 and 17 year olds the vote?

Attachments

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency