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Gay Marriage

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Gay marriage, nearly 1,500 posts, is it really that important.:D

I think people are going to have much more pressing problems, in the next 5 years, only my opinion of course.:D

On a positive note, it will help the budget.

A same sex couple living together married will only pull a $34k pension, living together as is, they pull a $44k pension.
They might want equality, until they get it, be carefull what you wish for.lol

See there is an up side.IMO

Sometimes you wonder who drives these agendas.
 
sptrawler said:
Gay marriage, nearly 1,500 posts, is it really that important.:D

I think people are going to have much more pressing problems, in the next 5 years, only my opinion of course.:D

On a positive note, it will help the budget.

A same sex couple living together married will only pull a $34k pension, living together as is, they pull a $44k pension.
They might want equality, until they get it, be carefull what you wish for.lol

See there is an up side.IMO
Click to expand...

Exactly.

So many more important issues.

It's gonna happen, just pass it and get it out of the farkin' way so the lawyers can make some more dosh in the divorce courts. :rolleyes:
 
Gay marriage.

We have this universe and in this universe we have all these living beings. With reason, wisdom and knowledge we human beings specifically, who are incredibly unique relative to the other living beings, seek truthful answers as to the meaning of existence and the universe. Over the ten of thousands of years of life, we human beings have developed from this interaction with the universe and existence, philosophies, morals and social laws, which by experience have been shown to be true.

Self knowledge and the fact of our existence and observation of the person who am I, in my inner life, leads to further truths about dignity, self love and respect, which then is accorded to fellow human beings. Now we begin to understand and nurture relationships with others, and this begins primarily in our relationships with others. Now because of the facts of this experience that we have, which is to be completely human in a universe, we understand that we have a relationship with the universe and what's behind it. We look at the best of what is in humanity and we realise that all of it is a property of the universe and that with that fact, more insights develop. These insights lead to another experience. An entirely different experience, one that is the experience of a relationship with God.

Because we know that everything that is and who we are and what we are is a complete and utter gift, AND we know that all of it is a property of the universe, including everything about our humanity, we then get a glimmer of understanding finally that behind everything that is, there is a creator. We begin to see life not so much from the horizontal perspective of a evolutionary timeline but of a vertical perspective, of things being as they are instead of any other way, and we see that all these things are the property of a creator. We are but a reflection of the creator that is good. We know ourselves, which part is of the creator and which part is of some intrinsic evil which we create ourselves whenever we act in opposition to the laws of the universe, not just the physical laws but also the spiritual laws. We begin to see the spiritual laws and observe them. Some human beings begin to go deeper in this and develop a very deep highly sensitive inner life that has an incredibly deep insight into moral life and experience a compass for guidance in all life situations. Such people then see what is the big picture meaning of the universe and humanities place in it and now of the creators plan that is always aligned with our true nature and the true nature of nature itself.

From all this we have guidance as to the phenomenon of man. This phenomenon of man in universe in relationship with God and experiencing a deep inner life, that billions of other humans do not experience ,for the path is hard, results in us knowing that the love and marriage and procreation of children by functional and loving parents is the only true path and that everything else is disordered. We know that this truth is universal, natural and holy as it is deemed by a creator. For an atheist to negate this experience is to be incredibly intolerant, aggressive and discriminatory against our humanity and freedom of religion.

When somebody therefore tells us that it is not the case, then what they demand of us is to deny our very humanity our complete understanding and force upon us a worldview that is completely at odds with nature and also our nature and fact. They want us to negate ourselves and everything we know as fact. They want us to know instead that 1 + 1 = 3

Therefore the only way for the others is to destroy our world views and this is what atheists attempt to do. But they don't understand that this atheism will destroy them and their line anyway. Humans are tolerant, nature and spiritual laws are not. This entire universe and everything in it serves beings that are loving and good, beings that grant the courtesy of justice towards ones creator in humility and do not put themselves at odds against nature, nor don't overcome the disorder in their lives in the wrong manner.

The emotional life of a human being, their urges and desires are all at the very heart of the matter governed by free will. If it were not so we could never be morally culpable for everything nor anything we do. There would be no free will. There is nothing in our nature that a person with a healthy functioning free will cannot overcome. To deny this is to accept that something akin to chemistry and biology or the stars and planets hold our fates in their hands like some warped form of biological astrology that can be derived from reading the horoscope in the women's magazine.

The human being creates itself within a internal structural framework within a society and within an existence within a universe that is within something else. Our destiny as humans is to discover the deepest truth about ourselves, yet we know less about our inner lives then we know about the surface of the moon.

A human being that loves God cannot accept gay marriage as a holy act for it is a perversion of the natural order of the universe and against the natural plan that God has for everything that occurs in this universe and whatever it is leading towards and the full reasons for which it exists. It is from this that morality is an absolute and not just a majority opinion as the atheist would have people who love God, accept. The atheism that is attempted to be forced upon such human beings, in order to accept gay marriage is anti-existential. The atheists cannot succeed without destroying all religion and therefore they are anti-religious and trample on my very right to freedom of religion.

Atheist just turn around and say there is no God. A person with a relationship with God just turns around and says there is a God. At this clash is a scientifically perfectly matched impasse where the atheist and the person with a relationship with God, both of them, have no scientific proof or disproof of God. But at this point the person that has the deep inner life relationship with God and experiences the soul and its deep inner movements has this as proof, which he cannot transmit to anybody but himself because the relationship is precisely only personal with God. He can't even transmit this experience of God to a mere believer, for a mere believer is almost equivalent to an atheist in practice. We can probably literally only count on our hands and feet how many humans have attained such depths of a relationship with God. "If you love me, my Father in heaven will love you and we will come and make our home within you".

For a genuine seeker of love, truth and God, a person who will never be satisfied with anything less or anything else than God himself, the path is an incredibly difficult one and few ever venture onto the path, even if it's their greatest desire. It's for people who deep inside know that life is for one purpose only and that is to have God living in the home that is deep within themselves. These people care for nothing else. It's a path that one will never succeed on without a spiritual teacher in the first place. It's a path that God leads the person on, and not the person.

And a atheist will just shake his head in complete disbelief and be amazed to their very core that anybody could be so deluded and speak like this or about this as fact, and that is perfectly fine. The person who has a relationship with God knows that it's like telling a person from the Sahara desert who has never seen or tasted mango ice-cream, what ice cream is, never mind what a mango is.

I understand how a gay person can be bullied and vilified and treated with contempt. I understand that a gay person may be denied all kinds of rights. And to the best of my ability I will always try to treat gay people with the courtesy and love they deserve in their inherent dignity as human beings. I hope I will not stand by and let a person be treated in that manner. In the same way I will not allow a decent other straight person to be treated badly by the contempt of a gay person who discriminates or abuses a straight person as is the common practice nowadays. I will not tolerate the blatant discrimination that gay people have against the people who are religious and exercising their religious freedoms. I have also learnt that judging gays, their private behaviours or life situation is far beyond what any human being is capable of, even if they are objectively wrong , who am I to judge the reasons why a specific person does what he does?

The real problem for gays wanting marriage however is this:

It is beyond my or any other humans or collective of humans capacity to be able to grant gay people the marriage they seek. Marriage is written into existence as an existential fact to be between a male and a female, and even if the gay people attain every so called right they seek, in truth and fact their marriage never will be a true marriage anyway. For it is something that is not for a human to grant, it is a universal truth that cannot be altered and it comes ruled by spiritual laws if broken will lead to evil, which always seeks to destroy good but will only ever manage to cannibalise and destroy itself. Marriage and its meaning is simple clear and specific and it can't be altered. It is a man and a woman falling in love for eternity and participating in the act of procreating children in love and for love as part of the creators plan.

Opponents of gay marriage warn that allowing the example of gay marriage to exist. will create disorder in existence and harm for humanity and that's why they oppose it. They can't stop it if the majority threaten them with violence and imprisonment or destruction of their family as will now occur in America, so they standby and watch it happen, as will I.

So if by stubbornness, discrimination, abuse and persistence, gay people achieve all their aims, it's never going to be ice cream. And they know it by experience of that, which is blatantly obvious and they all know this. The reasons gay people want gay marriage, and all their gay rights and everybody to accept them and why they are so fanatical about forcing people to accept a new morality about this, is because they can never ever manage to, nor ever will, accept and love themselves. And they don't want to be reminded of this. But you cannot escape what is not created by you. Your life is a gift and how it is given was never your choice.

One becomes fully human by accepting humbly the constraints placed on us and owing justice towards ones creator.
 
Could you summarise the post, I can't be bothered reading it.

I wouldn't impose that much of my opinion on you, and if I did, I wouldn't expect you to read it.:eek:

Your opinion, or my opinion, isn't that important.IMO

Jeez this is Australia, no one takes it that seriously, and I didn't even read it.

Chill out mate, it isn't that important.
 
Ald123 said:
Gay marriage....
One becomes fully human by accepting humbly the constraints placed on us and owing justice towards ones creator.
Click to expand...

Yea, gays and their so call rights! How dare they think they're just as cool and as just superior as I and all those low-life heterosexuals. Don't they know that God put them on this Earth, in this universe to be inferior, unequal, and will go to Hell soon?


C'on man, maybe go to a different Church or something. Too intense where you're hanging.
 
sptrawler said:
Could you summarise the post, I can't be bothered reading it.

I wouldn't impose that much of my opinion on you, and if I did, I wouldn't expect you to read it.:eek:

Your opinion, or my opinion, isn't that important.IMO

Jeez this is Australia, no one takes it that seriously, and I didn't even read it.

Chill out mate, it isn't that important.
Click to expand...

I won't impose anymore.
 
Ald123 said:
I won't impose anymore.
Click to expand...

You're not imposing, when you give your opinion.
You aren't giving your opinion, when you cut and past an article, your giving someone else's opinion.
This is a chat forum, not a platform for a movement.IMO

That's only my opinion, I may be completely out of line.

However if we all go down that path, the pages will be full of cut and pasted garbage, not peoples opinions.
 
So Asia may view us a decadent if we allow same sex marriage. What a bizzare way to view thing.

I wonder if we're viewed as decadent for having:
  • A minimum wage
  • anti discrimination laws so adds like 18-25 chinese speaking female are not valid criteria
  • reasonably access to the rule of law
  • car safety standards so you don't end up in a concertina when in a crash
  • reasonably enforced environmental protection - breathable air in our cities.
The whole thing reminds me of the twitter wars over what colour the dress is. Blue and black / white and gold.
 
sydboy007 said:
So Asia may view us a decadent if we allow same sex marriage. What a bizzare way to view thing.

I wonder if we're viewed as decadent for having:
  • A minimum wage
  • anti discrimination laws so adds like 18-25 chinese speaking female are not valid criteria
  • reasonably access to the rule of law
  • car safety standards so you don't end up in a concertina when in a crash
  • reasonably enforced environmental protection - breathable air in our cities.
The whole thing reminds me of the twitter wars over what colour the dress is. Blue and black / white and gold.
Click to expand...

I agree, how Asia views us, didn't seem to matter, when we were going bananas about drug runners being excecuted.

Why has it become an issue now.:confused:

Also to think that Asia don't already see us as decadent, is a bit naive.
 
sydboy007 said:
So Asia may view us a decadent if we allow same sex marriage. What a bizzare way to view thing.

I wonder if we're viewed as decadent for having:
  • A minimum wage
  • anti discrimination laws so adds like 18-25 chinese speaking female are not valid criteria
  • reasonably access to the rule of law
  • car safety standards so you don't end up in a concertina when in a crash
  • reasonably enforced environmental protection - breathable air in our cities.
The whole thing reminds me of the twitter wars over what colour the dress is. Blue and black / white and gold.
Click to expand...

That's a silly comment by Barnaby when we have just sold out our young and older tradesmen to China for a few pieces of silver. Everything is cash to this government, nothing else matters, even when our Asian trading partners are using the most underhand tactics to dominate the world.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-05/clinton-says-china-will-stop-at-nothing/6595710
 
sptrawler said:
It's also a silly comment, to say it is party specific.
Click to expand...

I saw BJ on Insiders and agreed with some but not all of what he said about Gay marriage, but you can bet that most of the reporting of Barnaby's appearance on Insiders that will be his Gay Marriage remarks, not his agriculture report.

That just shows that GM, despite only affecting 5% of the population is sucking the oxygen out of other things that need to be discussed. If the government needs some clear air they should do something about the issue. Probably the best they can do if they aren't going to vote for it is to promise a plebiscite at the next election. At least that will get if off the agenda for a while and a few important other matters can get discussed.
 
SirRumpole said:
I saw BJ on Insiders and agreed with some but not all of what he said about Gay marriage, but you can bet that most of the reporting of Barnaby's appearance on Insiders that will be his Gay Marriage remarks, not his agriculture report.

That just shows that GM, despite only affecting 5% of the population is sucking the oxygen out of other things that need to be discussed. If the government needs some clear air they should do something about the issue. Probably the best they can do if they aren't going to vote for it is to promise a plebiscite at the next election. At least that will get if off the agenda for a while and a few important other matters can get discussed.
Click to expand...

Your concern is valid, but it's based on the assumption that the gov't want the public to focus on more important things.

It may not. It may be work best if the people are focus on the trivial and the big boys get to do their work without being looked at.

Take the TPP... I haven't heard much discussion about it. The only thing that's known about it is what has been leaked. And what has been leaked is scary.


The TPP is probably the biggest, far ranging, far reaching trades agreement to date. It's all done in secret, most US Senator and Congress do not know much about it or told much about it; it's headed by "advisors" from the world's largest corporations... and its aim is to bind the entire world - literally.

It's right out of some Orwellian, conspiracy nuts' dream... but it's real.


From the Young Turks, one of the leaked discussion papers said that if the gov't decided to privatise a certain asset that asset and can never again be taken back into the public domain. So if you sell your port, sell your airline, your roads... you can't take it back.

From Joe Stiglitz... another leaked document states that no gov't can sue or cancel a project/product without due compensation - cannot do it for any reason.

So if Coal Seam Gas was granted and it turns out that the process causes too much danger to the water, the environment.. it's bad. If laws were passed to cancel that project, the gov't have to pay the company their estimated/projected profit as though the project were to go ahead and complete its projected profit gain. That is, you cannot take away their right to kill you.

Another would be patent and generic drugs... extending by 15 years before patent would expire and drug become generic... imagine how much that will costs the public healthcare system. It won't do much for innovation either.


But what's the focus we all should worry about? Terrorism, gay marriage, refugees and sovereign borders... Climate change? Didn't Joyce said the gov't is doing something about it? By saving more water, funding more water infrastructure? I guess if the water rises we just move to higher grounds; if it snow in spring just put on a jacket.
 
Thanks for posting those two articles, trainspotter.
https://www.aussiestockforums.com/f...t=3680&page=72&p=874514&viewfull=1#post874514

As I have said throughout this discussion, PC has silenced us, but more so the children.
The first article said it very well.

Agree, Rumpole, if anything they should take it to the next election as a plebiscite.
The Libs went to the election with a NO changes, so I would hope that they stand by it for their term.
 
Ald123 said:
Gay marriage.

blah, blah, blah and a lot more blah.
Click to expand...

Summarised above for those that couldnt be bothered reading it or fell asleep in the middle.

"I believe in an imaginary person who i think made everything. My imaginary friend has decided what marriage is and it doesnt matter what anyone else thinks it is, it is as my imaginary friend says it is.

People who dont believe my imaginary person created everything and made all the rules are wrong.

Gay marriage cant exist because its not part of my imaginary friend's playworld."
 
sydboy007 said:
So Asia may view us a decadent if we allow same sex marriage. What a bizzare way to view thing.
Click to expand...

Yes, Barnaby's argument was, even by his lofty standard, the pinnacle of stupidity.
A reasonable observer would find some far more influential factors shape our neighbours' opinion of us:
  • How the Australian Government treats members of their race.
  • How the Australian Government treats members of their religion.
  • How the Australian Government treats refugees that try to escape suppressive regimes.
  • How the Australian Government respects what they consider their culture.
 

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