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Essendon - Supporter Support

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what a bloody exciting game essendon played,much more so than my
beloved port adelaide who should be wearing skirts this week.
 
Real1ty said:
Care to elaborate on what Knights did wrong?

Knights' contract runs out at the end of next season so he won't be going anywhere and i wouldn't be surprised to see him signed half way through next year.
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I agree Reality. I was a huge fan of Sheeds and was disappointed in the way he left the club but Knights has done well in a difficult situation.

Knights does play guys out of position and differently to "what we are used to". However there is probably a case for some tough love. He has a small window of opportunity to get his players to show some improvement so that he can be judged as a coach. The future for Knights (and the Bombers) is no longer with Lloyd, Fletcher and Lucas (although Fletcher continues to be a marvel. The best full back over the past 30 years of any side).

To be fair - I think Knights has done a pretty good job to date. He has made some good "hard" decisions. For example Johnson and Peverill had to go. They are not the future of the club. I think the decsion to grab Skipworth was a good one. Not because he is a wonderful player but he is a very servicable player with experience. Great team man and will be great for the development of the youngsters. Bombers at the moment are either old or young - Skipworth provides a balance (and before you say it - he is a few years younger than Peverill).

He has inherited a team that have suffered in recent years through either poor draft selection and/or injuries to top draft picks (eg Gumbleton and Bradley). Neither are Knights fault.

If the Bombers continue to play exciting, fast (and accountable) footy I think Knights will be well on his way to a contract extension.

Duckman
 
Duckman#72 said:
I agree Reality. I was a huge fan of Sheeds and was disappointed in the way he left the club but Knights has done well in a difficult situation.

Knights does play guys out of position and differently to "what we are used to". However there is probably a case for some tough love. He has a small window of opportunity to get his players to show some improvement so that he can be judged as a coach. The future for Knights (and the Bombers) is no longer with Lloyd, Fletcher and Lucas (although Fletcher continues to be a marvel. The best full back over the past 30 years of any side).

To be fair - I think Knights has done a pretty good job to date. He has made some good "hard" decisions. For example Johnson and Peverill had to go. They are not the future of the club. I think the decsion to grab Skipworth was a good one. Not because he is a wonderful player but he is a very servicable player with experience. Great team man and will be great for the development of the youngsters. Bombers at the moment are either old or young - Skipworth provides a balance (and before you say it - he is a few years younger than Peverill).

He has inherited a team that have suffered in recent years through either poor draft selection and/or injuries to top draft picks (eg Gumbleton and Bradley). Neither are Knights fault.

If the Bombers continue to play exciting, fast (and accountable) footy I think Knights will be well on his way to a contract extension.

Duckman
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Good post Duckman thanks for that.

I asked the question of ivant as he made a call on Knights and said that he wanted him gone but backed it up with no examples, so it was my guess he was one of the army that was a Sheeds lover and no one would be good enough to replace him.

Whether Knights is a good enough coach to be successful is yet to be proven, either way, but until it is proven that he isn't, he has my full support, as should he have of all Essendon supporters.

We have seen our club make many correct decisions over the years and haven't had to watch our club go through some of the lean periods others have and i have been lucky enough to witness 4 premierships since i have followed the Dons, which is a lot more than most other supporters. We ALL should back the decisions they make as they invariably make the right ones.

Knights is trying to get the players to follow a gameplan, which was non existent under Sheedy, and it takes time.
He had to learn what the players could and couldn't do and which ones were capable of carrying out the vision he has. That was mainly what last year was about.Find out which players were capable of playing fast attacking football.

This year has seen an introduction of a more balanced approach with a mix of attack and defence.
We have one of the younger lists in the AFL and as you rightly point out injuries to young up and comers have been brutal to us over the last few years and last year in general the injuries destroyed our year.

He is giving young players valuable game time for the future and we will have THE most talented defence in 3 years.

We are often criticised for our midfield but we have no trouble mixing it with the majority of other clubs midfields, other than the very elite, and he has done this by introducing numbers through the midfield and with Prismall still to return, my info is he will play reserves in 2 weeks, we have numerous options in there.

Anyway i am starting to go off tangent here but Knights has been a breath of fresh air imo and i can see little reason why he could be criticised at this early stage of his career, and i am interested in seeing ivant's reasons as to what he has done wrong and why he wants him gone.

Knights has a vision, some of our supporters can only see the now.
 
I actually like Knights as a coach. He is building a solid game plan & style of play that will let Essendon compete with the better sides in the comp when they finally mature, but most importantly it is a style of football that will win finals matches. Fast, attacking football wins finals matches.

I stand by my comments that Jetta is soft & lazy, he doesn't put on enough pressure like Davey & Rioli and is easily hassled off the ball. He doesn't work anywhere near hard enough or attack the ball hard enough imo.
 
Sorry guys, haven't checked this until now.

I think there is definitely a valid point in what has been said about Knights being new and what he has done well.

What I like about him:

He picks the young players well. He obviously has a good understanding of what they can and can't do, and without doubt that comes from being a reasonably successful coach at Bendigo.

He has made some good decisions off the field, with letting go certain players and looking forward (maybe a good time to consider Lucas and a VFL placement for him until he gets some confidence back).

Some small other points that are a waste of space.

What I don't like about him:

His choice of strategies. He is not a quick thinker. He has a tendency to have some players that are completely outplayed staying on the same opponent for the entire game. Some players are outpaced and outclassed and sometimes it is crucial for the end result. I will post some examples when I watch the next game. I didn't remember the particular matchups in the last game or the one against Carlton and Port that I thought were horrible.

I thought it was time for Sheeds to go in 2002-03. However, what I always loved about him, is that he could sure pump up his players. You could see him yelling in the coaches box. We came out in that 4th quarter like little children. After that Ryder goal there was nothing that happened until the end. We were horrible. The momentum that was generated in the 3rd was wonderful, and it was sad to see it go away. As a coach you need to rip the @ss of your players if they deserve it. You HAVE to have a team go firing in the last.

Back to strategy, he does not seem to be able to measure the strength of the side and spread it throughout the game. We were short players against that Collingwood match, and we were belting our full energy out before the last. No decent coach does that. Look at any sport. Look at soccer managers, how they pace their team. Hiddink was a master in that.

Lastly, our major problem is accuracy. We have the run, and he has generated a good midfield I think. But we have to work on accuracy. I will comment on this later in the season. If we are still 15th in accuracy by end of year, this will probably be my main concern with him.

In any case, I think he has done reasonably well, as he is new and young. If he can get that brain part working, and become a strategist on the field, he will do well. He has a year and a half to prove himself. Otherwise I think he would be an amazing assistant coach for his great side selection and off the field strategies.

Just my :2twocents. I could be very very wrong...
 
ivant said:
Sorry guys, haven't checked this until now.

I think there is definitely a valid point in what has been said about Knights being new and what he has done well.

What I like about him:

He picks the young players well. He obviously has a good understanding of what they can and can't do, and without doubt that comes from being a reasonably successful coach at Bendigo.

He has made some good decisions off the field, with letting go certain players and looking forward (maybe a good time to consider Lucas and a VFL placement for him until he gets some confidence back).

Some small other points that are a waste of space.

What I don't like about him:

His choice of strategies. He is not a quick thinker. He has a tendency to have some players that are completely outplayed staying on the same opponent for the entire game. Some players are outpaced and outclassed and sometimes it is crucial for the end result. I will post some examples when I watch the next game. I didn't remember the particular matchups in the last game or the one against Carlton and Port that I thought were horrible.

I thought it was time for Sheeds to go in 2002-03. However, what I always loved about him, is that he could sure pump up his players. You could see him yelling in the coaches box. We came out in that 4th quarter like little children. After that Ryder goal there was nothing that happened until the end. We were horrible. The momentum that was generated in the 3rd was wonderful, and it was sad to see it go away. As a coach you need to rip the @ss of your players if they deserve it. You HAVE to have a team go firing in the last.

Back to strategy, he does not seem to be able to measure the strength of the side and spread it throughout the game. We were short players against that Collingwood match, and we were belting our full energy out before the last. No decent coach does that. Look at any sport. Look at soccer managers, how they pace their team. Hiddink was a master in that.

Lastly, our major problem is accuracy. We have the run, and he has generated a good midfield I think. But we have to work on accuracy. I will comment on this later in the season. If we are still 15th in accuracy by end of year, this will probably be my main concern with him.

In any case, I think he has done reasonably well, as he is new and young. If he can get that brain part working, and become a strategist on the field, he will do well. He has a year and a half to prove himself. Otherwise I think he would be an amazing assistant coach for his great side selection and off the field strategies.

Just my :2twocents. I could be very very wrong...
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His choice of strategies. He is not a quick thinker. He has a tendency to have some players that are completely outplayed staying on the same opponent for the entire game. Some players are outpaced and outclassed and sometimes it is crucial for the end result. I will post some examples when I watch the next game. I didn't remember the particular matchups in the last game or the one against Carlton and Port that I thought were horrible.
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This has nothing to do with quick thinking but a conscious decision made by Knights and O'Donnell to leave Daniher on Fevola.
If you had of heard Knight's interview after the game you would of heard him say he discussed moving Daniher off fevola but O'Donnell, who is the defensive actions coach, pointed out that Darcy was making fev get most of his kicks from out wide and he wasn't really hurting us as he was kicking points.

Darcy has played about 5 games but the decision to leave him on fev would have given him confidence and he would have learnt plenty.

We only have 1 key position backman, Fletch, and it is Knight's job to get games into our kids to have them ready for when Fletch, Lucas and Lloyd are gone.

This means we have to wear some pain when they are getting beaten but it is what every club must go through when they are blooding kids and it is about the future, not the now.

Against Port, Hurley, playing his first game, kept Tredrea goal less and Tredrea has since kicked 2 bags of 6.

I thought it was time for Sheeds to go in 2002-03. However, what I always loved about him, is that he could sure pump up his players. You could see him yelling in the coaches box. We came out in that 4th quarter like little children. After that Ryder goal there was nothing that happened until the end. We were horrible. The momentum that was generated in the 3rd was wonderful, and it was sad to see it go away. As a coach you need to rip the @ss of your players if they deserve it. You HAVE to have a team go firing in the last.
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If Sheeds could always pump up his players how have we not made the finals since 2004 and we win only 3 games in 2006 avoiding the spoon barely be %?

You say you were happy with the third quarter so why should he have ripped the @ss out of his players at 3/4 time?

Have you considered that the effort expended in the third quarter took a lot out of the players and that Collingwood with nothing to lose gave it everything they had?

In any case, I think he has done reasonably well, as he is new and young. If he can get that brain part working, and become a strategist on the field, he will do well. He has a year and a half to prove himself.
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Yet you wanted him gone at the end of the year :rolleyes:
 
Oh it is such fun getting nailed about a topic I know so little about :) Haha.


Real1ty said:
This has nothing to do with quick thinking but a conscious decision made by Knights and O'Donnell to leave Daniher on Fevola.
If you had of heard Knight's interview after the game you would of heard him say he discussed moving Daniher off fevola but O'Donnell, who is the defensive actions coach, pointed out that Darcy was making fev get most of his kicks from out wide and he wasn't really hurting us as he was kicking points.

Darcy has played about 5 games but the decision to leave him on fev would have given him confidence and he would have learnt plenty.

We only have 1 key position backman, Fletch, and it is Knight's job to get games into our kids to have them ready for when Fletch, Lucas and Lloyd are gone.

This means we have to wear some pain when they are getting beaten but it is what every club must go through when they are blooding kids and it is about the future, not the now.
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Valid point! It is up to him to train kids (of whom most are older than myself :p) so that we have another 2000 :). I still think if someone is getting nailed it is a good idea to change something. Fletcher has historically been good against Fevola.

Against Port, Hurley, playing his first game, kept Tredrea goal less and Tredrea has since kicked 2 bags of 6.
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Hurley was good indeed. Who was the guy who kept scoring goals for Port that match?


If Sheeds could always pump up his players how have we not made the finals since 2004 and we win only 3 games in 2006 avoiding the spoon barely be %?
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I didn't say always. He got lazy in his last year or two, and wasn't willing to do anything.

You say you were happy with the third quarter so why should he have ripped the @ss out of his players at 3/4 time?

Have you considered that the effort expended in the third quarter took a lot out of the players and that Collingwood with nothing to lose gave it everything they had?
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Oh I understand. We were much more tired than them, which brings me back to one of my points, about knowing how much energy your side has. Ripping was needed to be done to a few of the players, specifically Lloyd and Lucas, who had almost no input to the game. Regardless, you still MUST motivate your players, regardless of how well they are playing. I remember when I played footy a few years ago, if a player wasn't playing well (like Lucas), there are things that a coach can say that will make everything seem better and I have seen on several occasions players playing a lot better after a good chat.
Yet you wanted him gone at the end of the year :rolleyes:
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Ha! Well maybe I do :p But obviously since I now know that his contract expires next year, that won't happen.

Lets switch to some debate about trading or politics or something :p haha. I won't get so nailed in those :) I haven't seriously followed footy for a few years due to the lack of time. Pretty much since I stopped playing. I used to actually know all the players names in the full side, and a lot of the seconds. I forgot our coaches name 2 weeks ago!! So obviously I will lose any argument about Essendon haha. I just stated what I thought from the match on ANZAC day, and I still think Knights didn't do the best job in the world, from a strategy perspective.
 
Duckman#72 said:
The trick is now to encapsulate the desire and will to win in every game - not just against Collingwood and Carlton.
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Last night was a great example of "not being switched on". The boys were so flat. In truth the ANZAC Day game mentally hurt the Bombers badly (both on the park and the selection table). Had we lost that game - more scrutiny would have been placed on our weaknesses (ie Lloyd, Lucas, Jetta, no ruck divison). As it turned out the selectors took a "if it ain't broke don't fix it approach".

Despite what the match committee think - we are not going to win too many games this year with Lucas patrolling the forward line with all the poise and grace of a heavily sedated giraffe. Add Lloydy being out of form into the mix and you have one of the most celebrated and successful forward combinations ever to misfire.

Mentally - we were comprehensively ambushed. A team that gets walloped by 93 points should not be allowed a comfortable win 6 days later. Full kudos to Vossy and his troops - way to good.

Now to add insult to injury, Fletcher has broken his leg. Just great.

The football gods can be cute can't they! "Fletcher is Essendon's most consistent player. Let's break his leg on his 300th"........meanwhile at the other end of the ground you couldn't break Lucas in half with an army tank. I hate to say it but - it might have been the turning point of our season if Lucas had of broken his.

Without getting too negative - it is the inconsistency that is so frustrating for the Bomber fans. Some of the disposal was woeful as was the decision making. I'll give you my favourite example:

Lucas marked on the outer wing. Instead of kicking he played on by handpassing to Jobe Watson about 15m ahead, right on the boundary line with a player directly in front of him. (So you have one of the biggest kicks in the games passing to one of the least accurate kicks in the comp.) Now Watson - under pressure decides on a short pass to a stationary Davey....the smallest man on the ground, maybe even the whole AFL. He was monstered by two defenders and the ball rebounded straight down to Brown.

What a complete root up! Wrong players kicking, wrong players marking, poor positioning.

We have a terrible 4 weeks ahead which includes 3 of the 4 best sides (Hawthorn Geelong, St Kilda). Hopefully Knights can take a leaf out of the Lions book and get themselve ready for next week.

Duckman
 
Duckman#72 said:
Last night was a great example of "not being switched on". The boys were so flat. In truth the ANZAC Day game mentally hurt the Bombers badly (both on the park and the selection table). Had we lost that game - more scrutiny would have been placed on our weaknesses (ie Lloyd, Lucas, Jetta, no ruck divison). As it turned out the selectors took a "if it ain't broke don't fix it approach".

Despite what the match committee think - we are not going to win too many games this year with Lucas patrolling the forward line with all the poise and grace of a heavily sedated giraffe. Add Lloydy being out of form into the mix and you have one of the most celebrated and successful forward combinations ever to misfire.

Mentally - we were comprehensively ambushed. A team that gets walloped by 93 points should not be allowed a comfortable win 6 days later. Full kudos to Vossy and his troops - way to good.

Now to add insult to injury, Fletcher has broken his leg. Just great.

The football gods can be cute can't they! "Fletcher is Essendon's most consistent player. Let's break his leg on his 300th"........meanwhile at the other end of the ground you couldn't break Lucas in half with an army tank. I hate to say it but - it might have been the turning point of our season if Lucas had of broken his.

Without getting too negative - it is the inconsistency that is so frustrating for the Bomber fans. Some of the disposal was woeful as was the decision making. I'll give you my favourite example:

Lucas marked on the outer wing. Instead of kicking he played on by handpassing to Jobe Watson about 15m ahead, right on the boundary line with a player directly in front of him. (So you have one of the biggest kicks in the games passing to one of the least accurate kicks in the comp.) Now Watson - under pressure decides on a short pass to a stationary Davey....the smallest man on the ground, maybe even the whole AFL. He was monstered by two defenders and the ball rebounded straight down to Brown.

What a complete root up! Wrong players kicking, wrong players marking, poor positioning.

We have a terrible 4 weeks ahead which includes 3 of the 4 best sides (Hawthorn Geelong, St Kilda). Hopefully Knights can take a leaf out of the Lions book and get themselve ready for next week.

Duckman
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CRIPES!!!! :eek:

Glad I didn't get to see that!!!

I'm still holding Lucas in my team thinking that he will come around. He's costing me severely this year.

Have Fletcher in the back yard, will he be back next week?
 
kennas said:
CRIPES!!!! :eek:

Glad I didn't get to see that!!!

I'm still holding Lucas in my team thinking that he will come around. He's costing me severely this year.

Have Fletcher in the back yard, will he be back next week?
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Hi Kennas and Nomores

Fletcher won't be back next week - three weeks at the earliest and 8 weeks at the most serious.

I wouldn't be too worried about things if I were you Nomores. By the way hows the "new addition". Not so new anymore I guess. Has Dad turned (her?-from memory) into a true little Hawk supporter?

Duckman
 
Duckman#72 said:
I wouldn't be too worried about things if I were you Nomores. By the way hows the "new addition". Not so new anymore I guess. Has Dad turned (her?-from memory) into a true little Hawk supporter?

Duckman
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You just never know with this game, that's what makes it so good but we need to win to establish ourselves in the 8.

My little girl is awesome, she's 10 months old already and loves the hawks song;). Hope your flock are all going well too.
They certainly change your outlook on life.
 
If Knights was a futures contract, I'd close out my short and long him right now. Great game! Sorry about that nomore4s, you guys played really well!
 
Outstanding effort by the Bombers and good return to form by Lloyd.

Classic example of the difference between a team trying not to lose a game and a team trying to win a game.
 
ivant said:
If Knights was a futures contract, I'd close out my short and long him right now. Great game! Sorry about that nomore4s, you guys played really well!
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lol, the bombers played really well and took the game on, which was good to see. Told you Knights is building a solid game plan;), the bombers deserved to win without a doubt.

Hawthorn on the other hand were disgraceful, our skills & decision making were terrible, too many of our players looked slow with the ball and were lazy without it. There were alot of passengers last night for Hawthorn and we are nowhere near as fit as we were last season.

Luke Hodge needs a rest, he is obviously carrying an injury and he has been very ordinary all year - I don't think he has beaten his opponent once this year.

Enough of my rant, I'll let you bomber guys gloat now:p::D
 
nomore4s said:
lol, the bombers played really well and took the game on, which was good to see. Told you Knights is building a solid game plan;), the bombers deserved to win without a doubt.

Hawthorn on the other hand were disgraceful, our skills & decision making were terrible, too many of our players looked slow with the ball and were lazy without it. There were alot of passengers last night for Hawthorn and we are nowhere near as fit as we were last season.

Luke Hodge needs a rest, he is obviously carrying an injury and he has been very ordinary all year - I don't think he has beaten his opponent once this year.

Enough of my rant, I'll let you bomber guys gloat now:p::D
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Hi Nomores

Yes , we played really well last night.

Cannot understand them - the intensity, spirit and desire to contest the ball was unquestionable. A complete turnoaround from the week before.

Great decision to drop Lucas - and my remarks about Lloyd still being a very valuable player was also highlighted.

The Bombers look a better side at the moment without Jetta. Teams can be broken into Clydesdales(workhorse) and Thoroughbreeds(racehorses). The team needs to be balanced between the workhorses -Watson, Stanton, Monfries, Hocking, McVeigh, and Houli and the racehorses - Lovatt, Davey, Dyson, Winderlich. You need both sorts, but drop workhorses for racehorses at your peril. Jetta swings the balance too much towards the racehorses.

A great example of a racehorse used to be Caracella - when Essendon played well Caracella looked a star, but when Essendon played poorly, Caracella was nowhere to be seen.

Great coaching performace by Knights. Bellchambers and Ryder combined well in the ruck. Some of Paddy's vertical leaps in the last quarter were awesome.

I agree Nomores - your mob looked bad, however, credit where credit is due, the tackling and harrassment was fantastic by the Bombers and the deciusion to play on the kick long at every occasion threw the game in our direction. Hawthorn never controlled the tempo of the game. He who controls the tempo and style usually wins.

The big question is "which Essendon is going to turn up next week?" Do we have to wait a fortnight for another good performance.

Duckman
 
Dons are playing ahead of themselves aren't they?

Did Bellchambers get on the ground the past 2 games? I put him in my Super Coach team, but he looks like he'll be gone shortly with Laycock having a good first game at Bendigo. Do I replace him with Laycock?

How good is Ryder going to be? :)
 
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