Electric cars?

[Value Collector]

I don't doubt they did what they claim but:

They have 4 Tesla Powerwalls and a solar system that's substantially larger than would sensibly fit on the roof of many homes. All up, it's circa $60k AUD worth of equipment.

It was extremely cold outside and yet the electrical load remained low to the point that even a microwave oven being used lead to a visible jump in consumption. Where's the heating and where's the hot water load?

I'm not suggesting they cheated in what they did but there seems to be a bit of trickery involved here. Great big battery and solar system and seemingly no or very little heating or hot water isn't a realistic scenario for the average household.

My guess is they're burning something to keep warm and heat water.

They have natural gas heating, and probably hot water too, however you can see their solar panels were idling back each day once their batteries were full, so there is plenty of capacity to heat their hot water too if they did go electric hot water.

My house is fully electric, and I reckon in emergencies I could go off grid with just one power wall, all I would have to do is just be careful with how much hot water I used and when I charged the car if it was cloudy.

But I have a 8.2 KWH solar system, so on a sunny day it would have no problem heating the water from dead cold, topping up the car with 30% charge and having a power wall full by the time the sun goes down, and the power wall would easily cover an average night to the sun came up again

 

[rederob]

My guess is they're burning something to keep warm and heat water. Something as in gas most likely and if not gas then probably oil.

My guess?
Californians, so I reckon they burnt through their stash of buddha sticks so never had a chance to feel cold.

 

[Value Collector]

This guy only has a small 5 Kwh solar system 2 power walls, and was able to run his house for 5 full days, but he made no attempt to conserve power and was still running air con etc as usual, So I think if you were worried about losing grid power, solar and battery combo is a great option, you definitely would be fine especially if you were conserving power as you would in a real situation.

If you were considering installing a generator, you could just invest the funds into more solar panels and you wouldn't run out after 5 days like this guy, but its not often power cuts last more than 5 days.

 

[Value Collector]

Here is an actual account from a guy that survived 4 days without power during the Texas power outage.

 

[sptrawler]

This guy only has a small 5 Kwh solar system 2 power walls, and was able to run his house for 5 full days, but he made no attempt to conserve power and was still running air con etc as usual, So I think if you were worried about losing grid power, solar and battery combo is a great option, you definitely would be fine especially if you were conserving power as you would in a real situation.

If you were considering installing a generator, you could just invest the funds into more solar panels and you wouldn't run out after 5 days like this guy, but its not often power cuts last more than 5 days.

I will be able to tell you shortly, the son is going off grid in January.

 

[qldfrog]

Interesting debate, own situation very similar to @divs4ever i hope sanity will remain and the move will be technically sound while taking account the 20% who do not live in suburbia or inner cities.and who anecdotally feed you or at least are self sufficient and not competing for cans at woolies
If i was to stay in Australia and in current property, i would go off grid and batteries tomorrow.
And try to get a decent plug in hybrid.
No way would i want to trust the grid aka big corporation and or gov to charge uncharge my batteries.
But that is not majority of people situation
An interesting article i just found
I give it its own post

 

[qldfrog]

https://theconversation-com.cdn.amp...s-if-the-numbers-dont-add-up-economist-142765
I would disagree on the co2 global warming directional link but truly,fossil fuels are limited ,polluting and yes: we need to do better.mankind can not rely on oil for much longer.
But relying on an even more complex grid , and fleet of vehicles which can and will fry after a single solar flare,nor can handle a one to one vehicle switch .
Not exactly bright.
What EVs really mean ultimately is the end of individual transport.
The great Reset again. As per that article, this ultimately leads in the west to the end of freedom of movement.
And after the covid pretext,we are ripe
Go back to your kennel, populace .
We are not saving the olanet, just ensuring we are not all in together but preserve the better life of the fews..and this time ..the fews are not the west inclusive,has it has been in the past 100y.time will tell..
Saw the first MG EVs in a shopping centre yesterday.bland look but ok

 

[SirRumpole]

Wellll.
And that is the old model.

I wonder how long it will power a welder out in the paddock ?

 

[JohnDe]

I wonder how long it will power a welder out in the paddock ?

You must have a very long extension cord to reach the paddock

 

[rederob]

I wonder how long it will power a welder out in the paddock ?

The serious answer to this is that any farmer with a Tesla Cybertruck could drive to a far away paddock and use their V2L instantaneously.

 

[JohnDe]

Your Guide to Living with Off Grid Power | Farms & Remote areas | Off-Grid Solar Sytems | RedEarth Energy OffGrid Australia

Off-Grid Solar Kits, Batteries & DIY SHED Power. Off-Grid Power. Stand Alone Systems for Home, Business & Farms. Off-Grid Solar Systems with Australia Wide Installation

offgridaustralia.com.au

 

[JohnDe]

The serious answer to this is that any farmer with a Tesla Cybertruck could drive to a far away paddock and use their V2L instantaneously.

You need one of these

ALL ELECTRIC. ALL F-150.​

F-series is America’s best-selling truck for 44 years* for a reason. And now, it’s charging into the future with the all-new, all-electric 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning. It’s the first ever F-Series that’s gas-free and offers more purposeful technology, an elevated driving experience and trusted Built Ford Tough capability. Offering an ingenious array of connected, intelligent features with over-the-air Software Updates to help ensure your truck can get even better over time.

 

[JohnDe]

The serious answer to this is that any farmer with a Tesla Cybertruck could drive to a far away paddock and use their V2L instantaneously.

 

[SirRumpole]

You need one of these

View attachment 133979

ALL ELECTRIC. ALL F-150.​

F-series is America’s best-selling truck for 44 years* for a reason. And now, it’s charging into the future with the all-new, all-electric 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning. It’s the first ever F-Series that’s gas-free and offers more purposeful technology, an elevated driving experience and trusted Built Ford Tough capability. Offering an ingenious array of connected, intelligent features with over-the-air Software Updates to help ensure your truck can get even better over time.

Coincidentally, I've just been reading about this one.

 

[rederob]

View attachment 133980

No more fluffing around to get electricity approved for a new building site. Just rock up in the EV - Ford, Hummer, Rivian, Cybertruck (or Haval for @sptrawler ) and get on with the job.
Same goes for camping over weekends etc where you could glamp instead and aircon the tent for those hot and steamy nights!

 

[rederob]

But relying on an even more complex grid , and fleet of vehicles which can and will fry after a single solar flare,nor can handle a one to one vehicle switch .
Not exactly bright.

The grid will need to be complex because of the intermittency of renewables and DER functionality, irrespective of NEVS.

What EVs really mean ultimately is the end of individual transport.

Actually it will herald a greater ability to accommodate individual needs, as proven already by robotaxis.

The great Reset again. As per that article, this ultimately leads in the west to the end of freedom of movement.

Sorry, but that's just a silly claim.

We are not saving the olanet, just ensuring we are not all in together but preserve the better life of the fews..and this time ..the fews are not the west

Given the greater populations are not in the west, you got this claim back to front as well. That's because for the first time NEVs are so cheap that you can pick up a new BEV for under US$5k. So for the first time the very many on very low wages will actually be able to buy a car and travel to places they were never previously able to.

Saw the first MG EVs in a shopping centre yesterday.bland look but ok

The MGs are absolute plodders.
This is where BEV design is heading (and for the same price as a Tesla):

 

[JohnDe]

The grid will need to be complex because of the intermittency of renewables and DER functionality, irrespective of NEVS.

Actually it will herald a greater ability to accommodate individual needs, as proven already by robotaxis.

Sorry, but that's just a silly claim.

Given the greater populations are not in the west, you got this claim back to front as well. That's because for the first time NEVs are so cheap that you can pick up a new BEV for under US$5k. So for the first time the very many on very low wages will actually be able to buy a car and travel to places they were never previously able to.

The MGs are absolute plodders.
This is where BEV design is heading (and for the same price as a Tesla):

I believe that the industry is way ahead of you in what will be required, and plans are already in motion. There is going to be a lot of competition coming in the next year or so, this will bring in new software and hardware.

"Ampol set to join Shell, Telstra in bid to grab big piece of Australian electricity retail market"

"Ampol has now committed to joining Shell and Telstra in attempting to carve out a significant share of the electricity retailing market. All three believe that the incumbent major retailers – AGL, Origin and EnergyAustralia – are not maximising the advantages of their databases, artificial intelligence and other developments in the technology society."

Renewables to supply 69 pct of Australia’s main grid by 2030, government projections show

Morrison government projections show Australia’s main grid on track for 51 per cent renewables by 2025, and 69 per cent by 2030.

reneweconomy.com.au

 

[rederob]

I believe that the industry is way ahead of you in what will be required, and plans are already in motion. There is going to be a lot of competition coming in the next year or so, this will bring in new software and hardware.

"Ampol set to join Shell, Telstra in bid to grab big piece of Australian electricity retail market"

"Ampol has now committed to joining Shell and Telstra in attempting to carve out a significant share of the electricity retailing market. All three believe that the incumbent major retailers – AGL, Origin and EnergyAustralia – are not maximising the advantages of their databases, artificial intelligence and other developments in the technology society."

View attachment 133986

Renewables to supply 69 pct of Australia’s main grid by 2030, government projections show

Morrison government projections show Australia’s main grid on track for 51 per cent renewables by 2025, and 69 per cent by 2030.

reneweconomy.com.au

Neither supply (capacity) nor retailing is the problem. As @Smurf has banged on about for years, it's getting the technicals in place. Not my field but, for example, in the event of a blackout where is the inertia coming from to drive distributed energy across the network from BEVs and home batteries?

Back on topic, I am starting a list of the features I want from a BEV

• dedicated BEV platform (a la Tesla's)
• 800 volt architecture
• 400Km minimum range
• voice command control of all functions
• Uncluttered dashboard (minimalistic)
• 360degree surrounds and overhead view
• advanced driver assistance systems
• Autonomous driving (including parking)
• V2L and V2H minimum

At the moment I am good for a Wuling:

 

[JohnDe]

Neither supply (capacity) nor retailing is the problem. As @Smurf has banged on about for years, it's getting the technicals in place. Not my field but, for example, in the event of a blackout where is the inertia coming from to drive distributed energy across the network from BEVs and home batteries?

As mentioned, competition from Ampol, Telstra and Shell is going to create a race to be first in offering the best 'technicals' in place.

The 'inertia' required 'in the event of a blackout' will come from the batteries installed in homes and at specific locations provided by the supplier. South Australia, Victoria, Moorable, etc have or are setting up large battery power reserves.

The South Australian government has started a plan to have batteries installed in homes to help lower the cost of electricity to owners and also improve the grid during high peak usage.

Home Battery Scheme closed

www.homebatteryscheme.sa.gov.au

 

[sptrawler]

Back on topic, I am starting a list of the features I want from a BEV

• dedicated BEV platform (a la Tesla's)
• 800 volt architecture
• 400Km minimum range
• voice command control of all functions
• Uncluttered dashboard (minimalistic)
• 360degree surrounds and overhead view
• advanced driver assistance systems
• Autonomous driving (including parking)
• V2L and V2H minimum

At the moment I am good for a Wuling:
View attachment 133990

I can certainly see China creaming the U.S in the E.V space, the rate of improvement in Chinese vehicles is mind blowing, 10 years ago the Great Wall utes and SUV's looked like junk, now the product from China is certainly stomping on the second tier Japanese manufacturers. This is actually causing a lot of consolidation in the smaller manufacturers of Europe and Japan.

On this trajectory China is going to decimate the established auto makers, within the next 10 years IMO.
Unfortunately I tend to think Tesla will be swallowed up in the process, but they will be one of the last to and may go willingly, if the price is right and space x hits its straps.

The overheads and impediments that the capitalist system has, make it a no brainer that China will leapfrog the U.S, they have no businesses making all the decisions, without government accountability, no unions demanding conditions and an endless supply of Government money that is focused on growth.

The question is what will slow them down IMO, I tend to think things are moving that quickly, even tariffs would have limited effect now.
I think the World has to learn how to work with China, for a win/win situation, we have moved past the point of trying to slow their progress, way too much momentum IMO.
Interesting times ahead for some.