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Despair in Gaza

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You sure the video weren't cut, paste and edited from old, new, out of context sources?

But anyway, it's a bit much to excuse the literal sniping of people you imprisoned. Killing over 100, intentionally shoot with butterfly bullet, live ammo... aiming to permanently maim or kill, who cares.

So over 12,000 have their limbs shot to a pulp; over 100 killed... that's all good because they say nasty words and sound really angry. Setting fire to tires - polluting the environment for sure; trying to reach barbed wired fence - getting to one of them in the video, with two more to go, then ditches and mounts and crap load of military hardware.

So why are these Palestinian savages so angry and loud? Must be a Muslim thing where they just hate the Jews and instead of turning Gaza into a Singapore, they turn to terrorism [that's an almost word for word quote from the Israeli gov't].

Nevermind the total blockade, the rationing of food, electricity; the total destruction of the water infrastructure, sewage treatment...

Should really look into this. You don't want to be duped and unwittingly support genocide and war crimes.
 
Haven't read all your posts (limited time) but it's kind of cool how we're leaning in a similar direction on this issue. I was concerned Trump might do something like this. If you're the top guy you gotta have compassion for people...I don't think some of the old politicians like Frazer etc support Israel. They've worked it out.

In any case, my views are imperfect, but I only want to have a fair and just position in any conflict. If I pick the wrong side, then i'm ignorant.
 
Proposed ban and punishment for those who dare takes video of IDF soldiers.

I guess it's no longer the case of "you take the videos and I'll tell the story my way".

 
Triathlete said:
From their own mouths, the Gaza riots are about violence.

Stunning footage from filmmaker Pierre Rehov exposing what Palestinian leaders and rioters really intend to do in the Gaza border riots:
Click to expand...

I am sick and tired of the propaganda where Israel is seen to be the victim.

Look at the scoreboard Triathlete, as Luutzu has pointed out, over 100 Palestinians killed and thousands injured. What was the Israeli toll - zero!

If I locked you up in a cage Triathlete, and feed you scraps and beat you from time to time for my own enjoyment. I would imagine you would want to kill me?
 

Yea, a fair and objective opinion is what we should try to get at. I didn't know anything, really, about this conflict until a few years ago. Spent way too much time looking into it and man, it's pretty depressing.

Yea, leaders ought to be compassionate... just that those who's attracted to, and succeeded, at attaining power are often, pretty much always, psychopaths.
 
I understand what you are saying.....why has it not been sorted out by now???? there is never going to be peace in that area......the land that was taken during the wars is never going to be given back and I believe that is one of the sticking points (correct me if I am wrong).......In my mind no one wants peace anyway so we are going to go around and around in circles......
 
Anyone wonder why egypt shut its borders with Palestine?

Picking sides is an idiots game. You ain't after a solution.


Meanwhile lets ignore Turkey in Afrin.
 

It's not going to be sorted out until all the Palestinian are either dead or be gone somewhere else. Until then, both Gaza and the West Bank are just "human warehouse".

There's not going to be any two-state solution because what's been taken, as you say, are never going to be given back. But problem is, what's been taken weren't just taken during the 1967 war... All the arable land are taken and settled by the Israeli; all water sources are diverted and controlled. All funding or aids to the Palestinian must first go through Israel and they decide when and where it gets distributed.

All Palestinian land are "occupied land". i.e. a foreign military completely controls it. So it's a bit much to then complain and pretend that the Palestinian don't want peace, don't want to negotiate.

You can't oppress and imprison, occupied and colonise a people.. then be on your high horse about peace talks, negotiation, freedom and democracy.
 
moXJO said:
Anyone wonder why egypt shut its borders with Palestine?
Picking sides is an idiots game. You ain't after a solution.

Meanwhile lets ignore Turkey in Afrin.
Click to expand...

Egypt shuts its border with Gaza because its general and president, El Sisi [?] got a memo from Israel and the US. You want that nice title and comfy palace, want that billion a year military aid? One thing to do is shut that border.

That's why El Sisi is president while the democratically elected president before him is in prison for a few years now.

Arabs are not all brothers. They don't all hate the Jews either.

It's not about picking sides. It's about peace and justice.

Peace and justice are those simple things all us simple people want in the world. Just that often it's not what grand strategist and warmongers have in mind. And they'll sacrifice all of us if that's what it takes for "peace and freedom".

Turkey weren't happy that its NATO ally and supreme leader wanted its president out in a coup. Remember that a couple of years ago?

With Syria and Iraq being, then, over run by ISIS... they decided it's a good time to carve those regions up too.

Does other country's aggression make Israeli's peaceful?
 
Your part about egypt is once again really uninformed.

Which side wanted peace again?
Israel defended its borders. Other countries would do worse in the area. But the media focuses on where?
Advocating martyrdom solely for the media exposure is sick.

But lefties like making a point about Israel/Palestine, one being evil one being good. Fits their narrative.
How about venezuela. Death toll 111 with 1900 injured. Ssshhh lets not acknowledge thats a problem.


Its all over the world. You pick a side when you are to lazy to research the problem and pick tribalism over knowledge.
 

What country receives the second highest military aid from the US? Pretty sure it's Egypt. Which country receives the highest military aid? Israel.

But sure, the two countries aren't allies. They just happen to be liked by the one master.

And where are Israel's borders? It can't be the whole of Gaza and the West Bank right? But apparently it is seeing how they have the right to enforce blockades and shoot over the fences, take land and resources as they like.

As to Venezuela... dude, the US have been trying to overthrow its government since at least the early 2000.

There was a failed coup attempt under Chavez. The people literally rushed to the prison and rescued him.

But of course that's bad because what does the people know. Chavez was a commie who tax the rich, nationalised the oil companies and redistribute taxes into schools and hospitals. The bastard!

That's why Maduro is being sanctioned. There's open talk in the US about regime change for quite a while now. The sanctions is just to soften the ground a bit. There's just way too much oil right in the US backyard for tyrants and commies to own.
 
The sinai attack never happened, as it was a US plot I guess.

Have you actually been on the ground in Venezuela lately. Everything you just posted is bs. It has devolved into a chaotic mess. People are genuinely fighting for freedom and the government is to blame.
 

The Israelil tried to take Sinai from Egypt back then. They literally have plans and blueprint to build a massive Israeli city on the Peninsular. The place where Moses spoke to God or whatever.

Sadat [?] at the time warned the Israeli that if they take Sinai, he will fight back. He offered them all of Gaza - the place was a lot bigger then - just leave Sinai to the Egyptian.

But the Israeli, with the egging of Nobel Peace prize laureate Kissinger, thought the Arabs were no match so they pull one for democracy. That somehow didn't work out as planned since the Arabs all kind of got together to say no.


No I haven't been to Venezuela. But that's what the information age could get you... news all over the world.

Of course the place is falling to bits. It's been under sanction for almost a decade now. When a country has what is, from memory, the second largest reserves of oil in the world yet somehow it could not afford to fix and maintain its oil export infrastructure... you know it's not because its gov't doesn't want to, it's just sanctions and trade embargoes make it impossible to buy or borrow.

That will of course starve the people, ruin the economy.

In any given country, under the best of circumstances, there are factions and opposition. Under massive sanctions, with a superpower openly talking about regime change soon enough... That kind of stuff tend to give a few colonels hope doesn't it.
 
Triathlete said:
Terrorist group Hamas continues to sacrifice Palestinian civilians to gain the sympathy of the world and the media ... and it's working!

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1033613016787814
Click to expand...

Hamas must be loaded, with cash, to convince all those tens of thousands of people to fake a protest... week after week.

It's not like anybody's going to get kill, or maimed at the protests. So any hot meal and a few bucks for the pub is just a nice day out I reckon.

And it's not like those in Gaza have anything to protest about either. Can't go out into the open sea to fish; can't swim at the beach because the only sewage treatment facility got blown to shiet; can't drink or use 96% of your water; can't farm on some 30% of what's left of your land; can't fly or travel anywhere; can't find a job or start a family....

So yea, I have no idea why they're protesting. Must be Hamas' and their few silver coins.

And oh yea, the Media... those dam Mainstream Media and their liberal biases. Always questioning wars and stand up to big businesses. Always fighting for poor and desperate people of the world... Makes you wonder how these media companies make their money at all.
 
Red Cross sends war surgeons, supplies to Gaza "a sinking ship"
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...ies-to-gaza-a-sinking-ship-idUSKCN1IW0UT?il=0

GENEVA (Reuters) - The International Committee of the Red Cross is sending two teams of war surgeons to Gaza and setting up a surgical unit in the enclave’s main hospital to treat heavy casualties from clashes between Israeli forces and Palestinians.

Since protests on the Gaza-Israel border began on March 30, Israeli troops have killed 115 Palestinians and wounded more than 13,000 people, including 3,600 by live ammunition, Robert Mardini, ICRC’s director for the Near and Middle East, said.

This week also saw the most intense flare-up of hostilities between Palestinian militants and Israel since the 2014 Gaza war.

“The recent demonstrations and violence that took place along the Gaza border since the end of March have triggered a health crisis of unprecedented magnitude in this part of the world,” Mardini told a news conference in Geneva.

The ICRC will set up a 50-bed surgical unit at al-Shifa hospital, Gaza’s largest.

“Our priority now clearly is to help gunshot wound victims. Imagine, 1,350 people with complex cases who will need three to five operations each, a total of 4,000 surgeries, half of which will be carried out by ICRC teams,” he said.

“I think such a caseload would overwhelm the hospital in Geneva.”

The six-month surge of medical expertise, drugs andequipment will speed the long road to recovery and relieve an overwhelmed health care system, he said.

“The last eight weeks definitely the first priority has been to save lives and save limbs. Post-operative needs today are massive in Gaza,” Dr. Gabriel Salazar Arbelaez, ICRC health coordinator in Israel and the Occupied Territories, told reporters via Skype.

Guislain Defurne, head of the ICRC’s sub-delegation in Gaza, said many people will end up permanently disabled.


Mardini also said the economy of Gaza, which is blockaded by Israel and its other neighbor Egypt, was “suffocating”, with high unemployment, electricity limited to two hours a day, and untreated sewage flowing into the sea.

“Gaza is a sinking ship,” he said.
 
Yeah, I don't think the Jewish people intend on a 2 state solution...
 
grah33 said:
Yeah, I don't think the Jewish people intend on a 2 state solution...
Click to expand...

Some Jewish people might see themselves as Israeli, Jew or otherwise.

I know that Israel is selling itself as the state of the Jews, with Bibi anointing himself its current King David and all that. But I've seen a fair bit of interviews and news to know that a large chunk of non-Israeli Jews don't really care for all these "Jewish homeland", must keep it pure and stuff.

But to your point. Yea, there's no way in heck the Palestinians are going to get their state. As some Israeli minister was quoted by Chomsky as saying, we'll keep them cage up and they'll live like dogs. They can call it a state if they want.

Just heard that Israel is in the process of building a maritime fence to complete that prison. They've been posting a naval blockade all these years. It's probably getting too costly so it'll have to be something more permanent, and cheaper, than a few warships constantly at sea fencing in terrorists.

------------

Some Chicago and Harvard uni professors of international affairs, Mearsheimer and Waltz, had a theory some years back that since Israel had annexed the occupied territories to such an extend that it's impossible for the Palestinians to ever have anything resembling a state - self sufficient, roads, highways etc.... that Israel will soon enough be forced to completely took in all the occupied territories as Israel proper.

That mean all Palestinians will then become Israeli citizens... since there are more of them the Jewish character of Israel will be lost.

Chomsky's see it differently. That the Israeli will just keep doing what they've been doing all these years... the world will not give a rats azz because who cares about poor and impoverished Arabs anyway. And so the West Bank and Gaza will remain as they are - human warehouses, open prisons... with the occasional slaughter to keep the population in check.

Looking into the topic a bit more, Chomsky is definitely spot on.
 
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