Australian Politics General...

[wayneL]

Judge only trials seem to be the way to go, there are some poor souls on juries who have no idea what is going on.

Met many judges?

 

[sptrawler]

Just when you thought it couldn't get any worse, in todays SMH.
The media can hopefully continue on with their allegations, time will tell, they obviously think that he requires further court appearances.
I can see some very big compensation claims coming, if the media can't back up their allegations.

Media alleged that Bruce Lehrmann assaulted other women: court

It can also now be revealed Brittany Higgins had taken a week off from giving evidence during the trial in October due to a mental health crisis.

www.smh.com.au

A court judgment has revealed that the media had previously alleged that Bruce Lehrmann assaulted other women, after a high-profile rape trial against him was dropped over grave fears for Brittany Higgins’ mental health.

 

[basilio]

Just when you thought it couldn't get any worse, in todays SMH.
The media can hopefully continue on with their allegations, time will tell, they obviously think that he requires further court appearances.
I can see some very big compensation claims coming, if the media can't back up their allegations.

Media alleged that Bruce Lehrmann assaulted other women: court

It can also now be revealed Brittany Higgins had taken a week off from giving evidence during the trial in October due to a mental health crisis.

www.smh.com.au

A court judgment has revealed that the media had previously alleged that Bruce Lehrmann assaulted other women, after a high-profile rape trial against him was dropped over grave fears for Brittany Higgins’ mental health.

Previous allegations against Bruce Lehrmann for similar behaviour were reported. He had form.
These couldn't have been referred to in the trial nor could the reports have been brought up again in the months before the trial.

Anyway he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law. Whatever that means...

Were young women sexually assaulted when Bruce Lehrmann, the alleged parliament house rapist, was an official at the ANU UN conference? - Kangaroo Court of Australia

Bruce Lehrmann, the alleged parliament house rapist, was an official at the Australian National University (ANU) NCMUN annual conference in 2016 which was the

kangaroocourtofaustralia.com

 

[sptrawler]

Previous allegations against Bruce Lehrmann for similar behaviour were reported. He had form.
These couldn't have been referred to in the trial nor could the reports have been brought up again in the months before the trial.

Anyway he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law. Whatever that means...

Were young women sexually assaulted when Bruce Lehrmann, the alleged parliament house rapist, was an official at the ANU UN conference? - Kangaroo Court of Australia

Bruce Lehrmann, the alleged parliament house rapist, was an official at the Australian National University (ANU) NCMUN annual conference in 2016 which was the

kangaroocourtofaustralia.com

That's an interesting article, a lot of innuendo, one wonders with the body of information presented why he isn't taken in for further questioning.
Like I said, I think it will be all tested in the form of a compensation claim, time will tell.

From your article, there should be a body of information as to the veracity of the accusations:
There are now four investigations underway, in addition to the AFP inquiry, including into which staffers in the Prime Minister's Office (PMO) had knowledge of the assault allegation.

 

[SirRumpole]

Met many judges?

No , have you ?

In any case, a judges judgement can be more easily challenged than a juries, which essentially comes down to whether a judge instructed the jury properly.

Any point the judge makes in his written judgement can be challenged on appeal which makes it a more open process imo.

 

[basilio]

These are the newspaper reports of the other incidents involving Bruce Leherman.
Yes the women made statements and stat decs. But whether these would ever be enough to convince a police prosecutor to go to trial is another matter. And it would be hard to offer any further evidence.

Third woman alleges she was sexually assaulted by same man accused of raping Brittany Higgins

A third woman alleges she was sexually assaulted by the same former federal government advisor accused of raping former Liberal staffer Brittany Higgins.

www.abc.net.au

PM 'upset' to learn of second rape claim against man accused by Brittany Higgins

Prime Minister Scott Morrison says he is "upset" to read reports that a second woman was allegedly raped by the same man accused of sexually assaulting former Liberals staffer Brittany Higgins.

www.abc.net.au

 

[sptrawler]

These are the newspaper reports of the other incidents involving Bruce Leherman.
Yes the women made statements and stat decs. But whether these would ever be enough to convince a police prosecutor to go to trial is another matter. And it would be hard to offer any further evidence.

Third woman alleges she was sexually assaulted by same man accused of raping Brittany Higgins

A third woman alleges she was sexually assaulted by the same former federal government advisor accused of raping former Liberal staffer Brittany Higgins.

www.abc.net.au

PM 'upset' to learn of second rape claim against man accused by Brittany Higgins

Prime Minister Scott Morrison says he is "upset" to read reports that a second woman was allegedly raped by the same man accused of sexually assaulting former Liberals staffer Brittany Higgins.

www.abc.net.au

Until something goes to court it is just accusations, the timing and reporting of the accusations becomes very relevant as to the credibility of the accusations and is why judgement is best left to professionals.
If the reports and stat decs were done in a timely manner, with regard to the said incident, it would carry a lot more credibility than if it was made when the Higgins case appeared in the public arena.
There would be a lot of investigating of the incidents, when you consider the high profile and number of people actually investigating Leherman.
There are people who claim responsibility for unsolved murders, yet charges aren't laid, because the said person couldn't have been the perpetrator. But should we throw them in jail anyway, if the media report that the person owned up to it?

It will also be interesting to see if he makes a compensation claim, in light of the current situation and loosing his job.

 

[Knobby22]

Until something goes to court it is just accusations, the timing and reporting of the accusations becomes very relevant as to the credibility of the accusations and is why judgement is best left to professionals.
If the reports and stat decs were done in a timely manner, with regard to the said incident, it would carry a lot more credibility than if it was made when the Higgins case appeared in the public arena.
There would be a lot of investigating of the incidents, when you consider the high profile and number of people actually investigating Leherman.
There are people who claim responsibility for unsolved murders, yet charges aren't laid, because the said person couldn't have been the perpetrator. But should we throw them in jail anyway, if the media report that the person owned up to it?

It will also be interesting to see if he makes a compensation claim, in light of the current situation and loosing his job.

He has a history. If I were an opposition minister I would hesitate hiring him. Plenty of other young blood around. They can sack him for what happened without the rape. He won't get nuffin!

 

[sptrawler]

He has a history. If I were an opposition minister I would hesitate hiring him. Plenty of other young blood around. They can sack him for what happened without the rape. He won't get nuffin!

Again, as with Bas, you are sure he actually did rape all three ladies. But on what do you base that?
Because Brittany took him to court and two other women who knew him then came forward and said he also raped them, when they went out for dinner and drinks?
If people can be convicted on that basis, the criminal system isn't working.
There are several people on the forum, who said Israel Falau would get nothing, time will tell.
I would be shocked, if he doesn't pursue compensation, if he did nothing wrong and it was vindictive persecution, I would be very surprised if he didn't follow it up.
Time will tell, if he does nuffin, or does something and gets nuffin.
It's certainly interesting and in many eyes he is a rapist at large, so his employment opportunities will be affected as you said you would hesitate employing him.

 

[orr]

Ahhh that memory of Gene Wilder sorting through the bad-ass's of the wild west in Mel Brookes's "Blazing Saddles"; when the 'Kid' goes over the resume' of the next in line and quieries ?? 'you've put down rape twice?...' and gets the answer ...' I like rape'

 

[orr]

What a relief.... Justice is 'served'. In fact it's been whacked out of court and the stadium.

And who wouldn't want to breath these words ; " I'd like to introduce you the latest member of the family and my new son in law, Bruce Lehrmann"

 

[sptrawler]

What a relief.... Justice is 'served'. In fact it's been whacked out of court and the stadium.

And who wouldn't want to breath these words ; " I'd like to introduce you the latest member of the family and my new son in law, Bruce Lehrmann"

Be careful what you wish for, another one from blazing saddles was when the racist sheriff, used the black guy as a hostage and called him a n!gger.
These days he could be held to shame as a racist by the media and their followers, until they watched the show, for themselves.

As for having Leherman as a son in law, I wouldn't be very happy if either my son or my daughter behaved in the manner described in proceedings.

 

[Knobby22]

Again, as with Bas, you are sure he actually did rape all three ladies. But on what do you base that?
Because Brittany took him to court and two other women who knew him then came forward and said he also raped them, when they went out for dinner and drinks?
If people can be convicted on that basis, the criminal system isn't working.
There are several people on the forum, who said Israel Falau would get nothing, time will tell.
I would be shocked, if he doesn't pursue compensation, if he did nothing wrong and it was vindictive persecution, I would be very surprised if he didn't follow it up.
Time will tell, if he does nuffin, or does something and gets nuffin.
It's certainly interesting and in many eyes he is a rapist at large, so his employment opportunities will be affected as you said you would hesitate employing him.

I just said he had a history, he obviously doesn't get on well with the Liberal women in his office.

He won't get his job back with the Liberal Party. I can't see him going to court and have 3 women rock up against him. I didn't realise 2 others also accused him. I just heard he had a habit of feeding women drinks till they couldn't remember what happened.

Anyway to sack him they just have to show he illegally accessed the offices for non work reasons. On camera, open and shut case.

 

[bk1]

Anyway he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law. Whatever that means...

A court of law is all we have.
Unless you propose a Committee of Public Safety, a Star Chamber, a Central Committee, all staffed by goodthinkers just like you

 

[basilio]

There are squillions of people who have committed illegal actions who never get interviewed let alone charged or convicted. That is just the way of the world. To pretend otherwise is a nonsense.

Sexual assaults, particularly by people in positions of power, are the classic case. They are always very hard to prove. When people have enough money, power and ruthlessness they will usually get away with it.

Bruce Leherman is small fry. Just a wanna be politician who seems to have a knack for finding drunk woman who just can't say no to his charms. The big guys in this story are the Liberal political heavyweights who desperately wanted to bury this sordid little story before the stench permeated the whole leadership of the party. That is what political power is all about.

Anyway I'm a great believer in karma.

 

[basilio]

There are people who claim responsibility for unsolved murders, yet charges aren't laid, because the said person couldn't have been the perpetrator

That's a real red herring SP. You must be aware (and if not listen up..) that big murder cases inevitably drag up people who "confess" to the crime. Lot's of strange reasons. Police have to be very careful that they don't get sucked into such scenarios. But that is just the out and out crazies.

However there are also many cases of people confessing to crimes they didn't commit. Why ? Check it out.

Why Do So Many People Confess to Crimes They Didn’t Commit?

From: Vice By Samuel Gross and Maurice Possley This story was co-published with the Marshall Project. “You have the right to remain silent.” If you’ve ever watched any of the tens…

wrongfulconvictionsblog.org

 

[sptrawler]

I just said he had a history, he obviously doesn't get on well with the Liberal women in his office.

Which begs the reason, why would one of the girls even think to be alone with him, while paraletic.

He won't get his job back with the Liberal Party. I can't see him going to court and have 3 women rock up against him. I didn't realise 2 others also accused him. I just heard he had a habit of feeding women drinks till they couldn't remember what happened.

The two others, may well have had sex with him, who knows?
But when they have to prove it was criminal rape, as opposed to just sex, in a court of law it may well make them think carefully.
There is probably many a rampant alcohol induced night of regret, many of us would rather forget.
To change that into rape, jail and a criminal conviction, is another matter.

Maybe there actually does need to be an App, as has been suggested, consensual sex, swipe left, swipe right.
But I think that was shouted down from memory, because if the person was unconscious, it could be frauded.
Maybe put a PIN number attached to it, because ATM if someone wants to say it was rape, it seems as though the onus is on the person to prove it wasn't and that is extremely difficult when it is one word against another IMO.

Anyway to sack him they just have to show he illegally accessed the offices for non work reasons. On camera, open and shut case.

That is very true and correct, but confusing the two issues is another thing.

 

[sptrawler]

That's a real red herring SP. You must be aware (and if not listen up..) that big murder cases inevitably drag up people who "confess" to the crime. Lot's of strange reasons. Police have to be very careful that they don't get sucked into such scenarios. But that is just the out and out crazies.

However there are also many cases of people confessing to crimes they didn't commit. Why ? Check it out.

Why Do So Many People Confess to Crimes They Didn’t Commit?

From: Vice By Samuel Gross and Maurice Possley This story was co-published with the Marshall Project. “You have the right to remain silent.” If you’ve ever watched any of the tens…

wrongfulconvictionsblog.org

Are you saying that all rape cases are bonafide, therefore all rape cases should be just adjudicated, as guilty as accused?
Well if that is the case, it should be treated as a minimum incarseration, if a woman walks into a police station and says I was raped by so and so, he should be instantly incarcerated for a minimum term.
Why bother with the court system?
But obviously your logic thinks that is the way to go.

 

[wayneL]

Are you saying that all rape cases are bonafide, therefore all rape cases should be just adjudicated, as guilty as accused?
Well if that is the case, it should be treated as a minimum incarseration, if a woman walks into a police station and says I was raped by so and so, he should be instantly incaserated for a minimum term.
Why bother with the court system?
But obviously your logic thinks that is the way to go.

Only if they're LNP

 

[sptrawler]

Only if they're LNP

Don't get me wrong, if it was rape, he should be put in the slammer and the key thrown away.
But if you are going to base all your evidence and assumptions on what the media tells you, it just shows how far we have fallen IMO.