Soft dough, I can list many, many examples of incompetence of doctors, as you have listed for alternative medicines. It does proves nothing except there are bad in both.
Atorvastatin side effects include abdominal pain, allergic reaction, back pain, changes in eyesight, cold, constipation, diarrhea, dry eyes, dry skin, flu symptoms, gas, hair loss, headache, heartburn, indigestion, inflammation of sinus and nasal passages, itching, joint pain, leg cramps, muscle aching or weakness, purple or red spots on the skin, rash, sore throat, urinary problems, vomiting, weakness and occasionally liver damage.
If I suffered from any of those and found an alternative that kept my cholesterol levels down, I'd certainly use it - even if it lacked research.
Too many doctors over prescribe. SD, do you have any ideas how this can be combated?
And one a bit more local...
Doctors doling out more opiate drugs
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25300922-23289,00.html
What do they overprescribe? because as you might be aware, there are restrictions placed on prescribing that mean that doctors cannot prescribe certain medicines unless indicated.. so some examples please.
and as for side effects what is the alternative, which is efficacious, that has no side-effects? Please, provide me 1 natural medicine that is clinically proven to reduce cholesterol without side effects, and especially one with the relative risk reduction of atorvastatin.
2 doctors?
please try harder.
Of course there are dodgy professionals in every profession, but to stereotype doctor prescribing habits because of 2 doctors is ludicrous.
Read the articles in my last 2 posts.
I am not a naturopath, and have no idea what one would recommend to reduce cholesterol. If you desperately want to know, go see one for yourself. I simply stated if I was suffering side effects from a drug such as the one you mentioned, and found an alternative that also kept my cholesterol down, I'd use it. Even if it didn't have any clinically proven evidence.
That last 2 posts. 1 was relevant, and the other was from America ( which has totally different health regulations to Australia and so it makes the article irrelevant )
So you are defending naturopathic practices, and admit you have no idea about them.
Interesting, I might save some time, you see I know that natural products are untested, unreliable, and are used inappropriately, I do work in the health industry.
Hi Julia, have noted your comment "May assist in the relief of.........
That has to be stated on these natural alternatives to protect the supplier from litigation if it does not work.
Some things work for one but not others due to imo the genes we inherit.
Some homosexuals can be exposed to HIV/AIDS and never get it.
Some people develope cancer and can conquer it where others can't.
Some people can be exposed to ASBESTOS but never developes into ASBESTOSIS or MELOTHEMIOMA (Ithink that is the way they spell it ).
I was exposed to lots of asbestos in the late 1940's and have carried PLURAL PLAQUES around my lungs for my whole life............
Gav, again, not wishing to in any way malign your g/f's capabilities, you can buy blood pressure monitors at retail these days for home use. Anyone can use them. Probably more complicated to take one's temperature!LOL touchy subject? In fact judging from your reply, you may want to go check your own blood pressure:
You may get someone try to sell you placebos and not do any tests if you seen someone who was not qualified (which is why the industry needs to be regulated), however if you seen my g/f when she was practicing she would have asked you to provide evidence for your high cholesterol (test or letter from doctor) before prescribing what she believed was best (I have no idea what she'd prescribe). As for the blood pressure, she can test that herself (and yes she IS qualified to do that).
Again, I acknowledge that you're not the naturopath here and are probably guessing a bit, but I'm surprised that for the second time you haven't suggested some modification of diet/weight loss in the attempt to control the hypertension.Depending on the client's circumstances the first thing she'd recommend aerobic activity, and maybe a magnesium supplement and/or hawthorn berry supplement - unlike the many GP's whom her clients have come from who end up with side effects from blood pressure meds without even being recommended aerobic activity...
Very, very few medicines make it to market with 'insufficient testing'.Unfortunately their years of training and experience mean little if they prescribe something that has had insufficient testing.
The lives saved by medicines would far and away outweigh any lives lost, to the degree that it's pretty ludicrous to attempt to make this point.You may argue that alternative medicines have not had any testing for efficacy, and I agree with this. However, for prescibed drugs to be recalled shows they have had initally had insufficient testing, and should not have been prescribed in the first place. Unfortunately it is costing people their health, and often their lives.
Yes. When I agreed that GP's have a tendency to over-prescribe, I think I qualified that remark with the explanation that it's pressure of time that promotes this. Doesn't make it good, though.What do they overprescribe? because as you might be aware, there are restrictions placed on prescribing that mean that doctors cannot prescribe certain medicines unless indicated.. so some examples please.
The lives saved by medicines would far and away outweigh any lives lost, to the degree that it's pretty ludicrous to attempt to make this point.
One issue not raised so far is the placebo effect. Research has shown that a third of cases (varies from 0 to 76% depending on the medicine prescribed) people feel better taking a placebo and it has no side effects. Put it on the PBS.
Is the opposite true of natural or alternative remedies?
I believe that if natural or alternative should be regulated then they should be given the same government funding and also placed on the pbs if they have found to have beneficial effects.
If you are interested there was a study done in the US by some doctors called Death by Medicine and it stated that death from the regulated medicine was there 3rd or 4th biggest killer more than heart disease or cancer. If you are interested just google it. Even if you don't believe it or think it happens in Aust. its an interesting perspective.
One issue not raised so far is the placebo effect. Research has shown that a third of cases (varies from 0 to 76% depending on the medicine prescribed) people feel better taking a placebo and it has no side effects. Put it on the PBS.
Cheers
Very interesting thread! Just a couple of things to add-
1. I agree with Julia, that natural products would benefit from more clinical trials. I'm certain that at least some of them work but until they have proven clinical benefit, it would be unwise to swap from a proven medicine to an unknown entity. Some natural products HAVE undergone good clinical trials, such as echinacea, and olive leaf extract. Both have demonstrated clinical effectiveness and I have no problem recommending them when it's appropriate to. (some echinacea studies are positive, some are negative though- so, it's not entirely clear-cut)
3. Finally, the placebo effect. A personal passion of mine. Hopefully one day we can work out just how our brains can bring about physiological change via thought processes (in either direction). The one thing I DON'T like about handing people information on side effects is that a significant number of people go home and literally wait for one of them to materialize! And lo and behold, they get one! Now, often it is a real side effect, but I've had people say things like brand A of drug X makes them feel sick, but brand B of drug X is fine (even though brand A and brand B come from the same factory, made by the same people, possibly from the same manufacturing batch!).
. Research has shown that a third of cases (varies from 0 to 76% depending on the medicine prescribed) people feel better taking a placebo and it has no side effects. Put it on the PBS.
Some natural products HAVE undergone good clinical trials, such as echinacea, and olive leaf extract. Both have demonstrated clinical effectiveness and I have no problem recommending them when it's appropriate to. (some echinacea studies are positive, some are negative though- so, it's not entirely clear-cut)
LOL touchy subject? In fact judging from your reply, you may want to go check your own blood pressure:
You may get someone try to sell you placebos and not do any tests if you seen someone who was not qualified (which is why the industry needs to be regulated), however if you seen my g/f when she was practicing she would have asked you to provide evidence for your high cholesterol (test or letter from doctor) before prescribing what she believed was best (I have no idea what she'd prescribe). As for the blood pressure, she can test that herself (and yes she IS qualified to do that). Depending on the client's circumstances the first thing she'd recommend aerobic activity, and maybe a magnesium supplement and/or hawthorn berry supplement - unlike the many GP's whom her clients have come from who end up with side effects from blood pressure meds without even being recommended aerobic activity...
My doctor was amazed at the results which she could not explain the reason untill I explained to her what I had done. Her answer was if it works keep it up. What a great doctor I have to participate in alternative cures!
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