Where is/can Donald Trump take US (sic)?

[luutzu]

I think you will find it does, as prices of imported goods rise and unemployment falls, inflation will rise. The Fed will want to apply a brake to slow the rate of growth, to stop the economy running away again.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/how-the-fed-raises-interest-rates-2017-12?r=US&IR=T

yea alright, if you put it that way, what he signed does have affect interest rate.

 

[luutzu]

Good points Junior.

I was in US in April for a few weeks and the place is booming.

Especially San Fran, they are calling it a gold rush at street level (tour operators). Black America are shopping, have jobs, real confidence.

You have Amazon which is building a village in Seattle. San Fran has the likes of Apple, Uber, Twitter etc. The “Tech” companies to going to be huge.

Amazon has a chain of supermarkets called Whole Food Markets where probably 30-40% of floor space is meals, pizza, curries, salad bars, roasts, coffee, beer.

Trump doing all this? Who knows

Yea, I heard their gated communities and gentrified places are very nice places to hang around.

 

[Junior]

Anyone with basic experience following stock markets knows that whoever the President/leader/prime minister of the day is has little bearing on where the Index is at.

Again, sheer arrogance and outright rubbish from trump bragging that he is somehow responsible for record highs in US markets. Market was consistently hitting record highs under Obama before trump came into office.

Market is being driven higher by Tech giants who derive much of their growth outside of the US anyway.

 

[luutzu]

Anyone with basic experience following stock markets knows that whoever the President/leader/prime minister of the day is has little bearing on where the Index is at.

Again, sheer arrogance and outright rubbish from trump bragging that he is somehow responsible for record highs in US markets. Market was consistently hitting record highs under Obama before trump came into office.

Market is being driven higher by Tech giants who derive much of their growth outside of the US anyway.

You're right to say that now, but wait 'til the $1.5Trillion tax cuts kick in. Then the "tax reform" 2.0 being proposed by November this year.

They're going to do share buybacks, merger and acquisition, speculate like they got a few trillion to play with.

 

[sptrawler]

Anyone with basic experience following stock markets knows that whoever the President/leader/prime minister of the day is has little bearing on where the Index is at.

Again, sheer arrogance and outright rubbish from trump bragging that he is somehow responsible for record highs in US markets. Market was consistently hitting record highs under Obama before trump came into office.

Market is being driven higher by Tech giants who derive much of their growth outside of the US anyway.

Funnily enough though Junior, when Trump was running for office, the financial gurus were saying there would be a stock market crash if he was elected.

 

[Tisme]

Funnily enough though Junior, when Trump was running for office, the financial gurus were saying there would be a stock market crash if he was elected.

He has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. Everyone knows it, but the small mobs of haters who can't retreat back from their unsubstantiated words just use drama to mask the truth.

https://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stock-market-performance-by-president

 

[Darc Knight]

Some website analyzes Politicians B.S. level. Here's Trump's:

The PolitiFact scorecard

• True27 (4%)
• Mostly True69 (11%)
• Half True88 (15%)
• Mostly False133 (22%)
• False199 (33%)
• Pants on Fire85 (14%)

69% of Trump's statements are mostly false, false, or down right lies

https://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/

 

[bellenuit]

He has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. Everyone knows it, but the small mobs of haters who can't retreat back from their unsubstantiated words just use drama to mask the truth.

https://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stock-market-performance-by-president

Well the chart you posted certainly doesn't show that. In the same period that Trump was in office (the thick blue line), the chart is showing the Dow increased 34.8% under Obama and 34.6% under Trump. So when you say everyone knows that, I presume you mean Trump supporters know that even if the facts tell otherwise.

But even if one were to take the chart you posted and dig a bit deeper, you see that Obama is severely disadvantaged during that same length of time in office as he took over a Dow that was falling and had to turn it around, whereas when Trump took over the Dow was already rising. The first 6 months or so of Obama's first term in office was needed to turn the Down around and get it back to where it was when he took over. The following chart shows that clearly.

It isn't so much the Trump haters not acknowledging the Dow movement under Trump, but the Trump apologists claiming what Trump did is exceptional, when it clearly isn't and then treating the turnaround and long steady climb under Obama as for nought. Remember how Trump claimed all the good economic statistics under Obama were false and inflated by the respective government department, but was quick to claim the veracity of the same data when released after he entered office

 

[Darc Knight]

. So when you say everyone knows that, I presume you mean Trump supporters know that even if the facts tell otherwise.

]

I was reading a communication expert's analysis of Trump's communication skills. She was saying Trump uses the phrase "everybody knows this" (or similar) a lot. She said by "everybody knows this" Trump is generally referring to himself.

She also commended Trump's communication clarity, saying he can communicate with four year olds. Four year olds lol. Explains Trump's supporter base

 

[luutzu]

Funnily enough though Junior, when Trump was running for office, the financial gurus were saying there would be a stock market crash if he was elected.

Thing is, the market will crash because Trump [and Obama] got elected.

Their policies fuel the wrong kind of growth. It's what Marx would call "fictitious capital". i.e. monopoly money.

The real economy is circling the tube. The financial economy rises like water being pumped into a tank... ready to flush everything.

Not saying all corporations out there are crap. Most of them are... and they're way over priced to boot.

Just look at what the market gain consists of. In the US it's the FAANG... Facebook, Apple, google's Alphabet, Amazon, Netflix.

Beside the gov't subsidised data centre and cloud services... that and military/security i.e. spying contract... what are Facebook, google and Amazon's business really? Just information gathering for gov't that's making them any money.

The retailing and marketing, the ads placement. Meh... Most of the ads are just big friends giving money to those who control information.

Netflix is, from news I read a few months ago, is still losing money.

Apple just flogs overpriced consumer products.

And these are the high tech market leaders. So much for growing the economy.

Similarly in Australia... The top 20 companies represents som 75% of the All Ords?

Most of them are the big banks and insurers.... that's not going to end well.



Then there's the real economy... stagnant wages; debt to their eyeballs.

 

[Tisme]

Well the chart you posted certainly doesn't show that. In the same period that Trump was in office (the thick blue line), the chart is showing the Dow increased 34.8% under Obama and 34.6% under Trump. So when you say everyone knows that, I presume you mean Trump supporters know that even if the facts tell otherwise.

But even if one were to take the chart you posted and dig a bit deeper, you see that Obama is severely disadvantaged during that same length of time in office as he took over a Dow that was falling and had to turn it around, whereas when Trump took over the Dow was already rising. The first 6 months or so of Obama's first term in office was needed to turn the Down around and get it back to where it was when he took over. The following chart shows that clearly.

It isn't so much the Trump haters not acknowledging the Dow movement under Trump, but the Trump apologists claiming what Trump did is exceptional, when it clearly isn't and then treating the turnaround and long steady climb under Obama as for nought. Remember how Trump claimed all the good economic statistics under Obama were false and inflated by the respective government department, but was quick to claim the veracity of the same data when released after he entered office

View attachment 89427

Yeah no, that's just trying to make a model fit a premeditated argument, you're not reading the charts correctly. Obama came off a low base that had to correct itself upwards, at worst with with a prolonged dead cat bounce. All the indicators are solid, e.g. a 30% rise in the five weeks around last xmas, and there is not the pall of potential doom on the horizon that dogged Obama.

Why the preoccupation of trying to push everything up against the fence with Trump at the wicket? My bet is that your political party of choice in Oz gets all the plaudits from the hard work of the enemy, but none of the trash?

 

[Tisme]

I was reading a communication expert's analysis of Trump's communication skills. She was saying Trump uses the phrase "everybody knows this" (or similar) a lot. She said by "everybody knows this" Trump is generally referring to himself.

She also commended Trump's communication clarity, saying he can communicate with four year olds. Four year olds lol. Explains Trump's supporter base

Nice try, but you need to hone your third person skills DK. By your own admission if a four year old can understand Trump what does that say about you guys?

Stand aside worthy adversary !

 

[IFocus]

Well the chart you posted certainly doesn't show that. In the same period that Trump was in office (the thick blue line), the chart is showing the Dow increased 34.8% under Obama and 34.6% under Trump. So when you say everyone knows that, I presume you mean Trump supporters know that even if the facts tell otherwise.

View attachment 89427

Can we also add $1.5 trillion Trump has thrown at business that the US punters are going to have to pay for some time?

Trump is a genus.......and still a criminal.

 

[bellenuit]

Yeah no, that's just trying to make a model fit a premeditated argument, you're not reading the charts correctly.

Well Yes. I am reading the charts correctly. Move your cursor over the end of the blue line that represents Trump's time in office (the 20 month mark) and read the figures shown. Obama 34.8 and Trump 34.6

This is YOUR chart that you used to falsely claim Trump has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. Or should I be following Trump's dictum. Don't believe what you see. Don't believe what you hear.

Obama came off a low base that had to correct itself upwards, at worst with with a prolonged dead cat bounce. All the indicators are solid, e.g. a 30% rise in the five weeks around last xmas, and there is not the pall of potential doom on the horizon that dogged Obama.

Why the preoccupation of trying to push everything up against the fence with Trump at the wicket? My bet is that your political party of choice in Oz gets all the plaudits from the hard work of the enemy, but none of the trash?

This is simply nonsense. My political opinions have not come into this. I just simply showed you the figures from the chart you posted and it showed your contention to be wrong.

If you are saying I am reading the chart incorrectly, please indicate from the chart:

% increase in Dow during the 20 month period that Trump was in office
% increase in Dow during the first 20 months Obama was in office.

 

[Tisme]

Well Yes. I am reading the charts correctly. Move your cursor over the end of the blue line that represents Trump's time in office (the 20 month mark) and read the figures shown. Obama 34.8 and Trump 34.6

This is YOUR chart that you used to falsely claim Trump has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. Or should I be following Trump's dictum. Don't believe what you see. Don't believe what you hear.



This is simply nonsense. My political opinions have not come into this. I just simply showed you the figures from the chart you posted and it showed your contention to be wrong.

If you are saying I am reading the chart incorrectly, please indicate from the chart:

% increase in Dow during the 20 month period that Trump was in office
% increase in Dow during the first 20 months Obama was in office.

So by your own admission Trump is at least as good as Obama? (34.6 vs 34.8?)

 

[bellenuit]

So by your own admission Trump is at least as good as Obama? (34.6 vs 34.8?)

Its your statement that is in question. He has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. You were clearly wrong on that based on the chart you posted.

 

[Tisme]

Its your statement that is in question. He has a better record than Obama when it comes to Dow. You were clearly wrong on that based on the chart you posted.

No I stick to my assessment as previously stated. You can't deny the winner and record setting of a track and field race based on the past performance of another race. This isn't even a tag team, because the previous runner is bad mouthing and trying to sabotage the current runner.

~26,700 points is new territory and it was achieved on the back of "expert" predictions Trump would cause slump from the inherited ~19,800 from a predecessor who caused the slump to ~7,950 by being elected heir apparent on a socialist card, but that slump is allocated to Bush instead (likewise Trump gets allocated the gains under his watch, not Obama's).

 

[Tisme]

Could make a movie out of this and/or write a book and also make a quid or two.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/frien...naugh-4th-person-to-rebut-claims_2668653.html

 

[Junior]

Performance of the DOW whilst in office is a near irrelevant measure, if trying to assess the success of a Government.

It doesn't take a great leader to approve a massive increase in Govn't spending (using borrowed money), or the commencement of a new QE program, or slashing company tax rates. These things can all buoy markets, but do not indicate quality leadership.

Furthermore there are many, many factors outside the Governments control which move markets. Interest rates and events happening outside the US, for example. A large proportion of DOW listed companies derive much of their profits outside of the US, in any case.

 

[Tisme]

Performance of the DOW whilst in office is a near irrelevant measure, if trying to assess the success of a Government.

It doesn't take a great leader to approve a massive increase in Govn't spending (using borrowed money), or the commencement of a new QE program, or slashing company tax rates. These things can all buoy markets, but do not indicate quality leadership.

Furthermore there are many, many factors outside the Governments control which move markets. Interest rates and events happening outside the US, for example. A large proportion of DOW listed companies derive much of their profits outside of the US, in any case.

So Obama and his $1.5 trillion deficit followed by 3 years of $1 trillion doesn't figure? Pump priming is ok for democrats but not republicans?