Whale wars

[Sdajii]

You actually eat cat? Where do you get this cat meat from? Do you have a pile of flea-collars in your recycling bin, or is there perhaps an Asian cuisine store that has it? We all know what goes into Chinese take out, after all

Honestly, I've never seen cat meat, ever, anywhere!

Not often, but every chance I get (well, not every chance, I mean, I don't typically go galloping towards every cat I see on the street, but within reason...). I've never actually cooked cat myself (well, I vaguely remember helping to cook one, I think I built the fire and might have poured some oil, even shaken the pan a little at one point). I'm sure you've seen cat meat plenty of times, usually wandering around, sometimes squashed on the road (and typically wasted, left to rot! What a shame!).

If I was going to go for domestic cats, I think the collars would go into the regular garbage rather than the recycling

BBQ cat is the most delicious meat I have ever eaten. As I said, I don't go chasing the cats on the street, but if I'm hungry the thought does sometimes cross my mind! My Asian friends think I must secretly be part Asian :lol:

Back on topic, as I said, the only reason to oppose sustainable whaling is the cuddly factor (unless you want us all to be vegans, in which case I will send you a straight jacket). Strangely, some claim otherwise, so, it would be interesting to pose the question: If whaling was done in a completely sustainable way, with quotas strictly kept to, and it was done as humanely as possible, would you still oppose it?

Those massive predators (I hope I'm now allowed to use the term!) consume a correspondingly massive amount of food, which could otherwise be eaten by a starving human population, not to mention the whales themselves. It seems strange to eat cows, pigs, tuna and oysters, yet say "Oh no, you can't eat a whale". Similarly, it seems strange that people have such an aversion to eating animals such as horses, yet gobble down steak, chops and sausages made from other animals of the same paddock. Similarly, it is amazing that people will tuck into their prawns and oysters, yet all but vomit at the thought of eating beetles or grasshoppers (both of which are also delicious!).

In a world full of starvation, it seems odd to have a "Steak and three vegetables is as adventurous as my diet gets" attitude. There is a whole world of cullinary adventure if you want to take off your blindfold.

 

[Timmy]

In a world full of starvation, it seems odd to have a "Steak and three vegetables is as adventurous as my diet gets" attitude. There is a whole world of cullinary adventure if you want to take off your blindfold.

Bit off topic, but I think solving, or even understanding, the issues of "a world full of starvation" are only tenuously, if at all, related to an unadventurous attitude to diet.

 

[Logique]

Side with Nioka on this.

The protesters actions are tantamount to eco-terrorism. Patiently we wait for the Rudd government to denounce them, but the denunciation doesn't come. So now the question must be - is this state-sponsored eco-terrorism?

Now if they were Chinese whaling ships - it might be different. And the harrassment of the Japanese over whaling probably plays pretty well in Beijing.

 

[Happy]

If we cannot beat them why don’t we join them, catch all the whales in our territorial waters and sell them to Japanese ( of course for scientific purposes ).

If we can sell education to Indians we surely can sell some whales.
With no/hardly any whales left in our waters they can go somewhere else and others can talk and talk and talk on UN meetings regarding whaling.
(With this little issue fixed, our politicians can do some real work and fix few things at home)

There were few comments that unchecked population of anything will lead to overpopulation (looks that we are not immune to this disease either), so in my opinion some whaling is OK as well as culling wombats, kangaroos, crocodiles, camels, brumbies and few other things like flying foxes, many parrots and list goes on…

 

[Wysiwyg]

There were few comments that unchecked population of anything will lead to overpopulation (looks that we are not immune to this disease either), so in my opinion some whaling is OK as well as culling wombats, kangaroos, crocodiles, camels, brumbies and few other things like flying foxes, many parrots and list goes on…

What a terrible fate having a human being decide whether another animal lives or dies. Cover my face as the animals die.

 

[Happy]

What a terrible fate having a human being decide whether another animal lives or dies. Cover my face as the animals die.

Well, we don't have to, but over-population of anything means slow hunger death, so all we do is try to help.

I may add that not all our decisions time proved correct, but we try our best, at least we say we do

 

[drsmith]

BBQ cat is the most delicious meat I have ever eaten. As I said, I don't go chasing the cats on the street, but if I'm hungry the thought does sometimes cross my mind!

If you catch one that way it would be worth giving the olympic track and field selection panel a call.

 

[nunthewiser]

Anyone tried Dolphin ?

 

[Smurf1976]

You're not serious, surely?

A trade boycott on Japan? Have you any idea how many other countries around the world would be brought to their knees? 75-80% of the vehicles on the road in New Zealand come from Japan. The 2nd highest consumer of seafood in the world per capita is Japan and they import most of it....I could go on.

Nice idea but lets be pragmatic aye?

Indeed it would impact other countries. But the impact on Japan would be absolutely greater than on anyone else - Japan is very dependent on trade and is essentially stuffed without it. Give it a week or two and we'll see the Japanese at the negotiating table and that's the end of whale wars.

I doubt that too many cars in NZ couldn't be made to last another week or two. And most things destined for Japan could be held in storage then shipped when the boycott ends. We're talking about something that would almost certainly be finished in a matter of a few weeks at most - I just can't believe the Japanese would be prepared to wreck their entire country for the sake of a few whales that most don't eat anyway.

The point of any such action however isn't about saving the whales. It's about enforcing international law if Japan is in fact breaking such laws.

Boycotting Iran, Iraq or any other ME oil producer is arguably somewhat more serious for the world than boycotting Japan. Plenty of non-Japanese car manufacturers and consumers but there aren't too many sources of crude oil. That hasn't stopped action against Iran in the past, and nor did it stop a war in Iraq.

 

[IFocus]

The discussion about whaling is usually an emotional one and so it should be.

Seems the kill every thing for food mob are alive and ignorant. Sorry but you were born a century or two to late.

The hunting of whales by the Japanese is largely symbolic as is the protest against whaling.

Both sides have their own agenda little of which has been discussed here already.

As for those who want to kiss Japanese butt and pontificate the food aspect I envy that you must be blissfully unaware of their record on the destruction of any number of wild fish stocks in many fishery's around the globe.

This often with the complicit approval of the Japanese government.

Humor me and google "fish stocks depletion" or collapse fish or what ever then find some thing that says every thing about our oceans, eco systems, etc is just fine.

The general trend for wild fish depletion is down horribly down and this couples with the eventual break down of marine eco systems as the global human population and technology to catch fish expands at an ever increasing rate.

The end game for the human species is deeply connected with the earths oceans.

There is a heavy debate within the green movements as to the value of whale protests that try to connect to the general issue of the global oceans health.

The continued expansion of human populations and increase impact on the natural resources around us will eventually choke the environment that sustains our existence. This is coming sooner rather than later.

Whats the answer? I don't know, but I do know the numbers are very depressing.

Will the protests in the southern ocean fix / solve the problem?

I think its unlikely but I fully endorse and support those with the courage and balls to have a go and be the sight ray of hope for the future generations.

 

[Dowdy]

So, according to you and others like you, humans are an unnatural species who are somehow remote and removed not only from nature, but from the entire evolutionary cycle?




I don't thnk so.

I don't think so either because now you're just putting word in my mouth to suit your weak argument

 

[CanOz]

:iagree: with iFocus

Your a good man Focus!

The Japanese are not my favorite at the moment.

CanOz

 

[Calliope]

The point of any such action however isn't about saving the whales. It's about enforcing international law if Japan is in fact breaking such laws

I suggest you get this point right before you start talking about boycotts. If Japan (or Norway or Iceland) are breaking any International Laws, it is strange that the countries that object to people eating whale meat haven't taken them to the International Court, instead of threatening to. Maybe it's because they haven't got a case.

A trade boycott of Japan is just nonsense. An embargo on the export of our raw materials to Japan would harm us far more than it would harm them. And what would it achieve? You say it is not about saving the whales. Is it then because they are operating in waters over which we have a dubious claim?

 

[Garpal Gumnut]

Most countries only obey international laws when it suits them.

the EU is having problems with member nations like Ireland and France who flout decisions made in Brussels.

The Chinese and Japanese just use international laws when it suits them.

The US and Australia are no different.

International Laws are a crock of **** and matter little in the course of events.

If international laws cannot prevent war in Darfur or the exploitation of Pakistani workers in the emirates, how on earth can they protect whales in the Antarctic.

I can see where the Greens and Sea Shepherds are coming from. direct action is the only option.

gg

 

[Calliope]

I can see where the Greens and Sea Shepherds are coming from. direct action is the only option.

A belief that whales are sacred creatures, or a hatred of the Japanese does not justify hooliganism on the high seas.

 

[Smurf1976]

Keep going and by 2050 it will have sorted itself out. Nothing left to catch, and not many humans left to do any catching.

 

[Calliope]

In Queensland the fruit bat is revered as a cute cuddly protected critter by some and reviled by others as a pest.

In New Caledonia it is loved by everybody and is featured on the menus of restaurants in Noumea. I believe it is good tucker.

It just goes to show that what is sacred to some is just a meal to others.

 

[GumbyLearner]

Same message should go to the Japanese paper companies and the foreign pines planted in Australia that have exterminated Koala habitats in th e past. Emphasize peace as much as you want in Japan and get David Suzuki (the state supported Canadian apologist know-it-all) to make as many docos as he wants about nature. But in the end you have killed too many Koalas. What a smokescreen! Japanese people buy Whale burgers at Fast food joints in Japan and that has not changed! PEACE where??? In Japan??? What about the rest of the world? Self-centered dork consumers.

 

[gav]

"Japan is Australia's largest export market, accounting for $52.6 billion in 2008–09"

http://www.innovation.gov.au/Section/AboutDIISR/FactSheets/Pages/Australia'sExportsFactSheet.aspx

And the basket weavers wonder why our govt does nothing...

 

[GumbyLearner]

Wow a townsvillian thinks a country which had two nuclear bombs dropped on it should, "apologised for atrocities in WW2".

I agree GG.

The Japanese government should have apologised by now for past atrocities.
Hirihito and his vassals should have been held to account for what happened.
It's also important to remember that Japan only surrendered after the 2nd Atomic Weapon was dropped. Which is quite mad in itself if you take a minute to think about it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_war_crimes

The Japanese military during the 1930s and 1940s is often compared to the military of Nazi Germany during 1933–45 because of the sheer scale of suffering. Much of the controversy regarding Japan's role in World War II revolves around the death rates of prisoners of war and civilians under Japanese occupation. The historian Chalmers Johnson has written that:

It may be pointless to try to establish which World War Two Axis aggressor, Germany or Japan, was the more brutal to the peoples it victimised. The Germans killed six million Jews and 20 million Russians [i.e. Soviet citizens]; the Japanese slaughtered as many as 30 million Filipinos, Malays, Vietnamese, Cambodians, Indonesians and Burmese, at least 23 million of them ethnic Chinese. Both nations looted the countries they conquered on a monumental scale, though Japan plundered more, over a longer period, than the Nazis. Both conquerors enslaved millions and exploited them as forced labourers—and, in the case of the Japanese, as [forced] prostitutes for front-line troops. If you were a Nazi prisoner of war from Britain, America, Australia, New Zealand or Canada (but not Russia) you faced a 4% chance of not surviving the war; [by comparison] the death rate for Allied POWs held by the Japanese was nearly 30%.[18]

According to the findings of the Tokyo Tribunal, the death rate among POWs from Asian countries, held by Japan was 27.1%.[19] The death rate of Chinese POWs was much higher because—under a directive ratified on August 5, 1937 by Emperor Hirohito—the constraints of international law on treatment of those prisoners was removed.[20] Only 56 Chinese POWs were released after the surrender of Japan.[21]

There is also the issue of "Comfort Women" many of whom were Korean and were raped. A formal apology and offer of compensation has not eventuated and many of these terrorized victims have now passed away.


There is also the Rape of Nanking to consider.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanking_Massacre

The Nanking Massacre or Nanjing Massacre, also known as the Rape of Nanking, refers to a six-week period following the Japanese capture of the city of Nanjing (Nanking), the former capital of the Republic of China, on December 9, 1937. During this period, hundreds of thousands of civilians were murdered and 20,000–80,000 women were raped [1] by soldiers of the Imperial Japanese Army.[2][3] The massacre remains a contentious political issue, as various aspects of it have been disputed by some historical revisionists and Japanese nationalists,[3] who have claimed that the massacre has been either exaggerated or wholly fabricated for propaganda purposes. As a result of the nationalist efforts to deny or rationalize the war crimes, the controversy created surrounding the massacre remains a stumbling block in Sino-Japanese relations, as well as Japanese relations with other Asia-Pacific nations such as South Korea and the Philippines.

The prayer and worship of war criminals recently by former PM Koizumi at Yakusuni shrine has also opened many old wounds and bad memories for many who suffered under a nationalistic expansionist regime.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junichiro_Koizumi

Recently the Japanese government has tried to lay claim to the Dokdo Islets and its surrounds in the East Sea. Through dodgy historiography revisionism they claim the islands as Takeshima as their own sovereign territory. The photo of the Islets appears on many Japanese Public School History textbooks with the title Takeshima. Even though there are numerous primary evidence historical sources centuries old authored by Japanese historians that the islands are Korean territory.

IMO the Australian government should make it very clear what are the territorial waters of Australia. And prevent the plunder of our territorial waters by Japanese whaling boats.

Anyway back to the basket-weaving.