Japanese Whaling

[Pat]

If you were a(living) krill you would think of a whale as a predator. I,ve seen all sorts of things taken from whale stomachs from sea birds to herrings. Sperm whales are certainly predators. As for a shortage of krill they are being harvested in large quantities and like the fish stocks are being depleted.
Also if the apex predator is healthy then it is probably Ok to harvest some.
In a world where food is going to be in more and more demand and climate change reducing production, each whale will be looked at as 10 tonnes of meat and 8 tons of edible oil plus some other byproduct stock food ingredients.
As for possums, if you were a fruit grower you would not consider them endangered. They only seem that way because they mostly come out after dark and most people seldom get to see them.
Green peace like to show the killing of whales as very cruel. Most times the explosive charge in the harpoon head which explodes in the whale shortly after impact, means instant death. In the event that it does not happen then a second "killer" shot is fired. Of course there is blood in the water as there is blood in any abattoirs.
( I worked at whaling stations in the 50s for several seasons and do not apologise for the fact.)

Yes it is certianly in the beholders eye.
However I certainly don't like to live in a world where we are depleting our natural resources just to survive today. IMO we humans are smarter, and, more capable of a much better outcome for now and the future.
We are now educated enough to understand the consequences of our actions, well some of us are. Would you now, knowing what you know, work in a whaling station today?

 

[Kathmandu]

If only more people had balls like Capt. Paul Watson.

http://www.seashepherd.org/crew-watson.html

His organisation are the only ones that I know off who actually do anything to stop whaling.

http://www.seashepherd.org/

He was one of the founding members of Greenpeice, but was disheartened with their all talk-no action approach and collection of money to pay wages.

He set up Sea Sheperd and did something about stopping the slaughter.

EG: SS stopped the Icelandic whaling fleet by going into Iceland and sinking the fleet while at anchor so as not to endanger life.

http://www.seashepherd.org/whales/whales_SSCS_history.html

They actually offer rewards for info about eco-crime

http://www.seashepherd.org/rewards.html

I tip's me hat to the likes of Paul Watson and wish there were more like him

Dave

 

[Ageo]

Yes it is certianly in the beholders eye.
However I certainly don't like to live in a world where we are depleting our natural resources just to survive today.

Pat like i said before if they are depleting the numbers then its wrong, but if they are only harvesting a sustainable qouta (meaning it wont effect the population) then i see nothing wrong with it.

 

[Who Dares Wins]

If only more people had balls like Capt. Paul Watson.

http://www.seashepherd.org/crew-watson.html

His organisation are the only ones that I know off who actually do anything to stop whaling.

I tip's me hat to the likes of Paul Watson and wish there were more like him

Dave

Well Dave I think Paul Watson of Sea Shepard ought to be stopped then hung, drawn and quartered.

Lets face it the guy is just a renegade troublemaker of international proportion.

What he is doing by ramming ships on the high seas is commonly known throughout the world as Piracy. If I were to register a ship in any country I can think of and then carry out actions such as his I would expect severe legal consequences - how he has not already been called to order is beyond me.

We can only hope for the safety of all seafarers that he is removed in the future.

And you know at the end of the day:

WHALES ARE FISH TOO!

 

[Stan 101]

WHALES ARE FISH TOO!

In all fairness, whales may just be mammals, not fish..


cheers,

 

[BIG BWACULL]

Well Dave I think Paul Watson of Sea Shepard ought to be stopped then hung, drawn and quartered.

Lets face it the guy is just a renegade troublemaker of international proportion.

What he is doing by ramming ships on the high seas is commonly known throughout the world as Piracy. If I were to register a ship in any country I can think of and then carry out actions such as his I would expect severe legal consequences - how he has not already been called to order is beyond me.

We can only hope for the safety of all seafarers that he is removed in the future.

And you know at the end of the day:

WHALES ARE FISH TOO!

Actually whales arent fish they are mammals like us Breathing in the same toxic air we do, Go Doctor watson, At least someones having a go instead of turning a blind eye, After all for every ONE that is caught or sunk i'm sur there are hundreds flying under the radar, Sink Em All I say

 

[Mrs Mackie]

What really really really makes me mad is that they travel half way around the world to kill the whales in our waters. If they want to eat whale then well fair enough but they should keep to their own national waters and not plunder the resources of other countries. The fact is Aust and NZ make a lot of tourist dollars from whale watching so why should those businesses and tourism suffer because Japanese want to eat whale. Eat your own bloody whales and leave ours alone! Norway still cull whales too, but at least they keep it to their own waters and don't affect other stocks or other countries resources.

On the eco note, apparently krill and plankton are the basic food source for most of the oceans life, and they in turn depend on whale poo to survive. So take away the whales -> less poo -> less krill -> less ocean life. Whales are only doing what comes naturally and they (unlike humans) are a necessary part of the marine ecosystem.

I can't understand how any country can't realise that if you deplete your natural resources due to greed etc you will stuff the whole system up and be worse off in the end. Stupid stupid stupid.

Anyway, I heard that the majority of whale meat ends up as pet food and the Japanese just keep whaling because of pride issues ie they won't let other countries tell them what they can and can't do.

 

[BIG BWACULL]

In all fairness, whales may just be mammals, not fish..


cheers,

Hey that was my line
First in best dressed

 

[Kathmandu]

What he is doing by ramming ships on the high seas is commonly known throughout the world as Piracy

Funny you should mention that.

The ships they sunk in Iceland had no registration , no home port and no documentation on them whatsoever.

They had no existence, so how could he have sunk them.

They were "Pirate Whaling Vessels" and as such, could get no insurance.

No replacement meant no fleet.


His methods while I admit are a bit different, certainly have more effect than the alternative "Stop or I'll say Stop again" approach that is currently used by Greenpeice and Govt.

Also interesting is that while the govt. of the world dont exactly support his methods, some have in the past indirectly supplied food, fuel, and repair facilities for his vessels free of charge via. Naval facilities


Here are some additional teqniques the Japanes fisherman use for Dolphins.

http://www.seashepherd.org/taiji/taiji_ruthless_killing.html

Watch the Video Who Dares Wins, and come back and say that the Japanese fisherman are only killing fish and organisations like Sea Shepard should be stopped.


Dave

 

[Bazmate]

Speaking of marine creatures... It seems to me that the whales aren't doing too bad these days.

I'm a bit incensed about the treatment shown to sharks by some nations fisherpeople. Fancy killing a beautiful creature like that just to take 5% of it's bodyweight to market - It's fins.

In fact most sharks aren't killed when their fins are removed, they drown as they sink to the bottom after being thrown back.

 

[Who Dares Wins]

Dave, you do understand that while the harvesting of whales by Japan has only been common for about the last 70 years the harvesting of dolphins and pilot whales has gone on for many hundred years there, as has the harvest of whales by the native Inuit people in places like Canada and Alaska.

In consideration of the length of time that this has been occurring this would amount to traditional harvest would it not?

I live in New Zealand where we have it rammed done our throats every day to be respectful of other peoples, particularly native peoples, "traditional or customary rights".

Why is it that some people are allowed to catch and harvest these animals, or at least it is perceived to be morally acceptable to do so (the native Inuits), but not so for others?

Either the animals are endangered globally.......or not.

How is it that they are considered endangered for one group of people but not another?

Considering, as I've said, both the Japanese and the native Inuits have caught these aninals for a very long time what would it be that you're using to differentiate between the two groups rights for access?

It wouldn't be race would it Dave, cos you know what thats called...

 

[Who Dares Wins]

In all fairness, whales may just be mammals, not fish..


cheers,

For all the fools out there who sucked it up I am aware that whales aren't technically fish.

The "WHALES ARE FISH TOO" statement is on a T-shirt that was doing the rounds in New Zealand a while ago.

WDW

 

[nioka]

Yes it is certianly in the beholders eye.
However I certainly don't like to live in a world where we are depleting our natural resources just to survive today. IMO we humans are smarter, and, more capable of a much better outcome for now and the future.
We are now educated enough to understand the consequences of our actions, well some of us are. Would you now, knowing what you know, work in a whaling station today?

Yes. Providing I was sure it was sustainable harvesting and was done according to reasonable rules. I,ve also owned grazing properties and see no difference. I am an animal lover but not an animal liberationist.

 

[Kathmandu]

In consideration of the length of time that this has been occurring this would amount to traditional harvest would it not?

No it would not.

Unless of course they use "Traditionall" methods of harvesting, which they don't.

Dave

 

[SevenFX]

I've heard their is another team of SCIENTISTS that are hunting Japanese whalers using harpoon style medical instruments, to study their behaviour pattens in the name of Science.

They will also expand their studies to cover Shark Finn pouchers, and German Sheppard eaters...????

 

[Who Dares Wins]

No it would not.

Unless of course they use "Traditionall" methods of harvesting, which they don't.

Dave

No one else who catches anything under the "traditional or customary" banner uses totally traditional methods - why are you discriminating against the Japanese or for that matter the Norwegians?

Come on, even it up. If you harvest whales its bad, no matter who you are.

 

[Kathmandu]

No one else who catches anything under the "traditional or customary" banner uses totally traditional methods - why are you discriminating against the Japanese or for that matter the Norwegians?.

I believe the link I posted didnt just mention Japanese and Norwegians, so I don't just target them

Come on, even it up. If you harvest whales its bad, no matter who you are.

Absolutely.

Also anyone who uses "traditional or customary" as a reason to take any resource without using traditional or customary methods gets my thumbs down as well.

Dave

 

[Dukey]

Dave, you do understand that while the harvesting of whales by Japan has only been common for about the last 70 years the harvesting of dolphins and pilot whales has gone on for many hundred years there, as has the harvest of whales by the native Inuit people in places like Canada and Alaska.

In consideration of the length of time that this has been occurring this would amount to traditional harvest would it not?

I live in New Zealand where we have it rammed done our throats every day to be respectful of other peoples, particularly native peoples, "traditional or customary rights".

Why is it that some people are allowed to catch and harvest these animals, or at least it is perceived to be morally acceptable to do so (the native Inuits), but not so for others?

Either the animals are endangered globally.......or not.

How is it that they are considered endangered for one group of people but not another?

Considering, as I've said, both the Japanese and the native Inuits have caught these aninals for a very long time what would it be that you're using to differentiate between the two groups rights for access?

It wouldn't be race would it Dave, cos you know what thats called...

I think that in an ideal world there should be no difference in our attitude towards these diff cultures ... BUT comparing the Inuits to the Japanese whaling (or even norwegians) is like comparing apples and .... grapes!
The Japanese whaling fleet are 'harvesting' from all over the international waters - many thousands of miles from home in areas they could never have reached in traditional vessels. AND Japanese have plenty of other things to eat.

From my understanding (correct me if I'm wrong) - Inuits are taking small numbers, close to home and they have few other protein sources. Maybe we (international community) should work on that...

It's also true what was posted previously -by dunno who.
- having spent most of the past 3.5 yrs in Japan - I can vouch that most Japanese are not even the remotest bit interested in eating whale or dolphin meat. Most people abhor the idea - apart from a small number of 'war nostalgics'.
But these folk - as the elders - have political clout in Japan where tradition - is sacred. So they paint whale consumption as an important tradition when it is simply not the case.
Japanese media is also to blame - they invariably swallow and disseminate whatever lies the government feeds them. Resulting in the regular Japanese Joe-blo on the street having no/little awareness of what is really going on...

 

[Happy]

Not to be too blunt meat is meat; otherwise there would not be cannibalistic rituals in some native tribes.

And here real question – can rituals be changed?

These were customary rituals, and as such they do not exist, in theory at least, so any ritual can and should be changed, even wife purchasing.

Traditional, ritual – get real, in 1000 years we will have 31 century, move on people.

 

[Pat]

Traditional, ritual – get real, in 1000 years we will have 31 century, move on people.

But what if there are no whales left? Or particular species of whales? Or dolphins.... Or whatever we humans are making extinct.