Has Kevin Rudd misled parliament?

[Stan 101]

No just send a free pen. Everyone knows they are my personal choice of bribe

Yes you caught me with "I don't use taxpayer funds to do it." I am now tainted with the horror of stan101 corruption. "hypocritical" you might want to look that word up.

You have a unique way of going all over the place with your posts. Am I just tired and your posts coming off weird, or are they just weird?

it's not peronal, just type based on what I see. Much like the print media bagging Rudd.


Why should I look up that "big word"? I've admitted I'm open to corruption in small proprtions. As I mentioned, it's part of captialism. Our Parliment thrives on capitalism. In small proprtions. Please lay out where I have been hypocritical. I thought I was on a common chord.


cheers,

 

[moXJO]

Why should I look up that "big word"? I've admitted I'm open to corruption in small proprtions. As I mentioned, it's part of captialism. Our Parliment thrives on capitalism. In small proprtions. Please lay out where I have been hypocritical. I thought I was on a common chord.

You don't use tax payer's fund to apparently take part in untoward behaviour. You said, look just a few lines above.

cheers,

You are accusing the media of jumping to conclusions, then make the statement above in bold off one line I posted (hmmm see any similarities in jumping to conclusions). No I don't use taxpayer funds to accept free pens, free lunches etc.

 

[GumbyLearner]

I can understand how ALP dudes want to cruise.

But at the expense of the taxpayer, I can't understand why?

Also I could never understand how Johnny bailed out his brother?

Even though the company was useless at making a dollar above the red, it still got bailed out by the Australian taxpayer. Thanks JOHN HOWARD, you paid FOR EVERY ASF SUBSCRIBER



Who said TORIES hated anti-conservative diatribe? Not-me

Give Kev a go, the Liberals in Australia are really hypocrites, essentially they are?

Go and die in the wasteland or vote for TURNBULL!

I don't want to vote for Turnbull after over a decade of Howard!

That's the reality!!!!!

 

[Stan 101]

You are accusing the media of jumping to conclusions, then make the statement above in bold off one line I posted (hmmm see any similarities in jumping to conclusions). No I don't use taxpayer funds to accept free pens, free lunches etc.

Now I am the one who needs to ask... Have you been drinking?

I didn't understand a word of what you wrote..


But anyway, let's hope we have all just seen a lesson in "spin."

Easy to do, no? We both had ample opportunity to retort yet the waters were still muddied.

Imagine what a tabloid or heavan forbid, a broadsheet can do with a one way reparte.


cheers,

 

[GumbyLearner]

Kevin Rudd is a complete softcock.

Seriously I don't think Kevin Rudd could do an 8 hour day non-stop job with 25kg on his back, mind you John Howard could never have carried half that load. If he was willing to do it, I would believe him. But I challenge him to at least try! Come on Kevvy????

But since he is so averse to Aristotle and more agreeable to the likes of Plato, with one tenth of the intellect. He won't be the new Whitlam because he lacks the humanity and understanding of the people he is meant to be representing.

Chardonnay SOFTCOCK! JMO

DYOR

 

[GumbyLearner]

On the other hand

I think the Liberal Party of Australia were complete softcocks too.

They were complicit with Johnny Howard and the Aussie Wheat Boards desire too trade food for um.. Oil or maybe weapons... His family owned a servo in Sydney that's why Torie voters loved him so much! They loved success!

Now that Krudd has done a deal with his car dealer friends, Wayne Swan might get an inground pool built at the back of his house and refuse to pay the completion costs.

Who really cares?

Seriously who cares?

The key is that all these people could not give a living **** about you or me.
So it's a WOFTAM to worry about either of them!

What a waste of thread space!

 

[Tink]

The Liberals havent stopped whinging and moaning since they lost the election

like John Howard did nothing wrong?

Oh please....

LOL @ Gumby

 

[Quincy]

Mr Tanner said Mr Turnbull has been telling journalists that he has a copy of an email which shows Prime Minister Kevin Rudd lobbying for Ipswich car dealer John Grant, who was seeking assistance under the $2 billion OzCar vehicle financing scheme.

Are Lindsay's claims correct ?
Is Malcolm just stirring the pot ?
Is Malcolm delaying the release of the "said" E-mail to allow Kevin to further incriminate himself ?
Is it all just one big "beat up" ?

http://www.businessspectator.com.au...-Turnbull-to-show-evidence-T6JZM?OpenDocument

Business Spectator - 4:08 AM, 20 Jun 2009

 

[knocker]

Not at all. He is the best PM we have ever had.

 

[Quincy]

Keep digging Quincy - so far no documents from Krudd? So far looks like the treasury official may be left to carry the blame (if there is any)?

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/827872/newspaper-publishes-ozcar-leaked-email

06:05 AEST Sat Jun 20 2009


Newspaper publishes OzCar 'leaked email'

Emails alleging the Prime Minister's office tried to help Ipswich car dealer John Grant secure a taxpayer-funded loan from the $2 billion OzCar vehicle financing scheme have been published in a Sydney newspaper.

Senior Treasury official Godwin Grech, who is in charge of the OzCar scheme, told a Senate inquiry on Friday he had been approached by the Prime Minister's office about Mr Grant's needs.

He said he thought there had been an email which confirmed the request, but then told the committee it was possible his memory was faulty.

Prime Minister Kevin Rudd has repeatedly denied he or his office tried to help Mr Grant secure a government-backed loan. (Read more: Rudd orders inquiry)

On Saturday News Limited's The Daily Telegraph published emails it says were sent by Andrew Charlton, Mr Rudd's senior adviser, to Mr Grech.

A February 19 email from Mr Charlton to Mr Grant reads:

"Hi Godwin, the PM has asked if the car dealer financing vehicle is available to assist a Queensland dealership, John Grant Motors, who seems to be having trouble getting finance.

"If you can follow up on this asap that would be very useful. Happy to discuss. A."

In an alleged reply sent by Mr Grech on February 23 to Treasurer Wayne Swan and Department Liaison Officer (Economic) Andrew Thomas, Mr Grech reports on his progress.

"Andrew, as promised, I raised the case of John Grant with the CEO of Ford Credit, Greg Cohen, during my meeting with Ford Credit in Melbourne today.

"Cohen gave me an undertaking that Ford Credit will actively look at taking Grant on.

"John Grant called me earlier this afternoon (from Auckland) to say that Ford Credit had been in contact with him after my meeting."

An undated email, also allegedly sent by Mr Grech to Mr Swan and Mr Thomas, expresses concerns.

"Andrew, I told Grant to keep in touch and to let me know if Ford show concerns or resistance (I will not speak with Ford again on this unless it is absolutely necessary to push it through)," Mr Grech reportedly wrote.

"He also said that he wants to come to Canberra to meet me (and I assume you). Although I said nothing, I don't think that would be a good idea until this is settled. Godwin."

Mr Thomas thanked Mr Grech in a responding email.

"Great work," the email read.

"Just so you are aware, these emails are also going to the Treasurer's home fax. Cheers, Andrew.

Opposition Leader Malcolm Turnbull has called on Mr Rudd and Mr Swan to justify their actions over links to Mr Grant or resign.

 

[Calliope]

Utegate bears a striking resemblance to Watergate where personal assistants were prepared to engage in lies and deceit to protect their boss, knowing that if their boss went down they would go down too. Rudd's assistants have a history of lying on other issues.

Where is "Deep Throat" when you need him?

 

[Gamblor]

Jeez you guys have too much time on your hands.

Who cares

 

[moXJO]

Now I am the one who needs to ask... Have you been drinking?

I didn't understand a word of what you wrote..


But anyway, let's hope we have all just seen a lesson in "spin."

Easy to do, no? We both had ample opportunity to retort yet the waters were still muddied.

Imagine what a tabloid or heavan forbid, a broadsheet can do with a one way reparte.


cheers,

You accuse me of taking bribes by twisting my post and jumping to conclusions from one line of my post. Yet you complain everyone else does it (jump to conclusions) in the media. You even started another thread on it.
So in point form to slow it down

* You accuse media and board members of jumping to conclusions and no proof (except the fact it's sitting in his driveway and his mate has a massive favor loan)
* You condone corruption
* You jump to conclusions and accuse me of corruption, which is in itself hypocritical
* We both get more confused

The Liberals havent stopped whinging and moaning since they lost the election

like John Howard did nothing wrong?

Tink wrong is wrong. While I don't like the majority of what Rudd stands for and am biased, you don't excuse one side or another for dodgy dealings. If you let these things slide, they all think they can dip into our money for their own benefit. It goes on enough already. And having an 'it's fine everyone does it from time to time' attitude just reinforces the idea that they will get away with it. After a while it starts getting out of control.

While you can never stop it, you can at least punish those caught enough to scare the others. People being complacent and turning a blind eye is how we end up living knee deep in corruption. "Everyone does it" is not an excuse and people should expect more from their MP's.

 

[Tink]

I know your biased - I just hope you would be jumping up and down and demanding the same if it was the Liberals on the line..

I will sit on the fence on this one until I see some proof, if there is any...

 

[rederob]

Howard simply refused to be put in the firing line, and made his staff scapegoats when the going got tough. He even let his most senior advisor and good friend fall on his (Howard's) sword when evidence that tested his credibility got too close for comfort.

Rudd has made several statement in the House about what he knows, and what his staffers advise. He has had his Departments search for the smoking guns that now appear in the media. Nothing has turned up. Rudd is now asking the Auditor General to "search".
In this matter Rudd is fully aware that the Senate can probe more deeply still, and that Labor does not have control of the Senate.

The most amusing aspect of this matter is that, for some reason, we are putting aside the millions of dollars of political party contributions that have in the past curried favours, and are now focusing on something that is trivial in the extreme when put into the broader context.

Grant had a right to know about the program which affected his business, and would have been well within his rights to speak to any parliamentarian about it. That MP would have had a duty of care to ensure Grant's request was acted on. Turnbull has turned a right of citizenry into a three ringed circus where he, as Ringmaster, is managing to call the shots. It is an act of great buffoonery where, as the curtain falls, he will be revealed as the Clown he is.

 

[Timmy]

Utegate

Excellent!

 

[kincella]

they have had plenty of time to get rid of any emails, since the matter was raised in the house weeks ago....
were the emails via Telstra ??? and ordered to be deleted from Telstras system ???
oh and a poll todays says 72% believe the PM lied

extract from an article by LenoreTaylor today.(Dont listen to any of the political reporters anymore, since they have all been silent, apart from sucking up to rudd) its only raised here now....because they are finally reporting a negative side.....which should have been the case for the past 2 years

Mr Grech told the Senate inquiry that because the representation had come from the Treasurer's office he had given Mr Grant's case "priority"; he "had the impression (Mr Grant) wasn't your average constituent" and the Treasurer's staff had "made it clear (Mr Grant) was an associate of some type with the Treasurer and the Prime Minister".

And Mr Grant's case got astonishing attention for a small town Queensland car dealer.

Two emails from Mr Grech about the case, released yesterday, were sent to Mr Swan's home fax and to Treasury chief Ken Henry, as well as to senior public servants and ministerial staff. In one Mr Grech mentions in only three paragraphs Ford Credit's need for $500 million of finance to save its entire car dealership business, but devotes 10 paragraphs to whether Ford Credit will take on Mr Grant's business.
And he promises that if Ford shows "concerns or resistance" to taking on Mr Grant he would speak to them again to "push it through".

The government's problems are as much about Mr Rudd and Mr Swan's categoric denials as about what they and their staff have done. This is as much about the obfuscation or the cover-up as the alleged crime - that the government asked public servants to give priority to a prime ministerial friend and political donor.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25662847-5017906,00.html

 

[Quincy]

OzCar emails an elaborate hoax: Rudd

Kevin Rudd has branded leaked emails supposedly detailing his efforts to help a car dealer friend secure a taxpayer-funded loan an "elaborate hoax".

The emails were allegedly sent on Mr Rudd's behalf to Godwin Grech, the head of the Government's $2 billion OZ Car scheme, seeking financial help for Ipswich car salesman John Grant.

They were purportedly sent from the computer of Mr Rudd's senior economic adviser Andrew Charlton to Mr Grech.

But Mr Rudd's spokesman told the Daily Telegraph no such email ever existed.

"We believe the email is fake," the spokesman was quoted by the newspaper as saying.

"The opposition must rule out any involvement in the creation or distribution of this fake email."


http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/827872/newspaper-publishes-ozcar-leaked-email

06:05 AEST Sat Jun 20 2009

 

[moXJO]

I know your biased - I just hope you would be jumping up and down and demanding the same if it was the Liberals on the line..

I will sit on the fence on this one until I see some proof, if there is any...

Can you really tell I'm biased I think it’s more a dislike for the Labor party at present then being a lib supporter. The Libs need to do a lot of work before they become a viable option. My initial issue was more to do with a post trying to condone corruption, not with Rudd being guilty or not.


You are right though more proof needs to come out. And even then no one will care that much.

The most amusing aspect of this matter is that, for some reason, we are putting aside the millions of dollars of political party contributions that have in the past curried favours, and are now focusing on something that is trivial in the extreme when put into the broader context.

Yes, lets take a look at state and local contributions. How about the unions deals as well.

 

[MrBurns]

They should be able to verify if the email is real.

Why not put the car dealer under oath and ask him ? ........oh yeah he's a car dealer and the truth is probably not a high priority for him.

Just because they have no record of it doesnt mean it didnt exist.

Surely Ford Credit can verify or deny this.

If Rudd goes it leaves Gillard, what a freeking choice.