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Combating the Resurgent Taliban

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Are Aussies dying in Afghanistan so that the US can have bases in the back yard of Russia, China and Iran?

All we get told on the news is of a resurgent Taliban. I wonder who is supplying them with the weapons, Osama?




Kyrgyzstan To Set Deadline For Closing Key US Air Base
Last update: 2/3/2009 2:06:18 PM

MOSCOW (AFP)--Kyrgyzstan vowed Tuesday it would order the closure of a U.S. air base on its soil that has irritated Moscow, on the same day it received a generous Russian financial aid package.
The Manas air base serves as a vital supply route for NATO forces in Afghanistan but its location deep in former Soviet territory has annoyed an increasingly assertive Russia keen on restoring its influence in central Asia.
"The government of Kyrgyzstan has taken a decision over the ending of the time period for the American base to remain on the territory of Kyrgyzstan," President Kurmanbek Bakiyev said after talks with his Russian counterpart Dmitry Medvedev.
"The decision will be announced very soon," he added, in comments broadcast on state television. No timeframe was announced, although some reports have suggested the base will be given six months to close.
The U.S. immediately underlined the importance of the base, hoping that it would remain open and calling it "hugely important" for the resupply of U.S. forces in Afghanistan.
Coinciding with the announcement by Bakiyev, Russia agreed to a financial aid package settling an estimated $180 million debt owed by cash-strapped Kyrgyzstan to Moscow.
Russia also agreed to extend an interest free grant worth $150 million to Kyrgyzstan as well as a loan worth $2 billion, Russian news agencies reported.
There was no official mention of a link between the base's closure and the aid, but there has been intense speculation that Moscow has been using its financial muscle to get its way in its former Soviet territory.
The Kommersant newspaper said Russia "has laid down a strict condition: The provision of Russian financial help should lead to an official announcement by Kyrgyzstan on renouncing its obligations on the presence of the U.S. air base."
Bakiyev also said that by contrast the U.S. had been less forthcoming in giving aid to compensate for Bishkek's hosting of the base.
He said that when the base had been set up to assist coalition forces fighting to oust the Taliban from Afghanistan in the wake of the September 11, 2001, attacks it had only been supposed to exist for one or two years.
"Now eight years have passed. We discussed the question about economic compensation more than once with the United States but we did not find understanding," he said.
Medvedev said the base's future was a Kyrgyz issue but that "without this we would be able to join forces to enable a stabilization of the situation in the region."
The base at Manas airport near Bishkek is a supply point for Western operations in Afghanistan and had grown in importance as Washington steps up Afghan operations and faced difficulties with another route through Pakistan.
The importance of the northern route into Afghanistan was underlined as suspected militants blew up a key bridge in northwest Pakistan on Tuesday, suspending a NATO supply line.
"We are hopeful that we can continue our good relationship with the Kyrgyz government, and can continue to use Manas in support of our operations in Afghanistan," Pentagon spokesman Geoff Morrell said in Washington. "It is a hugely important air base for us."
On a visit to Kyrgyzstan on Monday a NATO envoy, Robert Simmons, stressed the base's importance, saying it would be a matter for "regret" if it closed.
Paul Quinn-Judge, an analyst with the International Crisis Group, said that Bakiyev was desperate for aid amid mounting problems, including an energy crisis and declining remittances from migrant workers in Russia.
There is also the prospect of elections due next year but possibly to be held sooner.
"The government is in serious financial straits. It's facing economic crisis.
"Bakiyev is haggling very hard. Quite clearly he needs the money. The unanswered question is how far he's going to be willing to go to get the money," Quinn-Judge said by phone from
 
Who is supplying them with weapons i suspect the australian motorist each time they fill er up. Saudi money has been traced to osamas mates so it wouldnt be surprising if it were going to the taliban as well
 
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/jan/25/obamas-vietnam/
KUHNER: Obama's Vietnam?
Most foolishly, the administration helped to transform the country into a centralized unitary state, where power is consolidated in the hands of a strong president and a vigorous executive branch. The result has been a violent backlash among numerous tribal chiefs and religious leaders.

From its creation in the 18th century, Afghanistan has been an ethnic and linguistic patchwork - more of a fractious collection of bickering warlords and Muslim clerics than a coherent nation. The only form of government suitable to it is a loose federation where economic, cultural and political authority is devolved to its diverse tribal regions and provinces.

The absence of a decentralized power structure is now fueling the insurgency. The country's ethnic Pashtuns, who form more than 42 percent of the population, are seething that the Bush administration decided to prop up President Hamid Karzai's corrupt and inefficient government. Rather than fostering a power-sharing arrangement among the Pashtuns, Tajiks, Uzbeks and Hazara Shi'ites, the United States has put all its political eggs in one basket - Mr. Karzai. But he is not Afghanistan's George Washington. Instead, Mr. Karzai is an incompetent thug. He possesses no national constituency and has failed to impose central-government control over most of its territory. The administrative bureaucracy is a giant parasite, sucking billions in foreign aid - where large chunks are being stolen and siphoned off by greedy apparatchiks - while doing little to build modern roads, schools and hospitals. The Afghan army and police forces are corrupt and ineffective, reluctant to fight the insurgents.

The key to success is not an infusion of American troops; it is the recognition that local warlords - like in Iraq - must be co-opted and given a real stake in Afghanistan's future. The Taliban are hated by too many Afghans to return to power. In fact, a large segment of the Taliban is not even anti-American. They are Pashtun nationalists, who feel marginalized by Mr. Karzai's regime.

Nation-building is not the answer. It is the problem. America has embraced an open-ended, impossible mission. Washington's primary national interest is not to plant modern institutions on Afghanistan's stony soil, but to prevent it from becoming a haven again for Islamist training bases. For this, nimble special forces are sufficient, provided they are nearby and ready to strike.

An interesting read:
Obama and the Graveyard of Empires By GARY LEUPP
http://www.counterpunch.org/leupp12262008.html


Lastly the original and the best. This Article was written before the war in Afghanistan started. Written by Ex-CIA station chief. It is quite visionary to be honest.
Afghanistan Graveyard of Empires
Milton Bearden


In the aftermath of the second British misadventure in Afghanistan, Rudyard Kipling penned his immortal lines on the role of the local women in tidying up the battlefields:

When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains
and the women come out to cut up what remains
Jest roll to your rite an' blowout your brains
An' go to your Gawd like a soldier.
http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20011...bearden/afghanistan-graveyard-of-empires.html
but here is a link to the free copy...
http://www.khyber.org/publications/006-010/afghangraveyard.shtml
 
I would find it very amusing if the Russians did the US their turn in kind, and supplied the Taleban with 1st world weaponry just like the CIA supplied the Mujahadeen with Stinger missiles in the 80's.
 
I would find it very amusing if the Russians did the US their turn in kind, and supplied the Taleban with 1st world weaponry just like the CIA supplied the Mujahadeen with Stinger missiles in the 80's.


I just reread the base closure, the important bit :
http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapcf/02/03/kyrgyz.base/
The relationship between the United States and Kyrgyzstan was damaged when a Kyrgyz citizen was killed by a U.S. airman in December 2006. The airman was transferred out of Kyrgyzstan and the dead man's family was offered compensation. Petraeus said in January the investigation was being reopened.

Bakiyev said in announcing the base closure Tuesday he was not satisfied with the inquiry into the accident and that his government's "inability to provide security to its citizens" was proving a serious concern.

Interestingly the northern neighbour of Afghanistan is closing the base, the Talibans are destroying the eastern supply route (NATO and US) via Pakistan. And the spring is fast approaching....
 
Anyone see the ABC four corners - Taliban invading Afganistan!!
watch it here...

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/content/2008/s2496178.htm

Man - those crazy f@ckers are coming!! and if they get large chunks of pakistan - and it's looking likely - then they'll be EVERYONES problem!!!
- not just the Sri Lankan cricketers!!

I predict USA and allies in Pakistan very soon. And probably, sadly - the sooner the better. There is no choice now IMO. Pakistan military is not capable of handling Taliban.
------------
Another plug - if you wanna get a feel for how they operate read (or watch) 'the kiterunner' - fantastic book, and the movie does it justice.
 
iraq and afganistan dont escape as major causes of america's current economic problems.

wars are expensive.
 
isnt western media great....

whe nrussia invaded afgahnistan, its defenders were called Mujahaddin (freedom fighters)....

when america invades, its defenders (regardless that they are just citizens) are called 'taleban'.....

evil people those 'taleban'. they all but wiped out the opium poppy fields whilst in power. afgahnistans opium crop fell to 10% of usual.

now that the us runs the show, the poppies are back, running at full capacity.


.
 
isnt western media great....

whe nrussia invaded afgahnistan, its defenders were called Mujahaddin (freedom fighters)....

when america invades, its defenders (regardless that they are just citizens) are called 'taleban'.....

evil people those 'taleban'. they all but wiped out the opium poppy fields whilst in power. afgahnistans opium crop fell to 10% of usual.

now that the us runs the show, the poppies are back, running at full capacity.

.

Whether 'constructed' by the never ending manipulations of the world powers or not... they are evil by measure of any society (but their own). and their name is irrelevant.

watch the report. They would have your and my head in a flash - just to scare the bloke standing next to you into submission.

They have been doing this for a long time - while travelling on Turkey about 10 years ago - I saw in the turkish english language newspaper, the case of a man and woman accused of adultery. They were taken into a football stadium at half time and stoned to death. This is how they rule - terrorise the population. then recruit more soldiers for jihad... ie - be recruited - or be killed. not much of a choice.

- Schools destroyed,
- women abused and pushed back to the status of 'baby factory'.

is that good?
or
would you jump on a plane to go live there and bring up your kids?
 
Below is the report from ABC's four corners website on the Taliban in Pakistan.

Watch video interviews on ABC website here : http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/content/2008/s2496178.htm

(I know I really shouldn't post this here - but being that this is such an important issue, AND the ABC is our free national broadcaster AND i have included the link to their site to watch the video interviews etc - I don't think they'll mind. Feel free to remove it Joe if you think it's too much)

I just feel this issue is about to become so big - folks need to get an idea of what is going on over there.... This will be way bigger than IRAQ in my opinion.

ABC1 : Four Corners program
Thank god for 'aunty' - our wonderful ABC at work !!

r341525_1554761.jpg

Pakistan on the Brink

Reporter: Matthew Carney
Broadcast: 23/02/2009

Talk to any major western leader and they will tell you Pakistan is a key ally in the war on terror. If that's true this week the President of Pakistan Asif Ali Zardari had some bad news for his strategic partners.
He told the world his police force and army has been unable to control Islamic extremists in his country, warning Pakistan had under-estimated the strength of the Taliban.

To judge just how bad the situation really is reporter MATTHEW CARNEY has travelled to key areas of Pakistan, teaming up with a senior local journalist to investigate the Taliban's expanding reign of terror.

For much of the past half century Pakistan has seen its major enemy in its region as India. Not anymore. Now it's clear the biggest threat facing Pakistan comes from within. In the past the Taliban and al Qaeda forces have used mountain bases in the north of the country to conduct a campaign of terror.

That campaign involves assassinations, bombings, beatings and the punishment of anyone who does not obey extremist decrees.

The North Western region is not the only area under threat though. Now the Taliban has broken out of its strong -holds in an attempt to take over the country. At the same time Pakistani authorities are providing very little resistance. As Inspector General of Police in Peshawar, Malik Naveed told Four Corners...

"We don't have the resources, our country is a poor country and then our province is one of the poorest provinces in this country. Basically we need bullet proof jackets. We need transport, mobility, proper wireless system and equipment for collection of intelligence, tracking of mobile phones, tracking of vehicles, and aerial surveillance, so that we know what is happening in around the city and the peripheries."

Travelling to Peshawar, the city that forms the gateway to the north-west reporter Matthew Carney found a city under regular Taliban attack. He also discovered quickly it would be impossible to go beyond Peshawar himself. Instead he teamed up with a local journalist who took a camera deep into Taliban territory. There the journalist spent time with a key fundamentalist leader, Hakimullah Mehsud. Hakimullah made it clear that the Pakistani government would pay a heavy price for siding with the United States. He told Four Corners...
"...if the country’s leaders were good we would not have been able to occupy this tribal territory, because of the harsh policy of the government and the army we have had to attack Peshawar ... and every corner of Pakistan."

Perhaps the most devastating insight into the Taliban campaign came in the Swat region. Formerly a holiday destination it is now controlled by the Taliban. There Matthew Carney discovered via his fellow reporter that the extremists had destroyed most of the regions' schools. Under the Taliban's rule girls education is forbidden and women are forced to stay at home. This has effectively shut down local markets. As one child told the program...

"We will not go to school again, even if we are given security because we are extremely scared. The Taliban are warning us they will bomb and destroy our school. The Taliban are very angry , the situation is getting worse every day."

But what is even more worrying is the Taliban's infiltration of Pakistan's biggest cities. Matthew Carney found the capital Islamabad a barricaded city. It is now considered more dangerous than Baghdad. In the huge port city of Karachi its slums have become a breeding ground for Taliban recruits. It was from here that the Mumbai terrorists boarded a boat to launch their killing spree.

In essence this confirms President Zardari's warning that his government is now involved in a life and death struggle with fundamentalist forces for control of Pakistan. The implications of this struggle have profound consequences for the country itself, the region and ultimately the peace and stability of the entire globe. Pakistan has become the next and perhaps most crucial battleground in the war on terror.

Reporter Matthew Carney reports from "Pakistan on the Brink" - next on Four Corners, 8.30 pm Monday 23 February on ABC1. This program will be repeated on Tuesdays at 11.35 pm.
 
Terry Taliban receives a lot of funding from the poppy fields. While theydon't phyisically own or work the fields but by sheer terror tactics they appropriate a high percentage of the money.

So who is funding the Taliban

Every drug addict, dope pusher, corrupt politician and cop throughout the world.

UBIQUE
 
Every Cop ?

Think he meant 'every corrupt cop'...

- but this is about much more than poppies and heroin I think, though obviously - cutting off funds is a major strategy.

It's about an ideology that is violently opposed to just about any kind of freedom you can imagine - except the freedom to blow yourself up for a fairytale god.

An ideology that grows only by intimidation - threat of violence and death.

We are talking Pakistani police officers beheaded and displayed in the town square to keep the locals quiet.

If they - the Taliban - come anywhere near us - we'll wish we had opium to forget our pitiful lives!
 
decriminalise marijuana and let people grow their own backyard stash. get the government to provide free doses of heroin to registered users at shooting galleries with medical and support services on hand. not sure how to handle cocaine, ecstasy and speed, need more input on this.

people want to do drugs. accept it, manage it and move on, then make life difficult for the criminal cartels.

illegal drugs is a BILLION dollar black industry that goes on to finance illegal arms acquisition, terrorism and god knows what else. legislative management will do more than a million dollars enforcement. how hard is it? human psychology is not rocket science.
 
From ABC 6 Mar. 09

POET'S SHRINE BOMBED OVER FEMALE VISITORS
Posted Thu Mar 5, 2009 8:41pm AEDT

Suspected militants have blown up the mausoleum of a 17th century poet revered in both Pakistan and Afghanistan, apparently because women visited the shrine.
The ethnic Pashtun poet, Abdul Rehman, is commonly known as Rehman Baba, and is loved by Pashtuns for his mystical verse.

People regularly go to his white, marble mausoleum on the outskirts of the north-western Pakistani city of Peshawar to pay their respects, but no-one was hurt in the pre-dawn blast.
"The structure of the shrine has been badly damaged but there were no casualties," police officer Zar Noor said.

Militants had warned people to stop women visiting the shrine, a resident told DawnNews television.
Militants have been stepping up attacks in Pakistan in recent years, especially in the Pashtun-dominated north-west.
As well as battling the security forces, the militants in many areas have tried to stamp out what they see as inappropriate practices such as music and dancing.
Radical Muslims such as the Taliban also consider paying homage at graves to be heretical.
- Reuters

Our way of life is in direct conflict with what they want, if compromise is not reached we are in for a bumpy future.

Even is Sydney church was torched only last week or couple of weeks ago.
It could be said well things are torched and few people from Victoria could second that, but if motif was not only to torch.

Remember last year Vietnamese little take away shop owner virtually run out of funds to repair shop as Police did not protect them and because they were selling pork products they were under constant attacks.
Finally they moved out, if this is how things are done in Australia we will be in for a bumpy future too.
 
Lets hope he did .

Thanks Dukey.

Bobby my appologies yes I meant every corrupt cop I have mates who are in the force and know that I respect the often difficult and unrewarded tasks that they perform.

But also given if it wasnt for the poppies they would soon find another funding source. What people cannot comprehend is that we are dealing with extremely dangerous religious fanatics. In some ways you could say a country full of hitlers. Back in 1940 one was hard enough to defeat when you are talking of thousands of Hilters as well as their brainwashed/coerced/threatened followers you will start to see the impossible and unatainable goal that was set when he allies went into the country.

For every Taliban Leader that is killed or captured there are 20+ to take his place.

The solution? Everyone has an opinion but the facts are you will never destroy the Taliban yes we can weaken him but he will always bounce back.

One possible scenario drive them into a few provinces and offer them a deal let them rule their own part of the country ie divide the country. Allow those who have embrassed the new found freedom that they have progressed to in the other half.

Build a berlin style wall between the two sides them use political and trade embargo's to try to get them to soften their stance. It wouldnt take long for the brainwashed followers to realise **** life is better on the othe side of the wall I am going to desert and live the other life.

Take away the follower base and the the Taliban will be neutralised. No Taliban Leader has ever been a suicide bomber, he is happy to sit in his bunker and send other off to die. So we have to start a hearts and minds process on the average follower.

UBIQUE

PS, this is by no means a foolproof answer but it is definately a better answer to the one we have at the moment.

Surely the yanks must realise the hit and retire process along with the accomanying hearts and minds process used in Nam did not work.

They would go in drive the enemy out out the village then retire back to their base.. what happened the VC returned the next day nothing was achieved except those villagers who where deamed to be co-operative with the allied forces were tortured and killed. The exact same scenario is happening with Terry Taliban.

Maybe a return to the sweeping extended fronts of WW1 and 2 are required, start on one border end extend the line drive them backwards and dont stop till you reach the other side. The downside is of course the taxi driver that drives you during the day is the bomb maker by night. but after maybe a few sweeps accross the country will flush them out. Yes it will take yrs but what the we have been in their for yrs now and have acheived bugger all

Enough of my ranting can you tell I have had a bad morning in the markets
 
..

The solution? Everyone has an opinion but the facts are you will never destroy the Taliban yes we can weaken him but he will always bounce back.

..


Not achievable, but if they could have only female children, something would have to change.
 
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