Wellington Capital PIF/Octaviar (MFS) PIF

[Garpal Gumnut]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

I know you guys and girls have been screwed over my Octaviar/MFS.

Many on Aussie Stock forums have similar stories.

To increase the reach of ASF, please consider voting for ASF in a poll being conducted at Compareshares.

A knowledgeable investing community independent of advisers and brokers is a powerful entity.

Here is the link

http://www.thebull.com.au/the_stockies/forums.html

gg

sorry to intrude

lets make sure investors are protected from financial advisers and brokers.

vote for asf, the investors own forum

gg

 

[ian1328]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

You may not like what I am about to say but please at least consider.

Obviously there are problems with the listing of PIF on the NSX - achieving a high selling price especially at this point in time.

Unfortunately many older people have invested way too much of their assets into the PIF and are desperately short of cash flow.

But there could be a side benefit for Centrelink entitlements based on the Income and Assets test.

IMAGINE if someone did sell 3,000 units.
2,000 @ 45 cents.
1,000 @ 15 cents.

The value of everyone's units/share will have fallen to 15 cents - but the NTA is still say 45 cents.

Centrelink will probably value all PIF units at the last selling price say 15 cents.

Everyone's Centrelink assets test and income test will be reduced and I would assume their Centrelink entitlements will increase accordingly.
Regards, RickH:couch

I can't imagine Centrelink revaluing PIF units on one sale of 15c.
No they will only look at revaluing each financial year and who knows, next year it may be more than 45c and entitlements could be less.

 

[Rance]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

You would have thought after the vote that people would have simply got on with life. Like it or not Welllington were succesful and it is now listed. There is no undoing that.

I would think there is no point at all going over what has been talked about to death. Except maybe in weeks, months or years people can come on here and proudly say I told you so.

I agree with Newwwtrader... let's not go around in circles anguishing over whether we (as a whole) have done the right thing. For better or worse, for richer or poorer, the deed is done... We have hooked our future on JH/WC. Only time will tell...

Rance

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

http://www.nsxa.com.au/ftp/news/021720763.PDF
The above link has a document entitled:
Information Memorandum For An Application For Admission To The Official List Of The Nation Stock Exchange Of Australia (‘NSX’)

It was written on the 18th August 2008 and released on the NSX on the 15 Oct 2008.

Here are a few extracts:
Page 2 is a one page address to unit holders from JH
View attachment 24923

From the risk section
View attachment 24924

Here you will be able to see that getting 10,000 units bought back in the buy back is unlikely. JH said to me in her office that everyone would be able to have at least 10,000 units bought back under the buy back. When we said that was impossible she said that due to a lot of people not having 10,000 units that it worked out to be possible and went on to refer to some wiz bang computer program which calculated this . The statement was even made that there are 6,000 unit holders with less than 10,000 units!
View attachment 24921

I think this next one is saying WC have spent the entire $3mill in 4 months and yet the the above document says they only expect yearly expenses to be $1.32 mill. I suppose the forums (in which I consider I was mislead) were not cheap.
View attachment 24925

 

[Jadel]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Now the shocking truth emerges

Investors had better enjoy the dividend they were so desperate to receive at Christmas because it is likely to be the last payment they will ever get

 

[danger danger]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Why do people want to come on here and alarm people.

You didn't listen to JH when she said to us in the forums and EGM? She already said that this year we will be given cash payments totalling 3 cents.

JH has stated we will get quarterly cash payments that will be tax free and that the amount will be something that JH will be proud to anounce. She envisages that this will be the case for some time. Due to the losses incurred in this fund by MFS (not WC), there will not be payments classed as income / dividends for quite some. They are derived from a mix of some income, but mainly capital.

So you are using the same old PIFI scare tactics on here once again by the same old handful, you know who you are and it does not help anyone. I see that one poster on here says that they are still trying to recruit members. Plans for the future etc. Oh please accept your thoughts where not worth a pinch and not adopted by anybody except a hanful. Accept that the money you spent is now lost.

 

[Jadel]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Dangerous

You sound like somebody familiar

If you can not not rely on the written word placed on the statement of admission to the NSX by WC then what in Gods name are investors supposed to believe in ?

Believe me i hope you are correct for all our sakes

 

[CableGuy]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Welcome back Javier/Guesswho/Maveric/Dangler Danger. It was obvious from your second post, but your first confirmed it. I've heard that excessive amounts of glam rock make people agressive...

-----
So what are you doing? Wanna catch a flick?

 

[danger danger]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

And who are you Cable Guy, do I know you?

 

[danger danger]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

You would have thought after the vote that people would have simply got on with life. Like it or not Welllington were succesful and it is now listed. There is no undoing that.

I would think there is no point at all going over what has been talked about to death. Except maybe in weeks, months or years people can come on here and proudly say I told you so.

Bravo, very well said. It's just that some people are bad losers and when they don't get their way they love to come on here as a way of venting their frustration at not being able to get their way to control the fund against the wishes of the majority of unit holders. It's laughable that they just can't let it go. I don't get it???? Please explain. That they reckon that they still have a plan for the future LOL@PIFI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Burnt]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

http://www.nsxa.com.au/ftp/news/021720763.PDF

It was written on the 18th August 2008 and released on the NSX on the 15 Oct 2008.

Here are a few extracts:
Page 2 is a one page address to unit holders from JH
View attachment 24923

Read the evidence of the blatant lies used by JH to con people into backing her plans to have management of a listed fund under her belt......."screw you poor little people - I'm going to get what I want". I know where the money from MFS was spent.......PR.

A few have done their deals with the devil & still do the dirty work under many disguises.
Many were sucked in by the PR and gave in to it.
A few fought to wrestle control of OUR money from the hands of those that have plotted this whole scheme to their advantage.

Every dog has it's day !!!!

$755mil is a sh..load of money & to those that are happy to give it away to con artists, I feel sorry for you.
To those that have done their deals..........every dog has it's day !!!!

The fight will go on. There are many of us that will not walk away from having this much money stolen.

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Why do people want to come on here and alarm people.
...

The current state of the fund is alarming.

...
You didn't listen to JH when she said to us in the forums and EGM? She already said that this year we will be given cash payments totalling 3 cents.
...

The written information we are seeing from WC is very different to what they say in person. I can see why one of the amendments to the constitution was to prohibit recording devices in members meeting.
You must know by know that WC's unwritten word means nothing to me. Some are waiting to see the outcome over the next year or two but there are already countless things that I've been told by WC that I consider to have been misleading or perhaps just mistakes.

...
there will not be payments classed as income / dividends for quite some. They are derived from a mix of some income, but mainly capital.
....

The statement is saying there will be no income payments for the foreseeable future, it's not just the way they are classed. If there are cash payments they will be from realising assets. But there is no mention of any kind of cash payments in the new year. Even saying they hope to provide some amount of quarterly payments would have been nice - i.e. might help to attract buyers.
“This has in turn eliminated any of the Income the Fund currently available to distribute to Unitholders. No Income payments are currently being made nor will they be made I the foreseeable future.”

 

[seamisty]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Hi all positive investors in these volitile economic times. It sure has been quiet on here while I have been away or is it just that I have so many on ignore that I have missed out on all the negative diatrobe LOL!!! I have passed on information regarding my meeting with WC to the majority of investors of the PIF that I am in contact with. I am extremely busy and don't have the time to call you or e-mail you all personally as I have done previously, but would like to reassure any of those I have missed that I am still quietly confident with the path that WC is taking with the PIF. As with numerous other funds and investment schemes, we are at the bottom of a cycle and previous returns are just not going to be forthcoming. For those investors that were new to this fund, you are going to experience a real downside, as are many others in similar schemes. The choice you make as to wether you stay for the long haul or bail out is entirely up to yourselves. If you sell on the NSX and take a loss it is possibly no different to if you had of stayed with the fund and observed the "The risks of investing" page 20 of the last PDS with MFS and experienced a similar downside due to the declining economic market ( even without sticky fingers diping in the piggy bank). If there is any of the half dozen PIFI diehards still beating that poor dead horse skeleton out there that feels inclined to respond to this post, don't bother!! Move on and get a life, this is not the only fund suffering but possibly one of a minority that has a chance of recovering with a dilligent, experienced team determined to work in the best interests of all involved.Cheers, Seamisty

 

[Jadel]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

As I stated previously ,I f you can not believe in the written word what in Gods name do you believe in.

We did not write those words

Somebody at Wellington Capital sat down and thought those particular clauses up in their brain cells for a reason .

What are we supposed to do now ? totally ignore these words as if they never existed !

Would investors prefer that we not bring this very important information to their attention ?

It appears that some people that post on this Forum people would prefer an Action group to be blind deaf and dumb

Any person with half a brain should be asking themselves - why on earth would WC publish something ,that is designed to frighten the living daylights out of investors , including myself at this late stage and only after we have voted.

I can assure investors that I did not get much sleep last night

How many people have entered into a contract with a tradesman based on a verbal understanding because you like somebody and think he is honest and will do the Right thing

If you have the the odds are you have been disappointed in human nature many time as I have

It took me many years to wise up but now I insist on a signed contract before any work is started

It always comes back to what is placed on black and white on a piece of paper with a signature and witness.

I fervently hope as does every investor that we continue to receive a dividend yield

However logic tells me that if this is constantly based on the drawdown of the funds capital it will not be possible over an extended term .

I might add that the PIFI has many investors from all parts of the world as members

We will continue to do everything in our power to ensure that our members are fully informed of the facts.

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Is anyone able to explain why WC said there were only 670,763,860 units in the PIF in the NSX Listing Application on 2 June? http://www.nsxa.com.au/ftp/news/021720762.PDF

The 31 May 2008 balance sheet and the June 30 2008 audit both show there were 755,147,052 mill units in the fund. Why would the listing application dated 2 June 2008 be for 84,383,192 units less than there actually were?

I was thinking it might have something to do with the $81 mill for the wholesale PIF (see Top20) but the listing application mentions this is part of the listing and even states that it represents 10.82% of the fund (which is calculated based on 755 mill units not 640 mill). I was told that WC planned to pay out hardship cases before the listing but it was nowhere near $84 mill. Also based on the percentages in the Top20 document it seems no hardship cases have been paid to date. Can anyone confirm?

I was also told by WC on the 22 Aug 2008 that the number of units had declined since 30 June 2008, unfortunately I didn’t ask how this was possible and it seems it didn’t occur but perhaps it was the plan to offload some units?

 

[selciper]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

If there are to be no income payments in the new year, it is imperative that JH issue a statement to "confirm or deny" this latest rumour IMMEDIATELY. It is impossible to plan anything in the present circumstances - we have been thrown into a limbo world. The uncertainty is a great burden and must be lifted one way or the other.

If the scaremongers are wrong, they also bear a great responsibility and should in future refrain from terrifying everybody. Have they checked with JH?

Repayment of capital or part of, in present economic circumstances, is understandable. Can the AG get an answer on all this?

 

[Jadel]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Selciper

Please ! Read carefully what has been written in my post

We have transmitted to you verbatim the exact words of statement presented to

the NSX by Wellington Capital that is intended specifically for public consumption

Every investor who looks at the NSX will read this

Yes they are frightening words but please do not blame us ,we did not write them .

What we want to know is, why is Wellington capital makeing these statements

 

[DoraNBoots]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

..
If the scaremongers are wrong, they also bear a great responsibility and should in future refrain from terrifying everybody. Have they checked with JH?
..

I am not saying the statements are wright or wrong just posting WC's words because I found them alarming.

The statement was not taken out of context. It was not surrounded by feel good statements where I picked out the bad bits. This was the very first paragraph in a letter addressed to unit holders which didn't go on to mention any benefits to a potential buyer.

None of the selling points that WC used to get people to vote for the resolutions were in NSX document. No mention of buy back at 45 cents, no quarterly cash payments after Dec (the opposite), no mention of adviser committee, no mention of returning any kind of value, let along $1 in 3 to 5 years. JH told unit holders she would do what she can to create a market on the NSX but there is nothing in that document which would prompt people to want to buy in.

 

[selciper]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Jadel -

I certainly don't discount the strenuous research that you undertake - it has often proved to be illuminating. However, we need a statement today from JH. I've tried the hotline (since 9am) and it seems to be very busy. Hopefully the right question is being asked by many.

 

[Jadel]

Re: Octaviar MFS Premium Income Fund PIF

Thanks Selciper

I can assure you we want answers as well .