# Daylight saving Western Australia



## CoffeeKing (23 October 2008)

Watched today/tonight...

Having lived in different states - mostly W.A. - been through all of the last 3 referendums about daylight saving - this time it's a trial and the last year, then, yep! another referendum ( thats 4 ) what are they waiting for... all the old remembering folk to forget...

Extra hour more excercise, extra hour more skin cancers, I don't like it but thats my opinion...

As for the poms on tomorrows show that will leave for the east if it doesn't come in, how big is the boat and how many can it take...

This one docks tomorrow night



If you want daylight saving... go to where it already is


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## Whiskers (24 October 2008)

*Re: Daylight saving West aust*

Hey CoffeeKing, you've stoaked a potential hornets nest here if a similar thread a year or so ago is any indication... but for what it's worth I'm from Qld and I'm not keen on it either. In fact it's a pain in the ass at times.


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## CoffeeKing (24 October 2008)

Probably have whiskers...

Just cannot understand after 3 referendums ( all NO ) - why the trial
wasn't here when it started, NSW at the time, had no choice there.

Looks like I retire to QLD - thats settled then...


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## Smurf1976 (24 October 2008)

It's up to people in WA what they want and if they don't want it then so be it. 

Just like it's our right here in Tas to have brought in this energy saving idea  four decades before energy conservation became fashionable. Yep, another endless argument started by the Tassie power industry... 

In a cooler climate I'd argue it's a great thing for health. The number of people out walking etc in the evenings is very noticeable and it stops the day Daylight Savings ends. Six months later they start exercising again. It might not be so good in a warmer climate though.

Oh well, it seems that NSW, Vic, Tas and SA are now pretty much agreed on how it should work. So maybe it's time for the next round, "Double Daylight Savings". I'm sure we can do some calculations and work out that a few watts will be saved somewhere and some loads balanced etc. Then we can get another 40 years of argument about it.


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## DJZ (24 October 2008)

To be honest, Im against it, theres no point in it in WA, the sun goes down at 8:30 anyway, it just buggers up your natural rythem. 

It takes me forever to get used to it anyway for some reason. 

Although it is good for the stockmarket, opens at 8:00 instead of 7:00


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## IFocus (24 October 2008)

DJZ said:


> To be honest, Im against it, theres no point in it in WA, the sun goes down at 8:30 anyway, it just buggers up your natural rythem.
> 
> It takes me forever to get used to it anyway for some reason.
> 
> Although it is good for the stockmarket, opens at 8:00 instead of 7:00





Feel pretty much the same way, I get up when its light and go to bed when its dark.

Tried previous years of adjusting the hour it just hasn't worked for me I will be voting against.

The Ref wont get up, some one may be able to correct me but I don't think any other state introduced DLS via a Ref

What really riles me about this Ref is that it was stated by that F#%kwit D'Orazio


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## Garpal Gumnut (24 October 2008)

IFocus said:


> Feel pretty much the same way, I get up when its light and go to bed when its dark.
> 
> Tried previous years of adjusting the hour it just hasn't worked for me I will be voting against.
> 
> ...




Perth is full of Irish, Pommies and South Africans, so there are few Aussies left there to maintain the time difference. It is just a matter of time before the time is changed to suit their trading needs.

gg

gg


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## CoffeeKing (29 March 2009)

*It's over*

Normal hours again, even slept in this morning

Leave it to the voters now...

And none of you other, over the border, like the daylight people send in your postal votes


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## togs (29 March 2009)

I'll volunteer to _peacefully_ debate the "Vote No" side, if anyobdy wants to tackle the affirmative!

Daylight saving has been found to increase power use.

Claims that daylight saving reduces energy use will slowly become less relevant as more homes are built with airconditioning. Consider which is more energy efficient:

a) Large office buildings which rarely experience a large fluctuation in temperature and can keep many thousands of people comfortable throughout the hottest part of the day, or
b) Personal airconditioners cooling only a few people and expending large amounts of power to cope with fluctuations in temperature in a small space.

It's not just the amount of electricity we use in keeping cool, there's also the millions of dollars in infrastructure and on-going maintenance spent to deal with peak power -- money spent to deal with the few hottest days in a year, a cost that is increasing as, you guessed it, more air conditioners are installed.

Then there's the human factors. Kids going home from school in the hottest part of the day, no light in the morning for those of us who're up early (people exercising late in day might try the other end of it - not so hot!), and for the rural side of the story, this fellow's got a unique take on it.

If I must take a postive stance, it would be that daylight saving time, to me, actually makes more sense in winter. You still get up in the dark, but there's a bit more light at the end of the day.

Cheers!
togs


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## pilots (29 March 2009)

togs said:


> I'll volunteer to _peacefully_ debate the "Vote No" side, if anyobdy wants to tackle the affirmative!
> 
> Daylight saving has been found to increase power use.
> 
> ...




NZ many years ago started Day light saving, this was to save power, at that time it did save power, I don't know if it still would apply to day.
What gets my goat is they tell us we are short of power and must save it, well if we are short, that is NOT my fault, build more power stations.


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## Smurf1976 (29 March 2009)

Post-war Daylight Saving was introduced in Tasmania at the request of the Hydro during the 1967-68 power crisis as a means of reducing electricity consumption. The idea was subsequently retained for recreational reasons and spread to some of the other states.

In February 1967 SE Tas was devastated by fire in a manner very similar to the recent Victorian fires. 60 or so lives lost and numerous homes destroyed. Later that year hydro-electric storages, the sole source of electricity in a state which also had no significant gas industry at that time, reached critical levels and power rationing was introduced.

Getting off topic here, but rationing took the form of a 35% (initially 25%) mandatory cut in industrial power use, street lights turned off and a general call to do everything possible to save energy - "you leave the lights on = someone in a factory loses their job" being the basic message. 

This wasn't a short term blackout but a prolonged major energy supply shortfall comparable to the recent WA gas crisis or the 1998 Victorian gas crisis. An economic disaster, not simply a blackout or two. The period of rationing lasted a few months with water storage bottoming at 14%, still its all-time low. 

In addition to that was the generator ship bought from NZ, an army of temporary diesel generators, two temporary oil-fired gas turbine power stations and construction of a large permanent oil-fired plant at Bell Bay to avoid future drought-induced crises (half of which blew up in November last year but the other half is running flat out at the moment, the replacement is under construction at present). That plus one new hydro plant in 1967, 3 in 1968, another two in 1969, another two in 1971 plus one each in 1972 and 1973. 

Back on topic... So how much power does it actually save? It was more about symbolism at the time and getting the message across that there was a crisis and drastic measures were needed. But there was a modest saving and that's still true today in Tasmania (though not necessarily elsewhere). People are still up after 8pm so keeping the lights off another hour does help whereas few would be up at 4am when it would be light without Daylight Savings.

It's up to each state to decide in my opinion. I can't imagine we'd ever decide to not have it in Tas as the recreational benefits are compelling and we're still not exactly over supplied with power (storage is about 25% at the moment). You just don't get up at 4 am when it's only 10 minutes drive to work so there's not much point in it getting light at that time. And the curtains never did fade as some warned...

An unintended side benefit in the 1960's was that local radio and TV news and current affairs production received a boost to cope with the time difference. That's largely an irrelevant issue now though, especially in WA where it's a different time zone anyway.


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## derty (30 March 2009)

I'll be voting yes, I reckon it is great. Heaps of time in the afternoon to work in the yard, play sport, walk the dogs and take the kids for rides on their bikes. 

Assume it will be voted down though, these Sandgropers are a stubborn lot, especially when conforming to any eastern state ideas.


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## jasonjetplane (7 May 2009)

*Less sleep for Kids*

My problem with DST is how to get a school kid to bed when its still light at 8 o clock.  Now its May and dark by 6.  Thats 2 hours difference between summer and winter bedtime with DST.  I suppose most people dont have kids any more so they dont really think about this, but how well are our kids brains going to function at school with less sleep, because this is what ultimately happens.  If I didnt have kids I would like DST, but that would be a selfish decision.


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## springhill (7 May 2009)

Ill tell you exactly what will hapen with DLS
It will get voted in, unfortunately
In the first 4 weeks people will be running round saying its fantabulous, head down the beach, have barbies, play with the kids outside. Then, being Perth once its continually 35+ day after day after day, the very people who voted yes will revert to the old lazy, slobbish ways and hide in the air-con after work complaining "Oooooo its to hot! I'll go out tomorrow"
Its a temporary feel good sentiment
Facts of life people are f***ing lazy slobs, always will be, choosing comfort above all else
Should be a law passed if u vote YES u get branded with a mark, and are forced to get out in that burning bastard sun for that hour you voted for it
Perth has no need for DLS with our climate
Have fun in the skin cancer ward in the future


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## DB008 (7 May 2009)

l voted YES today.


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## Farencue (8 May 2009)

No point having a discussion on daylight saving here in North QLD while we still have people ringing redneck radio to complain about confused cows.


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## Bat_Ears (9 May 2009)

I live in NSW and DLS was a terrible idea. Why do idiots keep trying to change what didn't need changing.


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## kitehigh (16 May 2009)

*WA's daylight poll heading for defeat*

Well it looks like daylight savings in WA is dead and buried for another decade.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/05/16/2572605.htm?section=australia

"The majority of West Australians have rejected daylight saving, with the fourth referendum on the issue heading for defeat.

The West Australian Electoral Commissioner, Warwick Gately, says with 65 per cent of the vote counted it appears the no vote has won."


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## derty (17 May 2009)

Spewin' the naysayers got up, though to be expected, these Sand Gropers are such sticks in the mud. There is as much chance of WA accommodating a change perceived to originate in the 'Eastern States' as there is as France adopting anything of British origin.

from that great ode, The New Preamble to the Australian Constitution;

'Western Australia is too far from anywhere to be relevant.
It's main claim to fame is that it doesn't have daylight saving
because if it did, all the men would get erections on the bus on the way to
work.'

change is bad, mkay

http://daze-of-our-lives.blogspot.com/2009/04/my-country.html


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## pacestick (17 May 2009)

Not surprised having lived in the Pilbara  for four years late 80's to early 90s it made about as much sense as daylight saving in saudi arabia


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## overit (17 May 2009)

Dont worry daylight saving supporters... you will keep having referendums until they eventually pass it! Then when it is passed you will never have a referendum again!


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## sting (17 May 2009)

I hope you all realise why QLD never had DLS during the Joh years.



It was cos Joh thought the sun shined outta his **** an he wasnt getting up an hour earlier for no B####ard.


NO actually I liked Sir Joh (I even had a pr of white shoes)I didnt agree wth all of this policies and a few of his political mates were definately shifty  (who can remember the oxenford tavern rort)but he stood by what he said and did what he promised in the election lead ups. No backflips for him.

He also stood up to the medias chooks instead of running around looking for hairdryers to ensure he looked good and sucked up to them.

I was hoping that his son John would get into state politics but was defeated by one of Paulines former cronies. If he was half as entertaining as his father it would have livened the place up.


UBIQUE


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## Gunlom (17 May 2009)

As a no voter, more daylight hours in perth is not that important, without daylight savings it's still light here in summer till 8.30 9 ish anyway.

but mostly I hate the fact it was only brought in as a distraction issue when the state labour government was under intense pressure from the CCC ( the corruption and Crime Commission ) and ministers where caught lying and doing all sorts of dishonest things....

And also the endless newspaper and tv debates on such a irrelevant issue. Get on with serious stuff!!!


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## Garpal Gumnut (17 May 2009)

Well done WA.

Look at the pickle NSW is in with DS, and they've had it for years. They are an hour ahead of progressive cities like Brisbane and Townsville for nearly half the year, which gives us an extra advantage on them for those months.

gg


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## badger41 (17 May 2009)

Well, more than one million hours of productivity gained in WA. I spent around 20 minutes adjusting my clocks at the start, and even longer resetting them at the end (easier to put clocks forward than back). Had to get out the instructions for the car clock, coped with the DVD, Mrs badger managed the kitchen clocks.

Let's see, roughly 1 million households in WA, that's 1 million households wasting their time each year changing clocks. Then they get to work or school and do it all again.

What a disasterous waste of what could be productive work, or enjoyable leisure time.

Live here, have voted no at every referendum. Hate it. Too hot in the evenings, beach not a goer because the westerly winds come in. Already, due to time zone positioning, have half an hour of it year round.

And doesn't anyone like seeing a bit of starlight, moonlight, in the evenings?
Think outdoor movies, astronomy tours, summer fireworks.

Cheers, badger


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## HC Victim (18 May 2009)

Just don't be grizzling when you go somewhere to order something from any sort of retail outlet , and you are told to come back tomorrow as 'the Eastern States' are now closed. Or 'can you get a price on this?', erm no , come back before 1pm tomorrow. Also many retailers get home much later than full time traders, so we appreciate a bit of daylight with OUR families too. Some sort of time equalisation would be nice , ie Vic start and finish an hour later [not likely], or we get up an hour earlier [more likely proposition], and have a little more of a life as well. Trouble is those bloody cows living in the suburbs MUST get milked at 6am and 6pm , or all hell breaks loose??....


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## burglar (9 November 2014)

badger41 said:


> Well, more than one million hours of productivity gained in WA. I spent around 20 minutes adjusting my clocks at the start, and even longer resetting them at the end ...




Flew into Perth last week.
Mobile, powered off in flight.
On arrival, powered mobile back on,

 ... and voila, WA Time.


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## pixel (9 November 2014)

burglar said:


> Flew into Perth last week.
> Mobile, powered off in flight.
> On arrival, powered mobile back on,
> 
> ... and voila, WA Time.




Good one, burglar;

it seems your mobile is smarter than the Pollies Over East that insist on messing with people's lives.


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## Ijustnewit (11 November 2014)

I must say daylight saving is the probably the only thing I hate about Tasmania. Having lived in QLD most of my life I just can't adapt to it. I think the whole idea is so stupid and it really plays with your head.
1. Trying adjust every dam clock , microwave , oven , dvd recorder , watches and then back again AHHHH

2. Bloody bird twit , the bloody birds don't know the clocks have changed do they ? They start chirping and twitting while I'm supposed to be sleeping. double AHHHH

3. Thinking it's 4 pm and it's really 8 pm , It doesn't get dark down here till 9:00 pm in the height of Summer. So here you are fluffing around in the yard thinking it's 4:00pm and you should be in the house having dinner because it's really 8:00 pm. I can't eat dinner when it looks like 4:00 pm outside.  triple AHHHHHH 

4. Skin Cancer , the powers to be don't think in their brilliant minds that they are putting you outside and hour ahead . I like to go for a walk at 2:00 pm , so it's really 1pm the height of UV time . The rest of the day goes the same , the Sun  doesn't know you have changed the clocks . x4 AHHHHHH 

5. Retail , I work in retail and guess what happens in DLST ? Every dam customer shows up at closing time , why ? Because again it' so bloody light out they think it's only 2:00 pm and it's bloody 5:00 pm. x5 AHHHHH 

Honestly I wondered why I was so tired and slept most of Winter when I moved here.  Then I worked it out , I was so stuffed and mentally drained from Day Light Saving times during Summer I just caved in Winter.  I think that any State that has not made the change to DLST is doing it's people a favour.


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## Smurf1976 (11 November 2014)

Ijustnewit said:


> 2. Bloody bird twit , the bloody birds don't know the clocks have changed do they ? They start chirping and twitting while I'm supposed to be sleeping.




The birds would be tweeting even earlier, eg 4am instead of 5am, if not for daylight saving.

Imagine that, light at 4am - basically nobody is up at that time whereas at least the light 8pm - 9pm is useful to most people in some way.



> Skin Cancer , the powers to be don't think in their brilliant minds that they are putting you outside and hour ahead




A double edged sword there. I forget the actual figures, but a large proportion (around half from memory) of the adult population of Tas is Vitamin D deficient with lack of sun exposure being a key factor. 

There's also the obesity issue. Summer - get home, eat dinner, go outside for a walk or whatever. Winter - get home, lock the door which will stay shut until the next morning, eat dinner, watch TV or whatever. 

Given the "can't get outside" problem that many have during winter, personally I'm very much in favour of daylight saving in Summer as an offset.


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## burglar (12 November 2014)

Ijustnewit said:


> ... 1. Trying adjust every dam clock ,  ...




Must admit those dam's clocks can be a bit tricky.
And just when you've got your clock in order, you visit someone else's dam.
And the lazy bstrds haven't bothered to alter their dam clock!

:


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## Smurf1976 (12 November 2014)

burglar said:


> And the lazy bstrds haven't bothered to alter their dam clock!




Not aware of any publicly visible clocks at dams in Australia but we've got a nice big one at Liapootah Power Station (it's a hydro station although the dam is quite some distance from the station itself).

It's outdoors right beside the Lyell Hwy (Tas) next to the switchyard with the power station itself behind that to the right of the photo. 

The clock dates from the original construction of Liapootah PS (commenced operation in 1960, still in full operation) and the clock has recently been refurbished. There's about 350 daffodils planted in the clock so it looks better when they're in bloom (spring).

It works as a clock, it keeps accurate time (it's electrically powered of course.....). Not sure if it's been adjusted for daylight savings - would be pretty ironic if not.


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## Logique (12 November 2014)

Ijustnewit said:


> I must say daylight saving is the probably the only thing I hate about Tasmania. Having lived in QLD most of my life I just can't adapt to it. I think the whole idea is so stupid and it really plays with your head.
> 1. Trying adjust every dam clock , microwave , oven , dvd recorder , watches and then back again AHHHH
> 
> 2. Bloody bird twit , the bloody birds don't know the clocks have changed do they ? They start chirping and twitting while I'm supposed to be sleeping. double AHHHH..........



Right on! Smurf isn't going to be happy, but Daylight Saving is especially ridiculous for a southern latitudes state like Tasmania, which already has as much enough summer evening daylight as anyone wants. And epidemic skin cancer rates.  

Daylight Saving is a dated concept. The time has come to scrap it. Nobody uses mains electricity anymore (well that's 'hyperbowl', but you get my drift). Better to get up at 5am sun time and turn on the lights and heating I suppose?  Let the poor little kids get some sleep at night.


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## pinkboy (12 November 2014)

Deadset cant believe what Im reading here!  Blaming Daylight Saving for skin cancer?  Seriously?

Here's a lesson for those considering working/being active in the sun:

Hierachy Of Controls:

Eliminate:  Can your task/job/exercise be done not in the sun?
Substitution:  Can it be substituted to earlier/later in the say or at night?
Engineering:  Can shade be erected to complete your task?
Administration:  Education of the past several decades of study into sun and skin cancer.  Slip/Slop/Slap Jingle.
Personal Protective Equipment:  Long sleeves, hat, sunglasses, suncream etc.

Ive never heard anything so absurd in my life - blaming the clocks change for cancer.  There is physically not any more/less sun in any given day wether it is DLS or normal time.  With all your own knowledge and decades of research and statistics you come to the conclusion to blame skin cancer on rolling a clock forward. 

I think people need to head inside and take a good hard look in a mirror.


pinkboy


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## Logique (12 November 2014)

Perhaps in a perfect world Pinkboy, where everybody Slips, Slops and Slaps with 100% effectiveness.  

It's not a desktop exercise, we're talking human nature here.


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## pinkboy (12 November 2014)

Logique said:


> Perhaps in a perfect world Pinkboy, where everybody Slips, Slops and Slaps with 100% effectiveness.
> 
> It's not a desktop exercise, we're talking human nature here.




Oh, the ol' 'human nature' arguement.....what a weak arguement!  Perhaps us humans are a weak race?

We all know, by simply slighly adjusting our behaviour to avoid harsh sun, yet we look to scapegoat whatever we can to put the blame somewhere else and not on ourselves.

Dont mix human nature and laziness.  We have ALL been educated about sun exposure and know the consequences.  Dont blame the turning of the clocks!  The sun still rises and falls the same amount during any given day wether the clocks are forward or not.


pinkboy


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## Smurf1976 (12 November 2014)

I'd think that people outside doing gardening, walking or playing sport at 8pm in Summer aren't going to get anywhere near as much sun exposure as if they crammed it all into the weekend and spent all day outside getting sun burnt.

Fundamentally though, DS is really a reflection of society's focus on work. Eg we drop DS, someone goes for a walk in the morning (instead of evening) and takes half an hour longer than expected. No problems, just turn up to work half an hour later since nobody will mind....

Evenings are far more useful to anyone who has to start work at set times etc. In the morning, you're always "watching the clock" rather than just doing whatever and finishing when it's finished. That plus Tassie mornings aren't exactly warm - even mid-summer the average at 5am in Hobart is only 11 or 12 degrees wheres evenings are much nicer.

As for WA (the original thread title) well that's really a matter for people who live there since I can't see any reason why we need a national approach to it. That said, not having it probably does make life a bit harder for a few WA businesses - but they'd have to work around time zone issues regardless, DS only adds another hour.


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## sptrawler (12 November 2014)

Smurf1976 said:


> As for WA (the original thread title) well that's really a matter for people who live there since I can't see any reason why we need a national approach to it. That said, not having it probably does make life a bit harder for a few WA businesses - but they'd have to work around time zone issues regardless, DS only adds another hour.




From a 12 hr shift workers perspective, we hated daylight saving, always going to work in the dark became depressing.

It was great, when the drive to work indicated the comming of summer and vice versa with winter.

It might not sound like much, but when you work in a room without windows, it meant a lot.


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