# The times they are a changin'!



## Joe Blow

Dear Members,

Recently it has become apparent to me that I have not been able to effectively keep on top of both the administration of ASF and the rapidly increasing costs of keeping the site and up and running fast. At the start of the year ASF had fewer than 500 members, now we have over 2150 and the increase in daily traffic has caused me to upgrade the hosting twice so far. However, next year comes the biggest hosting upgrade of all and my monthly hosting costs will increase by over 500%. Unfortunately, I am no longer able to meet these costs myself and the time has come for me to turn ASF from a loss making enterprise into a proftable one to ensure its future.

It has also become clear that I need to downsize my daytime commitments and spend more time in an administrative role here at ASF. My responsibilities here are many and getting progressively more time consuming. The average number of posts each day has more than tripled since the beginning of the year and my time spent moderating and administering the site has increased by a similar amount. So yes, out of necessity I am hoping to become Aussie Stock Fourms first part-time employee.

Now, short of a monthly telethon to raise funds, the only way to ensure revenue outstrips costs on a site like this is to allow advertising... and that is what will be happening from tomorrow night at midnight. ASF will be adopting a new logo layout and a rotating banner advertisement will be appearing just above where the 'Stock Quote' feature currently is in the top right hand part of each page. I just want to assure you that this is a necessary step in ensuring that I can continue to grow ASF, maintain site performance and devote more of my own time to overseeing the forums. 

I also want to be able to do some things next year that I have been unable to up until now. The first thing that comes to mind is to rework the stock tipping competition so that entrants may buy and sell stocks during the course of the month. I would also like entrants to be able to buy more than one stock. I enjoy the current competition, as I know many other do, and I think we can even make it more fun... but I am going to need to hire a programmer to work with me on it.

So, in short, by supporting any of the advertisers you will be helping to support ASF. Hopefully, next year I will be able to bring you a way to buy stockmarket books and software through ASF, but that is a little way off yet.

Thank you very much to those who have donated money to the site - you know who you are. I never forget an act of generosity and I want to let you know that it is truly appreciated.

I hope you all enjoy the site and are enriched by it in some way. After all, that's the whole reason why it's here in the first place.

Here's to the future... cheers!
Joe

P.S. If anyone has any questions, please feel free to ask.


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## sam76

Joe, we all appreciate the increased workload you taken on.

I'm sure if there were to be an "annual membership fee" you've would retain the majority of current members.

ASF (in my opinion) is by far the best stock forum site in Aus, and I for one would like to help out where I can.

Regards,

Sam


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## Joe Blow

sam76 said:
			
		

> Joe, we all appreciate the increased workload you taken on.
> 
> I'm sure if there were to be an "annual membership fee" you've would retain the majority of current members.
> 
> ASF (in my opinion) is by far the best stock forum site in Aus, and I for one would like to help out where I can.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Sam




Thanks for your support Sam!

I decided against a membership fee as I believe in equal access to information, irrespective of a persons financial situation. After weighing up all the options I decided that a single banner advertisement would be the best way to keep the site viable and help it grow into the future.


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## Happy

Joe,
I appreciate your dedication and generosity too.

I wander if there is room for some of your Elfs to take load off your shoulders?

Say for example somebody who is your helper, reads the post and considers it ‘safe’, gives it tick of approval, so you personally don’t have to read it until you want to of course.

Should decision be difficult to make, post doesn’t get the tick and you have to read it yourself or gets the flag for your attention, so you attend it ASAP.

This way your workload could be reduced, also you could employ some filtering program that you only read posts of some known to you to be unbalanced posters.

(And if it can help you I can reduce or stop posting all together – only kidding).


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## Julia

Dear Joe,

Thanks for detailed explanation of current situation re costs of running ASF.
I've previously expressed my appreciation of the way you run this excellent site ( I rarely bother logging on to any of the others any more).

I would absolutely support an annual registration fee but respect your philosophical objections to this.

Advertising is no problem as far as I'm concerned.

I'm more than happy to make a contribution.  I think most of us have recently experienced a fairly productive dividend season and should be in a position to do this.

All the best

Julia :


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## Smurf1976

Agreed with your approach Joe. I think that a charge on users would deter new members from joining and thus stifle growth somewhat. So you're doing the right thing IMO.

As for your advertising strategy, I think you should consider the approach that some of the better community radio stations take. They have limited advertising space by law (5 mins / hour) and rather than see this as a negative, they argue that ads on their stations won't be crowded out by others and are thus able to charge a premium compared to what their audience share would otherwise justify.

So if you're only going to have a small number of ads then you could trade on that plus the readily apparent intellectual superiority of ASF over competitors (I think most would agree there - much more intelligent discussion here versus the others) you could presumably get a premium for the ads. That said, I'm no expert when it comes to internet advertising...


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## money tree

Joe

A few months back I tried to make an advertising deal with you and you declined.

And now?


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## krisbarry

No offence here but...

One way to reduce your workload would be to disregard the ruling for (x)amount of post b4 and entrant qualifies for the monthly comp.

That way you would not need to read countless posts of crap just so members could qualify and then enter the comp.

Simple idea, that may be effective.

I do understand the logic in repeat business, but at what cost to your own health/well-being and finances.


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## raider

krisbarry said:
			
		

> No offence here but...
> 
> One way to reduce your workload would be to disregard the ruling for (x)amount of post b4 and entrant qualifies for the monthly comp.
> 
> That way you would not need to read countless posts of crap just so memebers could qualify and then enter the comp.
> 
> Simple idea, that may be effective.
> 
> I do understand the logic in repeat business, but at what cost to your own health/well-being and finances.



I fully agree with krisbarry if you didn't let people post crap post ( What kind
of car you drive or how much milk do you drink ) than you mightn't be overloaded,thank god or whoever that chicken is back.


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## tech/a

Why shouldnt you make a $$.
If your going to make more time for ASF you seriously have to think forward as one day you'll find you have to find something profitable to do to simply live.

2000 X $20 = $40,000.
2000 X $100 = $200,000.

Neither are above the means of the majority here. Less than most brokerage for a single trade!!

Why not a $20 min and $100 max those that can do those that cant dont.

I'm looking at this from a purely practical veiw and from a simplistic way to introduce.
Less time from your part.

*Isnt it time you looked at this as YOUR BUSINESS JOE?
You could then spend the necessary time to make ASF even better.*

Mind you Battman and I could probably fund you from multiple betts over a year!!!  If we make you benificary---


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## Joe Blow

krisbarry said:
			
		

> No offence here but...
> 
> One way to reduce your workload would be to disregard the ruling for (x)amount of post b4 and entrant qualifies for the monthly comp.
> 
> That way you would not need to read countless posts of crap just so members could qualify and then enter the comp.
> 
> Simple idea, that may be effective.
> 
> I do understand the logic in repeat business, but at what cost to your own health/well-being and finances.




Hi Kris, 

As the competition currently stands having 100 or more people suddenly entering would cause problems. The code that runs the competition page was donated to ASF over a year ago by a member and it hasn't been altered or modified since.

I might be able to drop the posts per day qualification once I rework the competition. Not sure yet. Time will tell.

Luckily there's not too much posting of crap going on. I think the General Chat forum is a good place for people to be able to get away from the market and talk about/discuss other topics. We can't be focussed on the market all the time.


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## krisbarry

I understand, I guess I just read a few too many, one or two line post from members just to reach the quota.

"one more post, am I there yet?"
"Do I qualify now Joe?"

etc etc.


Yes I agree maybe a reduction in the quota may help.

...I promise now to keep my postings down to a minimum, as in the amount of posts, and length, and to not attach so many images, thats my way of keeping ASF Fee free. This will save in server upgrades, hardware upgrades, software upgrades and from Joes brain being fried with so much gabble


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## Joe Blow

tech/a said:
			
		

> Why not a $20 min and $100 max those that can do those that cant dont.
> 
> I'm looking at this from a purely practical veiw and from a simplistic way to introduce.
> Less time from your part.
> 
> *Isnt it time you looked at this as YOUR BUSINESS JOE?
> You could then spend the necessary time to make ASF even better.*




Agreed tech. I have needed to look at ASF as a business for a while and am only just getting around to doing that now.    

However, I still can't bring myself to charge membership fees for ASF. I would rather accept donations from people rather than charge them to access the site. I think in the long term having an advertisement is the simplest way to generate income for ASF... as the site grows so will advertising revenue. I have another couple of tricks up my sleeve planned for next year but right now a single banner ad will generate the revenue necessary to keep everything on track! 

If anyone would like to donate to ASF, you can either click on the paypal button at the bottom of the page, or if you would prefer not to use a credit card you can send a cheque made out to 'Aussie Networks' to:

P.O. Box 1130
Carindale, QLD. 4152

All donations are gratefully accepted!


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## Joe Blow

krisbarry said:
			
		

> I understand, I guess I just read a few too many, one or two line post from members just to reach the quota.
> 
> "one more post, am I there yet?"
> "Do I qualify now Joe?"
> 
> etc etc.




kris, I agree this is annoying and I will be cracking down on this. Posts such as the ones you mention may be deleted, depending on whether it is a one off or not. I will not have people posting rubbish just to qualify for the competition. It's simply not fair to everyone else.


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## Joe Blow

Happy said:
			
		

> I appreciate your dedication and generosity too.
> 
> I wander if there is room for some of your Elfs to take load off your shoulders?
> 
> Say for example somebody who is your helper, reads the post and considers it ‘safe’, gives it tick of approval, so you personally don’t have to read it until you want to of course.




Happy, I currently have two great elfs named RichKid and WayneL.   

However, aside from the moderators, everyone can help keep bad posts off ASF. In the top right of *each post* you will notice this symbol '
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





'. By clicking on this you can report any post that you believe violates the forum rules or the ASF code of conduct.

99% of posts here are fine. It's the bad 1% that can be hard to track down at times, particularly as the site grows. By using this 'Report bad post' feature every ASF member can help me keep the site clean!


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## krisbarry

I guess the risk you take with charging an annual membership fee is that many members will simply move across to other boards that are free.

So advertising and donations may be a more beneficial approach.

Net users are a pretty savvy bunch and will find ways around being charged for anything.

Whatever is on the net for a fee can be found for free somewhere else on the net whether it be legal or not!


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## Happy

We could also take into consideration browsing Sponsor’s sites and considering purchase of their goods and services.
This way 2 or 3 birds can be trapped with several gold coins:

1. Give sponsors justification for Sponsorship costs
2. Make this site attractive to Sponsors
3. Give us an excuse to purchase goods for good cause (even fee avoiders could help, especially if products are discounted, giving win-win outcome   )


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## Joe Blow

Happy said:
			
		

> We could also take into consideration browsing Sponsor’s sites and considering purchase of their goods and services.
> This way 2 or 3 birds can be trapped with several gold coins:
> 
> 1. Give sponsors justification for Sponsorship costs
> 2. Make this site attractive to Sponsors
> 3. Give us an excuse to purchase goods for good cause (even fee avoiders could help, especially if products are discounted, giving win-win outcome   )




Indeed Happy... the ROI for advertisers will be an important factor, so any support visitors (registered members or otherwise) to ASF can show advertisers will help keep the site running and me in part-time work! 

All support is sincerely appreciated!


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## chansw

Joe

Thank you for running "Aussie Stock Forums" Web site. Much appreciated. A few months ago, I discovered this Web site by accident. I had a feeling like striking gold.   I am sure most members are happy to help out and keep this site running. To be honest, I browse ASF every day before work and after work. It becomes part of my daily life. You have done a very good job!


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## doctorj

The strength of ASF is its membership and their diversity.  While some forums, for eg. Reefcap may have more experienced traders, I find it quite intimidating.  This is in comparison to ASF where I know I can ask what may end up being a dumb question and I will get an answer and perhaps even some discussion to help develop my understanding of the concept.  The experienced traders here are very helpful and considerate.  

To my mind, charging fees would destroy this dynamic.  The very generous people that do have experience and understanding of many financial concepts come here to help others learn - I think it would be unlikely that they would donate their time and expertise and pay for the pleasure.  They'd be more likely to find another board where they can do it for free. This would drive the lesser experienced traders and investors away as they no longer have the pool of experience to draw from.

ASF needs to be treated as a business, if only for Joe's sanity.  In keeping with the mantra trading education, irrespective of your budget, perhaps Joe could look at starting a second hand bookstore for trading books.  People could send the details of the book they wish to sell to Joe who advertises it on this site.  Joe collects payment from the purchaser and instructs the owner of the book to mail it to the purchaser.  Joe then forwards payment of the book less his commission to the person after they've posted it.  The advantage of this is that Joe makes money and all he has to do is maintian a book listing and process payments.

There are many similar strategies along this line.   The key is using the high quality forum to build your community then selling related products/services to the established community.


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## doctorj

Like the new logo!

Are you able to share who you get your ads through and how you earn?  Is the fact that I've clicked the past 2 ads that have come up likely to help you at all?

Reefcap even gets a mention!


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## Joe Blow

doctorj said:
			
		

> Like the new logo!
> 
> Are you able to share who you get your ads through and how you earn?  Is the fact that I've clicked the past 2 ads that have come up likely to help you at all?
> 
> Reefcap even gets a mention!




doc,

Glad you like the new logo!

Advertisers are buying blocks of banner impressions rather than clicks so your click won't directly benefit ASF, but clicking through is half the battle... I appreciate you having a look at what the advertisers have to offer.

If you see anything that interests you feel free to click through and investigate further!


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## Happy

I wander why page hast to refresh on a way back?

Used to be instant response, now takes time. 
Can it be fixed? Or part of the ad-deal?


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## Joe Blow

Happy said:
			
		

> I wander why page hast to refresh on a way back?
> 
> Used to be instant response, now takes time.
> Can it be fixed? Or part of the ad-deal?




Happy, are you experiencing some site performance issues?

Please let me know the details if you do as I am determined to keep the site running fast and efficiently.


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## Happy

Joe,
I am pretty sure this is ad causing delay, so part of the deal.

Before if I went 5 or 10 pages deep, I could flick forward and backward through visited pages, now it appears to hesitate, and it appears that every time new ad is loaded, and since I am on dial-up connection it makes the difference.

What I have to do now is open “Back” box and jump as many pages as I want or 10 at the time maximum.

No major drama; just have to change the technique.


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## money tree

Happy said:
			
		

> We could also take into consideration browsing Sponsor’s sites and considering purchase of their goods and services.
> This way 2 or 3 birds can be trapped with several gold coins:
> 
> 1. Give sponsors justification for Sponsorship costs
> 2. Make this site attractive to Sponsors
> 3. Give us an excuse to purchase goods for good cause (even fee avoiders could help, especially if products are discounted, giving win-win outcome   )




As a 'commercial' member of ASF, I post here for one purpose. I have a product to sell. (Shock horror, someone trying to make money? Golly gosh, say it isnt so.....we are all communists here arent we?  : )

Unfortunately, this membership base appears to have the mentality of "lets get rich off others without paying anyone a cent!" I have posted on other forums and had a much higher sales rate. 

When I was a member of a popular property forum, I sold 30 courses in 2 months.

As a recent member of Jasons forum (synapse) I sold 4 or 5 courses in a month.

Despite my being here for a few years, I have only sold 3-4 courses. 
I am seriously considering leaving this forum as my posting seems to be a waste of time. There are too many people here leeching off others. Either people here dont have any money to invest, or are just too tight to spend money on getting educated. I know that many of the members are quite young and this may be a factor. 

As an advertiser, I dont see any reason to be a sponsor to this site. People here need to stop thinking they can get everything for nothing. I paid $6,000 for my education, and Im glad I did. 

Joe, if this site is to remain viable, something must be done.


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## tech/a

money tree said:
			
		

> As a 'commercial' member of ASF, I post here for one purpose. I have a product to sell. (Shock horror, someone trying to make money? Golly gosh, say it isnt so.....we are all communists here arent we?  : )
> 
> Unfortunately, this membership base appears to have the mentality of "lets get rich off others without paying anyone a cent!" I have posted on other forums and had a much higher sales rate.
> 
> When I was a member of a popular property forum, I sold 30 courses in 2 months.
> 
> As a recent member of Jasons forum (synapse) I sold 4 or 5 courses in a month.
> 
> Despite my being here for a few years, I have only sold 3-4 courses.
> I am seriously considering leaving this forum as my posting seems to be a waste of time. There are too many people here leeching off others. Either people here dont have any money to invest, or are just too tight to spend money on getting educated. I know that many of the members are quite young and this may be a factor.
> 
> As an advertiser, I dont see any reason to be a sponsor to this site. People here need to stop thinking they can get everything for nothing. I paid $6,000 for my education, and Im glad I did.
> 
> Joe, if this site is to remain viable, something must be done.




Tree you have to be kidding.
Your shifting the inability to sell courses to the reader.

Try a few dozen trades live---as you start accumulating positive results the course enquiry will go sky high.
Have a look at your marketing---employ pro people to set up your site with dynamic "wiffms"
Give something to get something.
Go spend another $6000 on a Business management course. Most Uni's have one.
If your not selling 100+ a month then YOUR not marketing your product well enough and when your selling 100 and your not selling 200 then your not marketing your product well enough.
Learn the power of referals.Show some humility being in the financial sector or being dux of an options course doesnt guarentee success.
Look outside the square of the financial sector youll find better advice.
What makes you different?
Show real value--what do you guarentee? 

I'd be happy to help you out for NOTHING but your so pretentious you'd take the offer as a sign of weakness and of no value.

Why should people stop investigating ways to find gems of wisdom for nothing?
You know the more I give out the luckier I get.
OH and not everyone is interested in options trading yet on Jasons site I'd be suprised if there was an interest in anything else.

Finally if your looking for business from forum postings then you seriously need marketing help. (Certaintly if nothing else to work on content--- might be on Jasons site but Ive never seen it here).


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## Joe Blow

money tree,

Thanks for your feedback. It has been taken on board and I only have a few comments to make.



			
				money tree said:
			
		

> Despite my being here for a few years, I have only sold 3-4 courses.




Aussie Stock Forums has only existed for around 17 months. You first registered around 13 months ago. Also, congratulations on the sales, you have made much more out of ASF than I have! 



			
				money tree said:
			
		

> I am seriously considering leaving this forum as my posting seems to be a waste of time. There are too many people here leeching off others. Either people here dont have any money to invest, or are just too tight to spend money on getting educated.




I don't see a lot of people leeching off others, I see a lot of people contributing. I think ASF has more useful content than most stockmarket forums, many of which are filled with endless ramping and playground insults. I think we have a lot of friendly, knowledgeable people here and yes, that attracts 'leechers', but the good news is that it also attracts more friendly, knowledgable people.



			
				moneytree said:
			
		

> I know that many of the members are quite young and this may be a factor.




I think you would be suprised at the median age of members of this forum. 



			
				money tree said:
			
		

> As an advertiser, I dont see any reason to be a sponsor to this site. People here need to stop thinking they can get everything for nothing. I paid $6,000 for my education, and Im glad I did.




Fair enough. Perhaps advertising on ASF just isn't for you. However, I have been putting advertisers off for over a year now, not sure exactly how and when I was going to introduce advertising. Unfortunately for me, ASF has always been about the challenge rather than the money. As long as costs were within what I was willing to bear, I covered them myself. I was a little too interested in community building than I was in turning a profit.



			
				money tree said:
			
		

> Joe, if this site is to remain viable, something must be done.




I think ASF will become viable. I think a lot of members value the site and enjoy their time here and will support ASF given the chance. I have had many emails from members thanking me for ASF and telling me how much they enjoy their visits. Anyway, as with all things, time will tell. On the whole, I've enjoyed the experience so far and I think ASF has a bright future. This has always been a long term project for me and I have confidence that ASF will be still be around for many years to come.


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## Joe Blow

Happy said:
			
		

> Joe,
> I am pretty sure this is ad causing delay, so part of the deal.
> 
> Before if I went 5 or 10 pages deep, I could flick forward and backward through visited pages, now it appears to hesitate, and it appears that every time new ad is loaded, and since I am on dial-up connection it makes the difference.
> 
> What I have to do now is open “Back” box and jump as many pages as I want or 10 at the time maximum.
> 
> No major drama; just have to change the technique.




Happy, I will see what I can do about improving site performance.

The fact that you are on a dial-up connection may play a big part in this. I would be interested in any feedback from others accessing ASF via a dial-up connection.


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## Dan_

Joe,

I'm on cable and notice the slight "delay" in the loading (especially the first time visiting the site on the day) and the back/forth process. However as I have Norton Internet Security I don't see any advertisements at all. So I’m unsure if the delay is caused by the blocking of the add, or the generation itself. 

No issue just some feedback. 

Keep up the great work


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## Smurf1976

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Happy, I will see what I can do about improving site performance.
> 
> The fact that you are on a dial-up connection may play a big part in this. I would be interested in any feedback from others accessing ASF via a dial-up connection.



I'm on dialup and have not noticed any difference at all. All OK.

That said, I do have the feeling that my dialup might be working a bit better than some. I have heard many people say that Google Earth doesn't work with dialup - works fine for me. My actual connection speed is typically 44K on a 56K modem.


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## Julia

money tree said:
			
		

> As a 'commercial' member of ASF, I post here for one purpose. I have a product to sell. (Shock horror, someone trying to make money? Golly gosh, say it isnt so.....we are all communists here arent we?  : )
> 
> Unfortunately, this membership base appears to have the mentality of "lets get rich off others without paying anyone a cent!" I have posted on other forums and had a much higher sales rate.
> 
> When I was a member of a popular property forum, I sold 30 courses in 2 months.
> 
> As a recent member of Jasons forum (synapse) I sold 4 or 5 courses in a month.
> 
> Despite my being here for a few years, I have only sold 3-4 courses.
> I am seriously considering leaving this forum as my posting seems to be a waste of time. There are too many people here leeching off others. Either people here dont have any money to invest, or are just too tight to spend money on getting educated. I know that many of the members are quite young and this may be a factor.
> 
> As an advertiser, I dont see any reason to be a sponsor to this site. People here need to stop thinking they can get everything for nothing. I paid $6,000 for my education, and Im glad I did.
> 
> Joe, if this site is to remain viable, something must be done.





Moneytree:

Your comments have surprised me, probably because I had imagined most other forum members were - like myself - here because we value the free exchange of ideas and information.  I really had not thought about ASF as primarily a site where members derive profits from one another in their various private enterprises, but rather a place where there is a sense of community  fostering the  give and take which is possible from a membership base of such varied ages, experience and interests.

That's not to say, of course, that what you are  looking for is wrong.  I wish you luck in attracting business.  However, ASF is not the venue I would go to if I were looking to buy anything.

Julia


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## Happy

At the moment ASF is the venue in transition stage and if members do not come here to buy something, venue might disappear, unfortunately.


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## It's Snake Pliskin

money tree said:
			
		

> As a 'commercial' member of ASF, I post here for one purpose. I have a product to sell. (Shock horror, someone trying to make money? Golly gosh, say it isnt so.....we are all communists here arent we?  : )
> 
> Unfortunately, this membership base appears to have the mentality of "lets get rich off others without paying anyone a cent!" I have posted on other forums and had a much higher sales rate.
> 
> When I was a member of a popular property forum, I sold 30 courses in 2 months.
> 
> As a recent member of Jasons forum (synapse) I sold 4 or 5 courses in a month.
> 
> Despite my being here for a few years, I have only sold 3-4 courses.
> I am seriously considering leaving this forum as my posting seems to be a waste of time. There are too many people here leeching off others. Either people here dont have any money to invest, or are just too tight to spend money on getting educated. I know that many of the members are quite young and this may be a factor.
> 
> As an advertiser, I dont see any reason to be a sponsor to this site. People here need to stop thinking they can get everything for nothing. I paid $6,000 for my education, and Im glad I did.
> 
> Joe, if this site is to remain viable, something must be done.




Money tree,

I am really surprised by your comments. You've insulted the users of this forum because you haven't sold any courses. That's loser material mate!

Snake


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## Joe Blow

Happy said:
			
		

> At the moment ASF is the venue in transition stage and if members do not come here to buy something, venue might disappear, unfortunately.




Indeed Happy. Advertisers will be looking for a return on their investment. They will move on if they do not. So I hope people will take a look at what they have to offer.

I am looking for ways to make it possible for ASF members and visitors to buy financial books/software through ASF and support the site in the process. I'm hoping to introduce this early next year.


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## RichKid

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Indeed Happy. Advertisers will be looking for a return on their investment. They will move on if they do not. So I hope people will take a look at what they have to offer.
> 
> I am looking for ways to make it possible for ASF members and visitors to buy financial books/software through ASF and support the site in the process. I'm hoping to introduce this early next year.




Think of interviews too Joe in the financial mags, they should pay you, you can send them a small general profile of the site and I'm sure the big investor mags would be interested in doing pieces on us. That'll attract more publicity too, and hence more members for advertisers to target. The stock comp would be an added attraction. We could emphasise our higher standards and quality of material as setting us apart from the rest of the crowd.


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## money tree

tech/a said:
			
		

> Try a few dozen trades live---as you start accumulating positive results the course enquiry will go sky high.




Trades? I actively DISCOURAGE trading remember. 97% of people fail. 



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Learn the power of referals.




Silly assumption. A lot of my sales are by referal.



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Show some humility being in the financial sector or being dux of an options course doesnt guarentee success.




If you had ever bothered to listen to anything I say or at least read my site, you would know it is not an "options course". Options are a risk-limiting tool and my course focuses on reducing risk and increasing returns, so they are an important part. Primarily I want to show people that the crappy returns the finance sector puts out can be easily beaten by getting creative. I want to teach people that there are other ways of making money in the market apart from "buy for $1 and sell for $2" A lot of my course is about tax minimisation. Which is better, $2 made on a trade, or $1 saved in tax without risk?



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Look outside the square of the financial sector youll find better advice.




LOL. meaning we should all worship you?



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> What makes you different?




Put it this way. A financial advisor knows about 10% of what is in my course. That is to say, I managed to fill a book on what your financial advisor DOESNT KNOW. Scary huh? Well it wouldnt shock you. You think they are all beneath you. Also, I wanted to share all the important info all the other trading books neglect to tell you. The truth. Things like "hey pal, want a margin call?" or "hey buddy, you have a 3% chance of success doing this"



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Show real value--what do you guarentee?




real value. Well, saving $5k in tax every year for the rest of your life, for a $590 outlay is real value. Im sorry, but if you cant see that as a good investment then you have no business being in the stock market.



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> I'd be happy to help you out for NOTHING but your so pretentious you'd take the offer as a sign of weakness and of no value.




Thats rich. Mr "I'm smarter than all the financial experts out there". All you have to do to help me is to take your foot off my head. I mean seriously, you kick me in the guts every chance you get. Its obvious that you feel threatened by me. You want to be the king here, fine, be my guest. I have never sought that role and dont want it. often you have hinted that you know more than all the experts and that we should all listen to you instead.
So Im going to call you on your bluff. What is it you can do to help me? Seriously. Was that an empty gesture or are you for real?



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Why should people stop investigating ways to find gems of wisdom for nothing?




Well, if they want to waste 5 years and lose a heap of money learning from their own mistakes, let em. But if they want to save time and money, invest in my experience.



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> You know the more I give out the luckier I get.




Just today I got an email from someone who bought my course a year ago. He thanked me for what I taught him and announced that he has just retired. I can put you in touch if you dont believe me.



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> OH and not everyone is interested in options trading yet on Jasons site I'd be suprised if there was an interest in anything else.




Again, there is far more to my course than just options.



			
				tech/a said:
			
		

> Finally if your looking for business from forum postings then you seriously need marketing help.




Well thats just your opinion. On many other forums people make a good living from forum post referals.


----------



## money tree

Julia said:
			
		

> Moneytree:
> 
> Your comments have surprised me, probably because I had imagined most other forum members were - like myself - here because we value the free exchange of ideas and information.  I really had not thought about ASF as primarily a site where members derive profits from one another in their various private enterprises, but rather a place where there is a sense of community  fostering the  give and take which is possible from a membership base of such varied ages, experience and interests.
> 
> That's not to say, of course, that what you are  looking for is wrong.  I wish you luck in attracting business.  However, ASF is not the venue I would go to if I were looking to buy anything.
> 
> Julia




I expected this sort of reaction. Rather than someone who is here to get you to buy something you dont want, I prefer to think of myself as HELPING people here for a fee. What they get out of the deal is often 10x or 20x what I get. So its a win-win situation. 

Unfortunately the utopia that this site began as is not sustainable. people need to face reality. Good advice costs.....usually. If tech wants to do it all for free thats his business. But if someone wants me to help them make an extra $5k and they dont think I deserve a reward, then stuff em. We are all here because we want to make money.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin

money tree said:
			
		

> Trades? I actively DISCOURAGE trading remember. 97% of people fail.
> 
> 
> 
> Silly assumption. A lot of my sales are by referal.
> 
> 
> 
> If you had ever bothered to listen to anything I say or at least read my site, you would know it is not an "options course". Options are a risk-limiting tool and my course focuses on reducing risk and increasing returns, so they are an important part. Primarily I want to show people that the crappy returns the finance sector puts out can be easily beaten by getting creative. I want to teach people that there are other ways of making money in the market apart from "buy for $1 and sell for $2" A lot of my course is about tax minimisation. Which is better, $2 made on a trade, or $1 saved in tax without risk?
> 
> 
> 
> LOL. meaning we should all worship you?
> 
> 
> 
> Put it this way. A financial advisor knows about 10% of what is in my course. That is to say, I managed to fill a book on what your financial advisor DOESNT KNOW. Scary huh? Well it wouldnt shock you. You think they are all beneath you. Also, I wanted to share all the important info all the other trading books neglect to tell you. The truth. Things like "hey pal, want a margin call?" or "hey buddy, you have a 3% chance of success doing this"
> 
> 
> 
> real value. Well, saving $5k in tax every year for the rest of your life, for a $590 outlay is real value. Im sorry, but if you cant see that as a good investment then you have no business being in the stock market.
> 
> 
> 
> Thats rich. Mr "I'm smarter than all the financial experts out there". All you have to do to help me is to take your foot off my head. I mean seriously, you kick me in the guts every chance you get. Its obvious that you feel threatened by me. You want to be the king here, fine, be my guest. I have never sought that role and dont want it. often you have hinted that you know more than all the experts and that we should all listen to you instead.
> So Im going to call you on your bluff. What is it you can do to help me? Seriously. Was that an empty gesture or are you for real?
> 
> 
> 
> Well, if they want to waste 5 years and lose a heap of money learning from their own mistakes, let em. But if they want to save time and money, invest in my experience.
> 
> 
> 
> Just today I got an email from someone who bought my course a year ago. He thanked me for what I taught him and announced that he has just retired. I can put you in touch if you dont believe me.
> 
> 
> 
> Again, there is far more to my course than just options.
> 
> 
> 
> Well thats just your opinion. On many other forums people make a good living from forum post referals.





Hey Tech,

Do you have any courses for sale? I'm interested in learning all about the big wide and difficult world of the markets and equities.   

I once read something to this effect: "If they have such wonderful systems, blackboxes, courses etc. Why aren't they in the bahamas instead of trying to sell their....."

Snake


----------



## Joe Blow

RichKid said:
			
		

> Think of interviews too Joe in the financial mags, they should pay you, you can send them a small general profile of the site and I'm sure the big investor mags would be interested in doing pieces on us. That'll attract more publicity too, and hence more members for advertisers to target. The stock comp would be an added attraction. We could emphasise our higher standards and quality of material as setting us apart from the rest of the crowd.




Hi RK... I somehow missed your post until this thread was bumped. Thanks for your suggestions!

Yes, I am looking at all kinds of ways of promoting ASF to keep new visitors arriving but most will have to wait until I get back from my break during December. I need some time and space to plan ASF's direction for 2006... but most of all I need some time away from the computer.   

But in terms of traffic ASF keeps going from strength to strength. Here is a graph of daily traffic and page impressions from April 1 this year until today. Higher highs and higher lows... things are looking up.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Hi RK... I somehow missed your post until this thread was bumped. Thanks for your suggestions!
> 
> Yes, I am looking at all kinds of ways of promoting ASF to keep new visitors arriving but most will have to wait until I get back from my break during December. I need some time and space to plan ASF's direction for 2006... but most of all I need some time away from the computer.
> 
> But in terms of traffic ASF keeps going from strength to strength. Here is a graph of daily traffic and page impressions from April 1 this year until today. Higher highs and higher lows... things are looking up.




Wow!
We can trend trade the usage of ASF!


----------



## Joe Blow

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> Wow!
> We can trend trade the usage of ASF!




Buy ASF at 4000 page impressions at day... sell at 6000!


----------



## Kauri

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Buy ASF at 4000 page impressions at day... sell at 6000!




   And there is just enough volatility to keep it interesting....


----------



## Joe Blow

Kauri said:
			
		

> And there is just enough volatility to keep it interesting....




Weekends seem to drive the price down!  :


----------



## RichKid

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> But in terms of traffic ASF keeps going from strength to strength. Here is a graph of daily traffic and page impressions from April 1 this year until today. Higher highs and higher lows... things are looking up.




Wow Joe!! I love charts, so much easier to gather info that way. No rush, good for you to get some time away from the hypnotic machine for awhile. We can look at some 'market rigging' to help that chart when you're back!


----------



## Trembling Hand

Joe

Just wondering you have some adds on ASF that are revenue generating via Affiliate links. Others like Interactive Brokers seem just sponsor adds without any Affiliate link?

I don't know how many hundreds of times I've read and posted myself recommendations for services that have some sort of financial arrangement with ASF but simply posted in plain text within a post.

Why not have a script whenever the words "Interactive brokers" or "etoro" or "whatever sponsor name" is placed in a post its changed to a link with your Affiliate No.?


----------



## Joe Blow

Trembling Hand said:


> Joe
> 
> Just wondering you have some adds on ASF that are revenue generating via Affiliate links. Others like Interactive Brokers seem just sponsor adds without any Affiliate link?
> 
> I don't know how many hundreds of times I've read and posted myself recommendations for services that have some sort of financial arrangement with ASF but simply posted in plain text within a post.
> 
> Why not have a script whenever the words "Interactive brokers" or "etoro" or "whatever sponsor name" is placed in a post its changed to a link with your Affiliate No.?




Hi TH,

I've thought about this in the past but haven't introduced it yet for a couple of reasons. Mostly, I've never promoted enough affiliate programs to make it worthwhile. The majority of the advertisers you see on ASF book directly through the agency that sells ASF's advertising and I only occasionally experiment with affiliate programs, mostly out of curiosity. The other reason is that I felt that links of this type appearing in posts may be a little too intrusive. I have heard stories from other forum admins of negative reactions to a similar sytem where keywords in posts are replaced with affiliate links. Not really the same thing but similar enough to make me hesitant about introducing something along those lines.

Still, it is something I have an open mind about and may introduce down the track, even if just on a test basis.


----------



## investorpaul

Yer the idea of links in posts did not go down well on HC.

At least here the idea can be raised in a normal manner. Over there any criticism resulted in a suspension for the first few days until it was clear that everyone hated it and they could suspend everyone.


----------



## Joe Blow

investorpaul said:


> Yer the idea of links in posts did not go down well on HC.
> 
> At least here the idea can be raised in a normal manner. Over there any criticism resulted in a suspension for the first few days until it was clear that everyone hated it and they could suspend everyone.




The thing about advertising on websites like ASF is the more the advertisers are supported by the community the less of it there needs to be. Market forces will gradually increase the cost of advertising if the advertisers are finding the results of their campaigns are meeting or exceeding their expectations. Word gets around. More advertisers competing for a limited amount of exposure will tend to pay more to secure a guaranteed spot.

So, if you can, please support ASF's advertisers by visiting them and taking a look at what they have to offer, especially those who you see frequently and over a long period of time such as Interactive Brokers, who have supported ASF for years now and came on board when we really needed the revenue. And be sure to let them know you found out about them on ASF!


----------



## Tysonboss1

Hey Joe,

I saw a post from a few years back where you announced a record of 1,000,000 page loads in a month.

How are we trending these days? are we still above a Million a month?

also just another question I have wondered for a while, 

When you don't have you admin cap on, Do you post under a different name?


----------



## Joe Blow

Tysonboss1 said:


> Hey Joe,
> 
> I saw a post from a few years back where you announced a record of 1,000,000 page loads in a month.
> 
> How are we trending these days? are we still above a Million a month?
> 
> also just another question I have wondered for a while,
> 
> When you don't have you admin cap on, Do you post under a different name?




Hi TB,

You might say that, in TA terms, ASF has experienced a bit of a pullback since those days. 

The GFC took a bit of the wind out of our sails, as it did with most of the other stock market forums as well. We lost a number of members who left the market when everything fell apart a few years ago and there has been a bit of a dip in activity as a result.

The number of posts and page impressions a day has fallen from the highs of a few years ago. However, we  have reached a significant support level and are now trading sideways waiting for a bounce when more confidence returns to the market. 

Regarding your other question, no I only post under this user name.


----------



## CanOz

Joe Blow said:
			
		

> Hi TB,
> 
> You might say that, in TA terms, ASF has experienced a bit of a pullback since those days.
> 
> The GFC took a bit of the wind out of our sails, as it did with most of the other stock market forums as well. We lost a number of members who left the market when everything fell apart a few years ago and there has been a bit of a dip in activity as a result.
> 
> The number of posts and page impressions a day has fallen from the highs of a few years ago. However, we  have reached a significant support level and are now trading sideways waiting for a bounce when more confidence returns to the market.
> 
> Regarding your other question, no I only post under this user name.




Replying to this from my iPad joe. Nice layout, quite functional too.

Thought I might bump this thread, given the new bear market!

CanOz


----------

