# Deceptive Terrorism Support



## TheAnalyst (22 July 2006)

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,19872475-5005961,00.html



> Anti-war protesters gather
> 
> SEVERAL thousand people have gathered in the centre of Sydney, calling on the world to "give peace a chance" in the Middle East.
> Protesters carrying Australian and Lebanese flags and placards have converged on Town Hall and blocked off George Street, in Sydney's CBD.
> ...




Mostly Lebonese who really dont like the idea that Israel has a great capability of defending itself instead of allowing itself to be pushed into the sea and murdered and butchered by the Arab peoples around them including the Lebonese.


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## TheAnalyst (22 July 2006)

One more thing; are these Lebonese protesters going to ask for the release of the unprovoked kidnapped Israeli soldiers as well?


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## TheAnalyst (22 July 2006)

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,19874889-5005961,00.html



> Mid East policy a failure, rally told
> 
> July 22, 2006 04:54pm
> 
> ...




The only thing that would keep this racist jew/Israeli hater happy would be to send Aussie troops to help Hezzabollah whilst the young men of Lebonese descent run from battle with a free trip to Australia by the Aussie tax payer.

What an absolute joke, they need to see the spirit of the young Aussie diggers of past wars as an example of patrionism......

c'mon Lebonese stand up and fight for Lebonon its your land.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (23 July 2006)

Analyst,

They seem totally ignorant of the effects that Arafat caused years ago and now hezbollah. Get rid of hezbollah and let the government military do the defending independent of Iran and Syria. There exists a regime within and perfectly operating government - one of the better middle east societies.

Years agao it was the best society before Arafat corrupted it after being kicked out of Jordan for causing trouble. History notes, where ever the palestinians go there is trouble.

And for those PC, green types who think the palestinians are poor and lower class deserving our help; they have been one of the more educated and intelligent people of the the Middle East.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

At yesterdays rally in Melbourne the so called peaceful Lebonese attacked other protesters that were stating the fact that Arab leaders overseas need to do a lot more in regards to terrorist attacks against the nation of Israel.

It is time our state and federal governments got up and tell these Lebonese in Australia that if this is the way they think;leave and make your home in the middle east and let Israel deal with their terrorist mentality.


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## the_godfather4 (23 July 2006)

Hey didnt I see you guys at Cronulla last year????? 

Educate yourself with more than just CNN and then post your sweeping general statements........no wonder meatheads like G.W.Bush get re-elected........

This garbage does not even deserve correction........

I think this thread needs to be retitled "Deceptive white supremacist support"


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Hey didnt I see you guys at Cronulla last year?????
> 
> Educate yourself with more than just CNN and then post your sweeping general statements........no wonder meatheads like G.W.Bush get re-elected........
> 
> ...





These statements are facts "Godfather" and dont expect us to censor facts! if you dont like it dont ask us to lie about what is really and actually going on.

You can always start a new thread.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> These statements are facts "Godfather" and dont expect us to censor facts! if you dont like it dont ask us to lie about what is really and actually going on.
> 
> You can always start a new thread.




I don't think any of us *REALLY* know what's going on.

I suggest we all have some sort of bias one way or the other. 

Those with extreme bias should examine the reasons for such... religion, propaganda, whatever. Then they should give themselves an uppercut to wake themselves up. This sort of thing never happens in a vacuum in the modern age.

I have said it before, there are no white hats here. Both sides have agendas.

However, the targeting of civilians, no matter who's doing it, is obsene, despicable, and in fact is terrorism.

The way I see it, we have two terrorist organisations fighting each other, with the possibility of other terrorist groups (governments) joining in.

I repeat! There are no white hats.

I just wish the general populace had the wherewithal to call these organisations ( governmental or otherwise) to account. It is our lives they are gambling with.

Cheers


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## It's Snake Pliskin (23 July 2006)

> the_godfather4
> Hey didnt I see you guys at Cronulla last year?????




It`s this type of comment that is ruidiculous and shows the poster`s maturity, or lack of.  

Well for your information God4: I lived in the Bansktown area of Sydney for over 3 years and worked there as well. If you don`t know it is the Lebanon of Australia.

Lets just say I have first hand knowledge of these people and the way they treat Australia. I had tenents who were part of the PLO with banners proudly displayed in their dingy little apartments and photos of themselves holding machine guns. I had people accuse me of being jewish because I was white etc. Lebanese worked on my car, cut my hair and were, apart from the Vietnamese the main source of my income. Generally I got along well with most of them, because they treated me ok and I did the same. I actually understand that they are people being led astray by their religions and leaders. There were some who created trouble for others and some who were locked up for rape etc. Most tried to fit in , but there were those who will never fit in. The Lakemba book shop selling hate books: I`ve seen it; I didn`t know exactly what they were selling - books I know, but I have seen the creepy looking weird ones that hang out there. Lakemba is one dangerous place now - recall the Police station being shot up, well it is opposite that book shop just down the street. But, I am not drawing any links here, just a geographical coincidence.

I used to buy Lebanese bread nearly every day for snacks becuase it is the best and I miss it now - go to Yagoona if you want to try the best. The bread in Riverwood is not as good.I have friends who I miss and yes they are Lebanese.



> Educate yourself with more than just CNN and then post your sweeping general statements........no wonder meatheads like G.W.Bush get re-elected........




I don`t watch CNN. My statements are not general - I have seen it all in Bankstown, Lakemba and Greenacre. 

Don`t you think it is a bit arrogant to think that we all get our info from the idiot box etc?



> This garbage does not even deserve correction........
> 
> I think this thread needs to be retitled "Deceptive white supremacist support"




Call it what you like, but I suggest you start to wakeup and find out for yourself.  And leave your prejudices for the game of cricket and soccer.

Oh and every Israeli I have met has been a very nice person and law abiding, but I realise it is not representative of the rest of them.  Though I wish I had met more so I could understand why they are hated so much.

Think about it God!


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## It's Snake Pliskin (23 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Hey didnt I see you guys at Cronulla last year?????
> 
> Educate yourself with more than just CNN and then post your sweeping general statements........no wonder meatheads like G.W.Bush get re-elected........
> 
> ...




Actually God,

Hezbollah is an illegal army. Do you not respect the mandate of the UNations?

Do you not repect the fact that Lebanon should rule themselves without Iran and Syria interfering?


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

GodFather

 what you need to do is study the whole history of Israel and the reasons for its rebirth as a nation in 1948 and find out the reasons why the Arabs hate them and want them driven into the sea and how the Arab leaders have propagated racism and lies about them. What is terribble is these people have brang their racism and murderous doctrine to our land and it was ignored from the beginning and we actually have a bigger problem than our intelligence services are telling us.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> GodFather
> 
> what you need to do is study the whole history of Israel and the reasons for its rebirth as a nation in 1948 and find out the reasons why the Arabs hate them and want them driven into the sea and how the Arab leaders have propagated racism and lies about them. What is terribble is these people have brang their racism and murderous doctrine to our land and it was ignored from the beginning and we actually have a bigger problem than our intelligence services are telling us.




Fair enough Analyst. But my point is that the other mob ain't skeaky clean either. Lets not get carried away with the lop-sided analysis. Lets examine history from both points of view.

Cheers


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Fair enough Analyst. But my point is that the other mob ain't skeaky clean either. Lets not get carried away with the lop-sided analysis. Lets examine history from both points of view.
> 
> Cheers




Hi Wayne 

My point is what the protesters failed to denounce which to me and others says a lot about their real motives and have never seen Jews behave this way in Australia.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Hi Wayne
> 
> My point is what the protesters failed to denounce which to me and others says a lot about their real motives and have never seen Jews behave this way in Australia.




But have you seen the way they are behaving in Lebonon? The people being killed are not Hezbollah, just folks tryng to get by in the world.

Speaking of history, the irony is that the zionists practised terrorism against the British in palestine. 

There is no difference between these two opponents. Terrorists are terrorists whether guerillas or government, whether Israeli or Arab... or American or British for that matter, muslim, jew, christian, or hindu.

What is happening in the Mid East is terrorism... from both sides. Dropping bombs or firing missiles into civilian areas is terrorism.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> But have you seen the way they are behaving in Lebonon? The people being killed are not Hezbollah, just folks tryng to get by in the world.
> 
> Speaking of history, the irony is that the zionists practised terrorism against the British in palestine.
> 
> ...




Whoo Wayne I am talking of the protests in Australia and stating facts that if the Lebonese and their leaders want to protest then let them state all the facts and not leave any out and let them tell what they really think of Jews and we know what that is here and abroad.

Dont forget after Britian helped the Jews establish their own land again they then trained the Jordianians and the Ejyptians to kill them but the Israeli's were good at shooting down British war planes. So lets conentrate on what they are trying to spread in Australia.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Dont forget after Britian helped the Jews establish their own land again they then trained the Jordianians and the Ejyptians to kill them but the Israeli's were good at shooting down British war planes.




My point exactly. They are all terrorists. Even the Brits, Yanks, and yes, Israelis.



			
				TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> So lets conentrate on what they are trying to spread in Australia.




What are they trying to spread?


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

Just read what the protests were about Wayne a one sided story with lots of pieces missing.....you must be very niave.....leave it at that.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Just read what the protests were about Wayne a one sided story with lots of pieces missing.....you must be very niave.....leave it at that.




Now you're going _ad hominem_. That usually means someone is finding it difficult justifying their position with logic. So just start casting aspersions.

Weak as p&^%.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Now you're going _ad hominem_. That usually means someone is finding it difficult justifying their position with logic. So just start casting aspersions.
> 
> Weak as p&^%.





Whatever Wayne.........


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> What are they trying to spread?






			
				TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Whatever Wayne.........




Why don't you just provide a link so I can read what they are trying to spread? 

It was a genuine question FFS.

Sheesh


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## doctorj (23 July 2006)

Lets play the ball not the man folks.

To my mind, Australian Lebanese are more than entitled to protest the invasion and bombing of their homeland.  Their friends and family are dying.  You cannot possibly expect them to protest for the return of the soldiers - the main issue in their mind, and rightly so, is safety of their loved ones.  How would you react?

Israel is such a hard subject to debate because it typically draws such a passionate, emotional response from people.

That said, no matter which side you're on, you must agree that hundreds, if not thousands innocent people are dying on both sides. 

These people are the victims of the agendas of Israel, Hezbollah, Lebanon, Syria, Iran and the United States.


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## Julia (23 July 2006)

Analyst
  Wayne's response is entirely reasonable.  It is indefensible to make wild claims without providing supporting justification for them when discussing an emotive subject like this.

And, please don't take offence, but if you are going to refer to various races or nationalities, please take the trouble to correctly spell that identity.
Try Lebanese (not Lebonese), Egyptians, Jordanians.  It is insulting to any nationality to spell their names incorrectly whatever you think of their politics.
Would you like them to refer to you as "Austrayans" which is how many people pronounce "Australians".

Julia


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Why don't you just provide a link so I can read what they are trying to spread?
> 
> It was a genuine question FFS.
> 
> Sheesh




Do a google search and avoid the Arabic versions as the writers wont live long if they provide  a balanced version.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

Julia said:
			
		

> Analyst
> Wayne's response is entirely reasonable.  It is indefensible to make wild claims without providing supporting justification for them when discussing an emotive subject like this.
> 
> And, please don't take offence, but if you are going to refer to various races or nationalities, please take the trouble to correctly spell that identity.
> ...




They usually refer to me as aussie scum and my aussie mum an aussie sl*t......


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

doctorj said:
			
		

> Lets play the ball not the man folks.
> 
> To my mind, Australian Lebanese are more than entitled to protest the invasion and bombing of their homeland.  Their friends and family are dying.  You cannot possibly expect them to protest for the return of the soldiers - the main issue in their mind, and rightly so, is safety of their loved ones.  How would you react?
> 
> ...





Yes and no Doctor as the summary is way to short for this subject


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Do a google search and avoid the Arabic versions as the writers wont live long if they provide  a balanced version.




I really hate the label "racist" because it is so often misused. Can you explain to me how this comment is NOT racist?


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> They usually refer to me as aussie scum and my aussie mum an aussie sl*t......




That is inexcusable of course, but not really connected with the topic at hand.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> That is inexcusable of course, but not really connected with the topic at hand.




Wayne its how they treated the other protesters that is a concern as you will have to read the printed version of the Sunday Herald Sun.


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## warney (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> They usually refer to me as aussie scum and my aussie mum an aussie sl*t......



this is not uncommon,aussies i know have certain rules they have to live by in southwestern sydney,such as never admit that you are an aussie as it may get you hurt or worse if you are female.this is not fiction or in a far away country!its here,sad isnt it.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

warney said:
			
		

> this is not uncommon,aussies i know have certain rules they have to live by in southwestern sydney,such as never admit that you are an aussie as it may get you hurt or worse if you are female.this is not fiction or in a far away country!its here,sad isnt it.




This is very true Wayne and until you have experienced it you will never realise the underlying danger that is within until a certian amount of power is obtained by them which is happenning right now and being monitered by our very own intelligence agencies.


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## the_godfather4 (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> GodFather
> 
> what you need to do is study the whole history of Israel and the reasons for its rebirth as a nation in 1948 and find out the reasons why the Arabs hate them and want them driven into the sea and how the Arab leaders have propagated racism and lies about them. What is terribble is these people have brang their racism and murderous doctrine to our land and it was ignored from the beginning and we actually have a bigger problem than our intelligence services are telling us.




Mate, i have studied the history in depth and have written a thesis and numerous papers on the topic....I challenge anyone who has a more balanced knowledge on the topic........not sure where u r getting your facts from but while u r at it, when you have studied the REAL history, read up a little on the "actual" and not popular "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" we will probably be able to have a civilised discussion which looks at all sides of this argument and why, as all my close jewish friends will tell you, what is happening is nothing short of barbarianism and straight out murder....israeli support from _civilised _ countries such as Oz only strengthens the zionist cause and makes us look like puppets doing the US dance.........


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Mate, i have studied the history in depth and have written a thesis and numerous papers on the topic....I challenge anyone who has a more balanced knowledge on the topic........not sure where u r getting your facts from but while u r at it, when you have studied the REAL history, read up a little on the "actual" and not popular "Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion" we will probably be able to have a civilised discussion which looks at all sides of this argument and why, as all my close jewish friends will tell you, what is happening is nothing short of barbarianism and straight out murder....israeli support from _civilised _ countries such as Oz only strengthens the zionist cause and makes us look like puppets doing the US dance.........





Godfather I suspect now that u are telling fibs or you read Yasser Arrafats history......


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

AND FOR THE RECORD I HAVE NEVER SAID I AGREE WITH THE DEATHS OF ANY INDIVIDUAL IN THIS CONFLICT......it was over what went on at the protests.


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## the_godfather4 (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Godfather I suspect now that u are telling fibs or you read Yasser Arrafats history......




I dont even consider Arafat as a blip in history........he was just as useless as GW Bush and the other puppets in history.......i have no time for fibs, not on this topic......


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> This is very true Wayne and until you have experienced it you will never realise the underlying danger that is within until a certian amount of power is obtained by them which is happenning right now and being monitered by our very own intelligence agencies.




Don't tell me about not experiencing it. I have several false teeth all for the crime of having an american accent.... done by Aussies. However I don't blame all Aussies for this.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> I dont even consider Arafat as a blip in history........he was just as useless as GW Bush and the other puppets in history.......i have no time for fibs, not on this topic......




Godfather this statement says it all that u really are making it up as you see fit. Once again my concern is what the Lebonese protestors left out at the protest and its this silence is what is the major concern.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Godfather this statement says it all that u really are making it up as you see fit. Once again my concern is what the Lebonese protestors left out at the protest and its this silence is what is the major concern.




What did they leave out?  

You're insinuating something here and nobody knows what you are driving at. Come on out and say it... if it is true.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Don't tell me about not experiencing it. I have several false teeth all for the crime of having an american accent.... done by Aussies. However I don't blame all Aussies for this.




Wayne these Aussies must have listened to leftist lying journalists corrupted by middle eastern jihadists as any real aussie would have realised that the freedom that the Lebonese used to protest today came about by U.S. help during WW2 so they  have a lot to be thankful to America for than they realise.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> What did they leave out?
> 
> You're insinuating something here and nobody knows what you are driving at. Come on out and say it... if it is true.




Your the only one saying it in those terms


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Your the only one saying it in those terms




Then what is your point FFS?


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Then what is your point FFS?




Wayne go back to post one of the thread and read and thats what I am saying.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Wayne these Aussies must have listened to leftist lying journalists corrupted by middle eastern jihadists as any real aussie would have realised that the freedom that the Lebonese used to protest today came about by U.S. help during WW2 so they  have a lot to be thankful to America for than they realise.




Sorry, that is just absurd. These particular Aussies were just prejudiced, pure and simple.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Wayne go back to post one of the thread and read and thats what I am saying.




Then what you are saying is lacking in any real balance and fails to take into consideration the whole range of issues. 

cause => effect


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Then what you are saying is lacking in any real balance and fails to take into consideration the whole range of issues.
> 
> cause => effect





Thats cool by me as you have every right to your opinion as this is what the Americans fought and died for and now protect and lucky you dont live in the Gaza strip or Lebonon as you will surley fall into harms way if you disagreed with Hezza and Hamas.


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

Hezbollah agrees prisoner-swap talks
From correspondents in Beirut
July 23, 2006
THE radical Lebanese group Hezbollah has agreed to indirect talks with Israel on a prisoner exchange, Lebanon's parliament speaker Nabih Berri said in Beirut.

The pro-Iranian Shiite movement was ready to discuss with mediators the release of two Israeli soldiers that it abducted 12 days ago in a cross-border raid, Mr Berri said, adding the Lebanese Government would play a key role in the talks.

"The Lebanese Government will lead the exchange through the intermediary of a third party," he said.

Israel is holding three Lebanese and hundreds of Palestinians in its prisons.


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## wayneL (23 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Thats cool by me as you have every right to your opinion as this is what the Americans fought and died for and now protect and lucky you dont live in the Gaza strip or Lebonon as you will surley fall into harms way if you disagreed with Hezza and Hamas.




So Aussies Brits Canadians Polish Norwegians etc etc etc had nothing to do with it huh?


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## TheAnalyst (23 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> So Aussies Brits Canadians Polish Norwegians etc etc etc had nothing to do with it huh?




They helped


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## TheAnalyst (24 July 2006)

Hezbollah is listed as a terrorist organisation by the United States and Australia, as well as Britain, Canada and Israel. Yet it is able to control southern Lebanon and is so well armed that it can do this:

Israeli troops are massed on the border for a possible large-scale ground offensive against Hizbollah guerrillas holed up in southern Lebanon who have fired more than 600 rockets into Israel in the past 11 days, killing 15 civilians.

Hezbollah’s rockets are now so advanced it can fire them even into Haifa. What other weapons does Hezbollah have - or expect to get from Iran? What weapons do other Islamist terror groups now have or hope to obtain? This is the reality and fear that has driven so much of the West’s response to 9/11.


Tell the Lebonese leaders in Australia to denounce Hezzabollah and see if they will? Guarantee they wont......


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## the_godfather4 (24 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Godfather this statement says it all that u really are making it up as you see fit. Once again my concern is what the Lebonese protestors left out at the protest and its this silence is what is the major concern.




No idea how u would arrive at that assumption but to be quite honest, having read your posts, your statements are based on your prejudice and xenophobia and not fact.......my intelligence is insulted by your posts and I refuse to enter into arguments with those who are just not interested in anything else but their own ideas and perceived sense of history. Have a dig at me as much as you like mate but at least when the dust has settled and people finally wake up, I know I will be on the right side of history. Im outa here.  

PS I'll send you a free copy of my book when its released. Then maybe we can discuss this in a civilised manner


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## wayneL (24 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> No idea how u would arrive at that assumption but to be quite honest, having read your posts, your statements are based on your prejudice and xenophobia and not fact.......my intelligence is insulted by your posts and I refuse to enter into arguments with those who are just not interested in anything else but their own ideas and perceived sense of history. Have a dig at me as much as you like mate but at least when the dust has settled and people finally wake up, I know I will be on the right side of history. Im outa here.
> 
> PS I'll send you a free copy of my book when its released. Then maybe we can discuss this in a civilised manner




Probably the best approach Godfather.

Let me know when you book is finished.

Cheers


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## It's Snake Pliskin (24 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Probably the best approach Godfather.
> 
> Let me know when you book is finished.
> 
> Cheers




So now everyone is writing books, wow.


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## the_godfather4 (24 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> It`s this type of comment that is ruidiculous and shows the poster`s maturity, or lack of.
> 
> Well for your information God4: I lived in the Bansktown area of Sydney for over 3 years and worked there as well. If you don`t know it is the Lebanon of Australia.
> 
> ...




Snake, 
I lived in St Marys in Sydneys west for 3 years as I was growing up and I can honestly tell you that even as a 'pure' Aussie (ie not new Australian) I also felt that a safe trip down to the shops was a blessing....I was rolled for my shoes 3 times and was jumped by groups of piss heads at least twice (2 nights in hospital) and guess what not a leb in sight.....this does not lead me to paint my fellow aussies as thugs or meatheads.....
I have lived in the US, France, UK, HK, Beirut, and Spain for at least 6-24mths and I can see how dangerous generalisations can be......basically, in the US and europe, Aussie blokes like me are all considered to be beer drinking yobbos who dont have any respect for women.....and this is coming from the "educated" side of those societies...... so for us to form opinions of a whole country and stand by while attrocities are being commited based on the actions of a "meathead" minority is very frustrating.........I see the meathead lebs that make us stereotype the rest, but i have also seen the good majority who live in peace in their own country (as i have seen both in Australia).......

As for the Israelis being hated so much, the answers lie in the similar crap they instill in the brains of their young (as do the muslim fundamentalists)....just read the link i already attached on the WW3 thread regarding what they truly think of the 'goyim' or gentiles......


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## the_godfather4 (24 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> So now everyone is writing books, wow.




I recall a post where you questioned my "maturity" at having a cheap shot at you.....seems u and i are not that different after all...... :


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## the_godfather4 (24 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Probably the best approach Godfather.
> 
> Let me know when you book is finished.
> 
> Cheers




Will do mate.....i appreciate your balanced and fair approach to this topic....


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## dubiousinfo (24 July 2006)

Are we allowed to shoot rockets at NZ when the all blacks beat us?  


But seriously, why aren't the Lebanese doing more to stop the rockets being fired from their country? It's their country the Hezbollah are operating from.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (24 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> I recall a post where you questioned my "maturity" at having a cheap shot at you.....seems u and i are not that different after all...... :




You have misinterpreted my statement. Wow means wow, without the sarcasm. Note the smilie smiling - a genuine wow there God4.

Yes those beer drinking yobbos, I can see why they sterreo type them. St Marys, hmm a little scary out there.

Let me know when that book is done.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (24 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Snake,
> I lived in St Marys in Sydneys west for 3 years as I was growing up and I can honestly tell you that even as a 'pure' Aussie (ie not new Australian) I also felt that a safe trip down to the shops was a blessing....I was rolled for my shoes 3 times and was jumped by groups of piss heads at least twice (2 nights in hospital) and guess what not a leb in sight.....this does not lead me to paint my fellow aussies as thugs or meatheads.....
> I have lived in the US, France, UK, HK, Beirut, and Spain for at least 6-24mths and I can see how dangerous generalisations can be......basically, in the US and europe, Aussie blokes like me are all considered to be beer drinking yobbos who dont have any respect for women.....and this is coming from the "educated" side of those societies...... so for us to form opinions of a whole country and stand by while attrocities are being commited based on the actions of a "meathead" minority is very frustrating.........I see the meathead lebs that make us stereotype the rest, but i have also seen the good majority who live in peace in their own country (as i have seen both in Australia).......
> 
> As for the Israelis being hated so much, the answers lie in the similar crap they instill in the brains of their young (as do the muslim fundamentalists)....just read the link i already attached on the WW3 thread regarding what they truly think of the 'goyim' or gentiles......




Yes it is important that even us Australians don`t assume we are beer drinking yobbos.


----------



## Bobby (25 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> Yes it is important that even us Australians don`t assume we are beer drinking yobbos.




Snake,

I'm a beer drinking yobbo, & Iv'e paid enough tax to have my say   

Citizenship criterion *MUST* be questioned  !
Why not a plebisite on who we let in ,next federal election.

Time is running out ....Tick tick tick  :sheep: 

Bob.


----------



## TheAnalyst (25 July 2006)

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,19904271-661,00.html


Rice peace plan rejected

July 25, 2006 12:00am


LEBANESE parliamentary speaker Nabih Berri today rejected a ceasefire proposal by US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice aimed at ending Israel's war on Hizbollah.
A meeting between Dr Rice and Mr Berri, who is acting as an intermediary for the Shi'ite Muslim Hizbollah group, was marked by "differences," a source close to Mr Berri said after the surprise visit to Beirut by the top US diplomat.

"There was no agreement because Dr Rice insisted on a mechanism on a global settlement before a ceasefire," the source said on condition of anonymity.

"Rice set, as conditions for a ceasefire, the withdrawal of Hizbollah to the Litani river and the deployment of an international force in the area which would, she said, allow the return of displaced people."

The Litani river is about 20km from the border with Israel, marking an area that is largely under the control of Hizbollah.

Mr Berri, a veteran Shi'ite politician, had called for a ceasefire to be followed by a prisoner exchange and for Israel to allow the return of Lebanese who had fled the south "before discussing a complete plan to resolve the conflict".

But Dr Rice had refused to discuss an exchange of prisoners, the source said.

Hizbollah has demanded the release of Arab prisoners held in Israeli jails in return for two soldiers it captured in a deadly border raid on July 12 that triggered Israel's massive offensive on Lebanon.

Asked by reporters travelling with Dr Rice about the reported plan for some sort of buffer zone, US Assistant Secretary of State David Welch said: "I am not going to go into that."

In an earlier meeting, Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Siniora angrily attacked Israel for its relentless bombing campaign which has claimed mainly civilian victims.

"Israeli aggression is not only targeting Hizbollah but Lebanon itself, sending it back 50 years with its bombardment," he told Dr Rice.

Mr Siniora cited more than 350 deaths in Lebanon since the start of the campaign and some 1,500 wounded, a statement issued by his office said. – AFP


Tell the Lebonese in Australia to protest this!!!!!!!


----------



## Rafa (25 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Tell the Lebonese in Australia to protest this!!!!!!!





Protest what exactly Analyst....
1. Hizbollah not pulling out to the Litani River.... Last I checked, Hisbollah are funded by Syria and Iran... Lebanon haven't the army or the resources to stop them!
2. No agreement on prisoner swap... two soldiers vs hunders of civilians being held in israeli jails without charge! hmmm...
3. Or the sending of Lebanon back 50 years, 350 dead and 1500 wounded for no fault of their own...

Analyst... i've read your posts in this thread.... you are a joke... stick to posting about stocks...

tho hang on a sec... i've seen your posts on GTP.... enuf said!!!

PS: For the record, i am fully symathetic to plight of Israel... but what they are doing to Lebanon is plain wrong, and will not solve anything... They are blowing up civilians when the real problem is Syria and Iran...!


----------



## TheAnalyst (25 July 2006)

Rafa said:
			
		

> Protest what exactly Analyst....
> 1. Hizbollah not pulling out to the Litani River.... Last I checked, Hisbollah are funded by Syria and Iran... Lebanon haven't the army or the resources to stop them!
> 2. No agreement on prisoner swap... two soldiers vs hunders of civilians being held in israeli jails without charge! hmmm...
> 3. Or the sending of Lebanon back 50 years, 350 dead and 1500 wounded for no fault of their own...
> ...




Thanks and may hezzabollah bless you with a rocket



			
				Rafa said:
			
		

> tho hang on a sec... i've seen your posts on GTP.... enuf said!!!
> 
> PS: For the record, i am fully symathetic to plight of Israel... but what they are doing to Lebanon is plain wrong, and will not solve anything... They are blowing up civilians when the real problem is Syria and Iran...!




Thanks and may hezzabollah bless you with a big rocket up your..........trading account


----------



## Rafa (26 July 2006)

Your welcome... 

PS: when you quoted me, you stuffed up and inserted your comments within the quote... please ammend if you can... thanks...


----------



## Joe Blow (26 July 2006)

Rafa said:
			
		

> PS: when you quoted me, you stuffed up and inserted your comments within the quote... please ammend if you can... thanks...




Amended.


----------



## TheAnalyst (26 July 2006)

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20876,19910623-7583,00.html

Mark Steyn: If only they had refused to indulge Arafat
The myth that the Muslim world's problems are directly linked to the Palestinian question has gone up in flames, argues Mark Steyn
July 26, 2006

uly 26, 2006
A FEW years back, when folks talked airily about "the Middle East peace process" and "a two-state solution", I used to say that the trouble was the Palestinians saw a two-state solution as an interim stage en route to a one-state solution. I underestimated Islamist depravity. As we now see in Gaza and southern Lebanon, any two-state solution would be an interim stage en route to a no-state solution.

In one of the most admirably straightforward of Islamist declarations, Hussein Massawi, the Hezbollah leader behind the slaughter of US and French forces 20 years ago, put it this way: "We are not fighting so that you will offer us something. We are fighting to eliminate you."

Swell. But suppose he got his way, what then? Suppose every last Jew in Israel were dead or fled, what would rise in place of the Zionist entity? It would be something like the Hamas-Hezbollah terror squats in Gaza and Lebanon writ large. Hamas won a landslide in the Palestinian elections, and Hezbollah similarly won formal control of key Lebanese cabinet ministries. But they're not Mussolini: they have no interest in making the trains run on time. And, to be honest, who can blame them? 

If you're a big-time terrorist mastermind, it's frankly a bit of a bore to find yourself deputy under-secretary at the ministry of pensions, particularly when you're no good at it, and no matter how lavishly the European Union throws money at you, there never seems to be any in the kitty when it comes to making the payroll. So, like a business that has over-diversified, Hamas and Hezbollah retreated to their core activity: Jew-killing.

In Causeries du Lundi, Charles-Augustin Sainte-Beuve recalls a Parisian dramatist watching the revolutionary mob rampaging through the street below and beaming: "See my pageant passing!" That's how opportunist Arabs and indulgent Europeans looked on the intifada and the terrorists and the schoolgirl suicide bombers: as a kind of uber-authentic piece of performance art with which to torment the Jews and the Americans. They never paused to ask themselves: Hey, what if it doesn't stop there?

Well, about 30 years too late, they're asking it now. For the first quarter-century of Israel's existence, the Arab states fought more or less conventional wars against the Zionists and kept losing. So then they figured it was easier to anoint a terrorist movement and in 1974 declared Yasser Arafat's Palestine Liberation Organisation to be the "sole legitimate representative of the Palestinian people", which is quite a claim for an organisation then barely a decade old. Amazingly, the Arab League persuaded the UN, the EU, Bill Clinton and everyone else to go along with it and to treat the old monster as a head of state who lacked only a state to head.

It's true that many nationalist movements have found it convenient to adopt the guise of terrorists.

But, as the Palestinian movement descended from airline hijackings to the intifada to self-detonating in pizza parlours, it never occurred to its glamorous patrons to wonder if maybe this was, in fact, a terrorist movement conveniently adopting the guise of nationalism.

In 1971, in the lobby of the Cairo Sheraton, Palestinian terrorists shot Wasfi al-Tal, the prime minister of Jordan, at point-blank range. As he fell to the floor dying, one of his killers began drinking the blood gushing from his wounds. Doesn't that strike you as a little, um, overwrought? Three decades later, when bombs went off in Bali, killing hundreds of tourists plus local waiters and barmen, Bruce Haigh, a former Aussie diplomat in Indonesia, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, had no doubt where to put the blame. As he told Australia's Nine Network: "The root cause of this issue has been America's backing of Israel on Palestine."

Suppose this were true: that terrorists blew up Australian honeymooners and Scandinavian stoners in Balinese nightclubs because of "the Palestinian question". Doesn't this suggest that these people are, at a certain level, nuts? After all, there are plenty of Irish Republican Army sympathisers across the world (try making the Ulster Unionist case in a Boston bar), yet they never thought to protest against British rule in Northern Ireland by blowing up, say, German tourists in Thailand.

Yet the more the thin skein of Palestinian grievance was stretched to justify atrocities halfway around the world, the more the Arab League big-shot emirs and EU foreign ministers looked down from their windows and cooed, "See my parade passing!"

They've now belatedly realised they're at that stage in the creature feature where the monster has mutated into something bigger and crazier. Until the remarkably kinda-robust statement by the Group of Eight and the unprecedented denunciation of Hezbollah by the Arab League, the rule in any conflict in which Israel is involved - Israel v PLO, Israel v Lebanon, Israel v (Your Team Here) - is that the Jews are to blame. But Saudi-Egyptian-Jordanian opportunism on Palestine has caught up with them: it has finally dawned on them that a strategy of consciously avoiding resolution of the Palestinian question has helped deliver Gaza and Lebanon and Syria into the hands of a regime that's a far bigger threat to the Arab world than the Zionist entity.

Cairo and co grew so accustomed to whining about the Palestinian pseudo-crisis decade in, decade out, that it never occurred to them that they might face a real crisis one day: a Middle East dominated by an apocalyptic Iran and its local enforcers, in which Arab self-rule turns out to have been a mere interlude between the Ottoman sultans and the eternal eclipse of a Persian nuclear umbrella.

The Zionists got out of Gaza and it's now Talibanistan redux. The Zionists got out of Lebanon and the most powerful force in the country (with an ever-growing demographic advantage) are Iran's Shia enforcers. There haven't been any Zionists anywhere near Damascus in 60 years and Syria is in effect Iran's first Sunni Arab prison bitch. For the other regimes in the region, Gaza, Lebanon and Syria are dead states that have risen as vampires.

Meanwhile, Kofi Annan in a remarkable display of urgency (at least when compared with Sudan, Rwanda, Congo and others) is proposing apropos Israel and Hezbollah that UN peacekeepers go in to keep the peace not between two sovereign states but between a sovereign state and a usurper terrorist gang. Contemptible as he is, the secretary-general shows a shrewd understanding of the way the world is heading: already, non-state actors have more sophisticated rocketry than many EU nations; and if Iran has its way, its proxies will be implied nuclear powers. Maybe we should put them on the UN Security Council.

So, what is in reality Israel's first non-Arab war is a glimpse of the world the day after tomorrow: the EU and the Arab League won't quite spell it out but, to modify that Le Monde headline, they are all Jews now.

Mark Steyn, a Canadian and US columnist, is a regular contributor to The Australian's opinion page. He will address the Centre for Independent Studies in Sydney on August 14 and the Institute of Public Affairs in Melbourne on August 17.

This is exactly why the protestors did not denounce Hezzabollah here in Australia and this is the real danger.


----------



## the_godfather4 (26 July 2006)

Anyone seen these guys?????

www.nkusa.org/

they barely rate a mention on our news coverage.....yet they r well known in many parts of the world......they will  probably get labelled anti-semetic


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## wayneL (26 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Anyone seen these guys?????
> 
> www.nkusa.org/
> 
> they barely rate a mention on our news coverage.....yet they r well known in many parts of the world......they will  probably get labelled anti-semetic




Important topic this.

Not all Jews are zionists. And not all zionists are Jews. There are Christian Zionists as well.... they are the ones with the red button


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Important topic this.
> 
> Not all Jews are zionists. And not all zionists are Jews. There are Christian Zionists as well.... they are the ones with the red button




Not all people are prejudiced and not all prejudiced are wrong  

Yes an interesting link. It appears all religions have their differences. 
The other day Orthodox and (straight  ) jews were all bonded together supporting Israel in its action of late. So it appears those orthodox jews don`t all agree unlike the zionists.

Wayne I would like to hear more about the Cristian zionists. I am truly interested. I`m not aware of any in Australia, but what about the US?


----------



## wayneL (27 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> Not all people are prejudiced and not all prejudiced are wrong
> 
> Yes an interesting link. It appears all religions have their differences.
> The other day Orthodox and (straight  ) jews were all bonded together supporting Israel in its action of late. So it appears those orthodox jews don`t all agree unlike the zionists.
> ...




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Zionism

... and more here http://www.google.com.au/search?cli...q=christian+zionists&meta=&btnG=Google+Search


----------



## TheAnalyst (27 July 2006)

http://www.eretzyisroel.org/~dhershkowitz/

In 1831 Ottoman rule was interrupted by Muhammad 'Ali, who occupied Palestine and Syria until 1840. A new era began which was characterized by political and social reform aimed at centralizing control of the country, modernizing the administration and granting equal rights to non-Muslim minorities. The country was opened for the first time to widespread political, cultural and economic activity by the European powers. These new developments continued after the Ottoman rule was resumed in 1840-41. During the second half of the nineteenth century direct Ottoman control was gradually consolidated in all parts of the country, Bedouin attacks were checked, general security increased, the oppression of the urban population was eased to a considerable extent, and the involvement of the European powers expanded greatly. These developments brought about certain improvements in the country's economy and in the conditions of the inhabitants.

Jews of the Holy Land in the 19th Century
The Jews were concentrated mainly in the four "Holy Cities": Jerusalem, Safed, Tiberias and Hebron. By and large, the Jews were regarded as second-class citizens of the Ottoman Empire. They encountered legal discrimination at every turn, and evidence given by them was not recognized by the courts. Jews were debarred from attaining high government office. They were subject to daily mockery and scorn, were forbidden to ride camels or horses within the city limits, and were obliged to make way for Moslems. Their persons and possessions were unprotected by law and prone to constant abuse (without any possibility of appealing to the courts of justice). M. Reisher, who lived in Jerusalem, writes in 1866:

      "When a Jew walked among them in the market, one would throw a stone at him in order to kill him, another would pull his beard, and a third his ear-lock, yet another spit on his face, and he became a symbol of abuse". 

Although their principal source of income was the "Haluka" (financial support from abroad), heavy taxes were imposed on them by the Turkish authorities. Subsequent to the Crimean War (1853-1854), there was a gradual improvement in the predicament of the Jews, mainly as the result of the protection granted them by the consuls in certain cases. In any event, they continued to be second-class citizens reliant on the clemency of the ruling authorities and the Moslem population. From the 1840's the Jewish community grew considerably through new waves of immigrants, mainly from Russia. In the 1880's the Jewish population was further augmented by refugees and agricultural settlements which were founded in many parts of the country. Jewish urban centers (particularly in Jerusalem, Jaffa and Haifa), developed as well.


----------



## Rafa (27 July 2006)

from The Australian...

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19925802-601,00.html



> Greg Sheridan: Bad move by Israel
> We should lament the probable destruction of the brightest star on the Middle East horizon, writes Foreign editor Greg Sheridan
> July 27, 2006
> 
> ...




Its quite clear that there is only one victim of this war between Syria/Iran and Israel.... and that is Lebanon and its people!


----------



## TheAnalyst (27 July 2006)

Israel is the real victim as they did not draw first blood......how many times must the blood of the Jews be drawn before they may retaliate? Your own country and its allies have not condenmed Israel so i hope that tells you something......like for instance Rafa, God3 and WayneL that you are traitors to your country and its armed forces and think you should go live in Syria, Iran or Lebonon and dont come back as you are a high treason risk and should be placed on the ASIO security warning list.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

Rafa said:
			
		

> from The Australian...
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19925802-601,00.html
> 
> ...




And that would be the Lebanese christians and some of the islamic populace    

As far as Hezbollah goes, they are getting a good bit of woopass at the moment.


----------



## Rafa (27 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> As far as Hezbollah goes, they are getting a good bit of woopass at the moment.





Hezboullah derserve all the whoop assing it can get... so do Iran and Syria...


Analyst... I have said all along that Israel targetting the general populace of Lebanon is wrong... I have also maintained all along the complete support for Israel DISMEMBERING the Syrian and Iranian govts... That would in fact decapitate Hezbullah and Hamas...

I also believe this is broadly in line with our Govt response... 

So, please retract your statement...  In my opinion, your warmongering ways, and your devisive posts are more a threat to national security than my views.... 

(please read my posts in WW3, and other treads... before making statements such as the one you made...)


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Israel is the real victim as they did not draw first blood......how many times must the blood of the Jews be drawn before they may retaliate? Your own country and its allies have not condenmed Israel so i hope that tells you something......like for instance Rafa, God3 and WayneL that you are traitors to your country and its armed forces and think you should go live in Syria, Iran or Lebonon and dont come back as you are a high treason risk and should be placed on the ASIO security warning list.




What is ASIO going to charge them with? An opinion?

Analyst, it is ok in society, as you said before, to be able to opine without having your head cut off. It`s the same here.


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## visual (27 July 2006)

Taking the war to Iran and Syria does not mean that innocent people are not going to pay the price,if anything those countries would pay a higher price in terms of innocents lives than in Lebanon.The Lebanese in fact allowed the hesbollah to not only hide among them but supported them as well in Iran wonder how many people actually agree with the moron and his long name,in Syria people have to be organized to demonstrate wonder how many would actually demonstrate if they really had a choice.
I know this post is neither here or there,but it seems to me the more you keep people ignorant the easier it is to manipulate them.
Maybe the UN should work on an education bomb,one you could drop into these countries as books. :


----------



## TheAnalyst (27 July 2006)

Rafa said:
			
		

> Hezboullah derserve all the whoop assing it can get... so do Iran and Syria...
> 
> 
> Analyst... I have said all along that Israel targetting the general populace of Lebanon is wrong... I have also maintained all along the complete support for Israel DISMEMBERING the Syrian and Iranian govts... That would in fact decapitate Hezbullah and Hamas...
> ...





Ok Rafa....I take back my comments and state you are one of us on the allies side and no traitor.....but the other two are highly suspicious individuals.


----------



## TheAnalyst (27 July 2006)

http://www.theage.com.au/news/World/DFAT-wont-evacuate-child-brides/2006/07/27/1153816310516.html


DFAT 'won't evacuate child brides'

July 27, 2006 - 4:50PM


Some Australian Lebanese men have stayed behind in war-ravaged Beirut after officials refused to evacuate their teenage "child brides".

A spokesman for the immigration department (DIMA) told AAP some dual passport holders had turned up at evacuation points with wives younger than 18 - the legal age for marriage in Australia.

The men were told by Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade (DFAT) officers that while such marriages were legal in some societies, they were not recognised in Australia and no spouse visa could be issued.

"We are aware there have been a number of cases," an immigration department spokeswoman told AAP.

"We have to look at factors such as whether the marriage is lawful under Australian law and also the country in which it took place.

"(We also) look at whether there has been real consent when the marriage was entered into."

DFAT would not comment on specific cases.

However, it is understood at least one man demanded that not only his underage bride be evacuated back to Australia, but also a young baby.

He is said to have caused a scene when told his family would not be evacuated, warning he would take his gripe to the media.

DFAT said it was important people were familiar with the guidelines relating to evacuation.

"While spouses and dependant children of Australian citizens and permanent residents must have valid visas prior to arrival in Australia, the Australian government does not require that their visas be approved prior to evacuation from Lebanon," a DFAT spokesman said.

"(However) the authorities of receiving countries, notably Turkey, may require them.

"Where possible DIMA will seek to commence application processes prior to evacuation but decisions on applications can be made at a further point of evacuation outside Lebanon.

"It's in the interests of applicants to start the application process as soon as possible."

The government is no longer evacuating Australian passport holders from Lebanon, though Foreign Minister Alexander Downer has said it could begin doing so again if there was a need.

 © 2006 AAP


----------



## wayneL (27 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Israel is the real victim as they did not draw first blood......how many times must the blood of the Jews be drawn before they may retaliate? Your own country and its allies have not condenmed Israel so i hope that tells you something......like for instance Rafa, God3 and WayneL that you are traitors to your country and its armed forces and think you should go live in Syria, Iran or Lebonon and dont come back as you are a high treason risk and should be placed on the ASIO security warning list.




Why is having an opinion traitorous? We are talking about a conflict in a foreign nation. Australia in not involved and I have a different opinion about the belligerents to you. Traitor? Shear idiocy!!

Ah yes, but the first resort of the illogical and unintelligent; ad hominum attacks and accusations of treason.

There will be a job for you, if the brownshirts ever take over. Meanwhile, I remind you this is still a democracy. 

Chill dude.


----------



## the_godfather4 (27 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Ok Rafa....I take back my comments and state you are one of us on the allies side and no traitor.....but the other two are highly suspicious individuals.




Who is God3?   

Analyst, one more thing, look up the word *XENOPHOBIC*. That is if you know how to read.

And if you want to start potentially defamative rumours on a public forum because people do not agree with your opinions, then GROW UP. 

Lucky for me, my self worth is not measured by what others think of me (and particulalry NOT U). I know who and what I am. Maybe its time for some self evaluation mate.


----------



## the_godfather4 (27 July 2006)

Anyone notice how Analysts posts no longer have ANYTHING to do with the theme of this thread.....its basically become a forum for him to air his racist/intolerant/xenophobic views.......Sad when you think about it......In a funny way, I kinda pity him.   
Its 2006, not 1946.


----------



## wayneL (27 July 2006)

Analyst claims to be standing up for his land in another thread. I am still wondering what land he is standing up for. It seems to be Israel.

That's OK if he is an Israeli, but shouldn't expect Australians to blindly stand up for Israel without at least asking a few questions. I certainly don't see how it is treason to question Israels tactics when the inquisitor is AUSTRALIAN.

Nobody questions Israels right to exist, they are there now, right or wrong. But the circumstances by which this came about was problematic to say the least.

For popular support, governments must take the high moral ground. This is not happening. Both side are behaving like barbarians.


----------



## the_godfather4 (27 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> That's OK if he is an Israeli, but shouldn't expect Australians to blindly stand up for Israel without at least asking a few questions. I certainly don't see how it is treason to question Israels tactics when the inquisitor is AUSTRALIAN.




EXACTLY!!!!


----------



## TheAnalyst (27 July 2006)

Like I have said from the beginning of this thread the Lebonese protests in Australia were a support of terrorism because of the fact that they refused to denounce Hezzabolah and attacked other peaceful protestors and made no mention of the acts done against the Israeli's and had no respect of this nations soveriengty.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Like I have said from the beginning of this thread the Lebonese protests in Australia were a support of terrorism because of the fact that they refused to denounce Hezzabolah and attacked other peaceful protestors and made no mention of the acts done against the Israeli's and had no respect of this nations soveriengty.





If that is the case, then the protestors have said: "we the collective do not support the UN resolution requiring Hezbollah to disarm and disband"

So, it appears they would support terrorists based on ethnicity rather than what is right or wrong. Now that is racism! Though it will never be levelled at them.


----------



## wayneL (27 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Like I have said from the beginning of this thread the Lebonese protests in Australia were a support of terrorism because of the fact that they refused to denounce Hezzabolah and attacked other peaceful protestors and made no mention of the acts done against the Israeli's and had no respect of this nations soveriengty.




While going to great pains here NOT to support Hezbollah in their terrorist activities, does not Lebanon have sovereignity as well? 

Israel certainly has the right of self defense, but in the criminal law that we citizens are required to uphold under threat of incarceration, is that we are only permitted to defend with as much force as is applied by the attacker.

So if someone comes at us with their fists, we cannot blow their head of with a shotgun, even if in self defence... and we cannot go and blow away the attackers children and family members.

Yet is this not what Israel is doing? They have openly stated they will destroy 10 buildings for every Hezbollah rocket  

They cannot claim the high moral ground under these circumstances.

I don't know what happened in Sydney because you won't provide a link, but a few people doing the wrong thing in Sydney in not relevant to the central issue.

If they do the wrong thing then shame on us for allowing it to develop to the stage it has. It's not our fault, but we should have nipped this BS in the bud years ago.


----------



## wayneL (27 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> If that is the case, then the protestors have said: "we the collective do not support the UN resolution requiring Hezbollah to disarm and disband"
> 
> So, it appears they would support terrorists based on ethnicity rather than what is right or wrong. Now that is racism! Though it will never be levelled at them.




Snake,

Israel doesn't pay any attention to UN resolutions either. Both sides are racist.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> > Israel certainly has the right of self defense, but in the criminal law that we citizens are required to uphold under threat of incarceration, is that we are only permitted to defend with as much force as is applied by the attacker.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (27 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Snake,
> 
> Israel doesn't pay any attention to UN resolutions either. Both sides are racist.




I`m not getting into who is and who isn`t, but the observation was clear.

Regarding Israel what UN resolutions have they ignored?


----------



## wayneL (28 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> wayneL said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (28 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Snake Pliskin said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## wayneL (28 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> I`m not getting into who is and who isn`t, but the observation was clear.
> 
> Regarding Israel what UN resolutions have they ignored?






http://www.economist.com/world/na/displayStory.cfm?story_id=1378577


----------



## TheAnalyst (28 July 2006)

Posted by WayneL

I don't know what happened in Sydney because you won't provide a link, but a few people doing the wrong thing in Sydney in not relevant to the central issue.

Response

I can not provide a link as it can only be read in the Melbourne Herald Sun printed version but it is there pictures and all.


----------



## TheAnalyst (29 July 2006)

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailyteleg...s/the_threat_hezbollah_poses_is_catastrophic/

The threat Hezbollah poses is catastrophic

By Piers Akerman
Saturday, July 22, 2006 at 12:00pm 

HEZBOLLAH flags flew at rallies in Sydney and Melbourne last week. Hezbollah’s TV station, Al-Manar, was broadcast into Australia, spreading racist hatred and advocating violence, until its backer went broke last year.

Its headquarters were in southern Beirut until a few days ago, when an Israeli attack forced it to move.

Hezbollah is a proscribed terrorist organisation in the European Union, the US and here.

Any sensible person who has seen what has happened since Hezbollah attacked Israel would realise that this group is solely responsible for the mayhem.

Although some Australians waiting to be evacuated from Beirut are blaming the Australian Government for their plight, surely their outrage would be more effective if it were directed to Hezbollah’s leader, Hassan Nasrallah, or to his Iranian masters, the real engineers of this catastrophe.

Not to put too fine a point on it, there is a direct line running from Ayatollah Khomeini’s installation of an Islamist theocracy in Iran to Hezbollah today - Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Egypt are fully and fearfully aware of it.

Hezbollah’s abduction of two Israeli soldiers was not a one-off incident. It was part of a strategy designed to re-ignite the Middle East, and the flag-wavers in Melbourne and Sydney are willing dupes in this operation.

The turbanned team in Tehran does not recognise Israel’s right to exist any more than it recognises the rights of women or the rights of those who don’t follow Islam.

They want to see Israel drawn into a war of attrition which, they hope, will sap the commitment of support it enjoys from liberal democracies such as the US, Britain and Australia.

Unfortunately, they may get their wish if any of the missiles they have given Hezbollah strike the oil refineries surrounding the Israeli port of Haifa. Such a hit would not only create an ecological disaster but would kill tens of thousands of civilians.

Not that Hezbollah has ever shied from murdering civilians - that’s its modus operandi. It’s notan army, it’s a militia.

Its forces don’t wear uniforms or abide by any conventions, Geneva, Paris or Lakemba.

Conventions don’t apply to those who claim to be on a jihad dedicated to furthering Islam, as their banner-bearers in Australia well know.

Hezbollah, like the Palestinian terrorist group Hamas, has always used civilians as shields, setting up its arsenals in schools and hospitals, using ambulances to ferry its bombs and ammunition, establishing its headquarters in mosques.

It wants the civilian toll to rise - on both sides of the conflict - but it wants to blame Israel for the bloodshed, and most media organisations are more than happy to play along in this charade.

Ethicists have been excited by the buzzword “proportionality’’, but what proportional force would they suggest is reasonable to respond to an attack by a missile loaded with ball bearings, whose technology has been developed by the Chinese, is manufactured in Iran, armed in Syria and fired by Hezbollah from Lebanon?

The Lebanese government is powerless against Hezbollah’s occupying force, the Syrian government is acquiescent, and the Iranians are the masterminds.

The Chinese see a larger picture entirely; they are addicted to Iranian oil, and are prepared to prostitute themselves to keep it flowing, even to the extent of providing Pakistani-developed nuclear technology.

Hezbollah and Hamas subscribe to the suicide bombers’ mantra: we love death, you love life, therefore we will win.

These groups don’t flinch when they strap suicide vests on to children; indeed, they ensure their love of death and hatred of the West is inculcated from the cradle.

Much of the West has refused torecognise this reality until the terrorists struck at their hearts.

The US, like Australia, is a migrant nation that has for centuries welcomed the contributions of those seeking abetter life. In Britain, a growing Muslim population has been accommodated and provided for.

United Nations secretary-general Kofi Annan has not deserted his customarily craven position, calling on Israel to exercise restraint.

But Israel withdrew from Lebanon in 2000 and Gaza last year. It provides hospital care for those injured by suicide bombers, be they Palestinians or Israelis, and is unquestionably the injured party in this crisis.

Hezbollah has announced it has chemical and biological weapons, and has shown it can destroy the Haifa refineries.

Should it use this weaponry or devastate Israel’s economy, it’s a near-certainty Israel will attack Tehran’s nuclear program, just as it destroyed Iraq’s nuclear reactor in June, 1981.

In the face of the threat posed by Hezbollah, the world must prepare for this eventuality.

Australians cannot become hostage to this evil. They must understand that in this conflict, Israel is our ally in the pursuit ofliberty and freedom.

The foul malevolence represented by Iran and its murderous accomplices is beyond contemplation.

As lunatic as the Iranians may be, they are matched in their insanity by those among us who carry Hezbollah’s banner here.


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## TheAnalyst (29 July 2006)

http://www.theage.com.au/news/in-depth/tide-turning-in-the-arab-world/2006/07/28/1153816381171.html

Tide turning in the Arab world

Neil Macfarquhar
July 29, 2006

AT THE onset of the Lebanese crisis, Arab governments, starting with Saudi Arabia, slammed Hezbollah for recklessly provoking a war, providing what the US and Israel took as a wink and a nod to continue the fight.

Now, with hundreds of Lebanese dead and Hezbollah holding out against the vaunted Israeli military for 18 days, the tide of public opinion across the Arab world is surging behind the organisation, transforming the Shiite group's leader, Sheikh Hassan Nasrallah, into a folk hero and forcing a change in official statements.

The Saudi royal family and King Abdullah of Jordan, who were initially more worried about the rising power of Iran, Hezbollah's main sponsor, are now scrambling to distance themselves from Washington.

An outpouring of newspaper columns, cartoons, blogs and public poetry readings have showered praise on Hezbollah while attacking the US and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice for trumpeting American plans for a "new Middle East" that they say have led only to violence and repression.

Even al-Qaeda, run by violent Sunni Muslim extremists, has gotten in on the act, with its deputy leader, Ayman al-Zawahiri, releasing a taped message on Thursday saying that through its fighting in Iraq, his organisation was also trying to liberate Palestine.

Mouin Rabbani, a senior Middle East analyst with the International Crisis Group in Amman, Jordan, said: "The Arab-Israeli conflict remains the most potent issue in this part of the world."

Distinctive changes in tone are audible throughout the Sunni world. This week, President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt emphasised his attempts to arrange a ceasefire to protect all sects in Lebanon, while the Jordanian king announced that his country was dispatching medical teams "for the victims of Israeli aggression". Both countries have peace treaties with Israel.

The Saudi royal court has issued a warning that its 2002 peace plan ”” offering Israel full recognition by all Arab states in exchange for returning to the borders that pre-dated the 1967 Arab-Israeli war ”” could well perish. "If the peace option is rejected due to the Israeli arrogance," it said, "then only the war option remains, and no one knows the repercussions befalling the region, including wars and conflict that will spare no one, including those whose military power is now tempting them to play with fire."

The Saudis were effectively putting the West on notice that they would not exert pressure on anyone in the Arab world until Washington did something to halt the destruction of Lebanon, Saudi commentators said. There are evident concerns among Arab governments that a real victory for Hezbollah would further nourish the Islamist tide engulfing the region and challenge their authority. Hence their first priority is to cool simmering public opinion.


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## wayneL (29 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> http://blogs.news.com.au/dailyteleg...s/the_threat_hezbollah_poses_is_catastrophic/
> 
> The threat Hezbollah poses is catastrophic
> 
> ...




Ah yes, P. Ackerman. A distinctly Jewish name, no? Not withstanding the trangressions of some of the Lebanese community, that is possibly one of the most unprofessional articles I have ever seen written by a supposedly professional journalist.

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:...37857+piers+++jewish&hl=en&gl=au&ct=clnk&cd=8

I'm not a lefty. I've never voted labour or Aust democrat in my life, and never will. But that is the politically one sided and prejudiced article I have seen.

Obviously Mr Ackerman is a tad emotional and lacking in judgement over this issue.


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## TheAnalyst (29 July 2006)

It seems you are in absolute denial WayneL of some quite disturbing facts that should not be ignored and you must ask a real question. Where does the money and tradable goods go that the Lebonese send overseas to Lebonon.


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## Rafa (29 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> http://www.theage.com.au/news/in-depth/tide-turning-in-the-arab-world/2006/07/28/1153816381171.html
> 
> Tide turning in the Arab world
> 
> ...





Your own article says it Analyst...

Israel may have had the moral highground initially... and indeed the sympathy of many, including the Arab world (except Syria and Iran) but their stupid, indiscrimate and manic slaughter of lebabnese civilians is bringing about their own undoing....

They are digging their own grave...


Analyst, if you indeed are a Jew... I would be very concerned at the naive military strategy being used by your nation at this point in time... 

After all, as history has shown repeatedly, its not just those with the biggest guns who win... its those with the smartest minds...


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## Rafa (29 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> It seems you are in absolute denial WayneL of some quite disturbing facts that should not be ignored and you must ask a real question. Where does the money and tradable goods go that the Lebonese send overseas to Lebonon.





And on this point Analyst... I suggest you forget about the money sent back to Lebanon by a handfull of lebanese...

For it is us... you and me... every time we fill our car with petrol,  every time we go on our overseas holidays, everytime we eat exotic fruit transported for far away shores, that is paying for this...

Its OIL Analyst that is funding this, nothing else.... you and me and funding this, because we are addicted to the high standard of living...  brought about as a result of cheap OIL!


And if don't beleive me... do you know, South Lebanon, the hospitals and the infrastructure was built by Hezbullas Political wing.... do you know how... with OIL money from Iran...!!!

Then you ask wonder why people support Hezbulla.... Hezbualla has built souther lebanon... with your money and with mine...!


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## wayneL (29 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> It seems you are in absolute denial WayneL of some quite disturbing facts that should not be ignored and you must ask a real question. Where does the money and tradable goods go that the Lebonese send overseas to Lebonon.




Analyst,

I am not in denial of any disturbing facts whatsoever. I just look at both sets of disturbing facts.

The  second set of disturbing facts are what you appear to be in denial over.

This double standard is disturbing and a monumental hypocricy.


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## TheAnalyst (29 July 2006)

Rafa said:
			
		

> And on this point Analyst... I suggest you forget about the money sent back to Lebanon by a handfull of lebanese...
> 
> For it is us... you and me... every time we fill our car with petrol,  every time we go on our overseas holidays, everytime we eat exotic fruit transported for far away shores, that is paying for this...
> 
> ...





I am on LPG and I am not a Jew either.


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## TheAnalyst (29 July 2006)

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19950784-1702,00.html

Lebanon protesters mob PM's car
July 29, 2006
VIOLENT scuffles have broken out between police and Lebanese protesters who mobbed Prime Minister John Howard's car as he left a Liberal Party conference in Perth.

Mr Howard was leaving the Western Australian Liberal Party state conference when about 200 protesters, many of whom were waving Lebanese flags and shouting "we want peace", mobbed his vehicle.

Protesters punched, kicked and threw projectiles at Mr Howard's car as police struggled to keep them at bay.

Mr Howard's entourage sped from the scene as police wrestled protesters to the ground.

The Prime Minister said this week he understood Israel's decision to carry out its devastating military offensive against Lebanon to put an end to attacks by Hezbollah guerillas who have fired rockets deep into Israeli territory and are holding two Israeli soldiers captive.


Get rid of these aussie hating vermon....


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## It's Snake Pliskin (29 July 2006)

It appears the bleeding hearts are in denial. 

Israel and PALESTINE are both not adhearing to resolutions imposed on them. 
Lebanon is supporting a terrorist organisation (supported by Australians) on its soil.
Iran is a threat to the world stability.
Israel must eliminate Hezbollah.
Israel wants peace but never gets it.
Palestine wants peace, but never gives it a chance.
Australians enjoy a good quality of life devoid of tribal factions and religious law. (some want this changed)
Books of hate towards western values are sold by immigrants. 

Bleeding hearts wakeup and smell the roses. Free speech of journalists should not be labelled biased when composed with fact. 

Analyst thanks for the posts and your concern is not misunderstood here.
Wayne, why not add another passport to your list  Though keep posting your thoughts. 

Enjoy your evening.


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## wayneL (29 July 2006)

You can continue to use right wing nationalistic cliche's all you like Snake. I will continue to add balance.

I don't for one moment support Hezbollah or what the protesters did today. Nor do I support the behaviour of immigrants who are antagonistic towards Oz.

Please do not interpret criticism of Israel as support for Hezbollah, that is downright dishonest; shame on you for inferring that.  

I simply point out that Israel is not the white hat. Bombing civilians is terrorism, whether perpetrated by Hezbollah or Israel.

Good evening.


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## the_godfather4 (29 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> You can continue to use right wing nationalistic cliche's all you like Snake. I will continue to add balance.
> 
> I don't for one moment support Hezbollah or what the protesters did today. Nor do I support the behaviour of immigrants who are antagonistic towards Oz.
> 
> ...




Amen to that!


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## It's Snake Pliskin (29 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Please do not interpret criticism of Israel as support for Hezbollah, that is downright dishonest; shame on you for inferring that.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (29 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Amen to that!




 :sleeping:


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## the_godfather4 (29 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> :sleeping:




Im still taking the peaceful route.....no more tit for tat with me.

Snake, i forgive u.  

Considering changing from the_godfather4 to "the_pope"

Watch this space


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## the_godfather4 (29 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> :sleeping:




Sweet dreams


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## It's Snake Pliskin (30 July 2006)

Wayne,

I am still waiting for you to highlight my inference. Be careful of accusations!


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## wayneL (30 July 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> It appears the bleeding hearts are in denial.
> 
> Israel and PALESTINE are both not adhearing to resolutions imposed on them.
> Lebanon is supporting a terrorist organisation (supported by Australians) on its soil.
> ...




I took that, in the context of the rest of the post, as the inference.

If I have misinterpreted, then I apologise. But am now at a loss as to what that meant. What did it mean?


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## It's Snake Pliskin (30 July 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> I took that, in the context of the rest of the post, as the inference.
> 
> If I have misinterpreted, then I apologise. But am now at a loss as to what that meant. What did it mean?





Wayne,

Inferences are quite clear and unambiguous. I accept your apology with kisses and hugs. :blover: 

I`m sorry if I have unnerved you, but it was sought of a joke. You have three passports, so think yourself very lucky.


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## TheAnalyst (31 July 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Im still taking the peaceful route.....no more tit for tat with me.
> 
> Snake, i forgive u.
> 
> ...





Britain's Prime minister took the false peaceful route as well prior to WW2 so tell that to the dead an maimed of that era........


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## wayneL (31 July 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> Britain's Prime minister took the false peaceful route as well prior to WW2 so tell that to the dead an maimed of that era........




So Chamberlain should have attacked Germany? How would that have avoided dead and maimed? Hang on.. I understand now! Thats why the US invaded Iraq!! To avoid their being any dead and maimed right?

Maybe we should attack Muslim Indonesia... just to avoid dead and maimed  in the future


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## Sean K (31 July 2006)

I think there are just too many people on the planet atm. It's human nature to defend our territory, and be untrustful. It's a natural survival mechanism. The more populous we become the more likely there is conflict.

I'd be interested to know peoples opinions on the *origin* of the conflict in the Middle East. The route cause. 

By my understanding, the conflict in the Middle East started around the time the Israelites led by Moses and Aron invaded Palestine. Sure there were other tribal wars but this was the catalyst for the religious based conflicts we see today. By history, 'Israel' is not the righful owner of the Middle East. They originally took it by force under the authority of God and then had it handed to them after WWII by the UN as an apology for the holocaust. Happy to be corrected there. 

How do we solve it? 

I think the only way we can live in harmony is a massive culling of the human population across the region, and for that matter, the planet. Obviously, I don't advocate a deliberate program to accomplish that, but we have done our best over the last hundred years to achieve this by proxi. That is, world wars, genocide, etc.

I think in the end, Mother Earth will accomplish it for us one way or the other.


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## Rafa (31 July 2006)

Analyst...
Glad your on LPG.... but I take it you understand the drift of my post...?

Also, apologies for calling you a Jew... 
(not that there is anything wrong with that... sorry, couldn't resist an old Seinfeld saying     )


Kennas, once again you make a good point...    

On the issue of how Israel got there in the first place... SBS is doing a doco on Israel and the historical accuracy of the Old Testament... 7:30pm Sunday... last episode is next Sunday, must watch...

To give you a brief synopsis of the story / history so far...

Abraham was the founding father of the Israelites 15th century BC.... (some evidence of this found),

The Egyptians were the dominant empire of the time, and Abrahams descendants were slaves to the Egytians..., (some evidence of this found),

Moses led an exodus, into Canaan, tho it certainly was't 2million Jews, maybe a few hundred, via the south of Sinai, (circumstantial evidence of this found),

The people settled in two regions, Israel in the North (rich and fertile) and Judah in the south (arid and poor)

David, Solomon, etc were chiefs of small tribes in Judah between the 10th and 9th centuries BC 

Israel was invaded by the Assyrian empire in the 8th century BC and amalgamated with it, Judah was left alone cause it was so poor... 

Josiah, the ruler of Judah in the 7th century BC, discovered / wrote the books recounting the stories of Genesis, the partriarchs (abraham and co), exodus, with moses, and then the great kings David and Solomon, of whom he was a descendant... 

These form the founding books of the Torah…  His aim, to unite all the tribes of the region to a single cause and to worship on God, who resides in Jerusalem (and hence making Jerusalem the Capital)… The new religion of Judah…. Judaism.



The first five books recount legends past down from generation to generation, and naturally they added their own exaggerations to it!  

Historically, not completely accurate, tho it served to inform the people that...
1. Israel/Judah is the chosen land for the people
2. Israel did once belong to Jews, not the Assyrians and it was a powerful kingdom
2. David was the original king of Israel / Judah and Solomon, his son, turned Israel / Judah into the mighty empire...
3. Josiah as descendant of David, is the rightful ruler of Judah, as well as Israel in the north, if they can capture it back from the Assyrians.

So that is it… The great wars fought by David, Solomon and co… the mass genocide, etc… DID NOT happen, and if it did, it certainly did not happen at the hands of the Jews… they simply weren’t strong or powerful enough at the time, contrary to what the Book of Kings said… e.g. the walls of Jericho were already down by the time the Jews rocked up… maybe the Assyrian or Mesopotamian empires before that did the damage… or GOD… but you can see why it looked like a miracle…

Regardless, the Jews did have abode in Israel and Judah… from the 10th century BC onwards… in relatively peaceful circumstances…

However, writing about supposed past wars and battles and heroic ancestors, did certainly help instil a sense of nationalism and pride amongst the inhabitants of Judah… And it also confirmed the validity and authority of Lineage… Abraham, Moses, David, Solomon and Josiah…

There it is… (one more series to go next Sunday 7:30…)…


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## Sean K (31 July 2006)

Thanks Rafa. Good summary. I've read all this in various places but it would have been great to see it on the box. Damn! Will try and tune in next Sunday, but I'm usually at a pub down the road at that time eating pizza.


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## rub92me (31 July 2006)

Reading the various opinons on this thread reminded me of the Roger Waters lyrics from 'Too much rope' :
Moslim or Christian, Mullah or Pope.
Preacher or poet, who is it wrote.
Give any one species too much rope.
And they'll f*** it up...


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## TheAnalyst (31 July 2006)

http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/witness-disrupts-terror-hearing/2006/07/31/1154198056859.html

Witness disrupts terror hearing

Ian Munro
July 31, 2006 - 2:58PM
AdvertisementAdvertisement

A terrorism committal hearing in Melbourne erupted in uproar after a witness gestured at the defendants, calling them "animals".

Witness Mahmoud Khodr admitted making the gesture when he was recalled to the court.

He said: "I stuck my finger up at one of the animals in the back."

Two spectators in the court were ejected as several of the defendants rose to their feet and one of the spectators called, "Animals, animals ”” why are they animals?"

Mr Khodr, who had earlier told the court of a trip to a Melbourne gun shop with one of the accused, explained that his grievance was personal.

"They robbed my house, that's the only reason I hate them," he said.

Magistrate Paul Smith described the interruptions as inexcusable and said he would not tolerate any repeat performance as the two spectators were taken from the court.

Neighbour 'suspected accused'

The court also heard today that a Melbourne man became suspicious of his neighbour during a conversation about the war in Iraq and was struck by the "piercing eyes" of Ahmed Raad, one of 13 men alleged to have formed a terror cell in Melbourne.

Raad, 23, of Fawkner, is one of 13 men charged with being a member of a terrorist group. Ten of the men accused were arrested in Melbourne and Sydney in November last year, another three in March this year.

Raad's neighbour Roberto Vinci said he had also had suspicions about the movements of two cars, which at different times appeared to be hidden in Raad's backyard.

"Both were parked right in the far corners of an otherwise empty yard, which seemed a bit odd," Mr Vinci said in a statement to the Federal Police.

Several weeks after Raad's home was raided in mid-2005, Vinci said that Raad told him: "You download a few pictures and all of a sudden you are a terrorist."

War talk 'suspicious'

Raad told him that Muslims were being blamed for a lot of ills in the world and were being victimised.

Mr Vinci said he had nothing against Raad, who mostly seemed friendly and approachable, but he had been alarmed during their conversation about the war.

"That's when the look in his eye changed and he had a really serious, piercing look in his eyes. That's when he said, 'They brought war to my country, and it's too late now, and the war has come to their country'."

The committal hearing, which began on July 24, was stalled last week when only seven of the accused turned up to court.

Some had been left behind at Barwon Prison after a transport mix-up, but the group's most central figure, Abdul Benbrika, claimed to have been bashed while being taken to an earlier court appearance.

Benbrika, 46, of Dallas, is facing six charges, including directing and supporting a terrorist organisation, with maximum penalties ranging from 10 to 25 years' jail.

Others facing charges are Aimen Joud, 21, of Hoppers Crossing, Fadal Sayadi, 26, of Coburg, Amer Haddara, 26, of Yarraville, Shane Kent, 29, of Meadow Heights, Abdulla Merhi, 21, of Fawkner, Hany Taha, 31, of Hadfield, Izzy Deen Atik, 26, of Williamstown, Bassam Raad, 24, of Brunswick, Majed Raad, 22, of Coburg, Shoue Hammoud, 26, of Hadfield, and Ezzit Raad, 24, of Preston.

All 13 suspects appeared in court today. They appeared in good spirits, laughing and joking among themselves when they arrived.

theage.com.au


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## TheAnalyst (2 August 2006)

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19991201-7582,00.html

ABC sorry for bias on children's show
Caroline Overington
August 02, 2006
THE ABC has apologised to the Jewish community for presenting biased, anti-Israeli information to school children during an episode of Behind the News.

The educational program described Hezbollah terrorists as "soldiers" and as "refugees" whose land had been "taken by Israel".

In a letter to the Executive Council of Australian Jewry, which lodged a formal complaint with Communications Minister Helen Coonan, the ABC admits the information presented on the program was "inappropriate".

Audience liaison manager Denise Musto said the ABC acknowledged "that the content failed to meet the requirements of balance and impartiality".

"In its attempt to be simple and concise, the story did not represent key relevant viewpoints," she said. "Some of the descriptions were over-simplistic and inappropriate."

Behind the News is a news program designed for school students. The episode on the Middle East crisis was shown on July 25, with the transcript removed from the ABC website this week.

Ms Musto said the "errors of judgment" were "regrettable and not indicative of the program's overall high standards". She said the content removed from the web was being reviewed and revised.

Council president Grahame Leonard earlier this week wrote to the ABC and Senator Coonan about "errors and lack of balance" in the program. He said Hezbollah could not accurately be described as a "Palestinian refugee organisation".

"It is an extremist Lebanese Shi'ite Muslim organisation," he said. "Its ideology is the same as that of Iran and includes the destruction of the state of Israel."

ECAJ director Geoffrey Zygier said it was "difficult to reduce a complex issue such as the Middle East to a few simple phrases".

The program said the UN "wants the two groups to stop fighting but Israel says it'll continue to fight until Hezbollah is destroyed", Mr Zygier said.

"It did not say Hezbollah would not stop fighting until all Jews are out of Israel.

"It's just wrong, straight out wrong."

Mr Zygier said the report said Israel was proclaimed a country for the Jewish people in 1948, "taking much of the land from the Palestinian Muslims".

He said that that statement "would not make sense to anybody who had read the Bible".


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## TheAnalyst (2 August 2006)

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19992668-1702,00.html

Hardline Jews allowed inside mosque
From correspondents in Jerusalem
August 02, 2006
THE Israeli high court today upheld a request by far-right Jewish activists to enter Islam's third holiest shrine, the Al-Aqsa mosque compound, which is also revered by Jews as the Temple Mount.

The decision to allow the controversial visit to the east Jerusalem mosque compound on Thursday was taken despite police warnings that it could spark riots in Israel and the occupied territories.

"The petitioners ... will be allowed to enter Temple Mount during visiting hours," the court decision read.

The small Temple Mount Faithful group requested to visit the compound, where according to Jewish tradition Herod's Temple stood, to mark the Jewish day of mourning for its destruction in 70 BC.

But despite its controversial decision, the court ordered the group's leader, Gershon Salomon, to stay clear from the area of the Temple Mount or the adjacent Western Wall.

The court also ruled that the far-right group, which counts only a few dozen members, should "not be allowed to carry placards or act in a provocative manner".

Israeli Arab MP Mohammed Barakeh said in reaction that allowing the activists to enter the compound would lead to a flare-up.

"The decision is petrol in the hands of declared pyromaniacs and could lead to further violence," he said.

A police spokesman said that "they will not be allowed to pray inside the esplanade and they won't be allowed to enter unless it is open for visits".,P> A similar court decision in July 2001 sparked bloody clashes in Jerusalem in which 15 Israeli policemen and 18 Palestinians were wounded.


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## TheAnalyst (2 August 2006)

http://www.theage.com.au/news/Natio...sh-on-Hizbollah/2006/08/02/1154198198226.html


Govt, Muslim advisers clash on Hizbollah

August 2, 2006 - 6:19PM

The government is on a collision course with its Muslim advisory group over its claim that Hizbollah should not be considered a terrorist organisation.

The Muslim Community Reference Group is considering writing to Prime Minister John Howard asking the government to reconsider its listing of the militant arm of Hizbollah as a terrorist organisation.

The group is meeting Thursday and will decide whether to put the demand to Mr Howard.

But any call for the government to change its position on Hizbollah, which has been engaged in open warfare with Israel for the past three weeks, would appear to be futile.

Mr Howard made it clear Wednesday the government had no intention of removing the militant arm of Hizbollah from its official list of terrorist organisations.

"No chance, full stop. No chance at all (of removing Hizbollah from the list)," Mr Howard told reporters.

Attorney-General Philip Ruddock said the decision to ban Hizbollah, which was first listed in 2003, had not been made lightly.

"They're not decisions which are political," he said.

However, the government would be willing to consider new information which may cause it to reassess the listing.

"Obviously we look at these issues from time to time to see whether circumstances change," Mr Ruddock said.

"I'm not aware of any information that would suggest we should reconsider proscription of the military wing of Hizbollah."

But Ameer Ali, chairman of the Muslim advisory group set up last year in the wake of the London terrorist bombings, says Hizbollah should not be lumped in with groups like al-Qaeda.

"They should not condemn Hizbollah as a terrorist group," he told AAP.

"I don't think they should judge that they are simply a terrorist organisation like al-Qaeda.

"It is part of Lebanese politics."

On its national security website, the government says that Australian Security Intelligence Organisation believes Hizbollah's military wing is continuing to prepare, plan and foster the commission of acts involving threats to human life and serious damage to property.

"Such acts include those made with the intention of advancing a political, religious or ideological cause and with the intention of coercing or influencing by intimidation, US, Israeli and other Western governments."

Dr Ali believes the government's assessment of Hizbollah is clouded by the US and Israel.

"We are of the opinion that the Australian government does not have an independent foreign policy with regard to the Middle East," he told ABC Radio.

"We go along with whatever the Americans say and the Americans go along with whatever the Israeli lobby says."

 © 2006 AAP


Hey WayneL and Godfather3 why dont you lobby with em as well


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## TheAnalyst (2 August 2006)

http://www.theage.com.au/news/natio...banon-charities/2006/08/02/1154198193675.html

Terror warning over Lebanon charities


Kenneth Nguyen, Legal Affairs Reporter
August 2, 2006 - 4:20PM
AdvertisementAdvertisement

Australians wanting to donate to war-ravaged communities in Lebanon have been warned to stick with established charities, lest they inadvertently contravene Australia's broad anti-terrorism laws.

Under the Commonwealth Criminal Code Act, Australians may be jailed for up to 15 years if they give financial aid to an organisation that turns out to be a terrorist organisation and are "reckless" as to whether the organisation is a terrorist organisation. It is not necessary for the person to know that the organisation is a terrorist organisation.

Public law expert Professor George Williams, of the University of New South Wales, said Australians should be on safe legal ground if they donated to prominent charities.

"But if it's a different body, they should exercise great caution just in case it's a body that ... may be on the Government's banned list," he told theage.com.au.

"People may make an honest mistake but still fall foul of the law. It may be unfortunately easy to be 'reckless' in the current environment."

A particular danger is involved when donating to Hezbollah. Donations to Hezbollah's civilian arm, which runs extensive social development programs including health and education projects, might involve little legal risk. A mistaken donation to Hezbollah's military wing - which, unlike the rest of Hezbollah, is listed as a terrorist organisation under the Criminal Code Act - is a very different matter.

"It does show when you deal with Hezbollah you have to exercise extreme caution," said Professor Williams.

"How many people would know the difference between the political and military wing? It's often not easy to distinguish between them."

The listing of Hezbollah External Security Organisation as a terrorist organisation by the Australian Government means it is illegal for Australians to join its fighting force, train with them or recruit for them. There is no equivalent ban on joining or training with the Israeli military.

theage.com.au


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## wayneL (2 August 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> http://www.theage.com.au/news/Natio...sh-on-Hizbollah/2006/08/02/1154198198226.html
> 
> 
> Govt, Muslim advisers clash on Hizbollah
> ...




Why don't you have a 7 day holiday?


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## the_godfather4 (2 August 2006)

wayneL said:
			
		

> Why don't you have a 7 day holiday?




Hey WayneL, if u ignore a crying baby long enough they eventually fall asleep (or go away)....maybe this is something we need to keep in mind with _Anal_yst......im pretty sure I opted out of posting on this thread because I prefer not to lower myself to his level.......looks like analyst likes me though coz he cant but keep trying to pull me in  .....hey analyst, I know they say u cant forgive stupidity but I forgive you  ......keep dragging me in mate....i think your posts have proved to everyone here that u r just a scared and insecure little person  ......


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## the_godfather4 (2 August 2006)

the_godfather4 said:
			
		

> Hey WayneL, if u ignore a crying baby long enough they eventually fall asleep (or go away)....maybe this is something we need to keep in mind with _Anal_yst......im pretty sure I opted out of posting on this thread because I prefer not to lower myself to his level.......looks like analyst likes me though coz he cant but keep trying to pull me in  .....hey analyst, I know they say u cant forgive stupidity but I forgive you  ......keep dragging me in mate....i think your posts have proved to everyone here that u r just a scared and insecure little person  ......




I just lowered myself to your level Analyst.......I really am sorry  .....I will leave it to u......... looking forward to your next allegation/accusation.......


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## the_godfather4 (2 August 2006)

TheAnalyst said:
			
		

> ......like for instance Rafa, God3 and WayneL that you are traitors to your country and its armed forces and think you should go live in Syria, Iran or Lebonon and dont come back as you are a high treason risk and should be placed on the ASIO security warning list.




SO far analyst has labelled me (as well as others) all of the above plus more than I care to repeat all because I disagree with his point of view.....he believes I support hezbollah because I dont agree with his pro-zionist posts.......when in fact this is what I am against ...... www.lebanonunderattack.com ........I know I have pasted this very graphic link on another thread but I figure if I disagree with what is shown on this link and analyst labels me "a threat"........then obviously Analyst has "deceptive genocide (of ethnics) support" and actually thinks the innocent people in those pics deserve what they are getting (maybe coz they r a little different to the way we look).......Sick really  .....who is the REAL threat to our national security when u have citizens(?) like analyst who actually believe that this is right  .....people like this normally end up on tv with neighbours saying that they were really quiet and kept mainly to themselves and did not realise they were a serial killer who preyed on innocent little 'ethnic' kids..........


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## It's Snake Pliskin (3 August 2006)

A little childish it is becomming.


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## doctorj (3 August 2006)

Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> A little childish it is becomming.




I agree.

It scares me that people can be so fanatic in their beliefs to be unable to assess a situation with any objectivity, but as one poster said, we live in a democracy so they have every right to do so.  They also have a right to an opinion.

The idea of this section of the forum is to let people discuss the issues intelligently.  This thread has gone for four pages now and its not going anywhere but more name calling.

I'd like to leave you with this image.







PS.  No disrespect to mentally/physically disabled individuals intended.


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