# Cut in Immigration?



## wallyt99 (26 October 2008)

Liberal says to cut immigration by 25%.....Labour says this will 'turn off the tap' for businesses seeking skilled labour.

I say we need to cut immigration right back! Living in Melbourne, the traditional population is becoming outnumbered by Chinese and Indian immigrants....who all have Masters degrees, thanks to our Universities dumbing down the level of postgraduate studies to accommodate their poor language skills.

Our history, and our sovereignty is being threatened. Did our forefathers fight for the freedom of our people in two great wars, so we could become home to a segment of people who have no interest in helping the country to become a better place.  Rather, they wish to use (and abuse) what we, and our forefathers created.  Contributing to housing unaffordability, higher crime rates, and overcrowding.

Would these immigrants go to war to protect this country?  Would you want them standing next to you in the trenches?  Perhaps if all our men once again were forced to go to war....we would all come back home to find they had further sucked the lifeblood from this great country.

I know this country was built on immigration.  Yet what I am talking about is mass homogenous immigration from two countries that have already proved that they have no respect for the land, or a population balance.  Mass homogenous immigration, from two countries that are exceptionally rascist...  Just examine the Caste system in India, or the persecution of minorities (non-Han) in China. 

I am sick of the changing face of my own country.  People would, and do cry blue murder about the cultural globalisation that the west is perpetuating on the rest of the world.  RE: Starbucks in China....McDonaldization of the world... When our own culture is at threat, we keep quiet, for fear of being called a rascist.  I am sick of it.


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## robots (26 October 2008)

hello,

Australia: love it or leave it

thankyou
robots


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> traditional population is becoming outnumbered by Chinese and Indian immigrants...




can you kindly describe your so called *traditional population* you mean native Australians right.


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## wallyt99 (26 October 2008)

xyzedarteerf said:


> can you kindly describe your so called *traditional population* you mean native Australians right.




.... I mean the people who built the roads we drive on, the people who built the rail network we go to work on.... the people who dug the sewers, and built the dams, and went to war.

I know 'from the the lands on earth we come'

I dont want to have to change it to 'from China and India we come'.


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> I am sick of the changing face of my own country.


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> .... I mean the people who built the roads we drive on, the people who built the rail network we go to work on.... the people who dug the sewers, and built the dams,




oh yeah those guys i remember them , the greeks ,the italians mostly europeans oh yeah very traditional indeed.


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## wallyt99 (26 October 2008)

xyzedarteerf said:


> oh yeah those guys i remember them , the greeks ,the italians mostly europeans oh yeah very traditional indeed.




They are.  You have obviously ignored the complete crux of my argument in some banale attempt to label me a racist.


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## agro (26 October 2008)

cut the illegal refugees and funding towards the detention center for a start...and with that money invest towards aboriginals

as far as immigration - well "Australians" is a dying race


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## wallyt99 (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> I am sick of the changing face of my own country.


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## agro (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


>




i stand by pauline hanson.

give it a few more years, the population of actual Australians compared to "other" will be substantially less


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

traditional Aussies at there best.


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## agro (26 October 2008)

xyzedarteerf said:


> traditional Aussies at there best.




god bless em


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

agro said:


> god bless em




hahaha oi oi oi...


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## fimmwolf (26 October 2008)

Yeah, and if Jon Stewart's prediction of 6% unemployment by Dec 2009 is correct, how will those "traditional aussies" feel about the immigrants "taking their jos" ????

Maybe the milky bar kid knows.


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## CoffeeKing (26 October 2008)

agro said:


> god bless em






xyzedarteerf said:


> hahaha oi oi oi...




Doesn't get any better than this...


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## saiter (26 October 2008)

agro said:


> cut the illegal refugees and funding towards the detention center for a start...and with that money invest towards aboriginals
> 
> as far as immigration - *well "Australians" is a dying race*




"Australians" was never a race. If you're anglo-saxon then your race is related to some other European nation.



			
				wallyt99 said:
			
		

> Liberal says to cut immigration by 25%.....Labour says this will 'turn off the tap' for businesses seeking skilled labour.
> 
> I say we need to cut immigration right back! Living in Melbourne, the traditional population is becoming outnumbered by Chinese and Indian immigrants....who all have Masters degrees, thanks to our Universities dumbing down the level of postgraduate studies to accommodate their poor language skills.




Crap, crap and more crap. Universities require all students (International or Domestic) to have a reasonable level of understanding of English. These educated immigrants will most likely contribute more to society than most "natural Australians" and if you're unable to compete then too bad. Either live with it or smarten up.
Furthermore, you can blame your beloved Liberal government for reducing university funding and making universities more reliant on international students.



> Would these immigrants go to war to protect this country? Would you want them standing next to you in the trenches? Perhaps if all our men once again were forced to go to war....we would all come back home to find they had further sucked the lifeblood from this great country.




When some other nation is attacks our home and our families, then I'm certain that many will be willing to join the DEFENCE force. Until then, no one wants to join the OFFENCE force. Are you currently in the army yourself?



> I am sick of the changing face of my own country. People would, and do cry blue murder about the cultural globalisation that the west is perpetuating on the rest of the world. RE: Starbucks in China....McDonaldization of the world... When our own culture is at threat, we keep quiet, for fear of being called a rascist. I am sick of it.




How are these immigrants impacting on your culture? Sports, booze, and handouts, all characteristics of this culture, are plentiful.


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## agro (26 October 2008)

saiter said:


> "Australians" was never a race. If you're anglo-saxon then your race is related to some other European nation.





i am not racist by any means but what i was getting to is...

what if the population of foreigners (e.g. Asians, Middle-Easterns) for example out number traditional anglo-Australians?

i can see this country being a muslim nation in the future.. maybe they would represent Australia in the olympics?? how about that?

but hey i am going to be called racists by saying a thing like that... which *may *well indeed be a fact !! quote *may* happen


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## agro (26 October 2008)

This is a speach that was delivered by Australian Prime minister John Howard in October 2007, I just saw that someone posted it on a site I got linked to earlier.....




Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia , as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.

A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia and her Queen at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his Ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown. Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state, and its laws were made by parliament. "If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you", he said on National Television

"I'd be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia : one the Australian law and another Islamic law that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that's a better option", Costello said.

Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country. Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off. Basically people who don't want to be Australians, and who don't want, to live by Australian values and understand them, well then, they can basically clear off", he said.

Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques. Quote: "IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali , we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians."

"However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the 'politically correct' crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia " "However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand." "This idea of Australia being a multi-cultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity And as Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle."

"This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom"

"We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society Learn the language!"

"Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture."

"We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us."

"If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like "A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet. We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means, keep your culture, but do not force it on others.

"This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom,

'THE RIGHT TO LEAVE'."

"If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted."


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## chops_a_must (26 October 2008)

saiter said:


> Crap, crap and more crap. Universities require all students (International or Domestic) to have a reasonable level of understanding of English. These educated immigrants will most likely contribute more to society than most "natural Australians" and if you're unable to compete then too bad. Either live with it or smarten up.
> Furthermore, you can blame your beloved Liberal government for reducing university funding and making universities more reliant on international students.



Complete bollocks.

The mum has been disciplined at two separate universities now for failing full fee paying international students for not being literate, and hence providing rubbish as assessment. 

Agree with the comments about the Libs though. Most Australian unis are completely bankrupt.



agro said:


> i am not racist by any means but what i was getting to is...
> 
> what if the population of foreigners (e.g. Asians, Middle-Easterns) for example out number traditional anglo-Australians?
> 
> ...



What if these immigrants didn't butcher the "mother tongue", and had higher literacy standards than you?

How about that hey?


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## skyQuake (26 October 2008)

Wonder why he got voted off then...
Agree with parts of Howard's speech; Anyways its just the minority spoiling it for the majority...

As for 'foreign' population exceeding white Caucasian population (92%), i guess its gonna be quite a while...


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## mayk (26 October 2008)

Deviated from the topic again, and turned it into race baiting. 

The original question is should immigration be slashed, as per this news:


> Govt may cut migration intake: Evans
> October 26, 2008 - 12:15PM
> The federal government will wait until fresh economic data is released next month to reassess the nation's migration intake amid the global financial crisis.




I guess a more debatable point is the following:



> Senator Evans said it was easy to call for a migration reduction but it was important to consider migrants actually had a positive impact on the economy.
> 
> "What we know is most migrants have better job outcomes than Australians locally. We know that they consume, they buy property and they're a net positive to the budget," he said.
> 
> ...



http://news.theage.com.au/national/govt-may-cut-migration-intake-evans-20081026-58tu.html

Is Immigration good, of course, if they can help Australia grow, the social implications as pointed out by the original poster are secondary (yes important) considerations.

I do support skilled immigration, if skills are needed, like doctors, engineers, nurses, miners (if Aussies are not willing to work). 

First generation always have trouble adjusting, while second and third generations are more easy to blend in.


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## Largesse (26 October 2008)

chops_a_must said:
			
		

> Complete bollocks.
> 
> The mum has been disciplined at two separate universities now for failing full fee paying international students for not being literate, and hence providing rubbish as assessment.




was about to say.....

i've heard from a number of lecturers/tutors that i know personally that they 'aren't allowed' to mark down poor english skills from international students, and in some circumstances domestic students aswell.

bloody pathetic if you ask me.


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## bluelabel (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> Chinese and Indian immigrants....who all have Masters degrees, thanks to our Universities dumbing down the level of postgraduate studies to accommodate their poor language skills.




*Example*
I am currently studying accounting at TAFE and we had an Indian immigrant who was appointed as one of our teachers.  He was 25, had two degrees, had no industry experience and could hardly speak a lick of English.  The TAFE thought that because he had two degrees he would make a good teacher, they gave no consideration to his language skills.  If this is the level of which our institutions are willing to accept as a learning facilitator then I believe this is inadequate and an advanced level of comprehension, grammar and English needs to be met, advanced, not basic.

*My Rant*
I believe that if people wish to come to Australia they should do so because they like the country for what it is.  If they left their country, it was for a reason.  If you don’t like your country don’t come here and try and change Australia into a version of your country.  You came here to be Australian.  If we go to other countries we as Australians are taught to respect their cultures and as far as I know, we do.  Yet if an immigrant comes to Australia and doesn’t want to be Australian they don’t be Australian and as soon as someone says something about it the immigrant jumps up and down and cries racist.  In my opinion, they are the ones being racist. 

So in relation to the restriction of immigration, I feel that as stated above immigrants need to adapt to the Australian way of life that they found so appealing to move here.  They need to integrate into Australian society and they need to contribute to the society in a productive manner, if not then their visa needs to be cancelled and they be made to go home.  So if immigrants are not willing to do this then they should not be permitted into the country. How you measure this i don't know and i realise the difficulties on doing so.

I am by no means saying that as soon as they come here they do away with their cultures and beliefs.  I am all for it.  Just don't force it on me, don't force it on my family, and don't force it on my fellow Australians, we have the choice to adapt your culture if we choose to.  Just like you chose to move to Australia for what it is.  We didnt force it upon you.  You saw, you liked, you moved. 


:bier:

blue


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## xyzedarteerf (26 October 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> population is becoming outnumbered by Chinese and Indian immigrants....who all have Masters degrees, t




if your not wasis then why do you single out Indians and the Chinese out of all the Imegants


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## numbercruncher (26 October 2008)

Seems to me that Labour is hell bent on destroying the wage demands of the " skilled Labour " brigade.

Ofcourse immigration will eventually have to be slashed, a deep global recession is unfolding.

I understand over the last 12 months that emigration was the biggest on record ! are we even attracting quality people here anymore ? do we sit on the verge of becoming the long awaited banana republic ?

I see Chinese and Indians being mentioned in this thread, i think their numbers are disproportionately represented on the street because of the sheer number of them coming here on ma and pas dime to study - once again the collapsing world economy will mop up this little scam ......

So in short a cut in immigration is enevitable imho, we dont need anymore people to maintain a sustainable future anyways, and thats applicable to the whole planet .....

I think the most successful countries of the future will be those with lower population burdons ....


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## Happy (27 October 2008)

skyQuake said:


> Wonder why he got voted off then...
> Agree with parts of Howard's speech; Anyways its just the minority spoiling it for the majority...
> 
> As for 'foreign' population exceeding white Caucasian population (92%), i guess its gonna be quite a while...




One middle eastern man on social benefit furnishing his veggie shop, was shown on one of the Currant Affairs programs: had 3 wives, one lived with him, other two lived in public housing houses on single mother pension with children. (It was segment regarding polygamy in Australia).

If one male can make from 6 – 7 to 18 - 27 children in his breeding period, your 92% will shrink fast.

You might say nobody stops 92% do the same, but many people actually try to have only children they can support and give them good education without burdening social benefit services.

Difficult issue, and as mentioned before, the minute you open your mouth you are called racist, what a joke!


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## noirua (27 October 2008)

Happy said:


> One middle eastern man on social benefit furnishing his veggie shop, was shown on one of the Currant Affairs programs: had 3 wives, one lived with him, other two lived in public housing houses on single mother pension with children. (It was segment regarding polygamy in Australia).
> 
> If one male can make from 6 – 7 to 18 - 27 children in his breeding period, your 92% will shrink fast.
> 
> ...



The days of plenty may be gone and just as in Britain, all the Eastern Europeans are jetting out as the currency slumps, you may not be able to prevent them from going.

Aussies working abroad have suddenly seen a big increase in their earnings in the States, in Aussie terms, so it may be Aussie citizens who crowd the planes. 

There is a new campaign in the UK to get their citizens to head for Aus, funded by Rudd & co. The tanking of the AU$ has made plans that much easier.


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## derty (27 October 2008)

I support the reduction of immigration, purely as it seems pointless to be bringing in workers when it is likely that the unemployment rate in Australia will be rising. 

Not for the racist reasons of a few of the posters in this thread. Though when times get tough the ugly nationalism seems to come through when the paint begins to crack.


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## xyzedarteerf (27 October 2008)

this thread seems to be heading towards this discussion a few months ago.


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## noirua (27 October 2008)

Queue to leave broken Britain:  http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/justice/article949345.ece


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## It's Snake Pliskin (22 November 2008)

noirua said:


> Queue to leave broken Britain:  http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/justice/article949345.ece



Thanks for posting that. 

Some questions regarding England.

Considering there is such a small island for the English to live on why do they have immigration?


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## numbercruncher (22 November 2008)

Yes its crazy hey - they dont need immigratin at all, yet just let who ever flood in, almost like its designed to aggravate the natives.

I once read the UK can produce enough food for 20m people, yet have 60m+ , obviously they are grossly overpopulated ....


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## noirua (22 November 2008)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> Thanks for posting that.
> 
> Some questions regarding England.
> 
> Considering there is such a small island for the English to live on why do they have immigration?




I was told once that the UK Government wants to raise the population higher than that of Germany and France. These two countries are seen as leaders in Europe, but the UK thinks they are. (I say UK as some parts of Britain are not members: Isle of Man and Channel Islands.)


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## sinner (22 November 2008)

numbercruncher said:


> Yes its crazy hey - they dont need immigratin at all, yet just let who ever flood in, almost like its designed to aggravate the natives.




What a rediculous statement to make.

For centuries the British made their fortunes on the backs of their "colonies" i.e. slavery, class stratification, Opium Wars, EITC, etc etc the list of heinous **** committed under the name of Queen and Country is ENDLESS and now those people are coming back a few generations later to try and reap the fruits of THEIR ancestors labour the "natives" have the gall to complain!

I am quoting this from another forum, a poster whom I hold a lot of respect for:



> Western Europe succeeded on the back of African failure. England didn't become a superpower selling peat moss, folks; it invaded other regions, established resource/labor-exporting colonies, and benefited for the next two centuries. African states became independent only in the last forty years or less, and they inherited the infrastructure of unsustainable colonial enterprise which brought together nations heretofore separate under the practice of slavery. They inherited mono-sector economies, and you can't feed a newly independent country with cotton or cocoa. Countries which seemed at first to make a go of things did so just in time for the Cold War; the United States and U.S.S.R. came to Africa and fomented civil war, introducing not new manufacturing or agricultural technologies, but instead the Kalashnikov rifle, the AK-47. When the Cold War ended in 1991, few African states could even make the attempt at development, but even if they did... the so-called Western world introduced the Structural Adjustment Program (SAP) in order to convert these states into... (wait for it) .... cheap sources of labor and raw materials.




We are all complicit in this SAP **** that goes on across the globe in the 3rd world, do not deny it.


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## numbercruncher (22 November 2008)

The Germans shot holes in my Grand-Daddys yet I dont feel like they owe me anything .... ? Yet you think the descendants of centuries old English injustice have some sort of claim over the UK ? and thats even assuming all these people rocking up their infact are ..... odd argument ...

But each to their own, multi-generation/century grudges seems to be embraced by sheeples across the world !

I wonder who it is who gives africa most its aid and what would happen if it was withdrawn ?

Why are we now speaking about africa anyways ?

Face it the current British Governemnt are a pack of idiots, not at all popular, blagging it all the way, not representive of the average persons view etc ..

And I dont feel complicit at all in 3rd world affairs, they mostly choose their own fate, millions of examples abound - ie/ Zimbabwe throw all the white farmers out because they hate white people then starve then blame white people - yeah great - sad that people like yourself agree with this kind of thinking though. 

You should be out vehmently opposing Globilisation and free trade so as to spare anyone anymore suffering from western oppressors.

have a nice morning ....


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## sinner (22 November 2008)

I brought up Africa, because despite what nationalist types might have you think, the majority of immigration to England is by citizens of former colonies!

So by your logic slate is wiped clean each generation or something then? Nobody ever has to take responsibility for the past? Sounds excellent in your little fantasy land! 
I take such offence at being labelled "sheeple" I will refrain from interacting with you any further than this post in the future.



> I wonder who it is who gives africa most its aid and what would happen if it was withdrawn ?




This is an even more rediculous query. Maybe a better question would be why an ancient continent with more culture, history, resources and potential than England needs aid instead of being the superpower?



> Face it the current British Governemnt are a pack of idiots, not at all popular, blagging it all the way, not representive of the average persons view etc ..




Face it mate, from the several I know well and especially those backpackers I encounter when travelling they are well conditioned to be against immigration with heavy "nationalistic" tendencies if they are white! 



> And I dont feel complicit at all in 3rd world affairs, they mostly choose their own fate, millions of examples abound - ie/ Zimbabwe throw all the white farmers out because they hate white people then starve then blame white people - yeah great - sad that people like yourself agree with this kind of thinking though.




LOL! Yeah right, cos white Zimbabwean people have a monopoly on the skills and knowledge required to grow food, no way could a black Zimbabwean ever farm enough to feed his peers!  Sad that you're such a bigot...

You have got to be kidding me... I'm almost speechless. Maybe they blame the white people 'cos white farmers could get land and fertiliser and govt support on cheap/free/subsidised credit while black people need to buy land they can't ever possibly afford, fertiliser from international companies that won't do business with them unless they comply with IMF "guidelines" on issues ranging from abortion to fiscal policy and support from nonexistent scientific agencies!

Just think of how much the white people in Zimbabwe must have screwed over the black people that they gave their support to a ****-stick like Mugabe! And now what do the British do with their ex-colony? Issue written "condemnation" of massacres and free speech suppression and economic manipulation of their ex-Commonwealth-citizens all the while invading Iraq!


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## noirua (22 November 2008)

Who can we blame?  Some Britains, probably only about 12, still blame the Roman Empire for enslaving them for four hundred years (thousands died in the galleys or were fed to the lions) and Normandy for 200 years (heavily taxed every village and took over land throughout England).

Some Aussies blame the British for what happened to the Aborigines and we were not to blame as we were prisoners. 

Surprisingly, there are far more people who blame Alexander the Great for his conquests two and a half thousand years ago in countries where nothing much changes.

The British and French hate each other from a battle fought about 600 years ago when King Henry V told his archers to fire on 6,000 French prisoners of war. 
France also wants the British Channel Islands back as they belonged to Normandy at the time it became part of France in the 15th century.


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## numbercruncher (22 November 2008)

sinner said:


> I brought up Africa, because despite what nationalist types might have you think, the majority of immigration to England is by citizens of former colonies!
> 
> So by your logic slate is wiped clean each generation or something then? Nobody ever has to take responsibility for the past? Sounds excellent in your little fantasy land!
> I take such offence at being labelled "sheeple" I will refrain from interacting with you any further than this post in the future.
> ...




Im sorry to hear you are a racist African.

Enjoy your life in which ever country tolerates your fascist commentary.

Thankyou.


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## mayk (22 November 2008)

numbercruncher said:


> Im sorry to hear you are a racist African.
> 
> Enjoy your life in which ever country tolerates your fascist commentary.
> 
> Thankyou.




I am confused is Africa a country

Well this thread will go down the gruggler soon.


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## Bobby (1 December 2008)

Just let me ask this question ?

*Do Aussies want more humans from third world countries*

I don't !!

Bob.


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## Happy (2 December 2008)

Bobby said:


> I don't !!
> 
> Bob.




+1, but nobody wants to listen to me and no matter who you vote for it is 110,000+ and other issues decide who gets the PM job.

Last time it was industrial relations or work choices that tipped the balance.

On the positive note, once the immigration makes it too bad here we will be able to migrate somewhere else maybe over there?


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## It's Snake Pliskin (2 December 2008)

Immigration should be cut to only allow skilled migrants. People who fly to Indonesia and then get on a boat should be sent back to Indonesia.  

Why have Australia's interests been sold out?


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## Illuminated one (2 December 2008)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> Immigration should be cut to only allow skilled migrants. People who fly to Indonesia and then get on a boat should be sent back to Indonesia.
> 
> Why have Australia's interests been sold out?




Because more people= more working people who pay tax to the government= more people who have money in the banks= larger revenue for the banks= Banks work with the government to allow this to happen.

A prosperous nation like Australia is a target of Greedy banks wanting to get in on the boom and obviously use that huge profits to make even bigger profits.

And yes, immigration should be only for skilled workers, however, there is a huge shortage even in unskilled labor and even these positions have to be filled by someone..


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## It's Snake Pliskin (2 December 2008)

Illuminated one said:


> Because more people= more working people who pay tax to the government= more people who have money in the banks= larger revenue for the banks= Banks work with the government to allow this to happen.
> 
> A prosperous nation like Australia is a target of Greedy banks wanting to get in on the boom and obviously use that huge profits to make even bigger profits.
> 
> And yes, immigration should be only for skilled workers, however, there is a huge shortage even in unskilled labor and even these positions have to be filled by someone..




All at the expense of safety and culture?


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## Illuminated one (2 December 2008)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> All at the expense of safety and culture?




Unfortunately yes mate, however if we can teach and enforce strict safety laws, then maybe we could reduce dramatically the amount of safety breaches/Incidences at the work place, the last thing people would want is to be killed in the workplace, companies have to really step up and provide safety training and employ more safety personnel to combat this.

Education is the prevention.....


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## It's Snake Pliskin (3 December 2008)

Illuminated one said:


> Unfortunately yes mate, however if we can teach and enforce strict safety laws, then maybe we could reduce dramatically the amount of safety breaches/Incidences at the work place, the last thing people would want is to be killed in the workplace, companies have to really step up and provide safety training and employ more safety personnel to combat this.
> 
> Education is the prevention.....




Actually I was talking about the safety of the current population, but I agree with your points above.


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## numbercruncher (3 December 2008)

They will have to hook into immigration numbers with a sledgehammer soon - Joblosses are stacking up big time.


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## rub92me (3 December 2008)

Bobby said:


> Just let me ask this question ?
> 
> *Do Aussies want more humans from third world countries*
> 
> ...



Do I want humans from third world countries to procreate? I don't think my opinion on the topic will influence their inclination to do so. As to whether they should be allowed to come to this country legally and make it an even better place? Yes.


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## thunderer (3 December 2008)

I suggest you guys sell your properties ASAP if you really think this will happen soon.


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## numbercruncher (4 December 2008)

thunderer said:


> I suggest you guys sell your properties ASAP if you really think this will happen soon.





Apparently Australia has nearly run out of land, we dont even need immigrants anymore, Australian House prices to double every four years, its a new paradgim - a different dimension !!  Join the gravy train folks


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## tadpole (4 December 2008)

i wonder if this guy is still here?


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## dutchie (20 August 2018)

Little Marky tries so hard....


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## sptrawler (20 August 2018)

Actually when you listen to the interview, Fraser Anning isn't saying anything outlandish, jeez the media certainly stoked it all up. They really do need to stop bending news, to their own ends.


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## Tisme (20 August 2018)

sptrawler said:


> Actually when you listen to the interview, Fraser Anning isn't saying anything outlandish, jeez the media certainly stoked it all up. They really do need to stop bending news, to their own ends.




I caught up with a bloke on the weekend who had given evidence to the royal commission a day or two earlier. He was full of praise for Anning's personal support during his hearing, something that he apparently does for the victims.


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## sptrawler (20 August 2018)

Tisme said:


> I caught up with a bloke on the weekend who had given evidence to the royal commission a day or two earlier. He was full of praise for Anning's personal support during his hearing, something that he apparently does for the victims.



I find it sad, that the media can't keep personal bias out of their reporting. I know it must be hard, but it would certainly be much more professional and certainly more enlightening.


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## SirRumpole (20 August 2018)

There was some Muslim spokesperson on The Drum the other night saying people should not be allowed to say the things that Anning said  because some kids might be beaten up in a schoolyard. 

Utter nonsense.

It was the normal processes of democracy, Anning said what he wanted to say, others disagreed. We should be celebrating the freedom of speech that this country gives us.


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## Tisme (20 August 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> There was some Muslim spokesperson on The Drum the other night saying people should not be allowed to say the things that Anning said  because some kids might be beaten up in a schoolyard.
> 
> Utter nonsense.
> 
> It was the normal processes of democracy, Anning said what he wanted to say, others disagreed. We should be celebrating the freedom of speech that this country gives us.




Apparently Anning voted against Pauline's immigration plebiscite try on.


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## SirRumpole (20 August 2018)

Tisme said:


> Apparently Anning voted against Pauline's immigration plebiscite try on.




Well, I wasn't defending him, just the democratic process.


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## Tisme (20 August 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Well, I wasn't defending him, just the democratic process.




I know that. He's is refreshingly unashamed and forthright, even if his polices aren't something I would embrace in their entirety


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## dutchie (21 August 2018)

The West (including Australia) should close its borders and save its heritage.


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## CanOz (21 August 2018)

The western world needs to have bigger families to avoid a demographic catastrophe dutchie...


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## dutchie (21 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> The western world needs to have bigger families to avoid a demographic catastrophe dutchie...



Would not hurt, but it's too late for that, I'm afraid. The numbers are too big. The West is being swamped.


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## luutzu (21 August 2018)

dutchie said:


> Would not hurt, but it's too late for that, I'm afraid. The numbers are too big. The West is being swamped.




The poor, poor West, getting swamped by people from "sh!ithole" countries. 

I wonder if there's a solution for stopping people from running away from the land of their ancestors. 

Maybe... I don't know... stop farking around with their country. That might help not turning it into war zones and total disasters. Stop taking their resources and pretend it's for their own good. Stop putting them into poverty. 

Those few doing nothing, costing nothing might be good for them, and good for the West too. 

So on the one hand, Western leaders mouthed off about freedom, democracy, human rights; about the need to blow the crap out of other people's country to help liberate them. 

Then when the bombs and the wars drove those people into refugee camps; with a few of them not being able to go into any because they're all full... they got on a dingy to "migrate"... the Western leaders tell them to go fark off, it's full. 

Dutch, people are supposed to either use their head or their heart. Not freaking use neither of it. One or the other. 

Otherwise, you're just mouthing off rubbish. 

-------------

And here's a lesson from ancient Rome for you... "The tools of empire soon enough turn against the people of the empire." - Tacitus.

What does that mean? 

They wipe out entire cities then call it peace. They enslave barbarians and savages, take their life and their liberty, then their resources. 

The state treasury are spent on those missions; the plebs at home gets shafted while the few arms merchants and mercenaries gets filthy rich. 

Then the plebs got annoyed and angry. The same tools, the same mindset that turn barbaric neighbours into "sh!tholes" soon enough turn the empire into "sh!tholes" as well. 

Look at the US. Did the illegals loot $1.5Trillion from US taxpayers? Or did some douche just signed it with a pen?

Did refugees decided the cities get lead poisoned through their water system? Or was it the Russians?

Did the Arabs forced themselves to be tortured? Did Islam forced the US gov't to separate kids from their parents? Shoot coloured American citizens? Surveillance on everybody?


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## CanOz (21 August 2018)

The east always had the population advantage, just lacked the economics, now the tables have turned. I think Caucasians have cast their own destiny many decades ago, a gradual extinction.


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## SirRumpole (21 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> The western world needs to have bigger families to avoid a demographic catastrophe dutchie...




Right, but our "breeding stock" can't afford to have families these days. Most of them have to make do with casual, part time or temporary jobs and have to compete with migrants for the good jobs. They can't even afford a house, let alone kids to put in it.

We are doing our young people out of a secure future with high immigration.


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## CanOz (21 August 2018)

I don't think so. The people I know choose no kids because they like their lifestyle, nothing to do with can't afford kids...perhaps it's just the people I know. Immigration creates jobs, it doesn't take them away. Consider my wife and I, I work and she doesn't. We spend approx 4500 a month on living expenses, we bought two cars, three properties and now we're building a house. That's allot going back into the economy employing others....I'm the immigrant by the way.


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## SirRumpole (21 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Immigration creates jobs, it doesn't take them away.




It's a crutch, it doesn't solve any problems it just papers over it.

By your estimation we will need continual immigration forever, untill all the farmlands become housing estates and we end up like Delhi.

How do we determine when enough is enough ?


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## CanOz (21 August 2018)

Well it's grow or die really...the economy cannot mathematically function without either growth in tax revenue or a cut to social benefits....it's just math sir. Japan is now importing Vietnamese labor.


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## dutchie (21 August 2018)

Immigration is a PONZI SCHEME


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## SirRumpole (21 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Well it's grow or die really...the economy cannot mathematically function without either growth in tax revenue or a cut to social benefits....it's just math sir. Japan is now importing Vietnamese labor.




Uncontrolled growth occurs in biological systems too.

It's called cancer.


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## CanOz (21 August 2018)

Ponzi scheme it may be, but someone has to pay tax dudes...do the math or propose a solution that is factual, mathmatical.


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## CanOz (22 August 2018)

Read somewhere the other day that the Chinese are considering a tax on couples that don't have kids! Think about that for a moment...


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## wayneL (22 August 2018)

Ponzi is an apt phrase in Australia.  We have destroyed our industrial capacity,  and replaced it with a service based economy that relies on building and trading housing.

Eventually, saturation and collapse is inevitable.


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## CanOz (22 August 2018)

Im not of the view that industrial capacity is the future. Intellect capacity...


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## wayneL (22 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Im not of the view that industrial capacity is the future. Intellect capacity...



Yep sure,  but we still need to make some **** here, you know,  using the less intelligent grunt we have here to value add.


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## CanOz (22 August 2018)

For now, yes. But the key for the future is highly skilled work on automated industrial processes. Think logic control programmers, robotic technicians. Grunt work will be virtually eliminated faster then we could expect. Our immigration should be targeted for highly skilled, highly educated employees to generate tax in a high tech work force to pay for the generations that are retired.


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## Tisme (22 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> For now, yes. But the key for the future is highly skilled work on automated industrial processes. Think logic control programmers, robotic technicians. Grunt work will be virtually eliminated faster then we could expect. Our immigration should be targeted for highly skilled, highly educated employees to generate tax in a high tech work force to pay for the generations that are retired.




I was an early innovator in automation, robotics, etc starting way back in the 70's, designed and manufactured well into the 90's, but the cultural cringe was always a blocker both by engineers and govt. There's still some legacy manufacturers from that time, but much of the stuff is imported and the smarts in programming and applications isn't a country specialty  .... even the Indians get stuck into that enmasse these days.

Having said that there are small local operations using uber brains who are developing next gen tech, but the country can't run on a few gyrogearlooses.


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## Kerway (22 August 2018)

Immigration is not a problem as long as the immigrants coming in benefit our country.

My experience is that the vast majority of Asian immigrants into Australia (whether from SE Asia or the Indian sub-continent) have benefited Australia tremendously, whilst the relative few immigrants from places like Lebanon and Africa have not. The Lebanese because an uncomfortable number of them appear to be against the "Australian way of life" and the black Africans because an uncomfortable number of them are happier not to work. The white Africans from South Africa and Zimbabwe appear to fit in really well. Those who may see the latter distinction as racist, I am just generalising the situation as I see it and don't mean to offend any person or race group.


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## SirRumpole (22 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Our immigration should be targeted for highly skilled, highly educated employees to generate tax in a high tech work force to pay for the generations that are retired.




Why don't we use our education system to produce this high tech work force instead of throwing our young people on the scrap heap of the gig economy ?


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## sptrawler (22 August 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Why don't we use our education system to produce this high tech work force instead of throwing our young people on the scrap heap of the gig economy ?



Or the meth economy, for once I agree with you.
Why don't we get our education system, back to a system that encourages high achievers and helps guide low achievers, rather than trying to tell everyone they are a high achiever?


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## luutzu (22 August 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Why don't we use our education system to produce this high tech work force instead of throwing our young people on the scrap heap of the gig economy ?




It's "cheaper" to import than to raise our own. 

To the financial managers, it make perfect sense.

You get more money from international students. So you reduce places for the locals at the higher education. That's a few coins there.

Then you let those international students who studied here - with their own dole; or you permit those who studied and raised elsewhere - at their own dole too... lure them in and kar-ching, money in the bank. 

The locals can, I don't know... it's all the same on a spread sheet anyway.


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## SirRumpole (22 August 2018)

sptrawler said:


> Or the meth economy, for once I agree with you.




I think we have agreed a couple of times haven't we ?


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## CanOz (22 August 2018)

Hmm, guessing it might have to do more with parenting than education...


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## Wysiwyg (22 August 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Uncontrolled growth occurs in biological systems too.
> 
> It's called cancer.



I wouldn't consider any uncontrolled growth to be a cancer. Cancer by definition is not uncontrolled growth..


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## Wysiwyg (22 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Ponzi scheme it may be, but someone has to pay tax dudes...do the math or propose a solution that is factual, mathmatical.



If the government is managing the country finances efficiently then taxes should remain in line with inflation as the GST tax does cover. The poorly planned schemes that fritter and block waste tax payer money are many. Too often a cure is sought while in denial of the symptoms.


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## Wysiwyg (22 August 2018)

CanOz said:


> Im not of the view that industrial capacity is the future. Intellect capacity...



That discounts 75% of humans whom lack the ability to store information and recall it readily.


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## Tisme (24 August 2018)

Fit well into a Melbourne gang:

https://www.abc.es/sociedad/abci-brutal-agresion-ancianas-portal-bilbao-201808221515_video.html


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## SirRumpole (10 October 2018)

NSW government wants less immigration.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-10/nsw-premier-calls-for-immigration-rethink/10358696


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## PZ99 (10 October 2018)

Less people = less protest lights on the Opera House disrupting the gambling industry paying bills for the Alan Jones Liberal Party


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## sptrawler (10 October 2018)

PZ99 said:


> Less people = less protest lights on the Opera House disrupting the gambling industry paying bills for the Alan Jones Liberal Party



You really need to become less Party focused IMO.
Neither Party has a monopoly on any moral high ground, and stereo typing the LP as being in the pockets of the gambling industry I would think is misleading, did Labor do anything about gambling.
From memory, didn't a certain Tassie MP do a deal with Gillard over the pokies, just to have Labor reneg on it?
I could be wrong, the memory aint what it used to be.


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## Garpal Gumnut (10 October 2018)

The incidence of melanoma and basal cell carcinoma would fall if we had more darkies in Australia as opposed to the whities.

I'm all for immigration as long as it improves the stock.

I've probably spent too much time in cattle castrating weiners to be objective.

gg


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## PZ99 (10 October 2018)

sptrawler said:


> You really need to become less Party focused IMO.
> Neither Party has a monopoly on any moral high ground, and stereo typing the LP as being in the pockets of the gambling industry I would think is misleading, did Labor do anything about gambling.
> From memory, didn't a certain Tassie MP do a deal with Gillard over the pokies, just to have Labor reneg on it?
> I could be wrong, the memory aint what it used to be.



Labor had zip to do with this. Alan Jones is a member of the LNP and is a 24/7 motormouth for the Conservatives and as usual it's everyone else's fault when the fecal matter hits the fan.

Less Party focused? Great idea. Does this apply to everyone? Wanna lead the way?


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## sptrawler (10 October 2018)

PZ99 said:


> Labor had zip to do with this. Alan Jones is a member of the LNP and is a 24/7 motormouth for the Conservatives and as usual it's everyone else's fault when the fecal matter hits the fan.
> 
> Less Party focused? Great idea. Does this apply to everyone? Wanna lead the way?




A post of mine recently:

Another good move by the W.A Labor Government, just shows a Party doesn't have to move in with the fringe dwellers, to come up with fair and reasonable policy.

https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/nort...protect-entertainment-precincts-ng-b88963547z

Also it shows you don't have to use a sledge hammer to crack a walnut, it's a shame some of our Federal counterparts can't follow suit, rather than having to make every policy a Nation breaking event to suit the media circus.

Here is another example of the Government looking at the bigger picture, I think the Libs in W.A will have to improve their rhetoric, to land anything on McGowan.

https://thewest.com.au/business/min...ine-bailout-cost-taxpayers-250m-ng-b88965673z

Allow for the worst, hope for the best.

But hey let's just believe what you think, I see Sir Muppett liked it.


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## PZ99 (10 October 2018)

C'mon mate. It's no problem if you disagree with me.
It's not fair to throw barbs at another member because of it.

Back on topic and the NSW premier wants to reduce immigration into NSW.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-10/nsw-premier-calls-for-immigration-rethink/10358696

Got a viewpoint?


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## sptrawler (10 October 2018)

PZ99 said:


> C'mon mate. It's no problem if you disagree with me.
> It's not fair to throw barbs at another member because of it.
> 
> Back on topic and the NSW premier wants to reduce immigration into NSW.
> ...




I didn't disagree with you, just showed that I can give credit, where credit is due.
Shame others can't.
I don't know what you meant by the throwing barbs comment, I thought that was what you were doing.
Oh sorry, it was the sir muppett remark, well we go back a long way, so he won't take it personally.


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## PZ99 (10 October 2018)

sptrawler said:


> I didn't disagree with you, just showed that I can give credit, where credit is due.
> Shame others can't.



Well they can speak for themselves...

Over the last month or two I've given credit to ScoMo and Abbott on various issues. And I've given them stick on others. And will continue doing so. I call a spade a spade. If party sycophants choose to extrapolate that into something more extreme then it's a failing of their choosing


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## sptrawler (10 October 2018)

PZ99 said:


> Well they can speak for themselves...
> 
> Over the last month or two I've given credit to ScoMo and Abbott on various issues. And I've given them stick on others. And will continue doing so. I call a spade a spade. If party sycophants choose to extrapolate that into something more extreme then it's a failing of their choosing



Well I would say we are on the same page, I think it is great when posters can give honest from the heart opinions, without letting political biases influence it.

Good on you mate.


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## sptrawler (10 October 2018)

PZ99 said:


> C'mon mate. It's no problem if you disagree with me.
> It's not fair to throw barbs at another member because of it.
> 
> Back on topic and the NSW premier wants to reduce immigration into NSW.
> ...




That is a hard one, several Governments(Lab and Lib) over the last 10 years have supported population growth.
The problem with that is if you focus on refugee immigration, they are going to go to Sydney, Melbourne, they are the growing areas, that is where they would have been told to head for. Let's not under estimate social media.lol
If you are wealthy and want to buy your way into Australia, you wouldn't buy a delli or a coffee shop, in Walgett or Wiluna.
Your best chance of making money, if your bailing out of your own Country, is Victoria or NSW or probably Melbourne or Sydney.

So the real question is, when we need all the workers in outback Australia and nobody on the dole wants to go there, you either get new migrants to go there or make unemployed Australians go there, or re introduce 457 visa's.
With the current social agenda, it is much easier to make it a condition of entry, than make unemployed Australians go there.
I don't know how long we can afford to pander to the paradigm.


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## SirRumpole (15 October 2018)

Melbourne...going from one of the most liveable cities in the world to "Bangkok like" status.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-...-biggest-city-which-party-has-policy/10358988


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## noirua (15 October 2018)

Nothing has changed since Atari's game Kingdom out in spring 1980. It has the answers to immigration/migration:


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