# *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter



## reichstag911 (25 June 2005)

*The US war with Iran has already begun.*
by Scott Ritter

Sunday 19 June 2005. 

Americans, along with the rest of the world, are starting to wake up to the uncomfortable fact that President George Bush not only lied to them about the weapons of mass destruction in Iraq (the ostensible excuse for the March 2003 invasion and occupation of that country by US forces), but also about the very process that led to war.

On 16 October 2002, President Bush told the American people that "I have not ordered the use of force. I hope that the use of force will not become necessary."

We know now that this statement was itself a lie, that the president, by late August 2002, had, in fact, signed off on the 'execute' orders authorising the US military to begin active military operations inside Iraq, and that these orders were being implemented as early as September 2002, when the US Air Force, assisted by the British Royal Air Force, began expanding its bombardment of targets inside and outside the so-called no-fly zone in Iraq.

These operations were designed to degrade Iraqi air defence and command and control capabilities. They also paved the way for the insertion of US Special Operations units, who were conducting strategic reconnaissance, and later direct action, operations against specific targets inside Iraq, prior to the 19 March 2003 commencement of hostilities.

President Bush had signed a covert finding in late spring 2002, which authorised the CIA and US Special Operations forces to dispatch clandestine units into Iraq for the purpose of removing Saddam Hussein from power.  

The fact is that the Iraq war had begun by the beginning of summer 2002, if not earlier.

This timeline of events has ramifications that go beyond historical trivia or political investigation into the events of the past.  

It represents a record of precedent on the part of the Bush administration which must be acknowledged when considering the ongoing events regarding US-Iran relations. As was the case with Iraq pre-March 2003, the Bush administration today speaks of "diplomacy" and a desire for a "peaceful" resolution to the Iranian question.  

But the facts speak of another agenda, that of war and the forceful removal of the theocratic regime, currently wielding the reigns of power in Tehran.

As with Iraq, the president has paved the way for the conditioning of the American public and an all-too-compliant media to accept at face value the merits of a regime change policy regarding Iran, linking the regime of the Mullah's to an "axis of evil" (together with the newly "liberated" Iraq and North Korea), and speaking of the absolute requirement for the spread of "democracy" to the Iranian people.

"Liberation" and the spread of "democracy" have become none-too-subtle code words within the neo-conservative cabal that formulates and executes American foreign policy today for militarism and war.  

By the intensity of the "liberation/democracy" rhetoric alone, Americans should be put on notice that Iran is well-fixed in the cross-hairs as the next target for the illegal policy of regime change being implemented by the Bush administration.

But Americans, and indeed much of the rest of the world, continue to be lulled into a false sense of complacency by the fact that overt conventional military operations have not yet commenced between the United States and Iran.  

As such, many hold out the false hope that an extension of the current insanity in Iraq can be postponed or prevented in the case of Iran. But this is a fool's dream.

  The violation of a sovereign nation's airspace is an act of war in and of itself. But the war with Iran has gone far beyond the intelligence gathering phase.

The reality is that the US war with Iran has already begun. As we speak, American over flights of Iranian soil are taking place, using pilotless drones and other, more sophisticated, capabilities.

The violation of a sovereign nation's airspace is an act of war in and of itself. But the war with Iran has gone far beyond the intelligence-gathering phase.  

President Bush has taken advantage of the sweeping powers granted to him in the aftermath of 11 September 2001, to wage a global war against terror and to initiate several covert offensive operations inside Iran.

The most visible of these is the CIA-backed actions recently undertaken by the Mujahadeen el-Khalq, or MEK, an Iranian opposition group, once run by Saddam Hussein's dreaded intelligence services, but now working exclusively for the CIA's Directorate of Operations.

It is bitter irony that the CIA is using a group still labelled as a terrorist organisation, a group trained in the art of explosive assassination by the same intelligence units of the former regime of Saddam Hussein, who are slaughtering American soldiers in Iraq today, to carry out remote bombings in Iran of the sort that the Bush administration condemns on a daily basis inside Iraq. 

Perhaps the adage of "one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist" has finally been embraced by the White House, exposing as utter hypocrisy the entire underlying notions governing the ongoing global war on terror.

But the CIA-backed campaign of MEK terror bombings in Iran are not the only action ongoing against Iran.  

To the north, in neighbouring Azerbaijan, the US military is preparing a base of operations for a massive military presence that will foretell a major land-based campaign designed to capture Tehran.  

Secretary of Defence Donald Rumsfeld's interest in Azerbaijan may have escaped the blinkered Western media, but Russia and the Caucasus nations understand only too well that the die has been cast regarding Azerbaijan's role in the upcoming war with Iran.

The ethnic links between the Azeri of northern Iran and Azerbaijan were long exploited by the Soviet Union during the Cold War, and this vehicle for internal manipulation has been seized upon by CIA paramilitary operatives and US Special Operations units who are training with Azerbaijan forces to form special units capable of operating inside Iran for the purpose of intelligence gathering, direct action, and mobilising indigenous opposition to the Mullahs in Tehran.

But this is only one use the US has planned for Azerbaijan.  American military aircraft, operating from forward bases in Azerbaijan, will have a much shorter distance to fly when striking targets in and around Tehran.  

In fact, US air power should be able to maintain a nearly 24-hour a day presence over Tehran airspace once military hostilities commence.

No longer will the United States need to consider employment of Cold War-dated plans which called for moving on Tehran from the Arab Gulf cities of Chah Bahar and Bandar Abbas.  US Marine Corps units will be able to secure these towns in order to protect the vital Straits of Hormuz, but the need to advance inland has been eliminated.

A much shorter route to Tehran now exists - the coastal highway running along the Caspian Sea from Azerbaijan to Tehran.  

US military planners have already begun war games calling for the deployment of multi-divisional forces into Azerbaijan.

Logistical planning is well advanced concerning the basing of US air and ground power in Azerbaijan.  

Given the fact that the bulk of the logistical support and command and control capability required to wage a war with Iran is already forward deployed in the region thanks to the massive US presence in Iraq, the build-up time for a war with Iran will be significantly reduced compared to even the accelerated time tables witnessed with Iraq in 2002-2003.

America and the Western nations continue to be fixated on the ongoing tragedy and debacle that is Iraq. Much needed debate on the reasoning behind the war with Iraq and the failed post-war occupation of Iraq is finally starting to spring up in the United States and elsewhere.

Normally, this would represent a good turn of events. But with everyone's heads rooted in the events of the past, many are missing out on the crime that is about to be repeated by the Bush administration in Iran - an illegal war of aggression, based on false premise, carried out with little regard to either the people of Iran or the United States.  

Most Americans, together with the mainstream American media, are blind to the tell-tale signs of war, waiting, instead, for some formal declaration of hostility, a made-for-TV moment such as was witnessed on 19 March 2003.

We now know that the war had started much earlier. Likewise, history will show that the US-led war with Iran will not have begun once a similar formal statement is offered by the Bush administration, but, rather, had already been under way since June 2005, when the CIA began its programme of MEK-executed terror bombings in Iran.  

Scott Ritter is a former UN weapons inspector in Iraq, 1991-1998, and author of Iraq Confidential: The Untold Story of America's Intelligence Conspiracy, to be published by I B Tauris in October 2005.


You can find this article at:
http://tinyurl.com/92jf7


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## ctp6360 (25 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

I seriously do not know how the USA is able to get away with unjustified and blatant attacks on other countries with only the justification that it is a 'war on terror'.

Just this evening I heard an american senator say that since 9/11 they have been at war and that from that day forth it was their duty to attack Iraq. WTF, Osama bin Laden is from AFGHANISTAN.

They are killing innocent people with no justifiable reason. I must admit 

I wasn't so wound up about the Iraq thing because it has no direct impact on me personally (sounds superficial but I bet a majority of people are like this too, which is why things like this continue). However my fiancee is Iranian and I know first hand what a wonderful and kind people they are.

To label an entire nation of people as terrorists based on the actions of its leaders/government and then treat them as such is an absolute crime.


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## ghotib (25 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

Two points of fact:

*  Australia is as guilty as the US in the current Iraq invasion. Maybe even more so - we didn't even pretend that they'd attacked us. 

*  Osama bin Laden himself is from Saudi Arabia. Al Quaeda formed in Afghanistan because the physical and political environment suited them - porous borders, very difficult terrain, poor official communications with weak central govt and very powerful local government (meaning combination of warlords and religious leaders). Note that a large part of the reason for the political environment was the Russian invasian and attempted occupation (though to be fair the Russians were one in a long line). Note further that nothing has changed except that now it's our side doing the invading.

Hope the Bush administration is forced to pull its head in before it gets too involved in Iran. Best hope might be that they get worried about losing seats in the Congressional elections next year. OTOH, losing seats in Congress might also be the best hope. 

Meantime, what can we do at home to force our own government to think for itself about us and our place in the world instead of flapping around the failing flailing superpower.

Ghoti


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## Smurf1976 (25 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

1. Iran is a post-peak oil producer although it still produces about 4.5% of world output and has substantial reserves. At 3.9 million barrels per day (mmbpd) it is the seccond largest OPEC producer behind Saudi Arabia at 9.6 mmbpd. Iran's peak production was 6 mmbpd in 1974.

2. North America is collectively running out of natural gas. Discovery peaked long ago and maintaing production from a diminishing resource base is increasingly difficult and becomming impossible. In recent years US power stations have burned large quantities of diesel / kerosene and fuel oil (around 1 mmbpd) due to inadequate gas supplies. The UK is in an even worse position with gas production falling significantly and a relatively high dependence (in the order of 40%) on gas-fired electricity generation. 

3. Iran's key untapped resource is natural gas. With the largest individual gas field in the world Iran has more gas still in the ground than the US or UK ever had.

4. Judge for yourself what this means but at no point did I use the term "weapons of mass destruction" or "terrorism".


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## ghotib (25 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				Smurf1976 said:
			
		

> ... at no point did I use the term "weapons of mass destruction"....



Or "Massive weapons of destruction", for the Dr Who nuts among us.

Ghoti


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## DTM (25 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				ghotib said:
			
		

> Two points of fact:
> 
> *  Australia is as guilty as the US in the current Iraq invasion. Maybe even more so - we didn't even pretend that they'd attacked us.




Makes me think of East Timor.  If they didn't have gas and oil fields, would we have helped liberate their country and then do them in negotiating a percentage of the profits?????

How convenient that after so many years of not helping them, we suddenly think of freedom and democracy.., and oil!!!!!!


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## Mofra (26 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

Yes Osama Bin Laden is a Saud, and so were many of those who carried out the S11 attacks. But why would the US attack Saudi Arabia? They allegedly hold over 8% of equity on US markets, a dumping of that size as a result of military action would cripple the US economy (and leave most Americans furious at the sudden loss) and leave Bush with next to no political capital.

Howard was on the news tonight saying the price of petrol was "out of his hands". He forgot to add "my mates dubya & Rumsfeld will do his best to flood us with cheaper oil soon enough..."


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## It's Snake Pliskin (26 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				DTM said:
			
		

> Makes me think of East Timor.  If they didn't have gas and oil fields, would we have helped liberate their country and then do them in negotiating a percentage of the profits?????
> 
> How convenient that after so many years of not helping them, we suddenly think of freedom and democracy.., and oil!!!!!!




Actually, it was in our favour not to do anything about East Timor. Why? Because Indonesia granted us the share of oil we have. By liberating East Timor we have kicked our selves in the arse because we know must observe and obey the maritime seabed boundary determined by international law. Therefore it seems a bit green and immature, for anyone, to suggest east Timor was liberated for oil. 

The many people who tend to be anti American or western may take a few moments to think about their lives and the fact that we have such quality lives in thanks to the Americans. The alternative to the Americans is not even worth considering.


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## RichKid (26 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> Actually, it was in our favour not to do anything about East Timor. Why? Because Indonesia granted us the share of oil we have. By liberating East Timor we have kicked our selves in the arse because we know must observe and obey the maritime seabed boundary determined by international law. Therefore it seems a bit green and immature, for anyone, to suggest east Timor was liberated for oil.
> 
> The many people who tend to be anti American or western may take a few moments to think about their lives and the fact that we have such quality lives in thanks to the Americans. The alternative to the Americans is not even worth considering.




In my opinion the Australian Govt never expected a tiny country like East Timor to stand up to us on the oil issue, they thought they could blackmail them or bully them into giving up their rightful share under international law. That is the type of behaviour the US regime now champions and we should not be associated with it, pure self-interest is not a virtue in my book, whether it be done at the personal or international level. Furthermore, without going too far off topic, Australia could well have intervened earlier when we (our govt) had knowledge of the massacres which were taking place in East Timor, it did help in the end but out of tactical rather than humanitarian motivations. The same thing has happened with refugees in detention, years of using it as a political tool and only changing tack when it's politically safe (senate majority). Read former diplomat Richard Woolcott's book 'In the Hotseat' for an account of our Indonesian relations and see how 'altruistic' we were about East Timor.

The Americans always act in their self-interest, as Winston Churchill remarked, "Americans will always do the right thing - after they have exhausted every other possibility".  We will be discarded by them as soon as we are no longer useful, let's hope that is not soon. I can't see why Aussie lives should be lost for Uncle Sam, they already send their minority groups in as cannon fodder, thousands will return home with mental illness and damage the lives of their loved ones and those in the community.  War should be a last resort (if an 'option' at all), pre-emption is not cool.


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## Smurf1976 (26 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

If we would just stop using so much oil and gas then that would end all questions of war for oil/gas.

Hydro, wind, geothermal, coal, shale etc may well have problems but they don't lead to war.


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## DTM (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> Actually, it was in our favour not to do anything about East Timor. Why? Because Indonesia granted us the share of oil we have. By liberating East Timor we have kicked our selves in the arse because we know must observe and obey the maritime seabed boundary determined by international law. Therefore it seems a bit green and immature, for anyone, to suggest east Timor was liberated for oil.




Oops.  Opened my mouth about something I don't know anything about.  A bit like shares IMO.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				RichKid said:
			
		

> In my opinion the Australian Govt never expected a tiny country like East Timor to stand up to us on the oil issue, they thought they could blackmail them or bully them into giving up their rightful share under international law. That is the type of behaviour the US regime now champions and we should not be associated with it, pure self-interest is not a virtue in my book, whether it be done at the personal or international level. Furthermore, without going too far off topic, Australia could well have intervened earlier when we (our govt) had knowledge of the massacres which were taking place in East Timor, it did help in the end but out of tactical rather than humanitarian motivations. The same thing has happened with refugees in detention, years of using it as a political tool and only changing tack when it's politically safe (senate majority). Read former diplomat Richard Woolcott's book 'In the Hotseat' for an account of our Indonesian relations and see how 'altruistic' we were about East Timor.
> 
> The Americans always act in their self-interest, as Winston Churchill remarked, "Americans will always do the right thing - after they have exhausted every other possibility".  We will be discarded by them as soon as we are no longer useful, let's hope that is not soon. I can't see why Aussie lives should be lost for Uncle Sam, they already send their minority groups in as cannon fodder, thousands will return home with mental illness and damage the lives of their loved ones and those in the community.  War should be a last resort (if an 'option' at all), pre-emption is not cool.





I simply advise people to look at history and enjoy the live's you have. Without America Australia is a sitting duck for any would be agressor, it's as simple as that. Appease Indonesia as amuch as possible and enjoy the status quo. We don't have the individual power to go toe-to-toe with them. I feel we should do the right thing by the East Timorese and give them back their oil though :swear: 

Yes, America does look after itself first, a given right to a sovereign nation. If it didn't that would would be a crime to it's citizenry. So does Russia, China, North Korea, Iran...the lands of freedom and paradise in the eyes of the media. I'll jump up and down in joy if I see just one article about these countries and their negative aspects. I wait in anticipation. 

By the way, I'm not American. I'm a proud Aussie.


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## It's Snake Pliskin (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				DTM said:
			
		

> Oops.  Opened my mouth about something I don't know anything about.  A bit like shares IMO.




DTM,

Actually, I like what you contribute to this forum regarding stocks.


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## Mofra (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



			
				Snake Pliskin said:
			
		

> I'll jump up and down in joy if I see just one article about these countries and their negative aspects. I wait in anticipation.




With the recent election of an ultra-conservative in Iran, I wouldn't be surprised to see the usual spin about Islamic stereotypes.


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## Knobby22 (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

Jose Ramos in The Age said he was happy with the deal with Australia where East Timor gets 95% of the money from the oil and that he was sick of left wingers who keep whinging at him that he shouldn't accept the deal and who betrayed East Timor under Whitlam anyway!

I can see why Australia wants it's boundary to be the continental shelf.
Be aware that many comment is uninformed and based on hate rather than logic.


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## TheAnalyst (27 June 2005)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*

All that gas hidden under ground in Iran is justification for a war as it may and could be used to manufacture and produce and has the potential to be used in the wrong hands as a WMD.

This is what i think G Bush jnr is concerned about so he might have to preemtively strike Iran before they have the the means to use it.

He will have to send in the seals to locate where it actually is; they could come in the disguise of UN scientists with geology equipment that looks like WMD detecters then it can be located...Bush then gets the intelligence back that it has been hidden and and not used yet but stored up. He orders the US to strike and get it and then at the last minute his grandfather and fathers mates and ancestor's crack the ****s and say "wait a minute this will increase supply and cause our resource share prices to go down" so he leaves it in the ground and sets up a new Iranian government that help keep it in the ground until they come up with another idea and that is " we can make money out of this abundant supply" and Bush says "how?"

Here is the plan we can sell or short futures contracts over our own shares and as supply goes up and our share price decreases we can make money on the decline in gas prices due to over supply.

Now Bush says go get that weapon of mass destruction "Gas".


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## reichstag911 (10 July 2005)

*Bush Crowd:  "A Real Threat to Our Republic"*

*Joseph Wilson on Bush Crowd: "A Real Threat to Our Republic".*

Joseph Wilson is the author of The Politics of Truth: Inside the Lies that led to War and Betrayed My Wife's CIA Identity (Avalon Publishing Group, 2004). Joseph Wilson is a political centrist, was a career United States diplomat from 1976 to 1998. 

During Democratic and Republican administrations he served in various diplomatic posts throughout Africa and eventually as ambassador to Gabon. He was the acting ambassador to Baghdad when Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990. 

In February 2002, he investigated reports of Iraq’s attempt to buy uranium from Niger. In October 2003, Wilson received the Ron Ridenhour Prize for Truth-Telling from the Fertel Foundation and the Nation Institute. He lives in Washington, D.C. 

Joseph Wilson was interviewed by Lori Price with Michael Rectenwald, Ph.D., of Citizens For Legitimate Government on 6 July 2005. The transcript of that interview follows.

*http://www.legitgov.org/clg_interview_joseph_wilson_060705.html#wilson_statement*

"This is a radical regime, not a Republican administration. It is the most oppressive crowd I have ever seen and is a real threat to our republic. While I am not an expert in elections I can see how people might believe the last two elections were stolen."

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////


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## Garpal Gumnut (1 December 2011)

My contacts in Tel Aviv, London and Washington tell me that is "on".

The Ayatollahs have exhausted the patience of the rational governments of the West.

gg


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## DB008 (1 December 2011)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> My contacts in Tel Aviv, London and Washington tell me that is "on".
> 
> The Ayatollahs have exhausted the patience of the rational governments of the West.
> 
> gg




Oil Long GG?


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## Garpal Gumnut (1 December 2011)

DB008 said:


> Oil Long GG?




Oil long, as it should be.

gg


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## DB008 (5 December 2011)

*Iran military shoots down U.S. drone: state TV*



> TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran's military has shot down a U.S. reconnaissance drone aircraft in eastern Iran and has threatened to respond to the violation of Iranian airspace, a military source told state television Sunday.
> 
> "Iran's military has downed an intruding RQ-170 American drone in eastern Iran," Iran's Arabic-language Al Alam state television network quoted the unnamed source as saying.
> "The spy drone, which has been downed with little damage, was seized by the Iranian armed forces."
> ...




http://news.yahoo.com/iran-military-shoots-down-u-drone-state-tv-142804389.html


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## DB008 (28 December 2011)

Interesting....

*Iran Threatens to Block Oil Shipments, as U.S. Prepares Sanctions*




> WASHINGTON ”” A senior Iranian official on Tuesday delivered a sharp threat in response to economic sanctions being readied by the United States, saying his country would retaliate against any crackdown by blocking all oil shipments through the Strait of Hormuz, a vital artery for transporting about one-fifth of the world’s oil supply.


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## Whiskers (28 December 2011)

DB008 said:


> Interesting....
> 
> *Iran Threatens to Block Oil Shipments, as U.S. Prepares Sanctions*




I'd like to see them try.

No doubt with the growing desire by younger Iranians for 'western' culture and there increasing intolerance for fanatical religious rule,  it would give the US and UK etc, an opportunity to do a 'Gadaffi'  style campaign on them.


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## DB008 (28 December 2011)

Whiskers said:


> I'd like to see them try.
> 
> No doubt with the growing desire by younger Iranians for 'western' culture and there increasing intolerance for fanatical religious rule,  it would give the US and UK etc, an opportunity to do a 'Gadaffi'  style campaign on them.




As we all know, any type of disruption in the Middle East and bingo - POO (Price Of Oil) climbs.


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## DB008 (5 January 2012)

With all this hoo-ha going on with Iran, l'm pretty bullish on oil at the moment.


EU Moves Closer to Iran Oil Ban - Bloomberg



> European Union governments moved closer to halting oil purchases from Iran, stepping up the confrontation over the Islamic republic’s nuclear program.
> 
> EU foreign ministers are aiming to announce harsher sanctions on Iran’s energy and banking industries at their next meeting on Jan. 30 after Greece lifted its objections to an oil embargo.
> 
> ...




More on link above...


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## Whiskers (5 January 2012)

DB008 said:


> With all this hoo-ha going on with Iran, l'm pretty bullish on oil at the moment.
> 
> 
> EU Moves Closer to Iran Oil Ban - Bloomberg
> ...




Yeah, I'm a little also... but I'm not thinking it will go through the roof.

I understand since Obama reinstated permits in the gulf of Mexico after the BP disaster, they are now capable of drilling the deepest parts of the gulf and quietly optimistic there is considerable oil to be got there. 

With increased production out of Iraq and more exploration activity in Afghanistan also, for minerals and oil, it loosens Iran's grip somewhat as a major oil supplier for the rest of the world, hence an opportunity to increase sanctions against nuclear proliferation and military build up for invasion of Iraq for example.


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## Knobby22 (11 January 2012)

It appears the US hawks are trying to get into a fight with Iraq yet the Defence secretary states that he knows they are not building nucleur weapons!

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2012/01/us-defense-secretary-admits-iran-not.html


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## DB008 (12 January 2012)

Knobby22, it's hard to decide which side to believe in?

Boths sides are throwing propaganda around the place.


Hows this article? 



> *Iran Charges ‘Foreign Quarters’ Assassinated Nuclear Engineer*
> 
> Jan. 12 (Bloomberg) -- The Iranian government charged in a letter to United Nations Secretary General Ban Ki-Moon that a civilian nuclear scientist who was killed by a bomb yesterday was the latest victim of a foreign terror campaign.
> 
> ...




More on link above...


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## Knobby22 (13 January 2012)

Well it looks like the US sanctions on Iran will deliver China cheaper oil.
Insane policy. I just don't get where they are coming from on this.

_China stands to be the biggest beneficiary of U.S. and European plans for sanctions on Iran’s oil sales in an effort to pressure the regime to abandon its nuclear program.

As European Union members negotiate an Iranian oil embargo and the U.S. begins work on imposing sanctions to complicate global payments for Iranian oil, Chinese refiners already may be taking advantage of the mounting pressure. China is demanding discounts and better terms on Iranian crude, oil analysts and sanctions advocates said in interviews. _


http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2012/01/china-snubs-geithner-on-iran-oil-china.html


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## Sean K (13 January 2012)

DB008 said:


> Boths sides are throwing propaganda around the place.
> 
> Hows this article?
> 
> More on link above...



There's no doubt in my mind that Israel is behind these assassinations with tacit approval from the US and probably UK, France and Germany. Israel are best positioned to conduct these types of attacks inside Iran with their deep cover agents. All would be deniable operators without links back home. Really, who else would be trying to kill off their nuclear scientists? It's just plain obvious.


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## bellenuit (13 January 2012)

kennas said:


> There's no doubt in my mind that Israel is behind these assassinations with tacit approval from the US and probably UK, France and Germany. Israel are best positioned to conduct these types of attacks inside Iran with their deep cover agents. All would be deniable operators without links back home. Really, who else would be trying to kill off their nuclear scientists? It's just plain obvious.




Whilst I would accept that the mentioned parties would have an interest in the assassination of the scientist, don't rule out the possibility that Iran itself may be the culprit. If the scientist in question was not involved in the development of nuclear weapons, but discovered that such activity was occurring and was planning to expose it, then the Iranian authorities may have decided to eliminate him while pinning the blame on the West. They certainly have the means to do it, more than any external government has.


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## DB008 (13 January 2012)

I'm leaning towards the Jews taking out Iranian scientists myself. As they have done in the past. 

Also, when you hear someone say this, someone sitting in Israel's shoes would want to do something about it. 
'Wiped off the map'...."will that be with a nuke Sir?"


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## DB008 (15 January 2012)

Stuxnet Worm

CNBC Code-Wars

NY Times - Stuxnet

Programmed into PLC's and looking for 1 particular type of machine, uranium centrifuge's. 

((Maybe l should hook my Dad up, he one of the best PLC programmers out there, but not these types, LOL    ))


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## DB008 (29 January 2012)

Interesting article about enriching Uranium and how it's getting easier and easier for Iran to do with existing Uranium...

NY Time's Article


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## Knobby22 (29 January 2012)

DB008 said:


> Interesting article about enriching Uranium and how it's getting easier and easier for Iran to do with existing Uranium...
> 
> NY Time's Article




Groan


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## DB008 (14 February 2012)

> *Attacks May Escalate Covert Israel-Iran War*
> 
> U.S. officials and defense analysts are concerned that a covert war of assassinations between Israel and Iran could escalate out of control.
> “Things are heating up and there is a surge” of assassination attempts, Matthew Levitt, a former U.S. Treasury Department official and now director of the Stein Program on Counterterrorism and Intelligence at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, said in a telephone interview.
> ...




Bloomberg Link


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## DB008 (20 February 2012)

*Iran Raid Seen as a Huge Task for Israeli Jets*



> One possible Israeli target, the uranium-enrichment facility in Natanz, Iran, was guarded in 2007 by antiaircraft artillery.
> 
> WASHINGTON — Should Israel decide to launch a strike on Iran, its pilots would have to fly more than 1,000 miles across unfriendly airspace, refuel in the air en route, fight off Iran’s air defenses, attack multiple underground sites simultaneously — and use at least 100 planes.
> 
> ...



More on link above...


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## DB008 (20 February 2012)

Bloomberg
Video takes a while to load

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/86713518/


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## AbrasiveCamel (21 February 2012)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ieves-Israel-may-strike-Iran-this-spring.html

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/02/201222072746430386.html


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## DB008 (21 February 2012)

4 corners last night. Story on Syria and Assad, interview with Jonathan Miller, UK Channel 4 reporter. Very interesting.

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2012/02/16/3432592.htm

Fast forward to the 9:50 mark.

What J Miller says is true, "if Iran develop the bomb and use it on Israel; the West Bank and Gaza (Palestinians), half of Lebanon, part of Syria and part of Jordan are gone"   

Sure, the Arabs might unite to be against the Jews, but Iran is it's own worst enemy and could wipe out it's fellow Arabs too.


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## DB008 (22 February 2012)

*Experts Say Iran Attack Is Irrational, Yet Hawks Are Winning the Debate*


by Peter Beinart Feb 21, 2012 4:45 AM EST





> The debate over whether Israel should attack Iran rests on three basic questions.
> 
> First, if Iran’s leaders got the bomb, would they use it or give it to people who might?
> Second, would a strike substantially retard Iran’s nuclear program?
> ...




More on link above...


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## Nutmeg (22 February 2012)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



ctp6360 said:


> I seriously do not know how the USA is able to get away with unjustified and blatant attacks on other countries with only the justification that it is a 'war on terror'.




The issue here is the power of the Israel Lobby in Washington.  Ultimately, the US does not have an independent Middle East foreign policy.  It only has the policy that Israel pressures it to have.  The US Congress is wholly owned by that Lobby.  If you want proof, count the number of standing ovations that Netanyahu received when he addressed Congress last year.  It was unprecedented.  It was like watching the Politburo in Soviet Russia being addressed by Stalin.  It was an embarrassment.


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## DB008 (25 February 2012)

Thought that l'd post another one on Iran and also a Bloomberg clip on POO (Price of Oil), up 11% in Feb alone.



Oil
*Oil Price Will Rise Till Economy `Breaks'*



Iran


> *Iran ‘Dismissed’ IAEA, Tripled Uranium Production
> *
> 
> Iran dismissed United Nations atomic inspectors’ concerns over possible nuclear-weapon work and the Persian Gulf nation tripled its quarterly rate of producing 20 percent-enriched uranium.
> ...


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## DB008 (3 March 2012)

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-obama-iran-20120303,0,5906341.story


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## Garpal Gumnut (3 March 2012)

Wouldn't it be nice to have a mullah-missile, just to take out the old godbothering farts, and leave the gentle people of Persia, the men, women and children of a great civilisation, safe and well to get on with their lives.

gg


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## Glen48 (3 March 2012)

Dream on GG they would some another replacement and USA would look for another country to beat up on.
The yanks are just as brained washed as the Koran Quoters.
Some thing we will never get rid of sadly.
We got a few Exclusive Brethren moving in around OZ  
 The biggest Jewish population out side Israel lives in Iran and have just as many rights as the locals do..


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## DB008 (3 March 2012)

Glen48 said:


> The biggest Jewish population out side Israel lives in Iran and have just as many rights as the locals do..





(Wiki...Iran#27)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_population

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/jewpop.html

http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/world-jewish-population.htm



> The top twelve Jewish populations in the world are:
> 
> 1.            USA      6,500,000
> 2.            Israel    4,950,000
> ...


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## bellenuit (4 March 2012)

Glen48 said:


> The biggest Jewish population out side Israel lives in Iran and have just as many rights as the locals do..




Even if that were true, which it isn't as the previous post has shown, having as many rights as the locals in Iran is really having few rights at all.


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## Macquack (4 March 2012)

*Re: *IRAN* War already started: Scott Ritter.*



Nutmeg said:


> The issue here is the *power of the Israel Lobby* in Washington.  Ultimately, the US does not have an independent Middle East foreign policy.  It only has the policy that Israel pressures it to have.  The US Congress is wholly owned by that Lobby.  If you want proof, count the number of standing ovations that Netanyahu received when he addressed Congress last year.  It was unprecedented.  It was like watching the Politburo in Soviet Russia being addressed by Stalin.  *It was an embarrassment*.




This is a perfect summary of the situation.

How can a country with less than 8 million people dictate policy to the United States?

Considering most Americans would not know where Israel is on a map of the world, why does Israel get so much support?

Nutmeg has answered all these questions.

Obama should tell Netanyahu that if Israel makes a pre-emptive strike on Iran, then you are on your own buddy.


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## orr (4 March 2012)

And who can forget the words of the Israeli journalist Amira Haas – Haaretz's reporter in the occupied West Bank, whom I often quote. She told me in Jerusalem that the foreign correspondent's job was not to be "the first witness to history" (my own pitiful definition), but to "monitor the centres of power", especially when they are going to war, and especially when they intend to do so on a bedrock of lies.

An extract from Robert Fisk's 
http://www.zcommunications.org/the-...ortable-truth-of-war-reporting-by-robert-fisk

Interesting in itself, all the more so when read with this voice from the Jewish diaspora

http://www.zcommunications.org/what-are-iran-s-intentions-by-noam-chomsky


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## Glen48 (4 March 2012)

Guess I was led to, Israel is seen by the thumpers in USA as the home of christian's every where and must be protected at all costs.

  AP: Israel Won't Warn US Before Iran Strike
Monday, 27 Feb 2012 09:53 PM
Israeli officials say they won't warn the United States if they decide to launch a pre-emptive strike against Iranian nuclear facilities, according to one U.S. intelligence official familiar with the discussions.

The pronouncement, delivered in a series of private, top-level conversations, sets a tense tone ahead of meetings in the coming days at the White House and Capitol Hill.

Israeli officials said that if they eventually decide a strike is necessary, they would keep the Americans in the dark to decrease the likelihood that the United States would be held responsible for failing to stop Israel's potential attack. The United States has been working with the Israelis for months to persuade them that an attack would be only a temporary setback to Iran's nuclear program.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Ehud Barak delivered the message to a series of top-level U.S. visitors to the country, including the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the White House national security adviser and the director of national intelligence, and top U.S. lawmakers, all trying to close the trust gap between Israel and the United States over how to deal with Iran's nuclear ambitions.

Netanyahu delivered the same message to all the Americans who have traveled to Israel for talks, the U.S. official said.

The official spoke on condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive strategic negotiations.

The White House did not respond to requests for comment, and the Pentagon and Office of Director of National Intelligence declined to comment, as did the Israeli Embassy.

Iran claims its nuclear program is for peaceful purposes, but the International Atomic Energy Agency has raised alarms that its uranium enrichment program might be a precursor to building nuclear weapons. The United States has said it does not know whether the government has decided to weaponize its nuclear material and put it on a missile or other delivery device.

The secret warning is likely to worry U.S. officials and begin the high-level meetings with Israel and the United States far apart on how to handle Iran.

But the apparent decision to keep the United States in the dark also stems from Israel's frustration with the White House. After a visit by National Security Adviser Tom Donilon in particular, they became convinced the Americans would neither take military action, nor go along with unilateral action by Israel against Iran. 

The Israelis concluded they would have to conduct a strike unilaterally ”” a point they are likely to hammer home in a series of meetings over the next two weeks in Washington, the official said.

Barak will meet with top administration and congressional officials during his visit. Netanyahu arrives in Washington for meetings with President Barack Obama next week.

The behind-the-scenes warning belies the publicly united front the two sides have attempted to craft with the shuttle diplomacy to each other's capitals.

"It's unprecedented outreach to Israel to make sure we are working together to develop the plan to deter Iran from developing a nuclear weapon," and to keep them from exporting terrorism, said Maryland Rep. Dutch Ruppersberger, the top Democrat on the House intelligence committee.

He traveled there with the intelligence committee chairman, Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Mich., to meet Israel's prime minister and defense minister, along with other officials.

"We talked about the fact that sanctions are working and they are going to get a lot more aggressive," Ruppersberger added.

They also discussed talked about presenting a unified front to Iran, to counter the media reports that the two countries are at odds over how and when to attack Iran.

"We have to learn from North Korea. All those [peace] talks and stalling and they developed a nuclear weapon," he said. "We are going to send a message, enough is enough, the stalling is over. . . . All options are on the table."

"I got the sense that Israel is incredibly serious about a strike on their nuclear weapons program," Rogers told CNN on Monday. "It's their calculus that the administration ... is not serious about a real military consequence to Iran moving forward.

"They believe they're going to have to make a decision on their own, given the current posture of the United States," he added.

U.S. intelligence and special operations officials have tried to keep a dialogue going with Israel, despite the high-level impasse, sharing with them options such as allowing Israel to use U.S. bases in the region from which to launch such a strike, as a way to make sure the Israelis give the Americans a heads-up, according to the U.S. official, and a former U.S. official with knowledge of the communications

Cooperation has improved on sharing of intelligence in the region, according to one current and one former U.S. official. Israel is providing key information on Syria for instance, now that the United States has closed its embassy and pulled out both its diplomats and intelligence officials stationed there, the U.S. official said.



 Newsmax.com:


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## Garpal Gumnut (4 March 2012)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Wouldn't it be nice to have a mullah-missile, just to take out the old godbothering farts, and leave the gentle people of Persia, the men, women and children of a great civilisation, safe and well to get on with their lives.
> 
> gg






Glen48 said:


> Dream on GG they would some another replacement and USA would look for another country to beat up on.
> The yanks are just as brained washed as the Koran Quoters.
> Some thing we will never get rid of sadly.
> We got a few Exclusive Brethren moving in around OZ
> The biggest Jewish population out side Israel lives in Iran and have just as many rights as the locals do..




Glen48, I would agree that the USA has it's fair share of godbothering nuts, however they do not control thought, acts and the freedom that is every human's birthright, as occurs in Persia.

The Iranian mullahs would be hard pressed if they were living in Queensland to get a job as a yardman at the Nidigully pub, so bereft of brains and humanity that they are.

gg


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## Glen48 (4 March 2012)

GG sadly its some thing that been going on for thousands of years and will continue to do so as you know, some how the DNA, Junk genes  and RNA got confused and went of on a different tangent.
 There more Jew love'sr in USA than any where else in the world who vote for your old mate Pistasa Newt or some other walk on water worshiper and there your problem right there.


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## DB008 (1 June 2012)

*Israel upping the pressure*

Stuxnet MkII

Flame virus attacked Iran oil industry 



> IRAN'S key oil industry was briefly affected by the powerful computer virus known as "Flame" that has unprecedented data-snatching capabilities and can eavesdrop on computer users, a senior Iranian military official said Wednesday.
> 
> The comment is the first direct link between the emergence of the new malware and an attack inside a highly sensitive computer system in Iran, which counts on oil revenue for 80 per cent of its income.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/australian-it/flame-virus-attacked-iran-oil-industry/story-e6frgakx-1226375774141


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## DB008 (2 June 2012)

*Confirmed: US and Israel created Stuxnet, lost control of it*

Very interesting article from ARS Technica on Stuxnet Worm/Virus...



> *Confirmed: US and Israel created Stuxnet, lost control of it*
> 
> *Stuxnet was never meant to propagate in the wild.*
> 
> ...




Ars Technica Article here


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## Glen48 (2 June 2012)

Israel attacked the un armed USS Cole during the Gulf war it was in international waters and Israel knew it was there.
The ship was sent to listen in on World communications, Israel sent in 3 unmarked planes which bombed and torpedoed the ship and then sent in patrol boats to finish off any survivors,the hope by Israel was the US would think Egypt was attacking the ship. The USA sent atomic bomb laden  planes to bomb Egypt but lucky for all they were called back. The Cole was patch  up and sent back to USA were the damage was so great  it was sold for scrap, the crew were given medals in private and told not to tell any one  what went on and the incident is still under  the secrets act to day.
 So Israel rules the world. USA has not won a war since 1945 including the war on plants yet every president since 45 has been in a war .
Wars are funded by big banks they fund both sides including Russia to keep the myth going and help bleed money out of suckers and support the arms industry.


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## DB008 (2 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> Israel attacked the un armed USS Cole during the Gulf war it was in international waters and Israel knew it was there.
> The ship was sent to listen in on World communications, Israel sent in 3 unmarked planes which bombed and torpedoed the ship and then sent in patrol boats to finish off any survivors,the hope by Israel was the US would think Egypt was attacking the ship. The USA sent atomic bomb laden  planes to bomb Egypt but lucky for all they were called back. The Cole was patch  up and sent back to USA were the damage was so great  it was sold for scrap, the crew were given medals in private and told not to tell any one  what went on and the incident is still under  the secrets act to day.
> So Israel rules the world. USA has not won a war since 1945 including the war on plants yet every president since 45 has been in a war .
> Wars are funded by big banks they fund both sides including Russia to keep the myth going and help bleed money out of suckers and support the arms industry.




Umm, link please....


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## CanOz (2 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> Israel attacked the un armed USS Cole during the Gulf war it was in international waters and Israel knew it was there.
> The ship was sent to listen in on World communications, Israel sent in 3 unmarked planes which bombed and torpedoed the ship and then sent in patrol boats to finish off any survivors,the hope by Israel was the US would think Egypt was attacking the ship. The USA sent atomic bomb laden  planes to bomb Egypt but lucky for all they were called back. The Cole was patch  up and sent back to USA were the damage was so great  it was sold for scrap, the crew were given medals in private and told not to tell any one  what went on and the incident is still under  the secrets act to day.
> So Israel rules the world. USA has not won a war since 1945 including the war on plants yet every president since 45 has been in a war .
> Wars are funded by big banks they fund both sides including Russia to keep the myth going and help bleed money out of suckers and support the arms industry.




Glen, this is the most outlandish pile of BS I've read since the claims that the moon landings were a hoax. Now if you cannot provide a factual link, it will be removed. 

CanOz


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## McLovin (2 June 2012)

CanOz said:


> Glen, this is the most outlandish pile of BS I've read since the claims that the moon landings were a hoax. Now if you cannot provide a factual link, it will be removed.
> 
> CanOz




If nothing else, it would be the first destroyer in the history of the world that was "unarmed".


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## Glen48 (2 June 2012)

yes you are correct it was the  USS Liberty

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/uss-liberty-dead-in-the-water/


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## Glen48 (2 June 2012)

While you are on about moon landings did you know Russia put 2 un maned vehicles on the moon and operated them from Earth.


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## DB008 (2 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> While you are on about moon landings did you know Russia put 2 un maned vehicles on the moon and operated them from Earth.




Really? 
Proof...


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## Glen48 (2 June 2012)

*Tank on the Moon | Watch Free Documentary Online*

*During the 1960s, the United States and the Soviet Union were engaged in a feverish competition to be the first to set foot on the moon. We know who won th.*
*topdocumentaryfilms.com/tank-on-the-moon/*​


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## Glen48 (3 June 2012)

CanOz said:


> Glen, this is the most outlandish pile of BS I've read since the claims that the moon landings were a hoax. Now if you cannot provide a factual link, it will be removed.
> 
> CanOz



Ok just don't tell me the Twin Towers were  hit by planes


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## DB008 (4 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> Ok just don't tell me the Twin Towers were hit by planes




Can't tell if your serious or not.....


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## Glen48 (4 June 2012)

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/911-explosive-evidence-experts-speak-out/

99% sure its all a con


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## Glen48 (4 June 2012)

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/september-clues/
Another one


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## DB008 (4 June 2012)

Glen48, check out this site, you need it.


http://tiny.cc/ldsdfw

..._and_...


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## Glen48 (4 June 2012)

I know my eyes are crook that's why I had to stop working..but I did manage to find this:

Forums prefer a premise of open and free discussion and often adopt de facto standards. Most common topics on forums include questions, comparisons, polls of opinion as well as *debates.* It is not uncommon for nonsense or unsocial behavior to sprout as people *lose temper, especially if the topic is controversial.* Poor understanding *of differences in values* of the participants is a common problem on forums. Because replies to a topic are often worded aimed at someone's point of view, discussion will usually go slightly off into several directions as people question each others' validity, sources and so on. Circular discussion and ambiguity in replies can extend for several tens of posts of a thread eventually ending when everyone gives up or attention spans waver and a more interesting subject takes over. It is not uncommon for debate to *end in ad hominem attacks.*


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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> I know my eyes are crook that's why I had to stop working..but I did manage to find this:
> 
> Forums prefer a premise of open and free discussion and often adopt de facto standards. Most common topics on forums include questions, comparisons, polls of opinion as well as *debates.* It is not uncommon for nonsense or unsocial behavior to sprout as people *lose temper, especially if the topic is controversial.* Poor understanding *of differences in values* of the participants is a common problem on forums. Because replies to a topic are often worded aimed at someone's point of view, discussion will usually go slightly off into several directions as people question each others' validity, sources and so on. Circular discussion and ambiguity in replies can extend for several tens of posts of a thread eventually ending when everyone gives up or attention spans waver and a more interesting subject takes over. It is not uncommon for debate to *end in ad hominem attacks.*




Are you trying suggesting that with all the 9/11 footage available (even one l found on youtube yesterday in under 20 seconds), that 2 planes did '_*not*_' fly into the World Trade Centre Towers in 2001?


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)

Yes and the Pentagon after 6 years in the RAAF fixing jets and piston engine aircraft I did a bit of flying around and know about planes but if you have confirmed info that planes flew into the buildings cough up a lot are waiting.


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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> Yes and the Pentagon after 6 years in the RAAF fixing jets and piston engine aircraft I did a bit of flying around and know about planes but if you have confirmed info that planes flew into the buildings cough up a lot are waiting.




Lets not get side-tracked and stay one the 1 topic here please.

World Trade Centre Buildings.

2 planes clearly fly into them. 

Are you seriously you are disputing the following 2 videos? You can see the plane flying into the building. Can you not this see this Glen48???

(CLEAR VIDEO FOOTAGE HITTING TOWER BELOW)





Yes, l am skeptical on WTC7 and the Pentagon, but the lets just stay on this topic.


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)

Ok DB:
 Which planes are you talking about the unmarked one, the UA painted or the Single engine prop.driven 

Explain how they found" Pilot" ATTA's expired drivers licence,Will,and passport on the footpath in front of the WTC and why would you have your will in your pocket if you knew you were going to fly into a building.

 Who shot the footage of the planes flying in and how did the planes cause the buildings to collapse when they were designed to withstand the impact of a 747.

If building 7 and  the Pentagon are suss why not these two as well.
 Why is there so much covered up if there is nothing to hide.
The strongest part of a plane is the Turbine wheel one in each engine yet now were found out of  eight.


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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

DB008 said:


> Are you trying suggesting that...2 planes did '_*not*_' fly into the World Trade Centre Towers in 2001?






Glen48 said:


> *Yes*



:asdf::asdf::asdf:



Glen48 said:


> ...after 6 years in the RAAF fixing jets and piston engine aircraft




You should know better!




Glen48 said:


> Which planes are you talking about




Example Below..




OR THIS




Are you still going to argue that no planes hit *either* the WTC North or WTC South Buildings?


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)

YES 

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/september-clues/


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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

Glen48 said:


> YES
> 
> http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/september-clues/





All l can say it, Good Luck.


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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

For those that have 20/20 vision, can you please tell Glen48 what is in the picture....


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## So_Cynical (5 June 2012)

DB008 said:


> For those that have 20/20 vision, can you please tell Glen48 what is in the picture....
> 
> 
> View attachment 47314




I watched the second plane hit live on CNN...live!

Pretty sure it was a plane.  cos i remember watching and thinking jezz that plane is low, then wow that's a jet, a passenger jet..its gona fly behind the twin towers now.. and then, well we know what happens next.

I didn't get to sleep until 5am.


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)




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## DB008 (5 June 2012)

The 2nd World Trade Center Attack: *43 angles*




You know what is worse, when someone can't admit that they are wrong.
Arrogance or brainwashed, l don't know what category Glen48 under. Or, if your on drugs, please give me some, it might change my perception of the world for the better.


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)

Next thing you will tell me Gillard will bring down un-employment.


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## So_Cynical (5 June 2012)

Your edit is better than mine...give me 20 minutes and i could clean it up enough to convince at least 1 nutter in 100 nuts. 
~


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## Glen48 (5 June 2012)




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## DB008 (10 June 2012)

*Crypto breakthrough shows Flame was designed by world-class scientists*

*Crypto breakthrough shows Flame was designed by world-class scientists*




> The Flame espionage malware that infected computers in Iran achieved mathematic breakthroughs that could only have been accomplished by world-class cryptographers, two of the world's foremost cryptography experts said.
> 
> "We have confirmed that Flame uses a yet unknown MD5 chosen-prefix collision attack," Marc Stevens and B.M.M. de Weger wrote in an e-mail posted to a cryptography discussion group earlier this week. "The collision attack itself is very interesting from a scientific viewpoint, and there are already some practical implications."
> 
> "Collision" attacks, in which two different sources of plaintext generate identical cryptographic hashes, have long been theorized. But it wasn't until late 2008 that a team of researchers made one truly practical. By using a bank of 200 PlayStation 3 consoles to find collisions in the MD5 algorithm””and exploiting weaknesses in the way secure sockets layer certificates were issued””they constructed a rogue certificate authority that was trusted by all major browsers and operating systems. Stevens, from the Centrum Wiskunde & Informatica in Amsterdam, and de Weger, of the Technische Universiteit Eindhoven were two of the driving forces behind the research that made it possible.




LINK

I have also spoken to a PLC Programming Specialist about this.

It appears that the previous 'Stuxnet' worm was intended to change the 'rpm' of the centrifuges for 'approximately' a 10minute, per day. This 10 minute disruption would have huge repercussions in trying to refine U-235 as you literally need a constant rpm for *months* to separate the U-235-238. Any disruption in RPM would render the whole process back to zero. By doing this, Israel/USA was able to keep Iran at bay. 
So, this points to *very, very specialist programming* with double agents involved (to get the worm into the plant as the plant is isolated from the outside world) . Israel and USA (NSA/CIA) at their finest.

Wiki - Isotope separation


----------

