# The Albanese government



## SirRumpole (23 May 2022)

It all starts here...


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## The Triangle (23 May 2022)

Does he last as leader for a full 3 years?  Or is it entirely dependent on the polls?

Surely he'll have no issues fending off Dutton in a popularity contest?


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## SirRumpole (23 May 2022)

The Triangle said:


> Does he last as leader for a full 3 years?  Or is it entirely dependent on the polls?
> 
> Surely he'll have no issues fending off Dutton in a popularity contest?




Yes he does last.

The Labor party changed it's rules about electing leaders after the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd fiasco.


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## sptrawler (23 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes he does last.
> 
> The Labor party changed it's rules about electing leaders after the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd fiasco.



That's good, because I think Albo is the nearest to a grass roots leader the party has had in a long, long time.
Not being a camera/media attention seeking leader is a change and will give him the chance to bring about some sensible improvements IMO.
It may be the dawn of a new Labor era, which would be refreshing.


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## SirRumpole (23 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> That's good, because I think Albo is the nearest to a grass roots leader the party has had in a long, long time.
> Not being a camera/media attention seeking leader is a change and will give him the chance to bring about some sensible improvements IMO.
> It may be the dawn of a new Labor era, which would be refreshing.




Yes. I thought Beazley was a decent bloke too, but he couldn't beat Howard.


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## sptrawler (23 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes. I thought Beazley was a decent bloke too, but he couldn't beat Howard.



Yes any other time I think he would have done well, right place, right time has a lot of effect on the outcome, as with everything a lot is about timing.


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## IFocus (23 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes. I thought Beazley was a decent bloke too, but he couldn't beat Howard.




Actually have met Beazley  came across as a pretty decent bloke and was comfortable talking  with the peasants.


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## moXJO (23 May 2022)

I liked Beazley.

But anyway 3..2....1 till free stuff.


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## wayneL (23 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> That's good, because I think Albo is the nearest to a grass roots leader the party has had in a long, long time.
> Not being a camera/media attention seeking leader is a change and will give him the chance to bring about some sensible improvements IMO.
> It may be the dawn of a new Labor era, which would be refreshing.



First things out of Albo's and Wong's mouth was all identity politics... Not even CC.

If they want a new era of grass roots politics, then they're going to have to get rid of that, because that is what will keep sowing the divisiveness that we currently have.


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## sptrawler (23 May 2022)

wayneL said:


> First things out of Albo's and Wong's mouth was all identity politics... Not even CC.
> 
> If they want a new era of grass roots politics, then they're going to have to get rid of that, because that is what will keep sowing the divisiveness that we currently have.



As long as Wong didn't have her hand up the back of his shirt, operating his mouth, it should be all good. IMO


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## sptrawler (23 May 2022)

moXJO said:


> I liked Beazley.
> 
> But anyway 3..2....1 till free stuff.



I wonder if the discounts on the E.V's will apply, if you have already ordered one, but it hasn't hit the country yet?🥳 😂


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## moXJO (23 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> I wonder if the discounts on the E.V's will apply, if you have already ordered one, but it hasn't hit the country yet?🥳 😂



I'm worried I'm going to end up with an electric lemon.


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## sptrawler (23 May 2022)

moXJO said:


> I'm worried I'm going to end up with an electric lemon.



Highly possible, it doesn't matter to me a lot, being retired I can use either the standard bike, electric bike, electric scooter or electric car and public transport.
I don't think I would be jumping in for a few more years if I was still working, there is still a lot of ironing out to be done with infrastructure and the tax issue/ cost issue.
There are a lot of issues that no one has got upset about yet, because they are new and novel, but like in W.A they are putting a 2.5c/klm charge on E.V's for loss of fuel excise, but that is a Fed tax the States only get the GST component from memory. Will the Feds put their own tax on?

Then you have the fact that in W.A the State owns the electricity network, so where they were not getting anything from the actual fossil fuel sale now, they will be getting near 30c per Kw/Hr if people use mains to charge.
So at approx 19Kw/100klm which the Ionic 5 gets on the highway, that means the State Govt will then get about $5.70 less the cost of production, or $57/ 1,000klm plus the 2.5c/klm = $25, well it is still cheaper than fuel, but at $82/1,000klm it wouldn't want electricity costs to skyrocket. 

If you had a small SUV say the Kona like I'm buying, the ICE model is half the price and gets say 7l/100kl so it would use 142l of petrol @$2 so about $300/ 1,000klm, but it costs $30,000 less.

That is unless you have your own solar and can charge during the day, not many wage slaves will fall into that category, while renting to save a deposit for a house.
Ah the art of misdirection, the Govt gives with one hand and taketh away with the other. 
From my understanding of how it is set up, it certainly won't take Mark long, to get his E.V incentive payment back. 😂


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## PZ99 (24 May 2022)

Back to the future...


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## Knobby22 (25 May 2022)

Good start from Albenese.

China says congratulations and we want good relations with Australia, blah blah blah.
Albanese straight back with "if you want improved relations with us then drop the tarrifs."

Direct, straight down the line. So nice.


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## SirRumpole (25 May 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> Good start from Albenese.
> 
> China says congratulations and we want good relations with Australia, blah blah blah.
> Albanese straight back with "if you want improved relations with us then drop the tarrifs."
> ...




And stop cyber attacking us would be nice too.


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## sptrawler (27 May 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> Good start from Albanese.



At last an old school politician with a bit of class, it has been missing since 2007 IMO, as I said pre election Albo might take Labor back to its roots, rather than trying to make politics a media soap opera for attention seekers.
You can't expect the general public and the media to have respect for politicians, when they can't treat each other with common decency.









						Albanese sent a signal on bad behaviour this week — and Plibersek scored his first rebuke
					

The timing of the Quad has been much to Mr Albanese's advantage. However, at home, the picture is grim on cost of living, as treasurer Jim Chalmers has underlined this week, writes Michelle Grattan.




					www.abc.net.au
				




One feature of Mr Albanese's first week was his signal that he is apparently determined to try to improve political behaviour.

He publicly rebuked his frontbencher, Tanya Plibersek, for insulting Peter Dutton, who next week will become opposition leader.

Ms Plibersek described Mr Dutton as looking "a bit like Voldemort", the villain from Harry Potter, saying: "I think there will be a lot of children who have watched a lot of Harry Potter films who will be very frightened of what they are seeing on TV at night, that's for sure."

She later contacted Mr Dutton to apologise. Mr Albanese said her comment had been unacceptable.

"I think that, in politics, we need to treat each other with respect. And I think that's important. Tanya recognises that, which is why she apologised," the new PM said.


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## moXJO (27 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> At last an old school politician with a bit of class, it has been missing since 2007 IMO, as I said pre election Albo might take Labor back to its roots, rather than trying to make politics a media soap opera for attention seekers.
> You can't expect the general public and the media to have respect for politicians, when they can't treat each other with common decency.
> 
> 
> ...



Wasn't Tanya part of the "squad" that bullied one of the other members?


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## wayneL (27 May 2022)

moXJO said:


> Wasn't Tanya part of the "squad" that bullied one of the other members?



He has got a bit of a mean girl's streak for sure.


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## wayneL (27 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> At last an old school politician with a bit of class, it has been missing since 2007 IMO, as I said pre election Albo might take Labor back to its roots, rather than trying to make politics a media soap opera for attention seekers.
> You can't expect the general public and the media to have respect for politicians, when they can't treat each other with common decency.
> 
> 
> ...



I will be saving my fulsomeness(sic) for a few months in if warranted.

Listening to QandA last night, there was no evidence of this new magnanimity from the minions


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## sptrawler (27 May 2022)

wayneL said:


> I will be saving my fulsomeness(sic) for a few months in if warranted.
> 
> Listening to QandA last night, there was no evidence of this new magnanimity from the minions



With a bit of luck he wont cowtow to the overpaid loonies in the media.


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## SirRumpole (27 May 2022)

wayneL said:


> I will be saving my fulsomeness(sic) for a few months in if warranted.
> 
> Listening to QandA last night, there was no evidence of this new magnanimity from the minions




Glad that arrogant twit Downer isn't still in Parliament though.


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## wayneL (27 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Glad that arrogant twit Downer isn't still in Parliament though.



He wasn't the one I wanted to punch in the face.


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## SirRumpole (27 May 2022)

wayneL said:


> He wasn't the one I wanted to punch in the face.




So who was it ?


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## wayneL (27 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> So who was it ?



Let's put it this way, I was brought up to never hit girls, and I fully embrace and live that.


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## SirRumpole (27 May 2022)

wayneL said:


> Let's put it this way, I was brought up to never hit girls, and I fully embrace and live that.




I know what you mean.


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## sptrawler (27 May 2022)

It will be good to see this crap sorted out, at last.








						Google Australia’s tax bill just $85 million despite profit rise
					

Search giant Google paid $85 million in tax in 2021 despite earning more than $7 billion from the local economy, shifting the majority of earnings to an international subsidiary.




					www.theage.com.au
				




Search giant Google paid $85 million in tax in 2021 despite earning more than $7 billion from the local economy, shifting the majority of earnings to an international subsidiary which reduced the size of its profits.
Financial accounts lodged on Thursday with the corporate regulator for the 2021 calendar and financial year show Google’s gross revenue in Australia grew 38 per cent to $7.2 billion in 2021, a major increase and a fresh high. Advertising revenue hit $6.1 billion, up from $4.4 billion the previous year.


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## moXJO (27 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It will be good to see this crap sorted out, at last.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Google is trash. Hope they tax them into the dirt.


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## sptrawler (27 May 2022)

moXJO said:


> Google is trash. Hope they tax them into the dirt.



As far as Im concerned, you can throw facebook and twitter into the same trash can, along with most of the media which is  competing in the race to the bottom of the cess pit IMO.
The problem is, having a nice platform where most comments are positive, doesnt drive repeat postings, only negative nasty $hit drives emotion and breeds ongoing combat.
So what do all these forms of interactive media promote?
Only FW's partake IMO.


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## SirRumpole (27 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> As far as Im concerned, you can throw facebook and twitter into the same trash can, along with most of the media which is  competing in the race to the bottom of the cess pit IMO.
> The problem is, having a nice platform where most comments are positive, doesnt drive repeat postings, only negative nasty $hit drives emotion and breeds ongoing combat.
> So what do all these forms of interactive media promote?
> Only FW's partake IMO.




More credit to a platform like this where we can discuss differences respectfully.

HC is a hotbed of random thoughts, trolling and a general lack of respect, even though the turnover is a lot higher.


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## Smurf1976 (28 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> As far as Im concerned, you can throw facebook and twitter into the same trash can, along with most of the media which is competing in the race to the bottom of the cess pit IMO.



If there's one thing really missing at present in mainstream society it's sensible, intellectual discussion.

Look at the overall standard of debate in recent times, on any subject, and to be blunt it's a fair way below what would've been considered acceptable at even a high school debating exercise sort of level in the past. 

It's at the point now where those who actually could make a strong contribution, on any subject, have simply walked away. Pick any subject and just observe not what's being said but who's saying it and what their credentials are. Those with academic qualifications, practical experience or other real, actual knowledge have largely walked away and left the masses to keep yelling at each other.

Just pick a subject and take a look. It's no longer Professor X from the University of 123, it's no longer Mr Y expert who's been doing something for 30 years, it's no longer Ms Z the CEO of big company whose entire business revolves around the subject being discussed. Those people have gone and now it's at best someone who's educated in a completely unrelated field, at worst it's someone who failed grade 10. But hey, they're an instant expert on everything from zoology to traffic engineering to Aboriginal art and they're armed with the full transcript of a 10 minute YouTube video that taught them all they know on the subject.

Of all things the new PM could achieve, raising the standard of public discussion, at least making it polite enough to bring back those with real knowledge, would be a good one.


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## SirRumpole (28 May 2022)

Smurf1976 said:


> If there's one thing really missing at present in mainstream society it's sensible, intellectual discussion.
> 
> Look at the overall standard of debate in recent times, on any subject, and to be blunt it's a fair way below what would've been considered acceptable at even a high school debating exercise sort of level in the past.
> 
> ...




Yes, we have politicians designing power grids now instead of engineers.


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## Smurf1976 (28 May 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes, we have politicians designing power grids now instead of engineers.



That industry and many others.

Nothing wrong with government deciding on the outcome required but we need competent people actually doing things.

Much as the marketing, scheduling and finance people at an airline will decide what destinations they ought fly to and from but they leave the pilots to fly the planes as such.


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## frugal.rock (28 May 2022)

Certainly saw a different face on Albanese apon victory.
I'm dubbing it;
"The Albanese Cheesy Greasy"


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## sptrawler (28 May 2022)

And Albo's real battle begins.








						Greens have mandate to stop new oil and gas projects: Bandt tells Labor
					

A significant number of voters backed the Greens or independents who called for stronger action on climate change – and Adam Bandt says Labor needs to recognise it.




					www.smh.com.au
				




Greens leader Adam Bandt says the party has a mandate to stop new coal and gas mines and warned the Labor government that it will use its balance of power in the Senate to introduce legislation to block new mines.
The Greens look set to quadruple their lower house representation by robbing the LNP of their Queensland seats of Brisbane and Ryan and booting Labor frontbencher Terri Butler from the seat of Griffith.


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## sptrawler (29 May 2022)

It sounds as though the Melbourne rail loop Federal funding isn't a done deal.








						Andrews and Albanese set for showdown on Melbourne’s rail loop funding
					

The Andrews and Albanese governments are on a collision course over the Suburban Rail Loop project, as federal cash will hinge on an independent assessment of the plan.




					www.theage.com.au
				



From the article:
The Andrews and Albanese governments are on a collision course over Victoria’s Suburban Rail Loop project, according to infrastructure experts, who expect federal cash to hinge on an independent assessment of the plan.

Prime Minister Anthony Albanese pledged $2.2 billion before this month’s federal election as an initial investment in the first stage of the 90-kilometre orbital railway through Melbourne’s middle suburbs.
But the commitment – Labor’s largest pre-election infrastructure pledge – is well short of the $11.5 billion Victoria wants from its federal colleagues to build the loop’s first eastern leg. The first stage connecting Cheltenham to Box Hill is set to open by 2035 and cost between $30 billion and $34.5 billion.

Infrastructure experts said further federal funding would be complicated by federal Labor’s pre-election pledge of restoring the role of independent advisory Infrastructure Australia, which Albanese established as infrastructure minister in the Rudd government in 2008 to guide spending decisions.
An Infrastructure Australia spokesman said it was currently evaluating an early-stage submission on the project, which is the first step in a three-stage assessment process.

The Andrews government had asked the former Morrison government for $11.5 billion over 10 years while former Labor leader Bill Shorten promised $15 billion over 15 years ahead of his failed 2019 bid for prime minister.


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## PZ99 (30 May 2022)

90 kilometres ?  Hehehe... how about $50billion + inflation + delays + blowouts ?

        

Chinese_hysterical_laughter.wav


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## sptrawler (30 May 2022)

PZ99 said:


> 90 kilometres ?  Hehehe... how about $50billion + inflation + delays + blowouts ?
> 
> 
> 
> Chinese_hysterical_laughter.wav



Yes there would be a lot of businesses salivating on that gravy train, once it's Govt it's a license to print money, "but minister", "just pay it I don't want any problems, it isn't as though it's our money". 😂


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## basilio (30 May 2022)

Seems like Labour has reached the 76  seats for a majority in the Lower House. 
Passing legislation through the Senate however will require support from either The Greens or the Libs.









						Anthony Albanese and Labor to form majority government
					

Prime Minister Anthony Albanese looks set to form a majority Labor government, with the ABC projecting victory for sitting member Josh Burns in the Melbourne seat of Macnamara.




					www.abc.net.au


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## basilio (30 May 2022)

I hope the Labour Government does appoint and independent speaker. I think Andrew Wilkie would be a great choice. I have always believed he was even handed in his approach to politics

Independent Andrew Wilkie prepared to discuss Speaker role in new Labor government​Tasmanian MP says having an independent Speaker ‘would send a powerful and positive message’ after voters elected large crossbench

Election 2022 results: live votes tracker and federal seat counts
Get our free news app; get our morning email briefing





Andrew Wilkie said if Labor was ‘fair dinkum’ about restoring trust in politics an independent Speaker was worth contemplating. Photograph: Lukas Coch/AAP

Katharine Murphy Political editor

@murpharoo
Mon 30 May 2022 09.57 BSTLast modified on Mon 30 May 2022 11.15 BST


The Tasmanian independent MP Andrew Wilkie says he is prepared to “have a conversation” with Anthony Albanese about being the Speaker of the lower house in the event Labor seeks a presiding officer from outside its own ranks.

Wilkie said on Monday he thought an approach from the new prime minister was unlikely because, in his view, Labor was on track to win 77 seats. The new government reached 76 seats on Monday night after Macnamara was called.

But the veteran independent said even if Labor had a clear majority there were “rational reasons” for the government to seek a Speaker from the crossbench.
“Even if Labor gets to 77 it would send a powerful and positive message to the community [for Albanese] to seek out an independent Speaker,” Wilkie told Guardian Australia, adding it need not necessarily be him.






https://www.theguardian.com/austral...-religion-and-more-traditional-liberal-policy
Wilkie said if Labor was “fair dinkum” about using the new parliamentary term to restore trust in politics, then such a gesture would be worth contemplating, given Australians had put their faith in a new and significantly larger group of independents.









						Independent Andrew Wilkie prepared to discuss Speaker role in new Labor government
					

Tasmanian MP says having an independent Speaker ‘would send a powerful and positive message’ after voters elected large crossbench




					www.theguardian.com


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## sptrawler (30 May 2022)

https://au.news.yahoo.com/australia-warned-over-chinas-new-deal-with-samoa-054847385.
		



China has signed a deal with Samoa to strengthen diplomatic relations in a move that Australia “should be very concerned about”, a local journalist has warned.
China’s Foreign Minister Wang Yi met with Samoa’s Prime Minister Fiame Naomi Mataafa on Saturday where an “Economic & Technical Cooperation Agreement” was signed. Details of the deal are so far unclear.
China is building on a security pact it recently signed with Solomon Islands, which has alarmed Australia and the US as they fear a stepped-up military presence by Beijing.
Alexander Rheeney, editor with the Samoa Observer, said local media were not given details about the meeting and were denied interviews with officials from both sides.

It comes as Mr Wang holds a virtual summit in Fiji on Monday with leaders and top officials from 10 Pacific Island states – which include Samoa, Tonga, Kiribati, Papua New Guinea, Vanuatu, Solomon Islands, Niue and Vanuatu – where details of a secret deal have been leaked.

The deal, obtained by Agence France-Presse (AFP), would see China train local police, become involved in cybersecurity, expand political ties, conduct sensitive marine mapping and gain greater access to natural resources on land and in the water.

As an enticement, Beijing is offering millions of dollars in financial assistance, the prospect of a China-Pacific Islands free trade agreement, and access to China's vast market of 1.4 billion people.


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## rederob (30 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> https://au.news.yahoo.com/australia-warned-over-chinas-new-deal-with-samoa-054847385.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What does this have to do with the Albanese government?


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## frugal.rock (30 May 2022)

rederob said:


> What does this have to do with the Albanese government?



Isn't Penny Wong over there sorting it out for Albo?
It's happening under the noses, whilst Albo watches... 🤪

As for all those locations mentioned, their selling their souls to the devil.


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## sptrawler (30 May 2022)

rederob said:


> What does this have to do with the Albanese government?



As it is in today's news, I would have thought it would have a lot to do with the Albanese Government, as they are now the elected Government. 
I'm assuming they will take a more conciliatory stance than the last Government and actually may resolve some of the existing tensions surrounding the South Pacific region.
I'm surprised you don't think they will be involved.


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## IFocus (30 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> As it is in today's news, I would have thought it would have a lot to do with the Albanese Government, as they are now the elected Government.
> I'm assuming they will take a more conciliatory stance than the last Government and actually may resolve some of the existing tensions surrounding the South Pacific region.
> I'm surprised you don't think they will be involved.




Hmm what a mess will be interesting if Labor can clean it up, suspect its all too late still looks like Labor will fund the public service (rather than extend the marketing arm with contractors)  so maybe some one will turn up.


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## rederob (31 May 2022)

sptrawler said:


> As it is in today's news, I would have thought it would have a lot to do with the Albanese Government, as they are now the elected Government.



Oh, I had not realised Albanese now governed those islands. My bad.


sptrawler said:


> I'm assuming they will take a more conciliatory stance than the last Government and actually may resolve some of the existing tensions surrounding the South Pacific region.



According to Scomo and his entourage they did everything right and were on top of all this.  You mean that was not true?


sptrawler said:


> I'm surprised you don't think they will be involved.



Well, I never saw Australia offer a deal, so I am surprised you think this has had anything to do with the Albanese government. 
Are you of the view that we (Australia) still regard these island folk as incompetents rather than the sovereign nations they are?
And for that matter, what exactly is the problem - preferably in your own words rather than another cut and paste from the media you keep deriding?


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## sptrawler (31 May 2022)

rederob said:


> Oh, I had not realised Albanese now governed those islands. My bad.
> 
> According to Scomo and his entourage they did everything right and were on top of all this.  You mean that was not true?
> 
> ...



I can't cut and paste from the media, they aren't saying anything about it today, obviously it is no longer going to be seen as a failing on Australia's part. 
No news is good news, must have been another storm, trying to be whipped up in a newspaper, they have probably been told to back off it is no longer required.


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## sptrawler (1 June 2022)

At least now we will see some action, a majority Government with a mandate and the media on board, hip hip hooray.  🥳
Now we should see some serious change, rather than the regurgitated hum drum boring $hit.
The first improvement is, my term deposit has gone from nothing to 1.7%, that's good.








						ABC projects Labor will score a 77th seat and evade deals with independents to find a speaker
					

Labor is set to gain a 77th seat, enough for Anthony Albanese to form a majority government and evade making deals with the crossbench to find a speaker.




					www.abc.net.au
				



Labor is set to gain a 77th seat, enough for Prime Minister Anthony Albanese to form a majority government and evade making deals with the crossbench to find a speaker.


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## PZ99 (1 June 2022)

1.7% ? 

No fear... your tax bill will go through the roof


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## basilio (1 June 2022)

The new Government has recast it's Federal Departments to reflect the importance of its electoral policies. Let's hope the quality and speed of their outcomes reflects the urgency of the situation.  This government needs to demonstrate some excellent outcomes within 18 months. Appropriate policies need to be laid out and legislated by the end of this year.









						Anthony Albanese to create climate super-department in bureaucratic shake-up
					

Prime minister also plans to remove AFP from home affairs portfolio as he reshapes the public service




					www.theguardian.com


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## sptrawler (2 June 2022)

basilio said:


> The new Government has recast it's Federal Departments to reflect the importance of its electoral policies. Let's hope the quality and speed of their outcomes reflects the urgency of the situation.  This government needs to demonstrate some excellent outcomes within 18 months. Appropriate policies need to be laid out and legislated by the end of this year.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well it wont take long to find out, gas reservation shouldn't be a problem for the Feds, it is a Labor State Govt.









						Manufacturers warn thousands of jobs at risk unless gas held back from export
					

Large gas users fear spiking energy prices could put them out of business, as Energy Minister Chris Bowen calls emergency meetings.




					www.smh.com.au
				



Major manufacturers warn thousands of local jobs are at risk unless gas is held back from being exported as the Albanese government calls emergency meetings with Queensland’s gas producers and state ministers to address spiking energy prices.
Climate Change and Energy Minister Chris Bowen on Thursday declared there were already positive signs for Australia’s gas supply outlook, but pledged to take necessary action to help businesses overcome a “perfect storm” that has sent east-coast energy prices soaring.


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## IFocus (2 June 2022)

Geezus the gas situation on the east coast is a mess isnt it what is it that Angus Taylor actually did?


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## sptrawler (2 June 2022)

IFocus said:


> Geezus the gas situation on the east coast is a mess isnt it what is it that Angus Taylor actually did?



About as much as the Feds did regarding W.A's gas reservation, Charlie Court contracted to take 170TJ from the NWS to make the Damier to Perth Gas pipeline viable, then the State paid for the pipeline and converted Kwinana Power Station to run on gas, so that there was at least some throughput. It wasn't until years later from memory that W.A actually used the gas they were paying for.
Then Perth was reticulated to have domestic gas, when the initial contract was due to expire Allan Carpenter signed the gas reservation policy to continue the allocation of W.A sourced gas for local consumption.

So in reality WTF has Queensland being doing with its gas, why hasn't their State Government done something about a gas allocation, after all isn't it a State function?


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## Knobby22 (3 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> About as much as the Feds did regarding W.A's gas reservation, Charlie Court contracted to take 170TJ from the NWS to make the Damier to Perth Gas pipeline viable, then the State paid for the pipeline and converted Kwinana Power Station to run on gas, so that there was at least some throughput. It wasn't until years later from memory that W.A actually used the gas they were paying for.
> Then Perth was reticulated to have domestic gas, when the initial contract was due to expire Allan Carpenter signed the gas reservation policy to continue the allocation of W.A sourced gas for local consumption.
> 
> So in reality WTF has Queensland being doing with its gas, why hasn't their State Government done something about a gas allocation, after all isn't it a State function?



WA has the advantage that it operates on its own while the Eastern States are connected in energy and dodgy politics. Angus Taylor had the opportunity to pursue gas reservation but he didn't act.  Do nothing government or were receiving donations towards the election? 

From his own internet page so you don't have to deal with the media.





						Ensuring Australian gas supplies | Ministers for the Department of Industry, Science, Energy and Resources
					

Joint media release with Minister for Resources, Water and Northern Australia Keith Pitt. The Morrison-McCormack Government is examining options for a prospective national gas reservation scheme as part of its plan to make energy affordable for families and businesses and supporting jobs as part...




					www.minister.industry.gov.au


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## sptrawler (3 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> WA has the advantage that it operates on its own while the Eastern States are connected in energy and dodgy politics. Angus Taylor had the opportunity to pursue gas reservation but he didn't act.  Do nothing government or were receiving donations towards the election?
> 
> From his own internet page so you don't have to deal with the media.
> 
> ...



That is the great thing about having the State Government and Federal Government from the same side of politics, the blame game stops.
It is too easy when the sides are opposed, to finger point and run the blame game, that now isn't as effective.
So we should see a more accountable political arena IMO.
As was seen in the pandemic, it can be difficult for the Federals to overrule the States, having opposing sides of politics trying to reach agreement makes it all the more difficult.


----------



## sptrawler (3 June 2022)

Labor getting done what the coalition couldn't, at last some action.  
Now it's seen as sorting out the NDIS, before it was seen as attacking the NDIS.








						‘Just blitz that waiting list’: Shorten eyes NDIS legal blowouts
					

Bill Shorten has vowed to crack down on providers overcharging for services claimed on the NDIS and clear the backlog of thousands of legal appeals.




					www.smh.com.au
				



From the article:
Labor has vowed to crack down on providers overcharging for services claimed on the National Disability Insurance Scheme as well as clear the backlog of thousands of legal appeals for funding, while delivering COVID-19 booster shots to people with disability.
NDIS Minister Bill Shorten said he is disturbed by the “twin-pricing system” for services to people with disabilities and says restoring trust between scheme participants and the senior bureaucrats is vital.


----------



## Knobby22 (3 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Labor getting done what the coalition couldn't, at last some action.
> Now it's seen as sorting out the NDIS, before it was seen as attacking the NDIS.
> 
> 
> ...



It's called doing something about rorting rather than doing nothing. 
Coalition just made cuts to services with a pen without sorting out the rorting. Don't know why you are defending them.


----------



## wayneL (3 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> It's called doing something about rorting rather than doing nothing.
> Coalition just made cuts to services with a pen without sorting out the rorting. Don't know why you are defending them.



Back in Queenslandistan, My biggest single client was the largest Riding For Disabled centre in the state, so was regaled with umpteen accounts of such rorts. I've no opinion on who to blame, but the system was a shemozzle, thievery of the highest order. It certainly needs sorting out big time.

The system also messed up how many charities operate... There weren't many fans of the whole NDIS there.


----------



## sptrawler (3 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> It's called doing something about rorting rather than doing nothing.
> Coalition just made cuts to services with a pen without sorting out the rorting. Don't know why you are defending them.



I'm not defending them I'm just  stating that's how it is, I have reported on numerous occasions about the rorting on the NDIS and every time it has been flagged up previously the Government has been attacked for trying to undermine a Labor initiative.
I personally don't give a ratz as long as it is sorted and as I said before the election labor need to get in, because they can introduce measures that the coalition can't, it's just a fact of life.
Ever heard of mediscare, increasing the pension age, it's just the way it rolls.
A change of Government is needed, then after a couple of terms everyone goes OMG, let's change again.
As I'm coming on 67, I've seen it a few times, the script doesn't change much.


----------



## IFocus (4 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> WA has the advantage that it operates on its own while the Eastern States are connected in energy and dodgy politics. Angus Taylor had the opportunity to pursue gas reservation but he didn't act.  Do nothing government or were receiving donations towards the election?
> 
> From his own internet page so you don't have to deal with the media.
> 
> ...





Read some where it was the Gillard Government that issued the gas licences without holding back provisions.


----------



## sptrawler (4 June 2022)

IFocus said:


> Read some where it was the Gillard Government that issued the gas licences without holding back provisions.



I don't think anyone is really to blame as such, 10 years ago renewables were in their infancy really and the East Coast obviously had many sources of gas supply, probably no one at the time gave it a thought.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but really the focus needs to be on the way forward, in a sensible holistic way.
W.A was in a unique position, we actually were very dependent on one source of LNG for quite some time, so supplies from that source were imperative.


----------



## sptrawler (5 June 2022)

It is good to see something will be done about MyGov, the people I speak to who uses it, say it is a nightmare.









						Ditch the ‘digital workhouse’: Shorten sets sights on myGov
					

The government will audit myGov with the aim of making it more user-friendly and less frustrating and time-consuming to use.




					www.smh.com.au
				




Labor wants to end the “digital workhouse” approach to people trying to get government payments, with new minister Bill Shorten planning to turn using myGov from an often-frustrating experience into a seamless one.
Shorten is taking briefings on his new government services portfolio but wants to get moving immediately on a user service audit of myGov, the online entry portal into services such as Centrelink, Medicare and the Australian Taxation Office.


----------



## SirRumpole (5 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It is good to see something will be done about MyGov, the people I speak to who uses it, say it is a nightmare.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I wish him luck


----------



## sptrawler (6 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> WA has the advantage that it operates on its own while the Eastern States are connected in energy and dodgy politics.* Angus Taylor had the opportunity to pursue gas reservation but he didn't act.  Do nothing government or were receiving donations towards the election?*
> 
> From his own internet page so you don't have to deal with the media.
> 
> ...



That is the narrative the media has been selling for quite some time, now that the Labor /Greens are in power the narrative adjusts. 
A very good article on the state of affairs, it is a pleasant change to get a full article, rather than a politically orientated one..









						The great gas rort: What options does the new government have?
					

In an energy crisis that pits gas exporters against Australia, there are two possible actions for the new Albanese government to take, writes Ian Verrender.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
*Unlike their WA counterparts*, *east coast state governments gave local and multinational energy firms carte blanche to export as much as they'd like.*

The real cause for the crisis, however, relates to a catastrophic blunder dating back more than a decade during the Queensland coal seam gas boom.

The energy giants over-estimated the amount of gas in the ground and contracted to sell more gas offshore than they could source.

To cover the shortage, they since have plundered local gas supplies, pushing domestic prices higher.

Their foreign customers now enjoy much cheaper Australian gas than Australians.

Turnbull's gas crisis redux​This isn't the first time we've faced a gas crisis. In 2017, then Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull was forced to bring the gas exporters to heel.

Australia had just overtaken Qatar as the world's biggest exporter of Liquefied Natural Gas. But the domestic market was facing shortfalls as the exporters squeezed supplies to meet their offshore commitments.

As ridiculous as it sounds, it was cheaper to buy Australian gas offshore, ship it all the way back home and reconvert it from liquid to gas, than to buy it on the local market.

In response, Turnbull created the Australian Domestic Gas Security Mechanism — a strategy designed to limit exports in the event of a domestic shortage.

While it's never been triggered, its creation and the threat it may be used, restrained some of the worst excesses of the exporters.


----------



## sptrawler (6 June 2022)

As I said early in the piece, Albo's biggest challenge will be working with the Greens.



sptrawler said:


> And Albo's real battle begins.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Now this facing the new energy minister Madelaine King.








						Resources Minister says there's 'not much more any government could or should do' on gas prices — while eyeing trigger
					

Madeleine King says she is assured the chief executives of Australia's biggest gas producers are doing "everything they can" to get more supply into the domestic market, but the gas trigger remains an option.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
_Federal Resources Minister Madeleine King has warned there may be little the government can do to reduce soaring wholesale gas prices in the short-term.
Ms King has been urging the chief executives of Australia's biggest gas producers to get more supply into the domestic market, which could lead to cheaper wholesale spot prices.

"I am assured by them that they are doing everything they can — both maximising production in their plants and seeking to maximise supply into New South Wales and Victoria," Ms King told the ABC.
Gas giant Santos has also announced it will expand its operations in the Cooper Basin, which spans the South Australian-Queensland border.
The company's managing director Kevin Gallagher says an additional 15 terajoules of gas per day could hit the domestic market by the end of the year.

Labor's support for gas development has been criticised by the Greens – which have a greater representation in the 47th Parliament – and want to stop new gas projects.

"Methane gas is more expensive than renewables, up to 86 times worse for the climate than carbon dioxide and is responsible for up to 12 per cent of the burden of childhood asthma," Greens leader Adam Bandt said last week._



> "Opening up new gas projects is a climate crime."





Oh dear.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> WA has the advantage that it operates on its own while the Eastern States are connected in energy and dodgy politics. *Angus Taylor had the opportunity to pursue gas reservation but he didn't act.  Do nothing government or were receiving donations towards the election?*
> 
> From his own internet page so you don't have to deal with the media.
> 
> ...



Well why isn't the new Government pursuing a gas reservation policy? I'll let the new minister explain, then you can stop blaming the last minister, maybe let the media know.  
The narrative is on the move, now nothing will be the Govt's fault, until the media run out of reasons to blame the last Govt, then it will be open season on this Govt.
Wash, rinse, repeat, ah the theatre of it.  








						Quickest fix to gas crisis is to bring coal plants back online, Resources Minister says
					

New Resources Minister Madeleine King says restoring ageing coal plants that went offline due to unexpected outages would provide quick relief to the east coast gas crisis.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
The reservation policy has spared WA from soaring gas prices, but Ms King argued it would be hard to implement on the east coast.

"The gas reservation policy of Western Australia was a very great political struggle to introduce, it was very hard on the then state Labor government, and a lot of people lost a lot of political skin in that fight," she said.

"It was also part of the design of the export industry — so it came in at the same time, and was also part of, the investment decisions of international investors into the WA gas production system.



> "That kind of system is very hard to reverse engineer now on the east coast, [the] export market was developed without that in place, investment decisions were made without that restriction."




All of a sudden it is hard to reverse engineer.   
So is putting common sense into the general public. 😂


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> "The gas reservation policy of Western Australia was a very great political struggle to introduce, it was very hard on the then state Labor government, and a lot of people lost a lot of political skin in that fight," she said.




Politics above the national interest ?

Not a good start Ms King.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Politics above the national interest ?
> 
> Not a good start Ms King.



Exactly why I say only the faces change and why I dont hold loyalty to either side.


----------



## Knobby22 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Well why isn't the new Government pursuing a gas reservation policy? I'll let the new minister explain, then you can stop blaming the last minister, maybe let the media know.



I will blame them if they do nothing. At present they are making noises. Only been in a week.

i know we aren't allowed to mention the previous government who are blameless in every way.

Coal prices are extremely high forcing the price up also.


----------



## rederob (7 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Politics above the national interest ?
> Not a good start Ms King.



The Coalition did not want a gas reservation policy, with Turnbull ensuring at the federal level a supply "trigger" mechanism was preferred, and is now locked in.  It's proven totally useless, and needs to be overridden if we are serious about *our *economy ahead of other nation's. 

What has happened under the Coalition is an open book.  Energy companies were screaming for investment certainty and never got it.  Instead they took the low road of cheap renewables and have not been backed up with the necessary grid infrastructure.  Rather they lose tens of millions on a gamble than a few billion at a time on potentially stranded assets!


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> I will blame them if they do nothing. At present they are making noises.
> Coal prices are extremely high forcing the price up also.
> 
> View attachment 142622



I wasnt having a go, just pointing out how the general public can be given a perception, when the reality is completely different.
It wasnt Duttons fault there was no reservation policy, but that was the perception the public were given to believe.
As has been said on numerous ocassions, the onshore gas reservation is a State issue, not a Federal one. That is why W.A has a gas reservation policy, despite what the ranters and chanters rave on about.Lol
The Feds have huge gas reserves offshore in the NW of W.A, whether they decide to use them is another thing.
They could have implemented a reservation policy back when they vave tbe ok to extract the Federal gas. Ooops, lol


			https://www.news.com.au/national/western-australia/federal-government-opens-door-to-floating-lng-plant/news-story/33ad9094cb30216a684007754e37ac68


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## rederob (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The Feds have huge gas reserves offshore in the NW of W.A, whether they decide to use them is another thing.



Well they can't as they don't have gas reservation policy, as you note.  The feds just *regulate *offshore oil and gas activity.

However, this seems to have escaped a lot of people's attention:
*"The **Agreement**, signed by Prime Minister Scott Morrison and LNG exporters, Australia Pacific LNG, Queensland Curtis LNG and Gladstone LNG will help secure competitively priced gas supply for the east coast market at least until 2023."*​​My calendar still shows 2022, not 2023, so that was a fail on time and price!


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

The Feds own offshore resources as I previously posted, you need to get out of electioneering mode, Labor won you can relax.  

*The agreement between Dutch Shell and the then Gillard Government, to allow Shell to extract and process* *Australia's Federal* *offshore reserves, while not reserving any for Australia. *
My calendar shows that was 2013 under the Gillard Government, when Gary Gray was resources minister, but don't let that get in the way of your narrative. 🤣
You tell a great story, you should write children's books, your rhetoric revolves around fantasy. 🥳


https://www.news.com.au/national/we...t/news-story/33ad9094cb30216a684007754e37ac68
From the article:
FEDERAL Resources Minister Gary Gray has varied the conditions on five of the seven Browse retention leases clearing the way for a floating processing plant.
Premier Barnett confirmed this evening the state government was still mulling over the decision, claiming the Commonwealth had rushed the approval.

“The State Government is still pursuing the appropriate development option which includes the appropriate benefits for Western Australia including onshore processing of gas, a supply base *and domestic gas obligations,”* he said.
“It’s a pity that the Commonwealth and State’s position is not aligned,” he said.

*Mr Gray has long supported the floating technology, but today said the new conditions of the lease did not specify any development concept*.

"It was clear that the Browse Joint Venture did not consider development of James Price Point to be commercially viable,” he said.

*“I take the view that companies, not governments, are best placed to determine which developments are commercially viable, subject of course to environmental and regulatory requirements."

He said Australia needed to provide an “environment for commercial decision-making” or risk missing out on investment.*

“Australia, Western Australia and the communities of the Kimberley cannot afford to delay any longer, which is why I have made this decision."

Australian Manufacturing Workers’ Union WA state secretary Steve McCartney was quick to criticise the decision, saying it put royalties before West Australian jobs and simply gave the consortium what it wanted.

“This decision means lost jobs, lost opportunity and lost economic development for Western Australia,” he said.

“It also delivers a severe blow to local communities, especially the most disadvantaged, by taking away opportunities for real jobs and real skills development.

“Manufacturers, construction workers and all the smaller Australian contractors that feed off our LNG industry will all lose because of this decision.”


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> *Or the agreement between Dutch Shell and the then Gillard Government, to allow Shell to extract and process* *Australia's Federal* *offshore reserves, while not reserving any for Australia. *
> My calendar shows that was 2013 under the Gillard Government, when Gary Gray was resources minister, but don't that get in the way of your narrative. 🤣
> https://www.news.com.au/national/we...t/news-story/33ad9094cb30216a684007754e37ac68
> From the article:
> ...




Does anyone else get the feeling of a parallel universe in which roles are reversed ?

The Libs usually act in the interests of big business, but a Liberal Premier Barnett acted in the interest of his State, Labor say they act in the national interest but Gillard lets big business take what they want. (Gough would never have done that).

What is the world coming to ?


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Does anyone else get the feeling of a parallel universe in which roles are reversed ?
> 
> The Libs usually act in the interests of big business, but a Liberal Premier Barnett acted in the interest of his State, Labor say they act in the national interest but Gillard lets big business take what they want. (Gough would never have done that).
> 
> What is the world coming to ?



That's why the rusted on attitude people get is so badly misplaced, Barnett was great, McGowan is great.
It doesn't come with the party, it comes with politicians who give a $hit and put the interests of Australia first.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> That's why the rusted on attitude people get is so badly misplaced, Barnett was great, McGowan is great.
> It doesn't come with the party, it comes with politicians who give a $hit and put the interests of Australia first.



I must admit I'm impressed by Albo and his team. 

I've been a member of 4 political parties in my time, Country, Nationals, LNP and ALP, ( not necessarily in that order and more than once at different stages in the cycle ) as I always liked to be in with the party in power. 

I have absolutely no shame, it is all about me, my family, my friends, my State and Australia, and if you are not with the party in power you cannot influence anything. Nobody in the local branches or head offices seemed to mind. 

I'm no longer a member of any party now. 

I'm hoping that that this ALP Government will have the vision and actions of Keating, even though a few of my mates went broke from interest rates and won't have a bar of him. 

gg


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

Albo has come out of the gates well, he could become one of Australia's great PM's IMO, he has a challenge ahead and I think he is the right person to sort it.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Albo has come out of the gates well, he could become one of Australia's great PM's IMO, he has a challenge ahead and I think he is the right person to sort it.



He seems to be able to get on with most people and doesn't rub anyone up the wrong way.

Of course the media (Sky) will say he's not tough enough but that's their problem.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> He seems to be able to get on with most people and doesn't rub anyone up the wrong way.
> 
> Of course the media (Sky) will say he's not tough enough but that's their problem.



Well I think the main thing that resonates with real Aussies, is the fact he isn't up there trying to big note himself, he doesn't speak mandarin, doesn't speak like a merchant banker, doesn't wear budgie smugglers, doesn't wail at everyone that that they are being picked on, yet has flaws.

You have to admire a guy, that obviously has to punch above his weight, to stay relevant in the $hit pit of politics.

He has, he now has his opportunity and if he is half as smart as I think he is he will measure twice and cut once, rather than shoot from the lip like a lot from  both sides of politics have done.

As for sky media I've never watched it, but I'm sure both sides of the media balance each other out, if people weren't smart Shorten would have been in last election. It wasn't because of Murdoch or Sky media, it was because the silent majority aren't stupid, as this election showed.

The facts lay somewhere between what the left leaning media say and what the right leaning media say, when they cover the same issue, as is being proven with the gas issue at the moment.
The real problems with the energy crisis over East now is, the States who really are the ones for the problems regarding gas, can't take the easy out and blame the Feds that door has closed.
Now the tide is going out, the ones who really stuffed up are going to be caught out swimming naked. Gilding their States with royalties while not allocating anything for domestic reserve, I wonder if ICAC was around then?


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> He seems to be able to get on with most people and doesn't rub anyone up the wrong way.
> 
> Of course the media (Sky) will say he's not tough enough but that's their problem.



I think people have woken up to Sky and all that other Murdoch crap after what happened with Turnbull and Rudd prior to that and for the first time in a decade they played little part in this election. Icing on the cake if they spent millions doing it


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> I think people have woken up to Sky and all that other Murdoch crap after what happened with Turnbull and Rudd prior to that and for the first time in a decade they played little part in this election. Icing on the cake if they spent millions doing it



That IMO is bizarre. 🤣
You think the electorate thinks back that far?
If it had to do with what happened to Turnbull and Rudd, Shorten would have won. I think, you're over thinking it. 
Maybe spending too much time reading the SMH and listening to ABC IMO. 🤣 
If you remember, Murdoch said " we can afford a term of Labor", during Shortens campaign.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> That IMO is bizarre. 🤣
> You think the electorate thinks back that far?
> If it had to do with what happened to Turnbull and Rudd, Shorten would have won. I think, you're over thinking it.
> Maybe spending too much time reading the SMH and listening to ABC IMO. 🤣
> If you remember, Murdoch said " we can afford a term of Labor", during Shortens campaign.



Your last sentence just contradicted the rest of your post. Please remind us why Murdoch said " *we* can afford a term of Labor"... they were undermining the Turnbull Govt.

As for overthinking.... I don't listen to the ABC nor read the SMH... isn't that a subscription thingy ?

Who on earth would pay to read subscription media unless it's to confirm their own prejudices ?


----------



## mullokintyre (7 June 2022)

Albo has  taken a most important step in visiting Indonesia with Penny Wong.
There is a nation of 270 million people on our doorstep, about ten times the number of our own fair citizens.
Indonesia as an ally is far more important than China, the US, or the UK.
Only India ranks in strategic, economic and cultural importance  close to that of  Indonesia.
It is to be hoped that if Albo and PW achieve anything, it is a permanent and constructive upgrading of the relationship with our most populous neighbour.
I await with bated breath.
Mick


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Albo has  taken a most important step in visiting Indonesia with Penny Wong.
> There is a nation of 270 million people on our doorstep, about ten times the number of our own fair citizens.
> Indonesia as an ally is far more important than China, the US, or the UK.
> Only India ranks in strategic, economic and cultural importance  close to that of  Indonesia.
> ...



Before China does IMO.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Your last sentence just contradicted the rest of your post. Please remind us why Murdoch said " *we* can afford a term of Labor"... they were undermining the Turnbull Govt.



No, it was the unlosable election, if you actually want to be accurate. 

Even the TAB were paying out on a Labor win before the election, so trying to get the mixmaster out, to wiz up spin doesn't cut it. 🤣  🤣  🤣

But it's great to see, you still have creativity. 

No one needed to undermine Turnbull, he did a good enough job himself, he is still digging the hole today sadly.😞

History proves, that that those who readily turn on their own, have trouble getting others to trust them.

As for for Rudd he is about as much a Labor person as Turnbull, let's see if he gets a job as an ambassador, I FFing hope not, the two of them should be duct taped together and sent into orbit IMO.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> No it was the unlosable election, if you actually want to be accurate.



Nothing to do with that election... it was all about replacing Turnbull with Dutton the previous year.

In any case it was fitting the Sky news at night anchors all had a sook because their party lost. It was worth changing the Govt just for that reason alone. Naturally they'll campaign against Albo and Co whenever they can for the rest of their term particularly on climate and economic policies. 

Like I said... I hope they lose millions doing it. They won't even be able to claim losses because they avoid tax.

Meanwhile... winners are grinners


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## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

I thought you didn't watch, " Sky news at night anchors all had a sook because their party lost. It was worth changing the Govt just for that reason".
Do you have to pay to watch sky news?
It doesn't come up on my T.V.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Meanwhile... winners are grinners



Yes it should be great for the worker on the award rates, which is terrific, they are the unappreciated people that actually pay for everything through their taxes, consumption, holidays,  socialising and surviving. 

The sad part is, you obviously paint Albo with the same brush as Rudd, Turnbull, Gillard, Shorten.
I certainly hope it doesn't stick.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> I thought you didn't watch, " Sky news at night anchors all had a sook because their party lost. It was worth changing the Govt just for that reason".
> Do you have to pay to watch sky news?
> It doesn't come up on my T.V.



No I don't watch " Sky news at night anchors all had a sook because their party lost. It was worth changing the Govt just for that reason"

Their little sook fest gained mainstream media attention and I posted the article here. I think you even liked it


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Yes it should be great for the worker on the award rates, which is terrific, they are the unappreciated people that actually pay for everything through their taxes, consumption, holidays,  socialising and surviving.
> 
> The sad part is, you obviously paint Albo with the same brush as Rudd, Turnbull, Gillard, Shorten.
> I certainly hope it doesn't stick.



I haven't painted Albo with any brush. I've said many times I don't rate him highly and I don't retract from that yet.


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Their little sook fest gained mainstream media attention and I posted the article here. I think you even liked it



I like most of the things you say, they normally seem balanced and measured, christ knows what has happened to you. 🤣


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> I haven't painted Albo with any brush. I've said many times I don't rate him highly and I don't retract from that yet.



Well that's good, but from my perspective, he is the first non attention seeker that Labor has put up since Kim Beazley.

That is the refreshing thing about this election, it is the first in a long time, where persona and personality didn't win.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> I like most of the things you say, they normally seem balanced and measured, christ knows what has happened to you. 🤣



Nothing has happened to _me_ bro...


----------



## sptrawler (7 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Nothing has happened to _me_ bro...



That's great, Murdoch is no different to any other media , they are trying to sell their product, they all focus on whoever they think has the money to buy their product.
As was shown this election and last election, the city elites are moving left, therefore the media will move left, as they are the ones who buy the product.
To think that one media is bad and another is good, just doesn't work for me, I paint them all with the same brush.
Most media opinion pieces these days are written by inner city yuppies, or ex celebrities, or social influencers that have no understanding of real life challenges, yet everyone holds them up as ffing gurus.
Just my opinion but there is a reason most people end up poor, they listen way too much to other people and the media and they think they are gurus.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> That's great, Murdoch is no different to any other media , they are trying to sell their product, they all focus on whoever they think has the money to buy their product.
> As was shown this election and last election, the city elites are moving left, therefore the media will move left as they are the ones who buy the product.
> To think that one media is bad and another is good, just doesn't work for me, I paint them all with the same brush.



That's your opinion mate and I respect that but I reserve the right to disagree with it.
Murdoch has a long history of attempting to influence elections and/or undermine Govts they don't like.
It's one of the reasons why one of his sons left the company in disgust.
They publicly endorse the Coalition at elections in the same way the Guardian endorse leftist parties.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> That's your opinion mate and I respect that but I reserve the right to disagree with it.
> Murdoch has a long history of attempting to influence elections and/or undermine Govts they don't like.
> They publicly endorse the Coalition at elections in the same way the Guardian endorse leftist parties.



As do the Guardian, the SMH, the AGE and the ABC, how do you differentiate between right and wrong?
The Murdoch press leans right, the ex Fairfax press, the Guardian and the ABC lean left, why condemn one side?
Like I've said over and over, the truth lies somewhere in the middle, if you shut down the Murdoch press, well you would probably be like China.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> As do the Guardian, the SMH, the AGE and the ABC, how do you differentiate between right and wrong?
> The Murdoch press leans right, the ex Fairfax press, the Guardian and the ABC lean left, why condemn one side?
> Like I've said over and over, the truth lies somewhere in the middle, if you shut down the Murdoch press, well you would probably be like China.



Why condemn one side ? Because it's just that one side that acts like a political party rather than a media outlet.
I think just about everyone knows that News Corp has a long history of scandals.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Why condemn one side ? Because it's just that one side that acts like a political party rather than a media outlet.
> I think just about everyone knows that News Corp has a long history of scandals.



I don't condemn any side, I think they are all there to pedal their opinions and beliefs, to further their own ends.
You're the one that thinks only one media outlet has it's own agenda.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> I don't condemn any side,



I never said you did. I just answered your question.


sptrawler said:


> The Murdoch press leans right, the ex Fairfax press, the Guardian and the ABC lean left,  *why condemn one side?*



Why condemn one side ? 

Because it's just that one side that acts like a political party rather than a media outlet.

Because it's only one side that peddles extreme right-wing propaganda and the rank disinformation that comes with it.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> I never said you did. I just answered your question.
> 
> Why condemn one side ?
> 
> ...



And are you saying that there isnt an equal and opposite side of the media? If that were so only one party would ever win elections.
To think Labor are always right and should always be in office is just silly, as is to think think the coalition should be.
Governments stay in, until they run out of ideas, or fall out of favour.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> And are you saying that there isnt an equal and opposite side of the media?



Of course I'm saying that. No other media apart from Murdoch has the ability - let alone the motive - to post anti - Labor "Kick this mob out" headlines on the front page of a nationally distributed newspaper.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Of course I'm saying that. No other media apart from Murdoch has the ability - let alone the motive - to post anti - Labor "Kick this mob out" headlines on the front page of a nationally distributed newspaper.



The SMH, AGE, Guardian and ABC have been posting anti Scomo stuff since he atained office, so what? The people still decide.
Labor are in office, unglue yourself off the road, life is good all is well.
Or are you saying those combined dont have the same coverage as Murdoch?


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The SMH has been posting anti Scomo stuff since he atained office, so what? The people still decide.
> Labor are in office, unglue yourself off the road, life is good all is well.



 "unglue yourself off the road" = dumb personal comment.

 "christ knows what has happened to you" = another dumb personal comment.

This isn't about ...... me. Play the ball not the man.

The SMH has posted anti labor stuff as well. Who cares?


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> "unglue yourself off the road" = dumb personal comment.
> 
> "christ knows what has happened to you" = another dumb personal comment.
> 
> ...



There is only one of us that has a fixation and it aint me. Lol


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> There is only one of us that has a fixation and it aint me. Lol



Not me either mate. My original comment was that Murdoch couldn't swing this election.

So yeah life is good all is well. You don't seem too happy about it but I guess that's tough luck hey ?


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Not me either mate. My original comment was that Murdoch couldn't swing this election.
> 
> So yeah life is good all is well. You don't seem too happy about it but I guess that's tough luck hey ?



Yes and he had fluck all to do with toppling Rudd and Turnbull, they did that all on their own, absolute fkwitts with selfie sticks.
To believe Murdoch swings elections, just shows a lack of perception, did he get Morrison in? Did he get Albanese in? Did he get Turnbull in? Who the hell did he get in?


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Yes and he had fluck all to do with toppling Rudd and Turnbull, they did that all on their own, absolute fkwitts.



That's your opinion. My opinion is he had a lot to do with toppling Rudd and Turnbull.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> That's your opinion. My opinion is he had a lot to do with toppling Rudd and Turnbull.



Why are you the publisher for their upcoming book, two millionaires who were gjven the ar$e and cant come to terms with it.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Why are you the publisher for their upcoming book, two millionaires who were gjven the ar$e and cant come to terms with it.



Yeah... well that stupid comment has just put you on my ignore list. 

So if you want to tell me to "unglue yourself off the road", you'll have to do it the hard way. 

That is.. log out of your account, read my post(s), copy and paste what you don't like, log back in, quote the 'horrendous' post that has offended you so much then add one of your usual stupid personal attacks complete with nefarious editing 10 minutes after you've posted it. 

If you really think that trolling me is really worth all that effort - then knock yourself out.
But don't blame me when you come out of it looking second best.

:waves:​
P.S. please also consider removing all the "likes" on my posts that you don't really like. Thanks.


----------



## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The SMH, AGE, Guardian and ABC have been posting anti Scomo stuff since he atained office, so what? The people still decide.
> Labor are in office, unglue yourself off the road, life is good all is well.
> Or are you saying those combined dont have the same coverage as Murdoch?




Murdoch is pretty visceral when attacking Labor, usually pulling the emotional 'outrage' strings of its usually less sophisticated consumers.

The Age, Guardian, ABC etc usually go for a policy based approach and you have to remember that the Coalition were in for 9 years and made a lot of mistakes so they needed to be questioned fairly hard.

Now that Labor is in, you would expect the same sort of tough but fair scrutiny of their efforts, Murdoch will still keep attacking anything Labor does just because they are Labor.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Murdoch is pretty visceral when attacking Labor, usually pulling the emotional 'outrage' strings of its usually less sophisticated consumers.
> 
> The Age, Guardian, ABC etc usually go for a policy based approach and you have to remember that the Coalition were in for 9 years and made a lot of mistakes so they needed to be questioned fairly hard.
> 
> Now that Labor is in, you would expect the same sort of tough but fair scrutiny of their efforts, Murdoch will still keep attacking anything Labor does just because they are Labor.



100%. And I think Peter Dutton in particular is going to have to moderate his attacks if he wants to be electable.
I noticed the ABC have already pulled up Katy Gallagher for getting her numbers wrong on the budget.








						Katy Gallagher says the government has inherited 'the worst set of budget books' in history. Is that correct?
					

Finance Minister Katy Gallagher says the incoming Labor government has inherited the worst set of budget books in history. Is that correct? RMIT ABC Fact Check investigates.




					www.abc.net.au


----------



## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> I noticed the ABC have already pulled up Katy Gallagher for getting her numbers wrong on the budget.




If only she had said 'one of' the worst.


----------



## moXJO (8 June 2022)

Labor getting ready to flood in working visas again. I don't agree with it and think they will over do it. Where the hell are we putting them?
Labor talks a big "wages protection" game. But more often then not protect big businesses and shaft everyone else.


----------



## wayneL (8 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> If only she had said 'one of' the worst.



That was pretty interesting article, I wish the media did a lot more balanced reporting like that.


----------



## rederob (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The Feds own offshore resources as I previously posted,



Get your facts straight as it affects what governments actually do.
If what you said was true then the feds could sell what they own for a fair price.  But they don't because they have no idea what resources are subsurface, so *regulate *how exploration and development occur. 
As a result the *feds do not own what comes out of the ground*, and can only control how it is distributed.


sptrawler said:


> *The agreement between Dutch Shell and the then Gillard Government, to allow Shell to extract and process* *Australia's Federal* *offshore reserves, while not reserving any for Australia. *
> My calendar shows that was 2013 under the Gillard Government, when Gary Gray was resources minister, but don't let that get in the way of your narrative.



*That's your narrative*, not mine.
I am in favour of including a domestic obligation *for all resources, *as such mechanisms only come into play when they are critical to our economy. 

Just remember that my link was to what was stated *last year*:
*"*Minister for Resources, Water and Northern Australia Keith Pitt said *the new Heads of Agreement puts Australian families and businesses first by making sure Australia does not experience a shortfall in supply at the expense of exports.*​​In other words in full knowledge of the situation we were in (unlike in 2013 when the idea of a renewable energy transition was a fairy tale) the then Minister stuffed up big time.  So Labor blaming the Coalition for our present predicament is fair game, and trying to suggest the problem is almost 10 years old is rather funny.


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## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

wayneL said:


> That was pretty interesting article, I wish the media did a lot more balanced reporting like that.




Actually the ABC has been running Fact Check for quite a while.

They have given stick to both parties along the way.


----------



## basilio (8 June 2022)

Mark Dreyfus is rolling out the Governments anti corruption watchdog timetable.
Looking for legislation by the end of 2022 and start of operation by mid 2023.
Will be* very* interesting to see the Coalition response as this unwinds. For example "How will they vote on the issue ?"
This was a key policy platform for Teals,Labour and The Greens

Attorney-General wants federal integrity commission up and running by mid-2023​By political reporter Matthew Doran
Posted 22m ago22 minutes ago





Mark Dreyfus says a federal anti-corruption body should be operational by this time next year.
Help keep family & friends informed by sharing this article



A national anti-corruption watchdog could be operational by the middle of next year, with the new Attorney-General Mark Dreyfus setting up a task force in his department to deliver on Labor's "paramount objective".
Key points:​
The government has proposed its integrity commission will have retrospective powers and be able to conduct public hearings
Labor will consult with independent MPs on its design
The government hopes it will be running by the middle of next year

Mr Dreyfus, who has been in the role for a week, said the federal government was in a position to take elements from state and territory commissions in designing its own model, addressing what he said were serious flaws in the previous government's proposal.
Legislation before parliament drafted by crossbenchers, including independent MP Helen Haines, would also serve to shape Labor's model.
"It's going to deal with serious and systemic corruption, it's going to be able to receive allegations from a whole range of sources," he told the ABC.


> "It's going to be able to, at its discretion, hold public hearings."



The Attorney-General insisted Labor's proposal would also allow for retrospective investigations.
"We think that it's completely inappropriate to suggest that an anti-corruption commission, once set up, would only be able to look at matters that arose after it was set up," Mr Dreyfus said.









						Government wants federal anti-corruption body operating by mid-next year
					

Attorney-General Mark Dreyfus wants a federal corruption watchdog up and running by mid-2023, if legislation can be passed this year.




					www.abc.net.au


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

@rederob Your link came up with this, on my computer.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

Jeez you're hard work, you have such believe in yourself, you should go into politics. 🤣



rederob said:


> Get your facts straight as it affects what governments actually do.
> If what you said was true then the feds could sell what they own for a fair price.  But they don't because they have no idea what resources are subsurface, so *regulate *how exploration and development occur.
> As a result the *feds do not own what comes out of the ground*, and can only control how it is distributed.



So the Feds don't own anything that comes out of the ground, well if that was true why did they have to sign over ownership to W.A duh.









						Browse Basin deal hands $2b gas royalties to WA Government
					

The Commonwealth officially signs over ownership of 65 per cent of the largest gas field in the Browse Basin to the WA Government, relinquishing up to $2 billion in royalties.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
_*The Commonwealth has officially signed over ownership of 65 per cent of the largest gas field in the Browse Basin to the WA Government, relinquishing up to $2 billion in royalties.*_

Now that is funny having to sign over something you don't own. But I do love your unbending belief, in your own narrative, it's impressive.


----------



## rederob (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> So the Feds don't own anything that comes out of the ground, well if that was true why did they have to sign over ownership to W.A duh.



Neither WA nor the feds own what has been extracted from the ground once permitted.
I can't make it any clearer!

If they did, then once extracted either government - assuming  your concept of ownership - could sell it.  That does not happen.
You have confused the ability to attract royalties from what is extracted, with actual ownership.


----------



## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Neither WA nor the feds own what has been extracted from the ground once permitted.
> I can't make it any clearer!
> 
> If they did, then once extracted either government - assuming  your concept of ownership - could sell it.  That does not happen.
> You have confused the ability to attract royalties from what is extracted, with actual ownership.



Governments own the resources, they give companies the rights to extract them and then sell them for a profit. If there was no government ownership they could not require a reserve like WA does.


----------



## basilio (8 June 2022)

Julian Assange is in a UK prison awaiting resolution of a extradition order from the US to face trumped up espionage charges.

Powerful story on the ABC on the fight his wife and family have undertaken to save his life. IMV this is the time for the Albanese Government to bring Julian back home.
Julian Assange's wife Stella Moris reveals how they raise children together while he is in jail waiting an extradition decision​By Stella Moris
Posted 5h ago5 hours ago, updated 1h ago1 hours ago





  Stella Moris says she fears that if her husband Julian Assange is extradited to the US to face charges, her children will lose access to their father.(Supplied: Gabriel Shipton)
Share this article



My Australian husband Julian Assange is fighting for his life from within the confines of a three-by-two-metre cell in Britain’s harshest prison, Belmarsh.

The US has accused him of espionage as a result of his work with WikiLeaks in 2010-2011 and wants to extradite him to face court.
If his extradition goes ahead, Julian faces a maximum 175-year prison sentence. As his wife, I fear he will be buried in the deepest, darkest corner of the US prison system until he dies.

During another extradition hearing last year a UK magistrate blocked Julian's transfer to the US over fears of "oppressive" conditions that could drive him to take his life.

On July 3, Julian turns 51. It will be the fourth year he has spent his birthday alone in a cell, without conviction.









						'Our nest in the razor wire': How Julian Assange, his wife Stella and their children seek moments of joy within prison walls
					

I don’t need to explain to Gabriel and Max the reality of Belmarsh prison where we go to visit their father. They live it, writes Stella Moris.




					www.abc.net.au


----------



## mullokintyre (8 June 2022)

so, that great bastion of western  adherence to equality and the law allows someone to languish for four years in prison without even charging him with a crime, much less actually convicting him.
next time we hear crap about repressive non western regimeslike China, South Korea or Russia,  just look at the assange case to see the gross hypocrisy displayed.
Assange might be a narcissistic  absolutist dick head, but if that was the critera for putting people in jail, a good percentage of the pipulation would be joining him.
An absolute disgrace.
Mick


----------



## rederob (8 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Governments own the resources, they give companies the rights to extract them and then sell them for a profit. If there was no government ownership they could not require a reserve like WA does.



That's why it's called "regulation."  
Nothing prevents a government from extracting and distributing their resources.  
However, they generally "permit" others to "own" what they extract on conditions they set.  Some conditions are pre-ordained, such as royalty entitlement.  Or, in the case of WA, a reserve allocation that can be exercised if needed.

My earlier link to Morrison's 2021 "agreement" showed it to be a paper tiger.  As a result, we now have to rely on a trigger that only gets us gas from 1 January 2023, rather than now when we need it.  @Smurf1976 posted a road map to get us over the present hump, but it's not a map that sees us into our energy future.  Hopefully Labor's meetings with industry set them on a course that does that better than the COALition.


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Neither WA nor the feds own what has been extracted from the ground once permitted.
> I can't make it any clearer!
> 
> If they did, then once extracted either government - assuming  your concept of ownership - could sell it.  That does not happen.
> You have confused the ability to attract royalties from what is extracted, with actual ownership.



Don't make yourself look more bizarre, of course they own it, Royal Dutch Shell pay the Government for the right to extract it and on sell it.
If the Government didn't own it, Shell wouldn't have to pay Royalties to take it.
The Government isn't in the oil and gas business, so they sell the rights to the company to extract and on sell the gas, while the Government takes a percentage cut on the volume. It's a simple business transaction, what you have going on in your head is completely beyond me.

Same as the Government owned Telstra, then they sold it, now they don't own it.
If the Government wanted to get into the oil and gas business, they could do so, then they would get all the money from the sale of the product, like they do with Snowy Hydro. 
Instead they sell the rights to Exon, Woodside, Shell etc to develop the gas extraction infrastructure and the Government gets a cut of the sales and the associated tax through Royalties, wages, profits etc.
*A royalty payment is a payment made by one party to another that owns a particular asset*, *for the right to ongoing use of that asset.*

Keep the narrative going, you will give yourself a migraine.


----------



## rederob (8 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Don't make yourself look more bizarre, of course they own it, Royal Dutch Shell pay the Government for the right to extract it and on sell it.
> If the Government didn't own it, Shell wouldn't have to pay Royalties to take it.



The government *permits *extraction.
It has no idea what is under the surface, so regulates the use of the land or sea area in question.
If they knew what was there in the first place they would sell it at a fair price.  But they don't, and they don't.
Why is there a problem?
Because the permitting arrangements (or regulations) confer ownership of what is found to the party who sought the permit.  That's the practicality of the matter, and it's why it's important to ensure we don't give away what we need.
It's a bit like the concept of Native Title which similarly does not confer ownership of what is extracted.


sptrawler said:


> The Government isn't in the oil and gas business, so they sell the rights to the company to extract and on sell the gas, while the Government takes a percentage cut on the volume. It's a simple business transaction, what you have going on in your head is completely beyond me.



That's not how it works.  The government permits commerce to occur.  There is no guarantee oil or gas will be found.  And as I said, nothing stops a government being in the oil and gas business if it wants to.

Did you not realise your post claimed the government owned what was extracted, or do you not understand what you write?


----------



## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Did you not realise your post claimed the government owned what was extracted, or do you not understand what you write?



Do you accept that the government OWNS resources that are in the ground ?


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (8 June 2022)

basilio said:


> Julian Assange is in a UK prison awaiting resolution of a extradition order from the US to face trumped up espionage charges.
> 
> Powerful story on the ABC on the fight his wife and family have undertaken to save his life. IMV this is the time for the Albanese Government to bring Julian back home.
> Julian Assange's wife Stella Moris reveals how they raise children together while he is in jail waiting an extradition decision​By Stella Moris
> ...



Mr. Albanese has enough on his plate without having to get involved with bringing Julian Assange back to his home, Magnetic Island, a little piece of paradise which one can see from the roof of the hotel. 

Speaking of which I was recently on the roof of the hotel helping to fix the Foxtel transponder thingo with an older tradie, and I decided to start a geopolitical conversation with him, and as we could see Maggie Island from the roof and I thought young Julian would be a good place to start. 

I began by an exposition of the dialectic that Julian through his work has saved many lives, but it unfortunately has led to the loss of some. I further compared his incarceration at Belmarsh with his antics at the Ecuadorean Embassy. The embassy of that enlightened country is close to one of my old watering holes, The Zetland Arms, which has a larger public bar area than the embassy. 

So he has suffered and has relieved suffering and caused suffering, I said. 

I posited that Albo could call a referendum confined to the good burghers and matrons of Magnetic Island to decide. 

Given the sensitive nature of young Julian's relationship with some of our largest military and economic partners, I would surmise that Albo may decide against this as many of the inhabitants of the island are barking mad, New Agers on Zimmer frames, and others, and may vote to repatriate him, I said. 

The tradie nodded. 

I digress. So the tradie sat down on the roof, took some chop chop from his hiviz and thumbed a Rollie. He then said. 

" And who the f**k is Jeremy Sanjeev when he is at home? "

gg


----------



## sptrawler (8 June 2022)

@rederob 
If the Government didn't own the resource after the exploration license was issued, they would not be able to negotiate royalties and reserve quotas if a resource is discovered on the exploration lease. Once a resource is identified the conditions of extraction and regulations are brokered.
As happened with Allan Carpenter in W.A, when the agreement to extract the gas was being negotiated, Carpenter demanded a reservation of 15% for W.A, if the Government didn't own the gas, the company would have said get stuffed.
They tried that and Carpenter said, thanks for coming and finding the gas, now you can sod off, the company relented and paid the royalties and agreed to the gas reservation.

I can't understand what you are on about, if as you say the company owned the gas they could tell the Government to get stuffed it is our gas.
You are certainly getting yourself confused with your spin.


----------



## rederob (8 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Do you accept that the government OWNS resources that are in the ground ?



Yes, as I have only posted about what is *extracted *from a land area, and *all *land use is regulated. 

@sptrawler seems to have a problem with who owns whatever is extracted, as the permit (or whatever name is chosen) *confers title* of the  mineral to the permit holder.  The permit can have any number of conditions, as @sptrawler notes in the WA agreement.

I have long held the view that Australia is giving away its mineral wealth for bugger all return, and we need smarter legislative provisions so that we don't get screwed over and end up having to pay a lot more tax.  Recent Queensland deals on royalties have been negotiated commercial in confidence, and this is is not tenable in a democracy.


sptrawler said:


> ... if as you say the company owned the gas they could tell the Government to get stuffed it is our gas.



The company obtained their permit with conditions so, as in the WA case, they will have understood the caveats to title.


----------



## SirRumpole (8 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Yes, as I have only posted about what is *extracted *from a land area, and *all *land use is regulated.
> 
> @sptrawler seems to have a problem with who owns whatever is extracted, as the permit (or whatever name is chosen) *confers title* of the  mineral to the permit holder.  The permit can have any number of conditions, as @sptrawler notes in the WA agreement.
> 
> ...



Yes , put an export tax on  coal, iron ore, gas, lithium, bauxite and use the proceeds to upgrade our energy infrastructure.


----------



## UMike (8 June 2022)

The Albanese government is gonna be a major disappointment and will barely last one term.​


----------



## rederob (9 June 2022)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Mr. Albanese has enough on his plate without having to get involved with bringing Julian Assange back to his home, Magnetic Island, a little piece of paradise which one can see from the roof of the hotel.
> 
> Speaking of which I was recently on the roof of the hotel helping to fix the Foxtel transponder thingo with an older tradie, and I decided to start a geopolitical conversation with him, and as we could see Maggie Island from the roof and I thought young Julian would be a good place to start.
> 
> ...



I am still struggling with your capitalsation of *R*ollie.

Anyway, it's about time the fortifications of Maggie got an upgrade as this island's strategic position in the Great Barrier Reef should be our Maginot line.  Enemies venturing further south will die from disappointment at what they will find, and deserve to be spared from that fate.


----------



## Ferret (9 June 2022)

I really don't like Bowen.  

Credit for arranging the meeting on the energy situation, but why does he have to play the blame game taking digs at the previous government?  Just get on with trying to fix things.

Such a politician.


----------



## SirRumpole (9 June 2022)

Ferret said:


> I really don't like Bowen.
> 
> Credit for arranging the meeting on the energy situation, but why does he have to play the blame game taking digs at the previous government?  Just get on with trying to fix things.
> 
> Such a politician.



Hes right about the former government, but the buck now stops with him.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (9 June 2022)

I must admit that I am very impressed thus far with Albo and his government's handling of the Foreign Affairs portfolio. 

He and Penny Wong work well together and his dealings with world leaders will hopefully lead to a safer Australia. 

There will be tough times ahead domestically, with rising interest rates and inflation, house prices and mortgages. 

A tough independent and retrospective Federal Anti-Corruption Commission is long overdue. 

gg


----------



## SirRumpole (9 June 2022)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I must admit that I am very impressed thus far with Albo and his government's handling of the Foreign Affairs portfolio.
> 
> He and Penny Wong work well together and his dealings with world leaders will hopefully lead to a safer Australia.
> 
> ...



I wonder if an CAC will investigate the departure of some Ministers to cushy Board jobs in companies they were supposed to be overseeing in their portfolios ?

Could that be called corruption ? Some  ICAC members may think so.


----------



## sptrawler (9 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> I wonder if an CAC will investigate the departure of some Ministers to cushy Board jobs in companies they were supposed to be overseeing in their portfolios ?
> 
> Could that be called corruption ? Some  ICAC members may think so.



The good thing is, there is talk it will have retrospective powers to 2007.


----------



## sptrawler (10 June 2022)

It's good to Bill is coming out of the blocks at a gallop, some Centrelink programmes to get a makeover, thankfully with computers all the old stationary doesn't have to be replaced.
I have a hard hat at home, that has three different company logo's on it and it was a Government dept first thing the boss has to do is rename the dept. 
At last, the unemployed will have a sympathetic Govt.








						A new points-based system has replaced Jobactive. How will it affect thousands of job seekers?
					

Jobactive — the Australian government's main employment services program — has been replaced by a new service called Workforce Australia Employment Services Provider. Here's how the change will affect your job search.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
From July 4, Jobactive — the Australian government's main employment services program — will be replaced by a new service called Workforce Australia Employment Services Provider.

If you've been on Jobactive while receiving the JobSeeker Payment, you'll soon be moved to the new program.

Workforce Australia has begun contacting participants about how they'll be impacted and what they need to do.

As a jobseeker, what will my obligations be?​There are new changes to the way jobseekers will have to complete mutual obligations.

A new* Points Based Activation System (PBAS)* has been introduced, which will replace the current system where jobseekers are required to submit 20 job applications a month.

Through the PBAS, jobseekers will need to* accumulate 100 points a month *in order to continue receiving payments.

How do I earn points?​You earn points by doing the following tasks:


Completing job applications
Attending interviews
Completing online learning modules

Here are the points values for some tasks:


*Task**Points earned on completion*Job application5 pointsOnline learning modules5 points (maximum of 5 points per month)Attending a job interview 20 points


----------



## mullokintyre (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It's good to Bill is coming out of the blocks at a gallop, some Centrelink programmes to get a makeover, thankfully with computers all the old stationary doesn't have to be replaced.
> I have a hard hat at home, that has three different company logo's on it and it was a Government dept first thing the boss has to do is rename the dept.
> At last, the unemployed will have a sympathetic Govt.
> 
> ...



Puts new meaning to the concept of "points scoring".
Mick


----------



## SirRumpole (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It's good to Bill is coming out of the blocks at a gallop, some Centrelink programmes to get a makeover, thankfully with computers all the old stationary doesn't have to be replaced.
> I have a hard hat at home, that has three different company logo's on it and it was a Government dept first thing the boss has to do is rename the dept.
> At last, the unemployed will have a sympathetic Govt.
> 
> ...



Well its obviously a Coalition policy which Labor can ditch if it wants.


----------



## sptrawler (10 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Puts new meaning to the concept of "points scoring".
> Mick



Yes, this is the very reason Govt's have to be flipped, there would be an uproar if this was suggested by a different Govt, but it needs to happen.
Companies screaming for workers from overseas is ridiculous, that shouldn't happen until you've exhausted the home grown pool.


----------



## sptrawler (10 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Well its obviously a Coalition policy which Labor can ditch if it wants.



Oh of course. 🤣


----------



## SirRumpole (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Oh of course. 🤣



Do I detect a touch of cynicism there ?


----------



## mullokintyre (10 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Do I detect a touch of cynicism there ?



Sometimes there is a fine line between cynicism and sarcasm.
Mick


----------



## sptrawler (10 June 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Do I detect a touch of cynicism there ?






mullokintyre said:


> Sometimes there is a fine line between cynicism and sarcasm.
> Mick



Or maybe I'm not as sharp as you guys and miss the subtleties. 
Fair suck of the sauce bottle, fella's.


----------



## SirRumpole (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Or maybe I'm not as sharp as you guys and miss the subtleties.
> Fair suck of the sauce bottle, fella's.




No offence intended.

We'll see what Labor does with this policy.

Maybe Bill Shorten will get asked about it on Insiders.


----------



## Knobby22 (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It's good to Bill is coming out of the blocks at a gallop, some Centrelink programmes to get a makeover, thankfully with computers all the old stationary doesn't have to be replaced.
> I have a hard hat at home, that has three different company logo's on it and it was a Government dept first thing the boss has to do is rename the dept.
> At last, the unemployed will have a sympathetic Govt.
> 
> ...



He has been sitting there with grand plans for years, stewing away. 
That's why I always like governments to change.


----------



## sptrawler (10 June 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> He has been sitting there with grand plans for years, stewing away.
> That's why I always like governments to change.



My sentiments exactly, new ideas, new faces and a clean slate.


----------



## mullokintyre (10 June 2022)

What is it about  politics in the ALP that any leader has to watch his back.
Writing in  The Evil Murdoch Press today, Cameron Milner a former Queensland labour Secretary who has worked on Labour Election strategies for the last thirty years according to his blurb is already warning Albo to watch out for the demoted Tanya Pilbersek who might get the numbers to shaft him.


> As veteran political commentator and The Australian columnist Graham Richardson wrote a week out from the election, “in the Labor caucus the knives are being sharpened”.
> 
> Current frontbenchers had caucus numbers being whipped to have them dumped despite years of service. Many others missed out again, like Tim Watts, held back from the ministry despite entering parliament the same year as Jim Chalmers.
> 
> ...



The bloke has only been in the job for a few weeks, yet already the knives are out.


> Australia hasn’t seen a full two-term Labor prime minister since Bob Hawke. Little point actually fulfilling your manifest destiny of becoming Labor prime minister if you don’t get to keep it once you’ve got there. If you want to win back-to-back premierships and “change the country”, then you’ve got to have one eye on the electorate and one eye on your caucus.




Must be a pleasant workplace that cess pit they call parliament House.
Mick


----------



## SirRumpole (10 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> What is it about  politics in the ALP that any leader has to watch his back.
> Writing in  The Evil Murdoch Press today, Cameron Milner a former Queensland labour Secretary who has worked on Labour Election strategies for the last thirty years according to his blurb is already warning Albo to watch out for the demoted Tanya Pilbersek who might get the numbers to shaft him.
> 
> The bloke has only been in the job for a few weeks, yet already the knives are out.
> ...




Richardson has gone round the twist I reckon, he's been reading too much Machiavelli.

Paid columnists have to write something otherwise they don't get paid, and nothing sells like a good conspiracy.


----------



## wayneL (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> My sentiments exactly, new ideas, new faces and a clean slate.



All we need now is magi riding in from the east on camels.

Francincense and myrrh, anyone?


----------



## wayneL (10 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> The bloke has only been in the job for a few weeks, yet already the knives are out.



We know these stories always end in a crucifixion


----------



## SirRumpole (10 June 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Or maybe I'm not as sharp as you guys and miss the subtleties.
> Fair suck of the sauce bottle, fella's.



The government has only been in 3 weeks, the legislation for these changes would have had to be passed by the previous government, Labor haven't had the time to make any changes.


----------



## PZ99 (10 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> What is it about  politics in the ALP that any leader has to watch his back.
> Writing in  The Evil Murdoch Press today, Cameron Milner a former Queensland labour Secretary who has worked on Labour Election strategies for the last thirty years according to his blurb is already warning Albo to watch out for the demoted Tanya Pilbersek who might get the numbers to shaft him.
> 
> The bloke has only been in the job for a few weeks, yet already the knives are out.
> ...



Under their rules TB would need over 50% of the caucus and over 50% of the membership vote to challenge. Given the vast majority of the caucus is "third way" centre right I can't see Tanya winning that contest. Bill Shorten... well that's another matter


----------



## IFocus (10 June 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> What is it about  politics in the ALP that any leader has to watch his back.
> Writing in  The Evil Murdoch Press today, Cameron Milner a former Queensland labour Secretary who has worked on Labour Election strategies for the last thirty years according to his blurb is already warning Albo to watch out for the demoted Tanya Pilbersek who might get the numbers to shaft him.
> 
> The bloke has only been in the job for a few weeks, yet already the knives are out.
> ...




And so it starts Murdock campaign to bring Labor down usual suspects cheering on.


----------



## Eager (12 June 2022)

As if to confirm that coalition governments are only capable of being adversarial with anyone and everyone, Australia and China are once again talking to each other. ANY direct dialog is good, regardless of the content.

Relationships with France have also been repaired.

We also have the very welcome situation of the Nadesalingam family coming home. On compassionate grounds alone, this is a far better example compared to the au pair that was working for the liberal donor McLachlan family, or the one working for one of Dutton's former colleagues. For those with conveniently short memories: https://www.news.com.au/national/po...m/news-story/6b9205f78b3693715884a6b1bcda5863

I remember Abbott once pumping himself up as a doer because in his words he has always fighting, battling etc., but never realising that all he had to do to be truly successful was to work with people rather than against them (it's also why Gillard was able to run a very effective minority government). Morrison also fell into the trap, to the detriment of Australia. It is how conservative governments roll. So far, Albanese and his crew have shown how damaging the last 10 years have been to this country, simply by acting as humans should.


----------



## moXJO (13 June 2022)

Small business about to get targeted by ato. I'm sure Labor back to its old tricks. Just after the pandemic and during an inflation burst.
I'm starting to see  businesses going under.


----------



## Knobby22 (13 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Small business about to get targeted by ato. I'm sure Labor back to its old tricks. Just after the pandemic and during an inflation burst.
> I'm starting to see  businesses going under.



The temporary insolvency protection rules have ended.
Plenty of businesses are now forced to declare themselves insolvent.









						End to COVID-19 Insolvency Protections: Win For Creditors | Results Legal
					

On January 2021, as new insolvency reforms to support small business started, the COVID-19 temporary insolvency protections ended. Good news for creditors!




					www.resultslegal.com.au
				












						At some stage the ATO will tighten up debt recovery in 2021 – are your clients at risk? - Rapsey Griffiths
					

Now the pandemic’s effects are letting up, it’s tipped that the ATO will start taking action to recover the debt. Additional resources are also likely to be allocated to the ATO to help them manage the significant task of collecting tax liabilities, especially historical ones predating COVID. To...




					rapseygriffiths.com.au


----------



## PZ99 (13 June 2022)

It should never have been allowed to happen in the first place.

It was supposed to be temporary - not used as a permanent get out of jail card.

Trading while insolvent is a one way ticket to a financial crisis.


----------



## Macquack (13 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Small business about to get targeted by ato. *I'm sure Labor back to its old tricks*. Just after the pandemic and during an inflation burst.
> I'm starting to see  businesses going under.



To be fair, if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about.


----------



## moXJO (13 June 2022)

Macquack said:


> To be fair, if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about



Not so much the roots but the late payments. Giving that material is hard to ship in, cash flow is shot for a lot of people and everyone is paying very slowly. Tax department been given the nudge to go in hard and collect debt.


----------



## moXJO (13 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> It should never have been allowed to happen in the first place.
> 
> It was supposed to be temporary - not used as a permanent get out of jail card.
> 
> Trading while insolvent is a one way ticket to a financial crisis.



It's the stock/material in a lot of cases. By the time some stuff comes in right now people have already cancelled the orders. It's not the 'general badly managed ones I was talking about. It's government lockdowns that pretty much stuffed huge swathes of businesses. 
It's government created on a number of fronts

Public service are clueless.


----------



## Sean K (13 June 2022)

LOL


----------



## moXJO (14 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Not so much the roots but the late payments. Giving that material is hard to ship in, cash flow is shot for a lot of people and everyone is paying very slowly. Tax department been given the nudge to go in hard and collect debt.



Roots=rorts


----------



## sptrawler (14 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Roots=rorts



Yes late payments for roots, can lead to problems, whether your married or single.


----------



## PZ99 (14 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Roots=rorts



Not a truer word spoken... just ask Gladys Berejiklian


----------



## PZ99 (15 June 2022)

Minimum wage up by 5.2 %. 

Labor got what they wanted but now they need to cut taxes for business right now.









						Fair Work Commission says 5.2pc increase 'protects real value of wages' for Australia's lowest-paid workers — as it happened
					

The national minimum wage will be $812.60 per week, or $21.38 per hour, after a decision by the commission exceeds the government's suggested 5.1 per cent increase.




					www.abc.net.au


----------



## rederob (15 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Labor got what they wanted but now they need to cut taxes for business right now.



Why?
When I had a small company taxes were never a problem as there were so many ways to reduce them!
The company also had lots of assets that were put to excellent personal use.
Small businesses should always have a good tax accountant and not rely on bookkeepers to save them money.


----------



## PZ99 (15 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Why?



Because increased wages + higher inflation + higher interest rates + higher fuel costs + higher power costs is not the sort of thing a business can absorb let alone make disappear into thin air no matter how good their tax accountant is.

I don't want this to become another case where the business community cite the above to lobby the 'independent' FWA to cut penalty rates again which has always been their low hanging fruit.


----------



## rederob (15 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Because increased wages + higher inflation + higher interest rates + higher fuel costs + higher power costs is not the sort of thing a business can absorb let alone make disappear into thin air no matter how good their tax accountant is.
> 
> I don't want this to become another case where the business community cite the above to lobby the 'independent' FWA to cut penalty rates again which has always been their low hanging fruit.



All businesses adjust their prices accordingly.
It's not rocket surgery.


----------



## PZ99 (15 June 2022)

rederob said:


> All businesses adjust their prices accordingly.
> It's not rocket surgery.



Then feel free to pass on this simplistic advice to the Chamber of Commerce and business community.
They're already having a whinge.


----------



## rederob (15 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Then feel free to pass on this simplistic advice to the Chamber of Commerce and business community.
> They're already having a whinge.



Hawke was the only person in my memory able to get workers and businesses to agree on what had to be done regarding wages.
Aside from that I cannot ever recall a single employer body supporting a wage push.
The only time wages significantly affect a business is when they cease to be competitive, and there are lots of reasons how that can occur.  Given their peers are at the same disadvantage with wage increases, that factor is logically excluded.


----------



## PZ99 (15 June 2022)

rederob said:


> Hawke was the only person in my memory able to get workers and businesses to agree on what had to be done regarding wages.
> Aside from that I cannot ever recall a single employer body supporting a wage push.
> The only time wages significantly affect a business is when they cease to be competitive, and there are lots of reasons how that can occur.



Taxation is the other driver which was a key change made by the Hawke Govt to make that agreement possible.


----------



## Eager (15 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Then feel free to pass on this simplistic advice to the Chamber of Commerce and business community.
> They're already having a whinge.



Indeed. ACCI chief exec Andrew McKellar has said that the cost over the next 12 months will be $7.9b. 

Someone needs to remind him that all of it will probably be put back into the economy. *facepalm*


----------



## rederob (16 June 2022)

Eager said:


> Indeed. ACCI chief exec Andrew McKellar has said that the cost over the next 12 months will be $7.9b.
> 
> Someone needs to remind him that all of it will probably be put back into the economy. *facepalm*



During the GFC Keating put a $1000 bonus back in the hands of taxpayers.
During the pandemic Jobseeker bolstered payments to the unemployed.
All the evidence suggests these payments were stimulatory.

The Coalition's record on real wages was abysmal:




However, during the same period employer profit margins were constantly increasing.  So morally bankrupt are employer groups that they actually argued for further wage cuts, against the above backdrop.


----------



## PZ99 (22 June 2022)

Wow.... $10k for crocodile tears ? What a joke. LOL









						Cafe owner gifted $10,000 by Kyle and Jackie O after teary interview
					

Phillip Salhab, who runs the Appetite eatery in Five Dock, said he feared his business couldn't survive amid rising cost pressures and a 5.2 per cent increase to the minimum wage.




					www.dailymail.co.uk


----------



## Smurf1976 (22 June 2022)

rederob said:


> All businesses adjust their prices accordingly.



Not if they're trade exposed they can't.

It's either pass the cost back to workers / government / suppliers or go broke. This problem is of course not directly due to which party is in government - both seem to fail to grasp the realities of trade exposed industry.

At present we seem to have a very divided economy. Some sectors booming, others basically stuffed and ignored.


----------



## moXJO (22 June 2022)

Intentionally or not, some of the best wages I've seen came under the coalition. Mainly from the fact we were not importing as many workers during covid.
Job opportunities were plentiful.
People had a lot of money for years.


----------



## moXJO (22 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Wow.... $10k for crocodile tears ? What a joke. LOL
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hospitality is so mixed at the moment. You can't get staff. Delivery drivers are impossible to find with the current fuel prices. And you are paying a huge amount for workers.

Restaurants most guys I know are raking it in. Cafes are the opposite. They seem to be struggling as they have hit the point where they can't raise prices anymore. Customers are baulking at the expense. 

Work from home had an effect as well.


----------



## sptrawler (22 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Restaurants most guys I know are raking it in. Cafes are the opposite. They seem to be struggling as they have hit the point where they can't raise prices anymore. Customers are baulking at the expense.
> 
> Work from home had an effect as well.



That's probably a good point, the cafes are probably more in line with the market place, as they may rely on passing foot traffic, with spare change in its 'pocket'. Whereas the restaurants are a premeditated and budgeted spend.
I know some of the cafes around my area are closing, so it will be interesting to see if the trend accelerates with the wage increase, also I wonder if it will affect weekend opening hours.
Interesting times.


----------



## PZ99 (22 June 2022)

moXJO said:


> Hospitality is so mixed at the moment. You can't get staff. Delivery drivers are impossible to find with the current fuel prices. And you are paying a huge amount for workers.
> 
> Restaurants most guys I know are raking it in. Cafes are the opposite. They seem to be struggling as they have hit the point where they can't raise prices anymore. Customers are baulking at the expense.
> 
> Work from home had an effect as well.



Agreed. However after watching that interview where the owner stated he was already paying his staff some 20% above the award rate it's fair to assume the 5.2% rise had no effect on that business. Everything else, yes, but not the wages.

Obviously that didn't stop the media from politicising it by blaming the wages whilst ignoring the real issues.


----------



## moXJO (22 June 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Agreed. However after watching that interview where the owner stated he was already paying his staff some 20% above the award rate it's fair to assume the 5.2% rise had no effect on that business. Everything else, yes, but not the wages.
> 
> Obviously that didn't stop the media from politicising it by blaming the wages whilst ignoring the real issues.



I dare say that guy has discovered that running a small business f*cking sucks.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (30 June 2022)

Beijing has called Anthony Albanese ‘ignorant’ and ‘ill-informed’


----------



## wayneL (30 June 2022)

Dona Ferentes said:


> Beijing has called Anthony Albanese ‘ignorant’ and ‘ill-informed’




As much as it pains me to say, I think the Chinese are correct.

I hold these truths as self-evident.


----------



## moXJO (15 July 2022)

Albo's doing alright so far. No complaints.


----------



## Knobby22 (15 July 2022)

moXJO said:


> Albo's doing alright so far. No complaints.



Bit of a test coming up Monday. 
Hopefully he holds the line on home payments for Covid. It probably should have ended in March.


----------



## wayneL (18 July 2022)

Honeymoon over already?


----------



## mullokintyre (18 July 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> Bit of a test coming up Monday.
> Hopefully he holds the line on home payments for Covid. It probably should have ended in March.



Fail.
Caved into the states and union movement.
COVID payments at least to be shared between states and feds.
mick


----------



## moXJO (18 July 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Fail.
> Caved into the states and union movement.
> COVID payments at least to be shared between states and feds.
> mick



Labor supporters were thick on twitter saying "how refreshing it was to have a PM that listened". 
Not sure why these idiots think there's an endless supply of money with no repercussions.

Albos biggest threat will be the woke and commie brigade constantly screeching. Hope he doesn't listen. They literally ruined every western country.


----------



## Smurf1976 (18 July 2022)

moXJO said:


> Albos biggest threat will be the woke and commie brigade constantly screeching. Hope he doesn't listen. They literally ruined every western country.



Probably not the most popular thing to say on a stock market forum but I'll add some elements of the business lobby to that.

Some of what the say is justified and has merit, as with most lobby groups there's an element of truth, but some is just trying to prop up outdated business models for no reason other than self interest.

When it comes to the latter, government needs to let capitalism do its thing and let the outdated fail to make way for the new. There's more than a few trying to avoid change right now, clinging to what's become obsolete.


----------



## wayneL (19 July 2022)

Smurf1976 said:


> Probably *not the most popular thing to say on a stock market forum* but I'll add some elements of the business lobby to that.
> 
> Some of what the say is justified and has merit, as with most lobby groups there's an element of truth, but some is just trying to prop up outdated business models for no reason other than self interest.
> 
> When it comes to the latter, government needs to let capitalism do its thing and let the outdated fail to make way for the new. There's more than a few trying to avoid change right now, clinging to what's become obsolete.



You'd never get any argument from me on that score. The current system is not capitalism, unless we admit the mutant crony version thereof... effectively economic fascism.

Creative destruction is healthy for an economy.

Curiously, it is the crony capitalists and the hysterical wokist which seem to be operating symbiotically. This is a cultural and economic malaise which may destroy what we have.


----------



## Knobby22 (19 July 2022)

The goverment has a number of larger political battles to win against the Greens and using political capital on this relatively minor issue was not worth it.

At least this scheme now ends in September.

I heard the Assistant Treasurer talk on 7:30 report and she came across well as determined to reign in the largesse.


----------



## PZ99 (22 July 2022)

Say goodbye to HollyWoke 









						Bill Shorten intervenes to remove ‘birthing parent’ from medical forms amid criticism in Daily Telegraph
					

Decision to stop trial of trans-inclusive language at three hospitals condemned by LGBTQ+ advocates and praised by Katherine Deves




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## SirRumpole (22 July 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Say goodbye to HollyWoke
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Good on ya Bill.

It was interesting to see on Afternoon Briefing (ABC TV) a LNP Senator get her cues wrong and criticise a decision introduced by the previous government !

https://iview.abc.net.au/video/NU2222V124S00  at the 32:00 minute mark.


----------



## mullokintyre (23 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Good on ya Bill.
> 
> It was interesting to see on Afternoon Briefing (ABC TV) a LNP Senator get her cues wrong and criticise a decision introduced by the previous government !
> 
> https://iview.abc.net.au/video/NU2222V124S00  at the 32:00 minute mark.



Ya don't understand Horace, when ya is in opposition, ya  supposed to oppose everything, regardless of who made the original decision.
Thats how our parliamentary democracy works.
Mick


----------



## SirRumpole (23 July 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Ya don't understand Horace, when ya is in opposition, ya  supposed to oppose everything, regardless of who made the original decision.
> Thats how our parliamentary democracy works.
> Mick




I get that, but sometimes the pollies just look stupid when they oppose something they supported a couple of months ago.

They would have for more cred in my opinion if they just said what they thought and stuck with it instead of slavishly towing the party line.


----------



## mullokintyre (23 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> I get that, but sometimes the pollies just look stupid



personally, I would have left out the "sometimes".
Mick


----------



## sptrawler (23 July 2022)

I think we are going to see this happen more and more, over the next few years, especially on renewable sites as they are generally proposed in remote and in culturally or environmentally sensitive areas.









						Plibersek halts fertiliser plan for Indigenous cultural site after outcry
					

The environment minister is staying silent as she considers an application from Indigenous women to stop the project.




					au.news.yahoo.com


----------



## SirRumpole (23 July 2022)

sptrawler said:


> I think we are going to see this happen more and more, over the next few years, especially on renewable sites as they are generally proposed in remote and in culturally or environmentally sensitive areas.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Well, basically the whole country is 'culturally sensitive' as our indigenous friends lay claim to all of it.

Sometime the government will have to put a stop to it and consider the national interest first.


----------



## sptrawler (23 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Well, basically the whole country is 'culturally sensitive' as our indigenous friends lay claim to all of it.
> 
> Sometime the government will have to put a stop to it and consider the national interest first.



Yes but with the ground swell of interest, in becoming of indigenous heritage, there will be a lot of public backlash. So it wont be easy, I read there are 30% more people identifying as indigenous than were in the last census, I know my youngest son is but I don't know where he traces it back from. 
It definitely isn't from my side, unless there was a travelling Australian native in Yorkshire, in my history.


----------



## moXJO (24 July 2022)

ABCC about to get scrapped so unions can continue to act like dckheads onsite. Hope it's not the start of the ideological creep.

Still seem to be brown nosing the Yanks but it's still early days.


----------



## wayneL (24 July 2022)

moXJO said:


> .. Hope it's not the start of the ideological creep.



It's not.

It's the start of ideological gallop.


----------



## IFocus (25 July 2022)

moXJO said:


> ABCC about to get scrapped so unions can continue to act like dckheads onsite. Hope it's not the start of the ideological creep.
> 
> Still seem to be brown nosing the Yanks but it's still early days.





How about a commission on the big money  / real corruption  / dodgy building standards / bankruptcy avoiding repairs etc etc.

To ideological eh.


----------



## sptrawler (25 July 2022)

IFocus said:


> How about a commission on the big money  / real corruption  / dodgy building standards / bankruptcy avoiding repairs etc etc.
> 
> To ideological eh.



It will be interesting to see what is actually actioned, on all fronts, with Albo in charge I'm hoping for a breath of fresh air.
Several others are carrying way too much baggage IMO, but with Albo's popularity it may well keep the lid on them. 
Time will tell, but if the self serving take over, it will be a short honeymoon IMO.





__





						Review to strengthen super | Treasury Ministers
					






					ministers.treasury.gov.au
				



From the article:
That’s why we have tasked Treasury to review the operation of the Your Future, Your Super laws (YFYS laws) after the second round of MySuper performance tests have taken place by August this year.

Funds must always be held accountable for their performance. In doing so, accountability mechanisms must not simultaneously create perverse or unintended outcomes for members.

*The Government is aware of concerns that the YFYS laws have the potential to create such outcomes by discouraging certain investment decisions or certain infrastructure investments.*


----------



## moXJO (25 July 2022)

IFocus said:


> How about a commission on the big money  / real corruption  / dodgy building standards / bankruptcy avoiding repairs etc etc.
> 
> To ideological eh.



More like the paper bags stuffed full of cash on Chinese jobsites handed over to members.

 Commission into work cover and their bs treatment of injured. Cases costing $200000k + with a $15k payout to claimants.

Or only allowing approved builders to get the nod. Where do you want to start?


----------



## macca (26 July 2022)

Hopefully we don't return to the days of $850k tuckshops a la K Rudd era


----------



## sptrawler (28 July 2022)

The question I want asked is, if we legislate 43% reduction and can't meet it, what happens.
Do we have to pay a fine, do we have to buy credits off the EU, really what does it mean?


----------



## SirRumpole (28 July 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The question I want asked is, if we legislate 43% reduction and can't meet it, what happens.
> Do we have to pay a fine, do we have to buy credits off the EU, really what does it mean?



SFA probably. Its an aspirational thing not a contract and its too far away for most people to care. Not that we shouldn't try, but if we only get to 40% is anyone going to sue us ?


----------



## wayneL (28 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> SFA probably. Its an aspirational thing not a contract and its too far away for most people to care. Not that we shouldn't try, but if we only get to 40% is anyone going to sue us ?



We won't have any money to pay anyway


----------



## PZ99 (28 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> SFA probably. Its an aspirational thing not a contract and its too far away for most people to care. Not that we shouldn't try, but if we only get to 40% is anyone going to sue us ?



We'll be lucky to even get to that figure. The Govt of the day whoever they are will either BS their way through it by using offsets or just dump it outright. The Climate wars are not over


----------



## mullokintyre (28 July 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The question I want asked is, if we legislate 43% reduction and can't meet it, what happens.
> Do we have to pay a fine, do we have to buy credits off the EU, really what does it mean?



It will mean that  special interest groups will take the Government to court for not meeting the targets as legislated.
Lawyers will make a (another) motza, we taxpayers  will pay through the nose, and Oz will still not have met the targets.
Gotta be a great outcome.
Mick


----------



## SirRumpole (28 July 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> It will mean that special interest groups will take the Government to court for not meeting the targets as legislated.




Not if the government un-legislates the target first.


----------



## mullokintyre (28 July 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Not if the government un-legislates the target first.



That would probably require a change of government, or even multiple changes of government.
Mick


----------



## macca (28 July 2022)

sptrawler said:


> The question I want asked is, if we legislate 43% reduction and can't meet it, what happens.
> Do we have to pay a fine, do we have to buy credits off the EU, really what does it mean?




Mate, we just close everything down at let China make the stuff

Didn't you know they are exempt from the virtue signalling rules


----------



## sptrawler (28 July 2022)

macca said:


> Mate, we just close everything down at let China make the stuff
> 
> Didn't you know they are exempt from the virtue signalling rules



That's right, I keep forgetting it is a third world developing country.


----------



## sptrawler (9 August 2022)

Well it looks like patching up the friendship with China, is far more problematic than first thought.









						Albanese pledges Australia’s return to golden age with China
					

Labor leader Anthony Albanese says Australia’s tricky relationship with China won’t be changed overnight, but if he is elected he hopes to oversee a return to business with the superpower.




					thewest.com.au
				




Well that was the intent, it doesn't seem to be panning out that way.









						China delivers blow to Albanese after 'unacceptable' act
					

The fallout from Australia criticising China's Taiwan retaliation continues with yet another scathing message. Find out more.




					au.news.yahoo.com
				




Foreign ministry issues lengthy list of demands​As it did over and over again with the Morrison government, the foreign ministry warned Mr Albanese to change his government's ways, suggesting he is heading the way of his predecessor.

"We urge the Australian side to develop a clear understanding of the situation," he told reporters.

"Pursue the right course, respect China’s core interests and major concerns, abide by the one-China principle, observe basic norms governing international relations, stop interfering in China’s internal affairs, stop saying or doing the things that undermine regional peace and stability, refrain from echoing or assisting certain countries’ misguided strategy of using the Taiwan question to contain China, and avoid creating new obstacles for China-Australia ties."


----------



## mullokintyre (9 August 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Well it looks like patching up the friendship with China, is far more problematic than first thought.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah, I just don't understand why Australia doesn't just follow NZ and kowtow to everything China demands.
Mick


----------



## sptrawler (9 August 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Yeah, I just don't understand why Australia doesn't just follow NZ and kowtow to everything China demands.
> Mick



I guess it's because we sell more than lamb and kiwi fruit to them.


----------



## Knobby22 (9 August 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Yeah, I just don't understand why Australia doesn't just follow NZ and kowtow to everything China demands.
> Mick



That was in January. A lot of water has passed under the bridge since then.


----------



## moXJO (18 August 2022)

So albo is about to up immigration intake to 200,000 for skilled migration. And accept shtty third world training/degrees. 
On advise from the business(slave trader) council.

Homeless at record highs. Housing being built is currently slowing. And your Australian education basically void. Currently it's an employees market, but say goodbye to that.

Some things never change it seems.


----------



## JohnDe (18 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> So albo is about to up immigration intake to 200,000 for skilled migration. And accept shtty third world training/degrees.
> On advise from the business(slave trader) council.
> 
> Homeless at record highs. Housing being built is currently slowing. And your Australian education basically void. Currently it's an employees market, but say goodbye to that.
> ...




Australia is the country it is today because of immigration, starting with the first fleet.


----------



## wayneL (18 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> Australia is the country it is today because of immigration, starting with the first fleet.



Immigration is nuanced.

We want immigrants that will benefit Australia and *Australians/current residents* as a whole.

Not to specifically benefit the corporatocrats(sic) et al.


----------



## Smurf1976 (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> Australia is the country it is today because of immigration, starting with the first fleet.



It is but as with anything more isn't automatically better.

Growing population is directly at odds with concerns about the natural environment for example. It's more food, more water, more minerals, more everything and ultimately it must stop at some point.

It would be less of an issue if we were an economy based on intellectual pursuits or at least manufacturing which can simply be scaled up as population grows. In practice however we're an economy that's substantially reliant on resource extraction and therein lies the problem - there's only a finite quantity of those resources such that each additional person means less per capita, the resource base doesn't grow with population.

Related is the question of where that growth is focused.

More people in WA, NT, SA and Tas might actually achieve something, it might make viable some things that aren't really viable at present due to an insufficient population base but the same isn't true in Sydney or Melbourne, there's very little that the big two don't have today on account of lack of population.

Growth can be good but it isn't automatically, it depends greatly on the detail.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

Smurf1976 said:


> It is but as with anything more isn't automatically better.
> 
> Growing population is directly at odds with concerns about the natural environment for example. It's more food, more water, more minerals, more everything and ultimately it must stop at some point.
> 
> ...




Everyone has a different definition of more. Yours might be less than mine, and mine less than my neighbours.


----------



## moXJO (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> Australia is the country it is today because of immigration, starting with the first fleet.



Failing to address the housing crisis, or tafe/university first is what I have a problem with. Flooding in cheap labour helps big business, which Labor is notorious for. Despite their supposed idealogical position.


----------



## mullokintyre (19 August 2022)

Albanese may have  pissed off a small but important  section of the Population, the Vietnam Era veterans.
Yesterday was Vietnam Vets day, though you might never have known about it given the low level of publicity.
Albanese acknowledges anything and everything, but some how his army of advisers missed the day.
The Minister for veterans affairs put out a press release before the day, so they were at least on the ball.
Lets hope that he does better next year when its the 50th anniversary of the battle of  Long tan.
mick


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2022)

Smurf1976 said:


> It is but as with anything more isn't automatically better.
> 
> Growing population is directly at odds with concerns about the natural environment for example. It's more food, more water, more minerals, more everything and ultimately it must stop at some point.
> 
> ...




I'd like to see the government solve the basic problems first.

Like housing, people sleeping on the streets or in shipping containers is not what this country should be about.

Where are another 200,000 a year going to sleep, in caves ?


----------



## sptrawler (19 August 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Albanese may have  pissed off a small but important  section of the Population, the Vietnam Era veterans.
> Yesterday was Vietnam Vets day, though you might never have known about it given the low level of publicity.
> Albanese acknowledges anything and everything, but some how his army of advisers missed the day.
> The Minister for veterans affairs put out a press release before the day, so they were at least on the ball.
> ...



Maybe wanting to stick to the small target theme, better to have missed it than have the media going on about him glorifying war.
Keep the focus on the secret ministries, that in the same breath the reporters are saying the deputy P.M McCormack knew about. Lol


----------



## sptrawler (19 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Failing to address the housing crisis, or tafe/university first is what I have a problem with. Flooding in cheap labour helps big business, which Labor is notorious for. Despite their supposed idealogical position.



Mate you need to cut out the free thought and stick to the script, or you will be cancelled. Lol


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Failing to address the housing crisis, or tafe/university first is what I have a problem with. Flooding in cheap labour helps big business, which Labor is notorious for. Despite their supposed idealogical position.




Utopia is a myth. There is always going to be problems, but we always work out solutions.

TAFE was introduced to overcome problems "_Technical education tended to prosper during times of national crises such as world wars and economic depression when there were more funds provided for buildings and student places._" We are currently experiencing a national crisis.

A labour shortage will help existing workers increase their wages, and for a short time this is good. But what happens if the labour shortage continues for an extended period and gets worse?



> Impact of labour shortages – Summary​
> Rising wages in competitive industries
> Rising inflation as firms pass wage costs onto consumers
> Higher wages may increase labour supply as it becomes more attractive to work.
> ...



There needs to be balance, that is what the existing federal government is trying to do; a balance between higher wages, economic prosperity and a continuing development of Australia.

The other alternative is to follow the extreme left - governing bodies control wages, everyone is treated equally, environment is protected by having minimal industrial development.

Which do you prefer?


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> The other alternative is to follow the extreme left - governing bodies control wages, everyone is treated equally, environment is protected by having minimal industrial development.




False argument, pretending that only extremes are valid.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> False argument, pretending that only extremes are valid.




A one sentence response offers no information on what you are trying to convey.

_False argument_? No argument just a limited example due to format and time constraints.

_Pretending that only extremes are valid_? Again, it was only a limited example. In this instance taken from my days as a member of the greens many moons ago.

FYI I don't class the Greens as extreme left (just far left), though I do wonder how they would implement their policies if they had full control of parliament


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> A one sentence response offers no information on what you are trying to convey.




You said

*"The other alternative is to follow the extreme left - governing bodies control wages, everyone is treated equally, environment is protected by having minimal industrial development."*

You implied that there was only one alternative to "your way" and that was to follow the extreme Left. That statement is extreme in itself. 

There are other ways that are not extreme but rational. 

One is recognising that there is a limit on development and population that must be recognised to avoid degradation of resources and lifestyle.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> You said
> 
> *"The other alternative is to follow the extreme left - governing bodies control wages, everyone is treated equally, environment is protected by having minimal industrial development."*
> 
> ...




To be clear, writing on an internet forum "the other alternative is" does not translate to 'the only alternative'. It only indicates that there is another alternative, it may be the only one or there could be others. On the other hand if I had said 'the *only *other alternative is', then I would have limited it to one.

"_One is recognising that there is a limit on development and population that must be recognised to avoid degradation of resources and lifestyle_." Yes, that was Greens policy when I was a member 30 odd years ago. It disappeared from their written formats and discussions not long after. They even had a population number that Australia could comfortably accommodate that would not cause any further damage to the environment, water supply, and so on.


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> To be clear, writing on an internet forum "the other alternative is" does not translate to 'the only alternative'. It only indicates that there is another alternative, it may be the only one or there could be others. On the other hand if I had said 'the *only *other alternative is', then I would have limited it to one.
> 
> "_One is recognising that there is a limit on development and population that must be recognised to avoid degradation of resources and lifestyle_." Yes, that was Greens policy when I was a member 30 odd years ago. It disappeared from their written formats and discussions not long after. They even had a population number that Australia could comfortably accommodate that would not cause any further damage to the environment, water supply, and so on.




*The *is singular indicating only one. If you wanted to suggest that there may be more than one alternative *another *would be more appropriate.

Anyway, let's not nitpick about semantics because I think we are on the same page as far as the Greens are concerned.

I think they were a good party until they were infiltrated by communists like Lee Rhiannon. Thankfully she is gone but Bandt seems to have taken over her mantle. Although he makes some good points about corporate profits and tax dodging he still seems to think that money can be plucked out of thin air or printed without causing unwanted consequences. A bit more pragmatism wouldn't go astray.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> *The *is singular indicating only one. If you wanted to suggest that there may be more than one alternative *another *would be more appropriate.
> 
> Anyway, let's not nitpick about semantics because I think we are on the same page as far as the Greens are concerned.
> 
> I think they were a good party until they were infiltrated by communists like Lee Rhiannon. Thankfully she is gone but Bandt seems to have taken over her mantle. Although he makes some good points about corporate profits and tax dodging he still seems to think that money can be plucked out of thin air or printed without causing unwanted consequences. A bit more pragmatism wouldn't go astray.




The options are ….


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> The options are ….



You only stated one.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> You only stated one.





Definition of option

(Entry 1 of 2) 1 : *an act of choosing hard to make an option between such **alternatives*.


----------



## JohnDe (19 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> *The *is singular indicating only one. If you wanted to suggest that there may be more than one alternative *another *would be more appropriate.
> 
> Anyway, let's not nitpick about semantics because I think we are on the same page as far as the Greens are concerned.
> 
> I think they were a good party until they were infiltrated by communists like Lee Rhiannon. Thankfully she is gone but Bandt seems to have taken over her mantle. Although he makes some good points about corporate profits and tax dodging he still seems to think that money can be plucked out of thin air or printed without causing unwanted consequences. A bit more pragmatism wouldn't go astray.



 True.


----------



## moXJO (19 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> Utopia is a myth. There is always going to be problems, but we always work out solutions.
> 
> TAFE was introduced to overcome problems "_Technical education tended to prosper during times of national crises such as world wars and economic depression when there were more funds provided for buildings and student places._" We are currently experiencing a national crisis.
> 
> ...



Homelessness of families that can't get housing is real. There is a shortage of rentals. 
Saying "oh it's never perfect" is missing the fact that there's nowhere to live.

Wage growth will lower more. Make no mistake, this is slave Labor for businesses.

There's what? 200k permanent jobs 300 part time and in comes 400k of skilled workers with subpar training. 
 Companies seem to be over hiring then not providing enough shifts for workers to cover living expenses. Aged care is notorious. This isn't a good thing for this period of time.

In NZ pensioners are taxed normally for work they do. Australia has 50% tax or something.
Participation in Australia of pensioners is something like 3%
In nz it's 23-25%. (Fuzzy on the details as it's something I looked at a long time ago)



We won't be hitting climate targets any time soon either. Government here is doing the easy thing for them and the sht thing for the rest of us. There's huge holes in education, utilities, etc. 

The other thing I would argue is that migrant workers are rarely protected either. 

It's short sighted policy.


----------



## IFocus (19 August 2022)

Oh God, 10 years of attacking unions, 10 years of flooding in immigration to prop up the GDP, 10 years of letting foreign corporations enslave workers and paying SFA, 10 years of letting banks rip off the average punter, remember ripping penalty rates of the lowest paid all the time here was silence and crickets.

And now the revelations about Morrison extortionary.

Labor will need (wont get) 20 years to repair the damage

BTW being away in the country side of the SW stunning scenery had a great time.


----------



## Smurf1976 (20 August 2022)

JohnDe said:


> Everyone has a different definition of more. Yours might be less than mine, and mine less than my neighbours.



Of course but does anyone dispute that increasing the population of Sydney to 6, 8, 10 or however many million won't mean more of everything compared to retaining it at ~5 million?

Regardless of how much each individual uses, if we have twice as many people then in total they're definitely going to use more than we do now. Indeed if living standards are to be retained then all up it's quite a bit more.

In the context of Perth, Darwin, Adelaide or Hobart there's an argument that it does bring real benefits. Add another million to Perth, double the population of Adelaide and double the population of Tasmania as a whole and it might actually fix some present problems. 

That said, the problems it fixes are mostly rather trivial ones - we're talking about a Tasmanian AFL team being viable and things like more live music events in Perth and Adelaide and things like that. Entertainment and other "nice to have" but by no means essential things. It's not fixing serious things like homelessness or hospitals.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

IFocus said:


> Oh God, 10 years of attacking unions, 10 years of flooding in immigration to prop up the GDP, 10 years of letting foreign corporations enslave workers and paying SFA, 10 years of letting banks rip off the average punter, remember ripping penalty rates of the lowest paid all the time here was silence and crickets.
> 
> And now the revelations about Morrison extortionary.
> 
> ...



Morrison, Turnbull, and Abbott were all called out. Scomo was hated. Where were you for the last ten years? Labor was just a terrible alternative at the time.

Do you know what the unions were trying to negotiate?
That they would agree to mass skilled migrants if they were made to join the unions. Yeah truly looking after members.
It's looking like the same bs as last time. It's possibly the worst time to allow mass skilled migration. Half the number would have been adequate.

The housing crisis is bad. Builders are now going under so it gets worse. We then import workers and it floods the market with more shonks when it's looking like turning down.

I'll criticise sht decisions. Labor went back on a pledge on their immigration target. Doing so spits on Australians. It's a cop out after hearing so much about "Labor Values".


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Builders are now going under so it gets worse.




You seem to be in this industry so I'll ask you the question, are builders going under because they are being priced out of the market by raw material increases, or for some other reason ?


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

Smurf1976 said:


> Of course but does anyone dispute that increasing the population of Sydney to 6, 8, 10 or however many million won't mean more of everything compared to retaining it at ~5 million?
> 
> Regardless of how much each individual uses, if we have twice as many people then in total they're definitely going to use more than we do now. Indeed if living standards are to be retained then all up it's quite a bit more.
> 
> ...



Sustainable migration is absolutely needed. "Big Australia" is a stupid idea and doesn't just lower standard of living, buy ruins the actual Australian environment.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> You seem to be in this industry so I'll ask you the question, are builders going under because they are being priced out of the market by raw material increases, or for some other reason ?



They got caught in a price squeeze. Signed up too many buyers and got caught during covid, shortages and price rises.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

The *national* vacancy rate has fallen to its lowest point on record after four consecutive months of holding steady.
*Sydney* has fallen to a record low vacancy rate of 1.3%, exacerbating worsening rental conditions and a highly competitive environment.
*Melbourne’s* vacancy rate dropped for the seventh consecutive month to 1.4%, the lowest point since March 2019.
*Brisbane* remains at an all-time low of 0.6%.
*Perth* and *Adelaide* rental markets continue to tighten, falling over the month to a record low of 0.5% and 0.2%, respectively.
*Brisbane*, *Hobart* and *Canberra* were the only cities to remain steady over the month.
While vacancy rates have fallen in July and continue to operate in a landlords market, we could see rental conditions stabilise in the coming months with the rise of investment activity helping to alleviate tightening conditions.





__





						Loading...
					





					www.domain.com.au
				




So something like 23,000 national rentals currently available. But tell me I'm over exaggerating.

You also have to take into account that many people had to move back with their parents. People living in caravans and shared housing.

Investment opportunity for those willing to take the punt.


----------



## IFocus (20 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> They got caught in a price squeeze. Signed up too many buyers and got caught during covid, shortages and price rises.





Same here locally plus big problems getting trades to turn up, everyone just trying to survive know some one who had a 63% price rise thrown up before signing the contract needless to say he passed on the deal.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

IFocus said:


> Same here locally plus big problems getting trades to turn up, everyone just trying to survive know some one who had a 63% price rise thrown up before signing the contract needless to say he passed on the deal.



It's crazy. I think it's beginning to ease. Certain items are just gone though and majority of stock is order only. Gone are the days someone has it in stores.


----------



## IFocus (20 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Morrison, Turnbull, and Abbott were all called out. Scomo was hated. Where were you for the last ten years? Labor was just a terrible alternative at the time.
> 
> Do you know what the unions were trying to negotiate?
> That they would agree to mass skilled migrants if they were made to join the unions. Yeah truly looking after members.
> ...





I think the term deathly silence fits and there are more than just the CFMEU that have been shackled.

Still agree re immigration to a point however the structural problems running through the economy thanks to previous do nothing governments that managed a low wages environment of the working poor / under class keeping people unskilled while importing skilled migration will take time to fix and likely wont be solved during Labors term.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Investment opportunity for those willing to take the punt.



Catching the falling knife, in a sector that could be attracting new tax implications, there are profit opportunities or possible new pitfalls.
Ah getting wealthy is so easy, the baby boomers were so lucky, now the opportunity presents for the next generation, some will gamble and win, some will gamble and lose.
The losers will be forgotten, the winners will be held up by the media as the reason for the teenagers of today, not being able to get into the property market in the future.
Wash, rinse, repeat.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2022)

IFocus said:


> I think the term deathly silence fits and there are more than just the CFMEU that have been shackled.
> 
> Still agree re immigration to a point however the structural problems running through the economy thanks to previous do nothing governments that managed a low wages environment of the working poor / under class keeping people unskilled while importing skilled migration will take time to fix and likely wont be solved during Labors term.



So taking from that we just expect increased competition from increased immigration, and it will increase for three years, so get used to the idea of increased rent, increased homeless, less job opportunities, more unemployment and more crime.
Yep OK, Roger that.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

IFocus said:


> I think the term deathly silence fits and there are more than just the CFMEU that have been shackled.
> 
> Still agree re immigration to a point however the structural problems running through the economy thanks to previous do nothing governments that managed a low wages environment of the working poor / under class keeping people unskilled while importing skilled migration will take time to fix and likely wont be solved during Labors term.



The libs literally ignored huge fundamental problems. I'm not saying everything they did was wrong and it's the same with Labor. But they both seem to add fuel to the fire to make it worse in the long term. I'd hate to see Australia's standard of living drop to that of somewhere like the US. The amount of homeless was ridiculous. 

The people that really do care about workers, aged, homeless and the direction of the nation are rarely those that are in power.


----------



## moXJO (20 August 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Catching the falling knife, in a sector that could be attracting new tax implications, there are profit opportunities or possible new pitfalls.
> Ah getting wealthy is so easy, the baby boomers were so lucky, now the opportunity presents for the next generation, some will gamble and win, some will gamble and lose.
> The losers will be forgotten, the winners will be held up by the media as the reason for the teenagers of today, not being able to get into the property market in the future.
> Wash, rinse, repeat.



Similar thing happened 2011 and I took the punt. It was off the back of a property bull that use to post here. I was a bear and bit the bullet and took on board what he said. 
Made bank from that bet.

But research research research. What I said was a throw away line as I think property is over priced. The building game might continue on though.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Similar thing happened 2011 and I took the punt. It was off the back of a property bull that use to post here. I was a bear and bit the bullet and took on board what he said.
> Made bank from that bet.
> 
> But research research research. What I said was a throw away line as I think property is over priced. The building game might continue on though.



Property is over priced in some places, property IMO has to be priced on net dividend return and possible capital gain on location value, everything else is white noise.


----------



## qldfrog (21 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> Similar thing happened 2011 and I took the punt. It was off the back of a property bull that use to post here. I was a bear and bit the bullet and took on board what he said.
> Made bank from that bet.
> 
> But research research research. What I said was a throw away line as I think property is over priced. The building game might continue on though.



I would look outside the economics,  more toward the societal and regulation changes. we have a role model.. kind of.. which we seem to follow,  and it is not the US,  more Europe. UK especially but economically more Spain... 
would you own an investment property in UK or Spain now.. irresoective of price? 
labour and green aka far left in power,plus immigration loose directly links to 
ghettos,  crime,  squatters and anti landlord legislation, taxes. 
IP in Australia is a no go in 2020. 
Who cares about the yield if the rent is not paid,  you have to pay the rates, water, BC, and any loan,  and the not paying tenant is still there after years of defaults and throw you in jail if you become agitated. welcome to woke starving vegan EV uberised Australia 2040
Own property / ppor is slightly different.  but not the same market and will still see the effects of crime and ghetto. choose wisely for a place to live,  not an investment


----------



## moXJO (21 August 2022)

qldfrog said:


> I would look outside the economics,  more toward the societal and regulation changes. we have a role model.. kind of.. which we seem to follow,  and it is not the US,  more Europe. UK especially but economically more Spain...
> would you own an investment property in UK or Spain now.. irresoective of price?
> labour and green aka far left in power,plus immigration loose directly links to
> ghettos,  crime,  squatters and anti landlord legislation, taxes.
> ...



Given the slugs in parliament own property it will be interesting to watch if they do crack down. Realistically, an increase in skilled population will hold prices up. Should lower interest rates. Increase yields. They have been tightening up the ability to kick renters out though.

But I know what you are saying. The leftist media has definitely entered its "Labor in government" phase with an increase of articles about taking stuff away from the haves. Not the actual rich mind you,like the ones with millions in the bank. But from those in the $200k bracket. 

Greens have been bleating stupidity as usual. Labor/libs are similar at this point. Realistically what's the difference? 
Still sucking US ar5e
Still licking big business boot.
They are still screwing over workers at a time where they shouldn't be. The population is just too dumb to notice. 

Running on environment and then jamming huge numbers of immigration through. Just degrades the Australian environment more. 
Plenty more consumers though.
Plenty more taxpayers.

I'm beginning to set up in another country at the moment. Australia taxpayers are becoming like battery hens. That money is wasted by politicians (who by the way also constantly raise their own wages) on dumb sht. I've personally seen it in action. The attitude that it's an endless pot of money, without seeing the sweat off the backs of Australians that it was taken from.

The standard of living drop is noticeable. Having kids spread over the past 2 decades, you do see the differences.


----------



## sptrawler (21 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> The standard of living drop is noticeable. Having kids spread over the past 2 decades, you do see the differences.



If people think it was tough for the gig economy workers for the last 10 years, IMO they are in for a real shock if 200,000pa immigration starts up, don't forget Kev said Australia's sweet spot is about 50million people.
Well dividing the resources pie, by twice as many people, should make for some interesting outcomes. 
They will certainly get over the worker shortage.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2022)

Those who are concerned about immigration or any other policy area can use this link to contact the PM. I know I have.






						Contact Your PM | Prime Minister of Australia
					






					www.pm.gov.au


----------



## moXJO (21 August 2022)

200k is just skilled migration as well isn't it?
I think the actual migration figures are something like 300k+?


----------



## sptrawler (21 August 2022)

moXJO said:


> 200k is just skilled migration as well isn't it?
> I think the actual migration figures are something like 300k+?



I would think so, they will be bringing family members with them one would think, so the number of working age who would want employment may well exceed 200k.


----------



## sptrawler (21 August 2022)

Like I said we had to have a change of Government on so many fronts, it looks as though waste is being cut.
Has to be done, but only some can do it.









						Eight disability employment services are to be shut down, as sector faces overhaul
					

Eight providers of disability employment services are set to be effectively shut down by the federal government, as part of wide-ranging overhaul of the sector.




					www.abc.net.au
				



Eight providers of disability employment services are set to be effectively shut down by the federal government as part of wide-ranging overhaul of the sector.
From today, 52 of the 104 DES providers nationally will begin to be contacted and informed that some or all of their services will end due to poor performance.

While most will be able to continue offering some services, eight will lose funding for all of their services.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Like I said we had to have a change of Government on so many fronts, it looks as though waste is being cut.
> Has to be done, but only some can do it.
> 
> 
> ...




At least it shows that someone is monitoring results and is prepared to pay on performance.

*Maybe* the last government just paid the invoices and didn't enquire too much about effectiveness.


----------



## sptrawler (21 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> At least it shows that someone is monitoring results and is prepared to pay on performance.
> 
> *Maybe* the last government just paid the invoices and didn't enquire too much about effectiveness.



No the review was started by the previous Government, there would be hell to pay if they said they were closing down a load of disability providers, but I have no doubt they need closing down.


----------



## qldfrog (21 August 2022)

Hey a positive headline for Australia..nearly feeling like sending my resume


			https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/military/radical-plan-to-build-killer-robotoc-submarines-in-sydney-australia/news-story/cc52ba55d0b47c678251e4995c3df0cd


----------



## sptrawler (22 August 2022)

IMO, this will be the biggest challenge the Govt takes on, once this ball gets rolling, it will gather pace and size at a rate that I hope the Government can keep control off.
 IMO it will either be a fantastic achievement, or a pink batt disaster, should be interesting to watch it unfold.
It is one thing changing electrical generators over to renewables, they can absorb some of the costs.
It is quite another getting people out of their cars into a new one and having the infrastructure to support the uptake.









						Australian Government to open gates for more affordable electric cars, petrol and diesel car emissions targets
					

The Australian Government has indicated plans to grow the range of affordable electric cars available, with a national electric-car strategy.




					www.drive.com.au


----------



## Smurf1976 (22 August 2022)

sptrawler said:


> IMO, this will be the biggest challenge the Govt takes on, once this ball gets rolling, it will gather pace and size at a rate that I hope the Government can keep control off.
> IMO it will either be a fantastic achievement, or a pink batt disaster, should be interesting to watch it unfold.



The one thing I don't like about it is this lie:



> Federal Minister of Climate Change and Energy, Chris Bowen, told reporters and industry figures in Canberra today Australia is the only country in the OECD – a group of 38 major world nations – other than Russia not to currently have, or plan to introduce vehicle emissions standards.




We've had emissions standards on cars since the 1970's. Perhaps not the standards Chris Bowen wants, but standards as such nonetheless so it's dishonest to say there are none at all.


----------



## sptrawler (22 August 2022)

The line that sums up what worries me perfectly, is the last line:
_Australia’s vehicle emissions standard needs to be realistic, achievable, and *should not unduly punish consumers or motorists who cannot afford the transition*_*."*

The problem I see is, it has already been stated by the vehicle manufacturers, that it will be difficult and with some cars impossible to attain Euro 7 and if they can the cars will be expensive due to R&D etc.
The most likely outcome IMO will be that the legacy manufacturers in 2030 will say we can't achieve it, so are no longer producing them.
That has two benefits for them, it gives them eight years to ramp up E.V production and two it gives them a definitive time they have to make ICE parts, as in most countries they have to supply parts for 10 years.








						Euro 7 regulations will effectively "ban" internal combustion engines by 2030, industry lobby claims
					

The end of internal combustion engine manufacturing could come sooner than previously thought, if claims from the ACEA are to be believed.




					www.drive.com.au
				




Meanwhile for the next eight years I think it will add a hell of lot of cost to buying or owning a motor vehicle, as the manufacturers keep raising the entry price, in the name of emission standards, not everyone may be able to afford it but still require a car.
Do we end up like the U.S? Smog testing for rego/insurance? Time will tell.
Or is it NBN Mk2, where the taxpayer funds the legacy businesses, to transition from old technology to new technology?


----------



## wayneL (22 August 2022)

EV just can't be achieved at the scale required and ICE shivved in the liver by Greenie loons.

I may just start breeding Clydesdales and making buggies...


----------



## mullokintyre (23 August 2022)

wayneL said:


> EV just can't be achieved at the scale required and ICE shivved in the liver by Greenie loons.
> 
> I may just start breeding Clydesdales and making buggies...



Preferably Dune Buggies, but with batteries.
Mick


----------



## sptrawler (23 August 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Preferably Dune Buggies, but with batteries.
> Mick



You will love this Mick, I was reading about it the other week, right up your street a legend returns. 








						Meyers Manx is Back as a Cool as Heck EV
					

In the 1960s, a Californian upstart called B. F. Meyers & Co launched the OG sports utility vehicle. The original...




					www.gizmodo.com.au
				










Better get back on thread, or I will be in trouble, yet again.


----------



## qldfrog (23 August 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> Preferably Dune Buggies, but with batteries.
> Mick



I saw an old R&D movie on this: the future of Australia motor industry 
Was called Mad Max..a whole serie if i remember 😉


----------



## sptrawler (29 August 2022)

It's strange Albo isn't scrapping the tax cuts for high income earners, they were dead against them when they were initially suggested, I would have thought scrapping them would be popular with the majority.









						Labor vows to keep stage 3 tax cuts for wealthy Australians
					

Tax relief for people earning between $45,000 and $200,000 is locked in for 2024, as Labor agrees to keep the final stage of the government's legislated tax cuts.




					www.abc.net.au
				



The changes scrap the 37 per cent tax bracket for those earning above $120,000, making those earners the biggest winners from the cuts.


----------



## SirRumpole (29 August 2022)

sptrawler said:


> It's strange Albo isn't scrapping the tax cuts for high income earners, they were dead against them when they were initially suggested, I would have thought scrapping them would be popular with the majority.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I think they may have gone a bit too far to ditch them now.

I hope they do ditch them, the financial reality is that they are un-affordable, but Labor apparently doesn't want to be tarred with the Socialist' brush.

It's a big test for Albo I reckon, do what is best for the country or be accused of breaking a promise.

The people most affected didn't vote for him anyway.


----------



## sptrawler (29 August 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> I think they may have gone a bit too far to ditch them now.
> 
> I hope they do ditch them, the financial reality is that they are un-affordable, but Labor apparently doesn't want to be tarred with the Socialist' brush.
> 
> ...



They are not due until 2024, so maybe on a wait and see public reaction, they can always change their mind if there is a backlash.


----------



## frugal.rock (5 September 2022)

This government is like a bad shopping trolley; you use it if it's all you got.

Greens and union's appear to be ruling the roost. 

Am actually missing Scomo and Fries&burger a little...


----------



## moXJO (5 September 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> This government is like a bad shopping trolley; you use it if it's all you got.
> 
> Greens and union's appear to be ruling the roost.
> 
> Am actually missing Scomo and Fries&burger a little...



Yeah, turning into a slow mess.


----------



## PZ99 (5 September 2022)

Heh heh... Not sure what the unions have done but given the revelations about thuggery over the election preselections from a party split 3 ways I think I can safely say those other folks aren't coming back anytime soon


----------



## IFocus (5 September 2022)

Actually I am missing the daily news conference (back ground of a hundred Australian flags) waving pamphlets and saying how good the Morrison Government is while doing nothing other than chest beating on how tough they are on China.

Still I can only hope this government can grow into this form some day who knows?


----------



## frugal.rock (5 September 2022)

Jobs and skills summit. 
Let's open the doors to "skilled migrants", meanwhile, apparently too many Australians go to University. 🤨

You don't even have to run that past the pub test...


----------



## Knobby22 (6 September 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> Jobs and skills summit.
> Let's open the doors to "skilled migrants", meanwhile, apparently too many Australians go to University. 🤨
> 
> You don't even have to run that past the pub test...



It's a conference. Different interests are pushing Different agendas. Let's see what decisions are made before passing judgement.

I actually think it's good that there are discussions going on between different groups who normally never meet.

There have been some good ideas with regard wage bargaining with companies wanting to be able to negotiate together in a sector for instance.

Some powerful groups, usually foreign owned, have been getting a free run with the ordinary Aussie missing out. A reset is due.


----------



## PZ99 (6 September 2022)

The Jobs and skills summit is simply a re-run of the Morrison Govts failed IR omnibus bill from 2 years ago with the biggest difference being an adjustment to the BOOT as opposed to just suspending it altogether.

The Coalition simply can't be trusted with IR because they are paid to hate workers' penalty rates and unfair dismissal.


----------



## Knobby22 (6 September 2022)

PZ99 said:


> The Jobs and skills summit is simply a re-run of the Morrison Govts failed IR omnibus bill from 2 years ago with the biggest difference being an adjustment to the BOOT as opposed to just suspending it altogether.
> 
> The Coalition simply can't be trusted with IR because they are paid to hate workers' penalty rates and unfair dismissal.



BOOT?


----------



## InsvestoBoy (6 September 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> This government is like a bad shopping trolley; you use it if it's all you got.
> 
> Greens and union's appear to be ruling the roost.
> 
> Am actually missing Scomo and Fries&burger a little...




I follow one of the Greens, David Shoebridge, who has done a stellar job in NSW of fighting corruption in the state before moving to Federal politics. He is one of a few greats, like Andrew Wilkie and Rex Patrick that work on transparency.

It's highly amusing to read dumb comments like these versus what Shoebridge has been documenting as their accomplishments trying to convince Labor to do anything they want: nothing so far.

How exactly are they ruling the roost, then? 

Don't you feel like a giant buffoon when you open your mouth and Sky News comes out?


----------



## PZ99 (6 September 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> BOOT?



Better Off Overall Test.


----------



## wayneL (6 September 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> I follow... the Greens




This actually explains a lot.

Treat with ignore, gents.


----------



## InsvestoBoy (6 September 2022)

wayneL said:


> This actually explains a lot.
> 
> Treat with ignore, gents.




Yeah, ignore someone because they follow someone you disagree with on social media. Wow you have got it figured out!


----------



## wayneL (6 September 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> Yeah, ignore someone because they follow someone you disagree with on social media. Wow you have got it figured out!



It's not that, Brx. it's how you name call ALL the time. It's what all Greens do, in the absence of a reasonable point.


----------



## InsvestoBoy (6 September 2022)

wayneL said:


> It's not that, Brx. it's how you name call ALL the time. It's what all Greens do, in the absence of a reasonable point.




Just to make sure I understand this correctly.

I said I follow a politician who happens to be a Green because of their anti-corruption work, you misquote me to say "I follow the Greens", and claim the reason I keep calling you a rabid idiot makes sense now, because I am a Green?

What a moron. I'm a Stalinist.


----------



## wayneL (6 September 2022)

I rest my case, Komrade.


----------



## sptrawler (6 September 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> There have been some good ideas with regard wage bargaining with companies wanting to be able to negotiate together in a sector for instance.



That works extremely well, it actually lifts the minimum wage is a sector, so say for example the CFMEU feels that the construction industry is falling behind, they strike on the big projects to get the minimum construction wage or sit allowance increased.
Then even those who work for the smaller contractors get it, the good thing is it gets rid of the marginal smaller companies out of the mix, as they struggle to compete and make a profit.
Same happens in all sectors, the bigger and more politically/financially sensitive projects cop the industrial action and the increases flow down. It works well for the workers.
The EBA model was introduced to make payrises coincide with workplace changes at the specific location and was usually an above award payment.
I guess we will see in three years how it pans out.
I do think the EBA model had run out of steam, mainly due to the fact you can only increase productivity so much, then the gains start being harder and harder to find, so the pay rises become harder and harder to justify.
Bringing in a truck load of skilled migrants will help keep a lid on wages, as they will be gagging for work and trying to get on the Melbourne/Sydney housing ponzi scheme.
So if the industry wide strikes start, there will be plenty of people willing to take the jobs, that the disgruntled workers leave.
Just my thoughts.


----------



## frugal.rock (22 September 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> I follow one of the Greens, David Shoebridge, who has done a stellar job in NSW of fighting corruption in the state before moving to Federal politics. He is one of a few greats, like Andrew Wilkie and Rex Patrick that work on transparency.
> 
> It's highly amusing to read dumb comments like these versus what Shoebridge has been documenting as their accomplishments trying to convince Labor to do anything they want: nothing so far.
> 
> ...



I only expressed broad and general throw away opinions. I can't stand politics in general.
Back in the day of frequenting "the local pub", the social rule was; no discussion of politics, religion and death.

Thanks for the information on Shoebridge, as I had never heard of him, and, glad your amused with my "dumb comments", which weren't then a complete waste of time.

As for ruling the roost, when little old ladies get stuck at say, Bundanoon train station, because a train never arrived due to "industrial action", I get annoyed.
Union actions seems to  have increased in NSW recently from what I have noticed, but again, that's a generalisation of observations from various sources, and only NSW.
Further, it's not really a point I wish to debate or argue.

I don't watch Sky News, but sometimes I feel like a giant buffoon anyway, because
I'm human, I make mistakes.
I own my mistakes. I try to learn from them, but often find I'm inadvertently making the same mistake again.

If someone starts using derogatory debasing language in regards to correcting what is perceived to be others "mistakes", the intended lesson isn't learnt, but another unintended lesson is.
Chin up, carry on.


----------



## sptrawler (23 September 2022)

Well the change of Government and some thumbs up and backslapping over a beer with China, doesn't seem to have changed China's opinion of us.
The Chinese tariffs on Australian goods are set to remain, who do we blame now?
Best we just keep looking for new markets for our produce and new suppliers for our imports IMO.
Wong hoses down hopes on China tariffs​The Foreign Minister has poured cold water on hopes for an end to the tariffs as a reset in the relationship with Beijing appears to fade.


----------



## SirRumpole (23 September 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Well the change of Government and some thumbs up and backslapping over a beer with China, doesn't seem to have changed China's opinion of us.
> The Chinese tariffs on Australian goods are set to remain, who do we blame now?
> Best we just keep looking for new markets for our produce and new suppliers for our imports IMO.
> Wong hoses down hopes on China tariffs​The Foreign Minister has poured cold water on hopes for an end to the tariffs as a reset in the relationship with Beijing appears to fade.




At least we should have a token increase in tariffs on Chinese goods, and give it as a bonus to pensioners and the low paid.


----------



## wayneL (23 September 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Well the change of Government and some thumbs up and backslapping over a beer with China, doesn't seem to have changed China's opinion of us.
> The Chinese tariffs on Australian goods are set to remain, who do we blame now?
> Best we just keep looking for new markets for our produce and new suppliers for our imports IMO.
> Wong hoses down hopes on China tariffs​The Foreign Minister has poured cold water on hopes for an end to the tariffs as a reset in the relationship with Beijing appears to fade.



They'll never respect us while the Baizuo are in charge.


----------



## The Triangle (28 September 2022)

Government asks Optus to pay for new passports for customers caught up in data breach
					

Foreign Affairs Minister Penny Wong asks Optus to cover the passport application fees for anyone affected by last week's massive data breach.




					www.abc.net.au
				




God help me... I agree with Penny Wong.

_Foreign Affairs Minister Penny Wong has asked Optus to cover passport application fees for anyone caught up in last week's massive data breach, which affected millions of Australians....The opposition has previously suggested the government should waive the fees. However, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese said Optus must cover the cost._

Not surprising to see the Liberals wanting the taxpayer to foot the bill rather than their corporate mates Optus who were responsible for this breach (Optus which is a foreign government-controlled company that likes to employ former Australian Liberal leaders).  

These labor guys aren't too bad after all. Keeping my tax cuts, franking credits, and sticking it to corporations...  Looking good.


----------



## basilio (28 September 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> Just to make sure I understand this correctly.
> 
> I said I follow a politician who happens to be a Green because of their anti-corruption work, you misquote me to say "I follow the Greens", and claim the reason I keep calling you a rabid idiot makes sense now, because I am a Green?
> 
> What a moron. I'm a Stalinist.



You dared to openly support *a* Green politician( for very defined reasons)  get deliberately and mischievously  misquoted  and then  attempt to have a rational discussion with Wayne ? 
Take the ignore option from Wayne and move on Investo.


----------



## InsvestoBoy (28 September 2022)

basilio said:


> You dared to openly support *a* Green politician( for very defined reasons)  get deliberately and mischievously  misquoted  and then  attempt to have a rational discussion with Wayne ?
> Take the ignore option from Wayne and move on Investo.




Boomer snowflakes don't realise that following someone on facebook doesn't mean you vote for them or subscribe to their policies.

Shoebridge and his greenie buddies aren't left enough for the likes of me, I am waiting for the Stalinist purge.


----------



## wayneL (28 September 2022)

basilio said:


> You dared to openly support *a* Green politician( for very defined reasons)  get deliberately and mischievously  misquoted  and then  attempt to have a rational discussion with Wayne ?
> Take the ignore option from Wayne and move on Investo.



We thought you had died, Bas.

Nice to see you back, so the rest of us look sane


----------



## Telamelo (28 September 2022)

There is a recent & current proposal by the Treasury and the Government to disallow franking credits associated with capital raisings by Australian companies. Worse still, they are considering making the legislation retrospective.

This means that investors will be hit by huge tax bills for capital raisings that have been carried out, in good faith, in the past. Investors in companies like BHP, CBA, WBC etc. will all be severely and negatively affected. 

I therefore urge ALL investors to strongly oppose this measure, the details of which can be found in the link below. The link contains an email address which can be used to voice your concerns/disapproval/dissatisfaction 
(prior to deadline 5th October 2022).






						Franked distributions and capital raising | Treasury.gov.au
					

As part of the 2016‑17 Mid‑Year Economic and Fiscal Outlook, an integrity measure was announced to prevent the distribution of franking credits where a distribution to shareholders is funded by particular capital raising activities.




					treasury.gov.au


----------



## Belli (29 September 2022)

Telamelo said:


> There is a recent & current proposal by the Treasury and the Government to disallow franking credits associated with capital raisings by Australian companies. Worse still, they are considering making the legislation retrospective.
> 
> This means that investors will be hit by huge tax bills for capital raisings that have been carried out, in good faith, in the past. Investors in companies like BHP, CBA, WBC etc. will all be severely and negatively affected.
> 
> ...




Do you mean the Tax Payer Alert (TA2015/2) on the subject matter and issued by the ATO in May 2015 wasn't sufficient warning to cause companies to exercise some caution about this matter?


----------



## wayneL (29 September 2022)

Belli said:


> Do you mean the Tax Payer Alert (TA2015/2) on the subject matter and issued by the ATO in May 2015 wasn't sufficient warning to cause companies to exercise some caution about this matter?



Retrospectively would punish the wrong players.


----------



## mullokintyre (30 September 2022)

ARRGGGH, what is wrong with politicians?
After bleating about the coalitions job for the boys for the past ten years, the Labour party has gone and appointed one of their own to High Commissioners position in the UK.
Stephen Smith, who served as Defence minister and foreign affairs minister in the Rudd and Gillard Governments, has joined a conga line of ex politicians doubling up on their generous parliamentary pensions  with he plum posting.
Can't wait for the Greens and the teals  to join the bleating from the coalition.
Mick


----------



## SirRumpole (30 September 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> ARRGGGH, what is wrong with politicians?
> After bleating about the coalitions job for the boys for the past ten years, the Labour party has gone and appointed one of their own to High Commissioners position in the UK.
> Stephen Smith, who served as Defence minister and foreign affairs minister in the Rudd and Gillard Governments, has joined a conga line of ex politicians doubling up on their generous parliamentary pensions  with he plum posting.
> Can't wait for the Greens and the teals  to join the bleating from the coalition.
> Mick



K.Rudd for US Ambassador?


----------



## sptrawler (30 September 2022)

Looks as though the tough decisions are being made. not before time, money just can't keep being handed out.
The only good thing about it is, it isn't splashed all over the media add nauseam 24/7, as it would have been in the past, realities are realities.
https://www.smh.com.au/property/new...or-an-increase-fall-flat-20220930-p5bmbt.html
Low-income households face the prospect of rising rents without an increase in rent assistance, as the government rebuffed calls to boost the payments on offer.

An emphatic Productivity Commission report on Friday called for an overhaul of taxpayer spending on housing help, saying the government should prioritise a review of rent assistance given the “strong case” to improve its adequacy and targeting.

Social Services Minister Amanda Rishworth said reforming Commonwealth Rent Assistance (CRA) was not on the agenda in the coming budget, blaming this on the “$1 trillion debt left behind” by the former Morrison government.

“We would love to fund every good idea that has merit, but we need a way to pay for it,” Rishworth said in a statement to _The Age_ and _The Sydney Morning Herald_. “Treasury estimated in 2020 that a 40 per cent increase to CRA would cost $1.7 billion extra each year in 2019-20 dollars.

“We have to consider all potential increases to payments in the budget context. Reforming CRA is not something we are going to do in the October budget.”


----------



## moXJO (1 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Looks as though the tough decisions are being made. not before time, money just can't keep being handed out.
> The only good thing about it is, it isn't splashed all over the media add nauseam 24/7, as it would have been in the past, realities are realities.
> https://www.smh.com.au/property/new...or-an-increase-fall-flat-20220930-p5bmbt.html
> Low-income households face the prospect of rising rents without an increase in rent assistance, as the government rebuffed calls to boost the payments on offer.
> ...



So far Labor has been surprisingly "adult" about the way things have been run. I don't agree with everything they have done, but not a lot to complain about so far.


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2022)

moXJO said:


> So far Labor has been surprisingly "adult" about the way things have been run. I don't agree with everything they have done, but not a lot to complain about so far.



Yes a change of government has taken the media focus off domestic politics, which is great for public sentiment, a constant barrage of negative political narrative is wearing on the public confidence.
Now the focus is on a new dream, the dawning of a new sunrise built on the promise of cheap E.V's, cheap electricity and clean air, that should keep the plebs happy for a couple of years.


----------



## Knobby22 (1 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Yes a change of government has taken the media focus off domestic politics, which is great for public sentiment, a constant barrage of negative political narrative is wearing on the public confidence.
> Now the focus is on a new dream, the dawning of a new sunrise built on the promise of cheap E.V's, cheap electricity and clean air, that should keep the plebs happy for a couple of years.



The focus is on fixing the mess left by the previous government, trillion dollars debt , internal corruption,  poor policies in energy, ev  etc. and almost no legislation passed for 3 years


----------



## wayneL (1 October 2022)

Pffft. The energy and Ev policies unachievable will blow up in their faces.... and "The Voice" will end up being a divisive clusterphark.

The only thing stopping this being a one term government is the total incompetence and lack of direction of the current illiberal party.


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> The focus is on fixing the mess left by the previous government, trillion dollars debt , i



Obviously the last government should not have done anything about helping people through covid, it certainly was a waste of money, according to the media.
I wonder what the media would have said, if the previous government had said, look we can't afford to help you, suck it up princess.  🤣
You have to love Australian's gratitude, a fully paid year off work a doubling of the welfare payments and now people say why the hell have we got a trillion dollars debt. 
Priceless.


----------



## SirRumpole (1 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Obviously the last government should not have done anything about helping people through covid, it certainly was a waste of money, according to the media.
> I wonder what the media would have said, if the previous government had said, look we can't afford to help you, suck it up princess.  🤣
> You have to love Australian's gratitude, a fully paid year off work a doubling of the welfare payments and now people say why the hell have we got a trillion dollars debt.
> Priceless.



Next big step will be the budget when we may get more sense of their direction.


----------



## InsvestoBoy (1 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Obviously the last government should not have done anything about helping people through covid, it certainly was a waste of money, according to the media.
> I wonder what the media would have said, if the previous government had said, look we can't afford to help you, suck it up princess.  🤣
> You have to love Australian's gratitude, a fully paid year off work a doubling of the welfare payments and now people say why the hell have we got a trillion dollars debt.
> Priceless.




Yep this is 100% the correct take  , the Liberals were perfect stewards of the national debt right up until COVID forced their hand.


----------



## mullokintyre (1 October 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> Yep this is 100% the correct take  , the Liberals were perfect stewards of the national debt right up until COVID forced their hand.
> 
> View attachment 147550



And Howard was the only one who managed to leave the gross debt in a lower position than when he started.
Not even Hawkie managed that.
Mick


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## InsvestoBoy (1 October 2022)

mullokintyre said:


> And Howard was the only one who managed to leave the gross debt in a lower position than when he started.
> Not even Hawkie managed that.
> Mick




Imagine being essentially the undisputed King of Australia for *a decade* with only weenies like Mark Latham to oppose you, being handed an economy by Hawke and Keating who floated the AUD/deregulated banks/slashed tarrifs/implemented enterprise bargaining; into the face of the rise of China and the worlds greatest mining boom and managing to hit eject just before the GFC and your crowning accomplishment in being a legendary economic manager is...

Reducing gross Government debt from 20.8% of GDP to ....20.12% of GDP






👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏


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## sptrawler (2 October 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> Imagine being essentially the undisputed King of Australia for *a decade* with only weenies like Mark Latham to oppose you, being handed an economy by Hawke and Keating who floated the AUD/deregulated banks/slashed tarrifs/implemented enterprise bargaining; into the face of the rise of China and the worlds greatest mining boom and managing to hit eject just before the GFC and your crowning accomplishment in being a legendary economic manager is...
> 
> Reducing gross Government debt from 20.8% of GDP to ....20.12% of GDP
> 
> ...



What you are saying removing tariffs to send all the manufacturing to third world countries and devaluing your currency by 50% was a stroke of genius?
Also great you mentioned the wages accord, that gave the workers a cpi adjusted wage loss of 18%, that pulled Aust out of the $hit.
Obviously you are a business owner,financial adviser or a government worker.lol
Bet you can't wait for the 185,000 new skilled workers to get on board to help us out.
Nothing like you dudes that re write history, rather than owning it. Lol
Wasn't Latham the leader, before he became your weaner, or was he the fall guy which seems to be the go to answer these days.


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## Knobby22 (2 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Obviously
> You have to love Australian's gratitude, a fully paid year off work a doubling of the welfare payments and now people say why the hell have we got a trillion dollars debt.
> Priceless.



I am not grateful. You may think they did a good job of it you will have some disagreeing with you. John Howard for one. 1 Triilion of debt and now interest rates rising.


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## Knobby22 (2 October 2022)

Anyway  old ground and off topic. Lets just drop it.


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## sptrawler (2 October 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> I am not grateful. You may think they did a good job of it you will have some disagreeing with you. John Howard for one. 1 Triilion of debt and now interest rates rising.



I agree with you,  I think it was a completely over the top reaction, but the government were put under immense media and opposition pressure to supply the funding.
Now that the dust has settled, those that demanded the aid and  criticised the government for being slow to provide the funding are now complaining about the debt.
The whole thing is ridiculous, it is what it is, they just have to get on with it, I'm surprised they didnt cancel the final tax cuts.
But like you say, need to move on, I hope the media and the government do so.


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## InsvestoBoy (3 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> What you are saying removing tariffs to send all the manufacturing to third world countries and devaluing your currency by 50% was a stroke of genius?
> Also great you mentioned the wages accord, that gave the workers a cpi adjusted wage loss of 18%, that pulled Aust out of the $hit.




Seems difficult for you to grasp that I'm not saying that at all, but rather that the Howard Government had everything going for it from a national debt perspective and despite the perception of their prowess the entire opportunity was squandered.



sptrawler said:


> Obviously you are a business owner,financial adviser or a government worker.lol




If it's so obvious then why is it wrong on all counts?



sptrawler said:


> Bet you can't wait for the 185,000 new skilled workers to get on board to help us out.
> Nothing like you dudes that re write history, rather than owning it. Lol
> Wasn't Latham the leader, before he became your weaner, or was he the fall guy which seems to be the go to answer these days.




Which part of my post was rewriting history?


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## sptrawler (3 October 2022)

InsvestoBoy said:


> Which part of my post was rewriting history?



My apologies, I obviously misunderstood your post.
One of the major changes that helped, during the Howard years, was the introduction of GST which removed several levels of tax duplication and complication.
Hawke and Keating did rationalise a lot of the economy, by removing tariffs which led to the closing down of local manufacturing and led to cheaper imported goods offsetting the reduction in real wages by the floating of the dollar and the wages accord.
Also the offshoring of manufacturing led to the resources boom, as the first world manufacturing had to be replaced by new manufacturing facilities and equipment being made in the third world countries. That led to the increase in their affluence, which in turn started the building and infrastructure booms in China etc.
Whether the changes of the 1980's and 90's, that led to globalisation, have proven a bonus for the western countries, or a millstone around its neck is open to conjecture.


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## sptrawler (6 October 2022)

Interesting snippet from the jobs and skills minister.








						Australia suffering dire skills deficit with occupation shortages doubling in 2022
					

A new National Skills Commission report has revealed the country is facing a "staggering" skills shortage, with nearly a third of occupations struggling to fill positions.




					www.abc.net.au
				



From the article:
Australia is facing "staggering" skills shortages, according to a new National Skills Commission report, which shows occupation shortages doubled in 2022 as the labour market tightened.
The number of occupations struggling to fill positions has jumped from 153 to 286 over the year, meaning nearly a third of all Australian sectors are confronting serious worker shortfalls.

The Skills Priority List shows registered nurses, software engineers, and care workers are in most demand, with construction managers, childcare workers and motor mechanics also near the top.

Job vacancies have grown more than 40 per cent in the year to August 2022, reaching 309,000 jobs, according to the report.

"I think everything has to be on the table when it comes to supplying the skills and labour we need."
Mr O'Connor also criticised the former government's migration settings, saying they had hamstrung attempts to plug shortages.

His government announced an increase to Australia's permanent migration cap by 35,000 earlier this year.

"We are a very attractive destination but there are other attractive destinations and there are a lot of countries, for example, that do offer you know, do offer some, you know, permanent skilled migration pathways, not just temporary visas."


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## moXJO (6 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Interesting snippet from the jobs and skills minister.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's education and our clunky teaching methods. It's extremely hard to upskill in this country.


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## Smurf1976 (6 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Whether the changes of the 1980's and 90's, that led to globalisation, have proven a bonus for the western countries, or a millstone around its neck is open to conjecture.



Using language that was common at the time, the biggest problem with the bean counters is they failed to count all the beans and thus made decisions that don't add up.

 Of particular relevance to the present situation is those "inefficient" state-owned railways, utilities, road construction crews and so on were "inefficient" because they spent big $ training apprentices, putting existing staff through higher education, building infrastructure for the future and so on. That didn't come cheap.

When such things were disbanded the main cost saving was simply by bringing training in all forms and investment into future assets to a screeching halt. When you're not investing for the future well no surprise you can do it cheaper.

Now the proverbial chickens are coming home to roost with both rundown infrastructure, especially but not limited to energy, and a lack of skilled workers.


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## basilio (15 October 2022)

Good piece from Katherine Murphy on the Albanese governments progress to date. 
Offers an excellent historical perspective on how previous governments have operated when coming to office.









						The Battleship Albanese is a paragon of calm but in the water lurks Dutton, looking for cracks in the armour | Katharine Murphy
					

The government has achieved commendable milestones already thanks to the PM’s reset strategy. If only it could last




					www.theguardian.com


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## SirRumpole (15 October 2022)

basilio said:


> Good piece from Katherine Murphy on the Albanese governments progress to date.
> Offers an excellent historical perspective on how previous governments have operated when coming to office.
> 
> 
> ...



That was a good piece, highlighting the flim flam coming from the Coalition. "A burp tax", give it a rest.

If the Coalition want to win back the TEAL seats, I wish them luck. History shows that Independents who win Coalition seats usually stay there a long time, eg Peter Andren (he had to die before the Nats got his seat back), Andrew Wilke, Zalie Steggal, Helen Haines, Bob Katter etc.

The Coalition will be pushing it uphill for quite a while imo. Albo will be in for two terms at least, maybe more, unless Labor have a complete brain fade.


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## wayneL (15 October 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> That was a good piece, highlighting the flim flam coming from the Coalition. "A burp tax", give it a rest.
> 
> If the Coalition want to win back the TEAL seats, I wish them luck. History shows that Independents who win Coalition seats usually stay there a long time, eg Peter Andren (he had to die before the Nats got his seat back), Andrew Wilke, Zalie Steggal, Helen Haines, Bob Katter etc.
> 
> The Coalition will be pushing it uphill for quite a while imo. Albo will be in for two terms at least, maybe more, unless Labor have a complete brain fade.



 There is a malaise at the heart of conservatism in that conservatives aren't actually conservative anymore. This applies here in Australia, other parts of the anglosphere, but especially so in the UK.

Only in the US is there a glimmer of light.

Our Liberal party and conservatism in general will continue to be non-viable so long as they try to pander to progressives and woke psychopaths.

As evidence of my thesis here, watch Ron Desantis, as opposed to the other clowns and buffoons flailing in flowering around like total tosspots, trying to win votes they will never get, all the while totally alienating their core constituency.


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## moXJO (15 October 2022)

wayneL said:


> There is a malaise at the heart of conservatism in that conservatives aren't actually conservative anymore. This applies here in Australia, other parts of the anglosphere, but especially so in the UK.
> 
> Only in the US is there a glimmer of light.
> 
> ...



Too many dumb conservatives about is the problem. Or they are so one dimensional they end up useless.


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## IFocus (15 October 2022)

moXJO said:


> Too many dumb conservatives about is the problem. Or they are so one dimensional they end up useless.





Actually the Australian Labor party are now the old conservatives more than ever, Labor are currently trying to govern for the people, parliamentary precedence and democracy (who would have thought?) not for corporate donors etc.

Conservatives world wide have largely followed the US bat **** crazy ideological path... then there is Trump and Truss in the Angelo sphere who defy explanation.


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## sptrawler (16 October 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> That was a good piece, highlighting the flim flam coming from the Coalition. "A burp tax", give it a rest.
> 
> If the Coalition want to win back the TEAL seats, I wish them luck. History shows that Independents who win Coalition seats usually stay there a long time, eg Peter Andren (he had to die before the Nats got his seat back), Andrew Wilke, Zalie Steggal, Helen Haines, Bob Katter etc.
> 
> The Coalition will be pushing it uphill for quite a while imo. Albo will be in for two terms at least, maybe more, unless Labor have a complete brain fade.



Spot on IMO, Albo will be in until the media tire of him, which IMO is good for Australia as he is the first PM we have had in a long time, that isn't ego driven.
He like McGowan understands that it is important to keep both the workers and the corporates happy, yet not appear to be favouring either and he is doing it well at the moment.


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## Smurf1976 (19 October 2022)

sptrawler said:


> He like McGowan understands that it is important to keep both the workers and the corporates happy, yet not appear to be favouring either and he is doing it well at the moment.



Also getting on with resolving long outstanding issues that have been in the "too hard basket" for too long.

Some announcements imminent regarding energy infrastructure funding for example. Doesn't fix everything and can't wave a magic wand and so on but at least some boxes are being ticked.


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## moXJO (19 October 2022)

IFocus said:


> Actually the Australian Labor party are now the old conservatives more than ever, Labor are currently trying to govern for the people, parliamentary precedence and democracy (who would have thought?) not for corporate donors etc.
> 
> Conservatives world wide have largely followed the US bat **** crazy ideological path... then there is Trump and Truss in the Angelo sphere who defy explanation.



So far Labor has been pretty sensible. If the budget has no surprises and they keep the woke screeching to a minimum, then I think albo will stay for a few terms.
They might even diminish both the greens and libs votes at the same time.


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## PZ99 (19 October 2022)

Labor look sensible because they haven't been tested yet. I remember people saying the Rudd govt was the sensible "Howard lite" until they had to respond to the GFC and the climate challenge of our time. Most of that Govt is now in this Govt.

One advantage for Albo is we have a progressive senate as opposed to the obstructionist one of a decade ago. Peter Dutton doesn't have the luxury of just saying no to everything like Abbott did.

One disadvantage is this Govt got into power with a 10% lower primary vote than Rudd did. So they have a lot of work to do to win over the 70% that didn't vote for them


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## wayneL (19 October 2022)

moXJO said:


> So far Labor has been pretty sensible. If the budget has no surprises and they keep the woke screeching to a minimum, then I think albo will stay for a few terms.
> They might even diminish both the greens and libs votes at the same time.



The Libs are lost.
The Greens are just freaking insane.
Labor has the potential to be great government, they just have to get rid of:

Ideological socialists
Woke psychopaths
CC zealots
Keynesians and MMT faithful
WEF shills
Cradle to grave apparatchiks.
Lawyers
Ex union organisers.

If they can do that, they won't blow themselves the @#$& up.


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## SirRumpole (19 October 2022)

wayneL said:


> The Libs are lost.
> The Greens are just freaking insane.
> Labor has the potential to be great government, they just have to get rid of:
> 
> ...




Maybe they should hire more IPA members ?  

But I generally agree with you.

They are starting to look like a Hawke government with a foot in both camps ; ie business and the unions. 

If they look after both few people will complain , except the LNP of course and who cares about them. ?


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## wayneL (19 October 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Maybe they should hire more IPA members ?
> 
> But I generally agree with you.
> 
> ...



Well, even the IPA has the sh*ts with the liberal party at the moment.


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## moXJO (20 October 2022)

PZ99 said:


> Labor look sensible because they haven't been tested yet. I remember people saying the Rudd govt was the sensible "Howard lite" until they had to respond to the GFC and the climate challenge of our time. Most of that Govt is now in this Govt.
> 
> One advantage for Albo is we have a progressive senate as opposed to the obstructionist one of a decade ago. Peter Dutton doesn't have the luxury of just saying no to everything like Abbott did.
> 
> One disadvantage is this Govt got into power with a 10% lower primary vote than Rudd did. So they have a lot of work to do to win over the 70% that didn't vote for them



Yeah this is true, it's still early days.
A lot of talk about increasing tax in the news. Most likely a softener being pushed by government.

Interesting the covid report that came out that basically said what a lot of people were saying here. Lockdowns were overused and keeping kids out of school was a mistake. 

Given how far the States went it was a major worry that Labor in no way listened and shouted down critics. Even nsw state libs caught the disease to a degree. The biggest worry though was the rusted ons demanding harsher lockdowns.


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## sptrawler (20 October 2022)

moXJO said:


> Yeah this is true, it's still early days.
> A lot of talk about increasing tax in the news. Most likely a softener being pushed by government.
> 
> Interesting the covid report that came out that basically said what a lot of people were saying here. Lockdowns were overused and keeping kids out of school was a mistake.
> ...



Yes now the schools are lining up student free days with public holidays, so that they all become an Easter weekend. Lol
Continuing our drive to mediocrity.


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## sptrawler (21 November 2022)

At last a way out of our skills shortage, skilled backpackers.









						A $70,000 salary the ‘Goldilocks threshold’ for skilled migrants: Grattan
					

Lifting the pay threshold for skilled migrant visas will help prevent exploitation, without putting them out of reach for workers Australia needs, new research has found.




					www.smh.com.au
				



From the article:

More critical workers including teachers and nurses could be attracted to Australia if the temporary skilled migrant income threshold is lifted to $70,000 according to the Grattan Institute, as the government works to overhaul the country’s migration system.

A review of the system led by former Treasury secretary Martin Parkinson is currently under way and expected to hand a report to government by early next year.

Immigration Minister Andrew Giles said in a speech at a Committee for Economic Development of Australia event last week that improving the country’s migration system was vital.

“We need a system that attracts and retains talent – a system that is simple, efficient, and complementary to the skills existing in Australia,” he said.
Loading
As part of the migration review, the Department of Home Affairs last week released a discussion paper on Australia’s migration system. It said the system needs to be overhauled to deal with critical skill shortages, emerging industries and increasing competition for workers from other countries.
“Our current migration system is complex and inflexible, lacks a strategic rationale, and no longer meets our needs,” the report said.
There are currently more than 100 individual visas, and 20 different IT systems used by the department to log and process applications, making the system difficult for both visa applicants and for immigration staff to navigate.

While the number of permanent visas is capped – at 195,000 for this financial year – temporary visas are not. The department estimated there are 1.85 million people in Australia on temporary visas who are eligible to work.


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## sptrawler (17 December 2022)

Bringing the energy crisis to a head is a master stroke by Albo IMO, it puts the blowtorch on the gas producers to supply gas at a reasonable price to the Australian public.
This really has IMO circumvented the ridiculous situation the Eastern States got themselves in, by not having a domestic reservation policy, the next step IMO may be an option for the gas producers.
Either a domestic reservation policy, or an ongoing cap on domestic gas prices after this 12 month cap expires, great move by Albo IMO.


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## SirRumpole (17 December 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Bringing the energy crisis to a head is a master stroke by Albo IMO, it puts the blowtorch on the gas producers to supply gas at a reasonable price to the Australian public.
> This really has IMO circumvented the ridiculous situation the Eastern States got themselves in, by not having a domestic reservation policy, the next step IMO may be an option for the gas producers.
> Either a domestic reservation policy, or an ongoing cap on domestic gas prices after this 12 month cap expires, great move by Albo IMO.



There are still long term issues which I wonder if he's willing to face, like whether we should be allowing private interests such control over essential services, or cleaning up the inefficiencies in the system that Smurf has been pointing out for some time.

If he sorts those out ill give him 3 gold stars.


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## IFocus (18 December 2022)

The Albanese government has broken the curse. The curse that has held Australia in thrall to the resources sector ever since the Rudd government was destroyed in its efforts to impose a resource super-profits tax.









						Australia was always bullied by vested interests, until now
					

The Albanese government has broken the curse of a nation too timid to stand up to the might of industry. Can Perrottet follow suit with his push against pokies?




					www.smh.com.au


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## SirRumpole (20 December 2022)

Well , there's a surprise.

Kevin Rudd appointed Australian Ambassador to the US.

Who'da thunk it ?


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## Knobby22 (20 December 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Well , there's a surprise.
> 
> Kevin Rudd appointed Australian Ambassador to the US.
> 
> Who'da thunk it ?



Good move. Keeps him busy. Also helps in consultations as he was a previous PM in the same colour as the existing PM.
He was also recommended by Hockey.


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## sptrawler (20 December 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> Good move. keeps him busy. He was recommended by Hockey.



Now all we need is to find a job for Turnbull as well, maybe selfie ambassador to movie world. 🤣


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## SirRumpole (20 December 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Now all we need is to find a job for Turnbull as well, maybe selfie ambassador to movie world. 🤣
> 
> View attachment 150687




My bet is on Turnbull for Ambassador to UNESCO.


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## IFocus (20 December 2022)

Knobby22 said:


> Good move. Keeps him busy. Also helps in consultations as he was a previous PM in the same colour as the existing PM.
> He was also recommended by Hockey.




Interesting wouldn't have thought he would have been the best choice, he must be better connected to the Republican side  than I thought certainly knows how to work hard and has a very high intellect hope he has his groveling technic down pat.


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## sptrawler (20 December 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> My bet is on Turnbull for Ambassador to UNESCO.



Yes that would be good, he would have a captive audience there. 🤣


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## sptrawler (20 December 2022)

IFocus said:


> Interesting wouldn't have thought he would have been the best choice, he must be better connected to the Republican side  than I thought certainly knows how to work hard and has a very high intellect hope he has his groveling technic down pat.



Yes I can see it now, "Hello I'm Kev, I'm here to help". 🤣


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## sptrawler (20 December 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Well , there's a surprise.
> 
> Kevin Rudd appointed Australian Ambassador to the US.
> 
> Who'da thunk it ?



Albo's not stupid he just wants him out of the local papers, give him something to do in a far away land, where no one hears from him for 5 years.
Abbott's in the U.K, now all he has to do is Pizz Turnbull off and the the three wretched ghosts are gone.


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## SirRumpole (20 December 2022)

sptrawler said:


> Albo's not stupid he just wants him out of the local papers, give him something to do in a far away land, where no one hears from him for 5 years.
> Abbott's in the U.K, now all he has to do is Pizz Turnbull off and the the three wretched ghosts are gone.




Well, Kevin was over there anyway most of the time.


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## sptrawler (20 December 2022)

Don't worry he still manages to pop his head up on a regular basis. Definitely best to bench him IMO.
Albo's not stupid, having a lose cannon floating in and out of the media, the last thing Labor needs ATM is a hostile media with all this energy crisis on.


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## PZ99 (20 December 2022)

Hehe... banished from the country for resisting the Murdoch Mob ?

Just when I thought ignored folks could post something worth reading as well. Pity.

Oh well... give it another year


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## SirRumpole (20 December 2022)

Lovely photo here. Is it real , could it have been digitally enhanced ? 









						Nuclear sub deal sees Australia 'strategically naked' for 20 years
					

Former prime ministers on both sides of politics are calling for a rapid acceleration in the building of a fleet of nuclear-powered submarines, with claims Australia will otherwise be left "strategically naked" for the next two decades.




					www.abc.net.au


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## PZ99 (20 December 2022)

SirRumpole said:


> Lovely photo here. Is it real , could it have been digitally enhanced ?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That would've been for the Lodge handover in 2013 I guess


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## mullokintyre (20 December 2022)

IFocus said:


> The Albanese government has broken the curse. The curse that has held Australia in thrall to the resources sector ever since the Rudd government was destroyed in its efforts to impose a resource super-profits tax.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Nah, just the vested interests have changed.
Now we will get bullied by the Union movement, the Superannuation Funds Industry,  and Lisa Wilkinson.
Mick


----------

