# Gobbledygook: Reality, Dreaming or Rubbish?



## explod (18 September 2010)

I have found the large divide in how we percieve and therefore understand our fellow travellers on ASF can lead to a lot of tension.

My hope is that this thread may examine the issues that effect good communication.

Time and outside distractions are of course just two of them.  My wife for example has just called "soups on the table" so I have to go for the moment.

However feel free to jump in early to help set a suitable agenda as I go for my soup.


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## Garpal Gumnut (18 September 2010)

A very good thread plod.

Karma mate, karma, so lacking.

Or a knowledge of, I should say.

Also a knowledge of a second language, an ability to think outside the oblong, and a sense of humour would help many posters keep their knickers unknotted.

gg


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## explod (18 September 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> , an ability to think outside the oblong,
> 
> gg




You have hit a sailient point there gg.   An oblong, as I see it, can span a page yet the sides may be as small as half an inch.  So to get the thinking out laterally we really have to perhaps stretch beyond the usual.  By doing that we may increase our chances of a real breakthrough.  And with the increased distance there is a chance to put the foot down on it too.

Conversely to think virtically, which I suspect many of us rarely do, your illustration (or if you like abstract) allows for this aspect to come nearer to the consciousness of the now.  The upper and lower restrictions (ie the long horizontal lines) are more obvious.

An *oblong* eh !   Take my hat off to you gg; and see you in a new light already.


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## Logique (18 September 2010)

G'day Explod,

not entirely sure where you're going with this, reading the esoteric conversation with Garpal I have a horrible feeling I'm out of my depth here.

On the subject of communication, I do recall my recent surprise that some posters of the female persuasion don't like the generic greeting 'hi guys' - live and learn.


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## explod (18 September 2010)

Logique said:


> On the subject of communication, I do recall my recent surprise that some posters of the female persuasion don't like the generic greeting 'hi guys' - live and learn.




An excellent question and case in point.  The social divide is the greatest gap and has its pieces within religion, politics, ethnic origins and very many more.  In the common form it is the generation gap.  But unfortunately that term is too simplistic.

Complicating matters we have the gender issues and they too are broken up into many facits on both sides.  We could fence off and isolate many other areas and hope that contributors do so.

If it was my Step Grandaughter, 2nd year Uni, the expression *"Guys"* is not a problem, my daughter a whole new ball game.  So we need to respect, but above all be aware of who we are addressing.  We like to think that the plural is the singular and vice versa but it is rarely the case in the demographic of the ASF community (ie, our age group and general cultural backgrounds).

Of course many are put off becase the term is an Americanism.  Have noticed it when out dining in mixed company and the young female waitress will say "Hi guys, what would we like to order?" and you can hear a pin drop for about 4 seconds.


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## Julia (18 September 2010)

Logique said:


> G'day Explod,
> 
> not entirely sure where you're going with this, reading the esoteric conversation with Garpal I have a horrible feeling I'm out of my depth here.



I'm pretty much with you here, Logique.  Also feel a vague need for a translation from the so far impressively esoteric nature of the exchange between explod and gg.
However, happy to see it continue in the interests of elevating the intellectual content of ASF!



> On the subject of communication, I do recall my recent surprise that some posters of the female persuasion don't like the generic greeting 'hi guys' - live and learn.



OK, this was my objection, and perhaps I was being a bit cranky.  I appreciate that the term is widely applied to people generically.
I just hate being addressed thus:  largely because (a) it just seems thoughtless and lazy, and (b) because it's yet another Americanism that Australians seem to have embraced.   

We used to say 'programme', now everywhere it's 'program'.  Much of this alteration to our version of English I accept as inevitable, but being addressed as a 'guy' is something that I just dislike intensely.  But probably I have to just suck it up, as the current idiom suggests.

On the thread topic, one of the obvious problems of communicating via printed screens is that we don't have the benefit of vocal tone, and facial expressions, along with body language.  We all have different interpretative styles.  Mine is regrettably literal, so often I don't pick it up when someone is meaning to be funny.

I'll always respect genuinely expressed comments on ASF, whether I agree with the sentiment or not.  What does stifle debate, however, is the post that simply seeks to disrupt or ridicule discussion.  That's what I believe has driven many of our old and excellent members away.

Good topic to raise:  thanks, explod.


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## explod (18 September 2010)

> I'll always respect genuinely expressed comments on ASF, whether I agree with the sentiment or not. What does stifle debate, however, is the post that simply seeks to disrupt or ridicule discussion. That's what I believe has driven many of our old and excellent members away.




Great to have your input Julia and the problem you outline is a very difficult one.  Your observations are some of my own feelings of late and have wondered if in fact my defensive/offensive approach has done a lot of damage in that area.

I do believe that the chat section removal off the front page will gradually improve the quality of both the investment and the chat area' respectively.  In fact just this week I found the investment/trading forums very active.

On a personal note Julia, I hope to lift a discussion we had a couple of weeks ago into this thread to indicate'more clearly where I was (or thought I was) coming from.  In retrospect my assertions at that time were not entirely correct and therefore unfair.


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## wayneL (18 September 2010)

Perhaps "guys" when addressing a mixed group is because of a lack of suitable informal dual gender greeting (that I can think of). I often use "folks", but this is seen as quaint if not ever so slightly old fashioned.

What should people use instead?

I quite like the French "messieursdammes", but of course we don't speak French.


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## johenmo (18 September 2010)

explod said:


> Of course many are put off becase the term is an Americanism.  Have noticed it when out dining in mixed company and the young female waitress will say "Hi guys, what would we like to order?" and you can hear a pin drop for about 4 seconds.




Yet waiting staff in the US won't say that in the majority of places - they are usually polite and "sir" etc.  They need the tips to survive.

I know it's an example but if they said "What woudl we like to order?", the first thing I'd think is "Oh.  I didn't know you were dining with us!!" 



wayneL said:


> What should people use instead?




What about "Sir" and "Madam"?  or "Good Evening/Morning/etc everyone.  Are you ready to order?"

Original topic - we are limited by our experiences, our culture/upbringing and any prejudices that we pick up through these.   Hence different views.  Add to that strong personalities/egos and we can get excited.  I think that is a simple way of summing it up.


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## tech/a (18 September 2010)

I'm Ducking for cover.
Too much quackery here.


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## explod (18 September 2010)

> Yes waynel, I am biased.
> 
> We all want this election to go towards meeting our individual hopes, needs and desires for a better future.
> 
> ...




On the 4th of September I posted this statement on the "2010 Fderal Election" thread.   Julia was rightly perplexed by it.  After dinner I will address myself to the gobbledygook of it all.


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## Garpal Gumnut (18 September 2010)

tech/a said:


> I'm Ducking for cover.
> Too much quackery here.




There is an option here perhaps to cover a Duck.

I'm selling a put on Gobbledygook lasting for 10,000 posts. A Duck.

gg


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## explod (18 September 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> There is an option here perhaps to cover a Duck.
> 
> I'm selling a put on Gobbledygook lasting for 10,000 posts. A Duck.
> 
> gg




gg, as always you are a great help.  Unfortunately these days one cannot use a shotgun without a licence.

Anyway, thanks for hanging around at least.

Paragraph 4 of my outburst on the 4th of November on reflection does give me considerable pain and on looking at it again was pleased to go to dinner in the hope it would go away.

Will be back in a minute or two as I need to print it off, for a full cut, paste and rearrangement


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## explod (18 September 2010)

> Because such a question ought to be tackled and resolved within each individual context, or if you like, within its intrinsic seperate human layers, then the defining of sentiment, judgement, control and bias as it may effect investing or trading, then perhaps we should meet in a more appropriate thread for that purpose.




Now this paragraph, which is in fact a longwinded sentence, is what you get when someone is cornered, outnumbered and trying to shoot down the enemy whilst at the same time running away.

The life saver, if one can salvage anything, is the admission of bias.

However bias was the critical issue raised back on the 4th Nov (sic) (was the 4th September).  My reason for moving this discussion to this point is that it is a sociological issue more on topic for this type thread.

We are effected, as already avered to by others above, by which side of the tracks we come from, our education and general life experiences.  A statement that is perhaps biased to one may not be to another.   As another already touched, an inflamitory or sexist remark may have many dozens of different effects on others.

A re-reading of my offending 4th paragraph does reveal some murmerings of these issues but it is a complex hornets nest and no one individual can in my view (now in retrospect) get the hands completely around it.

So I invite assistance in perhaps developing some good reasoned argument so that we may define some ways of improving tolerance and understanding on ASF.  And still have some fun too.

Of course politics (as was the case) is always a very bad mix.


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## Garpal Gumnut (18 September 2010)

This is my type of thread, its got it all, guys, dolls, ducks, options, oblongs, misunderstandings, explanations and politics.

James Joyce, arise from your grave, all is forgiving.

gg


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## Julia (18 September 2010)

wayneL said:


> Perhaps "guys" when addressing a mixed group is because of a lack of suitable informal dual gender greeting (that I can think of). I often use "folks", but this is seen as quaint if not ever so slightly old fashioned.
> 
> What should people use instead?
> 
> I quite like the French "messieursdammes", but of course we don't speak French.



I like 'folks', but can see it could be old fashioned to some.  What's wrong with the simple "People"?
Or on a forum like this, simply omitting any greeting and just getting to what you want to ask/say?

I'm reminded of talkback radio where every caller seems to feel obliged to greet the host and say "How are you, Bob?"  Fergawdsake, the previous fifty callers have asked him he is, we have learned that he has been quite fine every time, so for pete's sake leave it out and just ask your damn question!



johenmo said:


> I know it's an example but if they said "What woudl we like to order?", the first thing I'd think is "Oh.  I didn't know you were dining with us!!"



Oh, johenmo, you bring up one of my most hated expressions in nursing, where the nurse (or even occasionally the doctor), says, "and how are we today?"!!!
So stupid.   The more assertive patients will feel bound to say that they have no idea how the doctor is but they themselves are feeling mightily irritated at being so patronised.




explod said:


> On the 4th of September I posted this statement on the "2010 Fderal Election" thread.   Julia was rightly perplexed by it.  After dinner I will address myself to the gobbledygook of it all.



Wonderful, Explod.  I'm filled with anticipation.



explod said:


> Now this paragraph, which is in fact a longwinded sentence, is what you get when someone is cornered, outnumbered and trying to shoot down the enemy whilst at the same time running away.



And congratulations, explod, for such honesty.  I think verbosity and obfuscation are traps we all fall into when finding it difficult to come up with a clear response.
I've often felt like this, and have eventually learned that it better furthers the discussion to simply say "sorry, but I don't understand what it is you are saying", rather than attempt to further confuse everyone by adding more words that are meaningless to anyone.

Let's remember the basic purpose of language, i.e. to communicate amongst ourselves.  So usually, the simpler the better.

Then as soon as I've said this, I'm reminded of the great pleasure I have when reading e.g. Clive James who has such a gift of the expression of English that I don't much care what point he's actually making, such is the pleasure of reading or hearing the cadence of his remarks.



> The life saver, if one can salvage anything, is the admission of bias.



Doesn't this depend on the context?  If we are engaging in a political discussion, then yes absolutely the acknowledgement of our biases provides added credibility.




> However bias was the critical issue raised back on the 4th Nov (sic) (was the 4th September).  My reason for moving this discussion to this point is that it is a sociological issue more on topic for this type thread.



In the spirit of the thread, I'm going to admit that I don't know what you're talking about here.  Could you clarify?




> We are affected, as already averred to by others above, by which side of the tracks we come from, our education and general life experiences.  A statement that is perhaps biased to one may not be to another.



It's a rare human being that is able to completely eliminate personal bias.
We have a natural tendency to seek out such texts that confirm our natural bias, thus reinforcing our original feelings.   That's fine from the point of view of our personal comfort levels, but bad for promotion of objectivity.




> As another already touched, an inflamitory or sexist remark may have many dozens of different effects on others.



Many dozens of different effects?  Perhaps a few but not that many imo.
Sexism is not that subtle.




> A re-reading of my offending 4th paragraph does reveal some murmerings of these issues but it is a complex hornets nest and no one individual can in my view (now in retrospect) get the hands completely around it.



Sorry, but this sentence is just as confusing and unclear to me as was your original post.
(Not wanting to be critical, but if the thread is to achieve anything, I can't let this go.)   




> So I invite assistance in perhaps developing some good reasoned argument so that we may define some ways of improving tolerance and understanding on ASF.  And still have some fun too.



Great idea.  I'd say that we can all best serve the interests of clear discussion, and ourselves, by expressing ourselves as simply and clearly as possible, without too often seeking refuge in a meaningless confusion of words.




> Of course politics (as was the case) is always a very bad mix.



Could you maybe express this somewhat differently?   Not sure what you mean when you say 'politics is always a very bad mix'.  Mix of what?
Political opinions/views?   Differences here are inevitable and anything but bad imo.


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## Calliope (19 September 2010)

Maury Maverick, a Texan lawyer who invented the word, "gobbledegook", said his inspiration was the turkey "*always gobbledy gobbling and strutting with ludicrous pomposity*."

This thread certainly fills the bill.

http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-gob1.htm


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## nunthewiser (19 September 2010)

Thankyou Calliope for providing the " reality"


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## explod (20 September 2010)

nunthewiser said:


> Thankyou Calliope for providing the " reality"




Getting a bit off topic there nune.  *reality*really.

Anyway, love your outfit, as a five year old at school I used to wonder what may be behind a Nun's habit.

Keep up the good work anyway, great to have you on board.


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## Calliope (20 September 2010)

explod said:


> Getting a bit off topic there nune.  *reality*really.




While we are on the subject of *reality* explod, I am intrigued by a  statement you made a few posts back, viz;

*



			As my superior on this forum wayneL, I seek your lead.
		
Click to expand...


*
In what ways do you consider Wayne to be your superior? Is it in intellect, ability, politics or what?

Or is it because he is a moderator?


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## explod (20 September 2010)

Calliope said:


> While we are on the subject of *reality* explod, I am intrigued by a  statement you made a few posts back, viz;
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Moderators dont' count; eg. in giving them say a free kick just because, thier job of drudgery is to ensure the enterprise survives would not even be tolerated by the Mod's themselves..

Nope, just sheer numbers always wins hands down.   It is not brains in the world (IMV), but determination and persistence.   Churchill was the greater exponent.  In saying that I am not attmepting to say that I am putting a ruler on Waynel's brains or anybody elses for that matter.  Jeeeessszz,, touchy stuff here.  Will I hit enter? 

Good question though, because bringing measures of intellect into the picture is a sure way to step up the gobbledygook tempo and some bright colours too.  

IMVHO of course.

Another rumination faze.


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## Calliope (20 September 2010)

explod said:


> Good question though




Well, if it is a good question, then it deserves an answer, not just more rambling philosophy. In what ways do you consider Wayne superior to you?.


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## explod (20 September 2010)

Calliope said:


> Well, if it is a good question, then it deserves an answer, not just more rambling philosophy. In what ways do you consider Wayne superior to you?.




Sheer numbers champ, he has more than 11,000 posts, I take my hat off to his mamoth persistence.  And of course, remain in the good light to remain a mod.

What is wrong with rambling philosophy? 

It is one of the prime purposes of this thread, IMHO

However do not be deterred in putting forth your own directional input ,which I hope keeps us ever evolving.


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## nioka (20 September 2010)

explod said:


> Sheer numbers champ, he has more than 11,000 posts, I




Sheer numbers is no qualification whatsoever. Remember to go to the toilet once a day is healthy but to be going every hour has another name. So that rules out numbers. Take the motormouth, word numbers but information is often lost in the volume. rules out numbers again.

However I do give him credit for intelligent discussion stimulation over a range of topics even if I do not agree with him at times.


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## wayneL (20 September 2010)

I like this:

"Every man is my superior in that I may learn from him."
   - Thomas Carlyle 

PS - That includes the ladies too.


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## Julia (20 September 2010)

wayneL said:


> PS - That includes the ladies too.



Ah, Wayne, so thoughtful.


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## explod (20 September 2010)

nioka said:


> Sheer numbers is no qualification whatsoever. .




A good point and taken on board too.

However I would be concerned at a squeezing of the parameters.  An open and frank discussion on the facits of gobbledygook must not only take in "reality" IMHV.   

To evaluate for example "dreaming" and its sometimes near partner "rubbish", which could of course be averred to as a part of the criteria for a meaning of "gobbledygook", then we may have to allow some considerable flexibility.

Have any ASF'ers studied the Da da movement, it was from memory a branch of performance art which grew off the surrealist movement in art of around the early 1940's when everyone (perhaps some) became very mad at the effects of rising Narzism.  This movement attempted (and succssfully in my view) to elicit a meaning or message from absolute repetition.  Probably where Warhole got some of his idea of the soup can paintings some 25 odd years later.

So untill we can get an angle on this thread that brings all the players properly into it (and along would be great), we ought in my view keep a fairly open mind.  Not wanting to dominate or (hate this word) dictate, (which is why Hitler kicked the Da da and all the other outside the square movements out anyway) but to just settle this idea of examining gobbledygook *in*.


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## artist (20 September 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Also a knowledge of a second language, an ability to think outside the oblong, and a sense of humour would help many posters keep their knickers unknotted.
> 
> gg




Agreed, and always eschew obfuscation too.


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## Julia (20 September 2010)

explod said:


> A good point and taken on board too.
> 
> However I would be concerned at a squeezing of the parameters.  An open and frank discussion on the facits of gobbledygook must not only take in "reality" IMHV.
> 
> ...




Explod, when I read the title of this thread I made the perhaps incorrect assumption that you would be against 'gobbledygook', assuming you'd share my belief that this is obfuscation, waffle and meaningless combinations of words.

But I'm beginning to wonder if I was quite wrong, and in fact your intention is to actually promote unclear communication, such is the confusing nature of your posts in this thread.

Or perhaps I'm just lacking in the capacity to interpret the depth of your presentation.
It might be a guide that few members seem moved to add their contributions.

I'm not wishing to be unreasonably critical, but I'm just rather puzzled as to what you're actually setting out to achieve with this thread?


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## nunthewiser (20 September 2010)

Julia said:


> I'm not wishing to be unreasonably critical, but I'm just rather puzzled as to what you're actually setting out to achieve with this thread?




Perhaps he ran out of other people to dribble meaningless waffle to and decided to share his talent here instead.


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## explod (21 September 2010)

It is meant to be a bit of fun, where one can express some rubbish now and then and not upset all and sundry on threads that do have real intent.

Had thought it may have been obvious from the opening where gg got on the train (of thought) immediately.

Sort of my own little "Solly's general chat" thread.

If it is not your style then you do not need to visit.  However it may be usufull to some for a bit of on line performance.   Google up "performance art" and also "the Da Da movement" and you may get a bit more drift (yes, its a bit eccentric).  Of course, only if you think you could be interested.

cheers to all on this fine Tuesday,    explod


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## Calliope (21 September 2010)

Julia said:


> Explod, when I read the title of this thread I made the perhaps incorrect assumption that you would be against 'gobbledygook', assuming you'd share my belief that this is obfuscation, waffle and meaningless combinations of words.
> 
> But I'm beginning to wonder if I was quite wrong, and in fact your intention is to actually promote unclear communication, such is the confusing nature of your posts in this thread.






I think it is my fault. A few weeks back on another thread I labelled one of explod's nonsensical posts as "gobbledygook." The word fascinated him so much, that ever since, all his posts have been an attempt to reinforce my assessment.

I have the sinking feeling that we will never know what he is on about.:dunno:


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## explod (21 September 2010)

Calliope said:


> I think it is my fault. A few weeks back on another thread I labelled one of explod's nonsensical posts as "gobbledygook." The word fascinated him so much, that ever since, all his posts have been an attempt to reinforce my assessment.
> 
> I have the sinking feeling that we will never know what he is on about.:dunno:




Yeh, that could be it because Julia (I think?) used the same term and I was convinced.

Has anyone on ASF ever pondered "after image"  It is a brightness that imprints on the retina after looking at the sun or similar.  These types of things have been created in art.

Anyway my thesis began with a fascination with that and moved onto the physical frequency of sight.   My current project are large *oblong* (gg you hit the chord pal) paintings that are sectioned off with gradations of colour that fit this sight frequency so that as one looks across the picture plane there is a visual oscillation.

My type of art is great in itself but few to talk to about it.  So perhaps I have gone totally gobbledygook.


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## BrightGreenGlow (21 September 2010)

Julia said:


> I'm pretty much with you here, Logique.  Also feel a vague need for a translation from the so far impressively esoteric nature of the exchange between explod and gg.
> However, happy to see it continue in the interests of elevating the intellectual content of ASF!
> 
> 
> ...




I don't believe the hello guys thing is a bad thing. It's like calling a Postman and Postperson, so stupid. No offence intended on the females in the world but that's just the way it is.

In regards to Programme, we only adopted Program due to the computer age, ie: Software Program. Programme I still see used the way it was meant to be used. ie: "I love that Television programme". 

Either way, taking offence of someone on an online forum is a lil' bit coo-coo unless you're aim is to do exactly that. Just like someone said above... have a sense of humour and lighten up.. or something like that?


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## noie (21 September 2010)

nioka said:


> Sheer numbers is no qualification whatsoever. Remember to go to the toilet once a day is healthy but to be going every hour has another name. So that rules out numbers. Take the motormouth, word numbers but information is often lost in the volume. rules out numbers again.
> 
> However I do give him credit for intelligent discussion stimulation over a range of topics even if I do not agree with him at times.




There is an example for every scenario, normally lawyers or politicians or criminals only chose one to benefit themselves.

lets talk numbers, in Rugby, Meters gained, points scored line breaks, high is a sign of a great player, how about errors, yellow cards?

hmm two sides..

withing a social media context, in a forum base, posts indicate willingness to involve in conversation. In a serious forum with only serious threads this would be a counter for helpfulness, here with off topics and general chat is a symbol of being a part of the community and getting involved.


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## robots (21 September 2010)

Hello,

explod, dont you have a dog you can discuss all these things with when you out walking?

the ladida movement

the dog hasnt got out has it

thankyou
professor robots


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## explod (21 September 2010)

robots said:


> Hello,
> 
> explod, dont you have a dog you can discuss all these things with when you out walking?
> 
> ...




The new dog is fantastic and yes we have great conversations, he is already "Dad's little man" and of course "Mum's boy".  

Had a delivery of some wine last week, well Max gave him a huge pay, the bloke said :"what a good dog,(as I apologised) nah, just doing his job",  must dust that thread out and give everyone an update and thankyou all.

Was reading in the Paper that Prince Charles talks to the trees and plants so things are looking up.

Sun has just come out here on the penisular Professor, all good.


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## Logique (6 October 2010)

I get the feeling Prof Robots isn't quite across the existentialist musings thing Explod. 

And let's see any gormless canine (when it's not being zapped by Julia's BMW that is) compose _Don Juan_, or _The Waste Land_. What do the barking mutts know of rhyme or meter.


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## explod (10 October 2010)

Had a stargazer on the tellie this morning talking about todays date, 10/10/10.  Have to be very carefull about the naming of a newborn in line with the numbers apparently.

Anyway the ten ten ten reminded me of an old ditty my Father would recite a long time ago now as it rhymes with the date.   Jam tins were a big thing in the great depression, he'd say "you mean the tin that rin tin tin s..t in"  Rin Tin Tin was a cleaver dog in TV show when tellie first started out in the 60's

Bit rough and uncooth was my Dad, but the whole eight of us loved him anyway.   Oh, nine including Mum.   But that does not rhyme with today though.


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## explod (10 October 2010)

On an opposition thread today they have been talking about correct grammer, writing and speaking.   Many are not happy at how some of us bogans express ourselves.

Had a bit of a say myself but very correctly was corrected, so withdrew to the bunker.

I have a very old Mercedes Benz and all the family believe I should upgrade.  I refuse, cars are not my thing but at times I do need to get from A to B and the old bomb does that.  10 ks to the litre, plenty of power to cut off the odd youngun in a 4 x 4 and the comfort and reliablity is amazing.

Now back to my topic (within this topic) Language to me is that too, gets you from A to B, often wish I could do it better sometimes because I am often missquoted and missunderstood.  Not so worried about the latter at my age.  Became very good at spelling with a lot of effort so that I could succeed in my career but after 12 years of retirement find that I have reverted back to my failed grade Viii (form 2 these days, no year eight I think) standard on my graduation from school.  It was more like very pleased to see me go and it was mutual.

None of that stopped me from being a good shearer, Father and to a very high level in my later chosen career, in fact I achieved High Distinctions for papers at Uni.

So what is it with communication.  Is it not that we should be understood and be able to understand our fellow that is important, I dont' know.

Its all a mixture obviously of gobbledygook, reality, dreaming and perhaps *rubbish*, the latter emphasis because I suspect we may be too pedantic IMVHO of course, and not wanting to offend either.

As long as we get the job done and I have good trades the world is sweet in my corner.  

Expanded the vegie patch considerably this afternoon.  Very worried about what Benanke is going to do with the Federal Reserve or your money.


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## Julia (10 October 2010)

explod said:


> On an opposition thread today they have been talking about correct grammer, writing and speaking.   Many are not happy at how some of us bogans express ourselves.



But explod, what's the point of anyone making a correction if you take no notice?
Again you have 'grammer' rather than 'grammar'!



> I have a very old Mercedes Benz and all the family believe I should upgrade.  I refuse, cars are not my thing but at times I do need to get from A to B and the old bomb does that.  10 ks to the litre, plenty of power to cut off the odd youngun in a 4 x 4 and the comfort and reliablity is amazing.



Ah, an analogy to which I can completely relate at present.



> None of that stopped me from being a good shearer, Father and to a very high level in my later chosen career, in fact I achieved High Distinctions for papers at Uni.



Well, I can quite see that exemplary grammar and spelling would be less than important to a career as a shearer.  You probably also made way more money in this capacity than many employed in more academic fields.  So it's a good point.
I'll refrain from comment about uni marks, other than perhaps to refer to my earlier comments on the Spelling/Grammar thread about standards of teachers.

Well done for having done the uni thing later in life when it's much harder.



> So what is it with communication.  Is it not that we should be understood and be able to understand our fellow that is important, I dont' know.



I'm really not sure.  In spoken English, I think we more readily accept less than perfect language, but somehow with the printed word it's more glaring.
I suppose when we are engaged in oral conversation we're also absorbed by the other person's body language, warmth of personality etc., but none of that is easily apparent in typed words.

So, I'd say I probably apply a harsher standard to the written word, especially in these days of spell checkers etc.
A lot of the poor spelling and grammar is simply laziness imo.
Obviously, a lot of posters on this great forum don't even bother to read through their posts for typos prior to submitting.  How hard is it to do that?



> As long as we get the job done and I have good trades the world is sweet in my corner.



OK, fine.  None of us are put on this earth to make others happy.



> Expanded the vegie patch considerably this afternoon.



That sounds like a satisfying activity.  Could we perhaps look at growing vegetables as an analogy for using proper English?
Don't you feel a sense of pride if you can grow, pick and use the perfectly formed ripe tomato, Explod?   Isn't it somehow a bit more satisfying than a few wizened, disease-affected specimens which still qualify as food?

Such can be the difference between reading reasonably well constructed English and picking one's way through misspellings and incorrect grammar.

I appreciate that I'm sounding pedantic and picky, but before anyone lambasts me, let's remember that I'm only commenting in the threads on the subject, so if you're not interested in said topic, why not just move on to something that is of more interest.

I'm vaguely reminded of the "Are wine buffs wankers' thread.  I'm sure a few people will get the connection.



> Very worried about what Benanke is going to do with the Federal Reserve or your money.



Yes, it's a worry right up there with what the Greens will do to the Australian economy.


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## Boggo (10 October 2010)

Julia said:


> Yes, it's a worry right up there with what the Greens will do to the Australian economy.




Yes, and I actually agree with Alan Jones on this one !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PeNkI9FYgY


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## explod (25 October 2010)

After copping the wrath from the grip of the grape just thought I would retreat to the nonesense area for awhile.

Ar ha, the two Gs for gg.   Gobbledygook and the Grape.

Tried hard to stick up for Julia on the other thread but on ASF she seems to lean a bit to the right and on the thread I thought it was about her being a bit to the left.   Should have stayed shearing but the back gave out, some say our brains are at the wrong end.

Julia I am trying with the grammar,

We have the old merk in common,

You do a good job on our written word Julia,

Yep tomatoes over the word anyday, you just cant' win em all ;

And the greens do not really care too much about money, its about making the planet better and everyone haveing a fair go.

Julia, I just love it when you go crook at me, makes me feel wanted.


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## Julia (25 October 2010)

explod said:


> After copping the wrath from the grip of the grape just thought I would retreat to the nonesense area for awhile.
> 
> Ar ha, the two Gs for gg.   Gobbledygook and the Grape.
> 
> ...




Ah, explod, you know deep down I have an abiding affection for you, doncha!

Agree regarding the Greens lack of respect for money (and yes, I know you didn't put it quite like that), that's just fine if we're talking about their money, but I don't think most of us are all that thrilled about them disregarding the value of our dollars.


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## explod (25 October 2010)

Julia said:


> Ah, explod, you know deep down I have an abiding affection for you, doncha!
> 
> Agree regarding the Greens lack of respect for money (and yes, I know you didn't put it quite like that), that's just fine if we're talking about their money, but I don't think most of us are all that thrilled about them disregarding the value of our dollars.




As a bit of an aside, our dollars are doing a fine job in their own at the moment.

And you would be proud to know I do a google on every word I think may be wrong now.  Of course recognising what is right or wrong is a *bit* of a problem.

And on the latter, good 4 u, thats just gr8 2


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## Bat_Ears (28 October 2010)

Another thread about postmodernism


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## explod (29 October 2010)

Bat_Ears said:


> Another thread about postmodernism




That's an interesting observation Bats_Ears,  

postmodernity takes the form of a structured chaos because the act or creation, though off the edge or percieved to be out of the norm, is in fact contrived.

Trying to create something that one cannot grapple with is a bit like the dog trying to catch its tail, or if you like, seeking the end to infinity.

Another aspect is the attempt to be different, which is a part of maturing I suppose and at the end we find we are the same.


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## Julia (29 October 2010)

explod said:


> Trying to create something that one cannot grapple with is a bit like the dog trying to catch its tail, or if you like, seeking the end to infinity.



With apologies for being facetious, I did have a dog who had no trouble catching her tail.


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## explod (30 October 2010)

Julia said:


> With apologies for being facetious, I did have a dog who had no trouble catching her tail.




Great post there Julia, reality.   But I do think these post modernists think they are a bit above the rest of us and is why my comments were a tad sarcastic. 

Now that must have been a great dog, did you ever think of the possibilites if she could go beyond her tail and re-invent herself, or, sort of like she would be in dupicate.  Nah, gobbledygook again but at least we have this little running track in which to explore the possibilities.

Have a great weekend.   too


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## Logique (30 October 2010)

Interesting the talk of postmodernism. Thought it a bit gauche to go to wikipedia on such as this, but did look it up on essortment. While still a somewhat elusive notion, it shed some light, and on some others..deconstruction...post-structuralism. I need another cup of coffee first.

From: http://www.essortment.com/all/postmodernphilo_rorp.htm

....Postmodernism is essentially still in is infancy. It is an attempt to think beyond the confines of the past. Derrida, one of the chief exponents of *post-structuralism*, coined a term called “*deconstruction*” which means a philosophical method of looking for weak points in modern thinking and established ways of perception...

...Secondly, there is a concentration on fragmentation and discontinuity as well as ambiguity. The postmodern focuses on a de-structured, de-centered humanity. What this really means is that *the idea of disorder and fragmentation, which were previously seen as negative qualities, are seen as an acceptable representation of reality by postmodernists*. Modernism considered the fragmented view of human life as bad or tragic, while postmodernists rather celebrate this seemingly meaningless view of the world. It is an acceptance of the chaos that encourages a play with meaning. Postmodernism also accepts the possibility of ambiguity. Things and events can have two different meanings at the same time. A more rigid rational and logocentric or linear approach tries to avoid or reduce ambiguity as much as possible. *Postmodern thought sees simultaneous views not as contradictory but as an integral part of the complex patterning of reality*. 


Beyond all the theory and academic discussion, what is postmodern thought and what is its importance for the modern person? Postmodern thought is, in its very essence, an adventure and an expression of life experience. From its modernist beginnings, Postmodernism is an attempt to question the world that we see around us and especially not to take other people’s views as the final truth. *Postmodernism puts everything into question and radically interrogates philosophies, strategies and world views. There is no such thing as a definition of the postmodern. It is a mood rather than a strict discipline.* Postmodernism, with all its complexity and possible excesses, is an attempt to find new and more truthful versions of the world.


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## Bat_Ears (30 October 2010)

Postmodernism:

Making up fancy sounding bull****, sophistry and downright sollispism. When challenged, fall back on even more nonsense. Never give a straight answer. At the same time maintain an air of arrogant disdain and superiority. Then wait for the academic positions and gullible fools to buy your books thinking you have some revealed wisdom to present them with.

Then laugh at the stupidity of the other people buying into your bull**** and feel secure in your arrogant disdain and superiority.


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## explod (30 October 2010)

Well done posting the definition.  Its an elusive area unless one is aligned closely with the finer arts bordering on sociology.

Discussions in this area can be very rewarding in my view and in taking it seriously can improve understanding and appreciation of where others may be coming from.

One of the great problems in art, and academia itself, is that it tends to hide behind words that to others are gobbledygook.  We need more discussions like this to break down those barriers.

A reason why I like both the Julia's, they say what they mean in language that all can understand

Good one Logique, and I recommend the definition as posted be read over a few times by those interested.  It took me three years to get a reasonable hold on it at Uni.


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## Julia (30 October 2010)

explod said:


> Now that must have been a great dog, did you ever think of the possibilites if she could go beyond her tail and re-invent herself, or, sort of like she would be in dupicate.



Heavens, no, explod:  one of her was quite enough!  




Logique said:


> .........Beyond all the theory and academic discussion, what is postmodern thought and what is its importance for the modern person? Postmodern thought is, in its very essence, an adventure and an expression of life experience. From its modernist beginnings, Postmodernism is an attempt to question the world that we see around us and especially not to take other people’s views as the final truth. *Postmodernism puts everything into question and radically interrogates philosophies, strategies and world views. There is no such thing as a definition of the postmodern. It is a mood rather than a strict discipline.* Postmodernism, with all its complexity and possible excesses, is an attempt to find new and more truthful versions of the world.



Logique, thank you for that.  It's the first reasonably clear explanation of postmodernism I've read.   Enlightening, as I've always been unclear as to what it's essentially about.


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## explod (30 October 2010)

Bat_Ears said:


> Postmodernism:
> 
> Making up fancy sounding bull****, sophistry and downright sollispism. When challenged, fall back on even more nonsense. Never give a straight answer. At the same time maintain an air of arrogant disdain and superiority. Then wait for the academic positions and gullible fools to buy your books thinking you have some revealed wisdom to present them with.
> 
> Then laugh at the stupidity of the other people buying into your bull**** and feel secure in your arrogant disdain and superiority.




And again Bat_Ears a great post and insight.   It all began to a great degree with the new 20th Century thinkers that comprised the Bauhaus School from about the 1920's.  They were a group of radicals so bad in fact that Hitler closed them down and chased them out of Germany in the early 1930's

Their ideas have had a great deal to do with modern architecture and the new look square city style.   Minimalism was an important develoment which today is evident in the streamlined modern home in square look and not too much clutter.

The branch, that in my view had a lot to do with the post modern slant, was that of the Da Da School which grew out of the Bauhaus mob.  Surreilist panting probably the trade mark but sitting on the stage saying "da da da da........" as the entire performance one of its great highlights.   

So yep it would be good if we did not have these ratbags, then there would be no change and perhaps we could still live in a cave where man was boss.

I reckon I could do a painting of you now Bat_Ears, based on my existential feeling for this discussion.


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## Julia (30 October 2010)

explod said:


> I reckon I could do a painting of you now Bat_Ears, based on my existential feeling for this discussion.



Oh, wow!  Could you share this?   Am filled with eager anticipation for such an artistic endeavour.  Would also love to have an existential understandiing of Bat Ears.


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## explod (17 November 2010)

Julia said:


> Oh, wow!  Could you share this?   Am filled with eager anticipation for such an artistic endeavour.  Would also love to have an existential understandiing of Bat Ears.




Have had to go into the cave and back to the books on this one Julia but think I have it.  Apologies for the delay on such an important matter too.

Bat_ears makes a very valid point.   Work is of value, education so that one can work is of value and of course we need a rest so therefore sport is of value.

However *thinking* is impossible to measure as value, you cannot put a dollar with or against it, so it is of no value in the general consensus.  And my Dad was one who pointed this out many times and when I expressed the desire to be an artist he put a brush in my hand and had me paint the farm house.

"Postmodernist" thought is about some versions of thinking to some people but as we have learnt, there is no value in it.

Bat_ears is sensible, just like my Dad and though my image of him may not be understood by some I have it clearly in my mind as an overpowering cloud that keeps the good people in order.

Trouble is most of us like to be bad or dare I say it, to be a bit free.  A bit like religion, the conflict between what we see and can prove, *the science* and what we believe, *the faith*

Hope this helps Julia.


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## explod (25 January 2011)

Since the last post I have moved on a lot and would like to apologize in particular to you Julia for not really being in sympathy with where I was wanting to go and reading back on it, I was lost.   And by the way, my new/old now, dog Max is wonderfull.

Have been thinking a lot about gambling and poor people.  As I am not that well heeled but love to play roulette feel that I have some expertise in this area and I also think it may be very important.

A couple of months ago up in Cains I met a fine gentleman from Thursday Island who was also on holidays.   We were at the roulette table together, the old shearer and my new pal, who looked just like an old cane cutter so we both just looked the part.

When I play my game I have a daily limit of $50 and because I play by a charting method I often come home with more than my allowance but not enough of course to make a living out of it or write a book (yet).   My old cobber however was way ahead of me.  His limit is every dollar he can put in and his system is to hit them big where it hurts to try and bring the house down.  Well the house stands and to even an old shearer's view it hurt.  He deserved better and IMHO to win, a fine upstanding man who I am sure has a very nice family at home with a number of children.

Now this is where everyone will not like me.  I am as you know a bit left wing and have been re reading Carl Marx in considerable detail.   I should be at the local Greens Annual meeting toninght (at the Mooroduc Public Hall) but realise they are too far up in the clouds.  So in what follows I am looking for supporters, a new direction and advice on carrying my idea forward into reality.

My old mate at Cairns as you guessed in a most gentlemanly way lost all of his three thousand dollars in about half an hour chasing red.  At Crown Casino I see many pensioners doing very similar at breakneck speed in all facits of all games.  I am sure many of you will be able to advise me of much greater losses in many other places too.  

But they are all great people, softly spoken gentle folk just trying to enjoy themselves and do the right thing.  In conversation they will soon tell you of the lovely Grandchildren they are never able to see or thier children who are very very busy doing very well but too busy to catch up.

Now the Government get a great deal out of this gambling to help run the country but I am told the people who run the Casinos get the most and they also get tax breaks because they are good for the country and they employ a lot of people and contribute to election campaigns and other dignitary events which feature prominently on the television with the Prime Minsiters or thier deputies.  So its all very nice.  Indeed

As I have a lot more to say on my plan I will go to the next post


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## explod (25 January 2011)

What if we could have not for profit gambling venues, the government would have to supervise of course, and after the running costs are paid the rest of the money goes into a fund to help families, particularly childen effected by gambling, alcohol and poverty.

The fund would provide no cash up front to individuals, though we may need to allow the Government to take the cut they are now getting.

Where needed it would provide:

food;

shelter ie, maintain basic home situation, bedding and clothing;

education to full potential, employment and mentoring; and

medical backup.

The people I speak to at the Casinos would also be very happy with this idea and may even put more of thier money into the pokies for such a cause.  I am sure my old Pal from Thursday Island would feel, opps, his Children would feel better for it in the long run too

A happy Australia day tomorrow to all ASF ers.


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## Logique (25 January 2011)

explod said:


> ...A happy Australia day tomorrow to all ASF ers...



And to you also Explod, an overdue update to the thread. I still need to read your posts two or three times to get the import, I'll get back to you.
Cheers, Logique


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## Julia (25 January 2011)

Hello Explod,

First, never any apology needed.  I know you to be a person of integrity and good faith who believes absolutely in whatever you're saying even if sometimes you're not quite sure yourself where you're going with the thought.

But, sorry, I'm totally against any taxpayer sponsored gambling scheme.   Such a venture would surely never gain widespread voter approval, and imo neither it should.
It would in effect be offering tacit approval for people to gamble.

The last thing we should be doing is offering an alternative to individuals taking responsibility for their personal decisions.

Your friends may be charming people but with your endless capacity to see people in the best possible light, you are rather being blinded to simple reality.


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## ghotib (25 January 2011)

Taxpayer sponsored gambling, in the form of lotteries, bought the Sydney Opera House and a lot of hospitals. Given that the house always wins, maybe it makes sense for the house to provide shelter for the people who pay for it?? 

Ghoti


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## Calliope (26 January 2011)

explod said:


> A couple of months ago up in Cains I met a fine gentleman from Thursday Island who was also on holidays.   We were at the roulette table together, the old shearer and my new pal, who looked just like an old cane cutter so we both just looked the part.




When did you go from being a shearer to being a copper...or was it the other way around? It would have been a significant change of pace. In view of your assertion;



> Never worked traffic in my entire career. Rose to high rank and commanded very large numbers of personnell.




Your shearing career must have been brief.


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## explod (26 January 2011)

Calliope said:


> When did you go from being a shearer to being a copper...or was it the other way around? It would have been a significant change of pace. In view of your assertion;
> 
> 
> 
> Your shearing career must have been brief.




Went shearing at 16 and became very proficient at it.  At one stage taught shearers under the auspices of the Australian Wool Board and the United Graziers Asociation in Queensland.  Bill Gunn(later Sir Willaim) wanted me to stay on with them but my Dad died after working hard all of his life at 51 years so signed up for what I thought would be a better chance for my family to the police force at the ripe age of 24 in which I had a very good career for 30 years.  

I have a passion for the battler and the hard workers due to some of my own beginnings and as naive as I may seem to some we are going to have to all get off our buts one day soon and do something about the current direction of the world and this idea we have of expansionism.

But the gambling take and how it is taken is disguting and a disgrace to everyone.  We all ought to hang our heads in shame.  But no we rationalise these things to stay comfortable in our own little nests.  It is no longer good enough.


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## breaker (26 January 2011)

spent some time shearing Wilcannia/Broken Hill best time of my life...... Grazcos...ask some shearers how to run the country......bet on free beer


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## Calliope (26 January 2011)

explod said:


> Went shearing at 16 and became very proficient at it.  At one stage taught shearers under the auspices of the Australian Wool Board and the United Graziers Asociation in Queensland.  Bill Gunn(later Sir Willaim) wanted me to stay on with them but my Dad died after working hard all of his life at 51 years so signed up for what I thought would be a better chance for my family to the police force at the ripe age of 24 in which I had a very good career for 30 years.
> 
> I have a passion for the battler and the hard workers due to some of my own beginnings and as naive as I may seem to some we are going to have to all get off our buts one day soon and do something about the current direction of the world and this idea we have of expansionism.
> 
> But the gambling take and how it is taken is disguting and a disgrace to everyone.  We all ought to hang our heads in shame.  But no we rationalise these things to stay comfortable in our own little nests.  It is no longer good enough.




So you consider yourself an "old shearer" rather than an old copper, and yet you call yourself "explod". I know it's none of my business, but your posts are confusing.


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## explod (26 January 2011)

Calliope said:


> So you consider yourself an "old shearer" rather than an old copper, and yet you call yourself "explod". I know it's none of my business, but your posts are confusing.




Have been retired from the Force for 12 years which seems pretty ex to me.  If I could have an ASF name change I would, it does get me into bother sometimes.   I suppose not well thought out when I signed up.


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## explod (26 January 2011)

breaker said:


> spent some time shearing Wilcannia/Broken Hill best time of my life...... Grazcos...ask some shearers how to run the country......bet on free beer




First shed in Queensland was with Grazcos at Cunnamulla.  The burr ripped my soft Victorian arms to pieces.  But yes they were great days, would think nothing then of driving 130 miles just to get a box or two of beer.

Now what are we going to do to stop expansionism and the Jamie Packers of this world exploiting our childrens and grandchildrens inheritance.

You will not stamp out gambling as it is now established entertainment.   It needs to be nationalised so that all the profits go back into the system to help the younger generation be nurtured and educated properly so that they too do not end up gamblers.

To change things the thing has to be bred out imho.


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## explod (15 May 2011)

Gold coins have been used for thousands of years as an exchange for goods.  Are we on the threshold of turning away from the paper money.  Some states in the US think so and have passed legislation for the move.

Gobbledygook ?

http://www.midlandsconnect.com/news/politics/story.aspx?id=616413


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## Glen48 (15 May 2011)

Explod, Did you know a Charelville based copper named Kenny Cant we had another surname for him, he  helped me find out about undue noise by manner of operation, bald tryes ( no hair  as one ex gf asked ) speeding regardless in the vehicle was moving or not.

Back in the days when Pontius was a pilot.


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## explod (15 May 2011)

Glen48 said:


> Explod, Did you know a Charelville based copper named Kenny Cant we had another surname for him, he  helped me find out about undue noise by manner of operation, bald tryes ( no hair  as one ex gf asked ) speeding regardless in the vehicle was moving or not.
> 
> Back in the days when Pontius was a pilot.




Kept clear of the cops in those days.  My Brother was locked up at Longreach over a weekend for being in charge of a vehicle whilst drunk.  He decided not to drive as he had had too many so fell asleep but unfortunately had the keys in the ignition.

I joined the Victoria Police and tried to stop that approach.   Gradually I was not popular but as I rose through the ranks do feel that I eventually made a good contribution to changing some of the poor judgements made.   

Yes in the old days it was often worse but unfortunately there will always be pockets of problems as the job does seem to still attrract the Darth Vader stand over type.  I do think the new Chief in Victoria is trying to deal with such issues but the white anting of people like .... and now aided by the press's cr..p on listening to these same tired old recent ex....trouble makers in trying to interefere with Government enquries; he does have a tough job in front of him.  (Of course....no names no pack drill)

In retrospect, Christeen Nixon was very insightfull in getting Overland from out side in, first to rid us of the shootin tootin underworld and then some of the rot in the Crime Department.  It is the latter that still try to hang in there and undermine the good job he is doing.   40 odd years ago the Chief Commissioner I served under Mick Miller had to do the same thing.  Two very high ranking CIB men went to gaol and I enjoyed a career within a very stable work environment.  The police and community involvement programmes that were established we can be very proud of.   The current woes spring from the Kennett Govt's cutting out at the time a very good middle management arrangement.  Thought they could do without the Inspectors who in effect were the auditors keeping a watch on the troops so to speak.   The rest is history IMHO

Thanks for asking the question Glen48, been wanting to tell someone how I felt about this for awhile.


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## Glen48 (15 May 2011)

Explod hope it has been some help and you are born again, check to see if you have another belly button.

 That rule about sleeping whilst drunk only encouraged the driver to drive as they would have been nicked anyway.

 Another topic fit for this post
Charleville was the training ground for Terry "Little fish " White  and a disgrace to honest coppers.
 My pet hate is the law and police and the stupidity with in I am sure a lot must leave the force when they see commonsense is not welcomed and only encourages crime.


 As a kid when I saw a police car I would run even when I knew I had done nothing wrong and respect was in vogue.
 I am sure every one would have a story to tell about the law and how they think rules should be changed, as the depression draws near we will see more rules introduced to increase revenue for the feds etc. like they are now doing in USA were speeding fine for doing over MPH have gone from $60 to $200


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## explod (7 June 2011)

The continued loss of our young men in war zones, Aphganistan today sickens me to the core and I believe our Government and the US have lost the plot.

Like Korea, Vietnam and Irak this campaign will prove to be an utter waste.

But can you stand the waste of our youth, the best of them in fact and Fathers to  Australian children.

I am very very sad a pi   ed off.    Both My Dad  and Gandfarther died far too young due to the 1st and 2nd WW's and my Grandmother with a broken heart that they were cannon fodder for the rich to stay that way.

What do others think?   Gillard is a mong..el in my view who does not think for herself but patters after the seppos.

F... *explosion* in my head tonight, I am fed up totally.


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## Wysiwyg (7 June 2011)

We have been told that Afghanistan is the breeding ground for those terrorist nutters. I wonder what would be the outcome if they were left unchecked to spread not only their propaganda into neighbouring countries but their signature of cowardice to the sane world.

We could sit back and allow America to do what has to be done ..... or not. Every one of those individuals from Australia know where they stand when joining the Armed Forces.


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## explod (7 June 2011)

Wysiwyg said:


> We have been told that Afghanistan is the breeding ground for those terrorist nutters. I wonder what would be the outcome if they were left unchecked to spread not only their propaganda into neighbouring countries but their signature of cowardice to the sane world.
> 
> We could sit back and allow America to do what has to be done ..... or not. Every one of those individuals from Australia know where they stand when joining the Armed Forces.




And that is one of the points, I do not remember Korea but I do remember being told by the Government of the day about Vietnam and Iraq and they proved in my view to be wrong.   

I tend to think that fighting these nutters only breeds more hate and more of them.

And yes they join the services to fight for thier country and support thier mates.  It is the way they have been brought up and taught.   However in this are we doing something wrong perhaps?

Visited my Son on Sunday and my 5 year old Grandson was on the computer playing one of the latest war games for his age group.  I was shocked at the reality of it and his prowess already at seeking out and shooting the enemy.

Could he be coming home in a body bag in 15 to 20 years time?

Surely we can find a better way.


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## Wysiwyg (7 June 2011)

explod said:


> Surely we can find a better way.



Beings have the capacity to do good or evil. As long as that is possible, the fighting (of evil) will go on. Hatred and revenge are two common evils that fester. 

Which I suppose comes down to the first stone thrower. Then people take sides and you have a conflict. Smart man dumb man all in one.


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## Glen48 (8 June 2011)

The only way you will win war's is to throw money at DNA etc research that is the key, find out what makes the mind tick and which DNA switch needs to be turned on or off I know its genetic manipulation but if we want peace we need to research it all.
 We originated from Fish millions of years ago and Humans are only a few DNA switch's different from Monkeys the main one is we have a Thumb.
If we can work out what makes different nationalities think the way they do we should be able to have a civilized society. 
 Which brings up the next problem we have peace so the population increases at least War's kill.

Now thats a good playstation were you can play God


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## Wysiwyg (8 June 2011)

Glen48 said:


> The only way you will win war's is to throw money at DNA etc research that is the key, find out what makes the mind tick and which DNA switch needs to be turned on or off I know its genetic manipulation but if we want peace we need to research it all.



It must be a glitch in the evolutionary process to reduce specie numbers. We learn what evil is primarily through television nowadays but we all aren't evil. Why, I believe, is because of what Sig. Freud coined as the pain or pleasure principle. Most of us move away from pain and toward pleasure but for some they seek out pain. Maybe pain seekers don't feel they belong in the community so will be destructive toward others with the knowing their gratification from punishment and suffering will come. This could also be reason why traders fail. They unwittingly seek pain.


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## Glen48 (8 June 2011)

To unlock the secret of the universe we need to work out what makes the Brain tick and why some have more or less of the seven deadly sins which genes do what to the way people think and  I assume nature made us this way so nature can get a lot of different avenues to explore and maybe find out Muslims are the strongest species and they will rule or will Western thinking be the answer with technology.


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## cynic (9 June 2011)

Glen48 said:


> The only way you will win war's is to throw money at DNA etc research that is the key, find out what makes the mind tick and which DNA switch needs to be turned on or off I know its genetic manipulation but if we want peace we need to research it all.




"Ja mein fuhrer!"


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## Glen48 (9 June 2011)

Nine  Nine !!!


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## explod (12 October 2011)

Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.  Anyone that thinks a bit outside the square is targetted.

In conclusion will post up a message I recieved tonight from a very good freind Gumby Learner who was finally barred from ASF for posting some slight swear words against an intolerant poster.  

Gumby, an Australian by birth, teaches at a University in South Korea, is a qualified solicitor and Sociologist.  His Sister is a Professor at Monash of some distinction.  Their parents were not well off and in fact gave poor support to thier children.  So people from the other side of the tracks can make it but on top of that because of their hardships in the beginning are far ahead intellectually than the conservative middle mob who comprise the current status quo.

Good luck with your sinking ship Joe and if I am lucky enough to win the current tipping competition you are to pass it on to the person who comes last this month.

The main part of his message as follows.



> James
> 
> It's nothing to worry about mate. I'm sick of ASF. 80% of the stuff posted on that site is done so by one-eyed idealogues. I have joined Zero Hedge, while there are a few ratbags on it. The common theme is that the economic system is bankrupt and devoid of the rule of law.
> 
> ...


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (12 October 2011)

> 1) Garpal Gumnut and Julia are one and the same poster.




That is enormously insulting to Julia and should be withdrawn.

gg


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## Julia (12 October 2011)

explod said:


> Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.  Anyone that thinks a bit outside the square is targetted.
> 
> In conclusion will post up a message I recieved tonight from a very good freind Gumby Learner who was finally barred from ASF for posting some slight swear words against an intolerant poster.



If that's the case, I'd offer the view that such swear words would represent the 'last straw' from ASF administration which gives everyone a very fair go and fair warning when they are overstepping what's reasonable.

Gumby could at times be interesting and offer some thoughtful insights.  But these times were offset with some offtopic and very personal attacks.  



> Good luck with your sinking ship Joe and if I am lucky enough to win the current tipping competition you are to pass it on to the person who comes last this month.



Best wishes to you, explod.  I've often disagreed strongly with your views, but have much respected your sincerity and humanity.




> 1) Garpal Gumnut and Julia are one and the same poster.




Just about fell off my chair when I read this.  
The suggestion, however, flatters me.


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## Joe Blow (12 October 2011)

explod said:


> In conclusion will post up a message I recieved tonight from a very good freind Gumby Learner who was finally barred from ASF for posting some slight swear words against an intolerant poster.




Actually, this is incorrect.

GumbyLearner has been suspended twice. The first time it was due to accumulated infraction points incurred as a result of posting drunk. GumbyLearner would log onto ASF late at night and post rambling, incoherent, off topic posts that needed to be removed by myself or the moderators. Occasionally he would make outrageously insulting attacks on other ASF members with absolutely no provocation. This happened almost nightly for months. He was warned again and again but refused to modify his behaviour.

A couple of weeks ago he sent me an email asking to have his ASF membership reinstated. I reminded him of the reasons for his original suspension and told him that if he was to come back there was to be no more late night drunken posting. He agreed. I then lifted his ban and allowed him to return.

Literally within days, the drunken, rambling, off topic, obscenity laden posting began again. I issued a final warning which was ignored. He was then suspended once more, for the final time.

GumbyLearner had more chances than anyone who has ever been suspended from ASF. He was warned more times than I can remember and squandered the second chance that was offered to him. I believe in second chances because I believe that some people are capable of change and I offered that opportunity to GumbyLearner and it was thrown back in my face.

If doing my job makes me a "tool" then so be it.


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## So_Cynical (12 October 2011)

explod said:


> Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.  Anyone that thinks a bit outside the square is targetted.




Sad to see you go explod, but i do understand some of your frustrations with the ASF right, personally i can highly recommend the ignore function..about a year or so ago i used it on the worst 2 members of the ASF right and it saved the forum for me...turning of the bitter right wing noise was wonderful.

Also sad to see Gumby go  i only ever got to see his good posts.


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## Joe Blow (12 October 2011)

I would also like to briefly address the topic of ASF members' political views. 

Being right wing or left wing is not a punishable offense here at ASF. Nor is being dogmatic, narrow minded, sarcastic, smug or arrogant. Political opinions are not censored unless they are so hateful as to be offensive to all reasonable people. These sort of instances are few and far between.

Reacting to someone's political opinions with a string of obscenities, as GumbyLearner was guilty of, is not a reasonable or acceptable response under any circumstances.

I don't like suspending anyone, nor do I like to see ASF members leave, especially long term members. The moderators and I do our best to see that ASF continues to be a constructive, friendly place but political threads can be a bit rough and tumble at times and that is simply the nature of the beast. Things can get a little heated but when the line is crossed we do intervene.

IMO, the key to successfully participating in political threads is to keep the focus on the opinions of others rather than the individuals themselves. As soon as things turn personal, civil discourse tends to cease and insults and personal attacks take over. If you find someone's views objectionable, attack the opinions rather than the person posting them. 

Also, as So_Cynical has indicated, judicial use of the forum software's "ignore" feature can filter out those you find particularly irritating.


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## moXJO (13 October 2011)

explod said:


> Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.




Typical leftie fashion of "not everyone agrees with me and now I'm butthurt"
Guess what, those on the right have to listen to leftist dribble as well.
You should take political posts with a grain of salt. Getting so worked up over something as stupid as the current political environment is a big waste of time.
Will miss your ramblings xplod.


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## Logique (13 October 2011)

On a personal note, would definitely will miss you if you go Explod, and I never found Gumby insulting, although it sounds like some posts were heavily moderated/deleted. 

'..Gumby...teaches at a University in South Korea, is a qualified solicitor and Sociologist..' - who knew, never suspected this. 

I find Joe perfectly fair, and as for GG and Julia supposedly being one and the same, that belongs on the jokes thread.


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## nulla nulla (13 October 2011)

Joe Blow said:


> Actually, this is incorrect.
> 
> GumbyLearner has been suspended twice. The first time it was due to accumulated infraction points incurred as a result of posting drunk. GumbyLearner would log onto ASF late at night and post rambling, incoherent, off topic posts that needed to be removed by myself or the moderators. Occasionally he would make outrageously insulting attacks on other ASF members with absolutely no provocation. This happened almost nightly for months. He was warned again and again but refused to modify his behaviour.
> 
> ...




Hi Joe,

My bolds, does this mean you will extend "nunthewiser" an opportunity to return given that he is not the worst poster (less warnings and chances than extended to GumbyLearner) and maybe warrants a second chance?

regards nulla


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## Joe Blow (13 October 2011)

nulla nulla said:


> Hi Joe,
> 
> My bolds, does this mean you will extend "nunthewiser" an opportunity to return given that he is not the worst poster (less warnings and chances than extended to GumbyLearner) and maybe warrants a second chance?
> 
> regards nulla




Hi Nulla,

Nun started out okay early on but towards the end of his time at ASF he was trolling full time and it seemed his sole purpose here was to provoke others and stir the pot. As I'm sure you understand that sort of behaviour is unacceptable as it causes non-stop management problems for the mods and myself.

However, if Nun were to contact me and offer an apology for his behaviour (and for the torrent of abuse he hurled in my direction via email), and promise to be a more constructive member of ASF I would probably give him another chance. 

I don't give second chances to everyone. They are only offered to previously long term members who continually pushed the boundaries of what is acceptable and got suspended as a result.


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## Tink (13 October 2011)

Yep, sad to see anyone leaving, you could just take a break and come back later, but its your choice.

Whatever you decide, all the best to you explod : )


----------



## nulla nulla (13 October 2011)

explod said:


> Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.  Anyone that thinks a bit outside the square is targetted.




 Whilst I agree with your sentiment in respect of the rightwing element (So Cynical has one solution in using the "ignore" button, the other solution is to simply ignore them without the button) your sincerity and comments will be missed. 

Who will speak up for Michelle Corby in your abscence? I was starting to think it was time to let her come home.


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## nomore4s (13 October 2011)

explod said:


> Ah well, probably my last post on this right wing forum.  Have noticed a lot of the spirit has gone and the educational value is very little now.  Anyone that thinks a bit outside the square is targetted.
> 
> In conclusion will post up a message I recieved tonight from a very good freind Gumby Learner who was finally barred from ASF for posting some slight swear words against an intolerant poster.
> 
> ...




Explod, if that rant from Gumby doesn't send warning bells off I'm not sure what would. I find it somewhat ironic that he is whinging about "narrowmindedness" on these boards but yet he is unwilling to accept other peoples opinions as just that opinions, pot calling the kettle black perhaps?

I totally back up what Joe said, Gumby has had a lot of posts removed and plenty of chances but continually kept offending. You also have not seen the abuse laden email he sent to Joe after being banned which is something Joe doesn't deserve after giving him a second chance which Gumby blew by not sticking to the agreed terms of his return. Joe and all the mods put up with a fair bit of cr@p behind the scenes at times to keep this forum friendly for the majority mainly because of the minority like Gumby who continually push the boundaries and cannot accept other people are allowed to have opinions.

Maybe internet forums aren't for you if you cannot put up with wide ranging views from all different sectors of society. This forum would be very boring if we all had the same opinions on the wide ranging matters that are discussed on these boards.


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## trainspotter (13 October 2011)

Here's to post #93 and Joes responses.


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## nulla nulla (13 October 2011)

trainspotter said:


> Here's to post #93 and Joes responses.




Who is the actor and what character was he playing? 

My Guess:
Actor: Unknown
Character: Archduke Ferdinand (just before his assassination and the start of WW1).


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## trainspotter (14 October 2011)

nulla nulla said:


> Who is the actor and what character was he playing?
> 
> My Guess:
> Actor: Unknown
> Character: Archduke Ferdinand (just before his assassination and the start of WW1).




Orson Wells - Citizen Kane. Still applauding the mods response.


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## Garpal Gumnut (14 October 2011)

trainspotter said:


> Orson Wells - Citizen Kane. Still applauding the mods response.




Agree mate.

gg


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## explod (29 October 2011)

> wayneL
> 
> Such a hateful post.
> 
> ...




In the way we express ourselves we leave our stamp all over the place.  You in my view enjoy a pretty good life and that is good.

My own is tormented from the past and this only increases I find as we face the end of life.  I have done well from where I came from but some of those past chains have stopped me from going further.

My passion for people has drawn me to enquire into those on the bottem end and I can assure you all most have equal attributes but no hope of overcoming the bad start.  A child who goes to Sunshine High has no hope of attaining the asperations of one from Geelong Grammer.  That is the way of it of course but we would should at least try to somehow equalise the equation.  And if that means greater taxes on the rich with increased funding to the more ordinary schools then that could be a way.

And in perception, I have had wide experience in commanding very large groups of staff working under very difficult situations.  One soon learns to read all sides to achieve the role and very often that is from the paper work.  

I have no hard feelings for you wayneL, but enjoy that hard banter and the hope that others may learn to see the other side.  Not saying you dont' but I will attack the possibilities.


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## explod (29 October 2011)

> jbocker
> 
> Hi Explod
> Did you ever feel that he got to like you?




To some degree at the end.  His own Father played a part in that and I also married the girl that he liked.  Later divorced many years later because it was not the girl I liked.  I held on to the marriage till the youngest was 18 years and had a job but none of my three children have had much to do with me since I departed in 1992.  I could write a book on just that aspect but one has to move on.  But in the end you cannot, hence as we were discussing, *the blood pressure* kicks in


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## JTLP (29 October 2011)

explod said:


> To some degree at the end.  His own Father played a part in that and I also married the girl that he liked.  Later divorced many years later because it was not the girl I liked.  I held on to the marriage till the youngest was 18 years and had a job but none of my three children have had much to do with me since I departed in 1992.  I could write a book on just that aspect but one has to move on.  But in the end you cannot, hence as we were discussing, *the blood pressure* kicks in




Explod - you seem to have led quite an interesting life from your own accounts. This quote right here baffles the mind and I would love to know more (albeit it's rude to ask and invasion of privacy etc). Perhaps you should write a book!


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## moXJO (29 October 2011)

You ok explod?
Seem to be a bit erratic of late, hope you are travelling well.


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## explod (29 October 2011)

moXJO said:


> You ok explod?
> Seem to be a bit erratic of late, hope you are travelling well.




Alls good, the last week just cleaned out my Stepdaughters place which she recently sold (of course she took off for a holiday in NZ and left her Mother and I to the dirty work), so doing more than I should and at the same time trying to have some interaction on ASF.  About the only outlet I have time for at the moment.

Thanks you very much for the concern. 

Bright spot was a lot of money made when I closed a trade in PXS early in the week.


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## Julia (29 October 2011)

explod said:


> To some degree at the end.  His own Father played a part in that



I can relate to that.  When what should be love and trust is replaced by abuse, it's very confusing and the effects in adult life take some time to displace.



moXJO said:


> You ok explod?
> Seem to be a bit erratic of late, hope you are travelling well.



Nice post.  Goodonya, moXJO.


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## wayneL (30 October 2011)

explod said:


> ...but one has to move on.  But in the end you cannot, hence as we were discussing, *the blood pressure* kicks in




Funny things we humans, how we carry stuff with us. I'm married to someone whose mother is psychologically abusive and I can attest to how difficult it is to move on from it. I certainly can relate to what you are saying.

As for myself, my only sibling was killed when I was 19 (this changed everything) and my father died on my 30th birthday. I am haunted by the regrets of what I should have said and done. Maybe that is normal I don't know.

Obviously it doesn't manifest as high blood pressure, but the black dog comes for a visit every now and again.

I think most of us live with some sort of pain and wealth doesn't sooth it a jot in my observation. 

Good luck to you Mr Plod, I know we will cross swords again and I do understand the motivation of your politics, even if I vehemently disagree with the ideology.


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## dutchie (30 October 2011)

wayneL said:


> I am haunted by the regrets of what I should have said and done. Maybe that is normal I don't know.




Very normal mate. I too have regrets about unsaid words and actions with my father.

I would hazard a guess that most men have issues with their fathers even after they have past away.


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## explod (30 October 2011)

Thanks for the encouraging words everyone.  Just a word can go a long long way.

I am not one to run away.  I was very upset emotially about the departure of a former ASF member who has had in his life from childhood perhaps a harder run than any of us.  

But we move on, I am over it, and hopefully we can continually learn from each other with the usual vehemence.


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## Julia (30 October 2011)

wayneL said:


> Obviously it doesn't manifest as high blood pressure, but the black dog comes for a visit every now and again.
> 
> I think most of us live with some sort of pain and wealth doesn't sooth it a jot in my observation.



Agree.



> Good luck to you Mr Plod, I know we will cross swords again and I do understand the motivation of your politics, even if I vehemently disagree with the ideology.



 +1.


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## Julia (30 October 2011)

explod said:


> I am not one to run away.  I was very upset emotially about the departure of a former ASF member who has had in his life from childhood perhaps a harder run than any of us.



Good to be loyal to a friend, but you seemed not to see the situation from Joe's point of view which was less than fair.

I think many of us would be surprised to know the difficulties and trauma various members have come through in the course of their lives.


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## explod (30 October 2011)

Julia said:


> Good to be loyal to a friend, but you seemed not to see the situation from Joe's point of view which was less than fair.
> 
> I think many of us would be surprised to know the difficulties and trauma various members have come through in the course of their lives.




Do agree with that.  

In my view ASF would serve all better by taking an instant stand on posts that personally attack, are abusive or insulting to others.

Such posts should be deleted without reason or question.

Members will *at times * be effected by a life trauma or alcohol.  These same transgressors may be well educated and valuable contributors to the forrums and of course the interaction, and as I find for myself, may also be of benefit to the person.  And this would be an ASF community benefit/service.

And it can be done, as I have noticed on other sites bad posts are just pulled without question.  If a poster is continually deleted I am sure they will soon get the message.  I would not even leave evidence that a particular post had ever existed.  Have often in hindsight wished I could delete some of my own posts in the past, he he.

This would also remove the conspiratorial idea of some that certain ones are cornered and removed as they may for example, kick too far to the left or to the extreme.

And then of course comes the political side for ASF, to be onside with advertisers which holds up the site financially.


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## explod (2 November 2011)

Not too sure where to put the following link so feel free to expose it in the right place as I believe those who have not caught on to the absolute corruption throughout the financial system need to take it into account.

http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/blog/2840/mfing-global

I would also like to express sincere appreciation to the number of pm's I recieved over the last week.  

And wayneL a big appology for my outburst on your thread, "bloodpressure" it was unwarented and out of order.

I feel much better and encouraged to stay within ASF.


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## explod (29 February 2012)

Maybe we can do better off the front page.

Yes wayneL, to be catigorical on "governments and bankers" is in error.

However when I thinks of government I consider its composition as being also the people who elected them and thereby have a bias towards the likewise ideology.

Bankers, those who work for them, I was married to one for a short time, are very adroit on the dogma handed down and, in this case in point, spread to family and friends all around.

And we could go on about the branches of these influences, such as the huge spike in property led by such sociological influence also.

Anyway, over to you


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## explod (11 October 2012)

Bean a bit quiet around here so thought of you all as I was checking back through a sketch book diary of mine.  Says a more than we often give ourselves credit.  Our failures tend to bury our successes.  Anyway the entry.

dated 29/2/92



> "Media today is technological and saturates everything.  It has taken away the democratic or free thought.  Art (creative) visually no longer competes for attention.  My painting is for the self.  It frees me from the control of the technical media.  It is one of the few means to intellectual freedom and individual development but its nature will be growing isolation and perhaps a lonely end."




Sobering to thin back on but all too  true as things are turning out.


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## wayneL (11 October 2012)

explod said:


> Bean a bit quiet around here so thought of you all as I was checking back through a sketch book diary of mine.  Says a more than we often give ourselves credit.  Our failures tend to bury our successes.  Anyway the entry.
> 
> dated 29/2/92
> 
> ...




Mr Plod,

I think you were overly generous in believing that humans (in general) had free thought back then, anymore than now.

The only thing that has changed via technology is the _modus operandi_.

IMNTBCHO

Anyway, I hope you are still enjoying art. In its many forms, it allows us to stay in touch with the pantheon, whatever we believe that is.


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## explod (11 October 2012)

wayneL said:


> Mr Plod,
> 
> I think you were overly generous in believing that humans (in general) had free thought back then, anymore than now.
> 
> ...




Thanks for those thoughts Ole Pal.  Thinking as you say is not free nor condoned.  Systems such as religion and AFL football to ensure this state of control, not for the State, but the money machine ie. the power is what I seem to see.

Anyway my mood is more reflective and self indulgent tonight and so I turn back a page in the notes to the 27/2/92



> Intuition does not come from an imaginary thought but builds upon an idea.  The object is like settling water, intuition washes it down, like soil being eroded till all is flat.  The clutter minimalises/simplifies/; is distilled by the thinking process.  Does a "eureka" need to suddenly surprise or unexpected are we not looking to satisfy the whims of others.  I only seek to satisfy myself  If that is boring to others, or they cannot see what I see I no longer care.  I must push the best parts of my work into new paintings and the work will grow from itself and new ideas will be born from within.




Which has proved true but my human frailty (or weakness if you like) stopped the fulfilment of the promise.

Or, the heady heights of the idea became too great and so an obstacle.


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## Gringotts Bank (12 October 2012)

explod, everyone likes to be understood.  If you're trying to read something that is full of spelling and grammatical errors it's like having someone in your other ear while you're on the phone.  The brain gets confused.  The reader stops reading and no meaning gets conveyed.  Then the whole thing is a waste of effort.  It's not about perfectionism, it's about ease of communication.

On a similar note, there was a thread recently about 'does God exist'?  Lots of strong opinions and not one person had even bothered to define terms.  If you're going to debate such a tricky subject, you first need to describe exactly who or what is God and agree on that...then move onto 'does it exist?'.  Otherwise, one person is arguing based upon his Sunday school image of a man with a beard and flowing robes (that's the extent of his knowledge) and the other is talking about love, another is talking about peace, another is talking about altered states on consciousness, another is talking about ego death, and so on and so on.  And yet the argument continues!!!  And no one knows what the other is talking about because no one really reads what anyone else says and no one bothers to try to understand.

Communication rarely takes place.  It's an illusion.  Especially on forums.


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## explod (24 November 2012)

Gringotts Bank said:


> explod, everyone likes to be understood.  If you're trying to read something that is full of spelling and grammatical errors it's like having someone in your other ear while you're on the phone.  The brain gets confused.  The reader stops reading and no meaning gets conveyed.  Then the whole thing is a waste of effort.  It's not about perfectionism, it's about ease of communication.
> 
> On a similar note, there was a thread recently about 'does God exist'?  Lots of strong opinions and not one person had even bothered to define terms.  If you're going to debate such a tricky subject, you first need to describe exactly who or what is God and agree on that...then move onto 'does it exist?'.  Otherwise, one person is arguing based upon his Sunday school image of a man with a beard and flowing robes (that's the extent of his knowledge) and the other is talking about love, another is talking about peace, another is talking about altered states on consciousness, another is talking about ego death, and so on and so on.  And yet the argument continues!!!  And no one knows what the other is talking about because no one really reads what anyone else says and no one bothers to try to understand.
> 
> Communication rarely takes place.  It's an illusion.  Especially on forums.




Not sure that anyone is too concerned about grammar and spelling when at the bottom.

The wife and I parted some months ago and today my dog Max (my last bastion)was hit by a car on the highway out front of where I live.  That would be not so bad but we are unable to find him or his body at this stage in spite of a very big search for him.  He was sighted several times limping badly and in distress.  Got him from the lost dogs home (nearly 3 years ago) and he has always come home from his tendency to wander, but not this time. Have kept him tethered most times of late and all seemed good before he did go this afternoon.

So how low does one have to go in grief.

And for those who have no care, okay, but this is my little thread to let out steam. So just butt out. And  will add my further thoughts tomorrow.


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## Tink (24 November 2012)

Oh, explod. I am so sorry to hear that. 
I have been battling the last month since losing my little pomeranian, and a few close friends have lost family members.
Life can throw so many challenges at times.

Stay safe


----------



## qldfrog (24 November 2012)

sorry to hear that Explod.
**** happens and from my experience, it tends to happen a lot when you are already down..
The math side is illogical but still it seems you have in a life periods where absolutely every thing goes down the drain.
The positive side: it will have an end hopefully sooner than later.
Take care  of yourself .
Keep the spirit up


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## explod (24 November 2012)

Thank you both deeply for your thoughts.

However when my Brother arose Max walked sheepishly in the gate about 6.30 am this morning.  Drank 300 mil of water and is back licking a broken claw he sustained chasing a fox last week.  

I just cannot believe it.  He dodged all the cars and all the people looking for him.


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## Julia (24 November 2012)

Well, that's wonderful news, Explod.  I can so imagine your relief.  I started to read your original post where he was missing and thought 'oh god, how awful', but now he's home he'll soon recover  from his experience.

Is there any particular reason you have him tied up?  Do you not have fences?
You can train dogs not to leave their property even without fences.


----------



## explod (24 November 2012)

Julia said:


> Well, that's wonderful news, Explod.  I can so imagine your relief.  I started to read your original post where he was missing and thought 'oh god, how awful', but now he's home he'll soon recover  from his experience.
> 
> Is there any particular reason you have him tied up?  Do you not have fences?
> You can train dogs not to leave their property even without fences.




Thanks for your kind thought Julia.

He has had a propensity to wander off on his own and I did pick him up from a lost dogs home some three years ago.  It could well be why he was there too.

Anyway, he is very stiff and sore but has been drinking plenty of water and did have some food tonight.

Things are most definitely looking up after that stroke of luck.


----------



## Tink (25 November 2012)

I am so glad to hear your dog came back, explod : )

Very true qld frog, can be like a house of cards, pull one they all fall.
The last month for me has been death and funerals, very sad.


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## explod (15 January 2013)

You can start investing with $5 by purchasing old pure silver coins.  They have grown in value by 500% since 2001.

At my urging some years back my Step Grandson began collecting 1966 silver 50 cent rounds.  His first ones for around $4.50  He is still buying them has more than a  thousand and he could sell them for more than 10g today.  Up 3% so far this week infact.

Posted here as the person talking to the newbies does not like me to upset the apple cart.

No one seems to be able to think outside the square anymore.

Tink, I am sorry to say that Max got out again and chased a very large roo across the busy highway just missing a car.  Could not keep him chained (bad in itself all the time) and he seemed to be able to escape as he wished.  As you all know I got Max from the pound some 2.5 years back and he was never a happy fellow, always cowering, expecting to be hit.  A sad loss but sometime you just have to put things aside and move on.


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## Tink (16 January 2013)

Hi explod,

I am so sorry to hear about your little dog, I know its a part of life and we just have to move on, doesnt make it any easier at times, I hope you are coping OK.

Its been very quiet in our household since losing both our pets last year in a matter of 6 mths, after 17 years of pets in the home. I am slowly adjusting, but its amazing how much a part of our lives they are.
I am minding my brothers toy/miniature poodle for a few days at the moment, very cute. He is only 2.

We have decided to take a trip overseas, and when we come back, see how we feel and maybe do it all again with the next generation - a cat and a pomeranian, see what happens...

All the best


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## Julia (16 January 2013)

explod said:


> Tink, I am sorry to say that Max got out again and chased a very large roo across the busy highway just missing a car.  Could not keep him chained (bad in itself all the time) and he seemed to be able to escape as he wished.  As you all know I got Max from the pound some 2.5 years back and he was never a happy fellow, always cowering, expecting to be hit.  A sad loss but sometime you just have to put things aside and move on.



This doesn't actually say Max has passed on to canine heaven.  You say he just missed a car.  I thought he had gone to another member of your family to live?


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## Tink (16 January 2013)

Ooops, that was my fault, sorry explod.
Yes, I can understand your reasoning, and its good that you can still see him 

I do tend to ramble at times...


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## explod (16 January 2013)

Julia said:


> This doesn't actually say Max has passed on to canine heaven.  You say he just missed a car.  I thought he had gone to another member of your family to live?




That is the case Julia, the later development took place since we last spoke.  The other party could not keep him there and my Brother would not allow him back here.  Then on the accident with the car, then chasing the roo across the road and his child biting problem I had to let him go.  

On reflection as stated above he never did get over the cruel treatment he undoubtedly received from his previous owner as we thought that he would.  I am very sad about it all but due to the unfortunate circumstances overall feel that he is in a better place.


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## explod (3 June 2014)

Time to move on and do some dusting.

Interesting the news of late, notice Goldman Sachs are going to provide Equador with $580 million in liquidity for 466,000 ounces of gold.  Ye good ole private banks have no borders or government to worry about so will do well over this one.

Yep, and over the last few years noticed that they as well Morgs and a few others, (on behalf of shareholders of course) have been averaging down/up on failing gold and silver mines. Could be a bob in all this as the US dollar's prop is looking a bit shaky. But gold could be a bit shorted for awhile yet.

On QandA notice that we too will follow the good ole U S of A and Tony will do a barnstorm just like Julia as she strutted the stage with the Pres.

Russia going to tighten up the gas to Ukraine who are a bit behind on the bills.  So all good.



Promise this time I will be back soon.  BP back to 170 so a bit of excitement thrown back will be all good.

And remember this thread is about rubbish.


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## explod (11 September 2014)

So moving along we see that Ukraine is about stuffed now with Russia and China soon free to trade resources etc outside of the petro dollar.

Of course the US are as mad as hell but are able to keep MSM  blocked on the big issues with blown up war fronts.

Funny really, as ISIS is probably not much more dangerous than the oth three groups in that middle east region and you would think a wise man would leae and let them fight it till their own end.  But of course near the dam etc there is oil an of course we need basses in which to hold of the UN and democracy so things go on.

The great (a)rabbit of course is laying out what the would should do with his Bishop strutting the stage in a big way.

Meanwhile the workers work less and have nothing to play on.


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## SirRumpole (11 September 2014)

explod said:


> So moving along we see that Ukraine is about stuffed now with Russia and China soon free to trade resources etc outside of the petro dollar.
> 
> Of course the US are as mad as hell but are able to keep MSM  blocked on the big issues with blown up war fronts.
> 
> ...




I didn't understand any of that, so it must be gobbledygook


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## bellenuit (11 September 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I didn't understand any of that, so it must be gobbledygook




Yes, close to incomprehensible.


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## explod (12 September 2014)

Thanks SirRumpole and bellenuit for your valuable observations.

Today we have Obama standing up to the threats, 'We will destroy ISIL"

On the ball this lad, set them up with arms and supplies not eight months ago to now blow them away. Very good for their private munition factories too.  I think they would have good offshore deals and manufacture them offshore to feed some of the poor in the wrong places too. Have I got that right? Next war zone "places" maybe.

And we move onto the rabbit, opps, excuse me, Mr Abbott, who it is announced also today "Abbott awaits call from Obama". Now this could really turn the tide in my view, we have been going hard at it since Fighting George dubya stood on the aircraft carrier deck (sounds a bit like a tale my dad used to say "the boy stood on the burning deck" mum would never let him finish the line, must have been dirty) in 2003 and swore "...a great day for democracy"...

So to quote Fred Aberystwyth, of Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam, (today's Age) " we have an Orwellian war-without-end, so that they could continue to reap billions in profit from the misery and suffering of people in lands far enough away as to not cause a whimper in the "homeland". The lid is totally off the can now, and the worms are calling the shots."


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## SirRumpole (12 September 2014)

explod said:


> So to quote Fred Aberystwyth, of Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam, (today's Age) " we have an Orwellian war-without-end, so that they could continue to reap billions in profit from the misery and suffering of people in lands far enough away as to not cause a whimper in the "homeland". The lid is totally off the can now, and the worms are calling the shots."




You have outdone yourself again explod 



Should all this be in another thread ? Why did you put that stuff in this one ?


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## explod (12 September 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> You have outdone yourself again explod
> 
> 
> 
> Should all this be in another thread ? Why did you put that stuff in this one ?




Good suggested there Sir arr, but I do tend to stray away from topic.  I may well move the connection of the rabbit in tomorrows news to the problems Kim Beasly has with his toenails these days..

Your support in these dark days is appreciated. to you too.


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## Julia (12 September 2014)

explod said:


> And we move onto the rabbit, opps, excuse me, Mr Abbott,






explod said:


> I may well move the connection of the rabbit ...



 Explod, if you can't find some slur a little more sophisticated than the above, perhaps best to just not try being cute.  It's on a par with the silly "Juliar" when Ms Gillard was PM.

You rather remind me of a caller to an ABC radio program a few days ago who spluttered in indignation that, of all things, Mr Abbott actually turned up on the beach in his budgie smugglers.   Wow!   What would he expect?
A dinner suit on the beach?
If you're going to express dislike for an individual or his policies, have the common sense to find valid points of criticism rather than silly puns based on the pronunciation of a person's name.



SirRumpole said:


> Should all this be in another thread ? Why did you put that stuff in this one ?



Given the title of this thread, it seems entirely appropriate here imo.


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## explod (13 September 2014)

Mr Rabbit is all over the front pages war mongering on a conflict that has nothing to do with the proper governing of this country.

In fact the first 10 minutes of ABC news last night was all that. And the more noise is,made the more these youngsters will seek attention.


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## explod (6 December 2014)

*Re: 45 years ago today*

About 45 years ago I went to the Koroit Police Station and filled out an application form to join the Victoria Police. 

My Son-in-law a few years ago became the Officer in Charge of the Koriot Pole Station. 

His wife,  my Daughter (now a Det/Inspector)  said when she joined up that she would never marry a Policeman because they were too shifty. 

My Son-in-law was a fireman.   When his mob privatised he was moved to Townsville Queensland.   My Daughter took12 months leave without pay to be with him. 

On their request I completed an application for him to join up.   He proved not to be shifty and produced two lovely Grandaughters.   The eldest completed her HSC this year and looks to go to Uni next year. 

Just before I filled out that form 45 years ago,  my Dad on his deathbed asked if there was any sign of his first Grandchild.   Sadly I could not satisfy the yearn in his fading eyes.   He'd had a hard life,  lost his Mum at 14, injured and traumatised in WW2, and had eight of us wild children. 

But now and again he loved to go to the races.   In 1957 he had 7 children,  the farm,  just getting on its feet produced 7 bales ofwool,  he went to the Melbourne Cup that year staying with his elder Brother at North Melbourne.   Overnight he dreampt No 7 in the frame,  backed it well and home it came. 

My Daughterof course never met her Grandfather,  I am not one for the horses myelfbut my Daughter loves to go now and again. 

This year,  newly promoted she could not get to The Cup,  but got to Flemington on the Saturday.  Noticed he picking a few and comments on facebook.   About10 minutes before the main race just decided to have a look at the field.   For some reason No 7 stood out at about 12 to 1.  I simply sent her a text,  No 7, not even thinking she would back it. 

A few seconds after the horses crossed the line came the reply "thks Dad,  a few dollars richer" 

It was not till abit later and speaking with my Daughter that perhaps here was my Dad sending a message to his firstborn Granchild. He now has 15 of them and though I do not believe in a God,  I sort of think that Dad is somewhere out there smiling. 

45 years of time and space.   Andforgive the spellin please.


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## explod (30 November 2015)

Julia said:


> Explod, if you can't find some slur a little more sophisticated than the above, perhaps best to just not try being cute.  It's on a par with the silly "Juliar" when Ms Gillard was PM.
> 
> You rather remind me of a caller to an ABC radio program a few days ago who spluttered in indignation that, of all things, Mr Abbott actually turned up on the beach in his budgie smugglers.   Wow!   What would he expect?
> A dinner suit on the beach?
> ...




How I miss Julia,  a wonderful leader from the rear who made us all feel greater. 

I do wonder at what she would assess the huge,  in some cases 50% loss in BHP,  WOW and so many other so called players holding up supperannuation funds.  We are now in worrying and uncharted waters. 

And missing from discussions of late are my old friends,  Uncle Festivus,  that great ole bloke from Townsville,  So Cynical very quiet too,  Tech/A as well. 

Do we have a fear to express,  feel this myself of late,  the markets look totaly rigged but no one wants to talk about it. 

Cumoorn,  some discussion on the big issues that worry you.


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## cynic (30 November 2015)

I'm certain that you're not alone in your various sentiments.

Every time I peruse this forum now, I cannot help but notice the conspicuous absence of her daily posts and the ofttimes sagacious ways she delivered a dose of reality and prudence in places where it was needed.

As for your comments on the markets, there's certainly been some larger players getting caught out in recent years. The comparable paltry fines they receive when caught are hardly sufficient to deter continuance of such behaviour.


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## explod (30 November 2015)

Everyone is scared,  and so am I. 

Not only the financial world,  but population and climate too,  

Yeh,,  ok

,,  no answers...... only fear. 

Cumoorn,  some answers please.???? 

Or r we really fu cke..  d


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## explod (30 November 2015)

cynic said:


> I'm certain that you're not alone in your various sentiments.
> 
> Every time I peruse this forum now, I cannot help but notice the conspicuous absence of her daily posts and the ofttimes sagacious ways she delivered a dose of reality and prudence in places where it was needed.
> 
> As for your comments on the markets, there's certainly been some larger players getting caught out in recent years. The comparable paltry fines they receive when caught are hardly sufficient to deter continuance of such behaviour.




Yes Julia was a beautiful ray of sunshine on us all. 

Agree in toto on the thrust of your post,  but where to now? 

Do we just close down and die,  or can we pick something up for survival. 

Noco,  answers please??


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## explod (30 November 2015)

I used to follow the gold price by the hour as I do believe in the value of tangible things. 

Top paintings are currently fetching record prices around the globe.   This happened in 1976/78 and soon after the markets crashed and gold went from US$200 to $700 in a whisper. 

In my view,  because it is seen as the financial  canary in the cage gold is being held down to a considerable degree. 

However my point,  the markets are no longer reflecting reality in my view so why bother watching. 

Just party.


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## cynic (1 December 2015)

At some point reality will reassert itself and it won't be at all pretty when it happens. However, until then we might as well enjoy the party because we'll all be expected to pay for it sometime, irrespective of whether or not we partook in the financial exuberance.


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## Craton (1 December 2015)

explod said:


> Everyone is scared,  and so am I.
> 
> Not only the financial world,  but population and climate too,
> 
> ...




Yep, we're all stuffed, more so now that we've lost Julia. 

Finance, population, climate, fear, whatever, so what's new?

Nothings new so let's rehash some old news.

Those in power fear losing it so keep the average Joe from rising up and becoming equal, average Joe is kept hobbled by whatever means necessary, GST, CGT, taxes in general, war, warfare, war-mongering, financial distress and hardship, market "distortions", price manipulations, religious bias, hate, environmental degraduation, human inequality, doom and gloom is shouted from the highest vantage points for all the Joe's to hear, so yeah, situation normal...


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## SirRumpole (1 December 2015)

Craton said:


> Those in power fear losing it so keep the average Joe from rising up and becoming equal, average Joe is kept hobbled by whatever means necessary, GST, CGT, taxes in general, war, warfare, war-mongering, financial distress and hardship, market "distortions", price manipulations, religious bias, hate, environmental degraduation, human inequality, doom and gloom is shouted from the highest vantage points for all the Joe's to hear, so yeah, situation normal...




But there has never been a better time to be an Australian !!!

:aus:


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## luutzu (1 December 2015)

SirRumpole said:


> But there has never been a better time to be an Australian !!!
> 
> :aus:




Might be some truth in that: What's a better place climbing up and out than when you've hit rock bottom? Or we're not there yet?


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## SirRumpole (1 December 2015)

luutzu said:


> Might be some truth in that: What's a better place climbing up and out than when you've hit rock bottom? Or we're not there yet?




In all honesty I think I would rather be here than just about anywhere else.

Other possibilities might include New Zealand, Canada, Switzerland and Norway/Sweden.


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## explod (6 July 2016)

Time to dust this thread off.  Having been pretty crook since my prostate cancer situation 9 years back and the desertion of my wife from this loser a few years back I have shaked my head and starting to think again. 

Now I am concerned about where society is going.  Corruption and evil was mentioned by some on the political threads today,  SO:-

Curruption and evil seems to be aided and abetted by Governments these days.   Questions are arising on the war by western governments into Iraq.   In fact we bomb the **** out of countries,  we withdraw overseas aid that feeds people,  and WONDER why they flee to safer havens.  We then abuse and marginalise them. 

Arms dealers flood war-torn Middle East with weapons and then lobby EU to militarize borders against refugees -  profiting from both ends of the conflict.   Money its about the money.   Old man Rothschild used to provide finance and loans to both sides of major conflicts. 

Someone said today the ALP is corrupt with its rant on Medicare,  people are rightly scared of the big powers is why this had effect.  On Friday night I set up bunting (in accordance with the Act.  Done it for years)  at a booth I was supervising for the Greens.   On arrival at 7.30am Saturday it was gone.  Replaced by CFA banners.  Enquiries later revealed that it was Liberal Party members.   They were caught on that night at another booth. 

So who's honest


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## explod (27 August 2016)

Arr well,  no answers since the last post.   And I can blame no one.   Could be mad,  certainly stretched beyond all that we'd even thought about 50 years ago.   But we have learned it was there in fact but hidden and unreported. 

Change of Government in the Territory,  but will that change the banks,  will it help the poor,  stop population growth. 

Pouring another wine in my lone party to celebrate infinity.  Get.......... d

That word may start with an R to ensure expansion.


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## SirRumpole (27 August 2016)

Another Conservative stronghold goes.

WA next ? March 2017 is the date.

But as you say, nothing much changes regardless of who is in. Politics is just a game that parties play.


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## explod (27 August 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> Another Conservative stronghold goes.
> 
> WA next ? March 2017 is the date.
> 
> But as you say, nothing much changes regardless of who is in. Politics is just a game that parties play.




Yes we (and thanks for posting) are concerned.  Till now felt my efforts within my own political circle could help.   However as you say,  its a game and even the obviouse (political identities) players have no say or control.

Does GO really start from death,  defeat or capitulation.  Do we have to concede to "the survival of the fittest". 

Who will or can take a stand and where is the light.     I will not stop trying and currently working on a Candidate's media profile for Bendigo Council elections coming up.


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## qldfrog (28 August 2016)

Hi Explod,
a bit of a late night thinking, not that happy , after what i hope was a good bottle of wine;
Reality is harsh, and I do not like it much either; people in the western world are chasing pokemon, watching brain killing TV or for the new generation sending pictures of their so perfect photoshoped life on instagram/snapchat.
If on that side of the political party, do you really have to be happy with a NT labour win?
Not to destroy your mood further , but the win will be caused by another promise of free money, no effort, give me more to an electorate who has no more political conviction, nor critical thinking or desire of a common good;
a nation of welfare takers be they on the dole, in a "union" for the "left" or sucking 6 figures from deals  borderlining corruption, protecting their NG when not directly involved in sucking the political system on the right.
I am afraid Sir Rumpole that replacing one rotten branch with another one of a different colour does not really make a difference.I now think that only severe crisis can readjust values and priorities; and i am getting more and more  afraid of what it will be; the GFC was a good opportunity , but reserve banks actions have pushed back the issue while increasing the risks and now the problem is bigger;
A much older entry here by Cynic shocked me by its concise truth:"At some point reality will reassert itself and it won't be at all pretty when it happens. However, until then we might as well enjoy the party because *we'll all be expected to pay for it sometime, irrespective of whether or not we partook in the financial exuberance.* " and *financial *is probably too restrictive
not a mood lifting post, but the sun was bright and the surf good in Mooloolaba yesterday


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## Tisme (28 August 2016)

I'm about to walk down to my local, so I'm not in dreaming mode yet, but I will offer the idea to out disenchanted friend that an angry heart makes for few friends and worse: zip intimacy.

Since the Liberal Party and the Labor Party became compromised by a religion in the 1990's parliament has become a traditional Holy Roman Empiresque fight between St Patricks and St Pauls. IMO the only way back is to devolve back to the Church of England's invention of separation of powers.


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## wayneL (29 August 2016)

Tisme said:


> I'm about to walk down to my local, so I'm not in dreaming mode yet, but I will offer the idea to out disenchanted friend that an angry heart makes for few friends and worse: zip intimacy.
> 
> Since the Liberal Party and the Labor Party became compromised by a religion in the 1990's parliament has become a traditional Holy Roman Empiresque fight between St Patricks and St Pauls. IMO the only way back is to devolve back to the Church of England's invention of separation of powers.




I have been thinking the same, Tisyou. A principle that seems to have been forgotten and nary mentioned these days.


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## explod (30 August 2016)

Constructive recent posts above. 

But in the words of Rod Taylor (welcome to Whoop Whoop) I express "hunken..........  doolah"  our Parliamenrt today began with both principal leaders praying to God. 

The the witch doctor is back in control and we can now act on beliefs and kick out the facts.


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## explod (16 June 2017)

Julia said:


> I'm pretty much with you here, Logique.  Also feel a vague need for a translation from the so far impressively esoteric nature of the exchange between explod and gg.
> However, happy to see it continue in the interests of elevating the intellectual content of ASF!
> 
> 
> ...



I love the last paragraph of Julia's here.  It says so much of where we are and in realising that,  feel we are today,  very lost.


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## explod (16 June 2017)

Sorry I could not show that Last para of Julia's.  Read down,  its well worth it.  What a wonderful girlnwe lost.  However lets dig into this meaning of who we are and where we may go.


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## basilio (20 January 2019)

I was wondering here to put this story  and perhaps this thread is the right spot.
Could you imagine being part of a  three year performance art installation where you are living in a 1930's/1950's Soviet research laboratory ?

Check this out and think about about booking your tickets for the premiere..
 
*Stalinist Truman Show: artist paid 400 people to live as Soviet citizens *
Participants lived in replica Stalin-era research institute as part of three-year art project

Mark Brown, arts correspondent

Fri 31 Aug 2018 22.18 AEST   Last modified on Mon 3 Sep 2018 21.44 AEST

This article is over *4 months old*
Shares
5,007




A still of Ilya Khrzhanovsky’s film Dau. Photograph: Jorg Gruber/Phenomen IP, 2018
In an art project that has been compared to The Truman Show, Big Brother and the Charlie Kaufman film Synecdoche, New York, a Russian artist has paid 400 people to live for three years in a fictional but functioning Stalin-era research institute.

In an experiment long anticipated in the film and art worlds but confirmed by the Guardian on Friday, Ilya Khrzhanovsky created an institute of theoretical physics in eastern Ukraine modelled on the shadowy facilities which existed in the Soviet Union from the 1930s to the 1950s.

Inside it were more than 400 real people, who relived 30 years of the Soviet experience in three years between 2008-11, eating the same food, wearing the same clothes, and obeying the same rules as Soviet citizens would have.

People fell in and out of love, conceived 14 children, formed friendships and made enemies, according to executive producer Martine d’Anglejan-Chatillon.





Two participants in the model Soviet-era research facility. Photograph: Volker Glaeser/Phenomen IP, 2018
Khrzhanovsky used the story of Soviet physicist Lev Landau – whose nickname also provided the project’s title, DAU – as the basis for his fictional world. “It is really to show how people are, it is not particular to that culture or that time,” says d’Anglejan-Chatillon. “It is about looking at what human nature is capable of, under a microscope, and the capacity for beauty and intellect and optimism and change or a capacity for the opposite.

“In a way what Ilya created was an encyclopaedia of human relationships and human nature and how things develop over time in people.”

It has been a sprawling project shrouded in secrecy. Very few journalists have ever been given access. One who was, Michael Idov, wrote a piece for GQ in 2011 headlined The Movie Set That Ate Itself, describing Khrzhanovsky as “unhinged”.

James Meek, a novelist and former Guardian Moscow correspondent, was in 2015 invited to a building on Piccadilly where Khrzhanovsky has spent years pulling the project together. He wrote a piece for the London Review of Books in which he said “I felt I’d crossed a membrane into another medium.”
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...st-paid-400-people-to-live-as-soviet-citizens


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## basilio (20 January 2019)

The launch of Dau will be held in Paris from Jan 24 to Feb 17th. Sounds like a surreal experience.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dau_(film)


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## basilio (20 January 2019)

Found this story on the production of _Dau
_
Just so , so crazy. But then sometimes the most brilliant ideas and the most brilliant people are crazy.
Well worth a read (IMO) to expand one's knowledge of the film director and his world..

*The Movie Set That Ate Itself*
By
Michael Idov
Photographs by
Sergey Maximishin
October 27, 2011






Five years ago, a relatively unknown (and unhinged) director began one of the wildest experiments in film history. Armed with total creative control, he invaded a Ukrainian city, marshaled a cast of thousands and thousands, and constructed a totalitarian society in which the cameras are always rolling and the actors never go home.

The rumors started seeping out of Ukraine about three years ago: A young Russian film director has holed up on the outskirts of Kharkov, a town of 1.4 million in the country's east, making..._something_. A movie, sure, but not just that. If the gossip was to be believed, this was the most expansive, complicated, all-consuming film project ever attempted.

A steady stream of former extras and fired PAs talked of the shoot in terms usually reserved for survivalist camps. The director, Ilya Khrzhanovsky, was a madman who forced the crew to dress in Stalin-era clothes, fed them Soviet food out of cans and tins, and paid them in Soviet money. Others said the project was a cult and everyone involved worked for free. Khrzhanovsky had taken over all of Kharkov, they said, shutting down the airport. No, no, others insisted, the entire thing was a prison experiment, perhaps filmed surreptitiously by hidden cameras. Film critic Stanislav Zelvensky blogged that he expected "heads on spikes" around the encampment.

I have ample time and incentive to rerun these snatches of gossip in my head as my rickety Saab prop plane makes its jittery approach to Kharkov. Another terrible minute later, it's rolling down an overgrown airfield between rusting husks of Aeroflot planes grounded by the empire's fall. The airport isn't much, but at least it hasn't been taken over by the film. And while my cab driver knows all about the shoot—the production borrowed his friend's vintage car, he brags without prompting—he doesn't seem to be in the director's thrall or employ.

I'm about to write the rumors off as idle blog chatter when I get to the film's compound itself and, again, find myself ready to believe anything. The set, seen from the outside, is an enormous wooden box jutting directly out of a three-story brick building that houses the film's vast offices, workshops, and prop warehouses. The wardrobe department alone takes up the entire basement. Here, a pair of twins order me out of my clothes and into a 1950s three-piece suit complete with sock garters, pants that go up to the navel, a fedora, two bricklike brown shoes, an undershirt, and bors. Black, itchy, and unspeakably ugly, the underwear is enough to trigger Proustian recall of the worst kind in anyone who's spent any time in the USSR. (I lived in Latvia through high school.) Seventy years of quotidian misery held with one waistband.





The twins, Olya and Lena, see nothing unusual about this hazing ritual for a reporter who's not going to appear in a single shot of the film—just like they see nothing unusual in the fact that the cameras haven't rolled for more than a month. After all, the film, tentatively titled _Dau_, has been in production since 2006 and won't wrap until 2012, if ever. But within the walls of the set, for the 300 people working on the project—including the fifty or so who live in costume, in character—there is no difference between "on" and "off."
https://www.gq.com/story/movie-set-that-ate-itself-dau-ilya-khrzhanovsky


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