# This guy's so shy he's never kissed a girl



## Solly (13 September 2009)

*Meet the man so shy he's never even kissed a woman*

_I wonder what his ASF member name is ?_

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/4626075.Meet_the_man_so_shy_he_s_never_even_kissed_a_woman/


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## jono1887 (13 September 2009)

haahah... i've never kissed a girl. But I'm not where near 27... just havn't found her yet :


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## gav (13 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> haahah... i've never kissed a girl. But I'm not where near 27... just havn't found her yet :




Is it because you also feel nervous around women?  Or just never met a female you want to kiss? (that also wants to kiss you back   How old are you Jono?  

Please tell me to butt out if I am being rude. Just curious...


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## Smurf1976 (13 September 2009)

Wouldn't this be a self-reinforcing situation?

If you're 10 and never been kissed then that's irrelevant since you're no different to most 10 year olds.

15 and maybe you're getting a bit embarassed and don't want to tell your mates. But still no big deal.

20 and you're becoming some sort of freak.

25 and you are a freak and the trouble now is in addition to the original fear, you'll have the extra "what if she finds out this is my first time" fear added to it.

So in short, the longer you wait the harder it gets.


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## Nyden (13 September 2009)

That problem may be alleviated Smurf, they're called hookers :


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## Mr J (13 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> haahah... i've never kissed a girl. But I'm not where near 27... just havn't found her yet :




You haven't found the right girl? There are plenty of right girls - girls right for now :.



> So in short, the longer you wait the harder it gets.




Some girl might have read the article and decided to help him.


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## explod (13 September 2009)

Nyden said:


> That problem may be alleviated Smurf, they're called hookers :




fortunately never had to try a hooker, and now prolly too old to ever bother

but kiss one  ??


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## rustyheela (13 September 2009)

Nyden said:


> That problem may be alleviated Smurf, they're called hookers :




Youre game kissing a hooker!!! never know where both pairs of her lips have been


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## nunthewiser (13 September 2009)

pretty sure they charge extra for that anyways ............... hang on i,ll just go ask


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## Mr J (13 September 2009)

Why haven't his mates done anything to help him? It's simple, get him smashed at a bar, and hook him up with *anyone*.


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## Nyden (13 September 2009)

explod said:


> fortunately never had to try a hooker, and now prolly too old to ever bother
> 
> but kiss one  ??




Well, I'm sure it would be quite vile. However, it would get him out of a potential vicious cycle! Just thinking outside the box, is all


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## explod (13 September 2009)

Nyden said:


> Well, I'm sure it would be quite vile. However, it would get him out of a potential vicious cycle! Just thinking outside the box, is all




Liked your post, just worried that if they both had any sore or opening on lips it is possible to transfer aids or hepatitus


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## Surfer35 (13 September 2009)

They are all hookers and will only give some suger once a few dollars has changed hands. Just that some are more honest with themselves about it.


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## nunthewiser (13 September 2009)

Surfer35 said:


> They are all hookers and will only give some suger once a few dollars has changed hands. Just that some are more honest with themselves about it.





LOL ............ONYA!

hope ya wearin a crash helmut


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## Nyden (13 September 2009)

explod said:


> Liked your post, just worried that if they both had any sore or opening on lips it is possible to transfer aids or hepatitus




To be fair (why the heck am I defending these sorts?), these risks are present in any and all physical relationships. One never knows the previous sexual history of their partners.

And with the all promiscuous behavior of most young adults today, they may as-bloody-well be hookers. Sure as heck dress the part!


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## Mr J (13 September 2009)

> And with the all promiscuous behavior of most young adults today




I would be surprised if it has changed all that much. It may just be less taboo.



> they may as-bloody-well be hookers.




I imagine decent hookers will take care of themselves. They'll know the risks and manage them. Your drunk bar bicycle will not. I'm guessing decent hookers will also mainly have regulars.



> One never knows the previous sexual history of their partners




And it doesn't matter as long as they're clean. I'm actually surprised how few partners most people have had. Say you go out once every two months for a fling. Do that for 10 years, and you have a figure that most people would say is high. And that's only one fling every two months.


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## sammy84 (13 September 2009)

Nyden said:


> And with the all promiscuous behavior of most young adults today, they may as-bloody-well be hookers. Sure as heck dress the part!




And we are complaining about this why?


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## explod (13 September 2009)

sammy84 said:


> And we are complaining about this why?





Good point, the more shagging one can get the better and its very good for the health as well


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## grace (13 September 2009)

Surfer35 said:


> They are all hookers and will only give some suger once a few dollars has changed hands. Just that some are more honest with themselves about it.




I feel very sorry for you.  Just where have you grown up to find yourself only amongst women who are hookers?


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## Mr J (13 September 2009)

grace said:


> I feel very sorry for you.  Just where have you grown up to find yourself only amongst women who are hookers?




We all wh0re ourselves in one way or another.


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## nunthewiser (13 September 2009)

would like to take this opportunity to confirm to all concerned that i have never kissed a hooker


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## berbouy (13 September 2009)

according to those french films on sbs late at night, the parisian "ladies of the night" have hearts of gold, and would not charge for a kiss,to break your duck...but you must look like gerard depardieu.do you?

not that i have seen french films on sbs , just on my way to business lateline lol


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

gav said:


> Is it because you also feel nervous around women?  Or just never met a female you want to kiss? (that also wants to kiss you back   How old are you Jono?
> 
> Please tell me to butt out if I am being rude. Just curious...




I'm not nervous around women.. just never met a female i wanted to kiss. 
btw. im 18



Mr J said:


> You haven't found the right girl? There are plenty of right girls - girls right for now :.




haha.. yea, for a fee of coarse


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## gav (14 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I'm not nervous around women.. just never met a female i wanted to kiss.
> btw. im 18




Well, if you start doing well in your trading and can afford the car in your display pic, I'm sure you'll have many lining up for a kiss!


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

gav said:


> Well, if you start doing well in your trading and can afford the car in your display pic, I'm sure you'll have many lining up for a kiss!




Well theres one out in the open in Brisbane city, in front of the casino. The only thing around it is a glass case (nothing a good old brick cant get through)... anyone know how to hot-wire an R8??


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## gav (14 September 2009)

Well at least you have good taste in cars! Jason Statham drives nothing but Audi's in the Transporter movies, and women love him! :


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

gav said:


> Well at least you have good taste in cars! Jason Statham drives nothing but Audi's in the Transporter movies, and women love him! :




I think they're going for his looks as opposed to his taste in cars...


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## Solly (14 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Well theres one out in the open in Brisbane city, in front of the casino. The only thing around it is a glass case (nothing a good old brick cant get through)... anyone know how to hot-wire an R8??




jono ,the other day one of my mates sent me this pic of your dream car as he was stumbling out of the Treasury Casino after a big night. (He's suffering similar probs as gg at the moment)

You'll need a big brick.


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono ,the other day one of my mates sent me this pic of your dream car as he was stumbling out of the Treasury Casino after a big night. (He's suffering similar probs as gg at the moment)
> 
> You'll need a big brick.




yep, thats the one. they've got  a casino guard walking around it wiping the glass after ppl touch it. im sure if not a brick.. a sledge hammer would do.


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## Smurf1976 (14 September 2009)

gav said:


> Well, if you start doing well in your trading and can afford the car in your display pic, I'm sure you'll have many lining up for a kiss!



And that's precisely the sort of girl you'd be better off without...


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## Mr J (14 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I'm not nervous around women.. just never met a female i wanted to kiss.
> btw. im 18
> 
> haha.. yea, for a fee of coarse






Never met a female you wanted to kiss? That's very strange.

For a fee? No, I'm talking about girls that you don't see as part of your future, but a fun for the time being.



Smurf1976 said:


> And that's precisely the sort of girl you'd be better off without...




Exactly. A lot of guys use their possessions and flashiness to attract the wrong type of women, and then are surprised when these women don't stick through tough times or decide to clean them out? It's a minefield out there, but there are a lot of awesome girls out there who don't really care what you drive or how much you earn*.

*To an extent, as women still want a man who can look after himself and help provide a reasonable standard of living.


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## aaronphetamine (14 September 2009)

A dosage of 0.1g of MDMA would alleviate this problem in about 35minutes  A few shots of some dirty vodka wouldnt go astray either. but this guy needs to gee up.

I was out on the town on satty night and there was heaps of talent around, so as if theres no girls youd wanna kiss let alone do other things with. Even the filthy looking rank birds manage to hook up in most cases much to my amusement. As long as shes got tidy straight teeth and not some dirty set with gaps wide enough to kick a field goal through and shes relatively hot - changes on how desperate the night is going - then reach for the stars.


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Never met a female you wanted to kiss? That's very strange.
> 
> For a fee? No, I'm talking about girls that you don't see as part of your future, but a fun for the time being.




Well whats the point if you don't see them as part of your future?? I'm not that kind of person..


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## nunthewiser (14 September 2009)

hey......... 

leave the dude be 

he was honest enough to say he hasnt kissed anyone ............ he is only 18 

full respect if that is what he has chosen to do ......... shows  commitment


if it is because of circumstance..........so what? 

quite refreshing to hear a story of someone not banging there brains out from the age of 13 for a change


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## nunthewiser (14 September 2009)

i think i need aarons phone number


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## Solly (14 September 2009)

nunthewiser said:


> i think i need aarons phone number




That reminds me, it took me two years to work out why Sollette #1 had only one nostril. But you've got to remember I'd just moved out of mom's basement.


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## Mr J (14 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Well whats the point if you don't see them as part of your future?? I'm not that kind of person..




Have you ever made temporary friends, i.e. taken a course, made friends but know that you'll go your different ways afterwards? It's the same thing. A companion is quite different to a sexual partner. 

I know some people only want to have a relationship with people they think they have a future with, and that's something I don't understand, and why I replied to you. Do you usually think of the future, rather than living in the moment? Do you not make friends as easily as others? Do you have fewer friends, but they are great, longterm friends? If this is too personal I understand, but I like to try and understand different thought processes.

I'm also interested to know why you haven't found anyone attractive by 18, or perhaps the few you do find attractive have no been available? By 18, most of us have met a lot of people, so it's very unusual to not have found anyone attractive.



> quite refreshing to hear a story of someone not banging there brains out from the age of 13 for a change




Seems everyone does. I like to add 3-4 years unless they say 19 or older, in which case they're probably telling the truth :.


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## jono1887 (14 September 2009)

> Have you ever made temporary friends, i.e. taken a course, made friends but know that you'll go your different ways afterwards? It's the same thing. A companion is quite different to a sexual partner.




Yes, i have... but i honestly dont think the same thing does not apply to sexual partners.



> I know some people only want to have a relationship with people they think they have a future with, and that's something I don't understand, and why I replied to you. Do you usually think of the future, rather than living in the moment? Do you not make friends as easily as others? Do you have fewer friends, but they are great, longterm friends? If this is too personal I understand, but I like to try and understand different thought processes.




Yep, I can say that I would only want to have a relationship with someone I can see having a future with.. otherwise my investment of time, money and what not would be wasted... i don't want to make investments with no foreseeable future.

I guess I am also more careful in my choice of friends... not any less by I do choose my long term friends carefully and they'll probably be friends for life.



Mr J said:


> I'm also interested to know why you haven't found anyone attractive by 18, or perhaps the few you do find attractive have no been available? By 18, most of us have met a lot of people, so it's very unusual to not have found anyone attractive.




I've found many women attractive in my time... doesn't mean I gonna go out and start kissing ever second one i meet. There are a lot of other factors things that I look for other than looks in a partner.

Also.. just because I find someone attractive, doenst mean they feel the same way :


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## ck13488 (14 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Yes, i have... but i honestly dont think the same thing does not apply to sexual partners.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



i was pretty much the same but till 17. turned 18 and started going out and kissing acquantances/friends but lost the novelty...few years later ive found someone i can see me being with for a fair whack of time...its worth the wait mate. 

im sure if you can handle the crap you get off your mates your more than well prepared to put up with the babble these fools are tossing around


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## gav (14 September 2009)

gav said:


> Well, if you start doing well in your trading and can afford the car in your display pic, I'm sure you'll have many lining up for a kiss!






Smurf1976 said:


> And that's precisely the sort of girl you'd be better off without...




Surely you could see I said the above comment in jest...

Good on you Jono for standing by your beliefs/opinion.  It shows character.  The world would be a boring place if we were all the same.


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## Junior (15 September 2009)

Had my first kiss at 16 and lost the V plates at the ripe old age of 21.  Certainly later than the vast majority of my friends, which made me feel a bit uncomfortable at the time but as it turned out not really a big deal at all.

I strongly recommend spending time travelling/overseas if you want to gain some experience with women before searching for a long term partner.  It's a hell of a lot easier to meet people and have a few one night stands when you're travelling and away from your home town.


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## Mofra (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Well whats the point if you don't see them as part of your future?? I'm not that kind of person..



Depends on your definition of future. I've been single for over a year now and in that time met plenty of women I've eventually had a future with - often that future starts and ends in a measurement of hours though


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## stocksontheblock (15 September 2009)

Sorry to jump into the middle of all the pointless banter about all women being hookers, yet what makes any one of you think that this load of rubbish is in fact a real story?

Sounds like a right load of excrement to me!


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## awg (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I'm not nervous around women.. just never met a female i wanted to kiss.




you lie!   (he shouts)...either that, or..(no offense intended)


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## Mr J (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Yes, i have... but i honestly dont think the same thing does not apply to sexual partners.




Probably because you view sex differently. Sex may not be as big an issue once you have it.



> Yep, I can say that I would only want to have a relationship with someone I can see having a future with.. otherwise my investment of time, money and what not would be wasted... i don't want to make investments with no foreseeable future.




Probably because you're making the investment that they will be in your future, while I'm making an investment that they will be here for now. I take life one day at a time, while keeping an eye on the future. If a fling turns into a marriage, fine, but I don't go into anything expecting to marry the girl later down the road. It's just not sensible given that most relationships will not last.



> I've found many women attractive in my time... doesn't mean I gonna go out and start kissing ever second one i meet. There are a lot of other factors things that I look for other than looks in a partner.




Nobody has suggested you have to kiss every girl you meet, but it might be a start. Kissing and sex is a lesser deal after you've done them, and maybe you'll discover playing with a girl is fun, regardless of your vision of the future .



> Also.. just because I find someone attractive, doenst mean they feel the same way :




A bit of a snag. I say have a few beers and find a nice girl to have some fun with. Worst case you feel it was a waste of time eek, or maybe you discover that "for now" isn't so bad. Up to you, but I like trying new things, never know if you don't try.


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## nunthewiser (15 September 2009)

Mr j  you are a tart 

please do not corrupt this nice young man


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## stocksontheblock (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Yep, I can say that I would only want to have a relationship with someone I can see having a future with.. otherwise my investment of time, money and what not would be wasted... i don't want to make investments with no foreseeable future.




I'm a little older than 18, so please take this for all the good advice in the world, don’t share this 'view' with women or any woman, particularly ones you might kiss one day.

Unless of course you want to be single, and actually never kiss a girl (without having to pay for it) be sure to ask them if your time and money and efforts will be a 'good investment'


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## jono1887 (15 September 2009)

stocksontheblock said:


> I'm a little older than 18, so please take this for all the good advice in the world, don’t share this 'view' with women or any woman, particularly ones you might kiss one day.
> 
> Unless of course you want to be single, and actually never kiss a girl (without having to pay for it) be sure to ask them if your time and money and efforts will be a 'good investment'




You don't go out right and tell them  You can get a general idea after getting to know someone if they're someone you can foresee spending your future with..


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## Solly (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> You don't go out right and tell them  You can get a general idea after getting to know someone if they're someone you can foresee spending your future with..




jono, it might be prudent to throw up some data in a graphical format for you at this point.


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## drsmith (15 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono, it might be prudent to throw up some data in a graphical format for you at this point.



The workplace is a lot like marriage in that respect.


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## Smurf1976 (15 September 2009)

gav said:


> Surely you could see I said the above comment in jest...
> 
> Good on you Jono for standing by your beliefs/opinion.  It shows character.  The world would be a boring place if we were all the same.



All good, no worries. 

For me though, driving a conservative car and not wearing fancy clothes works nicely as a screening method for getting rid of women I'd rather not waste my time with.


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## nunthewiser (15 September 2009)

dear Mr J 

i hearby apologise for calling you a tart 

i hope i did not hurt your feelings 

it was a spur of the moment comment 

thankyou 

a sincerely repentant nun


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## Julia (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> You don't go out right and tell them  You can get a general idea after getting to know someone if they're someone you can foresee spending your future with..




Jono, whilst I respect your point of view, I wonder if you're taking the whole boy/girl thing a little too seriously for your age?

I'm not sure how you will know when the 'right person'' comes along if you don't have a few, um, friendships with girls beforehand.   It's these early, experimental relationships that help us understand what we like and don't like.
e.g. you may have to accept that no one girl will ever fulfil the sort of very high standards you seem to be expecting.

I'm assuming you mix with the opposite sex at uni, general social life etc?

Is it possible that your unwillingness to engage in a casual relationship might be due to some level of fear on your part?  My apologies if that's way off base, but it's quite common to avoid situations about  which we feel less than comfortable.

You come across as a pretty serious young bloke.  Do you think there could be a case for just having fun?

Please don't regard the above as criticism.  Just a suggestion.


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## jono1887 (15 September 2009)

Julia said:


> Jono, whilst I respect your point of view, I wonder if you're taking the whole boy/girl thing a little too seriously for your age?
> 
> I'm not sure how you will know when the 'right person'' comes along if you don't have a few, um, friendships with girls beforehand.   It's these early, experimental relationships that help us understand what we like and don't like.
> e.g. you may have to accept that no one girl will ever fulfil the sort of very high standards you seem to be expecting.
> ...




I am not someone with extremely high standards that is not flexible. I do mix with the opposite sex at uni, social life and so on. 

I dont think its fear thats stopping me from taking part in casual relationships. I just dont believe in 'casual' relationships with women. I have friendships with women, but I would rather not engage in a casual relationship when they are friends that I dont see having a future with (as a long term partner).

Also, I'd like to add that I don't believe in sex before marriage for religious reasons. Although this does not apply to kissing or any other forms of intimacy... I am careful about who I get close to and on how intimate I get...

And no.. i dont think there is a case for just having fun... this case has also been applied to sex and just see where society has gone..


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## drsmith (15 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Also, I'd like to add that I don't believe in sex before marriage for religious reasons. Although this does not apply to kissing or any other forms of intimacy... I am careful about who I get close to and on how intimate I get...
> 
> And no.. i dont think there is a case for just having fun... this case has also been applied to sex and just see where society has gone..



Take the above a bit less seriously otherwise you'll end up being an old fart with nothing but regrets.


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## jono1887 (15 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> Take the above a bit less seriously otherwise you'll end up being an old fart with nothing but regrets.




I'll admit I should be less serious about kissing.. but I do not want to be regretting loosing my virginity to the wrong person... I fully intend on waiting till marriage.


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## drsmith (16 September 2009)

Principals (religious or otherwise) are one thing but if you are too rigid that could be a very long wait.


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## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> Principals (religious or otherwise) are one thing but if you are too rigid that could be a very long wait.




I'm in no rush... got plenty of time ahead of me...


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## Mr J (16 September 2009)

nunthewiser said:


> dear Mr J
> 
> i hearby apologise for calling you a tart
> 
> ...




Hey, no reason not to call a spade a spade .



> I'll admit I should be less serious about kissing.. but I do not want to be regretting loosing my virginity to the wrong person... I fully intend on waiting till marriage.




After they first have sex, most people regard virginity as something overrated. You can't know this because you haven't had sex, but it's likely that once you do, you'll regret your decision. I can't say you will, just that you probably will.

To the wrong person? Then who is the right person? If you get married, it's a coinflip whether or not it is the right person. Judging by your standards so far, you may never meet someone you will marry.

Waiting until marriage is really not a great idea, as many people will break up over sexual incompatibility. You will not know how compatible you are with your partner until it is too late. Good luck, I hope you don't live to regret your decision. Don't take this as me trying to change your mind, just presenting the flipside of the coin for you to consider.


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## Julia (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> To the wrong person? Then who is the right person? If you get married, it's a coinflip whether or not it is the right person. Judging by your standards so far, you may never meet someone you will marry.
> 
> Waiting until marriage is really not a great idea, as many people will break up over sexual incompatibility. You will not know how compatible you are with your partner until it is too late.



So true.  Jono, you probably imagine it will automatically be shooting stars and everything that's wonderful, but not necessarily.   This is one instance where we could definitely apply the 'try before you buy' principle.

Even when you do marry, it sounds rather as though your expectations will be so rigid, any young woman would find it pretty difficult to meet these.


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## Tink (16 September 2009)

nunthewiser said:


> hey.........
> 
> leave the dude be
> 
> ...





well said Nun : )

Jono, I am sure you have a good set of friends you spend time with and talk to..

Good for you for listening to yourself in what you want to do : )


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## stocksontheblock (16 September 2009)

Now I'm really confused.

Unless there are 2 Jono1887's how does this comment by you jono1887 tie up with this comment on another thread. If anyone is wondering what thread : Re: Divorce buggers Money Management.

Here you were making a comment to GG:



> i would think that someone like you or most people on these forums would probably be more well prepared. I think your initial post made it sound far worse than would it would probably have been.




Then the smoking gun:



> *I'm not married but I was.. only a very small amount of our assets would be held in joint cash accounts.*




I added the colour, bold etc.


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## Nyden (16 September 2009)

stocksontheblock said:


> Now I'm really confused.
> 
> Unless there are 2 Jono1887's how does this comment by you jono1887 tie up with this comment on another thread. If anyone is wondering what thread : Re: Divorce buggers Money Management.
> 
> ...




I'm still somewhat out of it (just woke up!), but even I can see that there was meant to be an "if" in there. 



> I'm not married but *if* I was.. only a very small amount of our assets would be held in joint cash accounts.




Notice the use of the word would? Was a dead giveaway.


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## stocksontheblock (16 September 2009)

Nyden said:


> I'm still somewhat out of it (just woke up!), but even I can see that there was meant to be an "if" in there.
> 
> 
> 
> Notice the use of the word would? Was a dead giveaway.




You are right, yet the rest of the comment from the previous thread contained future and current tense, and if the 'I' was to be an 'if' then you wouldnt spell 'if' with an 'I' if it was in the body of the sentence, so just wanted to clarify, thats all!


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## stocksontheblock (16 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> You don't go out right and tell them  You can get a general idea after getting to know someone if they're someone you can foresee spending your future with..




Really, do you honestly believe that a cup of coffee and piece of cake a few times (don’t take this literally) gives you the basis as to whether this person is for life? Are you that sure? If I had a $ for every one, and including myself who thought that the one 'right now' was the one 'forever' then I would be sitting on my own island drinking fine wine for the rest of my life without a care in the world.

I'm really interested to know how you are so sure that you know that someone is the one for you after getting to know them. Is not the point of a 'relationship' getting to know someone over 2 months, or 20 yrs?



jono1887 said:


> I am not someone with extremely high standards that is not flexible. I do mix with the opposite sex at uni, social life and so on.
> 
> I dont think its fear thats stopping me from taking part in casual relationships. I just dont believe in 'casual' relationships with women. I have friendships with women, but I would rather not engage in a casual relationship when they are friends that I dont see having a future with (as a long term partner).
> 
> ...




You keep saying a casual relationship. What is a causal relationship? Is it any relationship that doesn’t last forever? Or is it one that essentially is sex on the side with no commitment?

I would have to say that women, generally, are not a stupid group of people, and can generally tell from attitudes of people - men and relationships - what the other person may me thinking in respect to some attitudes and opinions.

Looking at your posts here and elsewhere you are very concerned - if not worried to the point of near hysteria about losing money or assets when it comes to a relationship. I don’t know your religious background or beliefs, yet how do you reconcile not wanting/having sex before marriage - I assume because you see it as wrong - with your views on having international bank accounts, burying money in the backyard and the like.

Maybe I am misguided, yet trust is a pretty big deal when it comes to a relationship, so hiding money etc seems to fly in the face of having a relationship.



jono1887 said:


> I'll admit I should be less serious about kissing.. but I do not want to be regretting loosing my virginity to the wrong person... I fully intend on waiting till marriage.




Well, if you are ready then you shouldn’t regret it, yes? No? And so, once again I ask how do you know? What if your radar, or instinct is wrong and you have sex and this woman (I assume it will be a woman) isn’t the future Mrs Jono? Your comment sounds so final; will you never trust a woman again?

Please understand, I’m not having a go at you, I am just trying to understand your view as it seems just all a little to black and white.


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

stocksontheblock said:


> Now I'm really confused.
> 
> Unless there are 2 Jono1887's how does this comment by you jono1887 tie up with this comment on another thread. If anyone is wondering what thread : Re: Divorce buggers Money Management.
> 
> ...




Yea, there was meant to be an if in there. It was late last night..



stocksontheblock said:


> Really, do you honestly believe that a cup of coffee and piece of cake a few times (don’t take this literally) gives you the basis as to whether this person is for life? Are you that sure? If I had a $ for every one, and including myself who thought that the one 'right now' was the one 'forever' then I would be sitting on my own island drinking fine wine for the rest of my life without a care in the world.




I think we live in completely different worlds. I honestly believe we are able to judge someone accurately without having sex with them. It just takes time...you have to get over all the 'chemical romance' stage where everything in the relationship is all happy and there are no arguments :

I expect to get to know my future spouse for at least several years before even considering marriage. I know this sounds old fashioned, but I have friends that have done the same (some have/had been dating for 4+ years before marriage - with no sex). 

And why are relationships so strongly based on sex these days... It used to be when society was more religious, sex was not til marriage and there werent any of these problems of incompatibility when it came to sex.



> I'm really interested to know how you are so sure that you know that someone is the one for you after getting to know them. Is not the point of a 'relationship' getting to know someone over 2 months, or 20 yrs?




I would say 1-2 years would be the bare minimum. Everyone should know that the pheromones and endorphins are raging within the first 6-12 months - the honeymoon period where you cant find a single fault in your partner. Science has proven this, and you will have a very high probability of divorce if you get married after this very short period of time.



> You keep saying a casual relationship. What is a causal relationship? Is it any relationship that doesn’t last forever? Or is it one that essentially is sex on the side with no commitment?
> 
> I would have to say that women, generally, are not a stupid group of people, and can generally tell from attitudes of people - men and relationships - what the other person may me thinking in respect to some attitudes and opinions.




A casual relationship is probably one you are in but where so dont see yourself having a future with them. Or it could just be sex on the side with no commitment.



> Looking at your posts here and elsewhere you are very concerned - if not worried to the point of near hysteria about losing money or assets when it comes to a relationship. I don’t know your religious background or beliefs, yet how do you reconcile not wanting/having sex before marriage - I assume because you see it as wrong - with your views on having international bank accounts, burying money in the backyard and the like.
> 
> Maybe I am misguided, yet trust is a pretty big deal when it comes to a relationship, so hiding money etc seems to fly in the face of having a relationship.




I am not worried to the point of hysteria. If you read the whole post in the divorce thread.. i was merely pointing our how it would be very stupid of you to risk loosing a severe portion of your assets that would 'bugger' your money management permanently. As I pointed out, it is relatively easy to avoid a situation as described by GG.

International bank accounts is not illegal... its just 'rainy day' money. You can several k in no interest yielding accounts in a number of countries that is not illegal as its not income bearing. And I didn't mention anything about not telling your spouse about it. Its just that a angry spouse would probably not consider money in international accounts when planning to run away. And they would have to fly over to take the money out... making it slightly more difficult.

Yes, I do see sex before marriage as wrong... but I would say its rather foolish for someone, either single or married to not have money burried somewhere. Its not illegal - the ATO is not going to hunt you down for having 10-20k burried under your house. Its probably rather prudent... what are you going to do if your house burnt down, mortgage payment due, insurance not paying up for a few months and your low on cash as the market suddenly hit a downturn? Having some cash to live on for at least a month would be wise - not just for protection when in a relationship.



> Well, if you are ready then you shouldn’t regret it, yes? No? And so, once again I ask how do you know? What if your radar, or instinct is wrong and you have sex and this woman (I assume it will be a woman) isn’t the future Mrs Jono? Your comment sounds so final; will you never trust a woman again?
> 
> Please understand, I’m not having a go at you, I am just trying to understand your view as it seems just all a little to black and white.




I am certain that relationships are not all based on sex and there are other ways of 'knowing'. I will rely on my instincts on this.. there is no set of rules or scientific formula to love. 

And no, I do not have trust issues with women...


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> After they first have sex, most people regard virginity as something overrated. You can't know this because you haven't had sex, but it's likely that once you do, you'll regret your decision. I can't say you will, just that you probably will.
> 
> To the wrong person? Then who is the right person? If you get married, it's a coinflip whether or not it is the right person. Judging by your standards so far, you may never meet someone you will marry.
> 
> Waiting until marriage is really not a great idea, as many people will break up over sexual incompatibility. You will not know how compatible you are with your partner until it is too late. Good luck, I hope you don't live to regret your decision. Don't take this as me trying to change your mind, just presenting the flipside of the coin for you to consider.




IMHO you would be pretty shallow to base an entire marriage on your 'sex' or sexual compatibility as you have stated. As I wrote in my previous post, you can tell if you are compatible with someone over time... you cant rush relationships, and you really have to get over the initial period to fully get to know someone.



Julia said:


> So true.  Jono, you probably imagine it will automatically be shooting stars and everything that's wonderful, but not necessarily.   This is one instance where we could definitely apply the 'try before you buy' principle.
> 
> Even when you do marry, it sounds rather as though your expectations will be so rigid, any young woman would find it pretty difficult to meet these.




This is where I definitively disagree with you. Society has regarded sex so lowly these days that its a 'try before you buy' concept. I don't think thats how sex should be treated.. its a special bond that shouldnt just be used to 'try out' a product. 

What do you think my standards are by the way. I have not set out an arduous list in this forum. List out these standards that you seem to have concluded from my posts for me..


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## Nyden (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Judging by your standards so far, you may never meet someone you will marry.





With so many people having multiple divorces these days, would that be such a bad thing?


----------



## Julia (16 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> And why are relationships so strongly based on sex these days... It used to be when society was more religious, sex was not til marriage and there werent any of these problems of incompatibility when it came to sex.



How do you know?  Sorry, Jono, but that's complete nonsense.  Many a virginal marriage foundered on sexual incompatability.  It's a hugely important aspect of a relationship.



> Yes, I do see sex before marriage as wrong... but I would say its rather foolish for someone, either single or married to not have money burried somewhere. Its not illegal - the ATO is not going to hunt you down for having 10-20k burried under your house. Its probably rather prudent... what are you going to do if your house burnt down, mortgage payment due, insurance not paying up for a few months and your low on cash as the market suddenly hit a downturn? Having some cash to live on for at least a month would be wise - not just for protection when in a relationship.



Curioser and curioser.  Um, what's wrong with an ordinary bank account?
Non-interest bearing, if you are worried about paying a bit of tax.



> I am certain that relationships are not all based on sex and there are other ways of 'knowing'.



Perhaps, but if the sexual aspect is incompatible, that will affect all of the rest of the relationship.



jono1887 said:


> This is where I definitively disagree with you. Society has regarded sex so lowly these days that its a 'try before you buy' concept. I don't think thats how sex should be treated.. its a special bond that shouldnt just be used to 'try out' a product.



OK.  So what would you do if you marry this perfect woman and then find she has been content not to have sex for several years, though in a semi-committed relationship because she simply dislikes sex?   Might have married you just *because* you were the first bloke not to want what is pretty normal amongst a couple of people who like/love each other?




> What do you think my standards are by the way. I have not set out an arduous list in this forum. List out these standards that you seem to have concluded from my posts for me..



Well, I couldn't know a 'list of standards'  but what is standing out from this discussion, plus your posts in other threads here and there, is a young man, bright enough, but very serious for his age, actually lacking humour, defensive, rigid, controlling, critical.  No doubt you have many positive qualities, Jono, but I'd just simply be concerned that no young woman will ever be 'good enough'.
Good luck.


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## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

Julia said:


> Curioser and curioser.  Um, what's wrong with an ordinary bank account?
> Non-interest bearing, if you are worried about paying a bit of tax.




Well it was based on my other post in the divorce thread... after GG mentioned having his accounts cleared by with 4th wife. Having money in physical cash I think is quite important. What if the banking computer system was to crash : 

but more seriously.. you should have some physical cash. Never know accounts can be frozen, comptuter errors, accounts getting hacked. Everyone needs some cash for one reason or another.


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## peterh (16 September 2009)

Jono, I like and agree with your thoughts on relationships and marriage. Keep it up.


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## Knobby22 (16 September 2009)

Good luck Jono. You'll find the right girl. It's about intimacy.
Society is putting all these false pressures on that you are ignoring. Good on you.


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## Junior (16 September 2009)

Knobby22 said:


> Good luck Jono. You'll find the right girl. It's about intimacy.
> Society is putting all these false pressures on that you are ignoring. Good on you.




On another note, I like your signature, I used to be very much addicted to that game.  More recently I was addicted to Transport Tycoon.


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## stocksontheblock (16 September 2009)

Hi Jono, I think it is all getting a little too hooked up on the sex thing.

I don’t think I ever suggested that sex was OK (although I think it is), or that you should do it, or that your missing out, or that you are foolish for thinking in such a manner.

By definition, what you are saying is that you would have a relationship with someone before marrying them.



> I expect to get to know my future spouse for at least several years before even considering marriage…




To me this sounds like you are prepared to live with them, buy house, buy a dog, see the world, and get some plants (don’t take it all literally). So, there is nothing casual about this at all. The fact that sex has been raised is not a precursor to a relationship.

I would have to agree with Julia about the sex part of a relationship. Sex is important. It might not be a priority or on the top 10 things that make a relationship, yet I better dollars to disco that its number 11. Sexual compatibility has always been important; it’s that society has relaxed much of the preconceived notions of divorce, and women in general.

Once upon a time - and not that long ago, women were subjugated to the point where they had no say - in public, no say - at home, and any opinions or thoughts where considered secondary to that of the mans. So as we - as a society - have progressed women have demanded better sex, asked a man to be a little more caring, work a full day, work better jobs, get better pay and on it goes. So, sex - for you might not be important in knowing someone, yet for many women it is, and this would include the people you know.

However, the big concern I have about what you have written is the cold and hands off idea you have to finances, and not just your own. I'm not sure why you felt the need to distinguish that money buried and in an offshore account is not illegal. I'm not sure it was suggested it is, however it can, yet that’s another topic altogether.

Money, assets and the like in a relationship are exactly that – a relationships money and assets. I am sure should you say to any future Mrs Jono: look I'm going to stash some money in the backyard which is not yours, it will be mine etc. will quickly see her talking to the first solicitor she can call.

A relationship, which I think you have failed to understand, is a partnership, based on honesty and trust. This might sound like a great fantasy, yet it’s the few things which most people hold dear to establishing and maintaining a relationship.

However, you are, as you say 18 and never kissed a girl, so with all the respect in the world you really have no idea.

When you are 28, married, a couple of kids, house, an investment or 2, holding down a job, mowing the lawn on the weekend let us know how your attitudes have changed, as I am pretty dam sure that should you take this sort of attitude with you til that age none of the above will come your way.

Consider what you said:



> I think we live in completely different worlds. I honestly believe we are able to judge someone accurately without having sex with them. It just takes time...you have to get over all the 'chemical romance' stage where everything in the relationship is all happy and there are no arguments
> 
> I expect to get to know my future spouse for at least several years before even considering marriage. I know this sounds old fashioned, but I have friends that have done the same (some have/had been dating for 4+ years before marriage - with no sex).




Don’t forget, in that 'time' it takes to get to know them they will be getting to know you. So should she for a moment think this guy is just trying to see if I am worth keeping around (and not going to rip off all his money (should he have any)), then I can say she will be gone before you know she has left. It cuts both ways.

Sex or no sex. Money or no money. It should, just maybe, have a slight element of love.


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## Tink (16 September 2009)

Umm - since when is dating, living together?

I know people that have dated for years and never lived together

He is 18 years old - let him live his life the way he sees fit. 

He has already mentioned he is old fashioned, so maybe his friends are the same as him..

NO right or wrong here...


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## Mr J (16 September 2009)

Tink said:


> old fashioned, so maybe his friends are the same as him..




"Old-fashioned" is a myth, well at least something that only applied to a minority for a short period of time. We've been sexually liberal for most of our history.



> IMHO you would be pretty shallow to base an entire marriage on your 'sex' or sexual compatibility as you have stated




A marriage might not be based on it, but it can sure end over it. There are many factors that can ruin a marriage, and this is just one of those. You can't really suggest it is not important when you haven't had sex or (I assume) a proper relationship.



> NO right or wrong here...




Maybe, maybe not, but it has been shown that the quality of our sex lives strongly influences our state of mind, and I don't want Jono flipping out and taking a bunch of innocents with him :.This is all a bit like saying you don't like chocolate ice-cream, having never tried the stuff.


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## Agentm (16 September 2009)

hmmmmmm.. he seriously looks like kevin rudds love child


and his socks are part of the problem..

as for his phobia

its real and as with anyone with a disorder, he can have treatment

i think a week on a cruiseboat in the whitsundays with a dozen chicks would fix it.. but the soxs have to go!!


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## Bushman (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> A marriage might not be based on it, but it can sure end over it. There are many factors that can ruin a marriage, and this is just one of those. You can't really suggest it is not important when you haven't had sex or (I assume) a proper relationship.




In my experience, a successful arriage is 25% friendship, 25% sexual chemistry, 25% financial security and 25% ethos. These are the stressors in relationships and if you are not in sync, it ain't gonna work.  

As for 18-year old virgins, well at what other age can you afford to be idealistic? You have time and a lack of responsibility on your side. Make sure it is not religious dogma and associated guilt though that is suppressing those primal urges . J*sus Freaks have been trying to control human sexuality for some time. Mmmm; hard to devote yourself slavishly to the Church when you spend your time thinking about bangin' Miss X in the front pew.    

In terms of the article itself, agree with the socks comment. Anyway if you have such a phobia, why go on the front page of the Scottish Argus or whatever it is? Someone give the guy a BJ and lets move on. Not that I'm volunteering. That would be one that was hard to explain to the missus (an extra rule for marriage which is 100% trust/fidelity and no BJ's for Kevin07 McBeth). LOL.


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## Knobby22 (16 September 2009)

Junior said:


> On another note, I like your signature, I used to be very much addicted to that game.  More recently I was addicted to Transport Tycoon.




It's pretty true. I think a lot of people would have learnt the reality of margin calls. Better to learn about it in a game!


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## Mr J (16 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> i think a week on a cruiseboat in the whitsundays with a dozen chicks would fix it..




If he hasn't already been taken care of. There are generous and freaky girls out there. One may have seen it as a way to heal him, another may just love virgins. Who knows. Or maybe he's going to try and sell it on E-Bay.


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## adobee (16 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> i think a week on a cruiseboat in the whitsundays with a dozen chicks would fix it..



Is there a travel agent you can book this online with... ????
I am in .. roll it out !


Havent read the whole thread but brother..  (thats you *jono1887*)

dont even think about this kissing someone and it will be special find someone you really like etc etc etc.. (this is bull crap thought up by your mind being demented cause you havent pashed anyone this happens more as you get old and really think about sex) you need to get this out of the way asap and things will be alot easier life will be better and you will play warcraft alot less...  dress cool hit some bars ..  get on the drink .. pash some chicks.. are you in sydney ????   You have a great selection ... Crazy chicks at Tank, Home and other house clubs .. cargo, loft ... etc etc  no luck .. try some older chicks at establishment .. still no luck hit up  Jacksons on George  still no luck try Arq at Taylor square..   then shoot across to Cronulla try at the clubs there .... 
what about the club at the central coast ??? troppo ?? is it still around..
no luck...
try the clubs at your local leagues clubs or rsl... always popular with pashers..


*here is how it works for the shy in experienced guys...* dont deny it.. cause you are.. its okay..  dont say you dont want tips cause you obviously have no idea of what is going on what to do or how to handle this situation .. its okay dont deny it.. you need to move past denial... and get with the chicks... (Important note do not think you love this girl you pash.. you want to pash three or four girls per night..) If you get a drink thrown on you then dont get mad and go skitz.. this is like being crowned !!!!! 

*1) CONFIDENCE IS KING - doesnt matter if you if you are a tool or a nerd or normal or not... confidence is king*
*2) ITS A NUMBERS GAME -* Every rejection is closer to an acceptance.. and remember .. low odds high returns.. high odds low returns.. (I would start with the high odds - low returns)

- rock up to the club / bar whatever ..
- look neat so you get in.. 
- take cash..  lots of cash .. (ditch your fat ass wallet) carry cash folded in your pocket..
- its time to warm up .. buy some drinks...  (tip bar tender really really well so you get his attention next time) (slap hand if possible and say " Nice one brotha in an English accent)
- look for a small group of girls chatting amongst them selves (two or three)
- take your mate with you and say the secret words...
- Hi, I dont think we have met before I am (insert name here) (hold out your hand to shake)
(get names)
- say something about the name .. (ie if its lara .. "like lara croft tomb raider" stick to well known names and sexy ones dont use warcraft or fat chicks names ...
- (insert name here) we are going to hit the bar for some shots before having a dance are you in ?   lets do it ! 
- proceed to bar (girls must accompany you or no shots for them)
Bartender 12 quick f*cks please (three each is good start and 12 on the bar looks cool - will get the attention of other chicks)..
( Yell Salute and hold your glass out for cheers) (I dont know what this means but it sounds cool)..
Do this three times ..  boom ...
Say.. Lets dance.. take girls hand pull to dance floor
dance a bit..
do sexy dancing / dirty dancing (you can only do this if you are age 19 or less else you are a jerk)
start pashing !!!!

NOW you know the secret to being an 18 year old man !!!


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## Kryzz (16 September 2009)

adobee said:


> You have a great selection ... Crazy chicks at Tank, Home and other house clubs .. cargo, loft ... etc etc  no luck .. try some older chicks at establishment .. still no luck hit up  Jacksons on George  still no luck try Arq at Taylor square..   then shoot across to Cronulla try at the clubs there ....
> what about the club at the central coast ??? troppo ?? is it still around..
> no luck...
> try the clubs at your local leagues clubs or rsl... always popular with pashers..




RSL club? lol joking right? forget tank and home bar (don't forget your parachute pants if u do tho!) , soho and ivy r winners!!

Jono, are you catholic?  (just out of curiosity) sorry if im asking too much.


shaun.


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## aaronphetamine (16 September 2009)

If you're in Brisbane the clubs with the highest ratios of bang tidy birds are to be found at the following clubs;

The Family, The Met, X & Y Bar, Cloudland, Birdie Num Nums, Empire, GPO, The Monastery, The Planet, Alhambra, Zuri.

the dirty rank birds are to be found at;

The Bank, RG's, Mystique, Mustang, Kalibar - avoid these places at all costs.


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## awg (16 September 2009)

lol to all the advice on finding chicks.

here is the advice I gave to a mate of mine, who is Much older than 18, and very shy with ladies, although he is well built and quite ok looking.

*go out late, when the clubs are near closing, as the chicks are pissed by then, and much less discriminating.

*you save time and money by not having to buy heaps of drinks for them

*dress well, have a nice car

*start with fat chicks, as they are more desperate.

*If you dont know how to start a conversation, literally just let them bump into you...this happens when they are pissed, especially if they are keen

*work your way up the scale..ie fat but pretty...hot body, but a bit ugly etc, to suit yr preference

If I had more time, I could amuse you with the story about a mate and myself, (both good looking studs, we decided to slip away when a couple of girls got red-hot keen, and sprint off, hiding in an alley, giggling our arses off..( we were both married men)..many gory details omitted.


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## adobee (16 September 2009)

aaronphetamine said:


> If you're in Brisbane the clubs with the highest ratios of bang tidy birds are to be found at the following clubs;
> 
> The Family, The Met, X & Y Bar, Cloudland, Birdie Num Nums, Empire, GPO, The Monastery, The Planet, Alhambra, Zuri.
> 
> ...




Gold Coast is also a great move... if you are 18 dude hit up schoolies...
you cant go wrong and if you make the news you can post it on you tube ...


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## adobee (16 September 2009)

Kryzz said:


> RSL club? lol joking right? forget tank and home bar (don't forget your parachute pants if u do tho!) , soho and ivy r winners!!
> 
> Jono, are you catholic?  (just out of curiosity) sorry if im asking too much.
> 
> ...





Sorry man .. I am 29 now so not up on the scene ...

Ivy is killer but to get a pash ???? 

home you can pash for sure ...  pash two girls at once !

is blackmarket still open  ??? hit this up and just tell some mean look chicks you have never been kissed and you will be looked after ...

Soho looks good for the youngones.. our reception seems to frequent oftern..

otherwise for a bit of pashion...

RSL - Castlehill, Epping etc (dont they put on a dance party once a month)
Parra leagues has a nightclub..
Tracks @ Epping ..
Hillside Taven Castlehill
Northies @ Cronulla
Sheaf @ Double Bay

Ohh forget the winner -
hit up Minskies @ Cremorne ...


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## adobee (16 September 2009)

Follow These Rules & Youll have mad bread to break up -



*1) CONFIDENCE IS KING - doesnt matter if you if you are a tool or a nerd or normal or not... confidence is king*
*2) ITS A NUMBERS GAME -* Every rejection is closer to an acceptance.. and remember .. low odds high returns.. high odds low returns.. (I would start with the high odds - low returns)

- rock up to the club / bar whatever ..
- look neat so you get in.. 
- take cash..  lots of cash .. (ditch your fat ass wallet) carry cash folded in your pocket..
- its time to warm up .. buy some drinks...  (tip bar tender really really well so you get his attention next time) (slap hand if possible and say " Nice one brotha in an English accent)
- look for a small group of girls chatting amongst them selves (two or three)
- take your mate with you and say the secret words...
- Hi, I dont think we have met before I am (insert name here) (hold out your hand to shake)
(get names)
- say something about the name .. (ie if its lara .. "like lara croft tomb raider" stick to well known names and sexy ones dont use warcraft or fat chicks names ...
- (insert name here) we are going to hit the bar for some shots before having a dance are you in ?   lets do it ! 
- proceed to bar (girls must accompany you or no shots for them)
Bartender 12 quick f*cks please (three each is good start and 12 on the bar looks cool - will get the attention of other chicks)..
( Yell Salute and hold your glass out for cheers) (I dont know what this means but it sounds cool)..
Do this three times ..  boom ...
Say.. Lets dance.. take girls hand pull to dance floor
dance a bit..
do sexy dancing / dirty dancing (you can only do this if you are age 19 or less else you are a jerk)
start pashing !!!!

NOW you know the secret to being an 18 year old man !!![/QUOTE]


----------



## adobee (16 September 2009)

awg said:


> lol to all the advice on finding chicks.
> 
> here is the advice I gave to a mate of mine, who is Much older than 18, and very shy with ladies, although he is well built and quite ok looking.
> 
> ...






Not sure about the going out when the clubs are closing... but at 18 mad car is a must... Seriously forget about money.. you can drive a getz later when your thirty and no one cares...

Easy affordable options - Audi TT , BMW Convertible 3 series, Mercedes SLK,
Unless you have a mad city pad these are your best options... 

I would strongly suggest getting two other mates and leasing a crazy apartment or house city fringers house or city apartment..  ENTOURAGE STYLES...  Three mates together in a house with a pool near bondi or bellevue hill probably $300 a week each and pay for it by having mad pool parties... Otherwise a hot apartment in a rubbish building like World Square or the like.. (choca block with asian birds and sweedish backpackers) You will pick up more chicks in the lift inviting them to your place for a drinks.. or at the pool side than anywhere else... (Plus weekends the meriton ones hire some out as hotel rooms - 70% being 18th birthdays and hens nights) BOOM!!

Forget the people who say.. ohh you will just get chicks who want money and to be seen in your car ... THESE ARE THE BEST CHICKS when you are 18..  Forget nice personalities they are all wack jobs... at least these girls are straight up and you know whatthey want...


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## adobee (16 September 2009)

adobee said:


> Not sure about the going out when the clubs are closing... but at 18 mad car is a must... Seriously forget about money.. you can drive a getz later when your thirty and no one cares...
> 
> Easy affordable options - Audi TT , BMW Convertible 3 series, Mercedes SLK,
> Unless you have a mad city pad these are your best options...
> ...





If only I was 18 again ...

(At lease I have got my average posts up! BOOM!)


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## Eloise (16 September 2009)

HAHAHAHAHA to all the above tips!

From a females point of veiw, if you (a bloke) gave me the impression he was only wanting to kiss a girl who he saw a future (Marriage) with, that is WAY WAY to much pressure for the girl and i would RUN RUN RUN!
Dont get me wrong i am an old fashioned girl in many senses, have never slept with anyone that i didn't know/wasn't in a relationship etc, although i have kissed many frogs, which was half the fun of finding the prince at the end. ( God i sound like my life is over, but i am still young, i think haha).

I was 18 (turning 19) when i met my partner father of my children, yet still not my husband..and are more "married" then half the folks we know that are.  I can honestly say when we entered our journey together, the last thing we both thought was that we would have 2 kids, some houses and still be together this many years down the track...no expectactions..just took each day, week, year as they came and couldn't be happier 

As for sex before marriage, i think its a personal decision, i have 2 very close friends that are now married, did the whole no sex before marriage, and were the happiest couple around, now they are married and experienced a different level of there relationship and filing for divorce (so yes sex [and lack of] is powerful act and has more bearing on things then one may think).

Another couple we know, also good friends, have only ever been together, had otehr relationships before but only experienced intamacy with each other, they are now looking at "open" marriage options as they are both are wondering what else is out there...

Good Luck
nothing wrong with your idea's, but there is nothing wrong with opening you mind up and seeing what it lets in and what happiness it may bring


----------



## Smurf1976 (16 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I would say 1-2 years would be the bare minimum. Everyone should know that the pheromones and endorphins are raging within the first 6-12 months - the honeymoon period where you cant find a single fault in your partner. Science has proven this, and you will have a very high probability of divorce if you get married after this very short period of time.



I've known quite a few people who have had relationships fail at about the 3 year mark, so I tend to regard anything over that as the "long enough to get married" point.

I'm single at the moment and the last relationship ended happily (we're still in occasional contact and on good terms). It just took 2 years 9 months for us to realise we weren't headed in the same direction, at least not without making one or the other miserable in the process.

I must say though that I do find it rather strange when people have 3 month, 6 month etc celebrations as though that was some kind of great milestone. I assume the novelty of that wears off after a while and they stick to the normal annual event.


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

adobee said:


> Not sure about the going out when the clubs are closing... but at 18 mad car is a must... Seriously forget about money.. you can drive a getz later when your thirty and no one cares...
> 
> Easy affordable options - Audi TT , BMW Convertible 3 series, Mercedes SLK,
> Unless you have a mad city pad these are your best options...
> ...




I wouldnt mind getting one of those cars... but 10k spent today could potentially be 1M by the time I'm 30 so I'd rather keep it in stocks..


----------



## Julia (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> "Old-fashioned" is a myth, well at least something that only applied to a minority for a short period of time. We've been sexually liberal for most of our history.



That's absolutely true.   I was amused to discover that my grandmother was pregnant when she married my grandfather.


----------



## Julia (16 September 2009)

Adobee and Aaronphetamine, re your advice to jono to party on at various clubs, I couldn't help thinking how intimidating that might be to a fairly serious 18 year old with the sort of views jono has.

Started me reflecting on how 'fun' is something quite different to all of us.

Jono, what is fun to you?  (no obligation to answer, of course.)

Personally, I've never enjoyed that boozy, club scene.

Good heavens, (and I know I'll get flamed over this) I can even remember having a pretty good time at a church social when I was about 15!!


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

Julia said:


> Adobee and Aaronphetamine, re your advice to jono to party on at various clubs, I couldn't help thinking how intimidating that might be to a fairly serious 18 year old with the sort of views jono has.
> 
> Started me reflecting on how 'fun' is something quite different to all of us.
> 
> ...




Hmm... I think I would probably find it intimidating being in that kind of environment. And I do not find those situations 'fun'. Although I do remember a few highschool parties where I did have fun tricking a few drunks into running a klm into bushes trying to find the stash of booze :

But my idea of fun would involve socialising with people over some good food.. talking about anything in general. Although I do also like a good conversation with anyone about their views of the economy/politics or their trading styles.


----------



## Julia (16 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> But my idea of fun would involve socialising with people over some good food.. talking about anything in general.



Sounds good.


----------



## Mr J (16 September 2009)

Adobee, your advice is fine if you want to often be rejected, waste money and come across as a punk and a sleaze. Then again, at certain clubs it may not matter . Don't worry, it's normal at that age.

My advice would be to work on charm, presentation, and think about body language. 

Charm: Be postive, confident, and smile. Seem comfortable, and make those around you comfortable. Make them feel better about themselves.

Presentation: Wear nice clothes and be well-groomed. Women place a lot of emphasis on grooming, but don't come across as a metro-sexual, as the majority of women like men who take care of themselves, rather than men who take more care of themselves than women!

Body language. The answer to whether or not she likes you is out there before you approach a woman. Watch her reaction to you. Almost every movement we make around people is intentional. Ask yourself what that movement means.

It also helps to be good-looking .



> Although I do also like a good conversation with anyone about their views of the economy/politics or their trading styles.




Try not to talk about trading with girls, at least not unless they're interested. Even then, don't take it seriously, and make fun of yourself/trading.


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## awg (16 September 2009)

Julia said:


> Started me reflecting on how 'fun' is something quite different to all of us.
> 
> Jono, what is fun to you?  (no obligation to answer, of course.)
> 
> ...




I preferred not to meet females in bars, as it was difficult to have any sort of intelligent conversation, if it was noisy, or much drinking was involved, so no flaming from me

A former colleague of mine was relentless on the hunt. ( He had even owned a nightclub)

here is a quote of his, it still sticks in my head...after I had opined words to the effect that Christian girls were a bit "conservative"

"Church socials are an excellent place to meet chicks , (as there were usually more women than men), and Christians still need a r@#t" 

I am unfortunately unable to give any direct testimony to support the second half of his assertion, but now that I think back, there were a lot of attractive girls at the small number of church functions I have attended

so Jono, or Mr J or whoever it is has never kissed..maybe get yr ass to church?


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## Mr J (16 September 2009)

awg said:


> so Jono, or Mr J or whoever it is has never kissed..maybe get yr ass to church?




Woah, I didn't do anything to deserve that .


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Adobee, your advice is fine if you want to often be rejected, waste money and come across as a punk and a sleaze. Then again, at certain clubs it may not matter . Don't worry, it's normal at that age.
> 
> Try not to talk about trading with girls, at least not unless they're interested. Even then, don't take it seriously, and make fun of yourself/trading.




Thats true... i think going to clubs is an absolute waste of money and is a pointless exercise. And as mentioned.. how do you expect to have any form of intelligent conversation with someone in a club?

And yes, I think the latter point is fairly obvious. Although it would be nice to find a girl interested in trading..


----------



## jono1887 (16 September 2009)

awg said:


> "Church socials are an excellent place to meet chicks , (as there were usually more women than men), and Christians still need a r@#t"
> 
> I am unfortunately unable to give any direct testimony to support the second half of his assertion, but now that I think back, there were a lot of attractive girls at the small number of church functions I have attended
> 
> so Jono, or Mr J or whoever it is has never kissed..maybe get yr ass to church?




hmm... really dont think it is appropriate. And I dont get what a 'r@#t' is...
I do go to church, you are seriously twisted


----------



## Julia (17 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Woah, I didn't do anything to deserve that .



Mr J, I don't think awg was casting any aspersions but rather just momentarily was confused between the 'j' of "Mr J" and the "J" of jono.  Hope I'm right here, awg?




jono1887 said:


> hmm... really dont think it is appropriate. And I dont get what a 'r@#t' is...
> I do go to church, you are seriously twisted



Lol!   This is the best post on this thread.


----------



## Solly (17 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> hmm... really dont think it is appropriate. And I dont get what a 'r@#t' is...
> I do go to church, you are seriously twisted




jono

Got this link in my favourites that you may enjoy, got it sent to me from a repentant Zoo Weekly hopeful who I met last time I dropped into the Mountain Song campus at Rover St . 

http://www.ehow.com/how_4464326_meet-spouse-church.html

I wish you luck in your quest to find a decent GF.

If things don't go your way, PM me and I'll arrange a night out with some of my undergrad mates from the Uni of the 3rd age. 

To prepare you'll need a good feed to line your stomach before you out, make sure you've got 50 bucks & your mum's address and directions home pinned to the inside of your shirt collar, just makes it easier for the cabbie to get you home afterwards especially if English isn't their first language. Make sure you've got untraceable cash, most of the places we visit don't have eftpos.

BTW we may need the assistance of a fit young lad to get a Fisher and Paykel 3 wheeler down the ramp at The Catwalk Club, there's quiet a tight turn at the end. 

We could even run into nun.


----------



## Tink (17 September 2009)

Aaaah what a wonderful world we live in...


----------



## adobee (17 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I wouldnt mind getting one of those cars... but 10k spent today could potentially be 1M by the time I'm 30 so I'd rather keep it in stocks..




Trust me brother Jackson.. 1million when your thirty doesnt come close to being 30 and looking back and realising you didnt live it up when you were 18..  I am 29 and have about 900k equity after slogging it out hard for the last 10 years and looking back I would much prefer to have run a muck and then backpacked from 21-27 years old.. this sort of stuff is priceless and if you have a good business mind you will make money there after.. the life experience is worth alot more 1mill....

Get the car.. you can probably lease one for $300 a month ( your 10k trade can pay this off for you ) and boom .. you are in with the 18 year old girls.. you will be picking up at the petrol bowzer .. at the traffic lights.. everywhere...  Put your number on the back window in big letters with for sale in small.. so you can point it out to the chicks at the lights !!! yeah baby!!


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## adobee (17 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Adobee, your advice is fine if you want to often be rejected, waste money and come across as a punk and a sleaze. Then again, at certain clubs it may not matter . Don't worry, it's normal at that age.
> 
> My advice would be to work on charm, presentation, and think about body language.
> 
> ...







Sleezy & Rejected !?!?!?!?!??  this plan is for 18 year olds not for 29 year olds.. you can be sleezy at 18 ... this is standard play ..

FOLLOW THOSE SIMPLE RULES I HAVE STATED AND YOU WILL HAVE AT LEAST 65% SUCCESS... once you hit the shots section you are up to 90% success... if they dont come for shots you dont pay and you have lost about 6 minutes.. you can cover half of Darling Harbour with this method in one night ...

Where is sleazy in -

HI dont believe we have met my name is (Insert name here) ..
We are hitting the bar up for some shots are you in ????
NO SLEAZE HERE -

Sleezy is the weird nerd who says... You are the most beautiful girl I have ever seen...  Hhhhiiiiiiiiii .. Can I buy you a drink...


*It also helps to be good-looking .*
RUBBISHHHHH!!!!

You could be an ape and it wouldnt matter confidence is key ... and appearing fun....   If you are ugly & a nerd shave your head number 2 buzz cut.. you will either look cool or tough but at least you wont have nerdy hair !
Never where short sleve shirts and always roll sleeves of long sleeve shirts up two rolls...


----------



## awg (17 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Woah, I didn't do anything to deserve that .




I have forgotten who is the non-kissee on this thread, no harm meant to you, sorry dude



Julia said:


> Mr J, I don't think awg was casting any aspersions but rather just momentarily was confused between the 'j' of "Mr J" and the "J" of jono.  Hope I'm right here, awg?




yes, this is the case



jono1887 said:


> hmm... really dont think it is appropriate. And I dont get what a 'r@#t' is...
> I do go to church, you are seriously twisted




r@#t = one of those things that grow from the bottom of trees, (slang for sexual intercourse)...I was quoting someone else, far be it from me to assert that of Christian females

me? twisted?

btw, is there more girls than guys at your church?


----------



## Mr J (17 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Thats true... i think going to clubs is an absolute waste of money and is a pointless exercise. And as mentioned.. how do you expect to have any form of intelligent conversation with someone in a club?
> 
> And yes, I think the latter point is fairly obvious. Although it would be nice to find a girl interested in trading..




You don't go to clubs to talk, just to dance and/or pickup, both of which are better done at other places.



adobee said:


> I am 29




Then why advise him to act like an 18 year old punk when he isn't an 18 year old punk?



adobee said:


> Sleezy & Rejected !?!?!?!?!??  this plan is for 18 year olds not for 29 year olds.. you can be sleezy at 18 ... this is standard play ..




Being sleazy will regularly move things along more quickly, but you can also do that without being sleazy. I'm sure Jono would prefer not to look back at himself as a sleazy, materialistic punk (which I do myself). I'm sure the type of girls he likes also aren't interested in sleazes (if they are anything like himself).



> Where is sleazy in -
> 
> HI dont believe we have met my name is (Insert name here) ..
> We are hitting the bar up for some shots are you in ????
> NO SLEAZE HERE -




I didn't say all of it was sleazy.



> Sleezy is the weird nerd who says... You are the most beautiful girl I have ever seen...  Hhhhiiiiiiiiii .. Can I buy you a drink...




No, that may be viewed as creepy and/or pathetic, but not sleazy.



> *It also helps to be good-looking .*
> RUBBISHHHHH!!!!




If I didn't look okay, I doubt girls would have overlooked all that they did. Confidence is certainly important, but it can only take you so far.



awg said:


> I have forgotten who is the non-kissee on this thread, no harm meant to you, sorry dude




Don't worry about it, I was just having a little fun.


----------



## Kryzz (17 September 2009)

adobee said:


> Trust me brother Jackson.. 1million when your thirty doesnt come close to being 30 and looking back and realising you didnt live it up when you were 18..  the life experience is worth alot more 1mill....
> !





You can always just have both


----------



## Mr J (17 September 2009)

adobee said:


> Trust me brother Jackson.. 1million when your thirty doesnt come close to being 30 and looking back and realising you didnt live it up when you were 18..




I've had wild years, I've had quiet years. Both have been valuable, and I've also learned that it is the present that matters.


----------



## jono1887 (17 September 2009)

adobee said:


> Trust me brother Jackson.. 1million when your thirty doesnt come close to being 30 and looking back and realising you didnt live it up when you were 18..  I am 29 and have about 900k equity after slogging it out hard for the last 10 years and looking back I would much prefer to have run a muck and then backpacked from 21-27 years old.. this sort of stuff is priceless and if you have a good business mind you will make money there after.. the life experience is worth alot more 1mill....
> 
> Get the car.. you can probably lease one for $300 a month ( your 10k trade can pay this off for you ) and boom .. you are in with the 18 year old girls.. you will be picking up at the petrol bowzer .. at the traffic lights.. everywhere...  Put your number on the back window in big letters with for sale in small.. so you can point it out to the chicks at the lights !!! yeah baby!!




Mate for a 29 year old, you are incredibly shallow... there are more things to life other having a nice car and girls. Why would I throw away my trading capital which has doubled in the last year for a car which would depreciate just as fast a downturn.



adobee said:


> Sleezy & Rejected !?!?!?!?!??  this plan is for 18 year olds not for 29 year olds.. you can be sleezy at 18 ... this is standard play ..




Now why would I want to be sleazy? 
And I have better uses for my money other then spending it on $15 shots..



awg said:


> btw, is there more girls than guys at your church?




umm... never counted, about even i think.



Mr J said:


> I've had wild years, I've had quiet years. Both have been valuable, and I've also learned that it is the present that matters.




Well, I'd rather save now and have a better 'present' in the future :


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## Mr J (17 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Mate for a 29 year old, you are incredibly shallow... there are more things to life other having a nice car and girls. Why would I throw away my trading capital which has doubled in the last year for a car which would depreciate just as fast a downturn.




All that matters is that you enjoy yourself. It still wouldn't hurt to find a few girls to play with just to see what the fuss is about - you can't know what you're missing until you try it. By denying yourself (of sex and intimacy), you allow for the possibility that you will marry too young and for the wrong reason.


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## drsmith (17 September 2009)

You don't need a nice (expensive) car or to throw away your trading capital to kiss a girl.

Look at this from the perspective of a religious leadership. Throughout history, sexual restraint is a means by which religions can control their flock and the over rating of virginity is part of this.

If it goes further before you are married, it won't drop off, the universe will still be the same afterwoods and you won't be condemmed to burn in hell for all eternity or similar.


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## jono1887 (17 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> You don't need a nice (expensive) car or to throw away your trading capital to kiss a girl.
> 
> Look at this from the perspective of a religious leadership. Throughout history, sexual restraint is a means by which religions can control their flock and the over rating of virginity is part of this.
> 
> If it goes further before you are married, it won't drop off, the universe will still be the same afterwoods and you won't be condemmed to burn in hell for all eternity or similar.




During history, wouldn't a greater population be more beneficial as there is more human capital stock?? I don't know how they would beneficial from keeping the population controlled but its my personal choice to wait till I'm married, doesnt mean I am scared of burning in hell or what not..


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## drsmith (18 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> During history, wouldn't a greater population be more beneficial as there is more human capital stock?? I don't know how they would beneficial from keeping the population controlled but its my personal choice to wait till I'm married, doesnt mean I am scared of burning in hell or what not..



What greater power can one person have over another than control of his/her strongest physical urges ?
This power need not be physical (restraint, violence etc), it can also be by through psychological influence.

Religion has had a history of wanting followers to breed as much as possible to keep them poor and uneducated and produce more followers but only after their leaders say so of course. 

In relation to your personal beliefs, which of the following do you consider represents the greatest moral difference,

1) sex between partners in a married relationship and sex between partners in an unmarried relationship or,
2) sex between partners in an unmarried relationship and casual sex ?


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## Solly (18 September 2009)

jono, here's a fine European lass to take out for a spin in the Audi;

http://www.ananova.com/News/story/sm_3485591.html


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## jono1887 (18 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> What greater power can one person have over another than control of his/her strongest physical urges ?
> This power need not be physical (restraint, violence etc), it can also be by through psychological influence.
> 
> Religion has had a history of wanting followers to breed as much as possible to keep them poor and uneducated and produce more followers but only after their leaders say so of course.
> ...




Well obviously the latter poses a greater moral difference, however it still doesnt make set in an unmarried relationship any more right.

Its like comparing the theft of a car to Bernie Maddoff's theft of billions of dollars. In the end, they're both still theft...


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## jono1887 (18 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono, here's a fine European lass to take out for a spin in the Audi;
> 
> http://www.ananova.com/News/story/sm_3485591.html




hmm... considering the fact that those construction workers ran away cowering in fear.. she must be pretty damn ugly


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## derty (18 September 2009)

So Jono I make the assumption that you expect to marry a virgin.

What happens if you fall in love with a woman who is not a virgin? Love certainly comes along at some weird times and in some weird places. Would you forsake your potential soul mate for the fact she is not a virgin?


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## Bushman (18 September 2009)

Boiling it down to its bare bones, the insistence on marrying a virgin seems to be an expression of a deep rooted primal urge of controlling your mate to ensure that your DNA gets passed on into the future. No penetrative sex, no chance that your perfect DNA mix could be tainted.  

Otherwise why the insistence on chastity? Is it some sort of Captain Cook-like syndrome  where being the first to penetrate virgin territory provides the man with a psychological boost? Mixing the deed with a moral and economic transaction like marriage seems to point more to the need for control. 

In my mind, if you marry later after having had some sexual experience, then this whole 'celestial virtue' charade is put to bed (pardon the pun) and it becomes an expression of a purer love.  

But that is me and in the end we are the sum total of our experiences. Respect to you Jono and good luck with it all my imaginary internet friend. The quest for your perfect mate is one of life's more fascinating journeys. It is also easier to reflect on once you have put some miles in that vehicle called life.


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## Smurf1976 (18 September 2009)

At the end of the day I could go and buy a new car right now if I wanted to. Just as I could buy new furniture, fancy clothes and all sorts of other things, sex included.

But I've never seen an example of money buying true love or even true happiness. Never. And that's even assuming it's your own money - borrowed money being even more likely to bring misery.

The older I get, the more I understand why I want a partner not a model. And why I like a normal house that I own, rather than a mansion built upon debt. And so on. Material posessions, other than those with actual utility, do little to improve happiness and wellbeing in the long run.


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## Solly (18 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> hmm... considering the fact that those construction workers ran away cowering in fear.. she must be pretty damn ugly




you maybe correct, it's the looks....that crazed wide eye demonic Linda Blair look, protruding eye teeth, laboured breathing and head like Rodney Dangerfield.

Not an uncommon look at "The Wharf" on a Friday night.


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## nunthewiser (18 September 2009)

I kissed a girl and i liked it


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## jono1887 (18 September 2009)

derty said:


> So Jono I make the assumption that you expect to marry a virgin.
> 
> What happens if you fall in love with a woman who is not a virgin? Love certainly comes along at some weird times and in some weird places. Would you forsake your potential soul mate for the fact she is not a virgin?




Well this is an incorrect assumption. I have no expressed anywhere in this forum that I expect to marry a virgin. I just expressed my personal opinions on sex before marriage. Although I would like to marry someone who is a virgin, I am not naive either... I'll just wait and see what the future will bring... :

and I don't believe in a single soul mate concept. It is quite fundamentally wrong on so many levels. If this was true... all it would take was for one person in the world to marry someone who is not their 'soul mate'. This process would result in 2 people in the world now no longer having access to their intended 'soul mates'. Now either these people dont marry anyone, but if they did, this would result in another 2 people loosing their soul mates. Hence, this process would continue from the single event of the first person not finding their intended 'soul mate' and thus creating a chain reaction preventing everyone else from finding their 'soul mates'. :


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## adobee (18 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Mate for a 29 year old, you are incredibly shallow... *there are more things to life other having a nice car and girls.*




No doubt ... fishing rocks too ..!!


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## ck13488 (19 September 2009)

Smurf1976 said:


> The older I get, the more I understand why I want a partner not a model. And why I like a normal house that I own, rather than a mansion built upon debt. And so on. Material posessions, other than those with actual utility, do little to improve happiness and wellbeing in the long run.




although im young (21) i never had a girlfriend for the sake of having one. always wanted a girl i actually enjoyed being with, wasnt keen on the constant bickering like my mates deal/put up with. been together over 6 months and not one fight, always out having fun and enjoying life. id much rather someone i can get out and have fun with than someone who wont go outside the house without hair being straightened and makeup done!!


----------



## jono1887 (19 September 2009)

ck13488 said:


> although im young (21) i never had a girlfriend for the sake of having one. always wanted a girl i actually enjoyed being with, wasnt keen on the constant bickering like my mates deal/put up with. been together over 6 months and not one fight, always out having fun and enjoying life. id much rather someone i can get out and have fun with than someone who wont go outside the house without hair being straightened and makeup done!!




you have to realise that a relationship that you go through without any fights is probably unrealistic in the long run. Although, your latter point on finding a girl thats willing to leave the house without makeup is also an important point..


----------



## Mr J (19 September 2009)

Fights can be part of a healthy relationship, and a lack of them _might_ be a problem. That said, there's not much to fight about when you're 21 and 6 months in, especially if you don't live together.


----------



## adobee (21 September 2009)

ck13488 said:


> although im young (21) i never had a girlfriend for the sake of having one. always wanted a girl i actually enjoyed being with, wasnt keen on the constant bickering like my mates deal/put up with. been together over 6 months and not one fight, always out having fun and enjoying life. id much rather someone i can get out and have fun with than someone who wont go outside the house without hair being straightened and makeup done!!




6 months is still honeymoon faze....
fights arent the best but you do want a girl with an opinion no matter what ..
tell her you are going on a bucks to vegas and see how she reacts ...
doesnt matter at 21 plenty of fish in the sea...


----------



## Solly (21 September 2009)

ck13488 said:


> although im young (21) i never had a girlfriend for the sake of having one. always wanted a girl i actually enjoyed being with, wasnt keen on the constant bickering like my mates deal/put up with. been together over 6 months and not one fight, always out having fun and enjoying life. id much rather someone i can get out and have fun with than someone who wont go outside the house without hair being straightened and makeup done!!






jono1887 said:


> you have to realise that a relationship that you go through without any fights is probably unrealistic in the long run. Although, your latter point on finding a girl thats willing to leave the house without makeup is also an important point..




A crusty hard old four striper, once took me aside when I was around your age, he taught me many things and imparted many words of wisdom.
One old truism I remember is;
"When Money Goes Out the Door, Love Flies Out the Window."


----------



## ck13488 (21 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> you have to realise that a relationship that you go through without any fights is probably unrealistic in the long run. Although, your latter point on finding a girl thats willing to leave the house without makeup is also an important point..






Mr J said:


> Fights can be part of a healthy relationship, and a lack of them _might_ be a problem. That said, there's not much to fight about when you're 21 and 6 months in, especially if you don't live together.






adobee said:


> 6 months is still honeymoon faze....
> fights arent the best but you do want a girl with an opinion no matter what ..
> tell her you are going on a bucks to vegas and see how she reacts ...
> doesnt matter at 21 plenty of fish in the sea...




i didnt mean to say that i expect us to never fight...its just that many of my friends who are 'attached' always seem to be bickering/fighting among themselves. even worse that it is over trivial little things


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## white_goodman (21 September 2009)

ck13488 said:


> although im young (21) i never had a girlfriend for the sake of having one. always wanted a girl i actually enjoyed being with, wasnt keen on the constant bickering like my mates deal/put up with. been together over 6 months and not one fight, always out having fun and enjoying life. id much rather someone i can get out and have fun with than someone who wont go outside the house without hair being straightened and makeup done!!




mate theres only one reason to have a gf at our age...
plus most of the ones I know you wouldnt bring home to the rents, something regarding cows and getting milk for free


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## Naked shorts (22 September 2009)

nunthewiser said:


> I kissed a girl and i liked it




Did you taste her cherry chapstick?


----------



## drsmith (22 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Well this is an incorrect assumption. I have no expressed anywhere in this forum that I expect to marry a virgin. I just expressed my personal opinions on sex before marriage. Although I would like to marry someone who is a virgin, I am not naive either... I'll just wait and see what the future will bring... :



No direct reference that you would only marry a virgin but you have compared sex before marriage to theft.



drsmith said:


> In relation to your personal beliefs, which of the following do you consider represents the greatest moral difference,
> 
> 1) sex between partners in a married relationship and sex between partners in an unmarried relationship or,
> 2) sex between partners in an unmarried relationship and casual sex  ?
> ...



Clearly you realise the practical implications of applying a no sex before marriage policy to potential partners so then why apply it so strictly to yourself ?

That's just taking a high moral position for the sake of it.


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## jono1887 (22 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> That's just taking a high moral position for the sake of it.




And what is wrong with this??  Don't you stand by your own values??


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## drsmith (22 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> And what is wrong with this??  Don't you stand by your own values??



It serves no useful purpose.

A far tougher question is the determination of which values are actually worth standing by.


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## Julia (22 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> And what is wrong with this??  Don't you stand by your own values??



I might be wrong, but I had the impression dr smith was suggesting your values were of a double standard in that you don't mind the future Mrs jono not being a virgin, but demand it of yourself.
Does that really sound logical to you?

(Not trying to talk you out of it, jono, your business absolutely, but just pointing out the illogical nature of your argument.)

And again, whilst not suggesting this is at all the case in your situation, occasionally a high moral stand can mask a fear of failure, in which case it would be maybe good for anyone in such a situation to have a few, um, practice rounds before that eventual wedding night.

Apologies if I'm being indelicate.


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## white_goodman (22 September 2009)

I dated this girl for a while. She was really a... nasty freak. She just loved to get down with sex all the time. It was like... anytime of day, she was like, "Yeah, let's go! I'm so nasty!" And I'd be nailing her and she'd be like, "Oh, you're nailing me! Cool!


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## adobee (22 September 2009)

white_goodman said:


> I dated this girl for a while. She was really a... nasty freak. She just loved to get down with sex all the time. It was like... anytime of day, she was like, "Yeah, let's go! I'm so nasty!" And I'd be nailing her and she'd be like, "Oh, you're nailing me! Cool!




hhhahahahah best post on the thread


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## jono1887 (22 September 2009)

white_goodman said:


> I dated this girl for a while. She was really a... nasty freak. She just loved to get down with sex all the time. It was like... anytime of day, she was like, "Yeah, let's go! I'm so nasty!" And I'd be nailing her and she'd be like, "Oh, you're nailing me! Cool!




hahha... so random


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## jono1887 (22 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> It serves no useful purpose.
> 
> A far tougher question is the determination of which values are actually worth standing by.




To you perhaps not... but I want to stand by my religious beliefs.



Julia said:


> I might be wrong, but I had the impression dr smith was suggesting your values were of a double standard in that you don't mind the future Mrs jono not being a virgin, but demand it of yourself.
> Does that really sound logical to you?
> 
> (Not trying to talk you out of it, jono, your business absolutely, but just pointing out the illogical nature of your argument.)
> ...




Perhaps I should reiterate.. I would like to find a girl who is a virgin, however what my previous comment stated was that I would not reject a 'soul mate' if thats what you want to call it just because she's had sex in the past. Now, with that being said.. I would also only consider marrying someone with the same religious beliefs as me. Hence, they may have had sex in the past, but have converted and have since abstained...


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## Naked shorts (22 September 2009)

white_goodman said:


> I dated this girl for a while. She was really a... nasty freak. She just loved to get down with sex all the time. It was like... anytime of day, she was like, "Yeah, let's go! I'm so nasty!" And I'd be nailing her and she'd be like, "Oh, you're nailing me! Cool!




I'm going to create a hall of fame for posts one day. This will be in it.


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## insider (22 September 2009)

Solly said:


> *Meet the man so shy he's never even kissed a woman*
> 
> _I wonder what his ASF member name is ?_
> 
> http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/4626075.Meet_the_man_so_shy_he_s_never_even_kissed_a_woman/




Maybe he's gay... Just a thought...

Goodness sake, what's this guy's problem?
too shy to kiss a girl and yet he's appears in the Argus?

I'm sure there must be a nice blind lady out there who wont know hes a ginger


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## overit (22 September 2009)

Naked shorts said:


> I'm going to create a hall of fame for posts one day. This will be in it.




Yeah cant wait for the video to come out either! :


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## AlterEgo (23 September 2009)

overit said:


> Yeah cant wait for the video to come out either! :




In case you don't realise, it's actually a quote from the "40 Year Old Virgin" movie - absolutely hilarious movie!

Jono - I think people on here are being a bit hard on you. Good on you for sticking by your morals and not succumbing to peer pressure. But please don't turn in to the main character of that movie though! lol


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## JTLP (23 September 2009)

Adobee - 3 Votes
Whitegoodman - 2 Votes
Julia - 1 vote

Jono I pose a question...i'm sure when people first get a girlfriend they aren't imposing a time constraint on them and expiring them after x amount of years. Why would you date somebody if you didn't think it had some chance? And what if your 'soul mate' decided that you were not her 'soul mate'...you're chance of being Cinderalla is over!

No offense, but I don't respect religion. The Church is such an overbearing, hypocritical institution that would brainwash you in any way possible just to get a few extra dollars out of you. And before you throw a tanty I have been baptised and broken bread with the big man (so to speak). 

By all means good on you for having beliefs and values...but be careful not to go through life wondering. Sexual experimentation can be an amazing thing when you are young, and unfortunately for yourself sexual intimacy is held in quite high esteem in relationships...so you better bring your A Game first time round.

Also, what happens if you are 'hung like a horse' and she is as 'tight as a fishes bottom'...this won't work.

And finally...i'd hate for your big day to arrive and something like this to happen:


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## Mr J (23 September 2009)

AlterEgo said:


> Good on you for sticking by your morals and not succumbing to peer pressure.




What a ridiculous suggestion. He's 18, not 13, so it's a matter of natural instinct, not peer pressure. He's denying his own existence, not holding the high ground.


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## Agentm (23 September 2009)

jono

having a belief in the ideal of virginity is not such a bad thing imho,

i have a good friend of mine who has cervical cancer, diagnosed last week, pretty advanced, so her current prognosis is dire but with treatment there are survivors.. 

my sister had it last year, and i know a few more who have had it..

wanting a women who is not infected with a sexually transmitted virus prior to engaging in a relationship is one way of reducing the chances of both you not being a carrier and her not being infected, as long as you both remain a virgins prior to marriage and follow the steps your religion asks.. 

its a safe passage 

the only cause of the cervical cancer is the Human Papilloma Virus, or HPV, and your ideals imho avoids the possibility of experiencing the severe repercussions later that this virus causes, and is more than worthy of a passing thought.

as much as having as many sexual partners is the best thing out there atm, and as much as the liberated sexual lifestyles of the current generations is absolutely fantastic, who, besides you, is going to stand against the massive ground swell of current liberated ideals on sexuality? 

there are consequences. and women cop it big time, as cervical cancer is now the second most prevelant cancer in women world wide (australia has better figures btw) its obvious spread easy, and its a virus which is carried by men, and is not a concern to them atm either, and women are being thinned out big time by this nasty little piece of work..

we all want to be on board the sexual revolution, and not miss the party.. but for women imho the more partners they expose themselves to in their quest to find that perfect man is also a journey likely to nail them later..

newtons law, for every action there is a........


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## AlterEgo (23 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> What a ridiculous suggestion. He's 18, not 13, so it's a matter of natural instinct, not peer pressure. He's denying his own existence, not holding the high ground.




I’m not saying that I agree with Jono. But people are entitled to make up their own minds as to how they wish to spend their lives. You guys seem to be trying to talk him in to doing something that he wouldn’t be comfortable in doing. However, I do hope that this is his own decision, and that he’s not abstaining just because his church may tell him to (ie. peer pressure from the church).


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## drsmith (23 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> jono
> 
> having a belief in the ideal of virginity is not such a bad thing imho,
> 
> ...



You have my deepest sympathies in relation to those close to you who have cervical cancer but the above argument against sex before marriage is just another variation of fire and brimstone.

For the prevention of SID's there are condoms, not that these should be necessary in any relationship where there is sufficient trust between the partners.


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## drsmith (23 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Perhaps I should reiterate.. I would like to find a girl who is a virgin, however what my previous comment stated was that I would not reject a 'soul mate' if thats what you want to call it just because she's had sex in the past. Now, with that being said.. *I would also only consider marrying someone with the same religious beliefs as me.* Hence, they may have had sex in the past, but have converted and have since abstained...



With regard to the comment in bold, is this a requirement you have placed upon yourself (like abstinence from kissing) or a requirement of your religion ?


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## Mr J (23 September 2009)

AlterEgo said:


> I’m not saying that I agree with Jono. But people are entitled to make up their own minds as to how they wish to spend their lives. *You guys seem to be trying to talk him in to doing something that he wouldn’t be comfortable in doing*. However, I do hope that this is his own decision, and that he’s not abstaining just because his church may tell him to (ie. peer pressure from the church).




Like having sex? It's a shame he wouldn't be comfortable with it, as by that age it should be natural. Of course it is his choice, but some people here are suggesting that abstaining suggests he has high morals etc. This is not true at all. Morals are an artificial construction, while sex is a completely natural act, and a very important one at that.

I do think he should have sex, not to pressure him into it because most people are having it, but because it's a natural act by this age. He can't judge it because he has never had it, and his view may change completely after he does. Waiting could end up being his greatest regret in life. It also means that he will lack sexual experience which may cause problems in relationships in the future.


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## lukeaye (23 September 2009)

The idea of viriginity is a religious value, I wonder why religion is so backward thinking, maybe becuase it was written over 2000 years ago?

I believe in god and the rest of it, but im sorry there have been more wars and more trouble caused over religion then anything else.

So to the arguement of should you have sex before marriage?

i say open your legs my dear, im comming in.

After all we are animals, and the animal insticnt is to appropriate. You look at all other animals that have sex for pleasure, and they do it like mad, dolphins, chimpanzeses etc.

There was a famous test done a while ago with a lab rat. an electrode was put into his head that would trigger his pleasure sensory. The way the rat could trigger these impulses was pressing down on a bar in his cage. the rat ignored all other impulses, the need for excercise, food and water, until the rat died, of pleasure!

Obiovusly this rat was unaware of religious values. I respect anyone with the restraint to hold off for sex before marriage. i do not judge you. But why do it? im having the time of my life, are you?


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## Agentm (23 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> You have my deepest sympathies in relation to those close to you who have cervical cancer but the above argument against sex before marriage is just another variation of fire and brimstone.
> 
> For the prevention of SID's there are condoms, not that these should be necessary in any relationship where there is sufficient trust between the partners.




lol

cervical cancer would be eliminated if people did, but its not the case and this little std is around because men dont..  you just dont know if you have it unless some symptoms show, but it often doesnt..

naivety over std's doesnt mean you wont be the potential carrier, you or your partner can get the disease and it sure doesnt mean your indescertions in your  younger years wont kill your present wife cold..  its a virus that can lay dormant on men for years..

imho to give over to desire as the only way to behave is the reason why women are being infected by their partners.. you can have a great sex life without multiple partners and also in the case of jono you can wait for a partner with shared values and be more satisfied than anyone that your not carrying nasty std's nor her

if all men wore condoms and took responsibility toward their own health and the future health of other partners then we would be in a safer world.. buts sadly thats not the case..  cervical cancer remains the second most prevalent cancer in women


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## Mr J (23 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> if all men wore condoms and took responsibility toward their own health and the future health of other partners then we would be in a safer world..




Takes two to tango. When a man doesn't wear a condom, I'm quite sure the woman is aware of the fact.


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## drsmith (23 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> imho to give over to desire as the only way to behave is the reason why women are being infected by their partners.. you can have a great sex life without multiple partners and also in the case of jono you can wait for a partner with shared values and be more satisfied than anyone that your not carrying nasty std's nor her



Everything we do in life carries an element of risk. The best we can do is manage that risk and weigh it up against the potential reward.

In this context managing cervical cancer by prohibiting sex before marriage seems somewhat extreme.


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## JTLP (23 September 2009)

lukeaye said:


> i say open your legs my dear, im comming in.




You know Jono is a boy right


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## jono1887 (24 September 2009)

JTLP said:


> You know Jono is a boy right




hmm... was getting worried after reading that post :


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## jono1887 (24 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> With regard to the comment in bold, is this a requirement you have placed upon yourself (like abstinence from kissing) or a requirement of your religion ?




I'm not abstaining from kissing... i was just noting that I had not kissed a girl.. see post 2. What I am abstaining from is sex.

The thing in bold is not a religious requirement... its just I would find it difficult to relate to someone if we dont have the same religious values...



JTLP said:


> Jono I pose a question...i'm sure when people first get a girlfriend they aren't imposing a time constraint on them and expiring them after x amount of years. Why would you date somebody if you didn't think it had some chance? And what if your 'soul mate' decided that you were not her 'soul mate'...you're chance of being Cinderalla is over!
> 
> No offense, but I don't respect religion. The Church is such an overbearing, hypocritical institution that would brainwash you in any way possible just to get a few extra dollars out of you. And before you throw a tanty I have been baptised and broken bread with the big man (so to speak).
> 
> Also, what happens if you are 'hung like a horse' and she is as 'tight as a fishes bottom'...this won't work.




considering the female anatomy is designed to push out a baby... i doubt that they are as 'tight as a fishes bottom' 

also as i had said in a previous post.. i stated the illogicalities behind 'soul mates' and hence i dont believe that there is a single 'soul mate' for each individual in the world...

and please elaborate on how teh church is a hypocritical institution??



lukeaye said:


> The idea of viriginity is a religious value, I wonder why religion is so backward thinking, maybe becuase it was written over 2000 years ago?
> 
> I believe in god and the rest of it, but im sorry there have been more wars and more trouble caused over religion then anything else.
> 
> After all we are animals, and the animal insticnt is to appropriate. You look at all other animals that have sex for pleasure, and they do it like mad, dolphins, chimpanzeses etc.




I dont see why sexual freedom is such a forwards thinking idea... adultry was rampant 4000 years ago just as it is now... no difference. 

Religions may have been the cause of many wars.. but so has oil, gold and communism. What relevance does this have on the topic??

No, we are not animals. Clearly our oposable thumbs, ability to record history, develop technology and adapt our environments to our needs as opposed to adapting to our environments sets us apart from other species. Just because the pig down at the farm is wallowing in filth - are you going to join in?


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## Agentm (24 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> Everything we do in life carries an element of risk. The best we can do is manage that risk and weigh it up against the potential reward.
> 
> In this context managing cervical cancer by prohibiting sex before marriage seems somewhat extreme.




lol

keep on dreaming dr smith.. the problems from multiple partners and unprotected sex is killing men and women. no one is prohibiting anything, and never did i say that, your just taking things out of context.. why not stay on the subject of what causes std's??  your just ignoring the facts here and saying the reason for the problem is not std's..  std's cause all sorts of health issues, just because it feels great for men and women to be part of the sexual revolution doesnt mean that you can ignore the cause of these infections, which are spreading, and not decreasing. they are directly related to the behavior itself..



it one of those sleepers, screw round and brag, but unfortunately there is a strong case for abstinence, and to join jono and his beliefs, which i commend,  would at least save him and others from risk..  

STD increases prostate cancer risk

Infection with a common sexually transmitted parasite places men at greater risk of developing the most aggressive and deadly form of prostate cancer.

While cases infected with the parasite known as Trichomonas vaginalis are easily treated, *some 50 to 75 percent of men with trichomoniasis never develop any symptoms and, therefore, remain unidentified*.

*According to a study published in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute, men infected with the parasite are more likely to develop prostate cancer later in life.*

*Furthermore, these men are 2.7 times as likely to die of the disease once they have developed prostate cancer.*

Scientists concluded that STD infection makes prostate cancers more aggressive and more likely to progress.

"*If we can find out how to prevent prostate cancer, and in particular prevent an aggressive form or lethal form of this disease, it will be an important development for reducing the mortality rate for men,*" said lead researcher Lorelei Mucci. 



they should endorse jono's example, and that would go a long way to eliminating the parasite

imho jono has every right to follow his ideals and should not be criticised in any way for them... keep fighting for it jono!!

the bible itself is always a book of rules and morals that people dont like to endorse, but perhaps some of the rules have credibility?


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I dont see why sexual freedom is such a forwards thinking idea... adultry was rampant 4000 years ago just as it is now... no difference.
> 
> Religions may have been the cause of many wars.. but so has oil, gold and communism. What relevance does this have on the topic??
> 
> No, we are not animals. Clearly our oposable thumbs, ability to record history, develop technology and adapt our environments to our needs as opposed to adapting to our environments sets us apart from other species. Just because the pig down at the farm is wallowing in filth - are you going to join in?




The relevance Jono, is that your values are based on religion, im questioning religion. look at muslims extremists declaring jihad they also have core beleifs, i wont roll in mud, but will you blow yourself and innocent others up as well?

Well jono if god didnt want us to have sex, why did he make it so pleasureable? if he didnt want us to have sex before marriage, why do we lust? if the act of fornication or pleasure is so forbidden, then you shouldnt be allowed to masturbate either. Isnt that a mroe sinful act?

I understand wars have been started over those things as well, but look through history the largest and most devastating wars have been started by religion. wars rage in the middle east still of a holy nature. I bet god is sick at what is being done in his name. Im merely stating that churchs and religions lost their way long ago. that we do not interpret in the way that god wanted.

So if i want to enjoy myself with some DD blonde on the weekend, i for one don't think im going to hell. I'm not hurting anyone, im not killing anyone, im not upseting anyone, if anything we are brining each other closer to god!

And i dont think you should base your beliefs and values on what some corrupt preacher tells you. dont even get me started on what holy preachers have done in "gods" name.

And Jono if you dont think we evolved from animals, how do you think we got here? dont be so naive.
As i stated before i believe in god, i believe in the after life, but i dont believe in religion. why would i believe in something that has killed more then cancer, and aids combined.


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

Jono, what im basically trying to say is, dont think that because you held off having sex before marriage, you winning pionts with god. If you want to do that then power to you.

But god knows, i dont have that restraint.


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## drsmith (24 September 2009)

Agentm said:


> lol
> 
> keep on dreaming dr smith.. the problems from multiple partners and unprotected sex is killing men and women. no one is prohibiting anything, and never did i say that, your just taking things out of context.. why not stay on the subject of what causes std's??  your just ignoring the facts here and saying the reason for the problem is not std's..  std's cause all sorts of health issues, just because it feels great for men and women to be part of the sexual revolution doesnt mean that you can ignore the cause of these infections, which are spreading, and not decreasing. they are directly related to the behavior itself..
> 
> ...



Jono's example is no sex before marriage so the comment to which you refer is hardly out of context.

That being said perhaps you can clarify the maximum number of sexual partners you feel we should have during the course of our lives ?


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## drsmith (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I'm not abstaining from kissing... i was just noting that I had not kissed a girl.. see post 2. What I am abstaining from is sex.



And post 33 clarified why although you did indicate some backing away from that stance in post 56 which is a good thing.



jono1887 said:


> The thing in bold is not a religious requirement... its just I would find it difficult to relate to someone if we dont have the same religious values...



If you don't mind being asked, what specific religion are we talking about here ?



jono1887 said:


> I dont see why sexual freedom is such a forwards thinking idea... adultry was rampant 4000 years ago just as it is now... no difference.



Sex before marriage in itself is not adultery.



jono1887 said:


> No, we are not animals. Clearly our oposable thumbs, ability to record history, develop technology and adapt our environments to our needs as opposed to adapting to our environments sets us apart from other species. Just because the pig down at the farm is wallowing in filth - are you going to join in?



While the above response was not in the specific context of sex before marriage, do you regard all sex before marriage as wallowing in filth ?


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## Julia (24 September 2009)

With apologies for being a bit off topic, Jono you're studying to be a doctor.
Have you decided what field of medicine will claim your interest?

Just wondering what you'd do if you were a GP or a gynaecologist and a young single woman came to you for sexual advice, contraception, or termination?

Would your personal religious beliefs preclude your making available to her the information or services she's seeking?

If not, how would you handle her consultation?

And if so, likewise how would you handle her consultation?


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## JTLP (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> and please elaborate on how teh church is a hypocritical institution??






Julia said:


> With apologies for being a bit off topic, Jono you're studying to be a doctor.
> Have you decided what field of medicine will claim your interest?
> 
> Just wondering what you'd do if you were a GP or a gynaecologist and a young single woman came to you for sexual advice, contraception, or termination?
> ...




Great post Julia.

Jono...the hypocrisy of the church would ruin this topic that is about you...so I will not get into it here. But perhaps brush up on some history and read about some wars...then you'll get my drift (and that's barely scratching the surface).


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## white_goodman (24 September 2009)

I think the problem is that he's putting the pussy on a pedestal


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## Kowabunga (24 September 2009)

Hey is it true that if you don't use it you lose it?


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

white_goodman said:


> I think the problem is that he's putting the pussy on a pedestal




Amen, how many times do you have to tell people that. funniest movie haha



Kowabunga said:


> Hey is it true that if you don't use it you lose it?




yeah well in his case he will lose his mind.

What happens when you religious values get in the way of stem cells, or organ transplant.

Jono what if your "soul mate" is an absolute sex machine and she wants to get down and dirty 5 times a day 7 days a week.


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## white_goodman (24 September 2009)

You know how I know you're gay? You have a rainbow bumper sticker on your car that says, "I like it when balls are in my face."


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## Mr J (24 September 2009)

lukeaye said:


> Jono what if your "soul mate" is an absolute sex machine and she wants to get down and dirty 5 times a day 7 days a week.




Sexual incompatibility. But hey, maybe he'll be down for it to make up for what he's missed.


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## jono1887 (24 September 2009)

Julia said:


> With apologies for being a bit off topic, Jono you're studying to be a doctor.
> Have you decided what field of medicine will claim your interest?
> 
> Just wondering what you'd do if you were a GP or a gynaecologist and a young single woman came to you for sexual advice, contraception, or termination?
> ...




I am probably going to go into surgery... probably in cardiothorasic or neuro... However, if I were a GP or gyno.. it is the role of the doctor to be objective in the treatments that they provide and to not impose any of their personal beliefs. As I have stated earlier... these are my personal views and I have no intention of converting anyone here on this forum. This would also be the case if I was a doctor. I would handle the consultation objectively... 

Last time I checked.. doctors didnt give sexual advice, im sure thats for therapist. But as for the latter 2 - sexual contraception or termination I have no objections towards either. People may argue that they are killing life or what not but as stated in the bible.. every life is planned. If the child is being terminated, it was God's intention in the first place. But as for advice.. i would say what is medically appropriate and nothing else.


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## jono1887 (24 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> If you don't mind being asked, what specific religion are we talking about here ??




Christianity 



lukeaye said:


> The relevance Jono, is that your values are based on religion, im questioning religion. look at muslims extremists declaring jihad they also have core beleifs, i wont roll in mud, but will you blow yourself and innocent others up as well?.




Im not muslim.. doesn't apply.



> Well jono if god didnt want us to have sex, why did he make it so pleasureable? if he didnt want us to have sex before marriage, why do we lust? if the act of fornication or pleasure is so forbidden, then you shouldnt be allowed to masturbate either. Isnt that a mroe sinful act?




I never said that he didnt want us to have sex. He doesnt want us to have sex outside of marriage. The act of pleasure is not forbidden. 

Why shouldnt you be allowed to masturbate? how is that even relevant? 

Why you lust? i cant answer that... i guessing something to do with various chemicals in your head making you desire something...get back to me in 6 years and ill explain how the human brain works..



> So if i want to enjoy myself with some DD blonde on the weekend, i for one don't think im going to hell. I'm not hurting anyone, im not killing anyone, im not upseting anyone, if anything we are brining each other closer to god!



how the heck is that going to bring you closer to god?



> And i dont think you should base your beliefs and values on what some corrupt preacher tells you. dont even get me started on what holy preachers have done in "gods" name.
> 
> And Jono if you dont think we evolved from animals, how do you think we got here? dont be so naive.
> As i stated before i believe in god, i believe in the after life, but i dont believe in religion. why would i believe in something that has killed more then cancer, and aids combine




Why should i listen to you over a preacher... and what makes you think they are all corrupt?

Not everyone believes in the theory of evolution. Besides its only a theory.
If you choose to place your self at the same level as one, than that is your choice..

How has God/religion killed more than cancer and aids combined? And what records are you basing this on? As far as i know.. there are no records for the deaths from religious wars or cancer/aid (which was not diagnosed within the last century)?


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

> So if i want to enjoy myself with some DD blonde on the weekend, i for one don't think im going to hell. I'm not hurting anyone, im not killing anyone, im not upseting anyone, if anything we are brining each other closer to god!






jono1887 said:


> how the heck is that going to bring you closer to god?




My point exactly jono. im afraid your are years off knowing.

the funny thing is. once you are married and have sex, you will be the one realising what you have been missing, and so you will be the one committing adultery. funny how the world works.


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## Mr J (24 September 2009)

Jono, if God is everywhere and sees everything, does that mean he watches us have sex?

Lukeaye, your original response gave me a good laugh .



> the funny thing is. once you are married and have sex, you will be the one realising what you have been missing




Jono, have you considered that there's a good chance you will regret your decision?


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

as long as somebody is laughing with me haha


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## JTLP (24 September 2009)

lukeaye said:


> My point exactly jono. im afraid your are years off knowing.
> 
> the funny thing is. once you are married and have sex, you will be the one realising what you have been missing, and so you will be the one committing adultery. funny how the world works.




Perhaps it is a case of ignorance is bliss though. By Jono not having sex now...it means nothing to him. He can't appreciate it (not a shot at you Jono) therefore he can't comprehend what he's been missing.

Remember to be respecting his decision here and not making fun of him...he has been kind enough to share his life and opinions on the topic.


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## jono1887 (24 September 2009)

Mr J said:


> Jono, if God is everywhere and sees everything, does that mean he watches us have sex?
> 
> Lukeaye, your original response gave me a good laugh .
> 
> ...




whats a mere 25-30 years abstaining to eternity in hell... :

*this is a joke... dont take it too seriously

I think most of you are forgetting im only 18... its not like ive wasted away my life.. there will be many years of great sex once im married.


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## lukeaye (24 September 2009)

jono, i have had sex with my fair share of women, and i can tell you, not all of them have been great, you may end up with one that isnt great, or isnt into it. what then? you cant divorce or you will go to hell, you cant comitt adultery you will go to hell, your ****ed. you suffer an eternity with your hand and the interent, a constant reminder of what you could have had, but never got.


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## Mr J (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> whats a mere 25-30 years abstaining to eternity in hell... :
> 
> *this is a joke... dont take it too seriously
> 
> I think most of you are forgetting im only 18... its not like ive wasted away my life.. there will be many years of great sex once im married.




I don't know Jono, Satan doesn't seem all that bad to me :.

18, and then 23, and then 28 and so on. What if you never meet a girl you want to marry, and who wants to marry you?



			
				lukeaye said:
			
		

> jono, i have had sex with my fair share of women, and i can tell you, not all of them have been great, you may end up with one that isnt great, or isnt into it




For someone who hasn't had any other experience and has held out for so long, I'm sure a girl as exciting as a plank of wood would give him a good time. Sorry Jono .


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## drsmith (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I think most of you are forgetting im only 18... its not like ive wasted away my life.. there will be many years of great sex once im married.



Of course, that's the plan.

The trouble is that life rarely goes according to plan. It's about taking opportunities as they present themselves as there is only a finite number of these between where you are now and the grave. What's worse is that we have no idea what will happen tomorrow. You could be waiting and then "clunk" you are hit by a bus or similar at the age of 25.

What happens when we do turn our toes up. There is no evidence to suggest that our spirit or soul goes on in some form nor is there a god or gods in the form described in the various religious manuscripts written by people. It's hard to accpet that the lights just go out at the end of your life but until I see actual evidence otherwise that's what I believe. If not well that's a bonus.

That's not to say there is not life beyond our own planet superior to our own or even in a form we cannot comprehend but religion is a human invention. It does nothing more than provide a set of rules from which a group can live together. In that context it is just a another hierarchical structure. It's downfall is that all the burden of accountability is on the followers and there is none on the leaders.


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## Solly (24 September 2009)

Yikees, jono maybe right.

THE average British man or woman has slept with 2.8 million people - albeit indirectly, according to figures released to promote awareness of sexual health.

"It's important that people understand how exposed they are to STIs..."

http://www.news.com.au/perthnow/story/0,,26118921-5005369,00.html


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## Julia (24 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I am probably going to go into surgery... probably in cardiothorasic or neuro... However, if I were a GP or gyno.. it is the role of the doctor to be objective in the treatments that they provide and to not impose any of their personal beliefs. As I have stated earlier... these are my personal views and I have no intention of converting anyone here on this forum. This would also be the case if I was a doctor. I would handle the consultation objectively...
> 
> Last time I checked.. doctors didnt give sexual advice, im sure thats for therapist. But as for the latter 2 - sexual contraception or termination I have no objections towards either. People may argue that they are killing life or what not but as stated in the bible.. every life is planned. If the child is being terminated, it was God's intention in the first place. But as for advice.. i would say what is medically appropriate and nothing else.



OK, reassuring answer, thank you, jono.  I think your sort of preciseness would see you fit in well with some form of surgery as a career.




JTLP said:


> Remember to be respecting his decision here and not making fun of him...he has been kind enough to share his life and opinions on the topic.



Yes, very good point.   
jono, although I don't agree with your position, it's none of my business.
I do, however, admire your willingness to defend it honestly and to be prepared to in continuing politeness go on answering all the challenges and questions put to you.  Good for you on that score.


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## Solly (26 September 2009)

jono, these are the evil ones to avoid. 

Just posting here as an information brief.



> Researchers, who surveyed 3000 women aged 18-50, found on average they slept with eight men, but were drunk with at least five, and on two occasions couldn't remember the man's name the next day...




It's from the Herald Sun so it has to be true:

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,26117724-36398,00.html


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## jono1887 (26 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono, these are the evil ones to avoid.
> 
> Just posting here as an information brief.
> 
> ...




Hahah.. yea, would be good they came with a label : jks.. but from the Herald Sun, such a great source


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## windy (28 September 2009)

Solly, good article, thanks for posting it. Last night on ch 7's "Sunday" program, there was an segment on Generation Y's binge drinking habits. I found it deplorable and sad, that society is going to lose a generation to becoming juvenile delinquents.  
In these days, it is not surprising to find such open opposition to Christian living. Jono,Your way of living may be a rebuke to their manner of life, and if it is, by all means remain faithful. Your critics are probably testing you to see if you have the strength to hold out. God has given you an opportunity to put your faith to the acid test. Be faithful, and you will be rewarded. 
Nothing destroys a marriage quicker than comparing previous sexual conquests.


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## Mr J (28 September 2009)

> Last night on ch 7's "Sunday" program, there was an segment on Generation Y's binge drinking habits. I found it deplorable and sad, that society is going to lose a generation to becoming juvenile delinquents.




Yes, we're going to take society down with us. Fear your old age .


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## drsmith (28 September 2009)

windy said:


> Solly, good article, thanks for posting it. Last night on ch 7's "Sunday" program, there was an segment on Generation Y's binge drinking habits. I found it deplorable and sad, that society is going to lose a generation to becoming juvenile delinquents.
> In these days, it is not surprising to find such open opposition to Christian living. Jono,Your way of living may be a rebuke to their manner of life, and if it is, by all means remain faithful. Your critics are probably testing you to see if you have the strength to hold out. God has given you an opportunity to put your faith to the acid test. Be faithful, and you will be rewarded.
> Nothing destroys a marriage quicker than comparing previous sexual conquests.



My position on this has nothing to do with seeing if Jono or anyone else for that matter has the strength to hold out.

There are many aspects of Christian living that provide a sound foundation for successful group society but harsh restrictions on our most basic instinct is not one of them. This has more to do with enhancing the power or religious leaders over the followers.


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## jono1887 (28 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> My position on this has nothing to do with seeing if Jono or anyone else for that matter has the strength to hold out.
> 
> There are many aspects of Christian living that provide a sound foundation for successful group society but harsh restrictions on our most basic instinct is not one of them. This has more to do with enhancing the power or religious leaders over the followers.




It is not difficult to resist temptation.. it not a complete restriction on this 'basic instinct', its just that you have to be married to do it..

I still do not see how this gives power to the religious leaders..



windy said:


> Nothing destroys a marriage quicker than comparing previous sexual conquests.




Well with no previous conquests... anything is good : won't have any complaints..


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## drsmith (29 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> It is not difficult to resist temptation.. it not a complete restriction on this 'basic instinct', its just that you have to be married to do it..



I didn't say complete restriction. This would be counter productive for any religion in any case.



jono1887 said:


> I still do not see how this gives power to the religious leaders..



They are dictating and you are abiding by their terms on the only physical act that can lead to human reproduction. For presevation of the species that is our most important function. This demonstrates a lot of power over an individual even though it may not be obvious to that individual.

Once married are you free under your religion to use contraceptives to manage the number of children you have or is this to be managed by abstinence when you don't want children ?



jono1887 said:


> Well with no previous conquests... anything is good : won't have any complaints..



Sex before marriage is not necessarily about conquests.


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## jono1887 (29 September 2009)

drsmith said:


> Once married are you free under your religion to use contraceptives to manage the number of children you have or is this to be managed by abstinence when you don't want children ?




there's nothing in the bible about contraception.. i have no idea why the catholics are so against it.. i have no problems with it... no need for abstinence


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## Solly (29 September 2009)

jono1887 said:


> there's nothing in the bible about contraception.. i have no idea why the catholics are so against it.. i have no problems with it... no need for abstinence




jono, I asked a believer mate of mine about this and he sent me this verse;

"He [Onan] when he went into his [deceased] brother's
wife, spilled his seed upon the ground, lest children should be born in his brother's name. And therefore the Lord slew
him, because he did a detestable thing" Genesis 38:8-10.

Not sure if it's relevant. 
I suppose you just gotta make sure you don't spill your seeds.


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## Tink (29 September 2009)

Geez Jono, they still hen pecking lol 



windy said:


> In these days, it is not surprising to find such open opposition to Christian living. Jono,Your way of living may be a rebuke to their manner of life, and if it is, by all means remain faithful





well said windy


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## jono1887 (29 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono, I asked a believer mate of mine about this and he sent me this verse;
> 
> "He [Onan] when he went into his [deceased] brother's
> wife, spilled his seed upon the ground, lest children should be born in his brother's name. And therefore the Lord slew
> ...




Copied and pasted... but this is my interpretation of the verse..
Genesis 38:6-9 -- The sin of Onan:

This passage describes how Tamar's first husband Er was killed by God because he was wicked. Under ancient Jewish tradition, Er's brother Onan was required to marry and engage in sexual intercourse with Tamar. Widows were not asked whether they wanted to remarry. In many cases, the woman would have experienced the sexual activity as a form of rape -- something required by tribal tradition which they had to endure. Similarly, nobody consulted the widow's brother-in-law about his wishes in the matter.

Their first son would be attributed to Er. Because any offspring would not be considered his child, Onan decided to use a common and relatively ineffective contraceptive technique to prevent conception. He employed "coitus interruptus". That is, he disengaged from Tamar just before he ejaculated, and "spilled his semen on the ground." (NIV) God was displeased at this action and killed Onan also -- presumably because he refused to follow Jewish tradition.

This passage was used until recent decades by some Christian groups who maintained that Onan's sin was actually masturbation. The term "Onanism" was coined as a synonym of masturbation. This interpretation is no longer in common use.

---------------

essentially, Onan had to sleep with his brother's wife and the child would have the rights to his brother's estate. Onan did not want this happen and wanted to have his brothers estate. So he had sex with his brothers' widow but made sure she didnt get pregnant. This is what got him killed not the spilling of seed or masturbation ...



Tink said:


> Geez Jono, they still hen pecking lol
> 
> well said windy




yea, seems like they are...


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## Solly (29 September 2009)

jono thanks for your reply, this is very similar to my mates interpretation.

I share more of a Richards Dawkins outlook on things but have some good mates who share a similar view to you. These different views make life interesting, stimulating and invigorating.


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## jono1887 (30 September 2009)

Solly said:


> jono thanks for your reply, this is very similar to my mates interpretation.
> 
> I share more of a Richards Dawkins outlook on things but have some good mates who share a similar view to you. These different views make life interesting, stimulating and invigorating.




Very true, its the differences in the world that make life interesting..


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## Sir Osisofliver (1 October 2009)

Wait so you're studying to be a doctor and you said



jono1887 said:


> *considering the female anatomy is designed to push out a baby... i doubt that they are as 'tight as a fishes bottom' *




This was in response to someone making comments about sexual incompatibility IE you're hung like a horse and she's as tight as a fishes bottom.

Of course the above statement is an overgeneralization in both directions..

Unless you are very unlucky you are not hung like a horse. If you ARE hung like a horse I suggest the number of potential partners you could draw you future wife from has now been drastically reduced.  

As for the female anatomy being designed to push out a baby...I invite you to ask any female you wish if they think they could fit your entire forearm where the babies come from. Of course women push out babies, but remarkably only at very specific times of their life and things that were stretched...tighten up.

My first girlfriend and I had a bit of a problem with our equipment not being standard gauge fittings..trust me...the relationship did not last.

Cheers

Sir O


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## Mr J (1 October 2009)

Sir Osisofliver said:


> My first girlfriend and I had a bit of a problem with our equipment not being standard gauge fittings..trust me...the relationship did not last.




Good comment. I feel anyone who is waiting until marriage is greatly underestimating the importance of sexual compatibility. Not just compatitable parts either, but similar drives and tastes. I hope it works out for you Jono, but you're not stacking the probabilities in your favour.


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## overit (1 October 2009)

Mr J said:


> Good comment. I feel anyone who is waiting until marriage is greatly underestimating the importance of sexual compatibility. Not just compatitable parts either, but similar drives and tastes. I hope it works out for you Jono, but you're not stacking the probabilities in your favour.




Exactly. You might wait 2years or whatever then get married to a girl who is into chains and whips and all kinds of freaky stuff! Good luck if your into that kinda thing but you might also run a mile. You can never judge them. Some sweet and innocent looking freaky girls out there. I have some of there videos if you want proof. :

Of the few religo's that I know who held off having sex until they got married, most ended up getting married after a few months of their first date. I guess they didnt want to break their rules so had to move things along a bit quicker. The whole lot of it is over-rated if you ask me.


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## jono1887 (1 October 2009)

Mr J said:


> Good comment. I feel anyone who is waiting until marriage is greatly underestimating the importance of sexual compatibility. Not just compatitable parts either, but similar drives and tastes. I hope it works out for you Jono, but you're not stacking the probabilities in your favour.




I don't think  I've underestimated the importance.. its just not the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not.


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## jono1887 (1 October 2009)

overit said:


> Exactly. You might wait 2years or whatever then get married to a girl who is into chains and whips and all kinds of freaky stuff! Good luck if your into that kinda thing but you might also run a mile. You can never judge them. Some sweet and innocent looking freaky girls out there. I have some of there videos if you want proof. :
> 
> Of the few religo's that I know who held off having sex until they got married, most ended up getting married after a few months of their first date. I guess they didnt want to break their rules so had to move things along a bit quicker. The whole lot of it is over-rated if you ask me.




Hmm... I think discussing the matter before hand could solve this chains and whips problem quite simply.



> There's no reason we need to be shackled by the strictures of the employee-employer relationship. Unless you're into that sort of thing. In which case, I got some shackles in the back. I'm just kidding. But seriously, I've got 'em.



:


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## Julia (2 October 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I don't think  I've underestimated the importance.. its just not the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not.



Well, I'd disagree there.  If you're not sexually compatible (and don't think for a millisecond such a thing is impossible) the rest of your relationship will be affected also.


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## Mr J (2 October 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I don't think  I've underestimated the importance.. its just not the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not.




How would you know it's not the main factor unless you have been in a sexual relationship? I'm not suggesting it is the main factor (it is certainly one of them for most people), but many couples break up over this. Not so many marriages, because these days we generally know our partner's tastes and drive by that point, but you won't have that information. You haven't had sex, so you don't realise just how incompatible a couple can be. As Julia says, this will effect your entire relationship.


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## Sir Osisofliver (2 October 2009)

jono1887 said:


> I don't think  I've underestimated the importance.. its just not the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not.




Similar to Julia I'm going to respectfully disagree here Jono, but I would also like to enquire as to what you define as the main factors in determining if the relationship will succeed or not.

We know one of them is that you share the same religious beliefs and I agree that this is an important factor in determining if your relationship will succeed. 

You may be surprised however that womens brains work quite differently to men's and those factors that you deem important may or may not be part of their decision making process.

Cheers

Sir O


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## drsmith (5 October 2009)

overit said:


> Exactly. You might wait 2years or whatever then get married to a girl who is into chains and whips and all kinds of freaky stuff! Good luck if your into that kinda thing but you might also run a mile. You can never judge them. Some sweet and innocent looking freaky girls out there. I have some of there videos if you want proof. :



By now your PM inbox must be full of requests.

One would not want to be stuck with a girl from the OWK.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Other_World_Kingdom


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## kgee (5 October 2009)

Hey but if you do get lucky can you give me her sisters phone number:


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## windy (7 October 2009)

I totally agree with Jono, sex is NOT the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not, and those who think that if you're not sexually compatible, then the rest of your relationship will be affected, that is not true. I think you know that is not true.
I have a 24 y.o. daughter who has never had a boyfriend, and was brought up in a strict christian household. She will wait for Mr right to come along, so please don't criticise her because she has been instilled with the same values as her parents, and we will be celebrating 25 years of marriage next month.


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## drsmith (7 October 2009)

I'm not sure what exactly defines a strict christian household but it comes across to me as a somewhat narrow perspective.


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## drsmith (7 October 2009)

The following are better examples of religious women. 

http://www.midlifebachelor.com/truths/truths-ft7-page13.html


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## Julia (7 October 2009)

windy said:


> I totally agree with Jono, sex is NOT the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not, and those who think that if you're not sexually compatible, then the rest of your relationship will be affected, that is not true. I think you know that is not true.
> I have a 24 y.o. daughter who has never had a boyfriend, and was brought up in a strict christian household. She will wait for Mr right to come along, so please don't criticise her because she has been instilled with the same values as her parents, and we will be celebrating 25 years of marriage next month.



Hello Windy, where does your 24 year old daughter plan to meet Mr Right?
Is she allowed to socialise with blokes?


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## Mr J (8 October 2009)

windy said:


> I totally agree with Jono, sex is NOT the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not, and those who think that if you're not sexually compatible, then the rest of your relationship will be affected, that is not true. I think you know that is not true.




I don't think anyone has suggested that it is _the_ main factor, but _one of the_ main factors in _most_ relationships. It may not be important to you, but it is to most, particularly with the current day emphasis on finding a highly compatible partner, rather than "working it out".


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## Bushman (8 October 2009)

Julia said:


> Hello Windy, where does your 24 year old daughter plan to meet Mr Right?
> Is she allowed to socialise with blokes?




Maybe Windy's daughter and Jono should go on a date? Could be a match made in heaven


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## Julia (8 October 2009)

Bushman said:


> Maybe Windy's daughter and Jono should go on a date? Could be a match made in heaven



Now there's a thought.  How about also "Bushman's Marriage Brokers":  only 20% of the combined assets of the two parties as payment for arranging a successful union.   Plus, of course, a small trail commission for as long as the marriage lasts.


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## drsmith (8 October 2009)

Julia said:


> Now there's a thought.  How about also "Bushman's Marriage Brokers":  only 20% of the combined assets of the two parties as payment for arranging a successful union.   Plus, of course, a small trail commission for as long as the marriage lasts.



Plus 5% of the assets of the parents of the two parties as part of the successful union fee. That should make for a more reliable revenue base.

As for trailing fees, 2% of assets per annum for the life of the marriage plus 1% of assets per annum for every child.

Once we have enough customers, gear it to the hilt and float the business.


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## JTLP (8 October 2009)

windy said:


> I totally agree with Jono, sex is NOT the main factor in determining if a relationship will work or not, and those who think that if you're not sexually compatible, then the rest of your relationship will be affected, that is not true. I think you know that is not true.
> I have a 24 y.o. daughter who has never had a boyfriend, and was brought up in a strict christian household. She will wait for Mr right to come along, so please don't criticise her because she has been instilled with the same values as her parents, and we will be celebrating 25 years of marriage next month.




Windy...I don't know you or your family situation...but if I just read the above slab of text on a piece of paper...I would think that the adults in the 24 y.o's life have decided her life for her and curved it to their taste. I'm sure all parents wish to raise their children with certain standards and morals...but it seems you've gone on the extreme and kept your daughter under house arrest.

Mr Right? I don't believe in soul mates in respect of love at first sight etc. You work hard at a relationship...sure there is natural attraction and common ground...but you don't click like a lightswitch and never disagree or question.

Congratulations on the 25 years of marriage...that is quite an achievement and you should be happy...but just to let you know just because you've had a successful marriage statistics in today's society would say otherwise for the general populous...no matter what the upbringing.


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## inenigma (13 November 2009)

JTLP said:


> Congratulations on the 25 years of marriage...that is quite an achievement and you should be happy...but just to let you know just because you've had a successful marriage statistics in today's society would say otherwise for the general populous...no matter what the upbringing.




I'll second that.....  7th Day Adventists are great as long as they don't knock on my door....


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## Julia (13 November 2009)

I have no truck with any religions, but just to be fair, Seventh Day Adventists don't go knocking on anyone's doors.   They leave that to the Jehovah's Witness and the Mormons.


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