# TAH - Tabcorp Holdings



## baglimit (11 November 2004)

1. i'd like to open by saying this is not a ramp - they dont need ramping currently. 
2. i dont need to buy anymore & arent planning on selling - SPP for employees was great enough....have since left.
3. refer back to 1 & 2.

hope that eliminates any nasty comebacks. i'm just wondering how far TAH is going to travel. it is tradition for them to have a great run in cup week, but they had a great month prior to that, and have continued on since. a little birdie has told me they are 'very likely' to re-introduce high rollers at star city early next year, to combine with the successful jupiters program and then take on crown ltd in seeking the cream on that weird but wonderful 'win rate'. (i dont know how that works) 
what i was also wondering was how former nswtab holders felt about seeing gains in a stock because they are a well run company, not because they are going to be taken over in a bidding war. surely TAB would still be in the $3.50 range if not for this years fight between TAH & UTB. former TAB's pls reply.
does anyone have any recent stock reports from brokers with target prices, as all the ones ive seen have seen the targets passed very quickly lately.


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## baglimit (15 November 2004)

*Re: TAH - wheres it gonna end*

clearly a dud topic in here - ok, i'll try another


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## son of baglimit (2 March 2006)

anyone willing to contribute ?

are on the lookout for any broker recommends / ratings for tah - anyone have any ?

still holding - still love the divvies, still love the drp - now for a drop of good news.


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## Ann (2 March 2006)

Hello to the Baglimit family,

I am happy to put a chart up with a few comments........

Sorry they aren't more positive....but I could be way off of course.


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## Julia (2 March 2006)

son of baglimit said:
			
		

> anyone willing to contribute ?
> 
> are on the lookout for any broker recommends / ratings for tah - anyone have any ?
> 
> still holding - still love the divvies, still love the drp - now for a drop of good news.




Hi Son of baglimit

Some time can you satisfy my wondering about the Baglimit family names?!!

Have checked on "Australian Broker Call" which offers the following from 24 February which is the latest comment on TAH.

Macquarie:     Neutral                 Target price $16.10

SB Citigroup   Buy, medium risk      Target price $19.60

Merrill Lynch   Buy, Low Risk          Target price $19.70

J P Morgan     Neutral                   No target price

UBS               Neutral                   Target price $16.15.

On 23 February Huntleys had a recommendation of Accumulate.

Hope this helps.

Julia


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## son of baglimit (3 March 2006)

thanks for that julia

family - no - one & the same - maybe technical issues, but i prefer to use 'tax dodge' as the reason.


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## son of baglimit (22 March 2006)

again - a call out for those who have any broker recommendations for tah - just havent seen any in detail....please help.


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## Ann (23 March 2006)

Hello Son of Baglimit,

I am not with a full service broker, so I don't get recommendations. However I was asked directly on another forum for my opinion of TAH. 

May I share my opinion with you, bearing in mind I am someone of no consequence. I am just sharing an opinion for what it is worth. 

I do not own any gaming stocks and I am completely unbiased....this does not necessarily make me correct in my assesment. 

TAH is offering a good yield because the price has fallen quite a bit over the last few months. If it had retained its normal price range you would not be looking at this sort of yield.

The Bracks Government wants to maximise returns from gambling in Victoria, so one of the factors they will be considering is whether Victoria retains the current licensing systems.

Both TAH and Tatts have the best chance to secure the licences beyond their 2012 expiry but the government is looking to attract bids from new players.

TAH has a $600 million break fee that must be paid to them by the Government if the company does not retain its wagering licence however this may be something that could be a trade off in securing a licence.

I understand both Racing Victoria and Queensland's UNiTAB may be interested in TAH's wagering licence and may be involved in a bid for the licence.

Let's have a look at the charts of both UTB and TAH. I have an indicator that I use to guage market sentiment. It is called the Positive Volume Index. It is not a reflection of the price movements....but it is more an indicator of the interest in a company. It can be manipulated but in these two cases I do not believe this is happening.


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## Ann (23 March 2006)

This is a chart for the potential licence contender....


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## Julia (24 March 2006)

Ann

Thanks for posting those charts.  Another factor probably influencing UTB's recent rise (before going ex-div at least) has been merger/takeover rumours.

Son of Baglimit

Broker Consensus Report as at 23 March for TAH was:

Strong Buy - 4
Hold - 6
Sell - 1

Sometimes, though, this includes recommendations which have been there for a while.

FN Arena has

Deutsche at 17/3  - Hold

Merrill Lynch at 9/3  -  Buy

Aspect Huntley at 6/3  -  Accumulate

Nothing more recent than that I'm afraid.

Julia


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## Ann (24 March 2006)

Julia,

Thank you very much for that information. I have put a similar post up in another couple of forums. I have had a response from someone with closer ties to TAH and they may be able to offer a less pessimistic view on TAH. So anyone interested, please stay tuned for another view.


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## Julia (24 March 2006)

ABN-Amro has just issued a Buy on TAH.  Their comment is (roughly paraphrased - can't copy and paste cos copyright):

"In the broker's view the longer the TVN/SKY split on broadcasting racing issue remains unresolved, the more serious it becomes, especially since relicensing process has commenced in Victoria."

I don't hold TAH, just UTB.

Julia


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## son of baglimit (3 April 2006)

anyone know whats behind current drive ? - well past pre utb/tts news price !!


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## Julia (3 April 2006)

son of baglimit said:
			
		

> anyone know whats behind current drive ? - well past pre utb/tts news price !!




Presumably it's being fuelled by persistent rumours (equally persistently denied) that it will attempt to outbid Tattersalls for Unitab.

Julia


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## son of baglimit (3 April 2006)

i'd argue the opposite - the takeover semed to initially fuel that speculation, and drove the price down, on expectation any bid would be overpriced. the denials and subsequent reports to say it would be a bad idea re-established the price, but now its gone beyond that - is it TVN finalised, or something else ?


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## son of baglimit (28 April 2006)

my spies tell me Slatter has got NSW racing minister to agree to pooling of NSW & VIC betting pools - if correct, they'd go online within a week of announcing - gee i hope its true.


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## son of baglimit (2 May 2006)

GEE - WHO SAW THAT COMING ??????????????


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## Dutchy3 (13 October 2006)

This one tempted me at the end of last week yet the selling last Friday was disconcerting. As we head for the close today I've been taking positions as this one is holding reasonably. Not going to set the world on fire. 10 - 20% should be possible from the next 12 months


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## GreatPig (13 October 2006)

Looks like it could be forming a saucer pattern.

GP


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## Dutchy3 (13 October 2006)

Hi GP

Indeed and then that might be about it ... If It does see 17.30 ish without much excitment that might prove to be a good time to bale. Its proven to be a bit of a bugger to watch over the years as it can turn in days / weeks where it is dumped upon in what otherwise is a strong up trend. It's size and position in the market almost make it madatory for the diversified fund to hold and yet they are quite prepared to cane it at the same time.

That said 5% margin on the position and a 10 - 20% move in price offers plenty of return.


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## son of baglimit (13 October 2006)

the 1st post of this thread mentions tah having a good october, prior to traditional v.good cup week - same again maybe. theres a bit of press now re:vic govt reluctance to disturb current pokies licences.
this sort of press versus the anti gambling movement are too often the catalist for changes in direction for tah.

closer to the election might see a new point of view.

post election though im expecting blue sky....$18 +


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## Dutchy3 (20 October 2006)

Hi son of baglimit

Have you any additional info on your 1800 +?

I'm actually a bit surprised how well this one held up this week


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## son of baglimit (20 October 2006)

im assuming its holding up with speculation of what packers gonna do with his new billions - he would want tah's casinos, and while the ACCC might wanna say something about it, the packers have very big friends and would probably get the deal done.
ive heard wagering going very well (drought means no cancelled meetings) and as mentioned, anti gambling folk are being ignored in run up to vic govt elections.

GO TAH


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## son of baglimit (11 January 2007)

while trying to find out whats behind recent TAH surge, found this from melb herald sun on 1/1/07

TABCORP is expected to learn within two weeks whether it can create a $10 billion mega-betting pool by merging its New South Wales and Victorian totes.

If the merger receives NSW Government approval, punters could have access to the combined totalisator pool in time for the Sydney autumn carnival. 
"Pooling the NSW and Victorian TABs is close," Tabcorp supremo Robert Nason said. 

"We have a proposal with Treasury and hope to hear something in the next two weeks. It could happen by March or April but that is only if we can get Government approval soon and agreement from the racing industry." 

NSW TAB has the nation's largest totalisator betting with annual wagering turnover of more than $5.5 billion. 

Victoria's SuperTAB pool includes TABs from Tasmania, the ACT and Western Australia, with a betting turnover of more than $4 billion annually. 

The NSW Government has sought guarantees from Tabcorp that government and racing industry revenues will not fall if approval is granted. 

The merger would provide much larger and more stable betting pools and help to stimulate punter interest with bigger dividends. 

Opponents of the TAB merger say it wipes out competition between totes, taking away choice and betting options from punters. 

It is understood Tabcorp has some alternative plans if the NSW Government still has concerns about pooling. 

It may look to introduce trial pooling on one code only, or to introduce pooling on certain bet types such as trifectas. 

Nason also confirmed Tabcorp should be in a position to co-pool with the New Zealand TAB in the next few weeks.


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## Chief Wigam (21 February 2007)

SOB,

Thanks for the post. No announcements on this. It's been >2 weeks. Have you heard anything?


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## son of baglimit (25 April 2007)

what a nice day......sure to generate a speeding ticket.

and what that reveals is the great mystery.

off market buyback for $350M - apparently

takeover by any number of parties - hopefully

struggling gaming stocks flavour of the month - doubt it


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## stockpile (25 April 2007)

Came across this article yesterday, this whole scenario could have a flow on effect with either PBL or Mac bank.




> SPECULATION Publishing and Broadcasting Ltd or Macquarie Bank could be lining up a consortium to take over the country's largest gambling group have sent Tabcorp shares soaring.
> 
> The shares closed more than 90c higher at $18 yesterday on rumours PBL and Macquarie were behind a series of large trades throughout the day that pushed volumes to double their normal levels.
> 
> ...





My theory is that PBL are preparing plans for a new casino in Sydney as Star City's 12 year exclusivity rights expire in September.  By Acquiring a large share in TabCorp they will position themselves as the major players in the city and maintain a stranglehold on the local gaming market.  It's no secret that James Packer sees the future of PBL in the gaming sector and this development adds further weight to this outlook.


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## trading_rookie (26 April 2007)

TAH are strongly denying any takeover talk with either PBL or McBank. Price has gone from a high of 18 to 17.70's.

I was under the impression the price was being driven up with the talk of Ziggy becoming CEO ;-)



> what i was also wondering was how former nswtab holders felt about seeing gains in a stock because they are a well run company, not because they are going to be taken over in a bidding war. surely TAB would still be in the $3.50 range if not for this years fight between TAH & UTB. former TAB's pls reply.




The cash payout was good, but the ratio of TAB:TAH shares wasn't...maybe I should have bought more TAH when they were at the $10 mark...no point crying over spilled milk. 

To be honest the only reason why I will hold onto my TAH stocks is because of the benefits card


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## CanOz (21 June 2007)

Interesting juncture, could you possibly get more 'symmetric? I like how the i got a signal to go short and long on the same candle! lol!

Cheers,


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## X888 (26 August 2007)

THE equine flu shutdown cost the NSW TAB $40 million in lost betting turnover yesterday and threatens to financially cripple the racing industry.

Interstate TABs and bookies nationwide lost more than $150 million as authorities cancelled all racing for the first time in memory.

The NSW TAB stood to lose $1 billion in betting turnover if the ban lasted for two months, Racing NSW chief executive Peter V'Landys said.

Yesterday's unprecedented cancellation of racing across Australia left NSW TABs and racetracks looking like ghost towns.

Punters had no races to bet on during the TAB's busiest period – Saturday afternoon – after a New Zealand gallops event at 12.10pm yesterday.


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## numbercruncher (26 August 2007)

Yes going to be interesting to see how badly the market punishes Tabcorp for these unfortunate events!




> THE equine flu shutdown cost the NSW TAB $40 million in lost betting turnover yesterday and threatens to financially cripple the racing industry.
> 
> Interstate TABs and bookies nationwide lost more than $150 million as authorities cancelled all racing for the first time in memory.




http://www.news.com.au/business/story/0,23636,22309915-462,00.html


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## Ken (28 August 2007)

Buying opportunity in my opinion.

Temporary pain for long term gain.

6.2% dividend at current prices.

Those who picked up $15.10 on open yesterday would have also received the 47 cent dividend.

Long term winner.

If you cant beat the TAB, you might as well join it.

People are always going to gamble.


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## Ken (29 August 2007)

Late surge for TABCORP on low volume.

Bit of cash has been made on TAH lately.

Good trading ranges.

Dont know whether its a short considering the dividend is around 6.3% now...

Limited downside I would think....???


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## bigdog (31 October 2007)

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,22675551-664,00.html

Yesterday there was talk about Packer starting a second Casino in Sydney!!!!

*Tabcorp's monopoly*
October 31, 2007 12:00am

GAMING giant Tabcorp Holdings will remain the sole operator of a casino in New South Wales for the next 12 years.

The announcement came after Tabcorp agreed to pay the NSW government a $100 million up-front fee and higher taxes on casino revenue.

In return, Tabcorp will be allowed to make various product changes to help make its Star City casino in Sydney more attractive to gamblers.

The company also said the new deal gave it the certainty it needed to proceed with a $300 million refurbishment of Star City, which would include a new 300-room hotel and restaurant precinct.

Tabcorp will pay the $100 million fee in two $50 million tranches - one this financial year and in 2008-09.

It will also move to a new indexed tax regime based on revenue from table games and slot machines. The current average tax rate will lift from 24.1 per cent to 27.5 per cent in 2013.

Tabcorp shares were 16c higher at $15.28.


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## Gurgler (10 April 2008)

In Trading halt pending the State Govt's ending of the poker machine duopoly held by Tatts & Tabcorp. (see Age article today: http://business.theage.com.au/tabcorp-tatts-lose-poker-machine-duopoly/20080410-251y.html)

What views on the outcomes? Both have other gaming interests, I guess.

Holding both


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## son of baglimit (10 April 2008)

i am so so so so glad i got out last may at $18.70 - thought it was too good a price, and now benefitting.

theres so little mention of the fact they have lost the wagering licence too, but of course they can bid for it as its up for tender....but it WILL BE keenly sought by others too.

i hate to think of the trading when they reopen - if anyone gets broker updates please pass on their targets...thanks.


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## dontknow (10 April 2008)

They are losing their Vic pokie license and probably the $600m the license is valued at on their balance sheet (how do you say extraordinary). Not good (if you own TAH). At least it's not for another 4 or so years.


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## reece55 (11 April 2008)

dontknow said:


> They are losing their Vic pokie license and probably the $600m the license is valued at on their balance sheet (how do you say extraordinary). Not good (if you own TAH). At least it's not for another 4 or so years.




Geez... The amortisation of the licence will probably choke up their profit for the next 4 years unless the Vic Govt actually gives them something back for it. Personally, I don't think this will be the end, I would assume that Tabcorp will probably seek some form of compensation......

Pre the licence, Tabcorp is now probably trading at 13 - 15 times earnings, so fundamentally it may be attractive. But obviously a fair bit of technical damage when a stock goes down > 20%.... Good luck to long term holders her, nothing worse than waking up to something like this.

Cheers


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## Knobby22 (11 April 2008)

They don't deserve a cent in compensation. They were running a duopoly given to them by the useless Joan Kirner. 

It is good to see it getting fixed. There was always the risk they would lose this, we just thought the politicians would be corrupted by the massive amounts of money given to the party during elections and hiring of ex politicians. Brumby has done a good thing and I will have to rerate the man. 
Love to see it occur in Tasmania with Gunns, unfortunately they have hopelessly corrupted the Liberal and Labour parties.


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## njc.corp (11 April 2008)

Knobby22 said:


> They don't deserve a cent in compensation. They were running a duopoly given to them by the useless Joan Kirner.
> 
> It is good to see it getting fixed. There was always the risk they would lose this, we just thought the politicians would be corrupted by the massive amounts of money given to the party during elections and hiring of ex politicians. Brumby has done a good thing and I will have to rerate the man.
> Love to see it occur in Tasmania with Gunns, unfortunately they have hopelessly corrupted the Liberal and Labour parties.




Has my first post - i must agree with u their-

Its a good change-

how do they feel about droping 20+% in a day = ask the victims they have had for a while

Nick--


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## dalek (11 April 2008)

Knobby22 said:


> They don't deserve a cent in compensation. They were running a duopoly given to them by the useless Joan Kirner.
> 
> It is good to see it getting fixed. There was always the risk they would lose this, we just thought the politicians would be corrupted by the massive amounts of money given to the party during elections and hiring of ex politicians. Brumby has done a good thing and I will have to rerate the man.
> Love to see it occur in Tasmania with Gunns, unfortunately they have hopelessly corrupted the Liberal and Labour parties.




This whole distasteful episode is just another remnant of one of the most shameful State Governments us Victorians have had to endure during the Kirner / Cain era.

But don't get too warm and fuzzy towards Brumby there is a whole lot of self interest going on here. General opinion seems to be that this will provide him with windfall of up to $8B for State coffers.


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## Bill M (12 April 2008)

dalek said:


> But don't get too warm and fuzzy towards Brumby there is a whole lot of self interest going on here. General opinion seems to be that this will provide him with windfall of up to $8B for State coffers.




You are on to something here, I've read the new licenses could be worth up to $2B. The only winner here is the Vic Government, cashing in on the new licenses. Don't worry the amount of machines, they stay the same, they will still reap the same taxes as well. Not for a second do I think it is good for the community, nothing changes for the punter. TAH and TTS may still sue, they are considering their options right now. What the outcome of that (if any) will be I will leave for the lawyers to work out.


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## Ken (13 April 2008)

What I dont get is people think that is going to reduce problem gambling.

If people want to play the pokies. There is always going to be on available.

It's like fast food. If someone wants kfc, they will find away off getting to one.

Will be interesting to see how low Tabcorp goes the dividend is already 8%.


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## bigdog (14 April 2008)

They were talking on the radio politicians sell out of Tabcorp and Tatts in the days before the Brumby ANN

Can anyone identify pollies that sold Tabcorp and Tatts in the days before the Brumby ANN?


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## Bill M (14 April 2008)

"A 13-YEAR-OLD letter appears to have doomed plans by gambling giants Tabcorp and Tatts Group to sue the Victorian Government for $1.2 billion in compensation over the loss of their duopoly grip on the state's poker machine licences."

Full Story Here


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## trading_rookie (15 April 2008)

Re: the recent high court decision going Betfair's way, then it's likely Tabcorp and Tatts could propose a merger...that'd be interesting indeed.


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## son of baglimit (15 April 2008)

the ACCC rejected TAH's takeover proposal on competition grounds for wagering (still shaking my head on that one) so to think they would NOW allow it is doubtful (true, funny things happen).

a merged TAH/TTS would own or control all wagering in eastern australia, lotteries in victoria, and all casinos thru NSW & QLD.

thats a lot of the gambling dollar potentially going thru 1 set of doors.

doubt it.

and even if it was allowed, who says NSW Govt would allow the wagering pool to be merged with Vic & QLD - they have resisted so far - why? - thru some fanciful idea that because TAH couldnt GUARANTEE turnover wouldnt decrease - every expert in the world would say it would, but because it couldnt be GUARANTEED, they knock it back - well thats the reasoning given anyway - i assume its some hatred of TAH after the sky channel debacle.


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## trading_rookie (16 April 2008)

True, but it is this state protectionism of TAB's that saw Betfair's recent success in the high courts. This is the ruling that's fueling the rumours...but as you say the ACCC can still knock it back on anti-competitve behaviour.

Re: compensation, it could end up being $600m to TAH, or any value in between, even zero!. It depends on the price of the license being issued in 2012. Vic gaming law states that any compensation being paid is either the value of the previous license or the premium being paid by the new licensee...whichever is the lesser. If they give out a license for free, that equates to zero compensation.

Unfortunately for us TAH shareholders, the TAH board has always believed that a future license would be worth more than what they paid in 1996...wishful thinking perhaps, I'm hoping they were right


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## son of baglimit (16 April 2008)

from the info out there about 4 years ago on the compensation, TAH get $600m, TTS get zilch.

sorry thats purely from memory - no source.


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## ROE (25 September 2008)

Anyone know where I can get TAH information on their break down earning
for each division.

Stuff I like to see which is not in Annual report is

Poker division how much they make
casino division how much they make
wagering division how much they make etc..

I will do my bit  and email them but if anyone know where I can dig that up that would be nice ..

ta


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## CAB SAV (25 September 2008)

ROE said:


> Anyone know where I can get TAH information on their break down earning
> for each division.
> 
> Stuff I like to see which is not in Annual report is
> ...




This is all I could find at the moment. If I get time, i'll have a look tonight.
EBIT 2H08
Vic. gambling 111.2m
Vic. wagering 43.4m
Casino's 168.8m
NWS wagering 86.3m
Keno 19.4m


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## ROE (25 September 2008)

CAB SAV said:


> This is all I could find at the moment. If I get time, i'll have a look tonight.
> EBIT 2H08
> Vic. gambling 111.2m
> Vic. wagering 43.4m
> ...




Thanks.. I also got a reply email from their investor relation so I'm fairly impress with their details email and the quick turn around.. if you got anything else can you dropped me an IM  ...

Financial statement tick off
Management 1/2 tick still got some more research to do 

thanks


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## Dangerous (6 February 2009)

Latest thoughts anyone?  I'm thinking debt high, threats from the on-line gamers and regulatory risks.  However, dividend looking fantastic... a good one for the SMSF?


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## trading_rookie (25 February 2009)

Comments re: the Share Purchase Plan? Anyone yet to subscribe, thinking about subscribing or rejecting the plan?



> Latest thoughts anyone? I'm thinking debt high, threats from the on-line gamers and regulatory risks. However, dividend looking fantastic... a good one for the SMSF?




You're thinking is wrong...debt is not high (check their half-year report for confirmation), they have enough stored away for a rainy day not to mention the extra $300million institutions snapped up recently in the SPP, and the $150million offered to retailers will mean the go ahead required to refurbish the Casino in Sydney and possibly purchase NSW Lotteries. 

As far as threats from on-line gambling, TAH recently purchased a Sydney-based company and relocated them to the NT to get in on the action. Not to mention forcing on-line gaming companies to pay TAB royalties for posting race start lineups and results. As you can imagine the they're not too happy.

As for dividend, well as all companies it's being slashed to preserve capital. TAH has slashed it by 70-80% of profits from previous benchmarks of 90-90% profit. Another precaution to preserve if and when the economy gets worse...says something about our government out on a spend-a-thon...maybe they should take lessons from the business community who are doing the opposite...


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## Bill M (25 February 2009)

trading_rookie said:


> Comments re: the Share Purchase Plan? Anyone yet to subscribe, thinking about subscribing or rejecting the plan?




That is a very easy decision. Right now the shares are trading at $6.37 and the issue price is $5.80. You have 2 choices, sell some now at $6.37 and buy it back (5K worth) at $5.80 or just buy a new parcel at $5.80. I am doing the first choice and pocketed a 50c per share profit.


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## ROE (25 February 2009)

I fully subscribe with the SPP  yesterday and then more outlay today for FLT  .. bank account getting low


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## trading_rookie (25 February 2009)

I don’t know guys, I’m still umming and arring…you sound pretty optimistic that you’ll get allocated $5K worth of shares. Having participated in a previous SSP, they’re usually over-subscribed and months later if you’re lucky you end up with the minimum offer, in TAH’s case that’ll be $500 worth of shares.

I didn’t read anywhere on the SSP that they were guaranteeing x number of shares for y existing number of shares. So as tempting as it seems selling at todays closing price of $6.41 (last week would have better at $6.59) and keeping fingers crossed that one will be allocated all the shares they’re after with the proceeds sounds too risky.

I suspect that’s what a lot of punters are doing – and what they’ve done with all the other publicly-listed companies doing a capital raising. 

According to analysts however, companies like TAH that are just shoring up their positions – ie, they don’t really need the cash like CBA, which they predict will see their  price head south….as I said, still umming and arring. ;-)


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## Bill M (28 February 2009)

Tabcorp has extended the offer period to 5pm Wednesday 4 March 2009. There was a problem apparently with the BPay code. So if you haven't done it yet there is still time.

From Company Announcement:

----------------------------

"Since yesterday evening, shareholders who wished to use the BPAY facility that had been established to lodge their application have been unable to access the BPAY facility as the prescribed Biller Code ceased to function."

---------------------------

For further information go to the company announcement dated 27/02/2009.


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## ROE (28 February 2009)

Bill M said:


> Tabcorp has extended the offer period to 5pm Wednesday 4 March 2009. There was a problem apparently with the BPay code. So if you haven't done it yet there is still time.
> 
> From Company Announcement:
> 
> ...




mine went through fine Tuesday or Wednesday.. crazy to leave it so late as the money has to be in 5pm Friday and if bank stuff up the batch job they maybe too late..better off pay 2 or 3 days before hand.


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## trading_rookie (15 April 2009)

I take it everyone is happy with the SPP ;-)

Anyone taking the plunge and buying TAH corporate bonds?


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## ROE (16 April 2009)

trading_rookie said:


> I take it everyone is happy with the SPP ;-)
> 
> Anyone taking the plunge and buying TAH corporate bonds?




Better return buy the stocks ... it gives similar yield 
Bond is more for income earner rather than investor looking for a bit of dividend and capital growth with a bit of risk for capital going backward.

Don't know why people don't get TAH for $5.80  get pass the doom and gloom paper and read into what they do and their market position and various other information I would have bought 50K if they let me


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## trading_rookie (27 April 2009)

I like the bond...good as a hedge regardless if things do or don't improve. If they improve then the fixed margin of 4.25%pa on it's own without taking the 90-day bank bill rate into account, will mean a not too shabby return of 21% over the 5 yr period - I'm assuming the bank bill rate will be useless. Whereas, if things get worse and the rate mirrors '74 double digit numbers then I'll be happy too ;-)

Last time I checked the 90 day Aussie bank bill was @ 3.05% so that would mean a quarterly return of (4.25+3.05) 7.3% pa, better than any banking on-line account or term deposit.


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## Gerkin (27 April 2009)

trading_rookie said:


> I like the bond...good as a hedge regardless if things do or don't improve. If they improve then the fixed margin of 4.25%pa on it's own without taking the 90-day bank bill rate into account, will mean a not too shabby return of 21% over the 5 yr period - I'm assuming the bank bill rate will be useless. Whereas, if things get worse and the rate mirrors '74 double digit numbers then I'll be happy too ;-)
> 
> Last time I checked the 90 day Aussie bank bill was @ 3.05% so that would mean a quarterly return of (4.25+3.05) 7.3% pa, better than any banking on-line account or term deposit.




I will admit good return, However you should look at the fundamental business that will be producing this income. There are alot of changes happening in Victoria in the next 2 years in regards to gambling especially pokies. Look at this first.

Also look at other listed hybrids/bonds that are currently on offer. You can buy these on the exchanges


----------



## trading_rookie (28 April 2009)

> I will admit good return, However you should look at the fundamental business that will be producing this income. There are alot of changes happening in Victoria in the next 2 years in regards to gambling especially pokies. Look at this first.



Vic is only one dimension of their total core business and if they win the tender for the Tassie tote and/or NSW lotteries, not to mention the recent relocation of an online gaming business they bought in Sydney and moved to NT to cash in on the billions being generated by these on-line services, current revamp of the Sydney Casino, the interest in buying their smaller QLD casinos, even though as far as I’m aware they’re not interested in selling…who knows there might be a deal on the table that no court action over the loss of the VIC pokies will see TAH keep the VIC tote and maybe even win the maintenance contract for VIC pokies…don’t forget NSW tote is a nice little earner.

Pardon the pun, but that’s the ‘gamble’ one takes when investing ;-)



> Also look at other listed hybrids/bonds that are currently on offer. You can buy these on the exchanges



The attractive thing about TAH Bonds is the fixed margin…I haven’t seen anyone offer better than that. Not to mention with talk of interest rates going further down, I’m not too keen on paying more for an existing bond that will return less. 

As you can probably tell, not interested in buying and selling bonds on the market, I’m comfortable with the risk and happy to see the bond mature in 5 yrs time and not only get back my initial investment but hopefully good returns in a couple of years when all this talk of market recovery turns into fruition and interest rates start going back up …


----------



## son of baglimit (28 April 2009)

trading_rookie said:


> Vic is only one dimension of their total core business and if they win the tender for the Tassie tote and/or NSW lotteries, not to mention the recent relocation of an online gaming business they bought in Sydney and moved to NT to cash in on the billions being generated by these on-line services, current revamp of the Sydney Casino, the interest in buying their smaller QLD casinos, even though as far as I’m aware they’re not interested in selling…who knows there might be a deal on the table that no court action over the loss of the VIC pokies will see TAH keep the VIC tote and maybe even win the maintenance contract for VIC pokies…don’t forget NSW tote is a nice little earner.





as far as TAH's record in buying up other assets, they have tended to go for the large scale buys, rather than small totes etc. go back and see what QTAB paid for SATAB all those years ago - only a few million. tah showed no interest. 
yes i know the scene has changed and betfair etc are based there, potentially helping turnover in that state, as well as their well publicised o/s deals, but you can guarantee the state govt has overpriced that asset (totetas) and it will bring very little.


----------



## trading_rookie (28 April 2009)

> as far as TAH's record in buying up other assets, they have tended to go for the large scale buys, rather than small totes etc. go back and see what QTAB paid for SATAB all those years ago - only a few million. tah showed no interest.




But if they lose VIC tote that will only give them NSW, so Tassie would be appealing, small or not.

As a former TAH employee bags, were they interested in QTAB and SATAB or was monopoly concerns one of the reasons they didn’t bid? As history shows, talk of a TAH/Tatts merger would have been rejected on these grounds.


> yes i know the scene has changed and betfair etc are based there, potentially helping turnover in that state, as well as their well publicised o/s deals, but you can guarantee the state govt has overpriced that asset (totetas) and it will bring very little.



True, both TAH and Tatts are down playing the governments asking price…by about 100-150 mill, but the government is offering very attractive sweeteners, and from what I’ve read further, are opening up the tender to overseas companies, forcing the 2 Aussie gaming giants to make a tender and keep almost a duopoly in Oz.


----------



## son of baglimit (28 April 2009)

trading_rookie said:


> were they interested in QTAB and SATAB or was monopoly concerns one of the reasons they didn’t bid? As history shows, talk of a TAH/Tatts merger would have been rejected on these grounds.




they bid for qtab, but that was rejected on competition grounds (on very poor reasoning btw)
and yes, theres no chance in hell of tah/tts marrying.

and thanks to the rumour mongers again for the packer takeover stuff back in 07 - a nice exit that was.


----------



## trading_rookie (8 May 2009)

Tabcorp Bonds (TAHHA) up $2 to $102, and the first quarterly payment will be at 7.33%...not bad, not bad indeed.


----------



## ROE (10 May 2009)

Gerkin said:


> I will admit good return, However you should look at the fundamental business that will be producing this income. There are alot of changes happening in Victoria in the next 2 years in regards to gambling especially pokies. Look at this first.
> 
> Also look at other listed hybrids/bonds that are currently on offer. You can buy these on the exchanges




that is old news already factor that into the price , that sort of doom and gloom scenario create beautiful opportunity for investors who truly understand tabcorp operation  

Tabcorp has all the upside from the Victoria Govie decision now that it's factor into the price..one court case could go Tabcorp way...Similar case happen in US and judgement rule in Tabcorp like favor.

and the other one I like to believe that not in the realm of impposibility is most clubs don't have the financial and capital like tabcorp to snap up the license
and bring on the global financial crisis it shape up more likely than not 

so in the end it could create head ache for Vic govie and may force to delay or do some deal with Tabcorp in the end 

and Victoria only account for Tabcorp 25% earning, why knock this dog around so hard hehe ..FEAR rule the market

oh don't forget the internet fear too , small operators going to kick Tabcorp ass with their nice little wagering internet site...latest report tabcorp wagering up 13% in revenue year to date


----------



## No.1MoneyMaker (19 August 2009)

Is any one still following this?? The price looks quite attempting, and I'm thinking to get in. But the price has just dropped 10% in one week, any ideas ???


----------



## son of baglimit (20 August 2009)

following, but only for old times sake. 

way too much uncertainty in earnings going forward, with gaming 3 years to run, wagering licence in vic to be determined, and star city getting spending for inconsistent returns. on an historical level the SP is attractive, but not for me right now, especially  with no free govt money on the horizon.


----------



## Dark1975 (3 September 2009)

big push today,gunna come back with charts to see if there's a potential key reversal here,not sure yet brb if anything interesting


----------



## skip9 (17 January 2010)

Have seen alot of "Buy" recommendations for this stock. Whats there future, even though they will be losing their Pokies license, it generally has good dividends. Anybody have some useful information or thoughts about Tabcorp?


----------



## rtjoa (29 January 2010)

skip9 said:


> Have seen alot of "Buy" recommendations for this stock. Whats there future, even though they will be losing their Pokies license, it generally has good dividends. Anybody have some useful information or thoughts about Tabcorp?




Hi Skip, I'm a beginner in stock trading. However, heres my 

I think this year will be a good year for bookmakers (one of TAB subsidiary), with the world cup is in play. Generally for all bookies across the globe this will be the time when betting turnovers will be at its peak. 

With Australia being a multicultural country (most importantly socceroo is there as well), I can see this can be a great year for TABSportsbet. However, the emergence of online bookies has certainly took some share of the pie in the betting market from TAB. Nevertheless, It is not something that your average joe gambler are comfortable with. Somehow they are still not too convinced with online bookmakers' credibility on them handling their money. As for TAB, your money is more or less 100% safe (very important for high stakes roller).


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (26 July 2010)

There has been no banter on this one for a while. Considering the heavy background volume in May and a speeding ticket revealing no information, are we seeing a new trend back up after a double bottom at the point of one year lows or is it looking like another countertrend with an expiry not too far away? 
_Disclosure:_ I hold for technical reasons suitable to me.


----------



## pixel (26 July 2010)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> There has been no banter on this one for a while. Considering the heavy background volume in May and a speeding ticket revealing no information, are we seeing a new trend back up after a double bottom at the point of one year lows or is it looking like another countertrend with an expiry not too far away?
> _Disclosure:_ I hold for technical reasons suitable to me.




you're not alone, SP
I started buying at the break on the 20th, but decided it'd be better to be a well-off coward than a broke daredevil - and sold last Friday.
As today's trading closed above previous resistance, I bought back in.
$7.12, $7.28, $7.52 are my next targets (but I'll take early profit again if resistance levels won't agree with me.)


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (31 July 2010)

pixel said:


> you're not alone, SP
> I started buying at the break on the 20th, but decided it'd be better to be a well-off coward than a broke daredevil - and sold last Friday.
> As today's trading closed above previous resistance, I bought back in.
> $7.12, $7.28, $7.52 are my next targets (but I'll take early profit again if resistance levels won't agree with me.)



Hi Pixel,

With a good week of rises on this one, did you take a Friday sell opportunity again? It seems to have dropped a bit, which is ok, with a bit more volume than previous days this week. I see it as if Friday sellers offloaded some, perhaps. Interesting psychology why risk is not held over the weekend. I still hold.


----------



## pixel (31 July 2010)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> Hi Pixel,
> 
> With a good week of rises on this one, did you take a Friday sell opportunity again? It seems to have dropped a bit, which is ok, with a bit more volume than previous days this week. I see it as if Friday sellers offloaded some, perhaps. Interesting psychology why risk is not held over the weekend. I still hold.




Hi SP,
I actually sold already on Thursday for $6.89; the decision was based

on Options distribution, which peaked at $6.87
on price target analysis, which suggested resistance at first Fibonacci level
and seeing the overhead one-year EMA
Re #1, consider that Friday's volume includes 902,000 shares sold at $6.87 by options writers, who had already pocketed the premium and can't feel too unhappy about selling at that price. Imagine how they'd feel if they had an inkling that TAH may drop back to the $6.70's if not lower : (I'm sure you know that the majority of options are written by large Fundies and Hedgies.)
Re #2 and 3, see the chart below.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (31 July 2010)

pixel said:


> Hi SP,
> I actually sold already on Thursday for $6.89; the decision was based
> 
> on Options distribution, which peaked at $6.87
> ...



Pixel,
It seems you are on a shorter time frame to me. On the daily I am happy to see it drop back a bit to confirm the break level. 
Cheers...


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (6 August 2010)

I got ripped up on the big nasty open gap with TAH. Any profit I had on Wednesday was gone by Thursday. Now out.


----------



## mr. jeff (6 August 2010)

It's Snake Pliskin said:


> I got ripped up on the big nasty open gap with TAH. Any profit I had on Wednesday was gone by Thursday. Now out.




Hi, what do you think about the likelihood of unwinding of some positions on account of latest earnings reports and the outlook being quite uncertain for now with TAH? Is there great potential for shorts on this market or does the stock sit to reflect all this already? Interested in your opinions, it seems to have several important factors against it at the moment...
earnings down.

- outlook uncertain
- margins reduced
- government regulation problems, upcoming license costs.

Interested in thoughts.


----------



## pixel (6 August 2010)

Call me crazy, reckless, catcher of falling knives ... but I've placed a buy order where I thought support might be sitting. Just got filled at $6.67.
Next Tuesday, August 10th, TAH will go ex 25cFF dividend. That'll possibly cause it to drop even lower, but usually, dividends are quickly regained and forgotten. RBS Morgans, while lowering their target to $8.09, still seem to be quite Bullish on TAH - especially considering the high yield. Even 55c annual dividend, grossed up to 79c, beats term deposit rates by a mile.


----------



## skc (6 August 2010)

pixel said:


> Call me crazy, reckless, catcher of falling knives ... but I've placed a buy order where I thought support might be sitting. Just got filled at $6.67.
> Next Tuesday, August 10th, TAH will go ex 25cFF dividend. That'll possibly cause it to drop even lower, but usually, dividends are quickly regained and forgotten. RBS Morgans, while lowering their target to $8.09, still seem to be quite Bullish on TAH - especially considering the high yield. Even 55c annual dividend, grossed up to 79c, beats term deposit rates by a mile.
> 
> View attachment 38253




I like fib level retracement / reversal trades but not so much when the fall was swift and caused by fundamental news.

On the dividend play - sometimes buying in after (say 1 week) the dividend is paid might actually get you in at a cheaper price. That has been the case with most of the recent utilities (APA, DUE etc) going ex-div.

On the positive side, TAH is probably still considered a true bluechip with good yield + potential takeover target by some. 

Good luck with the trade.


----------



## It's Snake Pliskin (6 August 2010)

mr. jeff said:


> Hi, what do you think about the likelihood of unwinding of some positions on account of latest earnings reports and the outlook being quite uncertain for now with TAH? Is there great potential for shorts on this market or does the stock sit to reflect all this already? Interested in your opinions, it seems to have several important factors against it at the moment...
> earnings down.
> 
> - outlook uncertain
> ...



mr. jeff, I have no idea. The gap open destroyed my original intentions.
I'll be watching the technicals.


----------



## noie (19 October 2010)

Gambling giant Tabcorp (TAH.AX: Quote) has taken steps to placate the concerns of its key shareholders by announcing a plan to separate its casino and wagering businesses. Tabcorp chief executive Elmer Funke Kupper on Monday said the board had been considering the split for more than two years. Tabcorp's casino business will be split from its wagering, gaming and Keno businesses, which will continue trading as Tabcorp Holdings. Page 1.


http://www.finnewsnetwork.com.au/archives/finance_news_network16041.html


----------



## Tyler Durden (28 December 2010)

Does anyone know if there are plans for dividends given that they will be spending hundreds of millions on renovations?

Also, what's everyone's opinion on a fair SP of TAH after it spins off the casinos?


----------



## Tyler Durden (10 May 2011)

No one watching this? For every TAH share you own, you'll get one share in Echo Entertainment (the casinos after the de-merger), probably why the SP has been rising steadily recently.


----------



## skc (11 May 2011)

Tyler Durden said:


> No one watching this? For every TAH share you own, you'll get one share in Echo Entertainment (the casinos after the de-merger), probably why the SP has been rising steadily recently.




After the demerger the share price of TAH will drop by that amount (all else being equal), although the market usually mark up the demerged companies.

Look at Fosters yesterday for example.


----------



## Tyler Durden (11 May 2011)

skc said:


> After the demerger the share price of TAH will drop by that amount (all else being equal), although the market usually mark up the demerged companies.
> 
> Look at Fosters yesterday for example.




Yes but still seems like a good deal. Just sell the TAH shares immediately after the cutoff date if you don't want long term.


----------



## Muschu (11 May 2011)

Tyler Durden said:


> Yes but still seems like a good deal. Just sell the TAH shares immediately after the cutoff date if you don't want long term.




When is that cut-off date please TD?  I hold TAH but have been slack following this deal...

Thanks 

Rick


----------



## skc (12 May 2011)

Muschu said:


> When is that cut-off date please TD?  I hold TAH but have been slack following this deal...
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rick




EGM on 1 June so separate listing won't be far off that I think.


----------



## Tyler Durden (12 May 2011)

Muschu said:


> When is that cut-off date please TD?  I hold TAH but have been slack following this deal...
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rick




10 June 2011


----------



## Muschu (13 May 2011)

Tyler Durden said:


> 10 June 2011




Thanks TD.  given that the demerger has already been announced why would the TAH share price go down?  Wouldn't the demerger influence already be factored in?

Someone told me, for what it's worth, that the Stock Radar newsletter considers TAH good value.

Rick


----------



## Tyler Durden (13 May 2011)

Muschu said:


> Thanks TD.  given that the demerger has already been announced why would the TAH share price go down?  Wouldn't the demerger influence already be factored in?
> 
> Someone told me, for what it's worth, that the Stock Radar newsletter considers TAH good value.
> 
> Rick




The way I see it, people want it on 10 June 2011 so that they can get the Echo shares - after that they'll dump it. The basic of this premise is that Tabcorp (post-demerger) + Echo > Current Tabcorp.


----------



## LifeChoices (6 June 2011)

Getting a hammering this morning - 54% down.


----------



## brianwh (6 June 2011)

Why!!!!


----------



## Muschu (6 June 2011)

LifeChoices said:


> Getting a hammering this morning - 54% down.




Interesting.. But how can Echo [EGP] shares be listed as trading today when holding statements for eligible shareholders are not issued until June 20?

Thanks 

Rick


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## Muschu (6 June 2011)

brianwh said:


> Why!!!!




It is the demerger Brian - Look at the TAH anouncement of April 15.


----------



## snowking (6 June 2011)

Muschu said:


> Interesting.. But how can Echo [EGP] shares be listed as trading today when holding statements for eligible shareholders are not issued until June 20?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rick





it is trading on a deferred settlement basis by the looks of things


----------



## kingkev (6 June 2011)

SP heading South big time..............is this an overreaction?


----------



## Muschu (6 June 2011)

snowking said:


> it is trading on a deferred settlement basis by the looks of things




Presently TAH is $3.40 and EGP is $4.47.  Total = $7.87

TAH closed Friday at $7.72.

But who is trading EGP and how?  I certainly can't access the EGP shares I *will* have...?

Anyone know the answer please?

Rick


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## Tyler Durden (18 June 2011)

Muschu said:


> Presently TAH is $3.40 and EGP is $4.47.  Total = $7.87
> 
> TAH closed Friday at $7.72.
> 
> ...




EGP is available for trade on a deferred settlement basis. It's just like any other stock, but you pay on the 24th. The shares you _will_ have will be registered on 20/6/11.


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## Tyler Durden (24 September 2011)

Anyone in the DRP? Dividends were paid yesterday but according to comsec, I haven't been allocated my shares yet


----------



## redcorvetteguy (29 December 2011)

What is the first rule of fight club?


----------



## redcorvetteguy (29 December 2011)

Does anyone know why TAH share price dropped so much during this year?


----------



## Tyler Durden (29 December 2011)

redcorvetteguy said:


> What is the first rule of fight club?




Never gamble at the casino.



redcorvetteguy said:


> Does anyone know why TAH share price dropped so much during this year?




TAH had a demerger, spinning off its casino businesses, which is now Echo (ASX: EGP). If you add TAH and EGP share prices, it will roughly equate to TAH's share price before the demerger. If you held TAH prior to the demerger, you would've received an equal amount of shares in EGP.


----------



## Tyler Durden (14 February 2012)

SP down 5.17% today to $2.75, not sure if it was because it went ex-dividend or because it announced it would issue subordinated notes. I can see why they might be a bit costly to shareholders, but an 8.9% pa return sounds pretty good.


----------



## Nostyling (12 May 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> SP down 5.17% today to $2.75, not sure if it was because it went ex-dividend or because it announced it would issue subordinated notes. I can see why they might be a bit costly to shareholders, but an 8.9% pa return sounds pretty good.




Tyler do you own any TAH ? 
Do you think there is much upside in the current price long term ? ($2.95)


----------



## Tyler Durden (14 May 2012)

Nostyling said:


> Tyler do you own any TAH ?
> Do you think there is much upside in the current price long term ? ($2.95)




Yes I do own a bit of TAH. Funnily enough it cracked the $3 barrier today. I think long term, there is a small upside (personaly opinion, I'm no expert). I have been hoping for it to drop back down to $2.70 so I could get more, but alas, no donut!


----------



## notting (14 May 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> hoping for it to drop back down to $2.70 so I could get more!



Struggling to crack through it's recent highs and closing softly over the last few days whilst rising on falling volume and having gone ex not too long ago.  It seems your hope could be fulfilled. 
Whether that turns out to be a pleasant experience is another question!


----------



## chops_a_must (29 April 2013)

It seems to be in a pretty strong up-trend.

Announcement out today suggesting continued solid growth.

If it could increase it's dividend as a result, that would be a good outcome.


----------



## MrBurns (5 May 2013)

I think rates will drop and it will get a bit tougher out there..................anyone have any theories on if people gamble more or less in tough times ?


----------



## Tyler Durden (5 May 2013)

MrBurns said:


> I think rates will drop and it will get a bit tougher out there..................anyone have any theories on if people gamble more or less in tough times ?




My theory has always been that in tough times, people get more desperate and are somewhat forced to take more risks, hence it should be good for gambling.

Can't believe this is now $3.44...guess I missed the boat when it was at $2.70


----------



## MrBurns (5 May 2013)

Tyler Durden said:


> Can't believe this is now $3.44...guess I missed the boat when it was at $2.70




That goes for a lot of stocks I'm afraid.


----------



## Gringotts Bank (25 September 2013)

Pattern.  Watch 3.28.


----------



## pixel (25 September 2013)

Gringotts Bank said:


> Pattern.  Watch 3.28.




Could you name the Pattern? Flag? Pennant?
Mind you, I agree with your Watch, I started to become interested about 3c lower, but my "watch"includes the condition "Daily Close Above" (or Below, if it's a trailing Stop).




Nonetheless, I haven't bought yet because the July rally dropped back rather far. I interpret a fall below 50% as a sign of weakness, so I'd rather err on the side of caution. Check out TPM, which turned at 50%


----------



## DJG (25 September 2013)

I can't even see the candles amongst all that!   You must have a decent set of eyes!


----------



## Country Lad (25 September 2013)

pixel said:


> Could you name the Pattern? Flag? Pennant?




Downtrend?


----------



## piggybank (27 December 2013)

It's fortunes have turned positive since the last posting.


----------



## Muschu (3 February 2014)

To my knowledge TAH generally goes XD in mid February.  However I am not aware of any announcement regarding February 2014.

Any able to provide more info please?

Thanks 

Rick


----------



## skc (3 February 2014)

Muschu said:


> To my knowledge TAH generally goes XD in mid February.  However I am not aware of any announcement regarding February 2014.
> 
> Any able to provide more info please?
> 
> ...




TAH is reporting 6 Feb so you should get the dividend details then.


----------



## Muschu (3 February 2014)

skc said:


> TAH is reporting 6 Feb so you should get the dividend details then.




Many thanks


----------



## piggybank (21 October 2014)

I don't know if the spring carnival is helping the price but it appears an overseas horse will take the Melbourne Cup out of the country again





​


----------



## Toyota Lexcen (28 October 2014)

Interesting one TAH, sold out of it $3.50 a little while ago, concerned with how easy it is for "online" betting to start up and siphone $ away from conventional operators

But since gone up to hit $4 mark


----------



## Tyler Durden (16 August 2015)

NPAT 334.5m, up 157.5%

Dividend of 10c per share.

Their last announcement was an update to their dividend announcement, which was this:



> The Appendix 4E Preliminary Final Report released by the Company on 13 August 2015 stated that a dividend reinvestment plan (DRP) will operate in respect of the final dividend, and that shares allocated to participants under the DRP would be acquired on market. The Company proposes that shares will be issued under the DRP, rather than acquired on market.




Can anyone tell me what this means? Promptly after this announcement the SP received a small little burst.


----------



## skc (16 August 2015)

Tyler Durden said:


> NPAT 334.5m, up 157.5%
> 
> Dividend of 10c per share.
> 
> ...




When existing holders take up their DRP, they accept shares in lieu of cash dividends. There are 2 ways for the company to satisfy these "new shares". 

1. They can issue new new shares to the holder, and as a consequence increase the total share on issue and actually have the cash in the bank rather than paying it out to the holder. 

2. They can buy their own existing shares on the market. This way the total shares on issue is unchanged and the cash is more or less paid out to the holder in a round-about way. This is sometimes called DRP neutralisation.

There isn't any absolute positive or negative in each situation. However, when a company needs capital to grow, they should in theory be retiainng the cash and issuing new shares under the DRP (i.e. option 1).


----------



## Tyler Durden (18 August 2015)

skc said:


> When existing holders take up their DRP, they accept shares in lieu of cash dividends. There are 2 ways for the company to satisfy these "new shares".
> 
> 1. They can issue new new shares to the holder, and as a consequence increase the total share on issue and actually have the cash in the bank rather than paying it out to the holder.
> 
> ...




Ok thanks, but shouldn't the SP go down a bit if they are going to issue new shares because it dilutes the current amount on market?


----------



## skc (18 August 2015)

Tyler Durden said:


> Ok thanks, but shouldn't the SP go down a bit if they are going to issue new shares because it dilutes the current amount on market?




1. I don't think the market movement was related to the DRP announcement. It was probably just coincidental timing wise.

2. Dilution is tiny. Dividend each period is something like 2%. If half of the investors take up the DRP, there'd at most be 1% increase in shares on issue. But these new shares are issued at close to the last trade price... so the dilution is very minimal.


----------



## Tyler Durden (2 September 2015)

skc said:


> 1. I don't think the market movement was related to the DRP announcement. It was probably just coincidental timing wise.
> 
> 2. Dilution is tiny. Dividend each period is something like 2%. If half of the investors take up the DRP, there'd at most be 1% increase in shares on issue. But these new shares are issued at close to the last trade price... so the dilution is very minimal.




Thanks skc. Never thought about that.


----------



## peter2 (30 April 2018)

It's been a long time between posts for this company. 
TAH has finally merged with TTS and the financing has been completed. IMO this should have been done 10-15 years ago. Back then, their bookmaking competition were local now they're multinational. 

After a losing trade I've started another using the current daily setup. The weekly trend is down so this trade is most definitely a reversal.


----------



## Ann (20 March 2019)

TAH listed Friday August the 26th 1994 its initial price was $1.11 today it closed at $4.73


----------



## greggles (6 November 2020)

Gap up today for TAH but can't figure out why. No news so far this month and volume appears to be within normal ranges. Currently up 13% to $4.

Any ideas?


----------



## Austwide (6 November 2020)

Maybe this

6 November 2020 ASX Market Announcements Australian Securities Exchange 20 Bridge Street Sydney NSW 2000 

Response to media article Tabcorp Holdings Limited (the Company or Tabcorp) refers to an article in today’s edition of The Australian titled “Private equity and Matthew Tripp circle Tabcorp in potential break-up deal for wagering giant”. Tabcorp is not aware of, and has not received, any proposal in respect of the Company or its businesses.

 This announcement was authorised for release by the Tabcorp Chairman, Paula Dwyer.


----------



## greggles (6 November 2020)

Austwide said:


> Maybe this
> 
> 6 November 2020 ASX Market Announcements Australian Securities Exchange 20 Bridge Street Sydney NSW 2000
> 
> ...




That'll be it. Thanks! The response hadn't been released when I posted. Although it has reminded me to always check the mainstream media when you see strange share price movements of listed companies where there are no announcements to explain it.


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## Dona Ferentes (18 April 2021)

Comments from Sandon Capital SNC - an 'activist' investor

_After previously disclosing that it had received a number of unsolicited approaches and proposals in relation to a potential transaction involving its Wagering & Media (W&M) business, Tabcorp Holdings Ltd (TAH) announced that it had “decided to undertake a strategic review to assess and evaluate all structural and ownership options to maximise the value of TAH’s businesses for the benefit of shareholders”. 

We have long argued that TAH’s Lotteries and W&M businesses have distinctly different business models that should not be housed under the same corporate umbrella.  We are pleased to see new Chairman, Steven Gregg, take steps to potentially streamline and simplify TAH’s corporate structure following what were clearly lowball offers for the company’s W&M business.  Importantly, the strategic review does not rule out any options that may be pursued and we were particularly encouraged by Chairman Gregg’s comments in the press that “you just need to make shareholders get the best result”.  The delay in appointing a replacement for the departing CEO was also, in our view, a common-sense decision.

After many years of operational and financial underperformance, it seems that the wheel at TAH might be finally starting to turn, with shareholders set to benefit. _


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## divs4ever (17 May 2022)

Treatment of Tabcorp Holdings Limited
Demerger within the S&P/ASX 200 Index
SYDNEY, MAY 17, 2022: S&P Dow Jones Indices announced today that it will make the following
changes in the S&P/ASX 200 Index, as a result of the scheme of arrangement under which Tabcorp
Holdings Limited (XASX: TAH) will spin-off The Lottery Corporation Limited (XASX: TLC).
Tabcorp Holdings Limited will spin-off 1 share of The Lottery Corporation Limited for every 1 Tabcorp
Holdings Limited share held. The Lottery Corporation Limited will be added to the S&P/ASX 200 Index
effective prior to the open of trading on May 24, 2022 at a zero price.
There will be no removal from the S&P/ASX 200 Index as a result of the inclusion of The Lottery
Corporation Limited.


=====================================================================

DYOR

i hold TAH ( currently up 102% , for me )

 decisions , decisions  .. will i try to grab some extra  when TLC  starts trading   OR wait and see if TAH plummets in price 

 ( TAH was originally  bought as a 'safe-haven ' to resist the crash i wrongly predicted for 2013  , and bought some TTS  later thinking they would merge with TAH  , at least i got that one correct )

 looks like more work for Joe , though, adding a new stock to the system


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## Miner (24 May 2022)

divs4ever said:


> Treatment of Tabcorp Holdings Limited
> Demerger within the S&P/ASX 200 Index
> SYDNEY, MAY 17, 2022: S&P Dow Jones Indices announced today that it will make the following
> changes in the S&P/ASX 200 Index, as a result of the scheme of arrangement under which Tabcorp
> ...



Do you still hold TAH ?
Today price crash was interesting though on face value the real effect of the reduction far lower than 80% drop once the demerger and share issue to current holders is considered.
@divs4ever - what is your analysis please? DNH.


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## divs4ever (25 May 2022)

yes i still hold and was trying ( unsuccessfully ) to increase the holding

 well  clearly  my analysis  is incorrect   if the current sell-off  has any basis

 i was thinking a price of $2.50 was possible  after the split ( not ridiculously high )

 now sure racing/sport activity  has been massively impacted over the last two years  , but i was expecting that to recover in the mid-term ( too many very rich and influential people  involved in the racing industry  as owners/part-owners  , and to a less extent in the other 'sports' bet on

 after yesterday the market implies TLC is about 75%    of the original company profit  , and while less impacted by the virus response was still impacted ( less folks sitting in bars playing keno )

 what we don't seem to know  is what are the underlying costs  for keno  , surely they will be sharing some on the revenue/turnover to the hotels ( as would TAH  for the betting facilities  there ) ... surely TLC doesn't get a free-ride rent-wise  , the lottery business  should be less of a tangle

 does the market factor in  one or more lock-down sagas  ( and if so why the high valuation of TLC , which one would still expect to be impacted , but to a lesser extent than TLC )

 does the market think sports-betting is dying ?? ( less football , boxing, horse-racing  while greyhound racing has already been  crushed )

 i might have to rethink the whole 'entertainment industry ' because that is what the TAH sell-down is implying ( massively reduced public-gatherings in the future )


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## Country Lad (26 May 2022)

The sum of the parts was 4.6% higher than the whole at opening on the day of the demerger.
At today's close, the sum of the parts is 6.3% higher than the the whole before demerger. 
TAH is down and TLC is up. Could be the market has lost interest in TAH now that the most valuable part of the business is gone. TAH is a company I avoided and even more so now.

This is what the new TAH looks like after the demerger.


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## Knobby22 (27 May 2022)

divs4ever said:


> yes i still hold and was trying ( unsuccessfully ) to increase the holding
> 
> well  clearly  my analysis  is incorrect   if the current sell-off  has any basis
> 
> ...



It just represents the huge competition from overseas owned wagering companies who are continually stealing market share.


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## dyna (30 September 2022)

S.P. still at 93 cents.
That must be about what Vangard paid last week for over 100 million shares , taking it to a 5 % holding of TAH's capital. ( Not allowed to go beyond 10% )

Doom and gloom. Sky falling in. Etc , etc.

But the pro's don't waste a good buying opportunity, to top up.


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## divs4ever (30 September 2022)

i added extra   ( doubled the original holding ) after the TLC divestment ( but before the recent div. ) i also participate in the DRP

 i consider this a 'safe haven ' ( SOME folks  will accelerate their gambling in desperate times )

 doom and gloom ( without imploding the company )  is a good scenario for this sector


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## Belli (30 September 2022)

dyna said:


> That must be about what Vangard paid last week for over 100 million shares , taking it to a 5 % holding of TAH's capital. ( Not allowed to go beyond 10% )




I'd be cautious about drawing any inferences the Vanguard Group being a substantial shareholder.  TAH has been in the ASX 300 index for years but in VAS accounts for only 0.1% of assets which is Sweet of FA.  A rebalancing of the weight and purchases across other Vanguard products does not mean Vanguard brought 100m shares on a particular date.  Even the purchase of say 5m across all products in the Vanguard Group could cause this and just as easily the sale of 5m shares across the group could well mean the group won't be a substantial holder.


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