# Tony Abbott is Gorne



## Garpal Gumnut (24 February 2015)

As a quick search will realise, I spent some time and 98 petrol ensuring that Tony Abbott would be elected as Liberal Leader in the dark days of ALP power.

I am now calling for Tony Abbott to relinquish the leadership of the Liberal Party and step down as PM.

He has not performed well as PM, he was a brilliant Opposition Leader.

I am driving tonight to Canberra, in the Arnage, to influence the movement of self interest and votes to a new PM. 

I should be at the NSW Border by sunset tomorrow.

I will check on your opinions on a suitable successor then.

gg


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## noco (24 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> As a quick search will realise, I spent some time and 98 petrol ensuring that Tony Abbott would be elected as Liberal Leader in the dark days of ALP power.
> 
> I am now calling for Tony Abbott to relinquish the leadership of the Liberal Party and step down as PM.
> 
> ...




GG, you must admit the left wing socialists media outlets are doing their best to destroy Abbott where ever they can....They pick on the most trivial things and exploit them to the fullest.

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...a_has_to_drag_down_abbott_is_this_really_wor/


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## drsmith (24 February 2015)

There remains at the very least some determined advocacy for change in his office.


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## Bintang (24 February 2015)

OMG. It's another political thread.

Pinkboy are you on the case?



pinkboy said:


> Seriously?  ASF needs another one of these threads? Seriously?
> 
> The domination of political and religious threads is almost on part with actual share trading threads. Can this question not be asked in a current thread?
> 
> ...


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## sptrawler (24 February 2015)

noco said:


> GG, you must admit the left wing socialists media outlets are doing their best to destroy Abbott where ever they can....They pick on the most trivial things and exploit them to the fullest.
> 
> http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...a_has_to_drag_down_abbott_is_this_really_wor/




I tend to think, him stepping down before the next election, was always on the cards.
He was a reluctant leader and is absorbing all the blame, for putting unsavoury medicine on the agenda.

Who replaces him, my favourite would be Scott Morrison.


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## Bintang (24 February 2015)

noco said:


> GG, you must admit the left wing socialists media outlets are doing their best to destroy Abbott where ever they can....They pick on the most trivial things and exploit them to the fullest.




'The Australian' is doing a pretty good job as well.  Has Rupert Murdoch had a sudden 'on the road to Damascus' conversion to left wing socialism?


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## drsmith (24 February 2015)

Bintang said:


> 'The Australian' is doing a pretty good job as well.  Has Rupert Murdoch had a sudden 'on the road to Damascus' conversion to left wing socialism?



He's publically stated he wants Peta Credlin out of the picture.


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## Garpal Gumnut (24 February 2015)

noco said:


> GG, you must admit the left wing socialists media outlets are doing their best to destroy Abbott where ever they can....They pick on the most trivial things and exploit them to the fullest.
> 
> http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...a_has_to_drag_down_abbott_is_this_really_wor/






drsmith said:


> There remains at the very least some determined advocacy for change in his office.






sptrawler said:


> I tend to think, him stepping down before the next election, was always on the cards.
> He was a reluctant leader and is absorbing all the blame, for putting unsavoury medicine on the agenda.
> 
> Who replaces him, my favourite would be Scott Morrison.






Bintang said:


> 'The Australian' is doing a pretty good job as well.  Has Rupert Murdoch had a sudden 'on the road to Damascus' conversion to left wing socialism?






drsmith said:


> He's publically stated he wants Peta Credlin out of the picture.




I wish to thank all ASF commentators on this thread. 

I presently rest at the Alligator Ck. servo, just South of Townsville on my Pilgrimage in the Arnage to Canberra.

I know Tony must go. 

I am unsure who should replace him.

btw, the Potato Scallops at the Alligator Ck. Servo are par excellence as my Frenchie forebears would have said. 

gg


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## drsmith (24 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I presently rest at the Alligator Ck. servo, just South of Townsville on my Pilgrimage in the Arnage to Canberra.



It sounds like a long night of coffee ahead.


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## Garpal Gumnut (24 February 2015)

drsmith said:


> It sounds like a long night of coffee ahead.




It is a popular servo.

I will stay awake tonight. 

gg


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## sydboy007 (24 February 2015)

Just someone with a bit of backbone, wont pander to the rent seekers, can explain the whys of what needs to be done, and can show a bit of humility and fairness in the way they go about their work.


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## Bintang (24 February 2015)

sydboy007 said:


> Just someone with a bit of backbone, wont pander to the rent seekers, can explain the whys of what needs to be done, and can show a bit of humility and fairness in the way they go about their work.




You are suggesting a non-politician. How is that going to work?


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## cynic (24 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> ...
> I know Tony must go.
> 
> I am unsure who should replace him.
> ...



You'd certainly get my vote GG!


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## Garpal Gumnut (24 February 2015)

sydboy007 said:


> Just someone with a bit of backbone, wont pander to the rent seekers, can explain the whys of what needs to be done, and can show a bit of humility and fairness in the way they go about their work.






Bintang said:


> You are suggesting a non-politician. How is that going to work?




John Howard was such a person.

gg


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## Bintang (24 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> John Howard was such a person.
> 
> gg




Invite him back then.


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## IrishDigger (24 February 2015)

sptrawler said:


> ..............
> 
> Who replaces him, my favourite would be Scott Morrison.




:iagree:


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## Garpal Gumnut (24 February 2015)

cynic said:


> You'd certainly get my vote GG!




Thanks mate,

Being realistic my next stop is the Marlborough Pub if it's survived Marcia, and a camp there and then on down to the border.

gg


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## Caveman (24 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I should be at the NSW Border by sunset tomorrow.
> 
> I will check on your opinions on a suitable successor then.
> 
> gg




Well after some serious thought I would choose Mickey Mouse over Donald Duck.


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## noco (24 February 2015)

Caveman said:


> Well after some serious thought I would choose Mickey Mouse over Donald Duck.




I think I will start another thread.....Will Shorten  convert to Islam?...Oh no, not another political thread.


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## Bintang (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> I think I will start another thread.....Will Shorten  convert to Islam?...Oh no, not another political thread.




It will be a very short (pun intended) thread.
The short answer is, "yes, if he thinks it is what he needs to do to win over the West of Sydney voters".

Anyway conversion to islam is no big deal. I know many Westerners who have converted to Islam in order to get married to muslims. They all admit that before converting they were bad Christians and after conversion they just become bad muslims instead.


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## Caveman (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> I think I will start another thread.....Will Shorten  convert to Islam?...Oh no, not another political thread.




:O
OK


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## noco (25 February 2015)

Bintang said:


> It will be a very short (pun intended) thread.
> The short answer is, "yes, if he thinks it is what he needs to do to win over the West of Sydney voters".
> 
> Anyway conversion to islam is no big deal. I know many Westerners who have converted to Islam in order to get married to muslims. They all admit that before converting they were bad Christians and after conversion they just become bad muslims instead.




Bill Shorten is a Fabian (communist) and would have to be an atheist...It sure would be a difficult conversion.


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## galumay (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> Bill Shorten is a Fabian (communist)




LOL! What arrant nonsense, I have known little bill for many years and one thing he is not is Fabian (communist). He is also Catholic.


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## chiff (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> Bill Shorten is a Fabian (communist) and would have to be an atheist...It sure would be a difficult conversion.




Perhaps if I said all people from Townsville are  redneck halfwits,and kept on repeating it,do you think that people would believe me?


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## SirRumpole (25 February 2015)

chiff said:


> Perhaps if I said all people from Townsville are  redneck halfwits,and kept on repeating it,do you think that people would believe me?






...


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## Bintang (25 February 2015)

chiff said:


> Perhaps if I said all people from Townsville are  redneck halfwits,and kept on repeating it,do you think that people would believe me?




According to Adolph Hitler, yes if the lie is big enough ( and except for people from Townsville)

“If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed"
― Adolf Hitler

Don't mind Noco though. 'Fabian' is just his favourite expression.


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## orr (25 February 2015)

The attached link will  test the attention span, it a few thousand words, of one or maybe two of the contributors to this thread, but for those capable of digesting the ideas presented in 'Fixing Politics', I'd be interested in critiques.

My pick, Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus he's got runs on the board.

http://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/...flannery-and-catriona-wallace/fixing-politics

For those with direct contact to Owen Harries, he just might be worth a call on this.


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## noco (25 February 2015)

Bintang said:


> According to Adolph Hitler, yes if the lie is big enough ( and except for people from Townsville)
> 
> “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed"
> ― Adolf Hitler
> ...




You must admit though when the Fabian Society is mentioned as being associated with the Green/Labor left wing Party, it sure ruffles a few feathers.


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## drsmith (25 February 2015)

sptrawler said:


> I tend to think, him stepping down before the next election, was always on the cards.
> He was a reluctant leader and is absorbing all the blame, for putting unsavoury medicine on the agenda.
> 
> Who replaces him, my favourite would be Scott Morrison.



Time to give Scott Morrison a broader public political experience could be a possibility.

His public appearances are certainly stepping up including a National Press Club speech today at 12:30pm.


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## luutzu (25 February 2015)

Bintang said:


> According to Adolph Hitler, yes if the lie is big enough ( and except for people from Townsville)
> 
> “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed"
> ― Adolf Hitler
> ...




Yea, Fabian sounds nice. A bit like Fabio. haha


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## noco (25 February 2015)

drsmith said:


> Time to give Scott Morrison a broader public political experience could be a possibility.
> 
> His public appearances are certainly stepping up including a National Press Club speech today at 12:30pm.




Doc,  Scott Morrison is my favorite but don't write off Abbott just yet.....There has been a marked  up swing in the polls for Abbott...Whether he can maintain that swing, we will have to wait and see....The Abbott pugilistic approach is starting to appear....Maybe the public are starting to see the true colors of Shorten and that is, he stands for nothing.


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## noco (25 February 2015)

luutzu said:


> Yea, Fabian sounds nice. A bit like Fabio. haha




My friend, do you know anything at all about the Fabian Society?

From your response, it is pretty obvious, you have very little knowledge of their activities.


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## burglar (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> My friend, do you know anything at all about the Fabian Society?
> 
> From your response, it is pretty obvious, you have very little knowledge of their activities.




Give the kid a break, ... he was just trying to lighten the topic.
Gawd knows, it is dour enough to have a non-performer as Prim Monster!

:


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## Wysiwyg (25 February 2015)

sptrawler said:


> Who replaces him, my favourite would be Scott Morrison.



That guy is totalitarian.


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## sydboy007 (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> Bill Shorten is a Fabian (communist) and would have to be an atheist...It sure would be a difficult conversion.




Aetheism is just one thing... That the burden of proof that there is a good has not been met. 

Personally I'd have more confidence in an atheist relying on their internal moral compass than a religious person relying on the morality in the Bible with great truths like beating your slave is OK as long as they don't die within a day. 

We have Robb lining up to sell out the county in the TPP. We pay an extra $200M a year on pharmaceuticals because of the Howard AUS US FTA, with that cost likely to balloon under the TPP.  Worshipping at the altar of managed trade masquerading as free trade is costing us dearly


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## Garpal Gumnut (25 February 2015)

noco said:


> Doc,  Scott Morrison is my favorite but don't write off Abbott just yet.....There has been a marked  up swing in the polls for Abbott...Whether he can maintain that swing, we will have to wait and see....The Abbott pugilistic approach is starting to appear....Maybe the public are starting to see the true colors of Shorten and that is, he stands for nothing.




A wise comment noco. I have booked in to the Bororen Hotel tonight, an oasis of cool.
Good food done. Cold beer. Accomodation fit for a Klingon. Excellent conversation, one table discussing Sartre, another Foucault, you get the ambiance.

I spent some time this morning with an ancient LNP major domo in Rocky.( Rockhampton)

He agrees that Tony is gorne. 

I am deciding who I should anoint as next leader of the Liberal Party and PM of this great nation. 

Scott Morrison is very good value, he taught Johnnie Human Smuggler where to take his dhow.

I will continue my journey, to Canberra for Tony's demise,  tomorrow. 

gg


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## drsmith (25 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Accomodation fit for a Klingon.



Surely a gentleman of your stature is fit for something a little more upmarket than a class 9 transport pod.



> The class 9 transport pod featured accommodations fit for a Klingon (i.e. none). Giving her only the essential space she required was what they would have given any Klingon. Giving her padding such as a pillow would have been considered an insult by Klingons, much the way Kurn did when he first met Worf.




http://www.klingon.org/smboard/index.php?topic=1011.20;wap2


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## basilio (25 February 2015)

Well indeed Tony Abbott is gone.  But you only have to look at how deep a hole he is digging to realise he is intending to inter at least half the Liberal Party with his good self.

I understand he sees himself as an Egyptian King who took his retinue with him into the afterlife for company.

So far Senator Brandis has attached himself firmly to the rope. When the Attorney General is being investigated for corruption and has effectively acknowledged this in the public arena - the signs arn't good.

In fact I think almost all of the Ministers  and members who have decided to follow the PM's attack on Gillian Trigg as a loyalty feat are tied to the same rope.  So when one goes down the hole ... you can connect the dots.  ( Be a shame if Julie Bishop can't wriggle out...)

Good luck GG. I'm sure in your own inimitable fashion you will dispatch the ungodly and the unelectable  and secure a righteous new Fuhrer for our beloved Liberal party. 



> *Tony Abbott's leadership facing renewed questions with Malcolm Turnbull breaking ranks*
> 
> Date
> February 25, 2015 - 6:48PM
> ...




http://www.canberratimes.com.au/fed...-turnbull-breaking-ranks-20150225-13osve.html

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-po...campaign-against-himself-20150225-13ori0.html


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## Tisme (25 February 2015)

I have a doubt that Abbott is gorne. He seems to revel in a scrap and in the absence of anyone to attack in the Labor Party except past regimes, I think he might relish a stoush with Malcolm just to hone his skills.


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## sptrawler (25 February 2015)

Tisme said:


> I have a doubt that Abbott is gorne. He seems to revel in a scrap and in the absence of anyone to attack in the Labor Party except past regimes, I think he might relish a stoush with Malcolm just to hone his skills.




The absence of someone to attack on the opposition benches, would be because those of any quality resigned after the last term fiasco.
All that's left are the back stabbing dregs.IMO


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## drsmith (25 February 2015)

I hope GG isn't on a 1-way trip to Rura Penthe in that class 9 transport pod.


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## Garpal Gumnut (25 February 2015)

basilio said:


> Well indeed Tony Abbott is gone.  But you only have to look at how deep a hole he is digging to realise he is intending to inter at least half the Liberal Party with his good self.
> 
> I understand he sees himself as an Egyptian King who took his retinue with him into the afterlife for company.
> 
> ...




basilio,

My thoughts are similar though cupped by an allegiance to the Libs.

Could not have put it better meself.

gg


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## burglar (26 February 2015)

drsmith said:


> Surely a gentleman of your stature is fit for something a little more upmarket than a class 9 transport pod ...



GG 
Did you blow a seal in the Arnage?


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## SirRumpole (26 February 2015)

I would expect TA to sack MT from the Cabinet pretty soon. 

Probably the last desperate gasp in his failed leadership.


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## noco (26 February 2015)

SirRumpole said:


> I would expect TA to sack MT from the Cabinet pretty soon.
> 
> Probably the last desperate gasp in his failed leadership.




Rumpy, I can't see that ever happening.


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## SirRumpole (26 February 2015)

noco said:


> Rumpy, I can't see that ever happening.




You're probably right, Turnbull will most likely get in first.


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## Garpal Gumnut (26 February 2015)

I am in Dubbo tonight, Canberra tomorrow.

I tend towards supporting Malcolm T.

The spill is on I am told. 

gg


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## Bintang (26 February 2015)

noco said:


> Bill Shorten is a Fabian (communist) and would have to be an atheist...It sure would be a difficult conversion.






galumay said:


> LOL! What arrant nonsense, I have known little bill for many years and one thing he is not is Fabian (communist). He is also Catholic.






chiff said:


> Perhaps if I said all people from Townsville are  redneck halfwits,and kept on repeating it,do you think that people would believe me?






noco said:


> You must admit though when the Fabian Society is mentioned as being associated with the Green/Labor left wing Party, it sure ruffles a few feathers.




I have taken the liberty of expanding on this theme in the V8 Supercars thread which might seem a strange place but I hope you don't mind.


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## drsmith (26 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I am in Dubbo tonight, Canberra tomorrow.



That's good to hear. There's a beaming shield on Rura Penthe that makes escape impossible, well, almost.

Hopefully your accommodation tonight is a little more comfortable than the class 9 transport pod.


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## explod (26 February 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I am in Dubbo tonight, Canberra tomorrow.
> 
> I tend towards supporting Malcolm T.
> 
> ...




Yep they are talking spill and Turnbull on main street media now and he has numbers now.


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## explod (27 February 2015)

Preview channell 7 news headline,  

"THERE WILL BE A CHANGE OF PRIME MINISTER NEXT WEEK"

Anyhow, 

Did you know that  the methane now escaping from under the two poles ice caps and Greenland is producing 20 times more Co2 than all the power stations on the planet. 

So,,,  just party GAME OVER and no one cares.


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## Garpal Gumnut (27 February 2015)

explod said:


> Preview channell 7 news headline,
> 
> "THERE WILL BE A CHANGE OF PRIME MINISTER NEXT WEEK"
> 
> ...




explod , you have hit on Truth. 

Nobody cares, nobody gives a monkeys. 

Back to Canberra, a very old tie necking is being arranged.

Watch this space. 

gg


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## drsmith (3 March 2015)

GG,

Have you finished up in Canberra or Rura Penthe ?

If it's Rura Penthe, an ear to the ground will only get very cold.


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## basilio (3 March 2015)

I think I have changed my mind about Tony being gorne...

I mean I think he is still totally dead meat politically, rotting as we speak. But somehow, somehow everyone in the Liberal is just holding their nose and pretending it's all ok and desperately waiting for TA to liquefy and bury himself quietly while they all continue with with the pretence that  he is a political asset and that he can somehow be a respected, effective leader.

The spectre of an actual political burial seems too much to bear.

This will be so interesting....


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## sptrawler (3 March 2015)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I am in Dubbo tonight, Canberra tomorrow.
> 
> I tend towards supporting Malcolm T.
> 
> ...




If Malcolm replaces Tony, the coalition are gorne.


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## noco (3 March 2015)

basilio said:


> I think I have changed my mind about Tony being gorne...
> 
> I mean I think he is still totally dead meat politically, rotting as we speak. But somehow, somehow everyone in the Liberal is just holding their nose and pretending it's all ok and desperately waiting for TA to liquefy and bury himself quietly while they all continue with with the pretence that  he is a political asset and that he can somehow be a respected, effective leader.
> 
> ...




Turnbull and the rebels have gone to water since the new poll showing a marked improvement in the Liberal standing.

Liberals up 4 points.

Labor down 4 points.

The Liberals are  now well ahead of Labor before preferences.

So I would say the rebels have decided to pull their heads in.


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## sptrawler (3 March 2015)

noco said:


> Turnbull and the rebels have gone to water since the new poll showing a marked improvement in the Liberal standing.
> 
> Liberals up 4 points.
> 
> ...




People and the press can talk all the crap they like, but at the end of the day, the truth holds up.

What has Abbott said, nothing other than the truth, the system is unsustainable.

No matter how Shorten wants to wrap up his $hit, it is still unsustainable, and he will choke on it.IMO

Unless he can come up with some viable way to support the welfare system, he is a goner, big time.

They didn't come up with any sensible remedy, when in office and blocking their own budget measures, shows they don't have a clue in opposition.

Silly Billy, sitting there with a grin, saying "trust me" isn't going to cut it. IMO


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## sails (4 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> If Malcolm replaces Tony, the coalition are gorne.




That's my feeling too.  I suspect an unprecedented number of informal notes as a protest vote by disenchanted Libs.  Morriison has been hitting some impressive runs and is shaping up well for the top job sometime in the future, imo.


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## Logique (4 March 2015)

There's a lot of unspoken payback for Gillard within Fairfax and the ABC, they are beside themselves.


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## pixel (4 March 2015)

sails said:


> Originally Posted by sptrawler:
> _If Malcolm replaces Tony, the coalition are gorne._
> 
> That's my feeling too.  I suspect an unprecedented number of informal notes as a protest vote by disenchanted Libs.  Morriison has been hitting some impressive runs and is shaping up well for the top job sometime in the future, imo.




I doubt that very much.
The hardline Lib/Nat voters won't change their affiliation, no matter what.
Turnbull will in turn be palatable for a significant number of middle-of-the-road swingers, who want to see clean environment, clean balance sheets, and clean work ethics. Abbott and the bulk of his current front bench are a legacy on all those fronts, and provided Turnbull gets the numbers in his own party, he is their best chance in the 2016 Federal Election.

The sooner Abbott's captaincy is aborted, the greater the Libs' chances to turn the tide under Turnbull.


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## Tisme (4 March 2015)

pixel said:


> I doubt that very much.
> The hardline Lib/Nat voters won't change their affiliation, no matter what.
> Turnbull will in turn be palatable for a significant number of middle-of-the-road swingers, who want to see clean environment, clean balance sheets, and clean work ethics. Abbott and the bulk of his current front bench are a legacy on all those fronts, and provided Turnbull gets the numbers in his own party, he is their best chance in the 2016 Federal Election.
> 
> The sooner Abbott's captaincy is aborted, the greater the Libs' chances to turn the tide under Turnbull.




Liberal voters are only 32% of the voting population so it relies on another party for coalition and lot of preferences. On that basis I think you are correct that Malcolm would be a seamless transition to the diehards and swinging voters. 

Whether Malcolm is a neo Liberal like Abbott and if the rusted on voters are wedded to the same extremes is an unknown, however a straw poll using the inane comments by some in this forum would suggest they have indeed travelled the same road to social class and ethnic disambiguation and that could be at odds with Malcolm's traditional Liberal Party social welfare middle class ethos. Once the idea that people deserve to live in misery because they don't have the means or ability to do otherwise without community support, that it's OK to expose children to taboo adult concepts at picture theatres and argue the point, etc., I would suspect it takes a strong bridle to bring them back to the land of the living.


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## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Tisme said:


> Once the idea that people deserve to live in misery because they don't have the means or ability to do otherwise without community support, that it's OK to expose children to taboo adult concepts at picture theatres and argue the point, etc., I would suspect it takes a strong bridle to bring them back to the land of the living.




Talk about going from the sublime to the ridiculous, that takes the cake. 
Extremism and fantasy writing at its best.


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## Julia (4 March 2015)

sails said:


> That's my feeling too.  I suspect an unprecedented number of informal notes as a protest vote by disenchanted Libs.  Morriison has been hitting some impressive runs and is shaping up well for the top job sometime in the future, imo.



Yes, largely agree here.  The people agitating for Turnbull are the Labor voters who see him as aligned to their own views and therefore more likely to swing the Coalition into agreement with Labor policy (if there actually is any).

Electing MT to the leadership again will cause a split, whether formal or just underlying, with the Nationals and the more conservative liberals.  MT is not a unifying sort of personality.  
I think they'd be better to persist with Mr Abbott, if necessary let him lose the next election, then change to either Julie Bishop or Scott Morrison, both of whom would have more capacity to get the whole of the Coalition behind them.

I couldn't vote for the Coalition if MT were to be leader again and I doubt my reaction would be unique by any means.


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## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> Yes, largely agree here.  The people agitating for Turnbull are the Labor voters who see him as aligned to their own views and therefore more likely to swing the Coalition into agreement with Labor policy (if there actually is any).
> 
> Electing MT to the leadership again will cause a split, whether formal or just underlying, with the Nationals and the more conservative liberals.  MT is not a unifying sort of personality.
> I think they'd be better to persist with Mr Abbott, if necessary let him lose the next election, then change to either Julie Bishop or Scott Morrison, both of whom would have more capacity to get the whole of the Coalition behind them.
> ...




My sentiments exactly.


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## noco (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> Yes, largely agree here.  The people agitating for Turnbull are the Labor voters who see him as aligned to their own views and therefore more likely to swing the Coalition into agreement with Labor policy (if there actually is any).
> 
> Electing MT to the leadership again will cause a split, whether formal or just underlying, with the Nationals and the more conservative liberals.  MT is not a unifying sort of personality.
> I think they'd be better to persist with Mr Abbott, if necessary let him lose the next election, then change to either Julie Bishop or Scott Morrison, both of whom would have more capacity to get the whole of the Coalition behind them.
> ...




Count me in as well....I am hoping the next poll will be an improvement on this weeks....If it does improve for Abbott it will show voters are starting to wake up to the Green/labor party....

Who knows, Bill Shorten's leadership may now come under threat and then we will see turmoil in the rank and file.


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## Tisme (4 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> Talk about going from the sublime to the ridiculous, that takes the cake.
> Extremism and fantasy writing at its best.





But true


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## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> My sentiments exactly.




So who would you vote for, the Nationals?


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## Julia (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> So who would you vote for, the Nationals?



I don't mean to cut across the question directed to sptrawler, but yes of course this is the dilemma.

As it happens my electorate only runs a National candidate anyway, but if they were still part of the Coalition led by MT, I wouldn't be able to vote for that National person, thoroughly decent bloke though he is.
Probably do an informal vote.
I hope it doesn't come to that.


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## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

It was directed to you also, Julia.
Informally voting just gives more voting power to others.

I can't understand  the dislike towards Turnbull personally especially if he keeps the Libs from losing.

Anyway Abbott has gone back on just about every budget measure now and appears to have learnt his lesson.
Maybe this time he can provide a fair budget and get support for it and restore some respect. 

One fly in the ointment is the trans-pacific free trade treaty that Australia is trying to get signed. The USA want stricter copyright laws, hopefully we don't fall for the 2 card trick twice. The last free trade policy with the USA was a disaster. 

One of the many nasty effects, if we agree to the US ambit terms, will mean we pay as much for drugs as they do, as generics will be effectively banned. Another is that US companies can sue the Australian Government. 

Personally I don't think Andrew Robb is that stupid, (but I'm not sure).


----------



## sydboy007 (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> It was directed to you also, Julia.
> Informally voting just gives more voting power to others.
> 
> I can't understand  the dislike towards Turnbull personally especially if he keeps the Libs from losing.
> ...




Even the business lobby groups are now getting worried about the secrecy surrounding the TPP.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/fed...partnership-negotiations-20150303-13tvtu.html



> The ACCI wants negotiating drafts to be shown to community and business groups who would then be under an obligation to keep them confidential.
> 
> Negotiators would retain their power to conclude deals without reference to the parliament but would be required to “properly consider and balance the merits of civil society’s views at all phases of negotiation”…
> 
> ...




Considering the US FTA is costing us at least $200M extra a year on the PBS, along with the crazy copy right extensions, I really hope this gets voted down in the senate if the US senate doesn't kill it off for us.

Why do we the people get no say in what is likely to to be the most restrictive managed trade deal we'll be shot gun weddinged into?


----------



## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

sydboy007 said:


> Even the business lobby groups are now getting worried about the secrecy surrounding the TPP.
> 
> http://www.canberratimes.com.au/fed...partnership-negotiations-20150303-13tvtu.html
> 
> ...




Thanks Sydboy. 
I can't understand how we sign these things. We must have the worst negotiators of any country. The one constant -Andrew Robb.


----------



## Julia (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> Informal voting just gives more voting power to others.



Yes, you're right.  I quite acknowledge that.



> I can't understand  the dislike towards Turnbull personally especially if he keeps the Libs from losing.



Well, Knobby, it has been expressed often enough.  Essentially, his world philosophy is much more aligned with Labor than with the Liberals/Nationals/Conservatives.

And he had his go at leading the party, when he went against the overwhelming wish of his party and crossed the floor to side with Labor over an ETS.

Then surely you recall what a total fool he made of himself over the Godwin Grech affair?  Allowed himself to be sucked into believing a complete set up with bogus emails, demanding the PM resign, and then make a humiliating public back down?

And as already stated above, he would not be a unifying figure.  The conservatives detest him.

And in polls, when asked "do you prefer Malcolm Turnbull or Tony Abbott as PM of Australia?" and MT is more popular, you need to consider that many of those responding to that question are Labor voters who will never vote Coalition in their wildest dreams, regardless of who leads it, but who would - like many here - prefer to see MT running the party because they know he's supportive of much of their own philosophy.


----------



## banco (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> And in polls, when asked "do you prefer Malcolm Turnbull or Tony Abbott as PM of Australia?" and MT is more popular, you need to consider that many of those responding to that question are Labor voters who will never vote Coalition in their wildest dreams, regardless of who leads it, but who would - like many here - prefer to see MT running the party because they know he's supportive of much of their own philosophy.




Yes bit with a much larger swinging voter population than used to be the case it's the party that can take a big slice of the swinging voter population that will win.  Plus with compulsory voting the hard core constitutency of the coalition and labor parties are forced to vote so no need to worry about them staying home and they generally don't have anywhere to go so end up voting the way they've always voted.


----------



## sydboy007 (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> Thanks Sydboy.
> I can't understand how we sign these things. We must have the worst negotiators of any country. The one constant -Andrew Robb.




Yes, he's very good at signing up open slather to the Australian market but waiting up to 20 years for our farmers to get much benefit from the deals.

But hey, they get the photo op from the signing, get to claim they're doing something, and unfortunately not many people actually understand how these managed trade deals work.  They herar XX billion in exttra trade over XX years and believe it.  Since the USA managed trade deal our trade deficit with them has ballooned.  Certainly a good deal for the country that wasn't desperate to sign at any cost.

I'm glad the ACCI is highlighting the spaghetti bowl effect that's caused by different rules in each managed trade deal.  Many smaller businesses don't have the resources to take advantage of most of the deals as there's no consistency between them.  They tend to benefit the large multinational companies that help design them.

Try reading up on the ROOs of a few managed trade deals and you'd probably find yourself in a padded cell.


----------



## Smurf1976 (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> And in polls, when asked "do you prefer Malcolm Turnbull or Tony Abbott as PM of Australia?" and MT is more popular, you need to consider that many of those responding to that question are Labor voters who will never vote Coalition in their wildest dreams, regardless of who leads it, but who would - like many here - prefer to see MT running the party because they know he's supportive of much of their own philosophy.




Another view would be that Tony Abbott is the single greatest asset the Labor party has. 

So long as Tony's leading the Coalition, Labor shouldn't have much trouble winning the next election.


----------



## SirRumpole (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> And as already stated above, he would not be a unifying figure.  The conservatives detest him.




That's only fair, most people detest Conservatives.

So Julia (and others), who is your "ideal" Conservative and why ?


----------



## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Tisme said:


> But true




Only in your mind, which despite your personal belief, doesn't amount to anything factual.


----------



## Tink (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> Yes, largely agree here.  The people agitating for Turnbull are the Labor voters who see him as aligned to their own views and therefore more likely to swing the Coalition into agreement with Labor policy (if there actually is any).
> 
> Electing MT to the leadership again will cause a split, whether formal or just underlying, with the Nationals and the more conservative liberals.  MT is not a unifying sort of personality.
> I think they'd be better to persist with Mr Abbott, if necessary let him lose the next election, then change to either Julie Bishop or Scott Morrison, both of whom would have more capacity to get the whole of the Coalition behind them.
> ...




Agree with your post too, Julia.


----------



## Julia (4 March 2015)

SirRumpole said:


> That's only fair, most people detest Conservatives.
> 
> So Julia (and others), who is your "ideal" Conservative and why ?



I don't know why you would assume I would have any 'favourite conservative'.   Surely my outline in previous posts deriding the views of the archetypal conservative have been clear enough.


----------



## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Smurf1976 said:


> Another view would be that Tony Abbott is the single greatest asset the Labor party has.
> 
> So long as Tony's leading the Coalition, Labor shouldn't have much trouble winning the next election.




That is very true smurph, he has born the brunt of blame for telling the public what they don't want to hear.

Whether this is his fault, or a combination of his lack of charisma and a media that obviously have an intense dislike of him, is anyones guess.

All negative aspects of the government are laid at Abbotts feet, it may well be great for press circulation and t.v presenters making cheap shots, however it does leave Labor with a big vacuum if Abbott steps down. Time will tell.


----------



## explod (4 March 2015)

On a lot of matters the Governmen have lost the power ballance in the Senate. 

With Abbott remaining in place it is now quite possible that the Senate could block supply and thereby force a double dissolution. 

And with growing discontent among Australian workers and the environmental reality gaining traction this could mean that we will see the last of liberal/country party governments at federal level. 

Interesting times.


----------



## explod (4 March 2015)

noco said:


> Count me in as well....I am hoping the next poll will be an improvement on this weeks....If it does improve for Abbott it will show voters are starting to wake up to the Green/labor party....
> 
> Who knows, Bill Shorten's leadership may now come under threat and then we will see turmoil in the rank and file.




Abit of wishful thinking in my view. 

Bill Shorten backed up by Tony Bourke is starting to settle in and performed very  well in Parliament in the last week or two.   Unlike the dribbling, and looks like raving  Rabbit,  Shorten is putting forward sensible  argument containing useful content that everyday people can relate to. 

The electorate responds to reason,  Abbott seems not to comprehen the meaning or importance.  Yes a bit of a rise in the polls but a focus on the Indonesian death penalty and wonder at Iraq could be doing that.


----------



## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> That is very true smurph, he has born the brunt of blame for telling the public what they don't want to hear.
> 
> Whether this is his fault, or a combination of his lack of charisma and a media that obviously have an intense dislike of him, is anyones guess.
> 
> .




It's not a guess its obvious: bare faced lying, totally incompetent and unfair first budget, total lack of diplomatic skills, partisan mentality. Fighting culture wars instead of governing. Anyone's guess? yea sure. 

If the Libs lose NSW which will be a disaster for the country, then the Feds can only blame themselves.


----------



## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

Julia said:


> Yes, you're right.  I quite acknowledge that.
> 
> 
> Well, Knobby, it has been expressed often enough.  Essentially, his world philosophy is much more aligned with Labor than with the Liberals/Nationals/Conservatives.
> ...




Turnbull is a conservative with some progressive policies relating to public issues. At heart he knows how to deal with big business and understands the economy. 

His biggest fault seems to me that he won't visit Rupert. Rudd did, Abbott did, Bishop did, how dare he! I want to vote Liberal but I won't be voting for Abbott again.


----------



## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> It's not a guess its obvious: bare faced lying, totally incompetent and unfair first budget, total lack of diplomatic skills, partisan mentality. Fighting culture wars instead of governing. Anyone's guess? yea sure.
> 
> If the Libs lose NSW which will be a disaster for the country, then the Feds can only blame themselves.




Let's be honest knobby, that sums up most of them. 
If they had any decency the first thing they would do is reign in their outrageous superannuation benefits.

Do you hear any of them Shorten, Abbott, Milne, Lambie, Palmer or any of the others saying that is unsustainable.

No, it is all about everyone else.

Maybe you could tell me a PM who hasn't lied, hasn't been considered incompetent and handed down a budget that people don't think is unfair.

I haven't seen anyone, get as much press coverage in my life.


----------



## basilio (4 March 2015)

I continue to  be surprised at the venom  directed to Malcolm Turnball as a potential Liberal leader. It seems his biggest failings are his relative centrist position on many policies, his intelligence and his capacity to develop good arguments

I have generally supported Labour governments and in fact would support a Greens government - but in the larger picture I have other criteria for valuing political leaders and political parties.

1) *I value good policy.*  Ideas that are reasonably fair, thoughtful and advance the broad interest of the country. I'd like to think that  Liberal, Labour or Green parties could come up with such ideas

2) *I value competence as a government. * Being able to effectively implement good policies and at least administer the country effectively.  This isn't a Lib/Labour matter.  

3)* I want to see intelligent leadership.* It makes a real difference to me to see a leader that doesn't sound like a Fxxxwit and can make and carry an intelligent argument. 

4) *I expect honest government*.  Ok a bit ambitious but who wants to see Ministers with their arms in the cookie jar? Or being clearly influenced by business interests and refusing to take actions  that are clearly necessary (banking failures/tax rorts by big business)? Or subservient to a union dicate at the expense of the broader community ?

I particularly despise the current government because it fails so abysmally on all the 4 points. It's policies are just not thought through, are often intrinsically unfair in their impact and not explained.  

The overall competence of  the Liberal Government is weak. Julie Bishop in Foreign affairs is clearly very good.  Malcolm Turnaball in Communications has been effective. The budget was a disaster. Unfair, divisive and incapable of being effectively sold.

The actions of the Attorny General are, in my mind , totally beyond the pale. He has no concept of defending  legal rights.  If anything he reminds me of Belke Peterson in his demolition of the separation of powers.

At the very top (or bottom) of the pile is Tony Abbott.  He has proven incapable of being a consultive or unifying PM.  He cannot/or will not develop an intelligent argument for his policies. He makes really, really dumb political decisions that alienate  far too many people and just make him and us look like nasty cretins. For example

1) Trying to bash up President Obama for speaking on Climate Change at the G20 
2) The utter madness of knighting Prince Phillip on Australia Day
3) The vindictive stupidity of attempting the bash the head of the Human Rights Commission for doing her job.  Every man and his jog has acknowledged that the smart move was to just take the report, point out what the government has done  and move on. 

All this a round about way of saying that on many of the points I raised Malcolm Turnball has demonstrated far more political skill than the current PM. If he is respected by many more people it is because he has something to respect. (As has Julie Bishop but probably not as good)


----------



## Knobby22 (4 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> Let's be honest knobby, that sums up most of them.
> If they had any decency the first thing they would do is reign in their outrageous superannuation benefits.
> 
> Do you hear any of them Shorten, Abbott, Milne, Lambie, Palmer or any of the others saying that is unsustainable.
> ...




I respectfully disagree, it was the worst budget I have ever seen and it lost my trust of him. John Cleese said last year that as he has gotten older he has realised that most world leaders have no idea how to run a country. Abbott definitely fits into that statement. He is proven incompetent...someone else please.


----------



## sptrawler (4 March 2015)

Knobby22 said:


> I respectfully disagree, it was the worst budget I have ever seen and it lost my trust of him. John Cleese said last year that as he has gotten older he has realised that most world leaders have no idea how to run a country. Abbott definitely fits into that statement. He is proven incompetent...someone else please.




I understand where you are coming from, and I think Abbott hasn't been able to overcome the issues and get the message across. I also agree Abbott will be out before next election, I think he will walk.
As for thinking that was the worst budget you have seen, I think we will be all in for a shock in the coming years.

If you are going to fund the health, education and welfare system with the current model, taxes will have to go through the roof.


----------



## moXJO (4 March 2015)

explod said:


> Abit of wishful thinking in my view.
> 
> Bill Shorten backed up by Tony Bourke is starting to settle in and performed very  well in Parliament in the last week or two.   Unlike the dribbling, and looks like raving  Rabbit,  Shorten is putting forward sensible  argument containing useful content that everyday people can relate to.
> 
> The electorate responds to reason,  Abbott seems not to comprehen the meaning or importance.  Yes a bit of a rise in the polls but a focus on the Indonesian death penalty and wonder at Iraq could be doing that.




Bill has been MIA for the majority of the time and crumbles under the spotlight. With all the skeletons in his closet he has a good chance of being turfed before the next election. The best outcome for the libs would be if Shorten remains.


----------



## Smurf1976 (5 March 2015)

sptrawler said:


> I understand where you are coming from, and I think Abbott hasn't been able to overcome the issues and get the message across.




I've encountered a few in various situations but I have never seen someone with a "born to rule" mentality succeed in the long term. They do well climbing the ladder, then fail miserably once they reach the top and succumb to self-induced group think.


----------



## drsmith (10 March 2015)

Transmission to Rura Penthe.............

TA is still very much on probation.

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2015/s4194419.htm


----------



## Logique (10 March 2015)

Sinodinos says he is in the conservative wing, yet his party room spill motion vote greatly helped the Turnbull supporters.

Other than that, he seems to be in the same place on the Abbott leadership as many in here (reports of his political death.. etc)

Where is the Garpal pilgrimage, is the Arnage idling by the side of the road in Goulburn?


----------



## banco (10 March 2015)

Logique said:


> Sinodinos says he is in the conservative wing, yet his party room spill motion vote greatly helped the Turnbull supporters.
> 
> Other than that, he seems to be in the same place on the Abbott leadership as many in here (reports of his political death.. etc)
> 
> Where is the Garpal pilgrimage, is the Arnage idling by the side of the road in Goulburn?




Sinodinos is pissed at TA because Peta Credlin put a knife in his back.


----------



## sptrawler (10 March 2015)

banco said:


> Sinodinos is pissed at TA because Peta Credlin put a knife in his back.




Now your being one of them misogynist thingamejigs.


----------



## banco (10 March 2015)

Joe Hockey is apparently such a poor communicator even his chief of staff misunderstands him:

Mr Hockey denied instructing the forum, through his chief of staff Grant Lovett, to return the money, despite an email from his chief of staff suggesting that he did.

"I don't instruct or control the money of the NSF," Mr Hockey said.

Mr Hockey said Mr Lovett may have interpreted it as an instruction.

"I told my chief of staff I was appalled at the suggestion and I hoped they actually do that," he said.

http://www.afr.com/p/national/politics/hockey_trial_don_instruct_or_control_cJWgCO3Dp4ntuDHHn39mHJ


----------



## drsmith (10 March 2015)

Logique said:


> Where is the Garpal pilgrimage, is the Arnage idling by the side of the road in Goulburn?



I remain worried that the accommodation fit for a Klingon has in fact taken him to a place colder than the nunnery.

I hope he hasn't been seduced by a shapeshifter posing as an attractive young lady.


----------



## sptrawler (11 March 2015)

drsmith said:


> I remain worried that the accommodation fit for a Klingon has in fact taken him to a place colder than the nunnery.
> 
> I hope he hasn't been seduced by a shapeshifter posing as an attractive young lady.




It would appear Sir Garpul's over riding vote wasn't required and the quest was in vain.

However one can only hope the business tax write off, doesn't become a political football, when GG moves into public convenien sorry public office.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

https://www.2gb.com/former-pm-phones-the-open-line-over-extraordinary-double-standard/


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

Tisme said:


> https://www.2gb.com/former-pm-phones-the-open-line-over-extraordinary-double-standard/




Another thing I agree with TA about.

I'm starting to get worried.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Another thing I agree with TA about.
> 
> I'm starting to get worried.




Well he stutters less for starters and has a contrasting voice to the vanishing and simpering man who calls himself Malcolm Turnbull.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

Tisme said:


> Well he stutters less for starters and has a contrasting voice to the vanishing and simpering man who calls himself Malcolm Turnbull.




Yes, but his economic policy stinks so I would never vote for him.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes, but his economic policy stinks so I would never vote for him.




The guy is a dickhed and worse he truly hates the working class.... a Thatcherite to the core. But that doesn't mean some of his virtues are wrong.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

Tisme said:


> The guy is a dickhed and worse he truly hates the working class.... a Thatcherite to the core. But that doesn't mean some of his virtues are wrong.




I agree, we should look at what everyone says on their merits and not just dump them into a Left/Right box.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> I agree, we should look at what everyone says on their merits and not just dump them into a Left/Right box.




I can't help but think people like Tony are hypocritical when it comes to freedom of expression rights, when he's so welded to a religion that denied entire nations the rights to have opposing views to church dogma.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

Tisme said:


> I can't help but think people like Tony are hypocritical when it comes to freedom of expression rights, when he's so welded to a religion that denied entire nations the rights to have opposing views to church dogma.




Conflict of theology vs democracy, the evil of religion.


----------



## Tink (7 June 2018)

Well I have often mentioned Ronald Reagan -
_If we ever forget that we are One nation under God, we will be a nation gone under._

--------------

imv, what I found interesting with Tony Abbott was the ABC's constant attack on his beliefs, but then, they didn't look at their own beliefs that they were trying to push.

I was against the change of Abbott to Turnbull.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2018)

If the change didn't happen your PM today would've been Bill Shorten.

Abbott was a wrecker in opposition, a wrecker as PM and now a wrecker in the backbench.

The reason he is hypocritical is because he is a fake without knowledge or conviction.

All the attributes of a self confessed liar.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Conflict of theology vs democracy, the evil of religion.




Trouble is that in the denial of established theology, the void is filled with a new religion, nowdays that is the bulsh1t that all men (sic) are created equal and entitled to quash anyone who breaks out against the mob mentality.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

PZ99 said:


> If the change didn't happen your PM today would've been Bill Shorten.




Some may say that if another change doesn't happen then Shorten will be PM after the next election.

Despite his faults he would be worth a try in preference to the most qualified non achieving PM in the nation's history.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

Tink said:


> Well I have often mentioned Ronald Reagan -
> _If we ever forget that we are One nation under God, we will be a nation gone under._
> 
> --------------
> ...




And you are right about the beatup, but he didn't have the nous to navigate through it. Personally I don't like his politics because he is a Machiavellian divisive hater/wrecker and I have held a disdain for Turnbull being a hollow man going way back.

It's like we are trapped in a vacuum of choice. And I have real reservations about what Labor stands for with it's overt bias in propelling aberrant social choices (gender, sexual choices, ethnicity, etc)  into the vanguard of policy ahead of traditional labour and national concerns.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Some may say that if another change doesn't happen then Shorten will be PM after the next election.
> 
> Despite his faults he would be worth a try in preference to the most qualified non achieving PM in the nation's history.




That's gotta be a hurt for you, because I recall you had great expectations for the man.


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

Tisme said:


> That's gotta be a hurt for you, because I recall you had great expectations for the man.




Yes, I thought Malcolm had some promise, but he's caved in to the Right in his party especially in terms of energy policy and the might of the coal lobby, and he's stuffed the NBN.

The only victory he's had is on gay marriage, which means bugger all to most of us.


----------



## Tisme (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Yes, I thought Malcolm had some promise, but he's caved in to the Right in his party especially in terms of energy policy and the might of the coal lobby, and he's stuffed the NBN.
> 
> The only victory he's had is on gay marriage, which means bugger all to most of us.




The sight of him selling the LNP vandalised NBN fiasco while in the bleachers was enough to quench any flicker of hope I had for him. Very unedifying.


----------



## PZ99 (7 June 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Some may say that if another change doesn't happen then Shorten will be PM after the next election.
> 
> Despite his faults he would be worth a try in preference to the most qualified non achieving PM in the nation's history.



Bill Shorten you mean? Yeah, why not? He's wrecked 3 Prime Ministers so why not a fourth? LOL


----------



## SirRumpole (7 June 2018)

PZ99 said:


> Bill Shorten you mean? Yeah, why not? He's wrecked 3 Prime Ministers so why not a fourth? LOL




Well, if he stuffs two Labor PM's and two Liberal PMs you can't call him biased can you ?


----------



## moXJO (7 June 2018)

Didn't labor just say that tax was gender biased in this country. God help us.


----------



## Tink (8 June 2018)

PZ, it is history now, but I don't agree with that.

What I see now is the same directed at Trump.

Yet these same people sang the praises of Castro.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2018)

What you see directed at Trump and/or Abbott is Karma.

It's nothing compared to what was directed at Gillard. There's a lot to be learned from that.

History shows a clean backyard has its merits. A dirty one has baggage


----------



## Tink (8 June 2018)

You are entitled to your view, PZ.


----------



## PZ99 (8 June 2018)

Thankyou Tink 

_Go the Panthers..._
_


_​


----------



## Darc Knight (8 June 2018)

When Abbott first came into the Howard Ministry he was one of the most controversial, some may say objectionable, Politicians in memory. Wasn't he the architect behind Pauline Hanson's imprisonment. He always seemed to be the one doing the dirty work for the Liberal party. He was then seemingly rewarded with the Leadership then eventually Prime Minister. Now he gets described as this "Statesman" with a measured tone. It's an interesting microcosm of Political reality.
He's a career politician. He'll be back, whether for good or bad.


----------



## Darc Knight (1 July 2018)

Anyone listening to Macquarie? Tony Abbott going in hard against Malcolm Turnbull. Has there ever been a Politician who has openly white-anted his Leader as much as Abbott?


----------



## Skate (1 July 2018)

Darc Knight said:


> Anyone listening to Macquarie? Tony Abbott going in hard against Malcolm Turnbull. Has there ever been a Politician who has openly white-anted his Leader as much as Abbott?




Are you sure, Tony gave his word that he wouldn't..

Skate


----------



## SirRumpole (1 July 2018)

Darc Knight said:


> Anyone listening to Macquarie? Tony Abbott going in hard against Malcolm Turnbull. Has there ever been a Politician who has openly white-anted his Leader as much as Abbott?




Kevin Rudd gave a good imitation of white anting Gillard by leaking to Laurie Oakes.


----------



## Smurf1976 (1 July 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Another thing I agree with TA about




Same here but I'll add that my confidence and respect for the entire concept of universities is rapidly diminishing.

In a relatively short space of time they seem to have gone from institutions of higher learning with high standards that rejected anyone who isn't fairly smart to businesses focusing on profit and their own agenda. Academic standards at universities seem to be going the same way as has already occurred at TAFE sadly.

The way things are going, by the time I'm dead there won't be a single respectable institution left. 

Banks, religion, public schools, TAFE, unions, public hospitals, utilities, government itself both state and federal. With few exceptions all have been trashed compared to what they used to be in terms of being respectable and capable organisations which functioned well. Now we're adding universities to the list it seems.

Considering the breadth and scale of decline it's hard to not see it in the broader context of Western civilisation. There's not a lot left in terms of institutions that are still respectable and effective in 2018.


----------



## SirRumpole (1 July 2018)

Smurf1976 said:


> In a relatively short space of time they seem to have gone from institutions of higher learning with high standards that rejected anyone who isn't fairly smart to businesses focusing on profit and their own agenda. Academic standards at universities seem to be going the same way as has already occurred at TAFE sadly.




They have, but imo that is because government funding for unis and TAFES have been dramatically reduced, so you can't blame the institutions for looking elsewhere. The sub contracting of TAFES to the private sector has been a disaster, and if nothing is done the Uni's may well go the same way.

More IPA doctrinal rubbish that is undermining our way of life.


----------



## Darc Knight (1 July 2018)

SirRumpole said:


> Kevin Rudd gave a good imitation of white anting Gillard by leaking to Laurie Oakes.




Yes, but that was covertly. Tony Aboott has openly declared a Jihad against Turnbull in the Media. Discussing party room meetings and declaring to one supported Turnbull's N.E.G. It really shouldn't be tolerated and should be kept behind closed doors ......... like Kevin Rudd did


----------



## PZ99 (2 July 2018)

Tony Abbott is not a fan of people "running around assassinating the leader" of political parties, but he is available if his party wants him to lead again.

https://www.news.com.au/national/br...n/news-story/77b7e40b88beff16784ca0f7d2bfb514

That's the funniest thing I've read all day


----------



## PZ99 (17 January 2019)

Thank you Mr  Abbott for embarrassing our country just one more time before loosing your seat.

After sharing his  about the Brexit crisis, Tony Abbott was lashed by experts and told he lacked a “basic grasp” of economics.

The House of Commons yesterday overwhelmingly rejected Theresa May’s plan for a withdrawal from the European Union, and today narrowly survived a no-confidence vote.

Britain now faces the likelihood of leaving the EU without a deal in place — something Mr Abbott doesn’t seem to think is a bad thing.

He took to Twitter yesterday just moments after the British prime minister’s government’s defeat in parliament, to offer his view.

Mr Abbott wrote: “What’s wrong with no deal? Australia does $100 billion a year in trade with the EU without a deal.”

It didn’t go down well with our UK cousins, with experts slamming his “embarrassing” contribution to the debate.

Jonathan Portes, a professor of economics at King’s College in London, shot back almost immediately.

“Australia’s trade with the EU is worth about 7.5% of Australian GDP,” his tweet read. “UK’s trade with the rest of EU is worth more than 30% of UK GDP. Anyone with a basic grasp of economics (not @TonyAbbottMHR it seems) should spot the problem”.

A stream of replies to Mr Portes rebuke also pointed out that Australia is in the process of securing a free-trade agreement with the European Union.

In a second comment, Mr Portes said: “As others have pointed out, there are multiple reasons why @tonyabbottmhr is talking nonsense. My tweet focused only on the most obvious.”

International trade expert Dmitry Grozoubinski also slammed Mr Abbott in a direct reply, pleading with him to “stop”.

“Australia’s exports to the EU are dominated by raw commodities and agricultural products for which it enjoys country specific quotas the UK won’t get,” Mr Grozoubinski wrote.

“You are embarrassing. Stop.”


Mr Grozoubinski knows Australia’s former PM well, having worked as a World Trade Organisation negotiator on behalf of his government.

Andy Bruce, an economics writer for the wire service Reuters, didn’t mince his words either.

“Gaffe-prone former Aussie PM, deposed by own party, once described by Council on Foreign Relations as most incompetent leader of any industrialised democracy: listen to this guy!”


Mr Abbott’s post on the social networking site yesterday included a plug for an article he wrote for right-wing UK publication _The Spectator_ late last year.

It was reprinted this week in a free magazine distributed across the country by a pub chain.

In it, he urged the British people to embrace a no deal exit in order to allow them to set their “own rules” when it comes to trade.

Mr Abbott also heavily criticised Ms May — something that prompted accusations he was colluding with her apparent leadership rival Boris Johnson.

The piece was seized upon by conservative commentators and politicians, who viewed his advice as worthy. Mr Abbott is a member of a pro-Brexit advisory panel called The Institute for Free Trade.

Also sharing her thoughts in Britain recently about the state of the withdrawal from the EU was Mr Abbott’s former chief of staff, Peta Credlin.

Ms Credlin, a host on Sky News, was interviewed by Talk Radio and shared her advice, which largely mirrored Mr Abbott’s.

“You should plan for a no-deal Brexit,” she said. “You should square your shoulders, Britain. Put something on the table and walk away.

“Bugger Europe, they need you far more than you need them … a bit of bulldog spirit there. I want to see Britain look and sound the way it used to look and sound.”

https://www.news.com.au/finance/eco...s/news-story/a55a99182d9b8b2bf442e05ebdd60b6e


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## Junior (17 January 2019)

PZ99 said:


> Also sharing her thoughts in Britain recently about the state of the withdrawal from the EU was Mr Abbott’s former chief of staff, Peta Credlin.
> 
> Ms Credlin, a host on Sky News, was interviewed by Talk Radio and shared her advice, which largely mirrored Mr Abbott’s.




Sky News after dark is embarrassing.


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## wayneL (17 January 2019)

Abbott is completely correct. No deal brexit means reversion to WTO terms.

This is not a bad thing and quite probably the best outcome in the long terms. 

In fact, the fear of the deal on the table and the relief at its rejection, is clear in  gbpusd chart.

No deal is the best deal... But remains to be seen if the nation is doublecrossed by the globalists


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## SirRumpole (17 January 2019)

wayneL said:


> Abbott is completely correct. No deal brexit means reversion to WTO terms.
> 
> This is not a bad thing and quite probably the best outcome in the long terms.
> 
> ...





He shouldn't be interfering in other people's business, he just doesn't have the street cred.


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## wayneL (17 January 2019)

SirRumpole said:


> He shouldn't be interfering in other people's business, he just doesn't have the street cred.



He is entitled to an opinion that only globalists disagree with.

Apparently, there is only one street in the mind of the left.

On my street, Shorten, Plibgfgyddhyf, Natalie et al have no cred. But I have to accept that there are other views for which there is a following.

Ebb and flow in the debate, bro.


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## Macquack (17 January 2019)

SirRumpole said:


> He shouldn't be interfering in other people's business, he just doesn't have the street cred.



When I heard Abbott was a Rhodes Scholar, it devalued my rating of Oxford University.


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## sptrawler (17 January 2019)

Well he still pulls an audience on here.lol

The other thing is, even after the excellent character assassination by Fairfax, I bet he would still have a better rating as preferred PM than silly Billy.


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## Darc Knight (17 January 2019)

Wayne calling Rumpy "bro"  Wonder if Rumpy's ever been called "bro" before. Fist bump me @SirRumpole 

<fist bump>

Abbott has certainly"evolved" as a politician. But the hatchet job on Turnbull and his links to Alan Jones and Co is a concern.


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## sptrawler (17 January 2019)

Darc Knight said:


> Abbott has certainly"evolved" as a politician. But the hatchet job on Turnbull and his links to Alan Jones and Co is a concern.




What about Turnbull's hatchet job, on Brendan Nelson and Abbott?


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## SirRumpole (17 January 2019)

Darc Knight said:


> Wayne calling Rumpy "bro"  Wonder if Rumpy's ever been called "bro" before. Fist bump me @SirRumpole




Yes I have, by my real brother.


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## SirRumpole (17 January 2019)

Macquack said:


> When I heard Abbott was a Rhodes Scholar, it devalued my rating of Oxford University.




Yes, it makes one wonder how he got that result.


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## wayneL (17 January 2019)

Darc Knight said:


> Wayne calling Rumpy "bro"  Wonder if Rumpy's ever been called "bro" before. Fist bump me @SirRumpole
> 
> <fist bump>
> 
> .



Are you concerned that I have assumed his or her....they, them, zhim, zher, whatever's...gender?

I'm pretty confident that Horace would be happy to be refered to in the masculine... bro.


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## IFocus (17 January 2019)

Proves Abbott is a tosser of the purest slime seriously what would he know other than lying and back stabbing, undermining his claim to fame is he was accidentally elected leader only to be thrown out by his own party.


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## Humid (18 January 2019)

As much as I think Abbott is a flog it’s a bit rich for that $hithole to be complaining about people meddling in their affairs


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## sptrawler (19 January 2019)

Funnily enough I think Abbott is on the money, why the F#$k should the U.K cowtow to the EU, they import more from the U.K than they export to the U.K.
Why does the U.K owe anything to the EU, why do they have to beg to sever ties? FFS they fought to save them from themselves twice. Now they demand the UK lose their sovereignty, how ludicrous.
What I find really interesting, is why we because the media say it is so, want to become everyone else's whipping post? lol
Expecting English people to roll over and take it, I don't think will happen, just because we do. lol


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## Macquack (19 January 2019)

The UK does not have to beg to sever ties. But if you throw in your full membership of the club, you don't automatically qualify for associate membership. Trade is a two way street.


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## sptrawler (19 January 2019)

Macquack said:


> The UK does not have to beg to sever ties. But if you throw in your full membership of the club, you don't automatically qualify for associate membership. Trade is a two way street.



Yes and from what I've read recently, because I didn't give a rats ar$e untill I read it on here, why the hell should the U.K have Europe telling them they have to give up Northern Ireland.
FFs the U.K lost a lot of lives and the Irish people lost a lot of lives, sorting out Ireland, now you have the French and the Germans telling the the U.K where their border should be.
I can see why Australia is so F%$ed up, too many take what is offered, suck it up princess losers. IMO
There is a word NO, and you can add FLUCK off, you don't have to eat $hit because someone tells you to, that is what made England great.
Also that is what made Australia great, but we have lost it, I hope the U.K hasn't.
Just my opinion.


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## Macquack (19 January 2019)

sptrawler said:


> Yes and from what I've read recently, because I didn't give a rats ar$e untill I read it on here, why the hell should the U.K have Europe telling them they have to give up Northern Ireland.
> FFs the U.K lost a lot of lives and the Irish people lost a lot of lives, sorting out Ireland, now you have the French and the Germans telling the the U.K where their border should be.
> I can see why Australia is so F%$ed up, too many take what is offered, suck it up princess losers. IMO
> There is a word NO, and you can add FLUCK off, you don't have to eat $hit because someone tells you to, that is what made England great.
> ...



From what I gather, Northern Ireland wants to stay in the EU. Otherwise, what is the big deal, Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland are different countries. Business as usual.


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## sptrawler (19 January 2019)

Macquack said:


> From what I gather, Northern Ireland wants to stay in the EU. Otherwise, what is the big deal, Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland are different countries. Business as usual.



Well if that was true, the whole process wouldn't be a problem.
If it was Australia and excising Tasmania, it probably wouldn't be a problem, as long as the newspapers agreed.
But I think the U.K has proven over a longer period, they actually have the balls, to stand up and say NO.


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## Macquack (19 January 2019)

sptrawler said:


> Well if that was true, the whole process wouldn't be a problem.
> If it was Australia and excising Tasmania, it probably wouldn't be a problem, as long as the newspapers agreed.
> But I think the U.K has proven over a longer period, they actually have the balls, to stand up and say NO.



You make out like the UK is heavyweight champion. No one is going to mess with us. Problem is they may have no opponents and just end up beating up on themselves.


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## sptrawler (19 January 2019)

Macquack said:


> You make out like the UK is heavyweight champion. No one is going to mess with us. Problem is they may have no opponents and just end up beating up on themselves.



We are so bitch slapped by the media, we feel we have no worth, the politicians and media work on that premise. Australians were strong stand up for themselves people, that didn't take $hit from anyone, I see a social engineering that is making us like something from a sci-fi movie.
We are told what to think by the Media, if you didn't pick it up on the news, you will get another flucking dose by some muppets on morning T.V.
The U.K is still the 5th biggest economy in the World, I don't know what you are on, I would guess a dose of SMH  fl^cking muppet juice. 

This is the problem in Australia, no one thinks anymore, just read the $hit and swallow it up.
Yes I'm angry, because I thought this forum had free thinking people, that processed the information, I have been sadly disappointed.


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## sptrawler (20 January 2019)

Macquack said:


> You make out like the UK is heavyweight champion. No one is going to mess with us. Problem is they may have no opponents and just end up beating up on themselves.



I must appologise for my last post, it was a bit aggressive, I'm sorry.
The U.K isn't a heavy weight anymore and they should accept anything the EU offers, because they are nobody's like us, we are sorry we are not deserving, we submit.
Sounds very Australian, aussie aussie aussie , can we say that, yes but not on Jan 26. lol
FFS when is it going to stop, when will someone say, hey stop this it is ridiculous.
My rant for this period of my life.


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## orr (21 January 2019)

Hi all...
And so it seems for a little while longer Abbott is still not 'gorne'. And for this little while longer he is doing his best work. 
Too make a Totally utterly unre-electable fiasco, with Abbott the fattest 'blow-fly' on this steaming heap, even more, if that could be imagined,  un-electable... Go tony, go son.... but not just yet.
It gets better; 
* Craig Kelly,_ 'the Stupidest_.'(recently benighted, By Morrison, for his services to idiocy)... relatively safe seat.
* Morrison   , from $3.25 now out to $5 bucks and 'heal' be back(in the 'Shire' they're thick, like _really_ thick)... gold.
* Eric Abetz???? does it get better than that..

But there is hope for the current Liberal party... They are doing well to solve their 'Women problem'...by getting rid of as many as they can.


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## basilio (22 May 2020)

Memory lane.
How to discredit a Report from Yes Minister with notes from Tony Abbot.


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