# Are most rich people stingy?



## Tyler Durden (15 January 2012)

I was walking in the city today and crossed passed a small lane, where I saw a very nice Audi parked (one of those rare city places you could park without buying a ticket). I thought "typical, they can afford a $80,000 car but don't want to pay $6 for parking".

It reminded me of a story my friend told me once - his wife had just started a new job at a large investment bank and was out at drinks with her new colleagues. She was the lowest paid amongst all of them, and yet when it came time to pay the bill, they all disappeared, leaving her with the bill.

I also have a friend who is on six figures and tries to skimp on the rest of us when we're out socially.

These people make a lot of money - do you think that in turn makes them somewhat stingy? What's been your take of rich people you know or have come across in the past?


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## tech/a (15 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I was walking in the city today and crossed passed a small lane, where I saw a very nice Audi parked (one of those rare city places you could park without buying a ticket). I thought "typical, they can afford a $80,000 car but don't want to pay $6 for parking".
> 
> It reminded me of a story my friend told me once - his wife had just started a new job at a large investment bank and was out at drinks with her new colleagues. She was the lowest paid amongst all of them, and yet when it came time to pay the bill, they all disappeared, leaving her with the bill.
> 
> ...




The exact opposite is my experience .


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## namrog (15 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I was walking in the city today and crossed passed a small lane, where I saw a very nice Audi parked (one of those rare city places you could park without buying a ticket). I thought "typical, they can afford a $80,000 car but don't want to pay $6 for parking".
> 
> It reminded me of a story my friend told me once - his wife had just started a new job at a large investment bank and was out at drinks with her new colleagues. She was the lowest paid amongst all of them, and yet when it came time to pay the bill, they all disappeared, leaving her with the bill.
> 
> ...




My experience is that so called rich people can be both stingy and generous.
Generally, I find that those who are self made to be a little more carefull when spending, as opposed to those who inherited their wealth.
Also, the poorer I find can be more generous as a percentage of disposable income when donating to charitable causes, whilst the wealthier are more generous with their time ..
Just a personal observation and a bit of an educated guess , as we really don't know everyones financial situation, even if it appears somewhat obvious...


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## Julia (15 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I was walking in the city today and crossed passed a small lane, where I saw a very nice Audi parked (one of those rare city places you could park without buying a ticket). I thought "typical, they can afford a $80,000 car but don't want to pay $6 for parking".



Why would anyone, regardless of level of wealth, want to pay for parking if they could equally conveniently park for free?
Your reasoning that it's "typical" of the wealthy is imo rather silly.
Have you considered that - long before the owner of the Audi was able to afford such a car - he/she got to be in that position by being sensibly thrifty where appropriate?

I don't see why you'd find it reasonable to extrapolate from a couple of personal anecdotes that all rich people are stingy.  I expect it's less to do with level of personal wealth and more to do with basic personality traits.


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## pixel (15 January 2012)

Julia said:


> Why would anyone, regardless of level of wealth, want to pay for parking if they could equally conveniently park for free?
> Your reasoning that it's "typical" of the wealthy is imo rather silly.
> Have you considered that - long before the owner of the Audi was able to afford such a car - he/she got to be in that position by being sensibly thrifty where appropriate?
> 
> I don't see why you'd find it reasonable to extrapolate from a couple of personal anecdotes that all rich people are stingy.  I expect it's less to do with level of personal wealth and more to do with basic personality traits.



 +1

reminds me of another discussion, where it was suggested solar panels were found in "pov, not posh" suburbs. Quite possibly, the owner of the Audi refuses to pay too much for necessities, so they can afford a little extravagance elsewhere.
I have my eyes on one of those new AMG Gullwing Mercs  
http://www.emercedesbenz.com/autos/...aunches-mercedes-sls-amg-gullwing-webspecial/
Checked one out on the Freeway yesterday.


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## Smurf1976 (15 January 2012)

The only reason I can see why a rich person might choose to not take the free parking space is if they thought that by doing so it would enable someone else to benefit. That might apply in a country town but certainly not in a major city.

I can afford to pay for parking just as I can afford to pay parking fines, electricity bills and to buy new clothes. But if there's a free park that doesn't come with the risk of a fine then why wouldn't I take it? Just like I don't leave the lights on all night for the sake of it and I don't tear holes in perfectly good clothes either (and no way am I spending $300 on a pair of sun glasses - that's just ridiculous).


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## pixel (15 January 2012)

Smurf1976 said:


> The only reason I can see why a rich person might choose to not take the free parking space is if they thought that by doing so it would enable someone else to benefit. That might apply in a country town but certainly not in a major city.
> 
> I can afford to pay for parking just as I can afford to pay parking fines, electricity bills and to buy new clothes. But if there's a free park that doesn't come with the risk of a fine then why wouldn't I take it? Just like I don't leave the lights on all night for the sake of it and I don't tear holes in perfectly good clothes either (and no way am I spending $300 on a pair of sun glasses - that's just ridiculous).



 +1 Smurf
But maybe you and I aren't really "rich" - whatever that means


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## sptrawler (16 January 2012)

Maybe the guy/girl with the Audi, could afford the Audi because they were thrifty. 
Does that make them a 'bad' person i.e stingy? 
Conversely, if they paid for parking, blew heaps of money gambling, drinking and using social drugs.
Would that make them a rich but socially acceptable person?
If so is that because everyone else can sit back and gloat on their foolhardiness?


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## Starcraftmazter (16 January 2012)

I would have to make many multiples of $80,000 before I could contemplate to pay $6 for parking every day. Much cheaper to take a bus.

Anyway, these things are silly generalisations most of the time I feel.

The wealthier I get, my priorities would be to shift my capital towards high-quality businesses that deserve it, and donating to causes that I have supported for a very long time.

Really, it probably has more to do with personality and upbringing than wealth. I'm extremely conservative when it comes to having to expend any sort of resources in all aspects of everything, so I've always been pretty stingy when it comes to spending money on unnecessary things and I will probably always be that way even if I had a billion dollars.


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## McLovin (16 January 2012)

What a dumb thread.


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## Knobby22 (16 January 2012)

When I was a pizza delivery boy, I found that it was always the renters and the poorer people that gave you a tip. It was rare toget one from the big houses with nice cars.


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## Calliope (16 January 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> When I was a pizza delivery boy, I found that it was always the renters and the poorer people that gave you a tip. It was rare toget one from the big houses with nice cars.




That's a good illustration of why these people will always be "renters and poor", and eating junk food.


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## Caveman (16 January 2012)

To the original poster.
He probably has a huge car finance bill to pay.


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## wayneL (16 January 2012)

Through circumstance I knew a lot of the WA Inc Corporate cowboys... Bond, Connell, Oats, Beckwith, and a lot you would never have heard of.

A couple of the above were both stingy and generous, depending on the circumstances, but most were very generous.

Almost all knew the value of a dollar and would become very stingy if they knew they were being touched up. IOW, if there was value for what they were getting they would pay, if not, it was as if they were contemplating spending their last dollar.

It's not about the money, it's an attitude... deliver value and they will pay up.


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## JTLP (16 January 2012)

Calliope said:


> That's a good illustration of why these people will always be "renters and poor", and eating junk food.




Big LOL. Well played.


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## Tyler Durden (16 January 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> When I was a pizza delivery boy, I found that it was always the renters and the poorer people that gave you a tip. It was rare toget one from the big houses with nice cars.






Calliope said:


> That's a good illustration of why these people will always be "renters and poor", and eating junk food.




I suppose the 'moral difficulty' lies there - share, and you shall be poor; be selfish, and you shall be wealthy.


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## medicowallet (16 January 2012)

In my experience there are many people with moderate incomes who RESPECT money, and are rich.

I also have many high income colleagues who do not respect money and struggle to live the lifestyle they want.


So to judge someone who respects money as stingy, can sometimes be a bit unfair..  

If everyone respected money, then we would not be so up the creek with world finances etc.


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## sptrawler (16 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I suppose the 'moral difficulty' lies there - share, and you shall be poor; be selfish, and you shall be wealthy.




How do you work that from your original qoute, that someone with an expensive car should pay for expensive parking.
Or is it that you are selecting qoutes from other people, to support your belief that people with money should throw it away recklessly.
The answer is easy vote for Gillard and the goons and let them throw it away for everyone.


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## Julia (16 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I suppose the 'moral difficulty' lies there - share, and you shall be poor; be selfish, and you shall be wealthy.



Oh, for heaven's sake, Tyler, that's a pretty silly conclusion to draw.
You've been given plenty of examples of how people might become financially independent.  Those people are probably more likely to exercise sensible nutritional choices and are unlikely to be buying in junk food in the first place.

You seem to be making some sort of moral judgment in favour of people who have little understanding of money management or nutritional choices.

Just hope you don't personally adopt such unproductive choices.


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## Smurf1976 (16 January 2012)

medicowallet said:


> In my experience there are many people with moderate incomes who RESPECT money, and are rich.
> 
> I also have many high income colleagues who do not respect money and struggle to live the lifestyle they want.
> 
> ...



I use money to enhance my life (and keep me alive) in the same way as I use a seat on a plane to get from A to B.

I don't go around throwing away money, or booking flights I have no intention of taking, for the sake of it. That leads to a surplus of income over expenses which in due course increases my wealth.

Why anyone would throw away their money, on things which are of no value whatsoever, is beyond me.


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## robusta (16 January 2012)

McLovin said:


> What a dumb thread.




+1 , I will never get the two minutes back it took me to read it.


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## waimate01 (17 January 2012)

A little story... A mate of mine has his own island. All very nice, lovely apartments, pool, private chef, etc. one day he invited me up to it for a few days. Also along was a very rich prominent Australian. And me. (At one point, the chopper pilot said to me, "so, who are you?" ... "me?, I'm nobody!". Ha ha ha).

Anyway, over dinner one night it emerged that of the three couples, I was the only one that had paid for an airfare up to Qld. The wealthy prominent Australian and his wife had travelled on separate flights in order to use points, and the island owner and his GF had caught a flight at some ungodly hour to use points. He also has his own jet and a full time pilot on his personal payroll. But I was the only one of the three that had paid money for a flight.

Stingy? Yes and no. My takeaway from it was : Don't waste money on airfares when you can go on points, but do buy the island.


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## tech/a (17 January 2012)

Stinginess isn't limited to those with money
I've noticed those without are in general frugal
Some stingy and a lot of people who don't have
A few bucks think the world owes them money
--- they deserve it--- and are *freeloaders*.

I don't mind helping most people out but if they don't even
OFFER to pay their share and have the attitude-- he/they
Can afford it----

You've lost me!


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## Solly (17 January 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> I was walking in the city today and crossed passed a small lane, where I saw a very nice Audi parked (one of those rare city places you could park without buying a ticket). I thought "typical, they can afford a $80,000 car but don't want to pay $6 for parking".
> 
> It reminded me of a story my friend told me once - his wife had just started a new job at a large investment bank and was out at drinks with her new colleagues. She was the lowest paid amongst all of them, and yet when it came time to pay the bill, they all disappeared, leaving her with the bill.
> 
> ...




 Tyler Durden,

Just my observations with the Clans on the Strip I mingle with....

Not everybody who drive expensive wheels can always afford them, in the long term, anyway. There's a bit of show, look at me syndrome. 

All the truly wealthy people I have known are very "careful" with their money, yes some may call it "stingy". After all most I know have come from meager backgrounds who have accumulated wealth themselves. No generational wealth.   

But after saying that, they are very "generous" with trusted inner circle friends and donate anonymously to chosen charities.

I wish I could tell you how I know..

S


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## Gringotts Bank (17 January 2012)

tyler, I feel like you're lamenting the realization that self-interest (selfishness) is what drives human behaviour.  It's true, human behaviour is selfish, almost all of the time.  If it wasn't true, then we wouldn't need laws.  Imagine for a second what would happen if there were no laws.  Seen the movie Mad Max?  

Every single thing we do as humans is directed at satisfying the self, through avoidance of pain or through the acquisition of objects (or people) of pleasure.  It's all about me, me, me or in your case, you.

If that was the end of the story, it would be a sad one.  But there's more!  To the degree that you can let go of the need to compete and win, therein your ability to connect with others.  And there's your real happiness.  Easy to say, difficult to do.

Money is so goddamn seductive.  It looks like it holds all the answers, but it doesn't.

Now onto my next trade.  Just paying my bills, not paying off a Ferrari (not that I'd complain, mind you )


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## McLovin (17 January 2012)

Solly said:


> Tyler Durden,
> 
> Just my observations with the Clans on the Strip I mingle with....
> 
> ...




I've seen Jimmy Packer driving around in a Commodore. I've got a fair few friends who have families in the BRW, most of them drive fairly average cars (Suburus, Hondas etc). Quite frankly, driving an expensive car != being rich.

The more you flash your cash the more nouveau riche you are. I actually see that in my own family.

Agree on the donating to charity.


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## Calliope (17 January 2012)

The poor certainly more generous. Visit you local club and observe the pokie players. You won't see any rich people donating their money so generously to the machines. A lot of the players are pensioners.


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## McLovin (17 January 2012)

Calliope said:


> The poor certainly more generous. Visit you local club and observe the pokie players. You won't see any rich people donating their money so generously to the machines. A lot of the players are pensioners.




I believe they call it "giving back to the community". A friend pointed out to me once that casinos/lotteries/pokies are the best form of income redistribution from poor to rich.


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## sunnysyd (17 January 2012)

robusta said:


> +1 , I will never get the two minutes back it took me to read it.




Agreed.


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## Bonk (17 January 2012)

I have been a successful trader for a decade, now class myself as middleclass survivor.  I can do anything ; dont need to work ; continuous living in SE Asia. 

I run into rich people who stay at Asian Sheratons etc.,. They make some show to impress, then I find out they are on a Qantas package or other . 

Yes , I am stingy ......  no show off...... just to survive !


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## prawn_86 (17 January 2012)

Bonk said:


> I can do anything !




I bet that comment depends on your definition of 'anything'


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## sammy84 (17 January 2012)

prawn_86 said:


> I bet that comment depends on your definition of 'anything'




Exactly. My definition changes every pay rise.


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## Glen48 (17 January 2012)

No   don't think I am.


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## Bill M (17 January 2012)

Dick Smith thinks some are and he wants to name and shame them.
---
Australian entrepreneur Dick Smith has threatened to name and shame rich people who do not contribute to the community, saying if they don't want to open their wallets they can "rack off".

Fairfax Media quotes Smith as saying *the rich in the United States donate generally 15 per cent of their income, while Australia's wealthy give less than one per cent.*

Link:http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/8296759/dick-smith-to-name-and-shame-stingy-rich
---


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## Garpal Gumnut (17 January 2012)

It depends on one's definition of "rich".

What is "rich"?

I consider myself rich, but am out-earned and outshone by others with greater assets, who I consider not as richly endowed with life's gifts as I.

I feel a poem coming on.

Again what is stingy?

gg


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## ColB (17 January 2012)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> It depends on one's definition of "rich".
> 
> What is "rich"?
> 
> ...




What is stingy?  Stingy is when your friend/s come round for dinner, bring a six pack which they leave in their esky just in case they don't drink all of them so they can take the rest home without suffering the embarassment of retrieving them from the fridge.  

The irony is that the friend in question is a top bloke and very wealthy but he must just hate the thought of giving something up he has paid for even though the hosts have probably gone to fair expense to feed them.

And GG could you please tell us what you describe as being 'endowed with lifes gifts' and I don't mean physical attributes


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## Smurf1976 (17 January 2012)

McLovin said:


> I believe they call it "giving back to the community". A friend pointed out to me once that casinos/lotteries/pokies are the best form of income redistribution from poor to rich.



Precisely why pokies in particular are one of the few exceptions to my "no nanny state" principles. 

They aren't there to entertain and they aren't something that the owners would like to see their own families spending much time or money using. There's probably something good about them, but I'm really struggling to find out what that might be...

Back on topic, I have more wealth than many others of similar age and income simply because I choose not to waste my money on things of poor value.


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## Garpal Gumnut (17 January 2012)

ColB said:


> What is stingy?  Stingy is when your friend/s come round for dinner, bring a six pack which they leave in their esky just in case they don't drink all of them so they can take the rest home without suffering the embarassment of retrieving them from the fridge.
> 
> The irony is that the friend in question is a top bloke and very wealthy but he must just hate the thought of giving something up he has paid for even though the hosts have probably gone to fair expense to feed them.
> 
> And GG could you please tell us what you describe as being 'endowed with lifes gifts' and I don't mean physical attributes




ColB, your description of your stingy mate fits in with the origin of the word, only used widely since 1914. In the Middle Ages it referred to a person who stung another by their miserliness. So to be stingy requires a victim in close proximity, as you were with your stingy beer guzzler.

As to my " life's gifts ", health, family, shelter, friends, books, peace, good sleep and tucker, and my dog garpaldog.

gg


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## Julia (17 January 2012)

Bill M said:


> Dick Smith thinks some are and he wants to name and shame them.
> ---
> Australian entrepreneur Dick Smith has threatened to name and shame rich people who do not contribute to the community, saying if they don't want to open their wallets they can "rack off".



Dick Smith should mind his own business.  People have their own reasons for giving or not giving and these are nothing to do with him.  Mr Smith has a hugely inflated notion of his own importance.
If he has so much time on his hands that he needs to comment on the philanthropic habits of others, he could more profitably use it by paying some attention to service levels in his stores.


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## Calliope (17 January 2012)

Julia said:


> Dick Smith should mind his own business.  People have their own reasons for giving or not giving and these are nothing to do with him.  Mr Smith has a hugely inflated notion of his own importance.




I agree.



> If he has so much time on his hands that he needs to comment on the philanthropic habits of others, he could more profitably use it by paying some attention to service levels in his stores.




Dick Smith Stores are owned by Woolworths.


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## Julia (17 January 2012)

Calliope said:


> Dick Smith Stores are owned by Woolworths.



Thanks.  I didn't know that.


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## sptrawler (17 January 2012)

Yes he sold it for a packet in the early 80's.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Smith_(retailer)

Woolies have lost money on it ever since, then they bought Tandy electronics another stuff up. IMO
They have no idea where it is all going, Jaycar has taken over the niche electronic market and has left Woolies fighting with Gerry Harvey.


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## wayneL (18 January 2012)

Julia said:


> Dick Smith should mind his own business.  People have their own reasons for giving or not giving and these are nothing to do with him.  Mr Smith has a hugely inflated notion of his own importance.




Could not agree more. He is a pompous @ss. 

Furthermore, I know for a fact that some of the people I mentioned above donated anonymously.

If some supercilious clown like Dick Smith makes a show of how much they give, it rather comes under the heading of marketing and publicity, rather than philanthropy IMO.


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## Logique (18 January 2012)

Not having a go, just something amusing from the web on the dangers of stereotyping.



> Buzzle.com
> http://www.buzzle.com/articles/stereotypes-list.html
> 
> •I'm into theater & art, so I must be a homosexual.
> ...


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## pixel (18 January 2012)

Logique said:


> Not having a go, just something amusing from the web on the dangers of stereotyping.



 LOL Logique, classics!
+1:
"I'm a famous sports/ TV/ movie/ rapper star, so I must be heard on anything from politics, whaling, climate, to religion"


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## Gringotts Bank (18 January 2012)

Bill M said:


> Dick Smith thinks some are and he wants to name and shame them.
> ---
> Australian entrepreneur Dick Smith has threatened to name and shame rich people who do not contribute to the community, saying if they don't want to open their wallets they can "rack off".
> 
> ...




Imagine the sudden surge of money into charities from "anonymous of Double Bay". :

It would be like you have to choose between a new yacht or having everyone know you're a tight ar$e!  Oh the shame!


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## Tyler Durden (28 February 2012)

Relevant:



> The wealthy are more likely to lie, cheat, steal, and break the law, seven separate studies designed to weigh ethics concluded, according to Bloomberg's Elizabeth Lopatto.
> 
> The results, which were presented today in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, showed that the rich were more likely to steal candy from children, lie while negotiating, and cheat when trying to win a price because they “perceive greed as positive and beneficial.”




http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-02-27/lifestyle/31103302_1_experiments-candy-bloomberg


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## Knobby22 (29 February 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> Relevant:
> 
> http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-02-27/lifestyle/31103302_1_experiments-candy-bloomberg




Human nature eh!.

Made me laugh (and cry) that the richer you are the more likely that you will steal the candy and the more you will take if you do steal it , even though you know its for some children. Also you will be much more willing to cheat to get $50 even though it means less to you.

I'm starting to think Mr Burns is an accurate potrayal of someone Groenig knew.

I said previously in another thread that humans basically were nice and was picked up by some members here as being wrong. Maybe the humans I know are basically nice because there are not very wealthy and the ones telling me they are not belong to the big end of town?


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## Julia (29 February 2012)

I'd like to see how the research was designed and what the sample of respondents was before believing a gross generalisation like that.  

And Knobby, I've known nice and nasty poor people and nice and nasty wealthy people.
I get really irritated by these overreaching generalisations.


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## moXJO (29 February 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> I said previously in another thread that humans basically were nice and was picked up by some members here as being wrong. Maybe the humans I know are basically nice because there are not very wealthy and the ones telling me they are not belong to the big end of town?




I know a few multi-millionaires and some are stingy bastards that have ostracised their whole family because of money. I heard a story from a friend of mine the other day. Apparently some old local codger wanted to be buried with his pillow under his head in the coffin (was on his way out). Anyway they did as he requested and when it came to settling his estate they now think he has packed the pillow with all his money ($400k) and took it with him. They now have to go through the drama to get permission to dig him up again.
Money does funny things to certain people.


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## Knobby22 (29 February 2012)

Lucky the money is plastic moXJO. Paper money wouldn't smell nice after that.


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## Eager (12 March 2012)

Words have recently been written in the press comparing the level of philanthropy, or rather lack of, amongst Australia's truly wealthy to those from other countries.

From the state where the vast majority of wealth is being generated and very wealthy people seem to be a dime a dozen, comes this:
http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/no-more-wishes-for-sick-kids/story-e6frfku0-1226296346197
Twiggy or Gina could fund this organisation for decades to come with some small change found down the back of their couches. What is stopping them?


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## Julia (12 March 2012)

I will never understand why the general public (or particular members of it) deem it appropriate to tell people what they should do with their money, just because they have rather more of it than they do.

And, for that matter, I doubt too many of these would be commentators are in a position to know how said rich people disperse their wealth anyway.


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## Gringotts Bank (12 March 2012)

I watched Fight Club again last night, umpteenth time.  It's a brilliant story until the end when he plots to blow up all the credit card companies and make everyone financially equal.  As if that would solve the lead character's problems, or the world's problems.  Needs to be re-written with a new ending.


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## Glen48 (12 March 2012)

If the rich were to tip buckets  loads of cash on some one who do you suggest, in OZ you can get help regardless of where you are.
Over seas poor farmers who want $100 to grow a crop need to put up an application fee and because the they don't have the money they are deemed high risk so have to pay a higher interest or go with out. 
  Most  can't get the loan so suicide.
A $100 to them is the same as 100K to an OZ, with the World population about to explode soon we need every grain available to feed them so Family's can reproduce.
This will continue until the Pope tells all it is ok to use birth control methods.


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## rumpole (12 March 2012)

The conclusion drawn from the original observation of the expensive car parked in a free spot , and the consequent generalisation that rich people are stingy is illogical.

Maybe when the Audi turned up all the meter spots were taken and the free one was just vacated. Who wouldn't take advantage of that ?

Maybe rich people don't want to be too conspicuous in handing their money out because they then get harassed by all sorts of people with their hands out, some of whom don't deserve to get a free ride.

Others of course have got rich because they are thrifty. If you want to call that stingy, so be it.


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## Gringotts Bank (12 March 2012)

Gringotts Bank said:


> I watched Fight Club again last night, umpteenth time.  It's a brilliant story until the end when he plots to blow up all the credit card companies and make everyone financially equal.  As if that would solve the lead character's problems, or the world's problems.  Needs to be re-written with a new ending.




Here's some ripper quotes from the movie.  Enjoy (or not).

Quotations from Fight Club
by Chuck Palahniuk, 1996



You buy furniture.  You tell yourself, "this is the last sofa I will ever need in my life".  Buy the sofa, then for a couple years you're satisfied that no matter what goes wrong, at least you've got your sofa issue handled.  Then the right set of dishes.  Then the perfect bed.  The drapes.  The rug.  Then you're trapped in your lovely nest, and the things you used to own, now they own you.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 5


May I never be complete.  May I never be content.  May I never be perfect.  Deliver me, Tyler, from being perfect and complete.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 5


Maybe self-improvement isn't the answer.... Maybe self-destruction is the answer.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 6


Nothing was solved when the fight was over, but nothing mattered.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 6


"It's only after you've lost everything," Tyler says, "that you're free to do anything."  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 8


By this time next week, each guy on the Assault Committee has to pick a fight where he won't come out a hero.  And not in fight club.  This is harder than it sounds.  A man on the street will do anything not to fight.  The idea is to take some Joe on the street who's never been in a fight and recruit him.  Let him experience winning for the first time in his life.  Get him to explode.  Give him permission to beat the crap out of you.  You can take it.  If you win, you screwed up.  "What we have to do, people," Tyler told the committee, "is remind these guys what kind of power they still have."  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16




We wanted to blast the world free of history.... picture yourself planting radishes and seed potatoes on the fifteenth green of a forgotten golf course.  You'll hunt elk through the damp canyon forests around the ruins of Rockefeller Center, and dig clams next to the skeleton of the Space Needle leaning at a forty-five degree angle.  We'll paint the skyscrapers with huge totem faces and goblin tikis, and every evening what's left of mankind will retreat to empty zoos and lock itself in cages as protection against the bears and big cats and wolves that pace and watch us from outside the cage bars at night.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16


"Recycling and speed limits are bull****," Tyler said.  "They're like someone who quits smoking on his deathbed."  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16


"Imagine," Tyler said, "stalking elk past department store windows and stinking racks of beautiful rotting dresses and tuxedos on hangers; you'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life, and you'll climb the wrist-thick kudzu vines that wrap the Sears Tower.  Jack and the beanstalk, you'll climb up through the dripping forest canopy and the air will be so clean you'll see tiny figures pounding corn and laying strips of venison to dry in the empty car pool lane of an abandoned superhighway stretching eight-lanes-wide and August-hot for a thousand miles."  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16


You are not a beautiful and unique snowflake.  You are the same decaying organic matter as everyone else, and we are all part of the same compost pile.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 17




We have to show these men and women freedom by enslaving them, and show them courage by frightening them.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 19


I am the all-singing, all-dancing crap of this world.... I am the toxic waste by-product of God's creation.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 23



I've met God across his long walnut desk with his diplomas hanging on the wall behind him, and God asks me, "Why?"  Why did I cause so much pain?  Didn't I realize that each of us is a sacred, unique snowflake of special unique specialness?  Can't I see how we're all manifestations of love?  I look at God behind his desk, taking notes on a pad, but God's got this all wrong.  We are not special.  We are not crap or trash, either.  We just are.  We just are, and what happens just happens.  And God says, "No, that's not right."  Yeah.  Well.  Whatever.  You can't teach God anything.  ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 30




The things you own end up owning you.  It's only after you lose everything that you're free to do anything.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


**** Martha Stewart.  Martha's polishing the brass on the Titanic; it's all going down, man.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


I say never be complete.  I say stop being perfect.  I say let's evolve.  Let the chips fall where they may.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


How much can you know about yourself if you've never been in a fight?  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy **** we don't need.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


We're the middle children of history.... no purpose or place.  We have no Great War, no Great Depression.  Our great war is a spiritual war.  Our great depression is our lives.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


You're not your job.  You're not how much money you have in the bank.  You're not the car you drive.  You're not the contents of your wallet.  You're not your ****ing khakis.  You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the world.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


No fear.  No distractions.  The ability to let that which does not matter truly slide.  ~Fight Club movie, screenplay by Jim Uhls, directed by David Fincher, novel by Chuck Palahniuk


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## Eager (12 March 2012)

Julia said:


> I will never understand why the general public (or particular members of it) deem it appropriate to tell people what they should do with their money, just because they have rather more of it than they do.
> 
> And, for that matter, I doubt too many of these would be commentators are in a position to know how said rich people disperse their wealth anyway.



I was merely surmising that very wealthy people in other countries are more likely to spend a greater portion of their money on charities like the one mentioned in my link, and that in this country, it has been noticed and reported that our very wealthy people are less likely to. There must be a reason for the difference so why shouldn't the general public question why?

The very wealthy people overseas probably don't face the same questions purely because of their generosity.

But, you may be right. Perhaps it is better to remain silent and let worthy charities go to the wall due to the lack of White Knights in Australia.


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## Julia (12 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> The conclusion drawn from the original observation of the expensive car parked in a free spot , and the consequent generalisation that rich people are stingy is illogical.
> 
> Maybe when the Audi turned up all the meter spots were taken and the free one was just vacated. Who wouldn't take advantage of that ?
> 
> ...




+1.


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## Knobby22 (12 March 2012)

Eager, seriously I've heard that Australians as a whole are quite good at charity and the stingy thing is untrue. We are one of the best givers. I have heard that this charity thing is a bit of a beatup.

I even think Gina is being a bit hard done by, she has a been a saviour to shareholders who wanted to unload shares to for Channel 10 and Fairfax.


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## rumpole (13 March 2012)

Speaking of Gina though, the $18 billion woman who wants to cut her own kids out of her daddy's will.

Greed ?


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## Eager (13 March 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> Eager, seriously I've heard that Australians as a whole are quite good at charity and the stingy thing is untrue. We are one of the best givers. I have heard that this charity thing is a bit of a beatup.



You very well might be right. Still, charities depend on the generosity of the public, and if any of them fold, maybe as a society we are still not generous enough?


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## Dressdown (13 March 2012)

Julia said:


> I'd like to see how the research was designed and what the sample of respondents was before believing a gross generalisation like that.
> 
> And Knobby, I've known nice and nasty poor people and nice and nasty wealthy people.
> I get really irritated by these overreaching generalisations.




The reason people get rich is because they understand money and risk.  For these people being carefull with money comes with the territory, that doesn't necessarily make them stingy.  We need risk takers and entreprenaurs for they generate the wealth.


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## Julia (13 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> Speaking of Gina though, the $18 billion woman who wants to cut her own kids out of her daddy's will.
> 
> Greed ?



I don't think it's any of our business.   Great pity that what should be an entirely private matter has become so salaciously public.
We don't know what financial, emotional and other issues are involved in the behaviour of any member of the family, and should care less imo.



Eager said:


> You very well might be right. Still, charities depend on the generosity of the public, and if any of them fold, maybe as a society we are still not generous enough?



Many charities are performing the functions which should be provided by governments and should receive more taxpayer funding.
Maybe also consider that because an organisation is a charity it's not necessarily efficiently run.  Some of them have no idea about managing their finances well.


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## rumpole (13 March 2012)

*"We don't know what financial, emotional and other issues are involved in the behaviour of any member of the family, and should care less imo."
*

Looks like we are going to find out if the courts don't let Gina cover it up.


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## Knobby22 (13 March 2012)

With Gina (off topic)

I think she feels she has wastrel children and is trying to do her best to protect them from themselves.  

The facts are however that the trust was set up by her Dad to look after the Grandkids and she really should hand it over to them now as they reach 40.

There is an old saying, the first generation makes the money, the second generation builds on it and the third generation wastes it.

It is the way of things. She should just let nature takes its course.

And sure it is none of our business, but it is the nature of humanity to be fascinated by this sort of thing.


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## rumpole (13 March 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> With Gina (off topic)
> 
> And sure it is none of our business, but it is the nature of humanity to be fascinated by this sort of thing.




She is a powerful person who obviously has hooks into people like Barnaby Joyce and Alby Shultz and who knows who else in the LNP. And if she gets control of Fairfax she will be in a position to control public opinion to her advantage. Knowing what sort of person she is is important to know how far she can be trusted in other areas.


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## MrBurns (13 March 2012)

As a real estate agent in a previous life a client owned a whole street of factories, not just in Melbourne but elsewhere, they didn't have the sewer connected so whenever there was a blockage he would climb down into the tanks himself to clean them out.
I never shook his hand and I think one of his long suffering tenants placed a large rock over the pit entrance when he was down there one time. Good.


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## IFocus (13 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> Speaking of Gina though, the $18 billion woman who wants to cut her own kids out of her daddy's will.
> 
> Greed ?




Greed, ego and control freak.


The trust owns a large proportion of Gina's company, if the kids cash it in then a out side buyer would then have a large controlling interest.


Gina works with no one...........ever not even her own kids.


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## Tyler Durden (14 March 2012)

Knobby22 said:


> There is an old saying, the first generation makes the money, the second generation builds on it and the third generation wastes it.




Interesting. Does that mean James Packer's child will be the one to waste it?


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## rumpole (14 March 2012)

Tyler Durden said:


> Interesting. Does that mean James Packer's child will be the one to waste it?




No James will waste it. Frank Packer made it, Kerry built on it


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## Tisme (6 August 2017)

Anyone who's spent time in New York knows about poor little rich kid Rockefeller Jnr.

Here's an article about the John Davison = stage 1 of shirt sleeves:


http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/23850780


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## Wysiwyg (6 August 2017)

Some other bits on that newspaper clip I found interesting ... cocaine injected into the spine as an alternative to chloroform, coal sale ad. for household and steam purposes, ice made from distilled water and the Real Turtle Soup ad.

One hundred years is a lot of change.


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