# End of financial year calculations



## Bullion (22 May 2007)

I am just wondering, this has been my first year of trading on the ASX. Do all the trades I've made automatically get calculated to find my net loss/gain by Comsec?

Or do I have to go through all my trades individually and work out my profit/loss that needs to be declared for tax?


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## It's Snake Pliskin (22 May 2007)

Bullion said:


> I am just wondering, this has been my first year of trading on the ASX. Do all the trades I've made automatically get calculated to find my net loss/gain by Comsec?
> 
> Or do I have to go through all my trades individually and work out my profit/loss that needs to be declared for tax?




Hard work brings great rewards.


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## Bullion (22 May 2007)

So I take it I will be busy for a day going through receipts of purchases then


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## It's Snake Pliskin (22 May 2007)

Bullion said:


> So I take it I will be busy for a day going through receipts of purchases then




I like to do it myself just to stay on top of things. 
It is also a good way to get a hard look at your purchases and results. You may learn something form it.


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## UPKA (22 May 2007)

If u use Etrade, u can generate an excel spreadsheet which has all ur individual purchase and sell prices, it makes ur life alot easier!


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## GreatPig (22 May 2007)

If you're doing it manually, it's probably easiest to enter each trade into your portfolio software or spreadsheet on the day you make it.

Cheers,
GP


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## bernardp (22 May 2007)

This is a great feature of E-trade where it gives you daily and total gains in percentage and dollar form of your portfolio.

E-trade have done some things right!


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## Gar (22 May 2007)

well I'll be damned, I never knew that feature existed, I've always recorded my gains/losses manually


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## nizar (22 May 2007)

Gar said:


> well I'll be damned, I never knew that feature existed, I've always recorded my gains/losses manually




So have I.
But Im with Snake, do it manually for the learning experience.

I almost shocked myself how many losses i made last year. No matter how small they are, they do add up...


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## nomore4s (22 May 2007)

bernardp said:


> This is a great feature of E-trade where it gives you daily and total gains in percentage and dollar form of your portfolio.
> 
> E-trade have done some things right!




Commsec also has his feature


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## Pat (22 May 2007)

Gar said:


> well I'll be damned, I never knew that feature existed, I've always recorded my gains/losses manually




Gar,
Thats something "Gil" your Avatar would say LOL!!!  :


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## nomore4s (22 May 2007)

Bullion said:


> I am just wondering, this has been my first year of trading on the ASX. Do all the trades I've made automatically get calculated to find my net loss/gain by Comsec?
> 
> Or do I have to go through all my trades individually and work out my profit/loss that needs to be declared for tax?




I know you can veiw all your contract notes online with commsec which shows all your trades but I don't think it adds it all up for you, I just run a spreadsheet throughout the year and update it when I buy or sell a stock.


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## Julia (22 May 2007)

Gar said:


> well I'll be damned, I never knew that feature existed, I've always recorded my gains/losses manually




Gar, with E-trade you can customise your portfolio page(s) in a number of different ways, choosing from I'd guess more than 30 different choices of individual bits of info. (sorry - that was really poorly expressed ).

I currently have, e.g., 
ASX code
No. of shares
Purchase Date
Purchase Price
Last Sale
$ increase (over yesterday's close) or decrease
% increase     "                      "       "
Total $ value of holding
% gain or loss from purchase price.

There are many other options which you simply enter for your Custom portfolio.


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## stoxclimber (22 May 2007)

Where is the ComSec feature? I've done it manual but when I do it it includes brokerage (i look at the net position..) so it would save me some work


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## KIWIKARLOS (23 May 2007)

Hey a question for someone..

If i buy/sell multiple times of the same stock and end up at the end of year still holding some. Can I for calculation of capital gains pick with buy portions i place with which sell order to achieve manipulate the capital gain.

EG.

   Date              Buy           Date              Sell
   1/1/06       100 x 0.1c        20/1/06    100 x 0.15c
   25/1/06     100 x 0.2c 

Notice i bought the 2nd parcel after i sold the first:

So heres the two ways i think i could calculate it.
1. bought cost 100 x 0.2 = 20  and sold 100 x 0.15 = 5
 therefore capital loss of 5

or

2. bought cost 100 x 0.1 = 10 and sold 100 x 0.15 = 15
therefore capital gain of 5

Do i have to figure the buy sells out chronologically, because i figure that if i 
calculate it such that i would have a loss i would simply propably have a gain the following financial year, so the tax man doesn't loose out?


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## deftfear (23 May 2007)

Kiwikarlos, its a bit hard to sell something that you don't own...unless you are shorting the stock. You would have to use option 2. However, if you bought on 15/01/06 you could choose which parcel of shares to sell.


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## nomore4s (23 May 2007)

stoxclimber said:


> Where is the ComSec feature? I've done it manual but when I do it it includes brokerage (i look at the net position..) so it would save me some work




Stox,
Go to outstanding or executed orders and you should see a link that says "View contract notes online" click on this and you should get a list of all your trades inc brokerage, settlement date, average & total price, number of shares brought/sold.
Not sure if this is what you want but hope it helps.

Sorry Stox just reread the thread, I think you might mean the Position summary feature. In the menu list on the right hand side "Postion statements" then "view holdings". You can edit your purchase price to include brokerage, this will give you your total profit/loss on the position and value change each day as well.


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## KIWIKARLOS (23 May 2007)

does anyone know a simple but effective portfolio software that coul;d figure this out for me.

I could put together a excel spread sheet but it is time consuming and messy


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## GreatPig (23 May 2007)

KIWIKARLOS said:
			
		

> If i buy/sell multiple times of the same stock and end up at the end of year still holding some. Can I for calculation of capital gains pick with buy portions i place with which sell order to achieve manipulate the capital gain.



Generally you can choose which stocks you're selling, but I'm pretty sure you would have to own them at the time of sale.

In the end though, the only thing that matters from a capital gain point of view is the purchase price for the stocks you're still holding at the end (and perhaps the date, if the 12 month thing becomes relevant). It would be nice to be able to make it the lowest-priced or oldest ones, but I think if you sold them all somewhere in between, you wouldn't be able to say that the one's you're still holding were the ones you bought initially.

Just my understanding, but check with your accountant to be sure.

GP


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## Bullion (23 May 2007)

Thanks everyone for your help. I am going to use a bit of both worlds and use Comsec how nomore4's mentioned to get the Contract Notes Summary, and make a spreadsheet with that information.


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## Bullion (23 May 2007)

Noob question here...

Do I count my brokerage in the loss/gain?


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## Prospector (23 May 2007)

KIWIKARLOS said:


> does anyone know a simple but effective portfolio software that coul;d figure this out for me.
> 
> I could put together a excel spread sheet but it is time consuming and messy




I use Portfolio Planner (solosw.com) which calculates many many reports, including dividends, growth over user-elected periods, tax, etc etc.  You purchase a lifetime licence for 3 entities.  They give you a trial period to see if you like it.  But whichever software you use, the best way to use it is to record everything on the day it occurs and not wait until June to do it.


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## Bullion (23 May 2007)

Well I just put all my info into a spreadsheet... Surprising how the losses add up indeed! Here I was holding out till after June to take some profits when I didn't really need to!


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## GreatPig (23 May 2007)

Bullion said:
			
		

> Do I count my brokerage in the loss/gain?



If you are investing, brokerage (ex-GST) forms part of the cost base for capital gains. Not sure about the GST component.

If you are a trading business, brokerage is a deductible expense in the year it is incurred, and if you're registered for GST, you can claim an input credit for the GST.

At least that's my understanding. Check with your accountant.

GP


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## Bomba (27 May 2007)

I use an excel spreadsheet to calculate my gains and losses.  

Having it prepared for your accountant is a good idea.  As has been said before the more you do, the less you have to pay.

Additionally it provides ease of mind if you do it yourself that it has actually all been calculated properly.  I know accountants know what they are doing, but if you have a lot of paperwork it can get messy and they might miss something. 

Last year i had a few losses but had many gains and have to pay for it as i owe the tax office money which is due in 2 weeks time.

I got in early this year as i have calculated all my profits and losses and have a small gain so i will be realising some losses to offset the gains.  

Last year i had many trades and it took forever to calculate it all.  This year not so many, so pretty straight forward.

Ive learnt if you maintain your spreadsheet as you go, it makes it easier come year end. I guess thats obvious though.  

Anywho just deciding which losses to cut now.


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## Yeti (29 May 2007)

Bullion said:


> Thanks everyone for your help. I am going to use a bit of both worlds and use Comsec how nomore4's mentioned to get the Contract Notes Summary, and make a spreadsheet with that information.




Bullion, I am doing a similar thing, but instead of using the Contract Notes Summary, I was thinking of using the financial statement feature on CommSec. After logging in to CommSec click on "Position Statements" on the left, then on the new page that opens up go to "Financials" along the top and select "Most Recent" This opens up your Financial Statement with CommSec which can be downloaded (click the Download button) as a CSV- (comma separated values) file, which can be opened in Excell and will give you the basis for your spread sheet.

Any other advice form some more experienced forum members would be very welcome! Some of you people must have been doing this sort of stuff for years?

I also thought some purpose designed Excell spread sheets might have been available- maybe for a small fee- on the internet, but my Googling has not come up with anything so far.


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## disarray (29 May 2007)

KIWIKARLOS said:


> does anyone know a simple but effective portfolio software that coul;d figure this out for me.
> 
> I could put together a excel spread sheet but it is time consuming and messy




in case you missed the thread ...

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6964&highlight=spreadsheet


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## yonnie (3 June 2007)

as an investor its enough to know the date, your purchase plus costs (inclusive of GST) and the date and the sale price minus costs.

but for a share trader its different

I reckon you need to reconcile with your bank account and have columns for your different costs like purchased shares, brokerage, bank costs, interest, power, telephone,
broadband, paper/magazines, gst etc.
On the other side sold shares, brokerage, interest, gst.

how do other share traders do this?


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## Baka_Gaijin (4 June 2007)

One of the factors contributing to the classification of trader for tax purposes is operating in a business type manner. If you are only doing a few trades throughout the year and throwing everything into a shoebox for end of year, you might not be a trader.


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