# Extrapolating the total issued shares from an annual report



## Helliune (9 April 2010)

Hi, I am currently learning value based fundamental investing and so I'm studying Annual Reports. What I am struggling to do is to find the total number of shares on issue by extrapolating that data in the Annual Report (so I can figure out the total shares at any given year from the respective year's Annual Report).

What I currently do is look at the financials in the Annual Report under diluted EPS. Then I go to the notes section to see what number of shares were used to calculate the diluted EPS. Is this a correct value to use?

What I am trying to do is to get a basic idea of what the market perceives the price of the company to be (ie, current share price X total shares) of any given year.

I also made a thread about this in the Trade Strategies / Systems forum, but I think I put it in the wrong forum. Given that I cant delete it, I decided to make another one here.

A reply I received in that thread says that total shares issued is common data, but I need to find out how to extrapolate it from the annual report so I can asertain the value on any given year. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

Thanks 
David


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## sneak'n (9 April 2010)

Annual reports should give exact figures on all shares issued, plus options, and conditions relating to options.

There is never a need to extrapolate this information, as it is a meaningless concept with respect to share issuance. The idea that you can somehow derive a perceived price on the basis you outline may be a reason for not getting replies.  It seems a nonsense.  The price ia always the price is always the price it is when it has a price.

Minerals companies with ore reserves can be priced in accordance with the price of the known minerals divided by the shares on offer, but again there are many other variables that will impact on perceived value as all future costs need to be known, along with the future price obtained for the ore.


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## Helliune (9 April 2010)

The annual report doesn't explicitly say "total shares in the company". And given that I'm new to this, I dont know what to include and what not to include to deduce the total shares in the company from the annual report. 

Given your reply - _why_ I want the information is now irrelevant to this thread (in order to keep it on topic). But basically, I can use that number to compare it to NTA backing for instance.


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## alphaman (9 April 2010)

Usually it says something like "weighted average number of ordinary shares". The number would be somewhere in the EPS notes.


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## Helliune (9 April 2010)

alphaman said:


> Usually it says something like "weighted average number of ordinary shares". The number would be somewhere in the EPS notes.



Thanks for that. I use the "Weighted average number of ordinary shares used in calculation of diluted EPS". I'm not sure whether the diluted EPS ordinary shares number should be used or the basic EPS ordinary shares number. But it's good to know I'm on the right track. Thanks again.


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## sneak'n (9 April 2010)

Helliune said:


> Thanks for that. I use the "Weighted average number of ordinary shares used in calculation of diluted EPS". I'm not sure whether the diluted EPS ordinary shares number should be used or the basic EPS ordinary shares number. But it's good to know I'm on the right track. Thanks again.



No disrespect but I can't see you are on the right track from anything you have posted.
Basic earnings per share are calculated from ordinary shares on issue.
Diluted earnings per share will add options and rights issues into the equation.
Contributed equity is found in most Annual Reports - representing ordinary shares on issue - while options and rights are generally also reported.
Weighted average shares on issue, used for EPS purposes, may have no value for subsequent calculations as significant dilutions from rights issues, share purchase plans, or capital raisings can affect future earning values.


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