# How much money per week do you need to live on?



## Bill M (14 April 2011)

I was browsing a website called "Super Guide" and an article with the headline "How much super is enough" came up. I asked a few of my friends how much they thought they would need to live per week without working and got varying opinions. Some said they could live on $500 a week, others said they need $1200.

So my question is a very simple one. How much money do you or you and your partner need per week to live on? _The situation I would like you to imagine is that you own your home outright and you have no debts at all_. You have no kids or they have moved out. Just you or you and your partner/spouse.

I'll start the ball rolling, my wife and I live comfortably on $800 a week net after tax. That's about $41,600 P/A. With that we can even do a cheap overseas holiday each year and a trip somewhere in OZ. So how much do you think you would need?

As a guide line of what the "Super Guide" site says I post the following info, I guess for my wife and I we are between the modest and comfortable lifestyle:

---
*Basic lifestyle (Age Pension only — $18,619 a year, or $28,070 for a couple*, including pension supplement, as at 20 September 2010). The single Age Pension now represents 27.7 per cent of Male Total Average Weekly Earnings. Are you willing to live on 27.7 per cent of an average Australian’s income? Living solely on the Age Pension gives you a basic income and access to discounts on health services and energy costs. While this figure is an amount you can survive on, many Australians don’t expect to live within this level of income by choice. (The Age Pension is adjusted every six months, with next adjustment on 20 March 2011, and then 20 September 2011).

*Modest lifestyle ($21,132 a year, or $30,557 for a couple). *Receiving an after-tax income that is slightly higher than the Age Pension obviously gives you a better lifestyle than living solely on social security, but you can only afford low-cost activities.

*Comfortable lifestyle ($39,302 a year, or $53,729 for a couple). *Living on this level of after-tax income means you can enjoy more recreational activities. Also, you can afford to purchase private health insurance, higher quality household goods and travel regularly. Even so, a ‘comfortable’ lifestyle isn’t outlandish

Link to article here: http://www.superguide.com.au/superannuation-basics/a-comfortable-retirement-how-much-super-is-enough

---


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## basilio (14 April 2011)

Good idea for a discussion. Can't really offer a cogent comment yet but one principal should be that  controlling costs as far as possible, finding sensible ways to meet ones needs and not being sucked into high cost/high maintenace living would let us live well but relatively cheaply.  All fairly obvious but I think these are deliberately overlooked by financial advisors who want to see us  throw in buckets of money to fund a  "comfortable" lifestyle while tipping plenty of commisions their way. 

I also think that it is very unlikely that most people will have the $1m plus super portfolio that* might* theoritically, on a good day... finance the comfortable lifestyle proposed by super fund salesmen. So perhaps the clever approach is having a serious look at developing an effective, comfortable but modest lifestyle.


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## pixel (14 April 2011)

"Comfortable" at $1000 a week? Including regular travels? They've got to be joking!

I'm also dismayed at the implication that only "comfortable" includes private health insurance. Having in my social sphere a number of pensioners that rely on the public health system, I know how sickening a prospect that is 

Another worrying aspect is the rising cost of living: Those who rely on the pension only will be "compensated" - most likely by just some official percentage that pushes them lower and lower, compared to AWE. *But what about Self-Funded Retirees?* Many of us will have to eat into their capital in order to live "comfortably". Who is compensating them? 

But not to worry: By the time the carbon tax has cleaned up the environment, most of us will have dropped into the lowest level, without private health insurance, so we'll die a lot sooner and needn't worry anymore.


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## prawn_86 (14 April 2011)

Our current situation is this:

160pw food (we eat extremely well)
120pw bills (utilities etc, i guess this would be higher if we owned a house)
200pw each for spending/misc

At the moment on top of that we are also savig for a wedding, travel and 'assets'.

This means we could live on $700pw no sweat, but it wouldnt include any holidays etc. So if we owned something outright i think 1k a week would be comfortable


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## Glen48 (14 April 2011)

So you don't own a house and you don't pay rent??


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## onthesword (14 April 2011)

We wondered about this too as retirement is close, we have been salary sacrificing for a few years to see how much we could live on and for the past 3 years it has been 30k pa. We do all we want to as well as have 2 ten day and 1 three week (aussie) holidays per year. We can actually save a few $ as well.


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## prawn_86 (14 April 2011)

Glen48 said:


> So you don't own a house and you don't pay rent??




The opening posts asks to assume house owned outright and no other debt


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## trainspotter (14 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> Our current situation is this:
> 
> 160pw food (we eat extremely well)
> 120pw bills (utilities etc, i guess this would be higher if we owned a house)
> ...




I would require at least 150k nett per annum to live the lifestyle of my choosing.


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## Glen48 (14 April 2011)

Pawn 
ok must be old  eerrr whats that again??
Me rent $75 a month food  $25 a week power $35 a month water $3 a month . no car ,phone rates insurance beer $1.2  a litre
 Still think accomadation should be included to get an idea what is being paid out


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## inq (14 April 2011)

Partner and I could live on say $500 a week, but I wouldn't define that as 'living'. 

Our financial plan on the other hand is on track for $180k/P.A. Now that allows for living.


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## Julia (14 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> The opening posts asks to assume house owned outright and no other debt



If you have a house owned outright you are still going to have to allow for rates, water, maintenance, and insurance.   Just as an example, I allow around $5000 p.a. to cover these.  It's naive to imagine that just because you don't have a mortgage or don't pay rent, you have no ongoing expenses in relation to where you live.

Re how much any of us need to live on, obviously it depends on what sort of existence you lead.  e.g. TS says he needs $150K.  I wouldn't know what to spend that much on.

I don't know how anyone can live on a government pension, let alone the unemployment benefit, but people do.  So presumably if income is simply not available one just has to modify the wants, and even do without some of the needs.

I think it also depends on the sort of financial philosophy you have practised for most of your life and that this is pretty ingrained by the time retirement looms.
Some of you might remember my deciding last year that it was time to be a bit self indulgent with an expensive car.  Did all the research on BMW, Mercedes et al, tried hard to talk myself into going ahead, but in the end just couldn't justify to myself what 'felt' wasteful, given I drive about 1000 kms a year, have the dog in the car for much of that shedding hair and drooling down the windows.  So bought a second hand station wagon for a changeover of just $15,000 and am entirely happy with that decision.

Depends also on whether you want to travel a lot.  I don't, after spending much of my working life travelling.  
Any travel, though, has to be business class and top standard accommodation.   I do want comfort on a day to day basis, so have pretty expensive pool heating/cooling, and buy good food.

Living in a large city probably means one would spend more on clothes, in contrast to being in a regional or country area where being on the beach or the garden hardly requires haute couture.

For this thread, I've just added up what I spent last FY and it was about $35,000.

Actual income exceeds this quite a bit so I do save.


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## medicowallet (14 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> 120pw bills (utilities etc, i guess this would be higher if we owned a house)






prawn_86 said:


> 120pw bills (utilities etc, i guess this would be higher if we owned a house)




This seems extremely low.

Water
Electricity
Gas
Phone
Internet

Then also
Car rego
Car servicing
Car insurance
House contents insurance
Private health cover
Stuff happens expenses
Incidentals

I'm sorry, I keep excellent records, am extremely proactive in every 3-6 months looking for the best deal, and still can not get anywhere near $120.


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## tech/a (14 April 2011)

To be honest I wouldnt have a clue.


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## prawn_86 (14 April 2011)

medicowallet said:


> I'm sorry, I keep excellent records, am extremely proactive in every 3-6 months looking for the best deal, and still can not get anywhere near $120.




We both put $60 pw into a seperate account for our bills.

It covers:
Home Phone
Internet
Power
Gas
Car Fuel
Car Repairs
Few random bits and peices but nothing major

Doesnt cover:
Personal mobiles
Major unexpected expenses 

Dont have:
Any form of insurance aside from third party property on the car
Private health

So only thing i am missing is rego, which i forgot about as my old man pays it as an xmas present each year. So add that on.

The total figure i quoted would be a minimum we would be able to live on but our bills are around 6k a year (120pw). 

Off the top of my head bills are as follows:
50pm internet (includes voip calls) = 600 pa
20pm phone line rental = 240 pa
350pq power = 1400pa
150 gas pq = 600 pa
40pm fuel = 480 pa
car repairs/servicing 1000 pa


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## aubooker (14 April 2011)

never wish to know where to spent my money...whats the point


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## sptrawler (14 April 2011)

I am not at retirement age but will retire before 60 a couple of my collegues retired pre 60 and they both live a comfortable life (own everything). They both say that $30,000 is a minimum and $50,000 gives you a comfortable lifestyle with an overseas holiday. So allowing for inflation of 10% and the occasional drawdown of say $20,000 every 5 years or so . 
One would think an amount of approx $1m should see you have a trouble free retirement. Lets not forget part pension and health care cards start to kick in as the capital falls, if indead it does.


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## Bill M (14 April 2011)

basilio said:


> not being sucked into high cost/high maintenance living would let us live well but relatively cheaply.




Hi basilio, that's one of the reasons we moved out of our unit and into the house. The levys were quite expensive, like $75 per week. That's about $3,900 P/A. Our house has cost us only $400 for maintenance for 18 Months. I know that eventually fences and water heaters will need to be replaced but the costs are no where near some of the outrageous levy fees some strata blocks charge.



pixel said:


> "Comfortable" at $1000 a week? Including regular travels? They've got to be joking!




They must mean Australian based holidays. You certainly could go to Europe even twice on that sort of money, maybe once with some hard saving.



> Another worrying aspect is the rising cost of living: Those who rely on the pension only will be "compensated" - most likely by just some official percentage that pushes them lower and lower, compared to AWE. *But what about Self-Funded Retirees?* Many of us will have to eat into their capital in order to live "comfortably". Who is compensating them?




Fear not, when you start running low the part pension can kick in, yeah I know it's not much but it's better than nothing, I fear inflation too.


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## Bill M (14 April 2011)

onthesword said:


> We wondered about this too as retirement is close, we have been salary sacrificing for a few years to see how much we could live on and for the past 3 years it has been 30k pa. We do all we want to as well as have 2 ten day and 1 three week (aussie) holidays per year. We can actually save a few $ as well.



I agree, my wife and I can do it for that too. It's just that we go overseas as well and therefore requires the extra $$$, cheers.



trainspotter said:


> I would require at least 150k nett per annum to live the lifestyle of my choosing.




Hi trainspotter, I know I shouldn't ask.... but now I am so curious, what costs 3 grand a week when you have your own home and no debts and no kids? I could eat steak and drink champaign each night and still have $$$$ left after it with $800 p/w. Just tell me to shove off if it's personal.



Glen48 said:


> Pawn
> ok must be old  eerrr whats that again??
> Me rent $75 a month food  $25 a week power $35 a month water $3 a month . no car ,phone rates insurance beer $1.2  a litre
> Still think accomadation should be included to get an idea what is being paid out




Glen, your circumstances are different, you live in the Philippines and as far as I know you can't buy property there in your name (could be wrong) so in your case it is fair to include your Monthly rental as well.


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## tech/a (14 April 2011)

Dont forget inflation it will be a killer to most who think they have "enough"

Passive income/s is/are a must.


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## Bill M (14 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> We both put $60 pw into a seperate account for our bills.




I'll give you my running costs, 2 people in a house. My answers are in Blue.

Off the top of my head bills are as follows:
50pm internet (includes voip calls) = 600 pa 
$720 pa

20pm phone line rental = 240 pa 
Nil but we need 2 Mobiles$240 pa

350pq power = 1400pa $710 pa

150 gas pq = 600 pa $400 pa

40pm fuel = 480 pa $4,800 pa

car repairs/servicing 1000 pa Same $1,000[/QUOTE]

Mine comes in at about the same as yours, $150 Per Week. Only reason why mine is higher is the frequent travel by car to Sydney, more petrol.


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## Ferret (14 April 2011)

tech/a said:


> Dont forget inflation it will be a killer to most who think they have "enough"
> 
> Passive income/s is/are a must.




That's right.  In planning for my retirement I factor in 3% inflation.  If I estimate a portfolio with a conservative mix of investments (industry super balanced fund, direct shareholdings, property, some cash) will return 7%, I see this as a real return of 4%.  

I'm aiming at a min of $80,000/yr for my wife and I to live on so we need 80,000/.04 = $2,000,000 portfolio for retirement.  This would keep up with inflation and we wouldn't be drawing down on it, so no danger of outliving it.  If something unexpected happened, we would have the fallback of being able to draw down.  Otherwise it would eventually be a decent inheritance for the kids.


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## Julia (14 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> We both put $60 pw into a seperate account for our bills.
> 
> It covers:
> Home Phone
> ...



Prawn, a couple of things which seem to be missing (or perhaps which you have considered and decided you don't need) are:

No loss of earnings insurance:  how would you get on if either of you have a catastrophic illness or accident and are unable to work?

No savings plan for buying a house:  should we therefore assume you intend to rent all your life?

No contents insurance:  do you have nothing you consider valuable enough to insure, i.e. if there were to be a fire and you lost the lot, are you happy to buy it all again from new?

No private health cover:  either you trust the public system 100% or believe you will never get sick/need an operation etc.
Also, isn't the taking out of private cover mandatory over a  certain salary level?


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## trainspotter (14 April 2011)

*ONE MILLION RUPIAH ......... PER DAY*

Would just get me through the day


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## Glen48 (15 April 2011)

Most  are assuming there will be no depression, house prices tanking or bank failures.
What if it does happen are you watching the markets  and have  a bail out plan???


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## Bill M (15 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> *ONE MILLION RUPIAH ......... PER DAY*
> 
> Would just get me through the day




That's a bit more like it, equates to around $760 P/W.


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## Bill M (15 April 2011)

Julia said:


> For this thread, I've just added up what I spent last FY and it was about $35,000.




Thanks for taking the time, seems about average, cheers.



sptrawler said:


> I am not at retirement age but will retire before 60 a couple of my collegues retired pre 60 and they both live a comfortable life (own everything). They both say that $30,000 is a minimum and $50,000 gives you a comfortable lifestyle with an overseas holiday. So allowing for inflation of 10% and the occasional drawdown of say $20,000 every 5 years or so .
> One would think an amount of approx $1m should see you have a trouble free retirement. Lets not forget part pension and health care cards start to kick in as the capital falls, if indead it does.




Yeah thanks sptrawler, it seems that most people fall into this 30K to 52K modest to comfortable group. There is one other group around and they are the ones with no children or anyone else they would like to leave their money to. This group can virtually draw down all their capital until they pass out of this world. They can actually spend a bit more as capital protection isn't such a big concern to them, cheers.


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## prawn_86 (15 April 2011)

To everyone questioning my expenses in this thread:

*The opening post asked us to assume that we own our house outright with no other debt*

Someone then questioned my expenses/bills so i gave a breakdown of what they are at the moment. I'm not discussing my personal circumstance, im simply replying to the question/scenario in the opening post


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## Sean K (15 April 2011)

tech/a said:


> To be honest I wouldnt have a clue.



Me too, it all just seems to go here and there. 

Heading generally in the right direction though.

Surviving.



Just.


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## El Tigre (15 April 2011)

Assuming no rent - I currently live off $300 a week no problem.

But how much do i *need*? I think i could live off $150 a week (probably $250 at 60+)

Haveing recently finished Uni I was living off $200 week, including $100 rent. Was pretty difficult and can be rather depressing, but one learns quickly when they have to.

That being said, I have no intention to live off the age pension. I'd like a minimum of 40k p.a for a comfortable lifestyle, but like most plan to have much more.


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## Greg (15 April 2011)

Hi Bill
Circumstances sound similar and I actually read that same article. I guess I'm looking at a pretty modest future with a target of $40k per annum. I also did my own spreadsheet a couple of years ago (based on real outgoings now that the kids have left the nest) and it came out at $35k which included a modest car changeover every 5 years or so (probably won't be driving as much) and also an allowance for an overseas holiday (probably visiting friends and rellies in UK and NZ, so no accommodation costs) every 3 years, with local holidays in between.
Sadly my super is only going to be around $500k after I complete the downsizing exercise I am currently in the middle of, but 8% of $500k is $40k so the numbers almost work! 
I honestly haven't asked all those "what ifs" because there isn't much I can do about them in most cases. Just being conservative in retirement as I have been in life and glad to have good health to enjoy whatever I've got.
Thanks for starting the thread, it's useful to get other people's points of view and circumstances (I envy quite a few of them and wish them well)
Cheers


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## Julia (15 April 2011)

prawn_86 said:


> To everyone questioning my expenses in this thread:
> 
> *The opening post asked us to assume that we own our house outright with no other debt*
> 
> Someone then questioned my expenses/bills so i gave a breakdown of what they are at the moment. I'm not discussing my personal circumstance, im simply replying to the question/scenario in the opening post



 Fair enough, Prawn.  My apologies if anything I said seemed intrusive.
It's just pretty important to understand that simply owning a house and having no debt does not translate to no ongoing expenses on that house.


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## JTLP (15 April 2011)

Horses for courses - when you need to scrape dollars together you learn to live with the minimum - if you're splashed for cash then you are going to head up a pretty lavish lifestyle.

Comfortable - I'd estimate about 100k a year. Comfortable to me would be living large - it's not living normal.


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## Dowdy (15 April 2011)

> Originally Posted by pixel
> "Comfortable" at $1000 a week? Including regular travels? They've got to be joking!




YOU HAVE GOT TO BE JOKING!

You can't live off $1000 a week, even including travel?!

I spent 4 months in USA and only spent 10k. That included tour bookings (3k) theme parks, NASA, 1 week in Orlando, 1 week in Miami (1k) a tattoo (1.5k) and the rest was drinking and having fun.


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## sptrawler (15 April 2011)

Greg said:


> Hi Bill
> Circumstances sound similar and I actually read that same article. I guess I'm looking at a pretty modest future with a target of $40k per annum. I also did my own spreadsheet a couple of years ago (based on real outgoings now that the kids have left the nest) and it came out at $35k which included a modest car changeover every 5 years or so (probably won't be driving as much) and also an allowance for an overseas holiday (probably visiting friends and rellies in UK and NZ, so no accommodation costs) every 3 years, with local holidays in between.
> Sadly my super is only going to be around $500k after I complete the downsizing exercise I am currently in the middle of, but 8% of $500k is $40k so the numbers almost work!
> I honestly haven't asked all those "what ifs" because there isn't much I can do about them in most cases. Just being conservative in retirement as I have been in life and glad to have good health to enjoy whatever I've got.
> ...




Greg I would say you have done pretty well there are a lot of people I know that are not going to have anywhere near $500k plus their house. Don't forget if you are a married couple you qualify for part pension at about $800k. So mate after the g.f.c your looking good.
I feel sorry for those that don't own a house and Labor has cut back what they can put into super and also lifted the age for them to obtain a pension, because we can't afford it. Then in the same breath say we are in a boom.


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## easylikesunday (15 April 2011)

To *survive* you would only need $50 a week. That would pay for food and a warm blanket. 

Anything above that figure is simply to cater for our luxuries.

We are a greedy lot nowadays.


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## sptrawler (15 April 2011)

What about the fine for vagrancy.
Cheapest high carb food is Macas or Hungry Jacks, $5 per burger two a day to survive winter cold = $70. So $50 a week would be cutting it pretty fine, it could probably be done but over a 12 to 24 month period I think you would end up in hospital. Maybe a bit of petty crime might see you over the lean periods but can be problematic. $50 a week is an option living on the beach in Asia.


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## Glen48 (16 April 2011)

Get arrested and go to a low security farm were you can grow food and sell a bit over the fence to the unlucky ones.
Only danger it the depression the fed's might let you out early to save costs.


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

Greg said:


> Hi Bill
> Circumstances sound similar and I actually read that same article. I guess I'm looking at a pretty modest future with a target of $40k per annum. I also did my own spreadsheet a couple of years ago (based on real outgoings now that the kids have left the nest) and it came out at $35k which included a modest car changeover every 5 years or so (probably won't be driving as much) and also an allowance for an overseas holiday (probably visiting friends and rellies in UK and NZ, so no accommodation costs) every 3 years, with local holidays in between.
> Sadly my super is only going to be around $500k after I complete the downsizing exercise I am currently in the middle of, but 8% of $500k is $40k so the numbers almost work!
> I honestly haven't asked all those "what ifs" because there isn't much I can do about them in most cases. Just being conservative in retirement as I have been in life and glad to have good health to enjoy whatever I've got.
> ...




Hi Greg, I agree with sptrawler, he said what I was going to say. That is that if you are married the part pension could kick in and bring you up to that amount, but then again you could be single or not at age 65 yet. In any case thanks for your post, that 35K to 40K mark seems to come up a lot.


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

easylikesunday said:


> To *survive* you would only need $50 a week. That would pay for food and a warm blanket.
> 
> Anything above that figure is simply to cater for our luxuries.
> 
> We are a greedy lot nowadays.




Yes you probably could but you would have to be somewhere totally free of bills. A friend, family or a cave? I knew some homeless men around Manly who lived in caves on the cliff faces on North Head, others lived in bus shelters. There was also the guy who lived in the side of the wall of one of the buildings it was a fire hydrant. He just pulled a piece of cardboard over the front at night......... what a horrible life.


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

Dowdy said:


> YOU HAVE GOT TO BE JOKING!
> 
> You can't live off $1000 a week, even including travel?!
> 
> I spent 4 months in USA and only spent 10k. That included tour bookings (3k) theme parks, NASA, 1 week in Orlando, 1 week in Miami (1k) a tattoo (1.5k) and the rest was drinking and having fun.




I did a little budget of what we spend in an ordinary suburb per week. I put in all our running costs for the house, insurances etc and the running costs of the car. I also allowed for half a tank of petrol. It includes an RSL lunch a week, a take away and my alcohol. We do not do any expensive sports like golf, skydiving etc. We do not have health insurance so you must add that in if you do. My wife and I live comfortably on $400 P/W. Every other bit of income such as in the above case $600 P/W would go into savings. Times that by 52 weeks gives you 32K which can be spent on holidays, so yes I think 52K a year is very comfortable and you can do a reasonable amount of travel.

What we are well aware of is that most of the time you do spend it living at home. The 8 or 10 Months at home living well but simply allows us to save the surplus and do our holidays. When we are overseas we do all our dental work and buy our clothes there, we save money by buying overseas. I have bought enough Billabong T Shirts at $5 each and jeans at $20 each to last me years, my wife is the same. We prefer the overseas bargains. I kind of use our trips not only for the holiday but to do/buy the things we need too. I look at living at home as money going in the bank for the next trip.


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

$3000 per week if I lived in Australia. I have expensive tastes
$700 per week if I lived in Bali. I have expensive tastes

The thread asked you to "live" ....... not to "exist". Why work all your life to squirrel money away only to pennypinch every cent of your funds? That to me is "existing" and not "living". 

Go to a decent restaurant (NOT McDonalds) and buy a nice Brut Cuvee as an apertif, have the soft shell crab for entree' with a delightful Chenin Blanc, Wagyu Tataki for main washed down with a full bodied Shiraz and then for dessert an apple and calvados sorbet drizzled in Cointreau. Not much change out of $500 for dinner for 2. I would expect this once a week. 

Do the same in Ku De Ta or the Oberoi in Bali and it would cost you $200.


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## prawn_86 (16 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> Go to a decent restaurant (NOT McDonalds) and buy a nice Brut Cuvee as an apertif, have the soft shell crab for entree' with a delightful Chenin Blanc, Wagyu Tataki for main washed down with a full bodied Shiraz and then for dessert an apple and calvados sorbet drizzled in Cointreau. Not much change out of $500 for dinner for 2. I would expect this once a week.




mm sounds good. But i would be pairing my meals with fine beers. Not many restuarants have a good beer list though


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## awg (16 April 2011)

easylikesunday said:


> To *survive* you would only need $50 a week. That would pay for food and a warm blanket.
> 
> Anything above that figure is simply to cater for our luxuries.
> 
> We are a greedy lot nowadays.




$50?... luxury dude!

food can be had 4 free from soup kitchens in city, scavenging. 

clothes, blankets salvos for nix

a few neccesities by charity shopping voucher, wipe yr ass with newspaper

freeganism & barter !

There is also a guy who walks the country, living off the land, and coins he finds, has done for 30yrs, been on TV, saw him recently near Condobolin


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## Ageo (16 April 2011)

Interesting 1 this.......

If i wanted to live like a peasant (no house, camp etc..) then a couple hundred a week would cover me.

But if you want the house, cars decent lifestyle then 100k per yr would have to be the minimum i reckon....


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## awg (16 April 2011)

Hi Bill, 

Have done a budget recently for the first time in a long while, to see if my wife can retire.

My total costs are not for just for a couple as we have dependant uni students who cost a bomb.

However opening my budget, I have made PA allowances for such things as:


Upgrades and Maintenance to Capitalist Swine Mansion  $6k

Upgrades to Luxury Capitalist Swine Household equipment      $2k

Total Cost for Capitalist Pig Auto fleet                  $10k

Energy Costs...#$%& well ahead of inflation!

I have found these to be the true costs of maintaining an older home and 2 cars including depreciation, if you dont factor them accurately, them future expediture forecasts will be shot to bits. 

These costs could obviously be less for some, but I am not what you would call a spendthrift.

If I posted the family food bill, that is scary, big boys eat a LOT.

On the basis of your original question, if only a couple, could get by on $1k a week, but more would be highly desirable


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

awg said:


> However opening my budget, I have made PA allowances for such things as:
> 
> 
> Upgrades and Maintenance to Capitalist Swine Mansion  $6k
> ...




Thanks for that. You seem to have allowed a lot for maintenance and upgrade for your house, 8k a year? I could buy 3 colourbond fences, a water heater and re carpet my whole house for that and then I won't need any of those for 10 years. But never mind I accept your figures, everyones needs are different.

One thing I didn't include in my budget was car depreciation. The reason for that is that I don't buy new cars. I only have 1 car and normally buy 5 year old cars with low kilometers that last me 10 years before I get another one. Cars don't interest me much so I don't spend much on them. In my case 10K over 10 years is only $20 p/w depreciation and has no impact on my budget.

Your living costs of $1k per week are quite reasonable considering all your expenses, cheers.


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## tech/a (16 April 2011)

My short answer and not a smart Ar$e one either is.

Enough* not* to worry about how much I need to live on a week.

Its just something I decided long long ago wouldn't be in life's equations.
Other more important issues to take care of--rather than concern yourself with the almighty $$.

The less important you make it the less important it is.

Whether you choose not to have it (Money) or have it in excess (Money).

Out of interest though I do know how much I need each month to keep the Company doors open.
$260,000 a month.
Kind of makes the Home budget pale somewhat.


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## sptrawler (16 April 2011)

WOW tech/a I would be stressed with those sorts of numbers. The good thing is though, from the replies here, you only need $261,000 per month to run the business and live reasonably.LOL


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

Bill M said:


> Hi trainspotter, I know I shouldn't ask.... but now I am so curious, what costs 3 grand a week when you have your own home and no debts and no kids? I could eat steak and drink *champaign* each night and still have $$$$ left after it with $800 p/w. Just tell me to shove off if it's personal.




I do eat steak and drink champagne each night. Alright ...... seeing how you asked for it.

Just to fill up one of my cars is $150 per week. V8 Landcruiser.
The other car is $100 per week. We do a lot of running around and travelling to Perth (country based) We will not be sitting in the house waiting to die.

Accomodation whilst in Perth. Not staying in a caravan park and never will it is not unusual to have to spend $300 per night for a decent room in a decent inner city hotel. Conservatively $3000 per annum and sometimes we fly to Perth (more expense)

Entertainment - See my other post RE: a decent restaurant ...... the reason we are in the big smoke is to go and see a show/entertainer/class act and not sitting in the bleachers nor the nose bleeds it gets up to $200 per ticket to get a good view.

House Outgoings - My house costs about $14,000 per annum to own. Land and Water Rates are $4,000 per year, Electricity, gas and water consumption is approx $5,000 per year. Not uncommon to get electric bills of $600 PLUS for a 60 day period !! Insurance is over $2000 per annum. Maintenance (reticulation, gardening, tapware, light fittings etc) take another $2000 per annum.

Clothing - I would think nothing of spending $250 on a business shirt which would last me only a couple of months. I have a penchant for leather jackets as well. $2500 for a Monza Italian is about the right money. My wife has equal tastes.

Holiday - One month in Bali every year costs me $10,000 inclusive flights, shopping meals etc etc. We also fly to QLD once a year. This year the rellies are coming to me (saving I think????) 

Hobbies - I have a boat that conservatively costs me $5,000 per annum to maintain/insure/keep afloat as well as fishing gear that is not at the cheap end of the scale that constantly is required to be replaced. One trip to the Abrolhos Islands would be a $2000 exercise in logistics. I do this 3 to 4 times a year. Bait is $18.50 per kilo for octopus. One decent 24 oz sinker is $6.00, some of the hooks I use are $5.00 each. You would lose up to 5 rigs per day.

Health Insurance/Incidentals - Close to another $100 per week easily. Top Cover

This is what I am doing right now. This to me is "living" and not "existing". Yes we could scale back and do everything on a budget and get it down to $800 per week but WHY? Lifestyle has the words LIFE and STYLE in it's spelling.

Champaign??? Never heard of it ?? :


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## Mister Mark (16 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> $3000 per week if I lived in Australia. I have expensive tastes
> $700 per week if I lived in Bali. I have expensive tastes
> 
> The thread asked you to "live" ....... not to "exist". Why work all your life to squirrel money away only to pennypinch every cent of your funds? That to me is "existing" and not "living".
> ...




Im up for adoption if you interested, sounds good to me


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

Thanks for that trainspotter, your response answers the 3K question. Man, your LIFE and STYLE sounds like a full time job to me Good luck to you mate, enjoy it.


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## Glen48 (16 April 2011)

Man think of the gold and silver you could buy with that sort of loot floating around


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

MP: You were lucky. We lived for three months in a brown paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six o'clock in the morning, clean the bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down mill for fourteen hours a day week in-week out. When we got home, out Dad would thrash us to sleep with his belt!

GC: Luxury. We used to have to get out of the lake at three o'clock in the morning, clean the lake, eat a handful of hot gravel, go to work at the mill every day for tuppence a month, come home, and Dad would beat us around the head and neck with a broken bottle, if we were LUCKY!


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## Julia (16 April 2011)

awg said:


> Upgrades and Maintenance to Capitalist Swine Mansion  $6k
> 
> Upgrades to Luxury Capitalist Swine Household equipment      $2k
> 
> ...







trainspotter said:


> We will not be sitting in the house waiting to die.
> 
> Accomodation whilst in Perth. Not staying in a caravan park and never will it is not unusual to have to spend $300 per night for a decent room in a decent inner city hotel. Conservatively $3000 per annum and sometimes we fly to Perth (more expense)



I feel the same.  Would rather go away less often and stay in good accommodation.
Last time in Sydney we paid around $400 per night.  Worth every bit.



> House Outgoings - My house costs about $14,000 per annum to own. Land and Water Rates are $4,000 per year, Electricity, gas and water consumption is approx $5,000 per year. Not uncommon to get electric bills of $600 PLUS for a 60 day period !! Insurance is over $2000 per annum. Maintenance (reticulation, gardening, tapware, light fittings etc) take another $2000 per annum.



Exactly.  This is the point I was trying to make yesterday when people were assuming no outgoings on one's residence if simply no mortgage.   On the contrary, there are constant and necessary outgoings.   Small example:  yesterday received notice that annual termite inspection and pest control is due.  Cost around $400 p.a.



> Health Insurance/Incidentals - Close to another $100 per week easily. Top Cover



Yep, I'm curious about why people do not have private cover, i.e. whether this implies total faith in the public system, similar faith in one's eternal good health, belief that no catastrophic accident or illness will happen, or alternatively a budgeted separate fund that ensures you could pay for private care if necessary, bearing in mind that some procedures can cost more than $300,000.



> This is what I am doing right now. This to me is "living" and not "existing". Yes we could scale back and do everything on a budget and get it down to $800 per week but WHY? Lifestyle has the words LIFE and STYLE in it's spelling.



Agree.  Obviously you can afford what you have so why not enjoy it.  Too many people (not suggesting this applies to anyone here) without quite realising it, become habituated to trying to save money when it's no longer necessary.




Mister Mark said:


> Im up for adoption if you interested, sounds good to me



 So funny.   Do you necessarily want to be adopted into Western Australia?  What can you offer as an adoptee?

Btw, great thread, BillM.


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## awg (16 April 2011)

Bill M said:


> Thanks for that. You seem to have allowed a lot for maintenance and upgrade for your house, 8k a year? I could buy 3 colourbond fences, a water heater and re carpet my whole house for that and then I won't need any of those for 10 years. But never mind I accept your figures, everyones needs are different.
> 
> One thing I didn't include in my budget was car depreciation. The reason for that is that I don't buy new cars. I only have 1 car and normally buy 5 year old cars with low kilometers that last me 10 years before I get another one. Cars don't interest me much so I don't spend much on them. In my case 10K over 10 years is only $20 p/w depreciation and has no impact on my budget.
> 
> Your living costs of $1k per week are quite reasonable considering all your expenses, cheers.




The bulk of those costs is for major stuff you only do rarely, like a room reno, or roof repairs, or additions. If you dont factor them in tho, your budget will be innacurate.
Believe me, I am no maintenance freak, but there is only so long a wife will tolerate a tired bathroom or kitchen, plus they wanna do makeovers an stuff

You can also have expensive items like tree removal, damaged sewer or water pipes,
worn out aircon compressor (the joy of PPOR and IP)

Have experienced these costs so thats why budget them, maybe just had a bad run


Man, I would sit on a couch till the stuffing was hanging out, but no...anyway, at least once a year an appliance such as computer, washing machine, dishwasher, TV etc etc seems to need replacing

I buy my cars well depreciated, so that is only about 2-3kpa on the 10k costs
The rest is rego,insurance, maintenance, petrol x 2.

my vintage cars I account as a seperate item.

The quoted figures are also inflated a bit in account of present family situation, they should probably fall in the future ? ( would be nice)

It would depend a lot on the size, age and type of structure for each property

The $1k p/week is what I would see as the bare minimum for us, if we were just a couple, based on todays money, any sort of luxury woud require extra dollars to the value of that spending. 

also not subsidising any offspring, which is unrealistic given the situation visa-vi the uni, job, welfare and property issues for the younger generation imo..is a very hard figure to nail down an estimate for future budget purposes, is how much it will cost you to subsidise a good uni education for them, best I could do is say, this will be the most we can afford.

Although this does not affect couples with no dependants, dependancy for welfare purpose can extend up to the age of 25! 

If I did not have to consider any other persons wishes,  reckon I would live on less money than otherwise, although admit may be torn between frugality and utter, reckless hedonism


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## Dowdy (16 April 2011)

Bill M said:


> I did a little budget of what we spend in an ordinary suburb per week. I put in all our running costs for the house, insurances etc and the running costs of the car. I also allowed for half a tank of petrol. It includes an RSL lunch a week, a take away and my alcohol. We do not do any expensive sports like golf, skydiving etc. We do not have health insurance so you must add that in if you do. My wife and I live comfortably on $400 P/W. Every other bit of income such as in the above case $600 P/W would go into savings. Times that by 52 weeks gives you 32K which can be spent on holidays, so yes I think 52K a year is very comfortable and you can do a reasonable amount of travel.
> 
> What we are well aware of is that most of the time you do spend it living at home. The 8 or 10 Months at home living well but simply allows us to save the surplus and do our holidays. When we are overseas we do all our dental work and buy our clothes there, we save money by buying overseas. I have bought enough Billabong T Shirts at $5 each and jeans at $20 each to last me years, my wife is the same. We prefer the overseas bargains. I kind of use our trips not only for the holiday but to do/buy the things we need too. I look at living at home as money going in the bank for the next trip.





You misread my tone. 

It should read - you have to be a foolish spendthrift to not be able to live off 1k a week


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## NewOrder (16 April 2011)

> I spent 4 months in USA and only spent 10k. That included tour bookings (3k) theme parks, NASA, 1 week in Orlando, 1 week in Miami (1k) *a tattoo (1.5k)* and the rest was drinking and having fun.




Is no one else shocked at someone spending $1.5k on a tattoo? Or have I read it wrong?

As for the OP I honestly have no clue, bad form really. Life is presenting me with too many wacked out challenges ATM to worry about how much money I will need in retirement. All I can say is that once I offload the kids life will be much cheaper anyway.


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## tech/a (16 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> MP: You were lucky. We lived for three months in a brown paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six o'clock in the morning, clean the bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down mill for fourteen hours a day week in-week out. When we got home, out Dad would thrash us to sleep with his belt!
> 
> GC: Luxury. We used to have to get out of the lake at three o'clock in the morning, clean the lake, eat a handful of hot gravel, go to work at the mill every day for tuppence a month, come home, and Dad would beat us around the head and neck with a broken bottle, if we were LUCKY!






My sort of humor!
A classic.
Anyone seen Doug and Dinsdale?
Or  Norman Cingenpolvolter
Where the petshop with the parrot?
Better still the Undertakers!


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

awg said:


> Although this does not affect couples with no dependants, dependancy for welfare purpose can extend up to the age of 25!
> 
> If I did not have to consider any other persons wishes,  reckon I would live on less money than otherwise, although admit may be torn between frugality and utter, reckless hedonism




I am convinced, I think I need to allow a bit more for house maintenance. By the way we are lucky (or unlucky for some) we do not have any dependant children, it really keeps our living expenses down.


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## Bill M (16 April 2011)

NewOrder said:


> Is no one else shocked at someone spending $1.5k on a tattoo? Or have I read it wrong?




If someone offered me $10K to go and get a tattoo I wouldn't do it. I don't like needles from the Doc let alone have someone inflict pain on me.


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## inq (16 April 2011)

NewOrder said:


> Is no one else shocked at someone spending $1.5k on a tattoo? Or have I read it wrong?




Not that surprising. To get an arm done well, you'd be looking at 2k+. I doubt it was a lil' tweety bird tat.


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19059&page=3&highlight=tattoos

Car rego, maintenance and insurance plus mobile phone bills another $600 per month.


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## Mister Mark (16 April 2011)

Julia said:


> I feel the same.  Would rather go away less often and stay in good accommodation.
> Last time in Sydney we paid around $400 per night.  Worth every bit.
> 
> 
> ...




I promise to do my best to keep up that life style, but my wife tells me she wants in as well, so do my 3 daughters and 12 grandchildren, am i selling this well?


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## Wysiwyg (16 April 2011)

> Too many people (not suggesting this applies to anyone here) without quite realising it, become habituated to trying to save money when it's no longer necessary.



Yes that sacrifice of personal life time for the future payoff has never really rang a bell for me. "Plans that either came to nought or half a page of scribbled lines". (Floyd)


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## NewOrder (16 April 2011)

inq said:


> Not that surprising. To get an arm done well, you'd be looking at 2k+. I doubt it was a lil' tweety bird tat.




WOW     OK I clearly have no clue.


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

"Never get too busy making a living that you forget to have a life" is my motto.



I think I need a Lear jet.


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## Wysiwyg (16 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> I think I need a Lear jet.



Okay Manny. Your cover is blown. 



> STORM Financial boss Emmanuel Cassimatis says he leased to buy a $7 million airplane when he could have spent money on improved software to safeguard clients because "I always wanted my own jet".


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## trainspotter (16 April 2011)

Wysiwyg said:


> Okay Manny. Your cover is blown.




LOL ....... lyrics of the song BUT it is cheaper to fly corpoprate jet than you think. Usually around $1500 domestic to $2500 per hour internationally. I can hire a turboprop (cheaper than a jet) from where I am in the country and land in the city 1 and 1/2 hours later for $1750. Plane can seat 8 people BTW so a $220 flight one way is comparable to what the local aeroflots are charging. The trick is to go only ONE WAY as you have to pay for the plane to sit around on the tarmac when not in use. I learned this the hard way when I chartered a helicopter and got the bill for the pilot and chopper "wait time".


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## Julia (16 April 2011)

Bill M said:


> If someone offered me $10K to go and get a tattoo I wouldn't do it. I don't like needles from the Doc let alone have someone inflict pain on me.



I agree absolutely.  But if you're someone who likes tattoos, they are something that you can enjoy every day for ever, so on that basis, $1500 seems entirely reasonable to me.  What is so interesting about this thread is the priority we all have for quite different uses of money.




Mister Mark said:


> I promise to do my best to keep up that life style, but my wife tells me she wants in as well, so do my 3 daughters and 12 grandchildren, am i selling this well?



Um, probably not too well, really.   The potential adoptee would need to bring with him/her benefits rather than liabilities.


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## white_crane (16 April 2011)

The answer is - very little.  Somewhere in the order of what Prawn was quoting.

As a university student, I learned to live on very little, something which I still do.  Now that I have a job, I can afford the odd little luxury here and there (although my version of a luxury is a $500 rod and reel setup that will last me for years).

Each fortnight I top my bank account up to a set level which covers all my expenses for the fortnight plus a little extra.  Of that amount, 30% is for direct debited savings programs anyway.  The rest gets transferred into other (online access only) accounts as savings also.  In order to buy something worth more than say $100, I have to transfer it back to the original account.


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## Bill M (17 April 2011)

I just thought I would add an old age pensioners point of view, the person is close to me, she's my Mother. My Mother is 80 years old and lives in a 3br brick house on her own. She has to pay for house maintenance and the running of her car. The old age pension is $360 P/W and she has other income of about $40 P/W.

My Mother lives comfortably on $400 P/W. She doesn't travel anywhere (other than local) as she can't and is on a walking frame. Whenever she needs a fence or new fridge she can afford to pay for a new one. She tells me that that $400 P/W is more than enough to look after herself. She has an active life but does things with her friends that doesn't cost much money and she is very happy.


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## Dowdy (17 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> I do eat steak and drink champagne each night. Alright ...... seeing how you asked for it.
> 
> Just to fill up one of my cars is $150 per week. V8 Landcruiser.
> The other car is $100 per week. We do a lot of running around and travelling to Perth (country based) We will not be sitting in the house waiting to die.
> ...






Some things I can understand - House, boat, petrol, insurance, entertainment

But some things are just outrageous - accommodation ($300 a night! A four star hotel in New York cost $250 a night)

Holiday & Clothing - I don't know why you would go to the same place every year and spend 10K. Explore the world, go somewhere else or just buy a holiday house in Bali if you're in love with the place.  Connects to clothing - if you spend $250 on a shirt and you go to bali for a month, why don't you just buy yourself clothes when you're in Bali and post them back home. I heard you can get a fitted suit with top notch material for under $300

Eating and Wine - This is just my personal preference but I don't like spending insane amounts of money on things that aren't memorable and don't last  - ie, food and wine

But hey, I guess it all comes down to if you got the money. My super rich Aunty and Uncle spend insane amounts of money. My uncle bought my aunty an 80k ring and she bought herself a 5k handbag (although my uncle wanted to give her the 15k handbag but she didn't like it) 





> Originally Posted by NewOrder
> Is no one else shocked at someone spending $1.5k on a tattoo? Or have I read it wrong?




Got it done at Miami Ink so there's usually a premium to get it done there but I'm really happy with it. It amusing when I go to the pools and even the senior citizens give me compliments   http://www.ratemyink.com/?action=ssp&pid=120118


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## JTLP (17 April 2011)

Julia said:


> Yep, I'm curious about why people do not have private cover, i.e. whether this implies total faith in the public system, similar faith in one's eternal good health, belief that no catastrophic accident or illness will happen, or alternatively a budgeted separate fund that ensures you could pay for private care if necessary, bearing in mind that some procedures can cost more than $300,000.




May be quite silly of me - but right now (24 about to turn 25) I see no need for private health cover (although I have had a parasite for 2 months now  ). I tried to justify even the most basic private cover (I think it was $10.95 a week) but I wouldn't come close to recouping the costs throughout the year and making it worthwhile...case in point - I hadn't been to the dentist in 9 years (was too scared after my braces) and finally mustered up the courage to go - after the spiel about how I should come every 6 months they said "oh wow - you must be very thorough with your teeth cleaning - just a check up for today". 

I will eventually get Private Health (to avoid the lifetime loading) but for the interim I have faith for emergencies in the public system (hope to god I never have an emergency!).


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## trainspotter (17 April 2011)

Dowdy said:


> Some things I can understand - House, boat, petrol, insurance, entertainment
> 
> But some things are just outrageous - accommodation ($300 a night! A four star hotel in New York cost $250 a night)
> 
> ...




$300 a night is cheap inner city accomodation in a moderate hotel in Perth. Up to $600 per night for Burswood river executive suites (very nice) The Richardson penthouse suite is $2500 per night (overpriced for what you get) and my all time favourite is the Hyatt Regency $800 per night for the Presidential Suite. (very good value for money IMO)

Bali is a BIG Island and there is more to it than just Kuta Square and Waterbom Park believe it or not. We explore the whole island as well as live in villages that round eyes don't even go to because it is too far off the beaten track. Every time we go we find something new and exciting we did not know existed. NOT guided tours of elephant parks or art galleries. We have swum in sulphur baths in temples that are off limits to the tourists and attended local weddings in full traditional clothing. NOT your normal Aussie yobbo Bali experience. There are pearl farms on the North of the Island at Lovina that interest me as well. 

Clothing in Bali is a strange commodity especially when it comes to "tailored" shirts, pants suits etc. I have tried several textile outlets and various tailors. Nothing to get excited about and yes I had several shirts/leather jackets/dress pants made but not the same as an Italian designer label. Wanky I know but you will know when you try them on. Yes yes yes there is the street vendors for your fake Billabong T shirts and your replicant Hurley shorts and plastic Nike shoes. Boring. 

Eating and Wine is an experience to be savioured and I have many memories of fantastic restaurants and incredible food and wine. When the Maitre d takes control of the situation and places you in the "right" spot in the dining area and the Sommelier reccomends the "right" wine to go with the meal to match what you have ordered and the Waiters bring the food and the wine to a crescendo of sublime performance whereby you do not have to ask them to fill the wine nor get their thumb out of the rim of the plate and not have to be told "YES WE ARE FINISHED SO TAKE THE DAMN PLATES AWAY." Once again until you have experienced such things you wonder why you tolerate sub standard service in other restaurants. Just my humble opinion of course.

Very cool tattoo BTW. Great layered ink and good subject.


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## Julia (17 April 2011)

JTLP said:


> I will eventually get Private Health (to avoid the lifetime loading) but for the interim I have faith for emergencies in the public system (hope to god I never have an emergency!).



Thanks, JTLP, makes sense at your age and with good health.


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## NewOrder (17 April 2011)

> Got it done at Miami Ink so there's usually a premium to get it done there but I'm really happy with it. It amusing when I go to the pools and even the senior citizens give me compliments http://www.ratemyink.com/?action=ssp&pid=120118



Very impressive


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## sptrawler (17 April 2011)

trainspotter said:


> $300 a night is cheap inner city accomodation in a moderate hotel in Perth. Up to $600 per night for Burswood river executive suites (very nice) The Richardson penthouse suite is $2500 per night (overpriced for what you get) and my all time favourite is the Hyatt Regency $800 per night for the Presidential Suite. (very good value for money IMO)
> 
> Bali is a BIG Island and there is more to it than just Kuta Square and Waterbom Park believe it or not. We explore the whole island as well as live in villages that round eyes don't even go to because it is too far off the beaten track. Every time we go we find something new and exciting we did not know existed. NOT guided tours of elephant parks or art galleries. We have swum in sulphur baths in temples that are off limits to the tourists and attended local weddings in full traditional clothing. NOT your normal Aussie yobbo Bali experience. There are pearl farms on the North of the Island at Lovina that interest me as well.
> 
> ...




I've got you pegged trainspotter, your a farmer on drought relief.


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