# SOL - Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Company



## System (27 August 2011)

Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Co. Limited’s (SOL) principal activities include ownership of shares and properties, coal mining and retailing of pharmaceutical products. The company’s main operating subsidiaries are New Hope Corporation and Pitt Capital Partners.

http://www.whsp.com.au


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## Taltan (5 September 2011)

System said:


> Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Co. Limited’s (SOL) principal activities include ownership of shares and properties, coal mining and retailing of pharmaceutical products. The company’s main operating subsidiaries are New Hope Corporation and Pitt Capital Partners.
> 
> http://www.whsp.com.au




There main shareholding is in BKW which owns large chunk of SOL which is why they're run jointly. There presumably is a good reason for this unusual structure although I am not myself aware of it.


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## skc (5 September 2011)

Taltan said:


> There main shareholding is in BKW which owns large chunk of SOL which is why they're run jointly. There presumably is a good reason for this unusual structure although I am not myself aware of it.




Takeover defence was the main aim.

I am against companies that focus on takeover defence. It should always be the shareholders who decide whether they wish to sell or not.


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## So_Cynical (5 September 2011)

skc said:


> Takeover defence was the main aim.
> 
> I am against companies that focus on takeover defence. It should always be the shareholders who decide whether they wish to sell or not.




I can see the attraction for the long term investor...park your money and forget about it, dividends every 6 months for ever...this is one of the main attractions for me with closely held stocks where there's 1 major holder with over 50% and maybe the top 20 holding over 85% of the stock = a high probability of long term ownership certainty.


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## SeekingYields (4 September 2013)

I'm a shareholder of SOL and am frustrated with this cross ownership structure they have with Brickworks. Both stocks as a result are trading well below there fair values.


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## SeekingYields (23 October 2013)

Things are going to start happening now! I've always rated the Perpetual investment team very highly, very confident there will be a positive outcome

http://www.businessday.com.au/business/carnegie-ups-pressure-on-brickworks-20131023-2w0n1.html


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## Judd (4 November 2013)

SeekingYields said:


> Things are going to start happening now! I've always rated the Perpetual investment team very highly, very confident there will be a positive outcome
> 
> http://www.businessday.com.au/business/carnegie-ups-pressure-on-brickworks-20131023-2w0n1.html




Personally, I am the opposite.  I've never considered Perpetual great fund managers, merely index huggers in the main.  And index hugging, while ripping fees out for the privilege, is a bit different from running a company for a profit (as opposed to considering share price fluctuations as being the be all and end all.)


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## piggybank (7 April 2014)

A Daily P&F Update:-


​


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## SmokeyGhost (1 June 2015)

SeekingYields said:


> Things are going to start happening now! I've always rated the Perpetual investment team very highly, very confident there will be a positive outcome
> 
> http://www.businessday.com.au/business/carnegie-ups-pressure-on-brickworks-20131023-2w0n1.html




Was curious whether there was a thread on SOL.  Lo and behold there is.  Seems something did start.   PPT and Carnegie Group appear to have given the game away.

Always wondered why they focused on SOL/BKW and not CIN/AHD in regard to the concept of repressing shareholders.


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## trinity168 (20 September 2016)

A newbie here.  Not much discussion on SOL.  I don't hold it but am looking to buy into SOL mainly for income/dividend stream.  Looking for an entry price, as it feels on the high side of the 52 week mark.


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## Muschu (20 December 2016)

My son has just bought this as a possible long term hold.  I see it has been very ordinary these past few months.... 

However the long term chart is of interest [I know the dialogue about the past not being a predictor of future performance.... ] bit if you've held since 1981 when it was 33 cents I doubt whether you'd be  complaining.

So $655 in another 36 years... Fun to think about - although I'll be well over a 100 yo by then 

As someone said SOL seems to attract little discussion - although I note around 1400 trades today.  

I'm not good at analysing stocks but are the fundamentals pretty solid?

Comments welcome if anyone is interested.


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## trinity168 (20 December 2016)

Not sure if your estimate considered dividends from SOL.  It is a nice, boring stock for a buy and hold person like myself.  

This is a chart from the last 10 years, with 10K invested.  




14% total return.


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## Muschu (20 December 2016)

No I wasn't including dividends... I think these are just under 4% fully franked.  

We have a SMSF and our holds are generally boring.... Also probably not diversified enough.  

Might spend some more time investigating SOL.

Thanks for the comment and chart.

Regards


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## So_Cynical (21 December 2016)

Muschu said:


> I'm not good at analysing stocks but are the fundamentals pretty solid?
> 
> Comments welcome if anyone is interested.




I almost bought that dip in early 2015, around $12 great value then, they have mountains of cash and little to no debt, more an investment company now than anything else...boring solid growth and FF dividends twice a year for ever.


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## ROE (21 December 2016)

This is a solid company with good management and investment track record, they been around for a long while now, I dont have any but I know a fair bit about them.

One of these business where I wait for a crash, NTA drop and investment return drop sharply then buy in and if it never happen it doesnt really matter, I have dozen or two business I keep an eye out for when the time come.

They recently bought around 2.6m  shares in AHZ which I hold which give me a bit of confident boost


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## So_Cynical (21 December 2016)

ROE said:


> They recently bought around 2.6m  shares in AHZ which I hold which give me a bit of confident boost




Interesting, i haven't looked at AHZ before, SOL only hold around 1%


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## Belli (22 September 2017)

Took a deep breath and topped up with a few of these yesterday.


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## Miner (22 September 2017)

Belli said:


> Took a deep breath and topped up with a few of these yesterday.



I also dived yesterday Thursday to buy few. The fundamentals are so strong. The market must have more and more expectations so the result could not fill up their appetites.


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## HelloU (5 October 2018)

toot  toot   (no idea why)


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## greggles (5 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> toot  toot   (no idea why)




Come on, you can do better than that. Let's not turn this place into HC. 

Even throwing up a chart would have been more informative. $16.50 to $28 in eight months is pretty impressive.


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## HelloU (5 October 2018)

not talking about that .....talking about since the report, and associated dump, and now toot toot. I have no idea why .......does anybody have toot toot thoughts? surely more than tpg - unless nbn related?

No interest in talking about why peeps should have bought 12 months ago ...more interested in the future ....and no chart available for that yet.


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## greggles (5 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> No interest in talking about why peeps should have bought 12 months ago ...more interested in the future ....and no chart available for that yet.




So tell us about the future of SOL. What are your thoughts? toot toot doesn't tell us anything apart from perhaps you've had too much to drink.


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## galumay (5 October 2018)

greggles said:


> Even throwing up a chart would have been more informative.




I have never seen an instance when that was true!!


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## HelloU (5 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> not talking about that .....talking about since the report, and associated dump, and now toot toot. I have no idea why .......does anybody have toot toot thoughts? surely more than tpg - unless nbn related?



I agree with this bloke ......and would also like to hear any thoughts on this latest toot toot......


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## Miner (5 October 2018)

Good posting Greg as always  .
We need many like yours to lift ASF to regain its position - thanks
SOL is a great stock. I have been late entry but happy to get 72% return in less than 12 months. The risks are with this stock is heavy reliance on TPG and BKW.  But SOL is a long standing investor and people have forgotten that it started as Soul Pattison Chemist and we all know it as an astute investor on real gems.


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## HelloU (5 October 2018)

Miner said:


> Good posting Greg as always  .
> We need many like yours to lift ASF to regain its position - thanks
> SOL is a great stock. I have been late entry but happy to get 72% return in less than 12 months. The risks are with this stock is heavy reliance on TPG and BKW.  But SOL is a long standing investor and people have forgotten that it started as Soul Pattison Chemist and we all know it as an astute investor on real gems.



so would you tip another, say $50K, into it tomorrow at $28.34? or is it being pumped right now?


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## HelloU (6 October 2018)

greggles said:


> So tell us about the future of SOL. What are your thoughts? toot toot doesn't tell us anything apart from perhaps you've had too much to drink.



as a non-drinker I can say that your post was a cheap shot .....and that a thread that has not been accessed in a year does not help new forum members understand current price movements. The latest movements are imo more than div scalping .........but I will leave that discussion to those who can lift the quality of ASF ....and gracefully bow out.


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## Miner (6 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> so would you tip another, say $50K, into it tomorrow at $28.34? or is it being pumped right now?



Hello U
good question but on ASF there is a certain norm we tend to follow when I joined here in 2007. Not sure if ASF still follows that. One thing is for sure we do not predict prices here.
Besides, every one as you know has different investment strategies - some are day traders and some are long to medium term investors.
As I said, I have been a gainer on SOL. Should I put $50K into it - NO. That amount is depending on my portfolio strategy where I do not spend more than 5% in any stock with the exception is HT1 and CVN where my quota is more than 5%. $50 K is more than 5% of my total portfolio. Would I buy at $28.94 or so is dictated by my expected growth from SOL. I have already gained 70% and do see it may go up another 20% in the next 12 months. I would keep my investment on SOL and not increase the holding. I would invest the same money on stocks where I do not break my 5% holding strategy and hope to get 25% in 12 months.
Regarding your disregard on past 12 months is very interesting. All charts and projection based on past trend so 12 months history is essential to project future.
If you have any other technique to develop a chart - you are welcome to show us. I would love to learn and burn my MBA Finance degree certificate immediately.
Why not you come out with some constructive analysis as well than throwing stones? Extremely disappointing to read your comments on this forum. It is a voluntary one and the main ethos here is collaboration and not sarcasm (In my view). BTW, I am from a non-English speaking background. I do not know what TOOT TOOT means - not a joke and seriously I do not understand. 
Thanks for understanding


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## HelloU (6 October 2018)

Miner said:


> Hello U
> good question but on ASF there is a certain norm we tend to follow when I joined here in 2007. Not sure if ASF still follows that. One thing is for sure we do not predict prices here.



that was not a prediction ....that was the price that was paid YESTERDAY by someone for SOL. Any SOL watcher would know that.

It is why it is running post ann that interests me ........and there are no constructive offerings to this question so far for the consideration of members in this SOL thread (and may be one of the reasons that the shares part of the forum is struggling)

If I want to be criticized, and lectured to, for doing a post I can go elsewhere for that.
If I want to see a 10 year chart on a stock, I can go elsewhere for that.
If I want to discuss current price movements of a stock, it seems I have to go elsewhere for that.
....toot toot.


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## HelloU (6 October 2018)

the irony here is that in a share thread that has not seen a post in OVER 12 months my contribution is considered to be sub-standard and therefore not worthy of inclusion by the thread police..........whilst the most popular thread on the site at present is about old white homophobes killing the forum. 

i have not posted in that thread by the way .... on purpose.


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## Miner (6 October 2018)

Hello U
Good morning and have a good weekend.
You are a free man (I am guessing a man) so do what your heart likes. 
May God bless you with wisdom and good feelings.
I have chosen to ignore your postings now.


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## Belli (6 October 2018)

I first bought SOL in 2009.  I've added but not sold since then.  At the moment, I wouldn't add to what I already hold.  The reason is the low yield - I prefer dividends and am not about capital growth - so I think in my case if I were to put any more funds into the market, I'd be inclined to purchase MLT.  Better yield, below NTA and it holds SOL as well.  But that's just me.

Why SOL has shot up in price, I don't know.


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## greggles (6 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> as a non-drinker I can say that your post was a cheap shot .....and that a thread that has not been accessed in a year does not help new forum members understand current price movements.




My remark was actually a bit tongue-in-cheek.

I agree that a thread that has not seen a post in a year does not help new forum members understand current price movements. But neither does "toot toot". If you wish to discuss current share price movements then that would be welcome. Meaningful content is the name of the game, not "toot toot" or "bump".


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## HelloU (6 October 2018)

greggles said:


> My remark was actually a bit tongue-in-cheek.
> 
> I agree that a thread that has not seen a post in a year does not help new forum members understand current price movements. But neither does "toot toot". If you wish to discuss current share price movements then that would be welcome. Meaningful content is the name of the game, not "toot toot" or "bump".



that is the point though ....the 'bump' and 'toot toot' ...you had a look ......and maybe went "what the hell stock is this and what do they do" ...... then asked "what does this bloke know that perhaps I do not know" ...all in between reading the thousands of posts in the old white man homophobe thread. 

If my contributions are worthless then feel free to ignore me, but know that I do not 'grade' the value of yours (I just read them with thanks that there is something to read that is stock related).  

So, back to SOL, there is a rumour running around and that may be the reason for the SP rise post report. But I cannot chart a rumour till later ........


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## So_Cynical (6 October 2018)

HelloU said:


> that is the point though ....the 'bump' and 'toot toot' ...you had a look ......and maybe went "what the hell stock is this and what do they do".




Shining a light on something often over looked is a good thing, SOL are very very astute investors, Clover, TPG, Newhope and many other stocks that they saw something in a decade or so ago all doing rather well, if there were genuine Aussie money manager rankings SOL would be top 5 for sure.


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## sptrawler (6 October 2018)

So_Cynical said:


> Shining a light on something often over looked is a good thing, SOL are very very astute investors, Clover, TPG, Newhope and many other stocks that they saw something in a decade or so ago all doing rather well, if there were genuine Aussie money manager rankings SOL would be top 5 for sure.



They have a big chunk of MLT and vice versa, I tossed up which way to go, and went MLT for dividend.


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## just_jay (23 October 2018)

I'm curious about the catalyst for the close to 10% dip on SOL today? Anyone have any ideas? It ended the day down 5.21% and having glanced at the annual report released this morning, I can't see anything that's glaringly negative (mind you, my fundamentals analysis is not the strongest). Only correlation I saw was perhaps the 9% dip in API in the last 2 days.










Volume in SOL in the last 5 days was very high, perhaps in anticipation of today's report and today's dip and high vol were attributed to panic selling by those who bought in the last few days?


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## barney (23 October 2018)

just_joell said:


> I'm curious about the catalyst for the close to 10% dip on SOL today? Anyone have any ideas? It ended the day down 5.21% and having glanced at the annual report released this morning, I can't see anything that's glaringly negative (mind you, my fundamentals analysis is not the strongest).




Don't follow SOL and know nothing worth while posting about it, but ….. The Chart for this year has been nothing short of stellar

A stellar Chart eventually has to have some Punters taking advantage of the associated rise …. and this is usually done by the "smart money" at various levels around the perceived tops ….. Nothing sinister, but maybe the $30 area is now not the time to buy


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## rnr (11 November 2018)

Although price is within easy striking distance of the ATH, bearish divergence is of concern.
The depth of the pullback will be interesting.


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## HelloU (11 November 2018)

just_joell said:


> I'm curious about the catalyst for the close to 10% dip on SOL today? Anyone have any ideas? It ended the day down 5.21% and having glanced at the annual report released this morning, I can't see anything that's glaringly negative (mind you, my fundamentals analysis is not the strongest). Only correlation I saw was perhaps the 9% dip in API in the last 2 days.
> View attachment 89953
> 
> View attachment 89954
> ...



that dip was Voldemort .......it is now dead and buried. we cannot talk about it though nor mention its name (actual results were out 1 month earlier on 20sep and not related to the oct dip). 
recent trading cycles that have been VERY lucrative are now ..........well ......... 16Nov (this week) will be the fork in the road. will be interesting to see what happens then and if any pump interest remains for cycles without the div carrot to work the whip. i will sit out the trading from mid-week for a bit to see.


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## Miner (14 March 2019)

Hello SOL followers
Could someone please throw light on Pengana Private Equity Trust IPO and SOL relationship?
I got a priority offer from Pengana Private Equity IPO and do not recall any communication on that matter from SOL (unless missed out).
https://www.pengana.com/news-and-in...lobal-private-equity-listed-investment-trust/
*Priority offer*

There will be a Priority Offer for investors in all of PCG’s funds as well as shareholders in the listed investment company Pengana International Equities Limited (ASX: PIA), Pengana Capital Group (ASX: PCG) and Washington H. Soul Pattinson (ASX: SOL). Details on how to apply under the Priority Offer will be contained in the Product Disclosure Statement (‘PDS’) and will also be outlined in a separate communication that will be sent to eligible investors before the offer period opens.

*Offer size*

The minimum offer amount will be $250 million, with a $1 billion maximum.

Regards


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## So_Cynical (14 March 2019)

Miner said:


> Hello SOL followers
> Could someone please throw light on Pengana Private Equity Trust IPO and SOL relationship?




Pitt Capital Partners is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Australia’s oldest listed investment house,
Washington H. Soul Pattinson & Company...Our goal is to identify outstanding companies to invest in and work with the management teams of those companies to help drive long term value creation.

https://www.pcap.com.au/

Pengana is one of their many partners, Pengana Capital is raising a bucket load of money to float its listed private equity fund/Trust, So a LIT not a LIC, the 1.25% Management fee and performance fee comes across as a little cheeky in a time of low fees.

I have access to the priority offer but have decided to pass.


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## Belli (14 March 2019)

Same here.  Passed.  Fees too expensive for me.  Plus SOL has about 35% of Pengana so I guess I'll get a cut through SOL.


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## Miner (14 March 2019)

So_Cynical said:


> Pitt Capital Partners is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Australia’s oldest listed investment house,
> Washington H. Soul Pattinson & Company...Our goal is to identify outstanding companies to invest in and work with the management teams of those companies to help drive long term value creation.
> 
> https://www.pcap.com.au/
> ...



Many thanks  SC for a very pertinent response as well sharing your action in regards to the priority offer.


Belli said:


> Same here.  Passed.  Fees too expensive for me.  Plus SOL has about 35% of Pengana so I guess I'll get a cut through SOL.





Both are helpful .
Regards
Miner


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## Miner (14 March 2019)

Belli said:


> Same here.  Passed.  Fees too expensive for me.  Plus SOL has about 35% of Pengana so I guess I'll get a cut through SOL.



Thanks Belli. Good to learn your view on SOL linkage with PE1.
Regards
Miner


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## Miner (14 March 2019)

@Belli  and @So_Cynical  Good morning
Further to your comments on my request, I did some digging. It looks SOL is holding 35% of the Pengana and the performance of Pengana is unsatifactory.
So I am joining your club - wait and see than becoming Columbus to put my hard earned money on accepting the priority offer. The comparative performacne analysis between PIA SOL and PCG are smply frightening.
Regards


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## Miner (9 April 2019)

Good morning holders of SOL and beholders of SOL thread
This morning you would have noticed on ASX that Robert Milner made two lots of purchase of SOL and each time 60,000 block. So in short he has purchased 120,000 shares spending about  $2.5 M . It is of course negligible considering he already holds more than 18 millions.
Interesting (for me) to observe why he made two lots on the same day instead of one lot of 120,000 shares as I thought initially ASX posted by mistake same notification twice.
https://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20190409/pdf/44459s2bfcdsg8.pdf
https://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20190409/pdf/44459lf6ffj441.pdf
Yes, I do hold SOL.


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## Zaxon (9 April 2019)

SOL has been trading sideways for 6 months.  I haven't been impressed with it of late.  The more buying pressure the better.


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## Garpal Gumnut (9 April 2019)

I always regret selling mine at $14 or so back in 2010 or thereabouts.

Never got back in to SOL. 

Must keep an eye on them. 

Thanks Miner.

gg


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## HelloU (9 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> SOL has been trading sideways for 6 months.  I haven't been impressed with it of late.  The more buying pressure the better.
> View attachment 93654



tricky
if you squint and hold your tongue just right, it and new hope do the funky dance together. late march, new hope deviated from sol. now in early april the deviation is ......less ............. not saying it is fair, it is just how it is. maybe sell one, or buy one, your choice.
leave u to it.
(go clover)


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## Zaxon (9 April 2019)

HelloU said:


> tricky
> if you squint and hold your tongue just right, it and new hope do the funky dance together. late march, new hope deviated from sol. now in early april the deviation is ......less




NHC has had a massive fall from grace due to the Chinese import restrictions.  SOL is good over the long run, but lately has been unimpressive.








HelloU said:


> maybe sell one, or buy one, your choice.



lol.  I sold NHC.  Still own SOL.  But I've put them on notice.  They're underperforming the rest of my portfolio, and I won't stand for it!


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## So_Cynical (10 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> NHC has had a massive fall from grace due to the Chinese import restrictions.  SOL is good over the long run, but lately has been unimpressive.
> 
> I sold NHC.  Still own SOL.  But I've put them on notice.  They're underperforming the rest of my portfolio, and I won't stand for it!




I sold some NHC as well just before the big fall as luck would have it, thats the thing with SOL they hold a diversified portfolio so while NHC has a bad year CLV has hit record highs and TPM has also had a significant recovery.


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## Zaxon (10 April 2019)

So_Cynical said:


> thats the thing with SOL they hold a diversified portfolio so while NHC has a bad year CLV has hit record highs and TPM has also had a significant recovery.



Yup.  SOL is essentially a mini index fund.  On the other hand, you could own the individual best performing constituents of theirs, not own the worse performing ones, and probably outperform SOL.  I guess that's the performance vs stability trade off.


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## Belli (10 April 2019)

I purchased some more SOL a couple of days ago.  I don't follow what the gyrations of market are.  Was the first time I have taken any notice of it in a number of weeks.

I know it's not how others approach the matter obviously but it's what I do that matters to me not what others think.  As long as money from dividends keep coming in to pay the bills, etc I'm content.


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## HelloU (30 April 2019)

HelloU said:


> tricky
> if you squint and hold your tongue just right, it and new hope do the funky dance together. late march, new hope deviated from sol. now in early april the deviation is ......less ............. not saying it is fair, it is just how it is. maybe sell one, or buy one, your choice.
> leave u to it.
> (go clover)



forgot to mention ..... mainly cos it is sort of written between the lines at the start of the thread ....... that bkw is the natural long/short pair if direction is unclear but u still want skin in the millner things.

(go clover)
(fluence - see ya next dance)
(last call jin - are we all finished, are we all done ...)
(a40 - is 16 better than 10)


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## So_Cynical (9 May 2019)

SOL getting back to the long term trend - kind of? traded under 21 bucks today with the TPG /ACCC announcement, div yield of 2.5% should be sustainable going forward.
~


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## Zaxon (9 May 2019)

So_Cynical said:


> SOL getting back to the long term trend - kind of?



Or has it fallen below a SMA, and is on its way down?  Time will tell which time frame holds predictive power.


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## HelloU (9 May 2019)

i find this difficult to value ...so charts it is
patience my pretty - patience


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## HelloU (20 May 2019)

HelloU said:


> i find this difficult to value ...so charts it is
> patience my pretty - patience



short positions are still increasing, but each days turnover is painful to watch as it is big % of low value churn without uncovering many any more sellers ..... makes me think of gough whitlam ..... (maybe trump can get another dollar out of it though?)


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## HelloU (21 May 2019)

HelloU said:


> short positions are still increasing, but each days turnover is painful to watch as it is big % of low value churn without uncovering many any more sellers ..... makes me think of gough whitlam ..... (maybe trump can get another dollar out of it though?)



hold that whitlam thought for a bit ........ where there is a will there is a way for those shorters (no need for trump). 
not sure if their favorite number is 86 or 92?


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## kenny (21 May 2019)

Any thoughts on the continued decline and where fair value lies?
I'm guessing the TPG merger block by ACCC, the weakened property market hitting BKW, and loss of favour of coal perhaps?


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## So_Cynical (22 May 2019)

The 52 week low is 19.02 - fair value is hard to judge with all the moving parts, TPG can maybe go a little lower even though the rest of the telco
sector is doing ok now, NHC is a very stable business, CLV has had an amazing run, TPE has lifted a little and maybe starting to run up at last, BKW
has recently made a big move into the US market, SOL is a beast.


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## HelloU (22 May 2019)

kenny, i already said i cannot value this but had some buy triggers come up recently so have been looking. i will just say for something that churns $10M per day it does not seem to have a lot of buyers or sellers - it just has a lot of trades (if u know what i mean).

(that trading queue is not somewhere for the weak of heart or big orders) the trading is ......... a bit of a boys club to me ....... and i still do not know if they want in or out. so, for better or worse, i wait but keenly watch.


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## HelloU (22 May 2019)

So_Cynical said:


> ...... NHC is a very stable business, ........



up 5% 2day (but i have not looked at how)
busy herding my ducks ........


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## HelloU (24 May 2019)

HelloU said:


> kenny, i already said i cannot value this but had some buy triggers come up recently so have been looking. i will just say for something that churns $10M per day it does not seem to have a lot of buyers or sellers - it just has a lot of trades (if u know what i mean).
> 
> (that trading queue is not somewhere for the weak of heart or big orders) the trading is ......... a bit of a boys club to me ....... and *i still do not know if they want in or out*. so, for better or worse, i wait but keenly watch.



appears out, they want down. i really do not like these people. there is nowhere to sell & there is nowhere to buy ...... seems an odd thing to say when it is doing $10M a day ....whatevs


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## HelloU (22 June 2019)

kenny said:


> Any thoughts on the continued decline and where fair value lies?
> I'm guessing the TPG merger block by ACCC, the weakened property market hitting BKW, and loss of favour of coal perhaps?



update
pilot done recently $21.86 ........ watched gap close from a year ago and took that as a sign from god.
see what the new fiscal brings (historically a down post june but the last 6 months has been different to other past like for likes - for what it is worth)
see what happens ...coin toss ...but ready to jump out.

(see new hope and clover spiked a little yesty - did not look but suspect short covering to help pay tax bills)


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## HelloU (25 June 2019)

.... and $21.89 (pretty close now, too close for me hence the "ready" comment above for my capital protection) and $15.13 are both extant target opportunities for those who poof trade.

if $15.13 goes poof that would be very very interesting ......


----------



## sptrawler (25 June 2019)

They certainly have had a fall from grace, I wonder if MLT will cop a bit of stick, last time I looked they had a swag of SOL. SOL's coal holdings have been doing o.k recently, haven't they?

I hold MLT, no SOL


----------



## HelloU (25 June 2019)

coincidence i am sure but they seem to all have the same surname .......... 

(have ..... not had)


----------



## sptrawler (25 June 2019)

HelloU said:


> coincidence i am sure but they seem to all have the same surname ..........
> 
> (have ..... not had)



I will have to check that out, directors I assume?


----------



## HelloU (25 June 2019)

.... and anything with the word "brick" in the coy title ......


----------



## HelloU (25 June 2019)

sptrawler said:


> They certainly have had a fall from grace, I wonder if MLT will cop a bit of stick, last time I looked they had a swag of SOL. SOL's coal holdings have been doing o.k recently, haven't they?
> 
> I hold MLT, no SOL



all good, nearly "nothing to see here" after a year .........


----------



## sptrawler (25 June 2019)

HelloU said:


> all good, nearly "nothing to see here" after a year .........
> View attachment 95703



The problem is you overlay ARG, AFI and MLT, there is nothing between them, picking dividends is no easy thing in these markets. Maybe I've got the wrong vehicle.


----------



## HelloU (26 June 2019)

sptrawler said:


> The problem is you overlay ARG, AFI and MLT, there is nothing between them, picking dividends is no easy thing in these markets. Maybe I've got the wrong vehicle.



... which is the very reason i see that as "it does not matter which one". Part of my posting that chart was that the big sol moves really did little to mlt either upside or downside. I do not get that, but accept it is how those particular lic's roll.
(certainly easier at tax time than etf's)


----------



## HelloU (28 June 2019)

sptrawler said:


> I will have to check that out, directors I assume?



OT
pengana is another that their fingers are into .......


----------



## So_Cynical (28 June 2019)

HelloU said:


> OT
> pengana is another that their fingers are into .......




Pengana is getting hammered, more than the other fund managers.


----------



## HelloU (28 June 2019)

So_Cynical said:


> Pengana is getting hammered, more than the other fund managers.



lol, not as much as the naos boys. 
yeah, peng, well under nta but nobody seems to care.

onto sol
1cent off closing the down gap with 2 hrs to go ........ traders really are a joyless bunch.


----------



## HelloU (25 July 2019)

HelloU said:


> .... and $21.89 (pretty close now, too close for me hence the "ready" comment above for my capital protection) and $15.13 are both extant target opportunities for those who poof trade.
> 
> if $15.13 goes poof that would be very very interesting ......



gap poof last week and triggered ....... that now leaves $15.13 .......(surely not) ....
but ranging down while market up ...hmmm ..... maybe the xko readjust will be a spark for another pilot? i will look into that (or see if it is another nail)
goodbye old friend, will visit again soon


----------



## Belli (25 February 2020)

No thanks, SOL, I will not be taking up the secondary offer in PE1 as your 39% holding in Pengana is sufficient for me.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (25 February 2020)

Belli said:


> No thanks, SOL, I will not be taking up the secondary offer in PE1 as your 39% holding in Pengana is sufficient for me.



Correct in that SOL has a 39% stake in Pengana, the old NAB stake, but the offer is for shares in the listed fund Pengana Private Equity (PE1) and that is only one of the hats they wear.
* FUNDS managed by Pengana*

Australian Equities Fund
Australian Equities Income Fund
Emerging Companies Fund
International Fund
International Fund - Ethical
International Fund - Ethical Opportunity
Pengana International Equities Limited
Global Small Companies Fund
High Conviction Equities Fund
WHEB Sustainable Impact Fund
Pengana Private Equity Trust


----------



## Belli (26 February 2020)

Dona Ferentes said:


> Correct in that SOL has a 39% stake in Pengana, the old NAB stake, but the offer is for shares in the listed fund Pengana Private Equity (PE1) and that is only one of the hats they wear.
> * FUNDS managed by Pengana*
> 
> Australian Equities Fund
> ...




There is that.  I looked at it from the perspective Pengana takes fees from the funds of which some flow to SOL and thus to me.  That's enough exposure to Pengana for my comfort.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (28 March 2020)

*Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Company (WHSP) lifted its interim dividend by a cent to 25 cents a share, despite a 33% fall in net after-tax profit to $124.7 million.*

The company has stakes in Brickworks (which has a similar stake in Soul Patts) as well as a shareholding in New Hope, TPG, API (chemists group) and several other companies in mining, exploration and rural activities and stock market investment.

Statutory group profit after tax was $51.0 million, down 71.5% in the first half of 2018-19. The shares edged up 2.5% to $19.73.


> Soul Patts again defended its business model, saying it “does not consider its earnings to be the key indicator of the Company’s performance. As with any investment portfolio, the key drivers of success are growth in the capital value of the portfolio and growing dividends.”



The company said it “declares its dividends from the cash it receives from its portfolio (rather than accounting earnings). The regular cash received by WHSP from its investments for the full year FY20 is expected to be in line with the previous year and will support our ability to pay a growing interim and final dividend.

“Our biggest investment, TPG, is a consumer staple business and should see increased demand for its products and services as people are increasingly working remotely. We believe the value-focused products that will be offered by the merged TPG and Vodafone will become increasingly attractive.”

“Since January, Thermal coal prices and demand have been resilient, particularly in Australian dollar terms, which will assist New Hope to maintain profitability.”

“Brickworks has the benefit of exposure to TPG and New Hope through its investment in WHSP and also a sizeable industrial property portfolio with long leases which should benefit from lower bond rates.”

“The businesses in our pharmaceutical portfolio are also performing quite well. Apex and API have both seen an increase in demand for their products since the outbreak of COVID-19,” chairman Robert Milner said in the ASX release yesterday.


----------



## Belli (10 December 2020)

Saw an announcement by SOL it has sold 50m shares in New Hope which has reduced its substantial holding from 50.1% to 43.9%.  My gut feeling is, and that is all it is, SOL is slowly exiting NH.  BKI disposed some time ago its total holding in NH.  I think MLT has also sold its holding but I'm not entirely certain that is the case.


----------



## Miner (10 December 2020)

Belli said:


> Saw an announcement by SOL it has sold 50m shares in New Hope which has reduced its substantial holding from 50.1% to 43.9%.  My gut feeling is, and that is all it is, SOL is slowly exiting NH.  BKI disposed some time ago its total holding in NH.  I think MLT has also sold its holding but I'm not entirely certain that is the case.



SOL probably realised enough is enough - New Hope is Hopeless


----------



## Dona Ferentes (21 January 2021)

_*Launch of up to A$250 million unsecured senior convertible notes due 2026*_

WHSP intends to use the majority of the net proceeds from the Offering to repay approximately A$200 million of existing financial indebtedness which will lower WHSP's average cost of debt and increase WHSP’s debt maturity profile. The remaining proceeds will be applied to further strengthen WHSP’s liquidity position 
Following the Offering, WHSP will continue to have low gearing and diversified sources of funding 
A base issue size of A$225 million with a potential upsize option of up to an additional A$25 million, the Notes are convertible into fully paid ordinary shares in WHSP


----------



## Dona Ferentes (25 March 2021)

SOL is out with its Half Yearly

_• Group profit after tax up 35% to $68.9 million (1H FY20: $51.0 million)  
• Diversified portfolio showing resilience against market volatility  
• Interim Dividend up 4% to 26 cents per share (1H FY20: 25cps)  
  o Grown at a compound annual growth rate of 8% for 20 years  
• The only company in the All Ordinaries to have increased its dividends every year for the past 20 years 
• Total shareholder return of 1,189% over 20 years   
  o Total Shareholder Returns have outperformed the market by 5.6% per annum for 20 years  
• Number of shareholders increased 13% on previous corresponding period_

*Outlook *

WHSP Managing Director, Todd Barlow, said: “_The operating environment for most of our investments continues to improve from the disruptions of Covid-19.  In particular, we are seeing a strong recovery in certain commodities such as thermal coal and copper (up 42% and 73% respectively in the last 12 months in USD terms).” 

“Our investment in Round Oak Minerals (wholly owned) is performing very well in this environment.  The development of Round Oak’s projects has been well timed with current increased production across all three operating mines at a time where commodity prices are strong and ore treatment charges have reduced.”  

“While we are disappointed with the lack of approvals for the extension of New Acland in Queensland, New Hope’s Bengalla asset in NSW is performing strongly and at current spot thermal coal prices generates strong cashflows.” 

“The integration of TPG and Vodafone appears to be proceeding well and, despite some reduction in earnings from lack of international travel impacting roaming and travel cards, we expect sustained growth in earnings over time.” 

“For Brickworks, we are seeing very strong detached housing building approvals in Australia.  The US market is still subdued from the impacts of Covid-19 but supportive government policy and low interest rates should be positive for the market.  The demand for industrial property to service the growth in online shopping and logistics is also a key driver for increased earnings from Brickworks’ property division.” 

“WHSP maintained good cash generation across the portfolio throughout the period impacted by Covid-19.  Cash generation from the portfolio continues to be strong and supports our ambitions to maintain increasing dividends over time.” 

“We continue to have liquidity available for new investments and have a strong pipeline of opportunities which we believe will deliver superior risk adjusted returns.” _


----------



## Belli (16 May 2021)

SOL paid a dividend of Friday.  I added to my holdings back in late April @ $17.15 last year when everybody decided the world has turned to custard.  This FY to dividend has been $0.61.  Still not a large holding of mine at 10,000 but it does the job.

A breakdown of its holdings as per its half-yearly report is attached.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (22 June 2021)

MILTON AND WASHINGTON H. SOUL PATTINSON AGREE TERMS OF A PROPOSED MERGER

• Milton Corporation Limited has entered into a Scheme Implementation Agreement with Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Company Ltd, under which it is proposed that WHSP will acquire 100% of the share capital in Milton it does not already own by way of a Scheme of Arrangement
• Milton Shareholders will receive WHSP scrip as consideration with Milton shares to be valued at a 10% premium to pre-tax net tangible assets adjusted for Milton final and special dividends. In addition, Milton shareholders will receive a fully franked special dividend (which Milton estimates will be up to 37cps) (Special Dividend), the fully franked final dividend (which Milton estimates will be approximately 8cps) (together the Proposed Dividends) and the fully franked FY21 final dividend from WHSP (which WHSP indicatively estimates to be 36cps, of which, based on the exchange ratio, and at current prices, Milton shareholders are estimated to be eligible for 7cps)
• Based on current prices, the proposal implies a value of $6.00 per Milton share, equivalent to an enterprise value of $3.99 billion based on a $4.05 billion equity value and $59.7 million net cash balance
• Implied value of $6.00 per Milton share represents a significant premium of 20.0% to Milton’s last closing price of $5.00 per share, a 9.9% premium to Milton’s pre-tax NTA of $5.46 per share, a 28.5% premium to Milton’s post-tax NTA of $4.67 per share and a 20.2% premium to the one month volume weighted average price of $4.99 per Milton share.

..... _but will the BKW / SOL arrangement get some attention?_


----------



## mullokintyre (22 June 2021)

Dona Ferentes said:


> MILTON AND WASHINGTON H. SOUL PATTINSON AGREE TERMS OF A PROPOSED MERGER
> 
> • Milton Corporation Limited has entered into a Scheme Implementation Agreement with Washington H. Soul Pattinson and Company Ltd, under which it is proposed that WHSP will acquire 100% of the share capital in Milton it does not already own by way of a Scheme of Arrangement
> • Milton Shareholders will receive WHSP scrip as consideration with Milton shares to be valued at a 10% premium to pre-tax net tangible assets adjusted for Milton final and special dividends. In addition, Milton shareholders will receive a fully franked special dividend (which Milton estimates will be up to 37cps) (Special Dividend), the fully franked final dividend (which Milton estimates will be approximately 8cps) (together the Proposed Dividends) and the fully franked FY21 final dividend from WHSP (which WHSP indicatively estimates to be 36cps, of which, based on the exchange ratio, and at current prices, Milton shareholders are estimated to be eligible for 7cps)
> ...



I guess it will have to.
The incestuous tie up between the two means that nothing happens unless both parties agree.
So one would assume that the the boards of BKW and SOL will have thrashed this out (in secret of course), and some other arrangement may have been agreed to.
The Problem for BKW is that there will be a severe dilution of its stake on SOL, but not he reverse.
Perhaps BKW will eventually be absorbed into SOL.
Time will tell.
Mick


----------



## Belli (22 June 2021)

SOL has increased its holding in BKW as at today.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (23 September 2021)

▪ WHSP has resolved to pay an FY21 Final Dividend of 36cps, fully franked
▪ Total dividends for FY21 of 62cps (up 3.3%)
▪ 21st consecutive increase in full year dividends

There is a presentation addressing the inclusion of Milton assets into SOL

*Investing strategy *
_WHSPs enhanced liquidity position following the merger will allow us to capitalise on investment opportunities arising in our target asset classes and thematics_

1. *Milton merger providing > $2b in additional liquidity*
WHSP has significant liquidity available for future investment. Additional debt capacity and low cost of debt

2. *There is a high level of deal flow in alternative asset classes*
Private equity, Structured yield, Emerging companies, Global equities, Real assets & Property

3. *WHSP is focusing on key thematics*
Health and Ageing, Energy Transition, Agriculture, Financial Services, Education

4. *Building around platforms for growth*


▪ _Addition of Milton assets will significantly increase Large cap portfolio (+ $3.5 billion).  
▪ Opportunity to rebalance the Milton portfolio in a disciplined manner over time as suitable investments arise

.... & I suspect there will be selling down/ reweighting towards assets in pts 2 and 3._


----------



## Belli (28 September 2021)

One of my kids holds MLT and asked what it meant.  Basically I said shareholders voted to give up a share close to NTA for one which has this NTA 






at a price greater than the $31 used in the exchange ratio calculation and a one-off sweetener of $0.37 special dividend.

Was a good deal for SOL using overpriced script to get assets of $1 for the price of $0.50.  At least new SOL holders will receive SOL's dividend in December.

ARG held a swag of MLT so some will be flung my way I guess.


----------



## Muschu (21 October 2021)

I held a bundle of MLT before the merger. Picked up their dividend of course. Then, a tad too late, I sold almost half of the SOL shares that I acquired.  The SOL share price continues to wend it way down.
Any thoughts, fundamental or technical, on where this might end?


----------



## Dona Ferentes (21 October 2021)

Washington H Soul Pattinson’s copper mining .. candidate Round Oak Metals will hit the streets for cornerstone talks with high hopes on Monday, trying to make the most of wide open IPO market and the surge in base metals prices.

It’s understood that deal research from Round Oak’s bankers Canaccord Genuity, Morgans and Bell Potter was being sent out on Thursday and Friday, ahead of the cornerstone roadshow.

The talks will involve both domestic and international institutions and the business is expected to attract a valuation in the $300 million to $400 million range. ... the business is likely to raise around $200 million through the float, with a $90 million primary raise, and about 50 per cent composed of a sell down.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (22 November 2021)

WHSP thanks shareholders who registered their interest in participating in the proposed Round Oak Initial Public Offering (IPO) process.  

WHSP has decided *not to proceed with the IPO process* at this time as a result of current market conditions for IPOs and some encouraging exploration results at Round Oak’s Jaguar operations in Western Australia that have the potential to materially extend mine life. 

Round Oak continues to perform very well with strong operations and favourable copper and zinc prices and WHSP believes that extending the life of mine at Jaguar and progressing the Stockman project in Victoria will add material value for WHSP shareholders.


----------



## Belli (14 December 2021)

SOL to put some Christmas spending money into my account today.  Thanks.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (6 January 2022)

A one hour podcast, interviewing Rob Millner of SOL. Matthew Kidman does a good job. 









						Rob Millner's simple rule for investing success
					

Episode three of Success and More Interesting Stuff features Rob Millner, the patriarch of Washington H Soul Pattinson. Soul Patts is the closest investment vehicle that Australia has to Warren Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway. And, like Berkshire Hathaway, Soul Patts has been an outstanding...




					www.livewiremarkets.com
				




1. Always focus on cash. Always have cash handy 
2. COP26 should have been called COP400 for the 400 private jets that turned up.


----------



## IrishDigger (8 January 2022)

I'm wondering how BKI fits into the overall future plan; will it go the way of MLT?


----------



## Dona Ferentes (8 January 2022)

IrishDigger said:


> I'm wondering how BKI fits into the overall future plan; will it go the way of MLT?




_Not much of an indication in the Interview transcript (link above). But thereagain, they play their cards close :_



> *Matthew Kidman*
> And with your other investments, you've got *BKI*, you've got Pengana, and there's five or six of them, do they come under the same scrutiny as what you're saying there? Milton was a lot bigger.
> *Rob Millner : *Yeah. Yeah.
> *Matthew Kidman : *Or do you have ambitions?
> ...





also this is a comment further on:


> *M.K. * So, there's quite a few people depending on you guys for those dividends. That's what they're there for.
> 
> *Rob Millner*
> _As you know, you've been around the investment company, the majority of the older people have their money in something they can understand like an LIC, and they're very dependent on that income.
> And unfortunately, this time last year, they all got smashed because some of the banks didn't pay a dividend, and BHP. I know *BKI*, for example, is going to make more in this half they made the whole year, last year because we've had these increases in dividends._


----------



## Dona Ferentes (8 January 2022)

Muschu said:


> I held a bundle of MLT before the merger. Picked up their dividend of course. ...
> 
> .... Any thoughts, fundamental or technical, on where this might end?



Apart from the point that it won't 'end' but is an ongoing story (check the interview transcript for succession talk), I must say it has been a bit of a ride for what are *essentially the same assets, *over the last year or so. 

A year ago, I had $100K in Milton and $80K in SOL; then MLT ran hard and by the time of the merger at one stage it was $270K. Now $190K in new enlarged SOL and of course some juicy dividend flow along the way. Should I have sold;  perhaps? Has it gone too far down? Possibly.

The old MLT, as a LIC, was easy to value on NTA (or NAV) whereas SOL has that X-factor of gearing, of unlisted assets and less visible valuations. After going through a _Review of Group Entities_, on P27 of the Annual Report it mentions this :


> The Consolidated Entity presents certain _*Alternative Performance Measures*_ (APMs), including regular and non-regular profit after tax, Net cash flows from investments and net asset value. These APMs are used by management to assess the performance of the business and may therefore be useful to investors. They are not a substitute for the Australian Accounting Standards measures and should be considered supplementary to those measures.




And , mention of how SOL now sees Milton is made in the interview :

*Matthew Kidman*
_But now you've decided to merge with Milton, and no longer will it be an LIC — it comes into the Soul company. Why would you do that?

Because you've already got your own investment portfolios within Souls, and you've got a number of positions in different various fund managers, and you've built up a terrific business, but now you bid this, and it's a big one. It's a big deal.
_
*Rob Millner*
_Again, they've got good people down there. And it gives us the option of not having $3.5 billion or $4 billion — it got to $4 billion at one stage — all in the Australian market.

It's going to give us an option, and we're not going to be as dependent as Milton was. And an LIC, as you well know, what I call the older ones have always been very dependent on paying out somewhere between 90 and 100% of their profits out to shareholders. Whereas we'll bring that into Souls.

We can put some money into overseas equities, probably put some money into private equity, and just diverse a little bit, but with the investments that we've got in Souls, Milton's shareholders are going to continue and probably get an extra dividend than what they would've got normally because they've got the diversification of the portfolio of Souls behind them as well._

*Matthew Kidman*
_So, it works for them just like it has for Brickworks over the years. So, you've had your own investment portfolios that you've got in Souls, large caps, small caps. Does Milton basically come in under those? Is that how it's going to look?_

*Rob Millner*
_It'll all be one. Obviously, it'll be different cost bases because obviously the Milton shares have all been set at a different cost base, but they'll be just run by the same people_.

[.... and, trying to tease out some indicator of the future?]
*........ Matthew Kidman*
_Or do you have ambitions?_

*Rob Millner*
_No. The Milton portfolio now will be run internally by Brendan O'Dea and his team, who are the Milton team._


----------



## divs4ever (8 January 2022)

does BKI need to grow any bigger ( than natural organic growth  , sensibly investing the cash reserves when opportunities arrive )


----------



## Ferret (25 February 2022)

Surely SOL is in oversold territory at close to $25.

I want to top up, but the chart is still ugly and times very uncertain.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (25 February 2022)

Ferret said:


> Surely SOL is in oversold territory at close to $25.
> 
> I want to top up, but the chart is still ugly and times very uncertain.



Been looking at it; any 'premium' that the SOL magic could create seems to have been stripped away, and it probably looks like MLT valuation @ NTA, nowadays. I'm sure they will be keen to maintain their record as "_the only company in the All Ordinaries Index to have increased its dividend every year since 2000_ "so that should underpin it.


----------



## finicky (25 February 2022)

Ferret said:


> I want to top up, but the chart is still ugly and times very uncertain.



I echo your sentiment on the chart and times. I hadn't noticed how poorly its chart was faring.
Looks like its H1 report is a month away going by last year. Maybe it will start to lift in anticipation of that but meanwhile no sign of monthly chart improvement I can see.
It's one I have thought of buying when I get more conservative although I feel more interest in BWK because of its organic land development segment and association with GMG. 

Monthly


----------



## divs4ever (25 February 2022)

i bought in @ $13.10  over a decade ago  , as an investment  ( looking for div. returns  ) it hasn't been overly impressive ( imo )

 BUT  as a financial analyst subscription ( giving opinions on companies they have invested in  , it has been useful and profitable  .. i have the SOL investment back in crystallized CLV profits alone  , and CLV wasn't the only goer )

 now i am NOT giving financial advice  , but check out those LIC reports sometimes there is a gem mentioned in there 

 DYOR


----------



## divs4ever (25 February 2022)

finicky said:


> I echo your sentiment on the chart and times. I hadn't noticed how poorly its chart was faring.
> Looks like its H1 report is a month away going by last year. Maybe it will start to lift in anticipation of that but meanwhile no sign of monthly chart improvement I can see.
> It's one I have thought of buying when I get more conservative although I feel more interest in BWK because of its organic land development segment and association with GMG.
> 
> ...



 some of the new ( ex-MLT ) holders  looking for the exit  ??

 very much apples vs. oranges  comparing MLT to SOL and i suspect  some won't like the new metrics 

 ( i hold SOL but never quite got my target price for MLT )

 DYOR


----------



## Belli (26 February 2022)

Many former MLT holders sold before the merger.  SOL was overpriced and it was noticed it was issuing expensive script for the MLT assets. Akin to buying a $1 of assets for 50c.

AFI was a large holder of MLT but sold before the merger as it considered SOL was overpriced.

ARG was another large holder of MLT but I noticed in its latest half-yearly report no mention was made of any special dividend which is normally the case in these circumstances.  As well it was mentioned in the media release SOL was a partial sale but not fully removed from the ARG holdings.  Issues of appropriate weightings there of course but gives one pause for thought if a larger holder isn't sufficiently enthusiastic hold more of SOL.

As well, many may have concerns at SOLs approach for its MLT subsidiary of moving from an ASX focus to international holdings.

It's an unusual structure.  I am not sure where Contract Asset Management sits charging 0.1% for managing the Large Cap folio of SOL yet there is MLT with, at present at least, holding similar.









						Washington H. Soul Pattinson - WHSP Large Cap Portfolio
					

WHSP Large Cap Portfolio is a high conviction portfolio of quality ASX listed companies that can provide an attractive income stream & capital preservation.




					contactam.com.au
				




I hold SOL outside of the SMSF and have for years.  Apart from adding in 2020, I won't be adding more.  It's just there to provide some Christmas spending money now.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (26 February 2022)

Ferret said:


> Surely SOL is in oversold territory at close to $25.
> 
> I want to top up, but the chart is still ugly and times very uncertain.



Thanks @Ferret .

SOL has been for me over recent years a "Held but sold too soon" stock so I have always glossed over it on this forum and in financial media. 

My hindbrain animalistic self must admit to smelling a meaty entrance, but the skin has been barely pierced. 

The chart is in a proper downtrend, unusual for the Milners'.

So roll on a proper correction.  

gg


----------



## rnr (26 February 2022)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Thanks @Ferret .
> 
> SOL has been for me over recent years a "Held but sold too soon" stock so I have always glossed over it on this forum and in financial media.
> 
> ...








 Just thought I would post a weekly chart showing the action from 2014 to last Friday.
 Since the ATH of $40.80, set on October 1st, 2021, price has moved steadily down in a 3 wave pattern to reach Fridays low of $24.76 and a close of $25.28. This equates to a retracement of approx. 62%.
Given the support around the $25 mark it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect a move higher from these levels.
Unfortunately there are no guarantees on expectations.
Cheers, Rob


----------



## Dona Ferentes (26 February 2022)

From the last published breakdown the AGM on 19 Dec,, and after MLT was absorbed.

Post-merger, WHSP has divided its portfolio by asset class
*Portfolio overview *
Net Asset Value of WHSP (pre-tax) as at 30 November 2021 was* $9.5 billion *, comprised of
_Portfolio .........................................Value  ($m)_
Strategic portfolio (1) ........................... 4,263
Large cap portfolio (1) ......................... 3,469
Private equity portfolio (2) ..................... 641
Emerging companies portfolio (1),(2) .... 545
Structured yield portfolio (1),(2) ............ 360
Property (2) ................................................169
Net working capital (2) .............................. 78

(1)  _At market value_
(2) _At cost or Directors’ valuation_

So, the lion's share of SOL is equity (1) and generally priced daily. MLT had a significant and large majority holding of Direct Equity, or (1), with a very small allocation to (2). Total Milton market cap back then was about $3.6B (?)

Latest market cap for SOL at 25/2 is* $9.123B*.. The ASX hasn't really gone anywhere; at end Nov, XJO was 7256 and it closed at 6998 yesterday. My view, and as I said yesterday #103:


> _any 'premium' that the SOL magic could create seems to have been stripped away, and it probably looks like MLT valuation @ NTA, nowadays._



I'd change that to '_Millner magic_' but, in reality, we now have an investment house, an ersatz LIC and '_nil premium'_ at that; previously there was more leverage and harder-to-value assets (2) and debt(?). I'm not sure why it was bid up so high, earlier, and well done to those that bailed at a higher price.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (24 March 2022)

Washington H Soul Pattinson delivered $1.3 billion in revenue for the half-year to the end of January, more than double the $590 million generated in the prior year, after the company absorbed investment group Milton.

The half-year results also include a jump in profits from ordinary activities, which sits at more than three times the dollar level of the prior period, at $343.7 million.

The company will pay an interim dividend of *29¢ per share* for the period, an increase of 12 per cent compared to the same period a year ago.

“_The company has again increased its dividend and continued to generate solid cashflows from its investments. Solid cash generation from our diversified investment portfolio continued to support another increase to the interim dividend_,” the company said in a statement.


----------



## Belli (24 March 2022)

SOL Reported this morning.

Lots of blah, blah and magic words in various announcements.

Only important aspect from my perspective is the increase in the dividend which is payable on 13 May.  Irritating the company delays payment of it for close on two months.


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## Dona Ferentes (24 March 2022)

Belli said:


> SOL Reported this morning.
> 
> Only important aspect from my perspective is the increase in the dividend which is payable on 13 May.  Irritating the company delays payment of it for close on two months.



I quite like a dividend declared in late March, ex-dividend in late April and paid mid May . Locked in and loaded. And paid out of cycle to other companies. Mid May I'll be receiving $xxxx.xx. Comforting.


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## divs4ever (24 March 2022)

yes a certain amount  of out of cycle payments    , are a helpful buffer to my finances as well  ( if all else fails you can save it  for later on )

 i will often prefer  shares ( REITs and LICs ) that pay monthly or 3 monthly divs  to give a steady trickle  of income   in between  the big payments  ( from the likes of BHP and FMG  )


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## Dona Ferentes (1 June 2022)

SOL has completed the acquisition of 100% of *Ampcontrol*, Australia’s largest privately owned electrical engineering company. WHSP has held a major shareholding in Ampcontrol since investing in the company in 2005 and has now acquired the remaining shareholdings. 

The acquisition comes as Ampcontrol accelerates its strategy to be at the forefront of developing and supplying advanced technology as well as innovative products and services that enable a competitive advantage in a net-zero carbon environment. This was evidenced recently when Ampcontrol and its technology partner *Tritium *were announced as a winner in the Global “Charge on Innovation Challenge” launched by BHP , Rio Tinto and Vale to accelerate the commercialisation of effective solutions for charging large electric haul trucks. 

Commenting on the transaction, Todd Barlow, Managing Director of WHSP said: 


> “_Ampcontrol is uniquely positioned to capitalise on the significant investment in resources, infrastructure and energy solutions, as the world transitions to a lower carbon economy.  Ampcontrol is a high-quality platform upon which we can continue to invest and grow a world-class business, taking advantage of strong industry tailwinds and their talented people, technology, and engineering excellence_.”




Ampcontrol Managing Director & CEO, Rod Henderson, said:  


> “_The acquisition marks a remarkable new era for the Australian manufacturing business and the next chapter in its growth story. The increased ownership of WHSP will provide us with the stability and resources to take advantage of the organic and inorganic growth opportunities that the decarbonisation thematic presents.”_


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## mullokintyre (1 June 2022)

Dona Ferentes said:


> SOL has completed the acquisition of 100% of *Ampcontrol*, Australia’s largest privately owned electrical engineering company. WHSP has held a major shareholding in Ampcontrol since investing in the company in 2005 and has now acquired the remaining shareholdings.
> 
> The acquisition comes as Ampcontrol accelerates its strategy to be at the forefront of developing and supplying advanced technology as well as innovative products and services that enable a competitive advantage in a net-zero carbon environment. This was evidenced recently when Ampcontrol and its technology partner *Tritium *were announced as a winner in the Global “Charge on Innovation Challenge” launched by BHP , Rio Tinto and Vale to accelerate the commercialisation of effective solutions for charging large electric haul trucks.
> 
> ...



So what exactly can SOL add to AMPcontrol to add value?
My only experience in working for a company that was targeted as a takeover was not good.
The company I worked for was a nimble , innovative,  quick to adapt flat management mob  that mostly made money.
The much larger conglomerate bought in its processes, its structures, pyramids of power mangement structures, killed the nimble innovative bit then wondered why it was no longer profitable.
Unless  Ampcontrol needed capital, can't see the advantage for either.
Mick


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## Belli (20 September 2022)

SOL reports tomorrow (brought forward by one day due to public holiday on 22 September.)

It will be interesting to see what, if any, impact the MLT merger will bring to the results as the intention was to move that portfolio towards a more international flavour.


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## Belli (21 September 2022)

SOL to pay 58c ff (including 15c special) on 12 December.


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## Belli (21 September 2022)

From the report.

Waffle, waffle, waffle then


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## Belli (4 November 2022)

It won't make the slightest bit of difference to the outcome but on receiving the for for voting I decided to be bloody minded for the sake of it and voted against all proposals.


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## divs4ever (4 November 2022)

am normally in tune with SOL management 

 but could be equally irritating by just  posting my form back ( i hold less than 100 SOL  )

 WOW never listen when i held thousands of WOW ( much reduced now ) , good luck , maybe somebody at SOL will notice , maybe even  find a compromise for you


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