# New to stock marketing



## Chaka1988 (3 July 2009)

Hey guys

I am planning to invest around $1500 initially just to learn how all of this goes. How can I know what to invest on? 

Cheers


----------



## ajjack (3 July 2009)

Keep watching, asking questions and reading.

Stay on the sidelines until you have some confidence.

It aint easy as you will no doubt discover


----------



## Chaka1988 (3 July 2009)

ajjack said:


> Keep watching, asking questions and reading.
> 
> Stay on the sidelines until you have some confidence.
> 
> It aint easy as you will no doubt discover





I dont really understand all the concept of stock marketing...


----------



## prawn_86 (3 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> I dont really understand all the concept of stock marketing...




Well then start searching around this site. Spend a year or two reading and that should go some way towards you not losing your money straight away.

If you dont understand it why do you want to invest?


----------



## Gordon Gekko (3 July 2009)

If 1500 hundred is all you have to start, than the first rule for you should be not to lose it.
There are some share market contests that you could start out with. That way you are not losing any of your own money.
Once you are sure you want to lose all you money than go ahead and start trading, otherwise go get an index or managed fund.
Someone is going to slag me of for that last comment i'm sure

There is a very good thread on this site for newbie's. I suggest you read it and than re-read it before you gamble any of your money away.

Best

G


----------



## Chaka1988 (3 July 2009)

Gordon Gekko said:


> If 1500 hundred is all you have to start, than the first rule for you should be not to lose it.
> There are some share market contests that you could start out with. That way you are not losing any of your own money.
> Once you are sure you want to lose all you money than go ahead and start trading, otherwise go get an index or managed fund.
> Someone is going to slag me of for that last comment i'm sure
> ...




what is index fund? I have heard that managed fund is useless...
Any advises for a good managed fund? how does it work?


----------



## Gordon Gekko (3 July 2009)

Do a search on this site for Index funds or STW, or just google managed funds vs index funds. That should get you started.
But thats not advice from me so do your own research and look for the newbie thread.

G


----------



## Julia (3 July 2009)

Since you have no idea how the market works, go to the ASX website, www.asx.com.au, and read through all of their Education section.

I can't believe you'd start parting with even such a small amount when you have no clue about anything!


----------



## matty2.0 (3 July 2009)

"stock *marketing*"???

You can sell my stocks if you can ...


----------



## Chaka1988 (4 July 2009)

I have read it. but still I dont know what to invest on...
Im interested on a long tern investment with relatively low risk- ie. I will not lose more than 30% of my investment.


----------



## Mr J (4 July 2009)

> just to learn how all of this goes




You don't need to spend a cent to learn how it works. The internet has a wealth of resources for you. As Gordon Gekko suggested, google can be a great help.



> How can I know what to invest on?




That is your choice. You invest in what makes you money, but it is up to you to decide where that will be.



> with relatively low risk- ie. I will not lose more than 30% of my investment.




Then only use 30% of your funds or quit when you drop 30%. The type of investment doesn't really matter, as risk is decided by you and not the type of investment.


----------



## Chaka1988 (5 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> You don't need to spend a cent to learn how it works. The internet has a wealth of resources for you. As Gordon Gekko suggested, google can be a great help.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





I have heard that government supported companies are considered to be relatively at lower risk of losing your money. isnt it?


----------



## Medici (6 July 2009)

Hi Chaka

I can see your problem, but you have to admit that investing $1500 will not make you big profit.
If you purchase your stock you have to consider brokers fees on purchase and sale of the stock. Then you have to calculate how much stock have to go up in price before you make any profit (after the fees).
This may take a while. 
I say, save you money (for some investment stock) and as suggested before me start investigate.
The information has to come from some source - news papers, ASX website, and internet (yahoo finance - you have access to prices and charts there).

Maybe some good book on charting or investing and then you can combine the information together and then decide to put your money in the right place.


----------



## Chaka1988 (6 July 2009)

Medici said:


> Hi Chaka
> 
> I can see your problem, but you have to admit that investing $1500 will not make you big profit.
> If you purchase your stock you have to consider brokers fees on purchase and sale of the stock. Then you have to calculate how much stock have to go up in price before you make any profit (after the fees).
> ...




thanks for your help.
What do you think about Forex? especially about the live trading rooms? it costs around $9000 to join it. does it worth it?


----------



## Medici (6 July 2009)

Chaka, i am not trading FOREX and no pr in this area, but before spending your retirement money, have look on the internet for FOREX trading.

I know that you can get some free software (similar to game trading) and you can tray trade FOREX for free, $9000 it is a lot of money to give someone as a joining fee.
I say do your research first.

Why FOREX ? You could get a good BHP stock today for $9000 and it will be good return on investment (i hope  )


----------



## Chaka1988 (6 July 2009)

Medici said:


> Chaka, i am not trading FOREX and no pr in this area, but before spending your retirement money, have look on the internet for FOREX trading.
> 
> I know that you can get some free software (similar to game trading) and you can tray trade FOREX for free, $9000 it is a lot of money to give someone as a joining fee.
> I say do your research first.
> ...




I have tried to research on stock market trading but it is too complicated and risky. 
On the other hand, forex seems to be less risky. Please check this site: http://www.stockexinsider.com.au/currency_results.htm

You can make a much higher profit with live trading forex and you dont have to have any knowledge with it. The experts will guide you what to purchase.


----------



## Medici (6 July 2009)

I hope that you are right Chaka.

Would love to see your experience later on if possible ( i may change my trading direction  )


----------



## Chaka1988 (6 July 2009)

I need some1 to give feedback about live trading rooms first. I cant just go blinded for this offer and spend this amount of money.


----------



## Julia (6 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> I need some1 to give feedback about live trading rooms first. I cant just go blinded for this offer and spend this amount of money.



"Going blinded" seems like just what you're likely to do.
In addition to earlier recommendation re education on the ASX website,
read through all of this thread:

https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14370

Sounds to me as though you're wanting to swim before you can paddle.


----------



## Medici (6 July 2009)

How did you start, Julia ?


----------



## Mr J (6 July 2009)

$9000 to join a chat room? Gods, that's enough to start a trading career. $9000 can buy a lot of trading experience and potentially grow into a significant amont, so no, I would not recommend joining your $9000 chat room.



> I cant just go blinded for this offer and spend this amount of money.




If you worry about the amount you risk, then you are risking too much. If you can't shrug off $9k, particularly on something as speculative as a chat room, then you have no business spending it there.


----------



## Chaka1988 (7 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> $9000 to join a chat room? Gods, that's enough to start a trading career. $9000 can buy a lot of trading experience and potentially grow into a significant amont, so no, I would not recommend joining your $9000 chat room.
> 
> 
> 
> If you worry about the amount you risk, then you are risking too much. If you can't shrug off $9k, particularly on something as speculative as a chat room, then you have no business spending it there.




So what is your advise? I still need someone to guide me in forex. ie. to give me the signals :


----------



## Mr J (7 July 2009)

My advice would be to learn to do it yourself. Relying on someone else will likely lead to failure.


----------



## Medici (7 July 2009)

Hi Chake

The only thing coming into my mind is that would be nice for you to find a master (mentor) who may give you some guide (masters apprentice ), but i suspect that this would be a mission impossible. (if you live in the same area as any one trading forex, maybe you could get together for lunch or something and talk about things.......)


----------



## jono1887 (7 July 2009)

you could use the 9k to buy yourself a **** load of books. That would probably be more useful :


----------



## beamstas (8 July 2009)

Is this thread serious or is he just subtly trying to ramp live trading rooms?

If your capital is $1500 then why the hell would you spend $9000 on live trading rooms. Use your $10,500 and learn to trade your way. Who cares if you lose $9000 of it, that's what you would have paid for being ripped off into believing that you can make money in a live trading room with absolutely no knowledge at all.



> So what is your advise? I still need someone to guide me in forex. ie. to give me the signals :




The last thing you need right now is entry signals. Entering at the "right" time won't make you money if you can't manage the trade.


----------



## Medici (8 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> So what is your advise? I still need someone to guide me in forex. ie. to give me the signals :





Maybe this will help:

http://www.babypips.com/


----------



## nunthewiser (8 July 2009)

give me the 9k 

i,ll chat to ya


----------



## data (9 July 2009)

You have $1500 to use. Why ask everyone here if a $9000 system is good to join. You clearly don't have $9000.

If you dont understand the stock market you wont understand FOREX. You are trying to run before you have learnt to walk.

Listen to what the people here are telling you - GO AND LEARN! You sound like you want everyone to do it for you and that my friend is down right lazy.

If you want someone to hold your hand and teach you talk to someone who is PS 146 qualified out there in the real world. You can piss one of these guys around as much as you like cause they will just charge you buy the hour.

Just so you know hand holding with a PS 146 is going to be expensive thats why the people on this forum have been guiding you to free information like ASX, babypips etc and books. TAKE THE HINT!

If you are here to waste our time in your questions wont be answered.


----------



## beamstas (9 July 2009)

data said:


> If you want someone to hold your hand and teach you talk to someone who is PS 146 qualified out there in the real world. You can piss one of these guys around as much as you like cause they will just charge you buy the hour.
> 
> Just so you know hand holding with a PS 146 is going to be expensive thats why the people on this forum have been guiding you to free information like ASX, babypips etc and books. TAKE THE HINT!




Exactly
Take the free info

Cause you'll get much worse info for a much higher price if you see Financial Adviser. (what regular people call a PS 146)

PS 146 doesn't mean you know how to trade. It just means you know how to ramp products.


----------



## Sean K (9 July 2009)

beamstas said:


> PS 146 doesn't mean you know how to trade. It just means you know how to ramp products.



It certainly doesn't mean you know how to trade. 

But 'ramping products' is not part of the program either. 

It's a decent course of study before jumping into the ramping bit.


----------



## Mr J (9 July 2009)

Give me your $10500, and I'll give you back double that at year's end.


----------



## Sean K (9 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> Give me your $10500, and I'll give you back double that at year's end.



So, doubling money means you're really good then?


----------



## Mr J (9 July 2009)

No, I can just make a large number of marginally +ev trades.


----------



## Sean K (9 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> No, I can just make a large number of marginally +ev trades.



Well, I'm crap! If anyone wants to lose all their money in a year, please send it to me!


----------



## kam75 (9 July 2009)

All good advice.  I could not agree more.  

But if I may offer a suggestion that no one else yet has, it's this:

Do your own thinking when it comes to trading.  Chatrooms and outside information can, and will cloud your judgement.


----------



## data (9 July 2009)

"PS 146" stands for "Policy Statement 146" which is a document outlined under the Financial Services Reform Act 2001 (FSRA) which is governed and administered by the Australian Securities Investments Commission (ASIC).

*It has nothing to do with ramping up programs, systems or products* it means that a person holding a PS 146 is licensed to provide financial ADVICE. 

PS 146 holders usually also hold an AFSL Australian Financial Services License in certain areas of the financial industry which are also governed by a regulated body.


----------



## white_goodman (9 July 2009)

if you dont have enough initiative to use google and read sites like this i'm afraid you have no hope... off to the PG146 crowd you go...


----------



## nomore4s (9 July 2009)

kennas said:


> Well, I'm crap! If anyone wants to lose all their money in a year, please send it to me!




No thanks, I can do it by myself. Although if I do outsource it to you I could use my time more productively and lose twice as much money:


----------



## nunthewiser (9 July 2009)

kam75 said:


> Do your own thinking when it comes to trading.  Chatrooms and outside information can, and will cloud your judgement.




but they can also offer an unbiased clearer viewpoint when one has a clouded biased judgement on something they hold/intend to hold 

paddle ya own canoe and read everything , dont have to believe it , just helps to have more eyes on something than just your own at times

i still ask for opinions on stocks im intrested in , just in case im missing something blatently obvious i havent picked up on 

each to there own


----------



## Mr J (9 July 2009)

kam75 said:


> Chatrooms and outside information can, and will cloud your judgement.




I don't know about that, I've been living on the ASF chatroom lately and have been getting awesome tips. Homerun quality.


----------



## data (9 July 2009)

Lets get back to the thread - and thanx for the kind comments 

One last comment tho. I have just left a financial industry that is so heavily regulated by government compliance and I have seen colleagues crucified first hand. We had to know the regs. Using certain words in advertising like "lowest" when quoting rates could cost you your license, your job and abolition from the finance industry all together. Google aint got nothing when the regulators want a scalp, it feels really pretty real when ppl you know are affected.

Point is this guy has no idea and if he doesnt get it he doesnt get it. 

His account is too small to trade from anyway from a position sizing pov, risk/ac management and he couldnt add to position on retracements  etc. etc. with such small amounts without risking almost 100% of his account with out trading leveraged products.

He cant grasp the simple nature of the equity market let alone the leveraged instruments like commodities, forex, cfd's, derivatives, warrants and I think he is wasting our time.

Put this guy in perspective: He wants a start in formula 1 but doesnt know how to drive and he doesnt know what type of car to bring to the track.

chaka1988 We have given you some direction. Read, learn then ask questions no one here will hold your hand. Good luck with it mate - you will have to go through a lot of crap before you find some good stuff though, just enjoy the journey.


----------



## nunthewiser (9 July 2009)

i,ll hold his hand for the 9k

mr J stop exaggerating , you know as well as i that any tips given in chat are all hindsight trades and we just there to mess with the newbies


----------



## Chaka1988 (10 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> Give me your $10500, and I'll give you back double that at year's end.





help me then to achieve it 



data said:


> Lets get back to the thread - and thanx for the kind comments
> 
> One last comment tho. I have just left a financial industry that is so heavily regulated by government compliance and I have seen colleagues crucified first hand. We had to know the regs. Using certain words in advertising like "lowest" when quoting rates could cost you your license, your job and abolition from the finance industry all together. Google aint got nothing when the regulators want a scalp, it feels really pretty real when ppl you know are affected.
> 
> ...




I dont have much time to read and research on it, as I have my uni studies. I have tried to research a bit of forex and stock marketing but they all seem very complicated, so I gave up :


----------



## Medici (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> help me then to achieve it
> 
> 
> 
> I dont have much time to read and research on it, as I have my uni studies. I have tried to research a bit of forex and stock marketing but they all seem very complicated, so I gave up :





What can i say ?  R I P  (or get a real job part time  - McDonald maybe ?)


----------



## Chaka1988 (10 July 2009)

btw, what is charting in forex andwhy do I need to use it. 
I thought there are ready charts for each currency on the internet.


----------



## beamstas (10 July 2009)

Lets get this straight

1) You have insufficient capital
2) You are not prepared to research anything
3) You want everything done for you

The stock market, futures markets and forex arn't an ATM when you insert $2000 and withdraw you're fortune. The only person who can make you trade profitably is yourself.


----------



## shag (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> help me then to achieve it
> 
> 
> 
> I dont have much time to read and research on it, as I have my uni studies. I have tried to research a bit of forex and stock marketing but they all seem very complicated, so I gave up :



look mate, if u cant work out forex etc u possibly shoundt b at uni or go near that field-forex/tech trading.
who at uni has spare dosh anyway, i was selling my stocks in the 80's to fund my booze habit etc. 30k's worth back then, plus summer earnings and incidentals.
theres no free dosh without risk. its better to spend it on education.
some egghead at uni would sort out forex and tech trading for u. its basic compared to any math they do, relatively speaking. its barely math anyway, or tertiary math at that level.
go to math or eng school and get some dood to show u.
good unis r full of cheap tallent.

then when u graduate and have an income stream u can manage it better.


----------



## data (10 July 2009)

Charka1988 - Put your money in the market and everyone here will do there best to take it off you including me.

Get a gameboy and PLAY THAT instead of STOCK MARKETING as you put it.

Enjoy your quilt making at uni cause your obviously not doing business.

Stop wasting our time we are too busy researching, reading and learning.


----------



## white_goodman (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> help me then to achieve it
> 
> 
> 
> I dont have much time to read and research on it, as I have my uni studies. I have tried to research a bit of forex and stock marketing but they all seem very complicated, so I gave up :




I have a full time job, full time uni and I still devot 40-50hrs a week, you are just lazy


----------



## Mr J (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> btw, what is charting in forex






It should be obvious what it is and what it will show. You could always just use google for these questions, as you'll get quicker and less negative replies. The negative replies are justified though.


----------



## skyQuake (10 July 2009)

less gaming more screentime.


----------



## Sunder (10 July 2009)

Funny how fast sentiment can turn in a thread. When I first joined, and still actually, as I am still learning, people were so helpful. As soon as it's clear that Chaka is not willing to do the work, or take the risks, (21 year old Gen Y?), people start getting arrogant, which is fair enough, really, but still feels like a turn in the feel of this forum.

My (non financial) advice to the OP is the same as everyone elses:

Learn. If you don't want to, just put the $1500 on black in the casino, because you'll waste less of everyone's time.


----------



## Timmy (10 July 2009)

Sunder said:


> Funny how fast sentiment can turn in a thread




I think when someone posts with a genuine query/question he or she will be greeted with, for the most part, helpful replies.  When the replies indicate that there is a little work to be done, though, and the OP then doesn't accept this and seeks out replies that promise gift-wrapped results people get a bit cheesed off, and rightly so.

I think the OP in this thread is just taking the piss though.  Nobody could be that st... stopping now.


----------



## Chaka1988 (10 July 2009)

I thought that its normal that there are experts in the marketing field, who are willing to be paid for some help to noobs.
After all, I dont have much time to research by myself as I am not doing arts at uni like most of the people in here.


----------



## beamstas (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> I thought that its normal that there are experts in the marketing field, who are willing to be paid for some help to noobs.
> After all, I dont have much time to research by myself as I am not doing arts at uni like most of the people in here.




Most people here
Risk more per trade than your account


----------



## Cartman (10 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> I think the OP in this thread is just taking the piss though.




it would be easy to come to that conclusion Timmy, but i think you'll find the OP is genuine  ---

a lot of kidz come out of school and go straight to Uni and wouldnt know a pip from a pith or a tic from a tick ---- he's prob heard the fanciful stories of rags to riches and hopes the yellow brick road is just a few questions away



Chaka1988 said:


> I thought that its normal that there are experts in the marketing field, who are willing to be paid for some help to noobs.
> After all, I dont have much time to research by myself as I am not doing arts at uni like most of the people in here.




Chaka --- couple of  questions -- 1) what r u studying at Uni, and 2) do u still live with your family (mother/father)?


----------



## beerwm (10 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> I dont have much time to read and research on it, as I have my uni studies.




LOL @ uni studies taking up time.


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> it would be easy to come to that conclusion Timmy, but i think you'll find the OP is genuine  ---
> 
> a lot of kidz come out of school and go straight to Uni and wouldnt know a pip from a pith or a tic from a tick ---- he's prob heard the fanciful stories of rags to riches and hopes the yellow brick road is just a few questions away
> 
> ...




Im doing dentistry and yes, I live with my parents.


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> I thought that its normal that there are experts in the marketing field, who are willing to be paid for some help to noobs.




Yes, it is.  Drop the dentistry and study economics, or combine the degrees, that will give you a grounding in markets.


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Yes, it is.  Drop the dentistry and study economics, or combine the degrees, that will give you a grounding in markets.




Economics?
I did that over summer
Just the subject not a major
What does economics teach that helps trading?


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

beamstas said:


> Economics?
> I did that over summer
> Just the subject not a major
> What does economics teach that helps trading?




Read the thread beamstas.
This guy wants to spend money to learn, $9,000 at last count.
We all know what will happen to him if he pays money to 'trading educators'.
Studying economics is the next best option for this guy.

As to your question of the value of learning economics, I believe it can be very helpful.  Bit more to it than a one semester subject though.


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Read the thread beamstas.




Sorry beamstas, just scanned back through the thread and you have read it and contributed quite a bit.

Chaka appears unwilling to take ANY advice from the posters here.

Maybe Radge's newsletter could be useful?


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Read the thread beamstas.
> This guy wants to spend money to learn, $9,000 at last count.
> We all know what will happen to him if he pays money to 'trading educators'.
> Studying economics is the next best option for this guy.
> ...




Yes
Got a few more to go for eco
That was first one
IMO his best bet isn't doing a combined degree
It's a waste of time
Takes too long

If you can paper trade without lying to yourself (1% of people) then that's good practice


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Sorry beamstas, just scanned back through the thread and you have read it and contributed quite a bit.
> 
> Chaka appears unwilling to take ANY advice from the posters here.
> 
> Maybe Radge's newsletter could be useful?




Possible
Im a subscriber so probably biased

9 grand will get him a bit over 9 years

To be honest his best bet, if he wants to be EDUCATED and not TOLD is to buy Radge's dvd and book. 

The subscription for buys/sells is probably a good idea, he should probably look at the growth portfolio over there.. Then he can be lazy like he wants to be


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

beamstas said:


> To be honest his best bet, if he wants to be EDUCATED and not TOLD is to buy Radge's dvd and book.
> 
> The subscription for buys/sells is probably a good idea, he should probably look at the growth portfolio over there.. Then he can be lazy like he wants to be




No doubt this suggestion will be disregarded too.  

Chaka doesn't seem willing to listen, or nothing is good enough for him.  (Assuming its a him).


----------



## jono1887 (11 July 2009)

don't drop dentistry just because you want to dip into the stockmarket... does anyone here even know how hard it is to get into dentistry or medicine?? its incredibly difficult and it should not be wasted by switching to a econ degree just because you want to learn how to trade.

I'm studying medicine and I've been able to find enough time to learn about the markets - read forums, books ect ect and have started trading. Its not that hard to do in your spare time if you have an interest in it and you are motivated. If not, which is what it seems like here... then dont bother, just stick with dentistry and get a p/t job


----------



## mazzatelli1000 (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Yes, it is.  Drop the dentistry and study economics, or combine the degrees, that will give you a grounding in markets.




I would disagree here.
It is quite difficult to get into dentistry, and to excel in that field alot of hours need to be put in.
Not only that it will provide him a lucrative career path [albeit boring imo].
Whether it is his dream or not is another debate.

There is an opportunity cost involved here.

My opinion is also that economics may help, but is not essential for trading. Too often there is supposition without empirical support.

But Nick Radge subscription is a good place to start [I do not use his services]


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

jono1887 said:


> don't drop dentistry just because you want to dip into the stockmarket... does anyone here even know how hard it is to get into dentistry or medicine?? its incredibly difficult and it should not be wasted by switching to a econ degree just because you want to learn how to trade.
> 
> I'm studying medicine and I've been able to find enough time to learn about the markets - read forums, books ect ect and have started trading. Its not that hard to do in your spare time if you have an interest in it and you are motivated. If not, which is what it seems like here... then dont bother, just stick with dentistry and get a p/t job




Thanks. At least someone here understands me. I didnt say I am not willing to put time in researching stock marketing at all. I will, but now now as I have my uni starting in 10 days and I am sure that 10 days isnt enough to have a good proficiency in the marketing area. I am planning to start doing that on December after my end of year exams...
Another question for you, what do you think is better for me to start with- forex or stock marketing?


----------



## Trembling Hand (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> stock marketing?




What the hell is *"stock marketing"*


----------



## jono1887 (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Thanks. At least someone here understands me. I didnt say I am not willing to put time in researching stock marketing at all. I will, but now now as I have my uni starting in 10 days and I am sure that 10 days isnt enough to have a good proficiency in the marketing area. I am planning to start doing that on December after my end of year exams...
> Another question for you, what do you think is better for me to start with- forex or stock marketing?




studying dentistry is what? 25 hours a week contact? plus 10 hours study at home? There is still plenty of time there, like on weekends to put in 30min a day or several hours on the weekend to put into studying the markets, basic econ, charting skills ect ect. If you are willing to put in the effort, you will find the time.

I suggest you dont just jump into the market and spend several months learning. Then start paper trading for a while before even considering using real money.

I would think that 'stock marketing' - which is not really a term, its stock trading/investing over forex as I personally find it easier. However, its probably personal preference, I know people that started out on forex.


----------



## jono1887 (11 July 2009)

Trembling Hand said:


> What the hell is *"stock marketing"*




don't tease the n00b, isn't obvious he's referring to stock trading/investing :


----------



## Cartman (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Im doing dentistry and yes, I live with my parents.




ok,  u r obviously a very intelligent young fella -- congrats on the dentistry

and living at home means u dont have to cook and clean -- u r much smarter than people realize  !!

U need to forget about trading --- your mind set is all wrong to be successful at *it at this stage 
* ---- u need some worldly experience under your belt 

concentrate on your degree ---- start up your own dentistry practice and pocket  5-10 grand a week ---- after u have half a million in the bank, then u can dabble with trading  

seriously -- u have limited time, limited resources (currently) and priorities on a different tangent ---- not conducive to trading. Long term investing will most likely suit u best but thats certainly not advice ---- talk to your old man about it !! -- Good luck.


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

jono1887 said:


> studying dentistry is what? 25 hours a week contact? plus 10 hours study at home? There is still plenty of time there, like on weekends to put in 30min a day or several hours on the weekend to put into studying the markets, basic econ, charting skills ect ect. If you are willing to put in the effort, you will find the time.




LOL. My non contact hours can easily double/triple the 10 hours stated. Plus, during uni time, I live away from home and I need to cook, shop etc, which also take quite a bit of time...


----------



## jono1887 (11 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> ok,  u r obviously a very intelligent young fella -- congrats on the dentistry
> 
> and living at home means u dont have to cook and clean -- u r much smarter than people realize  !!
> 
> ...




There is absolutely no reason why he should wait until he has a mill before he starts trading. If we all waited till we have a mill in the bank I'm sure most of us here on the forums wouldn't be trading yet.

I've spent several years learning since high school and have been able to be profitable with only several thousand.


----------



## Cartman (11 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> --- your mind set is all wrong to be successful at *it at this stage
> * ----






jono1887 said:


> There is absolutely no reason why he should wait until he has a mill before he starts trading. If we all waited till we have a mill in the bank I'm sure *most of us here on the forums wouldn't be trading yet*.
> 
> I've spent several years learning since high school and have been able to be profitable with only several thousand.





Jono, it was actually half a mill : (U may have missed the picture of my tongue in my cheek 

seriously though --- *most* people trading on this forum probably *shouldn't* be trading yet 

If u personally have become profitable -- well done, but  my comment was squared directly at Chaka --- *no-one else* ---

my point was --- his mindset is *all wrong* to start trading (at this point in time) ----


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Stop making excuses as to why you can't research trading.
No one cares if you don't, but to make any money you'll have to put in some time at some stage. Making excuses about why you can't learn won't mean someone else will learn for you.


Take a look at Radges site
_"We tell you where and when to buy"_


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Im Majoring Finance and Accounting, doing 3 semesters a year and working full time.

What i'd give to be doing uni alone. Obv dentistry is harder but you can't be that stuck for time,* seriously.*


----------



## Mr J (11 July 2009)

Chaka, give me 4k and I'll have you double the other 6.5k within a couple of months.



> I am sure that 10 days isnt enough to have a good proficiency in the marketing area.




You can learn plenty in 10 days. It's not "marketing", as we're not advertising, distributing and selling products here. Use "trading" instead.



> concentrate on your degree ---- start up your own dentistry practice and pocket 5-10 grand a week ---- after u have half a million in the bank, then u can dabble with trading




A novice with a half a million dollar account? That's a disaster waiting to happen. Better to test the waters when he is young as he has less to lose, and his experiences may help him in the future. Young and ignorant is better than old and ignorant, as the young have time on their side.


----------



## Julia (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> Yes, it is.  Drop the dentistry and study economics, or combine the degrees, that will give you a grounding in markets.



No, no, no, Timmy.  Don't swap dentistry for economics, Chaka.



Cartman said:


> ok,  u r obviously a very intelligent young fella -- congrats on the dentistry
> 
> and living at home means u dont have to cook and clean -- u r much smarter than people realize  !!
> 
> ...



Yep, I agree with Cartman, though probably wouldn't think quite half a mill needs to be the starting base.

Congratulations on getting into dentistry, Chaka.   It's a very lucrative career if you actually like poking around in people's mouths.

What I'd be doing is reading , starting with Stan Weinstein's "How to Profit in Bull and Bear Markets" and maybe for a start buying a 'almost can't go wrong' defensive stock like WOW (Woolworths) just to get a feel of the market.

Good luck.  I'm sure you didn't mean to come across as being as uppity as you did.  Just a case of unrealistic expectations which you've hopefully now modified.


----------



## wonderrman (11 July 2009)

Concur with everyone about not dropping dentistry. Why would you study economics either for trading? Markets are irrational, you want your system to take care of your trading, economics could cloud his judgment.


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

Julia said:


> No, no, no, Timmy.  Don't swap dentistry for economics, Chaka.
> 
> 
> Yep, I agree with Cartman, though probably wouldn't think quite half a mill needs to be the starting base.
> ...




Thanks. I have already ordered that book and I am sure that I will have some time to read it. I didnt mean to be arrogant. I just thought it is possible to make much money without having knowledge in the field. The sale consultant of that company was so convincing... I am just too naive.


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Thanks. I have already ordered that book and I am sure that I will have some time to read it. I didnt mean to be arrogant. I just thought it is possible to make much money without having knowledge in the field. The sale consultant of that company was so convincing... I am just too naive.




That's her job.


----------



## jono1887 (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Thanks. I have already ordered that book and I am sure that I will have some time to read it. I didnt mean to be arrogant. I just thought it is possible to make much money without having knowledge in the field. The sale consultant of that company was so convincing... I am just too naive.




well at least you have now managed to learn something from these forums. If it really was that easy to make money with no knowledge, don't you think everyone would be doing it by now??


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

jono1887 said:


> well at least you have now managed to learn something from these forums. If it really was that easy to make money with no knowledge, don't you think everyone would be doing it by now??




Probably, but the company exists only for 10 months


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Thanks. I have already ordered that book and I am sure that I will have some time to read it. I didnt mean to be arrogant. I just thought it is possible to make much money without having knowledge in the field. The sale consultant of that company was so convincing... I am just too naive.




You are making progress!  Good stuff.

OK next lesson:
Don't go with the herd.  The herd in this case advocates sticking with the dentist game.  Clearly this is not to be trusted.

Get out of dentistry.  You will end up poking around in people's foul-smelling gobs all day, catching swine flu (and, apparently, dying from it) and AIDS, most likely when one of the punters bites you.

Economics is the go, young man.  Repeat after me, people act rationally.


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

Timmy said:


> You are making progress!  Good stuff.
> 
> OK next lesson:
> Don't go with the herd.  The herd in this case advocates sticking with the dentist game.  Clearly this is not to be trusted.
> ...




Done. I have called my head of school already and told him to f*** off.
whats next? where can I get a good demo account for stock TRADING


----------



## Timmy (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> told him to f*** off.




Good man.  You are half-way there already!


----------



## matty2.0 (11 July 2009)

Read the book;

*"How to make money" by Adam Smith*

and

*"How to turn $9000 into $9M" by John Maynard Keynes.*

They're the only books you'll ever need, especially in your situation. Trust me. 

They're very rare books and hard to find, but once you've found it - you've found the holy grail.


----------



## Chaka1988 (11 July 2009)

matty2.0 said:


> Read the book;
> 
> *"How to make money" by Adam Smith*
> 
> ...




Yep too rare. even google cant find them...


----------



## beamstas (11 July 2009)

Timmy stop telling him bs


----------



## Cartman (11 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> A novice with a half a million dollar account? That's a disaster waiting to happen.







Julia said:


> Yep, I agree with Cartman, though probably wouldn't think quite half a mill needs to be the starting base.




geez u guys ---- why dont smilies have a tongue in cheek character !! 

i originally wrote a long response on this topic addressed to Chaka because i could see where he was coming from, and i thought his apparent "laziness" had been misconstrued ---- i think i was correct in that assumption -- 

i didnt post the original cause it resembled "war and peace"  lol ---

for the record -- i wasnt being literal when i said he needed half a mill to trade --- (i thought that was obvious   )

what i was saying is:-

1) his current approach to trading is wrong 

2) he has the ability to make many more $$ doing something he is qualified for (dentistry)

The chances are once he becomes a qualified dentist, *trading* will be the last thing on his mind because he will have the ability to make a squillion bucks with minimal risk --- (*investing is a different story all together*) 



Chaka1988 said:


> Done. I have called my head of school already and told him to f*** off.
> whats next? where can I get a good demo account for stock TRADING




learning fast ---- i knew u were smart !!  (tongue in cheek smiley inserted !!)---- i'll personally be very interested in how u develop over the next 6-12 months --- young people with intelligence are an interesting commodity   ---- keep us posted ...


----------



## Mr J (11 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> whats next? where can I get a good demo account for stock TRADING




You may want to look outside stocks, they're just a part of the financial markets. For an Australian, the commissions are also quite high, and the first aim of any betting type activity should be to minimise the vig/commissions.



			
				Cartman said:
			
		

> i wasnt being literal when i said once he needed half a mill to trade




It doesn't really matter, you advised him to put it off for a long time. My point is that experience during that time would go a long way, even if it is to convince him not to trade/invest.



> trading will be the last thing on his mind because he will have the ability to make a squillion bucks with minimal risk




Dentists don't make as much as some here seem to be suggesting. They do well, but like almost all professions it does have a ceiling.



> investing is a different story all together




Investing is simply ignorant trading in my opinion. So, he waits until he's got a successful practice, and the starts investing? I'm sure there were a lot of dentists taking their own painkillers during the crisis. Best he has plenty of experience to keep him out of trouble and preserve his wealth.


----------



## Cartman (11 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> It doesn't really matter, you advised him to *put it off for a long time*. My point is that experience during that time would go a long way, even if it is to convince him not to trade/invest.





i did ---- and to be fair, i think that was good advice considering his "original" approach based on *his* comments on this thread --- of course that can change in an instant once "enlightenment" sets in 

for the record Mr J --- i basically concur with most of what i have read which u write --- that of course is no benefit to you cause i am a fruit cake, and u may now be branded with "schizophrenia by association"  lol





Mr J said:


> Dentists don't make as much as some here seem to be suggesting.




Yes they do   --- ( good ones)



Mr J said:


> Investing is simply ignorant trading in my opinion.




i agree that can be true, 

but often poor traders can make *great* investors ---

poor investors rarely make good traders though !


----------



## Mr J (11 July 2009)

cartman said:
			
		

> i think that was good advice considering his "original" approach based on his comments on this thread --- of course that can change in an instant once "enlightenment" sets in




If the enlightenment doesn't kick in, wouldn't he be destined to lose it anyway? Surely he would just ignore us and think he knows better, and blow it .



> cause i am a fruit cake




Fruitcakes think differently to normal people. Sounds like a gift, not a curse!



> i agree that can be true,
> 
> but often poor traders can make great investors ---
> 
> poor investors rarely make good traders though !




As always, shades of grey. I see investing as trading with buy&hold and no shorting. It's all trading to me, 'investing' just refers to the timeframe and long-only positions.


----------



## beerwm (11 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> Yes they do   --- ( good ones)




same can be said for any profession really, 

more to take into consideration than $$$ - when it comes to career choice, imo


----------



## data (11 July 2009)

Good to here that you are coming round.

Larry Williams who is a good trader recommends:

R - Rules (work out your own set of rules then test and measure them)
A - Attitude (you have to brave the ups and downs with a STRONG mental attitude - your psychology needs to be balanced)
T - Techniques (you have to find your own techniques for trading be it fundamental, technical, astrological etc - whatever works for you like relationships between sectors like bonds and gold seem to have a relationship when one is up the other is down)
S - Systems/Strategies (you have to find your own systems and strategies and test them in the market or back test them. You could run 15 strategies that work for two weeks or 10 months then after that you will have to refine them again)

You cant say that uni will take all your time. You have it easy mate, way too easy.

You dont have a Masters to finish, a family to feed, a business to run, employees to pay, mortgages to pay (yes more than 1) and a household to run and trade. I am a proud Aussie that works hard. It took me 6 years part time to finish my double in business and management while working full time and supporting a family.

BTW uni wont help you to trade unless you like fundamentals and lots of drawn out mathematics. The ONLY accepted forecasting model that is used is the Constant Growth Stock Valuation model. 

http://www.globusz.com/ebooks/Valuation/00000020.htm

I hope you can change your mental block that you have there and get past thinking that you can't study dentistry and learn to trade at the same time. If you can you may do well.


----------



## Julia (11 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> Dentists don't make as much as some here seem to be suggesting. They do well, but like almost all professions it does have a ceiling.



Well, the last time I went to the dentist, I calculated how much he'd be earning on the basis of what I paid for a 30 minute appt.  It came out to around 1.5 mil.pa
Overheads are of course deductible and even after tax it's going to be a fairly healthy income.


----------



## data (11 July 2009)

see: My Career - Current job placement. Periodontist QLD 

150k-200k (Ref No. NSS01317B)

1.5mil is about 5 times what krudd is on. I know what you mean tho it cost me $500 to see the vet for 30min when my dogs ear got bit. But its crazy to think that if the vet earns $1000 per hour x 8hr day = 8k a day x 6 days = 48k per week x 52 weeks = 2.49 mil. I dont think so, just an isolated incident.


----------



## jono1887 (12 July 2009)

data said:


> see: My Career - Current job placement. Periodontist QLD
> 
> 150k-200k (Ref No. NSS01317B)
> 
> 1.5mil is about 5 times what krudd is on. I know what you mean tho it cost me $500 to see the vet for 30min when my dogs ear got bit. But its crazy to think that if the vet earns $1000 per hour x 8hr day = 8k a day x 6 days = 48k per week x 52 weeks = 2.49 mil. I dont think so, just an isolated incident.




You'd be surprised how accurate your calculations are... however, even if they do not have any customers for half their day - 2.75mil is still quite a very nice figure


----------



## Iggy_Pop (12 July 2009)

A friend of a friend who manages an accounting practice and looks after accounts for trades running their own business and professionals running a practice has mentioned typical yearly incomes - 

Electrical or Plumbing business - $300k - $500k year 

Doctor GP - $500k - $1ml year

Doctor Specialist - $1.0ml to $1.5ml year

A dentist would have to come in around the $500k to $1ml. These numbers are in a Regional area and in a Capital City would expect to be a bit higher. 

Chaka stick to dentistry and put the excess money in a fixed deposit


----------



## skc (12 July 2009)

Iggy_Pop said:


> A friend of a friend who manages an accounting practice and looks after accounts for trades running their own business and professionals running a practice has mentioned typical yearly incomes -
> 
> Electrical or Plumbing business - $300k - $500k year
> 
> ...




Don't be too excited. My wife is a GP and I know many GPs. The range of income is $80K to $1m+. To get substantially over $200K you have to run your own practice and employ several others, in which case you are not just a GP, but a business owner.

Don't believe me? Standard consult bulk bill = $33.55. GPs working in a practice may have a 60/40 split so they get $0.6x$33.55 = ~$20. Say they see 4 patients per hour, 35 hours a week and 48 weeks a year, that's $135K.


----------



## data (12 July 2009)

skc said:


> Don't be too excited. My wife is a GP and I know many GPs. The range of income is $80K to $1m+. To get substantially over $200K you have to run your own practice and employ several others, in which case you are not just a GP, but a business owner.
> 
> Don't believe me? Standard consult bulk bill = $33.55. GPs working in a practice may have a 60/40 split so they get $0.6x$33.55 = ~$20. Say they see 4 patients per hour, 35 hours a week and 48 weeks a year, that's $135K.




My point exactly. You have an undeniable quote and source - the minister of finance (our wives). And because your wife is a GP I would say that your source of information is not hearsay but fact.

As interesting as charka1988 future in dentistry is we are getting off topic. 

Charka1988 do your study in dentistry AND teach yourself to trade dont be a cop out and say you dont have time to do both because there are ppl out there doing it.

As a young person just starting in uni (mid semester?) you have many years ahead to learn the art slowly and it will take years. Some things you just have to let marinate before it makes sense. Depth of character is shown by what you do and how you achieve it so you can do more than just study. 

By saying that you dont have time to learn how to trade tells me that you dont want it bad enough. Because if you did you would break your back to do more. I know I have.


----------



## Mr J (12 July 2009)

Julia said:


> Well, the last time I went to the dentist, I calculated how much he'd be earning on the basis of what I paid for a 30 minute appt.  It came out to around 1.5 mil.pa
> Overheads are of course deductible and even after tax it's going to be a fairly healthy income.




Very healthy, but hardly a road to riches. Expenses - insurance, mortgage/rent, assistants, equipment etc. It's all very expensive. Like a GP, it's a business with high overheads. Large amounts of tax. Comfortable, yes, but then much of it is wasted on fancy new cars that depreciate strongly, electronics, entertainment, food, school fees etc. At the end of the day, the typical well-to-do 'comfortable' lifestyle is quite expensive. He won't be growing his net worth at a significant rate.



			
				Iggy said:
			
		

> A friend of a friend who manages an accounting practice and looks after accounts for trades running their own business and professionals running a practice has mentioned typical yearly incomes -




I noticed you stated trade business rather than the income. Insurance, apprentices etc? People rarely earn what others think. Consider that dentists and doctors start their careers far later than most, and also have large loans to pay off. They also must do a lot of work to get there and can work long hours in a stressful occupation.


----------



## Iggy_Pop (12 July 2009)

Yes the numbers are for businesses, not wages, but are yearly profit earned in the profession, by the owner of the business.  Chaka would be best putting his study into setting up a dentist practice when compared to trading, as Chaka seems to have a desire to make money.


----------



## Mr J (12 July 2009)

> Chaka would be best putting his study into setting up a dentist practice when compared to trading




I would only suggest trading if it was likely he will become a good trader in the near future. Without knowing anything about him, it seems unlikely, so it seems he would likely be far better off by pursuing dentistry. It doesn't seem that it comes down to trading versus dentistry anyway, but for trading to be something on the side. This is the best approach, since it provides him with a good chance of a reasonably high income.

Trading is field with a low chance of success, and I wouldn't advice anyone to jump into it as a primary income/occuptation, and without a good safety net. Of course, I ignored both of those.


----------



## jbocker (13 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> Hey guys
> 
> I am planning to invest around $1500 initially just to learn how all of this goes. How can I know what to invest on?
> 
> Cheers




Hi There Chaka1988 what did you finally decide on, from your original post?
I liked the response from "data" about R.A.T.S. and would recommend you stay with your studies.
I would try the ASX stock market game (there are probably others). That way you can experiment with a few different strategies. Appreciate that the ASX game only deals with top 100 stocks, but you can select several stocks on some watch lists with any shares - enter number of shares and amount paid. Then see how you go. Good luck with studies and your investments.


----------



## mazzatelli1000 (13 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> young people with intelligence are an interesting commodity   ---- keep us posted ...




I see now
First ivant, and now Chaka
It seems you have a taste for young men ::casanova: (tongue firmly in cheek!!!)


----------



## Cartman (13 July 2009)

mazzatelli1000 said:


> I see now
> First ivant, and now Chaka
> It seems you have a taste for young men ::casanova: (tongue firmly in cheek!!!)





Lol ---- dont tell my wife  --


----------



## Chaka1988 (13 July 2009)

Cartman said:


> Lol ---- dont tell my wife  --




dw Im single :casanova: :remybussi


----------



## Cartman (13 July 2009)

Chaka1988 said:


> dw Im single :casanova: :remybussi




 --- back to your books young fella --- i wanna see high morals and high distinctions from you -- in that order !!


----------



## jono1887 (13 July 2009)

Mr J said:


> I would only suggest trading if it was likely he will become a good trader in the near future. Without knowing anything about him, it seems unlikely, so it seems he would likely be far better off by pursuing dentistry. It doesn't seem that it comes down to trading versus dentistry anyway, but for trading to be something on the side. This is the best approach, since it provides him with a good chance of a reasonably high income.
> 
> Trading is field with a low chance of success, and I wouldn't advice anyone to jump into it as a primary income/occuptation, and without a good safety net. Of course, I ignored both of those.




Doesn't mean that he can't take in on as a hobby or secondary thing whilst he's still in uni


----------



## Mr J (13 July 2009)

jono1887 said:


> Doesn't mean that he can't take in on as a hobby or secondary thing whilst he's still in uni




Not sure why you're quoting my post, as that is what I suggested, and assumed as the OP's intention.


----------



## Chaka1988 (13 July 2009)

The book by Stan Weinstein is amazingly interesting and easy to follow!


----------

