# Australian Shareholder Centre



## steve85 (18 June 2013)

I was wondering whether anyone has used "Australian Shareholder Centre" and their experiences and thoughts?

Essentially I am currently using margin lending and my own investments. While this year has been good, overall I have not gone too well as I just dont have enough time looking at the market. I was looking around and came across Australian Shareholder Centre (I believe based out of gold coast).

They trade in CFDz which I am aware are higher risk but they rely heavily on trailing stock losses to mitigate risks. I got the sales pitch which, if believed, would yield close to 50% (which obviously rang some alarm bells). They provided me access for a limited period to their members area and I went through all of their trade recommendations for the year so far. In essence, this year they have achieved losses on 56% of their trades (from my own calculations). However, on the plus side, after brokerage etc, it would have yielded approximately $2000 profit thus far. This isn't far off other years they claim. This is in their A and B categories (essentially trading CFDs on ASX, NYSE and London). 

My concerns:
-obviously the extremely high return is of concern
- i can not find any reviews of them on the net. Some further searching identified they are a legitimte business IAW ASIC and australian business register and used to trade as Trumarket a number of years ago which hasn't got a good wrap on this forum.
- There is an extremely high set up cost of between $5000 and $7000

Reasons I am contemplating it:
- my own analysis of their trade recommendations year to date does demonstrate a high rate of return in line with what they are claiming.
- I want to get out of self managed investments as I don't have time and look at a medium to high risk place to park some of my savings that is fully managed.

Any thoughts, experiences and advice is greatly appreciated.


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## stockGURU (18 June 2013)

Hi Steve,

The following is my assessment of Australian Shareholder Centre:

*Red flags*

Domain privacy is enabled to hide ownership details on the domain name.
You cannot view the website without entering your name and mobile phone number. Well, you can, but I'll get to that in a minute.
Company registered and run out of the Gold Coast
No upfront information about the cost of services. It looks like you register your interest and then get a phone call with the hard sell.

But let's look a little deeper. Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd was previously known as TruMarkets Pty Ltd, an advisory firm that closed its doors and sold its customers to another business by the name of Iron Claw Investments Pty Ltd, trading as Active Traders. You can read about Active Traders here and here. At the second link you will see a user named "Chris Harris" offering a positive review of Active Traders, who then mysteriously disappears after promising more updates. More than likely this is someone associated with the company who is posting to try and make it seem that the company is generating good returns. Then the victims start showing up.

Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd and Iron Claw Investments Pty Ltd (Active Traders) have the same director and are both authorised representatives of AFSL holder Conquest Markets Pty Ltd. Conquest Markets has the same address as Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd, just different suite numbers. Can you see a pattern emerging?

My opinion: Stay far away from Australian Shareholder Centre, Active Traders, and Conquest Markets. There is something very shady going on here. My guess is that Active Traders received a lot of complaints and they have set up a new company and website (Australian Shareholder Centre) to shift the business to. It looks like the exact same offering, just a new company name, website and phone number. My guess is that it's only a matter of time until the victims of Australian Shareholder Centre start showing up on forums telling their stories. Don't be one of them!

P.S. To view the Australian Shareholder Centre website without surrendering your name and mobile phone number, just disable JavaScript in your browser. In Firefox you do this by going to Tools -> Options -> Content, then uncheck the "Enable JavaScript" box.


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## steve85 (19 June 2013)

Thank very much for your very useful thread. I had investigated a couple of the items you brought up but not nearly in as much detail as you have. In the links you provided, the background story as to how people got roped in sounds very much (read almost exactly) as it appeared I was being brought in. After writing my first post, it started to make me think harder and I could see that I was being lured by the high returns on investment even while being cognisant of it. 

I do have to note here that my calculations did indicate financial success overall for trades placed this year however, there was a low success rate (i.e. "winning" trades). 

Again, thanks for your time and your detailed response. 

I have decided to stick with my current portfolio for now but to start making a conscious effort of trying to do more research and actually start selling rather than just buy and hold as well as signing up to a share investment advice service before the EOFY - I will definitely have a good look on these forums for recommendations.


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## vrfund (20 June 2013)

Thankyou for this thread and comments. I have spent the last few days trying to decide whether to go with them. The returns sounded appealing but something didn't feel right and I struggled to find any info on them on www. This thread makes me very happy I decided not to go with them - thankyou!!


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## classer (21 June 2013)

_stockguru_
_The following is my assessment of Australian Shareholder Centre:_


A timely assesment, someone just asked me about this mob so I appreciate your effort.

Cheers Classer


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## mutz (1 July 2013)

steve85 said:


> I was wondering whether anyone has used "Australian Shareholder Centre" and their experiences and thoughts?
> 
> Essentially I am currently using margin lending and my own investments. While this year has been good, overall I have not gone too well as I just dont have enough time looking at the market. I was looking around and came across Australian Shareholder Centre (I believe based out of gold coast).
> 
> ...




As a general rule I suggest you do not register with any website where they want your email and your mobile number before they will tell you what services they offer. Also be suspicious of anyone who is unwilling to be upfront about their upfront costs. Sound business don't resort to these sort of tactics.


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## stockGURU (14 August 2013)

It appears that this company is changing its name and URL to "Australian Share Centre". 

The question needs to be asked, why?  What are they hiding? What are they running from? 

Another red flag and another reason to avoid this company like the plague.


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## Drew64 (23 August 2013)

stockGURU said:


> It appears that this company is changing its name and URL to "Australian Share Centre".
> 
> The question needs to be asked, why?  What are they hiding? What are they running from?
> 
> Another red flag and another reason to avoid this company like the plague.




Unfortunately, I decided to throw the dice and give the Australian Share Centre a try. 

BIG WARNING ... the information they give you access to in 'The Sell' is fabricated. If you look underneath the Trade Performance  there is the following disclaimer: "All results although based on live trades are hypothetical and do not reflect an actual trading account."

Hypothetical is 100% correct. In my experience, their success rate is closer to 10% so, if you chose to invest, be prepared to watch your funds steadily dwindle away. They take their share of brokerage for all trades so they win whether the trades win or lose, and more often than not - THEY LOSE.


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## samy (3 October 2013)

mutz said:


> As a general rule I suggest you do not register with any website where they want your email and your mobile number before they will tell you what services they offer. Also be suspicious of anyone who is unwilling to be upfront about their upfront costs. Sound business don't resort to these sort of tactics.




RE Australian Shareholder Centre

Great feedback and thank you!  I had the phone call recently from them and was quite attracted to what the company offers - especially the low brokerage. 

I wonder - does anyone have any experience of trading through this company?  I know the evidence quoted here is worrying but use of a stop/loss to mitigte losses is valid.  Yes they do take brokerage - doesn't everyone -  but at 0.1659%.  Their fee for service was not up-front as has been said here already but it wasn't hidden either - it came up later in the phone conversation - a $5000 fee to secure their services.  ON a decent perfromance you can make this back in time.

The arguement is sound - many of us including me do not have the time to do the reserch required on stocks across the US / London and Aussie markets.  Also to buy and sell across days and weeks requires time for intensive research - and making trades in a timely manner - I just can't do it timewise.

If this mob is not trustworthy - who is?  Do you know a firm/broker who will do the research and reccomend the trades for me on that research?  I wonder??

  I am really looking for some ideas here?

Does anyone know about Excela??  I have been using them for a while in conjunction with ANZ E-Trade.  I find its hard to get much action out of them and the feel is that there is nothing happening until you ring and ask?  I am down 3 grand on AMP through them. Anyone doing better than this??  Anyone who is also time-poor?

samy.


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## samy (3 October 2013)

steve85 said:


> I was wondering whether anyone has used "Australian Shareholder Centre" and their experiences and thoughts?
> 
> Essentially I am currently using margin lending and my own investments. While this year has been good, overall I have not gone too well as I just dont have enough time looking at the market. I was looking around and came across Australian Shareholder Centre (I believe based out of gold coast).
> 
> ...






Steve - I posted on the Aust Shareholders Centre thread too - I wonder who are you with if not Aust. Shareholders Centre?

You mention _" I want to get out of self managed investments as I don't have time and look at a medium to high risk place to park some of my savings that is fully managed."_

This fits me exactly - I have been with Excela for some years but its all too pedestrian; do you know any other optins?  (See my reply to your previous thread).

Thanks


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## stockGURU (4 October 2013)

What is it you are paying thousands of dollars for exactly? Where are the audited broker statements demonstrating that this business is recommending profitable trades?

I could register a Pty Ltd company tomorrow, rent an AFSL, charge $7,000 a year to people and start recommending trades. Does that mean that it is going to make anyone money? I have no track record and neither do the Australian Shareholder Centre, Australian Share Centre, Share Centre or whatever they are calling themselves now. This company has changed its trading name twice in a matter of months. How can anyone have faith in a business that keeps changing its name? 

There are many cheaper, more reputable options, such as Nick Radge's The Chartist. I honestly find it astonishing that anyone would hand over thousands of dollars to a company with no track record, that won't let people view their website without handing over their mobile phone number and that cold calls. 

Those considering handing over their money to this company should pay very close attention to Drew64's post in this thread.


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## steve85 (21 October 2013)

samy said:


> Steve - I posted on the Aust Shareholders Centre thread too - I wonder who are you with if not Aust. Shareholders Centre?
> 
> You mention _" I want to get out of self managed investments as I don't have time and look at a medium to high risk place to park some of my savings that is fully managed."_
> 
> ...




Hi Samy;
Sorry it took so long to reply to your post. I must admit, I ended up doing a bunch of research into technical analysis on the markets and paying closer attention to my shares.... for a while. Until I again ran out of time when work picked up and I had to head away for a while. I must admit, I had a lot of success in that brief period but then again, how can you not when we have had a great market of late.

As far as other companies, I havent looked into them as I was pretty disappointed with the general lack of transparency and some other things I read. I am not saying that there arent good analysts out there that will significantly improve my trading base, but reading a number of resources, only the absolute best have any real difference in results to the average home trader. And the absolute best arent going to worry about someone like me who is investing relatively little amounts of money. i.e. you can read this as (in my opinion) if you have a fund worth managing, you probably can get the best of it, if not, you are spinning the dice a bit. 

I am considering pulling out soon as I feel the market has been bullish for quite some time and I am finally almost square with my losses from 2008. That and I am about to move oversees and the chances of me monitoring my shares from Europe are even less. Good luck and if you do have success, let me know as this might be an option for me when I head away.

Also, thanks everyone else for the responses and I hope it helped other people out as well. I think the fact they changed their name shortly afterwards is an indication that this could be a lucky miss. I know that I am personally very happy with my decision to not go with them (p.s. from what was explained to me, the "low" commission is actually based on the full amount ie if you buy $1,000 of CFDs for shares worth $40k, you pay that % on the 40k..... that is a much larger commission on trades!)


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## stockGURU (17 November 2013)

Apparently my first post in this thread has caused some controversy and the Australian Shareholder Centre, or Share Centre, or whatever name they are currently calling themselves, has claimed that it is defamatory and has been threatening to sue Aussie Stock Forums.

I would like to go through my previous post and demonstrate that every statement of fact that I posted is true.



stockGURU said:


> Domain privacy is enabled to hide ownership details on the domain name.




As far as I can tell, there are now five domain names pointing to the Australian Shareholder Centre website. Three .com.au domain names and two .com domain names. Both of the .com domain names have domain privacy enabled. This is a fact. The three .com.au domain names do not have domain privacy enabled because *there is no such thing as domain privacy for .com.au domain names*. At the time of my first post in this thread, there were only two domain names pointing to the Australian Shareholder Centre website, one com.au and one .com. The .com domain name had domain name privacy enabled then and still does now.



stockGURU said:


> You cannot view the website without entering your name and mobile phone number.




This is a fact. Please visit the Australian Shareholder Centre website to confirm or simply take a look at this screenshot.

View attachment 55373




stockGURU said:


> Company registered and run out of the Gold Coast




The address of Australian Shareholder Centre is Suite 204, 237 Scottsdale Drive, Robina, 4226. Robina is on the Gold Coast, so this statement is factual. I consider it a red flag because of the Gold Coast's reputation as the fraud capital of Australia. Anyone dealing with any financial or investment company based on the Gold Coast should be especially careful for that reason.



stockGURU said:


> No upfront information about the cost of services. It looks like you register your interest and then get a phone call with the hard sell.




As of the date of my first post in this thread, and after checking again today, there is no information on the Australian Shareholder Centre website that outlines the cost of their services. As for the hard sell, that's what these companies do. You don't try and soft sell a service with no track record that costs several thousands of dollars. It doesn't qualify as an impulse purchase.



stockGURU said:


> Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd was previously known as TruMarkets Pty Ltd, an advisory firm that closed its doors and sold its customers to another business by the name of Iron Claw Investments Pty Ltd, trading as Active Traders.




From 06/08/09 to 10/12/12, the company was known as TRUMarkets Pty Ltd. From 10/12/12 until the present, the company was known as Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd. The last message on the TruMarkets website before it closed its doors was "TRU Markets is delighted to announce that they are moving all clients over to Active Traders, please call 1300 365 839 to receive your new log in details." So did TruMarkets just hand over their customers to Active Traders as a gift, or was there some kind of monetary exchange involved? I'm guessing the latter. Companies usually don't give away their clients when they close their doors, they sell them to other companies.

As for the details of the business names, this is all public information and can be easily verified by simple web searches.



stockGURU said:


> You can read about Active Traders here and here. At the second link you will see a user named "Chris Harris" offering a positive review of Active Traders, who then mysteriously disappears after promising more updates. More than likely this is someone associated with the company who is posting to try and make it seem that the company is generating good returns. Then the victims start showing up.




I am not responsible for content posted on other websites. As for my opinion regarding the motivations of "Chris Harris", it is common practice for individuals associated with companies to register at forums and talk up those companies. It happens here and at many other forums. The posts of "Chris Harris" do not sound like those of a genuine customer and I stand by my assessment of those posts.



stockGURU said:


> Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd and Iron Claw Investments Pty Ltd (Active Traders) have the same director and are both authorised representatives of AFSL holder Conquest Markets Pty Ltd. Conquest Markets has the same address as Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd, just different suite numbers.




The address of Australian Shareholder Centre Pty Ltd is Suite 204, 237 Scottsdale Drive, Robina, 4226. The address of Conquest Markets Pty Ltd is Suite 105, 237 Scottsdale Drive, Robina, QLD, 4226. The sole director of both of these companies is Rhys Edward Jones. So both of those statements are factual, and a matter of public record.

The remainder of my post is my honestly held opinion, and according to the Defamation Act 2005 that is protected speech, as long as it is based upon "proper material". "Proper material" is defined by the Defamation Act 2005 as being material that "is substantially true". As I have demonstrated above, what I posted earlier in this forum thread is both true and accurate. I stand by what I posted back then and I stand by it today. I would not recommend anyone hand over a cent to Australian Shareholder Centre. The company has no audited performance history available for public inspection and we have at least one person in this thread claiming to have lost money by using their services, just as I predicted would happen in my first post.

While I'm posting again, I might as well point out a couple of other facts that people seeking information about this company should be aware of:


According to their Financial Services Guide, there is no cooling off period. The following is a direct quote from their Financial Services Guide: 







> Due to the nature of the financial advisory services provided, all Private Client services provided are non-refundable and have no cooling-off period. All payments are final. The Share Centre maintains a strict No Refund Policy for all general financial advisory and educational services and accepts no responsibility for any financial loss suffered.



"Information relating to the price paid for products and services offered" is considered to be "confidential information" according to section 4.4. of the their Terms and Conditions. So is "information that relates to the marketing and selling techniques used by us", and "information regarding recommendations including outcomes and results." Why is this company so anxious to keep almost everything about the way it conducts business confidential? According to section 4.5 of the Terms and Conditions, if you divulge any of this "confidential information" Australian Shareholder Centre is entitled to seek compensation of a minimum of $2,500 per breach. Why is this company so secretive about how it conducts business?


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## stockGURU (17 November 2013)

stockGURU said:


> It looks like you register your interest and then get a phone call with the hard sell.




Those reading this thread can decide for themselves whether this person's experience with Australian Shareholder Centre qualifies as getting "the hard sell".

http://www.justanswer.com/australian-law/7xjuc-australian-shareholder-centre.html


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## skeandhu (31 January 2014)

*Re: CFD Brokers*

0Has anyone dealt with the Australian Shareholder Centre?


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## murdm (14 March 2014)

*Australian share holder centre*

Has anyone invested with this company?


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## The joker (11 May 2014)

All I can say is.......... do not do it!

I joined earlier this year and have lost about $6000. They have a win rate of approx 25 %.

My gut told me not to go with them but they kept ringing me up and eventually offered membership at $4900. I think they seriously misrepresent themselves and am currently looking at legal avenues to recoup my membership cost.

stay away


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## luutzu (11 May 2014)

Seriously, why do you guys trust people with your money like that?
I don't think anyone should even trust a proper, established, big institutional, global banking powerhouse and all that - backed fund manager let alone these clowns.

Is it because it's the stock market or financial product mumble jumble that separate your normal sense of caution?

If you are not dealing with the stock market, would you give any business your money just to then give them money so they will make you rich? [if you would, contact me for my bank details please].

I feel silly telling you this but you don't seriously think there are people out there wanting to do nothing but make you rich right?

Making money is supposed to be hard, making money in a field you don't know is almost impossible... so either do something that you do know to make money, or study and get to know the field you want to make money in to then make money- by yourself.

Unless you control the guy, control his paycheck, that without your paycheck he won't be able to catch a train or turn on the lights in his parent's garrage... unless you have that kind of influence on the guy, you cannot hope to be served by him. This applies to fund managers who take your 1-2% no matter how they perform, applies equally to subscriptions' "analysts" who have nothing to lose, really not much more to gain from you, to motivate him to work harder to make you rich.


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## ratbag1 (12 May 2014)

steve85 said:


> I was wondering whether anyone has used "Australian Shareholder Centre" and their experiences and thoughts?
> 
> They trade in CFDz which I am aware are higher risk but they rely heavily on trailing stock losses to mitigate risks. I got the sales pitch which, if believed, would yield close to 50% (which obviously rang some alarm bells). They provided me access for a limited period to their members area and I went through all of their trade recommendations for the year so far.




My experience with a similar outfit [may be the same one after multiple ?bankruptcy?name changes] is that their so-called members area provided information that was wholly misleading compared to their results once I spent my money. I would go so far as to suspect fraud [not necessarily in this case, of course] in order to suck people in. Have you any way of going back to verify with other members whether their recommendations were as described? Anyone can post recommendations after the event that look impressive!!

Stay away is my advice.


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## quill53 (14 May 2014)

*Australian Shareholders Centre*

has anyone had dealings with the above


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## Christie07 (14 June 2014)

The joker said:


> All I can say is.......... do not do it!
> 
> I joined earlier this year and have lost about $6000. They have a win rate of approx 25 %.
> 
> ...




I just wish I had found this thread six months ago.  I did a web search on the “Australian Stockholder Centre” but somehow only material put out by the company itself came up.

Early this year I was contacted by a very smooth talking and plausible representative of this company who persuaded me to pay them quite a lot of money ($5,000) to become one of their “clients".  As some people may already know, the ASC has a rather slick-looking website which provides purported detailed data on their past investments.  Before I agreed to become a client I went through the “Trade Statements” section of the ASC website carefully, and after adding and subtracting a lot of figures for the previous 6 months, it seemed to demonstrate that the company had in fact obtained good returns, in agreement with the graphs and statistics they showed for their performance over the past 6 years or so.  I also carried out a search of the web looking for any comments about the performance of the ASC, but couldn’t find any, adverse or otherwise.  The company rep told me that this was because none of their past or existing clients had any complaints to air as they were “doing so well out their financial involvement with the ASC”.  

However, since I have been with them their dealings have been almost uniformly disastrous, and to date I have lost almost $10,000 on the ASX and US sharemarket transactions they have carried out on my behalf.

I now think I may have made a huge mistake and after reading your comments it seems like a good idea to try to bail out of my “client” relationship with the ASC as soon as possible. 

I am now also wondering whether the Trade Statement section of their website has been in some way manipulated so that the returns look very good to prospective clients (who are only able to login for about 24 hours while considering their decision to become a client or not, using the company rep’s details); whereas existing clients like myself who login to the site using their own details are the only ones allowed to see the actual very poor results.  Would it in fact be possible for the developers of the website to do this?


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## Julia (14 June 2014)

I've just glanced through this page of the thread and was curious enough to google the company name.
I'd dismiss it instantly just on the basis that no access to any detail is available unless you register with your personal details.

Yeah, right.  So they can subsequently harass you with sales offers.

To those who feel dudded, what do you intend to do about it?  It's fine to complain here but ASF can't actually help you.  Do you feel sufficiently ripped off to report them to ASIC?


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## Propertypro (17 June 2014)

*Re: Australian Shareholder Centre.*



The joker said:


> All I can say is.......... do not do it!
> 
> I joined earlier this year and have lost about $6000. They have a win rate of approx 25 %.
> 
> ...




$8000 down in 2 months. Would like to recoup my membership costs. Any ideas?


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## Christie07 (9 July 2014)

*Re: Australian Shareholder Centre.*



Propertypro said:


> $8000 down in 2 months. Would like to recoup my membership costs. Any ideas?




Just discovered that the people running this dodgy business have changed their name yet again – they are now calling themselves "Share Centre".   Their 'new' website (www.sharecentre.com.au) is virtually identical to the one that was running under the banner "Australian Shareholders Centre".  The methods they have been using to fleece money from unsuspecting small investors are almost certainly exactly the same as before.

Seems pretty obvious that they have done this because their name was getting a really bad smell, as more people who have lost serious amounts of money with them are now starting to spread the word.


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## Timf (27 August 2014)

The joker said:


> All I can say is.......... do not do it!
> 
> I joined earlier this year and have lost about $6000. They have a win rate of approx 25 %.
> 
> ...




Thanks for the advice, they rang me today and sounded like they could make me lots of money,but i wasent sure so ,  I asked someone at work, who said I should look at this sight,after read what everone else was saying ,Ill think  stay away.   Thanks


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## RogerJ (6 November 2014)

Timf said:


> Thanks for the advice, they rang me today and sounded like they could make me lots of money,but i wasent sure so ,  I asked someone at work, who said I should look at this sight,after read what everone else was saying ,Ill think  stay away.   Thanks



.  That is a sensible decision.  I can tell you today after being with them for one month, I have instructed Halifax (the broker) to cancel my account and take no more instructions from ShareCentre.  I have lost about $4000 in that short time.  I was tentative about dealing with them in the first place, but decided I could afford to risk $10000.  Bad decision.  Wish I could have found this forum with the searches I did originally before I went with them.


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## Sherwood60 (23 November 2014)

I have been with Australian Shareholder Centre for only a month or so, trading in Category B CFDs, and I have already lost nearly $2,000 from a $10,000 investment.   Then there was the $4,990 initial membership fee as well.   The account was doing okay for the first couple of weeks, hovering between $9,500 and $10,100, but then in the third week it dropped down to $9,000 and in the 4th week it dropped down to $8,100.   That's around $2,000 losses in just 2 weeks !

I quickly rang their brokers, Halifax, and told them to immediately cease trading on my account.   I then sent an email to the smooth ASC sales representative that rang me in the first place, telling him in no uncertain terms that this performance was not as indicated during the tour of their website.  I concluded my email saying that I am thinking of pulling all my money out and ending my relationship with them.   A derivatives analyst rang me back and said that it was just the nature of Category B trades they they go up and down quite a lot.   I then asked him what had gone so wrong in the last 2 weeks compared to the first 2 weeks when my account was doing okay.  He replied with some long-winded mumbo jumbo that basically went over my head.  He sounded like a used car salesmen.  He then said that I could switch to Category A which is much safer (more conservative) than Category B.   He said that during the month I had been in Category B, I would have actually made $425 on my $10,000 investment if I had been in Category A.   So basically I had the choice of either moving my remaining 8 grand into Category A, or pulling out of ASC entirely.  I have chosen to switch to Category A but I will be monitoring my account closely and if it continues to slide backwards then I will pull out of ASC completely.

I am thinking of reporting them to ASIC or ACCC, since I believe they misrepresented their results on their website. 

Another thing now that I think of it:  I am on the Do Not Call telephone register, so didnt they break the law by calling me in the first place ?


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## So_Cynical (23 November 2014)

Sherwood60 said:


> I have been with Australian Shareholder Centre for only a month or so, trading in Category B CFDs, and I have already lost nearly $2,000 from a $10,000 investment.That's around $2,000 losses in just 2 weeks !




Think of your experience and loss as a very well priced lesson in how NOT to profit from the stock market and its derivatives, $2000 well spent as long as you learn a valuable lesson.


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## luutzu (23 November 2014)

Sherwood60 said:


> I have been with Australian Shareholder Centre for only a month or so, trading in Category B CFDs, and I have already lost nearly $2,000 from a $10,000 investment.   Then there was the $4,990 initial membership fee as well.   The account was doing okay for the first couple of weeks, hovering between $9,500 and $10,100, but then in the third week it dropped down to $9,000 and in the 4th week it dropped down to $8,100.   That's around $2,000 losses in just 2 weeks !
> 
> I quickly rang their brokers, Halifax, and told them to immediately cease trading on my account.   I then sent an email to the smooth ASC sales representative that rang me in the first place, telling him in no uncertain terms that this performance was not as indicated during the tour of their website.  I concluded my email saying that I am thinking of pulling all my money out and ending my relationship with them.   A derivatives analyst rang me back and said that it was just the nature of Category B trades they they go up and down quite a lot.   I then asked him what had gone so wrong in the last 2 weeks compared to the first 2 weeks when my account was doing okay.  He replied with some long-winded mumbo jumbo that basically went over my head.  He sounded like a used car salesmen.  He then said that I could switch to Category A which is much safer (more conservative) than Category B.   He said that during the month I had been in Category B, I would have actually made $425 on my $10,000 investment if I had been in Category A.   So basically I had the choice of either moving my remaining 8 grand into Category A, or pulling out of ASC entirely.  I have chosen to switch to Category A but I will be monitoring my account closely and if it continues to slide backwards then I will pull out of ASC completely.
> 
> ...




Shouldn't you pull out completely?


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## Sherwood60 (26 November 2014)

luutzu said:


> Shouldn't you pull out completely?





Their senior derivatives advisor said that Category A (which is more conservative) returned a positive 4.25% during the month that I was in Category B.   Category A doesnt trade in Forex, and has only 1 or 2 trades per month.   So I thought that maybe I could recover some of my money by moving over to Category A.....

Or are you suggesting that he was lying about Category A's recent performance ?

Quite possibly he was, since they obviously lied to me about their previous returns in Category B.

Anyway, I have downloaded and printed the complaint reports for both the ACCC (Scamwatch) and ASIC.  I intend to complete and return both forms.   The company has an ASIC financial licence and an ABN, so ASIC should be able to do something about them.   They have offices in Crows Nest, Sydney, and the Gold Coast, Queensland.

If I dont lodge formal reports with the ACCC and ASIC, then the company will just keep on swindling other consumers to support their lavish lifestyles driving around in Ferraris and sailing on yachts.

By the way, luutzu, I liked your previous post about why should a financial advisor work hard to make you rich when you have no control over his work ethic.  Financial advisors, investment houses, and brokers are only in it for themselves, as my experience as shown.  They cannot be trusted.

If I can get my $4,990 "life-long" membership back I will be happy.   The ACCC and ASIC may be able to help me in this regard.   The Ã¶ther 2 grand of trading losses I will probably have to chalk up to experience.

I would be interested to know if any of the previous posters want to join me in lodging complaints with ACCC and ASIC.   The more complaints they get, the more likely they will do something about it.

Cheers.


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## burglar (26 November 2014)

Sherwood60 said:


> ... are you suggesting that he was lying  ...







pull out completely


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## luutzu (26 November 2014)

Sherwood60 said:


> Their senior derivatives advisor said that Category A (which is more conservative) returned a positive 4.25% during the month that I was in Category B.   Category A doesnt trade in Forex, and has only 1 or 2 trades per month.   So I thought that maybe I could recover some of my money by moving over to Category A.....
> 
> Or are you suggesting that he was lying about Category A's recent performance ?
> 
> ...




If it's my money I would get it out completely.

I don't know the details or what ASC does exactly but it sounds fishy and I think you already knew that, but maybe just like all of us you're a bit hopeful that they would only lie to you once.

Don't rely on ACCC or ASIC to get your money back man... maybe try to smooth or tough talk to ASC somehow to get what you can back, then report.


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## Sherwood60 (27 November 2014)

luutzu said:


> If it's my money I would get it out completely.
> 
> I don't know the details or what ASC does exactly but it sounds fishy and I think you already knew that, but maybe just like all of us you're a bit hopeful that they would only lie to you once.
> 
> Don't rely on ACCC or ASIC to get your money back man... maybe try to smooth or tough talk to ASC somehow to get what you can back, then report.






I rang ASC today and they offered to put an extra $500 into my account.   Maybe if I threatened to report them to the ACCC and the ASIC they give me back some more ?

Why dont you believe that the ACCC or ASIC will help me and others out ?    Especially if a few of us lodge reports together ?   Isnt that what they are there for ?


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## sasch (27 November 2014)

Sherwood60 said:


> I rang ASC today and they offered to put an extra $500 into my account.   Maybe if I threatened to report them to the ACCC and the ASIC they give me back some more ?
> 
> Why dont you believe that the ACCC or ASIC will help me and others out ?    Especially if a few of us lodge reports together ?   Isnt that what they are there for ?




Number 1 rule, capital preservation!

Withdraw what you have remaining and you will also have the added bonus of knowing whether you actually do 
have $8000 left in your account.

Even if there was an investigation, they can take a long time, long enough for all your money to disappear.

You are paying a so called professional to manage your money and they lose 20% in two weeks? You can 
park your money in an online bank account and receive a guaranteed 4% return, no knowledge needed.


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## robusta (24 February 2015)

Got a call today from the Australian Investor Centre, they want to do a half hour presentation tomorrow.
I will have to do a little digging but I think they may be the same mob.


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## pixel (24 February 2015)

robusta said:


> Got a call today from the Australian Investor Centre, they want to do a half hour presentation tomorrow.
> I will have to do a little digging but I think they may be the same mob.




Why not read up on https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29596 and compile a list of questions to put to them.
Alternative: Take plenty of notes or even record their shpiel, then ask ASIC's opinion.


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## nulla nulla (24 February 2015)

How do these organizations get your phone number in the first place?


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## robusta (24 February 2015)

pixel said:


> Why not read up on https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29596 and compile a list of questions to put to them.
> Alternative: Take plenty of notes or even record their shpiel, then ask ASIC's opinion.




Good idea, I don't know how to record a phone call on a landline but I will be very interested in how they answer my questions on risk.



nulla nulla said:


> How do these organizations get your phone number in the first place?




My own stupid fault, I was trying to look at the MTU webcast presentation

"CEO Interim Results Webcast. 10:30am, Monday 23 February, 2015.
Go to ht tp://m2.com.au/investor-centre/calendar-of-events/ OR
ht tp://event.on24.com/r.htm?e=924274&s=1&k=A9F30B5531E89F31C015E7823CC76693"

Good old helpful Google said

Did you mean: http://m2.com.au/investor-centre/calendar-of-events

And I ended up here

http://www.australianinvestorcentre...8cmcqNQ6jQskdLc35MtM16eURrXP6lOCFAaAiPH8P8HAQ


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## robusta (25 February 2015)

Well I got my little presentation. They wanted to trade my money for me on CFD's with Aussie Blue Chips, International Shares, Currencies and Commodities. We went through stop losses, CFD's.
The ASIC disclaimer was read to me. My questions were all about risk management, frictional costs and brokerage.
I was shown a pretty chart of the ASX underperforming China, USA and European stock markets over a 1 and 10 year period. I asked if it was the accumulation index and they admitted it wasn't. I was shown a couple of trades, 1 winner and 1 loser. The sales pitch was very scripted and slick. It was stressed they look a the markets 24/7 I asked about a the risk of using such leverage in a GFC like situation and was told well it didn't happen over night you could see it coming. Then we moved on to their use of short selling. When I talked about risk we came back to stop losses again.
Anyway a bit over half an hour in I was asked if I would sleep well at night risking $200.00 on a trade with them. (they use CFD's and tight stop losses) I said no, not unless the returns were fantastic. The script wouldn't let us move forward without a yes. After asking the same question in a couple of different ways and casting some doubt on my risk management practices the call ended with some disappointment in the sales persons voice.


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## robusta (25 February 2015)

Just confirmed it, Australian Investor Centre has the same ABN.

Here are some reviews from some ex customers.

http://www.productreview.com.au/p/australian-shareholder-centre.html

I must say for someone that is not obsessed by the stock market like me it all sounds and looks very convincing.

Dont know how they sleep at night.


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## Junior (7 September 2015)

http://www.theage.com.au/business/markets/chasing-the-churners-is-a-challenge-20150906-gjg9nr.html



> Since that introduction, a number of victims have touched base. Their stories are too numerous to detail in this space, and many have been told on Aussie Stock Forums (ASF).
> 
> Alas, ASF is now fighting a defamation action from the Centre in the Queensland Supreme Court.
> "Their business model is almost the same in every instance," said a contact from ASF.
> ...





This is terrible....I understand perhaps no one can talk about any specifics of the case.  But what a shocking attack on free speech...and the ability to honestly review and discuss a service/product.


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## tech/a (7 September 2015)

Its pretty rare that you get glowing reports from successful participants 
in educational programs.
They seem to be big on theory and small on delivery.

Seriously if they were that good their Happy customers would be
a roaring chorus of defence.
Debate would be accolades and Advocates!

Doesn't seem like good business practice to me taking free speech to the courts!


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## Junior (7 September 2015)

I hope this isn't costing ASF much in $$ terms.  I'm sure members will be happy to throw in a few $$$ if that is the case.


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## Joe Blow (7 September 2015)

No doubt some of you have read today's article in the Sydney Morning Herald by Michael West about Australian Shareholder Centre.

Suffice it to say, proceedings are ongoing in the Queensland Supreme Court and unfortunately, on advice from my lawyer, I am unable comment on any specifics at this stage. Needless to say, it has consumed a considerable amount of time, energy and financial resources. 

Those interested in making a contribution towards supporting free speech here at Aussie Stock Forums can deposit donations into the following account:

Account Name: ASF Legal Defence Fund
BSB: 638-010
Account Number: 10787054

All donations, regardless of how small, are greatly appreciated and will be put to good use. Thanks!


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## shouldaindex (7 September 2015)

Wow, I'm sorry to hear about this.

I've only joined ASF for a few months and found it to be the best ASX stock forum by far.


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## notting (7 September 2015)

Delusional to be taking it to the actual courts.
They must have swallowed their own pig swill.

If I were you I'd be tracking down some terrible results and ringing the likes of Current Affair and mainstream media to ramp up the megaphone screaming of the losses that poor ignorant souls have incurred through participating in Australian Shareholder Centre's investment schemes.


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## notting (7 September 2015)

Here's a place where you may find some willing testimonials.
http://www.productreview.com.au/p/australian-shareholder-centre.html

And how could they establish any damages from any one site, given the interconnectectedness of social media?  They could only establish libel if a person made false claims about how much they lost.


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## Faramir (12 September 2015)

I despise companies like Australian Shareholder Centre or Australian Investor Centre.

There should be enough victims out there to start up a class action against them.


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