# Interactive Brokers and Options trading in Australia



## Seneca60BC

Hi All

Anyone here use IB to trade options in the aussie market.  If so what feedback do you have ?  The rates seem quite appealing, but before I sign up Id like to know what your thoughts are with options trading via IB.

Cheers!


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## chops_a_must

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Seneca60BC said:


> Hi All
> 
> Anyone here use IB to trade options in the aussie market.  If so what feedback do you have ?  The rates seem quite appealing, but before I sign up Id like to know what your thoughts are with options trading via IB.
> 
> Cheers!




You'll end up in the US.

You'll know why as soon as you get into it.


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## mazzatelli1000

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Seneca60BC said:


> Hi All
> 
> Anyone here use IB to trade options in the aussie market.  If so what feedback do you have ?  The rates seem quite appealing, but before I sign up Id like to know what your thoughts are with options trading via IB.
> 
> Cheers!




You will have to subscribe to Oz Data to see option prices and information which is a cool $35 a month. 

But as chops has alluded - the US options market is much more attractive. Plus all US market data is free on IB. I have been tampering with Korean and Hong Kong options markets which are interesting, but still a large learning curve at the moment, if you are interested in keeping with our time zone. The US will mean late night to early morning hours.


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## Seneca60BC

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Oh damn!! $35 a month! I thought I could use etrade to look up the quotes and then place an order via IB?  I guess this will not work? 

Yea USA wont work as I need to sleep to go to work the next day.


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## mazzatelli1000

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Seneca60BC said:


> Oh damn!! $35 a month! I thought I could use etrade to look up the quotes and then place an order via IB?  I guess this will not work?
> 
> Yea USA wont work as I need to sleep to go to work the next day.




Yes you can use E*Trade for your quote basis and place orders via IB. Should be no problem at all.

In answering your original question regarding using IB as an option broker, the rates and execution are good. No problems at all. Other than that nothing exciting really.

Enjoy


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## Seneca60BC

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Mazz

If I dont subscribe to the live datafeed, will I get at least the latest BID / ASK on the Options Trader screen for australian options ?

Thanks!


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## elbee

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

No!


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## mazzatelli1000

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Seneca60BC said:


> Hi Mazz
> 
> If I dont subscribe to the live datafeed, will I get at least the latest BID / ASK on the Options Trader screen for australian options ?
> 
> Thanks!




Hey sorry, forgot to come back to this

nuttin in IB - just a warning that you shouldn't trade blindly 
if you want to trade option spreads in Australia - try optionsxpress australia and if you're desperate E*Trade


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## Seneca60BC

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Oh darn!  so it looks like I will have to subscribe to the live datafeed and cop the $37 fee every month?

Thanks!


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## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Seneca,you can the bid/ask of the Oz market at OX by opening an account. It wont cost you anything.


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## Seneca60BC

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Grinder said:


> Seneca,you can the bid/ask of the Oz market at OX by opening an account. It wont cost you anything.




Ok - does that mean I dont have to deposit any funds with Options Xpress to open an account ?


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## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I can't remmember if i had to deposit or not at the time, you can give them a call & find out. Their Oz market data is basically bid/ask quotes, not like what they offer for the US markets, which you don't need anyways.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I have re-actived the account with IB   I need a back up broker now that OX has gone for Oz options and like the idea of being able to test ideas with small quantities without breaking the bank with fees.  Hopefully better luck this time around.

Last time I got into strife when closing a calendar spread which should have been for a credit, but it somehow went through as a debit which meant I paid twice for something I no longer owned.  Still mystified what happened about the NBBO.

Can't get the simulated trading to work properly, so have very carefully raised an order for a dummy one lot calendar spread in the live account (being ever so careful not to transmit )

I set this order up in combo trader (see pic below) - everything seems above board.  The description seems correct (see below).  The combo shows up in the order management page as it should, except for negative prices.

I click on "order ticket" - and the results are below.  Have highlighted the default price (I haven't changed it) and it shows a negative price which I believe means buying for a credit   The order preview page shows the same negative price (not shown).  The negative price changes the nature of the trade as I learned the hard way last time.  

Is this normal for TWS to change what should be a positive price (eg I am paying to buy a calendar here)??  

Wayne, Mazza - anyone else experienced with TWS options combo orders????  What am I doing wrong?? 

Any help would be much appreciated


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Went into the demo and entered a US BHP calendar spread (see below) and it defaults correctly to a positive limit price.  I used exactly the same order entry procedure as I did earlier for the Aus order. Very puzzling why the Aus calendars default to negative pricing.

Does anyone else have IB Aus options enabled - would you mind putting in a dummy order for a basic calendar spread using Aus options to see if it automatically defaults to negative prices? (just don't transmit it!) - would like to know if it's just me.

Any help would be much appreciated


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

I’ve been observing your posts with interest and today I actually tried to put in a dummy calendar as you had it laid out just to satisfy my curiosity but I didn’t get past the first page, I got a message saying exchange doesn’t recognize spread, (or words to that effect) did it twice then I gave up, I tried again tonight and I got past the first screen and added the spread to the quote panel but as the market was closed there was nil pricing.

I'll check it out again tomorrow morning.

Because I’m still on training wheels I enter my spreads one leg at a time but i think it's time to step up.


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## mazzatelli1000

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> I click on "order ticket" - and the results are below.  Have highlighted the default price (I haven't changed it) and it shows a negative price which I believe means buying for a credit   The order preview page shows the same negative price (not shown).  The negative price changes the nature of the trade as I learned the hard way last time.
> 
> Is this normal for TWS to change what should be a positive price (eg I am paying to buy a calendar here)??




sails 
Judging by your screenshots - it looks like you have done everything right, so it is a bit odd. Maybe the option gods are smiling upon you and giving you a calendar for free and then some

I don't have ASX data so can't check for you

Just out of curiosity - is that the latest version of TWS?


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## bunyip

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Seneca60BC said:


> Yea USA wont work as I need to sleep to go to work the next day.





That shouldn't be a problem. Work from daily charts, analyse your US charts after work. Place an order to buy an option at your selected price, or place a contingent order to buy an option if the stock trades at your nominated price. 
Go to bed at your normal time, get up next morning at your normal time. No need to do without your sleep or disrupt your normal routine.


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## wayneL

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> Went into the demo and entered a US BHP calendar spread (see below) and it defaults correctly to a positive limit price.  I used exactly the same order entry procedure as I did earlier for the Aus order. Very puzzling why the Aus calendars default to negative pricing.
> 
> Does anyone else have IB Aus options enabled - would you mind putting in a dummy order for a basic calendar spread using Aus options to see if it automatically defaults to negative prices? (just don't transmit it!) - would like to know if it's just me.
> 
> Any help would be much appreciated




Hmmm

I can't see what you've done wrong, it all looks right 

Do you do your combo orders from the option trader window?

I do my combo orders in the main TWS window instead. This gives you a live bid ask for the spread. I've done one on the closest NYSE version of your spread on BHP \/

Then you can just click on the spread bid or ask quote to enter your order


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi Sails,
> 
> I’ve been observing your posts with interest and today I actually tried to put in a dummy calendar as you had it laid out just to satisfy my curiosity but I didn’t get past the first page, I got a message saying exchange doesn’t recognize spread, (or words to that effect) did it twice then I gave up, I tried again tonight and I got past the first screen and added the spread to the quote panel but as the market was closed there was nil pricing.
> 
> I'll check it out again tomorrow morning.
> 
> Because I’m still on training wheels I enter my spreads one leg at a time but i think it's time to step up.




Thanks Cutz - be interesting to see what you get when the market starts trading.  Unlikely to get option prices for the first half hour or more - as I'm sure you've found out!

Hopefully my dilema will help your learning curve along - as long as I'm not leading you astray here. 

Appreciate you having a look to see what you come up with. 



mazzatelli1000 said:


> sails
> Judging by your screenshots - it looks like you have done everything right, so it is a bit odd. Maybe the option gods are smiling upon you and giving you a calendar for free and then some
> 
> I don't have ASX data so can't check for you
> 
> Just out of curiosity - is that the latest version of TWS?




LOL Mazza - MMs disguised as option gods!!  Unfortunately they wouldn't give money away - but they were as quick as lightening to take it when I was selling with a negative price.  It was unbelievable - TWS kept switching everything around in the order.  I hadn't learnt about the effect of negative pricing at that stage, and as this was the first spread I closed out with TWS, I assumed the negative price was the way TWS presented the order as I finally had everything else appearing to be correct.  That mouse click cost around $3K. 

Looks like TWS is still doing the same thing since that happened approx 15-16months ago.  Hopefully posting here might help prevent other Aus option traders from getting burnt in the same way.

Yes, I believe it is the latest version of TWS - just installed in the last few days and I believe it automatically checks for new versions each time I log in.




wayneL said:


> Hmmm
> 
> I can't see what you've done wrong, it all looks right
> 
> Do you do your combo orders from the option trader window?
> 
> I do my combo orders in the main TWS window instead. This gives you a live bid ask for the spread. I've done one on the closest NYSE version of your spread on BHP \/
> 
> Then you can just click on the spread bid or ask quote to enter your order




Thanks Wayne - yes I generated the combo from the main TWS window.

The negative bid/ask quotes are very annoying.  I understand how they work (now ) but there is enough to keep the mind busy with options trades to be unnecessarily trying to transpose this as well.  If you look at the top right hand corner of the first order ticket I posted, you will see what I mean by the negative bid/ask quotes for the Aus combo.

And it is simply so dangerous when the order ticket defaults to the same negative price especially when selling.


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

I’ve checked out that calendar spread and I’m getting minus 1.2 on the bid and minus 0.9 on the ask, clicking on both bid and ask to initiate orders also puts a minus in front of the default prices (both buy and sell).

I also set up  Jan 30/25 put vertical spread and that’s showing 0.875 on the bid and 1.025 on the ask, no minus symbols, also initiating a buy and sell orders on the vertical spread does not place a minus in front of the default price.

I’m not sure what’s going on with the calendar and the minus symbols let us know how you go.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks for checking Cutz   At least you are aware where the trouble lurks - just make sure you never, ever have a minus sign preceeding a limit price when selling.

Wayne, have just taken this snapshot of the TWS page - all the displayed spreads were generated as debit spreads (though it shouldn't matter).

The top combo was a combo of the two calendar spreads generated in the generic window.  Entered it carefully, filled in the fields methodically as they presented.  Still it shows negative bid/ask.

The next two calendar spreads are also showing negative bid/ask.  Cutz found the same thing.
Then tested it out with a vertical and, again, negative bid/ask.  Cutz set up a vertical and it shows normal (positive) bid/ask.
Then, for whatever reason, I generate a butterfly and voila, it gets it right

The only pattern I can find here is that those with negative bid/ask have a sell leg entered first (idendified by the minus sign) in the description column.  The butterfly has a buy leg entered first as can be seen with the initial plus sign.

Anyway, snap shot is below so you can see what I mean:

EDIT:  In the snapshot I see the bid is -0.010 for the fly, however the ask is positive.  It is simply that the bid price is so low and not part of the problem I have discussed.  eg mid price for the fly would be approx 14c.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



wayneL said:


> ...Then you can just click on the spread bid or ask quote to enter your order




I would normally do that if the bid/asks were normal.  Have only been bringing up the order ticket as I felt it was a safer means of checking on the order...

Looks like it's time to contact IB support - hope it is better than last time. 

BTW Wayne, I see your description column has a sell leg first in the calendar and yet it retains normal bid/asks - so that might not be the problem.  Methinks there might be a programming glitch..


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## wayneL

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> BTW Wayne, I see your description column has a sell leg first in the calendar and yet it retains normal bid/asks - so that might not be the problem.  Methinks there might be a programming glitch..



I would say that would have to be the problem too.


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

How did you go with IB customer service?

On the topic of spreads with IB, is it an issue to close out part of a combo initiated spread once it’s in the system or does it need to be closed as a complete combo. i.e., sometimes if I put on a credit spread (I don’t use combos ATM) and the market swings wildly several days later for example, I may close off the short leg and hang on to the long leg for possible re-entry on the short side. I was wondering if I could do the same on a spread that was sold as a combo.


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## wayneL

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> On the topic of spreads with IB, is it an issue to close out part of a combo initiated spread once it’s in the system or does it need to be closed as a complete combo. i.e., sometimes if I put on a credit spread (I don’t use combos ATM) and the market swings wildly several days later for example, I may close off the short leg and hang on to the long leg for possible re-entry on the short side. I was wondering if I could do the same on a spread that was sold as a combo.




Yes you can close out one leg at a time, it's no problem.

I often adjust trades via entering a spread trade as well. 

Say I have a short straddle and want to move one of the goalpoasts sideways a bit. You can buy a vertical spread with the bought option the same strike/expiry as on of the short options in the straddle and _voila_, you have a short strangle. 

TWS will automatically buy to close the short option in the straddle and sell to open the strike further out.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Yes Cutz, CS is happening - slowly.  Heard back and have been asked to supply details of each spread so they can be re-created.   Have posted below the info sent so far.  Top one is the summary showing the bid/ask quotes which I sent in originally - the second is the same spreads with the legs included.  Will keep you posted... 

Out of curiosity, was wondering if you would mind putting these same dummy orders into your TWS to see if they consistently come up with the same problem?  Only if you have time though - don't want to distract you from your trading ... 

Wayne is the helpful options TWS expert here at ASF - he's been using if for a long time.  Using spreads to move positions is great way to get the job done.  It also helps me think about the spread I am about to apply  and does it fit with my view of the market, volatility, etc.

TWS is like Iress where you don't have to specify whether you are opening or closing an option position.   Eg. if you have a short position and want to close it, you simply place a buy order for that particular option.  Whether it is part of a spread, it doesn't matter.

IMO, clicking on a "close position" button is a convenient way to simply reverses the original position and reduces the risk of trading a different option in error.  That's my understanding so far of TWS - I'm sure Wayne will correct if I've got it wrong.


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

Yep problem is still there, results as follows in same order as you have got,

  Bid               Ask
-1.2             -1.06
-0.71           - 0.53
-0.35           -0.235
 0.16             0.48


here's the result for the Jan 30/25 put vertical spread i had yesterday entered as a sell,
0.725      0.84  it hasn't got a minus in front, this one looks normal.(Along with your butterfly)

BTW thanks for the tips Wayne & Sails.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks Cutz  

We'll see what reply I get next!  BTW, I decided to email the Oz office as I really didn't want to try and explain this to an apparent non-techie with limited English skills and who didn't seem to understand the issues I was having with these Oz issues last time round.  Thankfully, it's not a live trade this time.


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## wayneL

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> IMO, clicking on a "close position" button is a convenient way to simply reverses the original position *and reduces the risk of trading a different option in error.*




YES!!!! lol

I learned that lesson  too.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> ...Will keep you posted...




Oh well, the silence is deafening  

So, who knows if they are trying to fix the problem or it's not important to them... 

Only time will tell....


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Guys,

I've got an iron condor over SPY on (AMEX) which I set up over several days, and just now I have set it up as a combo to put in the quote panel along with both credit spreads and I’m seeing negative prices on the iron condor, (for info Feb SPY 70/75/100/105  shows -1.06  -0.97) , the credit spread leg pricing is OK.

I’m not planning on closing this spread as one order but if I decided to, I guess would have to change the default price on the sell order to show a positive number as Sails mentioned ?


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I've got an iron condor over SPY on (AMEX) which I set up over several days, and just now I have set it up as a combo to put in the quote panel along with both credit spreads and I’m seeing negative prices on the iron condor, (for info Feb SPY 70/75/100/105  shows -1.06  -0.97) , the credit spread leg pricing is OK.
> 
> I’m not planning on closing this spread as one order but if I decided to, I guess would have to change the default price on the sell order to show a positive number as Sails mentioned ?




It's exactly how I lost 3K on a simple five lot calendar in a split second - it was a test run with IB.  IB expect option traders to know this (it has a small mention in their large help files) so they won't take any responsibility if it goes wrong.  I would suggest sending a ticket to CS to ask them if you should change the price - at least you have it in writing then from them...

Interesting, it's not just the Oz market then - maybe it's so do with the Hong Kong data ...  

Maybe Wayne can have a look at this to see if it's the same on his TWS - I don't have US data on TWS (have it on TOS!).


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## mazzatelli1000

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> It's exactly how I lost 3K on a simple five lot calendar in a split second - it was a test run with IB.  IB expect option traders to know this (it has a small mention in their large help files) so they won't take any responsibility if it goes wrong.  I would suggest sending a ticket to CS to ask them if you should change the price - at least you have it in writing then from them...
> 
> Interesting, it's not just the Oz market then - maybe it's so do with the Hong Kong data ...
> 
> Maybe Wayne can have a look at this to see if it's the same on his TWS - I don't have US data on TWS (have it on TOS!).




sails
maybe check out the large TWS manual
It has a section on the entry of combo orders and which spreads will be negative/positive priced


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



mazzatelli1000 said:


> sails
> maybe check out the large TWS manual
> It has a section on the entry of combo orders and which spreads will be negative/positive priced




Thanks Mazza - although you're probably already on your way to HK!

Have found it on Page 68 of the large manual, however, it doesn't address the way TWS presents negative bid/ask quotes in the *order management *window as seen in the screen shots.  It explains how negative/positive pricing works when transmitting orders.  

The problem here is with TWS displaying negative bid/ask quotes in order management is that those same negative prices automatically populate the order windows - hence making it extremely dangerous when selling a spread for a credit unless that negative price is manually overwritten - just means another unnecessary step during the order process.  

I would like to know if it is a programming glitch that is causing this or if it is something that can be configured in TWS to only have positive bid/ask quotes.  

Cutz, you might want to have a look at that section in the manual as I believe you do have to change the pricing to positive if you are selling.  I tried changing the price to a positive in the simulated trading though and it all locked up!

I still think it wouldn't hurt to let someone else know there appears to be a problem here.  Perhaps someone might let us know how to configure TWS so the bid/ask quotes work normally every time.

I have found it much simpler to buy a spread it it's a debit and sell a spread if it's a credit.  Only complicates things if buying for a credit and using negative numbers to achieve the same result.


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



mazzatelli1000 said:


> sails
> maybe check out the large TWS manual
> It has a section on the entry of combo orders and which spreads will be negative/positive priced




Thanks for the tip mazza.

Pages 68 and 69 of the PDF explain the negatives/positives numbers on the combo pricing.

Good luck in HK.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Thanks for the tip mazza.
> 
> Pages 68 and 69 of the PDF explain the negatives/positives numbers on the combo pricing.
> 
> Good luck in HK.




LOL Cutz - looks like you found it anyway


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

Beat me to it.


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

I think I’ve nutted out my iron condor after re-reading your post #13 and the manual, the iron condor is bought for credit therefore the spread pricing is negative so if I were to close it out as a combo I would sell for debit with a negative limit price, (buying for credit with a negative limit price if I laid it on as single order) , so in fact the negative quotes are OK, just got to refer to the manual when trading combos till I get the hang of it. ( if of course I decide to step out of my comfort zone of creating spreads a leg at a time)

And as for your calendar spread hopefully the glitches get resolved with the next software update.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Cutz, it sounds like you have it sorted by switching the buys and sells if you want to want use negative pricing.  Although TWS doesn't seem to be consistent in showing either all negative or all positive bid/asks which could become confusing and potentially increase the risk of error.  It seems it can flip either way when generating a combo.

Every other software I have ever used for options trading - including TOS, OX, etc all use positive bid/asks for the initial combo so it just seems to unnecessarily complicate the issue.  Hopefully,  there is a way to configure TWS to only show positive bid/ask.  Might see if I can find anything...


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

The pricing on your spreads now appear normal (without minus symbols).
You must have quite a bit of clout, i'm still waiting for XJO options to be turned on.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi Sails,
> 
> The pricing on your spreads now appear normal (without minus symbols).
> You must have quite a bit of clout, i'm still waiting for XJO options to be turned on.




Thanks for the heads up, Cutz.  Haven't loaded TWS yet - so will go and check! Be surprised if I had any clout  - perhaps it helped emailing directly to Kiera at the Oz office (she does the Oz TWS webinars).  Perhaps nobody has brought it to their attention before...


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Yes you are right, Cutz.  Looking much better now


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Good Morning All,

I have I small query regarding spread orders, this morning I put an order in just in front of the bid of the spread indicative price but my price didn’t up, I then got worried and cancelled. I’m I correct in saying that because it’s only an indicative spread price my order won’t be seen ?

In this case how is a spread order best managed, should i just place mine right in the middle ? Any thoughts.

BTW i'm looking at BHP which is fairly liquid and the spreads are tight.

Thanks in advance


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Cutz, got to go out soon and I will need to load up TWS and then have a play with it to see if I can help you out.  Will come back later...

Hopefully Wayne might know the answer...


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Cutz,

I put in a buy order for a put calendar in to see what would happen(entered it considerably below the bid price as I don't really want it!)

I compared TWS market depth of the two individual puts against Iress depth and it looks like TWS only gives the first line of market depth.  

And as you found out, my order also didn't appear in TWS market depth  for the spread.  On the surface, it looks like the spread market depth quotes in TWS are simply generated from the market depth of the two individual put depths, and so, are unlikely to appear in that window.  It doesn't seem to be a designated market depth such as I get when my broker sets the combo for me and then gives me an ASX generated code so I can actually see my order in that unique market depth window for that spread.  Often I'm the only one there - occasionally there might be someone else.  Sometimes a MM will come in on the opposing side with a counter bid/offer.   That seems unlikely to happen in the TWS spread depth window.

I did see my order in both of the individual option depth windows in Iress, but had to click on "detail" to get all the available levels.  eg. I could see the buy leg on the bid of Feb puts and the sell leg on the ask of the Jan puts.   However, because I had put the order in so far below the spread bid price, it was last on the queue of both options.  I knew it was mine because it was only a 1 lot and they disappeared as soon as I cancelled.

Looks like TWS has some limitations with market depth and the spread market depth appears to not be the real depth for that individual spread.  Next time I place a spread order through Iress, I will compare the market depth windows again.

At least you still have Iress market depth to get a good idea of where mid price might be and to see where you are in the queue of the individual options.  And then use the convenience of TWS to actually enter your orders into the market.

Does this help?  It's not real easy to explain...


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## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks Sails,

Yep it makes perfect sense, opening up depth windows in iress to monitor the two legs and pushing the order through TWS.


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## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Thanks Sails,
> 
> Yep it makes perfect sense, opening up depth windows in iress to monitor the two legs and pushing the order through TWS.




Glad to hear it made some sense!  Just a thought - I would never use the bid/ask prices of spreads in TWS as it appears they are simply taken from the 1st layer of depth.  I find it better to try and establish where the MMs are in the depth (on Iress) and then work out approx mid prices from there.  Most unlikely you will get the mid price or better as the MMs need to make a crust - but hopefully you will get closer to it than legging it.  

I watch depth of all options in the combo very closely - if the MMs are refusing my price and I see a better price by legging it - I am quick to cancel the order (or adjust the price so it won't be taken) and proceed to get the better deal.  I also watch where my order is in the individual option legs - can sometimes give a clue as to how much I need to adjust.

Once you start working with spreads, won't take you long to get a feel for them.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I tried to enter a butterfly order into TWS.  Got an error message that it's not supported by the exchange 

Does anyone know if this is a glitch at the moment - or are there some option combos that can't be traded through IB?


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails,

Yep i came across that error a couple of weeks ago, but it only happened once and it cleared itself the following day.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hello again Sails,

Butterflys seem to be working at my end.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks for the reply, Cutz.    Hopefully it will sort itself out.  Might send in a ticket later and see if they can explain why it didn't work today.  Would be annoying if trying to close a butterfly and then having to leg out...


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

G’Day everyone,

Has anyone been assigned on aussie stocks, I received my first on IB today.

Reason I ask is I received confirmation that 2 MQG May27 call options were assigned, that’s OK because I own the underlying and I can deliver, problem is I’ve also got a decent split month (dunno what else to call it) call backspread on with the lower strike at the 30 May ex, I noticed in the iress course of sales a few 30’s were assigned this morning so I suspect I may get hit up tomorrow.

Because of our short selling restriction how will this be handled if assignment occurs? Will an automatic buy at the open occur which will be allocated for delivery?

Thanks everyone, as you have all noticed not my best week, to many things going on (for a learner).


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Cutz,

I think you were very fortunate you had the stock as I think you only have until 10:10 am to deal with any naked positions.  If you had an ITM long call instead of owning the stock, I think you have to authorise exercise before 10:10am.  If you don't have the stock or don't exercise a long covering option (or don't to exercise it because it has too much premikum) or don't deal with the short stock yourself, IBs software may randomly start closing out your other positions that may not have a thing to do with the assigned call. 

I have never been assigned with IB, but Steve from IB confirmed the above when he first came on to ASF to advise that IB was coming to Australia.  Whether they have changed their rules, I don't know.  I explained to him that our market doesn't fully open until 10:10, but he insisted that was their policy.  So if you are in WOW, WBC that opens last, there wouldn't be much time to do anything with IB.  

I think MQG went X-div yesterday which would explain your early call exercise.  I saw a heap of puts were exercised this morning which is also normal the day after X-div.  If you didn't own the covering stock, you would have also been liable for the dividend - scary thought 

Not sure if you realise that option assignments showing up in the course of sales in the morning actually means they were exercised the day before.  It would appear that you were OK with your further out 30 calls, but it's not uncommon for further out month calls to be exercised for the dividend.  Hoadley has a nice little feature where you can check the probability of your calls being exercised early for the dividend.

Hope this helps and all the best.  Can be pretty unnerving when these things happen and I can certainly relate to that...


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails, 

Yeah, i was aware of the course of sales (assignments from previous biz day), i was up early this morning to check on iress and there were no 30 calls exercised, what a relief 

I do want to hang on to this position so waking up with a short underlying would be a better alternative than having to buy on market to deliver and being left with an OTM long call swinging in the breeze, hopefully one day the Australian rules will change to be more option trader friendly.

I think i have to be on high alert on this one, i like the risk profile but being assigned would muck it up.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi Sails,
> 
> Yeah, i was aware of the course of sales, i was up early this morning to check on iress and there were no 30 calls exercised, what a relief
> 
> I do want to hang on to this position so waking up with a short underlying would be a better alternative than having to buy on market to deliver and being left with an OTM long call swinging in the breeze, hopefully on day the Australian rules will change to be more option trader friendly.
> 
> I think i have to be on high alert on this one, i like the risk profile but being assigned would muck it up.




Ok - wasn't sure if you were aware about the course of sales.  Anyway, it might help someone else somewhere down the track!

At least with the xdiv day over now, there is less risk of assignment unless the ITM calls lose their extrinsic value as time passes or if mqg starts to climb again.  But I think you would already know all that. 

 I think the free Hoadley tool shows early exercise risk on all options - not just for dividends.  Might be worth checking up on it if your calls remain ITM.


----------



## Trembling Hand

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Anyone traded XJO or SPI oppies with IB?

Cannot seem to get any XJO data in the Optiontrader thingo 

Fine for ASX stocks.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Sails, 

I just found it, comes up with early exercise not optimal, but i should go over it and check all my inputs just in case.

BTW, I appreciate all the help and patience you’ve been giving us new guys,  hope I haven’t been to much of a pest, sometimes things can get a little stressful when the unexpected happens.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Trembling Hand said:


> Anyone traded XJO or SPI oppies with IB?
> 
> Cannot seem to get any XJO data in the Optiontrader thingo
> 
> Fine for ASX stocks.




I don't think you can trade XJO options with IB, but you can get SPI options.  Just type SPI into the "Underlying" column of TWS, hit enter and you can choose futures options, etc, etc.

I have occasionally looked at the option chains in Option Trader window, but there is rarely any quotes.  Looks like you would have to do a quote request.  The lack of quotes seem strange as there seems to be a fair bit of decent volume at times. Anyway, I usually check here in the morning to see what's been going on: http://www.asx.com.au/sfe/daily_monthly_reports.htm


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Trembling Hand said:


> Anyone traded XJO or SPI oppies with IB?
> 
> Cannot seem to get any XJO data in the Optiontrader thingo
> 
> Fine for ASX stocks.




Hi TH,

Yeah i trade them, use AP, it's actually is the code for XJO options funnily enough.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi Sails,
> 
> I just found it, comes up with early exercise not optimal, but i should go over it and check all my inputs just in case.
> 
> BTW, I appreciate all the help and patience you’ve been giving us new guys,  hope I haven’t been to much of a pest, sometimes things can get a little stressful when the unexpected happens.




No worries, Cutz - it can get a bit stressful when the learning curve steepens and I don't think too many option educators out there deal with some of these practical issues that can end up being costly.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi TH,
> 
> Yeah i trade them, use AP, it's actually is the code for XJO options funnily enough.




Many thanks Cutz - didn't know they were available... 

I tried again yesterday entering XJO into TWS and came up with nothing - so much appreciated.


----------



## Trembling Hand

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi TH,
> 
> Yeah i trade them, use AP, it's actually is the code for XJO options funnily enough.




Thanks that did it.


----------



## yarmun

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> I don't think you can trade XJO options with IB, but you can get SPI options.  Just type SPI into the "Underlying" column of TWS, hit enter and you can choose futures options, etc, etc.
> 
> I have occasionally looked at the option chains in Option Trader window, but there is rarely any quotes.  Looks like you would have to do a quote request.  The lack of quotes seem strange as there seems to be a fair bit of decent volume at times. Anyway, I usually check here in the morning to see what's been going on: http://www.asx.com.au/sfe/daily_monthly_reports.htm




Hi all,

is it possible to do a quote request in WebTrader for stock options? because for me there is no access to TradeStation at work.  is there any other way around this that's webpage based?

cheers,
yarmun


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi yarmun,

I've never used webtrader but i must say i've never really requested a quote.

What i normally do if no spreads are showing is check the price on a modeling tool or Iress's valuer then i just enter the order at above/below price (depending if i'm buying or selling) as appropriate and adjust as required. 

Normally after an order is entered when no spreads are showing, spreads automatically appear.


----------



## rossw

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi TH,
> 
> Yeah i trade them, use AP, it's actually is the code for XJO options funnily enough.




better double check that..
there should be both XJO and AP options
xjo are the index options on the asx, and are quoted by a number of mm's
ap are the index options on the sfe, and 90% of volume is crossed up through the broker market

xjos have a $10 multiplier, ap's are $25, but apart from that they're essentially the same (some differences due to margins etc)

not sure the codes IB would use for either, but you should be able to see both


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



rossw said:


> better double check that..
> there should be both XJO and AP options
> xjo are the index options on the asx, and are quoted by a number of mm's
> ap are the index options on the sfe, and 90% of volume is crossed up through the broker market
> 
> xjos have a $10 multiplier, ap's are $25, but apart from that they're essentially the same (some differences due to margins etc)
> 
> not sure the codes IB would use for either, but you should be able to see both





G'Day Rossw,

I'm aware of the differences between the two series but the IB codes for aussie index options are SPI for the SPI options, and AP for the XJO options.

And yep you can see both, although no spreads are showing on the SPI series.


----------



## rossw

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

ok. just wanted to double check. as i said, i didn't know the exact codes IB used for their option stuff

there's no quoting requirements for AP's, so no one shows continuous quotes. But there's usually someone who responds to quote requests there

plenty of depth in xjo's tho


----------



## yarmun

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Hi yarmun,
> 
> I've never used webtrader but i must say i've never really requested a quote.
> 
> What i normally do if no spreads are showing is check the price on a modeling tool or Iress's valuer then i just enter the order at above/below price (depending if i'm buying or selling) as appropriate and adjust as required.
> 
> Normally after an order is entered when no spreads are showing, spreads automatically appear.




thanks cutz, will give that a try


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi, I'm a long time trader but newbie to the forum.
I've been using Etrade and am interested in IB Brokers.
From what I have gatherered, IB charges a flat fee of $3 per contract. So is only cheaper if you are doing a small number of contracts.
Etrade charges between $40 and $50. I did a 90 WDC trade and was only charged $47 brokerage + 91.80 ach fee.
The only advantage I can see of IB brokers would be if I was trading in small numbers of contracts.
But considering the monthly subscription fee for data of close to $45. This would negate the price advantange.
Please correct me if I am wrong.
What advantages do you find in IB brokers besides

IB Brokers
Excellent forr USA markets
Flat fee $3 per contract ($1.88 + $1.22ach)
Data subscription $45


ETrade
Free monthly, although data is delayed if you are not on power trade (read this in the fine print, haven't verified yet)
Etrade doesn't quote for indexes
minimum fee $40 per trade. + ach

Options Xpress
Doesn't do OZ markets

Comsec
Doesn't do spreads online


There has surely goto be better options broker for the OZ markets?


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I was just about to open an account with IB so that I could trade options in Oz online, this thread has made me rethink my actions. its just so hard to find a company in Oz with online options, my main area of interest is trading options in the US however I am keen on doing covered calls, buy/writes etc on underlying stock that I have in my SMSF in Oz. Can anybody suggest a decent broker.


----------



## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Menage said:


> I was just about to open an account with IB so that I could trade options in Oz online, this thread has made me rethink my actions. its just so hard to find a company in Oz with online options, my main area of interest is trading options in the US however I am keen on doing covered calls, buy/writes etc on underlying stock that I have in my SMSF in Oz. Can anybody suggest a decent broker.




There is'nt one, been down this road many a time before. There is already a couple of threads on ops brokers, worth a look. Once OX closed Oz trading I knew I would end up trading the US. Traderdealer are'nt too bad, but you can't do credit spreads. All the rest are pretty much the same.

Toothyfish, IB would be my pick or if you want to avoid data fees I know a guy who likes Westpac. Aparently, multiple legs all online with a flat fee. So you would have to put on spreads in size to make it worthwhile. Hope it helps.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Menage said:


> I was just about to open an account with IB so that I could trade options in Oz online, this thread has made me rethink my actions. its just so hard to find a company in Oz with online options, my main area of interest is trading options in the US however I am keen on doing covered calls, buy/writes etc on underlying stock that I have in my SMSF in Oz. Can anybody suggest a decent broker.




Menage, if it's primarily covered calls, Trader Dealer could be worth looking into to see if they might meet your needs.  I believe it's only credit spreads they don't like (I don't know why as they are just as well hedged as debit spreads!).   You can trade options online through WebIress, but if you want to roll and enter the order as a combo, the order needs to be phoned or emailed.  I set up order templates for email and found it was the best way.  I felt it reduced the risk of error as opposed to phone combo orders.  Once they have the order in the Iress system and a code has been generated, you are then able to completely control it from there for the day.  You can increase, decrease price and/or size - it can be deleted and then re-order online again later. 

However, Iress is not the only trading platform - TD also have Bourse and Market Analyser.  I have only used Iress to trade with TD, so not sure about the others or how well they work with options.  Iress is quite expensive per month unless you trade enough to get it at a reduced price or for free.

One of the good things with TD is that you can scale in or out of your orders without necessarily generating fees on each and every order.  They have it all explained on their site - here is their page on fees: http://www.traderdealer.com.au/What-We-Charge.aspx

I tried Morrisons at one stage and they also use Iress for options.  Problem was they insisted on charging higher rates for combos as they had to be phoned in.  Also, they charged separately for every order through the day which could get a bit expensive if one wants to scale in.


----------



## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> However, Iress is not the only trading platform - TD also have *Bourse* and Market Analyser.  I have only used Iress to trade with TD, so not sure about the others or how well they work with options.  Iress is quite expensive per month unless you trade enough to get it at a reduced price or for free.




I used bourse briefly before giving it the flick, if you've used Iress or simmilar you won't be impressed by it. It's a very basic set up.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Toothyfish said:


> What advantages do you find in IB brokers




Hi Toothyfish,

Are you a long only WOTM mainly large lot option trader or are you a spreader adjusting daily/weekly as required, that may make a big difference between flat rate or per contract type brokerage.

For me the advantages of IB are adjustments don’t cost the earth, superior platform, superior margining, straight to the market, ability to trade any option configuration, mac compatibility, nice statements, assignment friendly, I can keep going but I think I’ll stop there.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Cutz,
You're right, It was a bought WOTM put as one of the legs for a spread.
Let's say I was to do a bull put spread with 50 bought and 50 sold contracts.  Would that be $300 for brokerage with ach fees under IB?
With Etrade, that would be about $220 with ach fees.
I've opened an account with IB to test it out. The software and flexibility is really superb. Just don't like the data subscription. I guess you can just turn it off when you get locked up for long periods of time... Did I say locked up, I meant go away on holidays
Another problem I have found with IB broker has been it takes about 3 days for your money to clear when you do wire transfer. With Etrade it only takes 1 day. I like to leave my spare money in a decent interest earning account and top up as required. Does IB pay interest on the left over balance? Haven't worked that one out yet.
I guess there isn't any outstanding options broker for the oz market. They all have their advantages and disadvantages.
I had a look at Westpac from Grinder's suggestion.
Their fees seems to be better than Etrade but don't know what their service or platform is like.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hello again Toothyfish,

I guess you need to work out what you need, if you’re realistic about a bull put 50 times you’re probably going to be looking at a liquid series which will be a heavily traded contract, (XJO,BHP, Big 4 ect), that’s a pretty big contract so the ASX data fee won’t be of too much concern.

Regarding transfers, in my experiences an early morning initiation with have the money show up in your account by the same day, but I guess that depends on your bank.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Sorry Cutz, I Didn't answer your question.
I'm usually a spreader but don't adjust my positions much due to the slippage in the Oz market. It's also because i have been mainly using WOTM options which are very illiquid. I've only been trading options for 2 years. I have traded stocks for 10 years. Maybe I should be adjusting my position more often. I guess IB would be much better for that. 
I am interested in IB for the USA markets. But have to do some ground work.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Toothyfish, I have found IB is great for small quantities, but not necessarily the best for larger quantities - so it does pay to shop around. Don't forget that IB's $3 per contract includes the ACHs $1.12 per contract which the others don't usually include in their base fees.  If you are doing WOTMs in large quantities, possibly a percentage based fee might work better for you. 

If you are looking at the US, have a look at Think or Swim https://www.thinkorswim.com/tos/client/index.jsp.  They are options brokers and provide excellent options software (free) and great service.  There used to be some negotiation with their fees and I got the the minimum per leg amount waived - it's been a while since I signed up with them, so not sure if it's still the same.


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Anybody out there have knowledge or experience with a broker called Kinetic Securities. My main interest is ASX stock & options.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Toothyfish,

FWIW, for huge WOTM lots if that’s your style, commsec have a flat rate of $34.95 up to 10K in leg value not including OCH fees , they do allow unrestricted options configurations (obviously staying within margin limitations) and they do offer webiress which is a useful platform,  but they charge a higher brokerage rate than their normal 0.12% on assignments/exercise, I use them for positions I don’t really need to tweek.

Prefer IB because I like to play around with index options on a regular basis and with stock options I’m close to the money so my volumes aren’t huge.


----------



## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Toothyfish said:


> I had a look at Westpac from Grinder's suggestion.
> Their fees seems to be better than Etrade but don't know what their service or platform is like.




Im told customer service is of high quality & very efficient for quotes, problms etc.. & their platform is web based. Can aparently do multi legs all at once. I took another look at their commish, good if you do alot of size but the % amount could maake it very costly.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi,
Etrade is 0.55% comission and Westpac is 0.35%. So Westpac seems to be the cheapest for large size.
Comsec has the problem of not doing spreads online. You need to call them to do spreads which attract a higher comission.

Menage, I had a quick look at Kinetics but couldn't find their comission rate. 

I have to agree with Cutz that IB seems to be the best all round broker.
I'm also looking at stock futures on the www.onechicago market which IB does deal with.
I'm also looking at doing collars using futures and options.
Although this IB security card login is frustrating the crap out of me!


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks Toothyfish, I found a $90 charge for a full broker but couldnt find any charges for online either. I will give them a call tomorrow but fear the reply may be that you can only trade oprions via a broker. It is beggining to look like I might have to trade Oz via IB in the US. AS a born & bred Aussie bloke this just seems incredible to me. Memory tells me the min account balance at IB is about $10k if you want to trade options, is this correct. Also how does IB handle stop losses, when I am on a run & up around fib 1.62 or above I let the profit run & really tighten up my stop losses, I just keep moving them up following my profit etc, if IB charge per change fees could be astronomical.


----------



## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Toothyfish said:


> Hi,
> Etrade is 0.55% comission and Westpac is 0.35%. So Westpac seems to be the cheapest for large size.




It seems Westpac would work out to be one of the cheapest brokers if you were putting on spread trades with at least 20 cons per leg in size WOTM where the value is much cheaper, thus keeping you under their threshold before the 0.35% kicks in. That being said, with a % commision you would get stung much more than most brokers if you played CTM where the higher values are


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hey guys, I just spoke to Kinetic Securitirs, the online charge is $20 or 0.2% & if you utilize a full brokers services it is $35 or 0.35%. They use the IB trading platform & if I understood him correctly they are trying to become the Australian distributor for IB, he stated that if I was to have a problem on IB ring them & they will sort it out etc, they are in Sydney, I am in Perth however a 2 hour time difference is a lot better than a 12 hour difference. They didnt hit me up for min account balances ( yet) & dollars etc are held in an Oz bank which makes the entire account management thing a lot easier. 
I found kinetic on the internet & have nil knowledge of their reputation so if anybody has heard anything, good or bad, I would appreciate hearing about it.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Wow! 
That sounds almost too good to be true Menage. Will definitely have to have a closer look. Thanks for the tip.


----------



## cooper1308

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Toothyfish said:


> Wow!
> That sounds almost too good to be true Menage. Will definitely have to have a closer look. Thanks for the tip.




If you have any questions in regards to Kinetic feel free to PM

Those rates are cheaper if you are a high volume trader


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

cooper1308,

Sorry to sound daft, I am new to this forum & it looks like I dont have a handle on the lingo, yes i do have questions about Kinetic however what do you mean by PM you?


----------



## cooper1308

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Menage said:


> cooper1308,
> 
> Sorry to sound daft, I am new to this forum & it looks like I dont have a handle on the lingo, yes i do have questions about Kinetic however what do you mean by PM you?




Private Message... It's ok i'll shoot you one now, just check your inbox.

Cheers


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

....With the risk of being called lazy. 

I haven't been able to put a spread trade thru IB's Trader Workstation.
Do you have to do each leg of the spread manually? Is it possible to do a Bull Put spread and put a limit in the order of 20 cents?
Please just answer by saying that the platform does let you. I'll try to figure out the rest. 

Aplogies for taking up your time.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Yes it does, you need to enable the Combo button.


BTW, personally i prefer legging into aussie spreads due to the sometimes wide quotes but each to their own.( Obviously depends on what you're doing)


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Found it. Thanks Cutz. Was just being lazy.


----------



## cooper1308

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> Yes it does, you need to enable the Combo button.
> 
> 
> BTW, personally i prefer legging into aussie spreads due to the sometimes wide quotes but each to their own.( Obviously depends on what you're doing)




This is fine if you have an intra-day directional bias

However, MM's will charge you less in the way of spread if you combine all legs and trade as a combo. If the market stays exactly flat all day you will get a better fill as a combo as opposed to legging it.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cooper1308 said:


> This is fine if you have an intra-day directional bias
> 
> However, MM's will charge you less in the way of spread if you combine all legs and trade as a combo. If the market stays exactly flat all day you will get a better fill as a combo as opposed to legging it.




It really depends how greedy they are on the day - or whatever other technical name there is for it!  

When entering spreads, I like to have all market depth windows displayed (thank goodness for Iress with full MD!) and watch to see if I can do better by legging it.  On many occasions, I have ended up cancelling the combo and get a better price by working the order myself - most likely ended up trading with other retail traders.

That said, I usually try the combo first as I have had some good combo fills.  But if the MMs are obviously not interested or I spot a better opportunity to leg it, then I'm outta there.


----------



## cooper1308

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Yeah I had a beer with a couple of guys from IMC the other week. I asked the question they said they will always give better fills as a combo. Just the way their systems work.. 

Spot on sails.....if you are getting better fills it is almost certain that one or two of the legs is a retail punter. You can usually pick it's a retail trader if the stock darts around and the option price & volume stays static.... You'll usually only get this info from the individual legs...... very rare a retail punter is trading the exact opposite of your combo order.






sails said:


> It really depends how greedy they are on the day - or whatever other technical name there is for it!
> 
> When entering spreads, I like to have all market depth windows displayed (thank goodness for Iress with full MD!) and watch to see if I can do better by legging it.  On many occasions, I have ended up cancelling the combo and get a better price by working the order myself - most likely ended up trading with other retail traders.
> 
> That said, I usually try the combo first as I have had some good combo fills.  But if the MMs are obviously not interested or I spot a better opportunity to leg it, then I'm outta there.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cooper1308 said:


> Yeah I had a beer with a couple of guys from IMC the other week. I asked the question they said they will always give better fills as a combo. Just the way their systems work..
> 
> Spot on sails.....if you are getting better fills it is almost certain that one or two of the legs is a retail punter. You can usually pick it's a retail trader if the stock darts around and the option price & volume stays static.... You'll usually only get this info from the individual legs...... very rare a retail punter is trading the exact opposite of your combo order.




lol, did he need some beers to start talking?...

Very difficult to get much info from MMs.  Retired ones are generally more helpful.  Nevertheless, actions speak louder than words and much can be gained by persistent observation of what goes on. Probably not possible if only using IB who only give one line of market depth for options. 

Yes, I agree with you that it is rare for another retail trader to take the opposite side of a combo.  Once a combo order is generated in Iress, I can bring up the market depth for that unique combo using the temporary ASX code that has been assigned to it for the day.  Even on BHP, it is usually only me and the MMs  Sometimes a MM will pop into my combo MD with a counter offer - other times it's pretty bleak.  So, I watch the market depth like a hawk and will only move the combo price as far as I think is fair (plus a little to the MM so he can eat... ).  After that, I either walk away from the trade or will have a go at legging in if it's a closing order.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Once again, learnt the hard way. You should do your homework before switching brokers. 
I switched all my accounts over to Westpac broking thinking their options brokerage rates was cheapr 0.35%
Turns out you can only have 10 open put contracts. Covered or Naked!
The staff are really great and say they are trying to get this changed, but it's company policy at the moment.
IB Brokers, Here I come:1luvu:!


----------



## Grinder

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Don't be too hard on yourself, same thing happened to a guy I know that was or is with Westpac. He was under the impression that if he did more size he would be better off, but the .35% proved costly. Also said something about having to wait around till orders were approved or something, sounded like a whole lota nonsense to me. The big banks have no idea.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I found this link to broker comparisons if anyone is interested.

http://pi.infochoice.com.au/investment/onlinebroking/compare/tables/default.asp


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Can anyone let me know the margin requirements for IB Brokers on ASX Options. Is it like most brokers roughly being 2 X ACH requirements or is is more?

I'm new to IB brokers and am playing with their paper trading facility.
I tried doing a Bull put spread on RIO to work out margin requirements.
Sell 10 contracts $44.95   and Buy $10 contacts $44.16.

The trader workstation popped up

SELL 10 RIO Combo -0.385" YOUR ORDER IS NOT ACCEPTED. IN ORDER TO OBTAIN THE DESIRED POSITION YOUR EQUITY WITH LOAN VALUE [486686.40 AUD] MUST EXCEED THE INITIAL MARGIN [618936.16 AUD] 


The margin requirement for IB can't possibly that high?


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi toothyfish,

I suspect the margin requirements on that position is max loss.

When i put on my first spread with IB, that's what it came up as. Definitely less than OCH requirements by 2.

Don't ask me how to work out multiple positions/complex spreads thou, I leave that to the software.


----------



## Menage

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I am new to IB as well, dont know if your outlook on Rio is long or short however if you sell a Bull Put Spread you will be short??? Will the IB margin reduce if work if you buy the spread instead of selling it?


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Menage,
I was looking at a short position. If you buy the spread you would be in debit and probably not require a margin.

Thanks Cutz,
It's good to know that IB are sensible about their margins unlike some firms which require  2 x ACH even when it exceeds the maximum loss. Guess they are preparing for you to get pinned.

If the paper trading facility is anything like the real trading, it still won't let me process the order without very excessive margins though. Might have to contact them.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Still waiting for reply from IB. But whilst tinkering, I noticed when I place a combo spread that the margins are rediculously high. If I leg it in then the margin is much more reasonable.


----------



## Toothyfish

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

IB requires a $100,000US minimum portfolio to have an account that allows for lower margins. It's called a Margin portfolio account. 
Is this your experience Cutz?


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Toothyfish said:


> IB requires a $100,000US minimum portfolio to have an account that allows for lower margins. It's called a Margin portfolio account.
> Is this your experience Cutz?




G'Day Toothyfish,

I set up a Reg T margin account, it's satisfactory for my requirements.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Guys,

Any ASX traders out there been assigned on a short equity call, i wouldn't mind the  option being converted to a short stock like what happens in the US, but due to the lack availability of short stock here in oz i suspect i may have to buy the stock on the open the next day for delivery.

Any thoughts ?


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

From post #45


sails said:


> ... it looks like TWS only gives the first line of market depth.



Hi Sails,

I have found a non trivial way of getting market depth info from TWS. You may have heard of the TWS API. IB provides this API so that end users can customise or extend their TWS capabilities. I experimented with the Java version of the TWS API and managed to get the MD for options. 

There are quite a few steps involved eg. setting up the Java Development Environment, enabling the API in your TWS etc. It can be quite tedious. If you are interested, please feel free to ask me for details.

I've attached a sample MD of CBA Oct 50 call options.


Fox.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Fox said:


> From post #45
> 
> Hi Sails,
> 
> I have found a non trivial way of getting market depth info from TWS. You may have heard of the TWS API. IB provides this API so that end users can customise or extend their TWS capabilities. I experimented with the Java version of the TWS API and managed to get the MD for options.
> 
> There are quite a few steps involved eg. setting up the Java Development Environment, enabling the API in your TWS etc. It can be quite tedious. If you are interested, please feel free to ask me for details.
> 
> I've attached a sample MD of CBA Oct 50 call options.
> 
> 
> Fox.





Well done, Fox!  Certainly an improvement to the one line. 

I have API enabled in TWS, but not familiar with the JDE so might need some help there.  Once it's set up, does the MD update dynamically - or do you need to keep refreshing?

Also, is it only level 1 depth?  

One thing I really like with Iress is the "detail" button found in the options MD window which gives the entire MD (not just 5 lines) and also shows level 2 - showing the break up of orders at each level.  It doesn't update dynamically anymore.  It used to be readily available and updated dynamically when I first started trading options, but then the ASX in all their "wisdom" (need a sarcastic smiley here!) decided to cut it out and permitted no more than 5 levels of dynamic level 1 MD for options.  The excuse was something along the lines that no-one else has it.  Now, if they could take the same attitude with fees and slippage, I might have thought it was fair...


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> I have API enabled in TWS, but not familiar with the JDE so might need some help there.



I'm assuming that you are running the windows operating system.
The basic steps required are:
1. Download and install *JDK 6 Update 16* from http://java.sun.com/javase/downloads/index.jsp
2. Download the TWS API from http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en/p.php?f=programInterface&ib_entity=llc . Go to the *Proprietary API* tab and download the API. I'm using the latest *windows* version. 
3. Step 1 should have installed the java compiler *javac* somewhere in C:\ProgramFiles\Java\jdk .... But you'll need to get *javac* to run from a DOS command line. To do this, you'll need to set the *PATH* environment variable to point to the location of where *javac.exe* resides. I'll send you another post as to how to do this if you are stuck.
4. With *javac* is correctly setup, look for a batch file named *run.bat* in the *Java* sub-directory of where the TWS API was installed. Type *run* from the command line. This should compile and invoke the sample java application that gives you the MD. I'll send more details if you need more assistance.
5. If you get this far, click on the *Connect* button to connect the sample java application to TWS. Then click on the *Market Depth* button, fill in the option details and like magic, MD will be streaming to your screen.



sails said:


> Once it's set up, does the MD update dynamically - or do you need to keep refreshing?



Dynamic MD updates.



sails said:


> Also, is it only level 1 depth?



I think level 1 only. The TWS API provides functions to request for level 2 as well, but it did not seem to be invoked by the sample application. To be honest, I don't know what level 2 depth looks like. So, I'm not really sure if it is provided or not.


----------



## wayneL

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Impressive stuff Fox.

I'll have a at this sometime... expect pathetic pleas for help.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Wayne, Sails,

Fire away with any questions you may have. More than happy to help. This is the least I can do, after all the generosity you have shown me and others in this forum. 



> 1. Download and install JDK 6 Update 16 from http://java.sun.com/javase/downloads/index.jsp



My Java Development Kit, JDK was installed in *C:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.6.0_10*



> 2. Download the TWS API from http://www.interactivebrokers.com/en...&ib_entity=llc . Go to the Proprietary API tab and download the API. I'm using the latest windows version.



http://www.interactivebrokers.com/download/JavaAPIGettingStarted.pdf is helpful if you need a guide.
My TWS was installed in *C:\IB_API_9_62\Java*



> 3. Step 1 should have installed the java compiler javac somewhere in C:\ProgramFiles\Java\jdk .... But you'll need to get javac to run from a DOS command line. To do this, you'll need to set the PATH environment variable to point to the location of where javac.exe resides. I'll send you another post as to how to do this if you are stuck.



This web page will help you with setting the PATH variable: http://www.computerhope.com/issues/ch000549.htm 
Add the line *;C:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.6.0_10\bin* to your PATH. Do not forget the semi colon at the start of the line.

Eg.
C:\Program Files;C:\Winnt;C:\Winnt\System32*;C:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.6.0_10\bin*



> 4. With javac correctly setup, look for a batch file named run.bat in the Java sub-directory of where the TWS API was installed. Type run from the command line. This should compile and invoke the sample java application that gives you the MD. I'll send more details if you need more assistance.



When you invoke *javac *from the DOS command line, you should see:



		Code:
	

C:\Documents and Settings\LS>javac
Usage: javac <options> <source files>
where possible options include:
  -g                         Generate all debugging info
  -g:none                    Generate no debugging info
  -g:{lines,vars,source}     Generate only some debugging info
  -nowarn                    Generate no warnings


I'll put the screen shots for a sample CBA option MD request parameters in the next post.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Example of request parameters for CBA Oct Call $50 options.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks Fox - it is impressive!  I have had a few other things on the go this afternoon & evening - so will print out your instructions tomorrow and follow them through carefully.  More than likely will be a few more questions... 

Is this the correct java version (build 1.6.0_15-b03)?  If so, that's already installed and running.

You mentioned you haven't seen 2nd level of MD - if you have Iress, open up a MD window for something liquid - eg BHP or XJO, front Month, at-the-money call or put.  Click on the "detail" button and a new window pops up - that's level 2.  That said, I haven't been trading the Oz market for a few weeks and I'm not paying for Iress at the moment.  So I am assuming they haven't removed the "detail" function while my back has been turned!  If you don't have it, maybe Cutz or someone else with Iress can post a screen shot of it.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> Is this the correct java version (build 1.6.0_15-b03)?  If so, that's already installed and running.



If I'm not mistaken, the java you are referring to is probably the *Java Runtime Environment* (JRE). What you need to build and run the sample application is the *Java Development Kit *(JDK). By installing the JDK, you will get the file *C:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.6.0_10\bin\javac.exe*. This is the java compiler, which is the tool you need, to build the sample java application that gives us the MD. Hope I'm making sense.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Wayne/Sails,

If setting up the JDK is too much hassle, you can use the C++ API instead of the Java API. The sample application for the C++ API is already pre-built and you therefore do not need to set up any development kits. Here's how to go about it.
1. Access http://www.interactivebrokers.com/download/GettingStartedC++API.pdf
2. Pages 23-26 provide detailed instructions to set up the test application and configure your TWS.
3. If you succeed with step 3 of page 26, you should have the C++ API sample application running.
4. Chapter 6 shows you how to connect the sample application to the TWS.
5. Chapter 8 shows you how to obtain MD.

Good luck. If you have any problems with the GettingStartedC++API.pdf guide, just refer the page and I'll see if I can help. I have not verified the MD for the C++ API sample application because the Oz market is not open yet as I write this post, but I strongly suspect that it will work too.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



Fox said:


> If I'm not mistaken, the java you are referring to is probably the *Java Runtime Environment* (JRE). What you need to build and run the sample application is the *Java Development Kit *(JDK). By installing the JDK, you will get the file *C:\Program Files\Java\jdk1.6.0_10\bin\javac.exe*. This is the java compiler, which is the tool you need, to build the sample java application that gives us the MD. Hope I'm making sense.




Thanks for sorting that one out, Fox!  I will try your original instructions first and see how I go.  Have to go out for a little while soon, and then hopefully (fingers crossed) I can have some time - I would really like to try this out...


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I've just checked out the Excel version of the TWS API. It is even easier to setup and use, and is targeted for non-programmers. Instructions are here:

http://www.interactivebrokers.com/download/DdeForExcelApiGettingStarted.pdf

I'll post a screen shot of MD when market opens.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

C++ and Excel TWS API Screen Shot


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Haha - was all set to have a go at this but forgot that IB shuts down over the weekend.

I already use TWSDDE in excel for downloading historical data from IB, so hopefully it won't be any more difficult than that for my fairly basic excel skills.

Thanks again for your detailed posts, Fox.  Your effort much appreciated...


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Fox,

OK, the excel spreadsheet seems to be working - will know for sure when the MMs decide to start work for the day...

But where do you find the other windows in the image you posted?  They are the ones above excel spreadsheet.  On second thought, that might be because I didn't load up the samples.  I simply used my existing TWSDDE spreadsheet that I set up some months ago to get historical data.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> But where do you find the other windows in the image you posted?  They are the ones above excel spreadsheet.



Good morning Sails,

I have been discussing the 3 flavours of the TWS API, namely the Java, C++ and Excel varieties. The images of windows above the image of the excel spreadsheet that you refer to, are from the C++ flavour of the TWS API. 

If you are keen to try them out, the steps to set it up are in post #116. The application is called *C:\IB_API_9_62\TestSocketClient\Release\client2.exe*.

Oz market opening soon. You should be seeing MD on your TWSDDE soon. Fingers crossed. 

Fox


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Thanks Fox!  BHP stock MD is updating dynamically and so far just one line of BHP 37 Oct call options.  Will see if more lines show up as the day progresses for the option.  

OK - will read your other instructions.  Maybe they aren't necessary at this stage, will check it out anyway!


----------



## freebird54

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Forgive my simplicity but I just have multiple pc screens with Westpac or any other market depth /last 10 trades open

Of course the market "makers" [read manipulators] hover with their automated entry or whatever they do [maybe someone can explain why there are always 10 or 11 orders in the market depth and as soon as you go on they all change] to drag you up/down anyway so having the information is of limited value

After waiting all day to get set so many times I often  put an order between the bid / ask if it is similar to the last trade and get filled immediately;-)

I then can go on to enjoy my day

I also see with IB you can place an order where the option bid/ask you enter moves relative to the underlying - does anyone know how this can be calculated easily?

Comments welcome on this


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

TWS doesn't always get Oz dividends amount correct and this consequently distorts IV calculations.  So, it is advisable to check the dividend amount in TWS and change/save if incorrect.

Here is a link to a recent discussion in another thread that I thought might be helpful to someone else down the track and is certainly applicable to this thread:  https://www.aussiestockforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=505751#post505751.  
The posts in this discussion range from #481 - #487


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



freebird54 said:


> After waiting all day to get set so many times I often  put an order between the bid / ask if it is similar to the last trade and get filled immediately;-)
> 
> I then can go on to enjoy my day




If I am reading your question correctly, yes, it can sometimes work quite well.  If you see another trade go through, it is possible that you could get the same price.  Just make sure though you know you are inside some sort of fair pricing and that the last trade hasn't just ripped off another retail trader!

It's a bit risky just looking at the last price traded (unless it is close to the mid price) because it could be one leg of a spread order that's just gone through - and it may be the worst priced leg of the spread. 

That said, I have often found that by immediately placing an order slightly in favour of the MM, it is often filled quite quickly.  But that's no guarantee.  I have also seen them ignore that - they want a bigger bite of my money!  If it's an opening order, I quit and move on to another trade. If adjusting, I would look at doing so with stock - so they miss out altogether.



> I also see with IB you can place an order where the option bid/ask you enter moves relative to the underlying - does anyone know how this can be calculated easily?
> 
> Comments welcome on this




I haven't done this, so hopefully someone else will answer your question on the mechanics of setting this up.  

However, if the MM wants a bigger slice of the spread, I can't see how bobbing around at the same amount within the MM spread is going to help get a fill unless another retail trader wants to take the opposite side and is happy to pay a little extra to get a better fill than the MMs are going to give.

Hope that makes sense!


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi Guys,

I've just started using risk navigator which by the way is a beautiful piece of equipment. Total greeks for each position and underlying are laid out in an easy to read format so i don't need to play around with risk graphs as much.

Problem I'm having at the moment is as I move positions around during the day the underlying contracts that are closed off are not removed from the table unless i do a system restart.

Anyone here got a tip on how to remove closed positions quickly.


Thanks in advance.


----------



## cutz

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

Hi guys, 

For info my above query has been resolved. Suspend/Resume does it.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> For info my above query has been resolved. Suspend/Resume does it.



That's handy to know. Thanks.


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



cutz said:


> I've just started using risk navigator ...



Does anyone know how to display the Profit and Loss graph of the risk navigator, in dollar amounts, as of today and at expiry like that shown in Hoadley P&L graphs?


----------



## Fox

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

*Reg T Margin*
Here's a tip that I got from IB customer support. I asked how I can find out what my Reg T Margin requirement WILL BE before I transmitted my order. The reply was that you can't know what your Reg T Margin will be until the order is executed. How pathetic.

The work around that they proposed is cumbersome but can be done. IB proposed that I placed the identical trade in my paper trading account and then watch the Reg T Margin figure change.

For those interested, I tried their suggestion out. For an XJO single contract bull put, the margin is:



		Code:
	

Reg T Margin = (sold strike - put strike) * 10.

NB. 10 being the XJO index multiplier.

For a 4000/4500 bull put, the Reg T Margin = (4500 - 4000)*10 = $5000.


----------



## sails

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*

I noticed the message below that popped up in my demo account, but it doesn't come up when trading option orders.  

IMO, the same protection should be there for option orders to prevent MMs stripping cash out of retail trader's accounts by trading one leg of a spread at prices way beyond the bid/ask spread which is neither fair nor consistent.


----------



## freebird54

*Re: Interactive Brokers and Options trading in OZ*



sails said:


> If I am reading your question correctly, yes, it can sometimes work quite well.  If you see another trade go through, it is possible that you could get the same price.  Just make sure though you know you are inside some sort of fair pricing and that the last trade hasn't just ripped off another retail trader!
> 
> It's a bit risky just looking at the last price traded (unless it is close to the mid price) because it could be one leg of a spread order that's just gone through - and it may be the worst priced leg of the spread.
> 
> That said, I have often found that by immediately placing an order slightly in favour of the MM, it is often filled quite quickly.  But that's no guarantee.  I have also seen them ignore that - they want a bigger bite of my money!  If it's an opening order, I quit and move on to another trade. If adjusting, I would look at doing so with stock - so they miss out altogether.
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't done this, so hopefully someone else will answer your question on the mechanics of setting this up.
> 
> However, if the MM wants a bigger slice of the spread, I can't see how bobbing around at the same amount within the MM spread is going to help get a fill unless another retail trader wants to take the opposite side and is happy to pay a little extra to get a better fill than the MMs are going to give.
> 
> Hope that makes sense!




Nearly a year later and it still seems to work the same - no big problems - also using IB spreads for rolling options


----------



## Kryzz

Is anyone able to clarify how to buy just straight put options in IB?? Not sure if I am confusing myself or not, but am finding this rather frustrating.

This screenshot is from Commsec, are these options available in IB? I can't seem to be able to search for them?

Hoping to avoid paying $35 in brokerage via commsec.

Thanks


----------



## cutz

Kryzz said:


> Is anyone able to clarify how to buy just straight put options in IB?? Not sure if I am confusing myself or not, but am finding this rather frustrating.
> 
> This screenshot is from Commsec, are these options available in IB? I can't seem to be able to search for them?
> 
> Hoping to avoid paying $35 in brokerage via commsec.
> 
> Thanks




Try "AP"


----------



## sails

Kryzz said:


> Is anyone able to clarify how to buy just straight put options in IB?? Not sure if I am confusing myself or not, but am finding this rather frustrating.
> 
> This screenshot is from Commsec, are these options available in IB? I can't seem to be able to search for them?
> 
> Hoping to avoid paying $35 in brokerage via commsec.
> 
> Thanks




Yes you can get XJO options in IB.  As Cutz said, type AP into a watch screen then choose "options" and select what you want.  You can also use "option trader" and type in AP as the security and then select expiries and strikes with the drop down boxes.

IB have archived webinars on their software which you might find helpful.


----------



## Kryzz

Got it. Thanks guys.

Will you not be to view the last trade price in IB, comparing this screenshot to the comsec one? Or am I missing something.


NB: Will get onto the webinar soon also.


----------



## freebird54

Seneca60BC said:


> Hi All
> 
> Anyone here use IB to trade options in the aussie market.  If so what feedback do you have ?  The rates seem quite appealing, but before I sign up Id like to know what your thoughts are with options trading via IB.
> 
> Cheers!




No problems at all
free data from w/pac or c/sec so u dont have to use theirs
2 platforms both good
If u r on the gold coast there is a free seminar on option trading through AIE - I can give you the links

yes I use them


----------

