# Nuisance Tree - Any Suggestions?



## Julia (10 November 2008)

A neighbour has a massive gum tree (about 200ft) in small backyard.

It sheds thousands of leaves into my pool, throughout the garden and lawns and blocks up the gutters, preventing rainwater flowing through to the tanks unless the gutters are cleared out every few days.

I've written a very polite letter, explaining the difficulties, and asking for at least some of the height of the tree to be reduced, offering to contribute to the cost.  No answer.

Went to the Justice Dept and asked them to set up a mediation.  They attempted to do this with two letters to the tree owner.  Likewise no reply.
Nothing more they can do.

This morning when I walked past on the way home, the owner was in the front of the house so I politely asked if I could speak with her.  She just walked away.

In case someone suggests poisoning the tree, that's out of the question because (a) the owner would assume I had done it, and (b) there is no way of getting access as they are home all the time and have a very noisy and vicious dog.

There is a law which says no homeowner/property may interfere with another homeowner's right to enjoy their property.   To get this enforced would - I'm advised by a lawyer - require applying to the District Court in Brisbane, and the employing of a barrister (!) at a cost of not less than $10,000.

Sounds completely ridiculous, and I'd run the risk of not getting costs awarded if the case was unsuccessful.

Has anyone had a similar situation ?
Any suggestions of anything more that we can do?


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## nunthewiser (10 November 2008)

Julia said:


> A neighbour has a massive gum tree (about 200ft) in small backyard.
> 
> It sheds thousands of leaves into my pool, throughout the garden and lawns and blocks up the gutters, preventing rainwater flowing through to the tanks unless the gutters are cleared out every few days.
> 
> ...





Dark night , cordless drill , roundup........ 
be sure to keep some of the drill shavings mixed with a lil dirt to rub onto hole s afterwards


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## prawn_86 (10 November 2008)

When she goes away get a heavy duty chainsaw and make sure you cut it so it falls on her house...


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## Julia (10 November 2008)

Thank you both for these suggestions.  I was actually hoping for something a little more realistic/genuine.


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## Nyden (10 November 2008)

Perhaps this can be of assistance?



> Overhanging branches
> You can lop off overhanging branches of a neighbour’s tree if the branches are causing a nuisance. You should not trespass on the neighbour’s land to do this. However, any branches you lop off belong to them and they cannot refuse to take the branches back if you are unable or unwilling to dispose of them.
> 
> Generally, your neighbour is not obliged to share the cost of hiring someone to remove the branches if they are too big or too high for you to cut down.




http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/1036.htm

 ... unless of course it's just wind blowing leaves over from a very tall tree? Perhaps constructing some sort of fly-mesh fence could resolve this ... if the neighbour refuses any sort of compromise, that is.


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## Absolutely (10 November 2008)

Well just the threat of legal action might be enough to get some response. A stern letter from a solicitor, referencing the relevant law, and threatening in nature, at the cost of three or four hundred dollars might do the trick.

Or it might not too.......


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## spooly74 (10 November 2008)

The roots of a tree that size may very well be causing structural damage to your property ie. driveway, walls (internal and external).

If so, hit her up with the costs for repair and she may change her view.
If not, some petrol at the base will do the trick ....you'll only have to pick up the leaves once more after that.


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## nunthewiser (10 November 2008)

Julia said:


> Thank you both for these suggestions.  I was actually hoping for something a little more realistic/genuine.




i was being realistic julia .... a person i know had the same problem with an offending neihbour with a Huge radiata pine tree shedding its stuff in the pool etc , fella had it right on the boundary and it pushed over the fence also the roots pushed up the pavers etc 

neihbour refused to do a thing 

too expensive legally so the tree died 

might not be everyones cup of tee but sometimes these situations turn into storys beyond belief

was kinda fortunate that certain varieties of pines often get a virus/disease that can kill them over a very short time frame and i dare say the fella with the cordless drill was very clever in where he drilled some holes .

sorry if this isnt what u wanted to hear just relaying a tale i heard down the pub once


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## gav (10 November 2008)

Absolutely said:


> Well just the threat of legal action might be enough to get some response. A stern letter from a solicitor, referencing the relevant law, and threatening in nature, at the cost of three or four hundred dollars might do the trick.
> 
> Or it might not too.......




I believe this would be the only way to go Julia.  Also mention in the letter what Spooly74 said.  Having neighbours like that is not nice at all.

My parents just evicted the tennant from hell and moved into their house, only to find out that tennant moved in next door.  His horse constantly gets on my parents property, and he often makes threats to my Dad.  I would never do anything to the horse, as its not the horses fault.

Unfortunately the police wont do anything until something more serious happens.  But having the appropriate authorities in the loop will help you down the track if something more sinister comes of it (in your case, tree roots damaging your property)


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## arco (10 November 2008)

Julia

We had a very large pine in our garden which died after the construction of a new driveway on the next door neighbours plot. (Apparently some major roots were severed so the tree did not survive).

You may be within your rights to sever any roots that are in your garden.

arco


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## Happy (10 November 2008)

You might have better case if there is also danger of falling branch on your house?
Damage from tree roots mentioned above definitely can be used in claim for compensation.

While ago in NSW you could remove roots from offending neighbours tree to a depth of 30 cm as well as you could remove overhanging branches (at cost to you, except when tree was declared protected specimen for some reason: age, type of tree).

I heard that some chemicals for other applications might not be beneficial to plants.
Not sure if gum tree is in this bracket, but excessive fertiliser can actually make some trees up to no good.

Somebody told me that faulty swimming pool pump might accidentally contaminate surrounding soil with chlorine or other chemicals used to make water softer or harder.


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## cuttlefish (10 November 2008)

Difficult situation.   A large dead gum tree isn't much fun either  (and most of the suggestions involve criminal acts anyway).

Its a pity they won't speak with you - getting some sort of dialogue where you can calmly discuss how the tree is affecting you and whether they can see any compromise to dealing with it would be the ideal.

Maybe you could look for a professional mediator and see if they can be hired to broach the issue with the neighbour to try to organise a discussion/dialogue.  It might be cheaper than a barrister and a pre-cursor to the heavy expensive process of legal action. 

A good professional mediator should be able to conduct a constructive discussion that lets the neighbour understand your viewpoint and issues without letting it get to a slanging match or too much defensiveness.  

I've never really looked into it but I have a vague idea that there are a lot of law firms that will offer a mediation service.  They might be able to approach the neighbour on your behalf and set up an open, non-binding mediated dialogue.    The local council might also be able to provide the name of experienced mediators in the area as well.

Its a pity about the leaves and lack of space because it sounds like a lovely tree but I can understand it being frustrating.  Large gums near houses are also a bit of a liability in high winds.


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## agro (10 November 2008)




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## arco (10 November 2008)

From A-Level Law in Action
By Brenda Mothersole, Ann Ridley

May apply


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## sammy84 (10 November 2008)

Fight fire with fire. Make her come to you. I suggest you leave the stereo on very loud when you leave the house, this way she might come over to your place asking you to turn it down. Then the negotiating can begin


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## gfresh (10 November 2008)

They probably enjoy the tree and the shelter / shade it provides, and therefore see no reason to cut down a perfectly nice tree due to the inconvenience to somebody else. Surely the leaves also fall onto their roof as well? 

I used to live in semi-bushland with similar problems, there are gutter protection things that willl prevent the leaves in the gutter being such a problem. Pool covers also prevent evaporation and can capture any leaves falling in your pool. 

Sometimes helps to see it from their perspective as well, and just be the stronger person. No, I don't live next door to you


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## arco (10 November 2008)

.
Garden Law Discussion Forum

http://www.gardenlaw.co.uk/phpBB2/index.php?sid=ec6fae55e5cec0dfad631e62b840f952


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## Whiskers (10 November 2008)

Julia, I think there's a cheaper way to deal with it. I'm sorta surprised the lawyer didn't know/suggest that the inital responsibility for policing tree vegetation falls with the Local Authority, in your case I think it is the Fraser Coast Regional Council.

Apparently there have been no specific Laws made since Amalgamation so it may be the case that a previous Maryborough City Council Law applies: Maryborough City Council Local Law 43 - _Vegetation Management 2006_, Ammended 2/05/2006  http://www.lgp.qld.gov.au/applications/LocalLawSearch/quickSearch/quickSearchResults/default.asp

To make a strong case and to put leverage and responsibility for any subsequent damage from the tree on the Council, you should also mention the building code wind force catagory rating for the area, risk of cyclonic winds and rain (apparently predicted to be higher this summer) as well as any dieback dead branches, etc that may suggest whiteants or rot in the centre of the tree.

Section 31 Hazardous Vegetation PDF. http://www.lgp.qld.gov.au/applicati...Vegetation Management 2006 LL_res02-05-06.pdf


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## ColB (10 November 2008)

Hi Julia,

How long has the tree been there?  I guess along time if its nearly 200ft tall.  

Trying to get it removed because it is dangerous or might fall over is probably a shallow argument unless it is obviously diseased as it has stood up okay until now.  

I would think your best chance of getting some action is to *determine if there is any damage that has or is likely to occur as a result of its root system invading your property*.  And if this is the case try and use the council to do your dirty work so it doesn't cost you anything.

You obviously have a problem neighbour if they won't even talk to you.  It couldn't be your fault because we all at ASF know you're okay.

As a qualified landscape gardener (and failed share investor!!) I have been pretty impressed with some of the solutions to your dilemna.  

Nunthewisers suggestion to drill into the trunk, insert some roundup and carefully patch up with the dirt/saw dust mixture leads me to think he's a professional arborist/terrorist that has done it before.  

The only problem is, that the tree will still need to be removed.  

Shame about the vicious dog!!  I do know someone with a directional drilling rig so that it can be done from your side of the fence!

Good Luck!  CB


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## Gundini (10 November 2008)

Option 1: I would put a massive net, like they have at a golf driving range, and funnel the leaves back into her house.

Option 2: Freeze up  a container of round up. Throw the cubes over their fence at night. Put the house on the market. By the time you sell your house, their lawn would be ruined. Take a scrapper to aid, and on the way out of the driveway, drop one prawn head in between the rubber of their car windows, and bid farewell...


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## roland (10 November 2008)

Julia, If it were at all possible, I would gladly donate my mother's 50 year Liquid Amber tree so you could have something to fight back with. Not only does it drop all it's leaves, but also drops these horrible spiky seed pods.

It has been the bane of her life, or the saviour with all that exercise in raking she is still very active - 70 something now.

If the leaves were not raked up you would be litterally knee deep in leaves with 2 weeks during the autumn/winter.

Check out the pic to see how it dominates her back yard.


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## Whiskers (10 November 2008)

Julia, the old Hervey Bay City Council equivilant, although not worded as precisely may be; (CONTROL OF NUISANCES) LOCAL LAW NO. 15 http://www.lgp.qld.gov.au/applicati...erv/15_Control of Nuisances LL_res19-5-99.pdf

Section 15 Overgrown allotments, s19 Miscellaneous nuisances, s28 Local Government's power to have work carried out and s29 Powers of entry and cost recovery.

The Council should have some Local Law covering dangerous trees and in any case if you make the proper written complaint it should shift the Common Law liability onto the council if they don't take approperiate action.

Seems like you've got one obstonate neighbour that has no appreciation of the danger of gum trees in close promixity to houses. They are a tough tree when young and healthy, but as they mature they are more brittle and prone to dieback and internal decay. In the bush they are approached with caution by professional timbercutters because of their tendancy to drop bits of dead branches on top of them as they start to fall... coined 'widow makers'.

An Aunty had a similar situation with a Housing Commision house backing onto her with a big gum tree near the back fence. The Housing Commision removed the tree and gave her a new privacy fence into the bargain.

Last year I had a bunch of three tall trees inter-twined with dead branches overhanging my fence on a rural block. The neighbour and his wifes father (turned out to be a professional timbercutter) and I just arranged a little working bee to cut them down and he got some fence posts out of it as well.


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## nunthewiser (10 November 2008)

ColB said:


> Nunthewisers suggestion to drill into the trunk, insert some roundup and carefully patch up with the dirt/saw dust mixture leads me to think he's a professional arborist/terrorist that has done it before.
> 
> The only problem is, that the tree will still need to be removed.
> 
> ...




 nose nuffing 

the onus on the dead tree removal is on the owner of the tree by the way 

also it can be done via the root system IF the roots are inside your yard 

cordless drill , roundup and a lil bit of love and care in patching up the nasty little holes them borers produced


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## nunthewiser (10 November 2008)

personally tho as a law abiding pillar of society i would suggest having a read of whiskers quality research and maybe following that path first


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## Wysiwyg (10 November 2008)

Julia said:


> Any suggestions of anything more that we can do?




The tree (at 200 ft. tall) may be 100`s of years old and would be a damned typical sad act to cut it down.Of course if I bought next door to this unique tree I would wonder what sort of life it had, the humans that  came and went during its life and the humans that will come and go in its future. 

I would also approach the neighbours and invite them over for tea & biscuits or a few ales and find out if they are nice people or just typical whinging, whining, selfish suburban nobs.


Long live the eucalypt.(and its inhabitants)


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## numbercruncher (10 November 2008)

Julia said:


> A neighbour has a massive gum tree (about 200ft) in small backyard.
> 
> It sheds thousands of leaves into my pool, throughout the garden and lawns and blocks up the gutters, preventing rainwater flowing through to the tanks unless the gutters are cleared out every few days.
> 
> ...






Heya Julia .....


Her ignoring your polite and fair request makes me wonder ....... it seems a bit irrational considering the circumstances ....

So im thinking maybe this woman has no spare money ? is she elderley scraping by on the pension ? she might be stressed about how she will come up with the cash ..... You know a few hundred maybe little to you and I but to someone getting 230 a week gov penion with no savings it could be a very daunting figure ....

Maybe you could try a new approach that you will pay all the removal/trimming costs - it will surely end up being free eventually when you weigh up the costs of cleaning pool and gutter over and over ?

Just a thought ..... she may even offer to pay part if her budget so allows .....


Cheers


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## sammy84 (10 November 2008)

Gundini said:


> Option 2: Freeze up  a container of round up. Throw the cubes over their fence at night.




You might kill the dog......


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## awg (10 November 2008)

Hi Julia,

you are in a difficult position.

unless the tree is actually damaging part of your property such as pipes, not merely an inconvenience, there is very little you can do.

the council will not involve themselves

the cost of removal of such a tree would be several thousand dollars

your neighbour is not obliged 

you are legally allowed to cut off any branch that overhangs your property, but first you would need approval from council, as it is a native tree!

If, by pruning the tree on your side, you destabilised it, and it later fell, you could have a legal problem yourself.

I have seen this situation several times.

I have a tree that a neighbour does not like, even though it is not overly large, he is very fussy. (A Red cedar, it drops leaves)

I previously removed a larger tree at my own expense, because I considered it may fall in the event of a large storm ( a Eucalypt)


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## Julia (10 November 2008)

ColB said:


> Hi Julia,
> 
> How long has the tree been there?  I guess along time if its nearly 200ft tall.



It was planted as a seedling about 2ft high only 15 years ago.  This gives an indication of how fast it grows.  My tree pruner says it can easily grow another 100 feet or more.  



> I would think your best chance of getting some action is to *determine if there is any damage that has or is likely to occur as a result of its root system invading your property*.  And if this is the case try and use the council to do your dirty work so it doesn't cost you anything.



As far as I know the roots are not affecting my property.  It's the height of the tree and the fact that the prevailing wind blows all the leaves my way.
The Council say they have no jurisdiction over trees on private property.
They will only intervene, they say, once a falling limb has done damage to a neighbouring property, e.g. caused a roof to be destroyed.



> You obviously have a problem neighbour if they won't even talk to you.  It couldn't be your fault because we all at ASF know you're okay.



Thank you for that vote of confidence.  I have indeed been very polite.
Perhaps this is the problem.  A threatening lawyer's letter might have more effect.  



> As a qualified landscape gardener (and failed share investor!!) I have been pretty impressed with some of the solutions to your dilemna.
> 
> Nunthewisers suggestion to drill into the trunk, insert some roundup and carefully patch up with the dirt/saw dust mixture leads me to think he's a professional arborist/terrorist that has done it before.



Perhaps so.  But that is illegal, it would involve trespass, if the tree subsequently died and I was questioned about any involvement, I'm a hopeless liar.   Anyway, trying to climb the fence and carry out this measure would probably have me torn apart by their dog.    



> I do know someone with a directional drilling rig so that it can be done from your side of the fence!



Interesting.  How does that work?



Whiskers said:


> Julia, the old Hervey Bay City Council equivilant, although not worded as precisely may be; (CONTROL OF NUISANCES) LOCAL LAW NO. 15 http://www.lgp.qld.gov.au/applicati...erv/15_Control of Nuisances LL_res19-5-99.pdf
> 
> Section 15 Overgrown allotments, s19 Miscellaneous nuisances, s28 Local Government's power to have work carried out and s29 Powers of entry and cost recovery.
> 
> ...



Whiskers, I've spoken with the bloke who is in charge of tree for Hervey Bay.
He advised that they have no jurisdiction over any tree in any privately owned property. Thank you for posting the section about overgrown allotments.  The council tell me this applies to low vegetation such as would be considered a risk for harbouring vermin.  Therefore the tree does not come under this legislation.



> An Aunty had a similar situation with a Housing Commision house backing onto her with a big gum tree near the back fence. The Housing Commision removed the tree and gave her a new privacy fence into the bargain.



  Dealing with the Housing Commission is a whole different ball game than dealing with difficult private individuals.




Wysiwyg said:


> The tree (at 200 ft. tall) may be 100`s of years old and would be a damned typical sad act to cut it down.



It's only 15 years old.  Certainly it would be a nice enough tree in the countryside or even in a park.  But not in a very small backyard in suburbia!



> Of course if I bought next door to this unique tree I would wonder what sort of life it had, the humans that  came and went during its life and the humans that will come and go in its future.



Well, that's a charming picture, but it was planted subsequent to my building my house and has been no problem until it attained its present height.
You are romanticising a very crappy problem.



> I would also approach the neighbours and invite them over for tea & biscuits or a few ales and find out if they are nice people or just typical whinging, whining, selfish suburban nobs.



Did you read my original post?  They won't even speak to me.  They don't speak to anyone.  When they first came there were violent, drunken fights every night.  Over the last few years this has stopped.



> Long live the eucalypt.(and its inhabitants)



Oh God!



numbercruncher said:


> Heya Julia .....
> 
> 
> Her ignoring your polite and fair request makes me wonder ....... it seems a bit irrational considering the circumstances ....
> ...



No, NC, she is a wealthy woman and owns several properties.
Moreover, she complained to her other neighbour that their jasmine (which flowers for only a couple of weeks once a week) gave her hay fever when it flowered and would they please remove it.   They did.
And anyway, I said that I had suggested to her I would be more than happy to contribute to the cost.  I don't even want the damn tree removed, just the height reduced.



sammy84 said:


> You might kill the dog......



Believe me, Sammy, that would be doing the world a favour.
However, she would undoubtedly return the favour and I love my dog too much to take that risk.


Many thanks to everyone who has made helpful and constructive suggestions.  It's really appreciated.  

Sounds as though the lawyer's letter might be the best next option.

Qld govt is mooting "neighbourhood courts' to cover just this sort of thing where attendance will be compulsory if one party has a complaint.

It's the obvious situation for mediation, but this is at present voluntary.
As I mentioned, I have attempted to arrange this through the Justice Dept's Medication Service.   They have approached her twice but she has simply refused to reply.

Believe me, I'd just love to go the chainsaw or poison way, but it's not a practical proposition, i.e. the tree is in the middle of their backyard.  I would have to climb the fence (probably into the jaws of the dog) and risk being caught in the act.  Just not on.


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## milothedog (10 November 2008)

Julia 

Your suggestion of reducing the height of the offending tree will only create greater problems.  The tree will not stop growing, obviously.  What will happen is the bifurcation of the tree trunk...multiple trunks from the cut area.  These bifurcated branches will be much more prone to splitting as the growth is distorted from the main trunk.  It is a very bad idea to treat any single trunk tree in such a manner.  By the way, it is unlikely (not impossible, as I do not know the variety) to reach 300 ft in height in a suburban setting...that would put in the class of some of the tallest trees in the world...

Loves trees here...welcome to suburbia.


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## trillionaire#1 (11 November 2008)

Julia,at my last property ,i had a couple of beautiful healthy gums that were,suddenly attacked by a borer type insect ,killed the trees dead in a flash.
solution?,research suitable gum wrecking insects,locate...er somewere,and
throw handfuls of specimens at the trees base.


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## Julia (11 November 2008)

Trillionaire, thank you.  Will do some research.

Btw, I made a mistake when talking about the jasmine that offended the tree owner:



> Moreover, she complained to her other neighbour that their jasmine (which flowers for only a couple of weeks once a week) gave her hay fever when it flowered and would they please remove it. They did.




That should have read *flowered just once a year for a couple of weeks.*


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## Gundini (11 November 2008)

sammy84 said:


> You might kill the dog......




Yeah,  forgot about the dog


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## awg (11 November 2008)

Hi again Julia,

                     You are almost certainly wasting your time and money sending a legal letter.

Owner is not obliged to do anything, and is likely to make them become even more hostile and unco-operative.

Having a hateful neighbour is much worse than some leaves, and you will still have the tree problem.

I have seen what can happen, you definately do not want to aggravate someone when you hold losing cards!

you could try planting said jasmines, then use that as a negotiating tool!

You may be better off spending the money on leaf guards for your gutters.

My only other suggestion, which I mentioned to a policeman friend of mine, is to shoot the dog, the owner and poison the tree, then torch the lot.

If you drive thru the leafy upper class suburbs of North Sydney, you will see huge numbers of massive gums, I imagine causes some disagreements.

I believe tree issues are a major bane of council officers ( friend of mine is council officer, they wont do a thing, if they are not fully obliged to, they stay out of it)

I can only reiterate, dont aggravate a difficult neighbour on an issue you cannot win, they can make your life absolute hell (watch today tonight etc).

If I had my time again, I would never plant large trees on my property


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## Agentm (11 November 2008)

sounds like your harrassing your neighbor big time, you wouldnt be doing it to me thats for sure!

what right have you to approach them after the pressure you have applied already, and why not first talk, then send letters later?  pretty weird sequencing of events.. if i was your neighbour i would have my solicitor send you a letter about the harassment.  leave them alone, and if you have any rights to have someone elses tree being removed then go through with the process and stop your hankering!!

i hope more trees are planted, and who cares about a pool, get a cover which both reduces evaporation and makes cleaning it far easier.. less chemicals needed also.. pools cost energy, waste water, and imho are out of touch with todays needs.. just an extravagance and a waste of precious energy and water resources..

i wrote to my neighbour about his use of ladders on some 10 - 15 foot high tomatoes he is growing along the fence, he has the right to enjoy his yard, and i asked he consider my privacy this summer.. he said wrote back he would.. problem solved..  

if he didnt i wouldnt be going around aggravating him by knocking on his door!!

imho either deal with the problem in the courts or live with it,, writing about it on a forum is just you venting your frustrations.. there are no solutions other than the ones your have investigated.

some councils allow leaves and litter from trees to be put on your property if it comes from your property.. consider returning the litter to them. ask them where they want it or advise them where you will place these leaves...

otherwise look at the tree, enjoy the birds it attracts and the beauty of it..


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## Julia (11 November 2008)

Agentm said:


> why not first talk, then send letters later?



I attempted to talk first.   She refused to have any discussion.  The letter followed.

The pool already has a cover, suspended about a metre over the water.
The leaves still slide off it and into the water.

AWG, thank you for further thoughts which I appreciate.


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## robert toms (11 November 2008)

What sort of tree is it...approaching 300 foot fully grown makes it amongst the tallest species (and individual) on the planet.
I got a tree removed from my neighbour's place...it was leaning toward our front yard and dropped a sizeable branch across my drive..I have got chainsaws so that didn't bother me.However the scar exposed rot and the lean was toward our place.
We used the danger approach through the council and this was successful in having the red gum removed (probably only 35 metres or just over 100 foot tall),but an expansive branch system.
I compromised by cleaning up his from yard for him,as long as he hired the cherry picker to lop ,and ground the bits that I could not handle...I am too frightened to climb them...tried once and put a branch thru my bathroom ceiling....no insurance there.


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## cuttlefish (11 November 2008)

Julia - do you have a leaf blower?   I'm sure the sole purpose those things were invented was to annoy neighbours.


If not, maybe you should get one.  I'd recommend using it to clean up your leaves around 5:30 a.m. every Sunday morning, then a knock on the neighbours door around 6:00 a.m to ask where they'd like you to put the leaves that came from their tree  (I'm sure they will have some interesting suggestions at that hour of the morning ).


After a few weeks of this approach they might start to see value in some pruning to reduce the leaf mess ...


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## Julia (11 November 2008)

robert toms said:


> What sort of tree is it...approaching 300 foot fully grown makes it amongst the tallest species (and individual) on the planet.
> I got a tree removed from my neighbour's place...it was leaning toward our front yard and dropped a sizeable branch across my drive..I have got chainsaws so that didn't bother me.However the scar exposed rot and the lean was toward our place.
> We used the danger approach through the council and this was successful in having the red gum removed (probably only 35 metres or just over 100 foot tall),but an expansive branch system.
> I compromised by cleaning up his from yard for him,as long as he hired the cherry picker to lop ,and ground the bits that I could not handle...I am too frightened to climb them...tried once and put a branch thru my bathroom ceiling....no insurance there.



Robert, it's a gum tree, don't know the exact species.  Would be lovely in a park - just completely unsuitable for small backyard with close neighbours.
The Council here has advised that when a large branch does structural damage tomy property, then they will intervene.  Great.  Sounds as though the same applied in your situation.




cuttlefish said:


> Julia - do you have a leaf blower?   I'm sure the sole purpose those things were invented was to annoy neighbours.
> 
> 
> If not, maybe you should get one.  I'd recommend using it to clean up your leaves around 5:30 a.m. every Sunday morning, then a knock on the neighbours door around 6:00 a.m to ask where they'd like you to put the leaves that came from their tree  (I'm sure they will have some interesting suggestions at that hour of the morning ).
> ...



Hi Cuttlefish, thanks for the suggestion.  They sure are hellishly noisy things.
The problem with that idea is that it would also annoy all the other neighbours who are great people and whom annoying would be the last thing I'd want to do.


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## spooly74 (11 November 2008)

trillionaire#1 said:


> Julia,at my last property ,i had a couple of beautiful healthy gums that were,suddenly attacked by a borer type insect ,killed the trees dead in a flash.
> solution?,research suitable gum wrecking insects,locate...er somewere,and
> throw handfuls of specimens at the trees base.




Love it ...slow and steady wins the race 

http://www2.dpi.qld.gov.au/hardwoodsqld/1819.html


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## seasprite (11 November 2008)

step 1 . fill your pool with large gravel up to 8 inches below the top.
       2 . add small gravel/sand mix then compact down .
       3 . place in wire mesh then fill to the top with concrete.
       4 . smooth to a nice finish and let dry for 4 days.
       5 . cut lines with a concrete cutter to prevent cracking .
       6 . get out the deck chairs and a bottle of wine.
       7 . enjoy a nice day in the shade of your neighbours tree. 

or 
       wait till new years eve , then aim all of your fireworks (that you saved from guy fawkes ) at the offending tree and let rip.


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## roland (11 November 2008)

You could move - that would not only fix the tree problem, but you would probably have better neighbours and less stress.


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## ColB (11 November 2008)

> Originally Posted by *Julia*: No, NC, she is a wealthy woman and owns several properties.
> 
> Moreover, she complained to her other neighbour that their jasmine (which flowers for only a couple of weeks once a week) gave her *hay fever* when it flowered and would they please remove it.




Well there's part of your answer Julia, the ones with money are usually the hardest to get it out of. She's not Jewish as well is she?

On your fenceline planting some nice Jasmine creeper, a Privet Hedge and any other plant that upsets hay fever sufferers might be a good idea.

Geez, I'm starting to sound like NunTheWiser!!  I Better go.... CB


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## nunthewiser (11 November 2008)

gday perversity , long time no see

do actually agree with the jasmin idea tho , should grab ya neibours attention by the nose


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## cuttlefish (11 November 2008)

Julia I just had another idea - you could always hire "Carlos the pool cleaner" - then sit relaxing by the pool with a Pina Colada while he gyrates his way around your yard cleaning up leaves and gutters each week - bound to take your mind off your neighbours.


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## macca (11 November 2008)

Hi Julia,

I think I would be creating a garden along that fenceline.

I would dig quite deeply while doing it, any roots coming from her side of the fence would be poisoned.

I would then plant numerous jasmines.

She likes gum trees, you like jasmines


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## wallyt99 (11 November 2008)

Wysiwyg said:


> The tree (at 200 ft. tall) may be 100`s of years old and would be a damned typical sad act to cut it down.Of course if I bought next door to this unique tree I would wonder what sort of life it had, the humans that  came and went during its life and the humans that will come and go in its future.
> 
> Long live the eucalypt.(and its inhabitants)





Exactly....  it would also likely be protected under protection of vegetation laws, and even if the owners want to remove it, they could not.


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## Wysiwyg (11 November 2008)

wallyt99 said:


> Exactly....  it would also likely be protected under protection of vegetation laws, and even if the owners want to remove it, they could not.





Well wal the tree is 15 years old and I found out that some species grow at a rate of 6 to 12 feet per year and have a life span of 400 years average.


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## awg (11 November 2008)

I have found out that preserving good neighbourly relations are more important than minor irritations, both from personal experience and observations of other peoples problems.

One day I politely asked if there was anyway that my neighbour could prevent his dog from pooing all over my front verge and coming into my yard at night and doing the same thing, (as my guests and young children were sick of stepping in dogdoo)

He flatly denied it was his dog

I replied that I had seen it many times

He denied it again.

I said "righto" and just left the matter without further comment

I understand dogs are territorial and as I had no dog, it considered my property to be its territory.

I knew he knew this as well.

We had always had cordial relations. I had even lent the guy one of my cars when his broke down so he could get to work!

A few days later, while i was watering my garden, he came running out and commenced to abuse me in the most vile language and threatened to bash me and various other illogical statements and accusations

all in front of my young kids as well.

I was shocked to say the least, but after about 1 minute of abuse, I began to feel my body levitating towards him.

very luckily for him, his wife rushed out and dragged him away.

for some years after this I had various troubles from him

I at all times maintained a cordial attitude, and never attempted to inflame him.

I believe he may have been suffering from an abnormality of the mind, exacerbated by shiftwork.

we get on fine now, more than 10 years later, we have never discussed the incident. 

his dog died some yrs ago (of natural causes)

I am glad I did not take any actions of which I might regret or be ashamed, or exacerbate the situation, I certainly had my patience tested.

we both still live here, and expect to for yrs to come


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## Julia (11 November 2008)

AWG, thank you for relating that incident.  I'm mindful of just that sort of risk - maybe poisoned meat being thrown over to my dog etc.

Also they are both drunks and therefore unpredictable.


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## Whiskers (11 November 2008)

Any chance of a photo of the tree, Julia?

Good chance of identifying the type of gum from a photo. Some, especially the more ornamental ones are the most brittle.


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## Julia (11 November 2008)

What difference does it make which type it is, Whiskers?  It can be as brittle as you like, or otherwise, and it won't make any difference whether or not they are prepared to do anything.  Ditto the council.


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## milothedog (11 November 2008)

Whiskers

More than 700 species of euc, many of which are defined by very specific details, such as the structure of seedpods, bark, leaf vein, etc.  It is unlikely to be definitively defined by a photo posted here.   Even if species is defined, I believe neighbourhood dispute would be no closer to resolution.


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## Whiskers (12 November 2008)

Julia said:


> What difference does it make which type it is, Whiskers?  It can be as brittle as you like, or otherwise, and it won't make any difference whether or not they are prepared to do anything.  Ditto the council.




Curiosity to a large degree Julia. Could give a better run down of what to expect if the variety was known and whether it's a protected species. 

But I'm not convinced the council can't do anything. They are often loathe to get involved but if the Maryborough City law applies since amalgamation (my first post) it's much stronger in terms of hazaderous trees than the old Hervey Bay (my second post) which as you say mainly deals with overgrowth, but extends to other circumstances via the later sections.

If I understand correctly you have spoken advice from the council. From my experience council response is often be quite different to a  'strong' formal written request. I promise, I've dealt with councils a lot.

I mean, it's your choice, but I wouldn't leave it rest on spoken advice cos they are loath to get involved, but when something is presented in writing they cannot just ignore it.



milothedog said:


> Whiskers
> 
> More than 700 species of euc, many of which are defined by very specific details, such as the structure of seedpods, bark, leaf vein, etc.  It is unlikely to be definitively defined by a photo posted here.   Even if species is defined, I believe neighbourhood dispute would be no closer to resolution.




Yeah, I know milo, but there are only about half dozen or so of what's commonly called 'gum' species in that area and the main ones are easily identifiable by their appearance to anyone wo knows their trees.

PS: Oops double clicked. Mod, cancel one of these please.


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## Whiskers (12 November 2008)

Julia said:


> What difference does it make which type it is, Whiskers?  It can be as brittle as you like, or otherwise, and it won't make any difference whether or not they are prepared to do anything.  Ditto the council.




Curiosity to a large degree Julia. Could give a better run down of what to expect if the variety was known and whether it's a protected species. 

But I'm not convinced the council can't do anything. They are often loathe to get involved but if the Maryborough City law applies since amalgamation (my first post) it's much stronger in terms of hazaderous trees than the old Hervey Bay (my second post) which as you say mainly deals with overgrowth, but extends to other circumstances via the later sections.

If I understand correctly you have spoken advice from the council. From my experience council response is often be quite different to a  'strong' formal written request. I promise, I've dealt with councils a lot.

I mean, it's your choice, but I wouldn't leave it rest on spoken advice cos they are loath to get involved, but when something is presented in writing they cannot just ignore it.



milothedog said:


> Whiskers
> 
> More than 700 species of euc, many of which are defined by very specific details, such as the structure of seedpods, bark, leaf vein, etc.  It is unlikely to be definitively defined by a photo posted here.   Even if species is defined, I believe neighbourhood dispute would be no closer to resolution.




Yeah, I know milo, but there are only about half dozen or so of what's commonly called 'gum' species in that area and the main ones are easily identifiable by their appearance to anyone wo knows their trees.


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## robert toms (12 November 2008)

When I didn't know any better I planted a Tasmanian Blue Gum near my house...it grew apace.
If this tree is within reach of your house,and the neighbour will not negotiate...I would be using the danger and unpredictability of eucalypts as my approach to council.When there is a severe wind event I lay awake at night hoping the tree is not going to fall on my house etc.
It sounds like this tree should only exist in the bush,not in a built-up area.


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## Julia (12 November 2008)

robert toms said:


> When I didn't know any better I planted a Tasmanian Blue Gum near my house...it grew apace.
> If this tree is within reach of your house,and the neighbour will not negotiate...I would be using the danger and unpredictability of eucalypts as my approach to council.When there is a severe wind event I lay awake at night hoping the tree is not going to fall on my house etc.
> It sounds like this tree should only exist in the bush,not in a built-up area.



Exactly right, Robert.   I suspect this is what happened in the case of this tree.   All our houses were built about the same time and the ground was bare.  I also made mistakes with some of the trees I planted (coming from NZ, wasn't familiar with Aus trees) and had them removed when I realised they would become a problem.   Their tree was planted as a 2ft or so seedling.

Whiskers, thank you for advice re writing to Council.   I will do this.
Meantime, have emailed a Councillor to ask her advice, if any.


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## sis (14 September 2011)

nunthewiser said:


> Dark night , cordless drill , roundup........
> be sure to keep some of the drill shavings mixed with a lil dirt to rub onto hole s afterwards




Doesn't work after 3 bottles of round up tree looks great.
I've been told dig a hole beside the tree and use diesel fuel


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## Logique (14 September 2011)

Just noticed this thread, these do not sound like good neighbours. 

Get a professional arborist to provide a health report on the tree. There are gum trees and gum trees. Is this one healthy, any hollows, any dead wood in the head, any termites etc.  If it was to fall, which direction would it go, over you or over the neighbours? Is there an alternative planting that would work better.

Go to your local council , as Whiskers suggests, with that report in hand. Your every correspondence on the matter should begin with '..I have tried to negotiate with my neighbours and offered to cover costs, but have been continually rebuffed..'.  

Having worked through this process, then issue a letter from your solicitor, outlining the situation and legal status of yourself and your neighbours. 

These sound like neighbours who will only listen to authority. Also it may finally twig with them that they're being set up to carry future liability. Could even sway them to sell and move.


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## Julia (14 September 2011)

Thanks for the thoughts, Logique.  I'd quite forgotten about this old thread.
I've tried all that you have suggested.  Zero response.
The tree is pretty healthy.  Storms usually come from a direction which would blow any breaking limbs into my property, most likely smashing through the  pool shade structure into the pool.

The Council refuse to have anything to do with neighbourhood tree issues, though there have been some murmurings from the State government to the effect that they will be initiating legislation for special court sittings for applications in just this sort of problem.

The owner refuses to talk to me or to respond to letters from me or from the Justice Department Dispute Resolution Program.   Lawyer's advice is that I can take it to I now forget which Court which would mean a trip to Brisbane and a cost of between $10,000 and $15,000 for a barrister, with no guarantee of a positive outcome.

So there it is.  Nothing much you can do except wait for the damage in a cyclone and in the meantime, continually clear the gutters of gum leaves and skim the pool of leaves every time you want to swim!


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## skc (14 September 2011)

Julia said:


> Thanks for the thoughts, Logique.  I'd quite forgotten about this old thread.
> I've tried all that you have suggested.  Zero response.
> The tree is pretty healthy.  Storms usually come from a direction which would blow any breaking limbs into my property, most likely smashing through the  pool shade structure into the pool.
> 
> ...




We had a 10-12m paperbark tree along the fence line (was there when we bought the house) and my neighbour has been complaining about leaves on their roof and pool etc. I however didn't really think it was that bad and refused to cut it for a year or so. He didn't really press on with the issue either.

A few months ago another tree in the front yard was getting close to the power/telephone line so I got someone in to remove both of them. My neighbour was pleased and I didn't even ask him for any money...

Moral of the story? Replace your neighbour!


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## macca (15 September 2011)

Hi Julia,

Have you tried getting someone to check along your fence line for roots crossing your boundary ?

Big trees can have hundreds of roots heading in all directions, if you can find a few that are on your property you may be able to poison them because they have entered your property.

If the tree should die you could feign innocence as you can't access their place because of the nasty dog. 

I have read that gum trees hate any type of copper solutions, perhaps a lawn fertilizer with high copper content might be of interest ?


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## Julia (15 September 2011)

macca said:


> Hi Julia,
> 
> Have you tried getting someone to check along your fence line for roots crossing your boundary ?



Thanks for the suggestion, macca.  Almost impossible to do this, given the density of planting on my side of the fence in one part and paving on the rest.



> If the tree should die you could feign innocence as you can't access their place because of the nasty dog.



Nice idea but a quite elderly woman lives there alone, no dog.  

The tree is not close to the fence line.  It's the extraordinary height of it that's the problem.  When it was not so tall it caused me no problems.


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## drsmith (15 September 2011)

This should make even a 200ft tree tremble on its roots and the neighbours in their boots.


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## Smurf1976 (15 September 2011)

drsmith said:


> This should make even a 200ft tree tremble on its roots and the neighbours in their boots.




Unfortunately it seems that council rules prohibit chainsaws powered by an internal combustion engine being used near a property not owned by the user unless permission is granted. Electric are allowed however.

So we just need to swap that motor for a decent 200kW electric motor and off we go...


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## jbocker (17 September 2011)

Dont look like there is much you can do Julia. 
I would suggest to make the most of a bad thing, as someone suggested, get a good looking Carlos the pool cleaner to pop around on a regular basis and a fit and agile gutter cleaner and enjoy the view...

... and the view of the _tree _Julia!

Oh and Jasmines would look nice along the fence dont you think, and a few other highly perfumed varities of bush so that you and neighbour could enjoy year round pleasures of delightful wafting scents. Love it sooo much it will bring tears to her eyes.

Maybe the other neighbour could replant their Jasmine too.

So you can spend time and money trying to regularly prune the tree or use the same time and money investing in the clean up solution. (Thats not even considering the cost of the grief too). Get Carlos to put the leaves into the compost bin and you have your mulch supplied free too, to put on the jasmines - you will want the best blooms.
You can call it the Karma Garden.


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## drsmith (17 September 2011)

jbocker said:


> Dont look like there is much you can do Julia.



Looking at the problem from a totally different perspective, If the neighbour has a partner, they themselves might disagree on how to manage the tree.


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## Julia (17 September 2011)

drsmith said:


> Looking at the problem from a totally different perspective, If the neighbour has a partner, they themselves might disagree on how to manage the tree.



Hah, that was actually true in that she did have a partner who tried to persuade her the tree was totally unsuitable for the small backyard.  She, however, owns the property, and he has since ended up in care due to chronic disease brought about by alcoholism.
The plus in this is that we are no longer regaled every evening with their drunken brawling.


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## drsmith (17 September 2011)

Julia said:


> The plus in this is that we are no longer regaled every evening with their drunken brawling.



Brawling of any nature between partners is a bugger.


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## Whiskers (1 November 2011)

Maybe some relief in sight for nuisance trees.



> The new Neighbourhood Disputes Resolution Act replaces the 60-year-old
> Dividing Fences Act, providing “more effective remedies” to resolve disputes
> about dividing fences and trees.
> 
> ...


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## Julia (1 November 2011)

Many thanks, Whiskers.  I wonder how effective it will be.  Many instances will be, like mine, not a case of overhanging branches at all.  I'd have quite happily paid to have such branches lopped off if that were all the problem was.

Quite different when it's the sheer height of the tree - although in the middle of the neighbouring back yard - that sheds thousands of leaves into my pool, guttering and throughout the garden.  Just such a nightmare in the prevailing SE wind.


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## Glen48 (1 November 2011)

Buy some Butyric acid  pump a bit under her door next morning she will pack up and move out the house will be vacant for years.
 This sort of thing annoys me you should be able to see the Council, they come around and look at the problem and  issue an order, case over but I guess it  does the lawyers out of millions of dollars and keep crime levels high.


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## sails (1 November 2011)

Julia said:


> Many thanks, Whiskers.  I wonder how effective it will be.  Many instances will be, like mine, not a case of overhanging branches at all.  I'd have quite happily paid to have such branches lopped off if that were all the problem was.
> 
> Quite different when it's the sheer height of the tree - although in the middle of the neighbouring back yard - that sheds thousands of leaves into my pool, guttering and throughout the garden.  Just such a nightmare in the prevailing SE wind.





Julia,  it could be effective.  As you know my daughter with depression is in a housing commission and her fully concreted back yard had two large gum trees overhanging and leaning in the direction of her townhouse.  The leaves were a nightmare, but the worst thing was the ibises pooping all over her concrete and her washing line.  Every morning there would be fresh poop all over her back yard. Not easy with a young pre-school child either.

When Qbuild guys were there doing some work a few months ago, she asked about the trees and if anything could be done.  They told her they had already approached the neighbouring complex (not part of Qld housing) and they had refused to have them cut down.

About a month ago, my daughter called me to say the trees were being taken down as we spoke and they were completely removed.  She is so relieved.   

What Whiskers has posted could be the reason the trees eventually were removed.  I understand another backyard tree was being taken down at the end of last week. 

I do hope this helps to resolve your tree problem too , Julia


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## Logique (2 November 2011)

From Whiskers' post:
_Under the laws, a person can issue a notice to a neighbour whose tree has 
branches hanging more than 50 centimetres over the boundary and *less than 2.5 
metres above the ground*, with the tree-keeper urged to cut them within 30 
days. _

- I wonder why it wouldn't apply to trees taller than 2.5m?


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## Julia (2 November 2011)

sails said:


> Julia,  it could be effective.  As you know my daughter with depression is in a housing commission and her fully concreted back yard had two large gum trees overhanging and leaning in the direction of her townhouse.  The leaves were a nightmare, but the worst thing was the ibises pooping all over her concrete and her washing line.  Every morning there would be fresh poop all over her back yard. Not easy with a young pre-school child either.
> 
> When Qbuild guys were there doing some work a few months ago, she asked about the trees and if anything could be done.  They told her they had already approached the neighbouring complex (not part of Qld housing) and they had refused to have them cut down.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the note of optimism, Sails.

However, the issue of trees on government owned property is a pretty simple proposition.  It's quite different when one has to deal with private property owners if these owners simply decline to communicate in the matter, even fail to respond to letters from the Justice Dept's Dispute Resolution Branch.

I contacted the local council a few years back about a dangerous tree in the park in our cul de sac.  They had someone out to look at it within a couple of days, and it was duly dealt with about a week after that.


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## sails (2 November 2011)

Julia said:


> Thanks for the note of optimism, Sails.
> 
> However, the issue of trees on government owned property is a pretty simple proposition.  It's quite different when one has to deal with private property owners if these owners simply decline to communicate in the matter, even fail to respond to letters from the Justice Dept's Dispute Resolution Branch.
> 
> I contacted the local council a few years back about a dangerous tree in the park in our cul de sac.  They had someone out to look at it within a couple of days, and it was duly dealt with about a week after that.




Julia, the trees weren't on government owned property.  They were on the other side of the fence on private land and the owners  apparently did refuse to have the trees removed.  I don't know what happened to change their minds.  Also, they were larger than the 2.5 metres as highlighted by Logique.  I hope my optimism is not unfounded...


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## Julia (2 November 2011)

OK, sorry I misunderstood.  Perhaps the approach to the owners by the government representatives on behalf of your daughter's property did the trick.

I don't think it can have occurred as a result of the new legislation which only came into place yesterday.


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## sails (3 November 2011)

Julia said:


> OK, sorry I misunderstood.  Perhaps the approach to the owners by the government representatives on behalf of your daughter's property did the trick.
> 
> I don't think it can have occurred as a result of the new legislation which only came into place yesterday.





Yes, I don't know what changed the owner's minds in the end.  The first that was known about it was the noise of a chain saw and a tree muncher.   Whether they used the new law coming to help get results or who paid for the tree removal, I have no idea.

All the best with that tree...


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