# ZIP - Zip Co Limited



## Bushman (20 April 2010)

Quick thread started on RRE. 

ASX-announcement today that it has started its drilling campaign on its Ruby Well prospect. This is located 70km from SFR's Degrussa. 

So another cheap 'nearology' play given success of SFR and current drilling campaigns by TLM and ALY. 

@ time of the last Dec-09 quarterly, it had cash in the bank of $5.7m. Tight share structure with 70m on issue. At 30 cps, this gives a market cap of $21m. 

Other prospects apart from Ruby Well. 

On the watchlist.


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## explod (13 August 2010)

*Re: RRE - Rubianna Resources*

Good Plug in the financila review today.

Further drilling results on the Curly's Project expected soon.

Dont' hold but on my watch.  If we get a rise off the current consolidation could be worth a punt.  Gold price a factor of course.


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## springhill (27 July 2012)

*Re: RRE - Rubianna Resources*

MC - $5.6m
SP - 7.8c
Shares - 77m
Options - 14.6m
Cash (end May 2012) A$1.39M

*Shareholders *
Top 20 ~66%

*Board*
TERRY SMITH
GORDON DUNBAR
DR STEVE BATTY

*RUBY WELL*
Reported in accordance with the JORC Code (2004), each of the resources are classified as an Inferred Mineral Resource and comprise:
● Bloodstone Prospect 140,000t @ 2.7g/t Au for approximately 12,000 ounces
● Golden Hope Prospect 86,000t @ 2.1g/t Au for approximately 5,600 ounces
● Ruby Anna Prospect 50,000t @ 1.6g/t Au for approximately 2,400 ounces
•Follow-up drilling at the Bloodstone prospect to further extend known mineralisation.
•Drilling between the Bloodstone, Trafalgar and Ruby Anna East prospects.
•MONETISE THE EXISTING GOLD ASSETS. 

*NORTH RUBY WELL*
● Target Area #1 – Two targets with coincident gold (>50 to 592ppb Au) and copper (102 to >200ppm Cu) anomalism1 have been defined from the infill sampling (200m line spacing & 100m sample spacing). The eastern target covers an area of approximately 700 x 200m and the western target an area of approximately 400 x 200m.
● Target Area #4 – Four NW-SE trending horizons with consistently anomalous Cu (>300ppm) have been delineated from the wide spaced sampling (400m line spacing & 200m sample spacing). Along horizon #1, broad intersections (RWAC0354, 20m@391ppm Cu from 28m to EOH & RWRB02142, 14m@460ppm Cu from surface to EOH) of anomalous Cu have been returned. These four horizons are cut by a series of NE-SW trending faults to define zones A-C.
● Target Areas #2 & 3 – A broad zone (2.0 x 0.8km) of coincident gold (>10ppb Au) and copper (>100ppm Cu) anomalism has been defined. A discrete bedrock source (250 x 100m, ≥100ppb Au) has been identified in addition to verification of the Au-enriched lateritic horizon identified from historic drilling. Due to the wide spaced sampling in this area (400m line spacing & 200m sample spacing), potential remains to identify further significant “bedrock” Au anomalies.
•Continue “interface” geochemistry at the priority Au-Cu targets.
•Ground EM survey(s).
•RC drilling. 

*KILLARA*
•Complete geological mapping and sampling over primary geochemical “soil” target areas.
•Ground EM survey(s).
•RC drilling. 

*ADDITIONAL PROSPECTS*
•Continue the Company’s on-going exploration programmes with a focus on gold and base metal (Cu-Pb-Zn) mineralisation.
•Project assessments leading to acquisitions


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## System (14 September 2015)

On September 14th, 2015, Rubianna Resources Limited (RRE) changed its name and ASX code to Zipmoney Limited (ZML).


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## richierouse (15 February 2016)

We caught up with Larry Diamond, CEO and Co-founder of online lender ZipMoney (ZML), to learn more about the company’s underlying business, its monetisation strategy, ZML’s unfair competitive advantage, the recently announced $100M facility its exciting deal with Victory Park and the catalysts for the stock in 2016.

Click below to watch:

http://www.peakassetmanagement.com....arry-diamond-ceo-and-founder-of-zipmoney-zml/


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## piggybank (29 April 2016)

Hi,

Well it appears the market were impressed by today's announcement - third quarter FY2016 update. The stock rose today by nearly 10% and with half the weekly volume.

http://www.stocknessmonster.com/news-item?S=ZML&E=ASX&N=761647


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## andione1983 (31 October 2016)

Good news report released today..  My 2c this is one to keep an eye on.  I cam see this taking off as a form of online payment.


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## McLovin (16 January 2017)

Has anyone had a look at ZML or AFY? I can't get my head around the valuations. ZML has an MC of $170m and a loan book of ~$68m. As far as I can see, this is just a traditional finance company that uses a bit of technology to deliver their product to the end user. It's not a "payments" business, in that it is not just intermediating a payment from A to B and clipping the ticket, rather it is using its own balance sheet to pay A and then collect from B.

As a finance company it funds its loan book through a mix of debt and equity. It's not scaleable in the way a payments business would be, or a tech company usually is. In order to grow it needs ever increasing amounts of debt and, I'm guessing, about 20% equity as security, given the nature of the lending. The only real way it can juice its balance sheet is by getting customers to repay loans more quickly so the capital can be redeployed, or by getting things like arrears and bad debts down.

There seems to be a bit of a land grab going on at the moment with these start-ups trying to capture as many merchants as possible and ramping up lending astonishingly quickly (it's pretty amazing that a company this young, with no profitability on the horizon, has managed to secure $110m securitisation warehouse facility). Anyone want to take a punt on how well these proprietary algorithms work in a recession?

I guess as long as the share price is high, equity is cheap and the economy is doing ok so the music keeps playing, but this looks a very frothy to me. They may get as big as FXL one day, but they're going to need a lot of capital to get to that point.


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## Klogg (16 January 2017)

McLovin said:


> Has anyone had a look at ZML or AFY? I can't get my head around the valuations. ZML has an MC of $170m and a loan book of ~$68m. As far as I can see, this is just a traditional finance company that uses a bit of technology to deliver their product to the end user. It's not a "payments" business, in that it is not just intermediating a payment from A to B and clipping the ticket, rather it is using its own balance sheet to pay A and then collect from B.
> 
> As a finance company it funds its loan book through a mix of debt and equity. It's not scaleable in the way a payments business would be, or a tech company usually is. In order to grow it needs ever increasing amounts of debt and, I'm guessing, about 20% equity as security, given the nature of the lending. The only real way it can juice its balance sheet is by getting customers to repay loans more quickly so the capital can be redeployed, or by getting things like arrears and bad debts down.
> 
> ...




Lines up with what I found... I stumbled across AFY during the IPO, as TCH owned a fair share of it. They claim that they don't make money through loans, as they don't charge interest. Instead, what they do is pay the merchant a little less, then wait for the customer to pay the full amount. Either way, they're building a loan book and continually need capital to grow.

Not sure if you've looked at it, but TMP has a similar capital requirement, although in a different sector. 

There's definitely demand for the product, but there were a few major issues in my mind:
1) No emphasis at all on credit quality - even if it is an item of a few hundred dollars (or less). What are the long-term credit risk implications or required rates of discount to allow for delinquencies?
On this point, ZML's has this interesting footnote on slide 6 of the MS Investor preso:

_"Note: zipMoney’s cost structure is made up of financing costs (expected to be 6% with new facility), data costs (~1%), bad debt expense (booked as ~3%) and corporate overheads"_


2) In line with what you said: will they forever tap investors for new capital, add more debt or use profits to feed new loans? Capital intensive either way...

Not really something that attracts me at the current price (TMP is more reasonably priced, but still not to my liking)


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## McLovin (16 January 2017)

Klogg said:


> There's definitely demand for the product, but there were a few major issues in my mind:
> 1) No emphasis at all on credit quality - even if it is an item of a few hundred dollars (or less). What are the long-term credit risk implications or required rates of discount to allow for delinquencies?
> On this point, ZML's has this interesting footnote on slide 6 of the MS Investor preso:
> 
> _"Note: zipMoney’s cost structure is made up of financing costs (expected to be 6% with new facility), data costs (~1%), bad debt expense (booked as ~3%) and corporate overheads"_




Yeah, it's all blue sky as far as the eye can see. There is demand. It was actually a friend whose online business use ZML that alerted me to it. He reckons it's been very good for his business, a few other people I know who run reasonably large $500m+ revenue retailers have both looked at ZML's product and think it looks pretty good. But no matter how good the product the valuation has to make sense.


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## skc (16 January 2017)

McLovin said:


> Has anyone had a look at ZML or AFY? I can't get my head around the valuations. ZML has an MC of $170m and a loan book of ~$68m. As far as I can see, this is just a traditional finance company that uses a bit of technology to deliver their product to the end user. It's not a "payments" business, in that it is not just intermediating a payment from A to B and clipping the ticket, rather it is using its own balance sheet to pay A and then collect from B.
> 
> As a finance company it funds its loan book through a mix of debt and equity. It's not scaleable in the way a payments business would be, or a tech company usually is. In order to grow it needs ever increasing amounts of debt and, I'm guessing, about 20% equity as security, given the nature of the lending. The only real way it can juice its balance sheet is by getting customers to repay loans more quickly so the capital can be redeployed, or by getting things like arrears and bad debts down.




I am guessing you read this article today. http://www.afr.com/business/retail/...to-highlight-christmas-growth-20170114-gtrms9

I can see scale benefits in brand, IT, back office and capital costs... and turning a $1 capital over 6 times in a year (clipping 4% each time as mentioned in the article) is probably not a bad business. It scales more like an online store that holds inventory rather than a payment system as you said. And yes FXL is probably a decent comparable.

AFY's credit check feels like a bit of magic sauce... it asks nothing more than the delivery address, credit/debit card details and email. May be they have some data sharing with the card company? Otherwise it's hard to see how they can have an edge in term of credit.

You can't deny AFY's growth in transactions in such a short time though... they are already at $300m annualised sales, it's not too heroic to see $1-2B in the foreseeable future if they get the physical store implementation right. With share price staying strong the dilution might not be as bad as feared. But yes plenty of things need to go right.

TCH is the actual technology behind AFY as it gets paid processing fee on the value transacted. Yet it's trading on nothing more than it's holding in AFY (TCH holds 50m AFY shares). So either AFY will lose a lot of the value, or TCH is undervalued, or TCH is so $hit that it will just be a cash drain forever (ignoring the fact that it has the technology behind AFY).


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## McLovin (16 January 2017)

skc said:


> I am guessing you read this article today. http://www.afr.com/business/retail/...to-highlight-christmas-growth-20170114-gtrms9




Ha! I hadn't seen that. Thanks.



skc said:


> I can see scale benefits in brand, IT, back office and capital costs... and turning a $1 capital over 6 times in a year (clipping 4% each time as mentioned in the article) is probably not a bad business. It scales more like an online store that holds inventory rather than a payment system as you said. And yes FXL is probably a decent comparable.
> ...
> You can't deny AFY's growth in transactions in such a short time though... they are already at $300m annualised sales, it's not too heroic to see $1-2B in the foreseeable future if they get the physical store implementation right. With share price staying strong the dilution might not be as bad as feared. But yes plenty of things need to go right.




Absolutely growth for both has been impressive. That's probably why I'm trying to poke holes in it. Do you think as they keep growing they can maintain turning capital 6x/year at 4%? That'll give them some pretty amazing RoE numbers, in a sector that is very competitive from both upstarts and the existing card cartel/banks. It's hard to see those merchant fees not coming under some pressure. If they can get to $2b in transactions with the same pricing structure I'll be pretty impressed. Even Amex only charge ~2% and merchants don't really like having to accept Amex. A standard Visa/MC is <1% merchant fees and 55 days interest free, and virtually every business on the internet already accepts them.



skc said:


> AFY's credit check feels like a bit of magic sauce... it asks nothing more than the delivery address, credit/debit card details and email. May be they have some data sharing with the card company? Otherwise it's hard to see how they can have an edge in term of credit.




Agree. And no one will really know how good their algorithms are until the **** hits the fan. As Klogg pointed out, their presentations are pretty scant on credit quality or methodology.


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## skc (16 January 2017)

McLovin said:


> Absolutely growth for both has been impressive. That's probably why I'm trying to poke holes in it. Do you think as they keep growing they can maintain turning capital 6x/year at 4%? That'll give them some pretty amazing RoE numbers, in a sector that is very competitive from both upstarts and the existing card cartel/banks. It's hard to see those merchant fees not coming under some pressure. If they can get to $2b in transactions with the same pricing structure I'll be pretty impressed.




I think they will get there. The key benefit for retailer is actually increased basket size. That's not something the existing card providers can claim.

Obviously the increase in basket size can't go on forever... it's a combination of brought forward consumption and higher share of wallet from non-participating merchants. So at this stage it's a no-brainer for a retailer to join up. And $2B is still only a drop in the whole retail world (if you include physical stores) so I can see the pricing structure holding up to that point. Very long term when market penetration is higher and the incremental benefits are no longer that distinct and quantifiable for the retailer, it would have to change then. But then it's a very good problem to have.



McLovin said:


> Agree. And no one will really know how good their algorithms are until the **** hits the fan. As Klogg pointed out, their presentations are pretty scant on credit quality or methodology.




I actually tried to buy a few things using AFY just now. I really can't see how they get information for credit checks... credit card details, delivery address and IP address (I guess). Information gets even more scarce in physical stores. So I am no wiser after trying it out.


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## McLovin (17 January 2017)

skc said:


> And $2B is still only a drop in the whole retail world (if you include physical stores) so I can see the pricing structure holding up to that point.




If there was one player with some IP that gave them a real edge, then yeah I agree. But there's a fair few of them out there who are fighting over a small section of the retail pie. Have a look at the demographics of who uses ZipPay: 20-34 year olds and 78% are female. So we're talking about retail addicts on modest/average incomes who may not qualify for a credit card (still at uni/poor credit etc). These are the easy yards. 90% of the stores ZML have on-boarded seem to be women's fashion. Their loan product has much more balanced demographics.

It will be interesting to see if they can diversify their portfolio of merchants, and move up the chain to an older more balanced male/female ratio, higher value spender who already has a credit card. I have a credit card, as I'm sure you do. I don't think I'd ever use Zippay, would you?



skc said:


> I actually tried to buy a few things using AFY just now. I really can't see how they get information for credit checks... credit card details, delivery address and IP address (I guess). Information gets even more scarce in physical stores. So I am no wiser after trying it out.




My understanding is that when you buy your card is immediately debited the first instalment. This seems to be the most rigorous part of the credit check. ZML seems to have a bit more guts to their checking process. They use FB and "bank transactional data" (how do they get that??) to form a profile of the customer.


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## McLovin (17 January 2017)

Good point as well about front loading consumption.


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## Quant (27 February 2017)

Today from my man  ..    """   
I’m pleased to attach a link to an announcement released today from ZML regarding a new financing facility with a Big 4 bank.  It appears that certain details are being treated as ‘commercial-in-confidence’ but we can piece together the following – click here for the zipMoney Limited (ZML) funding announcement



The amount of the facility is *$200m*, substantially more than expected.  I have been trying to ascertain if this is the largest fin-tech financing deal ever done in Australia … at this stage I am unable to find anything else even close to this magnitude.
The interest rate is conspicuously absent from the announcement however they have disclosed that their weighted average cost of capital (WACC) should halve to around 6%.  This implies that the rate of the new facility is *less than 5%* (_potentially closer to 4%_), an outstanding outcome.
The facility should be operational by the fourth quarter (April) at which time 50% of the current Victory Park Capital (VPC) facility balance will be rolled in, thereby reducing interest costs immediately.

Further to the above, ZML announced a $30m increase in the size of the current facility with VPC, to $140m.  This should ensure sufficient funding is available until the commencement of the new facility.


Since listing it is fair to say ZML management have been understated in their announcements & presentations to investment markets.  In this case then it is worth noting the words of CEO, Larry Diamond, when he says, “This is a transformative step forward for the Company.”  I have talked in previous emails about the issue of cash flow breakeven and the timing & effect this would have on the value of the company.  It is my view that the attached announcement all but ensures this will not only occur, but do so in coming months.


Should you have any questions please do not hesitate to contact me direct on  ""


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## System (14 December 2017)

On December 14th, 2017, Zipmoney Limited changed its name to Zip Co Limited.


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## System (25 January 2018)

On January 15th, 2018, Zip Co Limited changed its ASX code from ZML to Z1P.


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## aus_trader (30 June 2018)

I am tipping this stock for July stock tipping competition as a potential contender in the Financial Tech industry. Just posted this to comply with new competition rules.


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## aus_trader (29 September 2018)

I think it's testing the $1.20 high's and may break to the upside with a bit of momentum. This could be the underdog (*Z1P* currently around 350m) in the Financial Technology space since Afterpay Touch Group Ltd (*APT*) has become a huge 4b+ (that's 4 Billion Dollar Market Cap) company which operates a similar payment systems model.


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## rnr (10 February 2019)

Is this yet another constituent of the Emerging Companies Index that has the potential for a BO-HR.


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## $20shoes (15 April 2019)

Frustrating one for me. I missed a tight stop limit entry on 2nd April by 1c due to a small gap and thought I'd let it go. Z1P has been on a ripper run since then.


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## aus_trader (16 April 2019)

$20shoes said:


> Frustrating one for me. I missed a tight stop limit entry on 2nd April by 1c due to a small gap and thought I'd let it go. Z1P has been on a ripper run since then.



I also let this one go in my Speculative Stock Portfolio, not expecting this level of acceleration in share price. Really hoping they will allocate a decent number of shares for the Share Purchase Plan which I applied for. It's expected to be scaled back heavily as they are only raising $5m.


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## Zaxon (16 April 2019)

aus_trader said:


> Really hoping they will allocate a decent number of shares for the Share Purchase Plan which I applied for. It's expected to be scaled back heavily as they are only raising $5m.



85% scaleback, so we only get allocated 15%.  I bought in because of the price arbitrage.  Hopefully the price remains nice and high for the next few days.


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## aus_trader (16 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> 85% scaleback, so we only get allocated 15%.  I bought in because of the price arbitrage.  Hopefully the price remains nice and high for the next few days.



Although the new shares are not going to be listed till a later date, the actual allocated amount is going to be disclosed on the 18th (this Thursday). Will be looking forward to that announcement.


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## Zaxon (16 April 2019)

aus_trader said:


> Although the new shares are not going to be listed till a later date, the actual allocated amount is going to be disclosed on the 18th (this Thursday). Will be looking forward to that announcement.



Correct.






Did you go for the full 15k?


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## aus_trader (16 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> Correct.
> 
> View attachment 93829
> 
> ...



Yep, as you said there is a big arbitrage to be played here. Nothing is guaranteed though, since you can't trade the new shares till the 23rd of this month. Shares can come down just as fast as they've gone up between now and then (hopefully not  ).


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## Zaxon (16 April 2019)

aus_trader said:


> Yep, as you said there is a big arbitrage to be played here. Nothing is guaranteed though, since you can't trade the new shares till the 23rd of this month. Shares can come down just as fast as they've gone up between now and then (hopefully not  ).



Very true.  I've done the math based on today's share price. 






We'll see whether it's close to that or not by the 23rd.


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## tech/a (16 April 2019)

From what I see this is likely to come off pretty hard sooner than later.
At best an inside day today.


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## aus_trader (16 April 2019)

tech/a said:


> From what I see this is likely to come off pretty hard sooner than later.
> At best an inside day today.



Yeah, that's always the worry when a stock has run up that hard. I don't like chasing and buying into stocks that have shot up straight into the stratosphere due to this worry. Let's see if this is a major correction or more of a pull back for Z1P...

My favourite stocks are those that are slowly trending up over many months and years.


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## Zaxon (18 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> Very true.  I've done the math based on today's share price.



1490 extra z1p shares just appeared in my account.  Looks like my best guess calculation was spot on.


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## Zaxon (18 April 2019)

If you put in the full 15k, you would have been scaled back to 1490 shares.  Based on today's opening price of $2.56, that gives you a profit $1534.70.


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## aus_trader (23 April 2019)

Zaxon said:


> If you put in the full 15k, you would have been scaled back to 1490 shares.  Based on today's opening price of $2.56, that gives you a profit $1534.70.
> 
> View attachment 93901



I got allocated only 500 shares, not the full 15% that I was hoping for. Found out why the allocation was small. Then decided whether to hold onto them or sell them at the current profit. Details in the Speculative Stock Portfolio.


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## Zaxon (24 April 2019)

aus_trader said:


> I got allocated only 500 shares, not the full 15% that I was hoping for.



Well that's a shame.  You had to be holding enough Z1P shares originally.  Fortunately I met that criteria, but I see some people missed out.  Although we all missed out really.  At a maximum 15.2% scaleback, our profit was given away to the institutions before we ever had a chance.


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## greggles (22 May 2019)

Z1P getting close to cracking $4. I never expected this one to go this far this fast but I suppose it's riding on Afterpay's coattails and enjoying the positive sentiment associated with the installment payment sector generally.

They just announced a partnership with Kmart yesterday and will be providing installment payment services on the Kmart website by the end of the month.


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## Zaxon (22 May 2019)

greggles said:


> I suppose it's riding on Afterpay's coattails



Z1P has been outperforming APT of late.


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## bigdog (30 May 2019)

This clipping is from the May 20 issue of The Herald Sun Digital Edition. 
https://www.heraldsun.com.au/. 

ZIP GETS SOME LATITUDE Herald Sun - Monday, 20 May 2019 - Page 25 › WHO’D have thought there was so much money to be made helping eager shoppers buy fast fashion and junk food? Just ask former Macquarie Capital banker and now Zip Co chief LARRY DIAMOND, who has seen his digital payments start-up shoot from $300 million to $1 billion in value in five months. As more companies sign on to Zip, it is believed Latitude Financial Services, headed by AHMED FAHOUR (above), has considered buying it.

ASX Announcement
21/05/2019 9:28:51 AM *Zip goes next level with Kmart








*


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## PZ99 (25 June 2019)

Zip Co responds to Trade Mark claims Zip Co Limited (ASX:Z1P)

(“the Company” or “Zip”) and its subsidiary Zipmoney Payments Pty Ltd have been notified that Firstmac Limited (“Firstmac”) has commenced proceedings in the Federal Court against Zip Co Limited alleging infringement of Firstmac’s “ZIP” trade mark which is registered in respect of Financial affairs (loans) (“Firstmac trade mark”).

Zip notes that Firstmac has commenced these proceedings now, when prior to this year Firstmac had not raised any issue in connection with Zip’s use of any of its trade marks (“the Zip marks”).

The Company has used the Zip marks extensively since the business began 6 years ago in June 2013 and has since partnered with more than 14,000 retailers at more than 30,000 points of acceptance and has more than 1.2 million customers. As far as Zip is aware, Firstmac ceased offering a “ZIP” home loan product before the Zip business commenced in June 2013.

Zip has engaged law firm Corrs Chambers Westgarth to act for it and will vigorously defend the proceedings. Notwithstanding these proceedings, Zip is confident that it will continue to be able to use its trade marks.

Zip is also concerned by recent activity by Loans.com.au Pty Ltd (which operates the loans.com.au website, and is a subsidiary of Firstmac) in relation to home loan and debit card products being promoted by reference to “ZIP”. Zip is considering what action it will take in relation to this conduct.

https://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/20190624/pdf/44621n3rkg5b69.pdf


It all sounds a bit... "wet" and vexatious from Firstmac to me so a buy order is tempting


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## bigdog (26 June 2019)

https://www.theage.com.au/business/...fore-latest-court-action-20190625-p5213y.html

*Zip lost trademark battle over its name before latest court action*

*By Colin Kruger*
June 26, 2019 — 5.30am

Afterpay rival Zip Co lost its attempt to strip Australia's largest non-bank lender, Firstmac, of the Zip trademark six months before the Brisbane lender started legal action against it this week.

ASX-listed Zip Co applied to remove Firstmac's trademark for Zip in August 2016 on the grounds it had not been in use by Firstmac for more than three years.

Firstmac had offered a Zip home loan "which is essentially a line of credit provided through an interest-free Visa debit card," said documents relating to the case which was determined by the Australian Trade Marks Office (ATMO).

Zip Co claimed that the loan product had ceased to be offered by Firstmac in 2013, but Firstmac has continued to use the trademark with thousands of ongoing customers since that time, and related companies have started using the ZIP name again.

The ATMO's decision noted that Firstmac had been "economical" with its provision of evidence relating to its opposition to Zip Co's action, but the hearing officer Jock McDonagh said: "I am satisfied that it meets the minimum requirements of establishing bona fide use of the trademark in the relevant period.

"The evidence satisfies me that there has been genuine commercial use of the trademark with respect to the specified services in the registration during the relevant period. The grounds for removal have not been established and I therefore refuse to remove the trademark."

Zip Co is not pursuing the option of appealing the decision in the courts but lodged a fresh "non-use" application to have Firstmac's trademark de-registered in March this year.

"It is following that decision, and the refusal of Zipmoney and Zip Co to comply with Firstmac’s demands, that the proceedings before the Federal Court of Australia were commenced," Firstmac said in a statement to the _Sydney Morning Herald_ and _The Age_.

"Firstmac, and its affiliates and licensees, have used and have every intention to continue to use (and/or license the use) of the Zip mark in relation to their respective loan products."

IP Australia confirmed that Zip Co had its own attempts to trademark the Zip name rejected on the grounds that it was too similar to trademarks which had already been registered.

"It was examined and objections based on earlier trademarks were raised," IP Australia said of Zip Co's application.

"The owner did not overcome these objections and the application lapsed."

Zip Co shares closed 2¢ higher at $3.03 on Tuesday.


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## bigdog (17 July 2019)

Motley Fool today
https://www.aussiestockforums.com/threads/apt-afterpay-touch-group.33281/

*Zip Co Ltd* (ASX: Z1P) is an Afterpay competitor operating with a similar product offering in the same retail space. In my opinion, anything that Zip Co can do, Afterpay can do better.

However, while most people are inclined to choose a Coke over a Pepsi, that doesn’t mean that the Pepsi is a redundant product. Zip is on track to beat the expectations it set at the beginning of FY19, while already ahead of its goals of transaction volumes of $1 billion and a customer base of 1 million. The company has recently brought onboard some iconic Australian brands such as *Bunnings*, *Officeworks*, *Target* and *Chemist Warehouse*.

The Zip share price has also exhibited some constructive consolidation over the past two months and makes it a much more appealing investment in the short term.


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## bigdog (24 July 2019)

*ASX Announcement today which the market liked and currently up 6.9%*
24/07/2019 9:57:51 AM   *Quarterly Report*

















844


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## bigdog (20 August 2019)

Z1P share price kicked up following ASX announcement today











20/08/2019 9:37:17 AM * Zip debuts on the global stage, acquiring PartPay*






203


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## Knobby22 (20 August 2019)

Maybe the Zip model is better.
It's harder to use the first time for users but once in may be more profitable.


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## bigdog (22 August 2019)

ASX ann today 22/08/2019 9:41:41 AM  * FY19 Full Year Results Announcement




















*
Bought last month

279


----------



## bigdog (27 September 2019)

ASX announcement today
27/09/2019 9:02:38 AM * Annual Report to Shareholders*
https://www.asx.com.au/asx/statistics/displayAnnouncement.do?display=pdf&idsId=02151925*

*
First three slides below
*















Today SP hit 12 month high of $4.32




*
I hold Z1P

86


----------



## Boggo (1 October 2019)

Well done @bigdog

I don't know why I didn't get on to this in Aug 2018. I got on in April but missed a big chunk that would have had me holding double the volume.
Added some more yesterday and it's up and running again today.

(click to expand)


----------



## Porper (1 October 2019)

Boggo said:


> Well done @bigdog
> 
> I don't know why I didn't get on to this in Aug 2018. I got on in April but missed a big chunk that would have had me holding double the volume.
> Added some more yesterday and it's up and running again today.
> ...




Not on this but it came up on a scan yesterday. I didn't act on it!!


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2019)

I like the share trajectory of these buy now pay later companies, but their business model worries me, maybe I'm just the nervous type. As usual, I will probably miss the biggest opportunity, in a lifetime.


----------



## Boggo (1 October 2019)

sptrawler said:


> I like the share trajectory of these buy now pay later companies, but their business model worries me, maybe I'm just the nervous type.




Yes, there is a bit of a dotcom mentality.
Online stores are loving them though and that's the new era I guess.


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2019)

Boggo said:


> Yes, there is a bit of a dotcom mentality.
> Online stores are loving them though and that's the new era I guess.



To me, it just seems like another way so people can spend more than they earn. From an investors perspective, at least the banks have a caveat on something, do these companies have much as collateral against the loans?
These companies, just seem to be lending money, on the chance people will be able to pay it back.
Just my opinion, but bankruptcies, may end up as the end result.


----------



## bigdog (8 October 2019)

Z1P shares finished the day 7.5% higher at a record high of $5.19 and shares are now up a massive 372% since the start of the year.  The 12 month low was $0.89 in Oct 17, 2018

The 2019 Full Year accounts (30/09/2019) reported a 138% increase in revenue to $84.2 million thanks to a 108% lift in transaction volume through its platform to $1,128.5 million. This was driven by an 80% increase in customer numbers to 1.3 million, a 54% jump in partner numbers to 16,000, and a whopping 154% increase in transactions processed to 4.8 million.


----------



## bigdog (30 October 2019)

ASX announcement today
30/10/2019 8:27:08 AM 8  *Quarterly Report *uploaded

Bad news was
Net bad debt write-offs (bad debts written-off less bad debt recoveries) stood at 1.68% at the end of the quarter. This compares to 1.63% at the end of the fourth quarter of FY 2019. Gross bad debt write offs were 1.95%, compared to 1.82% in the prior quarter. And reported arrears were 1.75%, compared to 1.89% at the end of the previous quarter.

There was a reduction in its cash EBTDA as a percentage of average receivables which fell from 2.2% in the fourth quarter of FY 2019 to just 1% in the first quarter.

Management advised that this was result of its revenue yield sliding ever so slightly from 17% to 16.8% and a rise in cash cost of sales and cash operating costs. The latter was driven by growth initiatives.

---------------------------------------------
The company achieved record quarterly revenue of $31 million. This was a 107% increase on the prior corresponding period and a 15% lift on the previous quarter.

Zip Co also more than doubled its receivables and transaction volume during the quarter. Receivables increased 118% on the prior corresponding period to $783.6 million and quarterly transaction volume lifted 111% to a record of $402.1 million.

This was driven by a 55% lift in merchants to 17,890 and a 66% jump in customer numbers to 1,414,584. The latter was despite the company closing 57,331 accounts as a result of a one-off exercise to close aged accounts with zero balances.






228


----------



## frugal.rock (31 October 2019)

My two cents as per tipping comp
T's & C's.
1. Z1P recently acquired ASX300 status
2. While I suspect it may go a bit lower yet than close of 3.76 today, 
the general upward trend seems to point to it hitting 6.00 or thereabouts in a relatively short period of time.
3. It's not a stock, it's a yo-yo
4. Not financial advice above, do your own research.
F.Rock


----------



## Zaxon (31 October 2019)

frugal.rock said:


> 3. It's not a stock, it's a yo-yo



Most stocks are yo-yos.


----------



## frugal.rock (1 November 2019)

Some stocks are like stairways up to a magical higher place,
others are like tumbleweed, an occasional bounce but generally just rolling along aimlessly,
and then we have stocks that behave like lemmings, they jump off a cliff for no good reason.
So to say most stocks are yo-yos?, now, that's not really true at all...
F.Rock


----------



## bigdog (7 November 2019)

*"Zip Strikes Strategic Agreement with Amazon Australia"* ASX announcement today











471


----------



## Zaxon (8 November 2019)

Yes, I'm very exited about the Z1P-Amazon arrangement.  This should dramatically increase the revenue Zip processes, and Amazon Australia is still pretty new, so we could get decades of growth out of this.


----------



## Zaxon (20 November 2019)

With the recent pullback of Zip, I'm hoping it will get another growth spurt and return to trend.


----------



## WolfInvestor22 (29 November 2019)

https://youth-investment-group.com/...-time-to-join-the-zip-train-or-was-ubs-right/


----------



## bigdog (29 November 2019)

Three ASX Announcements today
29/11/2019 9:55:06 AM Capital Raising Overview (uploaded file)
29/11/2019 9:11:31 AM Trading Halt

The company is aiming to raise $50 million through a non-underwritten placement to professional and sophisticated investors and a $10 million through a share purchase plan

Zip Co intends to raise the funds at an offer price of $3.70 per share. This represents a 5.6% discount to its last close price.






29/11/2019 10:06:36 AM AGM Presentation
https://www.asx.com.au/asx/statistics/displayAnnouncement.do?display=pdf&idsId=02179699

I hold
944


----------



## Trav. (2 December 2019)

bigdog said:


> Zip Co intends to raise the funds at an offer price of $3.70 per share. This represents a 5.6% discount to its last close price.




Z1P resumed trading today and as expected dipped down to $3.72 ( -4.1%)


----------



## frugal.rock (9 December 2019)

Zaxon said:


> With the recent pullback of Zip, I'm hoping it will get another growth spurt and return to trend.



I have suspected for a while that the short orders wanted it down to $3.50 which it well and truly hit around 10 minutes before pre close today. Stayed there for final close also.
Good support showing under 3.50 but I guess if it hits 3.49 or lower tomorrow, a few triggers willl be hit.
Will no doubt be interesting either way! Hoping for a positive catalyst.
F.Rock


----------



## frugal.rock (27 December 2019)

With the placement finished now and shares being listed any day now, I hope the apparent trade range lock? of ~ 3.50 to ~3.70 will lift like a early morning fog.
With any luck, some good numbers may come from the Chrissie buy period.
The current financial sector doom and gloom has me worried though.
Cheers, FRock.


----------



## bigdog (27 December 2019)

Zip announcement included:
The Board would like to thank shareholders that participated in the SPP for their support. 505,628 ordinary shares will be allotted and issued under the SPP at $3.70 per share. Allotment of the new shares is scheduled for Tuesday 31 December 2019 and the new shares are expected to be quoted on the ASX on Thursday, 2 January 2020.


----------



## frugal.rock (27 December 2019)

Ummmm, bump.
Impatient beast. Couldn't wait until January for the monthly comp....
Like a bloomin blooded pit bull on a leash...
Chomping at the bit.
F.Rock


----------



## frugal.rock (29 December 2019)

Some eyes may have noticed a
L5/XT condition code,
(late trade/cross trade) that snapped up all ASX market available shares at 3.70 after the official Closing Single Price Auction was finished on Friday.
$345,932 worth/ 93,495 shares.
It would appear that 3.70 has been headbutted and KO'd ATM.
Let's see what next week brings to the table. Cheers.
F.Rock


----------



## fergee (1 January 2020)

I have been doing a quick technical analysis of Z1P it was brought to my attention through frugal.rocks post regarding APT and Z1P. 

On the weekly the bearish RSI divergence was confirmed right at the 1.61 fib extension level and a correction occurred. It has now broken through the 2019 up trend support line indicating (IMO) that there is further downside to come here. This may create some nice buy in opportunities for those of us, myself included, who have not had a chance to get into this yet.
Just my 2c


----------



## rederob (1 January 2020)

fergee said:


> On the weekly the bearish RSI divergence was confirmed right at the 1.61 fib extension level and a correction occurred. It has now broken through the 2019 up trend support line indicating (IMO) that there is further downside to come here. This may create some nice buy in opportunities for those of us, myself included, who have not had a chance to get into this yet.
> Just my 2c



Below is free data from IC because being frugal rocks:





Trading volume over past 6 weeks shows a continuation of strong selling pressure.
Recent placement to raise around $60M at $2.70 has yet to bear fruit.
I like their product but would like a few more months to see if the cash injection is delivering results before changing my mind.


----------



## fergee (1 January 2020)

rederob said:


> Below is free data from IC because being frugal rocks:




Yes... yes it does  +  +  + = $


----------



## fergee (1 January 2020)

rederob said:


> Below is free data from IC because being frugal rocks:
> View attachment 99405
> 
> 
> ...



Nice chart rederob.

It looks probable that it goes back up to ~$4again, maybe even quickly. But there seems to be a bit of selling pressure around there according to your volume adjusted candle chart. I wouldn't be surprised if a few people who bought the issue @ $3.70 bail out for a quick 10-15% profit around there too. It would also be a trendline back test of the up trend line from the last 12months and would make an ideal short entry point IMO.


----------



## rederob (1 January 2020)

fergee said:


> Nice chartI wouldn't be surprised if a few people who bought the issue @ *$3.70* bail out for a quick 10-15% profit around there too.



I re-read my post #68 too late to fix the error, but I agree that historically that practice does weigh down on a stock's ability to as rise as rapidly as did last September.


----------



## fergee (1 January 2020)

rederob said:


> I re-read my post #68 too late to fix the error, but I agree that historically that practice does weigh down on a stock's ability to as rise as rapidly as did last September.



Don't worry about it, I knew that's what you meant  
Yeah there's usually some weak hands in the bunch that get itchy trigger fingers. I wouldn't be surprised if they need to tap the market and raise funds again in the next 12-18 months if they want to keep buying market share.
It's firmly on my watch list now so it will be interesting to see how it plays out.


----------



## Zaxon (18 January 2020)

I thought I would post the guesses from the https://www.aussiestockforums.com/threads/z1p-apt-prediction-competition.35127 thread directly into Z1P discussion area, to get a feel for what these predictions would look like.


----------



## Zaxon (18 January 2020)

This is what the Z1P yearly chart looks like:


----------



## Zaxon (18 January 2020)

This is everyone's prediction extending that chart:


----------



## tech/a (19 January 2020)

Another T/A view.

*WEEKLY CHART*

*



*


----------



## frugal.rock (19 January 2020)

frugal.rock said:


> Afterpay and Z1P on ABC news yesterday.
> Obviously good for business.
> Does ASIC really want to curtail the BNPL industry? Me thinks not, the code of practice will come in sooner or later.
> The consumer groups make no comparisons to credit cards, wonder why? It's much easier to get into bad debt via credit cards, but let's not mention banks generally charge $20 for every $1000 cash advanced for the priveledge, then typically charge
> ...



F.Rock


----------



## fergee (27 February 2020)

Z1P potentially about to make its first close below the 55 week moving average. Fridays close will be telling.


The last time it had a close below the weekly 55ma was just over 2 years ago.


----------



## frugal.rock (17 March 2020)

So, didn't know about Morningstar upgrading their recommendation for zip to strong buy.
I note, Morningstar is Westpac's analysis service.
Westpac is a Substantial holder of zip and lend money to zip also.
Z1P closed around 20% up today with a fairly late run/ spike that just kept going.
I dumped later today, small loss, but am happy to got out relatively unscathed... this time. No regrets.

I put the money into Tyro TYR instead... managed a smidge off a new 52 week low... hopefully that zips up soon...

F.Rock


----------



## bigdog (31 March 2020)

Z1P can be a great budgeting tool where you can factor repayments into your budget and spend wisely.

Up 7.8% today and well below the high of $5.86 in October 2019 and low was in this month.

Lots of folk will be soon getting their $1500 per fortnight


----------



## Knobby22 (31 March 2020)

What's the advantage of Zip compared to a credit card Big Dog?


----------



## bigdog (8 May 2020)

ASX announcement today
8/05/2020 10:04:02 AM Trading Update - Z1P Continues to Perform Strongly (Uploaded)

















876


----------



## Dona Ferentes (2 June 2020)

Zip Co shares have surged on its expansion into the United States, after the lender announced the $400 million acquisition of New York-based buy now, pay later player QuadPay in an all-scrip deal that will boost its customers to 3.5 million.

The deal will allow Zip to chase Afterpay in the high-growth US market, where consumers are turning to interest free, instalment payments as an alternative to paying with credit cards.


----------



## qldfrog (2 June 2020)

Dona Ferentes said:


> Zip Co shares have surged on its expansion into the United States, after the lender announced the $400 million acquisition of New York-based buy now, pay later player QuadPay in an all-scrip deal that will boost its customers to 3.5 million.
> 
> The deal will allow Zip to chase Afterpay in the high-growth US market, where consumers are turning to interest free, instalment payments as an alternative to paying with credit cards.



Yes, noted this today:
Let's be the devil advocate: how often have you seen an Australian company benefiting from an O/S acquisition for expansion?
From memory Slater and Gordon, NAB only to name 2 big recent ones....
Been here for 20+ years and as far as I remember it has been a rinse and repeat story... :-(
The precedents are not good but I wish ZIP will be different this time


----------



## frugal.rock (2 June 2020)

When you say precedents, are you comparing apples with apples?
We're any of the other o/s deals by BNPL subsector/ industry companies?
One only has to look at the success of After pay SP. Would you buy after pay at its current highs? I wouldn't be surprised to see it reach $60 in the next week or two.
Zip's biggest volume day on record today. Over $155 million changed hands on it today. 
Don't hold, unfortunately.


----------



## The Triangle (2 June 2020)

Dona Ferentes said:


> Zip Co shares have surged on its expansion into the United States, after the lender announced the $400 million acquisition of New York-based buy now, pay later player QuadPay in an all-scrip deal that will boost its customers to 3.5 million.
> 
> The deal will allow Zip to chase Afterpay in the high-growth US market, where consumers are turning to interest free, instalment payments as an alternative to paying with credit cards.



I have an unfounded view that Australians cannot compete with Americans in America.   For zip to buy quadpay it likely means that a lot of Americans turned down the opportunity first.   I ask - how many times has an Australian company successfully built up a business or expansion in the US?   I think maybe MSB might be the only one doing well, but they were kind of already there.  Also, if you want a pair of jeans or runners in the US, you just smash a shop window and take them.  Simple.  BNPL has no place there.  Smash and grab all the way.

On a side note I presume this is why my shares in FXL jumped up 16% today.    I don't know why After-pay doesn't just use its script to buy out both FXL and Zip and just crush any competition.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (11 June 2020)

The Triangle said:


> I have an unfounded view that Australians cannot compete with Americans in America.   For zip to buy quadpay it likely means that a lot of Americans turned down the opportunity first.



interesting observation. ... It's going to break through or break, I suspect. One school of thought is that 'money' is being redefined and the first mover advantage is producing winners that happen to be AU. The countervailing view is the big guns will mobilise and crush the upstarts



> When he finished an investor briefing this week on Zip Co’s transformative acquisition in the United States, co-founder Larry Diamond was asked where he thought the buy now, pay later player would be in three years time. It was telling his answer referenced PayPal, the US payments giant spun out of eBay five years ago.
> 
> “The shifts in sands we are seeing across Australia and globally are providing enormous tailwinds,” he said. “We have an ambition to have a global brand and global platform that is respected as a true payment leader … Just cast your eye on how many customers PayPal has – hundreds of millions. There is no reason we can’t build something similar over time.”
> 
> ...





> And now, as Reserve Bank assistant governor Michelle Bullock said this week: "COVID-19 might be the ultimate disrupter (because) both merchants and consumers appear to have been keen to reduce their use of cash.”
> 
> But as more payments go electronic, Zip and Afterpay are winning millions of customers because they're thinking more broadly than just facilitating a payment through their short-term instalment products. Both are intent on creating an ecosystem, a platform, a new shopping experience. And for now, at least, the retailing sector has been willing to pay up for access to digital-savvy customers, allowing the buy now, pay later providers to do away with interest charges, boosting customer loyalty.





> Buy now, pay later receives far more attention than its volumes deserve; its overall share of the payments pie is still minuscule compared with credit and debit card payments. The Reserve Bank estimated only $6 billion of buy now, pay later volume in 2019 - a number that would be at least twice as big this year given the rapid growth rates being reported by the listed players. But even at $15 billion or $20 billion, this is still tiny given annual spending on debit cards of $350 billion, and on credit cards of $270 billion.
> 
> But it's the growth rate capturing attention. As Diamond pointed out: “This was a sector that didn’t exist a few years ago, and in the next years, it is going to look incredibly different."



https://www.afr.com/companies/finan...-global-forcing-bank-response-20200605-p54zt1


----------



## Dona Ferentes (23 June 2020)

The facts







> Zip Co advised that a number of directors have sold shares this month. This includes Managing Director Larry Diamond, Chairman Philip Crutchfield, and Company Secretary David Franks.
> 
> According to one change of director’s interest notice, Mr Diamond offloaded a total of ~5.5 million through a series of on-market trades between 18 June and 19 June. The managing director received an average of $6.125 per share, which equates to a total consideration of ~$33.7 million.
> 
> ...



the usual bumph...







> In response to the sales, Zip Co released an announcement which explains why the sales were made. According to the release, the directors sold these shares to pay personal and/or related party tax obligations, reduce personal and/or related party debt commitments, and to allow them to diversify a minor part of their total investment in Zip Co.



... these directors are still heavily invested in the company, which means their interests remain aligned with shareholders.

In fact, although these were sizeable sales, in aggregate, the directors sold less than 10% of their holdings in the company. Furthermore, all three directors have confirmed that they have no present intention to sell any further shares in the medium term.


----------



## Dona Ferentes (25 July 2020)

_*Livewire Markets*_: Okay. Blake, buy now, pay later has been all the rage. Zip. Buy, hold, or sell?







> _*Blake Henricks (FireTrail)*_: Zip is a *sell*. When you think about these growing markets, it generally is winner takes all. Afterpay is probably going to be the one. And the other thing we have done is we actually took all the analyst expectations for all the buy now, pay laters and what the TAM (total addressable market) is, and I will tell you what, this is going to be a huge market if they're all right. We do not think they are. It is a Sell.



.
_*Livewire Markets*_: Zip Co has been the laggard in the buy now, pay later space. It has only gone up 100 per cent this year. Buy, hold, or sell?







> _*Jun Bei Liu (Tribeca)*_: It is *absolutely a buy *for me. Well in many parts of the technology space, if the market is small enough, it's winner that takes all, but this is an enormous market. In the US, a couple of BNPL players have now, with all that investment, only penetrated 1 per cent of the US market; 8 per cent in Australia versus 1 per cent in the US. Now Zip Co just bought into that market. And now Zip has exposure to eight different markets. Now, there's Canada, there's UK. There are so many markets that could potentially be coming online. It's enormous now. And this market is real because we've seen Silicon Valley investors putting money in Zip. We've seen Tencent putting money with Afterpay. And potentially there will be more further M&A and activity picking up because they are taking notice that this is a real market....





> So today Afterpay said they now can be sold through Google Pay, Apple Pay, all of that. QuadPay, which has been acquired by Zip, is already on there. So, the market is enormous and they bought a great platform onto it. And in terms of market cap, Afterpay at $18 billion, Zip, $2.5 billion. And Afterpay has 10 million customers. Zip has now, including the acquisition, over three, close to four million customers. So Zip has a long runway to go. By then probably Afterpay will be in the top five Australian companies, but Zip certainly will catch up quite a lot on that basis.




(Now there's confidence in BNPL)

( _DNH_ )


----------



## frugal.rock (11 September 2020)

With Z1P having a nice pull back, I am in under $6 this morning.
Recent high of $10.64 just 11 days ago on a day when it opened at $10.46... wow.
I envisage After pay potentially getting sold down and many pundits jumping ship onto Z1P.
Either way, an certainly expecting a good run from now especially with QuadPay now fully onboard.
Customers galore.
6 month chart, I don't see much downside from here on in...


----------



## doogie_goes_off (4 December 2020)

I haven't time to put together a TA chart but I could see this drop back to $4 before half year financials come out. 'Descending triangle'


----------



## Ferret (3 January 2021)

My final pick for the 2021 comp.

It's chart doesn't look to good at present, but as a company it seems to be making good progress.  Hoping it will turn around during 2021.


----------



## frugal.rock (21 January 2021)

Ferret said:


> My final pick for the 2021 comp.
> 
> It's chart doesn't look to good at present, but as a company it seems to be making good progress.  Hoping it will turn around during 2021.



Nice pick Ferret.
Market likes the news, eh?
I was wondering what catalyst would spark zip up again.
I have long expected Z1P to follow Afterpay up the ladder. Surely Afterpay is overbought by now...
Will this push give it the legs to get back and over the $10  mark?
A 5 minute chart


----------



## jamezo10 (21 January 2021)

Here is my reason for the competition of 2021!
Zip in my opinion is going to be huge. Today it is up 22%! I believe Larry Diamond will take this company very far. I have been involved with Zip for quite a while and truly believe with them going global, this stock will have a huge 2021. It is only just the beginning. For this reason I have made them my number 1 stock for 2021 (apart from CRO which I’ve been a big fan of for a long time).
I love using the Zip product, makes my life so much easier! I know a lot of others who also use Zip constantly and prefer this BNPL rather than using Afterpay.
Hopefully Zip continues the amazing work and will be a clear winner for this year.


----------



## Ferret (8 February 2021)

AFR reporting that Zip is considering a US listing.  Up strongly today on the news.

Paywalled article:









						Zip Co goes shopping for US investors, mulls second listing
					

Payments group Zip Co is going to the home of rival Afterpay’s biggest supporters to try to bridge a $35 billion valuation gap between the two companies.




					www.afr.com


----------



## jamezo10 (8 February 2021)

Fantas


Ferret said:


> AFR reporting that Zip is considering a US listing.  Up strongly today on the news.
> 
> Paywalled article:
> 
> ...



Excellent!!


----------



## Colm Doc (17 April 2021)

jamezo10 said:


> Here is my reason for the competition of 2021!
> Zip in my opinion is going to be huge. Today it is up 22%! I believe Larry Diamond will take this company very far. I have been involved with Zip for quite a while and truly believe with them going global, this stock will have a huge 2021. It is only just the beginning. For this reason I have made them my number 1 stock for 2021 (apart from CRO which I’ve been a big fan of for a long time).
> I love using the Zip product, makes my life so much easier! I know a lot of others who also use Zip constantly and prefer this BNPL rather than using Afterpay.
> Hopefully Zip continues the amazing work and will be a clear winner for this year.



Yes, as a holder I hope you are right. After raising $400mil. to enter other large markets global domination seems to be their goal. I’m worried that it might be too much too soon. (thoughts)


----------



## over9k (18 April 2021)

Wild ride this thing's had, almost tripling in three weeks, then halving, then shooting up another 25% in a week. Can anyone explain?


----------



## beejeboi (23 April 2021)

Theres talks the company could go to the US which is big news. surely that would be massive for the SP. Theres also talks of entering the crypto space. IDK what to make of it








						Zippay (Z1p.ASX) Raising Capital, Maybe Crypto Peer-Peer Lending is Looming? - Prophet Invest | Investing and Wealth
					

ZIPPAY (Z1P.ASX) RAISING CAPITAL, MAYBE CRYPTO PEER-PEER LENDING IS LOOMING?




					prophet-invest.com


----------



## Colm Doc (7 May 2021)

beejeboi said:


> Theres talks the company could go to the US which is big news. surely that would be massive for the SP. Theres also talks of entering the crypto space. IDK what to make of it
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Good news coming from Z1P all the time so why has the share price been falling recently? Is it part of a broader market correction or is the BNPL space yesterday’s news?


----------



## over9k (7 May 2021)

Inflation fears. Tech is much more sensitive to inflation fears and the hot tech is the most sensitive. If you go to this thread https://www.aussiestockforums.com/t...of-a-sars-coronavirus-outbreak.35169/page-229 and read from 16 feb onwards when the snowstorm hit, you'll see what I mean.


----------



## over9k (7 May 2021)

APT & Z1P both right on support levels now:


----------



## greggles (18 June 2021)

Looks like Z1P was oversold under $7 during May and June. It is looking much healthier now and has just poked its head over $8 today. With the Australian economy on the road to recovery, we should be seeing more activity in retail in the second half of 2021.

The most recent April figures are showing improvement.






I think we'll see a little more bullish price action from Z1P between now and the end of the year as long as the recovery in retail spending remains on track.


----------



## Tommy Shelby (24 June 2021)

over9k said:


> APT & Z1P both right on support levels now:
> View attachment 123872
> View attachment 123871




Good Op over9k - Support levels held and price has bounced back. the question is if its on for a sustainable run


----------



## over9k (24 June 2021)

I've trimmed some APT today. Not often a 6% run doesn't get a pullback, even if just over the next day or two.

FYI: They're both just following the U.S tech trend - the inflation fears are now in the rear view mirror and so tech is now running again. I've been over this in length in the virus thread. I could plot APT over FNGU to show you how closely they've followed each other but I don't think there's any need as you've probably gotten the point by now.


----------



## Gunnerguy (15 July 2021)

Thinking about a 7.25/7.00 bear spread for August or September. Will Z1P recover with the announcements of APPL and CBA getting in to BNPL ?

Gunnerguy
(Options trading beginner)


----------



## Colm Doc (17 July 2021)

Gunnerguy said:


> Thinking about a 7.25/7.00 bear spread for August or September. Will Z1P recover with the announcements of APPL and CBA getting in to BNPL ?
> 
> Gunnerguy
> (Options trading beginner)



I don’t think Z1P will be around much longer, the BNPL companies will consolidate and Z1P is not (globally) the biggest player. I could be wrong, I usually am but to much uncertainty for me. Sold all my lot on the Apple news, doubled my money so can’t complain. Looking at the lithium scene next, 🤷🏻‍♂️


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## frugal.rock (19 July 2021)

Some may know I have followed Z1P and BNPL for a while.
I have re-entered last week with a buying the dip outlook.

By my loose ball park calculations, there's still *immediate* growth room for 8 to 10x current worldwide BNPL market. (Overall, not saying Z1P specifically)
That's current space for growth only.
Future growth space depends on many things including population aging, ie; younger people coming of age where they are working/ borrowing etc.

A vote of confidence from Bank of America which owns a good chunk of Z1P and have increased their holding.
Substantial holding increase announcement lodged this morning.

 I will be holding until it hits the $10 area, unless it looks like it will get through that area with a bit of gusto.
iSL set at $5.70


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## frugal.rock (20 July 2021)

2 steps on the way...


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## barney (20 July 2021)

frugal.rock said:


> I have re-entered last week with a buying the dip outlook.




Good call and well done Rock


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## Gunnerguy (26 July 2021)

Dear Z1P enthusiasts,

I am considering a Short 5/10 Strangle on Z1P for September.
Selling a Put at $5 strike , and Selling a Call at $10 strike.
Not a great premium, however breakevens are $4.8 (-30%) and $10.2 (+46%).
Background - if I get assigned the Put I am happy to take the Z1P shares at $5.

Comments, critics greatfully recieved.

Gunnerguy.
(Just trying to use the IV of Z1P)


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## peter2 (16 September 2021)

I read that *Z1P* is considering allowing their US customers to transact using cryptos. Seems like desperation to me as they can't get the customer numbers up. 

*Z1P* is too volatile for me to recommend as a short position.


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## Miner (17 December 2021)

Who is next ? ZIP APT and ??
US regulators probing Afterpay and Zip over buy now, pay later consumer protections








						US regulators probing Afterpay and Zip over buy now, pay later consumer protections
					

Australian companies Afterpay and Zip are being probed by US regulators over their consumer protections, as the buy now, pay later sector booms and concerns grow about customer debt.




					www.abc.net.au


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## Miner (17 December 2021)

Miner said:


> Who is next ? ZIP APT and ??
> US regulators probing Afterpay and Zip over buy now, pay later consumer protections
> 
> 
> ...











						BNPL bloodbath: Sector sells off again after US regulators flag more oversight - Stockhead
					

The CFPB said on its website that it was particularly concerned about the impact BNPL providers have on the accumulation of consumer debt.




					stockhead.com.au


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## Ferret (30 December 2021)

I picked this in the 2021 comp.  It shot out of the blocks in January and has now fallen in a heap.

I'm picking it again, in the belief that BNPL isn't dead and buried.


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## bigdog (28 February 2022)

Lots of announcements today including trading halt and half yearly results

Buy now, pay later operator Zip is seeking to buy ASX-listed rival Sezzle in a $491 million deal that Zip says will accelerate its path to profitability, as it faces tougher industry conditions.

Zip on Monday said it was offering 0.98 Zip shares for every Sezzle share, which represented a 22 per cent premium to Sezzle’s closing price. The announcement came as Zip also reported a $214.3 million loss for the December half.

The merger, which was supported by both company boards, is aimed at giving the businesses greater scale in the crucial US market, where the BNPL firms are trying to take on a deep-seated shift away from credit cards. BNPL firms provide short-term interest free loans, which make revenue from fees charged to merchants and in some cases from consumers.
Zip chief executive Larry Diamond acknowledged Zip was under more pressure to be profitable, and he argued the merger would support this goal.

“”We are delighted to be bringing Zip and Sezzle together under a transformational transaction that is expected to deliver immediate scale and enhanced growth, which will support our path to profitability. Combining with Sezzle positions us as a leading global BNPL provider and prioritises our ability to win in the important US market,” Mr Diamond said.
Zip is raising $148.7 million in new equity to help strengthen its balance sheet and “execute on the potential synergies” from the Sezzle deal.

Zip, an ASX-listed rival to Afterpay, also on Monday reported revenue was up 89 per cent to $302.2 million and customer numbers were also growing, but it also made a $214.3 million loss.

BNPL company shares have plunged in recent months, as the prospect of interest rate rises has hit loss-making technology companies especially hard.

Zip’s results said the loss was driven by a number of non-recurring items, including acquisition costs, re-branding costs, and the impairment of goodwill in its UK business. It also said that its margin fell from 3.7 per cent to 2.1 per cent in the period due to higher credit losses.


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## Miner (1 March 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> 2 steps on the way...
> 
> View attachment 127606




In twelve months Z1P like many BNPL, has reached at near $2 with a SELL


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## frugal.rock (1 March 2022)

Miner said:


> In twelve months Z1P like many BNPL, has reached at near $2 with a SELL



Clearly the time to buy then isn't it?
It's undone around 2 years of SP gain in around 4 months.
I would think in the coming years it should do quite well, depending on pending legislation of course.


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## Miner (1 March 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> Clearly the time to buy then isn't it?
> It's undone around 2 years of SP gain in around 4 months.
> I would think in the coming years it should do quite well, depending on pending legislation of course.



Good luck mate @frugal.rock 
I do not have any more Lotto Luck or coins to be at Crown after reading the following clocks for 1 day ,  7 days and 30 days  scenarios.
Could be misleading data to influence market however. Could stoppage of Russia money flow be a blow for these BNPL stocks ? Who knows wherefrom the BNPL companies money to support the lending ?? :


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## frugal.rock (7 March 2022)

ASX Release 
7 March 2022 

Directors purchase Zip shares 
Zip Co Limited (ASX: Z1P) (“Zip”, or the “Company”) wishes to inform the market that on 4 and 7 March 2022, co-founders Larry Diamond and Peter Gray purchased approximately $1.5 million of Zip shares (873,198 shares). 

The Non-executive Directors, including chair Diane Smith-Gander, also purchased Zip shares on 4 March 2022. 
Under Zip’s Securities Trading Policy between 31 December 2021 and 2 March 2022, Zip’s Personnel (including the  
Board) were prohibited from trading in Zip’s shares (due to their knowledge of market sensitive information). 

In addition, due to the structure and timing of the institutional placement announced 28 February 2022, it would have  
been difficult for the directors to participate without seeking shareholder approval. 

While market factors and external conditions have impacted the fintech and broader technology sector in recent months, the co-founders continue to believe that the market opportunity to deliver transparent, fair, and innovative  
financial products remains significant. 

The founders remain committed to the successful execution of Zip's strategy and in delivering long-term value creation for all shareholders.


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## Miner (7 March 2022)

Miner said:


> Good luck mate @frugal.rock
> I do not have any more Lotto Luck or coins to be at Crown after reading the following clocks for 1 day ,  7 days and 30 days  scenarios.
> Could be misleading data to influence market however. Could stoppage of Russia money flow be a blow for these BNPL stocks ? Who knows wherefrom the BNPL companies money to support the lending ?? :
> 
> ...





			https://cdn-api.markitdigital.com/apiman-gateway/ASX/asx-research/1.0/file/2924-02496337-2A1361729?access_token=83ff96335c2d45a094df02a206a39ff4
		



			https://cdn-api.markitdigital.com/apiman-gateway/ASX/asx-research/1.0/file/2924-02495524-2A1361153?access_token=83ff96335c2d45a094df02a206a39ff4
		

A coin has two sides and stories.
Directors bought because of their skin on the game and that is good solidarity, unlike PDN directors who sold substantial out.
However financial institutions have no love excepting the blood and that too they need fresh or leave the prey to catch up another.


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## frugal.rock (10 March 2022)

Some stocks are a little different to lotto Mr Miner... Explorers are more like lotto tickets.

The OBV indicator paints a picture ? Will history repeat, yet again?


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## Miner (10 March 2022)

frugal.rock said:


> Some stocks are a little different to lotto Mr Miner... Explorers are more like lotto tickets.
> 
> The OBV indicator paints a picture ? Will history repeat, yet again?
> 
> View attachment 138881



The first lotto winner was a person in the name of Paddy Hannan


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## Gunnerguy (24 March 2022)

Took a bite yesterday. Just for fun.
With IV at 81% or so  I bought a very small amount of the stock and immediately sold covered calls against them. Not surprising there is good premium.
Went down 6% or so today, but hoping to sell covered calls every 2-3 weeks.
Let’s see if I can get some premium for a few weeks/months.
If they continue to fall ill just try to keep getting premium and sell for CGT losses against my main investment portfolio gains. I’ll sell an equivalent gain/loss amount (of another stock) for gains against the Z1P loss, and Ms. Gunnerguy will buy back the sold company at the same time.
Gunnerguy.
(God damn tired of the continuous narrative of Covid).


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## Gunnerguy (25 March 2022)

Does anyone know where I can get historical options pricings (and deltas) on ASX shares ?

Gunnerguy


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## Gunnerguy (25 March 2022)

Considering .....similar to my Z1P trade earlier (except that I don't actually like Z1P).

OZL : Buy 1,000 @ 26.89 = $26,890.
Sell 27C 21April, 27 DTE, PM = $1,000.
If assigned => Net $1,110 on $26,890 = 4%  in 27 days.
If no assigned => Retain PM of $1,000.

I like OZL for long term so if I don't get assigned I am happy.

Any thoughts ?

Gunnerguy.


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## Miner (26 March 2022)

some borrowed information.


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## System (21 April 2022)

On April 21st, 2022, Zip Co Limited changed its ASX code from Z1P to ZIP.


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## peter2 (21 April 2022)

LOL don't think that change will fool anyone.  Zip's on the way to zero, zilch, nada.


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## peter2 (21 April 2022)

Hey Garp,  *ZIP*, *SZL* and *SQ2* walk into a bar and order a round of drinks. The bartender asks them to pay now and drink later.


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## Miner (21 April 2022)

peter2 said:


> Hey Garp,  *ZIP*, *SZL* and *SQ2* walk into a bar and order a round of drinks. The bartender asks them to pay now and drink later.



Solid. The bar tender also told them to zip their pants 😀😃


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## CityIndex (4 May 2022)

Shares of Zip are down over 10.8%, trading at $1.03, with just over an hour of trading still to go today. 

Selling pressure seems to be stemming from a statement released by the company this morning in which they announced the release of a large volume of shares from voluntary escrow over the coming weeks. 

All trading carries risk, but after already testing they key psychological level of $1 last week, it will be interesting to see if the stock can bounce again, or will this finally see it break below.


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## peter2 (4 May 2022)

*ZIP* has gone through so many "reasonable" support levels that nothing seems reasonable now. 

I only hope that the next Gov't will regulate the BNPL as credit providers and put an end to them.


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## Gunnerguy (4 May 2022)

...... holding a small amount of ZIP shares specially for CGT losses on my tax return ....

😂😂😂😂😂😂🙂

Gunnerguy


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## Summer (4 June 2022)

Hi there, can anyone throw any Light on ZIP Shares.My Daughter has a lot & down an extremely amount of Money.
There is talk on other Forums they are headed for Bankruptcy.
We are terribly concerned as she was talked into by a friend .
They say the CEO is a bit Dodgy.
We are trying to talk her into
selling what but of money she has left.Thank you in Advance .


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## Sean K (5 June 2022)

Summer said:


> Hi there, can anyone throw any Light on ZIP Shares.My Daughter has a lot & down an extremely amount of Money.
> There is talk on other Forums they are headed for Bankruptcy.
> We are terribly concerned as she was talked into by a friend .
> They say the CEO is a bit Dodgy.
> ...




I suppose she has to ask herself why she bought them and if those reasons are still valid. Did she have an actual plan for holding, selling, short-term, long-term. I've got no idea if these guys are making any money, but by the chart it looks like whatever they were supposed to deliver a year ago has not been achieved, or their business model is wrong, or the sector they're trading in has gone a little off the boil. Chart looks disastrous. If this is the only thing she's invested in it might be a good lesson to not put all your eggs in one basket, or do a bit more research and have a plan to sell if you lose X amount of dollars. Sounds like she didn't have a plan at all. Good luck.


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## Austwide (5 June 2022)

I have traded ZIP 3 times (2 wins 1even) I haven't paid any real attention to its financial side. It was heavily pushed on social media which led to many inexperienced investors? buying it. It peaked at around $14 and now down to $0.79. I think every year it made bigger losses than previous years with no sign a profit in sight.

Its seems to have lost its media support and institution support so who knows where it will bottom. It is levelling out a bit but still making lower lows.
@peter2 suggested Zip's on the way to zero, zilch, nada. It does have a very large customer base and with a better product may avoid zero but I am not willing to back that.

@Summer Sorry for your daughters losses but without an exit plan at a small loss ZIP becomes a problem (quite common amongst a lot of investors). 

Chart looks bad, fundamentals look bad, sector looks bad.

If she has already lost maybe 80 - 90%, may be too late to sell and it is trading around its July 2018 value.

Its up to her to decided based on her financial position.


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## Sean K (6 June 2022)

In the Fin:






As the stock’s implosion accelerated through 2022, retail investors actually got offered last March’s capital raising at a $1.48 per share, on a 22 per cent discount to what the professionals paid at $1.90.

But with shares at 79¢ today everybody’s underwater and the retail bag holders are nursing paper losses around $11 million from the $24 million cash they paid for more Zip shares.

In just a few months total paper losses on the raising are close to $100 million on the $172.7 million raised. The latter amount is only just enough to cover the $148.3 million in bad debts Zip wracked up over the six months to the end of 2021.

That fact goes a long way to explaining why Zip shares can’t catch a bid like they used to and why some Gen Z investors are facing painful financial lessons.


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## Dona Ferentes (22 June 2022)

Sean K said:


> As the stock’s implosion accelerated through 2022, retail investors actually got offered last March’s capital raising at a $1.48 per share, on a 22 per cent discount to what the professionals paid at $1.90.
> 
> But with shares at 79¢ today everybody’s underwater and the retail bag holders are nursing paper losses around $11 million from the $24 million cash they paid for more Zip shares.



It seems like 79c was a wonderful trade, and not so long ago. .... now *47c*.



Sean K said:


> In just a few months total paper losses on the raising are close to $100 million on the $172.7 million raised. The latter amount is only just enough to cover the $148.3 million in bad debts Zip wracked up over the six months to the end of 2021. That fact goes a long way to explaining why Zip shares can’t catch a bid like they used to and why* some Gen Z investors are facing painful financial lessons.*



 and yet they're not giving up, ...

_Zip has moved to reassure the market that it is “__*well placed to respond to, and offset, the effects of rising interest rates*__” through a series of new initiatives which are underway. These include _

_consumer fee increases, _
_merchant repricing, _
_increased customer repayment velocity, and _
_weighted average margin benefits from the refinancing of legacy receivables._



> _“The US business in particular is resilient to a rising rate environment relative to credit cards and other consumer credit businesses, with any 25 basis point rise in base rate only impacting cost of funds by around 2 basis points per transaction,” Zip said._



_The company said it had “sufficient headroom” to support transaction growth, with $401.9 million undrawn and available in Australia, and $US168.1 million in the US as of March 31.

Zip added it remains “well-funded” with $303 million in cash and liquidity, plus an additional $24 million raised from its share purchase plan in April, which it expects to be sufficient to see it through to cash flow breakeven in FY24.

.............................._
all I see is that they are well placed to fall in a heap. Do you take the tax loss this year, or next?

(DNH)


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## Gunnerguy (22 June 2022)

Dona Ferentes said:


> It seems like 79c was a wonderful trade, and not so long ago. .... now *47c*.
> 
> 
> and yet they're not giving up, ...
> ...



Take the tax loss next year ..... it’ll be bigger
😂😂😂😂


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## CityIndex (12 July 2022)

Reports suggest that Zip will pay Sezzle 11 million USD after citing changes in economic and market conditions as the reason for the mutual termination of their merger agreement.

Seems like the move is having an impact on the Block shares as well with the Afterpay owner’s stock down just over 3% at the time of writing.


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## Dona Ferentes (21 July 2022)

> ZIP  declined to provide any guidance on losses for the quarter or FY 2022 and warned it may impair the value of its Quadpay, Spotti, and Twisto businesses.



_My rule of thumb, if it's a wanky name it's a wonky business._


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## Austwide (29 July 2022)

ZIP had a bit of a run lately, from around 50c to a peak of $1.72 this morning, but I think it's all over.

Currently at 10:45 back to $1.31.


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## waterbottle (29 July 2022)

Zip and BNPL et al. Are probably THE bellwether stocks for the NASDAQ risk trade.... Interesting movements today. Closing time will tell if the ASX Friday risk dump lives on


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## Dona Ferentes (25 August 2022)

_Merely a flesh wound_

Zip Co has posted a FY 2022 net loss of $1.1 billion after tax attributable to members and a total loss of $1 billion after adjusting for foreign exchange differences.

_Group impairments and writedowns totalled $821.1 million. _
_Total bad debts for the year reached $276.1 million._
_Revenue climbed 57 per cent over the year to $620 million_
_Total transaction volume up 51 per cent to $8.7 billion. _
_Total customer numbers increased 56 per cent to 11.4 million, _
_Ttotal merchants up 77 per cent to 90,700._
_Available cash and liquidity sat at $279 million as at 30 June_.
The impairment charges are related to the write-down in goodwill of the value of overseas acquisitions in the United Kingdom, United States, Singapore, the Czech Republic (Twisto) and United Arab Emirates (Spotii).


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## Miner (28 August 2022)

https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/other-industries/australian-buy-now-pay-later-provider-zip-reveals-1-billion-loss/news-story/efe35645f59147ab8bbdf930b56f7dd8


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## waterbottle (28 August 2022)

Will be interesting to see what happens Monday. Affirm (US BNPL)  tanked 21% on Friday on poor earnings....


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## qldfrog (28 August 2022)

Miner said:


> https://www.news.com.au/finance/business/other-industries/australian-buy-now-pay-later-provider-zip-reveals-1-billion-loss/news-story/efe35645f59147ab8bbdf930b56f7dd8



I can not even comprehend how you can lose 1billion;
229m in bad debt..I mean really you send free money to unsolvable people worth a quarter billion in a year??
Thanks god or common sense i do not hold now


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## Belli (28 August 2022)

This sector brings back fond memories of the dot.com era.  Never held any of them but like the BNPL sector it was interesting to watch - and read the stories of "Oh but I thought...." and "Will someone i.e. Guvmnt probably, please save us."


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