# Has Clive Palmer gone loco?



## rumpole (20 March 2012)

Green groups funded by the CIA ?

Does anyone believe that ?
-------------------------------------------
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-03-20/palmer-says-green-groups-funded-by-cia/3901920?WT.svl=news0

Mining magnate Clive Palmer has accused the United States government of funding environmental group Greenpeace via the CIA to undermine Australia's coal mining sector.

Mr Palmer made the extraordinary claim over Greenpeace's plan to use the court system to tie up coal mining applications.

He is angry at Greenpeace's plan to use lawyers to thwart future coal mining projects and claims funding is coming from US environmental charity the Rockefeller Foundation.

He alleges it is funded by the CIA and says it is trying to harm Australia's industry and help American interests.

Mr Palmer referred to a paper produced by environmental group Greenpeace which calls for action to stop the expansion of the Queensland coal industry.

Greenpeace's plans were leaked to the media earlier this month as it organises a campaign to raise $6 million to fund legal battles against controversial coal mining projects across Australia.

"You only have to go back and read the Church Report in the 1970s and to read the reports to the US Congress which sets up the Rockefeller Foundation as a conduit of CIA funding," he said.

"You only have to look at their secret budget which was passed by Congress last year, bigger than our whole national economy, which the CIA's got to ensure that.

"You only have to read the reports to US Congress when the CIA reported to the president that their role was to ensure the US competitive advantage and economic advantages.

"That's how you know it's funded by the CIA."

Mr Palmer says Greenpeace should be under far greater scrutiny.

"If you've got anyone funding directly, political parties funding lawyers to obstruct our laws in this country, it's something you should be ashamed of," he said.

    This is a serious matter indeed because it goes to the political independence of all Australians.
    Clive Palmer

He then picked out veteran Greens campaigner Drew Hutton.

"Drew Hutton is a tool of the US government and Rockefeller, and so are the Greens; everything they say. It's as simple as that," Mr Palmer said.

"I think the Greens in this coming state election, all their candidates should resign if they are being funded by an offshore political power," Mr Palmer said.

"It is tantamount to treason. Something needs to be done about it."
'Bizarre'

Mr Hutton, who was consulted in the document by Greenpeace, says there is no money from the Rockefeller Foundation.

"I have no idea where he got that amount of money from," Mr Hutton said.

"Certainly there's no amount of money that I'm aware of that's come to my organisation, or for that matter any organisation that I'm aware of, by the Rockefeller Foundation or anybody else.

"(This is) the first I've ever been accused of having any links with the CIA, I can assure you."

He says Mr Palmer's claims are bizarre.

"I just think that's a bridge too far," Mr Hutton said.

"I don't even understand the argument, to tell you the truth."

Federal Greens leader Bob Brown says Mr Palmer is a major donor to the Liberal National Party (LNP) and the party should distance itself from him.

"They should disown these comments," Senator Brown said.

In a statement, Greenpeace senior campaigner John Hepburn rejected Mr Palmer's comments as "ludicrous".

He said Greenpeace would not accept money from any government, corporation or secret service.
Court action

Mr Palmer is active politically and within the courts system.

One of the Coalition's biggest financial donors and a member of the Liberal National Party, Mr Palmer last week announced his companies were preparing legal action based on advice the Government's carbon tax legislation was unconstitutional.

But he will not be joining into any High Court action to stop the Federal Government's mining tax despite saying it is bad for the economy.

"It probably won't cost me anything because I'm not mining anything that comes under the classification of it," he said.

But Mr Palmer is set to sue international hotel operator Hyatt for $60 million over its management of the Sunshine Coast Hyatt resort, which Mr Palmer owns.

The magnate is alleging the company has been siphoning profits from the resort and sending the money to the US rather than the resort's owners.


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## orr (20 March 2012)

A quotation by Bertrand Russell gives his interpretation of megalomania: "The megalomaniac differs from the narcissist by the fact that he wishes to be powerful rather than charming, and seeks to be feared rather than loved. To this type belong many lunatics and most of the great men of history."[5]

Early Freudianism

Russell's near-contemporary, Sigmund Freud, freely used the same term in a comparable way. Referring with respect to an adult neurotic to 'the omnipotence which he ascribed to his thoughts and feelings', Freud reckoned that 'this belief is a frank acknowledgement of a relic of the old megalomania of infancy'.[6] Similarly Freud concluded that 'we can detect an element of megalomania in most other forms of paranoic disorder. We are justified in assuming that this megalomania is essentially of an infantile nature and that, as development proceeds, it is sacrificed to social considerations'.[7]

Just a guess but, you get the idea.


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## tinhat (20 March 2012)

I've got a feeling the Clive Palmer story is not going to end well. It's going to be a ripper read when it is written down and published but it's not going to end well. Alan Bond was once a billionaire too. I wonder if Paul Barry is starting to do his research on Palmer.


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## McLovin (21 March 2012)

tinhat said:


> I've got a feeling the Clive Palmer story is not going to end well.




While I don't wish anyone ill health, Clive Palmer is about 50kgs overweight in his 50's and has already had a heart attack. I have a feeling the story will end rather soon, unless he can improve his health.

That being said, I wonder if the cholesterol is blocking the arteries to his head because some of his recent ranting has been bizarre. He's in bed with the reds but he constantly rabbits on about dictatorships, freedom of speech etc.


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## Calliope (21 March 2012)

Has Clive Palmer gone loco? No I don't think so. He is just using the same sort of spin and making similar far-fetched accusations as Gillard and Bligh do when they are rubbishing Abbott and Newman.


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## tinhat (21 March 2012)

It's just occurred to me, after reading today's fairfax markets live blog, that the Chinese may have implanted some kind of thought control chip into Palmer's head. That would explain the anti-US conspiracy theory propaganda.


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## blue0810 (21 March 2012)

Gordo pero no loco. He is just enjoying it. For  freedom  ofspeech 
A psychiatric is not required.


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## rumpole (21 March 2012)

blue0810 said:


> Gordo pero no loco. He is just enjoying it. For  freedom  ofspeech
> A psychiatric is not required.




He may well have defamed someone. I hope he enjoys it if he's taken to court.


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## DB008 (21 March 2012)

McLovin said:


> While I don't wish anyone ill health, Clive Palmer is about 50kgs overweight in his 50's and has already had a heart attack. I have a feeling the story will end rather soon, unless he can improve his health.
> 
> That being said, I wonder if the cholesterol is blocking the arteries to his head because some of his recent ranting has been bizarre. He's in bed with the reds but he constantly rabbits on about dictatorships, freedom of speech etc.




Clive or Gina? She's a big girl too.


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## sinner (21 March 2012)

Personally, having seen some of the State Department cables released by Wikileaks, I find it very easy to believe what Mr Palmer is saying. I think it would be naive to dismiss his statements outright.

Anybody here read the Church Report?

I found this the other day 

http://digitalseance.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/the-cia-in-australia2.pdf


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## moXJO (21 March 2012)

Since all we get is the one wacky  soundbite here is the rest of his rant:

*Mining magnate Clive Palmer has accused the Australian Greens and Queensland environmental campaigners of “treason” in conspiring with US powers to destroy the nation’s coal industry.

Mr Palmer was expected to give his response to the passing of the Gillard government’s mining tax at a media conference called this afternoon, but the multi-billionaire was concerned only with perceived collusion between the United States’ Central Intelligence Agency and the environmental lobby.

Mr Palmer turned his attention to a report by Greenpeace and other anti-coal groups, titled Stopping the Australian Coal Export Boom, which outlined an environmental campaign designed to disrupt and delay the expansion of the industry.

While brandishing a copy of the report this afternoon, Mr Palmer said it was the result of a CIA conspiracy involving the US-based Rockefeller Foundation.

“This is funded by the CIA,” he said.

“You only have to go back and read … the reports to the US Congress that sets up the Rockefeller Foundation as a conduit of CIA funding.

“You only have to look at the secret budget which was passed by Congress last year – bigger than our whole national economy – with the CIA to ensure that.

“You only have to read the reports to US Congress where the CIA reported to the president that their role was to ensure the US competitive advantage – that’s how you know it’s funded by the CIA.”

Mr Palmer argued descendants of US oil magnate John Rockefeller had bankrolled the report, in a bid to disrupt and damage the Australian coal industry.

He went on to say that the document confirmed local environmental campaigners, including Lock the Gate Alliance president Drew Hutton and Greens leader Bob Brown, were improperly collaborating with foreign multinationals.

“The Greens have not been providing you with the full information about where their money comes from or what it’s about,” he said.

“I think the Greens [candidates] in this upcoming state election … should resign if they’re being funded by an offshore political power.

“It’s paramount [sic] to treason and something needs to be done about it.”

Mr Palmer made little mention of mining tax legislation, passed last night in the Senate, saying he had no concern with it.

“I don’t care about any tax. It won’t affect my life one way or the other,” he said.

Mr Palmer said the controversial tax, which aims to distribute the spoils of Australia’s mining boom, would have no affect on his businesses.

“It probably won’t cost me anything, because I’m not mining anything that comes under the classification of it. So, you know, it’s not something that’s worried me,” he said.

Mr Palmer said he would not join Australia’s third largest iron ore miner, Fortescue Metals, owned by Andrew “Twiggy” Forrest, in mounting a legal challenge.

“Certainly Andrew Forrest has indicated he’ll do that – he has major concerns with it, because it affects him, affects his business and affects the ability of his workers,” Mr Palmer said.* {end rant}

So will be interested on the follow up of said document. 


> He went on to say that the document confirmed local environmental campaigners, including Lock the Gate Alliance president Drew Hutton and Greens leader Bob Brown, were improperly collaborating with foreign multinationals.




Still a massive stretch from old Clive regarding CIA but wasnt Mark Arbib a US informant

Wouldn't let me quote tag wall of text


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## DB008 (21 March 2012)




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## breaker (21 March 2012)

Gina on her way to the salad bar and Clive saying "No more f#@%$&g chips


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## Macquack (21 March 2012)

Two fat capitalist pigs.

The images of Palmer and Reinhart should be used to promote the mining super profits tax.


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## drsmith (21 March 2012)

The so-called resources super profits tax (or MRRT in it's current form) will end up being another disaster for Labor.

This limited agreement with the three big miners will just result in the resource rich states cranking up their royalties and lots of angst between those states and the feds.

Sound perhaps in principal, but poorly implemented in practice.


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## Garpal Gumnut (21 March 2012)

Macquack said:


> Two fat capitalist pigs.
> 
> The images of Palmer and Reinhart should be used to promote the mining super profits tax.




I am of wide girth and I am not a capitalist, nor a pig.

Be careful with your language.

There are many union, ALP beneficiaries and Ambassadors to Washington who are       " fat ".

Pick on them.

gg


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## rumpole (22 March 2012)

drsmith said:


> The so-called resources super profits tax (or MRRT in it's current form) will end up being another disaster for Labor.
> 
> This limited agreement with the three big miners will just result in the resource rich states cranking up their royalties and lots of angst between those states and the feds.
> 
> Sound perhaps in principal, but poorly implemented in practice.




Maybe a better method would be a surcharge on dividends paid by mining companies


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## drsmith (22 March 2012)

A better method would have been to consult more broadly with the resource industry and the states. While there would have still been the usual argy bargy between the parties, the shortcomings of the original RSPT and the current MRRT would more likely have been overcome.


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## McLovin (22 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> Maybe a better method would be a surcharge on dividends paid by mining companies




Too easy to get around...

Plus it ends up being a tax on shareholders, not companies. Try selling that to the electorate.


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## rumpole (22 March 2012)

McLovin said:


> Too easy to get around...
> 
> Plus it ends up being a tax on shareholders, not companies. Try selling that to the electorate.




I doubt if most of the electorate have shares in mining companies


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## McLovin (22 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> I doubt if most of the electorate have shares in mining companies




Maybe not directly but through super funds most would. "A great big new tax _and_ threat to your retirement savings"...


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## awg (22 March 2012)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> I am of wide girth and I am not a capitalist, nor a pig.
> 
> Be careful with your language.
> 
> ...




I could sense Wayne Swans dissapointment that Andrew "Twiggy" Forrest is of reasonably athletic build, otherwise there would have been endless imagery possible, as the other pair do have a distinctly bloated look.

Our local magnate Nathan Tinkler had become a vastly bloated 40yr old till he recently underwent stomach stapling


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## Sitar (23 March 2012)

is the CIA funding clive?   

just joking......however i suspect that clive is utterly terrified of the growing political power of the greens.  the paper he referred to as being funded by the rock-a-fella foundation was not produced by the qld. greens, but by a rapidly-growing protest group called "lock the gate".

i would like to see clive and the other mining companies begin to clean up at least some of the profound pollution their activities are causing, and to pay our government to help clean up and repair some of this damage to our soils, water, agriculture and communities.

i'm in favour of scaling back the gung-ho, macho mining gangs, and bringing in strong environmental regulations.  at the moment such guidelines are laughable, and often written by the mining companies themselves.

by the way, the mining industry in australia contributes less than 10% to GDP and employes less than 2% of the workforce.  figures are available at the oz bureau of stats.

their political influence, especially that of the foreign 'big boys', however, is far greater than their contribution to this country.


the mining tax recently passed by the senate exempts uranium and gold mining.  why?


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## rumpole (23 March 2012)

*i would like to see clive and the other mining companies begin to clean up at least some of the profound pollution their activities are causing, and to pay our government to help clean up and repair some of this damage to our soils, water, agriculture and communities.
*

I can't really see this happening in Qld under Newman. There will probably be CSG mines going down all over the place.


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## moXJO (23 March 2012)

rumpole said:


> *i would like to see clive and the other mining companies begin to clean up at least some of the profound pollution their activities are causing, and to pay our government to help clean up and repair some of this damage to our soils, water, agriculture and communities.
> *
> 
> I can't really see this happening in Qld under Newman. There will probably be CSG mines going down all over the place.




well they already did under labor I thought?


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## rumpole (27 March 2012)

http://www.qpilch.org.au/resources/factsheets/Defamation.htm

*Criminal defamation

In certain circumstances, defamation may also be a criminal offence under the Criminal Code Act 1899 (Qld).  Criminal defamation occurs when a person publishes defamatory material knowing it to be false, or without having any regard as to whether it is true or false, and in publishing the material intends to cause serious harm to another.  The maximum penalty for this offence is three years imprisonment.*

Will be interesting to see if Clive ends up doing porridge


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## Calliope (27 March 2012)

The ABC and the ABC luvvies are ecstatic that Drew Hutton, funded by the radical left group, Getup, is taking Palmer to court for defamation. Hutton said they will also be looking for donations to the cause from those opposed to free speech.

It's a big stretch of the imagination to think that Palmer's motor mouth has harmed Hutton's reputation. He is basking in the publicity.


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## Glen48 (27 March 2012)

Be interesting to see if its 100% pure justice or Cliive gets  let off due to his power and connections.

I think you need to prove with out doubt that you have been harmed in a most positive way and if has done irreversible damage to your name or wealth.  
 Maybe  the stress of a court case will slow down his eating ???


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## trainspotter (3 December 2013)

Judging by his maiden speech I would say a resounding *YES !*



> *CONTROVERSIAL mining magnate turned politician Clive Palmer says he is worried Australia's top spy agency ASIO is listening into his phone calls and monitoring his emails.*




http://www.news.com.au/national/the...g-on-politicians/story-fncynjr2-1226773944813


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## trainspotter (5 December 2013)

Clive Bogan Palmer hits the hustings in style:



> CLIVE Palmer says he's a bogan and he'd love others to join his political party.
> The leader of Mr Palmer's party in Queensland, Alex Douglas, has made headlines with comments he made in private emails about bogans taking over Australia.




http://www.news.com.au/national/bre...ogan-qld-mp-says/story-e6frfku9-1226775807861


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## noco (17 March 2014)

Clive Palmer political life is fast coming to an end......He attempted to climb Mt.Everest but ran out of wind near the bottom.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...election-outcome/story-fnihsrf2-1226856413843


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## Julia (17 March 2014)

Perhaps people are finally waking up to Mr Palmer.   The coming W.A. Senate re-run might produce a different result from last time, hopefully seeing the vociferous Jacqui Lambie dumped.


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## boofhead (17 March 2014)

Lambie is a Tasmanian senator. Another 6 years until the voters have a choice. She seems to have some influence inside the party in Tasmania. She seems to be a bit of a good fit for Palmer's controlling type.


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## Julia (17 March 2014)

Thanks for the correction, boofhead.  My error.  Being in Qld where there is no upper house, I forget that other states have an upper house.

I'm glad, however, to know that her influence, such as it might be, is confined to Tasmania.


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## Calliope (17 March 2014)

Jacqui Lambie was elected as a Federal senator for Tasmania. She will play a role in the PUP/Green balance of power in the Senate...come July.


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## darkhorse70 (17 March 2014)

Haha I voted for this guy. I saw him when karl stepanovic was interviewing him and he had guts. He spoke his mind and thats worth a point in my view. Though I dont follow politics so meh haha


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## Calliope (17 March 2014)

darkhorse70 said:


> Haha I voted for this guy. I saw him when karl stepanovic was interviewing him and he had guts. He spoke his mind and thats worth a point in my view. Though I dont follow politics so meh haha




Yeah, you got that right...he has plenty of guts.


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## Bintang (18 March 2014)

Macquack said:


> Two fat capitalist pigs.
> 
> The images of Palmer and Reinhart should be used to promote the mining super profits tax.






Macquack said:


> Two fat capitalist pigs.
> 
> The images of Palmer and Reinhart should be used to promote the mining super profits tax.




How about replacing the mining tax with a  means tested * 'fat tax'.*
Only two tax brackets are required:
0 to less than 1 billion dollars  (0%)
> 1 billion dollars 99%

This should achieve better targetting and revenue outcomes than the mining tax while keeping Garpal Gumnut whole -  unless of course I have underestimated GG's networth.


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## darkhorse70 (19 March 2014)

Haha capp, im cracking up


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## Bintang (20 March 2014)

darkhorse70 said:


> Haha capp, im cracking up




Are you cracking up over my suggestion for a 'super girth and worth tax'?  How dare you.:frown:
I'll have you know that this is a very serious, well thought out proposal even though I spent less time on it than Rudd's lackeys spent on their Pink Batts program - (but I possibly spent more time on it than Gillard spent re-engineering the super profits mining tax). 

If Clive Palmer isn't loco already he sure will be once he hears about this 'super girth and worth' tax.

So if you want to crack up I suggest you nick off over to the ASF Joke thread.


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## drsmith (24 March 2014)

It's Senate election time again in WA and the Palmer United DVD has arrived in the post so some light viewing is in order tonight. 

I'm most interested in the bit about Titanic II.


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## drsmith (1 April 2014)

drsmith said:


> I'm most interested in the bit about Titanic II.



It fell somewhat short of being a progress report.

Meanwhile, it looks like there's a problem with the ATO.



> CLIVE Palmer’s prized asset is under threat of being closed down by federal authorities seeking to recover looming debts of $36 million.
> 
> Government agencies are moving to force the company, Queensland Nickel, into insolvency if it cannot pay a carbon tax bill that will triple over the year ahead as penalties apply.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...d-over-36m-bill/story-e6frg9df-1226870366207#


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## noco (1 April 2014)

drsmith said:


> It fell somewhat short of being a progress report.
> 
> Meanwhile, it looks like there's a problem with the ATO.
> 
> ...




Doc, I believe I heard on the news this morning that Palmer has just paid the Queensland nickel bill for the carbon tax.


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## drsmith (1 April 2014)

noco said:


> Doc, I believe I heard on the news this morning that Palmer has just paid the Queensland nickel bill for the carbon tax.



Just heard the same thing.

He's suggesting it was paid yesterday.


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## drsmith (1 April 2014)

Did he pay it yesterday or is he paying it today ?



> A spokesperson for the Clean Energy Regulator, which collects the carbon tax, at 1.30pm said it had “no record of payment” from Queensland Nickel.
> 
> “The Clean Energy Regulator is currently investigating whether Queensland Nickel Pty Ltd has made any payments towards the debt in the last 24 hours. We have no record of payment having been received at this stage,” the spokesperson said.
> 
> In a separate interview with Fairfax Media this morning, Mr Palmer said the payment “had been authorised by the bank and was going through … It should be through in three hours though it’s all electronic you know”.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...r-paid-68m-bill/story-fn59niix-1226870862516#


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## drsmith (1 April 2014)

It looks like his company was late paying the original tax bill and the Apr 5 deadline could have been something of a final notice which is now being hurriedly complied with.

More from the ABC,



> Mr Palmer says newspaper reports suggesting the Clean Energy Regulator (CER) was preparing to shut down Queensland Nickel over the unpaid bill are false.
> 
> "The Clean Energy [Regulator] wrote to us and said we had until the 5th of April," Mr Palmer told the ABC.
> 
> ...




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-04-01/queensland-nickel-pays-up-on-8-million-carbon-tax-bill/5358538

Fairfax,



> Mr Palmer, the federal MP for the Queensland seat of Fairfax and leader of the Palmer United Party, appears eager to neutralise the story about his carbon debt before this weekend's re-run of the West Australian Senate Election.
> 
> But the issue is unlikely to disappear, with the Clean Energy Regulator confirming Mr Palmer's Queensland Nickel owes the government $8.44 million in its 2012-13 carbon tax liabilities. Not only that, the nickel refinery owes a further $1 million in late penalties accrued by March 27, leaving a total debt so far of about $9.5 million, the regulator said.
> 
> ...




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...-tax-bill-before-due-date-20140401-35vbb.html


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## trainspotter (1 April 2014)

Calamari Clive has a habit of welching on payments.



> FOR six months, self-described billionaire Clive Palmer has refused to pay a $5300 bill owed to a small country race club that hosted a “calamari and chips” night for his political party.
> Mr Palmer and one of his high-profile federal election candidates, the former State of Origin and Penrith NRL star Matt Adamson, have been squabbling over who owes the debt since September’s poll.
> The petty row has upset Taree-Wingham Race Club directors, who have carried the debt since being told last July to buy enough food to cater for an expected crowd of 200 people.




http://www.news.com.au/national/cli...-clubs-5300-debt/story-fncynjr2-1226862712419


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## Calliope (1 April 2014)

trainspotter said:


> Calamari Clive has a habit of welching on payments.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/national/cli...-clubs-5300-debt/story-fncynjr2-1226862712419




Especially when he agrees to pay on April Fools Day.


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## noco (2 April 2014)

Calliope said:


> Especially when he agrees to pay on April Fools Day.




It looks like he owes a lot more yet......Maybe he is overspending on his WA senate campaign and now having trouble in digging up the cash..




http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...on-tax-liability/story-fnihsrf2-1226871475937


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## noco (1 May 2014)

Palmer might have bought 3 Aboriginal MPs in the NT but he has done his dash with the tribe near his Mineraology project in WA. 



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...genous-relations/story-fnk76wj3-1226901468114


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## noco (1 May 2014)

Palmer is so vindictive over his spill with Newman, that his recent tactics will eventually undo him....He is doing every thing in his power to bring down the Queensland Government.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...australian-party/story-fnihsrf2-1226901449048


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## noco (8 May 2014)

Palmer has upset the Chinese......I wonder if he will sue them for defamation......I also wonder whether this man sleeps at night......He can have his billions for my liking.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...campaign-chinese/story-fnk76wj3-1226909593972


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## trainspotter (9 May 2014)

Clive is nothing more than a sideshow http://www.news.com.au/national/que...rer-tim-nicholls/story-fnii5v6w-1226911956351


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## noco (10 May 2014)

noco said:


> Palmer has upset the Chinese......I wonder if he will sue them for defamation......I also wonder whether this man sleeps at night......He can have his billions for my liking.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...campaign-chinese/story-fnk76wj3-1226909593972




I think Mr Palmer will have some explaining to do if his Chinese partners start delving into his Western Australian Mineralogy affairs of siphoning off cash for Palmer's  electioneering campaigns. ($12.000,000).  

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...itic-cash-demand/story-fn59niix-1226912445201


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## dutchie (14 May 2014)

Memo to Clive:

1. When you put your name up to represent people at the Australian Parliament, then if elected, its a good idea to turn up.

2. When you do finally make it and occupy your seat its a good idea to stay awake.

3. When you get to vote on various legislations, as is your privelige, its would be good to average more than one per term/session.

4. Don't mingle with the Labor party too much as you will get into the habit of blaming Tony Abbott for your own failings. 

5. Otherwise people are going to think your a buffoon!  Oops, I mean a rich buffoon!


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## noco (14 May 2014)

dutchie said:


> Memo to Clive:
> 
> 1. When you put your name up to represent people at the Australian Parliament, then if elected, its a good idea to turn up.
> 
> ...




Palmer even blamed Abbott for having to take a cat nap.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/busin...in-question-time/story-fnihpj8r-1226917626416


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## noco (16 May 2014)

noco said:


> I think Mr Palmer will have some explaining to do if his Chinese partners start delving into his Western Australian Mineralogy affairs of siphoning off cash for Palmer's  electioneering campaigns. ($12.000,000).
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...itic-cash-demand/story-fn59niix-1226912445201




There seems to be conflicting stories coming from Palmer and the Chinese company Citic

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...se-over-lost-12m/story-fnk76wj3-1226919490700


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## noco (24 May 2014)

This should make some eyes roll when you read that Mr. Windbag has not paid any tax for 6 years in fact he gained $1.66 million from the coffers of the Federal Government ......So is he a smart man or a crook?


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...irms-paying-none/story-fn59niix-1226929373534


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## Julia (24 May 2014)

This is an interesting explanation from Ian Verrender, ABC Radio Business Editor, on Clive Palmer's current somewhat awkward business position, especially with respect to the mess that is what was once supposed to be such a great deal with the Chinese partner Citic Pacific.

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/saturdayextra/clive-takes-on-china/5473682


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## SirRumpole (24 May 2014)

Julia said:


> This is an interesting explanation from Ian Verrender, ABC Radio Business Editor, on Clive Palmer's current somewhat awkward business position, especially with respect to the mess that is what was once supposed to be such a great deal with the Chinese partner Citic Pacific.
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/saturdayextra/clive-takes-on-china/5473682




Clive Palmer reminds me of Alan Bond 30 years ago. Arrogant, big headed, obnoxious, and heading for a fall.


----------



## noco (24 May 2014)

Julia said:


> This is an interesting explanation from Ian Verrender, ABC Radio Business Editor, on Clive Palmer's current somewhat awkward business position, especially with respect to the mess that is what was once supposed to be such a great deal with the Chinese partner Citic Pacific.
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/saturdayextra/clive-takes-on-china/5473682




Wow Julia, very interesting but not funny....as I said in my last post.....Is Palmer a smart cookie or a crook!!!!!!

I guess time will tell if it all catches up on him and quite often this type of bloke generally comes undone......ahla Alan Bond.....they eventually come up against someone smarter than themselves.


----------



## noco (27 May 2014)

Palmer is getting himself into more legal 'HOT WATER'.......The way he is going ATM may eventually find himself in the 'jug'.....He is going to come unstuck some where down the line.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...mer-investigated/story-fnk76wj3-1226932402467


----------



## dutchie (3 June 2014)

Palmer keeps reinforcing my opinion that he is a (presently rich) buffoon.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...ief-of-staff-peta-credlin-20140603-39fdd.html



Firstly we had the greens helping to bugger up Australia in coalition with the ALP.
Having got rid of that destructive combo we look like we will be saddled with an ALP/PUP combo opposing any repair to the previous six years.

Australia just can't get a break.


----------



## noco (3 June 2014)

dutchie said:


> Palmer keeps reinforcing my opinion that he is a (presently rich) buffoon.
> 
> http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...ief-of-staff-peta-credlin-20140603-39fdd.html
> 
> ...




Palmer is just very vindictive because he could not get his own way in Queensland and has it in for Abbott because Abbott accused him him of buying his way into parliament....Palmer does not give a hoot about the national welfare.......it is all about Palmer getting even........PAY BACK.


----------



## Knobby22 (3 June 2014)

Yea, I heard him attack "The Australian" vehemently. Talk about making enemies.

As Bernardi said about Turnbull "I thought that Malcolm's response was too strident, I though it was inappropriate, it was unwise to do." 

We mustn't upset Rupert. In fact, when can we change the rules to give him Channel 10 we must make sure that we shut down ABC24 at the same time.


----------



## dutchie (3 June 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> We mustn't upset Rupert. In fact, when can we change the rules to give him Channel 10 we must make sure that we shut down ABC24 at the same time.




I'll drink to that - good idea Knobby22.


----------



## Julia (3 June 2014)

A lucid analysis of Clive Palmer's tasteless attack on Peta Credlin today:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-03/matthewson-canny-clive-takes-credibility-hit/5497502


----------



## Knobby22 (4 June 2014)

Clive's attack on Peta showed how little understanding he has on the policy as well as very poor parliamentary behaviour.

Peta as a public servant will get leave on full pay if she gets pregnant whether the policy passes or not.


----------



## noco (5 June 2014)

This 'BAG OF WIND' is set put himself on fire any time soon....He just cannot help himself with his unruly rhetoric.

He is in parliament for political purposes and does not have the national interest at heart.....he is spiteful and vindictive.


http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...|heading|homepage|homepage&itmt=1401928736415


----------



## Calliope (5 June 2014)

noco said:


> This 'BAG OF WIND' is set put himself on fire any time soon....He just cannot help himself with his unruly rhetoric.
> 
> He is in parliament for political purposes and does not have the national interest at heart.....he is spiteful and vindictive.
> 
> ...




But do not take him for a fool noco. His campaign of spite and vindictiveness is centred on his hatred of Abbott and is rapidly gaining supporters among the f*** Abbott brigade. This has little to do with Abbott's broken promises, but is the outcome of a well crafted hate campaign put together by the Greens over the years. As sydboy said in another thread, Palmer doesn't need policies or principles...hatred of Abbott will do.


----------



## noco (5 June 2014)

Calliope said:


> But do not take him for a fool noco. His campaign of spite and vindictiveness is centred on his hatred of Abbott and is rapidly gaining supporters among the f*** Abbott brigade. This has little to do with Abbott's broken promises, but is the outcome of a well crafted hate campaign put together by the Greens over the years. As sydboy said in another thread, Palmer doesn't need policies or principles...hatred of Abbott will do.




An interesting interview with Sarah Ferguson......He seems to deny what he said in parliament .......but it is all well recorded and condemned by both the major parties.


http://www.abc.net.au/7.30/content/2014/s4018926.htm


----------



## noco (6 June 2014)

And this bloke wants to be Prime Minister of Australia......could anybody ever imagine it.

He does not give any explanation why he has quit his directorship of a company which he fully owns.

He has paid no taxes for 6 years in fact he has received a refund for some $1.6 million. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ems-wont-go-away/story-fnk76wj3-1226945123400


----------



## Knobby22 (6 June 2014)

_He has paid no taxes for 6 years in fact he has received a refund for some $1.6 million._

That's a very socialist comment noco. Are you saying that the tax system is not skewed correctly?


----------



## Julia (6 June 2014)

noco said:


> An interesting interview with Sarah Ferguson......He seems to deny what he said in parliament .......but it is all well recorded and condemned by both the major parties.



As a female, I was very glad to see Sarah Ferguson do what all the other prominent females (with the exception of Julie Bishop)have failed to do, and challenge Clive Palmer's appalling attack on Peta Credlin.  Amazing how the feminist philosophy can adapt itself amongst the women of the Left to just ignore such an attack when it suits their political agenda.



noco said:


> And this bloke wants to be Prime Minister of Australia......could anybody ever imagine it.
> 
> He does not give any explanation why he has quit his directorship of a company which he fully owns.
> 
> He has paid no taxes for 6 years in fact he has received a refund for some $1.6 million.






Knobby22 said:


> _He has paid no taxes for 6 years in fact he has received a refund for some $1.6 million._
> 
> That's a very socialist comment noco. Are you saying that the tax system is not skewed correctly?



I took the fact that he has paid no taxes for six years as a simple reflection on the non-profitability of at least some of his businesses.  
Can you say why you see it as 'socialist', Knobby?

I'm glad to see Hedley Thomas is pursuing his interest in Mr Palmer.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (6 June 2014)

Julia said:


> As a female, I was very glad to see Sarah Ferguson do what all the other prominent females (with the exception of Julie Bishop)have failed to do, and challenge Clive Palmer's appalling attack on Peta Credlin.  Amazing how the feminist philosophy can adapt itself amongst the women of the Left to just ignore such an attack when it suits their political agenda.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Thanks Julia and all above for your comments on Clive Palmer. 

Clive is a very peculiar personality confined to Queensland. There are a hundred nascent Clives selling second hand cars and real estate between the Tweed River and Harvey Bay.

Due to our robust economy, one is likely to emerge every 7 or 8 years, the clown Keith Williams who destroyed Cardwell with his development, and Christopher Skase are two examples. 

Clive Palmer will fall as quickly as the other two because he is basically not very bright. He is cunning. But he is not bright. 

And this will be his downfall. 

gg


----------



## sptrawler (6 June 2014)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Thanks Julia and all above for your comments on Clive Palmer.
> 
> Clive is a very peculiar personality confined to Queensland. There are a hundred nascent Clives selling second hand cars and real estate between the Tweed River and Harvey Bay.
> 
> ...




Spot on GG, history is littered with people who make and lose a fortune.


----------



## noco (7 June 2014)

Palmer could be in hot water with the CMC.....he might be about to meet his WATERLOO.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ommission-action/story-fnk76wj3-1226946443484


----------



## noco (10 June 2014)

This guy Palmer is one dangerous cookie......I think his mouth will eventually be his down fall.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...or-rail-corridor/story-fnihsrk2-1226948789794


----------



## sydboy007 (10 June 2014)

noco said:


> This guy Palmer is one dangerous cookie......I think his mouth will eventually be his down fall.
> 
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...or-rail-corridor/story-fnihsrk2-1226948789794




Considering he's offered to allow Abbotts PPL a quiet death i think he's more in tune with the general public than Abbott.  Extending the current scheme to 26 weeks is IMO a more than fair compromise.  Might allow all corporations to receive a tax cut.

Will be very interesting if Abbott is really as pig headed as he seems and turns down this offer.  If he does I think palmer will be laughing for joy, along with Labor, because there will be a massive level of internal dissent within the L+NP over a policy only Abbott and a couple of others actually wants.  

I truly do not understand why Abbott is bleeding political capital over a policy the public DOESN'T WANT.  In his delusion Abbott thinks the people who voted for him were voting for his PPL scheme.  You'd better set him straight Noco, because I'm willing to bet that the majority of those who voted for Abbott did so in spite of his PPL scheme, not in support.


----------



## Julia (10 June 2014)

sydboy007 said:


> Considering he's offered to allow Abbotts PPL a quiet death



The ABC reported that that suggestion came from a member of Abbott's own party, not Clive Palmer.
Do you have a link to Palmer's 'offer'?



> Will be very interesting if Abbott is really as pig headed as he seems and turns down this offer.  If he does I think palmer will be laughing for joy, along with Labor, because there will be a massive level of internal dissent within the L+NP over a policy only Abbott and a couple of others actually wants.



Agree, yet he seems irrationally immovable on this.   It's a trait that's concerning.

Noco, I wouldn't be counting your chickens just yet on Jeff Seeney's belated reference of Palmer to the CMC.  You have to ask - if the demands were so corrupt - why was Mr Palmer not referred to the CMC two years ago?


----------



## trainspotter (10 June 2014)

Same as what they did to Pauline Hanson .... DISCREDIT DISCREDIT DISCREDIT until the media frenzy causes a cave in as the cracks start to show. Throw enough mud and some of it will have to stick eventually.


----------



## Calliope (10 June 2014)

There is no suggestion about this letter that it is "alleged". In my opinion it must lead to a _prima facie_ case against Palmer's "alleged" corruption. When the CMC hands down its logical decision, they will also deliver a slap on the wrist to Seeney and Newman for covering up the corruption for so long. Legally they are in the clear as the CMC does not place a time limit on corruption referrals



> The Courier-Mail can reveal Mr Palmer detailed his extraordinary treaty terms in a three-page letter that he gave to Deputy Premier Jeff Seeney’s senior staff during failed peace talks early last year.
> 
> The letter, along with all documents related to the Government’s dealings with the now federal MP and his companies, will today be handed to Queensland’s corruption watchdog.
> 
> ...




http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...or-rail-corridor/story-fnihsrk2-1226948789794


----------



## Julia (10 June 2014)

trainspotter said:


> Same as what they did to Pauline Hanson .... DISCREDIT DISCREDIT DISCREDIT until the media frenzy causes a cave in as the cracks start to show. Throw enough mud and some of it will have to stick eventually.



TS, as Calliope points out, the letter of demand from Clive Palmer is fact, not some vague allegation.
You're usually very perceptive about people.   I'm curious about why you seem to be a bit defensive about Mr Palmer?


----------



## sydboy007 (10 June 2014)

Julia said:


> The ABC reported that that suggestion came from a member of Abbott's own party, not Clive Palmer.
> Do you have a link to Palmer's 'offer'?
> 
> 
> Agree, yet he seems irrationally immovable on this.   It's a trait that's concerning.




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...se-on-paid-parental-leave-20140609-39szx.html

Abbott seems to be crash through or crash.  Not the best trait in a leader.  Certainly Howard had better nouse as to when to fight and when to accept the umpire's decision.


----------



## trainspotter (10 June 2014)

Julia said:


> TS, as Calliope points out, the letter of demand from Clive Palmer is fact, not some vague allegation.
> You're usually very perceptive about people.   I'm curious about why you seem to be a bit defensive about Mr Palmer?




Sure Julia the letter is a "statement of demand" if you will to have exclusive rights to the Galilee Basin rail line on the proviso he drops the Supreme Court action against the Newman government. It smacks of collusion as the Newman government has had this information for over 2 years now and has only just decided to release it to the press. I wonder why? Lacking in the polling department perhaps? A poll in The Sunday Mail, yesterday showed Mr Palmer’s party would secure more than 13 per cent of the primary vote at the next state election. Mr Newman must be quaking in his boots. Also there were allegations that the Newman government did not want some critical information about the handling of the Galilee Basin coal deposits mining approvals to see the light of day. Speculation is rife about the Hancock Prospecting Coal approval to construct the Alpha Coal Project. Hmmmm ?

Personally I believe Clive Palmer is a buffoon who has an extraordinary talent of throwing red herrings to the proletariat and the media who in it's eagerness to believe in an alternative voice in the political wilderness that they give this man and his party credence. If he had the polish of a Don Chipp and created a believable alternative party other than the reds and the blues then I believe it would be a different matter and the ink slingers would afford him a bit more positive press. He is a sideshow and nothing more who will eventually be found out to not be what he claims as well as the skeletons in his business ethics will eventually rise up (Chinese Citic Pacific iron ore anyone?) to cause his downfall. 

My reference to Pauline Hanson and her discreditation and ultimate crucifixion via the media was merely a reference point as to what will be forthcoming to the PUP senators and eventually Clive himself. Ricky Muir (Who clearly should NEVER have been elected into the senate ... 0.01 per cent of the primary vote PFFFTTTT !!!) aligned himself with PUP and the media pounced and turned him into mice meat. Jacqui Lambie, Dio Wang, and Glenn Lazarus 15 minutes of fame will come as the media dissect their lack of understanding of Australian politics and how a government functions.

The self proclaimed billionaire is on a mission to sink his party faster than the Titanic (or even the Titanic II that Clive is supposed to be building) and unfortunately the voting public is lapping this bovine excreta up as gospel.

*RANT OVER*


----------



## noco (10 June 2014)

Julia said:


> The ABC reported that that suggestion came from a member of Abbott's own party, not Clive Palmer.
> Do you have a link to Palmer's 'offer'?
> 
> 
> ...




Julia, it is not illegal to delay any reference to the CMC.....politics is a dirty business on both sides of the house.....sometimes these anomalies are keep in the memory bank and brought out at a convenient time to discredit an opponent.......there is a state election in Queensland early in 2015 and no doubt the LNP will use it all to their advantage.

Both sides do it if they believe there is some political mileage......you only have to look at what happened to Barry O'Farrell and that bottle of wine...enough said.


----------



## Julia (10 June 2014)

trainspotter said:


> *RANT OVER*



Rant completely justified imo, TS.  I'm duly reassured.



noco said:


> Julia, it is not illegal to delay any reference to the CMC.....politics is a dirty business on both sides of the house.....sometimes these anomalies are keep in the memory bank and brought out at a convenient time to discredit an opponent.......there is a state election in Queensland early in 2015 and no doubt the LNP will use it all to their advantage.
> 
> Both sides do it if they believe there is some political mileage......you only have to look at what happened to Barry O'Farrell and that bottle of wine...enough said.



Yes, accepted, noco.  I'll be the first to cheer if Mr Palmer's ambitions are dealt any sort of blow.


----------



## noco (11 June 2014)

Janet Albrechtsen sums up Clive Palmer very well....he is so vindictive and is intent in destroying what Abbott is trying to achieve.......it is not about the national interest with Palmer, it is all about what Palmer wants.

Please come back about PPL because I am against it as well.  


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...wont-fly-forever/story-e6frg7bo-1226949808457


----------



## noco (11 June 2014)

According to Seeney, Palmer urged Seeney to send the the 'corruption' material to the CMC......so the time period had nothing to do with it.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ve-palmer-to-cmc/story-fnihsrf2-1226950419024


----------



## trainspotter (11 June 2014)

noco said:


> According to Seeney, Palmer urged Seeney to send the the 'corruption' material to the CMC......so the time period had nothing to do with it.
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ve-palmer-to-cmc/story-fnihsrf2-1226950419024




As I posted in my rant .. Clive wants the info to come out as there is a few hairballs in the tender process from Hancock Prospecting that are about to clear the throat.


----------



## trainspotter (11 June 2014)

trainspotter said:


> As I posted in my rant .. Clive wants the info to come out as there is a few hairballs in the tender process from Hancock Prospecting that are about to clear the throat.




And right on queue here they are:



> *GREEN groups are challenging billionaire Gina Rinehart in Queensland's highest court in a bid to stop a mega coal mine.*
> Ms Rinehart's Hancock Coal and Indian mining giant GVK was given conditional approval in April to develop the multi-billion dollar Alpha coal mine in the Galilee Basin.




http://www.news.com.au/national/bre...against-rinehart/story-e6frfku9-1226950202523

Clive does not want his little fiefdom upset by a bigger whale


----------



## trainspotter (12 June 2014)

DB008 said:


> View attachment 46512
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 46513




Funny how fortune favours the brave ...


----------



## trainspotter (12 June 2014)

DB008 said:


> View attachment 46512
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 46513




Funny how fortune favours the brave ...


----------



## trainspotter (13 June 2014)

Clive is upset that his train proposal was rejected over Gina's.



> Mr Palmer has said his proposal would not have favoured Waratah Coal and would have ensured open access to infrastructure for every company operating in the basin in western Queensland.
> *In March 2013, the government announced Indian mining giant GVK and Gina Rinehart's Hancock Coal would work with freight rail company Aurizon to build rail infrastructure from the basin to the Abbot Point coal terminal near Bowen.*
> Mr Palmer on Friday produced four letters to him, from Mr Newman and Mr Seeney in 2012, showing they were pleased with Waratah Coal's proposals to build the rail line.
> "I congratulate you for your efforts to date, which are contributing to the long-held vision of the Galilee Basin becoming a major new resource region," Mr Seeney said in April 2012, a month after the LNP won power.
> ...




http://www.news.com.au/national/bre...-defamation-list/story-e6frfku9-1226952925477

So why did the Campbell government choose Gina over Clive? Cause Clive basically threatened the QLD government by advising them that he would drop the litigation against them if they awarded the rail infrastructure to Waratah. Mr Palmer’s political clout was underlined by a weekend poll in Queensland showing that support for the Palmer United Party had climbed to 13.6 per cent, potentially making it a force at the state election due early next year. CMC , Supreme Court action ... aaahhhh politics of Australia is just getting interesting.


----------



## Knobby22 (13 June 2014)

Very interesting


----------



## noco (17 June 2014)

Where has the money gone?.....Clive Palmer may well be in trouble sooner than we think......I wonder how this 'win bag' will recover from this one?


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ive-palmers-bank/story-fnk76wj3-1226956669600


----------



## drsmith (25 June 2014)

Clive Palmer is having a presser on policy today at 5:30pm EST, assuming he's on time.

It should at the least be entertaining.


----------



## darkhorse70 (25 June 2014)

Officially a Palmer united member wohhoo haha. Don't worry even if it is a mistake which I doubt at least I haven't made 40 years worth of mistakes supporting the libs/labours like some old timers on here haha. I don't know details but how is he going loco. He's just keeping it real. It would be good if he didn't have conflicts of interest but hey hopefully his key objective in the political sense isn't financially motivated. As long as he keeps to his words then ill keep voting for him.


----------



## darkhorse70 (25 June 2014)

bintang what are you on about, I was cracking up at calliopes photo


----------



## darkhorse70 (25 June 2014)

oh yeah and I guess what I see in clive palmer is some one who cuts the crap and speaks the truth. If he does have a hidden agenda then that will be his downfall. But as long as he gets the youth fired up about politics and about the truth then that's worth fighting for. Leaders can come and go, be replaced but if it starts a new way of thinking, if it gets you fired up about the truth and doing the right thing for the people then eventually we might have some justice. Maybe he is just the catalyst for a bigger picture.


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## drsmith (25 June 2014)

Who will Uncle Clive most closely resemble when all is said and done ?

Christopher Skase or Alan Bond ?


----------



## Julia (25 June 2014)

darkhorse70 said:


> But as long as he gets the youth fired up about politics and about the truth then that's worth fighting for



Truth?   Whose truth?   What you believe is true and right?   
Define truth.


----------



## darkhorse70 (25 June 2014)

Every one wants a good hospital/education and a better shot at life. At the moment the other parties arent providing that. Infact its getting worse. Atleast palmer adresses these problems instead of playing the blame game and tells it how it is. Plus liberal and labour have been in power for far to long. Thw country needs new parties who will have a greater sense of pride and responsibility. Plus palmer probably has 10 times more life experience than the most of us here. If he is genuine about his actions then I believe he can do a great job.


----------



## noco (26 June 2014)

Palmer does not have the interest of the nation at heart.....It is all about Palmer' interests.....Yes he has agreed to abolish the carbon tax because it cost him $6 million last year at the Townsville nickel refinery.....so why wouldn't he agree to it?....his tailing dams are over loaded and it could be an environmental hazard should we have an excessive amount of rain.....He wants to pump this toxic waste into the ocean of Townsville.....Two employees at the refinery have told me the tailing dams are have a large concentrate of iron ore and could be sold to a Japanese company so why doesn't he do it? 

He bought his way into politics with a very vindictive agenda to destroy the Queensland Newman government and the Liberal Party.......he had one of his toys taken away from him and he spat the dummy.....Can you imagine the fun the Labor Party would have had, had Newman approved his coal mine and exclusive rail corridor to Port Palmer?...Palmer was then a life member of the Liberal Party.

He is running around with that fraud Al Gore because he knows if he invests money into Gore's  ETS scams he could make more money for himself. 

These two are tarred with the one brush and are not to be trusted.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...-us-back-in-2007/story-e6frg6zo-1226966956482


----------



## SirRumpole (26 June 2014)

noco said:


> Palmer does not have the interest of the nation at heart.....It is all about Palmer' interests.....Yes he has agreed to abolish the carbon tax because it cost him $6 million last year at the Townsville nickel refinery.....so why wouldn't he agree to it?
> 
> He bought his way into politics with a very vindictive agenda to destroy the Queensland Newman government and the Liberal Party.......he had one of his toys taken away from him and he spat the dummy.....Can you imagine the fun the Labor Party would have had, had Newman approved his coal mine and exclusive rail corridor?...Palmer was then a life member of the Liberal Party at the time.
> 
> ...




I take it you would prefer that Clive votes to retain the Carbon Tax ?

Clive's proposal  would appear to be a gift to the government. Replace the C.T. with a non binding agreement to introduce an ETS at some unspecified time which will probably never happen because it's unlikely other major economies will introduce an ETS. Why wouldn't the government go for it ?


----------



## noco (26 June 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I take it you would prefer that Clive votes to retain the Carbon Tax ?
> 
> Clive's proposal  would appear to be a gift to the government. Replace the C.T. with a non binding agreement to introduce an ETS at some unspecified time which will probably never happen because it's unlikely other major economies will introduce an ETS. Why wouldn't the government go for it ?




Why would you assume that I would prefer to see the carbon tax remain?

I want to see it go in order to save pensioners and hard working families  $550  a year......THE Green/Labor socialist left wing wants to increase the cost of living when the carbon dioxide tax goes up by 5% on the 1st of July.

Rumpy, the word A-S-S-U-M-E makes an ASS out of YOU and ME.


----------



## darkhorse70 (26 June 2014)

Who says ethics pays off in a business. Is there such a thing as a rich honest business man? That doesnt mean that his political agenda is purely financial. "Thats your responsibility as a himan being - to constantly updating your positions on as many things as possible. And if you dont contradict yourself on a regular basis your not thinking" haha


----------



## Knobby22 (26 June 2014)

Ethics does paid off. I know a few very successful businessmen that have very good ethics.
To name some famous CEOs with high ethics  - Brian McNamee and Geoff Harvey.
In fact I would go so far to say that businessmen with low ethics are more likely to fail.


----------



## overhang (26 June 2014)

noco said:


> I want to see it go in order to save pensioners and hard working families  $550  a year......THE Green/Labor socialist left wing wants to increase the cost of living when the carbon dioxide tax goes up by 5% on the 1st of July.




You need to stop repeating another lie from Abbott that $550 a year will be saved from abolishing the carbon tax.



> *Consumers are being told not to expect a big windfall gain in their power bill if the carbon tax is repealed.*






> The carbon is in the order of cents per day so 20, 30, 50 cents a day is carbon in an electricity bill so that's the kind of numbers you'll see come out the other side






> Mr Warren says it is difficult to give an estimate of how much people will save, because it depends on which state or territory they live in and how intense their electricity use is.
> 
> "So we've already seen numbers like 8 per cent in Queensland, 7 per cent in Tasmania, that sort of order of magnitude," he said.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-26/modest-power-bill-cuts-if-carbon-tax-abolished/5550468

So the complete over estimate for savings on the average South Aus bill of $2300 at 8% would be $184 but that is using 8% on the whole bill and not just the usage component and doesn't take into account that South Aus produce a lot of energy from low carbon options, so it would be much lower but blows Abbotts $550 out of the water.

I find it strange Noco that you're so concerned about hard working family's which are much worse off from this budget that you seem to endorse than the carbon tax is/was. The GP co payment won't hit pensioners as hard as the carbon tax but is still something I would have thought you would be against to save those poor pensioners given your concerns.  



Abbott is so concerned about the cost of living from the carbon tax yet he still wants to reduce or axe the renewable energy target yet Government modeling shows that consumers will actually be better off keeping the target as it will lower energy prices. This was not the result the government was looking for and does not fit in with his reasoning to scrap the carbon tax.
http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...f-ret-stays-20140624-zskbd.html#ixzz35aZT5283


----------



## chiff (26 June 2014)

A few years ago,nearly ten,I owned shares in Pacific Hydro... a company into hydro electricity and wind farms.I consequently took interest in the RET.
After John Howard said that he would do nothing to disadvantage the coal industry the writing was on the wall and Pacific Hydro sold out to a union fund ,from memory.
Something tells me that Tony Abbott's agenda is the same,and has nothing to do with returning money to the Australian people.
I wonder how much the coal industry donated to the LNP?
They do not want one tonne of coal left in the ground ,I believe.
And how much has been spent on carbon sequestration research over the years?


----------



## darkhorse70 (26 June 2014)

http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2012/s3507793.htm

This is why I voted for this guy. CAUSE HE KEEPS IT REAL. U CAN RELATE. HE ACTS LIKE A NORMAL HUMAN BEING. He doesn't act like something his not


----------



## darkhorse70 (26 June 2014)

knobby im just being sarcastic. It does but it doesn't. In reality our whole economic model might not be the right one. We can function off a non-profit model and whose to say the world might not be better off.
My point is life is not black and white. Its grey and people on here acting like they have all the answers figured out. You know when ill listen to everything you got to say (not directed at any one in particular), when you can show me some of your credentials regarding your life achievements (hopefully its in the multi millions haha)


----------



## IFocus (26 June 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I take it you would prefer that Clive votes to retain the Carbon Tax ?
> 
> Clive's proposal  would appear to be a gift to the government. Replace the C.T. with a non binding agreement to introduce an ETS at some unspecified time which will probably never happen because it's unlikely other major economies will introduce an ETS. Why wouldn't the government go for it ?





I though this option of keeping the Tax and setting it to zero an absolute political master stroke by Clive.


----------



## drsmith (26 June 2014)

IFocus said:


> I though this option of keeping the Tax and setting it to zero an absolute political master stroke by Clive.



That then would make him a more astute political operator than either Julia Gillard or Kevin Rudd.

From what saw yesterday, Clive will vote with the Coalition to abolish the existing carbon tax but will also introduce legislation through the Senate for an emissions trading scheme. If that's the case, the latter would require support by the Coalition in the house of reps.

Clive is just flapping with the wind. Also of note, it's what the carbon tax rats are left with to cling to.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-...rs-defence-of-climate-change-agencies/5553214


----------



## Julia (26 June 2014)

IFocus said:


> I though this option of keeping the Tax and setting it to zero an absolute political master stroke by Clive.



Yes, he has successfully wedged all the other parties whilst entirely serving his own interests in ensuring the carbon tax goes.


----------



## qldfrog (26 June 2014)

And has the only "other" party available-> will get (with good reason) the protest vote of many of the 90% of australians who are not represented by either the labour/green or the  "Liberal".
Some people , as supprising as it may come for the dual parties are neither union employed nor sucking tax benefits under the pretence of doing business (or managing their super to please Syd ).
IMHO, this is very dangerous, this is the situation which brought Hitler in power: incompetence and rort from major parties leading to deep profund distruss into the supposely democratic process.
Or even "real hate" as per tea party in the US.
But who am i to know....


----------



## Julia (26 June 2014)

A quite good summary of the press conference between Clive Palmer and Al Gore.  The comments which follow the article are to the point.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...mr-vicepresident/story-e6frg6xf-1226967014997


----------



## SirRumpole (27 June 2014)

darkhorse70 said:


> http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2012/s3507793.htm
> 
> This is why I voted for this guy. CAUSE HE KEEPS IT REAL. U CAN RELATE. HE ACTS LIKE A NORMAL HUMAN BEING. He doesn't act like something his not




LOL

He has a great ability to serve his own interests while being populist at the same time.

He won't be on the forefront of big ideas that are good for the country, but politically unpopular. Populism ensures he gets re-elected to cream off the most that he can for himself.


----------



## noco (27 June 2014)

darkhorse70 said:


> http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2012/s3507793.htm
> 
> This is why I voted for this guy. CAUSE HE KEEPS IT REAL. U CAN RELATE. HE ACTS LIKE A NORMAL HUMAN BEING. He doesn't act like something his not




Richo sums up Palmer as the greatest media manipulator.......After all he was Joh Bjelke-Petersen's chief press officer for some years so he certainly knows how to feed the chooks in ABC and Fairfax.

What is more baffling is how he is plyting with Al Gore......I am sure Gore has no idea who he is dealing with........obviously he  has been sucked in to thinking Palmer will be an asset in the promotion of his ETS  business of trading carbon credits. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...threering-circus/story-fnfenwor-1226968095468


----------



## noco (27 June 2014)

Julia said:


> A quite good summary of the press conference between Clive Palmer and Al Gore.  The comments which follow the article are to the point.
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...mr-vicepresident/story-e6frg6xf-1226967014997




Good one Julia.....I can see Al Gore getting his fingers burnt if he hangs around with Palmer.

Al Gore looks like a lame duck along side Palmer.


----------



## Knobby22 (27 June 2014)

If Clive Palmer was younger, he would be a real threat, rather like Robert Menzies was to the previous Conservatives when he started the Liberal Party. 
As Darkhorse says, he acts like a normal human being and talks straight. 
He doesn't straight out lie and twist everything like certain other politicians. 

You will find that he will be effectively running the country this term unless the Libs change leaders. Don't believe me? Just watch.


----------



## drsmith (27 June 2014)

Interesting piece in The Australian this morning.

The week beginning July 14 looks like it will be the one where the death warrant will finally be signed on Labor's carbon tax.



> A NEW scheme to put a price on carbon has been scotched within hours of being unveiled, with Tony Abbott sealing an agreement to scrap the carbon tax but rejecting plans to put an emissions trading scheme in its place.
> 
> Scuttling a proposal from Clive Palmer and former US vice-*president Al Gore, the Prime *Minister declared the world was “going against” the use of trading schemes and carbon taxes to act on global warming.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ets-already-dead/story-e6frg6xf-1226968253049


----------



## noco (27 June 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> If Clive Palmer was younger, he would be a real threat, rather like Robert Menzies was to the previous Conservatives when he started the Liberal Party.
> As Darkhorse says, he acts like a normal human being and talks straight.
> He doesn't straight out lie and twist everything like certain other politicians.
> 
> You will find that he will be effectively running the country this term unless the Libs change leaders. Don't believe me? Just watch.




Cllive Palmer is a very clever man...he knows how to manipulate people and the media.....he has a sharp tongue which sooner or later may get him into trouble.

I live in Townsville and he has not got a very good name here with his nickel refinery.....If we have excessive rain here during the next wet season, Townsville will become an environmental disaster.....He wants to pump his toxic waste from the tailing dams into the seas off Townsville.....the waste from these tailing dams are some 150 times more toxic than raw sewage.

I find it hard to become enthused with this man probably because of his tactics of late, his money which talks and the fact that he has not laid out any policy as how he would fix the current financial problems ......He has mentioned a few things which I understand would  add some  $60 billion to the bottom red line.  

He stated some time ago that he would not meet with Tony Abbott because he did not like the Prime Minister but he appears to have back flipped and had breakfast with Abbott this morning.

I am afraid I will have to treat  him with great caution.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...scuss-carbon-tax/story-fnihslxi-1226967199560


----------



## Knobby22 (27 June 2014)

noco said:


> I live in Townsville and he has not got a very good name here with his nickel refinery.....If we have excessive rain here during the next wet season, Townsville will become an environmental disaster.....He wants to pump his toxic waste from the tailing dams into the seas off Townsville.....the waste from these tailing dams are some 150 times more toxic than raw sewage.




Don't worry, he won't be allowed to...the Federal Environment laws...oh wait Tony got rid of them.
Well hopefully the State Government will stop him.


----------



## drsmith (27 June 2014)

Nick Xenophon,



> CLIVE Palmer is arguably one of Australia’s shrewdest businessmen. He’s probably worth more than his 225 parliamentary colleagues combined. For someone so successful, he’s just done a very bad deal. Not just for his party but for the nation too. It’s like he’s sold his Rolls-Royce to a stranger without agreeing on a price or even a date when he’ll get paid.
> 
> This week’s joint announcement by Clive and climate warrior Al Gore will have a chilling effect ”” not on the climate but on business investment, confidence and jobs Australia-wide.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...-is-a-jobskiller/story-e6frg6zo-1226968080283


----------



## noco (27 June 2014)

Andrew Bolt
June 27 2014 (9:36am)


Fairfax reporter Mark Kenny co-wrote a front page story yesterday falsely claiming Clive Palmer would save the carbon tax - showing Kenny, a warmist, had just listened with his eyes at a press conference featuring warmist evangelist Al Gore:

    Clive Palmer has thrown into chaos Tony Abbott’s plan to abolish the carbon tax, demanding the Prime Minister instead create an emissions trading scheme that would swing into action when Australia’s major trading partners adopt similar measures.

In fact, Palmer wants the carbon tax gone, even if his doomed plan for an emissions trading scheme on the never-never is rejected.

Mark Kenny today scrabbles out of his hole:

    There are two schools of thought regarding the status of Tony Abbott’s climate change promises in light of Clive Palmer’s delphic pronouncements on Wednesday…

    (O)ne theory holds that because Palmer has signed the death warrant of the carbon price, the decision is a clear win for Abbott. End of story.

    The other holds that Abbott’s ...‘‘direct action’’ has been scuttled, while other crucial pieces of the Labor/Greens architecture will be left in place. Taken as a whole, therefore, his climate policy has been plunged into chaos.

    The government, and frankly most people within the politico-media community, lean towards the former…

“Most people within the politico-media community” is just Kenny’s grandiose way of describing the Canberra press gallery’s group thinkers and their pet warmists, yet again out of touch with reality.

And Kenny then gives evidence that suggests the Government itself is not at all alarmed by this “chaos” it’s allegedly been plunged into:

    it seems the $10 billion Clean Energy Finance Corporation - which the government desperately wants to scrap - and the 20 per cent Renewable Energy Target, will stay. Neither is popular in the Coalition party-room but their retention will not cause the government too much heartache 

“I was wrong” or “I was fooled” would have been much shorter.

UPDATE

The Australian laughs:

    CLIVE Palmer must have been tempted to throw out some chicken pellets as he left. The former media adviser to Joh Bjelke-Petersen had just sold the chooks of the Canberra press gallery a chopping block and rotisserie, and they gobbled it up.

    Journalists and commentators who had long campaigned against Tony Abbott and in favour of a carbon price had just been advised of a package that would kill the carbon tax, defer an emissions trading scheme into the never-never and put an end to carbon abatement through “direct action” — and they applauded…

    That the Queensland coalmine developer and nickel-refining billionaire was audacious enough to think he could snow the media just by having Al Gore share his podium was bizarre enough. That so many in the media fell for it is droll and depressing in equal measure. As for Mr Gore, given his claims about the origins of the internet, he might have found 10 minutes to Google his new political ally before administering self-harm to his diminishing reputation as a climate evangelist…

    SMH columnist Mike Carlton took to Twitter saying the announcement would “screw the Tories” but succeeded only in demonstrating his venom and lack of political acuity…

    If that weren’t embarrassing enough, no lesser figure than the managing director of the ABC shared an identical sentiment. “Sensing hyperventilation in The Australian’s editorial room,” tweeted Mark Scott. We should welcome Mr Scott’s honesty in publicly aligning himself with the embittered left fringe of politics but we should also despair that the ABC’s editor-in-chief should misunderstand policy and politics so comprehensively…

    Wednesday night on the ABC’s 7.30 Sarah Ferguson said the PUP leader was “putting himself at the vanguard” of climate policy. A couple of hours later on Lateline Tony Jones asked Mr Palmer what had caused his “road to Damascus conversion” on climate…

    Almost 24 hours on from the excitement of seeing Mr Gore take the stage with a man who has an equally large carbon footprint, the overexcited media pundits started to grasp what was happening.

(Thanks to reader Peter of Bellevue Hill.)

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...kenny_should_just_say_he_was_blinded_by_gore/


----------



## Calliope (27 June 2014)

Much encouragement has been given Palmer dislikers by the Law investigating his alleged misappropiation of 12 million dollars of Citic Pacific funds for his own dubiious uses. However the Law moves in mysterious ways and after 20 years they still haven't pinned anything on Ms Gillard.

I think the odds on us gettin rid of Clive, greatly favour his demise from over-eating than from our legal system pinning anything on him.

And I think the hard-working Hedley Thomas wiil die of over-work before Gillard and Palmer end up in the slammer.

There is a saying "Justice delayed is justice denied"...but in this case it is being denied to the public, not the perpetrator.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...follow-the-money/story-e6frg6zo-1226968229528


----------



## Julia (27 June 2014)

noco said:


> UPDATE
> 
> The Australian laughs:
> 
> ...



I gather the above was written by Peter of Bellevue Hill, not Andrew Bolt?
It's more astute - and more funny - than the contributions of most of Australia's journalists.


----------



## Calliope (27 June 2014)

Clive Palmer, who used to be Joh Bjelke-Petersen's media adviser, has the Canberra press gallery (his chooks) eating out of his hand.

Even The Australian, one of his few critics, today devoted five opinion pieces and its editorial to his recent stage managed antics on climate change.


----------



## noco (27 June 2014)

Calliope said:


> Clive Palmer, who used to be Joh Bjelke-Petersen's media adviser, has the Canberra press gallery (his chooks) eating out of his hand.
> 
> Even The Australian, one of his few critics, today devoted five opinion pieces and its editorial to his recent stage managed antics on climate change.




Well, you cannot deny the fact, he has sought out publicity and is getting plenty of it.....He certainly knows how to manipulate people.


----------



## Julia (27 June 2014)

Calliope said:


> Clive Palmer, who used to be Joh Bjelke-Petersen's media adviser, has the Canberra press gallery (his chooks) eating out of his hand.



I disagree.  "Eating out of his hand" implies unquestioning acceptance of what was said.

Certainly there has been a lot of comment which is surely as it should be when you have a piece of farce such as the joint press conference between Mr Palmer and Mr Gore.

 Everything I've read and heard in the press and on radio has been written/said with a clear tone of mockery toward both Gore and Palmer, whilst acknowledging the latter's rat cunning in successfully wedging everyone.  Mr Gore quite possibly is still ignorant of how he has been used.

If you can provide a link to any news reports which genuinely report this week's antics in a tone of intelligent admiration for anyone concerned, I'd be happy to withdraw this suggestion.


----------



## Calliope (27 June 2014)

Tony Jones and Clive palmer have a love affair . "God bless you, Tony. You're a great journalist".

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s4033303.htm


----------



## IFocus (28 June 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> Don't worry, he won't be allowed to...the Federal Environment laws...oh wait Tony got rid of them.
> Well hopefully the State Government will stop him.





LOL I think the irony may have escaped Noco


----------



## drsmith (28 June 2014)

Calliope said:


> Tony Jones and Clive palmer have a love affair . "God bless you, Tony. You're a great journalist".
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2014/s4033303.htm



I'm trying to imagine Tony Jones, Malcolm Turnbull, Clive Palmer and Al Gore in the same room all looking gooey eyed at each other.

It would last about as long as the common ground in their individual quests.


----------



## drsmith (28 June 2014)

Paul Kelly's analysis,



> BENEATH the calculated and distracting farce that he created this week, Clive Palmer did what was expected of him ”” announced he would vote to abolish Australia’s high-profile emissions trading scheme, the biggest legislative reform of the Labor era.
> 
> Palmer had a weak hand that he needed to conceal. As a businessman being punished by a hefty carbon tax bill and as a politician elected on a platform to abolish the carbon tax, Palmer had limited options. He is giving Tony Abbott the victory, above all, that Abbott had to have.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...e-of-uncertainty/story-e6frg74x-1226969413134


----------



## Julia (28 June 2014)

Paul Kelly's analysis is always worth reading.

For some amusement value, I liked Chris Kenny's article on the Palmer/Gore affair.


> T-Rex and Bambi show highlights big flaws in our debate
> 
> The Australian
> June 28, 2014 12:00AM
> ...



- The Weekend Australian


----------



## drsmith (28 June 2014)

Julia said:


> For some amusement value, I liked Chris Kenny's article on the Palmer/Gore affair.



I especially liked this line,



> Gore had been conned into thinking he was aiding Palmer’s conversion to climate action ”” Bambi helping T-Rex become herbivorous.




Sums it up to a T.


----------



## drsmith (7 July 2014)

Uncle Clive at his Press Club presser today has played another card and in doing so, got another headline,



> Clive Palmer has dealt a major blow to the Abbott government's deficit repair job by announcing his party will oppose more than $9 billion worth of savings measures linked to the repeal of the mining tax.




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...nked-to-mining-tax-repeal-20140707-3bi5w.html

More interesting though from the above article is the following in relation to the carbon tax repeal in the Senate,



> Mr Palmer confirmed he would support the repeal of the carbon tax, but would oppose the abolition of the Climate Change Authority and Clean Energy Finance Corporation.
> 
> The government's first attempt on Monday to force a debate on the repeal of the carbon tax this week failed.
> 
> ...




It will be interesting to see what his senators do in relation to that motion. 

My bolds.


----------



## Logique (7 July 2014)

G'day Doc.
I don't think Palmer should flirt with his political form. For mine this is clumsy politics. Clive needs to understand that sometimes you can be too clever for your own good. 



> http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...nked-to-mining-tax-repeal-20140707-3bi5w.html
> 
> The Palmer United Party leader told the National Press Club on Monday he supported the removal of the mining tax but *would not vote for many of the associated savings measures*. *These include scrapping the Schoolkids Bonus and superannuation rebates for low-income earners*.
> 
> *Scrapping the Schoolkids bonus* – which delivers payments of $820 per high school child and $410 per primary school student to families on Family Tax Benefit A - *would save the budget an estimated $5.2 billion over four years* based on figures from the Parliamentary Library.


----------



## drsmith (7 July 2014)

Logique said:


> G'day Doc.
> I don't think Palmer should flirt with his political form. For mine this is clumsy politics. Clive needs to understand that sometimes you can be too clever for your own good.



The abolition of the mining tax is still unconditional on his policy page.



> Media Release
> 
> OZ Minerals sackings direct result of Mining Tax: Clive Palmer
> 
> ...




http://palmerunited.com/policies/

It's in the PDF under all policy releases.

Many of his policy statements/media releases appear to date back to last year's federal election campaign. 

Perhaps he's since forgotten that Labor is less of a friend to him than the Libs.

My bolds.


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## Julia (7 July 2014)

Only day one of the new Senate and already the Palmosaurus is making clear his determination to exact revenge on the Liberal Nationals, especially for the Queensland party giving him the flick.

He is clearly having fun.  Bugger the country.


----------



## Calliope (8 July 2014)

*The Mahchurian Candidate*; 





*SPIN OF THE WEEK*



> It comes after revelations in The Australian and The Courier-Mail that Citic Pacific’s subsidiary Sino Iron alleged more than $12 million, which should have been used for operating a port, had been siphoned out of a Mineralogy-controlled bank account. The Federal MP has maintained there is no money missing.
> 
> While Mr Palmer yesterday proudly said he owned Mineralogy, he claimed he did not recall who signed two cheques, worth $12.167 million, which have become the centre of the bitter legal *dispute.
> 
> ...




http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ier-Mail|homepage|homepage&itmt=1404783646439


----------



## explod (8 July 2014)

Palmer is proving to be a very good orator, something very much lacking in both libs and alp camps. (add greens too)

He can make a picture with words and give people a sense of vision.  What I have been trying to get across to noco for some time.

Pretty sure he does not represent my politics but he is going to make people sit up.

Laugh at him if you will but the wise will sit up and take note of his methods.  And on some social service statements a large number of disadvantaged will be backing him.

If there's not some big changes the libs and alp will continue to be slaughtered by the electorate.  Where this may lead will be interesting to see.


----------



## drsmith (8 July 2014)

Clive Palmer is a political sprinter.

Behind the great theatre and oratory, there's no substance. His party is not governed by an underlying ideology other than what's best for Clive which is not a sound long term base.

It's a question of how long he can hold it all together. My estimate is that he and his party will run out of puff before the next federal election.

He'll help to toast the carbon tax this week which in the short term is what matters for the government. Longer term, it will let time wear down the cross bench senators on its budget measures.


----------



## sptrawler (8 July 2014)

Jolly ole Clive is trying to be clever, allow the government to pass tax cuts, but don't allow them to cut spending. Try and wedge Abbott.

He thinks he is sharp, I think he will cut himself.

The problem with Clive, Labor and the Greens, they are so focused on shafting Abbott, they aren't looking after Australias best interests.IMO

The powers of be will be watching carefully how this unfolds, I think Clive, Labor and the Greens will get burnt.


----------



## Calliope (9 July 2014)

explod said:


> Palmer is proving to be a very good orator, something very much lacking in both libs and alp camps. (add greens too)
> 
> He can make a picture with words and give people a sense of vision.  What I have been trying to get across to noco for some time.
> 
> ...




Strange that you Plod, our most ardent Greenie wants to join the PUPS. Perhaps you have ambitions of becoming a Senator? Politics makes such strange bed-fellows, when some of our most vocal lefties are attracted to PUP. Basilio is attracted to Jacqui Lambie. Knobby is attracted to Clive as his last hope.

I think the main reason for this fatal attraction is the shared hatred of Abbott, and you  see the PUPS now as your best opportunity of derailing representative government.


----------



## noco (9 July 2014)

Palmer is like a shark........he circles his prey for a while  to frighten the $h** out of them before he eats them.

Also be careful of that cream cake with the strawberry on top that Palmer offers everyone.....there could be a lot of  $H**  in the middle that you cannot see and will not like.


----------



## Craton (9 July 2014)

Disclaimer. I have no political alliance, just my musings.

To me, Clive came across as an amiable, fair dinkum larrikin Aussie bloke. IMHO though, he's starting to show his true colours. Glimpses of him going loco are starting to appear with the Clive and Al show. Yesterday with the on again, off again, on again Carbon Tax bill.

Will he and his party do Australia proud?

Hmm...saw Lambie's (from what I heard first I believe) question in the Senate yesterday. Wasn't impressed, just more of the same disgraceful, emotive behaviour in our parliament but this time from a different party. I don't think she liked the response from Abetz but she did fed him the best possible lead in to an answer. If this is the best PUP can do, Australia has voted for the wrong change.

Must say I had a giggle to myself when Ms Wong asked the Prez. if Lambie could have more time to finish  her sentence (which was the 2nd stab at a rant) as it was Sen Lambie's first day in the Senate after all. The Prez agreed but only this once. School days indeed!

Speaking of school days, yeah, I know it's Question Time but geez those on the opposite bench really do act like a bunch of hissy fitting school kids. I just expect more from our reps. The more I see/hear of Q time (mostly in my lunch breaks) the more I like the near cordial and civil manner in which the Libs reply.

I dunno, I thought governing the country was serious biz not about one up gamesmanship. I suppose when ya got nothing, like the ALP and the Greens, adversarial is the name of the game.

That being said, at least Clive and PUP have livened things up a bit and possibly, just possibly, Aussies might take their voting decisions a lot more seriously next time instead of voting for change just for change sake.


----------



## drsmith (9 July 2014)

Craton said:


> Speaking of school days, yeah, I know it's Question Time but geez those on the opposite bench really do act like a bunch of hissy fitting school kids. I just expect more from our reps. The more I see/hear of Q time (mostly in my lunch breaks) the more I like the near cordial and civil manner in which the Libs reply.



The activity level during question time is perhaps the reason why some of them then sleep through the remainder of the day.

The Senate does seem rowdier than the Reps which to me is a surprise. No one though gets kicked out under 94A. Either the president takes it easier than the speaker in the Reps or 94A doesn't apply.

The conclusion I've reached is the Q Time in both houses is more about theatre than it is about anything else.


----------



## noco (9 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> The activity level during question time is perhaps the reason why some of them then sleep through the remainder of the day.
> 
> The Senate does seem rowdier than the Reps which to me is a surprise. No one though gets kicked out under 94A. Either the president takes it easier than the speaker in the Reps or 94A doesn't apply.
> 
> The conclusion I've reached is the Q Time in both houses is more about theatre than it is about anything else.




Doc, all in the national interest....and pigs might fly......it is all about revenge from Palmer and it is all about point scoring from the Fabians in an effort to prevent the Coalition from reaching their goal.......it is lies, lies and more lies from the Green/Labor coalition......you know those two parties who are now supposed to be divorced but they still get into bed together behind closed doors.


----------



## Calliope (10 July 2014)

You would  have to be loco or a liar not to "recall" signing two cheques totalling $12.167m.



> Mr Palmer was the sole signat*ory on the NAB cheque account, according to sources close to his company, but he repeatedly told journalists on Monday he could “not recall’’ signing two cheques totalling $12.167m last year.
> 
> The Chinese government-owned Citic Pacific suspects its funds, which were held in the NAB account and subject to strict controls, were wrongfully used by Mr Palmer to bankroll the Palmer United Party



.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ash-to-1-company/story-fnk76wj3-1226983614303


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## drsmith (10 July 2014)

No Xmas card this year for Leigh Sales from the big teddy bear. 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-...sses-ahead-with-carbon-tax-repeal-bid/5588172


----------



## drsmith (10 July 2014)

I should have said Sarah Ferguson.



> "Don't talk to me about allegations and bull****," he responded to questions about the issue from 7.30 host Sarah Ferguson.


----------



## Calliope (11 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> I should have said Sarah Ferguson.




Talking about bullsh!i. You will find a big pile to clean up everywhere the bigPUP goes. I guess Sarah had to get the cleaners in after his hissyfit.


----------



## basilio (11 July 2014)

Well that cartoon on the PUP party is a hoot!! Perhaps they should make a hundred copies and send them to the Lib/Nats as laughing point !  I'm sure they would appreciate the joke..


----------



## noco (12 July 2014)

Palmer is doing a lot of ducking and weaving over the $12 million Chinese money, but sooner or later he is going to have to  face the music.

He might be able to run, but he cannot hide forever.......At end of the day, it could well be his undoing.

EVIDENCE of Clive Palmer’s company having nothing to do with a port for which he billed the Chinese more than $12 million in eight weeks for “port services” has been independently verified by the federal government. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ks-12m-questions/story-fn59niix-1226986174009


----------



## drsmith (12 July 2014)

noco said:


> Palmer is doing a lot of ducking and weaving over the $12 million Chinese money, but sooner or later he is going to have to  face the music.
> 
> He might be able to run, but he cannot hide forever.......At end of the day, it could well be his undoing.
> 
> ...



From late in that article it looks like he cracked another wobbly,



> In an ugly incident in Queenstown in New Zealand yesterday, he told a Channel 7 cameraman he would have him thrown out of a hotel, adding the Canberra-based reporter, Amelia Brace, could ‘f. k off’. Channel Nine also had a scheduled interview with Mr Palmer in New Zealand.
> 
> Text messages seen by The Weekend Australian show Mr Palmer had agreed to the interview at the Sofitel, but angrily canned it when the cameraman turned up.




More background,

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/clive-palmers-problem-with-living-two-lives-20140711-zt4g5.html


----------



## Julia (12 July 2014)

The ABC has belatedly picked up the Citic Pacific issue, that bothersome little blip that Mr Palmer insists is just 'all lies cooked up by The Australian'.

http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2014/s4044514.htm


----------



## wayneL (12 July 2014)

On a more politically holistic angle, I am struggling to see the common ideological thread between Palmer, The Brick and Lambie the mouth. WTF does PUP actually stand for?


----------



## sptrawler (12 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> From late in that article it looks like he cracked another wobbly,
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Could you imagine the media backlash, if Abbott carried on like this goon. 
Even when he was in opposition, the media jump on a facial gesture. 
With Clive he just tells them to F### off, and they say ok Clive.lol

Obviously Abbott is too shy, that must be why they climb all over him.


----------



## Julia (13 July 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Could you imagine the media backlash, if Abbott carried on like this goon.
> Even when he was in opposition, the media jump on a facial gesture.
> With Clive he just tells them to F### off, and they say ok Clive.lol
> 
> Obviously Abbott is too shy, that must be why they climb all over him.



Agree 100%.


----------



## noco (13 July 2014)

wayneL said:


> On a more politically holistic angle, I am struggling to see the common ideological thread between Palmer, The Brick and Lambie the mouth. WTF does PUP actually stand for?




What does Palmer stand for?

Palmer stands for revenge on Campbell Newman, because Newman took away his toys and he just went into a tantrum like a spoilt kid in a toy shop who could not get the toy he wanted.

Palmer stands for vindictiveness with Abbott to get back at Newman and at the same time being able to show his muscle in Federal Parliament to control the way we live...he does not give a damn about the working families....all Palmer is thinking about his power and how he is going to use it.....How he can dominate Abbott...He is a bully and very soon he will meet his match.

The old , old saying goes......THE BIGGER THEY ARE, THE HARDER THEY FALL.


----------



## Craton (13 July 2014)

wayneL said:


> On a more politically holistic angle, I am struggling to see the common ideological thread between Palmer, The Brick and Lambie the mouth. WTF does PUP actually stand for?




Yep, my thoughts exactly. Talk about shoot ya self in the foot! With the CITIC debacle and wobbly chucking antics, no amount of Media Circus Network-ing will stop the build up to the PUP self implosion.

A quote or two from my partner, "Ya'd think with all the money he's got he could afford to buy better clothes and ones that fit him. At least he could wear a tie couldn't he?"

Then this gem straight after, "Fancy arriving in his own cars, cars that most Aussies could never afford. Talk about rubbing our noses in it."

There ya go, how can we take PUP seriously anymore?


----------



## Craton (13 July 2014)

noco said:


> What does Palmer stand for?
> 
> Palmer stands for revenge on Campbell Newman, because Newman took away his toys and he just went into a tantrum like a spoilt kid in a toy shop who could not get the toy he wanted.
> 
> ...




Too right and all. Sooner the better.

BTW, CITIC debacle notwithstanding, curious to know. How does one get rid of Palmer?


----------



## Calliope (13 July 2014)

Craton said:


> .
> BTW, CITIC debacle notwithstanding, curious to know. How does one get rid of Palmer?




A PUP supporter recently said that the Courier-Mail has the worst journalism in Australia. They have a practice of putting the spotlight on Palmer's stupidities and indiscretions, instead of putting him on on a pedestal for trying to wreck the government like Fairfax and the ABC do.

Palmer has high hopes of wrecking Newman's government in next year's election. Dennis Atkins from the C-M said on Insiders that the C-M had commissioned a Galaxy Research on this subject. The results will be in the C-M tomorrow. Atkins said Palmer won't like them.


----------



## noco (13 July 2014)

Craton said:


> Too right and all. Sooner the better.
> 
> BTW, CITIC debacle notwithstanding, curious to know. How does one get rid of Palmer?




I honestly believe Palmer will eventually fall on his own sword.....we don't have to do anything.....he is too smart by half and voters will eventually wake up to what his true colors really are.


----------



## SirRumpole (13 July 2014)

noco said:


> I honestly believe Palmer will eventually fall on his own sword.....we don't have to do anything.....he is too smart by half and voters will eventually wake up to what his true colors really are.




Question is, does his ego exceed his intelligence ?


----------



## noco (13 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Question is, does his ego exceed his intelligence ?




I would say it does......he has a happy knack of telling people what they want to hear and the naive believe him.


----------



## Knobby22 (14 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> A PUP supporter recently said that the Courier-Mail has the worst journalism in Australia. They have a practice of putting the spotlight on Palmer's stupidities and indiscretions, instead of putting him on on a pedestal for trying to wreck the government like Fairfax and the ABC do.
> .




Excellent investigative reporting in today's Age showing Palmers lack of obeying the law.
Note, this is investigation by properly trained reporters who can read accounts rather than the rubbish the Courier Mail prints. I am sure it will be repeated without reference to the writer in tomorrow's inane Courier Mail. 

It is good we still have an independent Paper that writes without fear or favour unlike the alternative which just pushes a barrow and cannot be believed. The press that is not independent loves to attack it's competitors and unfortunately some guilleless people are swayed by this propaganda.

By the way, the Age is the paper and the same reporter who exposed the Commonwealth Bank scandal who now no longer advertise in the paper for telling the truth. This is also the paper that is suing a reporter for reporting on Gina Rheinhart. This mother of two young children stands to lose her house defending herself against this billionaire for not revealing her sources. Please check your facts Calliope before attacking Fairfax again. 

_Clive Palmer may be busy shaping the laws of the nation, but when it comes to obeying them, his flagship company is sadly lacking. An analysis of the accounts for Mineralogy Pty Ltd has identified a slew of irregularities. Some are technical, and are laid out in detail below._

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/book...any-picture-20140713-3buzt.html#ixzz37Od8OYFC


----------



## noco (14 July 2014)

What right has Palmer to be any where near the Senate house......He is a member of the House of Reps.....I think he is over stepping the mark.....he certainly likes to throw his weight around.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...king-staffer-cry/story-fnihsrf2-1226987632021


----------



## Calliope (14 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> Excellent investigative reporting in today's Age showing Palmers lack of obeying the law.
> 
> Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/book...any-picture-20140713-3buzt.html#ixzz37Od8OYFC




I trust that the Age has finally opened your eyes to the real Clive Palmer, and that you can no longer support a party led by this man.

There is nothing new here of course. Hedley Thomas, investigative journalist for the Australian has been saying the same thing for ages, but of course you wouldn't have read that rag.


----------



## noco (14 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> I trust that the Age has finally opened your eyes to the real Clive Palmer, and that you can no longer support a party led by this man.
> 
> There is nothing new here of course. Hedley Thomas, investigative journalist for the Australian has been saying the same thing for ages, but of course you wouldn't have read that rag.





And add this Palmer"s problems in getting some answers.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...12m-siphoned-off/story-fnk76wj3-1226987603754


----------



## Knobby22 (14 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> I trust that the Age has finally opened your eyes to the real Clive Palmer, and that you can no longer support a party led by this man.
> 
> There is nothing new here of course. Hedley Thomas, investigative journalist for the Australian has been saying the same thing for ages, but of course you wouldn't have read that rag.




What rubbish you post.


----------



## Julia (14 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> What rubbish you post.



Knobby, what Calliope said about "The Australian" and Hedley Thomas's excellent investigations into Clive Palmer is absolutely correct.   
Fwiw I don't think it's appropriate to compare the "Courier Mail" with "The SMH" or "The Age".  It's a crappy tabloid so compare it rather with other crappy tabloids.

The Australian, which certainly has a right focus in parts, as does the Age and SMH have a left focus, are probably chosen from confirmation bias where we generally like to read papers that reflect our own views.  
Maybe have a read of The Australian from time to time, or do a search for all the many investigative articles Hedley Thomas has done on Clive Palmer over now a sustained period of time.  Good to know Fairfax has decided to follow suit.


----------



## Calliope (14 July 2014)

The Age and the SMH are both tabloid. Tabloids cater to people of different tastes to broadsheet readers. Their stories are often lurid, unresearched garbage, to suit a political agenga, like this item which appeared in the SMH five days ago. Crappy tabloid? I think so.



> A wave of attempted suicides has swept Christmas Island as 12 mothers tried to kill themselves in the belief their then-orphaned children would have to be settled in Australia.
> *Fairfax Media has spoken with three independent sources who confirmed the women tried to end their lives* after being told they would be taken to Nauru or Manus Island, believing their children would have a better chance of living in Australia if they were dead.



 my bolds.




> tab·loid  (tbloid)
> n.
> A newspaper of small format giving the news in condensed form, usually with illustrated, often sensational material.
> adj.
> ...


----------



## Julia (14 July 2014)

I hadn't realised The Age and the SMH had moved to tabloid form.  Never see either of them up here.
Isn't Fairfax really struggling to stay afloat?  I do remember hearing about substantial numbers of journalists and photographers being given the flick.


----------



## SirRumpole (14 July 2014)

Julia said:


> Isn't Fairfax really struggling to stay afloat?  I do remember hearing about substantial numbers of journalists and photographers being given the flick.




They don't make flicks any more, it's all done on videotape


----------



## Calliope (14 July 2014)

> Tape is a linear method of storing information and since *nearly all video recordings made nowadays are digital direct to disk recording (DDR)*, videotape is expected to gradually lose importance as non-linear/random-access methods of storing digital video data become more common.



Wikipedia


----------



## SirRumpole (14 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> Wikipedia




Thanks, I needed that


----------



## Bintang (14 July 2014)

noco said:


> What right has Palmer to be any where near the Senate house......He is a member of the House of Reps.....I think he is over stepping the mark.....he certainly likes to throw his weight around.




Well he has got a lot of it to throw. When you've got it flaunt it.


----------



## drsmith (14 July 2014)

It seems there was a little soul searching from uncle Clive over the weekend,



> ALEXANDRA KIRK: Clive Palmer's defending the way his party handled things in the Senate last Thursday.
> 
> CLIVE PALMER:* So all in all, it was better not to be flustered, although we were a bit flustered last week,* to stick our guns, to get the right amendment done, so that people, members of our community, everybody that's here, will get a reduction in their gas and electricity prices.
> 
> We thought it would be fitting for the Government to move the amendment, so it puts it beyond any doubt, or any particular spurious argument.




http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2014/s4045737.htm

My bolds.


----------



## drsmith (15 July 2014)

The Senate clerk gave the big teddy bear advice he didn't like last week and now he's turned into a grizzly with a sore head.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-...demanding-obedience-from-senate-clerk/5596624


----------



## drsmith (16 July 2014)

The Australian's Hedley Thomas on Clive Palmer's rant at the senate clerk last week,



> PUBLIC servant Maureen Weeks was seen shaking. Her hands trembled and the redness of her eyes gave away her obvious distress.
> 
> A witness, who had been increasingly concerned for her as she repeatedly went in and out of the Senate chamber, described to The Australian his disgust at what he subsequently discovered was occurring behind closed doors: a bellowing, bullying tirade by Clive Palmer, furious he was not getting his way.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...990346718?nk=f01033c3bb0824ac860247840aa58bf2


----------



## noco (16 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> The Australian's Hedley Thomas on Clive Palmer's rant at the senate clerk last week,
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...990346718?nk=f01033c3bb0824ac860247840aa58bf2




    The wheels of this windbag are about to fall off.

    He thinks he can talk to anyone how he likes.......he might get a way with it in his private enterprise but he has another coming to him if he thinks he can do the same thing in Parliament.

    Palmer will be a one time wonder.

    Bring on a double dissolution next year and he will be gone.

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/a...=1405479822779


----------



## Knobby22 (16 July 2014)

Oh I don't know, Noco. Bring on a poll.

It looks like he is not going to support the very unpopular education reforms (did everyone see the galaxy poll? It is even unpopular with Liberal voters. I don't see why Chris Pynes kids will be able to go to Uni while mine won't be able to afford it, I want them to talk like him also) Cutting research and only letting the  dumb rich go to Uni -way to go Australia!

...and he has forced the government to change the financial advisors laws including clauses such as financial advisors are now to act in the best interests of their clients among other changes. I am sure the Courier Mail has all the changes listed.  

If not you can read them in the evil Age and Australia's number one paper the SMH. The ABC this morning insinuated the opposite for some reason.

I know he is a bit of a thug and skirts the law in his businesses but hey he appears to be on my side so I would not vote Pup out of the Senate. If the Libs want to make savings then they need to bring down a fair budget. I didn't think when I voted them I that they would act like Republicans and also break nearly every promise they made. They should go to the polls and let us vote on these "reforms".


----------



## noco (16 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> Oh I don't know, Noco. Bring on a poll.
> 
> It looks like he is not going to support the very unpopular education reforms (did everyone see the galaxy poll? It is even unpopular with Liberal voters. I don't see why Chris Pynes kids will be able to go to Uni while mine won't be able to afford it, I want them to talk like him also) Cutting research and only letting the  dumb rich go to Uni -way to go Australia!
> 
> ...




So what savings would you suggest?


----------



## Knobby22 (16 July 2014)

I have plenty of ideas.

In Uni for instance they could get rid of all the bulldust courses or at least don't fund them. We all know there are lots of rubbish courses with no jobs at the end of them. For instance did you know Melbourne Uni does a Bachelor of Science in Surfing Studies. Talk about a waste of taxes. If you are rich enough to be able to do such a course with little prospect of a job at the end then pay for it directly.
If you haven't the marks then don't go to Uni. http://www.toptenz.net/to-10-useless-college-classes-degrees.php

Reduce negative gearing so you can only negative from the income of the house investment, not your wage, as occurs in nearly every other country in the world. This would also make housing affordable. Or alternatively, only allow negative gearing on new houses to increase the building stock.

Pass laws so that companies such as Google which makes millions out of us actually pays tax. We actually give them money to undertake research yet they don't pay ANY tax in Australia!!!  They do donate big to both political parties so it would take good morals for Labor or Liberal to even suggest it.

Need I go on?

Note, I am not against some of the Lib proposals, a small charge to go to the doctor for instance is fair. There may be an argument for taxing petrol more  but I will let you argue that one.


----------



## noco (16 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I have plenty of ideas.
> 
> In Uni for instance they could get rid of all the bulldust courses or at least don't fund them. We all know there are lots of rubbish courses with no jobs at the end of them. For instance did you know Melbourne Uni does a Bachelor of Science in Surfing Studies. Talk about a waste of taxes. If you are rich enough to be able to do such a course with little prospect of a job at the end then pay for it directly.
> If you haven't the marks then don't go to Uni. http://www.toptenz.net/to-10-useless-college-classes-degrees.php
> ...




Could you put a figure on what those savings would amount to?


----------



## Knobby22 (16 July 2014)

No, but they would be massive. How many BA degrees are out there!

These are from Vic Uni.
Bachelor of Arts 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Community Development) 
◾Diploma of Arts (Community) 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Criminal Justice Studies) 
◾Bachelor of Arts / Diploma of Liberal Arts 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Honours)  
◾Bachelor of Arts (Honours) (Recreation Management) 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Honours) (Sport Administration) 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Kyinandoo) 
◾Bachelor of Arts (Legal Studies)

Negative gearing is a huge tax bleed.


----------



## noco (16 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> No, but they would be massive. How many BA degrees are out there!
> 
> These are from Vic Uni.
> Bachelor of Arts
> ...





Hmmm, I see......thanks Knobby, you have been a big help.


----------



## Julia (16 July 2014)

Knobby - and also Syd who rails against the government in pretty much every post:
perhaps have a look at the interview this evening on 7.30 with Chris Richardson, one of Australia's most respected economists, who is warning about the need to reduce spending, that spending is considerably outstripping Australia's income, a view also strongly expressed by Martin Parkinson, Secretary of the Treasury, and Glenn Stevens, Reserve Bank Governor, not to mention various other people who usually know what they're talking about.

But despite all that, you like Clive, think he talks sense, are apparently not prepared to consider that his motives are those of revenge and desire to create mayhem.  Just as Labor and the Greens apparently think it's quite fine to just go on racking up debt in order to give the unthinking people what they want.

And just btw, Christopher Pyne's accent is typical of South Australia, hardly a reflection of his tertiary education.


----------



## Knobby22 (16 July 2014)

Julia

I know we have to start reducing debt but that reduction should be done fairly and thought through. There are many ways to do this. I have listed many, I could add the reduction of the company tax rate is not good timing.

We know this is social engineering. We already know that they *plan to give tax cuts* before the election but I know that they won't restore tertiary education funding and my kids will struggle to go to Uni as a result. My niece is in a much worse position as she comes from the country and is now training to be a doctor. The fees will be horrendous and her family can't help.

I don't believe Clive's only ambition is revenge, there are many others as we are all complex creatures and that is a very simplistic view of the situation.

Why is the Coalition attacking our Australian way of life. The fair go? It's not just the Uni fees, it's the huge rise in temporary foreign workers taking jobs from our youth who now have nearly 25% unemployment. We know that is social engineering too to bring down wages. 

Everyone deserves a chance to make it whatever their station in life.

Anyone who stops them has my vote. Anyone who attacks my children's future has lost my vote.

As I said, I voted for the Liberal Party, not the US Republican party. I voted for Howard 3 times but he was not like this! Not happy Jan. This will be a deservedly one term Parliament.


----------



## luutzu (16 July 2014)

When u got elected into office, your investments must go into a black fund right? And to be fair on rich civic minded investors I'm assuming there's no capital gains tax on those forced sales right? Like in the US.

Going into politics might be better than going to the Bahamas and those other shelters.

And u can't just get in and say n do nothing


----------



## dutchie (17 July 2014)

Niki Savva on Clive Palmer

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...ss-tony-and-bill/story-fnahw9xv-1226991450738

WHEN Clive Palmer crashes and burns, as he inevitably will, he will walk away from the wreckage blaming the giant conspiracy orch*estrated by the government and News Corp Australia, laughing out the side of his mouth at the two small figures scratching through the rubble: Tony Abbott looking for bits of vertebrae and Bill Shorten for an inner compass.

Palmer will take no responsibility for his own demise, or for his soiling of parliament and the inexcusable trashing of the reputations of people bound to impartially serve it and protect it from threats to its integrity from people like him.

The Prime Minister, perversely Zen-like, genuinely believes despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, that all is well, or soon will be. The Opposition Leader at least appreciates the uniqueness of the situation but bristles at suggestions he should lift a finger to fix it, or that he bears any responsibility for the damage to the body politic, preferring to pose as an innocent bystander with little power to intervene.

If the past few years have taught us anything, it is that once trashed, reputations are almost impossible to rebuild. An exceptional practitioner of the art could manage it; however, Shorten is yet to show he is talented enough to do it, or has the will to repair the fiscal damage caused by Labor, the Greens and Palmer from now until he finally disintegrates.

Shorten should do what the government has not done and heed Ron Boswell’s advice to the Coalition leadership before he retired from the Senate: do not trust Palmer. The West Australians give similar counsel. They refuse to deal with Palmer because they have no faith he will abide by any agreement. Those who have known him best, or have dealt with him the longest, trust him the least. Ask Campbell Newman, who has taken a principled stand against Palmer.

On Wednesday night a week ago, Palmer shook hands with Environment Minister Greg Hunt and the Leader of the Government in the Senate, Eric Abetz, in Hunt’s office to clinch the deal securing Palmer United Party votes for the carbon tax repeal and Palmer’s amendment to ensure savings were passed on to consumers.

Less than an hour later Palmer began rewriting his own amendment. He was still rewriting it the following morning when he met his puppies and a seasoned drover’s dog, former Greens staff member Ben Oquist, now with the Australia Institute, who has emerged as an unlikely influence on Palmer. When Palmer gave it to the government about 9.15am, it accepted it within minutes.

It recognised its flaw ”” that it was unconstitutional ”” but trusted the Senate clerks would do their job, spot it, then inform the PUPs. The clerk did, suggesting it could be fixed simply by inserting one word: “penalty”.

Palmer was furious, resorted to verbal violence and insisted, as he still does, that he knows more about the Constitution than the clerks, whom he continues to abuse. Of course he does. He is Clive and they are not. Two independents, Nick Xenophon and John Madigan, had the ticker to take him on over it.

One of Palmer’s many problems is he doesn’t know what he doesn’t know. At least that was my observation to an Abbott minister who, for his sins, has been compelled to deal with Palmer. His reply was truer: “No. He does know what he doesn’t know and he doesn’t care.”

One of the first people Palmer alerted via text to his plans to vote down the repeal was his buddy Billy, whom he subsequently dudded on changes to financial advice rules. Among the last to know of Palmer’s carbon vote switch were his own senators, two of whom at least, Dio Wang and Glenn Lazarus, are taking their duties seriously. They found out about the same time as the government.

Palmer emasculates Abbott as surely as he renders Shorten *obsolete or complicit in his double dealings, and as certainly as he *tarnishes an already tainted *parliament.

After what happened last Thursday, after the slurs cast by Palmer against his ministers, alleging double-cross or dirty tricks that never happened, after the slurs against hardworking Senate staff, Abbott should have politely but firmly declared that the government had done its best to negotiate with Palmer (which it had), Palmer’s amendment would be *tidied up to ensure it was legal and free of unintended consequences, but that he would tolerate no more silly buggers from anybody, including Palmer, and invited him to vote for the package in parliament. Or not.

If Palmer did not, then it would have been a simple matter to make him wear the tax and the consequences.

The defeated bills could then have been saved for a double-dissolution election ”” not right away because slaughter beckons ”” but any time six months before the expiry of the government’s term, which is the latest it can be held, or whenever the government looks remotely as if it might be in a fit state to fight an election.

Instead Abbott, anxious not to antagonise Palmer ”” as if it’s possible to woo a brown snake ”” declared it “situation normal”. Only if you think a meteor landing on your roof is normal. Ministers were compelled to sing along with Abbott’s tune while privately admitting it is anything but normal and despairing at their leader’s meek responses.

Palmer’s self-detonation could come sooner rather than later; however, he has inflicted lasting damage on Abbott by making him look craven ”” and on an issue where there was supposed agreement.

The suggestion the debacle was the government’s fault took hold in receptive quarters. It is not the government’s fault, unless you want to blame it for not preventing Palmer’s election or that of his senators, but it most certainly is the government’s problem. It will pay the price for Palmer’s orchestrated chaos precisely because it is the government, which theoretically should control chaos.

Others suggest the PUPs and fellow traveller Ricky Muir should be cut some slack because they are not fully trained up yet in media, politics or procedural matters. Tell that to Liberal candidate Jaymes Diaz, crucified for not knowing his party’s asylum-seeker policy during the last election campaign, who subsequently failed to win the seat of Greenway.

The saddest part of the whole sorry episode is that while there will be a temporary respite as all sides resume budget battles, the carbon tax repeal will not stop the near decade-long fight over the weather and whether a tax can change it.



This is what we voted for.


----------



## Knobby22 (17 July 2014)

luutzu said:


> When u got elected into office, your investments must go into a black fund right? And to be fair on rich civic minded investors I'm assuming there's no capital gains tax on those forced sales right? Like in the US.
> 
> Going into politics might be better than going to the Bahamas and those other shelters.
> 
> And u can't just get in and say n do nothing




I believe in Australia you just have to declare it. No other rules.


----------



## Calliope (17 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> We know this is social engineering. We already know that they *plan to give tax cuts* before the election but I know that they won't restore tertiary education funding and my kids will struggle to go to Uni as a result. My niece is in a much worse position as she comes from the country and is now training to be a doctor. The fees will be horrendous and her family can't help.




Why should you assume that it is your divine right that *we* should pay for *your * children's tertiary.  education? Have they considered learning a trade?



> Anyone who stops them has my vote. Anyone who attacks my children's future has lost my vote.




I don't think Palmer and his PUPs are the answer to your assumed victim status.*Your* children's future is *your* responsibility. Man up!


----------



## overhang (17 July 2014)

That article Dr Smith linked really gives insight into what a thug Clive is.  It's employers like him that are the reasons unions exist, its a pity the unions also have thugs of their own.


----------



## SirRumpole (17 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> Why should you assume that it is your divine right that *we* should pay for *your * children's tertiary.  education? Have they considered learning a trade?
> 
> I don't think Palmer and his PUPs are the answer to your assumed victim status.*Your* children's future is *your* responsibility. Man up!




Those children may well be operating inside your chest after you've had a heart attack.

Do you want them to do a good job ?

Assuming they can afford to get their degree.


----------



## SirRumpole (17 July 2014)

> Need I go on?




Remove the tax rebate for mining companies for the State royalties they pay. That should be simple and low cost to implement.

Maybe net around $5 billion pa


----------



## drsmith (17 July 2014)

dutchie said:


> After what happened last Thursday, after the slurs cast by Palmer against his ministers, alleging double-cross or dirty tricks that never happened, after the slurs against hardworking Senate staff, Abbott should have politely but firmly declared that the government had done its best to negotiate with Palmer (which it had), Palmer’s amendment would be *tidied up to ensure it was legal and free of unintended consequences, but that he would tolerate no more silly buggers from anybody, including Palmer, and invited him to vote for the package in parliament. Or not.
> 
> If Palmer did not, then it would have been a simple matter to make him wear the tax and the consequences.



Niki Savva has a good point in the above but the carbon tax wasn't the one to pick for the battle with Clive. The mining tax is a better option.

TA has walked away from Clive Palmer before and will do so again when the timing is better.


----------



## Julia (17 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> Why should you assume that it is your divine right that *we* should pay for *your * children's tertiary.  education?



You do raise an interesting point.
Knobby, who amongst Australia's taxpayers, do you believe should be taxed sufficiently to provide the funds to pay for your children's tertiary education?

It's not a malicious question in any way, just a genuine enquiry.


----------



## luutzu (17 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I believe in Australia you just have to declare it. No other rules.




ah see... no politics for me then.


----------



## Knobby22 (18 July 2014)

Julia said:


> You do raise an interesting point.
> Knobby, who amongst Australia's taxpayers, do you believe should be taxed sufficiently to provide the funds to pay for your children's tertiary education?
> 
> It's not a malicious question in any way, just a genuine enquiry.




I will ask it another way.

Why should our best and brightest be excluded from the tertiary education system when we want to be the clever country? Even in the old days there were scholarships for people without the means to go to University. If you look throughout history, the people who got these scholarships tended out to be the some of the brightest scientists , diplomats and politicians the world has seen.

Why should we destroy opportunity to give a minor tax cut to the wealthy. Why should we turn away from the Australian concept of egalitarianism? "Sorry Denise, your mother is a single Mum, despite the fact you are a mathematical genius, there is no way you can go to University, get a job at Kmart."

This is not to say the funding could not be better directed. Why are we paying for rich kids to do a surfing course at Melbourne University? It can be done another way without being socially inequitable.

Also, I believe in some redistribution of wealth by taxation. This has been un-argued for generations. The Libs have stated they plan to give tax cuts at the end of their term so they can win elections.

So I will ask it another way?
Why is it good for society that only wealthy kids can go to University when in most countries of the world University students are chosen on ability for the ongoing good of the country and society? Where would Germany be now? Why did George W Bush go to Harvard despite being a very average student?


----------



## drsmith (18 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> Niki Savva has a good point in the above but the carbon tax wasn't the one to pick for the battle with Clive. The mining tax is a better option.
> 
> TA has walked away from Clive Palmer before and will do so again when the timing is better.



With the mining tax repeal, the government is going to reject senate amendments to retain associated spending measures.



> THE political brawl over $40 billion in budget savings reached an impasse last night when the Abbott* government refused to accep*t changes to the repeal of the mining tax, setting up a new test of will over the contentious reform.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...g-on-mining-tax/story-fn59nsif-1226992733364#


----------



## Calliope (18 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> .
> 
> Also, I believe in some redistribution of wealth by taxation.




By the way you are continually complaining that you want more handouts, I suspect your family is among the 48% of Australian families that pay no net income tax. Your hero Clive, doesn't pay any income tax either




> *Welcome to the welfare nation: Half of Australia’s families pay no net tax*



http://www.news.com.au/national/wel...s-pay-no-net-tax/story-fncynjr2-1226911042149

ATTACH=CONFIG]58720[/ATTACH]


----------



## Knobby22 (18 July 2014)

Calliope said:


> By the way you are continually complaining that you want more handouts, I suspect your family is among the 48% of Australian families that pay no net income tax. Your hero Clive, doesn't pay any income tax either




I pay plenty of tax and don't negative gear to avoid it. I have a really good job and am an Associate. I was the second person in my family ever to go to University and when I went my family was in dire straits. I thank the Australian populace for letting me succeed. 

Under your ideal world, where privilege is entrenched, I suppose I never would have got the chance. Oliver Twist is what the world used to be like before we acted more humanely.
I think we will just have to disagree on the direction Australia should go. I feel as a 6th generation Australian on all sides that I have the right to my view.


----------



## Calliope (18 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I pay plenty of tax and don't negative gear to avoid it. I have a really good job and am an Associate.



Many of the 48% play plenty tax, but their hand-outs exceed what they pay.

I may be naive, but I just can't understand how a person with a really good job, and an Associate to boot, should expect me, a self-funded retiree, to help pay for your children's tertiary education. It is all the more strange, when you consider that Palmer, the guy you reach out to as your last hope (for student handouts?) pays no taxes at all. :dunno:

It is also strange that you would make a remark like "Under your ideal world, where privilege is entrenched", when your apparently ideal world is entrenched entitlement and dependency on the nanny state.

Sorry if I appear grouchy, but I have my quarterly supplementary tax bill in front of me and the reason it is so big is because of the hefty 30% tax I pay on my term deposit interest, and I know the government will pass on a large chunk of it to persons better off than me, as you obviously are.


----------



## Julia (18 July 2014)

Knobby, I understand that you want your children to receive taxpayer funded tertiary education.  Seems an absolutely logical desire from a parent's point of view.

I guess all I'm trying to point out is that we all want what we want for ourselves.  
However, for someone to receive assistance means that some other taxpayer has to provide it.

I was just asking which of that taxpayer cohort you thought should offer their taxes to support  your children's education.

Others  might think more should go to eg the unemployed to help them get a job, any job.  Or people struggling with mental or physical health problems who need social suppport.

Wherever we look there are gaping needs.  Can't your children avail themselves of the HECS funding which doesn't have to be gradually paid back until they are earning?   Am I mistaken in thinking no one has to pay for their degree up front if they are Australian citizens?


----------



## SirRumpole (18 July 2014)

> I guess all I'm trying to point out is that we all want what we want for ourselves.
> However, for someone to receive assistance means that some other taxpayer has to provide it.




The taxpayer also gets the benefit of the services that qualified people provide. Sure we pay for them in fees and charges, but they have to be available in the first place.

 Think public transport (or other utilities), we pay for the running costs by fares, but we also pay for the capital cost ie availability through our general taxes. I think uni degrees are about a 50% student funded through HECS and 50% taxpayer funded. The taxpayer funding is paid off by the taxes that the students pay over their lifetime.


----------



## Julia (18 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> . I think uni degrees are about a 50% student funded through HECS and 50% taxpayer funded. The taxpayer funding is paid off by the taxes that the students pay over their lifetime.



Sure, if they get to actually earn enough to pay tax.  There are, as Knobby points out, some pretty useless degree courses out there.  I seem to recall  your making this very point a while back.

It just seems to me that, given the massive amount of demand for taxpayer dollars, to be particularly generous to tertiary students who have their entire earning capacity ahead of them, rather than, say, providing assistance to people who are saving the country money by personally caring for disabled or aged family, or perhaps offering more basic mentoring and support programs for disadvantaged students in the public school system, might be more fair.

Putting all the political point scoring aside, we will all have our personal views about this, depending on what matters most to us.


----------



## SirRumpole (19 July 2014)

Julia said:


> Sure, if they get to actually earn enough to pay tax.  There are, as Knobby points out, some pretty useless degree courses out there.  I seem to recall  your making this very point a while back.




Yes,there is a lot of room to only publicly fund courses that are in demand by the community, the rest of the tertiary education budget could be put into areas that you mentioned. Pity that no one in politics seems to have picked up on this point.


----------



## drsmith (22 July 2014)

After 11 years on the shelf, Jacqui Lambie's looking for a man.

Well hung and lots of money are minimum requirements.

Knowing when not to speak (which is all the time) is also up there.

Must also be a keen gardener.



> Then Kim asked Lambie about her bikini line and it was full steam ahead on the Oversharing Express.
> 
> "Right now the state I'm in, you'd want to bring out that whipper snipper first," replied Lambie. "It's a very scary area to talk about this morning."




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...-radio-station-heart-1073-20140722-3ccr2.html


----------



## Knobby22 (22 July 2014)

She is the opposite of a standard politician, isn't she? What a handful Lambie is! 

I love that she doesn't want her man to communicate verbally. 
Definitely not one of the sweet type of women.


----------



## waza1960 (22 July 2014)

I don't like to use the Hate word but if I was to hate anyone it would be that Lambie woman.
 I wish she would shut up and fade away. What an assault on the senses she is.


----------



## drsmith (22 July 2014)

From the comments section of the Fairfax article above,



> Please God - if I close my eyes, tap my heels together three times and pray real hard - don't let me be reincarnated in the next life as a Tasmanian whipper-snipper.....please?




I don't think whipper snipper sales are about to skyrocket.



> Jamie dropped off the line before radio presenters could set up a date for the pair.
> 
> “I have that effect on the men,” Senator Lambie said.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...-her-mens-policy/story-fn59niix-1226997606291

Meanwhile, I suspect someone's managed to give her some advice,



> "I apologise to any radio listeners who may be offended by my comments on Kim and Dave's Show," she said in an issued statement.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-22/lambie-describes-her-ideal-man-as-well-hung-on-radio/5615164


----------



## Bintang (22 July 2014)

waza1960 said:


> I don't like to use the Hate word but if I was to hate anyone it would be that Lambie woman.
> I wish she would shut up and fade away. What an assault on the senses she is.




I used to think Paul Keating was dead right when he described the Senate as "unrepresentative swill". But Lambie has successfully rendered that colourful phrase totally inappropriate. It's much too complimentary for her. She is far, far worse than  unrepresentative swill.


----------



## Glen48 (22 July 2014)

She would be a good catch .pension for life all expenses paid not to much to ask for..
reminds me of a quote for a movie star her hubby said I have spent enough on you to buy a battleship...she replied you have spent enough in me to float it,


----------



## trainspotter (22 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> After 11 years on the shelf, Jacqui Lambie's looking for a man.
> 
> Well hung and lots of money are minimum requirements.
> 
> ...




She looks like she has a fair amount of dirt to be turned in her garden Doctor.


----------



## noco (22 July 2014)

This woman has the Morales of an ALLEY CAT. She is certainly not setting any examples for young people.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/enter...ng-on-heart-1073/story-fnihmoiz-1226997163380


----------



## drsmith (22 July 2014)

If it doesn't have the man power or versatility of the Honda GX35, it just won't cut it.


----------



## Julia (22 July 2014)

waza1960 said:


> I don't like to use the Hate word but if I was to hate anyone it would be that Lambie woman.
> I wish she would shut up and fade away. What an assault on the senses she is.






Bintang said:


> I used to think Paul Keating was dead right when he described the Senate as "unrepresentative swill". But Lambie has successfully rendered that colourful phrase totally inappropriate. It's much too complimentary for her. She is far, far worse than  unrepresentative swill.



+100.  She's an embarrassment of the worst order.  Even the feminazis are unlikely to offer support to this awful woman.  Yuk!

This comment following one of the above links, makes an excellent point:


> Imagine the outcry if a male politician made comments equivalent to Jacqui Lambie's on his wish-list for a partner.



So right.  Just imagine if Tony Abbott had made such a remark!!!!  (were he single, of course.)


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (22 July 2014)

There is a certain moral judiciary operating on ASF atm. I am distraught. By it.

It is Topless Tuesday here at the hotel, and for the benefit of investors, I am moved to portray a more liberal view of the 11 years past Virginal, fair Jacqui Lambie's ejections on talk back radio this morning. 

She is a member of the PUP. 

This sets a warning tone. 

Does she breed tigers, dinosaurs, AK47's, or Gypsies?

Who knows.

However it is quite within the realms of reasonableness for her to seek a partner, temporarily or forever, who is rich and well endowed in testes and penis.

Particularly after an 11 year hiatus from the joys of conjugation.

It is what goyles do. 

Leave her be to pursue her wants. 

It makes the world go round. 

gg


----------



## Knobby22 (23 July 2014)

It's also good to be wanted, hey GG? 

I'm personally just finding enjoyment in it all. The thought police don't like her but so what.


----------



## SirRumpole (23 July 2014)

Re Jacquie Lambie

If we want Parliament to represent a cross section of society, we have to take the bad with the good.
,
Look at Toronto and the Mayor, Boris Yeltsin etc. Every Parliament in the world probably has a Lambie equivalent somewhere.


----------



## Bintang (23 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> After 11 years on the shelf, Jacqui Lambie's looking for a man.
> 
> Well hung and lots of money are minimum requirements.
> 
> ...




For a fleeting moment I thought that big Clive himself might be her perfect match. After all, he has lots of money, he is well hung girth-wise and the two of them are already in bed together. As for his gardening habits I'm not so sure but his recent mixing with the green fairies must count for something.  However,  he fails miserably on the third criterion. Big Clive never knows when to stop talking.


----------



## drsmith (23 July 2014)

Bintang said:


> For a fleeting moment I thought that big Clive himself might be her perfect match. After all, he has lots of money, he is well hung girth-wise and the two of them are already in bed together. As for his gardening habits I'm not so sure but his recent mixing with the green fairies must count for something.



That would come down to Clive's abilities with the powered garden implements. We know what the Greens views are on slashing the natural environment.

In Jacqui's comments yesterday there's an opening for Essential Beauty. She could be their new Mary Huff. Definitely a better marketing opportunity there than for Jim's Mowing. 



Bintang said:


> However, he fails miserably on the third criterion. Big Clive never knows when to stop talking.



And that's where the political relationship between those two will ultimately come to grief. 

The bust up when it comes I'd suggest will be nuclear.


----------



## Craton (23 July 2014)

Having heard what Lambie said on air, I laughed coz she sounded so typically Aussie. Who've known you could mix serious politics with sleazy comedy. Oh, hang on, I mean...


----------



## Julia (23 July 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I'm personally just finding enjoyment in it all. The thought police don't like her but so what.



I hope you continue to find enjoyment when the collective decisions of the PUP, given that they hold the balance of power in the Senate, mean you will be faced with a budget ten years down the track which is one hell of a lot worse than that to which you are so objecting now.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

Julia said:


> I hope you continue to find enjoyment when the collective decisions of the PUP, given that they hold the balance of power in the Senate, mean you will be faced with a budget ten years down the track which is one hell of a lot worse than that to which you are so objecting now.




Perhaps we may get a government who takes from those who can afford to pay and doesn't splash money out on silly parental leave schemes and doesn't throw away revenue like the carbon tax.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

Jacquie Lambie,

If a male Senator or MP said similar things about a woman, it would be a passport to electoral defeat, and you would hear the sreams of protest from the Sisterhood on the other side of the planet..


On behalf of the Brotherhood, I say how dare this person denigrate the male anatomy in such a disrespectful manner. Men are not here for the pleasure of women, we have a brain , and what's more men's brains are bigger than women's, and we deserve respect for the humble way we go about doing our jobs while living in a female dominated society.


Now excuse me, I have to go and finish the ironing. Anyone know a woman who can help me with that ?


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Perhaps we may get a government who takes from those who can afford to pay and doesn't splash money out on silly parental leave schemes and doesn't throw away revenue like the carbon tax.




Lets hope we don't get any more hare brain schemes like pink bats and over priced school halls.

And we don't need anymore $900 loans from that same government who splashed money around like drunken sailors.....nothing is free......we now have to pay it back over the next ten years.

Socialism  is good until they run out of other peoples money.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

noco said:


> Lets hope we don't get any more hare brain schemes like pink bats and over priced school halls.
> 
> And we don't need anymore $900 loans from that same government who splashed money around like drunken sailors.....nothing is free......we now have to pay it back over the next ten years.
> 
> Socialism  is good until they run out of other peoples money.




Those were GFC minimisation schemes. If there is no GFC threat no government would contemplate such things in times of fiscal deficits.


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

Sooner or later Palmer is going to come unstuck and I don't think he will be any match for the Chinese and furthermore I cannot ever see him being able to do any further deals with any Chinese companies in the future.

He has blotted his copy book well and truly. 

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...er-fiona-simpson/story-fnihsrf2-1226999286954


----------



## Knobby22 (24 July 2014)

From writer Lauren Rosewarne

_When Senator Jacqui Lambie - in all her unwaxed, 43-year-old glory - dared speak publicly about her own sexual interests, she was painted as a foul-mouthed hick.
The Victorian era force fed us all kinds of hokum. One of the lingering dictums is that good girls don't. Good girls, "classy" girls, well-bred and refined girls keep their knees together.

While the God-botherers, conservatives and some of those faux-feminist wowsers are still advocating such dreck, today the sane amongst us dismiss such notions as laughably repressive and egregiously controlling.

One Victorian era tenet that has stood the test of time, however, is the burden about being "ladylike" about sex. Apparently in 2014 we womenfolk can bonk with great and enthusiastic vigour but we shouldn't talk about it. We can do it, sure, but we shouldn't offer up too much detail, shouldn't harbour yearnings, shouldn't unapologetically divulge our cravings.

Not only did Jacqui Lambie break the unspoken rules of failing to shut up, but she did so on the wrong side of 30 and without sufficient levels of mainstream attractiveness needed to grant her a pass._


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Those were GFC minimisation schemes. If there is no GFC threat no government would contemplate such things in times of fiscal deficits.




I am sure if they had used their common sense, the Labor Party should have been able to do twice as much with half the amount of money instead of wasting it like they did.

But of course  we all know there is very little talent in the Green/Labor socialist left wing party  which is principally made of ex union hacks and Green Fabians with little between the ears.


----------



## Julia (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Perhaps we may get a government who takes from those who can afford to pay and doesn't splash money out on silly parental leave schemes and doesn't throw away revenue like the carbon tax.



I don't know a single person who supports Mr Abbott's PPL, but remember that it's paid for not by the ordinary taxpayer but a specific tax on some big businesses.

The carbon tax was an unreasonable impost on business and households, making Australia uncompetitive in the global environment.   You know that.  You also know that it was forced on Gillard in order to secure the Greens' support.  Had she not needed the Greens there indeed would have no carbon tax under the government she led.

All that's completely aside, however.  This is about PUP.   All the people who are finding them so amusing might be much less amused when the results of some of their capricious ignorance comes home to roost.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

Julia said:


> I don't know a single person who supports Mr Abbott's PPL, but remember that it's paid for not by the ordinary taxpayer but a specific tax on some big businesses.




Not quite true, as I believe I have pointed out before, but will do so again



> The scheme, which has been fully costed by the independent Parliamentary Budget Office,* will involve a net additional cost to taxpayers of $6.1 billion over the forward estimates. *That's after Mr Abbott hits 3000 of Australia's largest companies with a 1.5 per cent tax levy to pay for the scheme.
> 
> http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...ity-leave-scheme/story-fni0cx12-1226699076504






> The carbon tax was an unreasonable impost on business and households, making Australia uncompetitive in the global environment.   You know that.  You also know that it was forced on Gillard in order to secure the Greens' support.  Had she not needed the Greens there indeed would have no carbon tax under the government she led.




The rate went too high too fast, but the general idea was good imo.


----------



## Julia (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Not quite true, as I believe I have pointed out before, but will do so again



Really?
From the very article to which you linked:


> According the Parliamentary Budget Office the scheme will cost over $5 billion a year when it is fully up and running. But that cost will be offset by abolishing Labor's existing paid parental leave scheme that pays women 18 weeks leave at the minimum wage. There's also some savings around Family Tax Benefit A and B payments that would not occur if women were on baby leave.
> 
> There would be no double dipping by public servants who already have access to existing schemes and that would save money too. So once those savings are made the scheme would cost around $3.5 billion a year. That cost would be fully accounted for according to Mr Abbott by a levy on big business to pay for the scheme.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

Julia said:


> Really?
> From the very article to which you linked:




Oh, I'm sorry . I obviously misread the statement "*NET* additional cost to the taxpayer *AFTER* the levy on business".

The Telegraph seems confused , and who can blame them ?

But anyway, when Mr Abbott was moaning about costs to business under Labor, and then piles this on them, his credibility can only go downwards.


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

Julia said:


> Really?
> From the very article to which you linked:




Julia, typical of the Fabians......they cherry pick what they want you see....never let the truth get in the way of a bit of propaganda to discredit Abbott and his Government.


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

noco said:


> Julia, typical of the Fabians......they cherry pick what they want you see....never let the truth get in the way of a bit of propaganda to discredit Abbott and his Government.




You're right, he doesn't need any help on the discredit front.


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> You're right, he doesn't need any help on the discredit front.




So what may I ask does he deserve any discredit apart from the PPL .....the PPL which I for one have been opposed.

Abbott and Hockey are trying to get our economy under control in the National interest.

The Fabian indoctrinated Green/Labor socialist left wingers are doing the level best to further wreck the economy which is not in the National interest....they are economic vandals of the highest order and that includes PUP which this thread is all about..


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

It will only a matter of time....Palmer has met his match with the Chinese who are obviously much smarter than Palmer.

If Palmer is charged with fraud, how long will he be allowed to remain in parliament?

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-over-use-of-12m/story-fnihsrf2-1227000101623


----------



## SirRumpole (24 July 2014)

noco said:


> So what may I ask does he deserve any discredit apart from the PPL .....the PPL which I for one have been opposed.




How about for breaking most of his election promises ?


----------



## ChrisJH (24 July 2014)

noco said:


> The Fabian indoctrinated Green/Labor socialist left wingers are doing the level best to further wreck the economy which is not in the National interest....they are economic vandals of the highest order and that includes PUP which this thread is all about..




Are the PUP Fabian Indoctrinated?


----------



## Craton (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> How about for breaking most of his election promises ?




...and Labour, especially via Gillard, didn't?
Give me a break, both sides, no, make that ALL parties break promises, sheesh!

Totally agree with noco in that Shorten/Greens are doing all in their power to stuff this great country up. Make no mistake, I'm not a great fan of Abbott and less so of Shorten but to me TA and his mob are the best pick from the current crop of pollies. At least TA and crew are trying to fix the ill's of this nation for the long haul.

FWIW. The more I see and hear the more I'm liking TA's mob over Shortens' dishevelled bunch coupled with Green cohorts and don't get me started on the minorities like PUP, that only appear to have self and not national interest at heart.


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

ChrisJH said:


> Are the PUP Fabian Indoctrinated?




No.....I included them as economic vandals......If you read my post again you will understand that I did not make reference to PUP as indoctrinated with Fabianism.


----------



## noco (24 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> How about for breaking most of his election promises ?




Abbott promised to stop the boats...tick tick.

Abbott promised to scrap the Carbon Dioxide tax....tick tick.

Two thirds there.

Abbott promised to bring the debt and deficit left by the last rotten government under control but is being hampered by that same rotten past  government in the senate who are intent on continuing with their wrecking ball which is not in the National interest.

The Fabians have even broken their own promise to cut spending by some $6 billion which Hockey included in his budget.....Why did Labor break that promise?......Labor promised to scarp the carbon tax in September 2013 that Gillard promised would never happen under the Government I lead. 

So Rumpy, please do not carry on like a pork chop at Jewish picnic about broken promises...


----------



## SirRumpole (25 July 2014)

Craton said:


> ...and Labour, especially via Gillard, didn't?




And they got thrown out for it.

The same should happen with the current lot.

But politics as a whole in this country leaves a lot to be desired. One lying crowd replaces another lying crowd. Not much hope for the voters unless we show them that lying is unacceptable.


----------



## noco (25 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> And they got thrown out for it.
> 
> The same should happen with the current lot.
> 
> But politics as a whole in this country leaves a lot to be desired. One lying crowd replaces another lying crowd. Not much hope for the voters unless we show them that lying is unacceptable.




Rumpy, what have they lied about?

Age pensions will still increase every September and March...no cuts to the pension.

8% a year increase in Health

8% increase in Education.

9 months into their term....what do you expect......give them 18 months and you are bound to see a difference to the previous lot.


----------



## SirRumpole (25 July 2014)

noco said:


> Rumpy, what have they lied about?
> 
> Age pensions will still increase every September and March...no cuts to the pension.
> 
> .




They rise by less than they would have on previous arrangements, so that is a cut.


----------



## noco (25 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> They rise by less than they would have on previous arrangements, so that is a cut.




The adjustment to the  increase in pensions is an easier way just as Jenny Macklin found in the adjustments to child welfare of some family benefits....I am not sure what the system is but I will attempt to find out...in the meantime, call comrade Macklin and she should be able to explain it better.


----------



## Bintang (25 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> And they got thrown out for it.
> 
> The same should happen with the current lot.
> 
> But politics as a whole in this country leaves a lot to be desired. One lying crowd replaces another lying crowd. Not much hope for the voters *unless we show them that lying is unacceptable*.




And how exactly do we the voters show to them that lying is unacceptable?

Short of a revolution the only thing we *can do* is vote them out of office ...... to be replaced by yet another lying crowd and the merry-go-round will never stop.

So in reality there is zero hope for voters.

Oh I forgot,. we could of course expose them for what they are on, say, ABC television. Now wouldn't that be useful!


----------



## SirRumpole (25 July 2014)

Bintang said:


> And how exactly do we the voters show to them that lying is unacceptable?
> 
> Short of a revolution the only thing we *can do* is vote them out of office ...... to be replaced by yet another lying crowd and the merry-go-round will never stop.
> 
> ...




No, there is not zero hope. If they get thrown out often enough for lying then maybe they won't do it any more.


----------



## noco (25 July 2014)

Bintang said:


> And how exactly do we the voters show to them that lying is unacceptable?
> 
> Short of a revolution the only thing we *can do* is vote them out of office ...... to be replaced by yet another lying crowd and the merry-go-round will never stop.
> 
> ...




It is called democracy......you vote for the lesser of two evils.

Voters will always favor the party who fills their pockets with money....money that has been borrowed and now must be paid back....remember those $900 cheques that Rudd gave out.....he fooled everybody......he did not tell you it was a loan and now you have to pay it back one way or another.

As I keep saying.....Socialism is a wonderful thing until they run out of other people's money.

But these post are a bit off beat from the thread....HAS CLIVE PALMER GONE LOCO.


----------



## Bintang (25 July 2014)

noco said:


> As I keep saying.....Socialism is a wonderful thing until they run out of other people's money.
> 
> But these post are a bit off beat from the thread....HAS CLIVE PALMER GONE LOCO.




Maybe not completely off beat considering that  questions remain about whose money big Clive has been spending to get PUP votes.  Very likely also other people's money (chinese perhaps) rather than his own and when it runs out I guess this thread can be closed.


----------



## drsmith (25 July 2014)

No bullying in the house uncle Clive, please.



> Billionaire politician Clive Palmer has called for the clerk of the Senate to resign unless she is able to maintain impartiality, following a staff email she wrote implying Mr Palmer was a bully.
> 
> A leaked internal email sent to Senate staff on Thursday, and obtained by Fairfax Media, reveals clerk of the Senate Rosemary Laing warned staff not to tolerate ''unacceptable behaviour'' and made reference to the ''conduct of a member of the House of Representatives''.
> 
> While the email does not directly name the MP, it was widely reported two weeks ago that there was an altercation between Dr Laing and Mr Palmer, the member for Fairfax, over amendments to the carbon tax repeal bill.




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...-rosemary-laing-to-resign-20140724-3cigh.html


----------



## Julia (25 July 2014)

Nick Xenophon at the time called out Palmer for what he is:  a coward and a bully.  He further said that  Dr Laing is a well respected person with considerable expertise who tried in vain to explain to Palmer that his demands were not constitutional.


----------



## Craton (25 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> And they got thrown out for it.
> 
> The same should happen with the current lot.
> 
> But politics as a whole in this country leaves a lot to be desired. One lying crowd replaces another lying crowd. Not much hope for the voters unless we show them that lying is unacceptable.




I'd say that they, Labor, got thrown out because of the faceless caucus twice back stabbing of Mr Rudd (didn't Hawke get stitched up too?), botched schemes that cost lives and being reckless with the taxpayer's dollar and less so for the lies you acknowledge. Although the "no carbon tax" Gillard fib was a clanger.

Funny how Clive is living up to the standard isn't he?
Anyhow, lies or no lies, the TA crew always seems to be the party that puts Oz in a great position only to have Labor ride on the coat tails and stuff it all up again.
Now we've got a Senate hell bent on doing even more harm, or so it appears that way no thanks to Clive and his PUP. 
Clive has definitely gone loco to think we can't see through the smoke and mirrors that big money can create/buy but in politics no amount of money can hide a lie.


----------



## burglar (25 July 2014)

Julia said:


> ... And just btw, Christopher Pyne's accent is *typical of South Australia*, hardly a reflection of his tertiary education.




Is this the man you compare to all South Australians?



> can't stand this pr!ck... Pain in the goddamn ar$e - worse than Abbott.




http://www.messandnoise.com/discussions/3654105


Perhaps it was a typo, ... perhaps you meant "atypical" of South Australia.


----------



## Julia (26 July 2014)

No, I did not mean atypical.  Mr Pyne's accent is typical of SA.  Another example is Amanda Vanstone.
The SA is tending to be similar in some words to the NZ accent.

Nothing to do with liking him or otherwise.  

I was responding to someone, I think Knobby, suggesting Mr Pyne speaks as he does as a result of his having had tertiary education.  You don't have to think very hard to realise that's a less than reasonable suggestion.


----------



## SirRumpole (26 July 2014)

Julia said:


> Mr Pyne's accent is typical of SA.




Alexander Downer comers to mind too as having a similar accent to Pyne.

I never really thought you could pick a South Australian from other States by their accents, but perhaps I'm just not tuned in enough.


----------



## noco (26 July 2014)

Pup senators might find themselves in hot water if the Chinese claim is upheld in the court.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...cost-pup-members/story-fn59niix-1227002020292


----------



## drsmith (26 July 2014)

noco said:


> Pup senators might find themselves in hot water if the Chinese claim is upheld in the court.
> 
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...cost-pup-members/story-fn59niix-1227002020292



Jacqui Lambie might have to make wealth the number 1 priority above all else with any potential suitor.

A trip down to Essential Beauty though might still be wise investment.


----------



## noco (26 July 2014)

drsmith said:


> Jacqui Lambie might have to make wealth the number 1 priority above all else with any potential suitor.
> 
> A trip down to Essential Beauty though might still be wise investment.




She is obviously sitting on a gold mine and may have to use it with a well endowed young man with plenty of money.


----------



## Julia (26 July 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Alexander Downer comers to mind too as having a similar accent to Pyne.



Yes, true.  I'd forgotten about Mr Downer.


----------



## Knobby22 (28 July 2014)

Julia said:


> I was responding to someone, I think Knobby, suggesting Mr Pyne speaks as he does as a result of his having had tertiary education.  You don't have to think very hard to realise that's a less than reasonable suggestion.




No not so much tertiary, more private education. I know plenty of Adelaide people and they don't talk like him. I think the effect is strongest where the children actually live at the school. Alexander Downer went to Geelong Grammar a very exclusive boarding school (where Prince Charles went) and was also educated in England. Chris Pyne was educated only in Adelaide at a Co-ed Catholic school so I'm not sure how his accent got so strong. He was a big protÃ©gÃ© of Downer though. Still is, even pushing the SA Libs to make Downer their new leader. 

Some schools have a way of speaking. Raff Epstein on ABC drive Melbourne and John Safran also sound very similar (and a bit weird) as they went to the same Jewish school. 

It's a quite interesting effect. My previous neighbours had their girls go to an exclusive girls private school and I swear they started to sound more and more like Chris Lillee's "Jamie" the longer they were there. 

I agree there is a SA accent also.


----------



## noco (13 August 2014)

I think the wheels are starting to fall off the PUP pollie machine.....hail Clive the dictator.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...piece-candidates/story-fnihsr9v-1227022265366


----------



## noco (16 August 2014)

What is it with this big bag of wind?.....He certainly wants to throw his weight around......He has no economic policy....he is not interested in getting the nation back on it's feet and his true colours are starting to show......his intentions are very vindictive with one aim to bring down the LNP in Queensland and the Federal coalition....he will eventually get his just deserts. 

The Palmer United Party is fast becoming the Palmer Disunited Party......Perhaps he should rename it the Palmer Family Party.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...mime-nearly-over/story-fnihsr9v-1227025983977


----------



## Bintang (16 August 2014)

He should rename the party to: Palmer United Family Farce. PUFF


----------



## noco (19 August 2014)

I think our Clive has gone loco.

Can you just imagine the news headlines in September 2016.

*CLIVE PALMER BECOMES PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA

News paper headlines October 2016.

AUSTRALIA HAS DECLARED WW111 ON CHINA.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...-shoot-their-own/story-fn59nm2j-1227028702993*


----------



## Julia (19 August 2014)

A few more intemperate outbursts like this might gradually wake up some of the Palmer fans.


----------



## SirRumpole (19 August 2014)

Julia said:


> A few more intemperate outbursts like this might gradually wake up some of the Palmer fans.




Maybe so, the other side is that the Chinese are not easy to deal with. 

An authoritarian government controlling State owned enterprises can virtually write their own tickets as to what they want, and make their own rules.

Palmer went completely off the deep end on Q&A, but I get the feeling that some of what he said is rooted in bitter experience.


----------



## drsmith (19 August 2014)

The only experience Uncle Clive likes is getting his own way and if he doesn't get it, he's just like Uncle Psycho.

He could fill that vacancy in the ALP but they're perhaps not quiet ready for another Uncle Psycho yet.


----------



## Craton (19 August 2014)

Without needing to dot point all his machinations all I can say is that yep, I'm more convinced than ever that Uncle Clive has gone loco.


----------



## drsmith (19 August 2014)

Jacquie Lambie would prefer it not to be a Chinese manufactured whipper snipper,



> But as outrage grew over the comments PUP Senator Jacqui Lambie backed her leader, issuing a statement in which she said she strongly supported the "general point that Clive made about Communist China's military capacity and threat to Australia".
> 
> "If anybody thinks that we should have a national security and defence policy which ignores the threat of a Chinese Communist invasion - you're delusional and got rocks in your head.
> 
> ...




https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/24751653/palmer-slammed-over-china-tirade/

Interesting in the context that Uncle Clive this morning is trying (to some extent at least) to hose down his comments from last night,



> My #qanda comments not intended to refer to Chinese people but to Chinese company which is taking Australian resources & not paying




https://twitter.com/CliveFPalmer/status/501511626550304768


----------



## crypto (19 August 2014)

And people voted for these muppets.

We're doomed


----------



## drsmith (19 August 2014)

PUP-pet Senator Dio Wang also comes to Uncle Clive's defence, 



> WA's China-born PUP Senator Dio Wang today defended his leader, claiming Mr Palmer was provoked into making the comments.
> 
> "From personal experience I have found Clive to be consistently respectful and supportive throughout our relationship in both the private sector and now in the political arena," he said.
> 
> ...




https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/24751653/palmer-slammed-over-china-tirade/



crypto said:


> And people voted for these muppets.
> 
> We're doomed



Occasionally, we see the real Clive punch through the veneer of media savvy charismatic Clive and that's what we saw on display again last night.

It's something I suspect we'll see more of as time goes by.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (19 August 2014)

Julia said:


> A few more intemperate outbursts like this might gradually wake up some of the Palmer fans.






crypto said:


> And people voted for these muppets.
> 
> We're doomed






drsmith said:


> PUP-pet Senator Dio Wang also comes to Uncle Clive's defence,
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Clive is a buffoon. His investors at Coolum have been beset by expensive litigation because of Clive's inability to accept the umpire's decision. His litigation with CITIC will harm our exports.

gg


----------



## drsmith (19 August 2014)

He's unrepentant, 



> When asked if he stood by his use of the term 'mongrel' to describe Australia's largest trading partner, Mr Palmer said it was 'an accurate reflection' of a government that executed its own people.
> 
> 'They have one-day trials, they don't have any democracy,' he told Fairfax radio station 3AW on Tuesday.'
> 
> I feel for the Chinese people that live under such tyranny.




http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stories/2014/08/19/china-hits-back-at-clive-palmer-over-rant.html


----------



## Julia (19 August 2014)

PUP Senator Lambie has offered her vast experience and wisdom to back up her leader.  That experience seems confined to being in the army plus many years on a disability support pension.

From "PM" this evening:


> Following Clive Palmer’s remarks last night, Senator Jacqui Lambie has warned of the threat of a "communist Chinese invasion". She's calling for the defence force to be doubled to prevent future generations of Australians being 'enslaved'.
> 
> From Canberra, James Glenday reports.
> 
> ...



Barnaby Joyce's comment seems well made.  With madness like this it's no wonder the government is having so much difficulty in the Senate, especially when combined with Labor's determination not to assist in any way, presumably so that for purely political purposes the government will be seen to have failed to effect a return to surplus.

And, yes, the unfair aspects of the budget do need to be adjusted.  Good luck with that.  Ms Lambie declares that there's no way she's going to allow any GP co-payment at all, no matter what the AMA might be able to agree on with the government.  She, of course, knows better.


----------



## Craton (19 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> Jacquie Lambie would prefer it not to be a Chinese manufactured whipper snipper,




Bwahahahaha... thanks Doc, still cleaning up the keyboard from sprayed coffee after reading that line.


----------



## Craton (19 August 2014)

Julia said:


> PUP Senator Lambie has offered her vast experience and wisdom to back up her leader.  That experience seems confined to being in the army plus many years on a disability support pension.
> 
> Barnaby Joyce's comment seems well made.  With madness like this it's no wonder the government is having so much difficulty in the Senate, especially when combined with Labor's determination not to assist in any way, presumably so that for purely political purposes the government will be seen to have failed to effect a return to surplus.
> 
> And, yes, the unfair aspects of the budget do need to be adjusted.  Good luck with that.  Ms Lambie declares that there's no way she's going to allow any GP co-payment at all, no matter what the AMA might be able to agree on with the government.  She, of course, knows better.




Julia, I just shakes me head in disbelief.
I saw a brief glimpse of her and Uncle Clive together on the telly this morning. It was so blatantly obvious (to me anyway) that she is totally besotted by and devoted to him. Very creepy.


----------



## Bintang (19 August 2014)

Craton said:


> I saw a brief glimpse of her and Uncle Clive together on the telly this morning. It was so blatantly obvious (to me anyway) that she is totally besotted by and devoted to him. Very creepy.




Supports the observation I made in post #225 that Uncle Clive is close to being Lambie's perfect match. 
- He has lots of money
- He is well-hung girthwise

How could she not be besotted?


----------



## noco (19 August 2014)

Bintang said:


> Supports the observation I made in post #225 that Uncle Clive is close to being Lambie's perfect match.
> - He has lots of money
> - He is well-hung girthwise
> 
> How could she not be besotted?




I don't think he would know unless he had a mirror.


----------



## Calliope (19 August 2014)




----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

It certainly appears this lunatic has stretched the truth on more than one occassion.

As one commenter on the link states, "Stupidity knows no bounds".

And another comment...............

*Rick 1 hour ago

When Pauline Hanson made racists comments, Green Labor and the Left's ABC were all over her because they believed it damaged the then Howard government.


When Clive Palmer goes racist, they say very little, because they believe that will inflict the most damage on the Abbott government.


Does anyone else see a pattern here?*



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...really-does-hurt/story-e6frg9df-1227029977734


----------



## wayneL (20 August 2014)

As mentioned, any party named after the founder, is destined for the **** chute. Inevitably, it is about the personality rather than policy, any sitting members necessarily merely acolytes of the founder.

Once the members realise this, they fall into line or become disgruntled and leave. It happened to Pauline Hansons One Nation and is already starting to happen with the PUPs. As before, this party will pull itself to pieces before long.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

wayneL said:


> As mentioned, any party named after the founder, is destined for the **** chute. Inevitably, it is about the personality rather than policy, any sitting members necessarily merely acolytes of the founder.
> 
> Once the members realise this, they fall into line or become disgruntled and leave. It happened to Pauline Hansons One Nation and is already starting to happen with the PUPs. As before, this party will pull itself to pieces before long.




Pauline Hanson was not greedy and power hungry like Palmer who has one thing in mind and that is to destroy the Newman government in Queensland and the Abbott Government......he is full of rhetoric with little concern in the interest of the Nation.

I believe Pauline Hanson was once a member of the Liberal Party and was quite outspoken in Australians being treated equal with disregard to creed, color or race.......She believed that certain Australians were favored over others when it came to welfare and that things should change.

She made a lot of sense to many people when she presented her maiden speech to Parliament resulting in her popularity...Unfortunately it did not go down well with the Liberals and the Labor Party and the elements set out to destroy her....she also trusted people in her Party who did not exactly do the right thing by her.......the end result is now history.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

It is not getting any easier for Clive Palmer and he must now realize he cannot meddle with the  law, tell lies and go into a rant like does in his own business interests.

If he continues in the vein he currently exhibits, he will soon  find himself behind bars which in turn will extinguish him from parliament.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...er-lies-with-him/story-e6frg6zo-1227029887991


----------



## Bintang (20 August 2014)

I think the question posed by the title of this thread has finally been answered beyond any doubt.

Clive the fat feral fool is definitely loco.


----------



## Bintang (20 August 2014)

noco said:


> If he continues in the vein he currently exhibits, he will soon  find himself behind bars which in turn will extinguish him from parliament.
> 
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...er-lies-with-him/story-e6frg6zo-1227029887991




I can't happen soon enough.


----------



## Julia (20 August 2014)

For anyone who missed the latest wisdom from Senator Lambie, have a listen to her interview with Rafael Epstein, ABC Melbourne.
https://soundcloud.com/774-abc-melbourne/jacqui-lambie-with-rafael-epstein-on774-abc-melbourne

Quite, um, remarkable.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (20 August 2014)

Julia said:


> For anyone who missed the latest wisdom from Senator Lambie, have a listen to her interview with Rafael Epstein, ABC Melbourne.
> https://soundcloud.com/774-abc-melbourne/jacqui-lambie-with-rafael-epstein-on774-abc-melbourne
> 
> Quite, um, remarkable.




Thanks Julia,

I'm somewhat lost for words. Sen. Lambie is a decidedly stupid person.

gg


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

Julia said:


> For anyone who missed the latest wisdom from Senator Lambie, have a listen to her interview with Rafael Epstein, ABC Melbourne.
> https://soundcloud.com/774-abc-melbourne/jacqui-lambie-with-rafael-epstein-on774-abc-melbourne
> 
> Quite, um, remarkable.




Dear oh dear, Pauline Hanson again ?

However, China is getting somewhat more aggressive in it's military build up. That has been recognised by former and current governments, and as Lambie said is one of the reasons we now have US marines stationed in Darwin.

I see no reason why we shouldn't sensibly recognise and respond to changes in the strategic balance, but perhaps not in the blunt weapon way that Lambie has.

China is a trading partner that we want to keep, but the US has always been our military protector, and there is no reason that has to change either.


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

I get an impression of a sense of glee in the reporting at The Australia today.

In the second image, the horizontal distortion has him looking like Jabba The Hutt.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...k-so-destructive/story-fnk76wj3-1227030393072


----------



## Bintang (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> I get an impression of a sense of glee in the reporting at The Australia today.
> 
> In the second image, the horizontal distortion has him looking like Jabba The Hutt.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...k-so-destructive/story-fnk76wj3-1227030393072




It's not just glee. How about the mockery in the 'Starting a Paper' article.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/cutandpaste/starting-a-paper-were-happy-to-help/story-fn72xczz-1227029973875


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

Another Clive Palmer hang up,

https://soundcloud.com/720abcperth/clive-palmer-hangs-up-on-abc-mornings


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

Bintang said:


> It's not just glee. How about the mockery in the 'Starting a Paper' article.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/cutandpaste/starting-a-paper-were-happy-to-help/story-fn72xczz-1227029973875



In relation to the image in the post above (from the above linked article in the Australian),

What's ol' Pen thinking ?

Something along the lines of Oh crap! Our enemy's enemy is blowing up before our very eyes.

Before long, the closet thing he'll have as friends will be Green advisors and Al Gore.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> In relation to the image in the post above (from the above linked article in the Australian),
> 
> What's ol' Pen thinking ?
> 
> ...




Jeez doc, Fairfax must be gagging at the bit, not being able to get stuck into Clive, for fear of helping Tony.lol


----------



## Julia (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Dear oh dear, Pauline Hanson again ?



At least Pauline Hanson's influence was largely just in Queensland.  And, as far as I can recall, she didn't hold the balance of power federally.
But yes, the 'invasion' message seems similar.
Not content with warning us about imminent threat from the Chinese, Ms Lambie has gone on today to suggest we are also at risk of invasion by Indonesia.



Bintang said:


> It's not just glee. How about the mockery in the 'Starting a Paper' article.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/cutandpaste/starting-a-paper-were-happy-to-help/story-fn72xczz-1227029973875



That's so cleverly put together and so funny.  At least it would be if this egocentric creature did not have such a position of power.

I especially liked the bit where Clive is describing how he's going to hold his own special climate change forum at his very own Palmer resort on the Sunshine Coast, and Penny Wong and Heather Ridout both say "amongst the dinosaurs?"


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Dear oh dear, Pauline Hanson again ?
> 
> However, China is getting somewhat more aggressive in it's military build up. That has been recognised by former and current governments, and as Lambie said is one of the reasons we now have US marines stationed in Darwin.
> 
> ...




Unless China wishes to source a lot of its imports from elsewhere, similar to what Indoneasia did after the cattle export debacle.

Then we will look like a bunch of idiots, how much damage do you think China can do to us if it decides to impose targeted sanctions?


----------



## Julia (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Unless China wishes to source a lot of its imports from elsewhere, similar to what Indoneasia did after the cattle export debacle.
> 
> Then we will look like a bunch of idiots, how much damage do you think China can do to us if it decides to impose targeted sanctions?



Something that has already been suggested:


> The criticism from senior politicians has not satisfied the Chinese state-owned tabloid the Global Times, which has taken aim at Mr Palmer in its editorial.
> 
> "China cannot let him off or show petty kindness just because the Australian Government has condemned him," it stated.
> 
> ...


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Then we will look like a bunch of idiots, how much damage do you think China can do to us if it decides to impose targeted sanctions?




I don't know. We could freeze Chinese investment in Australia in return, but I don't think the Chinese are that bloody minded. 

So what do we do ? Lock Palmer up ? Talk to Tony Abbott about that, he did it to Pauline Hanson, and now he's the PM.


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

A legal setback for Uncle Clive,

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...t-citic-pacific/story-fn59niix-1227030839294#


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I don't know. We could freeze Chinese investment in Australia in return, but I don't think the Chinese are that bloody minded. .




Well we certainly hope the Chinese aren't that bloody minded, we suspended exports to Indonesia on the strengh of a t.v programme. I think they could send us into a fiscal depression in months, if they chose to do so.
It may sound tough and ockerish to kick sand in the big guys face, but don't cry when he bashes you.lol



SirRumpole said:


> So what do we do ? Lock Palmer up ? Talk to Tony Abbott about that, he did it to Pauline Hanson, and now he's the PM.




Start and act like grown ups, springs to mind.
Palmer, Shorten, Milne etc really need to settle down and think about our national interest, rather than having a tag team wrestling match against Abbott.
It may make Fairfax circulation and share price improve, but it all does little to help our fiscal situation.

The LNP has been elected to make decissions, whether Palmer and Co agree or not, they should be judged at the next election.
Same as Labor/ Greens were at the last election.


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

> Palmer, Shorten, Milne etc really need to settle down and think about our national interest, rather than having a tag team wrestling match against Abbott.




There are multiple definitions of "national interest" aren't there ?

It comes down to the age old question of whether the Senate should give the government a blank cheque, especially when most of the items in question never had a mandate because they were never mentioned before the election.

98% of the budget has been passed according to reports, so it's now up to Abbott and co to negotiate the rest through, like Gillard had to do with her legislation.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> There are multiple definitions of "national interest" aren't there ?.




Yes but most, including Palmer, Stevens and the treasury agree there is a fiscal situation that requires attention.
Shorten, Milne, Swan etc don't agree understandably, as they caused it.



SirRumpole said:


> It comes down to the age old question of whether the Senate should give the government a blank cheque, especially when most of the items in question never had a mandate because they were never mentioned before the election..




Something like what happened under Labor?



SirRumpole said:


> 98% of the budget has been passed according to reports, so it's now up to Abbott and co to negotiate the rest through, like Gillard had to do with her legislation.




If 98% of the budget has been passed, why are Fairfax, Shorten, Milne all saying it's a toxic budget that won't be passed and requires re writing.
Either you are bending the facts or they are.


----------



## Bintang (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> If 98% of the budget has been passed, why are Fairfax, Shorten, Milne all saying it's a toxic budget that won't be passed and requires re writing.
> Either you are bending the facts or they are.




What does 98% even mean?  
What is it measuring - number of pages of budget documents? Number of budget items passed?
What is the relative budgetary impact of that part of the budget which hasn't been passed?
It might be much larger than 2%.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Well we certainly hope the Chinese aren't that bloody minded, we suspended exports to Indonesia on the strengh of a t.v programme. I think they could send us into a fiscal depression in months, if they chose to do so.
> It may sound tough and ockerish to kick sand in the big guys face, but don't cry when he bashes you.lol
> 
> 
> ...




SP, this may just well be a tactic to bring down the Abbott Government......Palmer may  have it in mind to upset the Chinese in the hope that it will send the Abbott Government into a fiscal depression.

Who knows what this scum bag has in mind....he is so unpredictable.

The sooner he is out of the picture the better most people will like it and I believe it won't be too long.

I really don't believe the Chinese are that stupid to fall for such neurotic antics by one stupid Australian.

I am also sure behind the scenes Julie Bishop would have spoken to the Chinese Ambassador in Canberra about this whole sordid affair.

Palmer is more an embarrassment to himself than to Australia.


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

Bintang said:


> What does 98% even mean?
> What is it measuring - number of pages of budget documents? Number of budget items passed?
> What is the relative budgetary impact of that part of the budget which hasn't been passed?
> It might be much larger than 2%.




See below



> Treasury sinks budget crisis talk
> 
> TREASURY figures have punctured claims of a crisis over the passage of the federal budget, *revealing that 98.9 per cent of *expense measures are already legislated despite a savage political fight over a handful of reforms.
> 
> ...




So, who is bending the facts ? Me, the Greens, the Government, the Treasury or The Australian ?


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> There are multiple definitions of "national interest" aren't there ?
> 
> It comes down to the age old question of whether the Senate should give the government a blank cheque, especially when most of the items in question never had a mandate because they were never mentioned before the election.
> 
> 98% of the budget has been passed according to reports, so it's now up to Abbott and co to negotiate the rest through, like Gillard had to do with her legislation.





Rumpy, you are off topic.....the thread is about  Palmer....but then again I guess  you can't resist to bring in your criticism of  Abbott Government whenever you can.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> See below
> 
> 
> 
> So, who is bending the facts ? Me, the Greens, the Government, the Treasury or The Australian ?




There you go again Rumpy...you are off topic.......read top man....it states.....*RE: HAS CLIVE PALMER GONE LOCO?*


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

Not only off topic but wrong.



SirRumpole said:


> 98% of the budget has been passed according to reports, so it's now up to Abbott and co to negotiate the rest through, like Gillard had to do with her legislation.




The Labor-Green cabal that was the Gillard government had a majority in the Senate.


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

noco said:


> There you go again Rumpy...you are off topic.......read top man....it states.....*RE: HAS CLIVE PALMER GONE LOCO?*




A political thread is always going to go off topic sometime, besides I was just responding to posts that other people made.

Nice try trying to get people to "look over there", when the complete farce is Abbott and Hockey screaming about the Senate blocking a few of their "savings" when they have got 98% of their measures through.

It shows that the government is incapable of negotiation and are simply trying to bully people because they don't want to back down and get a few red faces.


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> Not only off topic but wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> The Labor-Green cabal that was the Gillard government had a majority in the Senate.




But not in the Reps, they had to rely on Windsor, Oakeshott and Wilke.


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

Clive Palmer neglects his parliamentary committee responsibilities,

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320

One can at least be partially understanding today. He's inspired one of his pussycats into some ongoing hissing that now includes Indonesia.



> On Tuesday PUP's defence spokeswoman, Ms Lambie, said Australia would not have the resources to stop a Chinese communist invasion.
> 
> A day later she suggested Indonesia was also a threat.
> 
> ...




After Uncle Clive's walkout this morning on ABC Perth 720 over questions about Jacquie Lambie's comments, one would have thought he would have been on the blower. If he has, it hasn't had much effect.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-...-from-jacqui-lambie-comments-on-china/5684400


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> But not in the Reps, they had to rely on Windsor, Oakeshott and Wilke.



Wrong again.

They too were part of pact that formed the Gillard government.

Let's please keep this thread on topic.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> See below
> 
> 
> 
> So, who is bending the facts ? Me, the Greens, the Government, the Treasury or The Australian ?




Well in relation to what I said.

_*Fairfax, Shorten, Milne *all saying it's a toxic budget that won't be passed and requires re writing.
Either you are bending the facts or they are_. 

You are, who mentioned the Government, the treasury or the Australian.

However on reading the article, obviously Fairfax, Shorten and Milne are just as guilty, as you.

Looks like you are all full of BS.


----------



## SirRumpole (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Well in relation to what I said.
> 
> _*Fairfax, Shorten, Milne *all saying it's a toxic budget that won't be passed and requires re writing.
> Either you are bending the facts or they are_.
> ...




I suggest you take it up with the Treasury or the Australian.

I'm sure they are in dire need of your undoubted expertise.

V


----------



## Macquack (20 August 2014)

noco said:


> Rumpy, you are off topic.....the thread is about  Palmer....but then again I guess  *you can't resist to bring in your criticism of  Abbott Government whenever you can*.




That is a bit rich, coming from the Master of Labor bashing/Liberal spin doctoring.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> Not only off topic but wrong.
> 
> 
> 
> The Labor-Green cabal that was the Gillard government had a majority in the Senate.




Yes doc, that proved to be a great marriage, the front row all buggered off.lol

What a rabble.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I suggest you take it up with the Treasury or the Australian.
> 
> I'm sure they are in dire need of your undoubted expertise.
> 
> V




Well I'm sure it would be as good as the Labor Party could come up with.

Let's not forget most of their senior 'talent' pulled out of politics at the last election.

All that's left is those that couldn't back their "sister" in her time of need, and those that haven't racked up a decent pension yet.IMO

So now the war cry is, let's bag Abbott, that didn't work when they were in office for six years, christ knows why they think it will work now.

Aligning with Palmer will end up with another Labor Party stuff up.

Palmer will be derailed, Labor need to be carefull they don't go down in the same wreckage.IMO


----------



## drsmith (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Aligning with Palmer will end up with another Labor Party stuff up.
> 
> Palmer will be derailed, Labor need to be carefull they don't go down in the same wreckage.IMO



I wonder what Penny Wong thinks of Jacquie Lambie now.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> I wonder what Penny Wong thinks of Jacquie Lambie now.




Probably the same as she thought of Julia Gillard, it's everyone for themselves in here sister.

One thing the Palmer experiment is going to show Australians, is that it really can get worse.

One big mouth polly could easily get China to say, no ships will be loaded that are destined for Australia and no ships will be unloaded from Australia.

Two months later, everyone is out of work.lol

What a state of affairs, absolute dickwits.

People really do need a dose of reality, the situation with an irresponsible political protocol could quickly escalate into an international situation.

Overseas Governments, won't see Palmer as we do, a bit of a laugh, put it up the Government sort of guy.
They see him as a duly elected representitive of the Australian people, voicing their opinion, that's scary

Not everyone has an Australian sense of humour.


----------



## Calliope (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> I wonder what Penny Wong thinks of Jacquie Lambie now.




I am sure Penny Wong would enjoy this one. It reminds me of Labor politician Arthur Calwell's remark in Parliament in 1947 in support of the White Australia Policy that "two Wongs don't make a White."

This is what Palmer said at a press conference in Brisbane, May, 2009:



> THERE’S a long history of Chinese people in business in Australia. Back in the 1890s two Chinese brothers set up a market garden 4km from the Brisbane CBD. The Wong Brothers ”” hence the suburb, Toowong. It’s two Wongs.
> 
> The Queensland Places website, run by the Queensland government.
> 
> TOOWONG, an inner residential suburb, is 4km southwest of central Brisbane. It is thought that the name was derived from an Aboriginal word describing a bird, or the call of a bird, possibly the koel or cooee bird, a species of cuckoo.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...re-happy-to-help/story-fn72xczz-1227029973875


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

Calliope said:


> I am sure Penny Wong would enjoy this one. It reminds me of Labor politician Arthur Calwell's remark in Parliament in 1947 in support of the White Australia Policy that "two Wongs don't make a White."
> 
> This is what Palmer said at a press conference in Brisbane, May, 2009:
> 
> ...




Australians have a unique sense of humour, also a great belief of 'she'le be right'. 
Unfortunately in the I.T instant information world we live in, people overseas get the phrase, before they get the humour of it.

Palmer will burn out,IMO, Faifax aren't touching him, wisely.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

This ABC report probaly shows Clive's real interest in the fiscal situation.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320

It probably highlights, the WTF is he doing in parliament, question.


----------



## Julia (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> Not only off topic but wrong.
> The Labor-Green cabal that was the Gillard government had a majority in the Senate.



And effectively in the Reps, given the alignment of Oakeshott and Windsor, as drsmith has pointed out.  
Just no comparison with the present situation.



SirRumpole said:


> A political thread is always going to go off topic sometime, besides I was just responding to posts that other people made.
> 
> Nice try trying to get people to "look over there", when the complete farce is Abbott and Hockey screaming about the Senate blocking a few of their "savings" when they have got 98% of their measures through.
> 
> It shows that the government is incapable of negotiation and are simply trying to bully people because they don't want to back down and get a few red faces.



The thread is about Clive Palmer, Rumpole.   It's also a bit simplistic to suggest the government are incapable of negotiation.  Just the last few days' display of Clive Palmer's extraordinary behaviour, suitably accompanied by his Tasmanian senator's nonsense, should give quite an understanding of what the government is up against.
Plus the Labor Party clearly being primarily motivated by revenge and a determination to see the government fail in the hope that they will be re-elected.  

I understand your loyalty to Labor (well, no, I don't really) but perhaps try to have some objectivity here.



SirRumpole said:


> I don't know. We could freeze Chinese investment in Australia in return, but I don't think the Chinese are that bloody minded.



Never mind the Chinese:  it would be suicidal for Australia to freeze Chinese investment in Australia.



drsmith said:


> A legal setback for Uncle Clive,
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...t-citic-pacific/story-fn59niix-1227030839294#



Excellent result.   The comments following the article were interesting, the following one summing it up pretty well:


> For a man who openly boasted that he had not lost a court case ever - at present he is battling to win one. Glad to see that the courts are waking up the this serial and vexatious litigant and awarding costs against him. Hopefully these judgements will hasten his financial demise so that eventually we will mercifully be shot of him and his coterie of ill-informed senators.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> This ABC report probaly shows Clive's real interest in the fiscal situation.
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320
> 
> It probably highlights, the WTF is he doing in parliament, question.





He would make a "GOOD" foreign Minister......first visit should be to China.


----------



## sptrawler (20 August 2014)

Sir Rumpole, just in case you think like Palmer,  have a squizz at this.

https://www.dfat.gov.au/geo/fs/aust.pdf

Wow China 36% of our exports and 20% of our imports, yes tell them to go and rat f@%k themselves.

Jeez sounds like Labor policy to me, what a hoot.

I'm not saying cow tow to them, but openly slagging off at them doesn't seem very intelligent.

Let's be honest they make up 50% of our economy, but who cares.lol

As long as we get Abbott, absolute dickwits.


----------



## noco (20 August 2014)

Macquack said:


> That is a bit rich, coming from the Master of Labor bashing/Liberal spin doctoring.




Thanks for the compliment quack quack......attack the man instead of playing the ball.....typical Fabian tactics.

I don't see you getting any support on here tonight....hope you are not feeling too lonely.


----------



## Bintang (20 August 2014)

drsmith said:


> Clive Palmer neglects his parliamentary committee responsibilities,
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320






sptrawler said:


> This ABC report probaly shows Clive's real interest in the fiscal situation.
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320
> 
> It probably highlights, the WTF is he doing in parliament, question.




I bet the people who did show up to the committee meetings were not disappointed by Clive's absence.
Technically of course he is derelict in his duties but if by chance these committees do anything that actually does serve the National interest I for one am also glad that  Big Clive doesn't bother to attend.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2014)

> I understand your loyalty to Labor (well, no, I don't really) but perhaps try to have some objectivity here.




Why bother ? When I point out from the Murdoch media and the Treasury that 98% of the proposed government savings has been passed, and people here still slang off the Labor party and Greens for obstructionism, then I would say that there is not a lot of objectivity on offer on this forum.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2014)

> I understand your loyalty to Labor (well, no, I don't really) but perhaps try to have some objectivity here.




I have a loyalty to equity and fairness which the current government demonstrably lacks. 

In these circumstances I believe it's  understandable that I promote an alternative position.


----------



## noco (21 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Why bother ? When I point out from the Murdoch media and the Treasury that 98% of the proposed government savings has been passed, and people here still slang off the Labor party and Greens for obstructionism, then I would say that there is not a lot of objectivity on offer on this forum.




What about the $6 billion savings Labor promised before the election and then broke their promise to stand by it?

They are still holding out....in the national interest of course......or is it in the Green/Labor interest to make the LNP fail in their attempt to bring our economy under control...then they can go to the next election gloating .......Wow, you see the Coalition have broken their promise again ....what a mob of crocks.


----------



## dutchie (21 August 2014)

sptrawler said:


> This ABC report probaly shows Clive's real interest in the fiscal situation.
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-08-20/clive-palmer-under-fire-over-economics-committee/5684320
> 
> It probably highlights, the WTF is he doing in parliament, question.




The impression that Clive gives me is that he is only interested in one thing - Clive Palmer!

I don't believe the bullsh*t about him fighting for the battler or any of Australia's interests.

He and Rudd make a great pair (me, me, me).

It would be good if he disappeared completely from the political scene, then he would be doing Australia a favour.


----------



## noco (21 August 2014)

dutchie said:


> The impression that Clive gives me is that he is only interested in one thing - Clive Palmer!
> 
> I don't believe the bullsh*t about him fighting for the battler or any of Australia's interests.
> 
> ...




Hang in there dutchie...you might get your wish sooner than you think.


----------



## dutchie (21 August 2014)

Lambie: you’re delusional if you ignore threat of a Chinese invasion 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...chinese-invasion/story-fn59niix-1227029283607

Jacqui's right we should double our defence budget - maybe we can get a loan from the Chinese to pay for it!


----------



## Calliope (21 August 2014)

Rumpy says;



> I have a loyalty to equity and fairness which the current government demonstrably lacks.
> 
> In these circumstances I believe it's understandable that I promote an alternative position.




Seeing that the majority of posters on this thread consider that Palmer and his PUPs are dangerous fools then Rumpy's alternative position out of "loyalty to equity and fairness" is that they are doing a good job. 

But maybe he is just off topic.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2014)

Calliope said:


> But maybe he is just off topic.




Maybe it is, but to get it back on topic, I think Palmer is a dangerous buffoon who is in Parliament for his own benefit, and the rest of his entourage are besotted with his obvious egotistical charms, although they may be good people in their own right. We can't be sure because Palmer keeps taking the limelight.

However, if Palmer et al can secure a better deal for those on low incomes who have been hit with this patently unfair budget before he and his party self implodes, then he will have at least achieved something worthwhile.


----------



## Calliope (21 August 2014)




----------



## Calliope (21 August 2014)

Palmer is indeed a friend of those on low incomes. He understands their problems.



> *ARE you on the dole and looking for empathy? It is OK, Clive Palmer has been there too. Worried about debt and public spending? Never fear, for Clive shares your concern. Hate budget cuts and think the debt challenge is overblown? Clive and his party are on your side too.* After all, Clive knows what it is like to be homeless, without a nickel, and also knows how to export $20 billion worth of nickel. If you want to do business with Beijing, Clive has sat on Mao’s knee and will put you in touch with all the right people. But if you would prefer to denounce China and generate fear about foreign investment, Clive can be your man too. Billionaire or busker, investment spruiker or foreign ownership fearmonger, deficit dalek or spendthrift, Sinophobe or Sinophile ””* Mr Palmer is whatever he thinks you want him to be. Or whatever suits his purposes for the day. He denies a human influence on climate one minute and promise a “better world” with Al Gore the next. Like The Terminator, he takes a body blow, disintegrates before your eyes, then reshapes his sizeable personage to reappear in a guise to suit the zeitgeist.
> *
> *Yet until this week Mr Palmer has escaped serious criticism and scrutiny from much of the media and, even now, the misfits on the Green-Left fringe (including publicly-funded journalists) continue to make excuses for him and revel in his antics.*



(my bolds)

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...balance-of-power/story-e6frg71x-1227031239920


----------



## Knobby22 (21 August 2014)

Well of course he is a man for all seasons. He is a politician. Even Joe Hockey feels for the small guy and knows what it is like and his budget is only to help them. Adam Bandt is one of the people to such an extent it is astounding . Bill Shorten is an ordinary guy who understands the ordinary person because he is one (yawn). As I said, they are politicians.  

I can tell you that the ABC press in Victoria has not been kind to Palmer at all despite what the Australian says, not in the least.(but then the Australian have their own agenda's to push ....and they do in every single article (refer Goebbels quote).


----------



## Julia (21 August 2014)

For anyone not entirely sure what Clive Palmer's dispute with Citic Pacific is all about, the ABC RN Breakfast program has put together a good summary, their group think finally appearing to wake up to the need to expose Mr Palmer for what he is.
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/breakfast/clive-palmers-china-dispute/5685594


----------



## Calliope (21 August 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I can tell you that the ABC press in Victoria has not been kind to Palmer at all despite what the Australian says, not in the least.




That must be very hurtful to you considering you look to Palmer as your last hope for responsible government, and also your admiration for Lambie and The Brick and Wang.


----------



## drsmith (21 August 2014)

Niki Savva in today's opinion piece on Clive Palmer in The Australian saves the biggest spray for the major parties,



> Bill Shorten could help by stepping in to claim the mantle of opposition leader/alternative PM from Palmer. He should heed the colourful words of one of his own to describe what lies ahead. “The punters have been looking at Tony Abbott and Joe Hockey and saying: ‘You are a bunch of arseholes, plus you are not that good.’ Some time before the next election they will turn to us and say, ‘What about you guys? Hah. They are arseholes, you are tools.’ ”




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...alition-a-chance/story-fnahw9xv-1227031182771


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2014)

> Bill Shorten could help by stepping in to claim the mantle of opposition leader/alternative PM from Palmer. He should heed the colourful words of one of his own to describe what lies ahead. “The punters have been looking at Tony Abbott and Joe Hockey and saying: ‘You are a bunch of arseholes, plus you are not that good.’ Some time before the next election they will turn to us and say, ‘What about you guys? Hah. They are arseholes, you are tools.’ ”




Typical Nikki Savva piece that pushes the standard of debate further into the gutter.

What a disgrace she is.


----------



## drsmith (21 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Typical Nikki Savva piece that pushes the standard of debate further into the gutter.
> 
> What a disgrace she is.



As a veteran and I what I generally regard a reasoned voice in Australian politics, she's expressing her extreme frustration with both the major parties, in particular the Libs.


----------



## banco (21 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Typical Nikki Savva piece that pushes the standard of debate further into the gutter.
> 
> What a disgrace she is.




Think you are being a bit precious.

Tony Abbott's problem since forever is that he comes across to a substantial slice of the public as an asshole. John Howard never really had that problem and his policies were similar.


----------



## SirRumpole (21 August 2014)

banco said:


> John Howard never really had that problem and his policies were similar.




I think he got a similar problem after "children overboard", Siev-X, weapons of mass destruction and the AWB scandal.


----------



## sptrawler (21 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> I think he got a similar problem after "children overboard", Siev-X, weapons of mass destruction and the AWB scandal.




Somewhat like the problem Rudd and Gillard got, after pink batts, school halls, carbon tax scandals.
It would appear the perception of poor politicians isn't limited to the LNP, but as has been mentioned, thread drift is occuring.


----------



## Julia (21 August 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Typical Nikki Savva piece that pushes the standard of debate further into the gutter.
> 
> What a disgrace she is.



What did you so disapprove of in Nikki Savva's article, Rumpole?
I found it a pretty intelligent and accurate summary of the current situation.  She is not showing bias toward either of the main parties.


----------



## Julia (21 August 2014)

banco said:


> Tony Abbott's problem since forever is that he comes across to a substantial slice of the public as an asshole. John Howard never really had that problem and his policies were similar.



I agree, banco.  John Howard had a calm assurance about him without being arrogant.  He also had a genuine feel for how he was being perceived by the electorate.

Tony Abbott is, I think, getting a bit better at this, but Joe Hockey still hasn't a clue.  Ditto Brandis and Abetz.
Meantime people like Sussan Ley and Kelly O'Dwyer are languishing on the back bench and Malcolm Turnbull continues to be sidelined in Communications instead of taking over from Hockey.

I suppose the internal politics are extremely difficult.  We don't see any of that.


----------



## Julia (21 August 2014)

To get back onto the thread topic, this from today's "The Australian" on how things are not going so well for Mr Palmer.



> CLIVE Palmer has suffered a *disastrous day in his multi-pronged legal war with Chinese corporate giant Citic Pacific, with judges in two states ruling against attempts by his flagship company to take control of a key iron ore port in Western Australia’s Pilbara region.
> 
> Mr Palmer suggested on the ABC’s Q&A on Monday that he had won a series of recent legal judgments over Citic, describing his estranged business partner as “Chinese mongrels”.
> 
> ...


----------



## SirRumpole (22 August 2014)

Julia said:


> What did you so disapprove of in Nikki Savva's article, Rumpole?
> I found it a pretty intelligent and accurate summary of the current situation.  She is not showing bias toward either of the main parties.




Can't she write an article with the swearwords ?


----------



## noco (22 August 2014)

Well, Clive Palmer has done his dash with Chinese for ever......The Chows have now imposed sanctions on any further business dealings. 


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...re-extraordinary/story-fnihslxi-1227032317032


----------



## Calliope (22 August 2014)

noco said:


> Well, Clive Palmer has done his dash with Chinese for ever......The Chows have now imposed sanctions on any further business dealings.




Chows? This is the sort of language I would expect Clive Palmer to use.




> Chow
> [chou]  Spell Syllables
> noun, Australian Disparaging and Offensive.
> .
> a contemptuous term used to refer to a Chinese person




http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/chow


----------



## Knobby22 (22 August 2014)

Well he definitely asked for it.


----------



## Julia (22 August 2014)

noco said:


> Well, Clive Palmer has done his dash with Chinese for ever......The Chows have now imposed sanctions on any further business dealings.
> 
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...re-extraordinary/story-fnihslxi-1227032317032



noco, do you actually read the story before linking to it?   I referred to it yesterday.  The Chinese have not imposed any sanctions.  It's simply an editorial from a Chinese tabloid newspaper suggesting that is what should happen.

It might happen and if it did, he has - as Knobby has suggested - would have absolutely asked for it, but at this stage it's just a opinion from a person at a newspaper, probably designed - as with many of our papers - to create attention and sell more copies.


----------



## orr (22 August 2014)

Julia said:


> noco, do you actually read the story before linking to it?




noco's got form in this regard. last week he linked to an article in the 'Business Spectator'(from memory) that was an absolute demolition of the argument originally being presented, Maurice Newmans Global cooling brain fade.  
On Commo reds under the beds thread noco champions and yet admits to never turning a page of Marx's work, up until prompted.

But noco votes.... the sort of guy you suspect who would like to in multiple.


----------



## noco (22 August 2014)

Julia said:


> noco, do you actually read the story before linking to it?   I referred to it yesterday.  The Chinese have not imposed any sanctions.  It's simply an editorial from a Chinese tabloid newspaper suggesting that is what should happen.
> 
> It might happen and if it did, he has - as Knobby has suggested - would have absolutely asked for it, but at this stage it's just a opinion from a person at a newspaper, probably designed - as with many of our papers - to create attention and sell more copies.




Can you imagine the Chinese ever wanting to business with Palmer again whether the sanctions were a suggestion or not.... I am damn sure if I were in their shoes, I would tell Palmer to go to hell...... I would be on the phone to Twiggy Forest the next day..


----------



## wayneL (22 August 2014)

orr said:


> noco's got form in this regard. last week he linked to an article in the 'Business Spectator'(from memory) that was an absolute demolition of the argument originally being presented, Maurice Newmans Global cooling brain fade.
> On Commo reds under the beds thread noco champions and yet admits to never turning a page of Marx's work, up until prompted.
> 
> But noco votes.... the sort of guy you suspect who would like to in multiple.




I suppose you could reel of a 10,000 word essay on  the Manifesto, Das Kapital etc in an hour or two, off the top of your head,  eh orr?


----------



## orr (22 August 2014)

wayneL said:


> I suppose you could reel of a 10,000 word essay on  the Manifesto, Das Kapital etc in an hour or two, off the top of your head,  eh orr?




You asked the other day where were the Keynesians before 2008. At the time I thought of directing you to the public statements/writing of Krugman, Stieglitz,(helicopter Ben) Bernanke, And J.K Galbraith while he was still alive.  during the preceding decade, But I thought 'why bother.'

One thing for Clive though he does know what a Library is .....   an deep association with the J.F.K memorial, from memory . A Library thats where you read things... Ahh John Stuart Mill a progressive in so many ways, What would he have made of the immortality and immorality of the modern Corporation..?. I can only guess maybe this ... ' I'll believe a Corporation is a person, When Texas executes one' 

For any one with the time I recommend any abridged version Das Kapital. 

For the Ayn Rand fans go to Chapter 7 of Anne Manne's 'The Life of I' ... on the book shelves now

On topic enough???


----------



## noco (23 August 2014)

There is little doubt Palmer has done his dash with voters who are finally beginning to wake up to his motives.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...ers-true-colours/story-e6frg75f-1227033725942


----------



## wayneL (23 August 2014)

orr said:


> You asked the other day where were the Keynesians before 2008. At the time I thought of directing you to the public statements/writing of Krugman, Stieglitz,(helicopter Ben) Bernanke, And J.K Galbraith while he was still alive.  during the preceding decade, But I thought 'why bother.'
> 
> One thing for Clive though he does know what a Library is .....   an deep association with the J.F.K memorial, from memory . A Library thats where you read things... Ahh John Stuart Mill a progressive in so many ways, What would he have made of the immortality and immorality of the modern Corporation..?. I can only guess maybe this ... ' I'll believe a Corporation is a person, When Texas executes one'
> 
> ...




Thanks for the book rec, I'll check it out. It would be interesting to me to see those pre 2008 Keynesian writings, because Krugman at least wasn't espousing anything countercyclical... he was spouting the classic, "it's different this time" rubbish on CNNNN.


----------



## drsmith (27 August 2014)

Uncle Clive's apology too little too late,

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/w...ology-too-late-to-stop-cattle-trade-backlash/


----------



## orr (28 August 2014)

wayneL said:


> Thanks for the book rec, I'll check it out. It would be interesting to me to see those pre 2008 Keynesian writings, because Krugman at least wasn't espousing anything countercyclical... he was spouting the classic, "it's different this time" rubbish on CNNNN.




Krugman on Keynes To the royal economic society 2007

http://www.res.org.uk/view/art2Jan09Features.html

The harsh light of hindsight shines on a lot of this articel  in 2003
http://www.pkarchive.org/column/031103.html

Fiscal policy in 2003 again

http://www.pkarchive.org/column/020703.html

A longish interview feb 2003, a lifted quote...."when the revenue was pouring in, as if they were a permanent condition. They didn't set aside money for a rainy day" 

http://www.pkarchive.org/economy/FA022503.html

 his lecture to the Commonwealth Club California 'circa 2006' 'The future of the middle Class' 

http://fora.tv/2007/10/30/Paul_Krugman_Future_of_the_Middle_Class


Surely there's no need for links to Benanki Galbraith and Stieglitz ???????

The Brick with Eye's seems to be presenting  'The Conscience of A Liberal'


----------



## drsmith (3 September 2014)

Hedley Thomas's latest piece on Uncle Clive,



> CLIVE Palmer tried unsuccessfully to repay $11 million to China five days after revelations from a Federal Court hearing, bank statements and legal documents raised serious claims he had wrongfully siphoned huge sums to bankroll his political campaign.
> 
> Documents filed in the Supreme Court in Brisbane show a bank cheque for $11,345,013 was authorised by the Palmer United Party leader on May 13, following the legal action launched by Citic Pacific and reports in The Aus*tralian days earlier.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ning-revelations/story-fn59niix-1227045698246


----------



## drsmith (3 September 2014)

Mr Palmer and the ice bucket,



> CLIVE Palmer has stormed out of another television appearance, kicking over a bucket of ice while abandoning one of his senators.
> 
> Last night, on the lawns in front of Parliament House, the Palmer United Party leader was expected to pour a bucket of ice over PUP senator Jacqui Lambie on live television to raise money for charity.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...of-tv-appearance/story-fn59niix-1227046027135

And on matters court,



> CLIVE Palmer made an unsuccessful bid to suspend all of his multi-billion-dollar legal battles with Chinese investment giant Citic Group while he campaigned for the West Australian Senate election in March and April, court documents reveal. The affidavits, filed in the West Australian Supreme Court, show lawyers for Mr Palmer’s company Mineralogy wrote to Citic’s law firm, Allens, on March 24 asking for a “standstill” in at least 10 separate court cases and arbitrations across three states.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...s-court-request/story-e6frgczx-1227045588922#


----------



## noco (4 September 2014)

This fellow Palmer one day denies any wrong doing with the Chinese and then later admits to buying a ship that does not exists.

This guy is mentally unfit to be a member of parliament and sooner or later he is going to come horribly  unstuck..

IMHO, he is becoming a menace to society. 




http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ch-did-not-exist/story-fnihsrf2-1227046925975


----------



## noco (5 September 2014)

Geez I never thought I would ever see Palmer stuck for words....to be a good liar, you must have a good memory.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...usiness-partners/story-fnihsrf2-1227048199875


----------



## Craton (5 September 2014)

How can anyone take this bloke seriously?

The mind just boggles at his school yard antics and dummy spitting episodes.


----------



## Knobby22 (5 September 2014)

I don't think many people do take him seriously but are just glad that he is there to stop some of the more extreme policies. That was the reason he was voted in, the desire to get rid of the influence of the Labor and Green parties but combat the lack of trust with Abbott (which has been proven correct). 

The Palmer vote would revert back to the Coalition if trust could be obtained. That won't happen with the present leader.


----------



## drsmith (5 September 2014)

Uncle Clive and PUP are not a long term political proposition. The conservative vote it has garnered will return to the Coalition when it and its leader implodes.


----------



## pixel (5 September 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I don't think many people do take him seriously but are just glad that he is there to stop some of the more extreme policies. That was the reason he was voted in, the desire to get rid of the influence of the Labor and Green parties but combat the lack of trust with Abbott (which has been proven correct).
> 
> The Palmer vote would revert back to the Coalition if trust could be obtained. That won't happen with the present leader.




+1 at least on your first paragraph;
About your other assumption I'm not so sure. I know quite a few dyed-in-the-wool Labor voters that turned their backs on the shambolic disaster of the infighting, and saw Clive P as an outspoken maverick. I'd say the tick for PUP was overwhelmingly a protest vote, meant to "stick it up" both of the major parties, who believe they own the place and the right to run it. 

Another considerable block could have come from voters who object to the growing influence of Church doctrine, be it from Jesuit Abbott or Holy Rudd. Even if it's seen in the main as inconsequential rhetoric, Palmer's calling a spade a bluddy shovel has a far more familiar ring to middle-of-the-road Australians.


----------



## Knobby22 (5 September 2014)

pixel said:


> +1 at least on your first paragraph;
> About your other assumption I'm not so sure. I know quite a few dyed-in-the-wool Labor voters that turned their backs on the shambolic disaster of the infighting, and saw Clive P as an outspoken maverick. I'd say the tick for PUP was overwhelmingly a protest vote, meant to "stick it up" both of the major parties, who believe they own the place and the right to run it.
> 
> Another considerable block could have come from voters who object to the growing influence of Church doctrine, be it from Jesuit Abbott or Holy Rudd. Even if it's seen in the main as inconsequential rhetoric, Palmer's calling a spade a bluddy shovel has a far more familiar ring to middle-of-the-road Australians.




Good points pixel. I think you are correct.


----------



## Julia (5 September 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> I don't think many people do take him seriously but are just glad that he is there to stop some of the more extreme policies. That was the reason he was voted in, the desire to get rid of the influence of the Labor and Green parties but combat the lack of trust with Abbott (which has been proven correct).



That likely is part of the reason for his vote, but do not dismiss the naive voters who actually believed him when he said that a vote him would get them a $100 p.w. more in their pension.

Never under estimate either the stupidity or the wisdom of the electorate.   Some saw through Palmer after his first sentence.  Others still actually believe he's there to look after them.


----------



## drsmith (8 September 2014)

Jacquie Lambie's concerned for Uncle Clive's health,



> I need to keep Clive Palmer off the Tim Tams so I can keep him alive long enough to keep mentoring me.”




It won't be the Tim Tams that kill him,



> “I don’t back down to Clive Palmer and I shouldn’t have to. Even a billionaire needs to be told every now and then.”
> 
> Senator Lambie tells the ABC she has given Mr Palmer a harder time “than I’ve given anybody in my life”




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...-clowning-around/story-fn59niix-1227051344567


----------



## Tisme (8 September 2014)

Why just Clive and PUP? What about the other cringe worthy historical nutters like Barnaby, Pyne, Katter, Mirabella,  O'Dwyer , Bronwyn, Hanson Young, Tuckey, Latham, etc


----------



## SirRumpole (8 September 2014)

Tisme said:


> Why just Clive and PUP? What about the other cringe worthy historical nutters like Barnaby, Pyne, Katter, Mirabella,  O'Dwyer , Bronwyn, Hanson Young, Tuckey, Latham, etc




Anyone in the National Party for starters


----------



## drsmith (8 September 2014)

Tisme said:


> Why just Clive and PUP?



Clive more so than any other high profile politician on the federal stage is only in it for himself. It's about furthering (or saving ?) his business interests and at the expense of the nation if necessary as demonstrated by his recent comments about China. 

His party has no underlying ideology other than Clive, Clive, Clive. That over time will be a too smaller space for his senators to operate in and the cracks there are already publically showing with Jacquie Lambie.

There's not enough room for those two at the top of any outfit.


----------



## noco (13 September 2014)

drsmith said:


> Clive more so than any other high profile politician on the federal stage is only in it for himself. It's about furthering (or saving ?) his business interests and at the expense of the nation if necessary as demonstrated by his recent comments about China.
> 
> His party has no underlying ideology other than Clive, Clive, Clive. That over time will be a too smaller space for his senators to operate in and the cracks there are already publically showing with Jacquie Lambie.
> 
> There's not enough room for those two at the top of any outfit.




Clive Palmer says parliament is no fun and in his own words did not expect to win, so why did he nominate in the first place.

It was in his vindictive nature to destroy the Newman Government in Queensland because he could not get his own way.

His record of attendance in parliament is appalling and he should resign....if he doesn't then he will be given the flick next time around....he only has himself to blame.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-expected-to-win/story-fnihsrf2-1227057145863


----------



## noco (17 September 2014)

Has anyone seen Clive Palmer lately?......He appears to be steering clear of TV interviews......maybe he is in hiding from the Chinese.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-banking-records/story-fnihsrf2-1227060715987


----------



## noco (17 September 2014)

Poor old Uncle Clive......he does not seem to be having luck at all lately....another court action lost.

I would hate to be paying his legal bills.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...by-supreme-court/story-fnihsrf2-1227061629660


----------



## drsmith (23 September 2014)

Which of his senate pussycats does Uncle Clive think is a dodo ?



> Clive Palmer has been overheard questioning the intelligence of outspoken Palmer United Party Senator Jacqui Lambie, in a conversation with colleague Zhenya "Dio" Wang at Parliament on Tuesday, according to sources.
> 
> It comes as cracks emerge within the minor party particularly over Senator Lambie's inflammatory comments on Islamic law, which she claimed "involves terrorism".
> 
> But in a bizarre twist, Senator Lambie's media adviser emailed her response to questions from Fairfax Media to all journalists in the Parliamentary press gallery, in which she denied her leader said she was "not very bright" and  inisisted that Mr Palmer had instead made those comments about her colleague Senator Wang




http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...palmer-and-jacqui-lambie-20140923-10koq9.html


----------



## pixel (23 September 2014)

noco said:


> Poor old Uncle Clive......he does not seem to be having luck at all lately....another court action lost.
> 
> I would hate to be paying his legal bills.




LOL noco;
as a percentage of available funds, for you or me it will probably amount to a cup of coffee or a cheap bottle of Red  But in absolute terms, some towns may wish they had an annual budget of that size.


----------



## Julia (23 September 2014)

pixel said:


> LOL noco;
> as a percentage of available funds, for you or me it will probably amount to a cup of coffee or a cheap bottle of Red  But in absolute terms, some towns may wish they had an annual budget of that size.



The actual dollars might be irrelevant, but his losing - after all his bluster - isn't.


----------



## noco (23 September 2014)

drsmith said:


> Which of his senate pussycats does Uncle Clive think is a dodo ?
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...palmer-and-jacqui-lambie-20140923-10koq9.html




I really don't think Lambo needs uncle Clive any more.....she is set for 6 years provided there is no DD.

She has used Uncle Clive as a sugar daddy and has got away with it..

What can Palmer really do to her?.....not a damn thing......she knows how to handle men.


----------



## noco (1 October 2014)

Clive Palmer is a sick power drunk vindictive man....I mean what in the hell is this country coming to with this type of behavior?

The senate has set up this committee with Lazzarith  as chair of the the committee with one Liberal senator.

IMHO., that is a conflict of interest and it is a personal vindetta by Palmer to pay back Newman for not giving Palmer what he wanted....Can you imagine what would have happened if the Newman Government had given special favors to a life member of the Liberal Party?.............The Labor Party and the media would have been all over it. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...075704753?sv=635bd8885bbcc6d29528f0b745027a49


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2014)

noco said:


> Clive Palmer is a sick power drunk vindictive man....I mean what in the hell is this country coming to with this type of behavior?
> 
> The senate has set up this committee with Lazzarith  as chair of the the committee with one Liberal senator.
> 
> ...




Haven't been following it much, but does seem to indicate there will be a lot of Senate investigations going on.

Sounds like it is a bit of Palmer saying to Newman,"mines bigger than your's".

Politics continue their ever accelerating decline. 
The pro republic movement must be rubbing their hands with glee, it just shows how out of touch voters are, when Palmer was voted in.

Then again, the last Government showed how useless you can be and still win a pension, that resulted in everyone and sundry nominating.


----------



## noco (1 October 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Haven't been following it much, but does seem to indicate there will be a lot of Senate investigations going on.
> 
> Sounds like it is a bit of Palmer saying to Newman,"mines bigger than your's".
> 
> ...




I don't believe we will see Palmer win a second term.

He will probably finish up in the "JUG" for fraud  before his term runs out.


----------



## sptrawler (1 October 2014)

noco said:


> I don't believe we will see Palmer win a second term.
> 
> He will probably finish up in the "JUG" for fraud  before his term runs out.




Well someone needs to cop a flogging, sooner or later. 
At the moment it appears anyone can have the life of Riley, if they get onboard.
Pay the $2k nomination, get a catch phrase, appeal to the electorate.
It's better odds than lotto.


----------



## SirRumpole (2 October 2014)

I don't believe Palmer will hang around in Parliament, now that he's got what he wanted, revenge against Newman.

He's been a total disgrace to the political system.


----------



## noco (2 October 2014)

Mr. Palmer may regret his vendetta against Campbell Newman if this senate inquiry reaches past the Newman Government as might Labor as well.

Interesting times ahead. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...077117859?sv=9e44fdd5ecb736995fb7e2138bda5f42


----------



## Julia (2 October 2014)

The comments following that article are what is most interesting.  This is typical:


> Qldrs will not take kindly to this type of parliamentary abuse or federal interference being exacted.




Mr Palmer seems to have a talent for misjudging his business opponents.  He seems to be heading the same way politically.
Meantime, a footballer with no political experience is pocketing an additional $21500 for chairing this enquiry.
Would be good to know what qualifies him to hold such a position.
What a farce.


----------



## Julia (2 October 2014)

From Hedley Thomas who has been following Clive Palmer's dealings in some detail:


> CLIVE Palmer wants a penetrating public inquiry in Queensland. He wants to expose dishonesty and corruption. Shameless standover tactics by big business bullying a government must be highlighted. He promises to root out this wickedness and more.
> 
> Let’s give the tycoon what he wants. A public inquiry is a brilliant idea.
> 
> ...


----------



## Calliope (3 October 2014)




----------



## noco (3 October 2014)

Is it possible the Greens have led Palmer into his own tangled web in an attempt to rid the Palmer United Party to save their own Party.

The Greens seem hell bent on muddying the waters for Palmer over environmental issues at the Yabulu nickel refinery near Townsville. 

I really believe the one who will come out on top of this vendetta will be Campbell Newman.......Remember Anna Bligh tried the same stunt on Newman before the 2012 state election and look where that got the Labor Party.

They are only half smart. 



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...tions-of-his-own/story-fnihsrf2-1227078391339


----------



## drsmith (3 October 2014)

noco said:


> Is it possible the Greens have led Palmer into his own tangled web in an attempt to rid the Palmer United Party to save their own Party.



Andrew Bolt,

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...s_inquiry_would_be_turned_against_him_did_th/


----------



## SirRumpole (3 October 2014)

Watch out for Newman announcing an enquiry into Palmer in return.


----------



## noco (3 October 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Watch out for Newman announcing an enquiry into Palmer in return.




Why would Newman need to do that?

The Greens are doing it for him....Don't you see, the PUP are a threat to the Greens and the Greens want to destroy Palmer.

It is a vicious circle......it is a case of dog eats pup.

Newman will come out of this victorious.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (3 October 2014)

noco said:


> Why would Newman need to do that?
> 
> The Greens are doing it for him....Don't you see, the PUP are a threat to the Greens and the Greens want to destroy Palmer.
> 
> ...




Quite a wise statement noco.

As anyone involved in politics will tell you, the Greens are different.

How Palmer ever got himself involved with the Greens in the upcoming Senate Inquiry in to Qld, has me beat.

The Greens destroyed the ALP under Rudd, and destroyed Gillard when she became the ALP/Green Party.

Poor ole Clive Palmer is going to go bare-arsed after this Senate Inquiry.

gg


----------



## noco (4 October 2014)

There is no doubt Palmer has bitten off more than he can chew this time and is about to come off second best IMO.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...078189814?sv=66d1d97d902d140441a1678c6bd93a95

*Clive Palmer has underestimated Campbell Newman

    The Australian
    October 03, 2014 12:00AM

    Print
    Save for later

CLIVE Palmer is digging his own grave (“Newman inquiry may backfire on Palmer”, 2/10). Typical of those who embark on vendettas, Palmer has just taken a sip from the poisoned chalice.

All governments get a smell about them, especially when reform is needed, as there was in Queensland. Overcoming a huge debt was not something that could be done without hard decisions, some of which were going to hurt. Campbell Newman attacked this with vigour, knowing his popularity would be damaged, but not necessarily beyond repair.

Palmer, an opportunist, thought he could play Newman off a break. Newman saw through him on from day one and Palmer didn’t like it. Palmer discards his closest mates when he is rejected; Newman was smart enough to slip Palmer’s noose early and rejection took centre stage.

Palmer sees Newman’s decline in popularity as an easy target for his vendetta, but this time he has underestimated the strength of the tiger.

John George, Terrigal, NSW

THE antics of the Greens and Palmer United Party senators point again to the absurdity of the system used to elect the Senate (“Business slams PUP-Greens pact”, 2/10). There is nothing democratic about an 8.65 per cent party (the Greens) joining forces with a 4.91 per cent party (PUP) to give a shoddy political exercise the dignity of Senate approval.

The behaviour of the minor parties in the Senate is a growing impediment to effective government, and the electoral system of that house ought better reflect an essential purpose of democracy, which is to prevent minorities from wielding power.

John Francis, Lauderdale, Tas*


----------



## SirRumpole (4 October 2014)

noco said:


> Why would Newman need to do that?
> 
> The Greens are doing it for him....Don't you see, the PUP are a threat to the Greens and the Greens want to destroy Palmer.
> 
> ...




Campbell Newman himself could be history after the next election:-

Bruce Flegg says LNP does not believe Campbell Newman can win his seat of Ashgrove

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-03/bruce-flegg-speaks-out/5790044


----------



## noco (4 October 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Campbell Newman himself could be history after the next election:-
> 
> Bruce Flegg says LNP does not believe Campbell Newman can win his seat of Ashgrove
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-03/bruce-flegg-speaks-out/5790044




Yes, I saw Bruce Flegg on TV last night and he was full of sour grapes.

Flegg has a long history as a poor performing MP.


----------



## Julia (4 October 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Campbell Newman himself could be history after the next election:-
> 
> Bruce Flegg says LNP does not believe Campbell Newman can win his seat of Ashgrove
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-10-03/bruce-flegg-speaks-out/5790044



No need for the drama of the oversized capital letters, Rumpole.
The only mistake the Newman government has made re Flegg is not dumping him sooner.
He has been a complete liability to the government and the State of Queensland.

Once again, however, ABC TV seized the opportunity of broadcasting anti-LNP sentiment in  allowing Flegg an extended period of whining and self-justification on "7.30 Qld" last night.


----------



## noco (4 October 2014)

Julia said:


> No need for the drama of the oversized capital letters, Rumpole.
> The only mistake the Newman government has made re Flegg is not dumping him sooner.
> He has been a complete liability to the government and the State of Queensland.
> 
> Once again, however, ABC TV seized the opportunity of broadcasting anti-LNP sentiment in  allowing Flegg an extended period of whining and self-justification on "7.30 Qld" last night.




Yeah...Flegg was just the beginning of the "DIRT" show by the Green/Labor socialist left wingers who are well and truly entrenched in the ABC......the mud will be flowing thick and fast up to the state election.....it is Labor history repeating itself in the run up to the 2012 election and look where that got them.....it is in their DNA to play dirty.....The state Labor Party, as are their Federal counterparts, don't have any economic credentials so they have to resort to the only method they know.


----------



## SirRumpole (4 October 2014)

Julia said:


> No need for the drama of the oversized capital letters, Rumpole.




No drama intended, just highlighting the point of the article.


----------



## noco (6 October 2014)

All this farce of a senate inquiry into Queensland is going to do is cost us tax payers heaps of money.
It is not Palmer's money, so why should he care?....he has no interest in the welfare of Queensland except what he can get out of it for himself.

The tailings dam at his Townsville nickel refinery is a disaster waiting to happen should we receive extraordinary heavy rains this summer.

I trust he will get all that is coming to him.

As the link below states, let the people decide for themselves at the next election.

Note : the latest poll shows Palmer's support has dropped form 8% to 4%....I hope he has taken note. 


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ights-and-voters/story-fnihsr9v-1227080879240


----------



## SirRumpole (6 October 2014)

Having read the following story, I agree that their should be an enquiry into the Newman government

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-...pes-prosecution-for-illegal-quarrying/5543896


----------



## noco (7 October 2014)

I have reason to believe Mr Palmer may have bitten off more than chew.

It is all going to come back and bite him on his oversize posterior.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-on-clive-palmer/story-fnihsrf2-1227081862062


----------



## Tisme (7 October 2014)

When the mouthpiece for the Liberals gives the QLD a spray for corruption like "welded on" Alan Jones did there must be something of concern.

Bruce Flegg made the mistake of distrusting his untrustworthy masters and recording their intrigue, which resulted in star chamber investigations by the LNP loaded CMC into their own corporate LNP executive. A premier needed to be taught a lesson on who the real power brokers in the party are.... the same brokers who, in concert with the same premier, betrayed the handshake deals with their wealthy, but estranged, benefactor no doubt


----------



## Tisme (7 October 2014)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Quite a wise statement noco.
> 
> As anyone involved in politics will tell you, the Greens are different.
> 
> ...




I think you have some valid points there.

Of course the whole abuse of power thing has been used by both major parties many times. I seem to remember Tony Abbott giving an absolute no statement to funding, when asked about the One Nation witchhunt headed by a fella named Sharples and as it turned out there was a piece of paper that showed our "honourable" member was bare faced  lying.

The LNP have pedigree of using the courts and parliament  to discredit and sue the pants off their opponents, especially in QLD. Joh was the best at it and the Liberal Party's print organ, the Courier Mail applauded his every machination. 

Yep all those "honourable members" should fear nothing if they have acted honourably and should welcome the positive publicity generated by the probe of their honourable peers.


----------



## Tisme (7 October 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Having read the following story, I agree that their should be an enquiry into the Newman government
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-06-...pes-prosecution-for-illegal-quarrying/5543896




Remember Alan:- 

http://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/43916#.VDNsak1005u


----------



## SirRumpole (7 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> Remember Alan:-
> 
> http://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/43916#.VDNsak1005u




If Alan Jones comes out against a conservative government, something is very wrong in the State of Queensland.


----------



## noco (7 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> When the mouthpiece for the Liberals gives the QLD a spray for corruption like "welded on" Alan Jones did there must be something of concern.
> 
> Bruce Flegg made the mistake of distrusting his untrustworthy masters and recording their intrigue, which resulted in star chamber investigations by the LNP loaded CMC into their own corporate LNP executive. A premier needed to be taught a lesson on who the real power brokers in the party are.... the same brokers who, in concert with the same premier, betrayed the handshake deals with their wealthy, but estranged, benefactor no doubt




Do you have some back up link or proof to confirm your accusations?


----------



## noco (7 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> Remember Alan:-
> 
> http://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/43916#.VDNsak1005u




Wow....I listened to the audio all the way through and if Alan Jones is correct, then The Newman Government should have the book thrown at them and they deserve all that is coming to them....I will have no sympathy for them if they are proven guilty of the corruption outlined by Alan Jones.


----------



## noco (9 October 2014)

The wheels of the PUP MOBILE are starting to fall off with no PUP rep in the Queensland parliament.

Palmer has goooooone, gooooone, gooooone. 

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...sun/comments/last_palmer_queensland_mp_quits/


----------



## Tisme (9 October 2014)

noco said:


> The wheels of the PUP MOBILE are starting to fall off with no PUP rep in the Queensland parliament.
> 
> Palmer has goooooone, gooooone, gooooone.
> 
> http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...sun/comments/last_palmer_queensland_mp_quits/




I would guess Clive has achieved what he had set out to do and is dissolving the party:

1) show how his money can buy seats, just like his money bought the LNP some seats
2) force an inquiry into Campbell Newman and his cohorts

Be interesting to see if he uses the inquiry to personally drop a bucket over his enemies with some party/meeting transcripts


----------



## noco (9 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> I would guess Clive has achieved what he had set out to do and is dissolving the party:
> 
> 1) show how his money can buy seats, just like his money bought the LNP some seats
> 2) force an inquiry into Campbell Newman and his cohorts
> ...




Was it his money or was the Chinese money he used to buy seats???????


----------



## noco (12 October 2014)

Me thinks Clive has hit the self destruct button.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...mmets-poll-shows/story-fnihsrf2-1227087647011


----------



## Tisme (14 October 2014)

noco said:


> Me thinks Clive has hit the self destruct button.
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...mmets-poll-shows/story-fnihsrf2-1227087647011




You can't use the Courier Mail as evidence of anything. It's a heavily tainted far right news feed that is becoming more like the "Weekly World News", with it's ridiculous yarns.


----------



## Calliope (15 October 2014)

Has Jaqui found the right package?


----------



## drsmith (15 October 2014)

Calliope said:


> Has Jaqui found the right package?



A grizzly prospect for Putin.


----------



## Julia (15 October 2014)

Calliope said:


> Has Jaqui found the right package?



  Yes, I had to laugh when reading her strong support for the Russian leader.  Probably based more on her lascivious imaginings than his condemnation of Islamists.


----------



## Calliope (16 October 2014)

Julia said:


> Yes, I had to laugh when reading her strong support for the Russian leader.  Probably based more on her lascivious imaginings than his condemnation of Islamists.




Lascivious! Spot on. It' amazing how the cartoonists can capture that lascivious look on her dial.


----------



## noco (16 October 2014)

Calliope said:


> Lascivious! Spot on. It' amazing how the cartoonists can capture that lascivious look on her dial.




I think Lambo may be looking for a roll in the hay with Vlad while he is in Brissy!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## drsmith (20 October 2014)

Uncle Clive suffers another setback in court,



> Two Chinese companies suing federal MP Clive Palmer have a genuine dispute against him, a judge says.
> 
> Subsidiaries of Chinese government-owned company CITIC Pacific are suing Mr Palmer and his company Cosmo Developments over claims $12.167 million was misappropriated by the MP's company Mineralogy.
> 
> CITIC Pacific subsidiaries Sino Iron and Korean Steel claim money deposited in an administrative fund and intended for the day-to-day running costs of a West Australian port was redirected to Cosmo Developments ($10 million) and Brisbane advertising firm Media Circus Network ($2.167 million).




http://www.smh.com.au/business/mini...-with-clive-palmer-court-20141020-118pdt.html


----------



## noco (24 October 2014)

Uncle Clive might be up the proverbial creek without a paddle if he can't find 500 PUP members by Monday. 



http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...s/palmer_scrambles_for_members_dead_or_alive/


----------



## noco (25 October 2014)

Uncle Clive is offering free PUP membership this weekend only.

By Sunday night you might be able to get free membership with 10 grand in the hand as well.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...0-paidup-members/story-fnihsrf2-1227101675627


----------



## Calliope (28 October 2014)

Photos of Jacqui are the best argument I have seen *for* the wearing of the burka. Clive too!!!



	

		
			
		

		
	
 Burka?...yes! 
	

		
			
		

		
	



	

		
			
		

		
	
 Burka? ...no!



> ANYONE who forces a child to wear a burqa in public could be jailed for a year and fined $68,000, under a draft law to be introduced by Jacqui Lambie.
> 
> The Palmer United Party Senator’s legislation would also make it an offence to “compel” an adult to wear a full face covering in public, with a fine of $34,000 or a maximum of six months in prison.
> 
> Additionally, the private member’s bill would make it unlawful to wear a full face covering in public “without reasonable excuse”.




http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/na...erings-in-public/story-fni0xqrb-1227104414371


----------



## noco (29 October 2014)

Does anyone know whether Palmer made the dead line yesterday with his 500 members requested by the AEC?


----------



## Weatsop (29 October 2014)

noco said:


> Does anyone know whether Palmer made the dead line yesterday with his 500 members requested by the AEC?




Yep.

http://www.news.com.au/national/bre...mber-list-in-qld/story-e6frfku9-1227104312904


----------



## noco (29 October 2014)

Weatsop said:


> Yep.
> 
> http://www.news.com.au/national/bre...mber-list-in-qld/story-e6frfku9-1227104312904





It has been noted though, there will be an audit made to check the authenticity......We must not forget Palmer is a tricky character and it would not be beyond him to fudge the list.

http://www.weeklytimesnow.com.au/ne...mber-list-in-qld/story-fnjbnvyg-1227104312904


----------



## Weatsop (29 October 2014)

Yeah, I doubt it would have been hard to find 500 people to sign, though. He's a nut, but he does get stuff done. Wacky stuff, true, but still.


----------



## noco (31 October 2014)

I think Mr Palmer is in deep trouble and could well find himself behind bars......We can all get into trouble without looking for it and he appears to found it.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...107783887?sv=e5d5b8ced83b7d8c08c3135942d75305


----------



## Tisme (31 October 2014)

"We'll give little Hitler his list and he can then start his persecution of them, like he's persecuted everyone throughout the state." Clive Palmer

Who was it that said if it's true there is no defamation?


----------



## noco (31 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> "We'll give little Hitler his list and he can then start his persecution of them, like he's persecuted everyone throughout the state." Clive Palmer
> 
> Who was it that said if it's true there is no defamation?




Where is the evidence that Campbell Newman was behind the AEC request to substantiate his PUP's 500 members.


----------



## Tisme (31 October 2014)

noco said:


> Where is the evidence that Campbell Newman was behind the AEC request to substantiate his PUP's 500 members.




No evidence that has presented itself to you, but I think most of us doubting Thomas' know in our hearts it's the usual stunt the LNP use to chase down the old style Liberals like Hansen and now Clive ... that's the irony of the whole thing.... they are waging war on their own Menzoid manifesto.


----------



## noco (31 October 2014)

Tisme said:


> No evidence that has presented itself to you, but I think most of us doubting Thomas' know in our hearts it's the usual stunt the LNP use to chase down the old style Liberals like Hansen and now Clive ... that's the irony of the whole thing.... they are waging war on their own Menzoid manifesto.




So you basing it all on assumption.


----------



## Weatsop (31 October 2014)

noco said:


> So you basing it all on assumption.




Yeah, I'm not sure that's so fair - Hansen was pretty emphatically kicked out of the party.

Clive is basing it on assumption, because he's insane.

Some other folk think it's the sort of thing Newman might do. I don't see how it matters either way: it'd be grubby for a premier to stoop so low, but on the other hand people are only asking Palmer to obey the law. Can't really complain about that, I'd think.


----------



## noco (1 November 2014)

Having admitted to drawing cheques for his election campaign where will it all end up now.

I would certainly not like to be in Clive Palmers shoes ATM.....I often wonder how he sleeps at night! 


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-breach-of-trust/story-fnihsrf2-1227108974452


----------



## drsmith (1 November 2014)

noco said:


> Having admitted to drawing cheques for his election campaign where will it all end up now.
> 
> I would certainly not like to be in Clive Palmers shoes ATM.....I often wonder how he sleeps at night!
> 
> ...



I didn't think sleep was a problem in the sunshine state. 

It appears to have been though for Clive but not for reasons of conscience.



> Palmer has also suffered from sleep apnoea.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clive_Palmer

One by one, we're seeing uncle Clive crumble on the government's election and budget agenda and that will continue, at least until his senate felines scatter. It's going to be a slow and tedious process but the conservative side of politics is the closest thing he has to friends even though he's ultimately poisoned the water there as well.


----------



## noco (6 November 2014)

How many more PUP "MEMBERS" will the QEC find to be unofficial like Phil Johnson?

What a rogue this Palmer turned out to be.....I hope they trough the book at him.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...boost-his-litter/story-fnn8dlfs-1227113999659


News
Puppetmaster Clive Palmer hands out unsolicited free memberships to boost his litter

    Jason Tin
    The Courier-Mail
    November 06, 2014 12:00AM

Share

56
Clive Palmer compares Campbell Newman to Stalin
Clive Palmer compares Campbell Newman to Stalin
Phil Johnson said he would like to see an ECQ investigation into why the PUP listed him a

*Phil Johnson said he would like to see an ECQ investigation into why the PUP listed him as a member. Picture: Tim Marsden

A BRISBANE voter falsely listed as a Palmer United Party member has demanded an investigation into why the party officially submitted his details in its battle to stay registered in Queensland.

University student Phil Johnson was stunned to receive a letter from the Electoral Commission of Queensland asking him to confirm his membership.

He says he never joined the party, having handed over minimal personal details last year to get more information about the fledgling outfit.*


----------



## Tisme (7 November 2014)

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/video/2014/nov/07/clive-palmer-rupert-murdoch-video


----------



## noco (8 November 2014)

Here is a breakdown on how Palmer spent the Chinese money and he says he has done nothing wrong.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...federal-election/story-fnn8dlfs-1227116443681


----------



## Calliope (10 November 2014)

Wierdos like Palmer and Lambi are God's gift to cartoonists.


----------



## drsmith (11 November 2014)

It's very softly softly, but uncle Clive has distanced himself from some of Jacqui Lambie's latest commentary,

http://blogs.news.com.au/dailyteleg...ces_himself_from_bogan_senator_jacqui_lambie/


----------



## drsmith (12 November 2014)

Is Jacqui about to tell uncle Clive where he can shove his whipper snipper ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-...ises-clive-palmer-leadership-policies/5886508


----------



## Julia (12 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> Is Jacqui about to tell uncle Clive where he can shove his whipper snipper ?
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-...ises-clive-palmer-leadership-policies/5886508



Yep, not long now, until PUP loses it's most attention-seeking senator.  A most entertaining interview on 7.30 this evening.


----------



## noco (12 November 2014)

Julia said:


> Yep, not long now, until PUP loses it's most attention-seeking senator.  A most entertaining interview on 7.30 this evening.




Yes, but I thought I heard her say say she would not resign from PUP and that Palmer would have to sack her.


----------



## noco (13 November 2014)

I don't think it will be too long now for Clive Palmer....he seems to be losing one PUP after another.

There is not much coming out of the NT with those other 3 defectors. 

The wheels are starting to fall off the PUP vehicle.



http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...lmer-is-strained/story-fnihslxi-1227121049311


----------



## SirRumpole (13 November 2014)

noco said:


> I don't think it will be too long now for Clive Palmer....he seems to be losing one PUP after another.
> 
> There is not much coming out of the NT with those other 3 defectors.
> 
> The wheels are starting to fall off the PUP vehicle.




That's because Palmer was never interested in being a politician in the long term, he just wanted revenge on Campbell Newman, which he has now got. I don't see him being in Parliament at the next election.


----------



## drsmith (13 November 2014)

Uncle Clive moves to put Jacqui Lambie back in her box.

Firstly, her chief of staff Rob Messenger has been expelled from the Party.



> "Everything Senator Lambie says is really coming from her chief of staff," Mr Palmer said in a statement.




He's also gone on to say this,



> "We aren't prepared to give a blanket threat to vote against the Liberal Government for the next five years. No such proposal has been considered in our party room," Mr Palmer said.
> 
> "I am amazed why Jacqui Lambie is being such a drama queen when the Palmer United Party unanimously supports the ADF and opposes the Government's proposed pay structure.
> 
> ...




Now it's over to Jacqui.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-13/pup-expels-jacqui-lambie27s-chief-of-staff-from-party/5888372


----------



## drsmith (13 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> Now it's over to Jacqui.



Kick me out Clive. I dare ya.



> "I'm actually surprised Clive hasn't asked me to leave - let's be honest," she said.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-...ief-of-staff-rob-messenger-from-party/5888372



> Crossbencher Senator David Leyonhjelm said he and Family First Senator Bob Day have discussed increasing their power bloc to three.
> 
> "If she [Senator Lambie] is looking for a friend, Bob and I are here to help her," Senator Leyonhjelm said.




They're foolish too if they want to court disaster. They should realise by now that Jacqui wants to be in control and is political poison.


----------



## Julia (13 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> They're foolish too if they want to court disaster. They should realise by now that Jacqui wants to be in control and is political poison.



Not to mention that they are ideologically opposed to most of what she says she stands for.
Seems that Day and Leyjonhelm have cottoned on to the attraction of being a power bloc of three, increasing their importance to the government.
Something about power overriding common sense, perhaps.


----------



## drsmith (15 November 2014)

The latest from Hedley Thomas on Clive Palmer,



> CRUISING in one of his luxury cars in his Sunshine Coast electorate, Clive Palmer showed his quirkiness and natural competitive instinct.
> 
> In Brisbane, about 100km from his dinosaur park-cum-resort, the world’s major economic event, the G20, was warming up with VIP greetings, high-level talks and security lockdowns.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...ll-went-so-wrong/story-e6frg6zo-1227123675487


----------



## Julia (15 November 2014)

I'm guessing that Lambie is pushing the boundaries in her behaviour toward Palmer in order to goad him into firing her from PUP.   He's so quick to sue that if she just said 'see ya, Clive, I'm off' he might well suggest she needs to reimburse him for the considerable amount he spent on pre-election advertising for her.

She has previously said that the only reason she switched from running as an Independent to joining PUP was because she had run out of money.


----------



## noco (15 November 2014)

Julia said:


> I'm guessing that Lambie is pushing the boundaries in her behaviour toward Palmer in order to goad him into firing her from PUP.   He's so quick to sue that if she just said 'see ya, Clive, I'm off' he might well suggest she needs to reimburse him for the considerable amount he spent on pre-election advertising for her.
> 
> She has previously said that the only reason she switched from running as an Independent to joining PUP was because she had run out of money.




I think Lambie has to tread very carefully with Palmer......If she resigns from the PUP she may find she will be replaced by another person of Palmer's liking......maybe his wife......I believe there is some legality that might take place here.

If she is sacked by  Palmer, she  may have the right to go independent.

I picked this up somewhere from some article...I will try to locate it it.


----------



## noco (15 November 2014)

noco said:


> I think Lambie has to tread very carefully with Palmer......If she resigns from the PUP she may find she will be replaced by another person of Palmer's liking......maybe his wife......I believe there is some legality that might take place here.
> 
> If she is sacked by  Palmer, she  may have the right to go independent.
> 
> I picked this up somewhere from some article...I will try to locate it it.





http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...why_lambie_wont_quit_although_she_really_has/

*Here’s one possible reason Lambie won’t take that final step against a man infamous for dragging poorer people off to court:

    It has also been made clear to Senator Lambie that if she quits the party she could face expensive legal action aimed at kicking her out of the Senate and replacing her with another PUP senator.

    Senators are allowed to quit their parties and sit as independents. Any legal action would most likely fail in the long run, but not before it potentially bankrupted Senator Lambie, which would disqualify her from Parliament.

    “She hasn’t got a cent as it is,” one PUP source said.*


----------



## Julia (15 November 2014)

You are amplifying my point, noco.  I'm sure Ms Lambie is well aware of the potential dangers.

I'd be on Clive's side if it came to this.  She has joined his party and was voted in (never mind by how few) as a representative of PUP, not because of herself as an individual.

Her personal obsessions and level of anger and outrage are rendering her unsuitable for any public office imo.


----------



## drsmith (16 November 2014)

If Clive Palmer could have sacked her and retained the senate seat, he would have done so by now. She won't go of her own accord because if Mark Arbib is any guide, she'll lose the seat.



> On 2 March 2012, Prime Minister Julia Gillard announced that Carr would be nominated to fill a casual vacancy in the Australian Senate caused by the resignation of Mark Arbib. This term would expire on 30 June 2014.




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Carr 

It's effectively a stalemate.


----------



## Julia (16 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> If Clive Palmer could have sacked her and retained the senate seat, he would have done so by now. She won't go of her own accord because if Mark Arbib is any guide, she'll lose the seat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Is it the same if she were still to remain a senator, just independent instead of PUP member?


----------



## SirRumpole (16 November 2014)

Of course another alternative is that Clive himself gets fed up and leaves the party, and the rest then elect Lambie as leader.

Stranger things have happened.


----------



## drsmith (16 November 2014)

Julia said:


> Is it the same if she were still to remain a senator, just independent instead of PUP member?



She can vacate the senate seat and it stay with the party as Mark Arbib did without an election. I'm not sure as to whether she can quit the party and retain the seat.

She hasn't quit the party for a reason.


----------



## drsmith (16 November 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Of course another alternative is that Clive himself gets fed up and leaves the party, and the rest then elect Lambie as leader.
> 
> Stranger things have happened.



The question that comes to my mind is why has a so-called mining billionaire has taken such an interest in politics.

In his case, it's the last refuge of a failing businessman.


----------



## Julia (16 November 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Of course another alternative is that Clive himself gets fed up and leaves the party, and the rest then elect Lambie as leader.
> 
> Stranger things have happened.



I can't see the other two choosing Lambie.  They have both criticised her current position of voting against all government legislation.

Clive just walking away seems more possible.   His world is crumbling in all directions.  I might start to believe in karma.


----------



## Knobby22 (17 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> She can vacate the senate seat and it stay with the party as Mark Arbib did without an election. I'm not sure as to whether she can quit the party and retain the seat.
> 
> She hasn't quit the party for a reason.




She said she made a verbal promise to Palmer saying she would not quit the party during her term. She intimated that she would willingly accept Palmer releasing her from this promise.


----------



## sptrawler (17 November 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> She said she made a verbal promise to Palmer saying she would not quit the party during her term. She intimated that she would willingly accept Palmer releasing her from this promise.




I'm upset, because I didn't have a Lambie standing up for tradesmen not getting CPI wage rises, during the Hawke/ Keating wages accord.

The one thing for sure the union reps, F###ing didn't.

Why can't Ricky Muir, from the 'Motoring enthusiast party, refuse to back legislation untill mechanics get a pay rise?

What is going on, it smacks of discimination, against non ADF workers.


----------



## Tisme (18 November 2014)

Knobby22 said:


> She said she made a verbal promise to Palmer saying she would not quit the party during her term. She intimated that she would willingly accept Palmer releasing her from this promise.




yes she could hardly be vocal about sticking by her army chums and then betraying her semper fidelis, could she 

Clive has her on a moral leash.


----------



## dutchie (19 November 2014)

Memo from Jacqui Lambie to Clive Palmer:

Thanks for the money Clive, now p#ss off!


----------



## Bintang (19 November 2014)

*Clive Palmer accuses Jacqui Lambie of lying and plotting to set up her own political party*

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...ical-party-20141119-11q0iv.html#ixzz3JVOr51Yw

It's probably not a bad idea to set up a new party. How can any of these clowns continue to be members of a party that calls itself the Palmer United Party. The very name is almost oxymoronic. At the very least it has become a contradiction in terms.


----------



## drsmith (19 November 2014)

The following isn't a bad read on the unfolding Lambie/PUP saga.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-...esnt-want-to-stay-doesnt-want-to-quit/5902816


----------



## Julia (19 November 2014)

Ms Lambie doesn't deserve the title of Senator.  She is behaving like a stupid teenager.   So she votes on legislation which subsequently passes.  Then , belatedly, she has a bit of a think about it (read "is subjected to sustained pressure by Labor and the Greens) and so says "oh goodness, I was wrong there, so I demand the parliament junk that legislation so that my hysterical irrationality can hold sway".

What a complete crock.  

She needs to be dumped from more than just PUP.  My money is on Clive in this particular stoush, much as I detest him also.


----------



## sptrawler (20 November 2014)

Julia said:


> Ms Lambie doesn't deserve the title of Senator.  She is behaving like a stupid teenager.   So she votes on legislation which subsequently passes.  Then , belatedly, she has a bit of a think about it (read "is subjected to sustained pressure by Labor and the Greens) and so says "oh goodness, I was wrong there, so I demand the parliament junk that legislation so that my hysterical irrationality can hold sway".
> 
> What a complete crock.
> 
> She needs to be dumped from more than just PUP.  My money is on Clive in this particular stoush, much as I detest him also.




Actually blackmailing parliamentary process, to extort a pay rise for a sector of the workforce. 
It is even more 'out there', than the Labor Party.lol 

Can't wait to see what happens, if Labor get in, owing her a favour.


----------



## Calliope (20 November 2014)

Senator Lazarus says he loves Jacqui Lambi but he can't understand why she doesn't return the love. Remember Lambi judges men by how well they are hung.  She now has  had time to evaluate Clive and The Brick and has found them sadly lacking in that department. The only thing well hung about them is their beer bellies which obscure their other tiny appendages.


----------



## drsmith (20 November 2014)

> At one point, she seemed to suggest she would not form her own party, saying "that would be an overload for me".
> 
> She said she would spend the weekend in Tasmania consulting her constituents and mentors.
> 
> "I'll make a decision from there early next week," she said.



What's Jacqui planning ?

It now seems there's only one choice she can make with PUP.

I can't see Labor showing any interest. She's already declared she'll vote against all government measures in the senate over defence pay. As for the non-PUP independent senators, they should consider that if Clive's money isn't enough to hold her............

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...with-palmer-united-party-20141120-11qbkb.html


----------



## noco (20 November 2014)

drsmith said:


> What's Jacqui planning ?
> 
> It now seems there's only one choice she can make with PUP.
> 
> ...




Doc, she says she will spend the weekend consulting with the people of Tasmania......Will someone remind her that she is just one of six senators in Tasmania and she is really a servant of the state government and should be consulting with the state government as well as the people of Tasmania....If she continues to make self interest decisions instead of the Tasmanian requirements then she is not doing her job and deserves to be kicked out..


----------



## boofhead (20 November 2014)

noco said:


> Doc, she says she will spend the weekend consulting with the people of Tasmania......Will someone remind her that she is just one of six senators in Tasmania and she is really a servant of the state government and should be consulting with the state government as well as the people of Tasmania....If she continues to make self interest decisions instead of the Tasmanian requirements then she is not doing her job and deserves to be kicked out..




She is one of 12 Tasmanian senators. I'm not sure about other states but generally there is a strong point of difference between state based politics and those representing the state federally.


----------



## noco (20 November 2014)

boofhead said:


> She is one of 12 Tasmanian senators. I'm not sure about other states but generally there is a strong point of difference between state based politics and those representing the state federally.




Yes you are correct with the 12 senators.....I was thinking of six who are elected in the half senate elections.

But they represent their appropriate states and should listen to the state governments and the people of that state as to what they consider is desirable and advantageous to their state irrespective of their own personal beliefs.


----------



## explod (20 November 2014)

noco said:


> Doc, she says she will spend the weekend consulting with the people of Tasmania......Will someone remind her that she is just one of six senators in Tasmania and she is really a servant of the state government and should be consulting with the state government as well as the people of Tasmania....If she continues to make self interest decisions instead of the Tasmanian requirements then she is not doing her job and deserves to be kicked out..




Rubbish,  policy should be developed and thrashed out in the Parliament under the eye of the pubic and general elecotorate.   Not from behind party closed doors.   This is why I admire people like Malcome Fraser because he came from such an era and espouses such today. 

Jackie Lambie was not fed on a silver spoon,  she as a single mum had a rough road.   She is speking openly from her heart and her opening up yesterday was a great day for democracy.


----------



## Julia (20 November 2014)

I suppose people like Explod are what Lambie is counting on to excuse her from her hysterical behaviour.


----------



## sptrawler (20 November 2014)

explod said:


> Rubbish,  policy should be developed and thrashed out in the Parliament under the eye of the pubic and general elecotorate.   Not from behind party closed doors.   This is why I admire people like Malcome Fraser because he came from such an era and espouses such today.
> 
> Jackie Lambie was not fed on a silver spoon,  she as a single mum had a rough road.   She is speking openly from her heart and her opening up yesterday was a great day for democracy.




Funny you should say that, they are poles apart in their beliefs.

Lambie wants a pay rise to be increased to match inflation.

Fraser brought in a wages 'freeze', with no restraint on prices, the average Australian worker despised him.


----------



## noco (20 November 2014)

sptrawler said:


> Funny you should say that, they are poles apart in their beliefs.
> 
> Lambie wants a pay rise to be increased to match inflation.
> 
> Fraser brought in a wages 'freeze', with no restraint on prices, the average Australian worker despised him.




Funny also, Hawke and Keating brought in a wage freeze which the unions agreed to.

If Abbott tried to do the same there would rioting in the streets.

Keating also promised tax cuts and it was to be L-A-W Law......it never happened.


----------



## explod (21 November 2014)

Julia said:


> I suppose people like Explod are what Lambie is counting on to excuse her from her hysterical behaviour.




Hysteriical,  she speaks calmy and to the point. She has not been in Parliament long but  is learning fast. 

Gee you Libs are so biased and blind,  particularly to content,  the last to all 3 previous posts.  We may be poles apart but I can relate to cincerity and her take on the real human condition of the have nots.  

With this mentality,  and the numbers now forming in the senate the current Government will desintigrate.


----------



## drsmith (21 November 2014)

I'm trying to imagine Jacqui around the same table with Christine and young Sarah.

It would certainly get to the point but I'm not sure how long it'd stay calm.


----------



## sptrawler (21 November 2014)

explod said:


> With this mentality,  and the numbers now forming in the senate the current Government will desintigrate.




And with it, any chance of being able to support the welfare system, we enjoy.lol

Go back to Labor/Green trajectory and sooner or later it implodes.

You can't keep spending more than you earn, I would have thought you would already know that.

Unless you are on a taxpayer funded income, but even that stalls, when the taxpayers are out of work.


----------



## explod (21 November 2014)

sptrawler said:


> And with it, any chance of being able to support the welfare system, we enjoy.lol
> 
> Go back to Labor/Green trajectory and sooner or later it implodes.
> 
> ...




That is not correct.   Our debt per capita is insignificant compared to most other western countries.  To invest in the future borrowing is standard practice. 

Home buyers and investors do it on borrowing. 

The debt on this Governments arrival (off top of head here)  was heading to 200 billion,  the Libs have raised the ceiling to half a trillion. 

All of the rhetoric of the two partes is just that,  hot air rhetoric.


----------



## noco (21 November 2014)

explod said:


> That is not correct.   Our debt per capita is insignificant compared to most other western countries.  To invest in the future borrowing is standard practice.
> 
> Home buyers and investors do it on borrowing.
> 
> ...




So if Shorten were to put his head in the fire, you would follow him.

Or if you are not sure what Shorten says or does , it does matter you would  still agree with him.

I mean why do we have to compare ourselves with other countries who were stupid enough to get themselves into so much debt..

The Green/Labor left wing socialists party wasted so much 2007/2013 with the excuse of a Global financial crisis. A Liberal Government would have done twice as much with half the money Labor wasted.

As I have said before Rudd's $900 cheques were just a loan and now we, the taxpayers, have to pay it back or perhaps the next generation will, one or the two.

It might have been better to go into a short recession like the one Keating  said we had to have rather than waste so much money.

Yes off topic.


----------



## noco (21 November 2014)

Emma had Clive by the short and curlies last night and he did not like, so he spat the dummy. 


http://www.couriermail.com.au/enter...th-emma-alberici/story-fnihmoiz-1227130189792


----------



## Tisme (21 November 2014)

noco said:


> I mean why do we have to compare ourselves with other countries who were stupid enough to get themselves into so much debt..
> 
> .




We compare ourselves because it is those delinquent nations who pumped flesh in Brisbane recently and decided the fate of the world's economy. We compare ourselves because we still insist on importing CEOs and MDs to run our companies. We compare ourselves because our private sector borrows vast amounts of monies from those other countries.

So although those other countries are apparently basket cases and poor money managers they still run show and we don't, although Joe Hockey did give it an embarrassing crack, Julie continues to think the UN takes her seriously and Tony thinks we are up to the task of going to war with Russia.


----------



## Tisme (21 November 2014)

noco said:


> Emma had Clive by the short and curlies last night and he did not like, so he spat the dummy.
> 
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/enter...th-emma-alberici/story-fnihmoiz-1227130189792




Grist for the mill.  Clive didn't get to where he is by being subordinate to a party machine and news cycle like most profile politicians. He has smashed his way through and probably sees no reason to change.


It was good sport, but Emma did take it too far IMO..... poor timing on this occasion.


----------



## drsmith (21 November 2014)

Tisme said:


> Grist for the mill.  Clive didn't get to where he is by being subordinate to a party machine and news cycle like most profile politicians. He has smashed his way through and probably sees no reason to change.



It's far too late for him to change.

Clive "Titanic" Palmer is sinking before our very eyes and his walkouts when the questioning gets tough are an obvious sign of that. Emma Alberici did her job will in that interview. The final line which Clive didn't stick around for was the most telling,



> EMMA ALBERICI: And if I had've had the opportunity, I was trying to make out - make the point that in these court documents it does say that Mr Palmer has attempted to pay back the money on three occasions.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-11-21/pup-would-like-lambie-to-stay-onboard/5907974

Meanwhile, the mess with Jacqui Lambie just gets worse,



> JACQUI Lambie claims someone has leaked details of a legal dispute with the Department of Veterans’ Affairs in a bid to damage her, as Clive Palmer called the rogue senator’s recent *behaviour “berserk”.
> 
> With Senator Lambie in Tasmania contemplating her political future, her spokesman told The Australian she had been the target of a dirty tricks campaign.
> 
> ...




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...lambie-goes-home/story-fn59niix-1227130126386


----------



## Calliope (21 November 2014)

Tisme said:


> Grist for the mill.  Clive didn't get to where he is by being subordinate to a party machine and news cycle like most profile politicians. He has smashed his way through and probably sees no reason to change.
> 
> 
> It was good sport, but Emma did take it too far IMO..... poor timing on this occasion.




It is not easy to interview a pathological liar. Emma did her best to expose him. I can't wait until they get him in court, where he will lie under oath.



> Understand what a pathological liar is. Basically, a pathological liar is someone who tells lies habitually, chronically and compulsively. It has simply become a way of life for this person, to make up things for a variety of reasons and eventually, the truth becomes uncomfortable while weaving whoppers feels right to them. This kind of lying tends to develop early on in life, often as a response to difficult home or school situations that seemed to resolve better if the child lied. It's a bad habit, not a manipulative trait––this is how to differentiate a pathological liar from a sociopath who does seek to manipulate.




http://www.wikihow.com/Spot-a-Pathological-Liar


----------



## Tisme (21 November 2014)

Calliope said:


> It is not easy to interview a pathological liar. Emma did her best to expose him. I can't wait until they get him in court, where he will lie under oath.
> 
> _Understand what a pathological liar is. Basically, a pathological liar is someone who tells lies habitually, chronically and compulsively. It has simply become a way of life for this person, to make up things for a variety of reasons and eventually, the truth becomes uncomfortable while weaving whoppers feels right to them. This kind of lying tends to develop early on in life, often as a response to difficult home or school situations that seemed to resolve better if the child lied. It's a bad habit, not a manipulative trait––this is how to differentiate a pathological liar from a sociopath who does seek to manipulate. _




I know it's easy pickings, but I have to say it ......... that sounds like so many politicians.


----------



## drsmith (21 November 2014)

PUP family album.

I'll start it off with happier times,


----------



## Calliope (21 November 2014)

Tisme said:


> I know it's easy pickings, but I have to say it ......... that sounds like so many politicians.




You criticise other politicians for lying to the electors, and yet Clive  told the biggest lie of all. He promised a Palmer *UNITED* Party The Party is of course a disUNITED rabble . But I suppose that is bound to happen when you try to clobber together a party of left-over dregs and Palmer hacks, and on whose election he spent milions of dollars of allegedly misapproprited funds.

To use your analogy, I think it is a big mistake to hitch your pony to the PUPs 

*The biggest lie from the biggest liar*


----------



## Julia (21 November 2014)

Calliope said:


> It is not easy to interview a pathological liar. Emma did her best to expose him. I can't wait until they get him in court, where he will lie under oath.



I have no time for Mr Palmer, but with respect to that part of the interview, I think maybe he had grounds to be irritated.  The Citic Pacific case is before the courts and surely we should all be prepared to await the outcome before persisting with questions on this.

Fair enough to have him on re the topical matter of Lambie and the general shambles of his party, but I don't think he has any obligation to be talked over so aggressively when he offers any sort of response.

(Above should not be considered conversion to liking anything about PUP or its founder.)


----------



## Tisme (21 November 2014)

Calliope said:


> You criticise other politicians for lying to the electors, and yet Clive  told the biggest lie of all.





Yes without fear nor favour. If I wanted to hear lies I could down to the nearest park where derelicts live and ask them what went wrong with their lives. I expect more from those that insist they are "honourable" and take money for being so.

I'm not too sure I was annoyed at Emma for overcooking it or that the show piece could have lasted a few more minutes.


----------



## explod (21 November 2014)

Tisme said:


> Yes without fear nor favour. If I wanted to hear lies I could down to the nearest park where derelicts live and ask them what went wrong with their lives. I expect more from those that insist they are "honourable" and take money for being so.
> 
> I'm not too sure I was annoyed at Emma for overcooking it or that the show piece could have lasted a few more minutes.




I used to pick up the so called derelects and put them in the can.  From your off hand aside you have no  idea of the social circumstances of the majority down on luck and most were very honest.


----------



## Calliope (21 November 2014)

Julia said:


> I have no time for Mr Palmer, but with respect to that part of the interview, I think maybe he had grounds to be irritated.  The Citic Pacific case is before the courts and surely we should all be prepared to await the outcome before persisting with questions on this.




Yeah yeah, I know...the old innocent until proven guilty argument. _The last refuge of the scoundrel! _He kept saying "I'm not interested". Another lie. He is a very interested party indeed. But as I said earlier it is futile for any interviewer to try to interview such a lying buffoon.



> Alberici questioned the billionaire over the alleged misappropriation of $12 million in funds.
> 
> "Look I'm not interested," he said in the Lateline interview.
> 
> ...





Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/20...of-abc-lateline-interview#JM2vhIASIZfYVW0L.99


----------



## drsmith (24 November 2014)

The conspiracy theories have started coming from uncle Clive as it as it appears Jacqui has her lawyer's clearance to leave PUP.



> THE fireworks between Jacqui Lambie and Clive Palmer continue, with the Palmer United Party leader accusing his Tasmanian senator of being used by someone to infiltrate his party.
> 
> SENATOR Lambie is expected to announce her split from PUP on Monday after taking advice from Tasmanian lawyer and poppy grower Glynn Williams.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ion-on-pup-split/story-fn3dxiwe-1227132522193


----------



## Calliope (24 November 2014)

Ms Lambie hadn't worked for 14 years before she took up with Palmer. She was on Disability Support Pension after discharge from the army with the ubiquitous back injury. The injury of course did not interfere with any of her activities.



> In a statement, Mr Palmer suggested that Senator Lambie, who got the DSP after being medically discharged from the army, may have collected the payment while getting a full-time wage from the PUP ahead of her election.
> 
> “The question remains: was she receiving disability payments from the commonwealth for being unable to work while receiving a full-time salary at the same time from the Palmer United Party?’’ he said.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...n-election-trail/story-fn59niix-1227132400807


----------



## noco (24 November 2014)

Lambie has made her decision to part company with the PUP.

Wonder what action Uncle Clive will take now?


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...mer-united-party/story-fnihslxi-1227132655927


----------



## Tisme (24 November 2014)

explod said:


> I used to pick up the so called derelects and put them in the can.  From your off hand aside you have no  idea of the social circumstances of the majority down on luck and most were very honest.





Oh yes I do and you know exactly what I asked (rhetorically) if you have indeed been a copper. My post wasn't a soapbox opportunity. You don't know me, but my money and resources most probably have touched your clients in some way.


----------



## IFocus (24 November 2014)

noco said:


> Lambie has made her decision to part company with the PUP.
> 
> Wonder what action Uncle Clive will take now?
> 
> ...





The actual problem will be for Abbott.....herding cats just got a lot harder with another lose cannon.


----------



## Tisme (24 November 2014)

IFocus said:


> The actual problem will be for Abbott.....herding cats just got a lot harder with another lose cannon.




Let the polls decide.

I think the public should be told the truth about our financial position by someone with merit (ABC fact check perhaps?) and then off to the polls we go.


All we have had for 14 months is spectre and pall of impending dire consequences if we don't do something quickly and people are getting exasperated at the lack of progress. The current mob promised us salvation, but the needle seems caught in the groove of behaving like the opposition rather the government. They can't even get past blaming everyone, including foreign leaders for their own paralysis. 

Where is the adventure gone that Bob Hawke started; the thrill of the uncertainty, the opportunity to take risks, the entrepreneurial have a go, the knowing there is a safety net if we fall trying?  Maybe it's all there, we just don't hear about it?


----------



## noco (25 November 2014)

The evidence which is starting to appear in the police investigation is not looking good for Palmer.

He could finish up being a second Alan Bond.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...133514462?sv=163b3527318ba5a651ed73a3a395183a


----------



## noco (26 November 2014)

The court hearing began today...Palmer believes he does not have to explain to the Chinese how he spent $12.6 million.

All he is doing is digging a deeper hole for himself.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...tical-fund-court/story-fnn8dlfs-1227135710243


----------



## noco (27 November 2014)

noco said:


> The court hearing began today...Palmer believes he does not have to explain to the Chinese how he spent $12.6 million.
> 
> All he is doing is digging a deeper hole for himself.
> 
> ...




This Clive Palmer is nothing more than a crook in every sense of the word.

He has accepted millions from 4 of his allied companies and hasn't declared the political donations.

I think Uncle Clive is very hot water in deed....Interesting times ahead.....his vindictiveness with the Queensland Government is all going to back fire on him big time.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...136270124?sv=fbd43d800dca964a1e7e5e7b36d5124b


----------



## noco (29 November 2014)

Palmers senate inquiry into allegations of corruption into the Newman Government in Queensland appears to have hit a brick wall.....it is an absolute farce and Palmer deserves everything that is coming to him.

He has now lost all three PUP representatives in the NT....He is now down to four including himself.  


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...to-hear-any-evil/story-fnn8dlfs-1227138871475

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...138926292?sv=c9a9f52a11219aaab22478d71d6afdbb


----------



## Calliope (5 December 2014)

Some Clive supporters think that journalists have no right to question him on the Citic civil case.



> CLIVE Palmer has told journalists to "stick it" after again being questioned about his business dealings.
> 
> THE Palmer United Party leader cut short a press conference in Canberra on Thursday when asked about his dispute with the state-owned Chinese company CITIC Pacific.
> 
> ...



http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...urnos-over-citic/story-fni0xqi3-1227144631392


----------



## Julia (5 December 2014)

Doesn't he have a valid point in this instance?  The issue is before the courts, and that's usually offered as a reason not to comment.


----------



## SirRumpole (5 December 2014)

Julia said:


> Doesn't he have a valid point in this instance?  The issue is before the courts, and that's usually offered as a reason not to comment.




He may be allowed to comment on a civil case, but it would be unwise to do so while the case was still going on in case something he said outside the court could be used against him.

What is particularly aggravating about Palmer is his rudeness, intolerance and arrogance. He could make it quite clear that he wasn't going to answer questions about a court case without telling the media to "stuff it". He has done this a number of times now and it's not a good look. 

Don't expect an ambassadorship for Clive anytime soon.


----------



## Julia (5 December 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Don't expect an ambassadorship for Clive anytime soon.



Indeed no.  If it all falls apart for Clive, an alternative career in the diplomatic service might not be on the cards.

The same could be said for his erstwhile senator, Ms Lambie, whose level of anger, obsession and irrationality seems to grow exponentially.


----------



## Calliope (5 December 2014)

Julia said:


> Doesn't he have a valid point in this instance?  The issue is before the courts, and that's usually offered as a reason not to comment.




If Clive has a valid point about anything I have yet to hear it. He thinks the CITIC case is part of a conspiracy against him by Rupert Murdoch working hand in glove with the Chinese government.

He said;



> “The coalition of News Limited (publisher of The Australian), the Liberal Party and the Chinese state-owned enterprise working in unison on these matters demonstrates a political agenda.”




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ops-are-after-me/story-fnk76wj3-1227134934083


----------



## noco (12 December 2014)

Uncle Clive has experienced another set back.....the way he is going, he will finish up in Alan Bond's old cell.




http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...153178619?sv=619fc97fd90011c5ef3bebc884bd0849


----------



## SirRumpole (19 December 2014)

Things are going from bad to worse for Clive

Should we judge him for the company he keeps, or give him the benefit of the doubt ?

Clive Palmer media adviser Andrew Crook charged over alleged kidnap of National Australia Bank executive



> Clive Palmer's media adviser and confidant Andrew Crook has been charged by Queensland Police over the alleged kidnapping of a National Australia Bank executive on an Indonesian island.
> 
> As part of the same operation, police from the state's anti-bikie taskforce arrested Mick Featherstone, a Gold Coast private investigator and former senior detective at the centre of a year-long probe by Queensland's Crime and Corruption Commission into money laundering and police corruption.
> 
> ...


----------



## noco (19 December 2014)

SirRumpole said:


> Things are going from bad to worse for Clive
> 
> Should we judge him for the company he keeps, or give him the benefit of the doubt ?
> 
> Clive Palmer media adviser Andrew Crook charged over alleged kidnap of National Australia Bank executive




Does Clive Palmer know how to make bullets?....if he does, then, he most likely gets someone else to fire them.


----------



## drsmith (18 January 2015)

We haven't seen much of uncle Clive lately and he won't be appearing at PUP's Queensland election campaign launch today according to the BCM.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...lection-campaign/story-fnr8vuu5-1227188509958

Flu is the reason given.


----------



## noco (13 March 2015)

drsmith said:


> We haven't seen much of uncle Clive lately and he won't be appearing at PUP's Queensland election campaign launch today according to the BCM.
> 
> http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...lection-campaign/story-fnr8vuu5-1227188509958
> 
> Flu is the reason given.




I think we will being seeing less of Clive since Lazarus has resigned and become an independent....If Clive is not already loco, he soon will be......He must have gigantic headache. 

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...mer-united-party/story-fnihsrf2-1227260745408


----------



## Tisme (13 March 2015)

Glen's wife gets the heaveho and Glen takes his bat and ball home


----------



## drsmith (13 March 2015)

All that's left for the Uncle Clive political movement now is his love and affection for the Chinese, and Dio Wang.

The question now is how long that will last.


----------



## noco (13 March 2015)

drsmith said:


> All that's left for the Uncle Clive political movement now is his love and affection for the Chinese, and Dio Wang.
> 
> The question now is how long that will last.




I am sure Campbell Newman will be laughing his head off...Palmer is getting his just desserts for his vindictive movement on the previous Newman government and it has cost him millions of dollars and all for what?


----------



## noco (1 April 2015)

Humpty Dumpty had a great fall and all the kings horse and all the kings men could not put Humpty together again.

His vindictiveness against the LNP has caused him so much heartache I am sure he must be wondering whether it has been all worth it....Now he is going to spend another couple of millions suing Lazareth and Lambie....I am shaking my head in disbelief.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...it-spent-on-them/story-fnihsrf2-1227287511554


----------



## Tisme (22 June 2015)

I'm not sure who the bigger nutter is:
http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2015/06/22/clive-palmer-breaks-every-rule-book/



> Multi-millionaire politician Clive Palmer has been chided by Speaker Bronwyn Bishop for the extraordinary feat of supposedly breaking every single rule in parliament pertaining to the asking of questions.
> 
> During Monday’s question time in the lower house, Mr Palmer attempted to quiz the Prime Minister about a mooted law to strip terror suspects of their Australian citizenship.
> 
> ...


----------



## drsmith (13 October 2015)

Is he now on the way to going broko ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-...siders-lending-25m-to-palmers-company/6850918


----------



## sptrawler (25 November 2015)

drsmith said:


> Is he now on the way to going broko ?
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-10-...siders-lending-25m-to-palmers-company/6850918




You may have called it right doc.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-for-some-cash/story-e6frg6z6-1227599491148

Maybe, that was the reason to jump on the 'gravy train'. Who knows?


----------



## Tisme (25 November 2015)

sptrawler said:


> You may have called it right doc.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-for-some-cash/story-e6frg6z6-1227599491148
> 
> Maybe, that was the reason to jump on the 'gravy train'. Who knows?





I doubt Clive would go broke ..... maybe do an Alan Bond and salt away a healthy few millions then play pauper for a few years.

He's apparently not getting all the royalties owed from Citec because one of the benchmarks used no longer exists.


----------



## drsmith (25 November 2015)

sptrawler said:


> You may have called it right doc.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...sh-for-some-cash/story-e6frg6z6-1227599491148
> 
> Maybe, that was the reason to jump on the 'gravy train'. Who knows?



That specific story sounds like a legal ploy for money to me more than imminent financial demise.

Tis,
I also think Clive will manage to look after himself should everything else go pear shaped. Defense of the bunker would have to be front and centre on his legal team brief.


----------



## Tisme (25 November 2015)

Back on the attack:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...-over-james-ashby-affair-20151125-gl7qq7.html

Mal Brough is under renewed pressure to explain his role in the torrid Peter Slipper affair, with Labor escalating its attack and Clive Palmer reviving sensational claims the Special Minister of State asked him to fund a $200,000 legal case to "destroy" his political rival.

Mr Palmer was a long-time member of and major political donor to the Liberal National Party before he quit in protest and formed the Palmer United Party.

Under parliamentary privilege, Mr Palmer told the House of Representatives on Wednesday that Mr Brough asked him in April 2012 to fund Mr Ashby's legal case, which he said to he understood to be worth around $200,000. 


"The current member for Fisher at the meeting requested I fund the legal costs of Mr Ashby and while no exact figure was discussed with the member for Fisher, who later ran against Mr Slipper in Fisher, I understood the cost would be at least $200,000," Mr Palmer said.

"The member for Fisher stated to me that we needed to destroy Peter Slipper."

"I refused the request from the member for Fisher, I did not think it was appropriate then and I don't think it is now that a person funds another person's legal action, designed to cause a third party's demise for political reasons."

It is not the first time Mr Palmer has made the claim and Mr Brough has in the past denied asking Mr Palmer to help bring down Mr Slipper.

But the case is back in the spotlight after the Australian Federal Police recently raided the homes of Mr Brough and James Ashby. Mr Ashby was a former political aide to Mr Slipper and accused the former speaker of sexual harassment. Police are investigating whether any criminal offence occurred when Mr Brough said in a media interview that he urged Mr Ashby to make copies of Mr Slipper's diary, which were leaked to the media.

Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull elevated the Member for Fisher from the backbench to the senior ministry after toppling Tony Abbott in September. Mr Brough was one of Mr Turnbull's key backers. 
Comment is being sought from Mr Brough.

Mr Palmer spoke in support of a Labor-instigated Matter of Public Importance debate after question time.
Shadow attorney-general Mark Dreyfus also used the debate to question Mr Turnbull's judgment in appointing Mr Brough as Special Minister of State.

"Australians are meant to accept that a man who is by his own admission under investigation by the Australian Federal Police for criminal wrongdoing is fit to set standards for propriety in public office,' Mr Dreyfus said.
"And this is not just about the member for Fisher, the man who we can now see would do anything to advance his own interests, to realise his ambitions and to return to the Parliament.
"No, this is about the judgment of the man who has fulfilled those ambitions – the new Prime Minister
"This is about the judgment of a prime minister who appoints as his minister for government integrity a discredited figure over whom loom allegations of serious misconduct.
"The judgment of a Prime Minister who stands by the member for Fisher even after he has been raided by the Australian Federal Police, even as the Australian Federal Police are considering charges against him."


----------



## noco (5 December 2015)

I cannot believe how self opinionated and self interested this Palmer guy is to destroy the LNP  because he could not get his own way in a mining venture in Queensland....He had no interest in the welfare of Queensland and hope he gets all he deserves.

His Nickel Refinery in Townsville is close to collapse and the Queensland government want to bail him out for the simple reason of how it could affect the economy of Townsville and the loss of some 600 to 1000 jobs.

I would suggest to the Queensland Government if they do bail out this wind bag they should have Palmer commit to a back up of one or more of his assets and if he defaults then sell those assets under his nose but knowing the Labor run Queensland government, I doubt if there is any brain in the Party who would think of that. 

He has a closed tourist resort on the Sunshine Coast sitting there in moth balls......He should be forced to sell up and throw the money into the Nickel Refinery.

Next Monday is crunch time for the refinery.. 






http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...ught-us-down-campbell-newman/story-fn59niix-1


----------



## drsmith (5 December 2015)

Any government bailing out uncle Clive is about as sensible as boarding the Titanic after it's hit the iceberg.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/mini...on-clive-palmer-refinery-20151202-gle1dr.html


----------



## noco (7 December 2015)

Is "Humpty Dumpty" headed for a great fall?

The Townsville nickel refinery is only hours away from the verge of collapse......The Labor state government and the Labor Mayor of Townsville are both running around like chooks with their heads chopped off.

He has had three offers to buy his Sunshine Coast resort and is refusing to sell....Maybe he would like to close the refinery for fear of an environmental disaster with the tailing ponds for if they overflow in the wet season it could cost him millions more.. 


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...e-in-worse-than-perilous-position/story-e6frg

*Clive Palmer is just hours away from putting his Townsville nickel refinery into administration and sacking 776 workers.

The Western Australian Supreme Court heard today that Mr Palmer would take the drastic action unless the court ordered China’s Citic to pay it $US48 million by 4.30pm Perth time.

Mr Palmer’s flagship company Mineralogy is seeking an urgent order from the court for Citic to pay an interim amount of disputed royalties from the Sino Iron project in WA.

The court heard today that five Australian banks all knocked back Mr Palmer for loans to keep his Queensland Nickel refinery afloat, despite the company’s official accounts valuing its assets at $1.9b and its debts at just $23m.

Commonwealth, Westpac, ANZ, NAB and Suncorp all refused to loan money to the struggling refinery, Mr Palmer’s lawyer said, while lawyers for Citic produced evidence from one of the banks in which the institution recommended Mr Palmer personally step in to provide funding to the refinery.

Mr Palmer was in court this morning to hear his own lawyer, Simon Couper QC, describe Mr Palmer’s business empire as in a “worse than perilous” financial position.

Mr Couper QC said that unless the court ordered China’s Citic to pay $US48m today, there would be major ramifications for Mr Palmer and his business interests.

“Queensland Nickel is in a situation where unless it receives $28m, (Queensland Nickel managing director Clive) Mensink has formed the rational view that the administrators have to come in,” Mr Couper said.

The Townsville refinery employs 776 people.

In addition, Mr Couper said Mr Palmer’s private company Mineralogy would struggle to continue paying its lawyers and its subsidiaries may lose coal tenements in Queensland.

“If money is not paid, Queensland Nickel’s position is worse than perilous and Mineralogy’s prospects of continuing litigation and maintaining valuable assets in its subsidiaries are seriously out at risk to say the least,” Mr Couper said.

While Mr Palmer has regularly described himself as a billionaire, the court heard today that Mineralogy brought in just $4m in revenue last year against spending of $29 million.

The lawyer representing Citic, Charles Scerri QC, said it was an “absurd proposition” that Citic should pay money to keep Queensland Nickel afloat given it was unrelated to the dispute between Citic and Mineralogy.

Mr Scerri also noted that Citic had paid Mr Palmer $US415m in 2006 so should have been in a position to support Queensland Nickel if he wanted.

“The only reason we are talking about Queensland Nickel is because the only shareholder of Queensland Nickel (Mr Palmer) has chosen not to support it and wants Citic to support it instead,” Mr Scerri said.

Citic and Mineralogy have been in a long running dispute over how to calculate a royalty payable to Mineralogy from Citic’s Sino Iron project. The formula relied on the now-defunct annual benchmark iron ore pricing mechanism.

Mr Scerri noted that the royalties agreement between Citic and Mineralogy did not include any cause for interim royalty payments in the event of a dispute, as was common in many other similar agreements.

The judge hearing the case, Justice Paul Tottle, has promised to deliver a decision by 4.30pm Perth time.

*


----------



## drsmith (7 December 2015)

The Clive-size question is when it's real and not another bluff,



> CITIC's lawyer Charles Scerri questioned that urgency, arguing that the previous "drop dead date" for Queensland Nickel had been Friday, but that had been miraculously extended until Tuesday.
> 
> Justice Paul Tottle also questioned why the company's director had not taken other steps to avoid administration, instead arguing if the money was not paid, he would "shut up shop, sack everybody and close the refinery".
> 
> "It seems a very dramatic step without considering... other options apart from bank finance," Justice Tottle said.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-12-07/clive-palmer-queensland-nickel-worse-than-perilous/7007628


----------



## noco (7 December 2015)

drsmith said:


> The Clive-size question is when it's real and not another bluff,
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-12-07/clive-palmer-queensland-nickel-worse-than-perilous/7007628




I would not trust him as far as I could throw and that would take some doing.

He has plenty of assets to sell to enable him to keep the refinery open but as I said before, IMHO he wants to close it down for fear of an environment hazard which could take place during the wet season.......The State Government has been at him for years to do something about it. ....This financial crisis It is just an excuse.


----------



## drsmith (7 December 2015)

Bluff or not, the judge has, unsurprisingly, called it.



noco said:


> Hundreds of jobs at Queensland Nickel's Townsville refinery could be lost after a West Australian judge dismissed Clive Palmer's bid for $US48 million from his estranged Chinese business partner, CITIC Pacific.
> 
> Earlier today, the WA Supreme Court heard that unless that bid was successful, Queensland Nickel would go into administration tomorrow.
> 
> In handing down his findings, Justice Paul Tottle said the application was "highly unusual" because Mineralogy was seeking a payment in a dispute which had not been through the court process.




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-12-07/clive-palmer-queensland-nickel-worse-than-perilous/7007628


----------



## noco (8 December 2015)

drsmith said:


> Bluff or not, the judge has, unsurprisingly, called it.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-12-07/clive-palmer-queensland-nickel-worse-than-perilous/7007628




Doc, his chickens are now coming home to roost......He deserves all he gets.

Even if he closes the nickel refinery there could still be an environmental disaster waiting to happen if we have a big wet season in the north and who will pay for the clean up?????

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...50d91aff3?sv=aaa712cc30264d2494d42e5d43b35bb5

*Clive Palmer’s nickel refinery has been accused of recklessly breaking environmental rules and *allowing a dam full of contaminated water to overflow during a cyclone last year.

Queensland Nickel is being prosecuted in Townsville Magistrates Court for wilfully breaching its environmental auth*ority at its north Queensland site.

The court case could not come at a worse time for Mr Palmer and his cash-strapped refinery, which was bracing last night for hundreds of job losses.

Jeff Hunter QC, for Queensland’s Department of *Environ*ment and Heritage Protection, yesterday told a committal hearing the company allegedly poorly managed a tailings dam containing wastewater for months, recklessly taking risks ahead of the 2013-14 wet season. No environmental damage was caused, but the spill into an effluent pond in April 2014 was “specifically prohibited” by the government-*issued envi*ron*mental authority and should never have occurred.

Mr Palmer met departmental officials as early as September 2012 to discuss water management at the site, but by the end of 2013, the court heard, there were still problems with the tailings dam.

A byproduct of the refinery is water contaminated with chemicals and fine particles. The wastewater is kept in a tailings dam, which must have enough capacity to cope with heavy wet seasons.

In February last year, Cyclone Dylan hit Townsville, bringing 200mm of rain and filling the tailings dam. The company reported the problem to the department. In April, Cyclone Ita hit. The tailings dam overflowed into the effluent pond, releasing up to 21 megalitres each day. “It’s simply a breach of the environmental authority,” Mr Hunter said.

The company installed large fans to help evaporate the waste*water, a measure Mr Hunter said should have been taken much *earlier to prevent the spill in the first place. He said two cyclones in such proximity was not unheard of for a wet season in north Queensland.

Queensland Nickel is fighting the charges. It is expected to argue the overflow was inevitable after two cyclones in the 2013-14 wet season. The hearing continues.

*


----------



## noco (8 December 2015)

This wind bag is as corrupt as the unions.

He won't accept a loan from the state government, he won't sell his assets to save the refinery and he does not care about his workers......He is using a wedge to close the place down and it is not only a financial loss being incurred but  the millions he will have to spend on the taillings dam....So close the place down which means less polluted water goes in with the hope the hot weather will evaporate the dams to a lower level to cope with a wet season.

OMG what sort of a person is this bloke? 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...t/news-story/6868a8888b4a013e9c700a2f8934770c


----------



## noco (9 December 2015)

What a nasty character this Palmer has turned out to be with his business and political saga.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...d/news-story/23849ee9d714916de57ed182e3cecc85

*Unfortunately for taxpayers and for those relying on Mr Palmer for their livelihoods, the “billionaire’’ has received minimal scrutiny from much of the supposedly serious media. The ABC, where his syrupy chats with Tony Jones were based on mutual antagonism towards Tony Abbott, has only recently paid any serious attention to Australia’s very own Silvio Berlusconi. The Australian Financial Review and its Fairfax Media brethren have been all but missing in action.

Any objective assessment of Mr Palmer’s record would conclude that his capricious and sometimes duplicitous conduct in business and politics has taken an incalculable toll on the federal budget, the Queensland budget, university finances, relations with China, good government in general, Sunshine Coast tourism, Coolum property owners and many others. Yesterday, he whinged that the Queensland government had refused to support Queensland Nickel. It needed to be at the forefront of supporting the people of Townsville, he said. By supporting him. Taxpayer largesse, however, has its limits.*


----------



## noco (9 December 2015)

Another day has passed and still no settlement on what is happening with Th Nickel Refinery in Townsville.

Palmer is trying to wedge the Government for financial assistance and I think they have called his bluff.

As a private investor he should be compelled to sell off some of his other assets to save 1600 jobs.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...r/news-story/157bb0171c8dd398ee8ad4183968572f


----------



## noco (10 December 2015)

As mentioned previously, the QN refinery is an environmental hazard waiting to happen and because Palmer has not acted on some rectification he is now being sued by the appropriate authorities.....The residue  ponds are rich in iron ore which could be recovered at a reasonable cost so I am told......
This hazard has been an ongoing problem for years and Palmer has done nothing about it.
He used $15 million of QN finances for his dash to parliament. 

https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/30317866/palmers-qld-nickel-to-face-trial/


----------



## noco (10 December 2015)

More financial information on Palmer's QN refinery....the QN money he has wasted would have been enough to see him through this tight squeeze until a recovery in the nickel price. 

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...t/news-story/960d426deba473babf59f494b250b8cb

*The sale agreement, obtained by The Australian, show that Queensland Nickel came into Mr Palmer’s hands with $US40m in working reserves.

However, Mr Palmer overcame the contractual restrictions to spend tens of millions of dollars of the Townsville refinery’s working capital on golf courses on the Gold Coast, buying the Hyatt *Regency resort at Coolum (now a defunct dinosaur park), a wedding venue, luxury cars and a coal tenement.

Last financial year, the refinery company “forgave” $38.3m in loans made to other entities controlled by Mr Palmer. While $27.6m was shifted from Mineralogy to Queensland Nickel in 2013 to help it navigate a weak market, Mr Palmer no longer has the ability to draw funds from elsewhere. The days of lavishing employees with overseas holidays and Mercedes-Benz cars as Christmas bonuses are long gone.

“Due to the current nickel price being lower than QN’s cost of production, QN can only sustain itself by external cash injections. Mineralogy is not in a financial position to make such *financial injections in the future,” Mr Wolfe, who is also the chief *financial controller for Mr Palmer’s other companies, including Mineralogy, said in his affidavit.

There is also little prospect of relief from a recovery in nickel prices. If the latest nickel price forecasts from investment bank Goldman Sachs are accurate, Queensland Nickel may be years away from returning to profit.

That helps explain the reluctance of the Commonwealth, Westpac, ANZ and NAB banks, plus Queensland’s Suncorp, to loan money to Queensland Nickel. It may also explain the reluctance of Mr Palmer to step in with funding from his own pockets, if indeed he actually has that sort of money to spend.

While the problems at Queensland Nickel can be condensed down to the weakness in nickel prices, the business’s situation has not been helped by its links to Mr Palmer’s other interests. As WA Supreme Court judge Paul Tottle noted in his judgment on Monday rejecting Mineralogy’s grab for cash, Queensland Nickel was deemed sufficiently profitable as recently as the 2014 financial year to donate more than $15m to the Palmer United Party.

While the problems are real, there does appear to be an *element of brinkmanship at play.*


----------



## noco (12 December 2015)

Palmer's bluff has be called by the state government and the banks and the refinery is still open for business.....If 
he is not prepared to open his books and make a disclosure, then he has something to hide.
I believe he has the cash but he would sooner sacrifice 16oo jobs to save him having to spend millions of dollars fixing the tailing dams which could well turn into an environmental disaster early in 2016.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...f/news-story/443f0752a31dd75aa92b918bd0d9c9bb


----------



## qldfrog (12 December 2015)

noco said:


> Palmer's bluff has be called by the state government and the banks and the refinery is still open for business.....If
> he is not prepared to open his books and make a disclosure, then he has something to hide.
> I believe he has the cash but he would sooner sacrifice 16oo jobs to save him having to spend millions of dollars fixing the tailing dams which could well turn into an environmental disaster early in 2016.
> 
> http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...f/news-story/443f0752a31dd75aa92b918bd0d9c9bb




Indeed by having qld government money, he would have made an ally in the coming disaster toward the end of the rainy season or the first cyclones
will give a new dimension to Saving the great barrier reef, in the meantimes, the greens aka watermelons care about  illegal immigrants...
Who is to speak in the name of Australia: the land, the environment, its people???


----------



## noco (12 December 2015)

Who would want to change to be the shoes of Clive Palmer?

The man has been a complete fool who has made lots of money in good times but does not know how to handle the bad times.

The rot set him with his revenge on the Newman Government and topped off by low commodity prices.

IMHO his PUP will also be short lived after the next election......He will be left with one senator and no seat for himslelf in the lower house.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...l/news-story/2d0046e4d59e3ddccbf93425a7f3e3bb


----------



## qldfrog (12 December 2015)

noco said:


> Who would want to change to be the shoes of Clive Palmer?




pick me pick me, seriously, however he fails with QNI, he will always have more left than I will ever have, and he still has the ability to influence, give me his assets and name and this country would change for the better, but Luutzu woiuld be unhappy!


----------



## noco (13 December 2015)

Palmer has been caught out......here we have a refinery which was supposed to close last Monday and is now still operating....


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opi...y/news-story/8a094a901fe6c8c07c3f2fbcef98ff99


----------



## noco (16 December 2015)

Poor old Clive has graciously dipped into his own pocket to save the jobs at his nickel refinery in Townsville...What a wonderful gesture by this con man.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...s/news-story/c16488ee79599ac3ae62b6ec66ea1f90

*Workers at Clive Palmer’s Queensland Nickel refinery have been told “it’s business as usual” *despite mounting evidence to the contrary.

There was confusion at the Yabulu refinery near Townsville yesterday as rumours of an “imminent” closure announcement *coincided with the release of a letter from Queensland Nickel managing director Clive Mensink suggesting there was no cause for alarm.

In the letter, workers were told Mr Palmer had dipped into his personal funds and made available $2.4 million to ensure staff received their Christmas wages and the company continued to operate. It went on to describe media reports about last week’s West Australian court case, in which a judge dismissed Mr Palmer’s bid for $US48m from his estranged business partner Citic Pacific, as “highly misleading”.

“Mineralogy urgently sought some payment so it could be provided to Queensland Nickel. The judge in the case did not think that the prejudice of you losing your job was a good enough reason to deal with the matter before trial and *decided to let the Chinese continue to take the concentrate from Mineralogy leases and not pay for it,” the letter read.

“The injustice of the current situation is deplorable and I want you to know your management team is working around the clock to find a solution.”

Workers had allegedly been warned by senior staff to expect bad news as early as yesterday afternoon but by last night word had spread of a reprieve for at least another week. Australian Workers Union northern district secretary Rod “Cowboy” Stockham said workers were sick of being drip-fed information and called on Queensland Nickel to “say it how it is”.

“If the purpose of the letter was to say ‘Don’t panic’, it has not achieved its goal,” he said. “But I am hopeful that the company will trade out of this glut.

“If there is still hope and they need more time, just come out and say so to the troops, but everyone is still on tenterhooks and we need to know what’s going on.”

*


----------



## drsmith (16 December 2015)

noco said:


> Poor old Clive has graciously dipped into his own pocket to save the jobs at his nickel refinery in Townsville...What a wonderful gesture by this con man.



The question now is how long he can (or is willing) to sustain that.


----------



## noco (16 December 2015)

drsmith said:


> The question now is how long he can (or is willing) to sustain that.




I am not sure Doc.....his biggest worry is those tailing dams.....As I keep saying, it is a disaster waiting to happen...It is going to cost him millions to rectify and I believe this is what he is trying to avoid....He has been putting it off since he bought the place and this why the state government is suing him to do something about it.

It was bad enough before he bought the refinery when BHP owned it at which time something should have been executed then.....BHP knew about it and then sold the worry to Palmer...I don't believe Palmer realized the real hazard that was looming....He was caught napping.


----------



## -Bevo- (16 December 2015)

Noco I'm in Townsville also not sure what rumors you have heard some people are telling me
Clive wants to close the plant and if some of the articles that its costing 2 million a month just
to keep running are true Im sure it will close my guess is after New year.
The staff would have to know or at least the smart ones are shipments of ore still being
delivered to the port?
My guess is those tailing dams contain metals that would be worth $$ so even if it does close
there would still be a small workforce there for sometime.


----------



## noco (16 December 2015)

-Bevo- said:


> Noco I'm in Townsville also not sure what rumors you have heard some people are telling me
> Clive wants to close the plant and if some of the articles that its costing 2 million a month just
> to keep running are true Im sure it will close my guess is after New year.
> The staff would have to know or at least the smart ones are shipments of ore still being
> ...




The dams are rich in iron ore.

I don't know when the court case comes up.....maybe he is trying quit while he is in front and let someone else worry about it.....I think he is caught up in his own web.

But Geez...what is $2 million a month to him...it is peanuts....He keeps saying things will come good by mid 2016.


----------



## drsmith (18 January 2016)

With over 200 in job losses at QN and the company itself now in voluntary administration, is this the beginning of the end for the uncle Clive show ?


----------



## noco (18 January 2016)

drsmith said:


> With over 200 in job losses at QN and the company itself now in voluntary administration, is this the beginning of the end for the uncle Clive show ?




Doc, I would not like to predict the future of QN or even that of Clive Palmer......Come what may I hope he gets all that is coming to him because he stuffed up Queensland politics by his revenge on Newman and in turn allowed the useless Labor Party and "Ms half a million a year" Premier Anatazia Palazczuk to stuff up Queensland even more.  

I feel sorry for the workers who are caught up in Palmer's tangled web.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...n/news-story/fe5cf501b4ab43bae45209cbb5bc3622


----------



## Glen48 (18 January 2016)

looks like we can now add Masters 7K staff to the car manufactures going out the door...


----------



## noco (18 January 2016)

Glen48 said:


> looks like we can now add Masters 7K staff to the car manufactures going out the door...



 Glen, who is Masters? 

And what is the relevance of Palmer and the car manufacturers?


----------



## Tisme (18 January 2016)

Glen48 said:


> looks like we can now add Masters 7K staff to the car manufactures going out the door...




Shame, because I liked shopping at Masters.


----------



## SirRumpole (18 January 2016)

Tisme said:


> Shame, because I liked shopping at Masters.




They are unknown in my area.

Bunnings and Mitre10 are about it.

for noco (read the ABC mate  )

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-18/woolworths-to-exit-masters-hardware/7094858


----------



## noco (18 January 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> They are unknown in my area.
> 
> Bunnings and Mitre10 are about it.
> 
> ...




Thanks for that Rumpy.

They are not up here in our neck of the woods and that is why I have never heard of them.:topic


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## noco (21 January 2016)

The way things are turning out for Clive Palmer, he may finish up like Allan Bond....Palmer is up to all the mischief he can find.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...
Mr Palmer’s office did not return calls.[/B]


----------



## noco (21 January 2016)

Palmer has. appointed his wife as director of mineralogy......But check out the cost to clean up QNI which may eventually have to be paid by the tax payers.

I have always maintained Palmer wants to wriggle out cleaning up the tailing dams which are so toxic and an environmental  hazard.  

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-21/clive-palmer-wife-appointed-director-of-mineralogy/7103320
*
The wife of federal MP Clive Palmer has replaced his nephew as director of his flagship mining company Mineralogy.

Documents lodged with the Australian Securities and Investments Commission (ASIC) show Anna Palmer was appointed director and secretary of the company two weeks ago.

She replaced Clive Mensink, who is the director of Mr Palmer's troubled Queensland Nickel.

The change occurred 10 days before Queensland Nickel went into voluntary administration, citing low nickel prices and the Queensland Government's refusal to guarantee a $35 million loan.

That announcement came days after the company sacked 237 workers.

Mr Palmer has reportedly sent a letter to his former employees apologising for the redundancies.

On Wednesday, the Federal Government offered $500,000 to help the sacked workers find new work.

If the company cannot trade its way out of voluntary administration, taxpayers could also be forced to stump up tens of millions of dollars to clean up the site at Yabulu.

While Queensland Government sources have claimed the process could cost up to $40 million, the Queensland Opposition has said the clean up bill could be "upwards of $300 million".[/U*]


----------



## noco (27 January 2016)

Palmer owes a mate of mine who was retrenched last week, $125,000 and the poor bugger says it looks like he will be whistling for it......He does not expect to a dime from Palmer.



http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...s/news-story/1df49b74bc7923ecb9d9ceea285d5ddc

*Clive Palmer has declared he has no personal responsibility for paying redundancy entitlements to the 237 workers sacked from his nickel refinery, and has denied using the alias Terry Smith.

At his first public appearance since the mass job cuts, the Fairfax MP preached a message of compassion, love and respect for his fellow man at a citizenship ceremony in his Sunshine Coast electorate to welcome 22 new Australians.

Offstage it was a different story, as Mr Palmer sweated, blustered and angrily mocked questions from The Australian about the operation of his troubled Townsville refinery, which sank into voluntary adminis*tration last week.

Asked whether he would dig into his personal wealth to ensure workers were paid their severance packages, the self-*proclaimed billionaire snapped.

“Well, of course I have no personal responsibility,” Mr Palmer said. “I retired from business over three years ago. Of the 22,000 workers who were sacked in Queensland and lost their jobs, none of the shareholders of any of those companies put up a cent.”

However, The Australian has evidence Mr Palmer, using an email address in the name “Terry Smith”, secretly ran the refinery and was responsible for approving expenditure at the plant between 2013 and last year — including when he was not formally registered as a director. Yesterday, Mr Palmer flatly denied using the Terry Smith moniker, and dodged questions about signing off on refinery spending.*


----------



## Tisme (27 January 2016)

noco said:


> Palmer owes a mate of mine who was retrenched last week, $125,000 and the poor bugger says it looks like he will be whistling for it......He does not expect to a dime from Palmer.




Same bloke who carries the LNP DNA? here

he's a living national treasure: here


----------



## SirRumpole (27 January 2016)

Tisme said:


> Same bloke who carries the LNP DNA? here
> 
> he's a living national treasure: here




Good to know you read the Green Left weeky Tisme, noco will be pleased.


----------



## Tisme (27 January 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> Good to know you read the Green Left weeky Tisme, noco will be pleased.




Cool


----------



## SirRumpole (27 January 2016)

Queensland Nickel: Clive Palmer 'could be liable' if he acted as QNI 'shadow director', lawyer says



> Clive Palmer could be held personally liable and face a hefty compensation payout if he is found to have operated Queensland Nickel as "shadow director" while the company was insolvent.
> Key points
> 
> Palmer says he did not covertly keep running the refinery after becoming an MP
> ...




His political brand would appear to be so damaged that I doubt whether he has a chance of being re-elected, if he runs.


----------



## noco (27 January 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> Queensland Nickel: Clive Palmer 'could be liable' if he acted as QNI 'shadow director', lawyer says
> 
> 
> 
> His political brand would appear to be so damaged that I doubt whether he has a chance of being re-elected, if he runs.




One thing for sure is will never become life member or even  member of the Liberal Party ever again.....He will be banned for life.


----------



## drsmith (27 January 2016)

Already political charcoal.

From Monday this week,



> A Galaxy poll published by NewsCorp on Monday showed the cutting of jobs at his Townsville nickel refinery have encouraged voters to abandon the Palmer United Party leader.
> 
> Mr Palmer's support in his seat of Fairfax is now sitting at just 2%, according to Galaxy, down from 26.5% when he won the seat in the 2013 election on preferences.




http://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.a...ces-devastating-defeat-support-crumb/2908935/


----------



## wayneL (27 January 2016)

Naming a party after yourself - the political narcissistic kiss of death... always only a matter of time. 

Is this an Australian phenomenon? Hansen, Palmer, Katter?


----------



## drsmith (27 January 2016)

The alternative when the electorate is increasingly dissatisfied with the major parties.

Pauline and Clive are genuine failures all be it for different reasons. 

Pauline was just a front with others pulling the strings. Essentially not smart enough. Clive is smarter but obviously has a particular leadership style and is essentially a snake oil salesman, even by politician standards. It was always an interesting question as to why a so-called billionaire would enter politics.

Next up to the plate is Nick Xenophon. He's not a Queenslander.


----------



## noco (27 January 2016)

drsmith said:


> The alternative when the electorate is increasingly dissatisfied with the major parties.
> 
> Pauline and Clive are genuine failures all be it for different reasons.
> 
> ...




He entered politics for revenge on Newman and his dislike for Tony Abbott....All be it an expensive exercise.

Xenophone is a cagey independent senator who wants to start his own party...He will realize soon enough when he involves other people that it ain't so easy.


----------



## Tisme (28 January 2016)

Albeit he has a way to go before his tenure is up here


----------



## SirRumpole (28 January 2016)

Tisme said:


> Albeit he has a way to go before his tenure is up here




I suppose the question is what deals will he try to get through for his own benefit before he gets thrown out.

Support for a GST in return for a bailout package for QLD Nickel  perhaps.


----------



## noco (28 January 2016)

Palmer is up to more tricks just 4 days before he called in the administrators for QN.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...-demand-hits-clive-palmers-250m-rescue-plan/n

*Weak global demand for coal is likely to undermine Clive Palmer’s alleged $250 million rescue package for his Queensland Nickel refinery, which could see his Galilee Basin coal tenements put up for sale.

The operating company for the federal MP’s Townsville nickel refinery collapsed into voluntary administra*tion last week, days after it sacked 237 workers.

Administrators are combing through the finances of Mr Palmer’s complex web of companies and will hold the first creditors’ meeting in Townsville tomorrow.

Two of Mr Palmer’s companies — Waratah Coal and China First, which have exploration permits over coal tenements in central Queensland’s Galilee Basin — became secured creditors of Queensland Nickel four days before it collapsed.

Insolvency experts said the move could be interpreted as an attempt by the Palmer companies to leap the creditors’ queue.

But The Australian under*stands Mr Palmer has told *administrators the two companies’ coal holdings are valued at $250m, and could be sold or used as security for a bank loan to help keep the refinery afloat.

Waratah Coal holds 14 granted exploration permits for coal in the Galilee, and unapproved applicat*ions for two mineral devel*opment licences and two mining leases.

Yet a senior operator in the Queensland coal industry told The Australian there was no way that Mr Palmer’s Galilee Basin coal exploration permits could generate $250m, given the depresse*d coal price.

“It’s a stretch,” the coal executive said. “The coal price has been hammered and you can pick up assets cheaply, even producing assets, rather than development assets that require a lot of resources to get off the ground. In a better market, they might fetch that much or more. But not now.”

He also said it was unlikely banks would offer finance using coal deposits — rather than a producing mine — as security.

An affidavit sworn by Queensland Nickel chief financial officer Daren Wolfe in the Federal Court in Western Australian late last year revealed that Waratah Coal’s financial situation was parlous*.

Waratah Coal had little more than $21,000 in cash in the bank in October and had brought in only $2441 in revenue in the 2014-15 financial year. Mr Wolfe said it was struggling to meet the minimum spending commitment of about $4m required* to keep the coal tenements in Mr Palmer’s control.

But The Australian under***sta*nds the threshold is less than $1m, and Waratah Coal is on track to meet the commitment.

*


----------



## noco (30 January 2016)

Palmer is a shroud customer indeed........I have stated on a few occasions the real reason Palmer wants to place QNI into voluntary liquidation is to avoid the environmental  clean up of the tailing dams which is estimated to cost between $40 and $300 million plus some $70 million which will be owed to ex employees......Add to all that to what he owes to the creditors....This bloke could walk away from the lot and not lose a razoo and has it legally covered.

The state government had commenced a court case against  Palmer to fix the tailing dams....I guess that will be now put on ice. 

It is so wrong.



https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/30681566/queensland-nickel-creditors-to-meet/


----------



## SirRumpole (30 January 2016)

noco said:


> It is so wrong.




Yep, I agree.

As wrong as Campbell Newman giving his mining company mates immunity from prosecution.


----------



## Tisme (30 January 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> Yep, I agree.
> 
> As wrong as Campbell Newman giving his mining company mates immunity from prosecution.




You don't mean the ~$1m Sibelco Australia Limited gave Campbell as campaign funding so they could get a $1.5bn windfall in sand mining revenue was actually questionable?


----------



## SirRumpole (30 January 2016)

Tisme said:


> You don't mean the ~$1m Sibelco Australia Limited gave Campbell as campaign funding so they could get a $1.5bn windfall in sand mining revenue was actually questionable?




Perish the thought


----------



## noco (17 February 2016)

From the report on the investigations into Queensland Nickel, it is little wonder Uncle Clive would like to see the refinery go down the gurgler....

The maintenance required on the plant is enormous and he has no intentions of implementing any plan......The plant is now 45 years old and has well and truly passed it's use by date.

I fear some worker/workers may be in danger of fatal injuries..

My friend, who was one of the maintenance  men retrenched, told me the plant is in one chaotic mess.....He often suffered from excessive ammonia intake due to faulty equipment.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...l/news-story/b4d776d2cdda3e0dcd2e9416eb703232

*Administrators at Clive Palmer’s Queensland Nickel are trawling through a daunting list of overdue maintenance requests engineers say could expose the company to costs of more than $30 million and ultimately decide the future of the troubled Yabulu refinery.

An explosion in one of the *refinery’s 12 nickel roasters early yesterday has fuelled speculation that mass sackings had translated into a drop in safety standards.

While it soon became clear the minor explosion was the result of gas build up in a roaster that had been out of use for a number of weeks due to declining nickel *production, leaked documents *revealed the refinery remained exposed to potentially greater safety risks.*


----------



## noco (2 March 2016)

The state of the future of Queensland Nickel is looking really grim and it is inevitable the refinery will fold in the next couple of months unless there is a cash injection.

It has been banded around that the refinery needs some $30,000,000 to  $300,000.000 to bring it up to scratch.....If it was accessed as the lower amount I have heard the remaining employees could take over the works which would amount to just $5,500 each.....Just how the legal side would work if the refinery was put into moth balls I am not sure......If Palmer defaults with creditors, the creditors will carry the can and the already retrenched workers would receive nothing from Palmer but may still be entitled to some remuneration from the government.

I am not sure where it will all end up. 

https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/30990849/nickel-refinery-needs-cash-now-fti/


----------



## noco (11 April 2016)

I watched an open meeting of sacked workers on Austar chaired by Alan Jones at 1 pm to today..

It was attended also by 4 Liberal Federal MPs, Jenny Hill (Mayor of Townsville), Bob Katter (sr) and Shane Kunuth  (Katter Party) from the Queensland Parliament.

We have 3 state Labor MPs here in Townsville and not one of them attended that meeting let alone any union reps.

So much for the interest shown by the unions and the Labor Party in the sacked 800 workers.

Five resolutions were agreed upon, one being that the poor old Federal Government pay those workers their entitlements......Palmer is getting off Scott free......

Also the clean up of the polluted tailing dams may fall back to responsibility of the Queensland state government.  


https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/31316161/palmer-had-last-say-on-qn-spending-calls/


----------



## basilio (11 April 2016)

Nice work Noco. Certainly has been a litany of neglect by Clive Palmer with the Refinery.

I wonder if anyone is liable for Health and Safety violations in the time of operations?  Who is responsible for chasing this ?  Is it possible other mining companies are risking similar sanctions operating dangerous equipment ?  Worth a question I think.

___________________________________

Also unimpressed with the risk of the Government ending up with  restoration costs.  Would it be useful to attempt to make directors personally liable for such costs even when the company goes bankrupt ? Or is that too anti- business ?


----------



## noco (11 April 2016)

basilio said:


> Nice work Noco. Certainly has been a litany of neglect by Clive Palmer with the Refinery.
> 
> I wonder if anyone is liable for Health and Safety violations in the time of operations?  Who is responsible for chasing this ?  Is it possible other mining companies are risking similar sanctions operating dangerous equipment ?  Worth a question I think.
> 
> ...




Clive Palmer has a lot of questions to answer......The environmental hazard he has created and neglected and the health and safety of workers due to lack of maintenance.

Palmer has his own legal team working for him full time and they know all the loop holes to protect Palmer's personal wealth.......He keeps saying he is not personally responsible for the mess he has created including the $73 million owing to sacked workers......

I have dinner with one of the sacked maintenance guys almost every Sunday evening at one of the local pubs and he often had told me of the state of the plant going back 2 years and they were only allowed to do essential repairs.....No major replacements ever took place so I would say Palmer has been planning the demise of the refinery for some time.  He was often dosed with leaking ammonia......My friend is owed $125,000.

The Palazuzeck Queensland Labor state government was suing Palmer for the environmental neglect and the case was due to be heard any time soon.....The Queensland State Government is responsible for the Health and Safety of the refinery and if Palmer becomes untouchable the hazard will rest on the shoulders of the state government to clean up the mess......My mate tells me the tailing dams are rich in iron ore, gold and other minerals so the government or some other contractual arrangement could possibly make some dollars from it.

I believe the company will officially go into liquidation on the 22nd April.

The affect on the Townsville economy is extensive to say the least...Maybe the Labor run local council could create some jobs but I doubt it.

I have very grave doubts about the reopening of the plant in July.


----------



## sptrawler (11 April 2016)

Isn't it ironic, that Palmer was voted in by the people outraged at politicians, who don't care about the"little guy".

Abbott was thrown out because he is a "normal bloke", who the reporters didn't like.

Turnbull is in, because the reporters thought, he was the "messiah".

Now the reporters want Shorten, because they have run out of preferred candidates, what a hoot.

What a way to run a Country, jeez we deserve everything we get, what a bunch of losers.

Australia a land obsessed with social media, with an expectation of social welfare and lack of personal endeavour.IMO We reward mediocracy, we actually encourage it.

Some may see me as being too critical, however I have been fortunate in seeing like for like, in the same workplace. 

What took 2 days to do 30 years ago, now takes 5 days, but everyone is happy cruising.lol

If you suggested to the workers, that apprentices used to do the same job in 2 days, you would have a strike on your hands. 
Hey that's progress, it cracks me up.

I bet you a pound to a pinch of $hit, that Chinese workers are filling the houses in North West W.A within 20 years, while our unemployed are sitting on welfare in the capital cities.

What a laugh that will be, maybe then the penny will drop, but I doubt it.lol


----------



## Tisme (11 April 2016)

Im guessing the unionised workforce and its EBA is of no consequence to the company going down ...... mainly because it's Clive Palmer at the helm as opposed to the pure as the driven snow LIberal supporting  execs at Arrium  (I wonder how much of shareholder dividends that company donated to the LNP?)

Of course unions are not the people in them, but the evil reps.


----------



## Tisme (11 April 2016)

noco said:


> I watched an open meeting of sacked workers on Austar chaired by Alan Jones at 1 pm to today..
> 
> It was attended also by 4 Liberal Federal MPs, Jenny Hill (Mayor of Townsville), Bob Katter (sr) and Shane Kunuth  (Katter Party) from the Queensland Parliament.




I can't comment on the veracity of your commentary, but why would the ALP attend a meeting called by a man who is vehemently caustic to them at all times? Alan Jones is not the government whip. Similarly I wouldn't expect the LNP to attend a meeting called and controlled by the chapter boss of the CFMEU.


----------



## sptrawler (11 April 2016)

Tisme said:


> Im guessing the unionised workforce and its EBA is of no consequence to the company going down ...... mainly because it's Clive Palmer at the helm as opposed to the pure as the driven snow LIberal supporting  execs at Arrium  (I wonder how much of shareholder dividends that company donated to the LNP?)
> 
> Of course unions are not the people in them, but the evil reps.




The unionised workforce, isn't receptive to one step back, for two steps forward.
It is onward, ever onward, regardless of the consequences. 

We will see how that pans out.

It doesn't matter whether it is LNP, Labor or Clive Palmer, if it is running at a loss it will fail.

Funny how you highlight how much the company donates to the LNP, how much does the union donate to the Labor Party?

 Just nonsense in the scheme of things, the issues are much bigger than petty crap like that.

Australia's living standard will fall, unless the underlying problems are addressed, that includes those on public servant pensions.

There is no upside to being on a public servant pension of 60% of FAS, if the currency drops by 40%.lol

The problem is atm,IMO the companies will shut down the refineries etc. 
Then when the when the A$ drops heaps, reopen and re employ at much lower wages. Just my opinion.


----------



## sptrawler (11 April 2016)

Tisme said:


> Of course unions are not the people in them, but the evil reps.




One thing has to be remembered, there isn't unions, if there isn't jobs.

Our unions thrive on a highly skilled, workforce that is dynamic and has something to offer, over third world countries.
I don't think that is being nurtured in our present system, be it our education system, our work ethic, our political leadership. 
Actually I feel there is nothing we are excelling at, other than finding excuses for our appalling mediocrity and finding more money to support it.


----------



## noco (12 April 2016)

Tisme said:


> I can't comment on the veracity of your commentary, but why would the ALP attend a meeting called by a man who is vehemently caustic to them at all times? Alan Jones is not the government whip. Similarly I wouldn't expect the LNP to attend a meeting called and controlled by the chapter boss of the CFMEU.




Wake up to yourself Tisme.....It was a meeting of sacked workers seeking their entitlements FFS.......The Labor Party and the unions are supposed to be the workers friends and should have been their fighting for their cause.

They were no where to be seen which in my mind they could not care less what happens to those QN Refinery sacked workers....The Labor Party and the unions are all for them selves...The only Labor Party rep at that meeting yesterday was Jenny Hill, the mayor of Townsville......She has just been re-elected and it would certainly have looked worse for the LUG Party if she had been absent. 

Need I remind you how Shorten and the AWU diddled the workers of Chiquita and Clean Event of their entitlements and penalty rates and yet they rave on about penalty rates for workers who seek extra work on weekends over and above their normal week day jobs......What happened to the old adage that the weekends were a time of rest and relaxation, where the family enjoyed their outing together and went to church on Sundays.......The problem today is that many people are too materialistic and greedy...They have to keep up with the Jone's next door.


----------



## noco (12 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> Isn't it ironic, that Palmer was voted in by the people outraged at politicians, who don't care about the"little guy".
> 
> Abbott was thrown out because he is a "normal bloke", who the reporters didn't like.
> 
> ...




SP you are a man after my own heart.

The media control politics today and I will continue to place emphasis on the ABC which is controlled by the LUG Party.


----------



## Tisme (12 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> The unionised workforce, isn't receptive to one step back, for two steps forward.
> It is onward, ever onward, regardless of the consequences.
> 
> We will see how that pans out.
> ...




Well party donations are not petty, they are an imperative for their survival. They do influence policy and they shouldn't. 

With the LNP facing electoral defeat plus an internal party schism the need for a focus enemy is real and the workers will be the sacrificial lambs and the crocodile tears will flow from the Govt leading up to polling day .

The duplicity of blaming unionists employed by the top end of town boys club on one front (Arrium) and then feeling sorry for unionists employed by a company involving Clive Palmer (QLD Nickel) is baffling and to me just adds weight to the hypocrisy that it's being displayed to win an argument.


----------



## Tisme (12 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> One thing has to be remembered, there isn't unions, if there isn't jobs.
> 
> Our unions thrive on a highly skilled, workforce that is dynamic and has something to offer, over third world countries.
> I don't think that is being nurtured in our present system, be it our education system, our work ethic, our political leadership.
> Actually I feel there is nothing we are excelling at, other than finding excuses for our appalling mediocrity and finding more money to support it.




I think you might be right, with the caveat that without the unions of the past we would probably still be majority serfs to a minority rich, wealth distribution would be chasms, kids would be pressed into service, and for all intents and purposes we would be the third world resource. Unionised Europe, North America, us and those blokes on the other side of the ditch all share some common factors and one is unionism ... which is a whipping boy for failing business leaders, opportunistic politicians and Mrs Buckets .

The key to remember is that unions are individuals who vote for the actions of the collective. Many unionists vote LNP.....I think the CEPU actually funded and "enemy" polly in Victoria a few recent years back?

Trade unions have given way to white collar unions who are invariably in the employ of the public service..... that is where the obscenity of undeserved wage rates, benefits and  piggies snouts in the trough occurs IMO and that is the true oncost to profit that is retarding our national expansion. 27% of the employable population probably taking home 25% on average more money than the people in the production sector? How bums on seats writing interoffice memos could ever be construed more valuable than someone making widgets for national income escapes me.


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## noco (12 April 2016)

Tisme said:


> Well party donations are not petty, they are an imperative for their survival. They do influence policy and they shouldn't.
> 
> With the LNP facing electoral defeat plus an internal party schism the need for a focus enemy is real and the workers will be the sacrificial lambs and the crocodile tears will flow from the Govt leading up to polling day .
> 
> The duplicity of blaming unionists employed by the top end of town boys club on one front (Arrium) and then feeling sorry for unionists employed by a company involving Clive Palmer (QLD Nickel) is baffling and to me just adds weight to the hypocrisy that it's being displayed to win an argument.




Tisme, you are talking through your hat again...There is no comparison between Palmer and Arrium......If you could just open your eyes for once you will understand what a rogue this fellow Palmer is....Palmer owned QN Refinery outright without any share holders as opposed to Arrium. ......Palmer is avoiding paying his sacked workers their entitlements..Palmer is avoiding cleaning up an environmental disaster in Townsville.....Palmer siphoned off millions of dollars out of QN for  political purposes.  Palmer is  avoiding paying capital gains tax.

Palmer was a life member and big donor to the Liberal Party and he told everyone the Liberal Party was the best thing and he praised Campbell Newman for wiping out the Labor Party in Queensland at the last election and then when The Liberal Government would not bend to his demands to allow his coal mine to go ahead he spat the dummy, resigned from the Liberals and set out on a revenge and destroy Campbell Newman. 

Now you tell me that you cannot see or understand the difference.


----------



## noco (12 April 2016)

Tisme said:


> I think you might be right, with the caveat that without the unions of the past we would probably still be majority serfs to a minority rich, wealth distribution would be chasms, kids would be pressed into service, and for all intents and purposes we would be the third world resource. Unionised Europe, North America, us and those blokes on the other side of the ditch all share some common factors and one is unionism ... which is a whipping boy for failing business leaders, opportunistic politicians and Mrs Buckets .
> 
> The key to remember is that unions are individuals who vote for the actions of the collective. Many unionists vote LNP.....I think the CEPU actually funded and "enemy" polly in Victoria a few recent years back?
> 
> Trade unions have given way to white collar unions who are invariably in the employ of the public service..... that is where the obscenity of undeserved wage rates, benefits and  piggies snouts in the trough occurs IMO and that is the true oncost to profit that is retarding our national expansion. 27% of the employable population probably taking home 25% on average more money than the people in the production sector? How bums on seats writing interoffice memos could ever be construed more valuable than someone making widgets for national income escapes me.




I have not seen any evidence of the unions being the whipping boy for the failure of QN Refinery...Talking through your hat again.

If as you say the unions are so great why has their membership fallen to an all time low....The majority of workers are sick to death of unions and the ones that remain are the likes of nurses, police, firemen and the public service and as you know they have no choice.


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## Tisme (12 April 2016)

noco said:


> Tisme, you are talking through your hat again...*There is no comparison between Palmer and Arrium*......




Wrong both leaderships have sunk a company. The difference is that Palmer hasn't lowered himself to blame his workers (yet)... the press on the otherhand have been quick to sink the boot into him because he's not part of Murdoch's the old boys club.



noco said:


> *Palmer was a life member and big donor to the Liberal Party *




Wrong he was firstly a lifer with the Nationals which transferred to the LNP




noco said:


> a nd he told everyone the Liberal Party was the best thing and he praised Campbell Newman for wiping out the Labor Party in Queensland at the last election and then when The Liberal Government would not bend to his demands to allow his coal mine to go ahead he spat the dummy, resigned from the Liberals and set out on a revenge and destroy Campbell Newman.




Wrong the defamation case he brought against Newman and the acrimonious split was as a result of Newman stating in public "a guy who tried to buy ... my government". It was in relation to a meeting between Clive and Jeff Seeney in 2012 when he tried, like so many others regularly do, to get gain concessions from the minister, in this case approval for Port Palmer and an exclusive rail corridor to the Galilee Basin. The LNP govt has since been accused to have favoured many who are directly linked to the LNP coffers.

Clive's no new comer to politics, he's been behind every eruption and party split since the 70's....just ask him


----------



## Tisme (12 April 2016)

noco said:


> I have not seen any evidence of the unions being the whipping boy for the failure of QN Refinery...Talking through your hat again.
> 
> If as you say the unions are so great why has their membership fallen to an all time low....The majority of workers are sick to death of unions and the ones that remain are the likes of nurses, police, firemen and the public service and as you know they have no choice.




I'm not going to debate the merits of unions. What I am saying is that it is convenient for individuals and blame a collective as if it is some ubiquitous being, when in fact it is many individuals who aren't necessarily rusted on Labor supporters. There is plenty of evidence to show that unions were the reason the Dickensian era came to an end and the rights of the individual emerged. 

The reason the declining % of membership = many reasons e.g. the stain of the **** thrown by opponents has stuck, the population no longer has the stomach to put in the good fight, individual greed over social good prevails, wannabe gentry don't see themselves as the working class they are, small one man business doesn't want the oncosts of EBAs, individualism, but I think the main reason is that they have skewered themselves by demanding and getting the social safety nets of the dole, health and welfare which means many don't "see the need to fight for their rights".

If the UK is any predictor only 45% of Unite union members vote Labor. And that would pretty much tally with the general mouthy members I've had to endure on various sites.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (12 April 2016)

Palmer is a very complex rich piece of work. Unfortunately we have not seen the end of him yet. 

Peter Beattie was the most adept, if not the most articulate, at describing him on 4C last night. It will not end "until he has left the planet"

gg


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## Tisme (12 April 2016)

http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/stories/2016/04/11/4438791.htm


'







> "He's an enigma. He's an individual let me tell you. They broke the mould when Clive was made."
> 
> "What you've got is this really complex character who's both brilliant and stupid all at the same time."
> 
> ...


----------



## noco (13 April 2016)

I hope they throw the book at this crook...Palmer deserves all that is coming to him.....His ego is so high he thinks he is bullet proof.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...heAustralianNewsNDM (The Australian | News |)

*Federal MP Clive Palmer faces the possibility of up to five years’ jail, bankruptcy and the unravelling of his fin*ancial empire after he was found to have siphoned more than $200 million from his cash-strapped Queensland Nickel to his other businesses before its *collapse.

A crushing administrators’ report recommends the refinery company be put into liqui*dation, finding it may have traded while insolvent and that Mr Palmer secretly acted as a “shadow director”, making him personally liable for the company’s collapse.

It also exposes the rest of his empire to possible legal plundering to repay $300m in debts owed to nearly 800 sacked workers and other creditors.

Administrators say Mr Palmer for years used QN as a “piggy bank” to prop up his other businesses, spending $21.5m on donations to his political party, nearly $6m on his ill-fated attempt to rebuild the Titanic, $5m on 60 vintage cars for his Sunshine Coast golf resort and $38m to him, his wife and his father-in-law on a *single day in 2012.

    More: Watchdogs should have done jobs
    More: Chickens come home to roost
    More: Clive call reveals our worst fears

Of $224m in QN funds siph*oned to other businesses since February 2011, $189m of the loans were forgiven.

The corporate watchdog is already investigating the failure of the Townsville refinery and will be under extra pressure to act after voluntary administrators FTI Consulting found Mr Palmer and his nephew, Clive Mensink — QN’s sole director — might have breached civil and criminal corporate law by acting “recklessly” as directors. The most severe penalty is five years in jail.

“We have considered the evidence available and are of the view sections 180, 181, 182, 183 of the act may have been breached,” FTI’s John Park wrote in his report.

“Further, there are indications the directors (Mr Mensink and Mr Palmer) may be in breach of their common law and fiduciary duties and may have also committed offences under Section 184 of the (Corporations) Act.

“Both Mr Mensink and Mr Palmer, in our view, appear to have been reckless in exercising their duties and powers as directors of QN. Ultimately, the determination of whether the directors have breached their duties will be made by a court.”

Mr Palmer denies any wrongdoing and insists he was entitled to act as he did under the terms of the refinery’s joint venture agreement.*

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...r/news-story/933cbaf4e6011267764c998ef9e2cf41

*Clive Palmer started whisking huge sums of cash from the coffers of Queensland Nickel one day in late November, 2012.

By the end of that day, Thursday, November 29, a total of $42,689,601 had been siphoned off. It was the biggest outflow of cash in one day in the nickel refinery’s torrid history.

In its damning report, the administrators of Queensland Nickel list where the sums of money went.

One account, SCI Le Coeur de L Ocean, which Palmer’s parliamentary register lists as being in French Polynesia and belonging to his wife, Anna Palmer, received a deposit of $US15 million.

Anna’s father, Alexandar Sokolov, suddenly found himself $US8m richer, at least on paper. Another chunk of $US15m went into Palmer’s personal accounts. A person called Zhenghong Zang received $4m, then a $500,000 top-up. Bednova Evgenia, believed to be one of Anna Palmer’s Bulgarian-born relatives, received $959,728.

The motives for the handful of massive withdrawals in one day have been a mystery.

The Australian can reveal, however, that Palmer was in a panic and highly agitated when he instructed the transfers on November 29, 2012.

A confidante recalled him being “absolutely paranoid — more so than usual” around this time because of something he believed he had discovered.

But what was it? Palmer believed that the Queensland government, led by then premier Campbell Newman, was secretly planning to imprison him and imminently confiscate his assets.*


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## Tisme (13 April 2016)

Let's hope they go after and recoup the preferential payments made ... including those to the LNP election coffers .

Fancy spending hard working employee's pensions on party donations .... but then again there might be fabian unionists on the payrol so they deserve to be done over.


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## SirRumpole (13 April 2016)

Disgusting...There is something wrong with our laws if Palmer gets out of his obligations.

Queensland Nickel liquidation could see taxpayers fund payouts, Employment Minister says

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-...nd-nickel-taxpayers-will-fund-payouts/7321998


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## Craton (13 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> Isn't it ironic, that Palmer was voted in by the people outraged at politicians, who don't care about the"little guy".



Yep and I wonder how the "little guys" feel after giving him their vote. A wasted vote IMHO, betcha they're none too happy and possibly even ashamed to have been taken for a none to cozy ride.

Anyhow, I think I've said it else where that it was just a matter of time before he showed us his true colours.

Lambie et all did well to get out when the going was good.


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## Craton (13 April 2016)

SirRumpole said:


> Disgusting...There is something wrong with our laws if Palmer gets out of his obligations.
> 
> Queensland Nickel liquidation could see taxpayers fund payouts, Employment Minister says
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-04-...nd-nickel-taxpayers-will-fund-payouts/7321998




I'm not in favour of using tax payer money to fund the payouts. 

If Clive had been doing absolutely everything in his power like selling assets not stripping out milions to "stop the rot" then I'd be more amicable to the idea but the guy is a joke, has abused his position (and his workers) and is a megalomaniac with scant regard for his fellow Australian.

As much as I feel for the workers, the company has done bugger all to assist but then how could they with Palmer being the "secret" puppeteer?


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## sptrawler (13 April 2016)

I think the whole sordid episode, just highlights, the complete lack of character and principles of Palmer.

What cracks me up, is how many people voted for him.

I wonder how many of the Queensland Nickel workers voted for him?

I also wonder how many people voted for him, as a sign of frustration with the Labor and Liberal parties?

Well as they say, be carefull what you wish for.

To take it one step further, imagine if we were a Republic and Clive was President Clive Palmer.

Now that would be really funny.


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## sptrawler (13 April 2016)

The one good thing about Clive, is that there won't be another hung Parliament for a while, I think the joke vote is over.

There will be a huge swing to mainstream IMO, good on you Clive.


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## Wysiwyg (14 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> I think the whole sordid episode, just highlights, the complete lack of character and principles of Palmer.



Self serving, arrogant, abusive, unhealthy, compulsive liar, self aggrandising, delusional and ultimately a controversial actor in the theatre of life. Standby for Clive Palmer's next manifestation. 

Gotta type this again ...

"Steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king," Bob Dylan.


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## Smurf1976 (14 April 2016)

sptrawler said:


> I also wonder how many people voted for him, as a sign of frustration with the Labor and Liberal parties?




My perception is that there are plenty of people not happy with our present governments (state and federal) for various reasons. But they aren't convinced that Labor / Liberal (as appropriate) would do any better and so they go looking for someone, anyone, else who they see might do a better job.

I think part of the issue there is that there's really not a lot of difference between Labor and Liberal these days. There's a few differences but overall they're not far apart and neither really stands out in any way.

So the choice when voting was realistically Laborial, Green, PUP or if there's a credible independent. It thus doesn't surprise me at all that PUP gained the support it did.


----------



## qldfrog (14 April 2016)

Smurf1976 said:


> My perception is that there are plenty of people not happy with our present governments (state and federal) for various reasons. But they aren't convinced that Labor / Liberal (as appropriate) would do any better and so they go looking for someone, anyone, else who they see might do a better job.
> 
> I think part of the issue there is that there's really not a lot of difference between Labor and Liberal these days. There's a few differences but overall they're not far apart and neither really stands out in any way.
> 
> So the choice when voting was realistically Laborial, Green, PUP or if there's a credible independent. It thus doesn't surprise me at all that PUP gained the support it did.




Palmer is our Trump;
Same same in term of why, I believe he is finished now but another one will pop up, and better a Trump or Palmer than an Adolf  ..


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## noco (14 April 2016)

Angry creditors have their say.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/qld/a/31329887/qld-nickel-what-the-creditors-report-says/

*QUEENSLAND NICKEL - WHAT THE CREDITORS HAVE BEEN TOLD

    Queensland Nickel should be "wound up" or liquidated.


    QN became insolvent no later than November 27, 2015, and remained so until administrators were appointed.


    Director Clive Mensink and Clive Palmer may have breached corporations and other laws.


    Palmer acted as a shadow director because he approved and directed expenditure requests and dealt with staff on operational matters.


    Given this, Palmer "owed the same duties to QN" as a formally appointed director.

QUEENSLAND NICKEL - WHAT THE ADMINISTRATORS ALLEGE

    Palmer and Mensink authorised transactions that don't appear to have been in QN's best interests.


    They failed to exercise discretion and avoid conflict between QN's interests and their own personal interests.


    They may have gained an advantage because of their positions and access to related information.


    Their actions appear to have caused significant detriment to QN.


    They "appear to have been reckless, in exercising their duties and powers as directors of QN".

WHAT'S A SHADOW DIRECTOR?

    Someone who's not on the public register as a director of a company but directs and manages its affairs like a director would.

(Source: FTI Consulting report into creditors)*


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## noco (15 February 2017)

Palmer is starting to throw his weight around again with some 6 or 7 legal eagles working for him full time.

http://www.townsvillebulletin.com.a...y/news-story/68382d304f7e0ec243ea3aeaef91e9d4


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## Tisme (15 February 2017)

"
Clive Palmer has said he's formally launched legal proceedings against Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull, through which people will find out "what really happened" in the collapse of Queensland Nickel.

"Malcolm Turnbull will have his day in court to tell the Australian people what really happened about Queensland Nickel and Senator (Michaelia) Cash will get her time in court too to make her explanation," the former MP said as he arrived at Federal Court in Brisbane today.

Mr Palmer said he would give further details at a news conference later today. 







The Queensland Nickel refinery. (9NEWS)

"We will see what really happened up there and what a tragedy it was for the people of North Queensland," he said.

"I've got to go in, I can't say much more."

Yesterday, Mr Palmer said he would launch a $10 million defamation lawsuit against Mr Turnbull, who it is claimed allegedly besmirched the businessman's name over the Queensland Nickel collapse.

Mr Palmer also said he would sue Employment Minister Michaelia Cash for $250,000 for saying responsibility for the nickel refinery business lay with him.

His lawyer Sam Iskander wrote to Senator Cash's office in October last year, claiming the businessman was being shunned and excluded by friends, employees and professional colleagues as a result of her comments and feared reprisals against himself and his family.

Mr Iskander said he would start legal action in the Brisbane District Court within 28 days unless Senator Cash issued a public apology and agreed to pay $150,000 in damages.

Mr Palmer was at the court to face a grilling about the collapse but said he would be out by about 11am and would address the media.

"It's very pleasing what's happened with the investigation so far," he said.

"The truth's coming out."

Queensland Nickel collapsed in early 2016 with debts of about $300 million, leaving close to 800 people out of work.


Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/20...ng-over-queensland-nickel#wq6avlSFIkWSiV8X.99"


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## noco (15 February 2017)

Tisme said:


> "
> Clive Palmer has said he's formally launched legal proceedings against Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull, through which people will find out "what really happened" in the collapse of Queensland Nickel.
> 
> "Malcolm Turnbull will have his day in court to tell the Australian people what really happened about Queensland Nickel and Senator (Michaelia) Cash will get her time in court too to make her explanation," the former MP said as he arrived at Federal Court in Brisbane today.
> ...




It was not only the 800 workers out of a job but all the support groups indirectly involved....Wharf personal unloading ships from New Caledonia, train drivers carting the ore to the refinery, out side contractors involved in maintenance work,  power plant workers, office cleaners, caterers and many more personal probably another 500 more who have been forgotten.


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## Tisme (16 November 2017)

On radio the other day, Clive maintained he had successfully sued Malcolm: ?

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...h/news-story/5323b68c4dc2b69b52407025cba52dc9




> CLIVE Palmer has notched a small win with his defamation case, with a judge ruling a reasonable person could view Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull’s comments about the mining magnate’s role in Queensland Nickel’s collapse as suggesting “fraud”.
> 
> Mr Palmer launched defamation proceedings against Mr Turnbull and employment minister Michaelia Cash in February in relation to comments made in April 2016.
> 
> ...



.”


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## SirRumpole (16 November 2017)

Courier Mail has gone paywall. Good luck with that.


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## Tisme (16 November 2017)

SirRumpole said:


> Courier Mail has gone paywall. Good luck with that.



 modified


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## Tisme (29 April 2018)

There you go:



> *Clive Palmer*
> 21 hrs ·
> Administrators confirm they refused Palmer’s offer to pay all bills and sacked 550 workers at Yabulu nickel refinery - destroying North Queensland’s economy
> 
> ...


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## Tisme (6 June 2018)

Clive farcebook posting Supreme Court judgement 5th June against Turnbull  in regards to the Chinese press conference where Turbull bagged out Clive.


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## Tisme (6 June 2018)

'Queensland Nickel plans to reopen refinery

Clive Palmer, the chairman of QNI Resources which owns the Yabulu Nickel Refinery, announced that QNI Resources has approved plans to reopen the refinery.

Mr Palmer confirmed that other group companies had nearly $500,000,000 of cash reserves in Queensland banks, some of which could be deployed to reopen the refinery.

“It was time for all governments and the community to work together to assist the refinery in opening in the shortest possible time,’’ Mr Palmer said.

Mr Palmer confirmed that QNI Resources was not seeking cash from any party or financial assistance to reopen the refinery. He said it could be achieved from his group’s own funds.

“What is needed is a positive approach from Government to assist the refinery reopening in the shortest possible time.

“The refinery operations over 40 years provided 3,000 jobs for North Queensland and was North Queensland’s largest employer.

“It is time for all sides to forget about politics and to support the Queensland company that owns the refinery and is debt free to open and operate for the benefit of Townsville and the nation,’’ he said."


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## Tisme (16 June 2018)

His latest post:


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## Tisme (9 July 2018)




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## SirRumpole (9 July 2018)

Tisme said:


>





I can see him ending up in Bolivia with his nephew at some stage.


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## Macquack (14 May 2019)

I am looking forward to the federal election and the end of the advertising bombardment by that imbecile Clive Palmer that seems to have been going on for a year now.

Who really wouldn't like to lay one on that fat c.


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## SirRumpole (14 August 2020)

Should we be concerned about governments passing legislation that interferes with the right of citizens to access the court system ?

This is going to be a fundamental test for democracy if the Palmer case goes to the High Court, especially if he gets a decision in his favour.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...-despite-laws-to-block-damages-claim/12556616


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## wayneL (14 August 2020)

SirRumpole said:


> Should we be concerned about governments passing legislation that interferes with the right of citizens to access the court system ?
> 
> This is going to be a fundamental test for democracy if the Palmer case goes to the High Court, especially if he gets a decision in his favour.
> 
> https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...-despite-laws-to-block-damages-claim/12556616



It has been a few comments around Twitter that the emergency legislation is unconstitutional. and to be honest I'm getting highly alarmed at this governments increasing authoritarianism and use of subterfuge


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## IFocus (14 August 2020)

SirRumpole said:


> Should we be concerned about governments passing legislation that interferes with the right of citizens to access the court system ?
> 
> This is going to be a fundamental test for democracy if the Palmer case goes to the High Court, especially if he gets a decision in his favour.
> 
> https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-08...-despite-laws-to-block-damages-claim/12556616




Its absolutely draconian and wrong.

Gareth Parker 6PR radio Perth (I don't like his politics but a really smart guy) who hates the McGowan government spoke to the previous Liberal Premier Barnett who started the whole problem said he agreed it was the right course of action!

Parker rang around all the major mining companies in the state quoting one of the execs who said he had no problem with the governments actions because no one acted or was like Palmer!

The major mining lobby group in WA said yep go ahead no problems!

Palmer has no Friends for good reason as per MacQuacks comment above.

However uneasy that this is the only course of action.

Its all due to a state agreements of which there are 70 Palmer is the only one ever to run it through arbitration everyone else works with the state to arrive at a point agreeable that works......not Palmer.


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## rcw1 (22 December 2022)

Good afternoon
Published today via New Corp Media.  Most interesting news really.  Not sure how this will work.  Allot things to do to get this up and running again.  Tailings are another issue ...  Having said that, it has been revealed that, "In September 2022 Yabulu secured a 30-year port access agreement with the Port of Townsville".  Big Clivey owed an absolute fortune apparently.  So if Big Clivey ain't around no more then would stand to reason the Port would open up entry/exit gate to the factory.  Interesting.

Most skeptical is rcw1 ... see what transpires then.

Palmer announces sale of Yabulu refinery​Clive Palmer has found a buyer for the Yabulu nickel and cobalt refinery in Townsville. Read why he’s put it on the market.

Tony Raggatt
@anthonyraggatt

3 min read
December 22, 2022 - 11:07AM
Townsville Bulletin

Clive Palmer has announced he has entered a share purchase agreement for the sale of the Yabulu Nickel and Cobalt Refinery in Townsville for an undisclosed sum to Zero Carbon Investek.  Mr Palmer is selling his joint venture shares in QNI Resources Pty Ltd and QNI
Metals Pty Ltd to Zero Carbon Investek — a special purpose vehicle formed to undertake the acquisition, based in Switzerland.

Mr Palmer said the sale would bring enormous economic and environmental benefits to the people of North Queensland and wider Australia.  “I am happy to announce that this first-class asset has found enthusiastic and expert new owners in Zero Carbon Investek,’’ Mr Palmer said.  “I look forward to the Queensland government and all relevant authorities lending their full support to the new owners. This is a big win for the people of North Queensland providing jobs and economic benefits,’’ Mr Palmer said. 

Yabulu operated for about 40 years before its operating company was placed in administration and then liquidation in 2016 mmAbout 800 people lost their jobs.

According to Mr Palmer’s statement, it is regarded as a world class, large-scale, globally significant nickel and cobalt refinery asset.  It previously represented a large part of the gross regional product of the North Queensland economy, contributing $1.37bn per year for Townsville and 3960 full-time equivalent jobs across Queensland, with more than half those jobs in and around Townsville.


The statement says the refinery was placed into a high-level of care and maintenance since 2016 and is now looking to restart.

“The Yabulu restart plan is designed to optimise refinery operations, including realising extensive tonnages of nickel and cobalt contained in the tailings storage facility. In September 2022 Yabulu secured a 30-year port access agreement with the Port of Townsville,” the statement says.

It says an 18-month restart plan positions Yabulu to rapidly become among the top 10 largest nickel assets in the world with a production capacity of 53,500 tonnes per annum of nickel and 3700 tonnes per annum of cobalt. Both are strategic and critical minerals playing a major role in industrial processes, global decarbonisation and electrification.





The Yabulu nickel refinery. Picture: Zak Simmonds

Nickel and cobalt are used for the production of electric vehicles, renewable power generation, battery manufacturing, energy storage, aerospace, defence and health.  According to the statement, Zero Carbon Investek is currently in advanced discussions with a number of globally significant strategic players who are seeking product offtake opportunities, alongside investment.

“Under Zero Carbon Investek, the refinery will directly employ about 800 staff, upon restart of operations, and many more during the construction period,” the statement says.

“To this end, in the longer-term, Zero Carbon Investek is hopeful that the site may unlock opportunities for new domestic industry, including battery or electric vehicle manufacturing.”

The Zero Carbon Investek syndicate is headed by Dr Richard Petty whose career spans more than 30 years in business and academia. He has served on more than 20 public and private company boards and has advised multinational companies and several governments on projects with an aggregate economic impact in the hundreds of billions of dollars. He previously served as a member of the Business20 and was a member of the B20 Financing Growth and Infrastructure Taskforce.

Dr Petty said the Yabulu refinery was positioned for an exciting future. He said Zero Carbon Investek would invest an additional US$800m ($1.19bn) in capital expenditure, post acquisition, further enhancing the facility including transitioning to net zero carbon through the replacement of coal and gas fired steam and power generation with solar, saving up to 500,000 tonnes of CO2 emissions per annum.

“Whilst the restart of the refinery is the key strategic priority, Zero Carbon Investek is also targeting the development of a large scale, 1.5Gw solar photovoltaic plant and battery storage facility at the refinery site to create new industry opportunities and sustainable environmental benefits,’’ Dr Petty said.

“Reducing the carbon intensity of operations through the development of solar PV is a key priority for Yabulu moving forward.

“The Yabulu large-scale solar project will be situated in the Northern Queensland Renewable Energy Zone and is set to become a main contributor to the Queensland Government’s new Queensland Energy and Jobs Plan which has a target of 70% renewable energy by 2032 and 80 per cent by 2035, representing an $85bn investment into the energy system.

“Helping the Queensland Government to achieve such targets whilst boosting the economy and providing jobs is an important part of Zero Carbon Investek’s mission.”  In pursuit of this ambition, Zero Carbon Investek says it has successfully developed agreements with leading researchers at some of the world’s top universities, including Imperial College London and University of Cambridge, who are developing game-changing industry-leading solar technology capable of unparalleled solar power conversion efficiency of 41 per cent, at a small fraction of the cost.

The PV plant will employ more than 50 people and will generate surplus grid scale power, which can be sold locally or interstate.

An associated battery plant will employ more than 50 people and will also allow sales in other states for domestic, industrial and grid scale power generation.

“We look forward to working with the people of North Queensland and relevant authorities to fully realise the potential of this world class asset,’’ Dr Petty said.

EDIT:  deled a photo​


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