# ES (Sim)



## boofis (17 July 2012)

So I've been bothering and learning from the more experienced contributors on this forum, and others, for a while now and was encouraged by a fellow trader (CanOz) to step up to the plate of public scrutiny. 

This is just a simulation account on the ES using Ninja, Jigsaw, and the recent bars of a 1min chart with one squiggly line on it. 

I watch the market from 10:30pm till 1-2am'ish AEST.
Here's last nights trades.




Lessons learned thus far:
*Losses got away from me on a few trades = bad.
*I don't like the feeling of being open all contracts w/out any profit secured, whoever said to sell some and wait with others makes me think they are right. 

I start the night trading 1 and then work up to trading 4 contracts (Which is what I plan on trading if all the sim  preparation works out ok.)

Will post up each successive night and see what happens over time.


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## boofis (18 July 2012)

Well that didn't go as planned: data issues (Couldn't get depth to show on DOM lol) = no trades to report back. All resolved now, but off to bed so will take two tomorrow night.


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## tech/a (18 July 2012)

Looks good from a risk view lots of close to b/e trades and just one that got away.
I presume your doing a T/H type methodology?


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## boofis (18 July 2012)

tech/a said:


> Looks good from a risk view lots of close to b/e trades and just one that got away.
> I presume your doing a T/H type methodology?




Yeah, spot on Tech, this is pretty much solely based on things I've learnt reading T/H's threads and blog.


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## tech/a (18 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Yeah, spot on Tech, this is pretty much solely based on things I've learnt reading T/H's threads and blog.




Never traded that fast.

How do you set your buy and sells and execute orders in seconds.
Is there a rapid buy sell funcyion in IB's software Im not aware of ?

Would love to know how you guys do it.
The fastest I can do it is around a mimute.
The speed of a Mammoth!


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## Trembling Hand (18 July 2012)

tech/a said:


> How do you set your buy and sells and execute orders in seconds.
> Is there a rapid buy sell funcyion in IB's software Im not aware of ?
> 
> Would love to know how you guys do it.
> ...




Really? Booktrader, 1 click on the price you want and you have your entry with bracket TP & stop.


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## Trembling Hand (18 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Lessons learned thus far:
> *Losses got away from me on a few trades = bad.



Why are you not using the ATM bracket orders? Then your stops are set on entry.


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## CanOz (18 July 2012)

LOL, TH are you trading an account for someone else again??

CanOz


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## CanOz (18 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Why are you not using the ATM bracket orders? Then your stops are set on entry.




I showed him this yesterday, so hopefully he'll have a play with it...

CanOz


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## Trembling Hand (18 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> LOL, TH are you trading an account for someone else again??
> 
> CanOz




I assume you are talking about the allocation being "gary"? hahah........ I have many friends


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## boofis (18 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Why are you not using the ATM bracket orders? Then your stops are set on entry.




Yeah as Can said he informed me of this so will hopefully get a chance to set it up before tonight. 

Tech, get yourself on the dom and you'll be surprised! 

Forgot to mention aswell, relative to the market replay sessions, I struggle to get 'filled' with limit orders on ES when doing live sim. Not sure why, but am going to be perceptive towards that tonight also.


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## Trembling Hand (18 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Tech, get yourself on the dom and you'll be surprised!




Nah his been telling us for 5 years its of no use!!!!!!!


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## boofis (18 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Nah his been telling us for 5 years its of no use!!!!!!!




DOM has changed everything, I look at a 1 min chart now and just one bar holds so much activity and possibility where as I would've been looking for 2 or 3 bars before just to get a set up :\. 
Whether that's right or wrong or whether I can be consistently profitable this way, as you are, is yet to be decided!


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## Joules MM1 (18 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Tech, get yourself on the dom and you'll be surprised!
> ...





keep encouraging........he'll be a kind in a candy shop


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Hmm learned a few lessons tonight!

I worked up to 4 contracts way too quickly and payed for it as I started trying to force trades too early. 
Was playing around with ATM stuff at the beginning of the session and am happy now with a 4 tick SL on the ES. 

Trying to take a portion of contracts at 2 ticks for 'security' then 1 at four if it looks to be moving in my direction still, or 2 contracts at 3 or 4 if dies off. 

Interestingly enough using my gf's internet tonight and it was a fair bit slower which gave a very different feel to how things operate.


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## Joules MM1 (19 July 2012)

boofis said:


> View attachment 47977
> 
> 
> Hmm learned a few lessons tonight!
> ...




are you scaling 1/2 then lifting stop to break-evens at that point ?

other lessons learned? specifically?

good effort, boofis


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## tech/a (19 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Nah his been telling us for 5 years its of no use!!!!!!!




The only way to learn this would be to spend a week or so--  observing one of you guys trading this method
With narration from you of what you see or are looking for. ( For Me )

There is the making of a film ( educational ) there.

I'm certainly open to have a look.
But know it's not the only way to turn a buck in the markets you 
Guys trade.


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Joules MM1 said:


> are you scaling 1/2 then lifting stop to break-evens at that point ?
> 
> other lessons learned? specifically?
> 
> good effort, boofis




Na, was kind of waiting to see if it went through the first two ticks then if it did would cancel the strategy and see what happened and just sell/buy at market (That's how I got my one bigger point win) Probably won't do that too much as it took a fair bit of time on a few trades when I was just waiting. 

Learned
- Not to take a trade then go and say goodnight to the lady friend  that was a poor idea lol. 

-There were a few times when the easy to see trend pulled up and I read the trades wrong in there. So the next few days will be conscious of that. 

- In terms of p/l if I had've had real money upsizing to 4 contracts would've killed me last night and I pretty much would've been at break even w/ commission at the end of the night as opposed to if those string of losers had've been one contract. Should've scaled back to 1 much faster upon losing multiple trades also. 

- I feel most confident moving with the overall direction. 

- Seem to be (Hard to measure) getting better at getting a market fill one tick away from the direction that I'm anticipating the move to head. 

- Need to be careful on being 'greedy' e.g. one of the last trades I did, at one stage I could've had 6 ticks on the trail contract but 'wanted' 7 so had a limit order never get filled and ended up with 3 or 4 (I can't remember whilst typing this :\) as a result. 


Tech, you're very right imo. I'm still trying to convince T/H to let me observe  as I've no doubt there would be a book to be written about little things one can improve on after watching screen time. I bought John Grady's (No BS day trading) beginner stuff so that I could watch some video of someone using DOM after I'd read a bit about it and it's handy but the Treasuries he trades seem so so so slow after doing some time on the ES.


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## Trembling Hand (19 July 2012)

tech/a said:


> The only way to learn this would be to spend a week or so--  observing one of you guys trading this method
> With narration from you of what you see or are looking for. ( For Me )
> 
> There is the making of a film ( educational ) there.
> ...




But how can you spend years rubbishing it without having a friggin clue that it exists? I mean seriously? Are you so all knowing in this game that you are able to discount what EVERY trader of size uses to execute their trades without even knowing what it is, how it works and why real traders use it? I gotta say Tech I am really dumbfounded!!  Your words were 5 years ago and this is a quotes,



> I've spent just as much time as anyone looking at depth and there is nothing in it.




I will sway to a degree about wheather or not one can take trade signals from it on higher time frames but as simply a platform to manage trades there is simply noway one can trade frequently or supply real demand/supply by using a order entry like TWS. it would cost $100,000s a year.

Some irony in you being a big fan of VSA and then rubbishing the tools that those who supply the demand use.

There *is *a reason why there is 13 DOM screens in his display and *you* are the one *trying* to follow him,


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## Trembling Hand (19 July 2012)

boofis said:


> - In terms of p/l if I had've had real money upsizing to 4 contracts would've killed me last night and I pretty much would've been at break even w/ commission at the end of the night as opposed to if those string of losers had've been one contract. Should've scaled back to 1 much faster upon losing multiple trades also.




Whats your thinking behind taking a two tick profit? You are trading the smallest of small moves, not much more than random noise.


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## prawn_86 (19 July 2012)

If we want to discuss validity of DOM can we please start another thread.

Boofis has started this thread as his journal so lets please try and keep it to that.


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Whats your thinking behind taking a two tick profit? You are trading the smallest of small moves, not much more than random noise.




I don't appear to be real good nerves wise when I haven't taken any profit at all, but once I've got a tick or two in my favour I'm much more relaxed in my original decision to enter. 

Thoughts?


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## Trembling Hand (19 July 2012)

boofis said:


> I don't appear to be real good nerves wise when I haven't taken any profit at all, but once I've got a tick or two in my favour I'm much more relaxed in my original decision to enter.
> 
> Thoughts?




Thoughts? yeah you will lose big-time. 

You are nervous because you don't know your expectancy over 100-1000 trades. But taking profit at 2 ticks may relive your nervousness but will absolutely F up your expectancy. And the end result being that over time you will become even more nervous because you crappy expectancy will lead to a slow and steady decline in your account....... at best.

Take good trades, 1 after the other, after the other for days on end, week after week, until you have numbers backing you for months on months. *THEN *after you have the numbers for 1000s of trades being nervous on the current trade will become irrelevant.


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Thoughts? yeah you will lose big-time.
> 
> You are nervous because you don't know your expectancy over 100-1000 trades. But taking profit at 2 ticks may relive your nervousness but will absolutely F up your expectancy. And the end result being that over time you will become even more nervous because you crappy expectancy will lead to a slow and steady decline in your account....... at best.
> 
> Take good trades, 1 after the other, after the other for days on end, week after week, until you have numbers backing you for months on months. *THEN *after you have the numbers for 1000s of trades being nervous on the current trade will become irrelevant.




Duly noted. 

Just to put this into practice: after building up from one contract tonight, when trading at four shall I enter with 2 contracts then double up on two ticks instead of selling out for a profit? 

Or are you saying to take clean trades in the sense of buy 4 contracts on entry, sell 4 at designated longer target? 

Do appreciate the heads up before blowing account up.(*albeit a theoretical blowing up. )


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Also, to anyone contributing/browsing, would it be beneficial for me to post up the Summary of the session Ninja gives which shows total no. of trades, average win/loss, profit etc. ?


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## Joules MM1 (19 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Also, to anyone contributing/browsing, would it be beneficial for me to post up the Summary of the session Ninja gives which shows total no. of trades, average win/loss, profit etc. ?




if you want to narrate the outlayer trades, yeah, good idea......you want to narrate habits......an outlayer trade that's a good swing can be as destructive (eventually) as a outlayer drawdown ........narrating them will bring up any habits youre not aware of......


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## Trembling Hand (19 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Duly noted.
> 
> Just to put this into practice: after building up from one contract tonight, when trading at four shall I enter with 2 contracts then double up on two ticks instead of selling out for a profit?
> 
> ...




Nah man you're trading for ticks rather than trade to take good/correct trades. Tell me have you done this,

"If I can earn 40 ticks a day I can replace my wage and be a fulltime trader. So to get 40 ticks I can trade 4 contracts at blah blah blah"

A good trade is 1:5 R:R or even 1 to 15. Thats how you become a fulltime trader. Not taking 2 ticks


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## boofis (19 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> "If I can earn 40 ticks a day I can replace my wage and be a fulltime trader. So to get 40 ticks I can trade 4 contracts at blah blah blah"
> 
> A good trade is 1:5 R:R or even 1 to 15. Thats how you become a fulltime trader. Not taking 2 ticks




Haven't done the 40 ticks thing as I know one will not get a shot in a prop shop with that limited potential.

Alright. SO, tonights scatter chart should ideally show a few closed trades that haven't moved much against me and majority longer range winning trades? And my trade frequency will decrease a bit with this yes? 

Also, I remember reading somewhere you said that an individual must learn to trade the chop cause markets don't trend that much relatively speaking, so tonight I will be trying to execute real trades as defined above and if there is any chop then I shall go in with 3 or 4 tick winners. 

You guys keep teaching and I'll keep listening/learning/practising and then in 10 years I will let you know how I've gone in the long run


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## boofis (20 July 2012)

lol lol lol, this is called a steep learning curve. 

No 1. I am no longer going to trade when I am at friends places; terrible internet connection here and it's not even close to what the ES is actually doing.


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## boofis (20 July 2012)

Ugh, calling it a night, this sucks; slow and unrealistic.  
Try again tomorrow night with real feed.


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Made three stupid mistakes tonight (highlighted in red for all to see): put in an ATM bracket order but then cancelled it (to manually readjust orders) when the price was moving in my direction only to have it shoot back on me!
Argh, these are the kinds of mistakes I am thankful I can make on sim not real account.

Tried to take less trades and ride things a bit more, but did take a few small trades after I lost confidence on bigger losses. 

The 1st big loss was ****eful as I was 1 tick off 2 points in my favour from entry, but I decided to let it 'play out' (based on what I don't know) and try and stand back instead of taking profits, painful. 

I stuffed up the results aswell by playing around before 10:30 so no detailed report sorry as it's not indicative of anything due to just taking trades with hot keys using ATM stuff for practise/fun/something different. 

Tried using new settings on the Jigsaw reconstructed tape to filter out alot of noise and was very happy with that.  

Can anyone inform me as to what happened at 10:21am CT? My dom just jumped around for a bit and nothing printed? Wasn't sure whether it was my net or what?

I've been taking video of trades if it tickles anyones fancy to have a peep just send me a PM.


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Made three stupid mistakes tonight (highlighted in red for all to see): put in an ATM bracket order but then cancelled it (to manually readjust orders) when the price was moving in my direction only to have it shoot back on me!




You don't cancel the bracket orders to adjust them. You just move them


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> You don't cancel the bracket orders to adjust them. You just move them




Right you are, one click order modification discovered and enabled.


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Thought I may aswell detail my plan here to see what does/doesn't change about how I trade. 

Define trend on my longer time frame chart using a simple moving average; trade with the trend. When it gets choppy (as defined by no clear trend) then stand aside or try take small tick winners.

Looking for entries on shorter time frame chart accompanied with size on the tape (for ES specifically taking note of what contracts>100 are doing (e.g. hitting bid, hitting offer, is price staying when the orders hit into or is it moving easily) and any large qty trades (1500 contracts), then move solely to DOM and try and get an entry when the price ticks against the direction I'm anticipating. 

4 tick stop loss on entry and am now trying a 6 tick 1 contract sell and then go discretionary with the remaining 3 contracts (Emphasis on trying).

That's pretty much it. I look at the total contracts traded for the session at diff. price levels for a feel of s/r (This is on the DOM) and I have a prior day OHLC on the trend chart just to be aware. 

Practice, practice, practice.


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

boofis last night the ES had a 64 tick down move in the Euro session then 64 ticks up in the US session.

Matching market to method come to mind?


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> boofis last night the ES had a 64 tick down move in the Euro session then 64 ticks up in the US session.
> 
> Matching market to method come to mind?




I think I follow the gist of what you were saying, but the crux of the matter for me at present is that I am only watching from in between 10:30 and 1 on average. I would love to, and one day I will, participate in the whole session but with other commitments I've only got a few hours to do a lot of learning. 
Last night when I first logged on price was at 1339.50 went to a low around 1332 and then came back up to 1337 when I was shutting down. So 30 ticks down, 20 ticks up if I could pick absolute high and lows. I'm just trying to be realistic in setting achievable targets..?


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

My point being your biggest winner was 4 ticks on the most volatile night in a long time. Clearly your trade ideas are not matching the potential of the market you are being presented. 

No one survives taking 4 tick max winners. You're training for failure. IMO.


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

If your just learning to read the DOM, i can't see that its a problem to do this. The training from one Prop Shop reads like this:

1.) look for pulling and stacking and trade that.
2.) look for ice bergs and trade that
3.) bracket the tape and stay in the market all day, only reversing not exiting

there's more...but you get the idea.

Do you think TH, that this could limit Boofis from thinking a little longer term?

I agree the money is in the bigger moves, but this is DOM practice still....is it?

CanOz


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> If your just learning to read the DOM, i can't see that its a problem to do this. The training from one Prop Shop reads like this:




You will never match as a retail trader what is possible with prop. Its not like you get brokerage in the cents and its not like you can drop 20g in a week and walk into your risk department and say sorry can I double up and have another 100g tomorrow.


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> My point being your biggest winner was 4 ticks on the most volatile night in a long time. Clearly your trade ideas are not matching the potential of the market you are being presented.
> 
> No one survives taking 4 tick max winners. You're training for failure. IMO.




I'm not sure that we're on the same page terminology wise: 4 ticks = 1 point, that max winner you saw from last night is 3.75 points = 15 ticks. 
The group of 4 trades at 0.25 points were my one tick winners.


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

boofis said:


> I'm not sure that we're on the same page terminology wise: 4 ticks = 1 point, that max winner you saw from last night is 3.75 points = 15 ticks.
> The group of 4 trades at 0.25 points were my one tick winners.



Oh ok! LOL ignore me!!


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

Haha, balls you had me worried, I deliberately focused on longer moves last night and they were still too small! :1zhelp:


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Oh ok! LOL ignore me!!




Just trying to clarify TH, its not everyday you get to learn from a prop trader so we all just want to clarify to be sure. ITs like learning something from tweets...

Its all very much appreciated

Cheers,


CanOz


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> Just trying to clarify TH
> 
> Its all very much appreciated




+1


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## Timmy (24 July 2012)

boofis said:


> +1




+20

(I took my shoes and socks off to count that high)


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## Trembling Hand (24 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> Just trying to clarify TH, its not everyday you get to learn from a prop trader so we all just want to clarify to be sure. ITs like learning something from tweets...




The thing to remember about this stuff that prop introductory courses dribble out is that they are just exercises. For complete newbies. Its just a small step in developing a method. They aren't expecting you to go live with these methods. What they are doing is getting you to, for example, practise backhand returns for a week, just to get the Myelin laid down.

What you end up going live with is most probably a million miles away from jobbing ticks.


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> The thing to remember about this stuff that prop introductory courses dribble out is that they are just exercises. For complete newbies. Its just a small step in developing a method. They aren't expecting you to go live with these methods. What they are doing is getting you to, for example, practise backhand returns for a week, just to get the Myelin laid down.
> 
> What you end up going live with is most probably a million miles away from jobbing ticks.




Yup, got it...


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

So with your knowledge of prop shops, from the few things I've read the ability to scale up in size, and consistency are two things they want out of an individuals trading i.e. if at the end of 2013 I go to a propshop with a brokers statement showing profitable history along the lines (and hopefully improved on) of what I'm doing here, is that going to assist in getting a foot in the door?


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

boofis said:


> So with your knowledge of prop shops, from the few things I've read the ability to scale up in size, and consistency are two things they want out of an individuals trading i.e. if at the end of 2013 I go to a propshop with a brokers statement showing profitable history along the lines (and hopefully improved on) of what I'm doing here, is that going to assist in getting a foot in the door?




Can't you just go and pay the money and take their course. They keep you on if your any good. If not you go your own way. Why spend capital when you can just take the course?  

Have you contacted them yet Boofis?

CanOz


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## boofis (24 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> Can't you just go and pay the money and take their course. They keep you on if your any good. If not you go your own way. Why spend capital when you can just take the course?
> 
> Have you contacted them yet Boofis?
> 
> CanOz




Yeah you can but I'm assuming they have quite a few candidates and the ones they keep one would be showing out of the ordinary potential. 
I feel more comfortable this way as it still gives me the option of taking the course down the track if need be, but feel far more confident developing skill over time rather than going for an all or nothing shot over one month trying to learn from their course and get a shot. 
Na, haven't contacted yet Oz. Got a foot in anywhere for me  haha?
And in terms of spend capital; 2.5k for their course = 200 ticks worth of bad trades on the ES ha, so having not put my real account at risk yet, I feel I'm still ahead.


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

boofis said:


> Yeah you can but I'm assuming they have quite a few candidates and the ones they keep one would be showing out of the ordinary potential.
> I feel more comfortable this way as it still gives me the option of taking the course down the track if need be, but feel far more confident developing skill over time rather than going for an all or nothing shot over one month trying to learn from their course and get a shot.
> Na, haven't contacted yet Oz. Got a foot in anywhere for me  haha?
> And in terms of spend capital; 2.5k for their course = 200 ticks worth of bad trades on the ES ha, so having not put my real account at risk yet, I feel I'm still ahead.




Fair enough...something to consider for the future i guess.

CanOz


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## CanOz (24 July 2012)

In the meantime have a look at this.....

Some good book references in there...

CanOz


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## boofis (25 July 2012)

Well here it is, nice and inconsistent d'oh. 




After watching that emini day trading thing posted in another thread he said he advises using greater than 1.5 point stop (with his being 4 point stop :| )so I tried loosening my stop but think I am happy with a 4/5 tick stop. The bigger losers nearly cancel out the winners and the ones that were losers if closed at 4 ticks rather than where they were things would've looked alot nicer. 

Caught a nice bigger move which I was pleased with. 
Bad habit for the night was to use size to end on a nice note after so many losing trades in a row shhhh I know, bad.


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## boofis (26 July 2012)

Interesting night. Had some good A'ha moments as well as some new questions:
*Started off the night terribly and would've stopped trading due to taking out limit, but one cannot go onto sim when they're already on sim so I carried on and made some ok trades afterwards. 
*What's the general consensus on adding to a position as it moves your way? I ask as I seem to do better when I make a single entry and almost a single exit without adding to or trailing anything really. 

The Stats





Whats most important to improve on? Minimise the extent of the losers would make a big difference, now to actually do that ha.


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## Joules MM1 (28 July 2012)

Can

Video

FT71 relates to Jodie.......maybe worth your while

http://www.vankartrading.com/vkbs/W...otlight-Jodie/2012-07-20-Spotlight-Jodie.html


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## CanOz (28 July 2012)

Joules MM1 said:


> Can
> 
> Video
> 
> ...




Thanks mate, but i can't seem to play it..


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## Joules MM1 (28 July 2012)

CanOz said:


> Thanks mate, but i can't seem to play it..




location?

runs fine on this system, firefox, maybe flashplayer issue


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## CanOz (28 July 2012)

Joules MM1 said:


> location?
> 
> runs fine on this system, firefox, maybe flashplayer issue




Yeah, it could be just the great fire wall...


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## boofis (29 July 2012)

What browser do you use Oz? Wouldn't play on Chrome for me but got it fine on IE.


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## boofis (31 August 2012)

Still cruising along with SIM, valuable time. Things get a bit tight between uni, work and sim time but not for much longer yewww.






Trading summaries of the past few days. Relatively speaking low volume and range on ES, a few things have been sinking in with the trading. Have been consciously trading less and watching more while no pressure of real finance on the line.


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## ThingyMajiggy (14 October 2012)

How are things going now boofis? still giving this a go?


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> How are things going now boofis? still giving this a go?




Yeah mate still trading sim every night. Just got too lazy to keep posting up results/progress ha! Am doing more active trading on the US treasuries and holding (Read: Trying to hold) longer positions on the ES now. The bsatard is daylight savings at the moment with the longer position I don't get to bed till 4:30/5am if I hold on until the bitter end on a good trending day in the ES. Just yell if there's any stats or anything else you'd like to see/know from this trial period.


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## Trembling Hand (15 October 2012)

boofis said:


> The bsatard is daylight savings at the moment with the longer position I don't get to bed till 4:30/5am




 Why trade it then considering everything else that there is to trade?


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Why trade it then considering everything else that there is to trade?




I guess the main reason is purely the time investment that it's been up to this point to get method established for it, aswell as I want to be doing night and day shifts so while I trade treasuries at night (which I will keep doing as they have been very profitable (sim)) it's easy to keep an eye on ES. But I guess the crux of the matter is that I don't really know much about other contracts.
Have read down the list on IB but am fluffed if I know where to start with choosing a market to trade lol.


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## CanOz (15 October 2012)

You have to consider data feed cost as well. If you didn't have this to consider and you are looking for some other options in highly liquid markets then yeah, there are other options like the K200 and the FESX that are more like your markets for liquidity.

TH, did you trade the K200 for a while?

CanOz


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

And margin and $$/tick aswell for those of us with less than 6 figure accounts


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## ThingyMajiggy (15 October 2012)

Yeah post up your latest session, keen to take a look. Nights definitely take their toll, I used to do that a lot, might be worth a switch to an Asian/European market. Especially if you're just on sim. You holding or scalping the ust's?


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

That's last thursday and friday mate.


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## Joules MM1 (15 October 2012)

boofis said:


> last thursday and friday




you'll get a better idea over a few more days, pref thru a few diff phases.....

def agree to learn/observe/trade hsi and dax for the time perspective.....also, your learning curve/executions are much steeper when not tired....


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

Joules MM1 said:


> you'll get a better idea over a few more days, pref thru a few diff phases.....
> 
> def agree to learn/observe/trade hsi and dax for the time perspective.....also, your learning curve/executions are much steeper when not tired....




Yeah have been doing it 5 days a week since the start of this thread (Except for 1 week off shearing) so am gaining experience step by step.

Nov. 12 is my start date for sim HSI as daytime commitments will be obsolete. 

At the risk of sounding spoon fed, what are some other aus day time markets/contracts people trade?


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> You holding or scalping the ust's?



Scalping essentially I guess.


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## Trembling Hand (15 October 2012)

boofis said:


> At the risk of sounding spoon fed, what are some other aus day time markets/contracts people trade?




Kospi, STW (Taiwan with the SGX) HHI (Honkers), MHI  (Honkers), Nikkie, CL (oil) DAX, FTSE, GC (Gold) and FX.

To be honest I reckon you are F'in nuts trading during the night knowing the concentration level needed.


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## boofis (15 October 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Kospi, STW (Taiwan with the SGX) HHI (Honkers), MHI  (Honkers), Nikkie, CL (oil) DAX, FTSE, GC (Gold) and FX.
> 
> To be honest I reckon you are F'in nuts trading during the night knowing the concentration level needed.




Thanks for the list. And I'll take that as a compliment lol. The treasuries seem to be a tame contract, I wouldn't say the concentration levels needed are unachievable especially given _most_ of the action for me is done by 1am.


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## boofis (16 October 2012)

All on the treasuries tonight. 



ZB is a great contract for a combo of liquidity and $/tick value imo.


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## Trembling Hand (16 October 2012)

boofis said:


> Scalping essentially I guess.




Just a note, scalping is doing 100s of RT not 6 a day.

PLEASE!!


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## CanOz (16 October 2012)

Well done mate! How many contracts?


CanOz


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## boofis (16 October 2012)

Trembling Hand said:


> Just a note, scalping is doing 100s of RT not 6 a day.
> 
> PLEASE!!




He asked whether I was holding or scalping. Neither is exactly what I do but its closer to scalping than it is to holding.

Hey CanOz, thanks mate, had 2 contracts on ZN and 1 ZB so was within my realistic limits for trading live.


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## ThingyMajiggy (16 October 2012)

Cheers for posting it up  how long was that session trading the treasuries last night?


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## boofis (16 October 2012)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> Cheers for posting it up  how long was that session trading the treasuries last night?




All good mate, I wouldn't be where I am now if it weren't for others willing to post up their journeys/learning/etc. Victorian time it opened 11:20pm and then I finished trading about 1:15am.


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