# Gulf of Mexico Oil Spill Disaster



## roland (30 April 2010)

Well, this is going to be worse than Exxon Valdez spill in 1989. There seems to be little doubt that fisheries, wildlife refuges in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida are going to suffer.


Glad I'm not holding BP shares.


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## Bigukraine (2 May 2010)

roland said:


> Well, this is going to be worse than Exxon Valdez spill in 1989. There seems to be little doubt that fisheries, wildlife refuges in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida are going to suffer.
> 
> 
> Glad I'm not holding BP shares.




Bugger the yanks they have been s''''t in everyone's nest and now they have to clean up one in or near their own back yard.... I'm so sad


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## Bushman (3 May 2010)

roland said:


> Well, this is going to be worse than Exxon Valdez spill in 1989. There seems to be little doubt that fisheries, wildlife refuges in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Florida are going to suffer.
> 
> 
> Glad I'm not holding BP shares.




It is some disaster now. 750,000 barrels a day from some reports. 

How this could happen on a modern oil rig is a mystery to me. This will cost BP billions. 

Oil sure is a dirty game.


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## noirua (3 May 2010)

All this, Gulf of Mexico spill, is good medium term news for all the major oil companies - minimum market cap US$40 billion. AS they may well have to be capable of coughing up for a major disaster or even two.

Barack Obama, and indeed many other nations will watch US moves to bundle out the small explorers who can't pay up. 
Basically it's the end of the road for smaller offshore drillers under the United States banner and beyond.

As to Big Oil's spill, it should take about another 7 days for 'Red' Adairs', (yes, 'Red' died in 2004) gang and International Well Control (Red's former key employees) to stop this one, 'though not capping it off in the long term. 

The Gulf Spill is in too deeper waters for divers to be used and the whole well may not be finally plugged off and capped this year.

BP shares may recover some on Tuesday (LSE closed Monday, Bank Holiday) as the recent fall is A$70 to A$80 billion and total costs will be a fraction of that.


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## dalek (3 May 2010)

What all the previous comments fail to acknowledge is the magnitude of impact on the environment. Who really gives a toss about BP or the dip in financial fortunes of those exposed / involved.
This episode will be paid dearly for, initially by all the living sea organisms within many kilometres and then by the local human population.
I know this is a financial web site but lets not forget you can't eat oil or money.


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## trainspotter (3 May 2010)

Seeing how the oil is drifting towards the American shrimping catchment area why don't they just wait for the oil to get closer to the fishing grounds and set it on fire? Instant fried seafood. Feed the world with prawns. Oil all gone. Perfect !

Anyways ....... back to reality ...... This is going to be the worst economic, environmental and damaging politically to the Obama administration and the  WORLD in history. Worse than Chernobyl, Exxon Valdez, Jadugoda toxic leak and 911 put together. We have not yet seen the damage that is about to occur.  BP should be throwing everything they have in the way of logitics to contain this ASAP.


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## CanOz (3 May 2010)

Agree, this is going to be an environmental disaster of mega proportions.

Well done BP, and slimy contractor.

CanOz


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## prawn_86 (4 May 2010)

I'm surprised by the lack of mention this is getting at ASF.

The environmental impact of this is absolutely massive, with Louisiana's seafood industry alone worth $2b pa.

What can be done to stop it happening in the future? IMO these things will happen more regularly as deeper wells are drilled going after the bigger oil targets. Although BHP may compensate those affected (ie fishermen) i bet they dont compensate them for life, it will be a one of payout and then see you later


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## trainspotter (4 May 2010)

Not only in ASF but also mainstream media does not see it as "newsworthy" ?? Hardly a ripple on the 6 o'clock news, not much on other blogs, Greenpeace is silent, no rampaging Greenies telling us the world is going to end when the oil spill hits the shores of the bayou. NUFFIN !

I am guessing that due to the spill has not actually affected the habitat and wildlife yet that it is unimportant. The shrimp fisherman could not go out trawling in the bay due to the horrendous weather anyhow so for them to get jobs with BP to assist in the cleanup is a bonus. I also think that because BP has come out and sai they are responsible for the cleanup costs then it does not rate as newsworthy?

When the West Atlas rig caught on fire off the coast of WA there was HUGE UPROAR !! This went on for weeks then NUFFIN ?? 

Myself I am apalled that this has flown under the radar with little or no factual reporting going on other than a few snippets here and there?


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## Atlas79 (4 May 2010)

Can you guys imagine the uproar if Bush were still in power? Obama took 12 days to visit the site. If they blame Bush for a governor's inability to deal with a hurricane, where is the condemnation of Obama in the media? (Silly question.)


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## newbie trader (5 May 2010)

Heard an American 'army guy' being interviewed on the news...(said something like this) 'well we dont exactly know what to do. We can't just bomb it or attack it so we'll just have to wait I guess'...I found it a little funny.


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## Wysiwyg (5 May 2010)

Dumb humans tapped the mother lode and couldn't control it. Following video is partially factual (i think) and typical American B.S. with prophecies and worst case scenario. Goes for 9 mins.


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## wildkactus (5 May 2010)

A friend sent me these, (he's an OSV captain in the gulf oil field)
they are taken from a support vessel that was nearby when Horizon went up.






















This is going to be a huge loss for Transocean the rig contractor, They will be ultimatly resposible, even though BP is the well owner, its there rig that caused it and them or their insurance that will have to cover it.

one thing we should not forget here is that 11 people died on this rig as well, a truely great loss for their families.

the gulf coast is going to suffer the most from this, the local fishing fleets were just about to start a season too.

lets hope they get it fixed soon.


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## wildkactus (7 May 2010)

Here is a quick video from the AP showing the box that they are lowering over the pipe to catch the oil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6zQ8mS9MiE


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## Smurf1976 (7 May 2010)

trainspotter said:


> Worse than *Chernobyl*, Exxon Valdez, Jadugoda toxic leak and 911 put together. We have not yet seen the damage that is about to occur.  BP should be throwing everything they have in the way of logitics to contain this ASAP.



Can't agree about Chernobyl.

The oil will make a huge mess now, that's for sure. But give it a few years and there is unlikely to be any real lasting impact. And the damage is at least contained - we won't see the stuff turning up in Europe for example.

But if this were a nuclear accident, there would be no prospect of any meaningful cleanup and the effects would spread over a much, much greater area downwind. THAT would be a catastrophy with effectively permanent consequences whereas the oil spill is at worst a temporary mess.

If this accident doesn't convince people that accidents are inevitable then nothing will. That being so, it's foolish in the extreme to undertake activities with truly catastrophic consequences in the event of a major accident. Nuclear power fits into that category very easily and is about the only thing that does...


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## trainspotter (10 May 2010)

Still no media urgency in this story? Occasional grab on the early morning news and not much else. Me thinks it could be if the media make too much of this catstrophe then oil production will cease in the Gulf of Mexico perhaps? Unlikely due to the US oil needs. 2/3rds imported and the rest comes from the Gulf of Mexico (give or take a few million barrels) Something is afoot here.


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## prawn_86 (18 May 2010)

ABC seems to be the only website covering this in relative detail:



> A research vessel has located plumes reported to be up to 16 kilometres long, 4.8 kilometres wide and 92 metres thick that suggest a far greater impact on the marine environment than previously thought



http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/18/2902320.htm?section=justin

Im still astounded by the lack of attention this is recieving. Why???


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## adobee (18 May 2010)

Smurf1976 said:


> Can't agree about Chernobyl.
> 
> The oil will make a huge mess now, that's for sure. But give it a few years and there is unlikely to be any real lasting impact. And the damage is at least contained - we won't see the stuff turning up in Europe for example.
> 
> ...




I would agree with this.. I thought Chernobyl was still burning under a trillion tonnes of concrete .. ?


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## adobee (18 May 2010)

prawn_86 said:


> ABC seems to be the only website covering this in relative detail:
> 
> 
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/18/2902320.htm?section=justin
> ...




Australian media is more interested in Sports player texting, cougars, and the next big ramp / attempt to end someones career. ABC and SBS are the only places you will be lucky to get any news.. BBC comes onto the slightly real news category too..


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## Aussiejeff (30 May 2010)

*UPDATE*

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...test-attempt-to-stem-the-leak-has-failed.html

Some *live* junk shot entertainment... 

http://blog.alexanderhiggins.com/2010/05/20/live-video-feed-webcam-gulf-oil-spill

Will POO sink or rise???


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## disarray (30 May 2010)

Live feed from BP subs 

That was then, this is then. quick piece about parallels with the  Ixtoc oil spill 



she makes a good point about technology. the companies say tech has become better but only at drilling and extraction, there appears to have been zero progress in disaster recovery.


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## explod (30 May 2010)

disarray;558086
she makes a good point about technology. the companies say tech has become better but only at drilling and extraction said:
			
		

> Its all for profit and the self, TV news tonight shows the flow has not decreased one iota.   There is no solution, we are all too gready.
> 
> No one wants answers anymore so a waste of time trying to give them.


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## Smurf1976 (30 May 2010)

I wonder how many people have looked at that big guzzler sitting in the driveway and contemplated just who really is the cause of disasters like this?

Bottom line is that if we're going to use lots of oil then we're going to get it from deep water, polar regions and all sorts of other hazardous means. Either we accept the inevitable accidents or we don't use so much of the damn stuff. Most people will never accept responsibility for the consequences of their own behaviour however...


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## Wysiwyg (31 May 2010)

disarray said:


> she makes a good point about technology. the companies say tech has become better but only at drilling and extraction, there appears to have been zero progress in disaster recovery.




That is a damning piece of video. America is so fake in many regards. 

I visualise some fat guy stuffing his face with burgers and waving to the blonde girls while driving his 6 litre pig down a Los Angeles highway on the way to Las Vegas for a shot of poker before catching a plane to Florida for a serious guzzolene burn at the Daytona 500.

Not that Australia is far behind. American media, television and movies are consumed and embraced by millions around the world on a daily basis. Anyway, I hope our big guy saw this March on his trip to Daytona Beach and plants a seed of change. Somehow I think it will be stuff ourselves silly until there is no more "cheap" oil.   



> It’s being dubbed the “Oil Spill Awareness March” — *although if you’re not aware of BP’s catastrophic spill in the Gulf of Mexico by now, you’re probably not registering a pulse.*
> 
> The event, being held this Sunday (May 30) in Daytona Beach, is really a rallying call to those opposed to Big Oil and our nation’s voracious appetite for fossil fuels. “We must end our addiction to dirty fuels and convince the government we are ready for alternative energy sources,” March organizers


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## Aussiejeff (31 May 2010)

IMO this latest NASA satellite pic shows the real extent, in contrast to US Government agency NOAA's pathetic "Trajectory Maps" which show little current threat... http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/456428main_pia13150-full.jpg

NASA full link... http://www.nasa.gov/topics/earth/features/oilspill/index.html

Just imagine what a hurricane might do with that lot!


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## Bushman (31 May 2010)

Smurf1976 said:


> I wonder how many people have looked at that big guzzler sitting in the driveway and contemplated just who really is the cause of disasters like this?
> 
> Bottom line is that if we're going to use lots of oil then we're going to get it from deep water, polar regions and all sorts of other hazardous means. Either we accept the inevitable accidents or we don't use so much of the damn stuff. Most people will never accept responsibility for the consequences of their own behaviour however...




great post. there is a price you pay. 

i reckon this will cost Obama the presidency even though, like the GFC, it is a legacy that has been left to him.


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## trainspotter (31 May 2010)

Finally ! The media has awoken to this catastrophe ! It only took BP to admit the amount of oil being leaked is THREE times the amount they told the public. It only took the oil to hit the mainland and start destroying fauna and flora with the usual footage of birds being cleaned with soap and men with rakes scraping the beaches. I guess when it is just blobbing around the ocean it does not make for good TV ? 

I remember when the Exxon Valdez oil spill occurred in Prince William Sound, Alaska, on March 24, 1989. Same thing here with little media coverage until the wildlife got oiled. This time there was a spectacular fireworks to begin with when the oil rig burst into flames. A story that I heard about the rehabilitation of the harbour seals (not sure if it is true or not) was that they spent something like $125,000 cleaning and nursing back to health two of the affected mammals. Big day come that they are ready to be released into their natural habitat with the usual dignitaries and press gathered to catch this momentous occasion. Open the box and let these two seals into the harbour. YAY ! they all hug each other on a job well done. 2 minutes later a pod of killer whales happened to be cruising passed the area of release ......... NOM NOM NOM NOM .... no more seals . Perfect !


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## Aussiejeff (31 May 2010)

trainspotter said:


> Finally ! The media has awoken to this catastrophe ! It only took BP to admit the amount of oil being leaked is THREE times the amount they told the public. It only took the oil to hit the mainland and start destroying fauna and flora with the usual footage of birds being cleaned with soap and men with rakes scraping the beaches. I guess when it is just blobbing around the ocean it does not make for good TV ?
> 
> I remember when the Exxon Valdez oil spill occurred in Prince William Sound, Alaska, on March 24, 1989. Same thing here with little media coverage until the wildlife got oiled. This time there was a spectacular fireworks to begin with when the oil rig burst into flames. A story that I heard about the rehabilitation of the harbour seals (not sure if it is true or not) was that *they spent something like $125,000 cleaning and nursing back to health two of the affected mammals*. Big day come that they are ready to be released into their natural habitat with the usual dignitaries and press gathered to catch this momentous occasion. Open the box and let these two seals into the harbour. YAY ! they all hug each other on a job well done. *2 minutes later a pod of killer whales happened to be cruising passed the area of release ......... NOM NOM NOM NOM .... no more seals* . Perfect !




Obviously, those Killerwattsits had expensive tastes....


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## Aussiejeff (1 June 2010)

*UPDATE*

BP robot cutter attempting to chop off damaged piping...

http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_int...local_assets/bp_homepage/html/rov_stream.html

I admire the skill of the techs driving those things from 5,000' up in a swell!


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## awg (1 June 2010)

I predict this will be a world changing event

when it sinks in that a vast area, previously a marine foodbowl, will be a marine desert for at least a couple of years, maybe many more, right in the heartland of USA


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## trainspotter (2 June 2010)

trainspotter said:


> This is going to be the worst economic, environmental and damaging politically to the Obama administration and the  WORLD in history. Worse than Chernobyl, Exxon Valdez, Jadugoda toxic leak and 911 put together. We have not yet seen the damage that is about to occur.  BP should be throwing everything they have in the way of logitics to contain this ASAP.




I wrote this on the 3rd May in post #6 ....... Now they are saying BP is a takeover target and "could break" the company? Oh dear !

http://www.news.com.au/business/bp-...b-as-shares-dive/story-e6frfm1i-1225874267296


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## Aussiejeff (2 June 2010)

*UPDATE*

BP FAIL. Gives up on Top Kill.



> Coast Guard Admiral Thad Allen said *BP will wait to try to kill the well with one of two relief wells, which are due to hit total depth in August*.
> 
> The UK supermajor has resumed drilling one of the relief wells to intercept the blown out Macondo bore after stopping it to ready the rig's blowout preventer (BOP) to go on top of the crippled Macondo unit.
> 
> Allen said that *an option to cap the well by stacking a second BOP to shut in the blown out Macondo well is now "off the table"* and efforts will focus on collecting the flow from the well.



http://www.upstreamonline.com/live/article216456.ece

Next plan, please....


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## Krusty the Klown (3 June 2010)

If anyone is interested.

Here is a website that overlays the actual oil spill surface area over your location on Google Maps.

http://www.ifitwasmyhome.com/

It's staggering in size, I did not realise how bad it was until I saw this.

And this is only the surface area, it does not take account of the depth of the slick which will make it orders of magnitude worse than this map shows.


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## Smurf1976 (3 June 2010)

Krusty the Klown said:


> It's staggering in size, I did not realise how bad it was until I saw this.



Indeed. In Australian terms, from the map it looks about the size of the entire state of Tasmania, or larger than all of Australia's major cities combined. Imagine that, either all of Tasmania or alternatively all of Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Adelaide and Perth covered in oil. That's a rather big mess...

Even open cut mining and use of brown coal looks decidedly "green" compared to this mess.


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## Whiskers (4 June 2010)

What gets me about this mess is how easily it could have been prevented.

I think I recall there was some sort of valve near the well head but was unable to be shut off by a robot, why?

Why wouldn't you have something like vacuum brakes, a mechanical spring or chamber loaded vacuum or pressure valve on the well head deep under the sea that required pressure or vacuum (from the operating platform) to remain open, but automatically closed at a controlled rate under the mechanical spring pressure or deep water pressure when the pressure or vacuum source was broken, suck as when the pipe is broken or the platform is destroyed.

Seems so obvious, isn't it!?


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## pacestick (5 June 2010)

THe effects of a hurricane on the oil spill  have been listed  at the following web site you will need to download the pdf

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/


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## Aussiejeff (5 June 2010)

> *BP oil spill cap a limited success*
> 
> From: AP June 05, 2010 1:04AM
> 
> ...



http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/br...-limited-success/story-e6frf7jx-1225875734541

What?

Only a paltry 1,000 _Barrels_ (42 US gallons per) per day? Oh well, that only leaves a measly 18,000 or so BPD (or 756,000 gallons) to clean up now.

Should be a cinch, what with Super Prez in control.

LMFAO


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## Smurf1976 (5 June 2010)

Whiskers said:


> What gets me about this mess is how easily it could have been prevented.
> 
> I think I recall there was some sort of valve near the well head but was unable to be shut off by a robot, why?
> 
> ...



I'm no expert on the technicalities of underwater oil fields, but to my understanding the best means of limiting the impact of a blowout such as this one is to have a second well already drilled and ready to relieve the pressure if needed. Had that been done, the situation would be able to be brought under control _much_ more quickly - worth noting that much of the delay now is because it takes 90 days to drill such a well (which BP are to my understanding doing right now) - but 90 days is a rather long time to wait in a situation such as this...

Waiting until there's an actual emergency before putting contingency plans in place to deal with it is much like deciding to install fire sprinklers when the building is already on fire. Too late, the damage has started and it will continue for much longer than it would have if such measures had been installed previously.

Note that I am not in any way having a go at BP. Basically the whole industry does it much the same way - obviously BP couldn't be expected to spend far more than anyone else to extract the same oil otherwise they'd end up broke. 

I reiterate my point about accidents in general though. Lots of systems and ALL of them failed either totally or partially, thus leading to the mess we have now. Something to think about next time you hear someone claiming that "it can't go wrong, we've got this many safety systems, backups and so on...". 

Bottom line is if man built it then it can go wrong and sooner or later it will. Hence there are some things we just shouldn't attempt in the first place. Drilling for oil in Antarctica would be one, nuclear power is another. Sooner or later it will go wrong and with either of those two examples we'd be stuck with a cleanup task that makes this disaster in the Gulf of Mexico seem trivial in comparisson.


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## Aussiejeff (7 June 2010)

*UPDATE* 


> A containment cap fitted onto a leaking well in the Gulf of Mexico is capturing 10,000 barrels of oil per day, BP Chief Executive Tony Hayward said Sunday.
> 
> Hayward, the subject of speculation that he may be forced out of his position due to the political fallout from the environmental disaster, also told the BBC that he had strong support from BP's board.
> 
> ...



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37536554/ns/disaster_in_the_gulf/

Hmmm, "the vast majority" huh? That's funny. When I look at their live video feed http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/37412412#37412412 I could swear that sucker is blowing just as much gunk as last week!

Oh, right, Mr Wayward, sir. I'll believe whatever you want to spin my way....?

Sure. Whatever you say, sir.


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## Aussiejeff (12 June 2010)

*PHEW*

From the US Environmental Protection Agency's home page, one could be forgiven for asking "Oil spill? What oil spill???" 



> Air
> Air Data
> EPA's air monitoring conducted through June 10, 2010, has found that *air quality levels for ozone and particulates are normal on the Gulf coastline for this time of year*.
> 
> ...




I'm totally dumfounded that they deployed teams "to collect a small number of samples". Why not a large sampling? Oh, that's right. This is nothing to worry about, folks. It's ALL NORMAL.

Sediment samples not showing elevated levels of oily gunk?? ARE YOU KIDDING ME??? Hmmm. Maybe all those video news clips of oil saturated beach sediment are fakes made in Hollywood backlots?? 

The US certainly takes the cake as one of the "best" countries where authorities do their utmost to cover up bureaucratic catastrophes or failings and bury their heads up their collective a$$e$. 

Then again, our Lil KRuddster & his mass of bureaubloat cronies seem to be doing their utmost to emulate 'em.... (insulation fiasco, anyone?)

*sigh*


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## noirua (12 June 2010)

President Obama doesn't publicise the fact that America owns 39% of BP and the rest of the world 61%. Close to 100% of those working for BP in the States are Americans.
It was Americans combined with Halliburton and Transocean, American companies, that supplied the faulty valve and positioned it.

I can see that BP have plenty of cash and from the cost point of view, Obama realises that it's best to land this on BP as they can sort out the problem better than Rig supplier Transocean and sub-sea cementer Halliburton. 

Set to go through the American courts for years and lawyers are lining up big time on this one.  Should be a 4 year gravy train.

There are NZ interests in BP through BP Oil NZ.


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## Julia (12 June 2010)

noirua said:


> President Obama doesn't publicise the fact that America owns 39% of BP



I didn't know that, noirua.  Thanks.

Let's remember that if this had happened with one of our companies, under the proposed RSPT, we taxpayers would be picking up the tab for 40% of the cleanup bill.


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## JimmyJimbo (12 June 2010)

If you go to BP's website you can read their Press Release from June 10. The headline of the Press Release reads...

*"BP is Not Aware of Any Reason for Share Price Movement"*

I don't have 5 posts yet so can't post the direct link.

[BP dot com]/genericarticle.do?categoryId=2012968&contentId=7062827


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## Smurf1976 (12 June 2010)

noirua said:


> President Obama doesn't publicise the fact that America owns 39% of BP and the rest of the world 61%. Close to 100% of those working for BP in the States are Americans.
> It was Americans combined with Halliburton and Transocean, American companies, that supplied the faulty valve and positioned it.
> 
> I can see that BP have plenty of cash and from the cost point of view, Obama realises that it's best to land this on BP as they can sort out the problem better than Rig supplier Transocean and sub-sea cementer Halliburton.



Halliburton isn't exactly a small business...


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## Aussiejeff (14 June 2010)

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/06/08/us/20100608-oil-spill-live-video-feed-bp.html

BP's cup gusheth over..... still....


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## DB008 (15 June 2010)

I haven't heard anything in the mainstream media in regards to alternative fuel/energies? The world will still be hooked on oil no doubt, even after this disaster.


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## trainspotter (15 June 2010)

Obama said oil spill " 'echoes 9/11' because it will change the nation's psyche for years to come." In an interview with Politico, Obama said that the oil spill " 'echoes 9/11' because it will change the nation's psyche for years to come." He further stated: "In the same way that our view of our vulnerabilities and our foreign policy was shaped profoundly by 9/11 ... I think this disaster is going to shape how we think about the environment and energy for many years to come."

911 comparisons already. Just got Chernobyl and Jadugoda toxic leak to go.

Independent fund to be setup as well for compensation: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100613/pl_afp/usoilpollutionenvironment

Just gets better and better.


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## bandicoot76 (15 June 2010)

does anyone have any comments on the following 3 rumours currently doing the rounds about the gulf oil spill:

1) just days before the disaster goldman sachs, for no apparent reason, sold a massive parcel (i have heard it was their total holding) of BP

2) BP tech's investigating the disaster say that there was signs of tampering on the safety relief systems that should have prevented the explosion

3) president obama is considering trying to seal the well with a tactical nuclear device

i do not know if there is any truth behind these rumours or if it is just BS... was wondering if anyone else had heard them and, if so, what their opinions about them are?


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## explod (15 June 2010)

bandicoot76 said:


> does anyone have any comments on the following 3 rumours currently doing the rounds about the gulf oil spill:
> 
> 1) just days before the disaster goldman sachs, for no apparent reason, sold a massive parcel (i have heard it was their total holding) of BP
> 
> ...




No one wants to even consider the dire possibility.  I picked up a similar rumour re Goldman Sachs selling thier shares two days prior, but no one would want to know.   

So forget it, its best we stay dumb and out of trouble.   Conspiracy theories are no fun these days.


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## Garpal Gumnut (15 June 2010)

Anyone on ASF holding BP shares would be well advised to sell them tonight.

Every brass nut in BP will need to used or sold to seal this leak and compensate the people of the southern States of the US for the pollution caused. 

There will be nothing left for investors.

gg


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## bellenuit (15 June 2010)

bandicoot76 said:


> does anyone have any comments on the following 3 rumours currently doing the rounds about the gulf oil spill:
> 
> 1) just days before the disaster goldman sachs, for no apparent reason, sold a massive parcel (i have heard it was their total holding) of BP
> 
> ...




I doubt if Obama would give any consideration to 3), but apparently some US politician has proposed such an idea. I can't recall who, or whether he was Democrat or GOP, but there was a brief mention of his suggestion on John Stewart's Today Show a few days ago.


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## son of baglimit (16 June 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Anyone on ASF holding BP shares would be well advised to sell them tonight.
> 
> Every brass nut in BP will need to used or sold to seal this leak and compensate the people of the southern States of the US for the pollution caused.
> 
> ...




i know of someone with oil industry knowledge who shorted BP the day they began the procedure to pump mud into the well to block it, saying he knew it was a complete joke of a process. he also now suggests as you do that BP are going to find it hard to survive this.

http://www.drillingahead.com/forum/...izon-1?id=3116006:Topic:99042&page=1#comments

if you have a spare few hours, read thru this oil industry forum on the whole situation there.


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## Aussiejeff (16 June 2010)

son of baglimit said:


> i know of someone with oil industry knowledge who shorted BP the day they began the procedure to pump mud into the well to block it, saying he knew it was a complete joke of a process. he also now suggests as you do that *BP are going to find it hard to survive this.*
> 
> http://www.drillingahead.com/forum/...izon-1?id=3116006:Topic:99042&page=1#comments
> 
> if you have a spare few hours, read thru this oil industry forum on the whole situation there.




Surely not.

Wouldn't BP fall into the "too big to fail" category? 

What's that? Oh, yeah - Pretty Pollies preen & tell us NO company is too big to fail now. Sure, sure.... 

Total BS.

US might not be too keen to attend the BP Finances Rescue Party, but I'm pretty sure the UK will, no matter WHAT it costs! Too many fingers in BP's sloppy pie...

IMO.


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## Whiskers (16 June 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> Surely not.
> 
> Wouldn't BP fall into the "too big to fail" category?
> 
> ...




A bit of natural justice maybe. I wasn't keen on BP increasing it's market share in Aus. Just don't like the way they market and price their products.

Maybe an opportunity for BHP to gulp them up. That should go down ok with the pommes, or at least the former Billiton shareholders.


----------



## Bushman (16 June 2010)

son of baglimit said:


> he also now suggests as you do that BP are going to find it hard to survive this.




Their debt has been downgraded to BBB by Fitch. So the options now will be highly dilutive rights issue or a takeover which might be in the best interests of shareholders. H/e how much would you need to provide for restitution and environmental remediation?  

They are dead ducks and will never do business again in the Yanks with the current Board or Executive. Credibility is shattered.  

I heard all the other oil execs bagging them at a congressional hearing, including Exxon saying they would not have drilled the well like BP did


----------



## Agentm (16 June 2010)

matt simpson has interesting views


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MARDF8F4P4


pretty amazing and dramatic solution, nuclear option!!


----------



## trainspotter (16 June 2010)

BP have gone all out and now have a Pin Up Girl advertising their products !


----------



## Whiskers (16 June 2010)

trainspotter said:


> BP have gone all out and now have a Pin Up Girl advertising their products !




That's a good one Trainspotter... and I'm sure it will stick (pun intended).


----------



## doctorj (16 June 2010)

Agentm said:


> pretty amazing and dramatic solution, nuclear option!!



If I recall, the former Soviet Union did this a few times in Central Asia (Kyrgzstan and/or Uzebekistan from memory).

This email was doing the rounds here yesterday.  Hopefully can add some perspective to the size of the spill.



> BP and olympic swimming pools
> 
> > Have burgled this via a colleague from the Gartman letter - apologies
> > if you've seen it already... the letter doesnt do the maths but I have
> ...


----------



## bellenuit (17 June 2010)

doctorj said:


> > - 10,000 bbls a day spilled = 1,440 cubic metres a day




Latest figures are much higher than that. 35K to 60K barrels a day.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/06/15/oil-spill-estimate-increa_n_613349.html


----------



## Aussiejeff (17 June 2010)

Speaking of "latest figures" being much higher than earlier estimates, QBE Insurance has just released a statement that includes "claims to date worth $29 million in relation to BP's Deepwater Horizon rig explosion and oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, United States".

Major insurers such as QBE must be awaiting with trepidation the day when they will have to disclose the final payout figure for that lot! In QBE's case, I'd be surprised if it wasn't multiples of the current figure. How long is a piece of string....??


----------



## pacestick (17 June 2010)

I dont know whether the live feed is just a different angle but it seems to have stopped


----------



## derty (17 June 2010)

Quoted a section of an extremely sobering comment from a reader at The Oil Drum. Basically stating that the casing within the sea floor is compromised and that none of their current methods will be able to stop the flow and the best they can hope for is to collect a portion of it. The relief wells are only current option and their success is not guaranteed.  
The whole comment: http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593#comment-648967


			
				comment from The Oil Drum said:
			
		

> ... All the actions and few tid bits of information all lead to one inescapable conclusion. The well pipes below the sea floor are broken and leaking. Now you have some real data of how BP's actions are evidence of that, as well as some murky statement from "BP officials" confirming the same.
> 
> I took some time to go into a bit of detail concerning the failure of Top Kill because this was a significant event. To those of us outside the real inside loop, yet still fairly knowledgeable, it was a major confirmation of what many feared. That the system below the sea floor has serious failures of varying magnitude in the complicated chain, and it is breaking down and it will continue to.
> 
> ...


----------



## Aussiejeff (17 June 2010)

pacestick said:


> I dont know whether the live feed is just a different angle but it seems to have stopped




Still flowin' here...

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/06/08/us/20100608-oil-spill-live-video-feed-bp.html

_"Gush, baby, gush...."_


----------



## DB008 (17 June 2010)

I don't know how to put a You Tube video in, so here is the link.
Could be hog-wash, but an interesting view on the whole event

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3_23PFnTZ8


----------



## -Bevo- (17 June 2010)

Nick Radge had this video posted on Facebook, as bad as this is I couldn't help but laugh my guts out at this.

*BP Spills Coffee* 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AAa0gd7ClM


----------



## Whiskers (17 June 2010)

-Bevo- said:


> Nick Radge had this video posted on Facebook, as bad as this is I couldn't help but laugh my guts out at this.
> 
> *BP Spills Coffee*
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AAa0gd7ClM




lol Yeah, I'll pay that!


----------



## basilio (18 June 2010)

> Quoted a section of an extremely sobering comment from a reader at The Oil Drum. Basically stating that the casing within the sea floor is compromised and that none of their current methods will be able to stop the flow and the best they can hope for is to collect a portion of it. The relief wells are only current option and their success is not guaranteed.
> The whole comment: http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6593#comment-648967




"Thanks"  for that reference Derty. I've just read the whole transcript and it is downright terrifying. Unfortunately the guy seems to have a very good grasp of the situation and has researched his material in great detail. 

*If this guy is even half right we are facing a world environmental emergency.*


----------



## Calliope (18 June 2010)

basilio said:


> *If this guy is even half right we are facing a world environmental emergency.*




It has gone past *emergency* and is now *disaster*. It will make Chernobyl look like a picnic. The economic fallout will be huge.


----------



## Broadway (18 June 2010)

Someone needs to call Bruce Willis, get him to drill to 800 feet and drop a nuke down to collapse the rock and seal the whole leak.

Have they got shuttles that go underwater?


----------



## basilio (18 June 2010)

Was doing some reading from one of the sites previously noted. Very interesting observation about what happened before the blowout.



> There is also evidence that BP, Halliburton, and Transocean sank a drill to a depth of 35,000 feet at the Deep Horizon site some six months ago without the required permits from the federal government. WMR has learned from U.S. government sources that the drilling at 35,000 feet caused a major catastrophic event that required the firms' oil rig personnel to quickly pull up the drill and close the drill hole.
> However, the Deep Horizon re-sank the drill some six months after the unspecified "catastrophe," resulting in another, more destructive chain of events following the explosion that destroyed the rig, killing eleven workers. When the Deep Horizon blew up, WMR has been told it also "blew down," cracking the the sub-seabed pipe that may have been re-drilled to a depth of between 25,000 to 30,000 feet, again, without a government permit.




http://www.drillingahead.com/profiles/blogs/british-petroleum-the


----------



## Mofra (18 June 2010)

bellenuit said:


> I doubt if Obama would give any consideration to 3), but apparently some US politician has proposed such an idea. I can't recall who, or whether he was Democrat or GOP, but there was a brief mention of his suggestion on John Stewart's Today Show a few days ago.



The Nuke option is doing the e-mail rounds too:



> "Heard you mention the oil disaster in the Gulf of Mexico this morning, and you (and most everyone else except maybe US talk show host George Noory) are totally missing the boat on how big and bad a disaster this is.
> 
> First fact, the original estimate was about 5,000 gallons of oil a day spilling into the ocean. Now they're saying 200,000 gallons a day. That's over a million gallons of crude oil a week!
> 
> ...


----------



## trainspotter (18 June 2010)

Not sure an A bomb would solve anything? Maybe push the first 3000 feet or so of mud around and maybe widen the hole? The first few thousand feet of the seabed will not be able to hold the pressure back. If you blow an A bomb to shift the ground so it 'bends' the several thousand feet of (production) casing, that will just let the flow into the sediments. From there, it will work it's way up, break up the sediments and keep working its way up to the seabed floor. And the gas will expand, break up more sediments, and then, at some point in the not so distant future, this will start to seep into the gulf and go on for years. You will no longer have ONE spot where the flow enters the gulf, but several holes all around the wellhead and ocean floor.

My bet is that Florida Keys Bubba Gump shrimp will be more expensive than Beluga Caviar by Christmas 2010.


----------



## derty (18 June 2010)

> When the rig sank it flipped over and landed on top of the drill hole some 5,000 feet under the ocean.
> 
> Now they've got a hole in the ocean floor, 5,000 feet down with a wrecked oil drilling rig sitting on top of is spewing 200,000 barrels of oil a day into the ocean. Take a moment and consider that, will you!



You would be doing quite well to have the rig land on the well head 5000 feet down. From what I have read the rig came to rest about 1500 feet from the well. Also the latest estimate is about 65,000 barrels of oil/day. 

Sounds like emotive bollocks to me.

A nuke may vitrify the rock enough to seal the hole, although away from the zone where enough energy is released to melt the rock the effect will likely be fracturing of the rock. With my limited knowledge, the downside of a nuke would be that it may create a fracture system that would allow oil to escape to the sea floor such that it could never be contained.


----------



## Broadway (18 June 2010)

-Bevo- said:


> Nick Radge had this video posted on Facebook, as bad as this is I couldn't help but laugh my guts out at this.
> 
> *BP Spills Coffee*
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AAa0gd7ClM




Why Kevin Costner...

McGyver, Norris or the A-team would have far better ideas.


----------



## Gar (18 June 2010)




----------



## trainspotter (18 June 2010)

The above post sums it up nicely and is post of the month IMO.


----------



## trainspotter (18 June 2010)

trainspotter said:


> Seeing how the oil is drifting towards the American shrimping catchment area why don't they just wait for the oil to get closer to the fishing grounds and set it on fire? Instant fried seafood. Feed the world with prawns. Oil all gone. Perfect !
> 
> Anyways ....... back to reality ...... This is going to be the worst economic, environmental and damaging politically to the Obama administration and the  WORLD in history. Worse than Chernobyl, Exxon Valdez, Jadugoda toxic leak and 911 put together. We have not yet seen the damage that is about to occur.  BP should be throwing everything they have in the way of logitics to contain this ASAP.




Check the dates  I posted this #6 thread 3rd-May-2010, 08:04 PM .......... zzzzzzzzz

Nuclear blown cap top down? Hmmmm .......lets think about this peoples


----------



## disarray (19 June 2010)

trainspotter said:


> Not sure an A bomb would solve anything?




A-bombs solve everything. it's the peak of our achievement isn't it?


----------



## wayneL (19 June 2010)

Broadway said:


> Why Kevin Costner...
> 
> McGyver, Norris or the A-team would have far better ideas.




http://www.google.co.nz/search?hl=e...&aq=2&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=kevin+costner+&gs_rfai=


----------



## basilio (21 June 2010)

Why Kevin Costner ? Because as Wayne pointed out he actually has a technology that looks as if it could separate the oil from the water.

Looks really good and certainly the most promising way of dealing with the sxxx that is going down.

And of course they would also get to recover the oil as well.  

Probably the only downer is the sheer volume of water already polluted and still coming out.  But in theory they could go on a crash building program to produce as many as can be used.  Well done


----------



## electronicmaster (21 June 2010)

It is estimated that One to Four Million Gallons "a day" is leaking in the Golf of Mexico Strata.  Estimated because it is hard to measure multiple Oil leaks many Miles away (5 to 20) from the major well head.

The Oil PSI is measured to be at least 20,000 PSI to 70,000 PSI out of the well head alone.  Capping the Well head may have caused the Oil leaks Meany Miles away.

And the gases is going to kill a lot of people too.  Reports are also stating that they drilled in to a Batholith 30 thousand feet deep in the ground (not counting the Sea level)

Here is the real news no media or government will ever tell, until it is all to late.


----------



## trainspotter (23 June 2010)

Well, well, well, (pun intended) what a surprise?

US stocks skidded today after a judge blocked the government's ban on deepwater drilling in the Gulf of Mexico and the White House said it would appeal, raising uncertainty about oil production. 

The Dow Jones Industrial Average dropped 148.89 points (1.43 per cent) to 10,293.52 in closing trades.

The tech-rich Nasdaq index shed 27.29 points (1.19 per cent) at 2261.80 and the S&P 500 index, a broader measure of the markets, retreated 17.83 points (1.60 per cent) to a provisional 1095.37.

The market responded to a Louisiana judge ruling that blocked a six-month ban on deepwater drilling in the Gulf of Mexico ordered by President Barack Obama in response to the BP oil-spill disaster.

The White House immediately said it would appeal the judge's favourable ruling on the challenge filed by 32 oil companies.

*The drilling freeze has raised investor concerns about its long-term impact on US oil production.*

P.S. Abiogenic petroleum origin is an alternative hypothesis ONLY and not the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help me God.


----------



## drsmith (23 June 2010)

electronicmaster said:


> Here is the real news no media or government will ever tell, until it is all to late.



That godbotherer is way too painfull listen to. He could get to the point in 1/10th of the time if he wanted to.

A weekly church sermon from him would be like visiting hell. By the end of the second clip I had had enough torture and that was 18 minutes more than it deserved.


----------



## electronicmaster (23 June 2010)

drsmith said:


> That godbotherer is way too painfull listen to. He could get to the point in 1/10th of the time if he wanted to.
> 
> A weekly church sermon from him would be like visiting hell. By the end of the second clip I had had enough torture and that was 18 minutes more than it deserved.




I know, I know.  Sorry lol

At least it is better than the media blackout we currently have.


----------



## DB008 (23 June 2010)

http://www.wimp.com/oilpowder/


----------



## akkopower (23 June 2010)

DB008 said:


> http://www.wimp.com/oilpowder/




Seems like a pretty ****e idea to me. The "science guy" says you need a ratio of 1:1 to solidify crude, I don know what that means vol/vol, mass/mass or mol/mol. But whichever it is that will be a huge amount of powder. Anyone know what the powder actually is?


----------



## electronicmaster (23 June 2010)

akkopower said:


> Seems like a pretty ****e idea to me. The "science guy" says you need a ratio of 1:1 to solidify crude, I don know what that means vol/vol, mass/mass or mol/mol. But whichever it is that will be a huge amount of powder. Anyone know what the powder actually is?




I agree, that chemical drys up very quickly too, and it tends to float.  So you won't soak up much Oil with that stuff.   

Especially when they are pumping chemicals in the sea to prevent the Oil from surfacing.


----------



## spooly74 (23 June 2010)

Well Blowout Basics for the Beginner



> I'm RESCME from CNN's commenting blog, I'm a well control specialist with hundreds of well fires and blow-out cappings under my belt including a shat load in Kuwait after Hussein had his toads torch the place, I am also a municipal firefighter and rescue tech.
> There has been a lot of questions as to what exactly goes on in a blowout and what can be done to plug them or cap them.   I will try to provide a format in laymans terms as best as I can in hopes you may more fully understand the situation and will be able to ask the right kind of questions of your government and entities related to this disaster in the gulf.  I also have made this page so that if people understand the dynamics a little more, perhaps an average Joe or Jolene might just come up with a brilliant and un-thought of idea in bringing this terrible thing to a faster finish.


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## electronicmaster (24 June 2010)

News Flash.  They knocked off the Cap off the Well.  Here is some video footage.


----------



## basilio (24 June 2010)

Knocking off the cap.. THAT is terrifying.  I understand they managed to put the cap on when the pressure was significantly less than now.  So it will be interesting to see how they mange to put another cap on the pipe with the current  gush. 

Oh well we were here for a good time not a long one.


----------



## Aussiejeff (24 June 2010)

basilio said:


> Knocking off the cap.. THAT is terrifying.  I understand they managed to put the cap on when the pressure was significantly less than now.  So it will be interesting to see how they mange to put another cap on the pipe with the current  gush.
> 
> Oh well we were here for a good time not a long one.




No wuckers.

Looks like they removed the cap to backflush & clear some blocking (crystalised methane?). Just saw 3-4 backflushes as the cap was held a few metres away from the gushing outlet, then moved back over. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/06/08/us/20100608-oil-spill-live-video-feed-bp.html

Nothing to see here.

Obama in control.

*Update*

Got the cap back over and very little overflow seen... in the first minute so far. *Guess it depends on how often the cap blocks up*.

**Update2**

About 2 mins. LOL. Cap off.

Gush, gush, gush.....


----------



## electronicmaster (24 June 2010)

*Oil rain: BP's black gold lands on Louisiana *



Could that be the Corexit Chemical?


----------



## Aussiejeff (25 June 2010)

Meanwhile...



> June 24 (Bloomberg) -- *A federal judge denied the U.S. government’s request to delay an order that allows deepwater oil drilling to resume*.
> 
> U.S. District Judge Martin Feldman in New Orleans today refused to stay his June 22 order lifting a moratorium imposed by President Barack Obama in reaction to the worst oil spill in U.S. history. The government said last night it would appeal and asked Feldman to put his order on hold.



http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aU3jcM1Aa_Z0&pos=8

Wow! Marty Feldman making a comical one man band grand stand against the US gummint. What a maroon....


----------



## electronicmaster (25 June 2010)

*Kindra Arnesan - Quoted on PBS Newshour 6232010* 

Confirmation of the local overview Venice LA - 6/19/10.. Quoted on PBS today in one sentence. Hear the horrors of the front lines and behind scenes workings of the BP Gulf Oil Spill Catastrophe. This Venice LA local has been granted security clearance to see it all.

http://video.godlikeproductions.com/video/Kindra_Arnesan_-_Quoted_on_PBS_Newshour_6232010

http://GulfEmergencySummit.org


----------



## electronicmaster (25 June 2010)

electronicmaster said:


> *Kindra Arnesan - Quoted on PBS Newshour 6232010*
> 
> Confirmation of the local overview Venice LA - 6/19/10.. Quoted on PBS today in one sentence. Hear the horrors of the front lines and behind scenes workings of the BP Gulf Oil Spill Catastrophe. This Venice LA local has been granted security clearance to see it all.
> 
> ...




Here is the youtube link.


----------



## haggis (25 June 2010)

this attachment was taken off reuters this morning.
Some of the methane readings around the drill site have hit 1,000,000 parts per billion--Safe level is around 61 parts per billion.

I hope that they can seal this thing, before it is too late for the gulf area.


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 June 2010)

What an incompetent bunch of wankers the US EPA is.

Their last surface water samples were taken on 15 & 17 June. Thats almost two weeks ago! Where the hell have they been since, when oil has been washing up all over the coastline? 

And guess what. Their website shows from the results of those tests that there was practically NO IMPACT on water quality in the Gulf region from the oil spill. Oh really? Did this event even happen? 

Coincidentally, NOAA's historical projection maps (which I eventually found for those particular dates - "hard" to find  - wonder why?) show that on 15 & 17 June, the oil slick was being blown well eastward, far away from the coast area where EPA sampling was restricted to.

Who is the EPA protecting?

Mayber they should rename the agency *B*PA?

LOL


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 June 2010)

What an incompetent bunch of wankers the US EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) is.

Their last surface water samples were taken on 15 & 17 June. Thats almost two weeks ago! Where the hell have they been since, when oil has been washing up all over the coastline? 

And guess what. Their website shows from the results of those tests that there was practically NO IMPACT on water quality in the Gulf region from the oil spill. Oh really? Did this event even happen? 

Coincidentally, NOAA's historical projection maps (which I eventually found for those particular dates - "hard" to find  - wonder why?) show that on 15 & 17 June, the oil slick was being blown well eastward, far away from the coast area where EPA sampling was restricted to.

Who is the EPA protecting?

Mayber they should rename the agency *B*PA?

LOL


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 June 2010)

What an incompetent bunch of wankers the US EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) is.

Their last surface water samples were taken on 15 & 17 June. Thats almost two weeks ago! Where the hell have they been since, when oil has been washing up all over the coastline? 

And guess what. Their website shows from the results of those tests that there was practically NO IMPACT on water quality in the Gulf region from the oil spill. Oh really? Did this event even happen? 

Coincidentally, NOAA's historical projection maps (which I eventually found for those particular dates - "hard" to find  - wonder why?) show that on 15 & 17 June, the oil slick was being blown well eastward, far away from the coast area where EPA sampling was restricted to.

Who is the EPA really protecting?

Maybe they should rename themselves to *B*PA?

LOL


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 June 2010)

What an incompetent bunch of wankers the US EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) is.

Their last surface water samples were taken on 15 & 17 June. Thats almost two weeks ago! Where the hell have they been since, when oil has been washing up all over the coastline? 

And guess what. Their website shows from the results of those tests that there was practically NO IMPACT on water quality in the Gulf region from the oil spill. http://www.epa.gov/bpspill/water.html Oh really? Did this event even happen? 

Coincidentally, NOAA's historical projection maps (which I eventually found for those particular dates - "hard" to find  - wonder why?) show that on 15 & 17 June, the oil slick was being blown well eastward, far away from the coast area where EPA sampling was restricted to.

Who is the EPA really protecting?

Maybe they should rename themselves to *B*PA?

LOL


----------



## pacestick (26 June 2010)

potential hurricanes forming and heading towards gulf  this could really get nasty

http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/graphics_at1.shtml?5-daynl#contents


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (26 June 2010)

Are there any organisms that thrive on a mixture of seawater and oil?

gg


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 June 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> Are there any organisms that thrive on a mixture of seawater and oil?
> 
> gg




You mean like this gg??

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=how-microbes-clean-up-oil-spills

Unfortunately,

(a) in the short term it appears sea water oxygen levels can be seriously depleted. Bad for fishing industry and most all other marine animals in the vicinity.

(b) microbes only work in warmer water levels and not down deep where apparently much of these diffuse plumes are.

Could take years to clear...

Chiz,

aj


----------



## drsmith (26 June 2010)

pacestick said:


> potential hurricanes forming and heading towards gulf  this could really get nasty
> 
> http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/graphics_at1.shtml?5-daynl#contents



Judging by the information on the link, it's only expected to reach tropical storm strength.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_cyclone#Classifications.2C_terminology.2C_and_naming


----------



## Aussiejeff (29 June 2010)

> *The US Navy may have to blow up a ruptured well gushing oil into the Gulf of Mexico if efforts to cap the leak with relief wells fail, former president Bill Clinton said.*



http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/06/29/2939851.htm

Big Bombs are always the US' ultimate solution in most circumstances?

Of course, they know exactly what they are doing, right?


----------



## Agentm (29 June 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/06/29/2939851.htm
> 
> Big Bombs are always the US' ultimate solution in most circumstances?
> 
> Of course, they know exactly what they are doing, right?




a small nuclear device is the only real option

its been discussed for a long time.


----------



## electronicmaster (29 June 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/06/29/2939851.htm
> 
> Big Bombs are always the US' ultimate solution in most circumstances?
> 
> Of course, they know exactly what they are doing, right?




They will miss the target as they always do.  They Might hit Iraq instead.


----------



## trainspotter (30 June 2010)

If BP go down the nuclear warhead path to stop the subterranean oil flow then they will need to change their logo ....... perhaps something like this?


----------



## Sdajii (30 June 2010)

trainspotter said:


> If BP go down the nuclear warhead path to stop the subterranean oil flow then they will need to change their logo ....... perhaps something like this?




That would only work if BP used a virus to solve the problem. Or unleashed a killer virus on to the populace, or moved away from oil and into microbiology.


----------



## trainspotter (30 June 2010)

Sdajii said:


> That would only work if BP used a virus to solve the problem. Or unleashed a killer virus on to the populace, or moved away from oil and into microbiology.




LOL .... I think they have unleashed a killer oil spill.


----------



## Smurf1976 (30 June 2010)

I'm wondering if BP service stations are seeing a drop in sales as a result of this? Is there any sort of consumer backlash going on?

Just wondering.


----------



## Agentm (1 July 2010)

there is a real possibility that bp oil disaster may have far bigger ramifications

these are the sorts of things i am hearing..


firstly the flow rates could likely be as high as 120,000 bopd

3 million barrels per month

the thomas jefferson naval ship has confirmed the well itself has no bop on it, its open hole..  it absolutely not something bp wants to be known..

its not a light crude coming up, its said to be carrying a lot of ugly asphaltenes and methane, butane and very toxic gasses and oils are mixing into a oil pool accumulating deep down in the gulf, some 4500 feet deep in the water, its about 400 - 500 feet thick.. 120 miles wide is the size of this pool.. 

there is fire coming out of the hole.. its speculated the well may be so deep its actually bringing up more than just oil .. kinda like a mini volcano coming up..

so far probably only 1% of the oil pool has reached the surface, but hurricanes can cause the oil pool to rise to the surface

what you see on tv are  tiny leaks in a riser..  some 10 miles from the open hole.. not the blowout. no one knows where the bop is.. its not on the hole itself, it unlikely anyone has seen nor located the open hole

this hurricane can bring up the toxic plume from the deep towards the shore.. then your looking at methane gasses being a massive risk to people in the gulf. so methane clouds are often being encountered

it has been proposed to seal this open hole, a small nuclear device can be blown up deep inside the hole 

its likely the oil plume and its toxic chemicals will create a dead sea in the gulf.  massive fish kills in rivers and all over the gulf are being reported


----------



## Sdajii (1 July 2010)

This probably sounds incredibly stupid, and often is a stupid thing to say in these situations, but "I'm sure they know what they're doing with a nuclear device..."

But...

While I presume this isn't the case at all, is there any chance a nuclear device could blow a larger hole allowing more oil to more freely escape?

I'm sure this is too obvious for 'them' to possibly overlook, but I'd be interested in seeing some sort of diagram or detailed data on the geology of the situation.


----------



## Agentm (1 July 2010)

Sdajii said:


> This probably sounds incredibly stupid, and often is a stupid thing to say in these situations, but "I'm sure they know what they're doing with a nuclear device..."
> 
> But...
> 
> ...




been done before in the ussr i understand a few times

it would fuse the ground shut


----------



## Sdajii (1 July 2010)

Agentm said:


> been done before in the ussr i understand a few times
> 
> it would fuse the ground shut




Being done successfully before is encouraging.

Obviously the idea is to fuse the ground shut, but I have a bit of trouble visualising it. I also imagine it causing big waves, but I suppose being so deep that wouldn't be an issue. I'd imagine the shockwave would kill a heck of a lot of fish too! Hehe, nothing in comparison to the oil damage of course.


----------



## electronicmaster (1 July 2010)




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## Agentm (6 July 2010)

Macondo History Before the Blowout
By: CEOoftheSOFA
July 4, 2010
This history of the Macondo well blowout has been assembled using information from the Oil & Gas Journal and the Houston Chronicle, two of the more reliable sources of information on the oil and gas industry.
The information released to the public on the cause of the blowout has been insufficient. BP is unwilling to release information due to the liability issues. The federal government has much information that it is not releasing. I have assembled as much reliable information as I could and tried to make a reasonable guess as to the cause of the blowout. My opinion on the cause differs from the views of the popular press.
History of the Macondo well
The Macondo well is an exploratory well, in search of a new oil field at a water depth of 4992 ft. The well was estimated to require 51 days to drill at a cost of $96 million.
The well was spudded on October 7, 2009 by the Transocean Marianas. The drilling rig was damaged in Hurricane Ida on Nov. 8-9 and was towed to a shipyard on November 26 for repairs. The Transocean Horizon rig resumed drilling when they landed the BOP stack on February 8, 2010.
The well experienced four well control events. A well control event is when formation fluids (oil, gas, water) enter the wellbore, also known as a “kick”. These events occurred on Feb. 17-23, March 2-5, March 8-14, and April 4-7. The primary method of detecting a kick is to measure increases of drilling mud volume in the mud tanks. Typically, when this is observed, the pipe rams on the blow-out preventer are closed. The pipe rams seal around the drill pipe. The mud flow exiting the well is directed through a choke valve which is partially closed to increase the surface pressure. This increases the bottom hole pressure and prevents further influx of formation fluids into the wellbore. The formation fluids are then circulated out of the well while increasing the mud weight by adding barite to the drilling mud. When the mud weight is increased, it is no longer necessary to hold back pressure with the choke valve. At this point, drilling can resume. A synthetic, oil based drilling mud was used. At the completion of the drilling, the mud weight was 14 pounds per gallon (ppg). This equates to a formation pressure of 13,366 pounds per square inch (psi).
The well was drilled to a total depth of 18,360 ft. A tapered string of production casing consisting of 7” and 9-5/8” casing was run from the total depth of the well to the surface. The casing was cemented by Halliburton. The purpose of the cement is to seal out formation fluids. When the well is ready to be put on production, holes will be perforated into the casing to allow oil and gas to enter the wellbore.

This represents a very aggressive casing program and is the primary reason the well drilling was behind schedule. The casing program was increased in response to the four well control events. The well is encased in steel down to a depth of 17,168 ft. The well is currently flowing behind the 7” production casing, so the three lower liners and the 16” casing are exposed to the oil flow. The 9-5/8” liner is the weak point with a yield strength of 22,000 psi which is 9,000 psi greater than the shut-in reservoir pressure. The well is therefore capable of withstanding the shut-in reservoir pressure if the well were shut in.
After the cement job of the production casing, the next task was to temporarily plug the well by setting several cement plugs in the well. This is done by running drillpipe and tubing to several different depths and spotting cement plugs. Prior to doing this, it was necessary to replace the oil based drilling mud with sea water, since the drilling mud would contaminate the cement. Seawater weighs about 5 ppg less than the drilling mud, and would not exert sufficient hydrostatic pressure on the oil formation to prevent fluid flow into the wellbore. If the cement were holding properly, it would not matter if the hydrostatic pressure were high enough since the cement should have sealed the well. There was a difference of opinion on the rig concerning the results of the pressure tests that were run to evaluate the cement job. A meeting was held at 1:00 PM on April 20, between the BP head drilling engineer and the lead Transocean engineer. It is not known what they were arguing about, but it is likely they were arguing over the results of the pressure tests. Apparently, the Transocean engineers thought the results showed that formation fluids were entering the wellbore due to a failed cement job, but they were overruled by the head BP drilling engineer who made the decision to continue. (One of the Transocean people was heard saying “well at least we have the BOP’s”, after leaving the meeting.) At 7:50 PM a pressure test was performed after which BP incorrectly concluded that formation fluids were not entering the wellbore. However, right after that, personnel on the rig floor reported that the fluid rate exiting the well was greater than the fluid rate entering the well. At 9:00, gas began coming out of the riser. Despite this, the pumping of seawater did not stop until 9:31. The gas ignited at 9:49 and the entire rig was engulfed in flames. The blind shear rams on the blowout preventers were not closed until after this. These rams should shear the drill pipe and completely seal the well. 8,300 feet of drill pipe was then dropped into the 18,360 ft well. The blind shear rams only partially sealed the well. Because of the bad cement job, the well is
now flowing outside the 7 inch production casing. The well pressure is now being exerted on the three lower liner strings and the 16” casing which was set at a depth of 11,585 ft.


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## Agentm (6 July 2010)

Shortcuts
BP took several shortcuts which may have compromised the integrity of the well.
1.
A cement bond log was not run. The usual practice is to run a cement bond log to evaluate the effectiveness of the cement job. Schlumberger was on site to run the cement bond log, but BP decided not to run one, presumably to save the 12 hours it would take to run it. Pressure tests were run instead, but were inconclusive.
2.
A lockdown sleeve was not used in the wellhead seal assembly for the production casing. This could cause the seal to unseat if there is upward movement of the casing, allowing fluid to enter the riser. Upward movement is normal as the casing expands when the temperature increases during the production of formation fluids.
3.
Only 261 bbl of mud was circulated prior to the cement job, which is far short of the usual 1.5 times the hole volume that is recommended by the API. The purpose of this is to clean the hole of debris and formation fluids, to improve the integrity of the cement job. This also saved 12 hours of time.
4.
BP has been criticized for running production casing instead of a liner. The liner would have been sealed inside the next higher liner which would have given an additional seal to prevent migration of formation fluids. The liner could have then been tied back to the surface. As it is now, the well is producing oil and gas from behind the production casing.
5.
There was testimony that BP only used 6 centralizers instead of the recommended 21 on the production casing. Centralizers cost about $100 each and take about 2 minutes to install. Centralizers keep the casing in the middle of the hole to improve the cement bond.
The popular press has focused on these shortcuts as the ultimate cause of the blowout, and that these shortcuts were taken just to save money. These 5 items together only saved one or two days of rig time, or about a million dollars. The press has charged that BP ordered these short cuts because the well was behind schedule and over budget. I don’t buy it. It is not uncommon for exploratory wells to be over budget. They should have been happy that they had a discovery.
I don’t think the fault should be focused only on the failed blowout preventer or the bad cement job. Bad cement jobs happen occasionally without resulting in burned rigs. Blowout preventers are supposed to be activated before the rig is engulfed in flames. I think the key cause of the blowout is simple human error (SHE) on the part of the BP head drilling engineer, who did not notice that the well was kicking. The well was likely kicking all afternoon and evening, and no one noticed until gas was coming out of the riser. It is inexcusable to allow this to go unnoticed for such a long time. All drilling engineers must be certified in well control. An annual class must be taken, with a written test and a test on a rig simulator. The primary thrust of the class is to determine when a well is kicking.
For this reason, I believe the primary cause of the blowout is simple human error on the part of BP. If the BP employees noticed that the well was kicking, the shortcuts would never have come into play. An undetected kick could have caused a blowout during any of the four well control events, where the failed cement job would not have been a factor.
For this reason, I believe BP will be found to be almost completely at fault. Transocean had the right to stop the operation, and for this reason they may bear a small amount of responsibility. The only way I can see Halliburton taking a small part of the blame is if it is shown that the cement was improperly mixed or displaced.
I don’t fault the Transocean blowout preventers because the rig was already on fire when they were activated. Blowout preventers are supposed to be activated before the rig is on fire. It is possible that the rig may have moved during the explosion and may have put the riser at an angle and prevented the proper closing of the BOP. Subsequent investigations will reveal if this was the case.
The above indicates how easy it is for a blowout to occur. I’m surprised it doesn’t happen more often. Since it is so easy for this to happen, it is inexcusable that BP should have been so completely unprepared for the aftermath. BP should have had the containment system built and tested ahead of time. (Shell had one on standby) And there should have been much more surface cleaning assets on standby, such as booms and skimmers. BP was so unprepared, that I believe they should have their drilling bond revoked in the Gulf of Mexico and they should be made to pay for each individual’s loss due to the spill, even if it causes BP to go bankrupt. Politicians that are paid off by the petroleum industry have indicated that this liability will prevent smaller companies from drilling in deep water. That’s too bad. I also believe that the 6 month drilling moratorium is necessary because all available oil containment assets are already in use and there would be nothing available if there were another blowout on another well.


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## spooly74 (6 July 2010)

AgentM, can you provide a link to the above, cheers .


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## Agentm (6 July 2010)

http://www.investingcontrarian.com/...uest-post-macondo-history-before-the-blowout/



also


it appears a 60% chance of a hurricane forming on the macondo site right now


From the National Hurricane Center

ZCZC MIATWOAT ALL
TTAA00 KNHC DDHHMM
SPECIAL TROPICAL WEATHER OUTLOOK
NWS TPC/NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER MIAMI FL
510 PM EDT MON JUL 5 2010

FOR THE NORTH ATLANTIC...CARIBBEAN SEA AND THE GULF OF MEXICO...

1. A SMALL WELL-DEFINED LOW PRESSURE SYSTEM LOCATED ABOUT 50 MILES SOUTH-SOUTHEAST OF MORGAN CITY LOUISIANA IS MOVING ONSHORE TERREBONNE PARISH NEAR CAILLOU BAY. DOPPLER RADAR AND SATELLITE DATA INDICATE THAT SUSTAINED WINDS NEAR TROPICAL-STORM-FORCE COULD OCCUR ACROSS TERREBONNE PARISH...ESPECIALLY IN TERREBONNE BAY...LATE THIS AFTERNOON AND EARLY EVENING AS THE SYSTEM MOVES ONSHORE. THERE IS A HIGH CHANCE...60 PERCENT...OF THIS SYSTEM BECOMING A TROPICAL CYCLONE BEFORE IT MOVES ONSHORE. THIS SYSTEM WILL MOVE SLOWLY NORTHWESTWARD AFTER LANDFALL AND PRODUCE LOCALLY HEAVY RAINFALL OVER PORTIONS OF SOUTH-CENTRAL AND SOUTHEASTERN LOUISIANA. INTERESTS SHOULD MONITOR PRODUCTS ISSUED BY THEIR LOCAL NATIONAL WEATHER FORECAST OFFICE FOR ADDITIONAL UPDATES AND ANY WATCHES OR WARNINGS.

2. A BROAD AREA OF LOW PRESSURE OVER THE NORTHWESTERN CARIBBEAN SEA AND THE SOUTHEASTERN GULF OF MEXICO IS PRODUCING WIDESPREAD CLOUDINESS AND DISORGANIZED THUNDERSTORMS.  UPPER-LEVEL WINDS ARE FORECAST TO BECOME MORE CONDUCIVE FOR DEVELOPMENT...AND A TROPICAL DEPRESSION COULD FORM OVER THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS AS THIS SYSTEM MOVES NORTHWESTWARD AT ABOUT 15 MPH.  THERE IS A MEDIUM CHANCE...30 PERCENT...OF THIS SYSTEM BECOMING A TROPICAL CYCLONE DURING THE NEXT 48 HOURS.  REGARDLESS OF DEVELOPMENT... LOCALLY HEAVY RAINFALL AND GUSTY WINDS ARE POSSIBLE OVER THE YUCATAN PENINSULA AND WESTERN CUBA OVER THE NEXT DAY OR SO.

ELSEWHERE...TROPICAL CYCLONE FORMATION IS NOT EXPECTED DURING THE NEXT 48 HOURS.


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## Smurf1976 (6 July 2010)

Sdajii said:


> This probably sounds incredibly stupid, and often is a stupid thing to say in these situations, but "I'm sure they know what they're doing with a nuclear device..."
> 
> But...
> 
> ...



Humans collectively have far more experience drilling for oil than with using nuclear devices to stop leaking oil wells. We messed up big time with the drilling despite this greater experience. 

At the very least, the nuclear idea is not without massive risk - we know far less about the likely consequences of that than we do about drilling for oil in the first place.

Thinking outside the box for possible solutions...

I understand that a lot of the oil is not coming to the surface, but staying somewhere on the bottom of the ocean floor or thereabouts. Could we not have a ship "drill" into that oil and bring it to the surface? The idea of using a ship as an oil platform isn't new.

Sure it would be contaminated, but at least then we've got it contained on a ship from which it can be loaded via pipes onto another ship and taken to shore. At that point it's fairly straightforward to separate the oil from other things, then use the oil in the normal manner to produce petrol etc.

It's not a complete answer, but at least it would remove some of the oil and put it to good use. How practical it would be I really don't know.

One thing I'm wondering, does anyone know the size of the field? What's the maximum possible amount of oil it will leak if not dealt with?


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## electronicmaster (8 July 2010)

Oil/Water samples from Gulf...VERY TOXIC


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## Agentm (10 July 2010)




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## Garpal Gumnut (10 July 2010)

This really is an environmental disaster, an oft overused expression, by the lazy green wagoneers.

BP's assets and income streams need to be quarantined so that their capital andrevenues in perpetuity can be made available to mitigate the impact on the environment.

gg


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## GumbyLearner (10 July 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> This really is an environmental disaster, an oft overused expression, by the lazy green wagoneers.
> 
> BP's assets and income streams need to be quarantined so that their capital andrevenues in perpetuity can be made available to mitigate the impact on the environment.
> 
> gg




And a financial catastrophe for BP.

Who would have thought a British icon like BP would one day have Libyan stakeholders? After all the C4 Libya exported to terrorists and the suffering that resulted.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/bus...ying-stake-in-bp/story-e6frg9ef-1225888326648

*Libya mulls buying stake in BP
*Tahani Karrar-Lewsley
Dow Jones Newswires
July 06, 2010 8:15AM

LIBYA'S top oil official has said his country should buy a strategic stake in BP to take advantage of its weak share price.

Shokri Ghanem, chairman of Libya's National Oil Co, said he will recommend buying a stake in BP to the Libyan Investment Authority, or LIA, the North African state's sovereign wealth fund.

BP shares are down about 48 per cent since April 20, when an explosion on Transocean's Deepwater Horizon drilling rig -- leased by BP for its Macondo well in the Gulf of Mexico -- killed 11 workers and triggered one of the worst oil spill disasters the US has ever seen.

"BP is interesting now with the price lower by half, and I still have trust in BP. I will recommend it to the LIA," Mr Ghanem said in a telephone interview.

"It's a good opportunity for bargain hunters."


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## Sdajii (11 July 2010)

Thanks, Agentm, that was quite an informative video, even if very basic.


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## GumbyLearner (12 July 2010)

prawn_86 said:


> Im still astounded by the lack of attention this is receiving. Why???




I agree p_86.

I did find a few stories on *Corexit *though.

These stories may be of interest. You won't find this kind of news on your TV.
Thank the uncensored internet for now. 


*BP gives Gulf of Mexico Corexit overdose: Submerged oil more deadly than surface oil slick*

Contributed by Live Free or Die (Reporter)

www.examiner.com/x-55371-Tampa-Gulf...merged-oil-more-deadly-than-surface-oil-slick

Slowly more mainstream media outlets are coming to the same conclusion reached here before many times; the dispersant *Corexit* 9500 is much more deadly and toxic than the oil itself. Evidence is starting to come out that environmentalists worst fears are coming true; the oil that is being "dispersed" is more dangerous than the oil that can be seen on the surface.

http://beforeitsnews.com/news/93/69...d_oil_more_deadly_than_surface_oil_slick.html

This is from yesterday, where the US Marine 'Corp' did actually exit. 

*US Marines evacuated, sea highly toxic*

Saturday, July 10, 2010 - 23:37

The Oil spill has reached a point of no return, the damage is done. But not a lot of people are aware of the extent of the damage mainly because the use of oil dispersants that made the oil 'invisible' but left bigger problems.

The dispersants ,*Corexit*, used made the problem so much worse that it has caused the oil to be able to evaporate into the air making the air toxic as well as the dispersants are being sprayed into the air and being picked up in the air currents carrying it unto land. Here is a video of  where Dr Chris Pincetich who is a Marine Biologist and Toxicologist explaining about *Corexit *being used in the Gulf.

http://fromtheold.com/news/gulf-mexico-marines-evacuated-sea-highly-toxic-2010071019651.html

Here's the wiki entry for *Corexit*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corexit

*Corexit*[1]  is a product line of solvents primarily used as a dispersant for breaking up oil slicks. It is produced by Nalco Holding Company which is associated with BP and Exxon.[2]  *Corexit* is the most-used dispersant in the Deepwater Horizon oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, with *COREXIT 9527* having been replaced by *COREXIT 9500* after the former was deemed too toxic.[3]  Oil that would normally rise to the surface of the water is broken up by the dispersant into small globules that can then remain suspended in the water, potentially forming underwater plumes of oil.[4]

*Corexit* was used during the 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill disaster in Alaska. In 2010, *Corexit* EC9500A and *Corexit* EC9527A are being used in unprecedentedly large quantities in the Deepwater Horizon oil spill.[5][6] The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) had pre-approved both forms of *Corexit* for uses in emergencies such as the Gulf oil spill.[7]

On May 19, 2010 the EPA gave BP 24 hours to choose less toxic alternatives to *Corexit*, selected from the list of EPA-approved dispersants on the National Contingency Plan Product Schedule,[8] and begin applying them within 72 hours of EPA approval of their choices, but BP refused to change from *Corexit*, citing safety and availability concerns with alternatives.[9] Sea Brat 4, the only effective alternative that is available in quantities large enough for the spill and is less toxic, was rejected by BP because of the risk that components would break down into nonylphenol, which persists in the environment and is toxic to marine life.[10]

BP had used *Corexit EC9500A and Corexit EC9527A* by late May, applying 800,000 US gallons (3,000,000 l) total,[11] but more accurate estimates run as high as 1,000,000 US gallons (3,800,000 l) underwater.[12] By late April 2010, Nalco, the maker of *Corexit*, says that it has been deploying only *Corexit 9500*.[13]

The ingredients of *Corexit*

http://www.naturalnews.com/028974_Corexit_dispersants.html

*Toxic Corexit dispersant chemicals remained secret as feds colluded with Big Business*

After weeks of silence on the issue, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) finally decided to go public with the list of ingredients used to manufacture *Corexit*, the chemical dispersant used by BP in the Gulf of Mexico oil disaster. There are two things about this announcement that deserve our attention: First, the ingredients that have been disclosed are extremely toxic, and second, why did the EPA protect the oil industry's "trade secrets" for so long by refusing to disclose these ingredients until now?

As reported in the New York Times, Brian Turnbaugh, a policy analyst at OMB Watch said, "EPA had the authority to act all along; its decision to now disclose the ingredients demonstrates this. Yet it took a public outcry and weeks of complaints for the agency to act and place the public's interest ahead of corporate interests."

On the toxicity question, you could hardly find a more dangerous combination of poisons to dump into the Gulf of Mexico than what has been revealed in *Corexit*. The *Corexit* 9527 product has been designated a "chronic and acute health hazard" by the EPA. It is made with 2-butoxyethanol, a highly toxic chemical that has long been linked to the health problems of cleanup crews who worked on the Exxon Valdez spill.

A newer* Corexit* recipe dubbed the "9500 formula" contains dioctyl sodium sulfosuccinate, a detergent chemical that's also found in laxatives. What do you suppose happens to the marine ecosystem when fish and sea turtles ingest this chemical through their gills and skin? And just as importantly, what do you think happens to the human beings who are working around this chemical, breathing in its fumes and touching it with their skin?

The answers are currently unknown, which is exactly why it is so inexcusable that Nalco and the oil industry giants would for so long refuse to disclose the chemical ingredients they're dumping into the Gulf of Mexico in huge quantities (over a million gallons dumped into the ocean to date).

But it gets even more interesting when you look at just how widespread this "chemical secrecy" is across Big Business in the USA... and how the U.S. government more often than not conspires with industry to keep these chemicals a secret.

It's time to end chemical trade secrets
Armed with the accomplices in the FDA, EPA, FTC and the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, powerful corporations have been keeping secrets from us all. It's not just the toxic chemicals in *Corexit*, either: Large manufacturers of consumers products -- such as Unilever, Proctor & Gamble and Johnson & Johnson -- routinely use toxic chemical ingredients in their products -- ingredients which are usually kept secret from the public.


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## electronicmaster (14 July 2010)

Indeed, this is getting really bad


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## GumbyLearner (16 July 2010)

*Claim BP linked to Lockerbie deal
*SUZANNE GOLDENBERG, WASHINGTON
July 16, 2010

http://www.theage.com.au/world/claim-bp-linked-to-lockerbie-deal-20100715-10cmm.html?autostart=1

HILLARY Clinton, the US Secretary of State, is to investigate charges that oil giant BP lobbied for the release of the Lockerbie bomber as part of an oil-for-terrorist deal.

BP also faces the prospect of being shut out of America after legislation that could ban it from offshore drilling projects for seven years cleared its first hurdle.

With pressure mounting on BP, Mrs Clinton responded to reports that it had lobbied the British government for the release of Abdel Basset al-Megrahi to help it clinch lucrative drilling contracts off the coast of Libya. ''I have received the letter and we will obviously look into it,'' she said.


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## pacestick (16 July 2010)

oil flow stopped 
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2010/06/08/us/20100608-oil-spill-live-video-feed-bp.html

However BP not sure if it will hold

http://news.yahoo.com/


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## Pager (16 July 2010)

Well were all doomed :, or how anyone knows what happened 250 million years ago and is about to happen again is slightly beyond me 




http://www.helium.com/items/1882339...ster-may-have-triggered-a-world-killing-event

Ominous reports are leaking past the BP Gulf salvage operation news blackout that the disaster unfolding in the Gulf of Mexico may be about to reach biblical proportions.

251 million years ago a mammoth undersea methane bubble caused massive explosions, poisoned the atmosphere and destroyed more than 96 percent of all life on Earth. [1] Experts agree that what is known as the Permian extinction event was the greatest mass extinction event in the history of the world. [2]

55 million years later another methane bubble ruptured causing more mass extinctions during the Late Paleocene Thermal Maximum (LPTM). 

The LPTM lasted 100,000 years. [3]

Those subterranean seas of methane virtually reshaped the planet when they explosively blew from deep beneath the waters of what is today called the Gulf of Mexico.

Now, worried scientists are increasingly concerned the same series of catastrophic events that led to worldwide death back then may be happening again-and no known technology can stop it.

The bottom line: BP’s Deepwater Horizon drilling operation may have triggered an irreversible, cascading geological Apocalypse that will culminate with the first mass extinction of life on Earth in many millions of years. 

The oil giant drilled down miles into a geologically unstable region and may have set the stage for the eventual premature release of a methane mega-bubble.

Ryskin’s methane extinction theory

Northwestern University's Gregory Ryskin, a bio-chemical engineer, has a theory: The oceans periodically produce massive eruptions of explosive methane gas. He has documented the scientific evidence that such an event was directly responsible for the mass extinctions that occurred 55 million years ago. [4]

Many geologists concur: "The consequences of a methane-driven oceanic eruption for marine and terrestrial life are likely to be catastrophic. Figuratively speaking, the erupting region "boils over," ejecting a large amount of methane and other gases (e.g., CO2, H2S) into the atmosphere, and flooding large areas of land. Whereas pure methane is lighter than air, methane loaded with water droplets is much heavier, and thus spreads over the land, mixing with air in the process (and losing water as rain). The air-methane mixture is explosive at methane concentrations between 5% and 15%; as such mixtures form in different locations near the ground and are ignited by lightning, explosions and conflagrations destroy most of the terrestrial life, and also produce great amounts of smoke and of carbon dioxide..." [5]

The warning signs of an impending planetary catastrophe””of such great magnitude that the human mind has difficulty grasping it-would be the appearance of large fissures or rifts splitting open the ocean floor, a rise in the elevation of the seabed, and the massive venting of methane and other gases into the surrounding water.

Such occurrences can lead to the rupture of the methane bubble containment””it can then permit the methane to breach the subterranean depths and undergo an explosive decompression as it catapults into the Gulf waters. [6]

All three warning signs are documented to be occurring in the Gulf.

Ground zero: The Gulf Coast

The people and property located on the greater expanse of the Gulf Coast are sitting at Ground Zero. They will be the first exposed to poisonous, cancer causing chemical gases. They will be the ones that initially experience the full fury of a methane bubble exploding from the ruptured seabed.

The media has been kept away from the emergency salvage measures being taken to forestall the biggest catastrophe in human history. The federal government has warned them away from the epicenter of operations with the threat of a $40,000 fine for each infraction and the possibility of felony arrests.

Why is the press being kept away? Word is that the disaster is escalating.

Cracks and bulges

Methane is now streaming through the porous, rocky seabed at an accelerated rate and gushing from the borehole of the first relief well. The EPA is on record that Rig #1 is releasing methane, benzene, hydrogen sulfide and other toxic gases. Workers there now wear advanced protection including state-of-the-art, military-issued gas masks.

Reports, filtering through from oceanologists and salvage workers in the region, state that the upper level strata of the ocean floor is succumbing to greater and greater pressure. That pressure is causing a huge expanse of the seabed-estimated by some as spreading over thousands of square miles surrounding the BP wellhead-to bulge. Some claim the seabed in the region has risen an astounding 30 feet.

The fractured BP wellhead, site of the former Deepwater Horizon, has become the epicenter of frenetic attempts to quell the monstrous flow of methane.

The subterranean methane is pressurized at 100,000 pounds psi. According to Matt Simmons, an oil industry expert, the methane pressure at the wellhead has now skyrocketed to a terrifying 40,000 pounds psi. 

Another well-respected expert, Dr. John Kessler of Texas A&M University has calculated that the ruptured well is spewing 60 percent oil and 40 percent methane. The normal methane amount that escapes from a compromised well is about 5 percent.

More evidence? A huge gash on the ocean floor””like a ragged wound hundreds of feet long””has been reported by the NOAA research ship, Thomas Jefferson. Before the curtain of the government enforced news blackout again descended abruptly, scientists aboard the ship voiced their concerns that the widening rift may go down miles into the earth. 

That gash too is hemorrhaging oil and methane. It’s 10 miles away from the BP epicenter. Other, new fissures, have been spotted as far as 30 miles distant.

Measurements of the multiple oil plumes now appearing miles from the wellhead indicate that as much as a total of 124,000 barrels of oil are erupting into the Gulf waters daily-that’s about 5,208,000 gallons of oil per day. 

Most disturbing of all: Methane levels in the water are now calculated as being almost one million times higher than normal. [7]

Mass death on the water

If the methane bubble””a bubble that could be as big as 20 miles wide””erupts with titanic force from the seabed into the Gulf, every ship, drilling rig and structure within the region of the bubble will immediately sink. All the workers, engineers, Coast Guard personnel and marine biologists participating in the salvage operation will die instantly. 

Next, the ocean bottom will collapse, instantaneously displacing up to a trillion cubic feet of water or more and creating a towering supersonic tsunami annihilating everything along the coast and well inland. Like a thermonuclear blast, a high pressure atmospheric wave could precede the tidal wave flattening everything in its path before the water arrives. 

When the roaring tsunami does arrive it will scrub away all that is left.

A chemical cocktail of poisons

Some environmentalist experts are calling what’s pouring into the land, sea and air from the seabed breach ’a chemical cocktail of poisons.’ 

Areas of dead zones devoid of oxygen are driving species of fish into foreign waters, killing plankton and other tiny sea life that are the foundation for the entire food chain, and polluting the air with cancer-causing chemicals and poisonous rainfalls.

A report from one observer in South Carolina documents oily residue left behind after a recent thunderstorm. And before the news blackout fully descended the EPA released data that benzene levels in New Orleans had rocketed to 3,000 parts per billion. 

Benzene is extremely toxic and even short term exposure can cause agonizing death from cancerous lesions years later.

The people of Louisiana have been exposed for more than two months””and the benzene levels may be much higher now. The EPA measurement was taken in early May. [8]

Doomsday

While some say it can’t happen because the bulk of the methane is frozen into crystalline form, others point out that the underground methane sea is gradually melting from the nearby surging oil that’s estimated to be as hot as 500 degrees Fahrenheit.

Most experts in the know, however, agree that if the world-changing event does occur it will happen suddenly and within the next 6 months.

So, if events go against Mankind and the bubble bursts in the coming months, Gregory Ryskin may become one of the most famous people in the world. Of course, he won't have long to enjoy his new found fame because very shortly after the methane eruption civilization will collapse.

Perhaps if humanity is very, very lucky, some may find a way to avoid the mass extinction that follows and carry on the human race.

Perhaps.
…………


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## explod (16 July 2010)

Who cares, sun will be up tomorrow and one cannot turn the clock back and start over.

Best mate who has cancer is on his last few days now, makes one realise we are just bits of dust in the universe and if we have had some good times we have been very lucky indeed.


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## Sdajii (16 July 2010)

Wow, Pager! If you're going to dig up ridiculous interweb hype, there is plenty better out there. I'm a big 'doomsdayer' and think we're on an inevitable track to a complete collapse of civilisation within 50 years or so, but that story is a load of crap.


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## AngusSmart (16 July 2010)

not sure if its been posted but heres a timeline of "internet media" events from many sources..

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2010/05/bp-gulf-oil-spill-timeline.php


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## Agentm (18 July 2010)

Sdajii said:


> Thanks, Agentm, that was quite an informative video, even if very basic.




cheers

if you call a nuclear explosion in a well very basic.. i guess so???

lol

just in case this is a  little too basic, so had better explain it..

its oil seeping from cracks in the sea bed..


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## electronicmaster (18 July 2010)

Agentm said:


> cheers
> 
> if you call a nuclear explosion in a well very basic.. i guess so???
> 
> ...




Not just Oil.  Gass as well is coming up.

That is typical since the Oil pressure will find the path least resistance while the cap is on the Well head.


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## bellenuit (19 July 2010)

electronicmaster said:


> Not just Oil.  Gass as well is coming up.
> 
> That is typical since the Oil pressure will find the path least resistance while the cap is on the Well head.




But why should there be a leak at all?  Isn't putting the cap on the well returning it to the same state as it was before the well was drilled in the first place. Presumably there was no leakage then.


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## Agentm (19 July 2010)

bellenuit said:


> But why should there be a leak at all?  Isn't putting the cap on the well returning it to the same state as it was before the well was drilled in the first place. Presumably there was no leakage then.




from what i here, there is a huge leak, about 20,000 bopd from the sea floor some miles from where the bop sits.. thats where all the oil is coming from, the small volumes from the well head doesnt account for the massive oil spill in the gulf..

the talk is  that there is a toxic pool of oil at the bottom of the gulf, some 500 foot thick, only a small %, has reached the surface thus far..   biggest issues will be the methane from the oil pool and the toxic pool has to still be dispersed into the surrounding environment..

sotra like one exxon valdez per day

not likely to swallow the "oil is contained" story unless the seabed leaks are contained, and the only way that is likely is to seal the well very deep down..


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## electronicmaster (19 July 2010)

bellenuit said:


> But why should there be a leak at all?  Isn't putting the cap on the well returning it to the same state as it was before the well was drilled in the first place. Presumably there was no leakage then.




The 2 inch thick hardened steal pipe was damaged buy the pressure when the Oil was first struck.  The pipe is now badly eroded away due to the abrasives  flowing through the pipe at a PSI of at least 20,000 to 80,000.


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## pilots (19 July 2010)

Electronicmaster, tell me about the 2inch pipe, they don't run 2inch casing, then WHO said they had 20.000 to 80.000 PSI, BP knows exactly what the PSI was. So much rubbish has been posted about this screw up, they will kill it completely with the two wells they are drilling now. This was a screw up, just the same as when a 747 runs in to a mountain, we don't stop flying do we. Get over it its only a screw up. BP will sack 5/6 people, place some money in a fund and we will all be back to normal.


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## GumbyLearner (19 July 2010)

*Rahm Emanuel’s Rent-Free D.C. Apartment Owned by BP Adviser…
* 

http://www.sodahead.com/united-stat...tment-owned-by-bp-adviser/blog-343075/?page=8

In case you were tempted to buy the faux Washington outrage at BP and its gulf oil spill in recent days, here’s a story that reveals a little-known corporate political connection and the quiet way the inner political circles intersect, protect and care for one another in the nation’s capital. And Chicago.

*We already knew that BP and its folks were significant contributors to the record $750-million war chest of Barack Obama’s 2007-08 campaign.* 

Now, we learn the details of a connection of Rahm Emanuel, the Chicago mayoral wannabe, *current Obama chief of staff*, ex-representative, ex-Clinton money man and ex-Windy City political machine go-fer.

Shortly after Obama’s happy inaugural, eyebrows rose slightly upon word that, as a House member, *Emanuel had lived the last five years rent-free* in a D.C. apartment of Democratic colleague Rep. Rosa DeLauro of Connecticut and her husband, Stanley Greenberg.


*For an ordinary American, that would likely raise some obvious tax liability questions.* But like Emanuel, the guy overseeing the Internal Revenue Service now is another Obama insider, Tim Geithner, who had his own outstanding tax problems but skated through confirmation anyway by the Democratic-controlled Congress. 

*Remember this was all before the letters BP stood for Huge Mess. Even before the Obama administration gave BP a safety award.
*

Now follow these standard Washington links if you can:

Greenberg’s consulting firm was a prime architect of BP’s recent rebranding drive as a green petroleum company, down to green signs and the slogan *“Beyond Petroleum.”* 

Greenberg’s company is also closely tied to a sister Democratic outfit — GCS, named for the last initials of Greenberg, James Carville, another Clinton advisor, and Bob Shrum, John Kerry’s 2004 campaign manager. :headshake


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## pilots (19 July 2010)

From day one, no government has EVER or will in the future tell any Oil company what to do, its the Oil companies that tell ALL GOVERNMENTS what to do.


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## electronicmaster (19 July 2010)

pilots said:


> Electronicmaster, tell me about the 2inch pipe, they don't run 2inch casing, then WHO said they had 20.000 to 80.000 PSI, BP knows exactly what the PSI was. So much rubbish has been posted about this screw up, they will kill it completely with the two wells they are drilling now. This was a screw up, just the same as when a 747 runs in to a mountain, we don't stop flying do we. Get over it its only a screw up. BP will sack 5/6 people, place some money in a fund and we will all be back to normal.




I don't recall saying they have a 2" pipe.

Yes, BP indeed knows what the true PSI.  They won't tell the media (or us) about the truth.  And it is also true that BP tells/controls the government what to do.

The government also knows BP lie, as they do.


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## OK2 (19 July 2010)

Amazing to see people protest against BP. 

Do these people not drive cars and heat their homes? The oil is where it should be, in the backyard of the biggest user in the world. Was this oil going to become a feature piece in peoples homes, no it was going to create more pollution than it has. It would have been used to create more machinery needing even more oil. 

We are all to blame, supply and demand. You want the oil company to do it in a better way, then you pay. Do you want to pay? No


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## Aussiejeff (19 July 2010)

Does this sound like panic??



> Admiral Allen, the government's pointman on the worst oil spill in US history, says BP must maintain coordination with government monitors and report in no more than four hours when seeps are detected.
> 
> "As a continued condition of the test, you are required to provide as a top priority access and coordination for the monitoring systems, which include seismic and sonar surface ships and subsea ROV and acoustic systems," he said.
> 
> ...




Now, why would he even publicly flag that panicky comment?? Does he know something we should be concerned about?  

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/07/19/2957808.htm


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## Agentm (22 July 2010)




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## DB008 (25 July 2010)

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/07/oil_spill_in_dalian_china.html


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## Agentm (20 August 2010)

Senior U.S. scientist rescinds previous claim that 3/4 of oil from spill is gone, says most is still there

bill lehr will have to think hard about when he uses his swimming pool now


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