# Market Manipulation S&P 500 and S&P/ASX 200



## rodwa (17 October 2014)

It's never very subtle but I haven't seen such blatant market manipulation for a long time.  

I'm referring to the night of the 15-16 Oct where the APZ4 futures followed the Yo Yo of US market (15th Oct) and then on the 16th Oct the same Yo Yo index pattern was repeated during the ASX trading day. 

I only got burnt a little as a few alarm bells help me stay out of the market and I also managed to ride out a yo yo and exit almost even.  

For these guys its easier than taking candy from a baby.

What say you? 

Any traders (commodity or otherwise) feel like venting ?


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## pixel (17 October 2014)

rodwa said:


> It's never very subtle but
> 
> [...]
> 
> ...



If yesterday's yo-yo caught you by surprise, you may possibly have missed the fact that it was Index Option Expiry. On those days - usually the third Thursday every month - even pre-open market pictures (bids/offers) are changing at a confusing rate. I have met only very few people who are able to "read" the shenanigans and get the swings right on days like that. I even remember a highly successful day trader who would take a couple of days either side of Option Expiry off. He prefers to play Golf while the Market is pushed this way and that, depending on where the Market Movers want their options to be exercised or expire worthless.

Here are three Market Maps, starting about 40 minutes before Open yesterday. The last snapshot is a 10-minute Intraday chart of the S&P ASX200, XJO.














PS: Have you ever watched a "Stop Raid" on a stock? A share can be sold down 10-20% in the blink of an eye, until all stop-loss orders have been snapped up? Now THAT is what I'd call manipulation. Others call it Market Forces at work.


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## Wysiwyg (17 October 2014)

pixel said:


> PS: Have you ever watched a "Stop Raid" on a stock? A share can be sold down 10-20% in the blink of an eye, until all stop-loss orders have been snapped up? Now THAT is what I'd call manipulation. Others call it Market Forces at work.



Another one is the large bid orders. Front runners are tempted into buying with the thought they have strong support and after a brief rally up the fake large bids are pulled and the price comes down quickly leaving front runners caught. All part of the game that the home trader usually gets stung by. And okay with the establishment with increased turnover being good for the establishment.


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## Wysiwyg (17 October 2014)

Another one is the price spike up at a turning point if shorting and spike down at a turning point if going long before price moves decisively away. I call it the left jab 'cause your stops are tight and the loss is minimal but it  stings nonetheless.


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## pixel (17 October 2014)

Wysiwyg said:


> Another one is the large bid orders. Front runners are tempted into buying with the thought they have strong support and after a brief rally up the fake large bids are pulled and the price comes down quickly leaving front runners caught. All part of the game that the home trader usually gets stung by. And okay with the establishment with increased turnover being good for the establishment.




That too, wysiwyg;
That's why it's never prudent for a Barina or Yaris driver to try being a front runner: If it suits the Mack truckie, the little guy doesn't even know what hit him.

Many years ago when I was still green and trying my luck with conditional (stop) orders, I found myself a couple of times wondering how my stop was taken out, making me the lowest seller of the day. Invariably, the price would miraculously bounce back up and go ballistic. And then I overheard a broker bragging how he had just run a report over their conditional order book. All he needed was a small sale that triggered the first condition. That led to an automatic avalanche and allowed him to clean up the lot.

They're no longer operating because some watchdog finally caught them at other "stuff" and bit them in the rear end. But just to avoid tempting anyone, I no longer use conditional orders at all. I set alerts instead, usually a few ticks early, that give me time enough to decide whether it's a "serious" sell-off or merely an Intraday glitch. On the odd occasion, I have even realised a stop raid was happening and joined in buying at the bottom just in time to pull up level with the Mack truckie.


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## qldfrog (18 October 2014)

pixel said:


> That too, wysiwyg;
> 
> Many years ago when I was still green and trying my luck with conditional (stop) orders, I found myself a couple of times wondering how my stop was taken out, making me the lowest seller of the day. Invariably, the price would miraculously bounce back up and go ballistic. And then I overheard a broker bragging how he had just run a report over their conditional order book. All he needed was a small sale that triggered the first condition. That led to an automatic avalanche and allowed him to clean up the lot.



Got hit many time by this. yet the options are spare if you are not glued on your screen.
I will check the alert capability for my platform.


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## dlineinvestor (18 October 2014)

Wysiwyg said:


> Another one is the price spike up at a turning point if shorting and spike down at a turning point if going long before price moves decisively away. I call it the left jab 'cause your stops are tight and the loss is minimal but it  stings nonetheless.




Wusiwyg,
They are called exhaustion candles : !
Are you trying to upset the establishment here ... lol

Nah mate ... I get that too, now sometimes I use them as signals.

A while back  I knew of a good female trader that traded her account up to 80,000.00 from very little. She was following a system from a so called SPI guru over east. He advocated "no stops in the night market. 
Needless to say she awoke with her position forced closed and nothing in her account. The price ran right back up to where it started. Flash Crash all computer generated, evil stuff.


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