# Saints vs. Cats: Who will win?



## GumbyLearner (25 September 2009)

Time to start a thread on this.

It has finally come down to the decider tomorrow.

I think the minor premiers will take this one out.

Not that I'm biased.  

Saints by a kick.

Go Sainters!


----------



## ThingyMajiggy (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Meeeeeeeeeeoooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwww!!! 

Go the Pussy Cats!!! 

Actually I don't care, ok well I do a little bit, I like the cats, in case you hadn't noticed, but I hope it will be a great game, both teams are full strength, actually not sure why the Cats are favourites, the Saints dominated the H&A season. 

Should be a ripper!  

I'll go long cats, profit target at 23 points.


----------



## springhill (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



GumbyLearner said:


> Time to start a thread on this.
> 
> It has finally come down to the decider tomorrow.
> 
> ...




Got a feeling the Cats are gonna tear them a new one them.... 6 goals +


----------



## TabJockey (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Im going tomorrow, first GF ive ever been to and its going to hail. 

Would love the Saints to get up but not sure if its going to be easy for them.


----------



## >Apocalypto< (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



springhill said:


> Got a feeling the Cats are gonna tear them a new one them.... 6 goals +




6+ in the rain against the best defensive team of the century? get off the crack pipe


----------



## springhill (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



>Apocalypto< said:


> 6+ in the rain against the best defensive team of the century? get off the crack pipe




Your 'best defensive team of the century' will crumble like feta on a greek salad 
In the words of Whitney Houston 'Crack is whack"


----------



## >Apocalypto< (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



springhill said:


> Your 'best defensive team of the century' will crumble like feta on a greek salad
> In the words of Whitney Houston 'Crack is whack"




still upset about the beatings we handed you during the home and away I see.

yeh yeh 97, i know that well I cried myself to sleep that night while cursing Darren Jarrmen.

this is a different saints team best i have seen in my 28 years of life.


----------



## >Apocalypto< (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

I have a felling it comes down to this man


----------



## >Apocalypto< (25 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

and stopping this man, go Clinton you can tag him out!

(That's Dal in the pic)


----------



## springhill (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



>Apocalypto< said:


> still upset about the beatings we handed you during the home and away I see.
> 
> yeh yeh 97, i know that well I cried myself to sleep that night while cursing Darren Jarrmen.
> 
> this is a different saints team best i have seen in my 28 years of life.




I wasn't going to stoop to mentioning 97 
Hope you aren't relying on Gardy to take a game winning pack mark & goal in the pouring rain.
Nor Reiwoldt to take a dozen contested ones in the same conditions.
If Cats close down Hayes contested ball wins you guys are cactus.
Respect for what the Saints have done this year though.


----------



## GumbyLearner (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



>Apocalypto< said:


> still upset about the beatings we handed you during the home and away I see.
> 
> yeh yeh 97, i know that well I cried myself to sleep that night while cursing Darren Jarrmen.
> 
> this is a different saints team best i have seen in my 28 years of life.




Have to agree.

I was at the game in 97, high up in the Ponsford stand. Flew down from Qld to watch it. It was crushing.  

The side we had then was great but look at the side we have now.

I thought it was ours here, when Aussie received from Banger and ran from half back to score.



It really sucked when Barry Hall lost his cool in the 3rd quarter and got dragged that was the turning point in my mind. And Adelaide played that smokey Ellen that no-one had done any research or heard of.  WTF?

Much more discipline and focus this time around.


----------



## >Apocalypto< (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

This is the best and worst situation for a saints supporter right now. 

Best
Making the grand final. 
20 - 2 for the season. 
beating Collingwood in the finals.
Beating Geelong round 14

Worst
Playing Geelong in the Grand Final in the rain possible hail!


As a saints supporter I am 100% behind em, but the form found ( or collingwood gave up?) last week anit a great thing to see.

its going to be a tight game due to the weather 

Saints but a goal or less.


----------



## Iggy_Pop (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Cats will win, but the match to watch is Storm V Broncos. Broncos to win by a point!


----------



## >Apocalypto< (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



GumbyLearner said:


> Have to agree.
> 
> I was at the game in 97, high up in the Ponsford stand. Flew down from Qld to watch it. It was crushing.
> 
> ...





 thanks for posting that.

Jones had amazing run through the corridor and down the wing.

97 was also such a great team.


----------



## nomore4s (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Cats in hopefully a close game.

Cats are the form team of the finals so far and will be hard to beat after the disappointment of last year imo.

Also if the Saints start like they did against the Bulldogs the game could be as good as over by 1/2 time, turnovers like that against the Cats will hurt alot more.


----------



## Sean K (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Will be a draw I think.


----------



## GumbyLearner (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

There are many reasons why the Saints will win this one. 

*Staying true to the red, white and black*
Greg Baum, The Age Sep 26 2009

http://www.realfooty.com.au/articles/2009/09/25/1253813614151.html

ALL football followers classify themselves as ''mad''. You hear it every day: ''I'm a mad Collingwood supporter.'' ''I'm mad Essendon.'' ''I'm a mad Tiger.'' It's like a self-conferred honorific.

But there are subtle distinctions between fans, as there are between clubs. Most St Kilda fans I know are marked out by their loyalty - not in the least diminished by the fact that it is never requited - and by an ability to laugh at themselves.

One went to watch the reserves on the morning of his wedding day; he said that otherwise, it would have felt all wrong. It was not as if the Saints were on a roll at the time. They were in the middle of a run of four successive wooden spoons.

When Malcolm Blight was sacked as coach of the Saints in 2001, another became indignant. ''That's it,'' she declared. ''I don't barrack for them any more.'' Then she laughed at her own hyperbolic insincerity. She knew not only that she did still barrack for them, wretches that they were, but she always would.

St Kilda fans don't desert their team in the dog days, as Richmond's, for instance, tend to. Nor do they protest in the streets, nor threaten to tear up their membership tickets, nor dump a trailer-load of rotting chicken hearts on the doorstep of the club, as a Collingwood fan once did.

They are phlegmatic. As it happened, the Saints' first match after Blight's sacking was on Saturday night, and nationally televised, meaning that all eyes were on the club and its fans. One image endures, of a bespectacled middle-aged woman in guernsey and scarf, sitting in the front row - knitting!


----------



## jbocker (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Probably the only GF that I cannot pick a winner on preference, its going to be so sad to see the loser, Geelong deserve the win and their reign, but I really feel for the Saints too.

Hoping for a classic GF like 05 and 06.

I think the cats will win, I think they got it together last week.

Gee I love footy.


----------



## Tink (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

I dont really care who wins, but I think the Cats will win after last weeks performance..

I will be cheering for the Cats  





Iggy_Pop said:


> Cats will win, but the match to watch is Storm V Broncos. Broncos to win by a point!




Go Storm :


----------



## LeftRightOut (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

I managed to bag a corporate package for the game mid week so I'm heading in there about 9:30am. Saints are definite underdogs (even though they went almost undefeted for the season, AND beat Geelong along the way), but I think they can do it.
My fear was they peaked too early, about 2 weeks before finals, and their game against Footscray would support that theory.

Having said that, they most certainly have the ability to pull it off, and I hope they do, GO SAINTS!


----------



## mazzatelli (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

I'm a neutral supporter on this one, but would like to see the Cats win.


----------



## Sean K (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*

Is the weather a factor?

Looks wet from Patagonia.

Will a wet weather team have the advantage?


----------



## mazzatelli (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



kennas said:


> Is the weather a factor?
> 
> Looks wet from Patagonia.
> 
> Will a wet weather team have the advantage?




Please no rain! It would be such a scrappy affair.
I'm hoping to see free, fast flowing football that these 2 can play.


----------



## springhill (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



kennas said:


> Is the weather a factor?
> 
> Looks wet from Patagonia.
> 
> Will a wet weather team have the advantage?




Rain, possible thunderstorms & hail. Max temp 14c
Plenty of mud larks in Geelong.
Dal Santo will be to busy restyling his hair every 2 secs in the wet to worry bout the footy.


----------



## Prospector (26 September 2009)

Adelaide bucketed down with rain and hail all night.  Should hit Melbourne around 1pm I reckon.

What do you people feel about moving the junior games away from the MCG?  Poor kids, and are we being a bit precious about the oval?  In my day........:

Does Footscray exist any more?  The difference between the two teams is that the Cats have quality players right down the list, whereas if something happens to the Saints captain, well.....Plus Tom Harley went to my son's school and he is a legend at the school along with Howard Florey!


----------



## springhill (26 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> What do you people feel about moving the junior games away from the MCG?  Poor kids




Molly Coddler! Let em slug it out, i say.


----------



## greggy (26 September 2009)

Geelong will win as they have greater finals experrience and perhaps play better in wet weather.


----------



## jbocker (26 September 2009)

Considering the weather Geelong win. Chapman for Norm Smith, always admired his style since early days.
Who else you reckon for Norm Smith.

Gotta go ...fridge needs a clean out ...too much beer in it!


----------



## Santoro (26 September 2009)

SAINTS!!! Every quarter....


----------



## Prospector (26 September 2009)

Lordy, you should look at the weather on the radar about to hit Melbourne.   Bugger.


----------



## justjohn (26 September 2009)

ST.KILDA only because they are called the saints


----------



## Agentm (26 September 2009)

going for the cats

but if saints win i will be right in the heart of st kilda celebrating


----------



## MrBurns (26 September 2009)

After 30 years I think the Saints deserve a flag.

They should be 3 goals ahead at least but they cant kick.


----------



## tech/a (26 September 2009)

Hmm

I'm seeing raw passion from the Saints.
43 yrs of it.
They want it more from what I see.
Should be further up,poor kicking and a x eyed Goal umpire.
They seem more at home in the wet.
If it was dry then a different ball game.
Sainters by 5+ (Goals).
Last quater White Wash.


----------



## springhill (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



springhill said:


> Got a feeling the Cats are gonna tear them a new one them.... 6 goals +




MEEEEEEOW!
P.S. that goal thing was a typo  i meant points


----------



## Knobby22 (26 September 2009)

Cats win!
What a close one!


----------



## ThingyMajiggy (26 September 2009)

*Re: Saints v. Cats Who will win?*



>Apocalypto< said:


> yeh yeh 97, i know that well I cried myself to sleep that night while cursing Darren Jarrmen.
> 
> this is a different saints team best i have seen in my 28 years of life.





Sleep tight bud!! : whos it gonna be this time? Chapman, Ablett?


----------



## MrBurns (26 September 2009)

Saints were robbed, that Cars point that was counted as a goal changed the whole dynamic of the game, we all saw it on TV dunno why the goal umpire who was standing next to it didnt.


----------



## ThingyMajiggy (26 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Saints were robbed, that Cars point that was counted as a goal changed the whole dynamic of the game, we all saw it on TV dunno why the goal umpire who was standing next to it didnt.





So give the Saints a free goal, Cats would still have won by 6 points. It was given straight back to them anyway with some of the stupid umpire decisions. Saints wasted way too many opportunities with misses.


----------



## MrBurns (26 September 2009)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> So give the Saints a free goal, Cats would still have won by 6 points. It was given straight back to them anyway with some of the stupid umpire decisions. Saints wasted way too many opportunities with misses.




They did waste too many opportunities I agree, but giving them the goal wont make up for the mistake made by the goal umpire, for a start there would have been a kickout instead of a center bounce, we'll never know how that changed the game not to mention the psychological effect on the Saints.

How the hell can a ball hit the goalpost and it goes unnoticed.???

Everyone who was watching the game on TV saw it straight away.


----------



## ThingyMajiggy (26 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> They did waste too many opportunities I agree, but giving them the goal wont make up for the mistake made by the goal umpire, for a start there would have been a kickout instead of a center bounce, we'll never know how that changed the game not to mention the psychological effect on the Saints.
> 
> How the hell can a ball hit the goalpost and it goes unnoticed.???
> 
> Everyone who was watching the game on TV saw it straight away.




Yeah I agree, was very obvious on TV, even the crowd behind the goals saw in, you could see them reacting in the replays they showed. 

But I don't think it effected them psychologically, in bits they still definitely had the upper hand over the Cats, the Cats just held on because they actually kicked them between the two big ones and because of the missed goals from the Saints.


----------



## MrBurns (26 September 2009)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> Yeah I agree, was very obvious on TV, even the crowd behind the goals saw in, you could see them reacting in the replays they showed.
> 
> But I don't think it effected them psychologically, in bits they still definitely had the upper hand over the Cats, the Cats just held on because they actually kicked them between the two big ones and because of the missed goals from the Saints.




Well I still think the outcome might have been different but we'll never know.

Saints should have won by several goals but couldnt kick straight anyway.


----------



## GumbyLearner (26 September 2009)

Next year !

there is always next year!

Well done fellas!

You will be hard to **** with and break down next year!

What a team! 

A new legacy to look forward to.


----------



## prawn_86 (27 September 2009)

Good game, good friends, good beer. Cant really ask for much more as a non supporter of either team


----------



## mexican (27 September 2009)

mmmmmmmmmmm how sweet it is!
What a great a game. Good old hard slog! 2 out the 3 aint bad!
When the game was up for grabs, the champs stood up. Not bad for a hand bagger midfield!
mmmmmmmmmmm how sweet it is!
THE MIGHTY CATS PREMIERS 2009


----------



## Tink (27 September 2009)

ThingyMajiggy said:


> So give the Saints a free goal, Cats would still have won by 6 points. *It was given straight back to them anyway with some of the stupid umpire decisions. *Saints wasted way too many opportunities with misses.




I agree Sam

Was an excellent game - really enjoyed it : )

Pity with the rain on the day, still they got a great crowd, just under 100,000

Well done Geelong


----------



## Purple XS2 (27 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Saints were robbed ...



They wuz robbed? You wuz robbed?  Mate, _ I wuz robbed_. I had a few bob on a draw, and also on a half-time level score.
A minute before half-time, Saints soccer a goal (well done Justin Koschitzke) and scores are level, you beauty !! $1,000 bucks coming up!!
And then that evil goul Milburn abuses the goal umpire, (without any moral basis - Koschitzke's kick wasn't touched), and the umps give St. Kilda a second kick!! _ NOOOOOOOOOO_
Milburn you nightmare, give me back my thousand bucks!!


> that Cats' point that was counted as a goal changed the whole dynamic of the game, we all saw it on TV dunno why the goal umpire who was standing next to it didnt.



To be fair to the goal ump, Hawkin's kick grazed the inside of the post, and didn't change the spin of the ball through the air - from the goal ump's perspective, there was no clear sign of post contact. Had a field ump seen the deflection the call may have been overruled, but that didn't happen. One of those things.
And then that ogre Milburn restores the cosmic balance by screeching a goal to the Saints.
But still I say: _I wuz robbed!!_


----------



## Prospector (27 September 2009)

Saints weren't robbed Mr B, as others have said there was an 'evener-upper' almost straight away.  The issue was, they simply didnt kick for goals well.  They would have blitzed Geelong but they simply missed very easy shots.


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> Saints weren't robbed Mr B, as others have said there was an 'evener-upper' almost straight away.  The issue was, they simply didnt kick for goals well.  They would have blitzed Geelong but they simply missed very easy shots.




Geeez I'll say it just one more time, if the goal ump had taken notice of the 15,000 people behind the goals and given the correct decision there would have been a kickout not a center bounce.

Don't tell me that didnt have the potential to change the outcome of the game.

The Saints couldnt kick but they were right up there all the way.

Therefore an umps stupid mistake could have altered the outcome.


----------



## Prospector (27 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Geeez I'll say it just one more time, if the goal ump had taken notice of the 15,000 people behind the goals and given the correct decision there would have been a kickout not a center bounce.




 WT!  You are saying that an umpire should be influenced by the cheer squad behind the goals?  Seriously Mr B, I understand what you are saying but since when should an umpire listen to what a (biassed) crowd is saying! That would have been a very dangerous precedent for an umpire - "um, I am not sure what happened - I know, I will ask all the ladies and gents in 'red and black' for their advice!"


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> WT!  You are saying that an umpire should be influenced by the cheer squad behind the goals?  Seriously Mr B, I understand what you are saying but since when should an umpire listen to what a (biassed) crowd is saying! That would have been a very dangerous precedent for an umpire - "um, I am not sure what happened - I know, I will ask all the ladies and gents in 'red and black' for their advice!"




Not just the cheer squad, EVERYONE would have been screaming at him, all he had to do was ask anyone, check make sure .........but no.


----------



## Prospector (27 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Not just the cheer squad, EVERYONE would have been screaming at him, all he had to do was ask anyone, check make sure .........but no.




Maybe he asked someone in blue and white? 

Seriously Mr B, an umpire cannot ask anyone except another umpire what happened.  You really know that deep down, don't you.....I think maybe you are just stirring us up and I fell for it.


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> Maybe he asked someone in blue and white?
> 
> Seriously Mr B, an umpire cannot ask anyone except another umpire what happened.  You really know that deep down, don't you.....I think maybe you are just stirring us up and I fell for it.




Not at all, it's just that the goal umpire was the only one who didnt see it hit the post, remarkable.

With all those people telling him it touched, he should have had the sense to check.


----------



## Prospector (27 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Not at all, it's just that the goal umpire was the only one who didnt see it hit the post, remarkable.
> 
> With all those people telling him it touched, he should have had the sense to check.




I am betting that the first rule umpires ever learn is to ignore the crowd.


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> I am betting that the first rule umpires ever learn is to ignore the crowd.




Probably.

I havent seen anything much about it in the media.

Ahhhh who cares


----------



## Ardyne (27 September 2009)

What about a field umpire not seeing a push in the back by a full forward in front of goal or some other missed decisions that result in goals. Umpires miss things all the time..its just part of the game..


WE ARE GEELONG...............THE GREATEST TEAM OF ALL....

oooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhh yyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

Ardyne said:


> What about a field umpire not seeing a push in the back by a full forward in front of goal or some other missed decisions that result in goals. Umpires miss things all the time..its just part of the game..
> 
> 
> WE ARE GEELONG...............THE GREATEST TEAM OF ALL....
> ...




Those misses dont translate immediately into an extra 5 points with the boost to pump them up as goals do and depress the other side somewhat.


----------



## >Apocalypto< (27 September 2009)

CRIED MYSELF TO SLEEP LAST NIGHT.

SAINTS GAVE IT AWAY WITH ALL THE WASTED SHOTS ON GOAL!

THEN THE CATS TOOK IT OFF US IN THE LAST 15MIN.

CANT BLAME ANYONE BUT THE POOR KICKING AT GOAL OF ST KILDA

ANOTHER CHANCE GONE

:alcohol:


----------



## >Apocalypto< (27 September 2009)

Ardyne said:


> WE ARE GEELONG...............THE GREATEST TEAM OF ALL....
> 
> oooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhh yyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh




LUCKY MORE THEN GREAT i WOULD SAY


----------



## MrBurns (27 September 2009)

>Apocalypto< said:


> CRIED MYSELF TO SLEEP LAST NIGHT.
> 
> SAINTS GAVE IT AWAY WITH ALL THE WASTED SHOTS ON GOAL!
> 
> ...




They should have won by plenty thats the tragedy for them.

They have to live with the fact they beat themselves.


----------



## YELNATS (27 September 2009)

Congratulations Geelong. Eight flags now and more to come over the next 10 years. 

Bad Luck Saints, you were great, but missed your chances as the Cats did in 2008.

After years of frustration, Geelong have developed that winning habit courtesy of the administration under Frank Costa and shrewd recruiting and player development from about 2002.

Was also great to see the old stalwart Bob Davis present the Cup.

I can't wait for the 2010 season to start. What's the betting Geelong will play St Kilda in game 1.


----------



## Prospector (27 September 2009)

>Apocalypto< said:


> LUCKY MORE THEN GREAT i WOULD SAY




Saints supporters - your team had its chances, Geelong suffered last year (from poor kicking) and this year they were accurate in front of goals and despite having less scoring shots, won the game.  That isn't luck, that is called doing the most with the opportunities that come your way.  Life is like that sometimes. 

(PS, I am a Crows supporter not a Geelong one, so I am objective.)



YELNATS said:


> .Was also great to see the old stalwart Bob Davis present the Cup




That was funny when he got onto the platform and wouldnt leave while the team had their photos taken.  We were thinking they would have to air-brush him out!


----------



## greggy (27 September 2009)

What a great match.  Evenly poised up until the last minute.  Congratulations to Geelong.  I'll make a prediction now that the Saints will come back even stronger next year and win the 2010 Grand Final.
P.S. I don't barrack for either of these teams.


----------



## Tink (27 September 2009)

YELNATS said:


> Was also great to see the old stalwart Bob Davis present the Cup.




Yeah I love seeing the legends of the Clubs in these special moments : )

He was so proud, the big smile on his face lol 
it was so nice to see the guys with him..

I used to enjoy watching Jack Dyer, Bob Davis Lou Richards on the footy show then, had another name..


----------



## Duckman#72 (27 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Not at all, it's just that the goal umpire was the only one who didnt see it hit the post, remarkable.
> 
> With all those people telling him it touched, he should have had the sense to check.




Zac Dawson was right in front of it - and he hardly made an objection!

I agree with you Prospector, you can't expect the umpire to make a decision on the basis of the cheer squad!! 

5 minutes later Milburn gives away a free kick for abusing a goal umpire for not calling a ball "touched" when it was clearly a goal on the replay!! Thank goodness the goal umpire didn't listen to him!!

The reason the goal umpire missed the ball hitting the post was that he was unfortunately caught out of position, by a poor disposal from St Kilda on their own goal line, and Hawkins produced a full blown kick from only 8 metres out. 

There are hundreds of potential free kicks and missed opportunities in games, don't just single out these ones.

If you want villans, try Schnider and Milne not kicking straight. Geelong held St Kilda's forward line very quiet. Reiwoldt, Kossie and the aforementioned didn't have much impact at all.

Grreat game for the AFL to showcase it's big day. Although I thought the prematch build up was ordinary this year. (By the way WTF was Paddy Ryder doing in the sprints for Essendon at half-time? Was it a sprint for the ruckman? Where was Davey, Winderlich, Lovett etc? Or can someone tell me if Paddy is our fastest over 100m?)  

Duckman


----------



## MrBurns (28 September 2009)

Duckman#72 said:


> Zac Dawson was right in front of it - and he hardly made an objection!
> 
> I agree with you Prospector, you can't expect the umpire to make a decision on the basis of the cheer squad!!
> 
> ...





Someone giving away a free kick is not the same as a goal umpire missing the obvious and changing the flow of the game and whats kicking accuracy got to do with it ??? ........and it wasnt the cheer squad it was everyone behind the goals plus a few million watching on TV the coaches who had access to phones to tell them and all the technology available in 2009 and the goal umpire calls a point a goal changes the flow of the game and you brush it aside ??????? 

Perhaps the impact of that unnessary blunder on that game escapes you, not me and a lot of others.


----------



## nomore4s (28 September 2009)

lol, let it go Mr Burns. This sort of thing has been happening in footy for 100 years. Not even St Kilda have raised it as an issue as they had plenty of chances to win the game after that point but feel short, too much left to too few imo.

As a hawks supporter I find it somewhat ironic that all the cats supporters that were whinging that Hawthorn didn't win it Geelong lost it are now happy to celebrate winning in the same fashion, in fact Geelong were probably luckier then the hawks last year.

The GF this year again proves that it's not the best team during the season but the best team in September that wins the flag.


----------



## Tink (28 September 2009)

nomore4s said:


> The GF this year again proves that it's not the best team during the season but the best team in September that wins the flag.




Yep I agree with that -- depends on how they play on the day


----------



## Ardyne (28 September 2009)

Mr Burns, did I mention..............................

WE ARE GEELONG THE *GREATEST* TEAM OF ALL


----------



## Prospector (28 September 2009)

Ardyne said:


> Mr Burns, did I mention..............................
> 
> WE ARE GEELONG THE *GREATEST* TEAM OF ALL




Except in 2008, 2006, 2005, 2004, 2003, 2002..........


----------



## mexican (28 September 2009)

nomore4s said:


> lol, let it go Mr Burns. This sort of thing has been happening in footy for 100 years. Not even St Kilda have raised it as an issue as they had plenty of chances to win the game after that point but feel short, too much left to too few imo.
> 
> As a hawks supporter I find it somewhat ironic that all the cats supporters that were whinging that Hawthorn didn't win it Geelong lost it are now happy to celebrate winning in the same fashion, in fact Geelong were probably luckier then the hawks last year.
> 
> The GF this year again proves that it's not the best team during the season but the best team in September that wins the flag.




Not all of us. I have plenty of friends that are Hawk supporters and as I said to them and to you on this site last year, "Well done the hawks took thier chances and the Cats did not. The hawks deserved to win the flag. Enjoy!"
The same with the Cats this year, they took thier chances and the Saints blew it! Not the goal umpire Mr.Burns. The saints time will come sooner or later. But not too late or they will miss the boat completely.

I have watched the game a few more times and those goals that the saints missed............ bloody terrible!
Watch the game with both eye's open, not one Mr.Burns.


Mr


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Someone giving away a free kick is not the same as a goal umpire missing the obvious and changing the flow of the game




Why not? If a central umpire doesn't pay an obvious free kick in the goal square, or worse, pays a free kick that isn't there.....isn't that the same thing? Why is it different? Both are mistakes, both "change the flow of the game". 



MrBurns said:


> ........and it wasnt the cheer squad it was everyone behind the goals plus a few million watching on TV the coaches who had access to phones to tell them and all the technology available in 2009 and the goal umpire calls a point a goal changes the flow of the game and you brush it aside ???????
> 
> Perhaps the impact of that unnessary blunder on that game escapes you, not me and a lot of others.




I'm predicting that the "impact of that unnessary blunder" as you put it, will hit the AFL community with similar force to Dennis Lillee bowling a yorker at me with a ping pong ball.       

One day we will see cameras added to goal posts, and we will see "snick-o-meters" in action, but until then I will enjoy our game - "Third Umpire Free". I would hate to see our game going into the ...."wait for the video ref" path.

Yes in an ideal world, it would have been called a point, but if it means that an "ideal world" involves radio fitted umpires, mobile phone calls, video replays and a stop in play, then I don't want to live in that world. At what cost to our unique game are you getting the right decision?

Duckman


----------



## MrBurns (28 September 2009)

nomore4s said:


> lol, let it go Mr Burns. .




I think everyone else should let it go and admit a mistake like this is different than giving a free kick away or any of the other stupid irrelevant comparisons they try to draw.


----------



## Prospector (28 September 2009)

Mr Burns, if the Saints had kicked those very easy goals in the earlier quarters you would be out celebrating now. It's funny how people (not just Mr B)attribute the very last error as the reason why a loss has happened, rather than everything else that was executed poorly before that.

If the Saints management take the same view as you Mr B and neglect the real reason why they lost, then they wont do very well next year.

Maybe take a break and then really look at the match again.  Of course it was a poor decision but it wasnt the reason they lost.  Geelong could just as well taken the ball after the point (instead of the centre bounce) and countered immediately with a goal.


----------



## Ardyne (28 September 2009)

From the age today.......

"The greatest? Seems so
THE greatest of team of all? Well, here are some stats to prove that Geelong may well be that. The Cats' dual triumph from three successive grand finals was the 23rd time the feat has been achieved in league history but, importantly, their match-winning percentage during their 2007-09 period was 86.67, bettering the previous best, by Carlton in 1907-09 (84.33 per cent) and ahead of Essendon in 1948-50 (82.81 per cent) and Hawthorn 1987-1989 (82.43 per cent)."




My Mum is a fanatical cats supporter and after last year she was obviously very disappointed. She did say however that althought they lost the team had been so successful that she really enjoyed the whole year anyway and going to the footy was a lot more fun than it used to be.


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> If the Saints management take the same view as you Mr B and neglect the real reason why they lost, then they wont do very well next year.




Completely agree Prospector. 


What was a bigger factor in the Saints loss in the Grand Final this year; 

a) Cameras not fitted to goal posts, or

b) Players skills under pressure situations?


What is going to win the Saints more games next year; 

a) Cameras fitted to goal posts, or

b) Further development of the players skills under pressure situations?

The question Mr Burns is asking is....are we all happy to change the rules to allow video overule? And if so under what circumstances.

Duckman


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

Ardyne said:


> From the age today.......
> 
> "The greatest? Seems so
> THE greatest of team of all? Well, here are some stats to prove that Geelong may well be that. The Cats' dual triumph from three successive grand finals was the 23rd time the feat has been achieved in league history but, importantly, their match-winning percentage during their 2007-09 period was 86.67, bettering the previous best, by Carlton in 1907-09 (84.33 per cent) and ahead of Essendon in 1948-50 (82.81 per cent) and Hawthorn 1987-1989 (82.43 per cent)."




Ummm...... am I missing something here?? 

Why is Geelong being labelled as "The Greatest Team of All" after comparing themselves to other teams that have only won 2 flags out of 3? 

Are the Lions 3 Flags in a row somehow not counted? 

If that s the criteria, for what it is worth, Geelong are clearly the greatest side in history that only won 2 out of 3 flags. 

Brisbane still have dibs on "The Greatest"

Duckman


----------



## Prospector (28 September 2009)

Ardyne said:


> From the age today.......
> 
> "The greatest? Seems so
> THE greatest of team of all? Well, here are some stats to prove that Geelong may well be that. The Cats' dual triumph from three successive grand finals was the 23rd time the feat has been achieved in league history but, importantly, their match-winning percentage during their 2007-09 period was 86.67, bettering the previous best, by Carlton in 1907-09 (84.33 per cent) and ahead of Essendon in 1948-50 (82.81 per cent) and Hawthorn 1987-1989 (82.43 per cent)."




Surely the bottom line is to win the Grand Final and not how you win it?  In which case the Brisbane Lions Australian Football Club is the most successful AFL team this century, having appeared in four consecutive AFL Grand Finals between 2001 and 2004, winning three (2001, 2002 and 2003).  

Geelong aren't there yet.

And back to back will also trump two out of three - as recently as the Crows.
I think maybe the statisiticians can drag up any manner of stats to prove a point.  But ultimately it is only the number of times a team has won the match that counts.

Ah Mr Duckman, we are in sync....


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> Ah Mr Duckman, we are in sync....




Be careful making comments like that Prospector!! 

Being "in sync" with Duckman is no good for your "street cred" on ASF.


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

Since we are talking about "The Greatest Team of All". Here's a test for you.

What is the worst team ever to be labelled "The Greatest Team of All"?

I'll kick off and say I think it has to be the Bombers for their 1999,2000 and 2001 years. For all their dominance, they only won 1 GF, lost another GF and failed by a point to even make the GF in 99.

The comments about them being the "Greatest Ever" came strongly after their win over North, where they came from 69 points behind to win the game. (What the "Greatest Team Ever" was doing 69 points behind is apparently irrelevant to the debate!!

Are there any others worse than this?

Duckman


----------



## mazzatelli (28 September 2009)

I'd still say the Lions 4 straight GF, winning 3 of them has them as one of the best of this era. 
The Dons were great, especially 2000 - but I'd rather say that was the greatest season of all them them being the best team of them all.


----------



## Prospector (28 September 2009)

Duckman#72 said:


> Since we are talking about "The Greatest Team of All". Here's a test for you.What is the worst team ever to be labelled "The Greatest Team of All"?




And while we are at it, how about the most potential - lowest performer tag.  I'll start with Mathew Richardson.


----------



## jbocker (28 September 2009)

Hey who keeps voting the cats will win.
The score was 24 a little while ago.

As far as best team goes what about Freo... ??
Poor old Harv's did he say Freo would be dangerous.
He must wish he didnt say that.


----------



## Duckman#72 (28 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> And while we are at it, how about the most potential - lowest performer tag.  I'll start with Mathew Richardson.




Ha...yes Richo is hard to beat, but I'll add a couple of names.

Clive Waterhouse (Fremantle) and Josh Fraser.

I haven't checked the records but he has been a disappointing No 1 Draft Pick.  

Richo certainly takes it on longevity!!

Duckman


----------



## Sean K (28 September 2009)

mazzatelli said:


> I'd still say the Lions 4 straight GF, winning 3 of them has them as one of the best of this era.



Hard to go past that in recent memory. However, hard to judge different eras and just a few years can make a huge difference. The game has changed so much.


----------



## springhill (28 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> And while we are at it, how about the most potential - lowest performer tag.  I'll start with Mathew Richardson.




From the same team, i'll go Richard Tambling. No 4 draft pick in '04

Here's the top 25
 1 Brett Deledio Murray Bushrangers Richmond 
 2 Jarryd Roughead Gippsland Power Hawthorn 
 3 Ryan Griffen South Adelaide Football Club Western Bulldogs 
 4 Richard Tambling Southern Districts Football Club Richmond 
 5 Lance Franklin Perth Football Club Hawthorn 
 6 Tom Williams Morningside Football Club Western Bulldogs 
 7 Jordan Lewis Geelong Falcons Hawthorn 
 8 John Meesen Geelong Falcons Adelaide 
 9 Jordan Russell West Adelaide Football Club Carlton 
 10 Chris Egan Murray Bushrangers Collingwood 
 11 Adam Thomson Sturt Football Club Port Adelaide 
 12 Danny Meyer Glenelg Football Club Richmond 
 13 Matthew Bate Eastern Ranges Melbourne 
 14 Angus Monfries Sturt Football Club Essendon 
 15 Lynden Dunn Calder Cannons Melbourne 
 16 Adam Pattison Northern Knights Richmond 
 17 Andrew McQualter Gippsland Power St. Kilda 
 18 Cameron Wood West Adelaide Football Club Brisbane Lions 
 19 Ryan Willits Northern Knights Port Adelaide 
 20 Dean Polo Gippsland Power Richmond 
 21 Thomas Murphy Sandringham Dragons Hawthorn 
 22 Jesse Wells Tasmanian Devils Football Club Western Bulldogs 
 23 Sean Rusling West Adelaide Football Club Collingwood 
 24 Nathan Van Berlo West Perth Football Club Adelaide 
 25 Adam Hartlett West Adelaide Football Club Carlton 

then
37 Mark LeCras
39 Travis cloke
45 Justin Sherman
46 Henry Slattery
56 Chris Knights
62 Matthew Egan


----------



## Prospector (28 September 2009)

And we could do a similar post for fantastic players that Port Power let go or didnt pick up when they had the chance!

Aw, I know Angus Monfries so cant put him on the list.  How about Ben Cousins?


----------



## MrBurns (28 September 2009)

I don't follow the Saints at all, I was just arguing a point of principle, that if the point had been awarded as such the Saints would have been 5 points better off and had a kick out instead of a center bounce and that may have been enough to change the outcome.

Trying to compare that to other umpiring decisions is wrong , you see we *KNOW *that was a point, other decisions are arguable so are left to the discretion of the umpire.


----------



## nomore4s (28 September 2009)

Prospector said:


> And while we are at it, how about the most potential - lowest performer tag.  I'll start with Mathew Richardson.




That's a bit harsh, there are plenty of guys that have underperformed alot more then Richo imo. The guy nearly won a Brownlow last year and he has also played in a team with some of the worst skills in the comp.


----------



## >Apocalypto< (28 September 2009)

nomore4s said:


> That's a bit harsh, there are plenty of guys that have underperformed alot more then Richo imo. The guy nearly won a Brownlow last year and he has also played in a team with some of the worst skills in the comp.




plus all the injuries


----------



## GumbyLearner (28 September 2009)

nomore4s said:


> The GF this year again proves that it's not the best team during the season but the best team in September that wins the flag.




Well said nomore4s.

The best team won. As a Saints fan I was upset at our failure to grasp opportunities. 

We went into 3/4 time up by 7 points. The scoreboard did reflect that as 0.7 more points than Geelong. All credit to Geelong they took their chances, the Saints didn't.

Here's an interesting fact about the game on the weekend.

*It was the first time in VFL/AFL history that a side had won the first three quarters of a Grand Final and lost the match*.

I hope the Saints create another opportunity and take it next year.


----------



## Duckman#72 (29 September 2009)

GumbyLearner said:


> Here's an interesting fact about the game on the weekend.
> 
> *It was the first time in VFL/AFL history that a side had won the first three quarters of a Grand Final and lost the match*.




Hi Gumby

That's not correct I don't think.

Essendon did it to Hawhorn in 1984. It was considered one of the great Grand Finals and one of the best come from behind wins ever.

Essendon were 21 points down at qtr time, 25 points down at half time and 23 points down at three qtr time. They kicked 9 goals 6 behinds in the last qtr to win the game by 24 points.

Duckman


----------



## Kez180 (1 October 2009)

MrBurns said:


> Those misses dont translate immediately into an extra 5 points with the boost to pump them up as goals do and depress the other side somewhat.




6 points chief...


----------



## YELNATS (1 October 2009)

Duckman#72 said:


> Hi Gumby
> 
> Essendon were 21 points down at qtr time, 25 points down at half time and 23 points down at three qtr time.
> Duckman




Duckman, if that's the case Essendon "won" the 3rd quarter by 2 points, so Gumby may be right.


----------



## MrBurns (1 October 2009)

Kez180 said:


> 6 points chief...




5 points on top of the one they got......chief


----------



## Timmy (1 October 2009)

Why is this thread still going, wasn't it decided last Saturday?  
We waiting on the Elliot Wavers to give their tip(s) or something? :


----------



## trainspotter (1 October 2009)

Umpire won the game for the Cats when a fee kick was awarded to G.Ablett Jnr directly in front of goal. Ablett had hold of Saint backmans arm and fell backwards. Umpire whistle said differently. Harumph. 

Goal umpire declared a goal that hit the post. (as per discussion) Harumph

Chapman fired and Reiwoldt didn't. End of game.


----------



## trainspotter (1 October 2009)

Timmy said:


> Why is this thread still going, wasn't it decided last Saturday?
> We waiting on the Elliot Wavers to give their tip(s) or something? :




Like all good legends or suburban myths, the deeds of the vindicated become more impressive and the vanquished turn into weaklings I guess.


----------



## Duckman#72 (1 October 2009)

YELNATS said:


> Duckman, if that's the case Essendon "won" the 3rd quarter by 2 points, so Gumby may be right.




Hi Yelnats

Yes I agree - it could certainly be right. Gumby hasn't reponded so I don't know what he meant. 

Depends on what is meant by "won". I've obviously assumed it to mean "won" as in ...."had the lead or were in front." 

Duckman


----------



## GumbyLearner (15 July 2010)

#bump#

I'm sure there will be those who think that this is quite speculative. But given the membership of this forum it is not entirely inappropriate. Saints by 6 goals this year for mine!


----------

