# Average salary for a stock trader in Australia



## blaz0430

I know it depends on your skills, knowledge and experience and everyone differentiates but could anyone give me an average figure of what an Australian share traders salary is? Thanks just curious!


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## minwa

Define stock trader ? Fund manager or a plumber who buys BHP and ANZ and spends once a month checking the price ? Does buying a share actively makes you a stock trader or do you have to be fulltime in the market as a profession ?

Let's say the "average" is $20k (fund managers who makes $500k and lots of small retail investors who loses $5k). How does this matter as there are people who trades millions and people who puts $1k in stocks that equates to this "average" figure.


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## skc

blaz0430 said:


> I know it depends on your skills, knowledge and experience and everyone differentiates but could anyone give me an average figure of what an Australian share traders salary is? Thanks just curious!




No one can.. such figure does not exist and even if it does, it'd be incomplete and totally useless for you to make any decision upon.

Also, the use of the word "salary" is really quite far removed from the reality of most traders (except may be those who are employed by institutions).


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## skyQuake

skc said:


> it'd be incomplete and totally useless for you to make any decision upon.




^This

Personally I'd say its around 100k with a standard deviation of 1mil


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## Magda

I like the way you think, SkyQuake


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## Magda

The average salary for a stock trader in Australia is impossible to determine.

To arrive at a meaningful figure one would have to interview a very large number of traders and ask them to state their true income truthfully.

Human nature, being what it is, means that hardly anyone will tell you the truth. Some will greatly overstate their income just to brag, while others may greatly understate their income for fear the taxman might find out that they had not declared all their income.

I personally know some traders who are doing extremely well, year after year, but they still won't tell me the actual figures. However, from their lifestyle (mansions, expensive cars, extravagant overseas holidays etc.) one can see that they must be making millions.

I also know some who regularly blow up their accounts, but even that fact doesn't allow me to arrive at a meaningful figure for an average salary.


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## rb250660

Two-fiddy


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## cynic

rb250660 said:


> Two-fiddy




I'll Ro Sham Bo you for it!


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## 1BlondeSuperman

blaz0430 said:


> I know it depends on your skills, knowledge and experience and everyone differentiates but could anyone give me an average figure of what an Australian share traders salary is? Thanks just curious!




Since it appears that no one else could do better than a stupid smart remark. Which were for the most part utterly wrong. You can get an accurate average for anything that has a value set. 

I have tried to find the answer for you as I had the same question. I got 84K as the median salary from this site http://www.payscale.com/research/AU/Job=Trader,_Commodities/Salary.

Sorry I didn't find this thread for several years but I only jus had the desire to know.


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## CanOz

1BlondeSuperman said:


> Since it appears that no one else could do better than a stupid smart remark. Which were for the most part utterly wrong. You can get an accurate average for anything that has a value set.
> 
> I have tried to find the answer for you as I had the same question. I got 84K as the median salary from this site http://www.payscale.com/research/AU/Job=Trader,_Commodities/Salary.
> 
> Sorry I didn't find this thread for several years but I only jus had the desire to know.




How the bloody h e double hockey sticks would they know? It would depend on so many things that as Skyquake said, the average would be useless. Imagine one guy that has a daily risk limit of 50k and takes 75% of that, but yet another who has a 1k daily risk and takes 50% of it...wtf??

So you get an average of 84k, does that make someone feel better?


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## VSntchr

skyQuake said:


> Personally I'd say its around 100k with a standard deviation of 1mil



Well, looks like I'm **somewhere** within 1 standard deviation of the mean


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## Gringotts Bank

Both the big brokerages and the ATO would know the answer to your question.  To get the answer you'd probably need connections.

There would be a big variation, obviously, with most losing.  

Whenever I meet an small business accountant, I ask him if he has any traders on his books.  Most say "ummmm... yeh I used to have one guy".  So it's not a common job, and you probably need to be in the top 5-10% to make a living.


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## john5

it starts with the amount you have available to invest/use to invest, the more capital the larger the positions you can take, and the higher the profits (or losses), thus "salary" from drawing on your account


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## OmegaTrader

john5 said:


> it starts with the amount you have available to invest/use to invest, the more capital the larger the positions you can take, and the higher the profits (or losses), thus "salary" from drawing on your account




To calculate economic gains only

Equivalent salary

=

(Capital*(Risk adjusted return-Passive portfolio return))
___________________________________________
Equivalent time spent trading

Examples

$50,000 and 1% above market = $500 P.A
$50,000 and 20% above market = $10,000 P.A


$1,000,000 and 1% above market = $ 10,000P.A
$1,000,000 and 20% above market = $200,000 P.A



Minimum wage+externalities ~ $20 ph @ 40 hr work week ~ $40,000 P.A

Better job ~$40 ph ~ $80,000 P.A


Single parent on centrelink one child
$32,460.48

Single parent on centrelink two children

$37,305.32

Single parent,with 4 kids, unemployed

$47,511.88

Household with 4 kids, both parents unemployed

$53,234.48 + externalities



https://www.centrelink.gov.au/RateEstimatorsWeb/cre.do


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## JoshL

I dont think this can be answered easily if at all...

I trade with 23 other Currency Traders on a Private Forum where we all analyse and share information, but even so we are all different in our trading methods and have different results all the time.

I also know that some of our members hardly make any money while others coin it big time.  If you have a look at "Investors Underground" on Youtube, for example, you will find a couple of their members making hundreds of thousands in a year.

How long is a piece of string?  As long as you want it to be....


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## minwa

JoshL said:


> If you have a look at "Investors Underground" on Youtube, for example, you will find a couple of their members making hundreds of thousands in a year.




Cool - members making hundreds of thousands pa on youtube. Their subscription packages must be a steal at $1-2k. Get in before it's full !


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## tech/a

A salary to me is a drawing from your trading business
Much like any business owner should pay himself a salary.

I'd expect that someone trading for a living would allocate 
A salary of x and any surplus would go into their business
Capital base.

I'm surprised that everyone here talks about total earnings with no
Mention of tax and over heads.

All businesses I know which see their principals earning year in year out 6 
Figure salaries have nett profits of 10-20% on turn overs of 4-10 mill
These businesses would require an investment of 1-5 million to own them.
With upper management also earning 6 figure salaries.

A consistent 6 figure salary year in year out including taxes is rare in the
Business of trading for a living from what I've seen.
And fanciful for most who ask the question here.


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## minwa

tech/a said:


> I'm surprised that everyone here talks about total earnings with no
> Mention of tax and over heads.




Overheads for trading ? There's barely any..PC & internet & home(office) are living essentials that most have anyway. Brokerage is included in net profit. What else ? Maybe a subscription or 2..that's it ? Don't see how that's significant.

Tax is different for everyone, different countries, family situations etc. skews results massively when getting an idea of trading profits.


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## tech/a

Many would have a wife.
My biggest overhead.


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## dutchie

Average salary for a share trader:
For the first 2 years:                 -$10,000 pa
For the next 2 years:                  $0 pa
For the next 2 years:                 +$10,000 pa
For the next years:                    $10,000 +  pa


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## MrChow

I would guess it would be negative for a DIY, since 90% fail.


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## JoshL

minwa said:


> Cool - members making hundreds of thousands pa on youtube. Their subscription packages must be a steal at $1-2k. Get in before it's full !




Yep!  Im not with them but I guess it's like anything else hey!?  You get what you pay for.  But if you are still jumping around from one thing to the next trying to find the "holy grain" then you probably have no idea what I mean by that...


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## Porper

JoshL said:


> Yep!  Im not with them but I guess it's like anything else hey!?  You get what you pay for.




The opposite is true in most cases.

These fly by the night courses that sell for $5,000 then want another $10,000 for the advanced course are pure scams. You can join several services that I know of for less than $1000 a year, and they have a positive expectancy.

But...people are greedy and are enticed by the wild claims of massive gains. They get taken for a ride and then expect refunds for their own stupidity. Never going to happen.


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## rb250660

Porper said:


> You can join several services that I know of for less than $1000 a year, and they have a positive expectancy.




True but I'd doubt most people would follow every single signal for eternity. When the going gets tough and your're launching into a big draw down you are likely to give up, probably close to the deepest part of the draw down too. I've been there and done that, luckily I didn't go into a draw down but I gave up because I didn't trust the signals.

Write your own strategy, test it, etc. etc... This way you will know what to expect and are much more likely to follow it. With that said, the profits are not as consistent as you would hope.

My short term strategies are at new equity highs about 45% of the time. My long term system is at new equity highs only about 15-20% of the time. The latter would be tough going if you were relying on it for income (I don't). That's why I have most of my equity in the short term systems, they are my 'income'. Some months are dry, others it's raining cash. That said, you need a good buffer for the dry times and exercise control and bank a bit when the coin is rolling in the door.


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