# Pub "Glassings" - Another Gen Y Phenomenon?



## roland (8 September 2008)

What's with this idea of assaulting others with a glass is our pubs? Is this something new?

I'm gen x and, although I don't frequent pubs very often, I did so with mates in past and up until recently, never heard of people being "glassed"

What's up with our 18 - 30 year olds?

Maybe I am showing my age here, is this the same generation gap of misunderstanding that I had with my parents? (not that I had much, since dad died when I was 18).

I may have turned into a whimp, but I avoid the city and any other gatherings of alcohol/drug enhanced youths. (Sydney City after dark is not a nice place to be) So I rarely experience the problems with our youth that I see on the news, but certainly do feel uncomfortable around groups of drunk and noisy teens.

Of course not all kids are into drugs, alcohol, violence, public disorder etc etc. but still wonder why there seems to be such an escalation is this type of stuff.

From Wiki:



> 1981-1994
> 
> Generation Y, also known as the Echo Boom and Generation McGuire although Millennials or Internet Generation is becoming the more common parlance for this generation. These are usually the children of Baby Boomers and people in early Gen X. Generation Y grew up with many world-changing events including the rise of mass communication, the Internet, and the 9/11 terrorist attacks. The Y Generation is known as a Culture War "battleground" with growing disagreements between conservative and progressive perspectives. 1976-2001 is the widest possible definition commonly cited, but generally speaking this generation starts in the early 1980s and ends in the early 1990s.




From SMH:



> Glassing attacks on the rise
> Email Printer friendly version Normal font Large font John Kidman
> June 29, 2008
> 
> ...


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## DB008 (8 September 2008)

*Re: Pub "Glassings" - Another Gen y Phenomenon ?*

Been happening in the UK for ages.

eg; http://archive.thisishampshire.net/1999/6/15/91084.html

Go to google.co.uk and search pub glassings...

I thought that the Chelsea (or any other football team) fans years ago were wild. If you survived a glassing, it was called a Chelsea smile. Something like that.


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## roland (8 September 2008)

*Re: Pub "Glassings" - Another Gen y Phenomenon ?*



DB008 said:


> Been happening in the UK for ages.
> 
> eg; http://archive.thisishampshire.net/1999/6/15/91084.html
> 
> ...




Still the same age group though:



> Pub glassing girl may lose an eye
> From the archive, first published Tuesday 15th Jun 1999.
> 
> A TEENAGE girl could lose her sight after being glassed in a Southampton pub brawl.
> ...




I didn't suggest that is was an Australian thing, seems like the unrest is global.


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## Buddy (8 September 2008)

*Re: Pub "Glassings" - Another Gen y Phenomenon ?*

It's not a new phenomenon.  I can remember in the 70's this happening, not infequenently, at some hotels in Perth.  Unfortunately on a number of occassions, the local SAS fellows were involved. Finished up doing porridge, of course. Nasty pieces of work.


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## numbercruncher (8 September 2008)

Glasses should be banned from all pubs and clubs - we have the technology !!

If its ok to take firearms off an entire nation because of one nutcase, we can take Glasses out of Pubs/Clubs because of several attacks a week !!

What will it take ?? Probably a politicians friend or relative to die for it to happen as usual !!


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

heck the Coogee Bay Hotel in Sydney was put out of bounds when I was in the Army around 1970 - for just this reason - one of our number was glassed there.  

Agree with you nc - glasses should be banned.
(but how will we see what we're drinking


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## Pat (8 September 2008)

numbercruncher said:


> Glasses should be banned from all pubs and clubs - we have the technology !!
> 
> If its ok to take firearms off an entire nation because of one nutcase, we can take Glasses out of Pubs/Clubs because of several attacks a week !!
> 
> What will it take ?? Probably a politicians friend or relative to die for it to happen as usual !!






2020hindsight said:


> heck the Coogee Bay Hotel in Sydney was put out of bounds when I was in the Army around 1970 - for just this reason - one of our number was glassed there.
> 
> Agree with you nc - glasses should be banned.
> (but how will we see what we're drinking



Yep ban glass, but even plastic can do some damage... I suppose it's the type of plastic. I'm not really fond of drinking beer from plastic but if it saves someone some scares (and myself) then so be it, I'll drink straight from the tap. :


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## Struzball (8 September 2008)

Seems like a new thing...


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

maybe make that "ban them in troublesome pubs"...
the Coogee Bay pub for instance still makes the news regularly for instance.


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## doctorj (8 September 2008)

numbercruncher said:


> Glasses should be banned from all pubs and clubs - we have the technology !!
> 
> If its ok to take firearms off an entire nation because of one nutcase, we can take Glasses out of Pubs/Clubs because of several attacks a week !!
> 
> What will it take ?? Probably a politicians friend or relative to die for it to happen as usual !!



While we're at it, you'd better ban bar stools, in fact all furniture.  Not to mention anything hanging from the walls that might be removed.  Also, bottles of wine shouldn't be sold.  Neither should hot food as that might be used to burn people.  Actually, alcohol is harmful... better ban that too.

FFS.


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

doctorj said:


> While we're at it, you'd better ban bar stools, in fact all furniture.  Not to mention anything hanging from the walls that might be removed.  Also, bottles of wine shouldn't be sold.  Neither should hot food as that might be used to burn people.  Actually, alcohol is harmful... better ban that too.
> 
> FFS.




so what are the stats on glassings vs being hit by barstools dj?


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## roland (8 September 2008)

How about we just ban anyone under the age of 65 and only open for 2 hours a day


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## doctorj (8 September 2008)

2020hindsight said:


> so what are the stats on glassings vs being hit by barstools dj?



I doubt either is very pleasant.


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## professor_frink (8 September 2008)

doctorj said:


> While we're at it, you'd better ban bar stools, in fact all furniture.  Not to mention anything hanging from the walls that might be removed.  Also, bottles of wine shouldn't be sold.  Neither should hot food as that might be used to burn people.  Actually, alcohol is harmful... better ban that too.
> 
> FFS.




don't forget pool cues


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## white_goodman (8 September 2008)

hard plastic cups...how difficult


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## roland (8 September 2008)

why does someone want to go to a pub and glass someone in the first place?

what are the choices:

1. premeditated?
2. in bad company and peer pressured?
3. violent natured, pumped by "dutch courage"?
4. some sort of mental problem?
5. accident?

none of the above really makes any sense


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## Greg71 (8 September 2008)

It's like glassing your girlfriend has become the latest fashion.

It really is amazing that there are glasses in a pub or anywhere that alcohol is served, alcohol usually being the catalyst for violence. I worked in a pub as security (although mainly just praying that nothing would happen) for about a month, and it is one of the first things that I thought of. Why aren't there perspex cups? Why not just give out knives with each beer?


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## MrBurns (8 September 2008)

Tax the crap out of grog not just alco pops and then the brainless dickheads who get ripped and attack people will have to find another hobby.
Yes the pubs will complain and the grog companies will complain but I think public safety is more important than their profits.
Unfortunately our impotent wimps of polititians wont do it because it might upset their mates from the big end of town.
I can only hope it's them who are on the end of some of this violence at least then they may listen.


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## roland (8 September 2008)

Greg71 said:


> It's like glassing your girlfriend has become the latest fashion.
> 
> It really is amazing that there are glasses in a pub or anywhere that alcohol is served, alcohol usually being the catalyst for violence. I worked in a pub as security (although mainly just praying that nothing would happen) for about a month, and it is one of the first things that I thought of. Why aren't there perspex cups? Why not just give out knives with each beer?




It's not the glass that causes damage, it's the idiot yielding it. It's no different with guns. In fact if you try hard enough, you can kill someone with a pair of thongs (the ones on your feet


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> Tax the crap out of grog not just alco pops and then the brainless dickheads who get ripped and attack people will have to find another hobby.
> Yes the pubs will complain and the grog companies will complain but I think public safety is more important than their profits.
> Unfortunately our impotent wimps of polititians wont do it because it might upset their mates from the big end of town.
> I can only hope it's them who are on the end of some of this violence at least then they may listen.



here hear. 
And since the coco pops tax has been canned by the senate - then (imo) it should be put to them that taxes go up on all spirits - 

I think that solves their concerns and (Senate) jeers about "the kids are mixing it themselves haha"  

"ok Mr Senator, then tax all spirits then!"

signed ... beer and/or wine drinker 

PS I have a son in Europe planning to go to the Oktoberfest.   I almost told him to beware of glassing - At his age I saw a bloke glassed with a jug  (or rather one of their steins which are about 10mm thick!!) - someone right beside him "kinghit" him - element of surprise will work every time.   actually broke the stein across his face @!!

big chunks of cheek hanging down - this bloke still wants to go on drinkning - ... For every litre he poured into his mouth, half of it leaked out his cheek


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## Mofra (8 September 2008)

*Re: Pub "Glassings" - Another Gen y Phenomenon ?*



roland said:


> I didn't suggest that is was an Australian thing, seems like the unrest is global.



Are there any reports of glassings in Australia outside of NSW?
For all the talk of drunken violence in Melbourne, I haven't seen a fight for years. Perhaps only certain nightspots (ie anywhere that plays top 40 hits, and is frequented by guys who wear polo shirts with the coller turned up) that are having the problems with crowd violence (including glassings).


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## Julia (8 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> Tax the crap out of grog not just alco pops and then the brainless dickheads who get ripped and attack people will have to find another hobby.



I completely disagree.   That would be yet another example of (a) a revenue grab by the government who already rake in quite enough tax from us, and (b) penalising the majority of the population who use alcohol sensibly.

I am utterly fed up with law upon law catering for the very small proportion of people who behave badly.  Much better to punish them severely.
We have enough of a nanny state as it is, without adding even more legislation.  The more you treat people as being irresponsible, the more they will fulfil that expectation.


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## Mofra (8 September 2008)

Julia said:


> Much better to punish them severely.
> We have enough of a nanny state as it is, without adding even more legislation.  The more you treat people as being irresponsible, the more they will fulfil that expectation.



Have to agree with this - most young offenders get a bond and community service which is a joke, supposed community service activities seem to be cleaning "litter" where the supervisor can't control the groups of offenders who skive off and smoke whilst they are meant to be working. 
Violent offenders (drunken violence) should be made to experience the after effects of their actions: show them a hospital emergency depatment on a Friday or Saturday night; drink drivers should work closely with road accident victims.

The only way we can change the behaviour of some people is to involve them in the after effects of their behavior to demonstrate the consequences of their behavior. The slap on the wrist approach so far has achieved little.


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## roland (8 September 2008)

Julia said:


> I completely disagree.   That would be yet another example of (a) a revenue grab by the government who already rake in quite enough tax from us, and (b) penalising the majority of the population who use alcohol sensibly.
> 
> I am utterly fed up with law upon law catering for the very small proportion of people who behave badly.  Much better to punish them severely.
> We have enough of a nanny state as it is, without adding even more legislation.  The more you treat people as being irresponsible, the more they will fulfil that expectation.




Here, here Julia - just the exact sort of intelligent response I've come to expect from you 

I think we need to put in some fear of authority for people doing the obvious wrong things. The way our police are snubbed and abused just shows how little respect some now have for the protectors of our community. It actually goes further than the public social space - even in schools, our teachers are treated like crap and there is no discipline in the classroom. Some parents have lost control in the same manner and the kids take refuge in the communications of the internet and mobile phones in some clandestein collaboration against discipline and authority.


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## MrBurns (8 September 2008)

Julia said:


> I completely disagree.   That would be yet another example of (a) a revenue grab by the government who already rake in quite enough tax from us, and (b) penalising the majority of the population who use alcohol sensibly..




It's not about revenue it's about making large amounts of grog harder to get. 

If you use alcohol sensibly you won't be paying much extra now will you.


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> If you use alcohol sensibly you won't be paying much extra now will you.



reminds me of the arguments against RBT testing - "all the pubs will go broke etc etc" 

and how many lives have we saved since that came in ...


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## roland (8 September 2008)

2020hindsight said:


> reminds me of the arguments against RBT testing - "all the pubs will go broke etc etc"
> 
> and how many lives have we saved since that came in ...




All of these solutions assume that the glasser needs to be drunk. I suspect the kind of person that smashes a glass into someone's face wouldn't necessarily need much provocation - be it alcohol or some other excuse.


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## Julia (8 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> It's not about revenue it's about making large amounts of grog harder to get.



You are pretty naive if you imagine making alcohol more expensive will be a deterrent to the idiots you are talking about.





> If you use alcohol sensibly you won't be paying much extra now will you.




Absolutely not the point.   Why should any ordinary, reasonable person be paying any more in order to create a perception that "something is being done" to curb stupid and violent behaviour? It makes no sense.

Handing out serious punishment to the offenders is far more logical and far more likely to be a deterrent.


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## nick2fish (8 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> Tax the crap out of grog not just alco pops and then the brainless dickheads who get ripped and attack people will have to find another hobby.




Brainless dickheads will always find money,to drink, no matter what the price  Thats why they are brainless

Lets find another way of solving our social ills than taxing the sh*t out of everyone.

I know.... how about Law and Order or is'nt that in the budget again this year?


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

nick2fish said:


> Lets find another way of solving our social ills than taxing the sh*t out of everyone.
> 
> I know.... how about Law and Order or is'nt that in the budget again this year?




lol 
well it won;t be in the budget unless we get some taxes in.


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## MrBurns (8 September 2008)

I think the people who do this are certainly and without exception drunk or drugged.

It will stop the idiots because they wont be able to afford to get drunk, they will be able to afford to drink but not the get drunk.

Just got back from Europe, no drunks there, they cant afford it. You can walk the streets of Rome no problems, yes there is crime but not drunken fools out of control.

Yes it would be good if the law had some balls, they just let these creeps go with a slap on the wrist, it suprises me there are not more cases of retibution by relatives and friends.

I'm personaly disgusted with the legal system.

Non of this will happen and someone will go to jail at some stage for doing what the law won't.


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## nick2fish (8 September 2008)

:







2020hindsight said:


> lol
> well it won;t be in the budget unless we get some taxes in.



 I go to work get paid then part with 30% to pay tax go and fill up the car so I can go to work pay some more tax 
buy a bottle of wine so I can face work pay more tax...........  Wheres that glass?


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## 2020hindsight (8 September 2008)

well nick,
You get a reduction in income tax commitment - you drink sensibly, you still come out ahead  

I'm guessing that the cost to society due to alcohol is pretty massive....
hospitals, accidents, fights, wrecked lives, marriages, brains, unrealised potential,  lost workdays, sickleave, etc -  ..... It comes back to "user pays"  (sorta) 

I wouldn't be an ambo for quids for instance ... 

I could talk about more obtuse effects - the inability of partners to just "know" and "trust" this person that they thought they knew before the grog took over. 

PS But I was probably heading into that argument of taxing thinking of how the Fed govt could extricate themselves from the situation where taxes have been imposed on alcopops for a month or two, but now it's not gonna make it through the senate it seems etc.  -  only way out I see is to tax the lot.  

PS Like the luxury car tax going up from 25% to 33% for the amount above $57K.   A new car that costs (on road) about $60K has no LCT whatsoever - so there will be no increase. A new car that costs (on road) about $120K will have about $3K extra LCT.   

Pro-rata, ....
a new car that costs on road about $70K will have about $500 extra LCT.
and 
a new car that costs on road about $80K will have about $1000 extra LCT
and 
a new car that costs on road about $90K will have about $1500 extra LCT
etc.

So back to that $70K car....   Averaged over 10 years $50 per year.   say $1.00 per week, or a fraction of the extra petrol they have to put in the thing anyway.  

Imo, these budget decisions often end up as ...  "It doesn't matter what you decide, as long as you decide something".  "And get on with it".  I mean , the govt have to get tax somewhere - in order to improve education and health (and etc etc).  So where else can you collect tax better than with luxury cars?  I just can't believe that someone who can afford a $70K car cares that much about $1.00 per week.  - or rather that they would carry on like Nelson does over the matter.


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## Pat (9 September 2008)

Julia said:


> Handing out serious punishment to the offenders is far more logical and far more likely to be a deterrent.



Totally agree, a mate of mine was glassed with a vodka bottle when he was younger, the offender was given 5 yrs (I think it was 5 yrs, maybe 2 yrs?) probation.
Not good enough IMO, I think in lot of cases, the law is to lenient.


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## xoa (9 September 2008)

More sensationalism...

In my suburb back in the early 90's, I remember there were discarded needles everywhere, people would yell and spit out of cars, it wasn't uncommon to see people fist fighting outside bars. Most of that has dissipated now that "Generation X" have put away their Nirvana cassettes and assumed their new "learned elder" persona.


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## Kauri (9 September 2008)

all Glaases, Bar stools, Pool ques, Platic plates, Ash trays, Burps, Farts,et al, that dare  to carry out unprovoved attacks on HUMAN beans should be locked up for the the duration of....   uuummm

  SAS... Perth... (need to resort to) *Glassing*???  not the ones I know..  

   Beers
...............Kauri


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## nick2fish (9 September 2008)

Totally agree on the luxury car tax 20/20, but it is unfortunate that the Ice scurge that keeps these losers on their feet to drink more and lose all sense of rational behaviour is creating a huge cost to society and of course dealers and users escape tax payments.

Lawmakers and Law enforcers have suceeded in making pure MDNA pills expensive and difficult to source yet Ice is cheap easy to source.

My bar days are behind me now but I think I would feel safer in bar full of happy people swigging on MT Franklin water than a bar full of glazed eyes dropping down shooters.

IMO glassers should be given jail time and made to pay plastic surgery bills

Their empty wallets would make sitting down a little less painful when released


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## 2020hindsight (9 September 2008)

ice - sheesh - true, now you're talking serious madmen. 

But even booze ... (I'm sure you have more bar service than me but) I worked behind the public bar at the Station Hotel in Auckland once- was replacing someone who tried to break up a fight between Maoris and Samoans the night before lol - he was in hospital with a cue shaped dint in his head.   etc 

Real fun place to work lol. 

PS I don't have any problem with heavy penalties for glassing - if you can catch em of course.
(That goes for kicking a man in the head when he's down etc as well   - which I've also seen )


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## moXJO (9 September 2008)

nick2fish said:


> IMO glassers should be given jail time and made to pay plastic surgery bills
> 
> Their empty wallets would make sitting down a little less painful when released




This is what it comes down too. I know someone that has glassed two people in different attacks. The most he got was a bond. Anyone that commits one of these crimes should be jailed. And if you really want to curb it, anyone over the .05 limit that commits these crimes should be given a harsher penalty.

 Glassing’s are nothing new. I think this is a case of once the younger people hear of it happen, then they up the ante of violence till it becomes the norm.


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## gfresh (9 September 2008)

More ego these days = more violence.. simple. 

Nothing new, violence in bars and pubs have been around for many decades. The media showing it off, and somewhat glamorising violence in popular culture doesn't really help. If they stopped covering it, I think it would stop being an issue. 

People get killed by being punched with a fist as well. Banning glassware really isn't really going to fix anything, people just use what is available. A hard perspex cup I'm sure could cause a lot of damage if used in the correct fashion.


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## imajica (9 September 2008)

The fact that this behaviour has been given a defined label, 'glassing' is disturbing in itself - that something so abhorrent can be rationalised. This is why I do not frequent pubs! As an example, there is a truly brutal glassing in the film Trainspotting. Maybe this has been inspiration for the westie, bogan, lower socio-economic bottom feeders who engage in this practice.


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## moXJO (9 September 2008)

imajica said:


> The fact that this behaviour has been given a defined label, 'glassing' is disturbing in itself - that something so abhorrent can be rationalised. This is why I do not frequent pubs! As an example, there is a truly brutal glassing in the film Trainspotting. Maybe this has been inspiration for the westie, bogan, lower socio-economic bottom feeders who engage in this practice.




Actually it’s the beachfront yuppie kids out my way.It's not limited to the bogans.


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## Calliope (14 September 2008)

There was a time when judges took a very dim view of any bodily assault committed with a sharp instrument, but now that we have a kinder and more compassionate view of the criminal, he (or she) has to be a serial offender to receive a jail sentence. And that of course will be fully suspended. This doesn't help the victim much.


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## Julia (14 September 2008)

Until there is widespread use of victim/offender conferencing, I wouldn't expect any change in criminal/assault behaviour.

At present the perpetrator seems to have little understanding of the impact of his behaviour on the victim, and the courts do nothing to change this.

But put the victim and the offender in a room together, with  well trained mediators, and (a) the victim has the opportunity to express the horror of the assault and the ramifications in his/her life, and (b) the offender is forced to acknowledge this in the presence of the victim.

Sounds simplistic, but the effects can be capable of changing future behaviour.   I don't understand why such a basic procedure isn't used more often.


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## MrBurns (14 September 2008)

Put put the victim and the offender in a room together, with the victim armed with a taser more like it.

You dont really expect the softly softly appeal to their feelings approach to work do you ?

Lock them up for a while , I'm talking about all violent types.

No bonds, jail time.


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## tigerboi (14 September 2008)

*Re: Pub "Glassings" done by anyone*

The demon drink causing more injuries with the glassing "fad" continuing,must ban all glasses pronto & yep there will be other weapons but i seen awhile ago a girl glassed another girl...wtf?

as for bogan westies doing it id say as someone said its more the surfie type...simple:ban the glass...bloody drink kills more than cars(sober drivers) or drugs each year.

thankfully for myself as the owner of the highest class of licence on the road i rarely drink mindful of the 0.2 for my licence which i apply whether in the truck or car...tb


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## Julia (14 September 2008)

MrBurns said:


> Put put the victim and the offender in a room together, with the victim armed with a taser more like it.
> 
> You dont really expect the softly softly appeal to their feelings approach to work do you ?
> 
> ...



Who said anything about 'softly, softly'?
No such thing.   

More  useful than your answer of yet more violence.


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## MrBurns (14 September 2008)

Thats right lets all hold hands and sing "give peace a chance" while people are nursing sometimes life threatening injuries.

These cretins should be jailed and if they re offend they should be locked away until someone can prove they arent a risk to society and that might be a long time , give them a great chance to get in touch with their feelings.


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## Pat (15 September 2008)

Julia said:


> More useful than your answer of yet more violence.



So true.

Education does wonders.


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