# Ireland - Is it saveable?



## Aussiejeff (26 May 2010)

Although their stock market has not quite reached the low of GFC#1 (as Greece is almost about to break through), it is now dropping inexorably & their really doesn't seem to be much life left in the chart for the land of lucky 4 leafed clovers & little people??

Dropped 3.8% last night to the red line.


----------



## gav (26 May 2010)

Their politicians are starting to get a bit wound up about it too...

***Warning: contains "unparliamentary language".


----------



## Aussiejeff (26 May 2010)

gav said:


> Their politicians are starting to get a bit wound up about it too...
> 
> ***Warning: contains "unparliamentary language".





Spoken like a true Oirishman... 

Good one, gav


----------



## nunthewiser (26 May 2010)

I like Ireland

Great countryside, Friendly and genourous people.

Lets save it.


----------



## bellenuit (26 May 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> doesn't seem to be much life left in the chart for the land of lucky 4 leafed clovers




I think you mean 3 leafed clovers of the variety known as shamrocks. The 3 leafed shamrock is the national flower of Ireland and St Patrick was supposed to have used it to explain the Trinity. The 4 leafed clover as a symbol of luck is, I think, unrelated to Ireland.


----------



## pacestick (26 May 2010)

wasnt that long ago its economy was considered so good that it was described as the celtic tiger looks like it was all smoke and mirrors


----------



## billv (27 May 2010)

pacestick said:


> wasn't that long ago its economy was considered so good that it was described as the Celtic tiger looks like it was all smoke and mirrors




Ireland was not alone.

Many EU economies and US states had expansionary programs before the GFC they took the easy money which was thrown at them and they were doing well.
Later the GFC came and EU countries and US States lost their growth and cheap finance dried up so it all started to fall apart.
It will take a while for this situation to turn around because they now have to cut deficits at a time when they should be spending to stimulate growth.

I think Ireland and Europe will turn this situation around because they are working on it.
Everyone seems to be concentrating on old Europe at the moment but I think we should not underestimate the US deficit and Debt which have been growing steadily and are reaching levels of no return.


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (27 May 2010)

As James Joyce famously said.



> Ireland is the old sow that eats her farrow.




I have been to southern Ireland on a number of occasions on business.

It is a nation run by developers and criminals, class ridden and until recently under the toe of godbotherers and the privileged descendants of a couple of hundred people who fought the British to obtain freedom one hundred years ago.

Being thus run, it was an excellent place in which to do business in a bull market, as ethics gave way to profit, and it operated like a giant Ponzi scheme

I would avoid it now as it will implode financially.

It is not salvageable. The talented will migrate as they have for centuries and Ireland will limp along, getting pissed and singing songs.

gg


----------



## gav (27 May 2010)

Well said GG.  My partner is Irish and your post pretty much sums up hers and her families views.  They left nearly 20 years ago.  My partners mother returned earlier this year for a funeral and could not believe how bad her homeland has degenerated.  Their govt is extremely corrupt.  Yet for some reason their refuse to leave, and drink away their sorrows daily.


----------



## Aussiejeff (29 June 2010)

Garpal Gumnut said:


> As James Joyce famously said.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




You may well be right.



> DUBLIN — As Europe’s major economies focus on belt-tightening, they are following the path of Ireland. But the once thriving nation is struggling, with no sign of a rapid turnaround in sight.
> 
> Nearly two years ago, an economic collapse forced Ireland to cut public spending and raise taxes, the type of austerity measures that financial markets are now pressing on most advanced industrial nations.
> 
> ...



http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/29/b.../json8.nytimes.com/pages/business/index.jsonp

I feel sorry for the common Irish. They have little option (apart from an uprising) but to suffer the consequences of their leader's woeful mismanagement.

An unfortunate fate that is likely coming soon to many other cash strapped nations around this sorry a$$ globe.


----------



## spooly74 (6 July 2010)

This was the final straw. We're finished.


----------



## spooly74 (1 October 2010)

LOL


----------



## explod (1 October 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> You may well be right.
> 
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/29/b.../json8.nytimes.com/pages/business/index.jsonp
> ...




Yep my Great Grandfather woke up long ago left Ireland and joined the gold rush to Australia with two brothers to Redbank just west of Avoca in Victoria.

If we wanted to swing the pick we could prabably still knock up a few bob there today in my Great Grand Uncles paddock.  Still called Paddy's Paddock by the locals to this day.


----------



## UBIQUITOUS (1 October 2010)

Is there one of these threads for EVERY country?

Pakistan - is it saveable?
Afghanistan - is it saveable?
Switzerland - is it saveable?


----------



## Garpal Gumnut (1 October 2010)

I have made a quick trip to Northern Ireland and Eire within the past two weeks, and it is as ever, 2 failed states.

gg


----------



## c-unit (2 October 2010)

At least Ireland is doing the right thing economy wise and not flushing more public money down the train on stimulus money. They are drinking the awful medicine, but they will get better.

The Americans, on the other hand. Well they are just trying to prolong the party hangover by drinking more.


----------



## UBIQUITOUS (2 October 2010)

c-unit said:


> The Americans, on the other hand. Well they are just trying to prolong the party hangover by drinking more.




The US are a different kettle of fish. They have so may weapons at their disposal that I wouldn't be surprised if this is as bad as it gets for them. They could devalue their reserve currency, impose trade sanctions or just go to war.

I'm not saying that they will do the right thing but unlike other nations, the US do have choices. The Irish on the other hand, as part of the European union, are in a bind.


----------



## MrBoJangles (24 October 2010)

It just might take so many years for it to get back on its feet.


----------



## Alex Barton (19 November 2010)

Most people live in an economic system that they don't understand. Regardless, the real truth of the matter is that Ireland brought this upon itself. The Germans have a strong economic model that works, it is the MOST successful economic model in Europe, yet they will be footing most of the bill for the Irish bailout! It seems to me there is a greater message here. A strong manufacturing base that provides equality for all its citizens allows an economy to grow sustainably. Did Ireland (indeed, does Australia) have such a strong economic base? I dare say no.


----------



## doctorj (19 November 2010)

Alex Barton said:


> Most people live in an economic system that they don't understand. Regardless, the real truth of the matter is that Ireland brought this upon itself. The Germans have a strong economic model that works, it is the MOST successful economic model in Europe, yet they will be footing most of the bill for the Irish bailout! It seems to me there is a greater message here. A strong manufacturing base that provides equality for all its citizens allows an economy to grow sustainably. Did Ireland (indeed, does Australia) have such a strong economic base? I dare say no.



The real truth is that it isn't Ireland they're bailing out, but their own banks.  Germany and the UK will ensure Ireland get by, because if they don't there's a very good chance that the contagion will spread to their own banking systems.

Attached is a table produced by Morgan Stanley that estimates the exposure of a number of European Banks to Ireland.  Note that it doesn't include the Landesbanks' exposure which is likely to be very high.


----------



## Calliope (24 November 2010)

When Ireland is in trouble emigration starts.

*Spectre of emigration stalks Irelan*d



> Fleeing for a better life abroad had seemed a closed chapter in Irish history but the searing economic crisis is once again sending Ireland's young people heading for the exits.
> 
> For centuries Ireland had been a country of emigration, with tales of escaping the Emerald Isle ingrained into its music and literature.
> 
> ...




http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-new...emigration-stalks-ireland-20101124-1872s.html


----------



## Aussiejeff (25 November 2010)

> Ireland has announced a record $20 billion worth of budget cuts, just days after accepting an unprecedented international bailout.
> 
> Finance minister Brian Lenihan announced a four-year economic plan designed to calm financial markets and satisfy international lenders that their $120 billion loan will be paid back.
> 
> ...




http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/11/25/3075765.htm

This is Ireland putting it's _BEST_ foot forward? Is this some kind of inane Irish joke? :silly:

Just some raving loony politician trying to hype up what is looming as a terrible future few years for middle to lower income Irish folk. Yeah, the little people. They're the ones who are going to carry the can for corporate Ireland.

What a sick joke.

Any smart Irish will ignore the pathetic media spin & gummint hype & pack their bags now before they sink into the bog....


----------



## Agentm (25 November 2010)

the only option coming up for the piigs will be the printing press..


----------



## Aussiejeff (25 November 2010)

Agentm said:


> the only option coming up for the piigs will be the printing press..




Excellent "at a glance" chart there, secret Agentm 

The one for Spain could be even more entertaining


----------



## professor_frink (25 November 2010)

Agentm said:


> the only option coming up for the piigs will be the printing press..




that's not an option for them, these countries don't control their own currency anymore.


----------



## Agentm (26 November 2010)

Aussiejeff said:


> Excellent "at a glance" chart there, secret Agentm
> 
> The one for Spain could be even more entertaining




spain is 7 times bigger




professor_frink said:


> that's not an option for them, these countries don't control their own currency anymore.




after spain, there is nothing left.. time to run the printing presses, which is what they  have already said they will do.


nigel farage in a classic speech..  gotta love it..



"But it's even more serious than economics, because if you rob people of their identity, if you rob them of their democracy, then all they are left with is nationalism and violence. I can only hope and pray that the euro project is destroyed by the markets before that really happens"


----------



## professor_frink (26 November 2010)

Agentm said:


> spain is 7 times bigger
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Who has said that the printing presses will start running agent?


----------



## Agentm (26 November 2010)

axel weber


anyone caught hitlers plan to save ireland... lol


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryqaGPMWFMM


i wont post the actual video as it contains offensive language on the facing screen


----------



## Dangerous (26 November 2010)

c-unit said:


> The Americans, on the other hand. Well they are just trying to prolong the party hangover by drinking more.




a few quiet ones down the local watching the footy and having a punt is the way these things are cured...


----------



## professor_frink (26 November 2010)

Agentm said:


> axel weber
> 
> 
> anyone caught hitlers plan to save ireland... lol
> ...




Just found the comments(here for anyone that's interested).

That's an interesting change from his usual line, I wonder how much of these recent comments could be put down to him wanting to be the next ECB chief.

He's been a rather vocal opponent of the bailouts up until now - he was calling for an end to the EU stimulus, and  had opposed rates staying low for any length of time

Seems like he has had a change of heart now that the French are opposing him becoming the next ECB president.

I'm rather wary of anyone that changes their opinion when power is up for grabs.


----------



## explod (26 November 2010)

Some great posts and a great thread on where it is at.

What is really good is I can sit back and not say anything anymore, everyone is starting to get it.

Yet to be crystal clear is the sufferring of ordinary people at the hands of the Wall Street paper ponzie's.   Lend and print and lend and Europe is too deep now to not have to do the same thing.  The few demonstrations already seen will turn into angry mobs looking for blood and ripe to be sent to war.

Go physical p/m's and the vegies.


----------



## gav (29 November 2010)

Irish Economic Crisis explained by robots...


----------



## nukz (29 November 2010)

I dont understand why they don't default, why does everything need to be saved. The cost is to great to save the PIIGS just imagine when the US defaults(formally or informally). 

The bailout basiclly makes Ireland a slave to the IMF and i would be expecting anybody who still has money would be emigrating out of the country if they havn't already anyway. 

The poli's in Ireland are very weak, they don't have the spine to default(of course they must be getting allot of pressure from country's and organisations in which they owe the money to) but they should understand that there job is to serve the public.

I saw a opinion poll which suggested a majority of people in Ireland favor a default rather than a bailout.


----------



## IrishDigger (18 December 2010)

An interview with an Irishman in America who tells it as he sees it.

Warning: Repeated use of the 'F' word is used during the interview

Click Here For Interview


----------



## Dona Ferentes (15 March 2022)

Now, let's see, a country has a low tax regime in an attempt to stimulate the economy ... and there are no consequences?

_Various estimates place the number of foreign-owned planes operated by Russian airlines at around 500 or more, and the vast majority of them were inside Russia when the war started February 24.

Aviation consulting firm Ishka estimates that the foreign-owned planes are worth US$12 billion ($16.67 billion), nearly half of that by Irish-based lessors._

And not a Tupolov nor Antonov among them.


----------

