# How many pip do you collect per week? (Newb Q's)



## The Mint Man (15 June 2009)

Hey people of ASF,
Just wondering how many Pip traders are achieving on average per week. And what do you consider a reasonable target?
I could ask how much $ people make but I figure that is relative to the amount you have to invest in the first place.

Myself, I'm fairly new to Forex so feel free to offer any tips... 
I have been practicing on and off for about 6 months after a work mate revealed that he had turned $2000 into $40000 in a little over 8 months I should mention that he practiced for about 6 months prior to trading for real and had traded the US stock market before that.

About 10 days ago I signed up for another demo account and so for I have made 200 pip over the 10 days. I try to keep it pretty simple and mostly stick to one trade at a time for now, follow the trends and trade on any decent news.... which was quite successful last week (in AUD/USD) when the job numbers came out. 
I also have been sticking to 3 pairs, in order of preference (judging by my transaction statements, haha) they are  AUD/USD, EUR/USD and USD/JPY.

I was just stopped out from a trade (using a OCO order) I entered this morning in the AUD/USD and made 70 pip. I will try to post up a pic of the chart I was using.... well one of them. I am using 15min, 30min and 1hr charts ATM. I mostly entered on trend con't from last week and also the fact that commodities were down which would obviously affect the markets. To me those two things combined made me fairly confident to enter that trade.

Anyway enough rambling.... I'm interested in what others have to say about their targets and trading techniques.

Cheers


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## white_goodman (15 June 2009)

the best question is what % you make a week, pips or dollar amounts mean nothing... well dollsr amounts do sorta


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## The Mint Man (15 June 2009)

Yeh percentages probably work too but the reason I ask for pip is because I'm currently practicing and have chosen a target of 100 pip a week to start with. 
Someone with just $5000 trading Aud/usd, lots of 10000 at any one time with a target of 100 pip per week and someone with $50000 trading aud/usd lots of 100000 at any one time will end up with the exact same percentage should they meet their target. However throw in levels of leverage, different currency pairs and each individuals risk appetite then the percentages and dollars made will be completely different.... 
IMO the guy who can make 200 pip a week is a better trader then the guy making 100 a week no matter what the %'s are.
As I said, its all relative to the amount you want to risk, how much leverage you wish to use etc, etc...


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## Mr J (16 June 2009)

> I have been practicing on and off for about 6 months after a work mate revealed that he had turned $2000 into $40000 in a little over 8 months I should mention that he practiced for about 6 months prior to trading for real and had traded the US stock market before that.




He'll probably lose it far more quickly and he'll never talk about it again. There's an off chance that he will not be your co-worker for much longer.



> About 10 days ago I signed up for another demo account and so for I have made 200 pip over the 10 days.




This is all meaningless. The result is over an insiginificant sample, and demo trading does not accurately mimic real performance.



> and also the fact that commodities were down which would obviously affect the markets




What makes you think there was an edge here?



> Yeh percentages probably work too but the reason I ask for pip is because I'm currently practicing and have chosen a target of 100 pip a week to start with.




Pips have different values to different people. The scalpers may be looking for a few pips on a trade, a trader working on a longer term timescale may be looking for 100 in a trade. Percentage is also relative, as averaging 1% a day is reasonable for some and dreamland stuff to others.

Don't aim for 100 pips a week. Results will vary greatly from week to week, you probably won't be profitable, and even if you are you will probably find that your weekly average will be quite different. Forget setting yourself a target, just try to make profitable trades. 



> IMO the guy who can make 200 pip a week is a better trader then the guy making 100 a week no matter what the %'s are.




You haven't given enough information to properly compare them, and most of the time traders can't be compared. We all have different aims, strategies and work on different time scales. 10 pips is a large move to some, peanuts to others.


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## alwaysLearning (16 June 2009)

I think everyone asks this question when they start to get serious about trading. 

IMO it is the wrong question to ask as others have mentioned previously.

Number of pips per day/week isn't the best thing to look at because the volatility can rapidly change from day to day or week to week etc.

Looking at a % gain or loss is better IMO but I guess it is personal preference.

I think psychologically it is tougher to try to think in terms of collecting a certain number of pips per day/week/month because the 'over trading' mind set can kick in very quickly as soon as you take a few losses in a row.

Trading IMO is not like a normal day job where you 'go to work'. It is speculation and requires good timing and risk management. You want to trade according to your edge and MM rules ofcourse. (MM rules in trading are essentially the same as what professional gamblers use).

By the way, I'd be very careful about trading during big news events. Look to Forexfactory calander and use caution if you trade during any red calandar items. 

http://www.forexfactory.com/calendar.php?

In general I'd stay the heck away from interest rate announcements and Non Farm Payrolls. It is incredible how price can move during these types of events. Some people have a knack for trading during these events but I think for most traders it is very difficult--based on personal experience and also what more experienced traders on forex factory say.

To get back to the topic. Probably the best reason to avoid thinking in terms of pips per week or day is that when you decide to make a trade you should be adjusting the number of units you buy or sell so that it is in line with the percertage you are risking on the trade such that it is matched with the approproiate stop loss value.

Volatility means that you can't/shouldn't just use a fixed stop loss value. (unless you have an edge that says you can )

btw--when looking at volatility, look at the ATR on the time frame you are interested in. ATR=Average True Range.


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## Stormin_Norman (16 June 2009)

The Mint Man said:


> Hey people of ASF,
> Just wondering how many Pip traders are achieving on average per week. And what do you consider a reasonable target?
> I could ask how much $ people make but I figure that is relative to the amount you have to invest in the first place.




and another question is how much risk is being taken. i could make 5% a week and risk 5% a week.

or i could risk 50% a week and make 50% a week.

an important distinction which is not often made when newbies think about returns.



The Mint Man said:


> Myself, I'm fairly new to Forex so feel free to offer any tips...
> I have been practicing on and off for about 6 months after a work mate revealed that he had turned $2000 into $40000 in a little over 8 months I should mention that he practiced for about 6 months prior to trading for real and had traded the US stock market before that.
> 
> About 10 days ago I signed up for another demo account




what happened with the previous accounts? expire or busted? if busted how many? how much was lost before the 200 pips in 2 weeks?

its why i advise $100 accounts. losses arent as easy to forget and start again as they are on a demo.


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## fapturbo (16 June 2009)

The Mint Man said:


> Hey people of ASF,
> Just wondering how many Pip traders are achieving on average per week. And what do you consider a reasonable target?




Learn about how many pips you put at risk to gain those 100 pips on average per week.

Find out how many wins you are getting compared to losses on average.

Once you know these ratios then you will have a good idea as to how much you should risk on anyone trade.

This will help you determine your position size/number of lots you should be trading per trade.

http://www.earnforex.com/position_size_calculator.php

Use this handy device to calculate your position size based on your risk per trade. I presume you are trading with a Stop Loss??


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## The Mint Man (16 June 2009)

Thanks for the replies... especially the members below which seemed most helpful.


alwaysLearning said:


> Trading IMO is not like a normal day job where you 'go to work'. It is speculation and requires good timing and risk management..



You got that right!


Stormin_Norman said:


> and another question is how much risk is being taken. i could make 5% a week and risk 5% a week. or i could risk 50% a week and make 50% a week.
> an important distinction which is not often made when newbies think about returns.
> what happened with the previous accounts? expire or busted? if busted how many? how much was lost before the 200 pips in 2 weeks?
> its why i advise $100 accounts. losses arent as easy to forget and start again as they are on a demo.



In order of questions:
I am practice trading based on a hypothetical account size of $5000 (in other words I'm disregarding the $50K that they give you) and trading 1 lot of 10000 at a time... with a risk of 1% per trade, which gives me a 50 pip stop loss ($50) each trade. In the past I have used 30 pip stop loss but this was taken out easily at times... so far 50 seems to give me more breathing room and usually sits below at least 1 good support/resistance line.
I have had 4 practice accounts so far for a few different reasons, one being the fact that I wanted to practice more and I also wanted to try out different trading platforms as some are clearly better than others. ATM I'm with GFT.
The first practice account I did what most would probably do and went ape **** ending up losing $, based on the whole 50K I think I finished with 45K
The second one was basically even as family stuff took priority over practicing trading.
The third I tried to take a calmer approach, sticking to 1 100,000 lot at a time (as thats the account I was given) and mostly trading the AUD/USD. Most of the trades were off support/resistance levels. I ended up about $450 at the EOM which wasn't that great but better than a loss. However I found that it wasn't very consistent.
This time I have got a mini account allowing me to trade realistic lots for a beginner. I have been mostly sticking to 1 lot at a time over 3 different currency pairs but the AUD/USD has been a clear favorite of mine. As mentioned I am in profit so far with this one. It might be small amounts to some but for me its all about building confidence ATM.
The best thing this time is i feel more in control and more consistent so far. 


fapturbo said:


> Learn about how many pips you put at risk to gain those 100 pips on average per week.
> 
> Find out how many wins you are getting compared to losses on average.
> 
> ...



Thanks for that fapturbo. As mentioned above I am using a stop loss however if I see that the movement is quite volatile I will cut the loss (or gain in a couple of cases) early and find another opportunity, sometimes I will wait a while or even until the next day so as to avoid making a silly decision in trying to make up for a loss.
I would post up the transaction reports but thats proving a pain in the @rse so over all the trades I have taken:
Losses = 8 for a total of $192.80
Wins = 12 for a total of $398.48

Cheers


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## Stormin_Norman (16 June 2009)

decision order:

1. opportunity to predict market
2. stop loss position
3. position size

using that tool above will help u get correct position size. look to place it the otherside of a support point. make sure its a little bit further, because u dont want it to be just hit then reverse.

but most importantly get a rock solid plan on how u trade.


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## The Mint Man (16 June 2009)

Spuin haha... I was going to get in short on the AUD/USD but thought I would reply to you guys first... only to return to my chart and find it well down, 50 pip down now. I'm guessing this has something to do with 2 of the other big banks increasing their rates making it even more possible for the RBA to comment on further reductions.


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## The Mint Man (16 June 2009)

Mr J,
My work mate has not lost the 40K.....I should mention that is 40K US too
When we last spoke he was sitting a couple of K above that and was telling me that he reduced the amount of risk he is taking. He has paid his house off (with profits from other investments) and is now waiting for the AUD to pull right back (to take advantage of the conversion rate) before taking most of his profits which he will invest in another property, while still leaving a little for the FX trading. 
Fact is he has made 2000% in less than a year, what do you make? As I said before he was a fairly experienced trader of the US stock markets prior switching to Forex. You should give people more credit especially when you really know nothing about them.

As for the impact of commodities on the AUD/USD I would have thought that was quite clear. This pair, according to my research follows the markets quite closely.... Commodities down means our markets down and USD strength against these commodities means increased downside risk to the pair.... Coupled with the preceding trend (Down) this trade seemed a no brainer.

Cheers


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## >Apocalypto< (16 June 2009)

The Mint Man said:


> Hey people of ASF,
> Just wondering how many Pip traders are achieving on average per week. And what do you consider a reasonable target?
> I could ask how much $ people make but I figure that is relative to the amount you have to invest in the first place.
> 
> ...




Hi Mint Man,

I trade off a 15min chart, based off the range I look to make 10-20 pips a day.


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## professor_frink (16 June 2009)

42.


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## fapturbo (16 June 2009)

>Apocalypto< said:


> Hi Mint Man,
> 
> I trade off a 15min chart, based off the range I look to make 10-20 pips a day.




I thought you didnt trade range breaks 

10-20pips per day is more than enough..... With the correct win/loss ratios..


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## >Apocalypto< (16 June 2009)

fapturbo said:


> I thought you didnt trade range breaks
> 
> 10-20pips per day is more than enough..... With the correct win/loss ratios..




MT4 bar range


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## Stormin_Norman (16 June 2009)

The Mint Man said:


> Spuin haha... I was going to get in short on the AUD/USD but thought I would reply to you guys first... only to return to my chart and find it well down, 50 pip down now. I'm guessing this has something to do with 2 of the other big banks increasing their rates making it even more possible for the RBA to comment on further reductions.




i think the weakness had more to do with general risk aversion + russia's comments re: USD.




The Mint Man said:


> Mr J,
> 
> Fact is he has made 2000% in less than a year, what do you make?




about 20,000. but ive calmed down now. i went crazyhorse at the start, but now that its serious money, carrying on that way would have eventually seen me fark up. now its 10-20% a week. which i think would come out around 2k a year if i calculated it out.

now i let my autotraders do my work, and dont trade manually at all anymore. i spend my 'trading time' working on new systems, or modifying current ones.

i started fundemental, then went technical -- but still not thinking robots were any good. now i only trade using them pretty much.


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## Mr J (16 June 2009)

The Mint Man said:


> Mr J,
> My work mate has not lost the 40K.....I should mention that is 40K US too
> When we last spoke he was sitting a couple of K above that and was telling me that he reduced the amount of risk he is taking. He has paid his house off (with profits from other investments) and is now waiting for the AUD to pull right back (to take advantage of the conversion rate) before taking most of his profits which he will invest in another property, while still leaving a little for the FX trading.
> Fact is he has made 2000% in less than a year, what do you make? As I said before he was a fairly experienced trader of the US stock markets prior switching to Forex. You should give people more credit especially when you really know nothing about them.
> ...




I didn't say he has already lost it, just that there's a very good chance he'll do so in the future. Plenty of people have had shorterm success and not survived. You didn't go into depth about his trading past, but that also does not guarantee future success.

Give people more credit when I don't know anything about them? I don't know anything about him, so I'm not going to assume anything. I don't assume he'll lose it, just that there's a good chance he'll lose it. Since I don't know him, it's the only reasonable view I could take.

2000% could be great or just some shorterm luck. If he's an experienced trader, then obvious the bias is towards skill, but without knowing his risk management I can't rule out that he's just been lucky. Many people have done this without skill, so I can't rule it out.


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## rossw (20 June 2009)

With oanda (I think) you can set your risk limit to a % of your account and then it auotmaically adjusts your $/pip

So your 20 pip stop when you start may only be $20 ($1/pip) but then as your account grows your same 20 pip stop could now be bigger as it adjusts your position size upwards

something else for you to look into...


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## MS+Tradesim (22 June 2009)

>Apocalypto< said:


> Hi Mint Man,
> 
> I trade off a 15min chart, based off the range I look to make 10-20 pips a day.




Interesting. This is my goal too. I'm using 15min candles, looking for high probability moves away from trend lines back into a range. 10 pips a day is plenty. I'm still in practice mode - live trading but very small positions.


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## AbundantIncome (17 July 2009)

Hmmm . interesting questions, from my about 3-4 months experience including paper trading, this is a very hard question ...

For example, I lost over ten grands of my profit the two weeks prior, then I get back nearly all of them this week ... so zero profit for the past 3 weeks ... eekkkkkkkkkkkk 

I am ashamed to say I am still not disciplined with my trades as yet ... wonder how long it would take to be disciplined with one's trading plan ?

Another week, more lessons to be taken in ...

Hope all of you had better week ...


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## Stormin_Norman (17 July 2009)

AbundantIncome said:


> I am ashamed to say I am still not disciplined with my trades as yet ... wonder how long it would take to be disciplined with one's trading plan ?




that's why i quite like autotraders. they do it by the book. even if that is the reason they often lose


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