Yogi Questions

[theasxgorilla]

They are showing the conflict I find in mixing various methods.

Coyotte,

You've illustrated well what I think Magdoran might have been saying about "bolt on" methods, like EW.

Based on the EW count chart on the left hand side, you'd expect the move up to be exhausted, right (5th of the 5th...)? But looking at the chart on the right a trend-following system might be saying, enter now and go long, blue sky.

I revert to Magdoran's comments about such a method being applicable in about 30% of situations. This is one of the other 70%. In the AGET chart the EW count has been "discovered", but if I was doing that count visually and by hand I think I'd be more inclined to say that there isn't an obvious count there.

 

[tech/a]

Coyotte.

I cant see any conflict just yet.
The wave 5 of 5 isnt yet complete and I'll have a look and see what a few targets say tonight. So BSL is still nett bullish.

 

[wavepicker]

Coyotte,

You've illustrated well what I think Magdoran might have been saying about "bolt on" methods, like EW.

Based on the EW count chart on the left hand side, you'd expect the move up to be exhausted, right (5th of the 5th...)? But looking at the chart on the right a trend-following system might be saying, enter now and go long, blue sky.

I revert to Magdoran's comments about such a method being applicable in about 30% of situations. This is one of the other 70%. In the AGET chart the EW count has been "discovered", but if I was doing that count visually and by hand I think I'd be more inclined to say that there isn't an obvious count there.

To get the most out about what is happening in terms of EW, you MUST start with the "big picture first" The primary long term wavecount is the starting point. From there we must work our way down into the smaller timeframes and degrees of trend. EW works in a fractal geometrical way as this. Start big and work toward small to the timeframe you wish to trade.

Only by doing this you can determine the types of wave structure that may be in progress. Confidence of this may help you determine the probabilities of certain structures that are most likely to follow.

Simply starting a EW count from anywhere may not yield the desired results consistantly.

The AGet wave counts are too simplistic and are really to be used with type 1 and 2 trade setups. As mag has previously said, the best computer is the one in between your ears

Cheers

 

[theasxgorilla]

To get the most out about what is happening in terms of EW, you MUST start with the "big picture first" The primary long term wavecount is the starting point.

I totally agree...and still struggle to get a clear wave count onto BSL. Anybody game?

 

[Kauri]

I totally agree...and still struggle to get a clear wave count onto BSL. Anybody game?

Hi ASX G..
I've got this on the weekly for an overall picture of where the trend/wave count is at...
Cheers
Kauri

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

I would have thought there was more interest in the Fib extension. Is 2.618 unreasonable? I guess not for the young'uns. I'll be happy with 1.27

External retracement! :

 

[56gsa]

Yogi - you are an enigma!

ref first message on this thread re PNN

06022007 ... positive news expected here. ANNOUNCEMENT 7/2
22022007 ... minor and intraday rally? 176 low 187 high
23-26022007 ... minor and positive PEAK OF THE RETRACEMENT
---
March 2007.
05032007 ... significant and negative 151 down to 135 low
22032007 ... significant and positive news ... TODAY 144.5 to high of 165

 

[yogi-in-oz]

Yogi - you are an enigma!

ref first message on this thread re PNN

06022007 ... positive news expected here. ANNOUNCEMENT 7/2
22022007 ... minor and intraday rally? 176 low 187 high
23-26022007 ... minor and positive PEAK OF THE RETRACEMENT
---
March 2007.
05032007 ... significant and negative 151 down to 135 low
22032007 ... significant and positive news ... TODAY 144.5 to high of 165

Many thanks for your kind words 56gsa ... positive feedback is
always welcomed here ... !~!

However, the accuracy of that post, simply bears testament to the
ongoing proof, that Gann's astrotrading principles remain as relevant
today, as they were 100 years ago .....

..... so, in understanding that Gann and others like him, simply employed
the NATURAL cycles in our lives, we can then be humbled and admit,
that as traders, we are only borrowing those astrotools to enhance our own
technical analysis ... and realizing then, our own contribution is virtually NIL.

Your post also comes at an opportune time, as today our Sun enters Aries,
marking the change of seasons and the start of Gann's trading year.

HAPPY NEW YEAR, Gannsters ... !~!

happy trading

paul

P.S. ..... now let's hear why the EW crowd could not make any accurate
forecasts on PNN, given they had the same opportunity, in this
thread ... ??? Maybe, they just got their count wrong again, huh?

Puhleeeeze ... it's time to give up LOOKING BACKWARDS at the
count and the man-made interpretations of lagging data ... !~!

It is now time, to work with the forward-looking God-given stuff instead,
using very specific natural laws, that NO MAN can EVER change.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

HAPPY NEW YEAR, Gannsters ... !~!

happy trading

paul

P.S. ..... now let's hear why the EW crowd could not make any accurate
forecasts on PNN, given they had the same opportunity, in this
thread ... ??? Maybe, they just got their count wrong again, huh?

Puhleeeeze ... it's time to give up LOOKING BACKWARDS at the
count and the man-made interpretations of lagging data ... !~!

It is now time, to work with the forward-looking God-given stuff instead,
using very specific natural laws, that NO MAN can EVER change.

Happy New Year too Paul.

Are you saying EW is a waste of time? No pun intended.

 

[yogi-in-oz]

Hi Snake,

Given the evidence, it would certainly seem that EW counts
are waaaay too subjective .....

..... if we intend to develop some reliable trading tools, we
should surely be building upon a solid foundation of objective
natural laws ... and if those laws could not be manipulated
or changed by ANY traders, it must surely make our tools
a lot stronger ..... yes???

happy trading

paul

P.S. ..... relying on EW wave counts, as our main trading indicator,
automatically has us looking at lagging data and also ignoring
the obvious benefits of analyzing the (constant) TIME axis.

 

[>Apocalypto<]

Hi Snake,

Given the evidence, it would certainly seem that EW counts
are waaaay too subjective .....

..... if we intend to develop some reliable trading tools, we
should surely be building upon a solid foundation of objective
natural laws ... and if those laws could not be manipulated
or changed by ANY traders, it must surely make our tools
a lot stronger ..... yes???

happy trading

paul

P.S. ..... relying on EW wave counts, as our main trading indicator,
automatically has us looking at lagging data and also ignoring
the obvious benefits of analyzing the (constant) TIME axis.

God that makes sense, Yogi totally agree with you.

Yogi what are your thoughts of Market Profile & Meta Profile? It is something that really interests me.

 

[It's Snake Pliskin]

Hi Snake,

Given the evidence, it would certainly seem that EW counts
are waaaay too subjective .....

..... if we intend to develop some reliable trading tools, we
should surely be building upon a solid foundation of objective
natural laws ... and if those laws could not be manipulated
or changed by ANY traders, it must surely make our tools
a lot stronger ..... yes???

happy trading

paul

P.S. ..... relying on EW wave counts, as our main trading indicator,
automatically has us looking at lagging data and also ignoring
the obvious benefits of analyzing the (constant) TIME axis.

Thanks Yogi for your thoughts.
I'll ponder the consequences of studying EW any further. I am not biased at the moment but still considering alternative approaches particulaly leading indicators. Most say EW is objective due to the rules etc. But the practitioner may make it subjective. I notice the original work by Elliott is not what it is today.

Yogi I am exploring the time element.
Happy trading
Snake

 

[yogi-in-oz]

God that makes sense, Yogi totally agree with you.

Yogi what are your thoughts of Market Profile & Meta Profile? It is something that really interests me.

Hi Trade_It,

..... sorry buddy, know next-to-zero about either one, so
cannot really make any informed comments, from this end ...

have a great weekend

paul

 

[yogi-in-oz]

Thanks Yogi for your thoughts.
I'll ponder the consequences of studying EW any further. I am not biased at the moment but still considering alternative approaches particulaly leading indicators. Most say EW is objective due to the rules etc. But the practitioner may make it subjective. I notice the original work by Elliott is not what it is today.

Yogi I am exploring the time element.
Happy trading
Snake

..... nice work, Snake ...

Time is constant and therefore, it must be easier to analyze,
than the highly variable price axis ... yes???

happy days

paul

 

[Agentm]

i have to apologise to you yogi, i showed disrespect to you in dec on the adi thread..

i now am totally convinced you have something that somehow works..

i have apologised on the adi thread and i now need to urgently know the answer to my question.. is yogi god?

 

[motorway]

Time is constant and therefore, it must be easier to analyze,
than the highly variable price axis ... yes???

One is a function of the other ?

The price axis is "highly" variable.... precisely because the time axis BY choice
is constant

Make the time axis variable ... ( that is adaptive to the speed of trend )
and maybe the highly variable price axis is no longer highly variable..

The speed of light is a constant

Time = process is anything but.

motorway

 

[motorway]

"

Prior to Albert Einstein's relativistic physics, time and space had been treated as distinct dimensions; Einstein linked time and space into spacetime. He said that time was basically what a clock reads; the clock can be any action or change, like the movement of the sun."
"the standard time interval (called conventional second, or simply second) is defined as 9 192 631 770 oscillations of a hyperfine transition in the 133caesium (Cs) atom."

****the clock can be any action or change******

This is very important point imo.. To take investment or trading to another level..

Time is not constant.... All it is is what We determine the clock should be..

Time is what a clock reads..

Build a better clock ( a stock or market clock ) and you build better trading system...

The tides in nature have No reflection.. We can predict the tides of the sea
and even utilize them AND they will not change... Time here a process is
constant ...

If We attempt to predict events that feedback through reflection
If We predict and utilize the waves of the Market

They will NOT stay the same .. The very act of reflection alters them

Here Time as process IS not constant.. But constantly speeding up and slowing down.. eluding any attempt of utilizing a feed forward system...

Time is what the clocks read .Clocks read any process We decide
Very arbitrary....

Whats important is recognizing this.. And using the right clock for our purposes..

motorway

 

[yogi-in-oz]

"

Time is what a clock reads..

Build a better clock ( a stock or market clock ) and you build better trading system...

Time is what the clocks read .

Whats important is recognizing this.. And using the right clock for our purposes..

motorway

Hi folks,

... some of what you say is true, motorway.

However, many traders want to make it a lot more complicated,
than it ever needs to be ... let's KISS ... KEEP IT SIMPLE, SUNSHINE ... !~!

Firstly, time IS what a clock reads and if we use the right clock for our
purposes, we CAN use it to confirm better exits and entries, in the markets.

... to keep it simple, we use a base measure of time, that EVERYBODY will
understand ... !~! ie ... 60 mins = 1 hour and 24 hours = 1 day

Just like your kitchen clock ...

If we apply that time measure to the planets, the Venus will orbit the sun
in 225 days, year-after-year, just as it has been doing for eons ... likewise,
our moon orbits earth every 28 days or 13 times every year
and all the other planets in our solar system, will have a similar story .....

If we use time in that way ... it IS both constant and SIMPLE ... !~!

Using financial astrology, we recognize 10 planetary orbits in our solar
sysem, that taken individually, remain constant.

If we then, take into account of the interaction, between those planetary
orbits (time cycles), then we can appreciate, that time MAY become a
somewhat more dynamic entity ... with waves of individual cycles, shown
to interact, with each other.

Motorway mentioned the tides, which in themselves ARE a reflection of
the movements of our earth and moon, measured against both time and
the position of the sun ... "as above, so below."

..... fortunately for traders, we only need to appreciate those dynamics,
at a very superficial (and mathematical level) and with the use of an
ephemeris, we can very quickly pinpoint the position of ANY planet, at
any point in time ... which makes it very easy to assess, on a 360 degree
dial, representing the "cosmic clock" or zodiac.


In short, to keep-it-simple for trading purposes, Gann used the planetary
cycles (measured in our regular time) to provide better market timing,
as the planets aspected, known positive or negative triggers for individual
markets, on their never-ending journey, around the Sun.


happy days

paul



=====

 

[yogi-in-oz]

i have to apologise to you yogi, i showed disrespect to you in dec on the adi thread..

i now am totally convinced you have something that somehow works..

i have apologised on the adi thread and i now need to urgently know the answer to my question..

Hi agentm,

... no apology needed, nor expected ... here or anywhere ... !~!

Only God (whatever you perceive Him to be) is God .....

Fact is, these natural cycles are available for EVERYBODY to use,
if they are prepared to make the effort ... learning some simple maths
and geometry, learning about the planets and their movements and some
simple interpretation, techniques, too ... !~!

happy days

paul

 

[Agentm]

thanks yogi..

now the burning question is answered, i can rest easier a little!!

phew!!! i was getting worried as i had a lot of lose ends i needed to fix up and hadnt got round to yet, kinda got worried!!

keep up the good work, and you are totally correct on adi, by dec the sp will be stratopheric, but for the next couple of months we all have to sit it out..

enjoy your kharma or whatever you guys do!! cheers