What can we learn from Anzac day?

[2020hindsight]

If anyone is interested, the National Archives have opened up files from WWI - so you can research old rels who were there. but be warned, a lot of people checking it out, (plus newspapers leading into Anzac Day) and might be better to check it our after that.
http://naa12.naa.gov.au

Further to previous post , here's more on that "Gift to the nation"
http://www.naa.gov.au/the_collection/gift-to-the-nation.html

 

[2020hindsight]

I just realise that, in the previous post, there is a photo of the horses used in WWI. Here's another copy of a poem I found on the web on that topic - Aussie origins (Kym Eitel) - sad one folks - and surely a sad moment for the men who had to kill their horses because quarantine and expense prevented them from coming back to Aus.

REMEMBER THE HORSES TOO
© Kym Eitel

The men who went to war for us, and died so far away,
are honoured and remembered well, each touching Anzac Day.
Our soldiers fought with hero strength, but let us not forget -
who helped them through those horrid times of bomb and bayonet?

The Remounts Section(*1) sourced the best – Australia’s finest Walers(*2)
were led aboard a hundred steam ships – patient equine sailors.
Oblivious to war ahead, they crossed the angry waves.
Not all of them survived the trip, some sleep in ocean graves.

The Brigadier’s prancing mount, the trooper’s sturdy steed,
the half-legs (*3) pulling water carts, gave strength, endurance, speed.
Through dust storms, scorching temperatures, and shifting sand and hills
they proved that they had hearts of gold, with courage, nerve and wills.

The Waler took the trumpeter to call at Palestine.
The heavy horse pulled medic carts behind the firing line.
The gun horse (*4) hauled artillery to arm the troopers’ fight,
while sections (*5) rode reconnaissance each dark and restless night.

The horses saw the desperate times, when death was all around.
They galloped through the screaming injured, thrashing on the ground.
They were shot at, strafed by German planes, felt shrapnel each grenade.
The wounded, frightened horses fell, as Turk machine guns sprayed.

All did their job, and did it well, with little hope of rest.
The saddle taken off at night, was thanks they got at best.
A pat, and “Thanks, good on ‘ya mate,” a nosebag with some corn,
a quick lay down, a few hours sleep, then back to war at dawn.

So many stories have been told – heroic acts of horses
who double-backed the injured men and dashed through Turkish forces (*6).
And when the war was finished, all the troopers clapped and cheered,
but what about the horses, that they loved and so revered?

Their horse was friend and comrade, through the thick of war and thin.
The Aussie politicians wouldn’t let them come back in.
They said, “Because of quarantine, and massive costs involved,
you’ll have to leave your mounts behind.” The troopers’ cheers dissolved.

The war was done. The men could leave that nightmare combat zone,
but first, they had to take the lives, of those who’d saved their own!
The younger mounts were volunteered to India’s command.
Those over four, were shot and left, to perish in the sand.

The horses of the 3rd Brigade, were killed in Tripoli.
They lined them up in olive groves, then shot them. Tears ran free.
Each marksman fired, and wished the horse had died while serving war,
to lay the blame on enemy – instead his own heart tore.

The horses’ frightened screaming rose above the gunshot rattle,
and left the men with lifelong scars, of killing after battle.
A thankless way to thank each horse for service in the sand,
and fearless dedication shown to save our precious land.

One hundred and eighty thousand horses, gave their blood and lives(*7),
to help return our troopers to their children and their wives.
They gave their all, and still found more, brave gallantry to give.
They’d never see green fields again, or come back home to live.

We're grateful for the Anzacs, and their sacrifice as well.
We know the wars were brutal, and the soldiers went through Hell.
So honour fallen loved ones, and the friends we never knew,
but I ask you, every Anzac Day … remember the horses, too …


1 - The Remounts Section sourced and bought horses to send overseas. Banjo Paterson was one of these men.

2 - The Waler was not a breed of horse, but they were an Australian-bred horse, from a range of breeds or cross breeds. They were bred to be extremely hardy and of good nature. Only blacks, bays and brown horses were used. It was in 1846 that the term “Waler” was coined by the British, because Australian horses were originally sourced in New South Wales, but by the mid-1800’s, all Australian horses were referred to as Walers. The most famous feat of the Walers, was the Light Horse charge on Beersheeba in 1917, to claim the water wells.

3 - “Half-legs” were a Clydesdale-cross, bred for endurance, speed and strength.

4 - “Gun horses” were the heavy horses that pulled “18 pounders” (a gun that shot shells weighing 18 pounds). Each gun and limber, which carried ammunition, were hitched together behind a team of six horses. The horses were arranged as three pairs, and each pair had a postillian rider on the near side horse. If any of the horses was injured, the rider could cut the traces and release the horse, so the rest of the team could keep going.

5 - “Sections” were groups of four horses and riders that went on scouting rides to look out for advancing enemy at night.

6 - A particularly interesting story can be found on page 111 of the book, “From the Saddlebags at War”, by Joan Starr – “... one night, (Major Mick) Shanahan found four Australians who had lost their horses in the thick of combat. He took two on his horse, and with the other two clinging to his stirrups, he dashed safely through the Turks in the darkness.”

7 - The only horse to return to Australia was Sandy, the mount of Major General Sir William Throsby Bridges, who was the highest ranking Australian officer killed at Gallipoli. He was given a state funeral, and the horse was shipped back to Australia to take part in the funeral parade.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.diggerhistory2.info/
http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-help/faq.htm#horses

Did the horses of the Light Horse or the Boer War contingents come home?

Sadly, no. The estimated 25,000 horses sent overseas could not be returned to Australia for quarantine reasons. The ones left in South Africa could look forward to a reasonably normal life. In North Africa and Egypt many Light Horsemen (supposedly) shot their beloved horses to save them a terrible life. The ones that were left were often abused by the locals but an English noblewoman set up charity with the aim of protecting them that was relatively successful and lasted for many years.

More information {if you go to thaqt site}

The total loss in horses (Boer War) on the British side was 326,000. Australian horses contributed 37,245 to this number. Not one horse from Australia is known to have returned.
The toll on horses in World War 1 was horrific. A monument in Sturt Street, Ballarat, commemorates the 958,600 killed "including 196.000 that left these shores and never returned".

 

[2020hindsight]

geek award given to the bloke responsible for (some of) the digger's website

Also an example of some of the countless FAQ's listed on that site - in case you didn't know what a "Deep Thinker" was for instance (which I for one didn't) - later changed to "Fair Dinkum" because anyone who joined after the casualty lists came out etcetc - really well set up site.

Lol, military jargon - "short arm inspection FAQ #32
http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-help/faq.htm#short

 

[2020hindsight]

Uniforms of WWII (apparently the male model is the american bloke who presented the "geek" award mentioned in the previous post ) - lol - talk about the "universal soldier "
http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-uniforms/all-forces.htm

 

[2020hindsight]

And on the condemn / contemn question (incidentally allegedly a distinctly Australian phenomenon):-

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-poetry/0-poetry-cat-index.htm

Grandpa, What Did You Do In The War? by Jeff Cook

I’d been mowing the lawn and pulling some weeds, and slipped inside for a breather
I picked up the paper and turned on the news, not paying attention to either
When my grandson came in with a look on his face and a question that hit me full bore
An innocent question, no intention to hurt, “Grandpa, what did you do in the war”?

My skin went all creepy, I had sweat on my brow, my mind shot back fifty years
To bullets that thudded and whined all around, to terror, to nightmares, to tears
I was crawling through mud, I was shooting at men, tried to kill them before they killed me
Men who had wives and children at home, just like mine, just like my family.

“What did you do in the war?” he had asked, a question not meant to cause pain
But it brought back the horrors I’d left far behind in a deep dark recess of my brain
I remembered the bombs being dropped from the planes, the explosions, the screams, and the loss
Of a friend - or an enemy - but a life just the same, replaced by a small wooden cross.

The visions attacked me of tramping through jungles, hot and stinking, with leeches and flies
Of orders that seemed to make no sense at all - of distrust, of suspicions, of lies
I lived once again all those terrible storms, the dysentery, fever, the snakes,
The blisters that lived with me month after month, all those blunders, and costly mistakes.

But how could I tell the boy all about that, ’Twould be better if he didn’t know
It’s a part of my life that I don’t talk about from a good half a century ago
So I gulped, took a breath and tried to sound calm, and bid him to sit at my side
Then opened my mouth to say a few words, but the tears welled up and I cried.

He cuddled to me with a look of concern, and I mumbled of feeling unwell
Then took hold of myself, blew hard on my nose, while I thought of some tales I could tell
“What did I do in the war,” I began, then the stories began tumbling out
And they flowed with such ease I felt better again, and got over my pain and my doubt.

I told him of how I had made many friends, how I’d trained and had gone overseas
Made a joke of how seasick I’d been on the way, almost dirtied myself when I’d sneezed
I told of the joy of the letters from home, of the hand-knitted socks and the cake
That I got for my birthday but three weeks too late ’cause it went somewhere else by mistake.

We talked about mateship and what it had meant to trust someone else with your life
And of when I came home to my family again, to my kids, Mum and Dad, and my wife
Of the crowd on the wharf, the bands, and the pomp, and the pride I felt in the parade
But I’m not ashamed that I hood-winked the boy, a decision I’m glad that I made.

He can grow up without seeing fear in my eyes, or know of the terror I knew
For he’d not understand - and neither he should - all those memories that hit me anew
But maybe some day when he’s older than now, I will tell him what war did to me
But with luck he won’t ask me ever again, about wars that never should be.

 

[2020hindsight]

Vietnam brief history... from a couple of websites . The map allegedly applies to the Tet Offensive.
Casualties overall as listed below :-
After Vietnam (millions killed on each side), of course the majority were USA, with 58,209 killed
followed by South Korea (5000)
and many more Aus killed (512) than NZ (37).
also Thailand 350.
Note that UK wasn't there, and nor officially was Canada. ..

At the heart of the conflict was the desire of North Vietnam, which had defeated the French colonial administration of Vietnam in 1954, to unify the entire country under a single communist regime modeled after those of the Soviet Union and China. The South Vietnamese government, on the other hand, fought to preserve a Vietnam more closely aligned with the West. U.S. military advisers, present in small numbers throughout the 1950s, were introduced on a large scale beginning in 1961, and active combat units were introduced in 1965. By 1969 more than 500,000 U.S. military personnel were stationed in Vietnam. Meanwhile, the Soviet Union and China poured weapons, supplies, and advisers into the North, which in turn provided support, political direction, and regular combat troops for the campaign in the South. The costs and casualties of the growing war proved too much for the United States to bear, and U.S. combat units were withdrawn by 1973. In 1975 South Vietnam fell to a full-scale invasion by the North.

The human costs of the long conflict were harsh for all involved. Not until 1995 did Vietnam release its official estimate of war dead: as many as 2 million civilians on both sides and

some 1.1 million North Vietnamese and Viet Cong fighters.

The U.S. military has estimated that between 200,000 and 250,000 South Vietnamese soldiers died in the war.

In 1982 the Vietnam Veterans Memorial was dedicated in Washington, D.C., inscribed with the names of 57,939 members of U.S. armed forces who had died or were missing as a result of the war. Over the following years, additions to the list have brought the total past 58,200.

(At least 100 names on the memorial are those of servicemen who were actually Canadian citizens.)

Among other countries that fought for South Vietnam on a smaller scale, South Korea suffered more than 4,000 dead,

Thailand about 350,

Australia more than 500,

and New Zealand some three dozen.

Vietnam emerged from the war as a potent military power within Southeast Asia, but its agriculture, business, and industry were disrupted, large parts of its countryside were scarred by bombs and defoliation and laced with land mines, and its cities and towns were heavily damaged. A mass exodus in 1975 of people loyal to the South Vietnamese cause was followed by another wave in 1978 of “boat people,” refugees fleeing the economic restructuring imposed by the communist regime. Meanwhile, the United States, its military demoralized and its civilian electorate deeply divided, began a process of coming to terms with defeat in its longest and most controversial war. The two countries finally resumed formal diplomatic relations in 1995
http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-conflicts-periods/vietnam/0-vietnam-cat-index.htm

In 1969, growing disenchantment with the war, as well as US attempts to reduce casualties and prepare for disengagement, led to the emphasis in operations changing to 'pacification' - the enhancement of the security of the populated areas of the RVN, combined with the upgrading of the effectiveness of RVN forces. Notwithstanding this commitment, 1ATF offensive operations in Phuoc Tuy ensured that by 1971 there were few incursions by VC and NVA major units.
Commencing in 1968, public opinion in both Australia and the United States began to turn against the war. Exacerbated by the propaganda disaster of the communists’ 1968 'Tet' Offensive, the combination of the unpopularity of conscription and the rising casualty rates, public opposition in both the US and Australia forced the political leaderships to announce the withdrawal of allied forces. In November 1970, 8RAR was withdrawn and not replaced. 1ATF withdrew from Phuoc Tuy in November 1971, followed shortly after by 1ALSG. AATTV, having been gradually reduced in strength, concentrated in Phuoc Tuy Province with the departure of 1ATF, and continued training ARVN forces until the withdrawal of the last Australian elements in December 1972.
For the Australian Army, the withdrawal from Vietnam represented the end of 33 years of continuous operational duties, which had commenced with World War II, continued through the occupation of Japan, the Korean War, the Malayan Emergency and Indonesian Confrontation to the Second Indo-China War in Vietnam.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-poetry/other/svn.htm

Wounded Heart
A poem by John Lyle

Our soldiers true blue fought world wars one and two;
in Korea as well dodging shot and shell;
Even in Malaya our soldiers saw hell;
But it was Vietnam when the people stopped caring.

Welcome home from the war they would say;
You've done a good job and were proud of you on this day;
For your effort and sacrifice will not be unknown;
On each Anzac day our respect you will be shown.

The Vietnam conflict over the troops have come home;
In one's and two's a few at time;
No welcome home not hero's are we;
But losers today, we lost the war or so they say.

Some even killed babies old people too;
We shamed our nation could all this be true;
Not Bloody likely No Bloody way;
It was the politicians who lost the flaming day.

You can't fight here; You can't do this and that;
The World is watching and we must be seen;
To fight this war fair and very, very clean.

What of our wounded;
What of our dead:
And what of our lost;
With the war still in their head.

The price for this war will never be known;
We all died a little;
And still more each day;
Betrayed by our country in this most dastardly way.

Shunned by the people;
Treated like dirt;
If only they knew how much we hurt

 

[Sean K]

Sorry, 20/20, did you serve in Vietnam?

I had a full day of parade rehearsals today at 4 CSSB, 4 Bde. The usual stuff. Turn up on 5s from about 5 ranks above me, to be dicked around at the Q store. And I'm a Major! LOL.

Anyway, after watching the SSO's embarrass themselves no end (read my Company) we had a nice piss up in the soldiers boozer tonight and it was OK.

Looking forward to the dawn service and marching down to the shrine!

 

[2020hindsight]

did you serve in Vietnam?

answered back there mate - nope, although like a fully brainwashed impressionable young bloke, I asked almost pleaded to go - but Portsea blokes got preference. My only overseas experience was on Rottnest

As for parade ground stuff-ups, we once trained - as cadets - for hours and bludy hourse on the (bitumen) parade ground to be "perfect" for some parade in front of some dignitary or other, forget who, you couldn't look sideways to see him anyway lol - and come the day, discovered that Vic Barracks was a grass parade ground, no sound, no guiding beat, and of course no band - and we "exhibited all the timing of bull in a CHINA SHOP" as the RSM's tonsils balled out to us later , lol.

Rather than get side-tracked yet again, I was just trying to express (back there) what I'm sure many Vietnam RSL members still feel really strongly about today - and will take those scars to their grave.

The price for this war will never be known;
We all died a little;
And still more each day;
Betrayed by our country in this most dastardly way.

Shunned by the people;
Treated like dirt;
If only they knew how much we hurt

Gotta feeling those poems on the digger's thread are probably the best way to do it . They provide some of the empathy that was totally lacking in the populatoin back home - no empathy or sympathy whatsoever - and not helped by the fact that, with time, we, the nation, has been shown to be wrong to go there in the first place!!! I mean, we are now the best of mates with the Vietnamese Dragon we so denigrated and maligned and vilified back then.

Needless to say, - had we REALLY believed in the cause, i.e. a LEGITIMATE call to arms a la WWII - then does anyone doubt that , under THESE circumstances, we would have won? You can bet your bottom dollar we'd have won.

But it was all done with mirrors, and paranoia, and sold to us by the likes of LBJ (who took over the presidency, coincidentally, immediately after JFK refused to become so embroiled in Vietnam - just one of the theories and coincidences around his death).

That last poem for instance, is a cry from the heart yes? Not his fault that he was sent there etc - or that we lost - or that the history books had to be rewritten for once, no longer were we (USA/AUS) the victors, crossing out the bits about domino theory ( that were proven to be lies anyway) !!!

Art is such a powerful medium to communicate these emotions.

I went to two plays at Glen St Theatre about 12 or 18 months back, both based on war.
One concerned Aussie Nurses who were prisoners of war in Singapore (WWII)- something similar to Vivian Bullwinkel including (topically in the current press) sexual exploitation. Forget the name now, something about a tin flute, or tin whistle - where one lady “consented” to sex with the Japanese (blackmailed) to obtain medication for her seriously ill friend (who otherwise would die), and her friend never forgave her, such was the hatred of the prison administration.

http://www.womenaustralia.info/biogs/AWE0362b.htm
Bullwinkel, Vivian (1915 - 2000) AO, MBE, ARRC, ED, FNM, FRCNA
Nurse and Health administrator
Born: 18 December 1915 Kapunda, South Australia, Australia. Died: 3 July 2000.
After completing her nursing training, Vivian Bullwinkel volunteered for the Australian Army Nursing Service (AANS) in May 1941 and sailed to Singapore. Aged 26 she survived 'The Banka Island Massacre', where she was shot in the back and pretended to be dead until the Japanese soldiers left. She then hid in the jungle before surrendering and being taken to a prison camp, where she spent more than three years. After the war, Bullwinkel spent 16 years as matron of Melbourne's Fairfield Hospital, retiring to Perth in 1977.
Vivian Bullwinkel was appointed to the Order of Australia (AO) on 26 January 1993, appointed a Member of the Order of the British Empire (MBE) on 1 January 1973 and awarded the Royal Red Cross Medal on 6 March 1947 for service to the veteran and ex-prisoner of war communities, to nursing, to the Red Cross Society and to the community. She was also the winner of the Florence Nightingale Medal.

Another was about the legacy of Vietnam and its effects on 5 women, who “experience” the Vietnam war and its many and varied facets - title something like “sunglasses, bullets and bikinis” (probably nothing like that, lol – best my memory can come up with). But very powerful drama, and that I can’t forget. – Many messages ranging from nurses who served - to press ladies , to wives who had to deal with their husbands who returned to them as stranger - to widows. (you almost felt the more sorrow for the one whose husband came home than for the widow - sheesh, how bad a scar is that!)

Anyway here’s another of those poems, something in keeping with (just one of the messages of) that second mentioned play.

Things You Didn't Do (by unknown author) http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-poetry/other/svn.htm#things

Remember the day I borrowed your brand new car and dented it?
I thought you'd kill me, but you didn't.

And remember the time I dragged you to the beach,
and you said it would rain, and it did?
I thought you'd say, "I told you so." But you didn't.

Do you remember the time I flirted with all the guys
to make you jealous, and you were?
I thought you'd leave, but you didn't.

Do you remember the time I spilled strawberry pie all over your car rug?
I thought you would hit me, but you didn't.

And remember the time I forgot to tell you the dance
was formal and you showed up in jeans?
I thought you'd drop me, but you didn't.

Yes, there were lots of things you didn't do,
but you put up with me,
and you loved me, and you protected me.

There were lots of things I wanted to make up to you
when you returned from Viet Nam.

But you didn't..........

 

[2020hindsight]

There was a fantastic musical legacy of course Here's a couple to get the ball rolling ...

Honky tonk..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90wdzsTEFfM&mode=related&search= mike woollett at his honkytonk piano
kiss me goodnight sergeant major
its a long way to tip a rarie

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYvrG7raZk8&NR=1 If you knew suzie ( Have A Party Medley)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykb-kCCLhrA&mode=related&search= maybe its becos Im a Londoner

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8Egihugiiw&mode=related&search= Make It A Party With Mike

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3pkwiA5AHU&mode=related&search= lovely bunch of coconuts LIVE!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3q6XxfzaWGk&mode=related&search= show me the way to home LIVE!!

KISS ME GOODNIGHT, SERGEANT-MAJOR
(Art Noell / Don Pelosi) Arthur Askey - 1939
Billy Cotton & His Band (vocal: Alan Breeze) - 1939
Also recorded by: Vera Lynn; George Formby;
Len Luscombe; Elsie Carlisle; Chas & Dave.

Private Jones came in one night
Full of cheer and very bright
He'd been out all day upon the spree
He bumped into Sergeant Smeck
Put his arms around his neck
And in his ear he whispered tenderly.....

Kiss me goodnight, Sergeant-Major
Tuck me in my little wooden bed
We all love you, Sergeant-Major,
When we hear you bawling, "Show a leg!"

Don't forget to wake me in the morning
And bring me 'round a nice hot cup of tea
Kiss me goodnight Sergeant-Major
Sergeant-Major, be a mother to me

Kiss me goodnight, Sergeant-Major
Tuck me in my little wooden bed
We all love you, Sergeant-Major
Even when your neck grows rather red

Don't forget to wake me in the morning
And bring me 'round a nice hot cup of tea
Kiss me goodnight, Sergeant-Major
Sergeant-Major, be a mother to me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHbcGeIilss Royal Sisters, Elizabeth and Margaret White Cliffs of Dover

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPFjToKuZQM (more recent)

And the band played Waltzing Mathilda
In memoriam of thoses, anzacs, turks, frenchs who lost their lives in Gallipoli. The song "Waltzing Mathilda" is performed by the Pogues.

When I was a young man I carried my pack
And I lived the free life of a rover
From the Murrays green basin to the dusty outback
I waltzed my Matilda all over
Then in nineteen fifteen my country said Son
It's time to stop rambling 'cause there's work to be done
So they gave me a tin hat and they gave me a gun
And they sent me away to the war
And the band played Waltzing Matilda
As we sailed away from the quay
And amidst all the tears and the shouts and the cheers
We sailed off to Gallipoli

How well I remember that terrible day
How the blood stained the sand and the water
And how in that hell that they called Suvla Bay
We were butchered like lambs at the slaughter
Johnny Turk he was ready, he primed himself well
He chased us with bullets, he rained us with shells
And in five minutes flat he'd blown us all to hell
Nearly blew us right back to Australia
But the band played Waltzing Matilda
As we stopped to bury our slain
We buried ours and the Turks buried theirs
Then we started all over again

Now those that were left, well we tried to survive
In a mad world of blood, death and fire
And for ten weary weeks I kept myself alive
But around me the corpses piled higher
Then a big Turkish shell knocked me **** over tit
And when I woke up in my hospital bed
And saw what it had done, I wished I was dead
Never knew there were worse things than dying
For no more I'll go waltzing Matilda
All around the green bush far and near
For to hump tent and pegs, a man needs two legs
No more waltzing Matilda for me

So they collected the cripples, the wounded, the maimed
And they shipped us back home to Australia
The armless, the legless, the blind, the insane
Those proud wounded heroes of Suvla
And as our ship pulled into Circular Quay
I looked at the place where my legs used to be
And thank Christ there was nobody waiting for me
To grieve and to mourn and to pity
And the band played Waltzing Matilda
As they carried us down the gangway
But nobody cheered, they just stood and stared
Then turned all their faces away

And now every April I sit on my porch
And I watch the parade pass before me
And I watch my old comrades, how proudly they march
Reliving old dreams of past glory
And the old men march slowly, all bent, stiff and sore
The forgotten heroes from a forgotten war
And the young people ask, "What are they marching for?"
And I ask myself the same question
And the band plays Waltzing Matilda
And the old men answer to the call
But year after year their numbers get fewer
Some day no one will march there at all

Waltzing Matilda, Waltzing Matilda
Who'll come a waltzing Matilda with me
And their ghosts may be heard as you pass the Billabong
Who'll come-a-waltzing Matilda with me?

 

[kromey]

How to make Anzac biscuits.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wODhokKRUtI&mode=related&search= It's A Long Way to Tipperary

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXsG2HlC5RI bless em all

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihhvZeADJMQ On the Road to Gundagai

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIva5JW5uqQ&mode=related&search= Vietnam War Montage - Goodnight Saigon

whilst this is strictly not a war song, still she was forced into prostitution during the war, and I guess represents the many civilians whose lives were "adversely" affected
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_QABS88nDc&mode=related&search= Edith Piaf - Non je ne regrette rien

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbUOY0Rk1tA

WILLIE McBRIDE
And I can't help but wonder, now Willie McBride,
Do all those who lie here know why they died?
Did you really believe them when they told you "The Cause?"
Did you really believe that this war would end wars?
Well the suffering, the sorrow, the glory, the shame
The killing, the dying, it was all done in vain,
For Willie McBride, it all happened again,
And again, and again, and again, and again

Eric Bogle
It wasn't for King or for England I died,
It wasn't for glory or old Empire's pride.
The reason I went was both simple and clear:
To stand up for freedom, did I volunteer.
It's easy for you to look back and sigh,
And pity the youth of those days long gone by,
For us who were there, we knew why we died,
And I'd do it again, says Willie McBride.

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-poetry/ww1/ww1-a.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbUOY0Rk1tA

WILLY McBRIDE'S ANSWER

G'day, Eric, old mate, this is Willie McBride,
I'm callin' today from across the divide
Of years and of distance, of life and of death,
Please let me speak freely with my silent breath.
You might think me crazy, you might think me daft,
I could have stayed back in Aussie where there wasn't a draft,
But my parents they raised me to tell right from wrong,
So today I shall answer what you asked in your song.

chorus

Yes, they beat the drum slowly, they played the pipes lowly,
And the rifles fired o'er me as they lowered me down,
The bugles played "Last Post" in chorus,
And the pipes played "The Flowers of the Forest."

Ask the people of Belgium or Alsace-Lorraine,
If my life was wasted, if I died in vain.
I think they will tell you when all's said and done,
They welcomed this boy with his tin hat and gun.
And call it ironic that I was cut down,
While in Dublin my kinfolk were fighting the Crown.
But in Dublin or Flanders the cause was the same:
To resist the oppressor, whatever his name.

chorus

It wasn't for King or for England I died,
It wasn't for glory or old Empire's pride.
The reason I went was both simple and clear:
To stand up for freedom did I volunteer.

It's easy for you to look back and sigh,
And pity the youth of those days long gone by,
For us who were there, we knew why we died,
And I'd do it again, says Willie McBride.

chorus

© Stephen L. Suffett 1997.

The slight alterations made to wording are only to 'Australianise" it. It is how an Aussie Bush Band might sing it. Just as the performer of the original has altered words so too do I feel able to keep the 'reply' a living thing. [[thanks to that fantastic diggers website]]

no song available on youtube sadly - but here's the words at least A BROWN SLOUCH HAT

There is a symbol, we love and adore it
You see it daily wherever you go.
Long years have passed since our fathers once wore it,
What is the symbol that we should all know,

It's a brown slouch hat with the side turned up, and it means the world to me,
Its the symbol of our Nation, the land of Liberty.
And as soldiers they wear it, how proudly they bear it for all the world to see.
Just a brown slouch hat with the side turned up, heading straight for Victory.

Don't you thrill as young Bill passes by
Don't you beam at the gleam in his eye?
Head erect, shoulders square, tunic spic and span
Ev'ry inch a soldier and ev'ry inch a man.

As they swing down the street, aren't they grand?
Three abreast to the beat of the band.
But what do we remember when the boys have passed along,
Marching by so brave and strong.

Just a brown ....

 

[2020hindsight]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ry9NjJJDoU lilli marlene (german)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W0QtiL8s8Y&mode=related&search= Marlene Dietrich ('72) - ditto (english)

Recent song ... likewise with two versions ( as posted back there)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPSmrb82ocM&mode=related&search= Marlene Dietrich : Sag Mir Wo Die Blumen Sind

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uc9KHpi6hDc&mode=related&search= Marlene dietrich "where have all the flowers gone"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZtEBPq5-Ic Vera Lynn - I'm Yours Sincerely & We'll Meet Again
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gX0B38IgYK8&mode=related&search= ditto - complete with... "fireworks"

one of Great Britain's greatest singers, Vera Lynn.
Vera Lynn (born Vera Margaret Welch in 1917) is a British singer whose career flourished during World War II, when she was nicknamed "The Forces' Sweetheart". She is best known for the popular songs "We'll Meet Again" and "The White Cliffs of Dover".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-Wwwb0VTPI&mode=related&search= this is the army Mr Jones, Second World War WWII WW2 Vera Lynn Songs

 

[2020hindsight]

comedy ( since the war) :-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wkz1ecxrQO4 'Allo 'Allo! Season1 Pilot (PART 1)
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query='allo+'allo (plenty more

René Artois, owner of a small café in the French village of Nouvion during WWII. René leads a simple life and is married to the tone-deaf Edith (who nevertheless loves to sing) and at the same time carrying on secret affairs with his two waitresses, Yvette and Maria. At the same time, René tries to maintain a good relationship with the occupying German officers, etc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_D7WtOHZd0&mode=related&search= Monty Python - Hitler in England

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6V2FU79ZS4 Dad's Army - The Deadly Attachment 3 (3-3) (a great episode )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyFNSKIgkFc Dad's Army
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dad's+army (heaps more)

 

[2020hindsight]

medals and recognition

Aboriginals came home from WWII - and
a) not only couldn't vote ( insult #1) , but
b) weren't even included in the census , i.e. mean they didnt even exist !

Many came home and were suitably rewarded with recognition (Weary Dunlop eventually became Aussie of the year, deserved everything he got of course etc)

but say, "White Mouse" Nancy Wake was insulted by Aus by being ignored to the point where any recognition was an insult in itself (yet she is one of the most decorated people of WWII - by USA, France - but not by Aus etc etc .

She was born in NZ but moved to Aus at age of 2.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Wake
Nancy Grace Augusta Wake, AC, GM (born August 30, 1912), was the Allies' most decorated servicewoman of World War II who fought alongside the maquis groups of the French Resistance.........(except by Aus - as at 2001 )

In the night of April 29-30 1944 Nancy Wake parachuted into Auvergne and became a liaison between London and the local maquis group. She coordinated resistance activity prior to Normandy Invasion and recruited more members. She also led attacks on German installations and local Gestapo HQ in Montluçon.

In April 1944 her 7000 maquisards fought 22,000 SS soldiers, causing 1400 casualties. Her compatriots, especially Henri Tardivat, praised her fighting spirit - amply demonstrated when she killed a SS sentry with her bare hands to prevent him raising the alarm during an Allied raid. During a 1990s television interview when asked what had happened to the sentry who spotted her, Wake simply drew her finger across her throat. On another occasion, in order to replace codes her wireless operator had been forced to destroy in a German raid, Nancy Wake rode a bicycle for more than 100 miles through several German checkpoints.

After the war, she received the George Medal, the U.S. Medal of Freedom, the Médaille de la Résistance and thrice the Croix de Guerre. She also learned that the Gestapo had tortured her husband to death in 1943.

Here's an extract from Peter Fitzsimmons book "Nancy Wake" (attached).

LOL, while I'm at it, I'll quote from his Acknowledgements .. thanks editor etc etc uncle Tom Cobley and all...

"As to my wife , Lisa, I didn't marry her because when we met she was already recognised as one of this country's greatest editors, but in terms of our subsequent lives together, it certainly hasn't hurt

He has also put out books about Kokoda, and Tobruk, (and probably others).
Sue Ebury put out "Weary" - great story.

I wonder how many people know that Weary played Rugby (Union) - unusual for a Victorian, started playing in his 20's, played for the Wallabies 2 years later, and often played with a broken nose.

He deseved to be Aussie of the Year for that alone. (ps I wrote a poem about him in case anyone thinks I don't respect him - man was a giant )

Finally some humorous quotes overheard whilst watching the ABC TV coverage of the Sydney Anzac day march...(some Colonel lol - funny dude)

"and here's the parachute regiment ... never could understand them - jumping out of perfectly good aeroplanes "

"searchlight batteries, these days they use rechargeables I'm told"

"and here's the carrier pigeon service, those birds were great for avoiding interception, unless of course by an eagle " etc

 

[2020hindsight]

The first computer - how we won the war..
(Anyone read "Ultra Secret" by Winterbotham ? - you read that, you'd have to conclude we would have lost WWII without Bletchley Park. Heaps of good info on the web these days of course)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bletchley_Park
Bletchley Park, also known as Station X, is an estate located in the town of Bletchley, now part of Milton Keynes, England. During World War II, Bletchley Park was the location of the United Kingdom's main codebreaking establishment. Codes and ciphers of several Axis countries were deciphered there, most famously the German Enigma. The high-level intelligence produced by Bletchley Park, codenamed Ultra, is frequently credited with aiding the Allied war effort and shortening the war,…..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra
Some Germans had suspicions that all was not right with Enigma. Karl Dönitz received reports of "impossible" encounters between U-boats and enemy vessels which made him suspect some compromise of his communications. In one instance, three U-boats met at a tiny island in the Caribbean, and a British destroyer promptly showed up.
In another case, the Germans became suspicious of Ultra when five ships from Naples headed for North Africa with essential supplies for Rommel's campaign were all mysteriously attacked and sunk by an Allied airforce. As there was no time to have the ships all spotted by the airforce beforehand and then sunk accordingly, the decision went directly to Churchill whether or not to act solely on Ultra intelligence. He gave the simple order "Sink them". Afterwards, a message was sent by the Allies to Naples congratulating a fictitious spy and informing him of his bonus. The Germans decrypted this message and believed it[1][2].
It is commonly claimed that the breaks into Naval Enigma resulted in the war being a year shorter, but given its effects on the Second Battle of the Atlantic alone, that might be an underestimate.
Breaking of some messages (not in German Enigma) led to the defeat of the Italian Navy at Cape Matapan, and was preceded by another "fortuitous" search-plane sighting. British Admiral Cunningham also did some fancy footwork at a hotel in Egypt to prevent Axis agents from taking note of his movements and deducing that a major operation was planned. Ultra information was of considerable assistance to the British (Montgomery being "in the know" about Ultra) at El Alamein in Western Egypt in the long-running battle with the Afrika Korps under Rommel and Intelligence from signals between Adolf Hitler and General Günther von Kluge was of considerable help during the campaign in France just after the Allied D-Day landings, particularly in regard to estimates of when German reserves might be committed to battle. The Red Army was well aware of the German buildup, locations and attack time precisely, prior to the battle of Kursk due to Ultra information provided to them.

By 1945 almost all German Enigma traffic (Wehrmacht, Kriegsmarine, Luftwaffe, Abwehr, SD, etc.) could be decrypted within a day or two, yet the Germans remained confident of its security. Had they been better informed, they could have changed systems, forcing Allied cryptologists to start over. The Germans considered Enigma traffic so secure that they openly discussed their plans and movements, handing the Allies huge amounts of information. However, Ultra information was also at times misused or ignored. Rommel's intentions just prior to the Battle of the Kasserine Pass in North Africa in 1942 had been suggested by Ultra, but this was not taken into account by the Americans. Likewise, Ultra traffic suggested an attack in the Ardennes in 1944, but the Battle of the Bulge was a surprise to the Allies because the information was disregarded.
After the War, American TICOM project teams found and detained a considerable number of German cryptographic personnel. Among the things they learned was that German cryptographers, at least, understood very well that Enigma messages might be read; they knew Enigma was not unbreakable. They just found it impossible to imagine anyone going to the immense effort required…………..
At the end of the war, much of the equipment used and its blueprints were destroyed. Although thousands of people were involved in the decoding efforts, the participants remained silent for decades about what they had done during the war, and it was only in the 1970s that the work at Bletchley Park was revealed to the general public

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCpQfc_y2Fk
Colossus The World’s First Computer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CAVmRVKh_8&mode=related&search= The Colossus Codebreaking computer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crlr71JPLgk&mode=related&search= Enigma at Bletchley - Audrey Wind talk at the Dover Society on her time in World War 2 at Bletchley and the Enigma machine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnBsndE1IkA The Enigma machine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kivnoAkM1WY&mode=related&search= Enigma machine

In the history of cryptography, the Enigma was a portable cipher machine used to encrypt and decrypt secret messages. More precisely, Enigma was a family of related electro-mechanical rotor machines — comprising a variety of different models. The Enigma was used commercially from the early 1920s on, and was also adopted by the military and governmental services of a number of nations — most famously by Nazi Germany before and during World War II.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pbluu56ULU&mode=related&search=
Take a day visit to the once top secret code breaking centre during WW2. There is so much more that I didn't include. I can only recommend you go for a visit yourself as the atmosphere is amazing. I simply took my video camera and filmed everything possible. Remember in the wartime, you would have been shot for having seen this stuff!

After the war, not only did no one mention this computer for 29 years, but they destroyed the computer. (just think, Bill Gaites and IBM were pipped to the post by a pom )

 

[2020hindsight]

PS Winterbotham :- "Let no one be fooled," Winterbotham admonishes in chapter 3, "by the spate of television films and propaganda which has made the war seem like some great triumphant epic. It was, in fact, a very narrow shave, and the reader may like to ponder [...] whether [...] we might have won [without] Ultra."