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What are your trading objectives?

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pavilion103

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Not sure which sub-forum to put this in. Please move if appropriate.

I'm curious to know what people's trading objectives are in terms of lifestyle implications.
Not so much: my objective is to make 30% p.a.
But rather: my objective is to make 30% p.a. which will allow me to take an extra holiday a year or to work part time etc.


I'll start.
My major focus is freedom. I do want to accumulate wealth but it isn't my primary consideration. My trading objectives are based around freeing me up from employment, which would allow me to devote my time to other things that I would like to accomplish.

My trading strategies also incorporate the principle of spending a small amount of time each night 'tidying up' trades, so that I'm not stuck at the screen (I guess a semi-passive income).

My goals:
- Cut back to 4 days a week at work (with the option to return to 5 at any time I like)
THEN cut back to 3 days a week (with the same option as above).
I'd like to achieve this in the shortish-medium term.
THEN when I am making a decent wage from trading, take a 6-12 month leave period (with the option to come back full time if I like) and then consider my options and see how my overall net worth is looking.
Luckily I have a job that may be able to facilitate this arrangement.
It is a very cautious approach with a strong safety net due to the volatility of trading.
THEN if all goes well spend my time pursuing other "ventures"/"opportunities"

How will I do this?
1) ASX momentum setup strategy
2) Sub 10c stock strategy
3) Some Index futures trading at night
4) Some medium term Index futures trading getting on a good trend and adding to it.

I've put a huge amount of work into my trading in the last 3 years and see this as an enormous possibility to work in the way that I desire.


What are others' objectives?
 
My current metric for my intraday trading is to get my average trade to $50.00 or more. So to clarify, each time I pull the trigger, on average I net $50. I think it's a reasonable goal given my statistics so far. I think it will take me the better part of this year to achieve this part of my plan.

In doing this I want to establish an auditable record of results.

I have other plans that will need the credibility that this brings.

My goals are to be able to provide a similar living and lifestyle that we are accustomed to now, whist building wealth for the future as well. I want to remain an entrepreneur, enjoying the benefits of freedom.

I wont go into my other projects that I have on the go, but I have several irons in the fire and we're always looking at opportunities for myself or my wife in small business.

The transition from career employee to self employed has been difficult but living in china has made a differnce, in regards to cost of living. I would not have done this if not for this situation.

I don't particularly want to trade fulltime as a career, as I tend to enjoy the analysis more than the actual trading itself. I also enjoy sharing my knowledge with others so that's something I can see myself doing as I gain more and more experience and reach the level I want to reach.
 
My objective is to be the best that I can be. As a full time trader, it is incumbent upon me to derive as much income as possible. I love this game. The freedom it gives and the almost unlimited potential in terms of dollars. To me, the only outcome of trading is the amount of money you can make. It might sound flippant, but that's what makes me tick. There are so many ways to play this game, but as long as you are making money then that must be the right way - until it isn't! It can be challenging and frustrating at times, but that only gives me more drive to improve - to succeed. I view it almost like a sport. The more you practice, the better you get at it. You just need the right attitude and the right training of course. I don't set myself percentage limits or dollar limits - rather - I set myself performance targets ie being consistent in my trading and trading my setups when they occur and staying disciplined. The market is ever changing - that's why it never gets boring for me.
I guess my material objective is to be able to afford a kickass ski trip every year to wherever the powder is coming down the hardest.
 
Though I do it very badly, I love trading!

I like penny-dreads, the adrenaline is unbelievable.
Unfortunately I have acquired a few bad habits which keep me poor.

But one day I will be RIDING THE TIGER again!

(Falcon FCN from $0.19 to $1.42 and oops, slips, back to $0.50 before exiting)

 

Check out my sub 10c stock thread.
Will be interesting to monitor some of these!
 
I am relying on an active investing approach rather than trading to generate the majority of my current income plus accumulate capital plus I use the same strategy to manage my mother's money which funds her retirement and I manage funds under trust for a disabled family member.

Income stocks: At the moment I look for opportunities to take positions with 6-7% net yield from companies with sound balance sheets, decent ROE and either stable or growing EPS outlooks. The days of accumulating the big four banks and Telstra at yields of 7% net are gone but there are still companies yielding 7% before franking credits with good balance sheets out there.

Capital Gain/Momentum: Aim is to invest in companies where I feel there is an opportunity for a 20%+ return over the holding window (whether that be three months to twelve months) on stocks with solid balance sheets. This will be based on a combination of FA discount to value and TA momentum. An example is BOL. I bought not long ago and am up 20%. I have no conviction towards this company but it has a sound balance sheet. I bought based on momentum.

Short term trade. Not often, but every now and then I hop onto volatility in a stock to make a day trade or very short term trade when I am having a day in front of the computer rather than outdoors where I prefer to be. I do this very rarely and with very small position sizes but tend to do OK. I'm looking for a 5% return and will more often take profit and sell out if I get a 10% return. The last example was IDC where I bought and sold on the 08/1013 for a 10% profit.

Actual performance of the portfolios I manage has been good income generation from dividends but soft capital gains overall, below those objectives, which I put down to making lots of mistakes and going through a learning curve over the past four years - most notably not cutting capital losses early.
 
pavilion103 said:
Check out my sub 10c stock thread.
Will be interesting to monitor some of these!
Click to expand...

Every portfolio should have a lottery ticket.

I don't pretend to understand charting.
I've been here three years and this is what I have learnt.
The colours are significant.

Hoping to learn more along the way.
I watch on with interest.





I need a better broker to be successful.
I need to be successful to change broker.
 
Nice post, 30% per annum is high, espeically as an average return. I think as part of your objectives you need to look at what is going to achieve 30% per annum. You are not going to get there trading Blue Chip shares, not without leverage anyway...

So in terms of what to trade to achieve 30% per year and some years you'll have nategtive returns and some years you'll make 100% plus, you're left with small cap and mid cap stocks or leveraged instruments like CFDs, futures and the like and that is a zero sum game so bloody hard to make anything at all.

Setting realistics objectives is probably step 1, 30% per year may not even be a realistic objective.

ZZ...
 
It's a huge responsibility to manage other people's money.
We all make mistakes, even after many years, and I'd be sick with worry if I were getting it wrong even slightly with someone else's funds.

Not something that worries you, tinhat?
 
Julia said:
It's a huge responsibility to manage other people's money.
We all make mistakes, even after many years, and I'd be sick with worry if I were getting it wrong even slightly with someone else's funds.
...
Click to expand...

+ 1

Funnily enough, there's a whole industry of people that do just that and yet somehow manage to elude accountability when things turn pear-shaped!
 
zipzap said:
Nice post, 30% per annum is high, espeically as an average return. I think as part of your objectives you need to look at what is going to achieve 30% per annum. You are not going to get there trading Blue Chip shares, not without leverage anyway....
Click to expand...

In my view, 30% is quite achievable. It is an average of only about 0.13% per trading day. I would say that is particualrly achievable with the strategy pav has in place.

ZZ, it may be worthwhile looking at pav's post below and his posts on his trading strategy for sub 10 cent shares as your comments are not really relevant to his post.

Cheers
Country Lad
 
pavilion103 said:
What are others' objectives?
Click to expand...

cynic said:
1) Money!
2) More Money!!
3) Even More Money!!!
4) Refer 1-3
5) Refer 4
6) Refer 5
7) Etcetera
Click to expand...

I'm with Cynic, its about the money, first comes the money, everything else is bull****.

Nic Taleb talks about **** you money, having enough money to say **** you to everyone...that's the sort of money i want/need, the end goal is the financial ability to say **** you.
 
cynic said:
+ 1

Funnily enough, there's a whole industry of people that do just that and yet somehow manage to elude accountability when things turn pear-shaped!
Click to expand...

tinhat, I assume your mother is of pension age.
How pear-shaped can it get?

My mother was in an aged care facility.
They took 85% (indexed) of her pension to cover all her needs.
 

Lol why the heck would you want to say that to people? Got a chip on your shoulder?

I want money to have freedom and enjoy life and help others enjoy it too. I've got nothing against anyone else, just want to help as many as I can!
 

Don't know about that CL
The method I introduced PAV
To I worked on in 1998 I couldn't
Return 30% a year consistently
In a single trade sure

Knowing what I know now
----
Perhaps PAV can.
 
tech/a said:
Don't know about that CL The method I introduced PAV To I worked on in 1998 I couldn't Return 30% a year consistently In a single trade sure Knowing what I know now ---- Perhaps PAV can.
Click to expand...

It would be achievable though Tech? Not out of the realms of possibility?
We did ok at the start of the year to return 50% on a small account in a very short time!

I guess it depends on account size also.
 
pavilion103 said:
Lol why the heck would you want to say that to people? Got a chip on your shoulder?

I want money to have freedom and enjoy life and help others enjoy it too. I've got nothing against anyone else, just want to help as many as I can!
Click to expand...

If the ultimate aim is to enjoy life and help others enjoy it, do you need to be rich first? Wouldn't the more expedient way be to devote your life right now to helping others and forget about being rich? You don't need money to live in the slums and serve soup as a full time job. All you would need is enough to cover rent and some food. All the happiness in the world is yours, serving others.

Or is it about making money for yourself and family to live in luxury and not have to work? And then give some of it to charities so that you don't feel guilty?
 

I loved Taleb's quote. It looks like you and I may be about to turn into a mutual appreciation society!

@Pav, it's not so much about wanting to say "FTSE you" to people, but more about being empowered to enforce personal boundaries.

Having had past experiences of unscrupulous individuals and/or corporate entities inappropriately interfering in my life via the exploitation of their respective positions of power and/or trust, I can definitely appreciate what Taleb's angle might be and therefore relate strongly to it.
 
Maybe somewhere in between the two. I don't think anyone should feel guilty about wanting a comfortable life. Neither is there any obligation to provide for others.

Neither should there be any implication that to donate to various charities is to avoid feeling guilty about having worked hard and saved in order to ultimately feel secure.

And I don't really think most ordinary individuals would consider they were experiencing 'all the happiness in the world' by living in some slum and serving soup to others. It's quite possible to look after ourselves and at the same time volunteer time and energy to help others.
 
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