Wage Rises

[tech/a]

Why should I have to go to court and pay thousands even if I am right in sacking someone? They pay nothing because the deadbeat can get access to legal aid and I have to wear the costs no matter the outcome. Wheres the justice in that?

That is what is wrong with the system; a massive wasting of government and employers money!

Been there done that.
4 times including the example above.

In a case where even the mediator admitted I was 100% correct in dismissing this person in question I was told that to run it through court would be $30K. and there was a chance that even if I won I would have to bear costs.

The economical view was to pay this scum (anyone who theives is scum) a sum and as part of that payment include dismissal.
So I was robbed 2wice. I live and work with it.

Without employers you wont have a job!
Without employees you wont have a business.

Employers DONT HAVE TO employ anyone but the best.
Employees DONT HAVE TO work for anyone but the best.

Whats the problem?

 

[krisbarry]

Why should I have to go to court and pay thousands even if I am right in sacking someone? They pay nothing because the deadbeat can get access to legal aid and I have to wear the costs no matter the outcome. Wheres the justice in that?

That is what is wrong with the system; a massive wasting of government and employers money!

I guess that is part of doing business, there are many laws and rules to follow, even if the employee is in the wrong it must be proven in a court of law.

Yes I understand the frustration in the current system from the sacking perspective, although should all workers have to suffer with less rights, less pay, from a few minor incidents. A better and fairer system would be just to tweek the current system, rather than to spend squillions over-hauling it because China and India are about to boom!

China and India over recent years have been booming along and so has Australia. We have been able to compete quite well, especially from the mining/materials sectors, so we still have the upperhand, and will continue well into the future.

Still cannot see anything at all in the new IR laws that will benefit myself, or the rest of Australia

 

[krisbarry]

It must be hard, very hard to run a business, and I do understand your frustrations but there is no need to be bitter about a few bad apples. For every one bad apple their are 10 others that are hard workers to bring fruits of the labour to market, so to speak.

If your not happy being managers, then become workers instead and leave the crap to others to deal with.

 

[tech/a]

Kris.

An employer like myself (and dont take this personally) wouldnt want people like yourself.

Here is why.
We want people to be PASSIONATE about what we do.
We understand that you are just like us in that if you join us you will be making what we do your lively hood.

For my people if I succeed then they have their job.
If I excell then they should excell.
The only way that RWI will and does excell is DUE to the input of every single member from myself to the labourers.

They want the BEST leadership and opportunity to better themselves.
We want the BEST builders of business---employees.

There are and will be businesses and employees that adopt the above--they WILL succeed far beyond the dreams each had/s.
Others will languish forever caught in the revolving arguement of who puts out first Employer or Employee.

If an employee doesnt come up to scratch in my company---I dont have to sack them genearally---the boys wont have a bar of them--they impair their earning capacity.
Ive had them come in and say --boss we need another operator Tony just isnt up to scratch--we are sick of doing his job as well as ours!
Now after meeting with tony and being given the opportunity/s he deserves and there is no improvement do you think he wants to stay??

To all looking for the best position you can find.

Be the best employee they will find.
Prove it!!!
Then negotiate what you are worth WITH them.

 

[krisbarry]

Think workers will find it harder in the future to negotiate with their bosses, when there is nothing left to negatiate with. Stripping everything back to the core!

The only solution is that employers bring to the table a range of packages that will entice/retain workers, if not they will just move on to bigger and better employment next door.

Employers will find it very costly in the future if they offer very little as workers will not hang around, hence the high rates of staff turner-over will be very costly.

But equally employees will have to show comittment/passion/hard working ethics also. And yes it will be a two-way street.

Tech/a, you run a company that appears not to work on public holdidays, weeknights and weekends but what is your solution to the many employers who do run companies in these hours? Would you pay higher rates than the award wage, would you implement penalty rates etc to retain workers?

 

[krisbarry]

Like I mention b4 about my wage and how it would be classed as a minimum wage job in the U.S.

Here is a little example

I am going to work tomorrow for 7.5 hours at a rate of $30 per hour ($225)

My American worker goes to work for the same amount of hours 7.5 at a rate of $6 (AUD) per hour ($45)

Hmmm which Country would you prefer to work in and for?

I know which country I would be proud to be a worker in and would be give 100% to that employer!

John Howard is about to turn this country upside down and inside out. Just a matter of time b4 many jobs become classified as mimimum wage jobs and then the minimum wage is slashed to compete with China and India.

 

[krisbarry]

Here is another example of what will eventually happen within Australia.

Back in 1997 while on my 1 year working visa, I picked up a job in Canada, working for Subway. They paid me the minimum wage of $7 per hour. I worked for them for a week, then told them where to shove their job in a polite way.

I went onto further employment while travelling for that 1 year period.

I then return back to Australia and went into a local subway store, and asked out of a mater of curiosity how much they get paid and to my shock it was somewhere in the amount of $14 per hour.

Now this seems so unfair.

Why should a Subway worker in Australia get $14 per hour, a Canadian Subway worker get $7 per hour and their neighbour in the U.S. be getting $5 per hour.

Now I have also factored in a little rate conversion here for the different countries but this is the very same example that will eventually pull Australia's wage down in line with these other countries to compete with China and India.

Wake up Australia and smell the roses...you are in for a very rude shock soon!

 

[tech/a]

Tech/a, you run a company that appears not to work on public holdidays, weeknights and weekends but what is your solution to the many employers who do run companies in these hours? Would you pay higher rates than the award wage, would you implement penalty rates etc to retain workers?

Kris.
Work is available at all times here. One of the problems with motivating staff is that when the reward is exceeding their requirements then motivation drops. So I have to find creative ways to motivate and its not limited to MONEY.

In answer to your question--absolutely you can call the negotiated rate of pay a penalty rate whatever you want, but if I want YOU to work in times you dont it has to be beneficial to you---you then have the choice to work or not.
I'm not going to get good people offering below average wages--I'm going to get the best(They are who I want) if I offer the best--I get opposition staff asking me for a job!!!!!

When last in Las Vagas I got talking to a barmaid in the Coyote Ugly bar on the strip. We got talking about tips.
Her wage was $3/hr--her tips $80-200.
Bellhop same thing hourly rate $6 tips $20-50 and he was damned good.

Yeh I agree wake up Australia----think outside the square---get off your complaining backside/s and MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

ADD VALUE--be someone worth employing---you'll never have to worry about financial security again.
If you're a labourer be the BEST Labourer.
A cleaner be more than spotless.
A barman be the guy everyone wants to be served by.

 

[krisbarry]

Yes agree totally if you are going to work in the States/Canada on minimum wage, then you are better off working in an environment that will also pay you tips.

That is the reason why I quit the job at Subway and moved onto a Restaraunt, where a 10% tip was compulsory on the bill. I also used my Australian accent to my advantage. Everynight I made more in tips than the wage itself. $56 in wages and approx $120 in tips.

But do we really want to head down that path of low wages, and tipping for service?

Women working in pubs/bars make more money in tips than males, so we are at a disavantage already! That leeds onto the next point of the attractive women making more money than the unattractive women.

Why not have a little more equality, same rate of pay and conditions for all employees that way no one has reasons to be unfairly punished and end up in a court of law.

 

[tech/a]

Idealic equality wont ever happen.

Time for people to be realists and to take care of their own futures.
90% of the population expect someone else to do it for them.

I've noticed that those who take care of their lot complain about very little.

In the big scheme of things taking care of your lot is about as good as we can make it.
Few can actually do that let alone anything else.

 

[bvbfan]

I'll support the reforms IF the politicians get the same workplace agreements, watching Kevin Andrew address this issue and laugh it off and try to get it back onto the typical Australian made me so angry. So a politicians is MORE than a typical Australian?

Workplace reforms should be for everyone but seems the politicans will be exempt so they can keep a pension for life, get 20% super or whatever it is and get a minimum $125,000 for make 1-2 speeches a year in parliament and cutting a few ribbons here and there.

If they want any success in these reforms they should start at the top and lead by example.

 

[tech/a]

BV

True and I agree pollies have a set of rules for them and one for us.

You'll never satisfy everyone.
To be honest it doesnt bother me --- life has its way of equalisation.
I cant control them and my veiw is lost in the crowd,so I just look after me.

In doing so I have to look after those around me--if I dont then I suffer.
Sure I'll have opinions and support issues I believe in,but thats as far as I'll go.

Anyway thats me and I'm glad everyone is different.

 

[Kauri]

All employers will tell you that they have had good employees and bad employees.
All employees will tell you that they have had good employers and bad employers.
No amount of government legislation will change the basic nature of people, bad employers will remain bad, good ones will remain good, the same goes for employees.
Good businesses will survive, bad ones will struggle, good workers will thrive, bad ones will complain.
On one job I was sent to PNG to work on a power station. The job was finished ahead of time. On coming home I was put up in a hotel in Honiara for 3 days.. .
On another job I roamed the deserts of WA, SA, and the NT, my accomadation after a 12 hr day for weeks was my swag rolled out beside a campfire. Once, on coming into the Alice before heading back out west into the Gibson desert I stayed overnight in a motel. I had to pay for it.
No amount of legislation would change the above.
Guess who I would choose to work for in the future.

 

[Smurf1976]

I can see both sides of this debate.

1. Some time ago I approached a company and suggested how they could make technical improvements to their manufacturing process which would save millions of dollars per year. Not long after that I was sitting in the company's office being asked how much I wanted to be paid. It was made very clear that there's no need to worry about what market rates for a position are when someone has ideas which improve the bottom line.

2. The other side. Go to practically any major US city and find the local slums full of, mostly, black people. That this can occur in the wealthiest country on earth whilst that same country spends a fortune on military adventures etc. is an absolute disgrace. The ultimate test of any civilisation IMO is how it looks after the disadvantaged. It is morally wrong for Australia to go down this track no matter what the economic benefits may be. To this end both the minimum wage and welfare payments must be at levels which provide basic food, clothing and shelter for all.

So, two sides to this debate and I agree with parts of both of them. Some people, indeed quite a large number, don't want to work and for them I have no sympathy. But for those willing to work, society owes them a decent existence even if they are unable to find work in the middle of the next recession.

Personally, I tend to avoid businesses which I know or suspect to have inappropriate policies in this area or who refuse to answer the question. I know others who do likewise. The blatant greed of certain large retailers who deny their mostly young staff a normal social life through their totally unnecessary trading hours (who really needs to do supermarket shopping late on New Year's Eve?) heads the list of those I avoid year round. There is, after all, more to life than money.

 

[krisbarry]

At the end of the day if my hourly wage gets cut and penalty rates go, then I will be forced off the stockmarket, and I am sure that I will not be the only one.

NEW WORK CHOICES = LESS IN THE HAND AT THE END OF THE WEEK!

That will not only mean that I will not be trading, I will also have no need to visit sites such as ASF.

So think b4 you decide your fate...do you change jobs now, do you stay on in your current job, do you change career paths etc.

Do you vote little Johnny out?
Do you just accept what is about to be law?
Do you fight for your rights and protest?
Do you join the union?
Do you find a workplace with 100+ workers to be a little safer?
Do you pester you local MP's

What do you do?

 

[Kauri]

Kris..
Do you think anything you can do will change what is happening?
If you do, do it.
If you dont, adapt as best you can to succeed in the new environment.
If you are not sure, stay the way you are and hope someone else will look after you. ..
The more that things change the more that they stay the same.

( By the way, I would miss your posts if you moved on. )

 

[tech/a]

At the end of the day if my hourly wage gets cut and penalty rates go, then I will be forced off the stockmarket, and I am sure that I will not be the only one.

NEW WORK CHOICES = LESS IN THE HAND AT THE END OF THE WEEK!

That will not only mean that I will not be trading, I will also have no need to visit sites such as ASF.

So think b4 you decide your fate...do you change jobs now, do you stay on in your current job, do you change career paths etc.

Do you vote little Johnny out?
Do you just accept what is about to be law?
Do you fight for your rights and protest?
Do you join the union?
Do you find a workplace with 100+ workers to be a little safer?
Do you pester you local MP's

What do you do?

Firstly you learn to trade at a profit so you dont need a job to prop up your trading losses.
You do what you think is best for you.

Simple really.

 

[Bloveld]

The last time that I was involved in a strike for wages was in 1987. Since then every large job that I have worked on has been covered by an EBA. Since then its all been about safety and conditions. And I can tell you that plenty of companies will ignore safety until we take action.
But it appears that the government is targeting EBA's. And making it very difficult to take any action, even over safety.

 

[Kauri]

The last time I was on strike over safety was in the late 80's when we went out because the company bus taking us from the camp at South Hedland to the site on Finucaine Is. had near bald tyres. Later the same day we took the bus to the coast to go fishing.

 

[mime]

Kris maybe you should read the new IR laws and not just union properganda(sp?).

The current IR laws are stupid. Under the current IR laws if you are caught stealing from your employer you CANNOT be sacked. You must recieve a written warning before you are dismissed.

A friend of mind got sacked because of theft (it was baitable), he phoned up the union and they said they couldn't help him. I know he could have gotten pay for unfair dismissal or compo for loss of earnings. Even though what he did was wrong, the point of the union is to represent the workers best interest and they let him down.

I've left the union because they didn't little to nothing for me and they where charging me $250 something dollars a year. They aren't worth the money.

Remember all the fear over the GST? Where's Kim's roll back policy gone? The IR laws will be the same.

Youth are alreading being exploited ($6 an hour) but at least they are building up work experience to make their CV to look good so they have a better change of getting better work in the future.

The new IR laws are designed to help small business and Australia WILL be better off under them.

PS. I've noticed the business council are advertising on TV in support of the new IR laws, so it's not just Mr Howards "personal ideology".