Victorian Fires

[spartn]

Partially people are themselves responsible for the ultimate price they paid.

It is obvious to me that some overestimated their chances of survival, others fell victims of poor judgements of those who make calls in the family, community.

Ultimate >we will be all right mate< attitude.

Surely more property would be lost, but not a single human life had to be scarified in flames.

Unfortunitely I agree with you mate. But a lot less wouldn't have died if it wasn't for those '****ing' arsonists that started half the bloody fires too.

Im not going to say what people should/shouldn't have done. What would you have done if everything you worked for and all your treasured memories just went up in smoke. I reckon a few must have just given up they were so Distraught

Spartn

:viking:

 

[MrBurns]

Partially people are themselves responsible for the ultimate price they paid.

It is obvious to me that some overestimated their chances of survival, others fell victims of poor judgements of those who make calls in the family, community.

Ultimate >we will be all right mate< attitude.

Surely more property would be lost, but not a single human life had to be scarified in flames.

I think it's the authorities who once again underestimated the danger, it had been over 40 last week then again estimated 45 ??? it was obvious that something would very likely hapen, people should have been told to get to clear ground as soon as the forecast was known.

Not good enough to say prople should look after themselves they have to be told of the danger and told to leave.

 

[sam76]

I think it's the authorities who once again underestimated the danger, it had been over 40 last week then again estimated 45 ??? it was obvious that something would very likely hapen, people should have been told to get to clear ground as soon as the forecast was known.

Not good enough to say prople should look after themselves they have to be told of the danger and told to leave.

i think that's a bit unfair mate.

Authorities have been warning the public up to a week before yesterday.

People make choices. All we can do is offer education.

Again, it is illegal to force anyone to leave their property in the event of a fire in Victoria.

 

[Julia]

I'm with Ghoti's reminder here.
It's easy for us to sit at our computers, having watched the horror of it all on the TV news, and say what people should have done. We don't know what preparations had been made.

Whatever people decided to do - go or stay - they would have done what they thought was best at the time. I know I'd leave in even the slight chance a bushfire could engulf my home. But not everyone has insurance. I saw one woman on the news weep that it had taken her twenty years to get her home and it was gone in five minutes. Houses can be rebuilt. Lost lives are gone for ever.

RIP the lives lost and sympathy to the families.

 

[gfresh]

It has been confirmed that former newsreader Brian Naylor, and his wife, unfortunately perished in the fires at Kinglake.

I grew up watching that guy on the news each night RIP

 

[sam76]

VICTORIAN BUSHFIRE FUND - 1800 811 700

 

[MrBurns]

i think that's a bit unfair mate.

Authorities have been warning the public up to a week before yesterday.

People make choices. All we can do is offer education.

Again, it is illegal to force anyone to leave their property in the event of a fire in Victoria.

I stand by what I said, the authorities have had experience of Ash Wednesday and should have known this would happen given recent weather and forecasts.

There's no excuse for this level of loss of life given the information at hand.

 

[sam76]

I stand by what I said, the authorities have had experience of Ash Wednesday and should have known this would happen given recent weather and forecasts.

There's no excuse for this level of loss of life given the information at hand.

They did know.

That's why they have been warning the public for the last week.

 

[MrBurns]

They did know.

That's why they have been warning the public for the last week.

The warnings probably weren't of an urgent enough nature, I dont recall any to be honest.

What's done is done but if the state Govt can spend $1B on a ticketing system that doesnt work perhaps they can work out a way to prevent this happening again and believe me, these circumstances will repeat themselves again within 10 years.

 

[MrBurns]

Just saw a guy on TV that survived in an underground cellar, perhaps this should be part of a building permit in these areas.

 

[son of baglimit]

happy - you were the 1st to state what ive been muttering to myself all day.

mr burns. - the forecast was known for days, and yesterday there were many warnings to ALL in victoria - get out NOW before it begins.

but people in the affected regions have had smaller grass/bush fires for several years now, beaten them, and become over-confident in their own ability and the ability of a garden hose and a mown lawn to save their properties.

BUT THE TRUTH IS........WHEN ITS 40+C, WHEN THE WIND IS BLOWING ABOVE 30 KNOTS, WHEN ITS AS DRY AS ITS EVER BEEN (ESPECIALLY AFTER THE PREVIOUS WEEKS CONSTANT 40+C DAYS) THE RULE SHOULD BE.........

WALK AWAY, YOU CANNOT FIGHT THOSE CONDITIONS AT ALL (HENCE THE BRIGADES WALK AWAY TILL ITS SAFE) AND ONCE ITS COME AND GONE, AND ONLY THEN, RETURN AND CLEAN UP & REBUILD.

if you choose to live in such beautiful scenic green areas in this country, you have to prepared for the ugly side of such, and that is walk away and live for another day.

i only hope that this FINALLY creates the rule that - should anyone wish to live in these areas, or the urban fringe, they are educated and see the devastation (im sure the media have recordings that never go to air, due to the gruesome scenes) and be made aware that when these weather conditions exist, you need to walk away and come back afterwards....live for another day.

 

[Judd]

First, my sincere condolences to the families of those who have been killed in these fires. So far the death tole is 96 and rising and, sadly, some of those in hospital are unlikely to survive. Of those who do, a number will require extensive and painful rehabilitation and that's only the physical aspect.

Second, you may care to browse this link.

http://www.abc.net.au/blackfriday/royalcommission/index_recommendations.htm

It is Judge Stretton's major recommendations following the Royal Commission into the 1939 bushfires. Not much as changed over the years, has it?

 

[nulla nulla]

IMO the idiots that casually flick a burning cigarete butt from their cars are just as criminal as the arsonists that deliberately light fires. When they catch whoever lit these fires that have claimed lives, they should be charged with murder and be put away for ever.

 

[Prospector]

My sincere condolences to all those affected by this. Not that they will have the luxury of reading ASF for a while.

Listening to some of the stories, it just seems that unless the entire country area of Victoria was evacuated, there was no way that people could really escape this fire. One person from SA said on the radio this morning that his brother had stayed to fight his house in an area between two of the major fires - 20 kms from 1, 30 from the other so you would think 'safe'. From the time they saw the fire (their area wasnt mentioned on the ABC radio as a potential bushfire risk) they had 15 minutes until it was on them. He stayed, his neighbours left. He doesnt think his neighbours survived the car trip, but he and his wife and child did. And then his father hired a helicopter to get them out.

In Adelaide, because our hills are now so densely populated and so close to the CBD, (less 15 minutes) we are talking major major evacuation. I dont think we could cope. On the other hand, look at what they do in the US when there is a hurricane risk.

It was hell here in Adelaide (and SA) for about 90 minutes; Victoria would have had this for around 8 hours.

So, I dont know, I dont know the answers.

 

[MrBurns]

I think the'll have to make a number of safe areas that people can easily get to in a fire OR regulate that homes within certain areas have bunkers that can be used to shelter - expensive though for that once a decade event.

As far as the warnings do I didnt hear any, except the usual "be careful" generalities.

 

[OK2]

Partially people are themselves responsible for the ultimate price they paid.

It is obvious to me that some overestimated their chances of survival, others fell victims of poor judgements of those who make calls in the family, community.

Ultimate >we will be all right mate< attitude.

Surely more property would be lost, but not a single human life had to be scarified in flames.

One of the homes lost had two fire pumps and a dam across the front of the property and no longer stands.

In the time that you began reading this post a fire started a few kilometers away from where you are right now and within 3 minutes will level your home. There is no warning as there is no fire in the area and your local CFA/MFB is away assisting other communities because there is no risk to their own. Neighbours are telling you that the roads out of the area are already closed, the 100kmh winds have brought down trees, power lines and caused numerous car accidents because of the zero visability. Are you so naive to think that so many people had the intention of fighting these fires with kids in the house and as respected elderly citizens like Brian Naylor? These people had no chance and this was only 60km's or so from Melbourne and not in the middle of the Great Desert. If this fire front had of hit any major city in Australia we would of been talking of exactly the same outcome only with more catastrophic results, there would of been no way of stopping it and no where to hide. What did you do, where did you go, what did you save or should I ask who did you save because you would not of been able to save yourself!

I hope that you enjoyed the last three minutes..........................................

 

[sam76]

Mr. Burns.

If you can tell the CFA where the fires will start then I'm sure they will focus more intently on those areas.

It is also a known fact that cellars are a quite dangerous place to shelter during a fire.

A: you don't know what is going on around you.
B: There is a very real chance something will fall and cover the trap door.
C: the whole floor collapes on to you.

In the last 10 years we have seen a major tree change by people moving out to the rural/urban fringe.

they move out there for the 'lifestyle' and to be 'close to nature'. These people simply lack fire knowledge believe they will get a truck come to them in the event of a major fire.

it's up to the locals and the cfa to educate them if they coose to allow themselves to be educated.

It's the whole leading a horse to water arguement.

The CFA do letter box dops then put on Fire ready Victoria sessions on street corners to gather interests from the community. Then Community Firegurd facilitators call these people and organise groups for a series of meetings to educate people on fire safety etc....

""As far as the warnings do I didnt hear any, except the usual "be careful" generalities.""

Blaming the Authorities for this well you've read my other posts on the matter. Just like you can't expect a truck in the event of a fire you also can't expect an individual warning.

 

[sam76]

In the time that you began reading this post a fire started a few kilometers away from where you are right now and within 3 minutes will level your home.

I hope that you enjoyed the last three minutes..........................................

This is the type of nonsense that confuses and scares people.

Houses do not burn in three minutes.

The fastest know fire was in 1939 at a speed of 15km/h

Writing this stuff does not help people.

 

[MrBurns]

Mr. Burns.

If you can tell the CFA where the fires will start then I'm sure they will focus more intently on those areas.

It is also a known fact that cellars are a quite dangerous place to shelter during a fire.

A: you don't know what is going on around you.
B: There is a very real chance something will fall and cover the trap door.
C: the whole floor collapes on to you.

In the last 10 years we have seen a major tree change by people moving out to the rural/urban fringe.

they move out there for the 'lifestyle' and to be 'close to nature'. These people simply lack fire knowledge believe they will get a truck come to them in the event of a major fire.

it's up to the locals and the cfa to educate them if they coose to allow themselves to be educated.

It's the whole leading a horse to water arguement.

The CFA do letter box dops then put on Fire ready Victoria sessions on street corners to gather interests from the community. Then Community Firegurd facilitators call these people and organise groups for a series of meetings to educate people on fire safety etc....

Blaming the Authorities for this well you've read my other posts on the matter. Just like you can't expect a truck in the event of a fire you also can't expect an individual warning.

Man and his family on TV saved by their cellar, steel door above them glowed red with the heat but they were ok. That's fact not opinion.

please don't turn this into a "someones blaming the CFA thing" because I'm not , by authorities I mean the State Govt, they can spend $1B on a ticketing system that doesn't work but they cant work out how to make rural environments safer for the people living there.

I don't think it's fair to say this was unexpected it's happened before and we had the hottest week on record - wake up !

Safe areas, maintenance paid by levies on rates for rural dwellers - there simple isn't it ? Why wasn't it done.

I know some people stayed when they should have gone and Brian Naylor was among them but if the warning to move to the safe areas (which didn't exist) were broadcast properly perhaps lives would have been saved.

As it stands you would be crazy to live in a rural area if you just accept that these events cannot be better prepared for.

 

[OK2]

This is the type of nonsense that confuses and scares people.

Houses do not burn in three minutes.

The fastest know fire was in 1939 at a speed of 15km/h

Writing this stuff does not help people.

Perhaps you should speak to people who were in the middle of it. I am in a semi rural area not far from there. People were running from neighbours home to neighbours home because they could not out run the fire. Are you serious? One person said that it was like a dozen fighter planes coming through. It was so fast that there was no air support. I take it that you live in suburbia. A house that is burning from four sides on the outside implodes, the air is first sucked out of it as opposed to a house which burns from the inside outward looking for oxygen to fuel it. Do some research or talk to someone in the CFA, they will tell you what you dont want to know.