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Ukraine War

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The EU hasn't bolstered its own defence, so why would they bolster Ukraine's defence?

Which is exactly why Trump called them out for it and was cancelled by the media who claimed he was destroying long standing alliances, when all he was doing was demanding the EU fulfill its side of the alliance by maintaining a viable military presence.

So what that tells me is, that the media were more concerned about undermining Trump, than putting the emphasis on his message that the EU could end up in the situation they now find themselves in.

IFocus said:
The US is divided on just about anything now, divided nations don't get anything done never mind war or suppling resources, you say the divisions are nothing to do with Trump its all the medias fault or the left wing loonies.
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The US is divided, the U.K is divided and Australia is divided, because the media are systematically undermining elected governments, to what end who knows, but the general public are feeling that they are being manipulated.
That is what is driving the discontent.

IFocus said:
Trump is the hero that would have stopped all this happening... some how.
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No one is saying Trump is a hero, that is a term you are using, the fact is China, Russia and North Korea definitely lacked confidence when Trump was the President. That lack of confidence obviously no longer exists.



IFocus said:
Yeah right, carry on.
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Time will tell, which way the majority feel, that's for sure.
Things are becoming more and more polarized.
 
I'm sure Ukraine once had a whole heap of nukes. Now they de-nuked under the promise of protection of the US or Russia I thought?
 
greggles said:
How can you expect that you, or anything you say, can be taken seriously by anyone after posting links to tinfoil hat conspiracy websites?
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do you ever think that there is more than meets the eye. why Putin attacked Ukraine and what he wants?

or just go along with the western media narrative who most people know are full or crap. you know when the other media peddle the same crap as the murdoch does there is something wrong?
when the ABC reports that nazis are in control of Ukrainian
why do the west hate Putin so much?
do you know the history of Russia and the Revolution of the Bolchviks etc
all those conspiracies of that trump and Russian collusion we proven to be a lie and set up by the democrats and western media

you wont know crap except call every thing a conspiracy and go on and believe that everything is rainbow and skittles in the world

“Navalny funded by the Soros foundation, while Clinton foundation, paid for his studies”-German Regional MP Gunnar Lindemann | Ella Cruz | Top Censored Conservative News

“Navalny is just a puppet of the US, funded by the Soros foundation, while Clinton foundation, paid for his studies"- German Regional MP Gunnar Lindemann
ellacruz.org

Putin’s Purge of the Rothschild Money Changers | VT Foreign Policy

www.veteranstoday.com
 


Mick largely agree the US is riven with division across many axis's be it wealth disparity at a all time high and increasing, race and culture wars, access to health care that's before you get to the toxic politics.

And yes wealth is power and those with it wont let go any time soon but disagree re bureaucracy Trump tried to destroy it as it stood in his way to domination its really the glue that's require for a democracy India being a case in point.
 
One of the few things the West has in it's favour imo is its consumer spending power.

I detested Trump, but he was right about getting manufacturing out of China and back to US or other Western countries.

Cut off the socialist's money supply and that leaves less for them to buy weapons with.

Some of us here have been saying that for a long time but it hasn't sunk in yet.
 
You nailed it, the problem is the multinational machine makes huge money by sending the manufacturing to low wage, low tax, easily corrupted Countries, how much do you think they would have lost in profits if they were farced to return to Western countries?
So the only way you can force them back is with financial penalties i.e tariffs, so how do you stop that? get rid of the people trying to impose them.
How do you do that, by telling those who work for your advertising dollars, that they had better sort it, because a big financial loss to us is a bigger financial loss to you.
I may be wrong, but as you say Trump was a horrible human being, it doesn't mean his intent wasn't correct with regard China and Russia. The last thing Trump would want is to see, is all his money go round the S bend, because the U.S goes down the toilet.
The multinationals they don't give a rats, it's about the bottom line, they just want to make it as cheap as possible and sell it at maximum profit and they don't care who buys it.
The bosses just move to where it is best to live and the last thing they care about is patriotism, China do the best deal, China it is.
Trump upset them, the bosses set the media blood hounds lose, status quo re established.
What is amazing is how many people, still can't get past the character assassination and want to view it as personal issue, it just shows the power of the media.
The West only has consumer spending power, while they have something to sell, which is fast running out the cashed up from the growing economies are buying the Wests best properties, the Wests best businesses anything of good value they are buying, once it is gone then comes the reckoning.
Then we are just a bunch of baristas, who own nothing and produce nothing of value, lets see how that works out for the smug ones.
 
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Reuters now reporting what North Korean state media says? Their clicks must be dropping off.

....North Korea's state media reported Saturday....
 
You have to hand it to the Ukraine army. Absolutely committed to depending their country. On paper this is no contest. But on the ground these soldiers and the countries leader are not giving an inch.

I think Putin believed that just invading Ukraine and blowing up the airfields would be sufficient to cower the country into submission. So far not so. The individual acts of heroism and "xuck you" courage would be inspiring others and unnerving the Russian military. I don't think this is their war.

As Russia has to fight harder, kill more people and destroy more of the cities their international reputation goes further down the toilet. The determination of Western counties to ratchet up sanctions on Putin and his supporters will increase. I wonder how secure Putin feels ?
 
If the West simply and absolutely freezes all the oligarchs' foreign bank accounts and confiscates all their property such as football teams and mansions, Putin might come to a RasPutin-esque end, courtesy of his "pals".
 
It is just a sad indictement on the West, that Russia would have the gall to do it, it just shows how low we have gone.

My father got off on this sort of insipid subserviant reaction, yet we in the West are telling our kids bullying isn't good.

What isn't good, is bringing up our kids to be victims, bullies will always be there, what we are doing is not teaching our kids how to deal with them.
 
Well the next move will be very interesting, will it be Taiwan? South Korea?, or Australia.

Well life is certainly moving on. ?
South Korea, Samsung and most of the other high level chip manufacturing, where is Trump when you need him.
 
I just hope all these people who take the moral high ground, to champion the underdog, are just as commited when the real $hit hits the fan.
 
What's the etiquette for nukes? A nice little shot across the bow as a chivalrous warning in some sparely populated oblast. Or would the West have to simply "empty the clip" on Russia? Dead Hand propaganda aside, I tend to think there would be tremendous advantage in making an overwhelming dawn raid style first strike. Even if there is somehow just enough of the good ol' Apollo 11 style genius left in the US of A, along with key allies, could the level of destruction ever be justified, even if the execution avoided MAD?
 
Couple of threads which is the reality of the situation. A lot of the Russians are conscripts that don't want to be there. I heard 10000 Chechens are heading to Ukraine. Possibly military tactic of sending in the recruits before your battle hardened. Who knows. This whole thing has me scratching my head.


Russian soldiers from all across the country were deceived into heading to the Ukrainian border, and some were beaten if they resisted.

...their sons only recently joined the military as conscripts and were told they were going to the border with Ukraine for drills. But their statuses were then abruptly changed to contract soldiers— a role for those with more combat and training experience—and they were suddenly thrust into war.

“They are switching entire regiments to contract [soldiers,] although the guys did not submit any formal requests for this, and took no such initiative. There are instances of physical violence, and beatings of those who refuse to become contract soldiers. And after that it’s completely unknown [what happens to them], because they take away their phones,”

“We've had a flurry of calls from scared mothers all over Russia. They are crying, they don’t know if their children are alive or healthy,”



Governments and the elite need to be the disposable ones. Not these young kids. Stop licking boot and learn the lesson. Government is not your friend.

*Possible propaganda *
 
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