Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

Turning 5,000 dollars into 50,000 dollars

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Yeah you're right y'know... How much could one person expect to earn with shares during a bear market? You'd have to learn to make use of every dead cat bounce and because of the frequent trading I guess fees and and taxes will gobble up the earnings... Maybe there are other ways of making money outside the share market and working... I guess Real Estate would be one...

When was the last Bear Market period by the way?
 
Insider, congratulations on getting more than 600% return of your money. You successfully gambled your $5000 in a highly speculative stock and you hit the jackpot. Now take the money and never do it again, especially in the long term. You are destined to lose all the money you've just gained in the future if you decided to pursue such "lucative" (in your mind/experience that is) opportunity again.

Like some others, while we are being negative, we are giving you a professional advice as a good will because we don't want to see you burnt out completely when your "speculative" trading with no plans do not work again.

Hear our advices, sell the stock NOW and go read Dr Van Tharp's Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom and learn how to develop your own trading system and understand the ever important concept of position sizing and money management.

And IF you managed to read the entire book and understand his ideas, you will think about how "lucky" you were and glad you actually made profit in this particular run.

While this thread is fairly educational, it is also in my opinion, a thread that lure more greedy people into the market and burnt themselve really badly. They would think, "ohhhh, this guy did it with a WELL researched speculative stock and made 600%, perhaps I should leverage my position and earn 3000%!!! Then I would be rich!". Then he goes in and.....the rest is history depending on his/her luck.

Again, we are not trying to be negative, we are just being "realistic" that in the "long run", you need an ENTIRELLY DIFFERENT MINDSET AND APPROACH to trading in the share market. We (at least myself) can guarantee you that your chance of losing most of your money in the next few "trades", using the same strategy, is almost a certainely.

Stop now, relax a bit and do some reading before going back in again.
 
Temjin said:
Insider, congratulations on getting more than 600% return of your money. You successfully gambled your $5000 in a highly speculative stock and you hit the jackpot. Now take the money and never do it again, especially in the long term. You are destined to lose all the money you've just gained in the future if you decided to pursue such "lucative" (in your mind/experience that is) opportunity again.

Like some others, while we are being negative, we are giving you a professional advice as a good will because we don't want to see you burnt out completely when your "speculative" trading with no plans do not work again.

Hear our advices, sell the stock NOW and go read Dr Van Tharp's Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom and learn how to develop your own trading system and understand the ever important concept of position sizing and money management.

And IF you managed to read the entire book and understand his ideas, you will think about how "lucky" you were and glad you actually made profit in this particular run.

While this thread is fairly educational, it is also in my opinion, a thread that lure more greedy people into the market and burnt themselve really badly. They would think, "ohhhh, this guy did it with a WELL researched speculative stock and made 600%, perhaps I should leverage my position and earn 3000%!!! Then I would be rich!". Then he goes in and.....the rest is history depending on his/her luck.

Again, we are not trying to be negative, we are just being "realistic" that in the "long run", you need an ENTIRELLY DIFFERENT MINDSET AND APPROACH to trading in the share market. We (at least myself) can guarantee you that your chance of losing most of your money in the next few "trades", using the same strategy, is almost a certainely.

Stop now, relax a bit and do some reading before going back in again.
Click to expand...


Agree wholly.
Great post.
 
nizar said:
Agree wholly.
Great post.
Click to expand...

I agree also that a trading knowledge is very important and experience is the only way to learn in the market. No books will actually teach you what to do. They only give various strategies that were dependent on the financial/global or company situation at that time. There are far too many variables that need to be restled with and you can never know everything in the share market. I guess that's why we aren't all millionaires.

I think its fantastic that Insider has achieved so much from MTN and I'm a heavy believer that Insider can at least double his money again from now before I would be saying to sell.

Anyway this is just in my opinion.

:)
 
Temjin said:
Insider, congratulations on getting more than 600% return of your money. You successfully gambled your $5000 in a highly speculative stock and you hit the jackpot. Now take the money and never do it again, especially in the long term. You are destined to lose all the money you've just gained in the future if you decided to pursue such "lucative" (in your mind/experience that is) opportunity again.

Like some others, while we are being negative, we are giving you a professional advice as a good will because we don't want to see you burnt out completely when your "speculative" trading with no plans do not work again.

Hear our advices, sell the stock NOW and go read Dr Van Tharp's Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom and learn how to develop your own trading system and understand the ever important concept of position sizing and money management.

And IF you managed to read the entire book and understand his ideas, you will think about how "lucky" you were and glad you actually made profit in this particular run.

While this thread is fairly educational, it is also in my opinion, a thread that lure more greedy people into the market and burnt themselve really badly. They would think, "ohhhh, this guy did it with a WELL researched speculative stock and made 600%, perhaps I should leverage my position and earn 3000%!!! Then I would be rich!". Then he goes in and.....the rest is history depending on his/her luck.

Again, we are not trying to be negative, we are just being "realistic" that in the "long run", you need an ENTIRELLY DIFFERENT MINDSET AND APPROACH to trading in the share market. We (at least myself) can guarantee you that your chance of losing most of your money in the next few "trades", using the same strategy, is almost a certainely.

Stop now, relax a bit and do some reading before going back in again.
Click to expand...


Also consideration should be given to the fact that Insider is not a trader and is not attempting to be one by the looks of things so the trading strategies in this instance aren't at all needed or necessary. Insider is a long term investor! Well at this stage anyway, so to buy and hold the way that Insider has done is fair and normall for any investor other than putting all of the eggs in one basket which under normal circumstances is very risky.
:)
 
champ2003 said:
I agree also that a trading knowledge is very important and experience is the only way to learn in the market. No books will actually teach you what to do. They only give various strategies that were dependent on the financial/global or company situation at that time. There are far too many variables that need to be restled with and you can never know everything in the share market. I guess that's why we aren't all millionaires.

I think its fantastic that Insider has achieved so much from MTN and I'm a heavy believer that Insider can at least double his money again from now before I would be saying to sell.

Anyway this is just in my opinion.

:)
Click to expand...

I can safely tell you that there ARE BOOKS out there that will teach you how to become a successful trader and cover everything from psychology to a writing a business trading plan to more detailed strategies (where a major of people tend to focus on) such as entries, exits to position sizing and money management.

You are right that there are too many variables on the market but the main point is, you do not need to know everything about the market, nor try to predict/control everything. The secret to trading usually lies on the person alone and their mindset on how to approach the market.

The fact is that most people in the world do the EXACT OPPOSITE of what is REQUIRED FOR SUCCESS. Put this in the trading perspective, a great majority of people only tend to focus on trying to find the holy grail of trading, that is, to be able to predict everything what is going on in the market and develop a system that is 100% realiability. They are "conditioned" to win, not to lose and thus, usually lead themselve to finanical ruin because they cannot overcome their natural biases.

This is exactly the reasons why alot of us aren't millionaires yet and only a few who "understand" what it takes to be a successful trader.

I can go on forever but like I said before, Insider was simply lucky and the chance of him to continue to double his money via the same strategies again through the next few trades is extremely extremely extremely extremely small, if not impossible.

champ2003 said:
Also consideration should be given to the fact that Insider is not a trader and is not attempting to be one by the looks of things so the trading strategies in this instance aren't at all needed or necessary. Insider is a long term investor! Well at this stage anyway, so to buy and hold the way that Insider has done is fair and normall for any investor other than putting all of the eggs in one basket which under normal circumstances is very risky.
:)
Click to expand...

Nope, there is no such thing as a long term investor. In fact, I don't even know what is a long term investor. When you buy a stock, don't you make any subconscious decision to sell the stock at some time if certain things happen? For example, it no longer represent values, the stock price dropped significantly or you want to lock in the profit.

Insider is a trader and he is playing with speculative stocks with potential for huge gains without any risk management or exit plans.

What happens if he purchase the next cheap stock with the full profit he just made, and then it drop in values by more than 50%? What is he going to do? Or are you suggesting the stock he picked will NEVER drop in value because of his "research" skill into the company?

He doesn't have a plan at all and is simply gambling his money. If he wish to pursue such strategies in the long term, he need to understand elements of trading and has to create a plan to his "long term investment" trading system.
 
Temjin said:
I can safely tell you that there ARE BOOKS out there that will teach you how to become a successful trader and cover everything from psychology to a writing a business trading plan to more detailed strategies (where a major of people tend to focus on) such as entries, exits to position sizing and money management.

You are right that there are too many variables on the market but the main point is, you do not need to know everything about the market, nor try to predict/control everything. The secret to trading usually lies on the person alone and their mindset on how to approach the market.

The fact is that most people in the world do the EXACT OPPOSITE of what is REQUIRED FOR SUCCESS. Put this in the trading perspective, a great majority of people only tend to focus on trying to find the holy grail of trading, that is, to be able to predict everything what is going on in the market and develop a system that is 100% realiability. They are "conditioned" to win, not to lose and thus, usually lead themselve to finanical ruin because they cannot overcome their natural biases.

This is exactly the reasons why alot of us aren't millionaires yet and only a few who "understand" what it takes to be a successful trader.

I can go on forever but like I said before, Insider was simply lucky and the chance of him to continue to double his money via the same strategies again through the next few trades is extremely extremely extremely extremely small, if not impossible.



Nope, there is no such thing as a long term investor. In fact, I don't even know what is a long term investor. When you buy a stock, don't you make any subconscious decision to sell the stock at some time if certain things happen? For example, it no longer represent values, the stock price dropped significantly or you want to lock in the profit.

Insider is a trader and he is playing with speculative stocks with potential for huge gains without any risk management or exit plans.

What happens if he purchase the next cheap stock with the full profit he just made, and then it drop in values by more than 50%? What is he going to do? Or are you suggesting the stock he picked will NEVER drop in value because of his "research" skill into the company?

He doesn't have a plan at all and is simply gambling his money. If he wish to pursue such strategies in the long term, he need to understand elements of trading and has to create a plan to his "long term investment" trading system.
Click to expand...

Worth repeating.
 
Temjin said:
Nope, there is no such thing as a long term investor. In fact, I don't even know what is a long term investor.

Insider is a trader and he is playing with speculative stocks with potential for huge gains without any risk management or exit plans.
Click to expand...

I was having a discussion with my brother about this and we came to the conclusion that shares aren't really portions of a company any more but like a commodity instead... Once upon a time people would invest in a company because they believed in the company... In contrast some people on this forum have openly admitted that they have invested in companies without even knowing what they do... I don't understand this as much as people understand my trading strategies... It doesn't make sense to me why would you even risk that... The share market has become a place where people simply shuffle money nowadays...

It was really interesting how shares can be seen as a commodity, something disposable but to others they are companies... I guess that's the main difference between a Trader and an Investor...
 
I'm not a trader... I'm an investor who watches the market very closely and If I have to I will push the eject button... there hasn't been any reason to yet...

I'm fortunate to have invested in MTN because when I did I only knew a fraction of what I know of them... I had plans to knock them off after $3.00 but It's because of my research IMO it'd be better to hold... It's works and gives strong results... When the market changes then so will my strategy...
 
Interesting thread.. Goes to show how much difference there is is each of our objectives.. Insider puts up $5K (which he could probably afford to loose) while others (like me) are probably older (60+) and are investing their future financial well being. In my case, with SMSF, loosing my stake was not an option and from being an ASX newbie 18months ago had to tread very carefully. I'm happy to report that after 18months with around 25 stocks i'm up about 50% which I'm happy with. My target when setting out on this journey was 25% pa..
 
The only thing I would do if I was Insiders position would be to sell whatever shares are necessary to cover my initial investment.

That way the initial capital is protected and then everything else is cream...
 
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