No guilt for what I had no part in at the time but accknowledgement that the industrial revolution, which pushed the west to where we are now, got a huge leg up from theses thing while others were left behind.these are interesting subjects. take slavery - the west have been the first society in history to enact a total emancipation of slaves and have set up all sorts of laws and edicts to outlaw it, yet for some reason we are still obsessed with carrying the guilt for what happened over 100 years ago.
Well there ya go. We agree!!i'm not saying ignore them, i'm saying don't feed them or give them cash handouts. provide education and assistance in infrastructure development so they have the tools to sort the problem out themselves. if they prove unable to rise above ancient tribal rivalries and continue to genocide each other based on some primative clan based division then that's their business.
Well there ya go. We agree!!
pfft we'll never get a 20 page thread going with thinking like that!
There was support offered for Disarray's position by an African consultant economist on Radio National's "PM" programme this evening. When an African delivers such a judgment it probably holds some weight.
Transcript here:
http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2008/s2492857.htm
He's actually a she, if it matters.Julia hes selling a book...he has an agenda.
i had a good chat with a cab driver from ghana a few weeks ago and he was explaining the situation in his country. apparently it was chaotic with coups and all sorts of problems until the military organised elections and went to civilian government - very thailand-esque.
his major discussion point was tension between muslims in the north and catholics in the south and his main insight which i found very enlightening regarded the education system.
muslim education revolves around madrasses which are essentially seminaries which teach the koran and nothing else really useful. when a student graduates from a madrass they can regurgiate all kinds of muslim law and koran quotes but don't actually have any useful skills that they can apply to society so its easy to radicalise and decide blowing yourself up is a viable life choice.
what the ghanan government has done is make standard schooling mandatory for all children for 6 hours a day where they study maths, science, english etc. and then the studends can go to the madrass afterwards. he thinks it has gone a long way to settling down some of the divisions in the country and he seemed quite positive about the future direction of ghana.
education and economics, the key to stability. sorry for the hijack, its just that so_cynicals post reminded me of it.
On the thread covering the Israeli/ Hamas war I queried why families living in such a hell hole as the Gaza Strip would have average sized families of six children. Why would women bring children into a world of no jobs and no hope for the future. Surely if they could bring in rockets, they could bring in contraceptives.
It was a rhetorical question really, because I already knew the answer.
So similarly Christianity should be responsible for the decline of Zimbabwe? Power grab and human nature has nothing to do with the atrocities committed in Africa, it is all because of Islam....
noooooo, it's about the potential offered by educational opportunities. education needs to be broad and encompass a range of subjects, based upon the western model would be a good start.
compare to islamic education or traditional confucian education or some such, the scope of knowledge taught is extremely limited and only offers narrow paths for advancement. someone who can cite the koran can't go off and apply those principles to agriculture or engineering which makes the education they have pretty bloody useless for any practical kind of purpose.
the difference between islamic and christian cultural educational systems (ghana being a case in point) is that broad education curriculum is mandatory in the west and the priest class go to the seminary to study useless god stuff AFTER they have completed a secular education. in many islamic societies however the only education that is offered is in a madrass so there aren't any useful skills imparted to the students so it is extemely difficult to advance and break out of ingrained social cycles because the students don't know any better. and extreme islamic societies don't educate their women anyway because they considered as little more than breeding cows (as the taliban demonstrated)
however i will take you to task on the "islam responsible for atrocities in africa" because yes, in many places it is. sudan ring a bell? nigeria? somalia? of course its all about power grab and human nature, that much is obvious, its the motivation and justification that is the point of interest in conflict.
Always disassociate culture from religion and you might see the difference clearly.
you are wrong. religion and culture are inextricably tied up in each other, this accounts for not only the foundation of religions but also how successfully they are spread and the method by which they are spread. what were the social conditions that a particular religion was founded in? did the believers gain converts by preaching or by warfare? how successful were the differing religions in various racial, cultural and geographic areas?
to disassociate one from the other and view them in isolation is to make gross simplifications of the complex tapestry of human society and culture. i also think race plays a big part in this tapestry as well but some people can't help but get offended when you suggest that we aren't all exact biologoical clones of each other and subtle things like hormone levels, neurotransmitters, specific physical adaptions, and racial intelligence types might actually account for the differences in sociology and culture we see all around the world.
This is our own back yard.
Of course its prominent.
When the twin towers were hit what did you see?
When Zimbabwe is suffering what do you see?
If an Aussie is in need and your an Aussie you'd want to be pushing to the front of the line to give a hand. That's what we do.
There's no turning a blind eye here.
Simply priorities.
Right here and Right now those in Victoria AND FNQ should be every Aussie's no 1 priority.
In regards to the Victorian Bushfires;
I understand this will not be well taken but its something that has to be wrote.
Over the past week, I have not been able to turn on the television without some reporter or politician telling me how bad the situation is, how this is a national tragedy. With foreign media and politicians offering support and offering their help and sorrow.
I honestly feel for everyone effected, it is a terrible hardship to endure.
And from recent reports the death-toll could rise to 230, with a number of more townships in ruins.
But lets look at the broader picture:
And right now watching TV see adverts asking me to donate...
Can people really turn a blind eye to such injustices in the third world but commend the efforts of "us australians for uniting together"
This situation has made me feel sick, and after seeing such destruction and pain in Victoria I feel there will no change in global policy towards those in true need.
I know where my donations are going.
great post techie...these are our people & we should always do the best for them.we should come first always.
you want to hope you never get left in the street with just the clothes on your back,you wont be wondering about other people who can NEVER feed themselves.you"ll have your hand out for help from your fellow aussies who know how tough it is.btw before you get the violin out for the rest of the world...http://www.ausaid.gov.au/
dont forget $2.5b to indonesia & they hate our guts,they sent $1m back!
meanwhile we got our people cant get their teeth fixed...
I humbly disagree with all this bullsh*t in bold. How come you can be saved by the blood of a black person of the same type, but can die instantly, if injected with the blood of your own race of the wrong blood type? So some races are not intelligent enough. What can I say?
Religion and culture are different, and if you are not able to see the difference then I guess you have not traveled enough. While I can agree that some cultures are more adapt at picking one religion over another because of their culture/heritage etc.
great post techie...these are our people & we should always do the best for them.we should come first always.
you want to hope you never get left in the street with just the clothes on your back,you wont be wondering about other people who can NEVER feed themselves.you"ll have your hand out for help from your fellow aussies who know how tough it is.btw before you get the violin out for the rest of the world...http://www.ausaid.gov.au/
dont forget $2.5b to indonesia & they hate our guts,they sent $1m back!
meanwhile we got our people cant get their teeth fixed...
Yes, Australians do in fact deserve to have dental care. Why should teeth be different from any other part of the body? It's crazy that we have Medicare but (except for a few chronically ill people) people's teeth are left to rot if they can't afford to pay for a private dentist.you're right, the rich should support the rich. white people should help white people., a few aussies with bad teeth deserve our billions $$$... lets forget about those 30,000 children who die of starvation each day.
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