The World is on the brink!

[disarray]

The problem as highlighted above is whether it can be done orderly and whether the middle classes are expected to take a disproportinate amount of the pain.

it's the young who will be expected to carry the burden. how gracefully they do it remains to be seen. this is more than a class conflict, its a generational conflict.

 

[prawn_86]

it's the young who will be expected to carry the burden. how gracefully they do it remains to be seen. this is more than a class conflict, its a generational conflict.

Totally agree with this. Why should our taxes pay for the baby boomers health/aged/medical care and pay off all the debts they have ran up? Its not as though they have left the World in a stable place for us to take over from, and those in power still cannot admit that they mave made continuous mistakes since their generation came to power.

(Generalising obviously, but thats my thoughts)

 

[sptrawler]

Totally agree with this. Why should our taxes pay for the baby boomers health/aged/medical care and pay off all the debts they have ran up? Its not as though they have left the World in a stable place for us to take over from, and those in power still cannot admit that they mave made continuous mistakes since their generation came to power.

(Generalising obviously, but thats my thoughts)

On behalf of my generation I would just like to say "sorry". LOL,LOL,LOL. Give me a glass of water I'm choking.
You younger generation need to get over yourselves, get of your ar@%e and stop being a bunch of babies.
Where ever I look there is young people sitting around sipping latte, filling fast food outlets or pubs and clubs. There has never been a more affluent group of young people, they have been over indulged by their baby boomer parents.
That is the biggest continuous mistake the baby boomers made.

(Generalising obviously, buts that's my thoughts)

 

[medicowallet]

You younger generation need to get over yourselves, get of your ar@%e and stop being a bunch of babies.
Where ever I look there is young people sitting around sipping latte, filling fast food outlets or pubs and clubs. There has never been a more affluent group of young people, they have been over indulged by their baby boomer parents.
That is the biggest continuous mistake the baby boomers made.

(Generalising obviously, buts that's my thoughts)

This is one of the best statements on ASF I have ever read.

We ALL contributed to the good and the bad.

The BB MADE the lifestyle that the younger generation inherited, but the BB also created the problems we have today, and more importantly we will be faced with tomorrow.

I think there is a deleveraging the world has to have.

I think that there needs to be worldwide re-evaluation of retirement ages.

I think that there will be massive pain felt by the younger generations, BUT remember that the BB felt a lot of pain whilst building up the world for the younglings.

The younger generation has less opportunity, but a better starting point, and a bleaker outlook.. I don't know which one I would prefer, but I DO know that hard work will prevail. I just think that the govt needs to get their head out, and INCREASE the RETIREMENT AGE before it is too late.

ALSO, means tests should include housing as an asset, to limit pensions to people who actually need them.

 

[Julia]

ALSO, means tests should include housing as an asset, to limit pensions to people who actually need them.

Strongly agree with this. We should not be having elderly people (or anyone else for that matter) sitting on million dollar homes and drawing on the public purse.

sptrawler: thanks for saying what I wanted to but lacked the courage! I am so utterly sick of Gen Y blaming baby boomers for everything.

 

[Samson 9]

(Strongly agree with this. We should not be having elderly people (or anyone else for that matter) sitting on million dollar homes and drawing on the public purse.)


And while your at it don't forget a Inheritance Tax would be also handy for Father State.


Sam

 

[Smurf1976]

ALSO, means tests should include housing as an asset, to limit pensions to people who actually need them.

But how does one define "need"?

If I work all my life and save for retirement, then why should I pay to provide a pension to someone else who had the same opportunities but who spent everything they earned?

It's like those damn "seniors card" discounts. Why should I pay more in order to provide a discount to others, many of whom are reasonably wealthy, simply based on their age? Would a discount for the genuinely poor or otherwise disadvantaged, of any age, not be a better outcome?

We seem to have become a society where practically everyone is receiving some form of welfare either directly, or through various bonuses, discounts etc. The majority are being propped up by an increasingly small number of hard workers who receive no handouts or discounts.

 

[Sean K]

Libyan missiles and uranium taken by Iran. Anarchy looms.

Pakistan still housing various militant groups in the NW raiding NATO in Afghanistan. US attacking sovereign Pakistan by the day. And night.

Syrian rebels about to establish a separate state on the border with Turkey led by a former General. Will consolidate to build strength and attack Assad no doubtably with Western backing.

EU is CRAZY to back the PIIGS and should kick them out. Stop putting band aids on people who are so insolent.

Germany will end up owning Europe at this rate. We know what they are capable of.

 

[Julia]

EU is CRAZY to back the PIIGS and should kick them out. Stop putting band aids on people who are so insolent.

Germany will end up owning Europe at this rate. We know what they are capable of.

I agree. I have much sympathy for the German taxpayers.

 

[disarray]

Germany will end up owning Europe at this rate

well after so many shots at it they deserve a payoff for their determination :

 

[Aussiejeff]

I wonder what the futures indexes are telling us?

Perhaps, the possibility of a brief rally in the short term followed by a sharp collapse to an even lower low?

How low might it go in the rollercoaster yo-yo...

Looks a tad grim IMO

 

[IFocus]

it's the young who will be expected to carry the burden. how gracefully they do it remains to be seen. this is more than a class conflict, its a generational conflict.

Totally agree with this. Why should our taxes pay for the baby boomers health/aged/medical care and pay off all the debts they have ran up? Its not as though they have left the World in a stable place for us to take over from, and those in power still cannot admit that they mave made continuous mistakes since their generation came to power.

(Generalising obviously, but thats my thoughts)

Totally agree but then I think of this

"The young do not know enough to
be prudent, and therefore they attempt
the impossible -- and achieve it,
generation after generation."
- Pearl S. Buck

 

[Sean K]

The word 'brink' is creeping into the vernacular in all sorts of places.

Europe is obviously on a path to self distraction. They can only hold it together for a short time longer. Eastern Europe is being dragged in. It's just looking completely brinkish really.

The Muslim world from Morocco to Pakistan is just plain defunct. Imagine when the oil starts running out. Millions of people with no functional economy and eventual MASS unemployment. That's a few years away though.... maybe

Once the spot light is put back onto the US we will see them having to raise the debt level once again. And probably again.

The solutions across the board are not solutions at all, but just plain dumb Band-Aids.


Replacing autonomous dictators with military rulers is not a fix.
Printing money to buy private debt is not a fix.
Imposing taxes to halt unstoppable cyclical climate change is not a fix.
Implementing consumer democratic politics in an ancient tribal structure is not a fix.

Blah. blah. blah, ....

Now, watch out for Japan being the next disaster to not be able to service debt.

 

[Smurf1976]

Replacing autonomous dictators with military rulers is not a fix.
Printing money to buy private debt is not a fix.
Imposing taxes to halt unstoppable cyclical climate change is not a fix.
Implementing consumer democratic politics in an ancient tribal structure is not a fix.

Like any chronic disease, the only real solution is to not do the things which cause it in the first place.

In my opinion, 5 things come immediately to mind (no doubt there are others):

1. The need for an honest money system. That is, a gold standard or something similar.

2. Globalisation is inherently flawed as a race to the bottom in everything from incomes to environmental standards. It will not work this time just as it did not work last time it was tried.

3. Reliance on a small number of countries for supplies of key natural resources is a problem, with oil and gas heading the list. Since these resources will also run out sooner or later in additon to the economic and geopolitical risks they present, minimising their use through the use of currently available alternatives and development of new technology is a priority.

4. Recognition that the planet is a finite resource and that the notion of constant GDP growth is inherently flawed and must at some point cease. This relates directly to point 1 above - we need a system that does not require constant growth in order to avoid outright collapse.

5. Smashing windows (or starting wars) in order to fix them adds to GDP but does not create real wealth. The economic system needs transformation to reflect this with a consequent shift away from producing products designed to break (relates to all points above in some way as well as being an issue in itself).

Address that lot (and no doubt a few others) and then we'll stop causing the disease in the first place. Prevention is always better than trying to effect a cure.

 

[drsmith]

4. Recognition that the planet is a finite resource and that the notion of constant GDP growth is inherently flawed and must at some point cease. This relates directly to point 1 above - we need a system that does not require constant growth in order to avoid outright collapse.

In terms of fossil fuel reliance from one planet as a closed system, that's true, but the universe is a big place.

Growth drives innovation and technological advancement, but the other settings also have to be right as you have noted above.

 

[skc]

4. Recognition that the planet is a finite resource and that the notion of constant GDP growth is inherently flawed and must at some point cease. This relates directly to point 1 above - we need a system that does not require constant growth in order to avoid outright collapse.

The ruling elites of this planet seem unable to understand or unwilling to care about the difference between growth and better standard of living...

 

[kavla1970]

The word 'brink' is creeping into the vernacular in all sorts of places.

Europe is obviously on a path to self distraction. They can only hold it together for a short time longer. Eastern Europe is being dragged in. It's just looking completely brinkish really.

The Muslim world from Morocco to Pakistan is just plain defunct. Imagine when the oil starts running out. Millions of people with no functional economy and eventual MASS unemployment. That's a few years away though.... maybe

Once the spot light is put back onto the US we will see them having to raise the debt level once again. And probably again.

The solutions across the board are not solutions at all, but just plain dumb Band-Aids.


Replacing autonomous dictators with military rulers is not a fix.
Printing money to buy private debt is not a fix.
Imposing taxes to halt unstoppable cyclical climate change is not a fix.
Implementing consumer democratic politics in an ancient tribal structure is not a fix.

Blah. blah. blah, ....

Now, watch out for Japan being the next disaster to not be able to service debt.

Yeap agree.

 

[Sean K]

4. Recognition that the planet is a finite resource and that the notion of constant GDP growth is inherently flawed and must at some point cease. This relates directly to point 1 above - we need a system that does not require constant growth in order to avoid outright collapse.

I doubt we will recognise the planet as finite until it is way too late. We won't be able to change anything by then anyway.

We think we're in charge at the moment, but we aren't really.

There has been, and probably still is, an assumption that we can grow forever: Probably linked to the bamboozling ridiculous belief in life after death.

Humans think they are the smartest creature in the Universe yet believe they can keep digging forever and the dirt will just keep on giving...

I think humans may have peaked about 2500 years ago and we've been in a steady decline since then.

We are just another transitional species controlling this rock in our own minds for this slight moment.

I think the answer may be to just accept that we are not in control.

The multiverses are.

 

[tech/a]

I doubt we will recognise the planet as finite until it is way too late. We won't be able to change anything by then anyway.

We think we're in charge at the moment, but we aren't really.

There has been, and probably still is, an assumption that we can grow forever: Probably linked to the bamboozling ridiculous belief in life after death.

Humans think they are the smartest creature in the Universe yet believe they can keep digging forever and the dirt will just keep on giving...

I think humans may have peaked about 2500 years ago and we've been in a steady decline since then.

We are just another transitional species controlling this rock in our own minds for this slight moment.

I think the answer may be to just accept that we are not in control.

The multiverses are.

Hell Kennas we agree.

 

[Sean K]

Hell Kennas we agree.

And, now I believe in God. We agree.